Guest guest Posted June 20, 2009 Report Share Posted June 20, 2009 For the Tamil speaking members in thie forum, there is a wonderful Tamil serial - Enge Brahmanan? - that talks about the true spiritual heritage, and its lack thereof today. Nice discussions on the Bhagawad Gita and other spiritual topics is interwoven into the storyline in a very interesting manner - a treat to watch.  Students of Swami Paramarthananda may be interested in this particular episode - (around minute 20)  http://tamiltv4u.com/enge-brahmanan/enge-brahmanan-tamil-serial-18-06-2009/#  True Brahminism has been described in various parts by Bhagwan Vyasacharya:  *** In the Mahabharata:  Na yonih na samskarah na shrutam na samnathi karanani dvijatvasya vrttam eva tu karanam Not the act of physical birth, nor the performance of the sacraments, not Vedic learning, nor humility: none of these lead to the twice born state - it is conduct alone.  *** Dharmas ca satyam ca damas tapas ca Amatsaryam hris titiksanasuya Yajnas ca danam ca dhrtih srutam ca Vratani vai dvadasa brahmanasya Adherence to dharma. Adherence to the truth Control of sense-organs. Austerity - in body, in mind and speech. Absence of covetousness Humility Non-envy Forebearance. Sacrifices - yajna Charity - Danam. Adherence to vratas Committment to Vedic learning.  - These are the twelve qualifications for a brahmana. "  *** satyam danam ksama-silam anrsyamsam tapo ghrna drsyante yatra nagendra sa brahmana iti smrtah One possessed of: Truthfulness, Charity, Forgiveness, Sobriety, Gentleness, Austerity and Lack of hatred - is called a brahmana. "  The Bhagavad-gita (18.42), the qualities of a brahmana are as follows — samo damas tapah saucam ksantir arjavam eva ca jnanam vijnanam astikyam brahma-karma svabhava-jam  Control of the mind, Control of the senses, Austerity, Purity - both internal and external, Tolerance, Honesty, straightforwardness Knowledge of scriptures, Wisdom and Faith in the Vedas — these are the qualities by which a brahmana is characterized "  *** In the Srimad Bhagavatam - samo damas tapah saucam santosah ksantir arjavam jnanam dayacyutatmatvam satyam ca brahma-laksanam " The characteristics of a brahmana are Control of the mind, Control of the senses, Austerity - of body,mind and speech Cleanliness - external and internal, Contentment, Forgiveness, Straightforwardness, Knowledge of the scriptures, Compassion, Truthfulness, and Surrender to Lord  *** Hari Om Shri Gurubhyoh namah Shyam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 20, 2009 Report Share Posted June 20, 2009 advaitin , Shyam <shyam_md wrote: > > > Â > True Brahminism has been described in various parts by Bhagwan Vyasacharya: In Itrans format, the verses would be as follows: True Brahminism has been described in various parts by Bhagawan Vyasacharya: In the Mahabharata: Anushasana parva 131:49 na yonirnApi sa.nskAro na shrutaM na cha saMnatiH . kAraNAni dvijatvasya vR^ittameva tu kAraNam .. 49..\\ Not the act of physical birth, nor the performance of the sacraments, not Vedic learning, nor humility: none of these lead to the twice born state; it is conduct alone.## *** udyoga parva - 43:12 dharmashcha satya.n cha damastapashcha amAtsarya.n hrIstitikShAnasUyA . yaGYashcha dAna.n cha dhR^itiH shrutaM cha mahAvratA dvAdasha brAhmaNasya .. 12..\\ Adherence to Dharma. Adherence to the Truth Control of Sense-organs. Austerity - in body, in mind and speech. Absence of covetousness, humility, Non-envy, Forbearance. Sacrifices - yajna, Charity - Danam, Adherence to vratas, Commitment to Vedic learning. These are the twelve qualifications for a brahmana. " *** vana parva 177:16 satya.n dAnaM kShamA shIlamAnR^isha.nsyaM damo ghR^iNA . dR^ishyante yatra nAgendra sa brAhmaNa iti smR^itaH .. 16..\ One possessed of: Truthfulness, Charity, Forgiveness, Sobriety, Gentleness, Austerity and Lack of hatred is called a brahmana. " ********************************************************************************\ ********* The Bhagavad-gita (18.42), the qualities of a brahmana are as follows : shamo damastapaH shaucaM kShAntirArjavameva ca | j~nAnaM vij~nAnamAstikyaM brahma-karma svabhAvajam || Control of the mind, Control of the senses, Austerity,Purity - both internal and external, Tolerance, Honesty, straightforwardness, Knowledge of scriptures,Wisdom and Faith in the Vedas these are the qualities by which a brahmana is characterized " . ********************************************************************************\ ******************* In the Srimad Bhagavatam 7:11:21- shamo damastapaH shauchaM santoShaH kShAntirArjavam | j~nAnaM dayAchyutAtmatvaM satyaM cha brahmalakShaNam || " The characteristics of a brahmana are Control of the mind, Control of the senses, Austerity - of body,mind and speech Cleanliness - external and internal, Contentment, Forgiveness, Straightforwardness, Knowledge of the scriptures, Compassion, Truthfulness, and Surrender to Lord. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 20, 2009 Report Share Posted June 20, 2009 Who is a Brahmin - The entire in *Vajrasuchi Upanishad *is dedicated to answer that question. Vajrasuchi clearly analyses and declares that the one who knows the Brahman is called Brahmana - brahmo JAnethi brAhmaNa: Who is a Brahmana ? The body ? the soul ? the class ? the intellect ? the actions or the virtue ? The soul is not a Brahmana because the soul is the same in all bodies past and future. The same person takes many bodies according to karma, nor is the body Brahmana – the body is the same from the Chandala (to the highest caste) being made of the five elements and is seen to have old age, death etc., alike. There is no fixity (of colour) such as Brahmana is white, Kshatriya is red, Vaishya is yellow and Sudra is black; also when the father’s body is cremated, the son etc., may be guilty of killing a Brahmana. Nor is the class a Brahmana. Then there would be many classes within the classes. Many are the great sages: Rishyasringa born of a deer, Kausika of reed, Jambuka of a jackal, Valmiki of an ant-hill, Vyasa of a fisher-girl, Gautama of a hare’s back, Vasistha of Urvasi, Agastya of a pot according to tradition. These are not Brahmanas by birth but by their knowledge. Nor is knowledge Brahmana: Kshatriyas and others also have knowledge. Nor is karma: all creatures are seen to have similar karma of Prarabdha etc., and all creatures act being impelled by karma. Nor is a man of virtue: There are many givers of gold – Kshatriyas etc. One who has directly realized, like the berry in the palm, the Atman without a second, devoid of class, quality and action and of defects like the six waves, the states, of the nature of truth, knowledge and bliss, free from adjuncts, the basis of all thoughts, immanent in all creatures, present inside and outside like space. Bliss impartite, beyond (ordinary) knowledge, to be realized by experience alone – AND having become successful, free from lust, rich in mental control, without greed, mind untouched by hypocrisy. This is the intention of Veda. Otherwise the nature of Brahmana cannot be achieved. One should contemplate one’s self as the spirit without a second, truth, knowledge and bliss. Thus the Upanishad. On Sat, Jun 20, 2009 at 4:23 PM, advaitins <advaitins wrote: > > > advaitin <advaitin%40>, Shyam > <shyam_md wrote: > > > > > > > Â > > > True Brahminism has been described in various parts by Bhagwan > Vyasacharya: > > In Itrans format, the verses would be as follows: > > True Brahminism has been described in various parts by Bhagawan > Vyasacharya: > > In the Mahabharata: Anushasana parva 131:49 > > na yonirnApi sa.nskAro na shrutaM na cha saMnatiH . > kAraNAni dvijatvasya vR^ittameva tu kAraNam .. 49..\\ > > Not the act of physical birth, nor the performance of the sacraments, > not Vedic learning, nor humility: none of these lead to the twice born > state; it is conduct alone.## > > *** > udyoga parva - 43:12 > > dharmashcha satya.n cha damastapashcha > amAtsarya.n hrIstitikShAnasUyA . > yaGYashcha dAna.n cha dhR^itiH shrutaM cha > mahAvratA dvAdasha brAhmaNasya .. 12..\\ > > Adherence to Dharma. Adherence to the Truth > Control of Sense-organs. Austerity - in body, in mind and speech. > Absence of covetousness, humility, Non-envy, Forbearance. > Sacrifices - yajna, Charity - Danam, Adherence to vratas, Commitment to > Vedic learning. > These are the twelve qualifications for a brahmana. " > > *** > vana parva 177:16 > > satya.n dAnaM kShamA shIlamAnR^isha.nsyaM damo ghR^iNA . > dR^ishyante yatra nAgendra sa brAhmaNa iti smR^itaH .. 16..\ > > One possessed of: Truthfulness, Charity, Forgiveness, > Sobriety, Gentleness, Austerity and Lack of hatred is called a brahmana. " > > > ********************************************************************************\ ********* > > The Bhagavad-gita (18.42), the qualities of a brahmana are as follows : > > shamo damastapaH shaucaM kShAntirArjavameva ca | > j~nAnaM vij~nAnamAstikyaM brahma-karma svabhAvajam || > > Control of the mind, Control of the senses, Austerity,Purity - both > internal and external, Tolerance, Honesty, straightforwardness, Knowledge of > scriptures,Wisdom and > Faith in the Vedas these are the qualities by which a brahmana is > characterized " . > > > ********************************************************************************\ ******************* > In the Srimad Bhagavatam 7:11:21- > > shamo damastapaH shauchaM santoShaH kShAntirArjavam | > j~nAnaM dayAchyutAtmatvaM satyaM cha brahmalakShaNam || > > " The characteristics of a brahmana are Control of the mind, > Control of the senses, Austerity - of body,mind and speech > Cleanliness - external and internal, Contentment, Forgiveness, > Straightforwardness, Knowledge of the scriptures, > Compassion, Truthfulness, and Surrender to Lord. > > > -- Vengatesh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 21, 2009 Report Share Posted June 21, 2009 advaitin , Shyam <shyam_md wrote: > > For the Tamil speaking members in thie forum, there is a wonderful Tamil serial - Enge Brahmanan? - that talks about the true spiritual heritage, and its lack thereof today. Nice discussions on the Bhagawad Gita and other spiritual topics is interwoven into the storyline in a very interesting manner - a treat to watch. >  Yes. very good show. On this topic, there are two aspects that get mixed. The varna social structure defined by occupation that should not have high-low divisions and the spiritual/guna structure that has. The latter one can be universally defined and ideally can be taken as the basis for statements like " only brahmana can attain moksha " . Cho says that if one fulfills the brahmana qualities, he/she is indeed fit to be specially respected - but this is not a title and as he says of some sannyasis, no such person would call himself a brahmana either. It is to be generally understood, who fits the varna as per guna. Generally those who fit the gunas are best inclined for certain occupations; however the birth based system of occupations should not be considered as defining the gunas. It is the concept of dharma that governs this system. Dharma means discipline, not choice - no work is inferior or superior, etc. By following it with the spiritual goal in mind, it will lead to freedom. There should be absolutely no high-low here. Anyway, I don't want to get caught in this topic, but the " middle way " should be considered rather than these extreme definitions or mixing of ideals with practicality to destroy the basis by which the varna system operates. Of course, topic is complicated by the jati thing as Cho says. In my opinion, that Sambu Shastri is pretty close to the social Brahmana whereas that Neelu is far away. As most of us are closer to the latter in living, we are better off looking for the ideal definition. That is not necesarily the best way to go for Hindu society; there is still the need to recognize the system while there are these Shastris who are entirely products of the birth-based system. That social dharma is still there for the rest of the Brahmanas though it seems too impractical. thollmelukaalkizhu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 advaitin , Shyam <shyam_md wrote: > > For the Tamil speaking members in thie forum, there is a wonderful Tamil serial - Enge Brahmanan? - that talks about the true spiritual heritage, and its lack thereof today. Nice discussions on the Bhagawad Gita and other spiritual topics is interwoven into the storyline in a very interesting manner - a treat to watch. > Hari Om > Shri Gurubhyoh namah > Shyam Namaste. In the past also there have been very learned Brahmins who held liberal views. One outstanding example is Kavyakantha Ganapati Muni about whom his great-grandson Sriram-ji had written in this List. Manu Smriti II.168 says-- " The Brahmana who without having studied the Veda in the proper way, labours after other things, falls, even in his present life, to the condition of a Sudra, together with his descendants " . I wonder how many of us qualify as Brahmins by this test. I certainly do not. Best wishes, S.N.sastri Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Manu Smriti II.168 says-- " The Brahmana who without having studied the Veda in the proper way, labours after other things, falls, even in his present life, to the condition of a Sudra, together with his descendants " . praNAms Hare Krishna these verdicts of dhama shAstra is always puzzling is it not?? why descendants should suffer due to one's own " svayaMkrutAparAdha " ?? does it mean to say even though his descendants do study the Veda-s with all sincerity they will not be granted the status of brAhmaNa due to one person's dodging in the dynasty??!! Likewise, I have read somewhere in mUndaka (?? not sure) if one gets the self realization, all of his 7 generation would get the Atma jnAna !! How can it be?? I think these are all some sort of threatening / eulogical statements just force one to follow his svadharma. Hari Hari Hari Bol!!! bhaskar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 NAMASTE, SRI SASTRIJI, YES, I TOO, DO NOT QUALIFY. AT THE SAME TIME, I DO VALUE MY BIRTH IN A BRAHMIN FAMILY, AS IT HAS DEFINITELY HELPED ME TO DEVELOP " GIGNASA " . WITH KIND REGARDS, R. S. Mani --- On Mon, 22/6/09, snsastri <sn.sastri wrote: snsastri <sn.sastri Re: A true Brahmin advaitin Monday, 22 June, 2009, 11:49 AM advaitin@ s.com, Shyam <shyam_md@.. .> wrote: > > For the Tamil speaking members in thie forum, there is a wonderful Tamil serial - Enge Brahmanan? - that talks about the true spiritual heritage, and its lack thereof today. Nice discussions on the Bhagawad Gita and other spiritual topics is interwoven into the storyline in a very interesting manner - a treat to watch. > Hari Om > Shri Gurubhyoh namah > Shyam Namaste. In the past also there have been very learned Brahmins who held liberal views. One outstanding example is Kavyakantha Ganapati Muni about whom his great-grandson Sriram-ji had written in this List. Manu Smriti II.168 says-- " The Brahmana who without having studied the Veda in the proper way, labours after other things, falls, even in his present life, to the condition of a Sudra, together with his descendants " . I wonder how many of us qualify as Brahmins by this test. I certainly do not. Best wishes, S.N.sastri Cricket on your mind? Visit the ultimate cricket website. Enter http://cricket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 There are three tyrpes of Brahmins acc to Swami Paramarthananda..pls read this.. http://srajahiyer.sulekha.com/blog/post/2009/06/enge-brahmanan-where-is-a-brahmi\ n.htm pranams to all http://www.acupressuresocks.com http://www.srajahiyer.sulekha.com/ --- On Mon, 6/22/09, snsastri <sn.sastri wrote: snsastri <sn.sastri Re: A true Brahmin advaitin Monday, June 22, 2009, 11:49 AM advaitin@ s.com, Shyam <shyam_md@.. .> wrote: > > For the Tamil speaking members in thie forum, there is a wonderful Tamil serial - Enge Brahmanan? - that talks about the true spiritual heritage, and its lack thereof today. Nice discussions on the Bhagawad Gita and other spiritual topics is interwoven into the storyline in a very interesting manner - a treat to watch. > Hari Om > Shri Gurubhyoh namah > Shyam Namaste. In the past also there have been very learned Brahmins who held liberal views. One outstanding example is Kavyakantha Ganapati Muni about whom his great-grandson Sriram-ji had written in this List. Manu Smriti II.168 says-- " The Brahmana who without having studied the Veda in the proper way, labours after other things, falls, even in his present life, to the condition of a Sudra, together with his descendants " . I wonder how many of us qualify as Brahmins by this test. I certainly do not. Best wishes, S.N.sastri Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 I was listening to a lecture by a lady who is well versed in the our scriptures and had great spiritual attainment. She says that according to scriptures birth as brahmin is one of the requisites for attaining mokaha. What she says is that in the long chain of reincarnations being born as a brahmin at least once is the requisite. It need not be the current one in which efforts are made for moksha. Thus according to her persons of all castes in the current birth have equal chance. Those of the aspirants that are not brahmins now could have been brahmins at least one in their earlier incarnations. I am unable to quote her authority. Those members who are well versed in scriptures could be able to put it better. According to her brahmin, in the scriptures mean, brahmin by birth only Ramana Sarma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 22, 2009 Report Share Posted June 22, 2009 Pranams Shastri-ji, Perhaps it is the sign of our times - of the Age of Kali (Kali Yuga)??  Sage Markandeya seems to have forecast this with remarkable insight in the Mahabharata, Vana Parva: " And Yudhishthira said,..I am filled with curiosity, however, in respect of what may happen in the Kali age. When morality and virtue will be at an end, what will remain there! And Markandeya said, '….In the dark age (of Kali), O thou best of the Bharata race, morality mixed with three parts of sin liveth by the side of men. Accordingly morality then is said to wait on men, with only a fourth part of itself remaining. ..And men with false reputation of learning will, by their acts, cause Truth to be concealed. .. in consequence of the littleness of their knowledge, they will have no wisdom. And for this, covetousness and avarice will overwhelm them all. And wedded to avarice and wrath and ignorance and lust men will entertain animosities towards one another...And Brahmanas and Kshatriyas and Vaisyas with their virtue contracted and divested of asceticism and truth will all be reduced to an equality with the Sudras..those men who are devoted to ceremonial rites…will be avaricious and will also appropriate and enjoy what belongs to others..those things will also be enjoyed by men in such times, the enjoyment of which hath been forbidden in the scriptures. And the Brahmanas, speaking disrespectfully of the Vedas, will not practise vows, and their understanding clouded by the science of disputation, they will no longer perform sacrifices and the Homa. And deceived by the false science of reasons, they will direct their hearts towards everything mean and low….. And the whole world will be filled with mleccha behaviour and notions and ceremonies, and sacrifices will cease and joy will be nowhere…men will cease to trust one another. And full of avarice and folly the whole world will have but one kind of food. And sin will increase and prosper, while virtue will fade and cease to flourish. And Brahmanas and Kshatriyas and Vaisyas will disappear, leaving, O king, no remnants of their orders. And all men towards the end of the Yuga will become members of one common order, without distinction of any kind…And at such a time men will seek those countries where wheat and barley form the staple food. And, O monarch, both men and women will become perfectly free in their behaviour .. the wife will never be content with her husband, nor the husband with his wife. And the possessions of men will never be much, and people will falsely bear the marks of religion, and jealousy and malice will fill the world. ..And people will, without compunction, destroy trees and gardens. .And when the end of the Yuga comes, everybody will be in want. .. "  How prophetic.  Hari OM Shyam    --- On Mon, 6/22/09, snsastri <sn.sastri wrote: snsastri <sn.sastri Re: A true Brahmin advaitin Monday, June 22, 2009, 2:19 AM Manu Smriti II.168 says-- " The Brahmana who without having studied the Veda in the proper way, labours after other things, falls, even in his present life, to the condition of a Sudra, together with his descendants " . I wonder how many of us qualify as Brahmins by this test. I certainly do not. Best wishes, S.N.sastri Recent Activity  7 New Members  1 New FilesVisit Your Group Finance It's Now Personal Guides, news, advice & more. Y! Messenger Group get-together Host a free online conference on IM. Mom Power Community just for Moms Join the discussion .. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 IMO - Bramin at this time are only for namesake and nothing more ? Even the ones who claim to preach or practice " pauruhatya " at present are nothing more than the what is best expressed in " uttar giitaa " yathaa kharaa ca.ndana-bhaara-waahii bhaarasya vettaa na tu saurabhasya | tathaa hi vipraH shruti-shaastra-puuraaNaH, dnyaanena hiinaH pashubhiH samaanaH || Uttara giitaa || .. Meaning (liberal)- Brahmin's who do not understand the significance of veda but merely recite them are nothing more than donkeys carrying the scandal wood. This situation existed even at the tine of Vyasa and that is precisely he penned mahaabhaarata. Kind regards, Dr. Yadu advaitin , Shyam <shyam_md wrote: > > Pranams Shastri-ji, > Perhaps it is the sign of our times - of the Age of Kali (Kali Yuga)?? >  > Sage Markandeya seems to have forecast this with remarkable insight in the Mahabharata, Vana Parva: > > " And Yudhishthira said,..I am filled with curiosity, however, in respect of what may happen in the Kali age. When morality and virtue will be at an end, what will remain there! > And Markandeya said, '….In the dark age (of Kali), O thou best of the Bharata race, morality mixed with three parts of sin liveth by the side of men. Accordingly morality then is said to wait on men, with only a fourth part of itself remaining. ..And men with false reputation of learning will, by their acts, cause Truth to be concealed. .. in consequence of the littleness of their knowledge, they will have no wisdom. And for this, covetousness and avarice will overwhelm them all. And wedded to avarice and wrath and ignorance and lust men will entertain animosities towards one another...And Brahmanas and Kshatriyas and Vaisyas with their virtue contracted and divested of asceticism and truth will all be reduced to an equality with the Sudras..those men who are devoted to ceremonial rites…will be avaricious and will also appropriate and enjoy what belongs to others..those things will also be enjoyed by men in such times, the enjoyment of which hath > been forbidden in the scriptures. And the Brahmanas, speaking disrespectfully of the Vedas, will not practise vows, and their understanding clouded by the science of disputation, they will no longer perform sacrifices and the Homa. And deceived by the false science of reasons, they will direct their hearts towards everything mean and low….. And the whole world will be filled with mleccha behaviour and notions and ceremonies, and sacrifices will cease and joy will be nowhere…men will cease to trust one another. And full of avarice and folly the whole world will have but one kind of food. And sin will increase and prosper, while virtue will fade and cease to flourish. And Brahmanas and Kshatriyas and Vaisyas will disappear, leaving, O king, no remnants of their orders. And all men towards the end of the Yuga will become members of one common order, without distinction of any kind…And at such a time men will seek those countries where wheat and > barley form the staple food. And, O monarch, both men and women will become perfectly free in their behaviour .. the wife will never be content with her husband, nor the husband with his wife. And the possessions of men will never be much, and people will falsely bear the marks of religion, and jealousy and malice will fill the world. ..And people will, without compunction, destroy trees and gardens. .And when the end of the Yuga comes, everybody will be in want. .. " >  > How prophetic. >  > Hari OM > Shyam >  >  >  > > --- On Mon, 6/22/09, snsastri <sn.sastri wrote: > > > snsastri <sn.sastri > Re: A true Brahmin > advaitin > Monday, June 22, 2009, 2:19 AM Manu Smriti II.168 says-- " The Brahmana who without having studied the Veda in the proper way, labours after other things, falls, even in his present life, to the condition of a Sudra, together with his descendants " . > I wonder how many of us qualify as Brahmins by this test. I certainly do not. > > Best wishes, > S.N.sastri > > > > Recent Activity > > >  7 > New Members > >  1 > New FilesVisit Your Group > > > > Finance > It's Now Personal > Guides, news, > advice & more. > > Y! Messenger > Group get-together > Host a free online > conference on IM. > > > Mom Power > Community just for Moms > Join the discussion > . > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 23, 2009 Report Share Posted June 23, 2009 advaitin , Shyam <shyam_md wrote: > > ..[snip].. And, O monarch, both men and women will become > perfectly free in their behaviour .. the wife will never be > content with her husband, nor the husband with his wife. And the > possessions of men will never be much, and people will falsely > bear the marks of religion, and jealousy and malice will fill the > world. ..And people will, without compunction, destroy trees and > gardens. .And when the end of the Yuga comes, everybody will be in > want. .. " Hari OM! Generally, people when they age start complaining how ruinous the younger generation is becoming every day, forgetting that is what they themselves heard from their ancestors in their youth! All that is mentioned, and even worse, was all along there in all yugas. Probably there is no to call something " Satya(Truth) yuga " if there does not exist any thing " asatya " (untruth). In yugas prior according to Puranas, Rakshasas swallowed and eat people live! Present seems far better with all the tragedies still. Shankara sang so eloquently " jIvO brahma eva na paraha " - individual soul itself is Brahman and no other. Importantly and interestingly, that declaration does not put conditions on its validity. Like Jiva is Brahman only in certain places or during certain times- it is just universal. On relative plane, when/if dualities torment, (swa)dharma continues to beckon us to do sadhana. ==================== Hari OM! -Srinivas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 sastri ji : I am a true shudran,despite by birth a jathi brahmana.Hope GOI will give me reservation status . suresh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 brilliant quote yadu ji. suresh. advaitin , " ymoharir " <ymoharir wrote: > > > IMO - Bramin at this time are only for namesake and nothing more ? > > Even the ones who claim to preach or practice " pauruhatya " at present are nothing more than the what is best expressed in " uttar giitaa " > > yathaa kharaa ca.ndana-bhaara-waahii bhaarasya vettaa na tu saurabhasya | > tathaa hi vipraH shruti-shaastra-puuraaNaH, dnyaanena hiinaH pashubhiH samaanaH || Uttara giitaa || > . > > Meaning (liberal)- Brahmin's who do not understand the significance of veda but merely recite them are nothing more than donkeys carrying the scandal wood. > > This situation existed even at the tine of Vyasa and that is precisely he penned mahaabhaarata. > > Kind regards, > > Dr. Yadu > > > advaitin , Shyam <shyam_md@> wrote: > > > > Pranams Shastri-ji, > > Perhaps it is the sign of our times - of the Age of Kali (Kali Yuga)?? > >  > > Sage Markandeya seems to have forecast this with remarkable insight in the Mahabharata, Vana Parva: > > > > " And Yudhishthira said,..I am filled with curiosity, however, in respect of what may happen in the Kali age. When morality and virtue will be at an end, what will remain there! > > And Markandeya said, '….In the dark age (of Kali), O thou best of the Bharata race, morality mixed with three parts of sin liveth by the side of men. Accordingly morality then is said to wait on men, with only a fourth part of itself remaining. ..And men with false reputation of learning will, by their acts, cause Truth to be concealed. .. in consequence of the littleness of their knowledge, they will have no wisdom. And for this, covetousness and avarice will overwhelm them all. And wedded to avarice and wrath and ignorance and lust men will entertain animosities towards one another...And Brahmanas and Kshatriyas and Vaisyas with their virtue contracted and divested of asceticism and truth will all be reduced to an equality with the Sudras..those men who are devoted to ceremonial rites…will be avaricious and will also appropriate and enjoy what belongs to others..those things will also be enjoyed by men in such times, the enjoyment of which hath > > been forbidden in the scriptures. And the Brahmanas, speaking disrespectfully of the Vedas, will not practise vows, and their understanding clouded by the science of disputation, they will no longer perform sacrifices and the Homa. And deceived by the false science of reasons, they will direct their hearts towards everything mean and low….. And the whole world will be filled with mleccha behaviour and notions and ceremonies, and sacrifices will cease and joy will be nowhere…men will cease to trust one another. And full of avarice and folly the whole world will have but one kind of food. And sin will increase and prosper, while virtue will fade and cease to flourish. And Brahmanas and Kshatriyas and Vaisyas will disappear, leaving, O king, no remnants of their orders. And all men towards the end of the Yuga will become members of one common order, without distinction of any kind…And at such a time men will seek those countries where wheat and > > barley form the staple food. And, O monarch, both men and women will become perfectly free in their behaviour .. the wife will never be content with her husband, nor the husband with his wife. And the possessions of men will never be much, and people will falsely bear the marks of religion, and jealousy and malice will fill the world. ..And people will, without compunction, destroy trees and gardens. .And when the end of the Yuga comes, everybody will be in want. .. " > >  > > How prophetic. > >  > > Hari OM > > Shyam > >  > >  > >  > > > > --- On Mon, 6/22/09, snsastri <sn.sastri@> wrote: > > > > > > snsastri <sn.sastri@> > > Re: A true Brahmin > > advaitin > > Monday, June 22, 2009, 2:19 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Manu Smriti II.168 says-- " The Brahmana who without having studied the Veda in the proper way, labours after other things, falls, even in his present life, to the condition of a Sudra, together with his descendants " . > > I wonder how many of us qualify as Brahmins by this test. I certainly do not. > > > > Best wishes, > > S.N.sastri > > > > > > > > Recent Activity > > > > > >  7 > > New Members > > > >  1 > > New FilesVisit Your Group > > > > > > > > Finance > > It's Now Personal > > Guides, news, > > advice & more. > > > > Y! Messenger > > Group get-together > > Host a free online > > conference on IM. > > > > > > Mom Power > > Community just for Moms > > Join the discussion > > . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 praNAms Hare Krishna Will it be possible for us to avoid single line mails with exclamations like : 'brilliant', 'fabulous', 'superb' 'thanks' etc. with a long tail of original mesg. ?? If at all we want to just show our gratitude & appreciation, that we can always do it directly to the originator of that mesg. is it not?? I dont know what is moderators' suggestion with regard to this.. Hari Hari Hari Bol!!! bhaskar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 Dear suresh, Let us not discuss not much on varna ashrama. Nobody is a true brahmin. The one who has mastered brahma vidya, established in brahmanuchintana, attained brahmi sthithi is only a brahmin. Frankly speaking how many dwijas are following the dharma prescribed in the veda, dharma sutras and manu smriti. A dwija should perform: 1) Nitya sandhya during 3 sandhyas 2) Devatarchana 3) Agnihotra 4) Nitya Aupasana 5) Brahma Yajna 6) Veda adhyayana 7) Sthalipaka every fortnight during new moon day 8) Should perform jyotishtoma / agnishtoma in atleast 2 years Apart from these: 1) He should not think of next day's meal 2) He should beg his food ie., madhukara 3) He should perform all the prayaschita karmas like chandrayana vrata if any lack of karma 4) He should not maintain bank balances 5) He should always bent upon teaching shastras and veda to the adhikaris 6) He should maintain shikha, kati sutra and yajnopavitha always 7) He should speak the truth, at any cost 8) He should have viveka and vairagya 9) He should be clean in character 10) He should never leave his Agni upasana and nityagni hotra 11) He should assimilate the essence of vedas and should dwelve in vedanta sutras 12) He should maintain sadachara (right conduct) These are some of the qualities of a brahmin and i am afraid only a handful of some dwijas can be found and my prostrations to them. So, let us not dwelve into the intricacies of brahminism too much lest we would go depressed. Let us try to hold the feet of Bhagavan Ramana, who is a TRUE BRAHMIN and abide IN HIM. Then we would also become a TRUE BRAHMIN as the sastra vakya says *brahma vid brahmaiva bhavati*. with regs, sriram --- On Thu, 25/6/09, sureshbalaraman <sureshbalaraman wrote: sureshbalaraman <sureshbalaraman Re: A true Brahmin advaitin Thursday, 25 June, 2009, 5:42 PM sastri ji : I am a true shudran,despite by birth a jathi brahmana.Hope GOI will give me reservation status . suresh. ICC World Twenty20 England & #39;09 exclusively on ! CRICKET http://cricket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 Dear yaduji, On the lighter note: There is a typo in the first line. " pauruhatya " ..... The meaning of a brahmin entirely changes with this typo which gives the meaning as *murderer*. It should be " paurohityam " . regs, sriram advaitin , " ymoharir " <ymoharir wrote: > > > IMO - Bramin at this time are only for namesake and nothing more ? > > Even the ones who claim to preach or practice " pauruhatya " at present are nothing more than the what is best expressed in " uttar giitaa " > > yathaa kharaa ca.ndana-bhaara-waahii bhaarasya vettaa na tu saurabhasya | > tathaa hi vipraH shruti-shaastra-puuraaNaH, dnyaanena hiinaH pashubhiH samaanaH || Uttara giitaa || > . > > Meaning (liberal)- Brahmin's who do not understand the significance of veda but merely recite them are nothing more than donkeys carrying the scandal wood. > > This situation existed even at the tine of Vyasa and that is precisely he penned mahaabhaarata. > > Kind regards, > > Dr. Yadu > > > advaitin , Shyam <shyam_md@> wrote: > > > > Pranams Shastri-ji, > > Perhaps it is the sign of our times - of the Age of Kali (Kali Yuga)?? > >  > > Sage Markandeya seems to have forecast this with remarkable insight in the Mahabharata, Vana Parva: > > > > " And Yudhishthira said,..I am filled with curiosity, however, in respect of what may happen in the Kali age. When morality and virtue will be at an end, what will remain there! > > And Markandeya said, '….In the dark age (of Kali), O thou best of the Bharata race, morality mixed with three parts of sin liveth by the side of men. Accordingly morality then is said to wait on men, with only a fourth part of itself remaining. ..And men with false reputation of learning will, by their acts, cause Truth to be concealed. .. in consequence of the littleness of their knowledge, they will have no wisdom. And for this, covetousness and avarice will overwhelm them all. And wedded to avarice and wrath and ignorance and lust men will entertain animosities towards one another...And Brahmanas and Kshatriyas and Vaisyas with their virtue contracted and divested of asceticism and truth will all be reduced to an equality with the Sudras..those men who are devoted to ceremonial rites…will be avaricious and will also appropriate and enjoy what belongs to others..those things will also be enjoyed by men in such times, the enjoyment of which hath > > been forbidden in the scriptures. And the Brahmanas, speaking disrespectfully of the Vedas, will not practise vows, and their understanding clouded by the science of disputation, they will no longer perform sacrifices and the Homa. And deceived by the false science of reasons, they will direct their hearts towards everything mean and low….. And the whole world will be filled with mleccha behaviour and notions and ceremonies, and sacrifices will cease and joy will be nowhere…men will cease to trust one another. And full of avarice and folly the whole world will have but one kind of food. And sin will increase and prosper, while virtue will fade and cease to flourish. And Brahmanas and Kshatriyas and Vaisyas will disappear, leaving, O king, no remnants of their orders. And all men towards the end of the Yuga will become members of one common order, without distinction of any kind…And at such a time men will seek those countries where wheat and > > barley form the staple food. And, O monarch, both men and women will become perfectly free in their behaviour .. the wife will never be content with her husband, nor the husband with his wife. And the possessions of men will never be much, and people will falsely bear the marks of religion, and jealousy and malice will fill the world. ..And people will, without compunction, destroy trees and gardens. .And when the end of the Yuga comes, everybody will be in want. .. " > >  > > How prophetic. > >  > > Hari OM > > Shyam > >  > >  > >  > > > > --- On Mon, 6/22/09, snsastri <sn.sastri@> wrote: > > > > > > snsastri <sn.sastri@> > > Re: A true Brahmin > > advaitin > > Monday, June 22, 2009, 2:19 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Manu Smriti II.168 says-- " The Brahmana who without having studied the Veda in the proper way, labours after other things, falls, even in his present life, to the condition of a Sudra, together with his descendants " . > > I wonder how many of us qualify as Brahmins by this test. I certainly do not. > > > > Best wishes, > > S.N.sastri > > > > > > > > Recent Activity > > > > > >  7 > > New Members > > > >  1 > > New FilesVisit Your Group > > > > > > > > Finance > > It's Now Personal > > Guides, news, > > advice & more. > > > > Y! Messenger > > Group get-together > > Host a free online > > conference on IM. > > > > > > Mom Power > > Community just for Moms > > Join the discussion > > . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 2009 Report Share Posted June 25, 2009 advaitin , " sriram " <sriram_sapthasathi wrote: > > Dear yaduji, > > On the lighter note: > > There is a typo in the first line. " pauruhatya " ..... > > The meaning of a brahmin entirely changes with this typo which gives the meaning as *murderer*. > > It should be " paurohityam " . > > regs, > sriram > > advaitin , " ymoharir " <ymoharir@> wrote: > > > > > > IMO - Bramin at this time are only for namesake and nothing more ? > > > > Even the ones who claim to preach or practice " pauruhatya " at present are nothing more than the what is best expressed in " uttar giitaa " > > > > yathaa kharaa ca.ndana-bhaara-waahii bhaarasya vettaa na tu saurabhasya | > > tathaa hi vipraH shruti-shaastra-puuraaNaH, dnyaanena hiinaH pashubhiH samaanaH || Uttara giitaa || > > . > > > > Meaning (liberal)- Brahmin's who do not understand the significance of veda but merely recite them are nothing more than donkeys carrying the scandal wood. > > > > This situation existed even at the tine of Vyasa and that is precisely he penned mahaabhaarata. > > > > Kind regards, > > > > Dr. Yadu > Dear Sriram: That was actually an intentional " TYPO " . I was hoping that someone will notice and inquire. The present day so called purohita (at least from last few generations)have literally killed our culture under the name of dharma. Their true interest was to only earn money and make themselves indispensable for the society. Unfortunately the cost for this was the " CULTURE " itself. Unfortunately some of the priests / pujaarii's arriving in the US and so pathetic it is not funny. Sage Atri despised such practices from " purohita " . Kind Regards, Dr. Yadu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 advaitin , " sureshbalaraman " <sureshbalaraman wrote: > > sastri ji : > > I am a true shudran,despite by birth a jathi brahmana.Hope GOI will give me reservation status . > > suresh. Dear Suresh-ji, This does not come within the scope of this List. But I agree with you that we are Brahmins only for being denied reservation. S.N.Sastri Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 Sriram ji: My understanding of Brahmana,Kshatriya,Vaishya,Shudra are four personality traits inherent in each every human being worldover,which gets its foundation from Saathwa,Raja,Tamasic - gunams. Varna verbatim may mean many things in different context,is my understanding. I think Lord Krishna,ultimately says surrender to me,i will look after your atma,which is my atma only,sarvam krishna mayam. Regards Suresh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 ok sastri ji,i will not stray into other topics dis-connected with list. Agnidevo dvijatinam Muninam hridi devatam Pratima svalpabuddhinam Sarvatra viditatmanam One who performs rituals, invokes god by fire worship, the learned pundit finds god in his own cavity of heart, the dull-witted seeks him in an icon, those with higher intellect see god in every thing. suresh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 26, 2009 Report Share Posted June 26, 2009 sitara ji : NA DEVO VIDDYATE KAASTH, NA PAASHAANE NA MRINMAYE || BHAAVO HI VIDDYATE DEVASTASMAADVBHAAVO HI KAARANAM || The deity neither dwells in a piece of wood or in a stone or clay model He dwells in one's faith these quotes are from Sage Chanakya from chanakya neethi. suresh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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