Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

March 27, 2010

Dear friends,

This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting.Let me give my

submissions.

Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry remark to

chhaya graha RAHU.

Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the mordern times

real Rahu is internet.

Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and formless and

takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in contact.

Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter + Rahu.

Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the type of

people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno sites, sports

sites etc.

Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite.

Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will have

distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals with

concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite

outside.

Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas, processions,

committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc.

But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet.

My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of planet

which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet whirlpool

and will not have peace of mind.

Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who is not

at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should remove

Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of earth,

Moon and Sun.

Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is hasty,

irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like it

expands your knowledge to limitless sphere.

Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to tolerate

difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all the people

in formless networking.

It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a

Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not

matter to them]

Inder

, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote:

>

> Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji,

> Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA

> Regards

> Kulbir Bains.

>

> On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949 wrote:

>

> >

> > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote "

> > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first line of

> > Kulbeer on the subject – Gurus plays a social role so do the

> > prostitutes.

> >

> > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants movement

> > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately

> > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further

> > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed

> > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native village,

> > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M) in the

> > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began against

> > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and slowly

> > and steadily spearead in the most states of India.

> >

> > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first posting

> > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari village ,

> > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968. Movements

> > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded.

> >

> > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly

> > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the

> > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga. He also

> > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with my

> > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back from

> > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded in

> > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri, and

> > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle

> > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back

> > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a number

> > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light area.

> > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence

> > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there was

> > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil police

> > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and throwing

> > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer running

> > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A fat

> > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking very

> > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing towards back

> > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment, our

> > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to be

> > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the

> > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had stopped,

> > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle.

> >

> > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at her

> > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small rear

> > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply.

> > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything , like me

> > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again peeped

> > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I kept

> > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as I

> > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself. She told

> > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her to

> > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help her to

> > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the way. As

> > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and commanded him

> > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it to

> > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should just

> > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and not to

> > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down, the

> > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I

> > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it near

> > his nose where he could feel the heat ….and he closed the rear

> > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the vehicle. I

> > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and

> > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so

> > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat.

> >

> > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is

> > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can place me

> > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge sheet

> > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me no

> > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I will kill

> > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed guide to

> > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But nothing ever

> > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling sorry

> > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder whether

> > she ever reached her home !

> >

> > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej Mantra,

> > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these memories

> > back to me as fresh as ever before.

> >

> > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the description

> > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's direct

> > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename it

> > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names like

> > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire needs

> > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I

> > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find any

> > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And lastly,

> > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966 to

> > 01-01-1969.

> >

> > Raj Bhardwaj

> >

> > <%40>,

> > " rohinicrystal "

> > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to examine in

> > your collection of charts or test bench.

> > >

> > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The joker in

> > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This is why

> > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona and

> > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose sign

> > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving

> > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the qualities

> > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or

> > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected loses

> > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or bad! So

> > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest-like nature', moon could lose

> > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its

> > aggression... etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a reduction in

> > the qualities.

> > >

> > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual

> > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific chart!

> > >

> > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk! In fact

> > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY THIS

> > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-)

> > >

> > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My prayers

> > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my Dadas!

> > >

> > > Rohiniranjan

> > >

> > > --- In

<%40>,

> > " rajbhardwaj1949 "

> > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis,

> > > >

> > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really very

> > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and smiling

> > while

> > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely

> > relaxed. My

> > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger

> > daughter

> > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed with

> > smile on

> > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got intermangled

> > very

> > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya,Deekshya,traditions; cunturies old and the

> > > > current traits.

> > > >

> > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also

> > included),

> > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their knowledge;

> > and

> > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go on

> > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not

> > withstanding

> > > > the skirmishes here and there.

> > > >

> > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis have

> > learned

> > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If this is

> > not

> > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do bit of

> > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read, how

> > quick

> > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we

> > prepare

> > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a shape

> > and

> > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and

> > satisfaction.

> > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also have no

> > doubt

> > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what appears

> > in

> > > > the group.

> > > >

> > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I were to

> > say

> > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are living. In

> > other

> > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it is

> > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any

> > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and

> > opportunity

> > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and every

> > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and languages.

> > One

> > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they will

> > use

> > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves.

> > > >

> > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was also

> > witness

> > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have been

> > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " . Why

> > such

> > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but Rahu

> > was

> > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been given the

> > name

> > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is

> > feared by

> > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a learner

> > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of

> > problems in

> > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take names of

> > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the

> > problems.

> > > > Very easy way out indeed.

> > > >

> > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and somehow

> > tend

> > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real sense.

> > His

> > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very very

> > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The image of

> > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes all the

> > so

> > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada. When

> > our

> > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must have all

> > the

> > > > rishis,munis,gurus who had dual personalities. There is no need to

> > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems to have

> > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a Shishya

> > is

> > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the Shishya,

> > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his silence

> > and

> > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing the

> > Guru.

> > > >

> > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who perhaps

> > never

> > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question which is

> > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of Jyotish did

> > not

> > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or

> > called as

> > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish !

> > > >

> > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > > >

> > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > " rohinicrystal "

> > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > But Praajee...!

> > > > >

> > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...!

> > > > >

> > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do ghabraa

> > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey Kaul

> > usday

> > > > 'marnay' day baad!

> > > > >

> > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa!

> > > > >

> > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib hai

> > yeh

> > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/Parmeshwar/God day bachchoon-di!

> > > > >

> > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik saal to

> > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor seekh-layngay, jo

> > raha

> > > > giya si is janam-vich baki!

> > > > >

> > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali!! ;-)

> > > > >

> > > > > Happy Easter!!

> > > > >

> > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > >

> > > > > --- In

<%40>,

> > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> > > > wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > SiRR ji,

> > > > > > HUSH is the word;

> > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je MANSOOR na

> > > > bolda taan

> > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda.

> > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor wouldn't

> > > > have been

> > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Regards

> > > > > > Kulbir Bains

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ------------------------------

> > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@

> > > > > > *To:*

<%40>

> > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM

> > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra sadhana's ?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Kulbir_praaji,

> > > > > >

> > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given by

> > > > competent

> > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to bring

> > > > salvation to

> > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already attained

> > > > salvation!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being given

> > in

> > > > the

> > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of Gurus

> > who

> > > > have

> > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and humanity

> > > > suffering so

> > > > > > much? " :-B

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai duniya

> > > > walon kay

> > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > >

March 27, 2010

Dear Inder ji

//Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the mordern

times real Rahu is internet.//

Kindly reconsider it.

involve COMMUNICATION - then give your reconsidered opinion.

Sir, It is very very difficult to find karakas involving only a single

planet.

However if you want to stick to Rahu theory only then for arguments sake you

can study how and where from internet started. PATAL-LOK. underwater--

motorola something! happy journey.

Regards

Kulbir Bains.

On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 5:12 PM, inder <indervohra2001 wrote:

>

> Dear friends,

>

> This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting.Let me give my

> submissions.

>

> Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry remark to

> chhaya graha RAHU.

>

> Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the mordern

> times real Rahu is internet.

>

> Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and formless

> and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in

> contact.

>

> Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter + Rahu.

>

> Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the type

> of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno sites,

> sports sites etc.

>

> Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite.

>

> Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will have

> distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals

> with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding

> infinite outside.

>

> Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas, processions,

> committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc.

> But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet.

>

> My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of

> planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet

> whirlpool and will not have peace of mind.

>

> Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who is

> not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should

> remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative

> position of earth, Moon and Sun.

>

> Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is hasty,

> irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like it

> expands your knowledge to limitless sphere.

> Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to tolerate

> difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all the

> people in formless networking.

>

> It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a

> Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not

> matter to them]

>

> Inder

> <%40>,

> Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote:

> >

> > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji,

> > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA

> > Regards

> > Kulbir Bains.

> >

> > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949 wrote:

> >

> > >

> > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote "

> > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first line of

> > > Kulbeer on the subject – Gurus plays a social role so do the

> > > prostitutes.

> > >

> > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants movement

> > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately

> > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further

> > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed

> > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native village,

> > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M) in

> the

> > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began against

> > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and slowly

> > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India.

> > >

> > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first posting

> > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari village ,

> > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968. Movements

> > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded.

> > >

> > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly

> > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the

> > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga. He

> also

> > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with my

> > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back from

> > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded in

> > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri, and

> > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle

> > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back

> > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a number

> > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light area.

> > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence

> > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there was

> > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil police

> > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and throwing

> > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer running

> > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A fat

> > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking very

> > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing towards

> back

> > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment, our

> > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to be

> > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the

> > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had stopped,

> > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle.

> > >

> > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at her

> > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small rear

> > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply.

> > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything , like me

> > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again peeped

> > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I kept

> > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as I

> > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself. She

> told

> > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her to

> > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help her to

> > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the way.

> As

> > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and commanded

> him

> > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it to

> > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should just

> > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and not to

> > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down, the

> > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I

> > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it near

> > > his nose where he could feel the heat ….and he closed the rear

> > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the vehicle. I

> > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and

> > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so

> > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat.

> > >

> > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is

> > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can place me

> > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge sheet

> > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me no

> > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I will

> kill

> > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed guide to

> > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But nothing

> ever

> > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling sorry

> > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder whether

> > > she ever reached her home !

> > >

> > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej

> Mantra,

> > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these memories

> > > back to me as fresh as ever before.

> > >

> > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the description

> > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's direct

> > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename it

> > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names like

> > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire needs

> > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I

> > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find any

> > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And lastly,

> > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966 to

> > > 01-01-1969.

> > >

> > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > >

> > > --- In

<%40>

> <%40>,

> > > " rohinicrystal "

> > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to examine

> in

> > > your collection of charts or test bench.

> > > >

> > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The joker in

> > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This is

> why

> > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona and

> > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose sign

> > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving

> > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the qualities

> > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or

> > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected loses

> > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or bad! So

> > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest-like nature', moon could lose

> > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its

> > > aggression... etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a reduction in

> > > the qualities.

> > > >

> > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual

> > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific chart!

> > > >

> > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk! In

> fact

> > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY THIS

> > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-)

> > > >

> > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My prayers

> > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my Dadas!

> > > >

> > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > >

> > > > --- In

<%40>

> <%40>,

> > > " rajbhardwaj1949 "

> > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis,

> > > > >

> > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really very

> > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and smiling

> > > while

> > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely

> > > relaxed. My

> > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger

> > > daughter

> > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed with

> > > smile on

> > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got intermangled

> > > very

> > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya,Deekshya,traditions; cunturies old and

> the

> > > > > current traits.

> > > > >

> > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also

> > > included),

> > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their knowledge;

> > > and

> > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go on

> > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not

> > > withstanding

> > > > > the skirmishes here and there.

> > > > >

> > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis have

> > > learned

> > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If this is

> > > not

> > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do bit of

> > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read, how

> > > quick

> > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we

> > > prepare

> > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a

> shape

> > > and

> > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and

> > > satisfaction.

> > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also have no

> > > doubt

> > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what

> appears

> > > in

> > > > > the group.

> > > > >

> > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I were to

> > > say

> > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are living. In

> > > other

> > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it is

> > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any

> > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and

> > > opportunity

> > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and

> every

> > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and languages.

> > > One

> > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they will

> > > use

> > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves.

> > > > >

> > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was also

> > > witness

> > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have been

> > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " . Why

> > > such

> > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but Rahu

> > > was

> > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been given the

> > > name

> > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is

> > > feared by

> > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a

> learner

> > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of

> > > problems in

> > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take names

> of

> > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the

> > > problems.

> > > > > Very easy way out indeed.

> > > > >

> > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and somehow

> > > tend

> > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real sense.

> > > His

> > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very very

> > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The image

> of

> > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes all

> the

> > > so

> > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada. When

> > > our

> > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must have

> all

> > > the

> > > > > rishis,munis,gurus who had dual personalities. There is no need to

> > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems to

> have

> > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a Shishya

> > > is

> > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the

> Shishya,

> > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his

> silence

> > > and

> > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing the

> > > Guru.

> > > > >

> > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who perhaps

> > > never

> > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question which is

> > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of Jyotish did

> > > not

> > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or

> > > called as

> > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish !

> > > > >

> > > > > Raj Bhardwaj

> > > > >

> > > > > --- In

<%40>

> <%40>,

> > > " rohinicrystal "

> > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > But Praajee...!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do

> ghabraa

> > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey Kaul

> > > usday

> > > > > 'marnay' day baad!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib hai

> > > yeh

> > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/Parmeshwar/God day bachchoon-di!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik saal

> to

> > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor seekh-layngay, jo

> > > raha

> > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali!! ;-)

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Happy Easter!!

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > >

> > > > > > --- In

<%40>

> <%40>,

> > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@

> > > > > wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > SiRR ji,

> > > > > > > HUSH is the word;

> > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je MANSOOR na

> > > > > bolda taan

> > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda.

> > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor

> wouldn't

> > > > > have been

> > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence.

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Regards

> > > > > > > Kulbir Bains

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ------------------------------

> > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@

> > > > > > > *To:*

<%40>

> <%40>

> > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM

> > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra sadhana's ?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji,

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given by

> > > > > competent

> > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to bring

> > > > > salvation to

> > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already attained

> > > > > salvation!

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being given

> > > in

> > > > > the

> > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-)

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of

> Gurus

> > > who

> > > > > have

> > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and humanity

> > > > > suffering so

> > > > > > > much? " :-B

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai duniya

> > > > > walon kay

> > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Rohiniranjan

> > > > > > >

March 27, 2010

Dear Inderjee,

Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called Chandal. So

Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu.

Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word chandal with the

morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that might not be the

case always.

Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will give results of

Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results during its

dasha.

Chandrashekhar.

-

inder

Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM

Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET

Dear friends,

This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting.Let me give my

submissions.

Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry remark to

chhaya graha RAHU.

Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the mordern times

real Rahu is internet.

Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and formless and

takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in contact.

Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter + Rahu.

Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the type of

people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno sites, sports

sites etc.

Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite.

Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will have

distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals with

concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite

outside.

Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas, processions,

committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc.

But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet.

My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of planet

which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet whirlpool

and will not have peace of mind.

Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who is not

at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should remove

Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of earth,

Moon and Sun.

Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is hasty,

irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like it

expands your knowledge to limitless sphere.

Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to tolerate

difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all the people

in formless networking.

It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a

Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not

matter to them]

Inder

, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote:

>

> Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji,

> Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA

> Regards

> Kulbir Bains.

>

> On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949 wrote:

>

> >

> > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote "

> > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first line of

> > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the