Guest guest Posted June 22, 2005 Report Share Posted June 22, 2005 advaitin , " advaitins " <advaitins> wrote: Namaste: Historically it was a common practice for Vedic scholars (including Shankara) to participate in philosophical debates in the public. The scholars engaged in meaningful discussions and debates have undergone formal training in `tarka sastra'(expression of viewpoints with logical coherence and consistency). In all public debates, rights and wrongs are openly exchanged and expressed. The point-counter points and the extent of tarka sastra that went in the analysis have been well documented in the Vedantic literature. There is nothing unusual in pointing out someone is wrong using logical means where appropriate. The scholars were fully aware that logic alone can never resolve all the outstanding philosophical issues. All discussants in forums like the advaitin list should also become familiar with two key terms – kutarka and vitanda. Here is my understanding of these terms: Kutarka is the technique generally applied by ego centered scholars to use their knowledge and skills of communication to discredit the viewpoints expressed by others. Mostly the kutarkis (those who apply the kutarka) will not hesitate to change their logic quite often because their only goal is to discredit others. From the Vedic time peirod, discussions are classified by Samvada, Vada, Jalpa and Vitanda. Samvada is the discussion between the teacher and the taught. All our scriptures are written in the form of samvada. Before the teaching starts, the teacher and the taught invoke the grace of the Lord, to make sure there is no hatred between the two so that teaching can takes place. The student is allowed to question, and the questioning is not intended to test the teacher but to clarify student's understanding (or misunderstanding). Jalpa is the discussion between the two who are also convinced that each one is right and the opponent is wrong. Unlike in vada, the purpose is not to discover or establish the truth, but only to convert the other guy. The outcome of this whole jalpa is lot of noise. Even if it appears that one has lost an argument, he will not accept it, instead he goes back to get some more materials or concocts some other arguments only to establish he is right and other is wrong. Vitanda is the least preferred and recognized among the above four employed with the sole purpose to defeat the opponent. Those who employ Vitanda do not have any conviction and only purpose of vitanda is to invalidate any established position. It is important for all of us to know the pitfalls of kutarka and vitanda so that we avoid employing those ill-suited techniques for discussions focusing on `Seeking the Truth.' This article is reposted at this time to help members to understand why they should avoid using Kutarka and Vitanda Vada during discussions. We all should also remind ourselves that posting is a privilege and is not a right. When a member engages in `Kutarka' or `Vitanda' the most `effective reply' for such posts is `no reply!' Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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