Some notes on Chapter 11 of Bhagavad Gita based on Advaitic Commentaries

[Guest guest]

Hari OM! Advaitin members,

 

Some notes on Chapter 11 of Bhagavad Gita based on Advaitic Commentaries

 

Reading Chapter 11 of Gita raises a lot of questions in the seeker:

" Who saw what and when and how? " . The following is a summary of the Advaitic

position as per my understanding of Shankara's and Madhusudana's

commentaries [1].

 

The post is rather long, but I believe that the subject is of interest to

everyone. The post has the complete translations by Swami Gambhirananda, of

all the verses used in the text, though it may help having a Gita copy at

hand. As always, corrections are welcome from members to correct my mistakes

or incorrect understandings.

 

(1) Arjuna's Vision

 

(i) What did he see?

 

The description by Arjuna of what he saw in the chapter matches the words in

Vedic purushha sUkta and the sUkta from taittarIya mahanArayaNa upanishhad,

commonly known as Narayana Sukta. (Incidentally, the Rishhi for the Rig

Vedic purushha sUkta (10.90) is nArAyaNa, with the devata being purushha!)

 

(ii) The vision of Arjuna had a beginning and end. Not the source:

 

Though it is commonly understood that the Lord shows His cosmic form to

Arjuna, it does not mean that the cosmic form had a beginning in time or

space or causality. The request by Arjuna made him see the eternal form of

saguNa brahman or Ishvara. Ishvara is anAdi (beginningless in time and

space) and exists without any other causal effect and is shaasvata as

extolled by Arjuna himself. Ishvara is the primal cause of everything else

and not caused by anything.

 

Thus, the granting of divine eyes (divya chakshu) by the Lord in 11.8 " I

grant you the supernatural eye " (divya.n dadaami te chakshuH) is the

beginning of Arjuna's vision and not of the Lord's Cosmic Form which is

eternal. The Lord Himself says at the end of chapter 10: " I *remain

sustaning* this whole creation in a special way with a part (of Myself) "

(ekaaa.nshena sthito jagat.h 10.42), and it is the whole that Arjuna desired

to see at the beginning of Chapter 11. The whole neither has a beginning nor

an end. The vision of the whole, depending on the limitations of seeker, and

his desires, has a beginning and end accordingly. These above two

statements have close relationship with the limitations of nAma-rUpa (name

and form) and the eternality, which is beyond nAma-rUpa.

 

(iii) The apparent cause of the cosmic form is Lord's maaya.

 

Further, Arjuna sees the form only because of Lord's yoga, with the word in

this context meaning mAya or divine power, or 'the power of accomplishing

the impossible' (meaning of aishvaram by Madhusudana). Twice does Lord

Krishna explain to Arjuna how he (Arjuna) could see the Cosmic Form. In

11.8, He says " behold My divine Yoga " (pashya me yogamaishvaram.h) while in

11.47 He says: " This form ... has been shown to you by Me through the power

of My own Yoga " (ruupaM paraM darshitamaatmayogaat.h). These two references

point out that it is maaya is Ishvara's cosmic power that is the material

cause for the Cosmic Form, while He (Ishvara) is the nimmita kaaraNa.

 

Lord Krishna briefly describes to Arjuna, in three verses 11.5-11.7 what

Arjuna would see. In 11.8, He explains to him what made the cosmic form

possible and then grants him the divine eyes. Here are the verses:

 

pashya me paartha ruupaaNi shatasho.atha sahasrashaH .

naanaavidhaani divyaani naanaavarNaakR^itiini cha .. 11.5..

 

O son of Prtha, behold My forms in (their) hundreds and in thousands, of

different kinds, celestial, and of various colours and shapes.

 

pashyaadityaanvasuun.hrudraanashvinau marutastathaa .

bahuunyadR^ishhTapuurvaaNi pashyaashcharyaaNi bhaarata .. 11.6..

 

See the Adiyas, the Vasus, the Rudras, the two Asvins and the Maruts. O

scion of the Bharata dynasty, behold also the many wonders not seen before.

 

ihaikastha.n jagatkR^itsnaM pashyaadya sacharaacharam.h .

mama dehe guDaakesha yachchaanyad.h drashhTumichchhasi .. 11.7..

 

See now, O gudakesa, O Gudakesa (Arjuna), the entire Universe together with

the moving and the non-moving, concentrated at the same place here in My

body, as also whatever else you would like to see.

 

na tu maa.n shakyase drashhTumanenaiva svachakshushhaa .

divya.n dadaami te chakshuH pashya me yogamaishvaram.h .. 11.8..

 

But you are not able to see Me merely with this eye of yours. I grant you

the supernatural eye; behold My divine Yoga.

 

(iv) If Arjuna's vision was limited, it was because of his desire:

 

In 11.7, Lord Krishna mysteriously says to (yachchaanyad.h

drashhTumichchhasi) that " He would would show Arjuna what ever else he would

like to see " . From this, we understand that the vishvarUpa that Arjuna sees

in this chapter is according to what Lord Krishna explains in the above

three verses (11.5-7) and according to what he (Arjuna) had *already*

desired in his mind to see. Shankara points out the above in his commentary

for 11.7 and hints at it in 11.26.

 

This is the reason for Arjuna being shown only a limited future, that too

only till the end of the war and its result. Though he was shown in

11.26-27, the death of the warriors of the opposite side, he was not shown

the coronation of Yudhishtara, or other later events like cosmic dissolution

as seen by Markandeya in Chapter 12 of Srimad Bhagavatham for example.

 

So, the other vishvarUpa-s seen by other devotees in mahAbhAratha/purANa-s

are different from this particular vishvarUpa only in this aspect. The same

vishvarUpa seen by different seekers, at different levels of Vedantic

maturity (adhikAra) from different source texts may be fallacious reasoning.

 

(v) Arjuna experiencing fear when he saw the vishvarUpa was because of the

fear of second entity:

 

Primarily we know the advaitic answers to the fear that Arjuna saw in other

beings (in 11.21, 11.23 or 11.36), or later experienced by himself (11.45).

It is the following Upanishadic statements " Fear indeed arises from a second

entity " (dvitIyAd vai bhayam bhavati Br. Up. 1.4.2) and " If he makes the

slightest differentiation in It, there is fear for him. That (Brahman)

becomes (the cause of) fear for knower (of differentiation) who does not

reflect " (etasminnudaramantaraM kurute atha tasya bhayaM bhavati tatveva

bhayaM vidushho.amanvaanasya tadapyeshha shloko bhavati Tai. Up. 2.7.1).

 

(2) What did 'others' see? (Others means devata-s (members of higher worlds:

indra, rudra-s and so on), the members of the three worlds, raakshasa-s and

Sanjaya)

 

In 11.20, Arjuna says that the three worlds saw the Cosmic Form and are

running away from it with fear.

 

dyaavaapR^ithivyoridamantara.n hi

vyaapta.n tvayaikena dishashcha sarvaaH .

dR^ishhTvaad.hbhutaM ruupamugra.n tavedaM

lokatrayaM pravyathitaM mahaatman.h .. 11.20..

 

Indeed, this intermediate space between heaven and earth as also all the

directions are pervaded by You alone. O exalted One, the three worlds are

struck with fear by seeing this strange, fearful form of Yours.

 

This is also supported by his words in verses 11.21-11.23 where Arjuna says

that the members of the three worlds (lokatrayaM), along with devata-s

(rudra-s, aaditya-s, vasu-s etc.), also saw the Cosmic Form.

 

amii hi tvaa.n surasaN^ghaa vishanti

kechidbhiitaaH praaJNjalayo gR^iNanti .

svastiityuktvaa maharshhisiddhasaN^ghaaH

stuvanti tvaa.n stutibhiH pushhkalaabhiH .. 11.21..

 

Those very groups of gods enter into You; struck with fear, some extol (You)

with joined palms. Groups of great sages and perfected beings praise You

with elaborate hymns,saying 'May it be well!'

 

 

rudraadityaa vasavo ye cha saadhyaa

vishveshvinau marutashchoshhmapaashcha .

gandharvayakshaasurasiddhasaN^ghaa

viikshante tvaa.n vismitaashchaiva sarve .. 11.22..

 

Those who are the Rudras, the Adityas, the Vasus and the Sadhyas [sadhyas:

A particular class of celestial beings.-V.S.A.], the Visve (-devas), the two

Asvins, the Maruts and the Usmapas, and hosts of Gandharvas, Yaksas, demons

and Siddhas-all of those very ones gaze at You, being indeed struck with

wonder.

 

 

ruupaM mahatte bahuvaktranetra.n

mahaabaaho bahubaahuurupaadam.h .

bahuudaraM bahuda.nshhTraakaraalaM

dR^ishhTvaa lokaaH pravyathitaastathaaham.h .. 11.23..

 

O mighty-armed One, seeing Your immense form with many mouths and eyes,

having numerous arms, thighs and feet, with many bellies, and fearful with

many teeth, the creatures are struck with terror, and so am I.

 

Further, Arjuna begins his well known prayer (verses 11.36-11.46) in verse

11.36 saying that raakshasa-s are running away from the Cosmic Form and the

siddha-s are praising Him. So, even here, he says that raakshasa-s (ones who

live in nether worlds) as well as devata-s saw the cosmic form.

 

sthaane hR^ishhiikesha tava prakiirtyaa

jagatprahR^ishhyatyanurajyate cha .

rakshaa.nsi bhiitaani disho dravanti

sarve namasyanti cha siddhasaN^ghaaH .. 11.36..

 

It is proper, O Hrsikesa, that the world becomes delighted and attracted by

Your praise; that the Raksasas, stricken with fear, run in all directions;

and that all the groups of the Siddhas bow down (toYou).

 

But, the above verses would raise the following question: why are others in

the three worlds, including the lower forms like raakshasa-s (11.36) are

able to see the Lord when Arjuna alone asked for it, and was gifted divya

chakshu-s (divine eyes) as a gift from Lord Krishna specifically for that

purpose? Also, how do the above verses go together with the following

verses, where Lord Krishna says that " this vision has not been seen by

anyone before (11.6) " , " the form has not been seen by anyone before other

than you (11.47) " , " the form is not achievable through any human effort

(like , veda-study, yaGYa, daana etc.) other than you (11.48) " , " this form,

which you have just seen is very difficult to see. Even deva-s are ever

desirous of a vision of this form " and again " not through any human effort

(veda study, tapa, daana etc.) can I be seen as you have seen me (11.53) " .

Here are the verses:

 

pashyaadityaanvasuun.hrudraanashvinau marutastathaa .

bahuunyadR^ishhTapuurvaaNi pashyaashcharyaaNi bhaarata .. 11.6..

 

See the Adiyas, the Vasus, the Rudras, the two Asvins and the Maruts. O

scion of the Bharata dynasty, behold also the many wonders not seen before.

 

 

mayaa prasannena tavaarjunedaM

ruupaM paraM darshitamaatmayogaat.h .

tejomayaM vishvamanantamaadya.n

yanme tvadanyena na dR^ishhTapuurvam.h .. 11.47..

 

Out of grace, O Arjuna, this supreme, radiant, Cosmic, infinite, primeval

form-which (form) of Mine has not been seen before by anyone other than you,

has been shown to you by Me through the power of My own Yoga.

 

 

na veda yaGYaadhyayanairna daanaiH

na cha kriyaabhirna tapobhirugraiH .

eva.nruupaH shakya ahaM nR^iloke

drashhTuM tvadanyena kurupraviira .. 11.48..

 

Not by the study of the Vedas and sacrifices, not by gifts, not even by

rituals, not by severe austerities can I, in this form, be perceived in the

human world by anyone ['By anyone who has not received My grace']. other

than you, O most valiant among the Kurus.

 

 

sudurdarshamidaM ruupaM dR^ishhTvaanasi yanmama .

devaa apyasya ruupasya nitya.n darshanakaaN^kshiNaH .. 11.52..

 

This form of Mine which you have seen is very difficult to see; even the

gods are ever desirous of a vision of this form.

 

 

naahaM vedairna tapasaa na daanena na chejyayaa .

shakya eva.nvidho drashhTuM dR^ishhTavaanasi maa.n yathaa ..

11.53..

 

Not through the Vedas, not by austerity, not by gifts, nor even by sacrifice

can I be seen in this form as you have seen Me.

 

 

Further, perplexing are the following statements from Advaitic Commentaries:

 

Shankara in His commentary for 11.6 notes that it is a form 'not seen

before-by you or anyone else in the human world'.

 

Further, He says in His commentary for 11.52 that " The idea is that though

they want to see, they have not seen in the way you have, nor will they

see! " (devaaH api asya mama rUpasya nityaM sarvadA darshanakAMkshiNaH,

darshanepsavopi na tvamiva drushhTavantaH, na drakshyanti cha iti

abhipraayaH).

 

Clearly, the word nitya in 'nitya.n darshanakaaN^kshiNaH' in the above verse

(11.52) has been interpreted by Shankara as meaning eternal or forever,

thereby meaning that the gods are forever desirous of the form. Madhusudana

also writes similarly.

 

Couple of questions arise (i) what was the need for the commentators to

interpret the nitya as forever (meaning eternally impossible) and (ii) how

can the commentary be interpreted along with their commentaries for 11.20-23

and 11.36-37, where it was interpreted that the other beings: celestial

beings or members of the three worlds or and members of the nether wordls,

saw the Cosmic form.

 

A simple interpretation is that the commentators read these verses

(11.52-53) in a pedagogic sense, implying that they are a eulogy of bhakti,

which has been extolled in 11.54-55 and thereby setting stage for the next

chapter of Gita (12), which has usually been called as bhakti-yoga. Here are

the verses:

 

bhaktyaa tvananyayaa shakya ahameva.nvidho.arjuna .

GYaatuM drashhTu.n cha tatvena praveshhTu.n cha para.ntapa .. 11.54..

 

But, O Arjuna, by single-minded devotion am I-in this form-able to be known

and seen in reality, and also be entered into, O destroyer of foes.

 

Tu, but, O Arjuna; bhaktya, by devotion-. Of what kind? To this the Lord

says: Ananyaya, by (that devotion which is ) single-minded. That is called

single-minded devotion which does not turn to anything else other than the

Lord, and owing to which nothing else but Vasudeva is perceived by all the

organs. With that devotion, aham sakyah, am I able; evamvidhah, in this

form-in the aspect of the Cosmic form; jnatum, to to known-from the

scriptures; not merely to be known from the scriptures, but also drastum, to

be seen , to be realized directly; tattvena, in reality; and also pravestum,

to be entered into-for attaining Liberation; parantapa, O destroyer of foes.

 

matkarmakR^inmatparamo madbhaktaH saN^gavarjitaH .

nirvairaH sarvabhuuteshhu yaH sa maameti paaNDava .. 11.55..

 

O son of Pandu, he who works for Me, accepts Me as the supreme Goal, is

devoted to Me, is devoid of attachment and free from enmity towards all

beings-he attains Me.

 

Such an explanation would also go along with the eulogical terms with which

Shankara has introduced 11.55 " essential purport of the whole scripture, the

Gita, which is meant for Liberation, is being stated by summing it up so

that it may be practised "

 

But a deeper meaning of Shankara's words in the commentary for 11.52 may

have to do with Cosmic maaya using which Lord Krishna has shown the divine

form. As written above, twice does Lord Krishna say that it is due to His

maaya alone that He has been able to show the Cosmic Form. So, though Lord

Krishna may have allowed for Arjuna to extoll him by saying that the Cosmic

Form has been seen by others too, actually, from a pAramArthic point of

view (Krishna's point of view), after the Cosmic Form has been withdrawn, it

is just a magic-show or drama, for Lord Krishna, with He being the divine

magician or actor!!! Ths spirit is much alike the verse 2 of Shri

Dakshinamurthy stotram: " by whose magic this was transformed (manifested) in

various forms, by His own will similar to a great-yogi's " (maayaaviiva

vijR^imbhayatyapi mahaayogiiva yaH svechchhayaa). Hence, Shankara's and

Madhusudana's commentaries for 11.52-53, along with their commentaries for

the earlier verses 11.20-23 and 11.36 are completely justified and are true

to the actual spirit of Advaita which Lord Krishna was teaching all along.

 

(ii) Sanjaya's vision: This is a very easy as explained by Sanjaya's account

to Dhritarastra at the end of chapter 18 (18.77), where he clearly says that

he is " rejoicing by repeatedly recollecting the extraordinary form of hari "

(adbhuta-rUpam), which could only mean the Cosmic Form.

 

tachcha sa.nsmR^itya sa.nsmR^itya ruupamatyadbhutaM hareH .

vismayo me mahaanraajanhR^ishhyaami cha punaH punaH .. 18.77..

 

O king, repeatedly recollecting that greatly extraordinary form of Hari, I

am struck with wonder. And I rejoice again and again.

 

And, rajan, O King; samsmrtya samsmrtya, repeatedly recollecting; tat, that;

ati-adbhutam, greatly extraordinary; rupam, form, the Cosmic form; hareh, of

Hari; mahan vismayah me, I am struck with great wonder. And hrsyami, I

rejoice; punah punah, again and again.

 

(3) What are the various forms that Lord Krishna takes in Gita

 

First of all, we should note that Lord Krishna is aatma and truly beyond

forms and anything that follows in this section is merely a textual

interpretation.

 

Lord Krishna, who was initially in the normal human form (with normal for

Lord Krishna, may not being the same as normal for humans) at the beginning

of the teaching, chapters 1-10 showed the cosmic form in Chapter 11 and

resumed to His " divine form " (deva-rUpam) or " form with four hands "

(chaturbhuja-rUpam), as requested by Arjuna in 11.46. The narrator Sanjaya

says that the Lord took a " serene form " (saumya-rUpam) and later in 11.51,

Arjuna says that he is pacified by seeing the human form 'maanusha rUpam'.

So perhaps there was a quick transition from Cosmic Form to divine-form (or

chaturbhuja-form) to human form. (I have used Swami Shri

Vidyaprakashananda's suggestion in annotating the rUpam in 11.45 with the

word deva, which is different from Swami Gambhirananda's translation below.)

Here are the verses:

 

arjuna uvaacha .

 

adR^ishhTapuurva.n hR^ishhito.asmi dR^ishhTvaa

bhayena cha pravyathitaM mano me .

tadeva me darshaya deva ruupaM

prasiida devesha jagannivaasa .. 11.45..

 

I am delighted by seeing something not seen heretofore, and my mind is

stricken with fear. O Lord, show me that very form; O supreme God, O Abode

of the Universe, be gracious!

 

kiriiTinaM gadina.n chakrahastaM

ichchhaami tvaa.n drashhTumahaM tathaiva .

tenaiva ruupeNa chaturbhujena

sahasrabaaho bhava vishvamuurte .. 11.46..

 

I want to see You just as before, wearing a crown, wielding a mace, and

holding a disc in hand. O You with thousand arms, O You of Cosmic form,

appear with that very form with four hands.

 

shriibhagavaanuvaacha .

 

maa te vyathaa maa cha vimuuDhabhaavo

dR^ishhTvaa ruupaM ghoramiidR^iN^.hmamedam.h .

vyapetabhiiH priitamanaaH punastva.n

tadeva me ruupamidaM prapashya .. 11.49..

 

May you have no fear, and may not there be bewilderment by seeing this

form of Mine so terrible Becoming free from fear and gladdened in mind

again, see this very earlier form of Mine.

 

sa.njaya uvaacha .

 

ityarjunaM vaasudevastathoktvaa

svakaM ruupaM darshayaamaasa bhuuyaH .

aashvaasayaamaasa cha bhiitamenaM

bhuutvaa punaH saumyavapurmahaatmaa .. 11.50..

 

Thus, having spoken to Arjuna in that manner, Vasudeva showed His own form

again. And He, the exalted One, reassured this terrified one by again

becoming serene in form.

 

arjuna uvaacha .

 

dR^ishhTvedaM maanushhaM ruupaM tava saumya.n janaardana .

idaaniimasmi sa.nvR^ittaH sachetaaH prakR^iti.n gataH .. 11.51..

 

O Janardana, having seen this serene human form of Yours, I have now become

calm in mind and restored to my own nature.

 

kiriiTinaM gadina.n chakrahastaM

ichchhaami tvaa.n drashhTumahaM tathaiva .

tenaiva ruupeNa chaturbhujena

sahasrabaaho bhava vishvamuurte .. 11.46..

 

I want to see You just as before, wearing a crown, wielding a mace, and

holding a disc in hand. O You with thousand arms, O You of Cosmic form,

appear with that very form with four hands.

 

praNAm-s to all Advaitins

Om vishvarUpAya namaH

Ramakrishna

 

[1] This notes was primarily prepared as manana and for posting on a forum,

whose motivation (according to my understanding) was to discuss the

differences in bhaashya-s among intra-vedantic schools. Sadly,

the gross mis-representation of advaitic position made me leave the group.

[Guest guest]

Namaste Advaitins,

 

advaitin , " Ramakrishna Upadrasta " <uramakrishna

wrote:

 

> (3) What are the various forms that Lord Krishna takes in Gita

>

> First of all, we should note that Lord Krishna is aatma and truly beyond

> forms and anything that follows in this section is merely a textual

> interpretation.

 

Also, just wanted to note that Arjuna in his prayer, when he asks for

apology for referring to Lord Krishna as kRishhNa, yaadava and sakha, is

recognizing that Lord Krishna is aatma, who is truly beyond forms,

in the true spirit of verses 7.24 and 9.11. Here are the verses.

 

 

sakheti matvaa prasabhaM yaduktaM

he kR^ishhNa he yaadava he sakheti .

ajaanataa mahimaanaM tavedaM

mayaa pramaadaatpraNayena vaa.api .. 11.41..

 

Without knowing this greatness of Yours, whatever was said by me (to You)

rashly, through inadvertence or even out of intimacy, thinking (You to be) a

friend, addressing (You) as 'O krsna,' 'O Yadava,' 'O friend,' etc.-.

 

avyaktaM vyaktimaapannaM manyante maamabuddhayaH .

paraM bhaavamajaananto mamaavyayamanuttamam.h .. 7.24..

 

The unintelligent, unaware of My supreme state which is immutable and

unsurpassable, think of Me as the unmanifest that has become manifest.

 

avajaananti maaM muuDhaa maanushhii.n tanumaashritam.h .

paraM bhaavamajaananto mama bhuutamaheshvaram.h .. 9.11..

 

Not knowing My supreme nature as the Lord of all beings, foolish people

disregard Me who have taken a human body.

 

praNAms to all Advaitins

Ramakrishna

[Guest guest]

advaitin , " Ramakrishna Upadrasta " <uramakrishna

wrote:

>

> Hari OM! Advaitin members,

>

> Some notes on Chapter 11 of Bhagavad Gita based on Advaitic Commentaries

>

> (v) Arjuna experiencing fear when he saw the vishvarUpa was because of the

> fear of second entity:

>

> Primarily we know the advaitic answers to the fear that Arjuna saw in other

> beings (in 11.21, 11.23 or 11.36), or later experienced by himself (11.45).

> It is the following Upanishadic statements " Fear indeed arises from a second

> entity " (dvitIyAd vai bhayam bhavati Br. Up. 1.4.2) and " If he makes the

> slightest differentiation in It, there is fear for him. That (Brahman)

> becomes (the cause of) fear for knower (of differentiation) who does not

> reflect " (etasminnudaramantaraM kurute atha tasya bhayaM bhavati tatveva

> bhayaM vidushho.amanvaanasya tadapyeshha shloko bhavati Tai. Up. 2.7.1).

 

 

Dear Ramakrishna ji,

 

Actually, one need not go to the extent of taking the vedantic basis for fear:

ignorance. Even otherwise, Bhagavan's revealing of the vishvarUpa is

predominantly in the kAla, Time, form. He Himself says this: KAlosmi...I am

Time. Time means destruction, of everything in the cosmos, micro and macro.

This aspect of the Divine makes everyone terrified. It is the terrible face of

Divinity that the Lord is showing Arjuna and this evokes fear in him. He sees

destruction all over, in varied forms and modes.

 

 

 

 

> (2) What did 'others' see? (Others means devata-s (members of higher worlds:

> indra, rudra-s and so on), the members of the three worlds, raakshasa-s and

> Sanjaya)

>

> In 11.20, Arjuna says that the three worlds saw the Cosmic Form and are

> running away from it with fear.

>

 

> Those very groups of gods enter into You; struck with fear, some extol (You)

> with joined palms. Groups of great sages and perfected beings praise You

> with elaborate hymns,saying 'May it be well!'

>

>> Those who are the Rudras, the Adityas, the Vasus and the Sadhyas [sadhyas:

> A particular class of celestial beings.-V.S.A.], the Visve (-devas), the two

> Asvins, the Maruts and the Usmapas, and hosts of Gandharvas, Yaksas, demons

> and Siddhas-all of those very ones gaze at You, being indeed struck with

> wonder.

>

> >

> O mighty-armed One, seeing Your immense form with many mouths and eyes,

> having numerous arms, thighs and feet, with many bellies, and fearful with

> many teeth, the creatures are struck with terror, and so am I.

 

 

> But, the above verses would raise the following question: why are others in

> the three worlds, including the lower forms like raakshasa-s (11.36) are

> able to see the Lord when Arjuna alone asked for it, and was gifted divya

> chakshu-s (divine eyes) as a gift from Lord Krishna specifically for that

> purpose? Also, how do the above verses go together with the following

> verses, where Lord Krishna says that " this vision has not been seen by

> anyone before (11.6) " , " the form has not been seen by anyone before other

> than you (11.47) " , " the form is not achievable through any human effort

> (like , veda-study, yaGYa, daana etc.) other than you (11.48) " , " this form,

> which you have just seen is very difficult to see. Even deva-s are ever

> desirous of a vision of this form " and again " not through any human effort

> (veda study, tapa, daana etc.) can I be seen as you have seen me (11.53) " .

> Here are the verses:

>

 

Actually, Arjuna alone saw the Cosmic form. Bhagavan agreed to show him that

form and in a way that Arjuna could know and appreciate it. This could be best

done only the way He did it: By making Arjuna 'feel' what 'happens' in the

Cosmos. For this Bhagavan could not have shown him something like a painting on

a canvas, a static vision consisting of oceans, mountains, planets, etc. Indeed

the cosmos is not a static one; its dynamic nature is mind-boggling. Most of

us, earthly beings, can't even estimate the scale of such dynamism. Constantly

destruction is taking place, at various levels. To show this aspect Bhagavan

shows a vision where the parties to such destruction are also present. Hence

Arjuna sees several others who are also overwhelmed with fear of the Cosmic

level of destruction. When Arjuna sees this first-hand experience of all

elements in the cosmos being subject to such a terror, he could get an estimate

of what cosmos really means.

 

To appreciate that ONLY Arjuna saw the vision, we may take this example: I am

lying on my bed and dreaming that I am in a stadium watching a football match.

There are hundreds of spectators, like me, seated on the gallery around the

field. People are cheering, jeering, waving, etc. at the players. All this I

see in the dream. I see myself also as one among those hundreds.

 

Did the hundreds of people really experience the match of MY dream? Certainly

no. If I were to wake up and ask a friend whom I saw in the dream about the

match, he would only laugh at me. Thus, in my dream, I see several others

watching the match, even as I watch the match. Arjuna's vishvarupa viewing is

just like this. He stood 'outside' the vision (on the battle field,

Kurukshetra) and yet saw himself as part of the vision, with several others also

inside the vision. This way, he could see for himself the kind of fear the Time

element of the Divine causes to so many beings in the cosmos.

 

Thus, Arjuna alone saw the Vision.

 

P.S: A few years ago I had got the same question that you have stated about the

'others also seeing the Cosmic Form'. A Mahatma explained to me with the

clarification. It is on those lines that I have replied above.

 

Pranams,

subbu

[Guest guest]

Respected Sri Subbuji,

 

advaitin , " subrahmanian_v " <subrahmanian_v wrote:

>

> advaitin , " Ramakrishna Upadrasta " <uramakrishna@>

wrote:

 

> To appreciate that ONLY Arjuna saw the vision, we may take this example: I am

lying on my bed and dreaming that I am in a stadium watching a football match.

There are hundreds of spectators, like me, seated on the gallery around the

field. People are cheering, jeering, waving, etc. at the players. All this I

see in the dream. I see myself also as one among those hundreds.

>

> Did the hundreds of people really experience the match of MY dream? Certainly

no. If I were to wake up and ask a friend whom I saw in the dream about the

match, he would only laugh at me. Thus, in my dream, I see several others

watching the match, even as I watch the match. Arjuna's vishvarupa viewing is

just like this. He stood 'outside' the vision (on the battle field,

Kurukshetra) and yet saw himself as part of the vision, with several others also

inside the vision. This way, he could see for himself the kind of fear the Time

element of the Divine causes to so many beings in the cosmos.

>

> Thus, Arjuna alone saw the Vision.

 

The analogy doesnt seem to suit the occasion. Comparing the state of Arjuna

with Divya-chakshus and dreaming of a foot-ball match in my bed just doesnt

jell.

 

The analogy also doesnt answer how Sanjaya saw the cosmic vision. It is Sanjaya

who is narrating the Maha-Bharata, and if only Arjuna saw the cosmic vision and

none other, how come Sanjaya is reproducing the vision to us?

 

Did Arjuna see himself both inside the vishwa-roopa and outside? Is it clearly

pointed out in Gita or MB? If so, can you please provide the relevant sloka?

 

With warm regards,

 

narayan

 

>> Pranams,

> subbu

>

[Guest guest]

Namaste Shri Subbu-ji,

 

Thanks for the comments and explanation from the mahAtma-s.

 

advaitin , " subrahmanian_v " <subrahmanian_v

wrote:

>

> advaitin , " Ramakrishna Upadrasta " <uramakrishna@>

> wrote:

> >

> > (v) Arjuna experiencing fear when he saw the vishvarUpa was because of

> > the fear of second entity:

> >

> > Primarily we know the advaitic answers to the fear that Arjuna saw in

> > other beings (in 11.21, 11.23 or 11.36), or later experienced by himself

> > (11.45). It is the following Upanishadic statements " Fear indeed arises

> > from a second entity " (dvitIyAd vai bhayam bhavati Br. Up. 1.4.2) and

> > " If he makes the slightest differentiation in It, there is fear for him.

> > That (Brahman) becomes (the cause of) fear for knower (of

> > differentiation) who does not reflect " (etasminnudaramantaraM kurute

> > atha tasya bhayaM bhavati tatveva bhayaM vidushho.amanvaanasya

> > tadapyeshha shloko bhavati Tai. Up. 2.7.1).

>

>

> Actually, one need not go to the extent of taking the vedantic basis for

> fear: ignorance. Even otherwise, Bhagavan's revealing of the vishvarUpa

> is predominantly in the kAla, Time, form. He Himself says this:

> KAlosmi...I am Time. Time means destruction, of everything in the cosmos,

> micro and macro. This aspect of the Divine makes everyone terrified. It

> is the terrible face of Divinity that the Lord is showing Arjuna and this

> evokes fear in him. He sees destruction all over, in varied forms and

> modes.

 

Agree with what you have said, though I see no difference between

bhaya and avidya, when they have manifest forms. Perhaps bhaya manifests

more as vikshepa with avidya is more of the nature of aavaraNa, but as a

seeker there is no difference.

 

Further, I see what the Lord says in verse 11.32 as His summarization of two

of His vibhuuti-s, as explained in chapter 10: " I am Time among reckoners of

time " (kaalaH kalayataamaham.h in 10.30) and " I am Death, the destroyer of

all " (mR^ityuH sarvaharashchaa in 10.34).

 

 

> > (2) What did 'others' see? (Others means devata-s (members of higher

> > worlds: indra, rudra-s and so on), the members of the three worlds,

> > raakshasa-s and Sanjaya)

> >

 

> Thus, Arjuna alone saw the Vision.

 

This goes well with my understanding too from the readings of

advaitic commentaries. The Cosmic Vision of Arjuna is a result of Lord

Krishna's maaya and shown specifically to Arjuna as Lord Krishna

Himself says.

 

One reason for this clarification is the following: an opponent Vedantic

school (in this case, dvaitins: who seem to be the topic of the month!) seem

to think that Shankara's commentaries in the two sets of places (11.20-23

and 11.37 vs. 11.6 and 11.47-53) are contradictory. According to their

theology, gods (sura-s: rudra-s, aaditya-s, vasu-s and so on), are of higher

spiritual power, and hence could actually *see* the Cosmic Form, along with

Arjuna. Also, their commentaries interpret the nitya in 'nitya.n

darshanakaaN^kshiNaH' of 11.52 as meaning ever desirous.

 

My understanding, after reading Shankara's commentaries is the dvaitin

interpretation is correct, but incomplete. Further, their interpreting

Shankara's commentary as inconsistent stems from the (usual?) incorrect

understanding of mAya!!!

 

Om vishvarUpAya namaH!

praNAm-s to all Advaitins

Ramakrishna

[Guest guest]

Thus, Arjuna alone saw the Vision.

praNAms Sri Subbu prabhuji

Hare Krishna

I think alongwith Arjuna, the 'live' commentator of kurukshetra, 'Sanjaya'

also has seen this vishvarUpa of the lord through the jnAna chakshu!!

That he himself exclaims in 18:77 taccha saMsmrutya saMsmrtya rUpaM

atyatbhutaM hareH vismayO me mahAn rAjan, hrushyAmi cha punaH punaH..(

remembering the most wonderful form of the lord again & again, great is my

wonder and I rejoice over and over again!!!

Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!

bhaskar

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

advaitin , Bhaskar YR <bhaskar.yr wrote:

>

> Thus, Arjuna alone saw the Vision. praNAms Sri Subbu prabhuji

> Hare Krishna

> I think alongwith Arjuna, the 'live' commentator of kurukshetra, 'Sanjaya'

> also has seen this vishvarUpa of the lord through the jnAna chakshu!!

> That he himself exclaims in 18:77 taccha saMsmrutya saMsmrtya rUpaM

 

Namaste Shri Bhaskar-ji,

 

I think what Sanjaya also had is divya-chakshuH (divine-eyes), though

granted by bhagavAn-vyAsa. They are different from GYAna-chakshuH (eyes of

wisdom), with the latter interpreted in the sense of 13.35 and 15.10.

Here are the verses and the relevant notes from Shankara's commentary.

 

kshetrakshetraGYayorevamantaraM GYaanachakshushhaa .

bhuutaprakR^itimoksha.n cha ye viduryaanti te param.h .. 13.35..

 

Those who know thus through the eye of wisdom the distinction between the

field and the Knower of the field, and the annihilation of the Matrix of

beings,-they reach the Supreme.

 

utkraamantaM sthitaM vaa.api bhu.njaanaM vaa guNaanvitam.h .

vimuuDhaa naanupashyanti pashyanti GYaanachakshushhaH .. 15.10..

 

jnana-caksusa, through the eye of wisdom-the eye is the realization in the

form of the knowledge of the Self, which arises from following the

instructions of the scriptures and teachers; through that eye of wisdom;

 

Persons who are diversely deluded do not see it even when it is leaving or

residing (in this body), or experiencing, or in association with the

qualities. Those with the eye of knowledge see.

 

jnana-caksusah, who have the eye of knowledge, [Jnana-caksuh means the

scriptures supported by reasoning, which are the means of knowledge.] who

have the insight of under-standing which has arisen from the valid means of

knowledge, i.e., those having a clear vision; pasyanti, see this one.

 

Kindly clarify if you used the term in another sense.

praNAmaH to all Advaitins

Ramakrishna

[Guest guest]

Kindly clarify if you used the term in another sense.

praNAms

Hare Krishna

I think you can replace the word jnAna chakshu with divya drushti, if the

former is strictly meant Atma jnAna. But what I am trying to say here is

Arjuna is not the only witness of vishvarUpa, but sanjaya also saw this,

vividly remembered and cherished those moments of gigantic show !!

Hari Hari Hari Bol!!!

bhaskar

 

 

[Guest guest]

Namaste:

 

Just before the Janmashtami, it is very appropriate to read chapter 11, " The

Cosmic Vision. " It is nice of Sri Ramakrishna to share his notes. Those who

are interested to overview this chapter can access the list archives and revisit

the Gita Satsangh discussions during September 2007 to the end of March 2008.

Here are the two verses 47 and 48 where Lord Krishna makes two important points:

(1) Only with God's grace one can experience the Cosmic Vision and (2) The

vision can't be achievable merely by the study of the scriptures, or by

sacrifices, gifts, rituals and austerities.

 

Here are these two verses along with my notes with explanations:

Sri Bhagavaan Uvaacha

 

Mayaa prasannena tavaarjunedam Roopam param darshitamaatmayogaat;

Tejomayam vishwamanantamaadyam Yanme twadanyena na drishtapoorvam.

 

The Blessed Lord said:

47. Out of grace, O Arjuna, this supreme, radiant, Cosmic, infinite, primeval

form-which (form) of Mine has not been seen before by anyone other than you, has

been shown to you by Me through the power of My own Yoga.

 

Na vedayajnaadhyayanairna daanair Na cha kriyaabhirna tapobhirugraih;

Evam roopah shakya aham nriloke Drashtum twadanyena karupraveera.

 

48. Not by the study of the Vedas and sacrifices, not by gifts, not even by

rituals, not by severe austerities can I, in this form, be perceived in the

human world by anyone ['By anyone who has not received My grace'. other than

you, O most valiant among the Kurus.

 

Notes for Verse 47

Lord Krishna acknowledged the devotion Arjuna bore towards Him and the fervent

prayer that he addressed to Him (in verses 3 and 4 of this chapter) had moved

His heart, and it was with a view to enlightening him about His own virtues,

glory and truth that He had mercifully shown His Transcendent form. Lord Krishna

understood the anxiety in the facial expression of Arjuna and the verbal

utterance of the adjective `Maya.'

 

The compound word `Atmayogat' denotes that the Cosmic Body of the Lord could

not be perceived by all and at all times. It could be seen only when the Divine

facilitates His vision through His own power of Yoga. Also those who are gifted

with the Divine Vision granted by the Divine will only be able to see the Cosmic

Body. This is one of the greatest privileges and it is available only to the

chosen Devote.

 

The use of the adjectives `Idam', `Param', `Tejomayam', `Adyam', `Anantam' and

`Visvam' with the substantive `Rupam' is intended to bring home to Arjuna the

greatness of His Transcendent Cosmic Body. The Lord thus told Arjuna that the

form in which He appeared before him was an Infinite Mass of Divine-luster

without limits and bounds exhibiting all Creations that Existed before, Exists

now and will happen in the future. What Arjuna saw was a Visual Display of the

Past, the Present and Future of the entire Cosmos. Actually what he could grasp

was an infinitesimal fraction of the Divine.

 

There was a world of difference between the Cosmic forms revealed by Sri Krishna

to mother Yashoda in His own mouth and to Bhisma and others in the court of the

Kauravas, on the one hand, and the Cosmic Body revealed on this occasion to

Arjuna. All these three forms have been described differently in Bhagavatham,

Mahabharat and Bhagavad Gita. . In the form revealed to Arjuna Bhisma, Drona and

the other heroes were seen entering the flaming mouths of the Lord. Such a

Cosmic form was never shown by the Lord to anyone before. Thus there is no

contradiction in the above statement of the Lord.

 

Notes for Verse 48

Study of the Vedas with all the supplementary sciences and other auxiliary

branches of Knowledge under a qualified teacher well-versed in the Vedic lore,

and thoroughly grasping their meaning is called `Vedadhyayana.' Even so

receiving instruction in the various rituals from teachers skilled in the

performance of sacrifices, and acquiring practical knowledge of the same by

attending sacrifices performed with due ceremony under the supervision of such

teachers is known as `Yajnadhyayana'.

 

`Dana' consists in gifting to another, with due regard to the latter's

qualifications one's wealth or other possessions, food, water, knowledge,

cattle, land etc, with a cheerful heart for the recipient's benefit and

enjoyment. Performing sacrifices enjoined by the Vedas and Smrti texts, and all

other pursuits sanctioned by the scriptures and followed for the sake of

discharging one's duty as prescribed by one's Varna or grade in society and

Asrama or stage in life are covered by the term `Kriya'.

 

Observing fasts recommended in the Sastras under the name of `Krcchra' and

`Candrayana' etc, and other stringent rules of life, subduing the mind and

senses with strong determination and reason, undergoing severe bodily and mental

suffering for the sake of one's duty, and various other forms of askes is

undertaken in accordance with the scriptural ordinance-all these are included

under the category of `austere penances.' Recent scientific investigative

studies on the benefits of fasting and controlled and reduced food undertakings

on prescribed dates of the months show positive health benefits. The Sastras's

prescribed purification is not limited to only mind and intellect but also our

body.

 

Declaring that it was impossible to obtain a vision of His Cosmic Body through

the above practices, and thereby revealing its transcendent glory the Lord

congratulates Arjuna on his being able, through His own grace and goodwill, to

behold the Form which could not be seen by any other means. The feelings of

fear, agony and bewilderment etc, obsessing Arjuna's mind at that moment were,

therefore, altogether, inopportune and unjustified.

 

Only blessed few among the human beings get the aptitude to study the Vedas and

rituals, practice charity, perform penance and undertake various other forms of

activities. And it is through the human body alone that one acquires various

other qualifications by performing fresh actions of various kinds. All beings

other than the humans (plants and animals) follow the laws of nature (their

destiny). The use of the word `Nrloke' is intended to bring out this glory of

the mortal world. The intention is to point out that when that Form of the Lord

cannot be seen by anybody through just by practices alone! What the Lord says

that the Grace of the Lord is not like a college diploma, after successful

completion of academic courses prescribed by the University. By addressing

Arjuna as `Kurupravira' the Lord shows that Arjuna was the greatest hero of the

Kuru race, and it was unbecoming of a hero like him to entertain fear. It seems

that Franklin Roosevelt had understood Lord Krishna's statement by this

declaration: " the only thing that we have to fear is fear itself! "

 

With my warm regards,

 

Ram Chandran

 

 

advaitin , " Ramakrishna Upadrasta " <uramakrishna

wrote:

>

>

[Guest guest]

advaitin , " Ramakrishna Upadrasta " <uramakrishna

wrote:

>

> Namaste Shri Subbu-ji,

>

> Thanks for the comments and explanation from the mahAtma-s.

>

>

> > >

>

> > Thus, Arjuna alone saw the Vision.

>

> This goes well with my understanding too from the readings of

> advaitic commentaries. The Cosmic Vision of Arjuna is a result of Lord

> Krishna's maaya and shown specifically to Arjuna as Lord Krishna

> Himself says.

>

> One reason for this clarification is the following: an opponent Vedantic

> school (in this case, dvaitins: who seem to be the topic of the month!) seem

> to think that Shankara's commentaries in the two sets of places (11.20-23

> and 11.37 vs. 11.6 and 11.47-53) are contradictory. According to their

> theology, gods (sura-s: rudra-s, aaditya-s, vasu-s and so on), are of higher

> spiritual power, and hence could actually *see* the Cosmic Form, along with

> Arjuna. Also, their commentaries interpret the nitya in 'nitya.n

> darshanakaaN^kshiNaH' of 11.52 as meaning ever desirous.

>

> My understanding, after reading Shankara's commentaries is the dvaitin

> interpretation is correct, but incomplete. Further, their interpreting

> Shankara's commentary as inconsistent stems from the (usual?) incorrect

> understanding of mAya!!!

>

> Om vishvarUpAya namaH!

> praNAm-s to all Advaitins

> Ramakrishna

>

 

Dear Ramakrishna ji,

 

Personally I see no contradiction in Shankara's commentary for the sets of

verses you have cited.

 

In 11.6 the Lord says what all you will be seeing in this vision; a preview !!

sort of. This includes Adityas, Rudras, etc. Thus, 'in' the vision that the

Lord proposes to show Arjuna, these entities, super-human, divine they are, are

also members. And how should the Lord show them? Just sitting or meditating?

He has proposed to show His terrible Time form and to bring out the effect in

the most impactable (?) way, He has to show how EVEN super-human Divinities

react to His KAla form. If this aspect is not there in the vision, the vision

itself would be devoid of the 'terror' aspect and would have failed to make the

kind of impact on Arjuna that it did. Supposing an IAS officer wants to show a

new subordinate what respect he commands in public. He can give him a video

tape of a big loan-mela sort of gathering where a number of officials,

politicians, bank officers, etc. are assembled and how they conducted themselves

towards this Officer.

 

Krishna was showing Arjuna a vision where so many divinities are expressing

various emotions like fear, wonderment, elation, deep respect to the Lord, etc.

This does not mean or demand that all these divinities simultaneously had the

very vision that Arjuna was currently having. For instance the vision has

Drona, etc. entering the Lor's Mouth/being killed (11.26,27). How is this

component relevant to Rudras, etc.? So, the purpose of these divinities being

present in the vision is to create the kind of impact on Arjuna about the

VishvarUpa.

 

We can consistently and correctly maintain that it was a vision exclusive to

Arjuna and the others being there inside the vision is all part-of-what Arjuna

was shown, just as in the dream-foot-ball match. There is no reason at all to

conclude/infer that the Rudras, etc. also saw the Vishvarupa just as, even as

Arjuna was seeing it. Again, the dream-analogy is the most useful one here.

 

In 11.22 it is Arjuna who is expressing in the manner of reporting that 'Rudras,

Adityas..are seeing You and are all taken by wonderment...in 11.23 it is only

Arjuna who says: By seeing You in this Form the entire world is terrified as

also myself. Is he saying this by remaining 'inside' the vision? No. He is

reporting/narrating/expressing this in the capacity of ARjuna, the warrior

standing beside the Lord in the battlefield. To somewhat unrealistically extend

the dream foot ball match, it would be like this: I, lying on the bed, am

dreaming that I am in the stadium. Simultaneously, I, lying on the bed

dreaming, am recording by voice the proceedings of the match into a recorder I

have with me. The situation of Arjuna narrating to Krishna what he is seeing in

the vision is similar to this.

 

So, these are the words of Arjuna and NOT of those divinities. This confirms

that it was a vision exclusively for Arjuna. As you had said in the beginning,

it began and ended, being a show just meant for Arjuna. Shankara has just

commented on these verses 11.22, 23 etc. as the verse has voiced. Nowhere can a

contradiction in Shankara's commentary can be effectively proved by anyone.

 

Just because you have mentioned about Maya, let me quote a verse of the

Vishnupuranam and or Mahabharata which Shankara quotes in His Sutra Bhashya

1.1.7.20:

 

mAyA hyeShA mayA sRShTA yanmAm pashyasi nArada |

sarva-bhUta-guNair yuktam maivam mAm jnAtumarhasi ||

 

O NArada, it is a mAyaa created by Me that you see Me in this form possessed of

all the substances and qualities. You MUST NOT understand Me thus.

 

Shankara writes here: Even for God there may be forms created at His will out of

Maya for the sake of favouring the aspirants.

 

As for Bhaskar ji's mention about Sanjaya too having had this vision, I reply

that I was aware of this while replying to you but considered it not significant

enough to mention. Sanjaya himself got the ability to see/hear the entire Gita

upadesha dialogue due to Vyasa's blessing: Gita 18.75. Even Veda Vyasa, the

author of Gita/Mahabharata should be admitted to have had this vision as it is

believed that VyAsa wrote the Mahabharata having had a direct vision of the

entire war. In fact, VyAsa is said to have had a role too in the war, in the

sidelines. That is another matter.

 

This quote from Ram ji's post is relevant here:

 

// There was a world of difference between the Cosmic forms revealed by Sri

Krishna

to mother Yashoda in His own mouth and to Bhisma and others in the court of the

Kauravas, on the one hand, and the Cosmic Body revealed on this occasion to

Arjuna. All these three forms have been described differently in Bhagavatham,

Mahabharat and Bhagavad Gita. . In the form revealed to Arjuna Bhisma, Drona and

the other heroes were seen entering the flaming mouths of the Lord. Such a

Cosmic form was never shown by the Lord to anyone before. Thus there is no

contradiction in the above statement of the Lord. //

 

Shri Narayan has posed some questions on the dream analogy advanced by me. Here

are my responses:

 

Sanjaya saw the vision on the strength of VyAsa's blessing. It is more of a

reporting kind than of an 'experience' kind that Arjuna had. For example, the

mamakAra that Arjuna has towards the persons involved in the war, the war

itself, his attitude/relationship with the Lord, are all subjective to Arjuna

alone and Sanjaya cannot be expected to have experienced the vision the same way

Arjuna did. The fear, etc. Surely, Sanjaya did not plead to the Lord to return

to His usual form. He did not do so many namaskaras to Bhagavan for excusing

him for breach of protocol. That way, we can still maintain that it was a

vision exclusive to Arjuna. Again it is reasonable to imagine that Arjuna,

remaining in the battle field, saw himself also in the vision. Otherwise it

would not be a vishvarUpa, a totality of the cosmos. In this sense also, we

cannot hold Sanjaya's vision as the same as Arjuna's.

 

Some medical experiments somewhere report that a device to read/record a

person's dream even as it is going on, by attaching probes to the relevant parts

of the brain is being attempted. This shows that there is a possibility of

someone else having some kind of a knowledge of someone else's dream. Thus, an

exclusive vision of Arjuna could have been accessed by Sanjaya. In Yoga

anything is possible. Further, as mentioned above, Sanjaya's vision cannot be

said to be the same as Arjuna's, subjectively speaking. Above all, the purpose

of the Lord's showing the vision to Arjuna is totally different from the purpose

of Vyasa's bestowing the ability to Sanjaya to view the entire war and report to

Dhritarashtra. So, naturally, the effect, impact, of the vision also will

definitely vary between the two.

 

In verse 7 the Lord says: See the Entire World today inclusive of the moving and

non-moving beings, in My Body. Surely Arjuna cannot be excluded from the Entire

World that he is being shown in the Vision. Verse 13 says that Arjuna saw the

Entire World, with many divisions/varieties. This also shows that ARjuna must

have seen himself also as part of the Entire world. In verse 26 Arjuna says:

The worlds as well as I experience fear after seeing your Form. (In a typical

dream where I am chased by a bull, I experience fear. In most cases this fear

wakes me up, ending the dream. The impact of the fear, trembling, palpitation,

sweating, etc. are seen in the physical me lying on the bed, now awakened. We

cannot imagine a dream where we are not ourselves a part of. For, the Mandukya

Upanishad is pramanam for this. It says in the dream also there are 19

doorways, the sense organs, mind..to interact with the dream-world.)

 

We have to imagine that the vision itself contained within it even the battle

field of Krukshetra. But yet, all this was seen by an ARjuna standing outside

the vision. This has to be accepted. Otherwise, the beginning and the ending

of the vision cannot be accounted for logically. Even in Yashodha's vision, she

saw herself inside the Lord's mouth, in the vision. Yet she was in the 'real'

Gokulam while experiencing this vision. In another kind of vision that the Lord

showed Narada when he asked to be shown what Vishnumaayaa was, the Lord asked

Narada to fetch Him some water from a pond nearby. Narada went to the pond and

there saw a bewitching woman and a samsara started for him. When the samsara

vision ended, he found himself near the same pond, the Lord 'waking him up' and

asking him, 'where is the water I asked you to fetch?'. So in such kinds of

visions it is quite reasonable to expect the seer of the vision to see himself

inside the vision-happenings and also, yet, be outside the vision itself.

Because, in all such cases, the vision itself enjoys a prAtibhAsika existence

while the locus/field of the vision is the vyAvahArika plane.

 

 

 

 

Regards,

subbu