Guest guest Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 Namaste, I have a simple question about Vedic astrology. If 2 boys (or girls for that matter) are born to different parents in the same hospital at the same time, astrology will tell me that they have the exact same future/mental/physical/behavior characteristics. Is that a true statement ? Can even a difference of seconds make a difference ? But from the point of Vedanta, they are totally different jeevas born in different families with different vasanas. Can the experts comment on this ? thanks, Shailendra Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 Shailender ji, Difference of second as well parental linearity makes difference as the conception times might not be the same.Even sex of the child too depends on parents.Accordingly their lives will never be same. vedanta is a broader explanation of the importance of cyclic births.Astrology too gives sifnificance. Navamsa/progressive chart hold key in respect of same time births. vrkrihnan --- On Wed, 7/22/09, bhatnagar_shailendra <bhatnagar_shailendra wrote: bhatnagar_shailendra <bhatnagar_shailendra question about Vedic astrology Wednesday, July 22, 2009, 9:36 AM Namaste, I have a simple question about Vedic astrology. If 2 boys (or girls for that matter) are born to different parents in the same hospital at the same time, astrology will tell me that they have the exact same future/mental/ physical/ behavior characteristics. Is that a true statement ? Can even a difference of seconds make a difference ? But from the point of Vedanta, they are totally different jeevas born in different families with different vasanas. Can the experts comment on this ? thanks, Shailendra Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 Dear Shailendra, Your question is highly significant. Two or more souls in process of taking birth are attracted to couples according to mental states at time of coitus of female native. Natural genetic factors and gotra , parental lineage is bound to influence & moulds the destiny of souls in getting body in process of intrauterines evolution. Naturally it is obvious birth at same time and place is not enough consideration. Desh kaal and lineage is also crucial. Now not only difference in birth seconds is significant but also measurable factor of semen discharge at time of coitus leading to particular impreganation and birth is complex phenomen. This is reason birth time rectification is a must and much depends on upon skill of astrologer's experience . Here i can only say that moon chart is very potential chart but least understood for it holds the key to all lineage , genetic and biological inhereted constitutanal makeup so important for judgement. So , I am sorry to say Statement in question is generalized one and far from reliable. From point of vedant , It is souls journey and soul is nothing else but a spark from same divine that regulates whole existence but journey of individual soul is guided by its karma loaded with in its account along with what it does here and now. with best wishes. RCS. , " bhatnagar_shailendra " <bhatnagar_shailendra wrote: > > Namaste, > I have a simple question about Vedic astrology. If 2 boys (or girls for that matter) are born to different parents in the same hospital at the same time, astrology will tell me that they have the exact same future/mental/physical/behavior characteristics. Is that a true statement ? Can even a difference of seconds make a difference ? But from the point of Vedanta, they are totally different jeevas born in different families with different vasanas. Can the experts comment on this ? > > thanks, > Shailendra > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 Krishnan ji, You bring up 4 points - difference of seconds in time of birth. My response is that generally second level information is either not available or not supplied to the astrologer . - conception time. My response is conception time is not supplied to astrologer either - sex of child. Lets assume it is same for the cases being compared - navamsa chart. Don't know how that is determined but the basic input is time of birth So if 2 subjects of the same sex, born to different parents at the same place and time get their chart read by a Vedic astrologer, tell me how could he tell the difference between the 2 cases ? I am assuming the astrologer is not looking at the faces of the 2 cases because one can read a few things after looking at a person's face. By the way, this is not for argument sake but for my understanding. regards, Shailendra , vattem krishnan <bursar_99 wrote: > > Shailender ji, > Difference of second as well parental linearity makes difference as the conception times might not be the same.Even sex of the child too depends on parents.Accordingly their lives will never be same. > vedanta is a broader explanation of the importance of cyclic births.Astrology too gives sifnificance. > Navamsa/progressive chart hold key in respect of same time births. > vrkrihnan > > --- On Wed, 7/22/09, bhatnagar_shailendra <bhatnagar_shailendra wrote: > > > bhatnagar_shailendra <bhatnagar_shailendra > question about Vedic astrology > > Wednesday, July 22, 2009, 9:36 AM > > > > > > > Namaste, > I have a simple question about Vedic astrology. If 2 boys (or girls for that matter) are born to different parents in the same hospital at the same time, astrology will tell me that they have the exact same future/mental/ physical/ behavior characteristics. Is that a true statement ? Can even a difference of seconds make a difference ? But from the point of Vedanta, they are totally different jeevas born in different families with different vasanas. Can the experts comment on this ? > > thanks, > Shailendra > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 Shailendra, sri RCS ji, and Sri Krishna ji have given the the right answers on ur hypothetical question, assumptions too why was noone else born as great as gandhi on that day surely many ppl wud have been born topo esp in Porbandar itself why no micheal jackson, sachin tendulkar, Kishore kumar, a Balamurili krishna, hariprasad chaurisya surely same time manyppl r both in same place! u will continue to chase wild gooses if u r looking for a purely mathetically generated output say a eephemeris or a computer s/w generated ones or u r looking for even twins of same family [some may be line many r not why the opening lines on a traditional Janma patri will show u why Janani Janma soukhyanaam Vardhini Kula Sampandam Padavim purva punyaanam Likyathe Janma Patrika which means the mother and native, its familys growth, propserity [of the family] is accurued fromthe family's ommissions and commissions due to their placement [in society] and this are reflected in the horoscope. as this subject is a divine subject and can;t be perfected by any s/w engineer and astrologer together or rolled into one. the Almighty will guide the info to be passed tot he family or the native based on his karma balancesheet and this will be either from a super scholar or a layman and can cailf also from any iff the time to know and benefit from such wise ppl is not yet in the destiny that is some more karmic debt has to be washed off tile then endure, suffer or miss the appointment and advice will happen as Bhagavad gita says doing good knowingly whoheartedly with Trikarna shuddi will help earn u punya or improve ur karma status but a accidental good act won't earn u, but a accidental mistake, ommission can earn u -ve karma so if one does it willingly or knowlingly u can imagine how the life will be not just this life the future ones too r in LINE TO SUFFER please read Bhagavad gita, swami vivekanandas inspitred talks, some of Buddh'as teachings too will help u understand the life better if u do then Jytoishya will be a different source of understanding urself, ur karma status Best wishes ________________________________ bhatnagar_shailendra <bhatnagar_shailendra Wednesday, July 22, 2009 10:09:56 PM Re: question about Vedic astrology Krishnan ji, You bring up 4 points - difference of seconds in time of birth. My response is that generally second level information is either not available or not supplied to the astrologer . - conception time. My response is conception time is not supplied to astrologer either - sex of child. Lets assume it is same for the cases being compared - navamsa chart. Don't know how that is determined but the basic input is time of birth So if 2 subjects of the same sex, born to different parents at the same place and time get their chart read by a Vedic astrologer, tell me how could he tell the difference between the 2 cases ? I am assuming the astrologer is not looking at the faces of the 2 cases because one can read a few things after looking at a person's face. By the way, this is not for argument sake but for my understanding. regards, Shailendra , vattem krishnan <bursar_99@. ..> wrote: > > Shailender ji, > Difference of second as well parental linearity makes difference as the conception times might not be the same.Even sex of the child too depends on parents.Accordingly their lives will never be same. > vedanta is a broader explanation of the importance of cyclic births.Astrology too gives sifnificance. > Navamsa/progressive chart hold key in respect of same time births. > vrkrihnan > > --- On Wed, 7/22/09, bhatnagar_shailendr a <bhatnagar_shailend ra wrote: > > > bhatnagar_shailendr a <bhatnagar_shailend ra > question about Vedic astrology > > Wednesday, July 22, 2009, 9:36 AM Namaste, > I have a simple question about Vedic astrology. If 2 boys (or girls for that matter) are born to different parents in the same hospital at the same time, astrology will tell me that they have the exact same future/mental/ physical/ behavior characteristics. Is that a true statement ? Can even a difference of seconds make a difference ? But from the point of Vedanta, they are totally different jeevas born in different families with different vasanas. Can the experts comment on this ? > > thanks, > Shailendra > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 Dear Members, This question has been put to astrologers time and again some genuinely wondering about its efficasy while most has been to degrade Astrology and its belief and most of all a systematic slandering of Hinduism and its practice. Yet, hoping that the member has posted this again only to gain some knowledge, I shall try to explain. " What if " remains an HYPOTHETICAL question, Birth or Hora which never happens. Practicaly, even twins borns of the same parents in the same room will have a time difference ranging anything from 5 to 20 minutes. Why should there be a difference between those born a few meters apart even if the time is same. The base of Astrology is Astronomy, planets that are thousands of kilometers away from earth. If you understand trigonometry and other related principles, you will know that even a small change in the angle makes a huge difference in something termed as arc or line-of-sight etc. Its effect hence, will also be different. remember that time format " Hours:Minutes:Seconds " are same as " Degrees:Minutes:Seconds " and those who know Trignometry & geometry know why. Now your question was how to differentiate between the two from the chart?. This also raises another point. If such is case, will the chart not show that there are more births during that lagna?. Indeed there are, our respected sages has given several combinations that indicates multiple births in the chart and since such incidences are rare, a well trained astrologer (with lots of divine grace) is sure to see it. Now going back to the original question, Interestingly uttarakalamritha by kalidasa gives a technique to find the nature of birth from the chart. Though this is not foolproof and fails in many charts, the very fact that the learned acharya has spend time to write about it shows that, human birth takes place only at prescribed time. In fact, there are a lot conditions & yogas described to understand the nature of birth as laid down by the ancients. A point to ponder : multiple births or several births at the same time at the same place happens only with " Keeta " janma or in " Keeta " yoni. There are some articles in this very groups files that illustrate these " janmas " and the importance of " Manushya janma " as understood from our scriptures. Now comming to the last part, HYPOTHETICALY assuming that there will be atleast some difference in actual birth time, Just as the Hypothetical asumption that they will be same, learned astrologers use many techniqes that may not be awailable in all the popular works but are selectively hannded over by traditions. There are many divisions beyond the shashtiamsa and some of the grouping is also known popularly known as " Nadi " which is a division of sign of 30 degrees into 150 divisions. " Devakeralam " or chandra kala nadi gives effect of birth in the first half & second half of each of these Nadi - ie: again divided by two. " Santhana deepika " an old treatise and very rare, unavailable till recently mentions about divisions such as " pancha Navamasa " , " Nava Navamsa " , " Dwadasa Navamsa " etc. If you compute these, you shall find even a single minute change even less is enough to change the lagna in these divisions. Even for an experienced and well trained astrologer, it will need 3 to 4 hours to analyse the chart properly. In fact, the initial effort is only to understand the benefics & malefics their effects, and finaly to get a hang on what they might do in future - its like drawing a line or a picture based on several factors including the past effects. Who has got time now-a-days. Every expects astrologer to blurt out every thing in their life and others withing 5 minutes as if playing tape recorder. Some astrologers even charge by the hour. Even if such & other secrets are made open, such hypothetical questions will keep comming. Finaly, remember, If you ask a Hypothetical question, you will get a Hypothetical answer. Just because you cannot tame a wild horse, does not mean that horse is slower than a donkey. It doesn't realy matter whether you have asked this question with real intention to understand. I have given a some arguments and those who wish to explore can spent some time and may be you shall dig out some gold nudgets there. A.G.Suresh Babu Shenoy. , " bhatnagar_shailendra " <bhatnagar_shailendra wrote: > > Namaste, > I have a simple question about Vedic astrology. If 2 boys (or girls for that matter) are born to different parents in the same hospital at the same time, astrology will tell me that they have the exact same future/mental/physical/behavior characteristics. Is that a true statement ? Can even a difference of seconds make a difference ? But from the point of Vedanta, they are totally different jeevas born in different families with different vasanas. Can the experts comment on this ? > > thanks, > Shailendra > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 22, 2009 Report Share Posted July 22, 2009 Prashant ji, I already said my question was not for argument sake. Anyway I appreciate your response. By the way, I sometimes marvel at the accuracy of some astrological predictions and personally I believe it is partly a Science and partly the grace of Bhagavan Ganapati and Mata Shakti. The duo represents Mahabuddhi and Mahasiddhi. regards, Shailendra , Prashant Kumar G B <gbp_kumar wrote: > > Shailendra, > > sri RCS ji, and Sri Krishna ji have given the the right answers on ur hypothetical question, assumptions too > > why was noone else born as great as gandhi on that day surely many ppl wud have been born topo esp in Porbandar itself > > why no micheal jackson, sachin tendulkar, Kishore kumar, a Balamurili krishna, hariprasad chaurisya surely same time manyppl r both in same place! > > u will continue to chase wild gooses if > > u r looking for a purely mathetically generated output say a eephemeris or a computer s/w generated ones > > or u r looking for even twins of same family [some may be line many r not > > why the opening lines on a traditional Janma patri will show u why > > Janani Janma soukhyanaam > Vardhini Kula Sampandam > Padavim purva punyaanam > Likyathe Janma Patrika > > which means the mother and native, its familys growth, propserity [of the family] is accurued fromthe family's ommissions and commissions due to their placement [in society] and this are reflected in the horoscope. > > as this subject is a divine subject and can;t be perfected by any s/w engineer and astrologer together or rolled into one. > > the Almighty will guide the info to be passed tot he family or the native based on his karma balancesheet and this will be either from a super scholar or a layman and can cailf also from any iff the time to know and benefit from such wise ppl is not yet in the destiny that is some more karmic debt has to be washed off tile then endure, suffer or miss the appointment and advice will happen > > as Bhagavad gita says doing good knowingly whoheartedly with Trikarna shuddi will help earn u punya or improve ur karma status > > but a accidental good act won't earn u, > but a accidental mistake, ommission can earn u -ve karma so if one does it willingly or knowlingly u can imagine how the life will be not just this life the future ones too r in LINE TO SUFFER > > please read Bhagavad gita, swami vivekanandas inspitred talks, some of Buddh'as teachings too will help u understand the life better > if u do then Jytoishya will be a different source of understanding urself, ur karma status > > Best wishes > > > > ________________________________ > bhatnagar_shailendra <bhatnagar_shailendra > > Wednesday, July 22, 2009 10:09:56 PM > Re: question about Vedic astrology > > > Krishnan ji, You bring up 4 points > - difference of seconds in time of birth. My response is that generally second level information is either not available or not supplied to the astrologer . > > - conception time. My response is conception time is not supplied to astrologer either > > - sex of child. Lets assume it is same for the cases being compared > > - navamsa chart. Don't know how that is determined but the basic input is time of birth > > So if 2 subjects of the same sex, born to different parents at the same place and time get their chart read by a Vedic astrologer, tell me how could he tell the difference between the 2 cases ? I am assuming the astrologer is not looking at the faces of the 2 cases because one can read a few things after looking at a person's face. > > By the way, this is not for argument sake but for my understanding. > > regards, > Shailendra > > , vattem krishnan <bursar_99@ ..> wrote: > > > > Shailender ji, > > Difference of second as well parental linearity makes difference as the conception times might not be the same.Even sex of the child too depends on parents.Accordingly their lives will never be same. > > vedanta is a broader explanation of the importance of cyclic births.Astrology too gives sifnificance. > > Navamsa/progressive chart hold key in respect of same time births. > > vrkrihnan > > > > --- On Wed, 7/22/09, bhatnagar_shailendr a <bhatnagar_shailend ra@> wrote: > > > > > > bhatnagar_shailendr a <bhatnagar_shailend ra@> > > question about Vedic astrology > > > > Wednesday, July 22, 2009, 9:36 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > I have a simple question about Vedic astrology. If 2 boys (or girls for that matter) are born to different parents in the same hospital at the same time, astrology will tell me that they have the exact same future/mental/ physical/ behavior characteristics. Is that a true statement ? Can even a difference of seconds make a difference ? But from the point of Vedanta, they are totally different jeevas born in different families with different vasanas. Can the experts comment on this ? > > > > thanks, > > Shailendra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 dear friends under the guru shishya parampara, the shishyas are encouraged to ask various queries and seek answers to get all doubts clarified while learning something including astrology. as regards specific straight answer to the query of two persons taking birth at same time in same hospital in two beds in the same room, they do not and will not have the same present or future for their past is different and they are two different jeevatmas. even twins taking birth at same time from the same yoni too will not have the same future. various medicinal cases suggest that the conjoined siamese twins are forced to live the same way and have same future till their bodies are separated. there is a god (soul) in each human and each native has a different present and future. with best wishes and blessings pandit arjun www.rudraksharemedy.com , " sureshbabuag " <sureshbabuag wrote: > > > Dear Members, > > This question has been put to astrologers time and again some genuinely wondering about its efficasy while most has been to degrade Astrology and its belief and most of all a systematic slandering of Hinduism and its practice. > > Yet, hoping that the member has posted this again only to gain some knowledge, I shall try to explain. > > " What if " remains an HYPOTHETICAL question, Birth or Hora which never happens. Practicaly, even twins borns of the same parents in the same room will have a time difference ranging anything from 5 to 20 minutes. > > Why should there be a difference between those born a few meters apart even if the time is same. The base of Astrology is Astronomy, planets that are thousands of kilometers away from earth. If you understand trigonometry and other related principles, you will know that even a small change in the angle makes a huge difference in something termed as arc or line-of-sight etc. Its effect hence, will also be different. remember that time format " Hours:Minutes:Seconds " are same as " Degrees:Minutes:Seconds " and those who know Trignometry & geometry know why. > > Now your question was how to differentiate between the two from the chart?. > > This also raises another point. > > If such is case, will the chart not show that there are more births during that lagna?. Indeed there are, our respected sages has given several combinations that indicates multiple births in the chart and since such incidences are rare, a well trained astrologer (with lots of divine grace) is sure to see it. > > Now going back to the original question, Interestingly uttarakalamritha by kalidasa gives a technique to find the nature of birth from the chart. Though this is not foolproof and fails in many charts, the very fact that the learned acharya has spend time to write about it shows that, human birth takes place only at prescribed time. In fact, there are a lot conditions & yogas described to understand the nature of birth as laid down by the ancients. > > A point to ponder : multiple births or several births at the same time at the same place happens only with " Keeta " janma or in " Keeta " yoni. There are some articles in this very groups files that illustrate these " janmas " and the importance of " Manushya janma " as understood from our scriptures. > > Now comming to the last part, HYPOTHETICALY assuming that there will be atleast some difference in actual birth time, Just as the Hypothetical asumption that they will be same, learned astrologers use many techniqes that may not be awailable in all the popular works but are selectively hannded over by traditions. > > There are many divisions beyond the shashtiamsa and some of the grouping is also known popularly known as " Nadi " which is a division of sign of 30 degrees into 150 divisions. " Devakeralam " or chandra kala nadi gives effect of birth in the first half & second half of each of these Nadi - ie: again divided by two. > > " Santhana deepika " an old treatise and very rare, unavailable till recently mentions about divisions such as " pancha Navamasa " , " Nava Navamsa " , " Dwadasa Navamsa " etc. If you compute these, you shall find even a single minute change even less is enough to change the lagna in these divisions. > > Even for an experienced and well trained astrologer, it will need 3 to 4 hours to analyse the chart properly. In fact, the initial effort is only to understand the benefics & malefics their effects, and finaly to get a hang on what they might do in future - its like drawing a line or a picture based on several factors including the past effects. Who has got time now-a-days. Every expects astrologer to blurt out every thing in their life and others withing 5 minutes as if playing tape recorder. Some astrologers even charge by the hour. > > Even if such & other secrets are made open, such hypothetical questions will keep comming. > > Finaly, remember, If you ask a Hypothetical question, you will get a Hypothetical answer. > > Just because you cannot tame a wild horse, does not mean that horse is slower than a donkey. > > It doesn't realy matter whether you have asked this question with real intention to understand. I have given a some arguments and those who wish to explore can spent some time and may be you shall dig out some gold nudgets there. > > A.G.Suresh Babu Shenoy. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " bhatnagar_shailendra " <bhatnagar_shailendra@> wrote: > > > > Namaste, > > I have a simple question about Vedic astrology. If 2 boys (or girls for that matter) are born to different parents in the same hospital at the same time, astrology will tell me that they have the exact same future/mental/physical/behavior characteristics. Is that a true statement ? Can even a difference of seconds make a difference ? But from the point of Vedanta, they are totally different jeevas born in different families with different vasanas. Can the experts comment on this ? > > > > thanks, > > Shailendra > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Dear Shailendra, What you ask is strangely not hypothetical but very rare and in my lifetime of becoming sensitized to astrology and following it sometimes from a distance, then up-close and so on, I recall one instance where two sisters born to different mothers (two very close families who stayed close for decades and yet with that 'healthy' competition that we all know about, heard about and perhaps experienced, known as sibling rivalry!). I do not have the dates and times and all the scientific details so this would be a good time to close this window and GO TO THE NEXT MESSAGE! :-) These two 'sisters' were admitted to the same nursing home on a November night decades ago. Both went in 'labour' nearly at the same time. Both had difficult labours. The slightly older one delivered with the help of technical help. The other mother came home with nothing but an emptiness within. God was not merciful on her that time. She had two daughters and a son eventually though. The two families remained closely connected. The boy born on that night always held a special place in the heart of the " mausi " . Neither the mausi nor the mother ever talked or discussed about this, but the mother when she was very very old told the surviving child about this and suddenly it all fell in place! Such things must be shared with children early rather than so late! It reduces questions and uncertainties. Questions such as: Can a body listen to or hold two souls? Rohiniranjan , " bhatnagar_shailendra " <bhatnagar_shailendra wrote: > > Namaste, > I have a simple question about Vedic astrology. If 2 boys (or girls for that matter) are born to different parents in the same hospital at the same time, astrology will tell me that they have the exact same future/mental/physical/behavior characteristics. Is that a true statement ? Can even a difference of seconds make a difference ? But from the point of Vedanta, they are totally different jeevas born in different families with different vasanas. Can the experts comment on this ? > > thanks, > Shailendra > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Namaskar The birth chart is nothing but a indicator of the past, present and future the planetary positions show the indication but it is not the planets which decide it. It is solely decided by Us our past karmas , the present , and future desires. Hope this helps, Nandana On 22/07/2009, bhatnagar_shailendra <bhatnagar_shailendra wrote: > > Namaste, > I have a simple question about Vedic astrology. If 2 boys (or girls for > that matter) are born to different parents in the same hospital at the same > time, astrology will tell me that they have the exact same > future/mental/physical/behavior characteristics. Is that a true statement > ? Can even a difference of seconds make a difference ? But from the point > of Vedanta, they are totally different jeevas born in different families > with different vasanas. Can the experts comment on this ? > > thanks, > Shailendra > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Dear Shailendra ji, You marveled at the accuracy but did you ever express gratitude? Especially after recognizing the scent of the Rose as you admit publicly? It is not the Deity that you choose or select or your next astrologer does, there is only one Divine! Once you are done trying to find IT outside in gurus and teerthas and temples and churches, unless successful (?) we all will realize IT when we are at the next transition! It is hilariously 'mundane' and commonplace! Most of us remember God when we are in deep trouble! If THAT is what it takes for us to remember GOD then there is something really wrong in the framework! And many more times shall we return before we figure it all out! Try something simpler! Force yourself to thank your parents or PARENTS each time something good happens to you and not just when things go wrong! Keep it up for as long as it takes for you to 'get it' , " bhatnagar_shailendra " <bhatnagar_shailendra wrote: > > Prashant ji, I already said my question was not for argument sake. Anyway I appreciate your response. > By the way, I sometimes marvel at the accuracy of some astrological predictions and personally I believe it is partly a Science and partly the grace of Bhagavan Ganapati and Mata Shakti. The duo represents Mahabuddhi and Mahasiddhi. > > regards, > Shailendra > > > , Prashant Kumar G B <gbp_kumar@> wrote: > > > > Shailendra, > > > > sri RCS ji, and Sri Krishna ji have given the the right answers on ur hypothetical question, assumptions too > > > > why was noone else born as great as gandhi on that day surely many ppl wud have been born topo esp in Porbandar itself > > > > why no micheal jackson, sachin tendulkar, Kishore kumar, a Balamurili krishna, hariprasad chaurisya surely same time manyppl r both in same place! > > > > u will continue to chase wild gooses if > > > > u r looking for a purely mathetically generated output say a eephemeris or a computer s/w generated ones > > > > or u r looking for even twins of same family [some may be line many r not > > > > why the opening lines on a traditional Janma patri will show u why > > > > Janani Janma soukhyanaam > > Vardhini Kula Sampandam > > Padavim purva punyaanam > > Likyathe Janma Patrika > > > > which means the mother and native, its familys growth, propserity [of the family] is accurued fromthe family's ommissions and commissions due to their placement [in society] and this are reflected in the horoscope. > > > > as this subject is a divine subject and can;t be perfected by any s/w engineer and astrologer together or rolled into one. > > > > the Almighty will guide the info to be passed tot he family or the native based on his karma balancesheet and this will be either from a super scholar or a layman and can cailf also from any iff the time to know and benefit from such wise ppl is not yet in the destiny that is some more karmic debt has to be washed off tile then endure, suffer or miss the appointment and advice will happen > > > > as Bhagavad gita says doing good knowingly whoheartedly with Trikarna shuddi will help earn u punya or improve ur karma status > > > > but a accidental good act won't earn u, > > but a accidental mistake, ommission can earn u -ve karma so if one does it willingly or knowlingly u can imagine how the life will be not just this life the future ones too r in LINE TO SUFFER > > > > please read Bhagavad gita, swami vivekanandas inspitred talks, some of Buddh'as teachings too will help u understand the life better > > if u do then Jytoishya will be a different source of understanding urself, ur karma status > > > > Best wishes > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > bhatnagar_shailendra <bhatnagar_shailendra@> > > > > Wednesday, July 22, 2009 10:09:56 PM > > Re: question about Vedic astrology > > > > > > Krishnan ji, You bring up 4 points > > - difference of seconds in time of birth. My response is that generally second level information is either not available or not supplied to the astrologer . > > > > - conception time. My response is conception time is not supplied to astrologer either > > > > - sex of child. Lets assume it is same for the cases being compared > > > > - navamsa chart. Don't know how that is determined but the basic input is time of birth > > > > So if 2 subjects of the same sex, born to different parents at the same place and time get their chart read by a Vedic astrologer, tell me how could he tell the difference between the 2 cases ? I am assuming the astrologer is not looking at the faces of the 2 cases because one can read a few things after looking at a person's face. > > > > By the way, this is not for argument sake but for my understanding. > > > > regards, > > Shailendra > > > > , vattem krishnan <bursar_99@ ..> wrote: > > > > > > Shailender ji, > > > Difference of second as well parental linearity makes difference as the conception times might not be the same.Even sex of the child too depends on parents.Accordingly their lives will never be same. > > > vedanta is a broader explanation of the importance of cyclic births.Astrology too gives sifnificance. > > > Navamsa/progressive chart hold key in respect of same time births. > > > vrkrihnan > > > > > > --- On Wed, 7/22/09, bhatnagar_shailendr a <bhatnagar_shailend ra@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > bhatnagar_shailendr a <bhatnagar_shailend ra@> > > > question about Vedic astrology > > > > > > Wednesday, July 22, 2009, 9:36 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > > I have a simple question about Vedic astrology. If 2 boys (or girls for that matter) are born to different parents in the same hospital at the same time, astrology will tell me that they have the exact same future/mental/ physical/ behavior characteristics. Is that a true statement ? Can even a difference of seconds make a difference ? But from the point of Vedanta, they are totally different jeevas born in different families with different vasanas. Can the experts comment on this ? > > > > > > thanks, > > > Shailendra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Shailendra, if this is not for arguement sake i mean a discussion to clear some doubts but a STATEMENT, then god alone can help u, a dangerous one I must say but if u accept the the subject workls and works within the Karma phala of different past Janmas, the current janma and what i can add or deducet from it when transfering the BALANCE AVAILABLE FUNDS TO ur next Janmam u can;t get any worthwile reading and worse off i u r looking for a due cast or a mould image. ur Karma vasana, samskaras will take u to the nearest parent's potential karma for that family so some last minute good things in this or past lives could have transfered ur ATMA to the desidred and matching karma family WELL IT IS KARMA BHOOMIKA IN A KARMA BHOOMI wher eit is for each one we have a choice right in this life and Jyotishya helps u understand the past and potential future so make good in this LIFE UR BEST CHANCE prashant ________________________________ bhatnagar_shailendra <bhatnagar_shailendra Thursday, July 23, 2009 12:49:54 AM Re: question about Vedic astrology Prashant ji, I already said my question was not for argument sake. Anyway I appreciate your response. By the way, I sometimes marvel at the accuracy of some astrological predictions and personally I believe it is partly a Science and partly the grace of Bhagavan Ganapati and Mata Shakti. The duo represents Mahabuddhi and Mahasiddhi. regards, Shailendra , Prashant Kumar G B <gbp_kumar@. ..> wrote: > > Shailendra, > > sri RCS ji, and Sri Krishna ji have given the the right answers on ur hypothetical question, assumptions too > > why was noone else born as great as gandhi on that day surely many ppl wud have been born topo esp in Porbandar itself > > why no micheal jackson, sachin tendulkar, Kishore kumar, a Balamurili krishna, hariprasad chaurisya surely same time manyppl r both in same place! > > u will continue to chase wild gooses if > > u r looking for a purely mathetically generated output say a eephemeris or a computer s/w generated ones > > or u r looking for even twins of same family [some may be line many r not > > why the opening lines on a traditional Janma patri will show u why > > Janani Janma soukhyanaam > Vardhini Kula Sampandam > Padavim purva punyaanam > Likyathe Janma Patrika > > which means the mother and native, its familys growth, propserity [of the family] is accurued fromthe family's ommissions and commissions due to their placement [in society] and this are reflected in the horoscope. > > as this subject is a divine subject and can;t be perfected by any s/w engineer and astrologer together or rolled into one. > > the Almighty will guide the info to be passed tot he family or the native based on his karma balancesheet and this will be either from a super scholar or a layman and can cailf also from any iff the time to know and benefit from such wise ppl is not yet in the destiny that is some more karmic debt has to be washed off tile then endure, suffer or miss the appointment and advice will happen > > as Bhagavad gita says doing good knowingly whoheartedly with Trikarna shuddi will help earn u punya or improve ur karma status > > but a accidental good act won't earn u, > but a accidental mistake, ommission can earn u -ve karma so if one does it willingly or knowlingly u can imagine how the life will be not just this life the future ones too r in LINE TO SUFFER > > please read Bhagavad gita, swami vivekanandas inspitred talks, some of Buddh'as teachings too will help u understand the life better > if u do then Jytoishya will be a different source of understanding urself, ur karma status > > Best wishes > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > bhatnagar_shailendr a <bhatnagar_shailend ra > > Wednesday, July 22, 2009 10:09:56 PM > Re: question about Vedic astrology > > > Krishnan ji, You bring up 4 points > - difference of seconds in time of birth. My response is that generally second level information is either not available or not supplied to the astrologer . > > - conception time. My response is conception time is not supplied to astrologer either > > - sex of child. Lets assume it is same for the cases being compared > > - navamsa chart. Don't know how that is determined but the basic input is time of birth > > So if 2 subjects of the same sex, born to different parents at the same place and time get their chart read by a Vedic astrologer, tell me how could he tell the difference between the 2 cases ? I am assuming the astrologer is not looking at the faces of the 2 cases because one can read a few things after looking at a person's face. > > By the way, this is not for argument sake but for my understanding. > > regards, > Shailendra > > , vattem krishnan <bursar_99@ ..> wrote: > > > > Shailender ji, > > Difference of second as well parental linearity makes difference as the conception times might not be the same.Even sex of the child too depends on parents.Accordingly their lives will never be same. > > vedanta is a broader explanation of the importance of cyclic births.Astrology too gives sifnificance. > > Navamsa/progressive chart hold key in respect of same time births. > > vrkrihnan > > > > --- On Wed, 7/22/09, bhatnagar_shailendr a <bhatnagar_shailend ra@> wrote: > > > > > > bhatnagar_shailendr a <bhatnagar_shailend ra@> > > question about Vedic astrology > > > > Wednesday, July 22, 2009, 9:36 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste, > > I have a simple question about Vedic astrology. If 2 boys (or girls for that matter) are born to different parents in the same hospital at the same time, astrology will tell me that they have the exact same future/mental/ physical/ behavior characteristics. Is that a true statement ? Can even a difference of seconds make a difference ? But from the point of Vedanta, they are totally different jeevas born in different families with different vasanas. Can the experts comment on this ? > > > > thanks, > > Shailendra > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 23, 2009 Report Share Posted July 23, 2009 Dear Shailendrer Ji, It is not that you feed all information to the Astrologer about adhana lagna and nisheka lagna .Astrologers have base to read charts fro different angles and anlyse the basic chart and could also find progression by various charts.the lives of two natives born at the same time and in same place certainly have different future as they have different past.If the past is attributable to the karmas of himself and his parents and the future certainly is due to his own mind and actions there of.Implication of lagna.rasi and sun sign have differet ways of expression about future.vedic Astrology has a very deep sens of analysis which canbe understood only by analytical frame of chart. vrkrishnan. PS:The xample cited by Shri rohini Ji is very much relevant how the jyotish can focus on various events that happen --- On Wed, 7/22/09, bhatnagar_shailendra <bhatnagar_shailendra wrote: bhatnagar_shailendra <bhatnagar_shailendra Re: question about Vedic astrology Wednesday, July 22, 2009, 12:39 PM Krishnan ji, You bring up 4 points - difference of seconds in time of birth. My response is that generally second level information is either not available or not supplied to the astrologer . - conception time. My response is conception time is not supplied to astrologer either - sex of child. Lets assume it is same for the cases being compared - navamsa chart. Don't know how that is determined but the basic input is time of birth So if 2 subjects of the same sex, born to different parents at the same place and time get their chart read by a Vedic astrologer, tell me how could he tell the difference between the 2 cases ? I am assuming the astrologer is not looking at the faces of the 2 cases because one can read a few things after looking at a person's face. By the way, this is not for argument sake but for my understanding. regards, Shailendra , vattem krishnan <bursar_99@. ..> wrote: > > Shailender ji, > Difference of second as well parental linearity makes difference as the conception times might not be the same.Even sex of the child too depends on parents.Accordingly their lives will never be same. > vedanta is a broader explanation of the importance of cyclic births.Astrology too gives sifnificance. > Navamsa/progressive chart hold key in respect of same time births. > vrkrihnan > > --- On Wed, 7/22/09, bhatnagar_shailendr a <bhatnagar_shailend ra wrote: > > > bhatnagar_shailendr a <bhatnagar_shailend ra > question about Vedic astrology > > Wednesday, July 22, 2009, 9:36 AM > > > > > > > Namaste, > I have a simple question about Vedic astrology. If 2 boys (or girls for that matter) are born to different parents in the same hospital at the same time, astrology will tell me that they have the exact same future/mental/ physical/ behavior characteristics. Is that a true statement ? Can even a difference of seconds make a difference ? But from the point of Vedanta, they are totally different jeevas born in different families with different vasanas. Can the experts comment on this ? > > thanks, > Shailendra > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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