Guest guest Posted June 1, 2009 Report Share Posted June 1, 2009 " Sitara " <smitali17 wrote: > > Some masters were quite unlucky in that respect, I guess Jesus was one of them, he got disciples with very limited abilities. Dear SitaraJi, Have you read " The Gospel of Thomas " ?, that wonderful " non-dual " piece of literature? or some of St Augustin's Confessions?, or Master Eckhart? without speaking about the Gospels (Jesus' disciples works, presumably) if one really " understands " them? The teachings of Jesus are quite allright and were passed also quite allright up to these days through certain " channels " by qualified disciples, otherwise they couldn't have survived. Yes, they survived, if one doesn't encounter them is a different story (you might enjoy seeing a wonderful film called " Into the Silence " about some cisternian french monks and their sadhana). As with many " traditions " (including Advaita, Buddhism, etc) , what holds back a real teaching, is the lack of preparation and inability of the masses to grasp the " essence " of it (maybe initiated by un-qualified disciples, granted), and since the power is usually in their hands (the masses), " institutions " start flowering around that focus mainly in the literal level (or first steps) of such teachings, churches/faiths/philosophies of all kinds loosing the actual meaning of the actual teaching. Under this optic, all Masters were unlucky, and yes, specially Jesus, Buddha and Shankara! At the present, there is no tradition that I know of that didn't fall into this trap, and why? very simple, the actual teaching (of every Master) gets mixed with the intricasies of Mind and Ahamkara, giving birth to theocracies of all kinds, panditism, occultism, etc... Fortunately, there is always an undercurrrent of understanding that survives this process (because it was passed along through qualified hands) and some of more recent teachers (of the christian tradition, buddhists, advaitins/vedantins, khabbala, sufis, islam, etc...) are starting to reveal the Unity and the inner/inter-connection between Teachings, because they start to see the moon and not arguing about the validity of the different fingers pointing at it. I and the Father are One --- Aham Brahmasmi --- Atman = Paramatman. Yours in Bhagavan, Mouna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2009 Report Share Posted June 1, 2009 " In the beginning was the word , the word was with God and the word was God ( the primordial sound Aum or Amen ) .. Pranams ramesh --- On Mon, 6/1/09, Mouna <maunna wrote: Mouna <maunna Advaita and Jesus Teachings advaitin Monday, June 1, 2009, 7:10 PM " Sitara " <smitali17@. ..> wrote: > > Some masters were quite unlucky in that respect, I guess Jesus was one of them, he got disciples with very limited abilities. Dear SitaraJi, Have you read " The Gospel of Thomas " ?, that wonderful " non-dual " piece of literature? or some of St Augustin's Confessions? , or Master Eckhart? without speaking about the Gospels (Jesus' disciples works, presumably) if one really " understands " them? The teachings of Jesus are quite allright and were passed also quite allright up to these days through certain " channels " by qualified disciples, otherwise they couldn't have survived. Yes, they survived, if one doesn't encounter them is a different story (you might enjoy seeing a wonderful film called " Into the Silence " about some cisternian french monks and their sadhana). As with many " traditions " (including Advaita, Buddhism, etc) , what holds back a real teaching, is the lack of preparation and inability of the masses to grasp the " essence " of it (maybe initiated by un-qualified disciples, granted), and since the power is usually in their hands (the masses), " institutions " start flowering around that focus mainly in the literal level (or first steps) of such teachings, churches/faiths/ philosophies of all kinds loosing the actual meaning of the actual teaching. Under this optic, all Masters were unlucky, and yes, specially Jesus, Buddha and Shankara! At the present, there is no tradition that I know of that didn't fall into this trap, and why? very simple, the actual teaching (of every Master) gets mixed with the intricasies of Mind and Ahamkara, giving birth to theocracies of all kinds, panditism, occultism, etc... Fortunately, there is always an undercurrrent of understanding that survives this process (because it was passed along through qualified hands) and some of more recent teachers (of the christian tradition, buddhists, advaitins/vedantins , khabbala, sufis, islam, etc...) are starting to reveal the Unity and the inner/inter- connection between Teachings, because they start to see the moon and not arguing about the validity of the different fingers pointing at it. I and the Father are One --- Aham Brahmasmi --- Atman = Paramatman. Yours in Bhagavan, Mouna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2009 Report Share Posted June 1, 2009 Namaste Mouna: Your answer is completely clarity, thank you. If you allow me, I would like to rise a question to you. Does the Christian doctrine of the expiation have any special meaning for the Tradition Védica? Namely An avatar delivered voluntarily to the death to save or to raise spiritually to the human race, Does it have any explanation to the Vedanta? Bearing in mind that this doctrine is not proper of the Christianity, but also it is present in the Greco-Roman mysteries, like the orfic mystery. Thank you very much In Bhagavan Nirgunananda advaitin , " Mouna " <maunna wrote: > > " Sitara " <smitali17@> wrote: > > > > Some masters were quite unlucky in that respect, I guess Jesus was one > of them, he got disciples with very limited abilities. > > Dear SitaraJi, > > Have you read " The Gospel of Thomas " ?, that wonderful " non-dual " piece > of literature? or some of St Augustin's Confessions?, or Master Eckhart? > without speaking about the Gospels (Jesus' disciples works, presumably) > if one really " understands " them? > > The teachings of Jesus are quite allright and were passed also quite > allright up to these days through certain " channels " by qualified > disciples, otherwise they couldn't have survived. Yes, they survived, if > one doesn't encounter them is a different story (you might enjoy seeing > a wonderful film called " Into the Silence " about some cisternian french > monks and their sadhana). > > As with many " traditions " (including Advaita, Buddhism, etc) , what > holds back a real teaching, is the lack of preparation and inability of > the masses to grasp the " essence " of it (maybe initiated by un-qualified > disciples, granted), and since the power is usually in their hands (the > masses), " institutions " start flowering around that focus mainly in the > literal level (or first steps) of such teachings, > churches/faiths/philosophies of all kinds loosing the actual meaning of > the actual teaching. > Under this optic, all Masters were unlucky, and yes, specially Jesus, > Buddha and Shankara! > > At the present, there is no tradition that I know of that didn't fall > into this trap, and why? very simple, the actual teaching (of every > Master) gets mixed with the intricasies of Mind and Ahamkara, giving > birth to theocracies of all kinds, panditism, occultism, etc... > > Fortunately, there is always an undercurrrent of understanding that > survives this process (because it was passed along through qualified > hands) and some of more recent teachers (of the christian tradition, > buddhists, advaitins/vedantins, khabbala, sufis, islam, etc...) are > starting to reveal the Unity and the inner/inter-connection between > Teachings, because they start to see the moon and not arguing about the > validity of the different fingers pointing at it. > > I and the Father are One --- Aham Brahmasmi --- Atman = Paramatman. > > Yours in Bhagavan, > Mouna > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2009 Report Share Posted June 1, 2009 Appropriate: (Advaita-Vedanta/Shankara's interpretation of Upanishads)::(Shentong interpretation of Buddha)::(Gnostic interpretation of Jesus Christ) Inappropriate: (Buddha)::(Jesus)::(Shankara) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2009 Report Share Posted June 1, 2009 " putranm " <putranm wrote: > > Inappropriate: " Inappropiate " is also an interpretation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2009 Report Share Posted June 1, 2009 > " Inappropiate " is also an interpretation. > On the basis of what avoids conflict - when different interpretations exist. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2009 Report Share Posted June 1, 2009 Dear Mounaji, There are certainly many sides to this issue but, you know, I am actualy not interested enough in Christianity to go deeper into a discussion about it. So please forgive me if I do not comment on your post. Om Shanti Sitara advaitin , " Mouna " <maunna wrote: > > " Sitara " <smitali17@> wrote: > > > > Some masters were quite unlucky in that respect, I guess Jesus was one > of them, he got disciples with very limited abilities. > > Dear SitaraJi, > > Have you read " The Gospel of Thomas " ?, that wonderful " non-dual " piece > of literature? or some of St Augustin's Confessions?, or Master Eckhart? > without speaking about the Gospels (Jesus' disciples works, presumably) > if one really " understands " them? > > The teachings of Jesus are quite allright and were passed also quite > allright up to these days through certain " channels " by qualified > disciples, otherwise they couldn't have survived. Yes, they survived, if > one doesn't encounter them is a different story (you might enjoy seeing > a wonderful film called " Into the Silence " about some cisternian french > monks and their sadhana). > > As with many " traditions " (including Advaita, Buddhism, etc) , what > holds back a real teaching, is the lack of preparation and inability of > the masses to grasp the " essence " of it (maybe initiated by un-qualified > disciples, granted), and since the power is usually in their hands (the > masses), " institutions " start flowering around that focus mainly in the > literal level (or first steps) of such teachings, > churches/faiths/philosophies of all kinds loosing the actual meaning of > the actual teaching. > Under this optic, all Masters were unlucky, and yes, specially Jesus, > Buddha and Shankara! > > At the present, there is no tradition that I know of that didn't fall > into this trap, and why? very simple, the actual teaching (of every > Master) gets mixed with the intricasies of Mind and Ahamkara, giving > birth to theocracies of all kinds, panditism, occultism, etc... > > Fortunately, there is always an undercurrrent of understanding that > survives this process (because it was passed along through qualified > hands) and some of more recent teachers (of the christian tradition, > buddhists, advaitins/vedantins, khabbala, sufis, islam, etc...) are > starting to reveal the Unity and the inner/inter-connection between > Teachings, because they start to see the moon and not arguing about the > validity of the different fingers pointing at it. > > I and the Father are One --- Aham Brahmasmi --- Atman = Paramatman. > > Yours in Bhagavan, > Mouna > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 1, 2009 Report Share Posted June 1, 2009 " Sitara " <smitali17 wrote: > So please forgive me if I do not comment on your post. > I forgive you SitaraJi... M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2009 Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 In advaitin , " nirgunananda " <s.nirgunananda wrote: > If you allow me, I would like to rise a question to you. Does the Christian doctrine of the expiation have any special meaning for the Tradition Védica? Namely An avatar delivered voluntarily to the death to save or to raise spiritually to the human race, Does it have any explanation to the Vedanta? Namaste Nirgunanada, I can't speak for the Vedic Tradicion, I am not qualified to do so. One thing that is clear in all traditions, is that the lives of Avataras, Prophets, Saints and Jnanis are road maps to our own inner world and to our possibilities to re-cognize our Essential Nature. Rama and Sita, Pandavas and Kauravas, the life of Prince Gautama, Socrates, Jesus are keys to Understanding if we can decode them properly. Bhagavan Ramana Maharshi used to say that Jesus' crucifixion denotes the death of the Ego. Jesus being the I-Am-the-Body idea (or Ego), has to perish for the Christ to emerge. Actually showing the Teaching with one's own acts and life is the Ultimate Teaching, that's my understanding of the expiation of Jesus. Yours in Bhagavan, Mouna Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2009 Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 Respected nirgunananda-ji, Namaste. My small request: Let us restrict ourselves to the teachings of Acharya Sankara. What jesus, allah etc. said is not our concern. I am aware that Hindusim is a sanatana dharma and has embraced other *isms* with a broad-minded outlook but unfortunately this *broad-mindedness* is being taken for a ride now-a-days. Just my 2 cents. regs, sriram advaitin , " nirgunananda " <s.nirgunananda wrote: > > Namaste Mouna: > > Your answer is completely clarity, thank you. > > If you allow me, I would like to rise a question to you. Does the Christian doctrine of the expiation have any special meaning for the Tradition Védica? Namely An avatar delivered voluntarily to the death to save or to raise spiritually to the human race, Does it have any explanation to the Vedanta? Bearing in mind that this doctrine is not proper of the Christianity, but also it is present in the Greco-Roman mysteries, like the orfic mystery. > > Thank you very much > > In Bhagavan > > Nirgunananda > > advaitin , " Mouna " <maunna@> wrote: > > > > " Sitara " <smitali17@> wrote: > > > > > > Some masters were quite unlucky in that respect, I guess Jesus was one > > of them, he got disciples with very limited abilities. > > > > Dear SitaraJi, > > > > Have you read " The Gospel of Thomas " ?, that wonderful " non-dual " piece > > of literature? or some of St Augustin's Confessions?, or Master Eckhart? > > without speaking about the Gospels (Jesus' disciples works, presumably) > > if one really " understands " them? > > > > The teachings of Jesus are quite allright and were passed also quite > > allright up to these days through certain " channels " by qualified > > disciples, otherwise they couldn't have survived. Yes, they survived, if > > one doesn't encounter them is a different story (you might enjoy seeing > > a wonderful film called " Into the Silence " about some cisternian french > > monks and their sadhana). > > > > As with many " traditions " (including Advaita, Buddhism, etc) , what > > holds back a real teaching, is the lack of preparation and inability of > > the masses to grasp the " essence " of it (maybe initiated by un-qualified > > disciples, granted), and since the power is usually in their hands (the > > masses), " institutions " start flowering around that focus mainly in the > > literal level (or first steps) of such teachings, > > churches/faiths/philosophies of all kinds loosing the actual meaning of > > the actual teaching. > > Under this optic, all Masters were unlucky, and yes, specially Jesus, > > Buddha and Shankara! > > > > At the present, there is no tradition that I know of that didn't fall > > into this trap, and why? very simple, the actual teaching (of every > > Master) gets mixed with the intricasies of Mind and Ahamkara, giving > > birth to theocracies of all kinds, panditism, occultism, etc... > > > > Fortunately, there is always an undercurrrent of understanding that > > survives this process (because it was passed along through qualified > > hands) and some of more recent teachers (of the christian tradition, > > buddhists, advaitins/vedantins, khabbala, sufis, islam, etc...) are > > starting to reveal the Unity and the inner/inter-connection between > > Teachings, because they start to see the moon and not arguing about the > > validity of the different fingers pointing at it. > > > > I and the Father are One --- Aham Brahmasmi --- Atman = Paramatman. > > > > Yours in Bhagavan, > > Mouna > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2009 Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 Hari Om I would like to add on a lighter note: This broad mindedness is considered Secular!! and if you talk of Hindu dharma you are branded as Communal. I full endorse Mr Sriram\s view. Thank - sriram advaitin Tuesday, June 02, 2009 7:00 AM Re: Advaita and Jesus Teachings Respected nirgunananda-ji, Namaste. My small request: Let us restrict ourselves to the teachings of Acharya Sankara. What jesus, allah etc. said is not our concern. I am aware that Hindusim is a sanatana dharma and has embraced other *isms* with a broad-minded outlook but unfortunately this *broad-mindedness* is being taken for a ride now-a-days. Just my 2 cents. regs, sriram advaitin , " nirgunananda " <s.nirgunananda wrote: > > Namaste Mouna: > > Your answer is completely clarity, thank you. > > If you allow me, I would like to rise a question to you. Does the Christian doctrine of the expiation have any special meaning for the Tradition Védica? Namely An avatar delivered voluntarily to the death to save or to raise spiritually to the human race, Does it have any explanation to the Vedanta? Bearing in mind that this doctrine is not proper of the Christianity, but also it is present in the Greco-Roman mysteries, like the orfic mystery. > > Thank you very much > > In Bhagavan > > Nirgunananda > > advaitin , " Mouna " <maunna@> wrote: > > > > " Sitara " <smitali17@> wrote: > > > > > > Some masters were quite unlucky in that respect, I guess Jesus was one > > of them, he got disciples with very limited abilities. > > > > Dear SitaraJi, > > > > Have you read " The Gospel of Thomas " ?, that wonderful " non-dual " piece > > of literature? or some of St Augustin's Confessions?, or Master Eckhart? > > without speaking about the Gospels (Jesus' disciples works, presumably) > > if one really " understands " them? > > > > The teachings of Jesus are quite allright and were passed also quite > > allright up to these days through certain " channels " by qualified > > disciples, otherwise they couldn't have survived. Yes, they survived, if > > one doesn't encounter them is a different story (you might enjoy seeing > > a wonderful film called " Into the Silence " about some cisternian french > > monks and their sadhana). > > > > As with many " traditions " (including Advaita, Buddhism, etc) , what > > holds back a real teaching, is the lack of preparation and inability of > > the masses to grasp the " essence " of it (maybe initiated by un-qualified > > disciples, granted), and since the power is usually in their hands (the > > masses), " institutions " start flowering around that focus mainly in the > > literal level (or first steps) of such teachings, > > churches/faiths/philosophies of all kinds loosing the actual meaning of > > the actual teaching. > > Under this optic, all Masters were unlucky, and yes, specially Jesus, > > Buddha and Shankara! > > > > At the present, there is no tradition that I know of that didn't fall > > into this trap, and why? very simple, the actual teaching (of every > > Master) gets mixed with the intricasies of Mind and Ahamkara, giving > > birth to theocracies of all kinds, panditism, occultism, etc... > > > > Fortunately, there is always an undercurrrent of understanding that > > survives this process (because it was passed along through qualified > > hands) and some of more recent teachers (of the christian tradition, > > buddhists, advaitins/vedantins, khabbala, sufis, islam, etc...) are > > starting to reveal the Unity and the inner/inter-connection between > > Teachings, because they start to see the moon and not arguing about the > > validity of the different fingers pointing at it. > > > > I and the Father are One --- Aham Brahmasmi --- Atman = Paramatman. > > > > Yours in Bhagavan, > > Mouna > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2009 Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 advaitin , ramesh chivukula <ramesh_chiv wrote: > > " In the beginning was the word , the word was with God and the word was God ( the primordial sound Aum or Amen ) .. > > Pranams > > ramesh " In the beginning was Prajapati, with Him was the Word, and the Word was truly the Supreme Brahman. " (Krishna Yajur Veda, Kathaka Samhita, 12.5, 27.1; Krishna Yajur Veda, Kathakapisthala Samhita, 42.1; Jaiminiya Brahmana II, Sama Veda, 2244.) Source: http://atmajyoti.org/spirwrit-the_christ_of_india.asp " Real " History? If you care for or against, email them. " ...even attributing to him incidents from the life of Buddha (such as the Widow's Mite) and mistaking his quotations from the Upanishads, the Bhagavad Gita and the Dhammapada for doctrines original to him. For example, the opening verse of the Gospel of John, which has been cited through the centuries as proof of the unique character and mission of Jesus, is really a paraphrase of the Vedic verse: " In the beginning was Prajapati, with Him was the Word, and the Word was truly the Supreme Brahman. " (Prajapati vai idam agra asit. Tasya vak dvitiya asit. Vag vai paramam Brahman. (Krishna Yajur Veda, Kathaka Samhita, 12.5, 27.1; Krishna Yajur Veda, Kathakapisthala Samhita, 42.1; Jaiminiya Brahmana II, Sama Veda, 2244.) Prajapati refers to God as Creator, and Brahman to God in His Absolute Transcendent Being. ) " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2009 Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 >>Namely An avatar delivered voluntarily to the death to save or to raise spiritually to the human race, Does it have any explanation to the Vedanta?<< Jesus was crucified by the conspiracy of jews in collusion with Romans.Otherwise why would Jesus exclaim " oh,Father forgive them,for they do not know what they are doing and added why did you forsake me father " ..... Jesus from age 13-30 was a shisya of sages of kashmir.He went back to Jerusalem to preach what he was taught,imho. Moderators,slight digression on my part from main topic.Thanks. suresh. advaitin , " N Kalyan " <nkalyan wrote: > > Hari Om > > I would like to add on a lighter note: > > This broad mindedness is considered Secular!! and if you talk of Hindu dharma you are branded as Communal. > > I full endorse Mr Sriram\s view. > > Thank > - > sriram > advaitin > Tuesday, June 02, 2009 7:00 AM > Re: Advaita and Jesus Teachings > > > > > > Respected nirgunananda-ji, > > Namaste. My small request: > > Let us restrict ourselves to the teachings of Acharya Sankara. > What jesus, allah etc. said is not our concern. > > I am aware that Hindusim is a sanatana dharma and has embraced other *isms* with a broad-minded outlook but unfortunately this *broad-mindedness* is being taken for a ride now-a-days. > > Just my 2 cents. > > regs, > sriram > > advaitin , " nirgunananda " <s.nirgunananda@> wrote: > > > > Namaste Mouna: > > > > Your answer is completely clarity, thank you. > > > > If you allow me, I would like to rise a question to you. Does the Christian doctrine of the expiation have any special meaning for the Tradition Védica? Namely An avatar delivered voluntarily to the death to save or to raise spiritually to the human race, Does it have any explanation to the Vedanta? Bearing in mind that this doctrine is not proper of the Christianity, but also it is present in the Greco-Roman mysteries, like the orfic mystery. > > > > Thank you very much > > > > In Bhagavan > > > > Nirgunananda > > > > advaitin , " Mouna " <maunna@> wrote: > > > > > > " Sitara " <smitali17@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Some masters were quite unlucky in that respect, I guess Jesus was one > > > of them, he got disciples with very limited abilities. > > > > > > Dear SitaraJi, > > > > > > Have you read " The Gospel of Thomas " ?, that wonderful " non-dual " piece > > > of literature? or some of St Augustin's Confessions?, or Master Eckhart? > > > without speaking about the Gospels (Jesus' disciples works, presumably) > > > if one really " understands " them? > > > > > > The teachings of Jesus are quite allright and were passed also quite > > > allright up to these days through certain " channels " by qualified > > > disciples, otherwise they couldn't have survived. Yes, they survived, if > > > one doesn't encounter them is a different story (you might enjoy seeing > > > a wonderful film called " Into the Silence " about some cisternian french > > > monks and their sadhana). > > > > > > As with many " traditions " (including Advaita, Buddhism, etc) , what > > > holds back a real teaching, is the lack of preparation and inability of > > > the masses to grasp the " essence " of it (maybe initiated by un-qualified > > > disciples, granted), and since the power is usually in their hands (the > > > masses), " institutions " start flowering around that focus mainly in the > > > literal level (or first steps) of such teachings, > > > churches/faiths/philosophies of all kinds loosing the actual meaning of > > > the actual teaching. > > > Under this optic, all Masters were unlucky, and yes, specially Jesus, > > > Buddha and Shankara! > > > > > > At the present, there is no tradition that I know of that didn't fall > > > into this trap, and why? very simple, the actual teaching (of every > > > Master) gets mixed with the intricasies of Mind and Ahamkara, giving > > > birth to theocracies of all kinds, panditism, occultism, etc... > > > > > > Fortunately, there is always an undercurrrent of understanding that > > > survives this process (because it was passed along through qualified > > > hands) and some of more recent teachers (of the christian tradition, > > > buddhists, advaitins/vedantins, khabbala, sufis, islam, etc...) are > > > starting to reveal the Unity and the inner/inter-connection between > > > Teachings, because they start to see the moon and not arguing about the > > > validity of the different fingers pointing at it. > > > > > > I and the Father are One --- Aham Brahmasmi --- Atman = Paramatman. > > > > > > Yours in Bhagavan, > > > Mouna > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 2, 2009 Report Share Posted June 2, 2009 advaitin , " sureshbalaraman " <sureshbalaraman wrote: > > >>Namely An avatar delivered voluntarily to the death to save or to raise > spiritually to the human race, Does it have any explanation to the Vedanta?<< > > Jesus was crucified by the conspiracy of jews in collusion with Romans.Otherwise why would Jesus exclaim " oh,Father forgive them,for they do not know what they are doing and added why did you forsake me father " ..... > > Jesus from age 13-30 was a shisya of sages of kashmir.He went back to Jerusalem to preach what he was taught,imho. > > Moderators,slight digression on my part from main topic.Thanks. > > suresh. Namaste Suresh. Yes in my opinion also Jesus was in India during the so called lost years...There are supposedly records of his visit at the temple in Jagganath.and in Kashmir...'Father forgive them for they know not what they do' is letting go and loving all so to speak... 'The why didst though forsake me' is something else...It could have been the body talking or it could have been translated as 'darkness comes over my face'... With regard to 'Jews'...this is tricky ground as Jew just means Judean and that would include Greek settlers from the time of Alexander...as well. I would say they are referring to the Priestly sect of Sadducees, who were really tools of Herod...Sadducees persecuted anyone who was a mystic or a threat to them...the other main sects in Palestine at the time were the Essenes, who Jesus was associated with and who had contacts in India, and the Pharisee, who eventually became main stream Judaism.. http://www.geocities.com/aoclery/Jesusbook/GospelofThomas.htm One must remember that there have been followers of Jesus in India for two thousand years....hundreds of years before 'Christianity' was in the West.In my 'Jesus Book'file on the above website you will see that the sermon on the mount is very Vedantic.....I don't know whether this will get through the moderator,,,if not I hope they fwd it to you..............Cheers Tony. List Moderators' note: What you are declaring is your own interpretation and your opinion has no valid evidence regarding the practice of christianity before two thousand years. Also please note that the topic your discussion is beyond the scope of this list and we request you to stop posting more on this subject topic. We request the same from others. thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 3, 2009 Report Share Posted June 3, 2009 HariOm! Please may I humbly request you to read again your statement about Jews. It is a direct accusation on them. It is not proven that Jews are responsible for the crucifixon of Jesus. All that we know is that a single jew (Juda) that too upon the request of Jesus given out the location of Jesus. That doesn't hold the whole race responsible for his death. Also Lord Krishna was beaten by his own clan Yaadavas, when he was taking rest under a tree an arrow struck him and he died. The hunter who released the arrow is certainly a Hindu. Shall we hold Hindus responsible for Krishna's death?! :-) They are all lilavataras so we can't blame anyone for the actions performed by and performed towards the Mahatmas. Love & Light, Madhava advaitin , " sureshbalaraman " <sureshbalaraman wrote: > > >>Namely An avatar delivered voluntarily to the death to save or to raise > spiritually to the human race, Does it have any explanation to the Vedanta?<< > > Jesus was crucified by the conspiracy of jews in collusion with Romans.Otherwise why would Jesus exclaim " oh,Father forgive them,for they do not know what they are doing and added why did you forsake me father " ..... > > Jesus from age 13-30 was a shisya of sages of kashmir.He went back to Jerusalem to preach what he was taught,imho. > > suresh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 4, 2009 Report Share Posted June 4, 2009 MT ji : I am not blaming jews as a whole race for the death of jesus christ.when body appears it has to die=simple truth.my apologies,if i have conveyed to you,that jews are responsible as a race for the death,of jesus christ.matter of fact,the first introduction to shri arjuna ,lord krishna tells him,that he remembers his previous births and he imparted bhagavath gita truth even before his present avataram as lord krishna. so,naturally lord krishna is taking future births too.imho,only sanathana dharma existed in bhu-loka.slowly as new territories got formed,individualistic religions cropped up.abraham=brahmaa.so,brahmaa is the originator of judaism,christanity,islam,is my view=much to the chagrin of many.i guess my spiritual development is at this stage,who knows where it will all cease? suresh. advaitin , " Madhava Turumella " <madhava wrote: > > HariOm! > > Please may I humbly request you to read again your statement about Jews. It is a direct accusation on them. It is not proven that Jews are responsible for the crucifixon of Jesus. All that we know is that a single jew (Juda) that too upon the request of Jesus given out the location of Jesus. That doesn't hold the whole race responsible for his death. > > Also Lord Krishna was beaten by his own clan Yaadavas, when he was taking rest under a tree an arrow struck him and he died. The hunter who released the arrow is certainly a Hindu. Shall we hold Hindus responsible for Krishna's death?! :-) > > They are all lilavataras so we can't blame anyone for the actions performed by and performed towards the Mahatmas. > > Love & Light, > Madhava > > > > advaitin , " sureshbalaraman " <sureshbalaraman@> wrote: > > > > >>Namely An avatar delivered voluntarily to the death to save or to raise > > spiritually to the human race, Does it have any explanation to the Vedanta?<< > > > > Jesus was crucified by the conspiracy of jews in collusion with Romans.Otherwise why would Jesus exclaim " oh,Father forgive them,for they do not know what they are doing and added why did you forsake me father " ..... > > > > Jesus from age 13-30 was a shisya of sages of kashmir.He went back to Jerusalem to preach what he was taught,imho. > > > > suresh. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 4, 2009 Report Share Posted June 4, 2009 tony ji : i personally think,lord jesus christ was born before as lord krishna,and lord krishna as lord rama and so on on on.....its the same atma which is transmigrating from time imemorial ,according to me.so,i really do not see differentiations amongst religions,though each one has its uniqueness as a talking point=as i live now,i have to accept what majority feel.advaitham teaches=non-duality.that is why guru adi-shankaracharyaals could drink even molten lead whereas his shisyas could not do so.swami ji came to us a guru darshanar,but imho was swayam bhagavan swaroopam.though i personally feel whatever we feel thru our sense perception is limited,whereas nirgunam brahman,is et al. suresh. advaitin , " Tony OClery " <aoclery wrote: > > advaitin , " sureshbalaraman " <sureshbalaraman@> wrote: > > > > >>Namely An avatar delivered voluntarily to the death to save or to raise > > spiritually to the human race, Does it have any explanation to the Vedanta?<< > > > > Jesus was crucified by the conspiracy of jews in collusion with Romans.Otherwise why would Jesus exclaim " oh,Father forgive them,for they do not know what they are doing and added why did you forsake me father " ..... > > > > Jesus from age 13-30 was a shisya of sages of kashmir.He went back to Jerusalem to preach what he was taught,imho. > > > > Moderators,slight digression on my part from main topic.Thanks. > > > > suresh. > > Namaste Suresh. > > Yes in my opinion also Jesus was in India during the so called lost years...There are supposedly records of his visit at the temple in Jagganath.and in Kashmir...'Father forgive them for they know not what they do' is letting go and loving all so to speak... 'The why didst though forsake me' is something else...It could have been the body talking or it could have been translated as 'darkness comes over my face'... > > With regard to 'Jews'...this is tricky ground as Jew just means Judean and that would include Greek settlers from the time of Alexander...as well. I would say they are referring to the Priestly sect of Sadducees, who were really tools of Herod...Sadducees persecuted anyone who was a mystic or a threat to them...the other main sects in Palestine at the time were the Essenes, who Jesus was associated with and who had contacts in India, and the Pharisee, who eventually became main stream Judaism.. > > http://www.geocities.com/aoclery/Jesusbook/GospelofThomas.htm > > One must remember that there have been followers of Jesus in India for two thousand years....hundreds of years before 'Christianity' was in the West.In my 'Jesus Book'file on the above website you will see that the sermon on the mount is very Vedantic.....I don't know whether this will get through the moderator,,,if not I hope they fwd it to you..............Cheers Tony. > > List Moderators' note: > What you are declaring is your own interpretation and your opinion has no valid evidence regarding the practice of christianity before two thousand years. Also please note that the topic your discussion is beyond the scope of this list and we request you to stop posting more on this subject topic. We request the same from others. thanks! > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 4, 2009 Report Share Posted June 4, 2009 Dear suresh-ji: Namaste. What is the source of these *reveletions*? I also heard that there is a bija mantra for christ is same as that of Krishna as both the names start with *kri*. So, *Om krim jesusaya namah* is the moola mantra of jesus, right???? with regs, sriram advaitin , " sureshbalaraman " <sureshbalaraman wrote: > > tony ji : > > i personally think,lord jesus christ was born before as lord krishna,and lord krishna as lord rama and so on on on.....its the same atma which is transmigrating from time imemorial ,according to me.so,i really do not see differentiations amongst religions,though each one has its uniqueness as a talking point=as i live now,i have to accept what majority feel.advaitham teaches=non-duality.that is why guru adi-shankaracharyaals could drink even molten lead whereas his shisyas could not do so.swami ji came to us a guru darshanar,but imho was swayam bhagavan swaroopam.though i personally feel whatever we feel thru our sense perception is limited,whereas nirgunam brahman,is et al. > > suresh. > > advaitin , " Tony OClery " <aoclery@> wrote: > > > > advaitin , " sureshbalaraman " <sureshbalaraman@> wrote: > > > > > > >>Namely An avatar delivered voluntarily to the death to save or to raise > > > spiritually to the human race, Does it have any explanation to the Vedanta?<< > > > > > > Jesus was crucified by the conspiracy of jews in collusion with Romans.Otherwise why would Jesus exclaim " oh,Father forgive them,for they do not know what they are doing and added why did you forsake me father " ..... > > > > > > Jesus from age 13-30 was a shisya of sages of kashmir.He went back to Jerusalem to preach what he was taught,imho. > > > > > > Moderators,slight digression on my part from main topic.Thanks. > > > > > > suresh. > > > > Namaste Suresh. > > > > Yes in my opinion also Jesus was in India during the so called lost years...There are supposedly records of his visit at the temple in Jagganath.and in Kashmir...'Father forgive them for they know not what they do' is letting go and loving all so to speak... 'The why didst though forsake me' is something else...It could have been the body talking or it could have been translated as 'darkness comes over my face'... > > > > With regard to 'Jews'...this is tricky ground as Jew just means Judean and that would include Greek settlers from the time of Alexander...as well. I would say they are referring to the Priestly sect of Sadducees, who were really tools of Herod...Sadducees persecuted anyone who was a mystic or a threat to them...the other main sects in Palestine at the time were the Essenes, who Jesus was associated with and who had contacts in India, and the Pharisee, who eventually became main stream Judaism.. > > > > http://www.geocities.com/aoclery/Jesusbook/GospelofThomas.htm > > > > One must remember that there have been followers of Jesus in India for two thousand years....hundreds of years before 'Christianity' was in the West.In my 'Jesus Book'file on the above website you will see that the sermon on the mount is very Vedantic.....I don't know whether this will get through the moderator,,,if not I hope they fwd it to you..............Cheers Tony. > > > > List Moderators' note: > > What you are declaring is your own interpretation and your opinion has no valid evidence regarding the practice of christianity before two thousand years. Also please note that the topic your discussion is beyond the scope of this list and we request you to stop posting more on this subject topic. We request the same from others. thanks! > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 4, 2009 Report Share Posted June 4, 2009 sriram ji: >>Dear suresh-ji: Namaste. What is the source of these *reveletions*? I also heard that there is a bija mantra for christ is same as that of Krishna as both the names start with *kri*. So, *Om krim jesusaya namah* is the moola mantra of jesus, right???? with regs, sriram<< the revealations are due to my dyaana. as far beeja akshaaras are concerned,i am seeing your moola mantra first time.my ishta devata is lord shiva lord brahmaa lord vishnu alongwith their shakthis parvathi saraswathi and lakshmi. i chant their beeja mantrams. maybe those,who follows lord jesus christ as ishta devata will be able to help.so,i do not know whether to say right or wrong,plz excuse me for my ignorance. suresh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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