Guest guest Posted March 11, 2010 Report Share Posted March 11, 2010 Dear all, I just have a simple question to ask from those of you who have the booklet Who Am I? in English. In the version I have, as you may notice in question & answer no 1, there appears the same expression the five cognitive sense organs twice, (see below) when it seems to refer to two slightly different meanings. Is this answer recorded the same in other English translations too? When willing to translate this into another language, such details become suddenly important. Thank you, viorica. 1. Who am I ? The gross body which is composed of the seven humours (dhatus), I am not; the five cognitive sense organs, viz. the senses of hearing, touch, sight, taste, and smell, which apprehend their respective objects, viz. sound, touch, colour, taste, and odour, I am not; the five cognitive sense organs, viz. the organs of speech, locomotion, grasping, excretion, and procreation, which have as their respective functions speaking, moving, grasping, excreting, and enjoying, I am not; the five vital airs, prana, etc., which perform respectively the five functions of in-breathing, etc., I am not; even the mind which thinks, I am not; the nescience too, which is endowed only with the residual impressions of objects, and in which there are no objects and no functioning’s, I am not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 11, 2010 Report Share Posted March 11, 2010  Dear Vicki, When I went through this part - though in the essay-version, I had this difficulty as well. I have here the Who am I?-version in Collected Works 9th ed., 2004. There is a small difference in it. The second should be "conative": "... the five congnitive sense organs, viz., the senses of hearing, touch, sight ... I am not; the five conative sense organs, viz., the organs of speech, locomotion ...." the first are the sense organs: ear, skin, rxrd, toungh and nose the second are the conative sense organs:of speech (i.e. mouth), locomotion (i.e. legs and arms), grasping (giving and taking, i.e. the doings of arms and legs), excretion and procreation (anus and genitals). Trust it helps. love Gabriele - viorica w Cc: ThePowerOfSilence Thursday, March 11, 2010 10:07 AM question - Who Am I? Dear all, I just have a simple question to ask from those of you who have the booklet Who Am I? in English. In the version I have, as you may notice in question & answer no 1, there appears the same expression the five cognitive sense organs twice, (see below) when it seems to refer to two slightly different meanings. Is this answer recorded the same in other English translations too? When willing to translate this into another language, such details become suddenly important. Thank you, viorica. 1. Who am I ? The gross body which is composed of the seven humours (dhatus), I am not; the five cognitive sense organs, viz. the senses of hearing, touch, sight, taste, and smell, which apprehend their respective objects, viz. sound, touch, colour, taste, and odour, I am not; the five cognitive sense organs, viz. the organs of speech, locomotion, grasping, excretion, and procreation, which have as their respective functions speaking, moving, grasping, excreting, and enjoying, I am not; the five vital airs, prana, etc., which perform respectively the five functions of in-breathing, etc., I am not; even the mind which thinks, I am not; the nescience too, which is endowed only with the residual impressions of objects, and in which there are no objects and no functioning’s, I am not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 11, 2010 Report Share Posted March 11, 2010 Dear Gabriele, It helps indeed. So this is after all a little inaccuracy. As you mentioned The Collected Works, I went through my copy of this book, edited by Arthur Osborne. It appears here in essay form as in your 2004 edition, yet Arthur Osborne uses the expressions "the five organs of sense perception" and "the five organs of external activity", which makes things even more clear. I think this essay form that I have here should be given more attention too, I don't know why I haven't turned to it until now. Thank you, vicki. gabriele ebert <g.ebert Sent: Thu, March 11, 2010 10:43:43 PMRe: question - Who Am I?  Dear Vicki, When I went through this part - though in the essay-version, I had this difficulty as well. I have here the Who am I?-version in Collected Works 9th ed., 2004. There is a small difference in it. The second should be "conative": "... the five congnitive sense organs, viz., the senses of hearing, touch, sight ... I am not; the five conative sense organs, viz., the organs of speech, locomotion ...." the first are the sense organs: ear, skin, rxrd, toungh and nose the second are the conative sense organs:of speech (i.e. mouth), locomotion (i.e. legs and arms), grasping (giving and taking, i.e. the doings of arms and legs), excretion and procreation (anus and genitals). Trust it helps. love Gabriele - viorica w Cc: ThePowerOfSilence Thursday, March 11, 2010 10:07 AM question - Who Am I? Dear all, I just have a simple question to ask from those of you who have the booklet Who Am I? in English. In the version I have, as you may notice in question & answer no 1, there appears the same expression the five cognitive sense organs twice, (see below) when it seems to refer to two slightly different meanings. Is this answer recorded the same in other English translations too? When willing to translate this into another language, such details become suddenly important. Thank you, viorica. 1. Who am I ? The gross body which is composed of the seven humours (dhatus), I am not; the five cognitive sense organs, viz. the senses of hearing, touch, sight, taste, and smell, which apprehend their respective objects, viz. sound, touch, colour, taste, and odour, I am not; the five cognitive sense organs, viz. the organs of speech, locomotion, grasping, excretion, and procreation, which have as their respective functions speaking, moving, grasping, excreting, and enjoying, I am not; the five vital airs, prana, etc., which perform respectively the five functions of in-breathing, etc., I am not; even the mind which thinks, I am not; the nescience too, which is endowed only with the residual impressions of objects, and in which there are no objects and no functioning’s, I am not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 the five organs of sense perception= panch jnaanendriyas The five organs of action= pancha karmendriyas regards, Sarma. On 3/12/10, viorica w <viorica_weissman wrote: > Dear Gabriele, > > It helps indeed. So this is after all a little inaccuracy. As you mentioned > The Collected Works, I went through my copy of this book, edited by Arthur > Osborne. It appears here in essay form as in your 2004 edition, yet Arthur > Osborne uses the expressions " the five organs of sense perception " and " the > five organs of external activity " , which makes things even more clear. I > think this essay form that I have here should be given more attention too, I > don't know why I haven't turned to it until now. > Thank you, > vicki. > > > > > > ________________________________ > gabriele ebert <g.ebert > > Thu, March 11, 2010 10:43:43 PM > Re: question - Who Am I? > > >  > Dear Vicki, > > When I went through this part - though in the essay-version, I had this > difficulty as well. > > I have here the Who am I?-version  in Collected Works 9th ed., 2004. There > is a small difference in it. The second should be " conative " : > " ... the five congnitive sense organs, viz., the senses of hearing, touch, > sight ... I am not; the five conative sense organs, viz., the organs of > speech, locomotion .... " > > the first are the sense organs: ear, skin, rxrd, toungh and nose > the second are the conative sense organs:of speech (i.e. mouth), locomotion > (i.e. legs and arms), grasping (giving and taking, i.e. the doings of arms > and legs), excretion and procreation (anus and genitals). > > Trust it helps. > love > Gabriele > > > - >>viorica w >> >>Cc: ThePowerOfSilence >>Thursday, March 11, 2010 10:07 AM >> question - Who Am I? >> >> >>Dear all, >> >>I just have a simple question to ask from those of you who have the booklet >> Who Am I? in English. In the version I have, as you may notice in question >> & answer no 1, there appears the same expression the five cognitive sense >> organs twice, (see below) when it seems to refer to two slightly different >> meanings.  Is this answer recorded the same in other English translations >> too?  When willing to translate this into another language, such details >> become suddenly important. >> >>Thank you, >>viorica. >> >> >>1. >> The gross body which is composed of the seven humours (dhatus), I am >> not;the five cognitive sense organs, viz. the senses of hearing, touch, >> sight, taste, and smell, which apprehend their respective objects, viz. >> sound, touch, colour, taste, and odour, I am not; the five cognitive sense >> organs, >>viz. the organs of speech, locomotion, grasping, excretion, and >> procreation, which have as their respective functions speaking, moving, >> grasping, excreting, and enjoying, I am not; the five vital airs, prana, >> etc., which perform respectively the five functions of in-breathing, etc., >> I am not; >>even the mind which thinks, I am not; the nescience too, which is endowed >> only with the residual impressions of objects, and in which there are no >> objects and no functioning’s, I am not.Who am I ? > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 Types Of Dhatus , Jnana Indriyas , Karma Indriyas and Five Pranas The gross body is made up of seven dhatus.Sapta is seven in Sanskrit. The dhatus can be roughly translated as " components " .Arthur Osborne uses the word " humours " . These are -- 1. skin2. flesh3. blood4. nerves5. fat (cholosterol)6. veins7. bonesBhagavan Ramana says this in Who am I? to Sivaprakasam Pillai at the age of 21!He also mentions five Jnana indriyas, five cognitive organs. These are -- 1. Hearing (ears)2. Touch (skin)3. Sight (eyes) 4. Taste (tongue)5. Smell (nose)He also mentions five Karma Indriyas, five conative organs. These are -- 1. Speech (mouth)2. Locomotion (legs)3. Grasping (hands)4. Excretion (anus)5. Procreation (genitals)There are five pranas, five vital airs. These are - 1. Prana2. Apana3. Vyana4. Udhana5. SamanaSri Sankara's Viveka Choodamani, also mentions about these. -- ఓం  నమో  à°à°—వతే  శà±à°°à±€  రమణాయ   పà±à°°à°¶à°¾à°‚తౠ జలసూతà±à°°à°‚ పà±à°°à±‡à°®à±‡ శాశà±à°µà°¤à°®à±  On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 12:30 AM, D.V.N. Sarma <dvnsarma wrote:  the five organs of sense perception= panch jnaanendriyas The five organs of action= pancha karmendriyas regards, Sarma. On 3/12/10, viorica w <viorica_weissman wrote: > Dear Gabriele, > > It helps indeed. So this is after all a little inaccuracy. As you mentioned > The Collected Works, I went through my copy of this book, edited by Arthur > Osborne. It appears here in essay form as in your 2004 edition, yet Arthur > Osborne uses the expressions " the five organs of sense perception " and " the > five organs of external activity " , which makes things even more clear. I > think this essay form that I have here should be given more attention too, I > don't know why I haven't turned to it until now. > Thank you, > vicki. > > > > > > ________________________________ > gabriele ebert <g.ebert > > Thu, March 11, 2010 10:43:43 PM > Re: question - Who Am I? > > >  > Dear Vicki, > > When I went through this part - though in the essay-version, I had this > difficulty as well. > > I have here the Who am I?-version  in Collected Works 9th ed., 2004. There > is a small difference in it. The second should be " conative " : > " ... the five congnitive sense organs, viz., the senses of hearing, touch, > sight ... I am not; the five conative sense organs, viz., the organs of > speech, locomotion .... " > > the first are the sense organs: ear, skin, rxrd, toungh and nose > the second are the conative sense organs:of speech (i.e. mouth), locomotion > (i.e. legs and arms), grasping (giving and taking, i.e. the doings of arms > and legs), excretion and procreation (anus and genitals). > > Trust it helps. > love > Gabriele > > > - >>viorica w >> >>Cc: ThePowerOfSilence >>Thursday, March 11, 2010 10:07 AM >> question - Who Am I? >> >> >>Dear all, >> >>I just have a simple question to ask from those of you who have the booklet >> Who Am I? in English. In the version I have, as you may notice in question >> & answer no 1, there appears the same expression the five cognitive sense >> organs twice, (see below) when it seems to refer to two slightly different >> meanings.  Is this answer recorded the same in other English translations >> too?  When willing to translate this into another language, such details >> become suddenly important. >> >>Thank you, >>viorica. >> >> >>1. >> The gross body which is composed of the seven humours (dhatus), I am >> not;the five cognitive sense organs, viz. the senses of hearing, touch, >> sight, taste, and smell, which apprehend their respective objects, viz. >> sound, touch, colour, taste, and odour, I am not; the five cognitive sense >> organs, >>viz. the organs of speech, locomotion, grasping, excretion, and >> procreation, which have as their respective functions speaking, moving, >> grasping, excreting, and enjoying, I am not; the five vital airs, prana, >> etc., which perform respectively the five functions of in-breathing, etc., >> I am not; >>even the mind which thinks, I am not; the nescience too, which is endowed >> only with the residual impressions of objects, and in which there are no >> objects and no functioning’s, I am not.Who am I ? > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 14, 2010 Report Share Posted March 14, 2010 the five vital airs, prana, etc., which perform respectively the five functions of in-breathing, etc., I am not; As seen above, in the 28 questions/answers form of the Who Am I?, answer no 1 contains this statement in which, in my opinion, the "etc." used twice can be frustrating to the reader. I intend to change the "etc." in my translation with the names of all the 5 vital airs and their respective functions. Thank you, Sri Prasanth, for the extra information posted here, some may know these things and others may not. If I have been unkind to you in my eagerness to protect the list from too long posts from all over the internet, I apologize. yours in Sri Ramana Prasanth Jalasutram <jvrsprasanth Sent: Sun, March 14, 2010 8:55:32 AMRe: question - Who Am I? Types Of Dhatus , Jnana Indriyas , Karma Indriyas and Five Pranas The gross body is made up of seven dhatus.Sapta is seven in Sanskrit. The dhatus can be roughly translated as "components".Arthur Osborne uses the word "humours". These are --1. skin2. flesh3. blood4. nerves5. fat (cholosterol)6. veins7. bonesBhagavan Ramana says this in Who am I? to Sivaprakasam Pillai at the age of 21!He also mentions five Jnana indriyas, five cognitive organs. These are --1. Hearing (ears)2. Touch (skin)3. Sight (eyes) 4. Taste (tongue)5. Smell (nose)He also mentions five Karma Indriyas, five conative organs. These are --1. Speech (mouth)2. Locomotion (legs)3. Grasping (hands)4. Excretion (anus)5. Procreation (genitals)There are five pranas, five vital airs. These are -1. Prana2. Apana3. Vyana4. Udhana5. SamanaSri Sankara's Viveka Choodamani, also mentions about these. -- à°“à°‚ నమో à°à°—వతే à°¶à±à°°à±€ రమణాయ à°ªà±à°°à°¶à°¾à°‚తౠజలసూతà±à°°à°‚ à°ªà±à°°à±‡à°®à±‡ శాశà±à°µà°¤à°®à± On Sun, Mar 14, 2010 at 12:30 AM, D.V.N. Sarma <dvnsarma (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: the five organs of sense perception= panch jnaanendriyasThe five organs of action= pancha karmendriyasregards,Sarma. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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