Fwd: Reincarnation Speculation

[Guest guest]

GuruRatings , " Tony OClery " <aoclery wrote:

 

GuruRatings , " Manjit " <manjitd101@> wrote:

>

> Hello All,

>

> Reading some of the recent comments here re reincarnation have got me

thinking.

>

> To start, I would like to clarify that whilst I no longer personally believe

in the concept of re-incarnation, that I really don't have a clue, and that the

'reality' may well be *inclusive* as well as 'transcendent' of the limitations

of the linear human concept of reincarnation. That said, some random musings

below:

>

> For most of my life I have been a very strong believer in the paradigm of

reincarnation. My association with a mystical group/practice, whose sole/primary

aim was to transcend reincarnation both re-inforced and highlighted this belief.

>

> As somebody who became fairly expert at 'astral projection' and/or lucid

dreaming at a young age, and as somebody who's experienced numerous spontaneous

'inner' experiences, I can state that I've had more than my fair share of 'past

life recollections'.

>

> However, here's the rub; as well as experiencing what appears to be singular

lives, in a linear, sequential procession (and rapidly experiencing uncountable,

perhaps millions of lives in such a manner), going through from insects, to

animals to human - there are far more intriguing experiences that could also be

had - and which contradict the entire paradigm of linear, sequential, indvidual

lives.

>

> From within the same mental 'state' (REM or 'astral') that 'past lives' are

experienced, it is also, far more profoundly, possible to 'identify' with the

'soul' of entire nations/races, or the entire human race all at once. There are

also experiences of identifying with the soul of plants, whole groups/classes of

plants, the entire planet as one, indivisible WHOLE (Gaia?). Further, one can

experience and identify with the 'soul' of *inanimate* objects, such as DNA,

archytypes such as anger or love, wrath or compassion. Other things such as

money, oil or humour - all can be experienced as a 'soul' with an i-dentity. And

it's all very profound to experience first hand, and almost impossible to

communicate.

>

> After having researched thoroughly, and experienced likewise, I completely

believe that these are all possible variations of the same mental phenomena

through which normal, mundane 'past lifes' are remembered?

>

> My problem, if it is indeed that, is this. Despite all these experiences, what

proof can we/I bring back to demonstrate that I have witnessed something OUTSIDE

my own consciousness? Nothing - there is nothing even approaching suggestive of

literal, objective re-incarnation when it comes to these experiences.

>

> The experiences themselves can be exceptionally meaningful, convincing, REAL

and apparently confirmative of the concept of reincarnation - but in my deeply

considered opinion, I believe this is a mistake based on the natural tendency to

assume just because something seems or appears real, that it objectively is.

But, then, what IS 'real'? And what is 'objective' etc?

>

> After having researched all the 'scientific' research into past lives, I

personally have found nothing, nothing at all, which even almost approaches

'proof'. I HAVE witnessed a lot of pseudo-scientific non-sense, backed up with a

whole host of poor scientific methodology?

>

> Hypnotic regression? Anyone with an understanding of hypnosis understands that

even the most subtle of micro-suggestions from the hypnotist with guide & mould

the hypnotised person's experiences. That's why a UFO expert has remarkably high

ratio of UFO experiencers amongst his subjects, sexual abuse hypnotists

likewise, and the same for past life regressionists. Very often, and almost

ALWAYS when researched properly, these 'memories' that arise during hypnosis are

found to be completely false/impossible, where verification is possible.

>

> Also, the type of past life experiences that occur during meditation *seem* to

sometimes be like some sort of progression through *evolution* rather than an

*individual soul's* journey, if you see what I mean?

>

> Perhaps it's our genetic history, held as memory/info in matter (in our

neuro-bioological system, somewhere), that is experienced during meditation? In

a sense, that's how it felt to me at the time, and I was a 'believer' in

reincarnation at that time! It seemed (at one point) like perhaps my 'reptilian'

brain had kicked in, etc.

>

> Lastly, I also think that a deep, deeper, deepest understanding of even

Eastern mystical/spiritual thought, at it's absolute pinnacle, also reflects

much the same understanding; Ultimately, there is no such thing as

re-incarnation. It is a convenient fiction for those who would like a nice, neat

conceptual model for the mystery that is our existence?

>

> But, what do I know?

>

> Perhaps something even more deeper, complicated and meaning-full is happening

than the human concept of re-incarnation, but along the same sort of lines -

only that the time/space limitations of our human mind/being prevent us from

totally understanding it?

>

> Anywhos, that's my 2 cents worth. You can keep the change.

>

Namste Manjit,

 

Both Nisargadatta Maharaj and Ramana Maharshi said the reincarnation was an

interlopation and was denied by them. However that was only in the context of

discussing realisation and absolutes. With regard to those who died with ego

there was still references to karma and the rebirth not of the person but

memories and attributes.

In other words there is a vibrational context with these memories and

attributes/samskaras etc that can be connected to the same vibrations----hence

looking at 'past lives' in a dream or hypnosis/meditation or whatever... All is

now anyway, so the 'lives' are all with us now. I'm sure that not only past

human lives can be contacted so to speak, it is still the same Jiva taking

forms.........Cheers Tony.

 

--- End forwarded message ---