Guest guest Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 You meant, I suppose: Jungle mein MOR naachaa, kissi-nay na dekha! :-) Achchay achchay laut aatay hain maya-jaal mai because Hasti is mightier than Nesti until Jaatak transforms into Darshak, hain naa Bhai_Kulbir? Better be a witness rather than the OTHER two MAYAVINI options! , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote: > > Repected Chandrashekhar Ji, You are absolutely right just a little > elaboration; HASTI means SELF-concerned existence because existence is only > as far as SELF is there. > Regards > Kulbir Bains. > > On Mon, Mar 29, 2010 at 10:59 PM, Chandrashekhar < > sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > > > > > > Dear Kulbirji, > > > > Does ibtedah not mean beginning and inteha mean the end? I suppose hesti is > > > > existence and nesti is destruction? > > > > Regards, > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > - > > " Kulbir Bains " <lalkitabkb <lalkitabkb%40gmail.com>> > > < <%40> > > > > > Monday, March 29, 2010 9:16 AM > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > Respected Chandershekar ji, > > > //ibtedah and inteha// In lalkitab it is known as hasti se nesti and > > nesti > > > se hasti. > > > Respect and Regards > > > KB > > > > > > On Sun, Mar 28, 2010 at 11:16 PM, Chandrashekhar < > > > sharma.chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar%40gmail.com>> > > wrote: > > > > > >> > > >> > > >> Dear Rohini Ranjan, > > >> > > >> One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a > > >> wicked > > >> man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is > > >> right. > > >> > > >> So your contention is also correct. I liked the comment about change of > > >> perception between ibtedah and inteha. You must be pretty good at Urdu? > > >> > > >> Have you heard of a manuscript called Vriddha Parashari? > > >> > > >> Regards, > > >> Chandrashekhar. > > >> > > >> > > >> - > > >> rohinicrystal > > >> To: <%40><Jyotish_Rem\ edies% > > 40> > > >> Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:45 AM > > >> Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > >> > > >> Dear Chandrashekhar jee, > > >> > > >> I have also heard that rahu represents mlechchaas or 'other > > >> cultures/foreign cultures' > > >> > > >> Often plays a part according to what jyotishis " claim " that it has to do > > >> with journey abroad or marrying into other cultures and religions and so > > > > >> on. > > >> Just another wrinkle, I suppose! But by no means uncommon, based on the > > >> queries received by jyotishis working actively on the " Jyotish > > HOT-LINE! " > > >> > > >> As touched upon in my astrotreasures article written long ago and posted > > > > >> on > > >> boloji years later -- BPHS changed its perspective between the ibetadh > > >> and > > >> inteha! That was a clue for me that I tuned-in profitably (in terms of > > >> learning!) -- and the fact that it was placed so close to Sudarshan > > >> completed the clue for me! > > >> > > >> Krishna was the awataar of Vishnu that carried the Sudarshan Chakra and > > >> was > > >> Poorna Purusha! If I write anything further on this matter in this > > august > > >> forum, I will be insulting the intelligence and Gnan of the inhabitants > > >> on > > >> this huge Island! > > >> > > >> Rohiniranjan > > >> > > >> --- In > > >> <%40> > > <%40>, > > > > >> " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > >> > > > >> > Dear Inderjee, > > >> > > > >> > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called > > >> Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and > > >> Rahu. > > >> > > > >> > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word chandal > > >> with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that > > >> might not be the case always. > > >> > > > >> > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will give > > >> results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full > > >> results > > >> during its dasha. > > >> > > > >> > Chandrashekhar. > > >> > > > >> > - > > >> > inder > > >> > To: > > >> > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM > > >> > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > Dear friends, > > >> > > > >> > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting.Let me give > > >> > my > > >> submissions. > > >> > > > >> > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry > > >> > remark > > >> to chhaya graha RAHU. > > >> > > > >> > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the > > mordern > > >> times real Rahu is internet. > > >> > > > >> > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and > > >> > formless > > >> and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in > > >> contact. > > >> > > > >> > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter + > > >> Rahu. > > >> > > > >> > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the > > >> type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno > > >> sites, sports sites etc. > > >> > > > >> > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite. > > >> > > > >> > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will > > >> > have > > >> distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious > > rituals > > >> with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding > > >> infinite outside. > > >> > > > >> > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas, > > processions, > > >> committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc. > > >> > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet. > > >> > > > >> > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of > > >> planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in > > >> internet > > >> whirlpool and will not have peace of mind. > > >> > > > >> > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who > > >> > is > > >> not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should > > >> remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative > > >> position of earth, Moon and Sun. > > >> > > > >> > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is > > >> > hasty, > > >> irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as > > like > > >> it > > >> expands your knowledge to limitless sphere. > > >> > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to > > >> > tolerate > > >> difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all the > > >> people in formless networking. > > >> > > > >> > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a > > >> Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen > > >> not > > >> matter to them] > > >> > > > >> > Inder > > >> > --- In > > >> > <%40> > > <%40>, > > >> Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@> wrote: > > >> > > > > >> > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji, > > >> > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA > > >> > > Regards > > >> > > Kulbir Bains. > > >> > > > > >> > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@> wrote: > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote " > > >> > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first > > line > > >> of > > >> > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the > > >> > > > prostitutes. > > >> > > > > > >> > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants > > >> movement > > >> > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately > > >> > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further > > >> > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed > > >> > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native > > >> > > > village, > > >> > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M) > > >> > > > in > > >> the > > >> > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began > > >> > > > against > > >> > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and > > >> > > > slowly > > >> > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India. > > >> > > > > > >> > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first > > >> posting > > >> > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari > > village > > >> > > > , > > >> > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968. > > >> Movements > > >> > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded. > > >> > > > > > >> > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly > > >> > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the > > >> > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga. > > He > > >> also > > >> > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with > > > > >> > > > my > > >> > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back > > >> > > > from > > >> > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded > > >> > > > in > > >> > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri, > > >> > > > and > > >> > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle > > >> > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back > > >> > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a > > >> number > > >> > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light > > >> > > > area. > > >> > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence > > >> > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there > > >> was > > >> > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil > > >> police > > >> > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and > > >> throwing > > >> > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer > > >> > > > running > > >> > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A > > >> > > > fat > > >> > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking > > >> > > > very > > >> > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing > > towards > > >> back > > >> > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment, > > >> > > > our > > >> > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to > > > > >> > > > be > > >> > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the > > >> > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had > > >> stopped, > > >> > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle. > > >> > > > > > >> > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at > > her > > >> > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small > > >> rear > > >> > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply. > > >> > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything , > > >> > > > like > > >> me > > >> > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again > > >> peeped > > >> > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I > > kept > > >> > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as > > > > >> > > > I > > >> > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself. > > She > > >> told > > >> > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her > > to > > >> > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help > > her > > >> to > > >> > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the > > >> > > > way. > > >> As > > >> > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and > > >> > > > commanded > > >> him > > >> > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it > > > > >> > > > to > > >> > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should > > >> just > > >> > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and > > not > > >> to > > >> > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down, > > >> > > > the > > >> > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I > > >> > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it > > >> near > > >> > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear > > >> > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the > > >> > > > vehicle. > > >> I > > >> > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and > > >> > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so > > >> > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat. > > >> > > > > > >> > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is > > >> > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can > > place > > >> me > > >> > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge > > >> sheet > > >> > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me > > >> > > > no > > >> > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I > > will > > >> kill > > >> > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed > > guide > > >> to > > >> > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But > > nothing > > >> ever > > >> > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling > > >> > > > sorry > > >> > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder > > >> > > > whether > > >> > > > she ever reached her home ! > > >> > > > > > >> > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej > > >> Mantra, > > >> > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these > > >> > > > memories > > >> > > > back to me as fresh as ever before. > > >> > > > > > >> > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the > > >> description > > >> > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's > > >> direct > > >> > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename > > > > >> > > > it > > >> > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names > > like > > >> > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire > > >> needs > > >> > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I > > >> > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find > > >> > > > any > > >> > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And > > >> lastly, > > >> > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966 > > > > >> > > > to > > >> > > > 01-01-1969. > > >> > > > > > >> > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > >> > > > > > >> > > > --- In > > >> > > > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40>, > > >> > > >> > > > " rohinicrystal " > > >> > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to > > >> > > > > examine > > >> in > > >> > > > your collection of charts or test bench. > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The > > >> > > > > joker > > >> in > > >> > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This > > >> > > > is > > >> why > > >> > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona > > >> and > > >> > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose > > >> sign > > >> > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving > > >> > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the > > >> qualities > > >> > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or > > >> > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected > > >> loses > > >> > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or > > >> > > > bad! > > >> So > > >> > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest-like nature', moon could > > >> lose > > >> > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its > > >> > > > aggression... etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a reduction > > > > >> > > > in > > >> > > > the qualities. > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual > > >> > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific > > chart! > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk! > > In > > >> fact > > >> > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY > > >> THIS > > >> > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-) > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My > > >> > > > > prayers > > >> > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my > > >> > > > Dadas! > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > Rohiniranjan > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > --- In > > >> > > > > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40>, > > >> > > >> > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 " > > >> > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote: > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis, > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really > > >> very > > >> > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and > > >> > > > > > smiling > > >> > > > while > > >> > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely > > >> > > > relaxed. My > > >> > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger > > >> > > > daughter > > >> > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed > > with > > >> > > > smile on > > >> > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got > > >> > > > > > intermangled > > >> > > > very > > >> > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya,Deekshya,traditions; cunturies old > > >> > > > > > and > > >> the > > >> > > > > > current traits. > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also > > >> > > > included), > > >> > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their > > >> knowledge; > > >> > > > and > > >> > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go > > on > > >> > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not > > >> > > > withstanding > > >> > > > > > the skirmishes here and there. > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis > > >> > > > > > have > > >> > > > learned > > >> > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If > > >> > > > > > this > > >> is > > >> > > > not > > >> > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do > > >> > > > > > bit > > >> of > > >> > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read, > > >> > > > > > how > > >> > > > quick > > >> > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we > > >> > > > prepare > > >> > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a > > >> shape > > >> > > > and > > >> > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and > > >> > > > satisfaction. > > >> > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also > > have > > >> no > > >> > > > doubt > > >> > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what > > >> appears > > >> > > > in > > >> > > > > > the group. > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I > > were > > >> to > > >> > > > say > > >> > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are > > living. > > >> In > > >> > > > other > > >> > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it > > is > > >> > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any > > >> > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and > > >> > > > opportunity > > >> > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and > > >> every > > >> > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and > > >> languages. > > >> > > > One > > >> > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they > > >> will > > >> > > > use > > >> > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves. > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was > > >> > > > > > also > > >> > > > witness > > >> > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have > > >> > > > > > been > > >> > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " . > > >> > > > > > Why > > >> > > > such > > >> > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but > > >> Rahu > > >> > > > was > > >> > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been > > given > > >> the > > >> > > > name > > >> > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is > > >> > > > feared by > > >> > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a > > >> learner > > >> > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of > > >> > > > problems in > > >> > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take > > >> > > > > > names > > >> of > > >> > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the > > >> > > > problems. > > >> > > > > > Very easy way out indeed. > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and > > >> somehow > > >> > > > tend > > >> > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real > > >> sense. > > >> > > > His > > >> > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very > > >> very > > >> > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The > > >> > > > > > image > > >> of > > >> > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes > > >> > > > > > all > > >> the > > >> > > > so > > >> > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada. > > >> When > > >> > > > our > > >> > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must > > >> > > > > > have > > >> all > > >> > > > the > > >> > > > > > rishis,munis,gurus who had dual personalities. There is no > > need > > >> to > > >> > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems > > to > > >> have > > >> > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a > > >> Shishya > > >> > > > is > > >> > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the > > >> Shishya, > > >> > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his > > >> silence > > >> > > > and > > >> > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing > > >> > > > > > the > > >> > > > Guru. > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who > > >> > > > > > perhaps > > >> > > > never > > >> > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question > > >> > > > > > which > > >> is > > >> > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of > > Jyotish > > >> did > > >> > > > not > > >> > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or > > >> > > > called as > > >> > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish ! > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > --- In > > >> > > > > > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40>, > > >> > > >> > > > " rohinicrystal " > > >> > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > But Praajee...! > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...! > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do > > >> ghabraa > > >> > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey > > >> > > > > > Kaul > > >> > > > usday > > >> > > > > > 'marnay' day baad! > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa! > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib > > >> hai > > >> > > > yeh > > >> > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/Parmeshwar/God day > > >> bachchoon-di! > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik > > >> > > > > > > saal > > >> to > > >> > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor > > >> > > > > > seekh-layngay, > > >> jo > > >> > > > raha > > >> > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki! > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali!! ;-) > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Happy Easter!! > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > --- In > > >> > > > > > > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40>, > > >> > > >> > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > > >> > > > > > wrote: > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > SiRR ji, > > >> > > > > > > > HUSH is the word; > > >> > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je > > >> > > > > > > > MANSOOR > > >> na > > >> > > > > > bolda taan > > >> > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda. > > >> > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor > > >> wouldn't > > >> > > > > > have been > > >> > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence. > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Regards > > >> > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > >> > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@ > > >> > > > > > > > *To:* > > >> > > > > > > > <%40> > > <%40> > > >> <%40> > > >> > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM > > >> > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra > > sadhana's > > >> > > > > > > > ? > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji, > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given > > > > >> > > > > > > > by > > >> > > > > > competent > > >> > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to > > >> > > > > > > > bring > > >> > > > > > salvation to > > >> > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle! > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already > > >> > > > > > > > attained > > >> > > > > > salvation! > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being > > >> given > > >> > > > in > > >> > > > > > the > > >> > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-) > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of > > >> Gurus > > >> > > > who > > >> > > > > > have > > >> > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and > > humanity > > >> > > > > > suffering so > > >> > > > > > > > much? " :-B > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai > > >> duniya > > >> > > > > > walon kay > > >> > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~ > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic way possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says. House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the drishti to guide it). Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda ko hazir mankar). Regards Kulbir Bains. On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001 wrote: > > > Dear Kulbir, > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or incorrect] > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking. > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking > makes it so] > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would > give arguments which may win him. > > Inder > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE DIVINITY AND RELISH THE > TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS. > > [image: Groups]</;_ylc=X3oDMTJkYWw3dmxoBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAz\ k2OTk4NjIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDgyNjkwBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2dmcARzdGltZQMxMjY5OTM0NDUz> > Switch to: Text-Only<-traditional ?subject=Change+Delivery+F\ ormat:+Traditional>, > Daily Digest<-digest ?subject=Email+Delivery:+Digest>• > Un<- ?subject=Un>• Terms > of Use <> > . > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 Well written RR_jee, I agree. Inder , " rohinicrystal " <jyotish_vani wrote: > > Chandrashekhar_jee and Raj bhaisaheb, > > I have generally winced a bit when people try to equate and extrapolate directly and literally from ancient allegories and in my opinion that creates problems which creates the 'black and white' in astrology. The latest that we have observed being the words from " Rahu is uncondtionally bad " camp. > > My personal preference is to take the allegories as nice mnemonics or memory aids but not an exhaustive description of the 'planets' concerned from an astrological point of view. The story of swarbhanu, the story of Kach and Devyani, and even the story of Harishchandra in Shani Mahatmay are great pointers and make what can be a rather dry subject (Astrology with its terse rules and exceptions!) interesting and even lively! But, if we get stuck in the mindset that those stories and allegories capture the entire essence of astrological reality or astrological details, then that would be a serious loss for the astrology learners and practitioners. Particularly the ones who actually read charts or give readings (the applied and practical astrologers). > > The astrological reality (more than sun in leo in 4th will result in this or that... for instance!) is multifactorial and rather than seeing the benefic/malefic dichotomy as absolute, I wish people will consider the modification and modulation of the essential, central characteristics of planets and realize that without such nuances and influences, astrology will begin to look rather threadbare. > > I am of the opinion that the karakatwas given in Jyotish texts such as BPHS (and I do not mean BPHS alone!) describe the core properties or values of the planets and we must not stray too far from those. In contrast, texts such as uttarkalamrita despite their prolific treatment of karakas must be considered with a pinch of salt, or at least some of the labels given there in the context of karakattwas. > > Some of the problems inherent in the 'modern' labels (neokarakatwas!) while being useful raise one question. How careful was the author or proponent in making sure that what he or she is giving is the nascent karakttwa and not the result of a multifactorial influence or compound karakattwa? What one is attributing to Jupiter for instance -- if derived from astrological observations, how much of the description is for the planet itself and what component or contamination in chemical mixture terms can be attributed to a melange of influences? It is often very difficult to tease out the influences of individual participants in a property or label which sometimes is ascribed to a single planet. > > I am not saying that BPHS alone is correct in all instances but certainly a safe starting point! Others may differ in their opinion, of course. > > Speaking of names, the label MANGAL for mars is intriguing. Why is a malefic that is cruel and associated with wounds, injuries, aggression, cutting etc should be associated with mangal which represents beneficience, shubha, amelioration? > > I am sure there are many similar nomenclatural puzzles in Jyotish and I realize that one lifetime is not sufficient to figure out all the labels and what not, but certainly makes the study of astrology rather interesting. > > Rohiniranjan > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > Dear Raj, > > > > I have already read your experience with interest. I can also understand what you felt as it was an absolutely wicked situation. You did something that needed great courage, knowing the way Army works. > > > > But I am one who can not equate ideologue of a violent movement, even for good causes, with Guru. In jyotish I always prefer to keep the grahas and our concepts about what their names should mean in the light of Puranas separate. May be not exactly separate but my interpretation of the puranic stories in explaining the nature of grahas is at variance with what is generally thought and so I prefer to keep it to myself. > > > > Take care, > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > - > > Raj > > > > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 9:52 AM > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar Ji, > > I am enjoying your posts. But, I feel you could have missed my msg No.73157 and what was the context of Guru-Rahu yuti,in the present times. ! I hope you will like reading it, as the thread began from there.! With my best regards. > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Vattem Krishnan, > > > > > > I was responding to Rohini's mail. I have already made clear what is meant by Chandal and what by MlecCha. I had said " One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. " > > > > > > Regards, > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > - > > > Vattem Krishnan > > > > > > Monday, March 29, 2010 12:37 PM > > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > It is true that persons opeartating from burial grounds are referred with this term.It's application however to Rahu in litteral terms is not properly substantiated.mlechas are not chandals. > > > In our epics more so when we recollect about Raja Satya Harischndra Story,we find the reference of " Chandal " the one who burns dead bodies and keeps watch at burial grounds. > > > Doms are not falling under chandal category.Some where it is also mentioned to cannibals or narbhakshas as chnadals. > > > > > > Vattem Krishnan Cyber Jyotish Services(For all counseling services)Dr.B.V.Raman " Fools Obey Planets While Wisemen Can Control Them " Planets are neutral Controllers of Mans Karma > > > > > > --- On Sun, 3/28/10, Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@> > > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010, 3:15 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan, > > > > > > I am trying to acquire its manuscript, through one of my friends and hope to learn some more about Paraashara. > > > > > > Yes, Chandal is an interesting term. They are generally thought to be those who operate at funeral sites. > > > > > > Rahu is enigmatic planet and so has not rest or does not allow others to rest. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > - > > > > > > rohinicrystal > > > > > > > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:57 PM > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > Chandrashekhar jee, > > > > > > Thanks for taking the time, Sir. I have not had the good fortune of having seen Vriddha Parashari. I have only studied BPHS, Parashara Samhita and Laghu/madhya parashari. > > > > > > My urdu is rather limited, actually. > > > > > > Chandaal is a very interesting term and at one point were thought of as the '5th caste'! In MP they were called Dom and in bengal nomoshuddoor. > > > > > > Poor Rahu! Even on its home-turf (internet according to some) there is no rest for the wicked :-) > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So your contention is also correct. I liked the comment about change of perception between ibtedah and inteha. You must be pretty good at Urdu? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have you heard of a manuscript called Vriddha Parashari? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > rohinicrystal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:45 AM > > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar jee, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have also heard that rahu represents mlechchaas or 'other cultures/foreign cultures' > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Often plays a part according to what jyotishis " claim " that it has to do with journey abroad or marrying into other cultures and religions and so on. Just another wrinkle, I suppose! But by no means uncommon, based on the queries received by jyotishis working actively on the " Jyotish HOT-LINE! " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As touched upon in my astrotreasures article written long ago and posted on boloji years later -- BPHS changed its perspective between the ibetadh and inteha! That was a clue for me that I tuned-in profitably (in terms of learning!) -- and the fact that it was placed so close to Sudarshan completed the clue for me! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Krishna was the awataar of Vishnu that carried the Sudarshan Chakra and was Poorna Purusha! If I write anything further on this matter in this august forum, I will be insulting the intelligence and Gnan of the inhabitants on this huge Island! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inderjee, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that might not be the case always. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results during its dasha. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > inder > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM > > > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting. Let me give my submissions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry remark to chhaya graha RAHU. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the mordern times real Rahu is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in contact. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter + Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno sites, sports sites etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite outside. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas, processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc. > > > > > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet whirlpool and will not have peace of mind. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of earth, Moon and Sun. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere. > > > > > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all the people in formless networking. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not matter to them] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji, > > > > > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote " > > > > > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first line of > > > > > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the > > > > > > > > > > prostitutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants movement > > > > > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately > > > > > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further > > > > > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed > > > > > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native village, > > > > > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M) in the > > > > > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began against > > > > > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and slowly > > > > > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first posting > > > > > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari village , > > > > > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968. Movements > > > > > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly > > > > > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the > > > > > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga. He also > > > > > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with my > > > > > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back from > > > > > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded in > > > > > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri, and > > > > > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle > > > > > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back > > > > > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a number > > > > > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light area. > > > > > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence > > > > > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there was > > > > > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil police > > > > > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and throwing > > > > > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer running > > > > > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A fat > > > > > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking very > > > > > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing towards back > > > > > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment, our > > > > > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to be > > > > > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the > > > > > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had stopped, > > > > > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at her > > > > > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small rear > > > > > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply. > > > > > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything , like me > > > > > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again peeped > > > > > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I kept > > > > > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as I > > > > > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself. She told > > > > > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her to > > > > > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help her to > > > > > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the way. As > > > > > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and commanded him > > > > > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it to > > > > > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should just > > > > > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and not to > > > > > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down, the > > > > > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I > > > > > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it near > > > > > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear > > > > > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the vehicle. I > > > > > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and > > > > > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so > > > > > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is > > > > > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can place me > > > > > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge sheet > > > > > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me no > > > > > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I will kill > > > > > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed guide to > > > > > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But nothing ever > > > > > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling sorry > > > > > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder whether > > > > > > > > > > she ever reached her home ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej Mantra, > > > > > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these memories > > > > > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the description > > > > > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's direct > > > > > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename it > > > > > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names like > > > > > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire needs > > > > > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I > > > > > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find any > > > > > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And lastly, > > > > > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966 to > > > > > > > > > > 01-01-1969. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to examine in > > > > > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The joker in > > > > > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This is why > > > > > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona and > > > > > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose sign > > > > > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving > > > > > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the qualities > > > > > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or > > > > > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected loses > > > > > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or bad! So > > > > > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest- like nature', moon could lose > > > > > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its > > > > > > > > > > aggression.. . etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a reduction in > > > > > > > > > > the qualities. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual > > > > > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific chart! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk! In fact > > > > > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY THIS > > > > > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My prayers > > > > > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my Dadas! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 " > > > > > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really very > > > > > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and smiling > > > > > > > > > > while > > > > > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely > > > > > > > > > > relaxed. My > > > > > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger > > > > > > > > > > daughter > > > > > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed with > > > > > > > > > > smile on > > > > > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got intermangled > > > > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya, Deekshya, traditions; cunturies old and the > > > > > > > > > > > > current traits. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also > > > > > > > > > > included), > > > > > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their knowledge; > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go on > > > > > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not > > > > > > > > > > withstanding > > > > > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis have > > > > > > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If this is > > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do bit of > > > > > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read, how > > > > > > > > > > quick > > > > > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we > > > > > > > > > > prepare > > > > > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a shape > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and > > > > > > > > > > satisfaction. > > > > > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also have no > > > > > > > > > > doubt > > > > > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what appears > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > the group. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I were to > > > > > > > > > > say > > > > > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are living. In > > > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it is > > > > > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any > > > > > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and > > > > > > > > > > opportunity > > > > > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and every > > > > > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and languages. > > > > > > > > > > One > > > > > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they will > > > > > > > > > > use > > > > > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was also > > > > > > > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have been > > > > > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " . Why > > > > > > > > > > such > > > > > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but Rahu > > > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been given the > > > > > > > > > > name > > > > > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is > > > > > > > > > > feared by > > > > > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a learner > > > > > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of > > > > > > > > > > problems in > > > > > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take names of > > > > > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the > > > > > > > > > > problems. > > > > > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and somehow > > > > > > > > > > tend > > > > > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real sense. > > > > > > > > > > His > > > > > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very very > > > > > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The image of > > > > > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes all the > > > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada. When > > > > > > > > > > our > > > > > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must have all > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > rishis,munis, gurus who had dual personalities. There is no need to > > > > > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems to have > > > > > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a Shishya > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the Shishya, > > > > > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his silence > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing the > > > > > > > > > > Guru. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who perhaps > > > > > > > > > > never > > > > > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question which is > > > > > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of Jyotish did > > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or > > > > > > > > > > called as > > > > > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do ghabraa > > > > > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey Kaul > > > > > > > > > > usday > > > > > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib hai > > > > > > > > > > yeh > > > > > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/ Parmeshwar/ God day bachchoon-di! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik saal to > > > > > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor seekh-layngay, jo > > > > > > > > > > raha > > > > > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali! ! ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @ . com<% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word; > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je MANSOOR na > > > > > > > > > > > > bolda taan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor wouldn't > > > > > > > > > > > > have been > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *To:* @ . com<% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra sadhana's ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given by > > > > > > > > > > > > competent > > > > > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to bring > > > > > > > > > > > > salvation to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already attained > > > > > > > > > > > > salvation! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being given > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of Gurus > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and humanity > > > > > > > > > > > > suffering so > > > > > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai duniya > > > > > > > > > > > > walon kay > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 Dear RR_jee, well written but not understood by me. Inder , " rohinicrystal " <jyotish_vani wrote: > > Chandrashekhar_jee, > > I have noticed that those too preoccupied and focused on nodes run into a situational problem which has an allegoric correlation! Rahu, unmitigated* could result in the feet not touching the ground, while ketu unmitigated* could result in one losing one's head (common sense!) and the analogy should be obvious given what Vishnu's Chakra did to Swarbhanu :-) > > Rohiniranjan > > *Important conditional consideration!! > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > Dear Rohini, > > > > Do not be modest unnecessarily. > > > > Being Chaya grahas they express themselves through others, so the laser analogy seems appropriate. > > > > It is also wondrous that though we are in a way living on the surface of Rahu we fail to recognize the Prithvi, as such. > > > > Take care, > > Chandrashekhar. > > - > > rohinicrystal > > > > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 4:02 AM > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar_jee, > > > > I may not have the profound experience of many of the currently famous and vocal Jyotish-pragnaas (Internet and otherwise), but I have been consistently impressed by the enormous spectrum and capability and potential of both Rahu and Ketu in the lives of human beings -- particularly those who have diverse experience as opposed to those who are stuck in a groove, as the expression goes. > > > > The lunar nodes have enormous potential but like a hologram trapped in a crystal they remain just a piece of decoration unless and until they are ignited by a beam of laser! Then their message comes alive (I hate to use a movie reference in this fairly heavy duty serious forum but those still young at heart may recall the modern EPIC Starwars and Princess Leah's entry and message!) > > > > This has reference to my recent message to, I believe Kulbir, where I referred to the laser, albeit not directly! Parashara did not write about Laser but BPHS (I dare say, any version, perhaps) refers to it very clearly and convincingly! > > > > Regards, > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Inderji, > > > > > > Is Rahu also not said to cause understanding of complex subjects (when in 5th) and give one Ganga snan(When in 10th)? > > > > > > Regards, > > > Chandrashekhar > > > - > > > inder > > > > > > Monday, March 29, 2010 3:11 PM > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > No dear, we shall not fight. I am again refering to imaginary situation that if we start fighting here it becomes Guru-Chaandal situation. > > > Rahu creats sudden, unexpected, good or nasty situations. Rahu is all about effects. > > > Inder > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Inderji, > > > > > > > > I thought we were talking about effects of Guru Chandal yoga. It seems like I was wrong and you were alluding to Guru Chandal situation. > > > > > > > > Anyway why should we start fight on this as we are obviously talking about two different things? > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > inder > > > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:05 PM > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chanrashekhar ji, > > > > > > > > Think of a hypothetical situation say 200 hundred years ago. > > > > Two Vidvan Pandit ji are sitting together and nicely exchanging pleasantries. Now they come out and join a vast gathering of people. > > > > Very soon they would pick up fight with difference of opinion on some ritual procedures or some interpretations in presence of mass gathering saving their egos and creating mass hysteria which would be further spread into village/town and house discussion.This is sort of Guru Chaandal situation.This is one example. So they loose their GURUDUM with Rahu effect. > > > > > > > > Donot take chaandal in literal terms, most of the people doing menial, small jobs, even dead body falls under Saturn.May be people carrying petty tales or rumours fall under Rahu. > > > > > > > > If we start fight here for example on this issue, it would certainly be Rahu effect. > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inderjee, > > > > > > > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that might not be the case always. > > > > > > > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results during its dasha. > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > inder > > > > > > > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting.Let me give my submissions. > > > > > > > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry remark to chhaya graha RAHU. > > > > > > > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the mordern times real Rahu is internet. > > > > > > > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in contact. > > > > > > > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter + Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno sites, sports sites etc. > > > > > > > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite. > > > > > > > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite outside. > > > > > > > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas, processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc. > > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet. > > > > > > > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet whirlpool and will not have peace of mind. > > > > > > > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of earth, Moon and Sun. > > > > > > > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere. > > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all the people in formless networking. > > > > > > > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not matter to them] > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji, > > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote " > > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first line of > > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the > > > > > > > prostitutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants movement > > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately > > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further > > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed > > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native village, > > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M) in the > > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began against > > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and slowly > > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first posting > > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari village , > > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968. Movements > > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly > > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the > > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga. He also > > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with my > > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back from > > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded in > > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri, and > > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle > > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back > > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a number > > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light area. > > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence > > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there was > > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil police > > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and throwing > > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer running > > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A fat > > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking very > > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing towards back > > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment, our > > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to be > > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the > > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had stopped, > > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at her > > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small rear > > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply. > > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything , like me > > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again peeped > > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I kept > > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as I > > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself. She told > > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her to > > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help her to > > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the way. As > > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and commanded him > > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it to > > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should just > > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and not to > > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down, the > > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I > > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it near > > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear > > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the vehicle. I > > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and > > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so > > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is > > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can place me > > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge sheet > > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me no > > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I will kill > > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed guide to > > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But nothing ever > > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling sorry > > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder whether > > > > > > > she ever reached her home ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej Mantra, > > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these memories > > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the description > > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's direct > > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename it > > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names like > > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire needs > > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I > > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find any > > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And lastly, > > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966 to > > > > > > > 01-01-1969. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to examine in > > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The joker in > > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This is why > > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona and > > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose sign > > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving > > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the qualities > > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or > > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected loses > > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or bad! So > > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest-like nature', moon could lose > > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its > > > > > > > aggression... etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a reduction in > > > > > > > the qualities. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual > > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific chart! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk! In fact > > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY THIS > > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My prayers > > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my Dadas! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 " > > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really very > > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and smiling > > > > > > > while > > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely > > > > > > > relaxed. My > > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger > > > > > > > daughter > > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed with > > > > > > > smile on > > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got intermangled > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya,Deekshya,traditions; cunturies old and the > > > > > > > > > current traits. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also > > > > > > > included), > > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their knowledge; > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go on > > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not > > > > > > > withstanding > > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis have > > > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If this is > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do bit of > > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read, how > > > > > > > quick > > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we > > > > > > > prepare > > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a shape > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and > > > > > > > satisfaction. > > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also have no > > > > > > > doubt > > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what appears > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > the group. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I were to > > > > > > > say > > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are living. In > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it is > > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any > > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and > > > > > > > opportunity > > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and every > > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and languages. > > > > > > > One > > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they will > > > > > > > use > > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was also > > > > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have been > > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " . Why > > > > > > > such > > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but Rahu > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been given the > > > > > > > name > > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is > > > > > > > feared by > > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a learner > > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of > > > > > > > problems in > > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take names of > > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the > > > > > > > problems. > > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and somehow > > > > > > > tend > > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real sense. > > > > > > > His > > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very very > > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The image of > > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes all the > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada. When > > > > > > > our > > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must have all > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > rishis,munis,gurus who had dual personalities. There is no need to > > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems to have > > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a Shishya > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the Shishya, > > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his silence > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing the > > > > > > > Guru. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who perhaps > > > > > > > never > > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question which is > > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of Jyotish did > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or > > > > > > > called as > > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do ghabraa > > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey Kaul > > > > > > > usday > > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib hai > > > > > > > yeh > > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/Parmeshwar/God day bachchoon-di! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik saal to > > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor seekh-layngay, jo > > > > > > > raha > > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali!! ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji, > > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word; > > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je MANSOOR na > > > > > > > > > bolda taan > > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda. > > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor wouldn't > > > > > > > > > have been > > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@ > > > > > > > > > > > *To:* <%40> > > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM > > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra sadhana's ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given by > > > > > > > > > competent > > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to bring > > > > > > > > > salvation to > > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already attained > > > > > > > > > salvation! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being given > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of Gurus > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and humanity > > > > > > > > > suffering so > > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai duniya > > > > > > > > > walon kay > > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 Dear Kulbir, I donot agree with you. Anyway does'nt matter. Inder , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote: > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic way > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says. > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it). > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on Saturn's > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda ko hazir > mankar). > Regards > Kulbir Bains. > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001 wrote: > > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or incorrect] > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking. > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking > > makes it so] > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would > > give arguments which may win him. > > > > Inder > > > > > > > > SURRENDER JOYFULLY TO THE WILL OF THE ULTIMATE DIVINITY AND RELISH THE > > TASTE OF ABSOLUTE BLISS. > > > > [image: Groups]</;_ylc=X3oDMTJkYWw3dmxoBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE0BGdycElkAz\ k2OTk4NjIEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDgyNjkwBHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2dmcARzdGltZQMxMjY5OTM0NDUz> > > Switch to: Text-Only<-traditional ?subject=Change+Delivery+F\ ormat:+Traditional>, > > Daily Digest<-digest ?subject=Email+Delivery:+Digest>• > > Un<- ?subject=Un>• Terms > > of Use <> > > . > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 Dear Rohini, Mangal is called that perhaps as he is energy and also mythologically it absorbed blood of Andhakasur, thus killing him in Andhalaasura Shiva fight? It is perhaps like a weapon of offence giving good results in hands of the protector of the country but bad in hands of the terrorists. Take care, Chandrashekhar. - rohinicrystal Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:43 AM Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET Chandrashekhar_jee and Raj bhaisaheb, I have generally winced a bit when people try to equate and extrapolate directly and literally from ancient allegories and in my opinion that creates problems which creates the 'black and white' in astrology. The latest that we have observed being the words from " Rahu is uncondtionally bad " camp. My personal preference is to take the allegories as nice mnemonics or memory aids but not an exhaustive description of the 'planets' concerned from an astrological point of view. The story of swarbhanu, the story of Kach and Devyani, and even the story of Harishchandra in Shani Mahatmay are great pointers and make what can be a rather dry subject (Astrology with its terse rules and exceptions!) interesting and even lively! But, if we get stuck in the mindset that those stories and allegories capture the entire essence of astrological reality or astrological details, then that would be a serious loss for the astrology learners and practitioners. Particularly the ones who actually read charts or give readings (the applied and practical astrologers). The astrological reality (more than sun in leo in 4th will result in this or that... for instance!) is multifactorial and rather than seeing the benefic/malefic dichotomy as absolute, I wish people will consider the modification and modulation of the essential, central characteristics of planets and realize that without such nuances and influences, astrology will begin to look rather threadbare. I am of the opinion that the karakatwas given in Jyotish texts such as BPHS (and I do not mean BPHS alone!) describe the core properties or values of the planets and we must not stray too far from those. In contrast, texts such as uttarkalamrita despite their prolific treatment of karakas must be considered with a pinch of salt, or at least some of the labels given there in the context of karakattwas. Some of the problems inherent in the 'modern' labels (neokarakatwas!) while being useful raise one question. How careful was the author or proponent in making sure that what he or she is giving is the nascent karakttwa and not the result of a multifactorial influence or compound karakattwa? What one is attributing to Jupiter for instance -- if derived from astrological observations, how much of the description is for the planet itself and what component or contamination in chemical mixture terms can be attributed to a melange of influences? It is often very difficult to tease out the influences of individual participants in a property or label which sometimes is ascribed to a single planet. I am not saying that BPHS alone is correct in all instances but certainly a safe starting point! Others may differ in their opinion, of course. Speaking of names, the label MANGAL for mars is intriguing. Why is a malefic that is cruel and associated with wounds, injuries, aggression, cutting etc should be associated with mangal which represents beneficience, shubha, amelioration? I am sure there are many similar nomenclatural puzzles in Jyotish and I realize that one lifetime is not sufficient to figure out all the labels and what not, but certainly makes the study of astrology rather interesting. Rohiniranjan , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Raj, > > I have already read your experience with interest. I can also understand what you felt as it was an absolutely wicked situation. You did something that needed great courage, knowing the way Army works. > > But I am one who can not equate ideologue of a violent movement, even for good causes, with Guru. In jyotish I always prefer to keep the grahas and our concepts about what their names should mean in the light of Puranas separate. May be not exactly separate but my interpretation of the puranic stories in explaining the nature of grahas is at variance with what is generally thought and so I prefer to keep it to myself. > > Take care, > Chandrashekhar. > > > - > Raj > > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 9:52 AM > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar Ji, > I am enjoying your posts. But, I feel you could have missed my msg No.73157 and what was the context of Guru-Rahu yuti,in the present times. ! I hope you will like reading it, as the thread began from there.! With my best regards. > > Raj Bhardwaj > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > Dear Vattem Krishnan, > > > > I was responding to Rohini's mail. I have already made clear what is meant by Chandal and what by MlecCha. I had said " One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. " > > > > Regards, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > - > > Vattem Krishnan > > > > Monday, March 29, 2010 12:37 PM > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > It is true that persons opeartating from burial grounds are referred with this term.It's application however to Rahu in litteral terms is not properly substantiated.mlechas are not chandals. > > In our epics more so when we recollect about Raja Satya Harischndra Story,we find the reference of " Chandal " the one who burns dead bodies and keeps watch at burial grounds. > > Doms are not falling under chandal category.Some where it is also mentioned to cannibals or narbhakshas as chnadals. > > > > Vattem Krishnan Cyber Jyotish Services(For all counseling services)Dr.B.V.Raman " Fools Obey Planets While Wisemen Can Control Them " Planets are neutral Controllers of Mans Karma > > > > --- On Sun, 3/28/10, Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@> > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010, 3:15 PM > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan, > > > > I am trying to acquire its manuscript, through one of my friends and hope to learn some more about Paraashara. > > > > Yes, Chandal is an interesting term. They are generally thought to be those who operate at funeral sites. > > > > Rahu is enigmatic planet and so has not rest or does not allow others to rest. > > > > Regards, > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > - > > > > rohinicrystal > > > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:57 PM > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > Chandrashekhar jee, > > > > Thanks for taking the time, Sir. I have not had the good fortune of having seen Vriddha Parashari. I have only studied BPHS, Parashara Samhita and Laghu/madhya parashari. > > > > My urdu is rather limited, actually. > > > > Chandaal is a very interesting term and at one point were thought of as the '5th caste'! In MP they were called Dom and in bengal nomoshuddoor. > > > > Poor Rahu! Even on its home-turf (internet according to some) there is no rest for the wicked :-) > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan, > > > > > > > > > > One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. > > > > > > > > > > So your contention is also correct. I liked the comment about change of perception between ibtedah and inteha. You must be pretty good at Urdu? > > > > > > > > > > Have you heard of a manuscript called Vriddha Parashari? > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > rohinicrystal > > > > > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:45 AM > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar jee, > > > > > > > > > > I have also heard that rahu represents mlechchaas or 'other cultures/foreign cultures' > > > > > > > > > > Often plays a part according to what jyotishis " claim " that it has to do with journey abroad or marrying into other cultures and religions and so on. Just another wrinkle, I suppose! But by no means uncommon, based on the queries received by jyotishis working actively on the " Jyotish HOT-LINE! " > > > > > > > > > > As touched upon in my astrotreasures article written long ago and posted on boloji years later -- BPHS changed its perspective between the ibetadh and inteha! That was a clue for me that I tuned-in profitably (in terms of learning!) -- and the fact that it was placed so close to Sudarshan completed the clue for me! > > > > > > > > > > Krishna was the awataar of Vishnu that carried the Sudarshan Chakra and was Poorna Purusha! If I write anything further on this matter in this august forum, I will be insulting the intelligence and Gnan of the inhabitants on this huge Island! > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inderjee, > > > > > > > > > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that might not be the case always. > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results during its dasha. > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > inder > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting. Let me give my submissions. > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry remark to chhaya graha RAHU. > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the mordern times real Rahu is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in contact. > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter + Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno sites, sports sites etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite. > > > > > > > > > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite outside. > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas, processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc. > > > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet whirlpool and will not have peace of mind. > > > > > > > > > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of earth, Moon and Sun. > > > > > > > > > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere. > > > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all the people in formless networking. > > > > > > > > > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not matter to them] > > > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji, > > > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote " > > > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first line of > > > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the > > > > > > > > prostitutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants movement > > > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately > > > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further > > > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed > > > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native village, > > > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M) in the > > > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began against > > > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and slowly > > > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first posting > > > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari village , > > > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968. Movements > > > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly > > > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the > > > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga. He also > > > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with my > > > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back from > > > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded in > > > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri, and > > > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle > > > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back > > > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a number > > > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light area. > > > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence > > > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there was > > > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil police > > > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and throwing > > > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer running > > > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A fat > > > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking very > > > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing towards back > > > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment, our > > > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to be > > > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the > > > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had stopped, > > > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at her > > > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small rear > > > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply. > > > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything , like me > > > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again peeped > > > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I kept > > > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as I > > > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself. She told > > > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her to > > > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help her to > > > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the way. As > > > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and commanded him > > > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it to > > > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should just > > > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and not to > > > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down, the > > > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I > > > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it near > > > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear > > > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the vehicle. I > > > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and > > > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so > > > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is > > > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can place me > > > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge sheet > > > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me no > > > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I will kill > > > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed guide to > > > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But nothing ever > > > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling sorry > > > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder whether > > > > > > > > she ever reached her home ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej Mantra, > > > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these memories > > > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the description > > > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's direct > > > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename it > > > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names like > > > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire needs > > > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I > > > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find any > > > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And lastly, > > > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966 to > > > > > > > > 01-01-1969. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to examine in > > > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The joker in > > > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This is why > > > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona and > > > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose sign > > > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving > > > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the qualities > > > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or > > > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected loses > > > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or bad! So > > > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest- like nature', moon could lose > > > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its > > > > > > > > aggression.. . etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a reduction in > > > > > > > > the qualities. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual > > > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific chart! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk! In fact > > > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY THIS > > > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My prayers > > > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my Dadas! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 " > > > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really very > > > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and smiling > > > > > > > > while > > > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely > > > > > > > > relaxed. My > > > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger > > > > > > > > daughter > > > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed with > > > > > > > > smile on > > > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got intermangled > > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya, Deekshya, traditions; cunturies old and the > > > > > > > > > > current traits. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also > > > > > > > > included), > > > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their knowledge; > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go on > > > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not > > > > > > > > withstanding > > > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis have > > > > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If this is > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do bit of > > > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read, how > > > > > > > > quick > > > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we > > > > > > > > prepare > > > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a shape > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and > > > > > > > > satisfaction. > > > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also have no > > > > > > > > doubt > > > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what appears > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > the group. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I were to > > > > > > > > say > > > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are living. In > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it is > > > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any > > > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and > > > > > > > > opportunity > > > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and every > > > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and languages. > > > > > > > > One > > > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they will > > > > > > > > use > > > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was also > > > > > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have been > > > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " . Why > > > > > > > > such > > > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but Rahu > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been given the > > > > > > > > name > > > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is > > > > > > > > feared by > > > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a learner > > > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of > > > > > > > > problems in > > > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take names of > > > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the > > > > > > > > problems. > > > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and somehow > > > > > > > > tend > > > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real sense. > > > > > > > > His > > > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very very > > > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The image of > > > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes all the > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada. When > > > > > > > > our > > > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must have all > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > rishis,munis, gurus who had dual personalities. There is no need to > > > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems to have > > > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a Shishya > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the Shishya, > > > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his silence > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing the > > > > > > > > Guru. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who perhaps > > > > > > > > never > > > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question which is > > > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of Jyotish did > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or > > > > > > > > called as > > > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do ghabraa > > > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey Kaul > > > > > > > > usday > > > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib hai > > > > > > > > yeh > > > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/ Parmeshwar/ God day bachchoon-di! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik saal to > > > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor seekh-layngay, jo > > > > > > > > raha > > > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali! ! ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word; > > > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je MANSOOR na > > > > > > > > > > bolda taan > > > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda. > > > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor wouldn't > > > > > > > > > > have been > > > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- > > > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@ > > > > > > > > > > > > *To:* <% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra sadhana's ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given by > > > > > > > > > > competent > > > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to bring > > > > > > > > > > salvation to > > > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already attained > > > > > > > > > > salvation! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being given > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of Gurus > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and humanity > > > > > > > > > > suffering so > > > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai duniya > > > > > > > > > > walon kay > > > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 Dear Inder; Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan. I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me. Regards Kulbir Bains Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM Dear Kulbir, I donot agree with you. Anyway does'nt matter. Inder , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ ...> wrote: > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic way > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says. > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it). > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on Saturn's > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda ko hazir > mankar). > Regards > Kulbir Bains. > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...> wrote: > > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct or incorrect] > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking. > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but thinking > > makes it so] > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law books he would > > give arguments which may win him. > > > > Inder On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote: Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic way possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the drishti to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda ko hazir mankar). Regards Kulbir Bains. On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001 wrote: Dear Kulbir, Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it so]Mars with Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give arguments which may win him. Inder Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 31, 2010 Report Share Posted March 31, 2010 In the emerging concepts of jyotish,there is scope for accommodating changes with reference and bring out some more concepts. It is still fresh in my memory of the final words given by my reverred teachers that no planets is bad as envisaged and also no benific planets is so benific as made out in the books for descriptive purposes. Basic AStrology though considers some planets as very malefic and others as benific,in reality often v find malefic planets including nodes giving the best and most desired material benifits and other benific planets letting down many good things and leaving the humans in a miserable state. In the context of malefic planets like Mars being referred as Managal it is both ways.Some people treat tues day as amangal also and do not take up or do or attempt for the fear of unwanted happenings.  It is for the purpose of identifying the week day it looks and the word mangal is not entirely referred in the context of kuja alone. It is eferred with reference to the day after Monday and Mnagal and it relates to Mata Guari known to refer to mangalya for a lady for her happiness. Infact Mangal vaar is accepted by some as very auspicious for vrat purpose by women folk and by some as very in auspicious and thery are many people who would like to avoid this day. Kuja od Bhauma being related with energy on account of physical features observed and recorded about this hot planets by ancient sages.Some puranic references related to lord Kumar swamy.Subrahmanya etc differ based on their customs and values. Infact in all functions it is very common to have gauri pooja for women oriented rituals.The importance of Mars female horoscopy and the karakatwas attributed to planets Mars further elaborate on theoretical issues. while considering jyotish what was referred in puranas might be anecdotal but the relevance of jyotish and application aare on different base. Vattem Krishnan Cyber Jyotish Services(For all counseling services)Dr.B.V.Raman " Fools Obey Planets While  Wisemen Can Control Them " Planets are neutral Controllers of Mans Karma --- On Wed, 3/31/10, Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET Wednesday, March 31, 2010, 1:30 PM  Dear Rohini, Mangal is called that perhaps as he is energy and also mythologically it absorbed blood of Andhakasur, thus killing him in Andhalaasura Shiva fight? It is perhaps like a weapon of offence giving good results in hands of the protector of the country but bad in hands of the terrorists. Take care, Chandrashekhar. - rohinicrystal Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:43 AM Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET Chandrashekhar_ jee and Raj bhaisaheb, I have generally winced a bit when people try to equate and extrapolate directly and literally from ancient allegories and in my opinion that creates problems which creates the 'black and white' in astrology. The latest that we have observed being the words from " Rahu is uncondtionally bad " camp. My personal preference is to take the allegories as nice mnemonics or memory aids but not an exhaustive description of the 'planets' concerned from an astrological point of view. The story of swarbhanu, the story of Kach and Devyani, and even the story of Harishchandra in Shani Mahatmay are great pointers and make what can be a rather dry subject (Astrology with its terse rules and exceptions!) interesting and even lively! But, if we get stuck in the mindset that those stories and allegories capture the entire essence of astrological reality or astrological details, then that would be a serious loss for the astrology learners and practitioners. Particularly the ones who actually read charts or give readings (the applied and practical astrologers) . The astrological reality (more than sun in leo in 4th will result in this or that... for instance!) is multifactorial and rather than seeing the benefic/malefic dichotomy as absolute, I wish people will consider the modification and modulation of the essential, central characteristics of planets and realize that without such nuances and influences, astrology will begin to look rather threadbare. I am of the opinion that the karakatwas given in Jyotish texts such as BPHS (and I do not mean BPHS alone!) describe the core properties or values of the planets and we must not stray too far from those. In contrast, texts such as uttarkalamrita despite their prolific treatment of karakas must be considered with a pinch of salt, or at least some of the labels given there in the context of karakattwas. Some of the problems inherent in the 'modern' labels (neokarakatwas! ) while being useful raise one question. How careful was the author or proponent in making sure that what he or she is giving is the nascent karakttwa and not the result of a multifactorial influence or compound karakattwa? What one is attributing to Jupiter for instance -- if derived from astrological observations, how much of the description is for the planet itself and what component or contamination in chemical mixture terms can be attributed to a melange of influences? It is often very difficult to tease out the influences of individual participants in a property or label which sometimes is ascribed to a single planet. I am not saying that BPHS alone is correct in all instances but certainly a safe starting point! Others may differ in their opinion, of course. Speaking of names, the label MANGAL for mars is intriguing. Why is a malefic that is cruel and associated with wounds, injuries, aggression, cutting etc should be associated with mangal which represents beneficience, shubha, amelioration? I am sure there are many similar nomenclatural puzzles in Jyotish and I realize that one lifetime is not sufficient to figure out all the labels and what not, but certainly makes the study of astrology rather interesting. Rohiniranjan , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashek har wrote: > > Dear Raj, > > I have already read your experience with interest. I can also understand what you felt as it was an absolutely wicked situation. You did something that needed great courage, knowing the way Army works. > > But I am one who can not equate ideologue of a violent movement, even for good causes, with Guru. In jyotish I always prefer to keep the grahas and our concepts about what their names should mean in the light of Puranas separate. May be not exactly separate but my interpretation of the puranic stories in explaining the nature of grahas is at variance with what is generally thought and so I prefer to keep it to myself. > > Take care, > Chandrashekhar. > > > - > Raj > > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 9:52 AM > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar Ji, > I am enjoying your posts. But, I feel you could have missed my msg No.73157 and what was the context of Guru-Rahu yuti,in the present times. ! I hope you will like reading it, as the thread began from there.! With my best regards. > > Raj Bhardwaj > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > Dear Vattem Krishnan, > > > > I was responding to Rohini's mail. I have already made clear what is meant by Chandal and what by MlecCha. I had said " One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. " > > > > Regards, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > - > > Vattem Krishnan > > > > Monday, March 29, 2010 12:37 PM > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > It is true that persons opeartating from burial grounds are referred with this term.It's application however to Rahu in litteral terms is not properly substantiated. mlechas are not chandals. > > In our epics more so when we recollect about Raja Satya Harischndra Story,we find the reference of " Chandal " the one who burns dead bodies and keeps watch at burial grounds. > > Doms are not falling under chandal category.Some where it is also mentioned to cannibals or narbhakshas as chnadals. > > > > Vattem Krishnan Cyber Jyotish Services(For all counseling services)Dr. B.V.Raman " Fools Obey Planets While Wisemen Can Control Them " Planets are neutral Controllers of Mans Karma > > > > --- On Sun, 3/28/10, Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashek har@> > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010, 3:15 PM > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan, > > > > I am trying to acquire its manuscript, through one of my friends and hope to learn some more about Paraashara. > > > > Yes, Chandal is an interesting term. They are generally thought to be those who operate at funeral sites. > > > > Rahu is enigmatic planet and so has not rest or does not allow others to rest. > > > > Regards, > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > - > > > > rohinicrystal > > > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:57 PM > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > Chandrashekhar jee, > > > > Thanks for taking the time, Sir. I have not had the good fortune of having seen Vriddha Parashari. I have only studied BPHS, Parashara Samhita and Laghu/madhya parashari. > > > > My urdu is rather limited, actually. > > > > Chandaal is a very interesting term and at one point were thought of as the '5th caste'! In MP they were called Dom and in bengal nomoshuddoor. > > > > Poor Rahu! Even on its home-turf (internet according to some) there is no rest for the wicked :-) > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan, > > > > > > > > > > One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. > > > > > > > > > > So your contention is also correct. I liked the comment about change of perception between ibtedah and inteha. You must be pretty good at Urdu? > > > > > > > > > > Have you heard of a manuscript called Vriddha Parashari? > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > rohinicrystal > > > > > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:45 AM > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar jee, > > > > > > > > > > I have also heard that rahu represents mlechchaas or 'other cultures/foreign cultures' > > > > > > > > > > Often plays a part according to what jyotishis " claim " that it has to do with journey abroad or marrying into other cultures and religions and so on. Just another wrinkle, I suppose! But by no means uncommon, based on the queries received by jyotishis working actively on the " Jyotish HOT-LINE! " > > > > > > > > > > As touched upon in my astrotreasures article written long ago and posted on boloji years later -- BPHS changed its perspective between the ibetadh and inteha! That was a clue for me that I tuned-in profitably (in terms of learning!) -- and the fact that it was placed so close to Sudarshan completed the clue for me! > > > > > > > > > > Krishna was the awataar of Vishnu that carried the Sudarshan Chakra and was Poorna Purusha! If I write anything further on this matter in this august forum, I will be insulting the intelligence and Gnan of the inhabitants on this huge Island! > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inderjee, > > > > > > > > > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that might not be the case always. > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results during its dasha. > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > inder > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting. Let me give my submissions. > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry remark to chhaya graha RAHU. > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the mordern times real Rahu is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in contact. > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter + Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno sites, sports sites etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite. > > > > > > > > > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite outside. > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas, processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc. > > > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet whirlpool and will not have peace of mind. > > > > > > > > > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of earth, Moon and Sun. > > > > > > > > > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere. > > > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all the people in formless networking. > > > > > > > > > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not matter to them] > > > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji, > > > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote " > > > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first line of > > > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the > > > > > > > > prostitutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants movement > > > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately > > > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further > > > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed > > > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native village, > > > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M) in the > > > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began against > > > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and slowly > > > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first posting > > > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari village , > > > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968. Movements > > > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly > > > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the > > > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga. He also > > > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with my > > > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back from > > > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded in > > > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri, and > > > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle > > > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back > > > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a number > > > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light area. > > > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence > > > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there was > > > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil police > > > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and throwing > > > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer running > > > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A fat > > > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking very > > > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing towards back > > > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment, our > > > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to be > > > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the > > > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had stopped, > > > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at her > > > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small rear > > > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply. > > > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything , like me > > > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again peeped > > > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I kept > > > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as I > > > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself. She told > > > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her to > > > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help her to > > > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the way. As > > > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and commanded him > > > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it to > > > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should just > > > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and not to > > > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down, the > > > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I > > > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it near > > > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear > > > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the vehicle. I > > > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and > > > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so > > > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is > > > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can place me > > > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge sheet > > > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me no > > > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I will kill > > > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed guide to > > > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But nothing ever > > > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling sorry > > > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder whether > > > > > > > > she ever reached her home ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej Mantra, > > > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these memories > > > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the description > > > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's direct > > > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename it > > > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names like > > > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire needs > > > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I > > > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find any > > > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And lastly, > > > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966 to > > > > > > > > 01-01-1969. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <Jyotish_ Remedies% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to examine in > > > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The joker in > > > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This is why > > > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona and > > > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose sign > > > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving > > > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the qualities > > > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or > > > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected loses > > > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or bad! So > > > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest- like nature', moon could lose > > > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its > > > > > > > > aggression.. . etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a reduction in > > > > > > > > the qualities. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual > > > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific chart! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk! In fact > > > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY THIS > > > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My prayers > > > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my Dadas! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <Jyotish_ Remedies% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 " > > > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really very > > > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and smiling > > > > > > > > while > > > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely > > > > > > > > relaxed. My > > > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger > > > > > > > > daughter > > > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed with > > > > > > > > smile on > > > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got intermangled > > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya, Deekshya, traditions; cunturies old and the > > > > > > > > > > current traits. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also > > > > > > > > included), > > > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their knowledge; > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go on > > > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not > > > > > > > > withstanding > > > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis have > > > > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If this is > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do bit of > > > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read, how > > > > > > > > quick > > > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we > > > > > > > > prepare > > > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a shape > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and > > > > > > > > satisfaction. > > > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also have no > > > > > > > > doubt > > > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what appears > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > the group. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I were to > > > > > > > > say > > > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are living. In > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it is > > > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any > > > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and > > > > > > > > opportunity > > > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and every > > > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and languages. > > > > > > > > One > > > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they will > > > > > > > > use > > > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was also > > > > > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have been > > > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " . Why > > > > > > > > such > > > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but Rahu > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been given the > > > > > > > > name > > > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is > > > > > > > > feared by > > > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a learner > > > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of > > > > > > > > problems in > > > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take names of > > > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the > > > > > > > > problems. > > > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and somehow > > > > > > > > tend > > > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real sense. > > > > > > > > His > > > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very very > > > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The image of > > > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes all the > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada. When > > > > > > > > our > > > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must have all > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > rishis,munis, gurus who had dual personalities. There is no need to > > > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems to have > > > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a Shishya > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the Shishya, > > > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his silence > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing the > > > > > > > > Guru. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who perhaps > > > > > > > > never > > > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question which is > > > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of Jyotish did > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or > > > > > > > > called as > > > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <Jyotish_ Remedies% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do ghabraa > > > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey Kaul > > > > > > > > usday > > > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib hai > > > > > > > > yeh > > > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/ Parmeshwar/ God day bachchoon-di! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik saal to > > > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor seekh-layngay, jo > > > > > > > > raha > > > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali! ! ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <Jyotish_ Remedies% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word; > > > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je MANSOOR na > > > > > > > > > > bolda taan > > > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda. > > > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor wouldn't > > > > > > > > > > have been > > > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- > > > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@ > > > > > > > > > > > > *To:* <Jyotish_ Remedies% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra sadhana's ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given by > > > > > > > > > > competent > > > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to bring > > > > > > > > > > salvation to > > > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already attained > > > > > > > > > > salvation! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being given > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of Gurus > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and humanity > > > > > > > > > > suffering so > > > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai duniya > > > > > > > > > > walon kay > > > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Why Vohrajee! Rahu is dragon's head while ketu is the headless part or the tail! Rahu does not need shoes and ketu does not need a hat! RR_, , " inder " <indervohra2001 wrote: > > Dear RR_jee, > well written but not understood by me. > Inder > > , " rohinicrystal " <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > Chandrashekhar_jee, > > > > I have noticed that those too preoccupied and focused on nodes run into a situational problem which has an allegoric correlation! Rahu, unmitigated* could result in the feet not touching the ground, while ketu unmitigated* could result in one losing one's head (common sense!) and the analogy should be obvious given what Vishnu's Chakra did to Swarbhanu :-) > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > *Important conditional consideration!! > > > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Rohini, > > > > > > Do not be modest unnecessarily. > > > > > > Being Chaya grahas they express themselves through others, so the laser analogy seems appropriate. > > > > > > It is also wondrous that though we are in a way living on the surface of Rahu we fail to recognize the Prithvi, as such. > > > > > > Take care, > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > - > > > rohinicrystal > > > > > > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 4:02 AM > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar_jee, > > > > > > I may not have the profound experience of many of the currently famous and vocal Jyotish-pragnaas (Internet and otherwise), but I have been consistently impressed by the enormous spectrum and capability and potential of both Rahu and Ketu in the lives of human beings -- particularly those who have diverse experience as opposed to those who are stuck in a groove, as the expression goes. > > > > > > The lunar nodes have enormous potential but like a hologram trapped in a crystal they remain just a piece of decoration unless and until they are ignited by a beam of laser! Then their message comes alive (I hate to use a movie reference in this fairly heavy duty serious forum but those still young at heart may recall the modern EPIC Starwars and Princess Leah's entry and message!) > > > > > > This has reference to my recent message to, I believe Kulbir, where I referred to the laser, albeit not directly! Parashara did not write about Laser but BPHS (I dare say, any version, perhaps) refers to it very clearly and convincingly! > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Inderji, > > > > > > > > Is Rahu also not said to cause understanding of complex subjects (when in 5th) and give one Ganga snan(When in 10th)? > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > - > > > > inder > > > > > > > > Monday, March 29, 2010 3:11 PM > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No dear, we shall not fight. I am again refering to imaginary situation that if we start fighting here it becomes Guru-Chaandal situation. > > > > Rahu creats sudden, unexpected, good or nasty situations. Rahu is all about effects. > > > > Inder > > > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inderji, > > > > > > > > > > I thought we were talking about effects of Guru Chandal yoga. It seems like I was wrong and you were alluding to Guru Chandal situation. > > > > > > > > > > Anyway why should we start fight on this as we are obviously talking about two different things? > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > inder > > > > > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:05 PM > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chanrashekhar ji, > > > > > > > > > > Think of a hypothetical situation say 200 hundred years ago. > > > > > Two Vidvan Pandit ji are sitting together and nicely exchanging pleasantries. Now they come out and join a vast gathering of people. > > > > > Very soon they would pick up fight with difference of opinion on some ritual procedures or some interpretations in presence of mass gathering saving their egos and creating mass hysteria which would be further spread into village/town and house discussion.This is sort of Guru Chaandal situation.This is one example. So they loose their GURUDUM with Rahu effect. > > > > > > > > > > Donot take chaandal in literal terms, most of the people doing menial, small jobs, even dead body falls under Saturn.May be people carrying petty tales or rumours fall under Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > If we start fight here for example on this issue, it would certainly be Rahu effect. > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inderjee, > > > > > > > > > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that might not be the case always. > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results during its dasha. > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > inder > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting.Let me give my submissions. > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry remark to chhaya graha RAHU. > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the mordern times real Rahu is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in contact. > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter + Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno sites, sports sites etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite. > > > > > > > > > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite outside. > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas, processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc. > > > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet whirlpool and will not have peace of mind. > > > > > > > > > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of earth, Moon and Sun. > > > > > > > > > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere. > > > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all the people in formless networking. > > > > > > > > > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not matter to them] > > > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji, > > > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote " > > > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first line of > > > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the > > > > > > > > prostitutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants movement > > > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately > > > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further > > > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed > > > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native village, > > > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M) in the > > > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began against > > > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and slowly > > > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first posting > > > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari village , > > > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968. Movements > > > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly > > > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the > > > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga. He also > > > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with my > > > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back from > > > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded in > > > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri, and > > > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle > > > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back > > > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a number > > > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light area. > > > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence > > > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there was > > > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil police > > > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and throwing > > > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer running > > > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A fat > > > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking very > > > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing towards back > > > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment, our > > > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to be > > > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the > > > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had stopped, > > > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at her > > > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small rear > > > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply. > > > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything , like me > > > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again peeped > > > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I kept > > > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as I > > > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself. She told > > > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her to > > > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help her to > > > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the way. As > > > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and commanded him > > > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it to > > > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should just > > > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and not to > > > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down, the > > > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I > > > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it near > > > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear > > > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the vehicle. I > > > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and > > > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so > > > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is > > > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can place me > > > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge sheet > > > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me no > > > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I will kill > > > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed guide to > > > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But nothing ever > > > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling sorry > > > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder whether > > > > > > > > she ever reached her home ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej Mantra, > > > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these memories > > > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the description > > > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's direct > > > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename it > > > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names like > > > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire needs > > > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I > > > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find any > > > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And lastly, > > > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966 to > > > > > > > > 01-01-1969. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to examine in > > > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The joker in > > > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This is why > > > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona and > > > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose sign > > > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving > > > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the qualities > > > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or > > > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected loses > > > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or bad! So > > > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest-like nature', moon could lose > > > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its > > > > > > > > aggression... etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a reduction in > > > > > > > > the qualities. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual > > > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific chart! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk! In fact > > > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY THIS > > > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My prayers > > > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my Dadas! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 " > > > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really very > > > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and smiling > > > > > > > > while > > > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely > > > > > > > > relaxed. My > > > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger > > > > > > > > daughter > > > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed with > > > > > > > > smile on > > > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got intermangled > > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya,Deekshya,traditions; cunturies old and the > > > > > > > > > > current traits. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also > > > > > > > > included), > > > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their knowledge; > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go on > > > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not > > > > > > > > withstanding > > > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis have > > > > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If this is > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do bit of > > > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read, how > > > > > > > > quick > > > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we > > > > > > > > prepare > > > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a shape > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and > > > > > > > > satisfaction. > > > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also have no > > > > > > > > doubt > > > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what appears > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > the group. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I were to > > > > > > > > say > > > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are living. In > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it is > > > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any > > > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and > > > > > > > > opportunity > > > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and every > > > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and languages. > > > > > > > > One > > > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they will > > > > > > > > use > > > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was also > > > > > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have been > > > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " . Why > > > > > > > > such > > > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but Rahu > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been given the > > > > > > > > name > > > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is > > > > > > > > feared by > > > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a learner > > > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of > > > > > > > > problems in > > > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take names of > > > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the > > > > > > > > problems. > > > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and somehow > > > > > > > > tend > > > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real sense. > > > > > > > > His > > > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very very > > > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The image of > > > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes all the > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada. When > > > > > > > > our > > > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must have all > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > rishis,munis,gurus who had dual personalities. There is no need to > > > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems to have > > > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a Shishya > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the Shishya, > > > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his silence > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing the > > > > > > > > Guru. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who perhaps > > > > > > > > never > > > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question which is > > > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of Jyotish did > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or > > > > > > > > called as > > > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do ghabraa > > > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey Kaul > > > > > > > > usday > > > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib hai > > > > > > > > yeh > > > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/Parmeshwar/God day bachchoon-di! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik saal to > > > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor seekh-layngay, jo > > > > > > > > raha > > > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali!! ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word; > > > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je MANSOOR na > > > > > > > > > > bolda taan > > > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda. > > > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor wouldn't > > > > > > > > > > have been > > > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@ > > > > > > > > > > > > *To:* <%40> > > > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra sadhana's ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given by > > > > > > > > > > competent > > > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to bring > > > > > > > > > > salvation to > > > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already attained > > > > > > > > > > salvation! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being given > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of Gurus > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and humanity > > > > > > > > > > suffering so > > > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai duniya > > > > > > > > > > walon kay > > > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Dear Praaji..., , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote: > >... Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic way > possible...> Kyon bhaayaa -- budhapay main Maar khilwaanay kaa iraada hai kya ...? ;-) ---<EoQm>--- Hum to youn hi BADnaam thay, teray zikr say pahlay! Aab aur paththar aayengay, kam thay jo khaayay pahlay? RR_, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Dear Chandrashekhar jee, Thank you for your kind and as always very thoughtful thoughts. You have struck a very resonant CHORD! I once came across, thankfully very early on during my astrological journey two charts of individuals born 'poles' apart in the sense of Longitudes within few days of one another with same ascendant and in kshetra with just one planet that was placed differently! One of them was a very skilled surgeon while the other was a serial killer! The lagna was scorpio in both cases. Your answer was way better than what I received a few years ago in other 'settings'! One astrologer of bengali origin said that " Mongol " did not refer to 'mongol' but to the cruel MONGOLS. Another Jyotish " Vidwan " in Varanasi told me that it was a clever remedial ploy to appease CRUEL LORD MANGAL just as some astrologers used to appease their protectors and sponsors: Royalty! Believe it or not...! Rohiniranjan , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Rohini, > > Mangal is called that perhaps as he is energy and also mythologically it absorbed blood of Andhakasur, thus killing him in Andhalaasura Shiva fight? > > It is perhaps like a weapon of offence giving good results in hands of the protector of the country but bad in hands of the terrorists. > > Take care, > Chandrashekhar. > - > rohinicrystal > > Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:43 AM > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > Chandrashekhar_jee and Raj bhaisaheb, > > I have generally winced a bit when people try to equate and extrapolate directly and literally from ancient allegories and in my opinion that creates problems which creates the 'black and white' in astrology. The latest that we have observed being the words from " Rahu is uncondtionally bad " camp. > > My personal preference is to take the allegories as nice mnemonics or memory aids but not an exhaustive description of the 'planets' concerned from an astrological point of view. The story of swarbhanu, the story of Kach and Devyani, and even the story of Harishchandra in Shani Mahatmay are great pointers and make what can be a rather dry subject (Astrology with its terse rules and exceptions!) interesting and even lively! But, if we get stuck in the mindset that those stories and allegories capture the entire essence of astrological reality or astrological details, then that would be a serious loss for the astrology learners and practitioners. Particularly the ones who actually read charts or give readings (the applied and practical astrologers). > > The astrological reality (more than sun in leo in 4th will result in this or that... for instance!) is multifactorial and rather than seeing the benefic/malefic dichotomy as absolute, I wish people will consider the modification and modulation of the essential, central characteristics of planets and realize that without such nuances and influences, astrology will begin to look rather threadbare. > > I am of the opinion that the karakatwas given in Jyotish texts such as BPHS (and I do not mean BPHS alone!) describe the core properties or values of the planets and we must not stray too far from those. In contrast, texts such as uttarkalamrita despite their prolific treatment of karakas must be considered with a pinch of salt, or at least some of the labels given there in the context of karakattwas. > > Some of the problems inherent in the 'modern' labels (neokarakatwas!) while being useful raise one question. How careful was the author or proponent in making sure that what he or she is giving is the nascent karakttwa and not the result of a multifactorial influence or compound karakattwa? What one is attributing to Jupiter for instance -- if derived from astrological observations, how much of the description is for the planet itself and what component or contamination in chemical mixture terms can be attributed to a melange of influences? It is often very difficult to tease out the influences of individual participants in a property or label which sometimes is ascribed to a single planet. > > I am not saying that BPHS alone is correct in all instances but certainly a safe starting point! Others may differ in their opinion, of course. > > Speaking of names, the label MANGAL for mars is intriguing. Why is a malefic that is cruel and associated with wounds, injuries, aggression, cutting etc should be associated with mangal which represents beneficience, shubha, amelioration? > > I am sure there are many similar nomenclatural puzzles in Jyotish and I realize that one lifetime is not sufficient to figure out all the labels and what not, but certainly makes the study of astrology rather interesting. > > Rohiniranjan > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > Dear Raj, > > > > I have already read your experience with interest. I can also understand what you felt as it was an absolutely wicked situation. You did something that needed great courage, knowing the way Army works. > > > > But I am one who can not equate ideologue of a violent movement, even for good causes, with Guru. In jyotish I always prefer to keep the grahas and our concepts about what their names should mean in the light of Puranas separate. May be not exactly separate but my interpretation of the puranic stories in explaining the nature of grahas is at variance with what is generally thought and so I prefer to keep it to myself. > > > > Take care, > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > - > > Raj > > > > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 9:52 AM > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar Ji, > > I am enjoying your posts. But, I feel you could have missed my msg No.73157 and what was the context of Guru-Rahu yuti,in the present times. ! I hope you will like reading it, as the thread began from there.! With my best regards. > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Vattem Krishnan, > > > > > > I was responding to Rohini's mail. I have already made clear what is meant by Chandal and what by MlecCha. I had said " One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. " > > > > > > Regards, > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > - > > > Vattem Krishnan > > > > > > Monday, March 29, 2010 12:37 PM > > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > It is true that persons opeartating from burial grounds are referred with this term.It's application however to Rahu in litteral terms is not properly substantiated.mlechas are not chandals. > > > In our epics more so when we recollect about Raja Satya Harischndra Story,we find the reference of " Chandal " the one who burns dead bodies and keeps watch at burial grounds. > > > Doms are not falling under chandal category.Some where it is also mentioned to cannibals or narbhakshas as chnadals. > > > > > > Vattem Krishnan Cyber Jyotish Services(For all counseling services)Dr.B.V.Raman " Fools Obey Planets While Wisemen Can Control Them " Planets are neutral Controllers of Mans Karma > > > > > > --- On Sun, 3/28/10, Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@> > > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010, 3:15 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan, > > > > > > I am trying to acquire its manuscript, through one of my friends and hope to learn some more about Paraashara. > > > > > > Yes, Chandal is an interesting term. They are generally thought to be those who operate at funeral sites. > > > > > > Rahu is enigmatic planet and so has not rest or does not allow others to rest. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > - > > > > > > rohinicrystal > > > > > > > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:57 PM > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > Chandrashekhar jee, > > > > > > Thanks for taking the time, Sir. I have not had the good fortune of having seen Vriddha Parashari. I have only studied BPHS, Parashara Samhita and Laghu/madhya parashari. > > > > > > My urdu is rather limited, actually. > > > > > > Chandaal is a very interesting term and at one point were thought of as the '5th caste'! In MP they were called Dom and in bengal nomoshuddoor. > > > > > > Poor Rahu! Even on its home-turf (internet according to some) there is no rest for the wicked :-) > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So your contention is also correct. I liked the comment about change of perception between ibtedah and inteha. You must be pretty good at Urdu? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have you heard of a manuscript called Vriddha Parashari? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > rohinicrystal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:45 AM > > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar jee, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have also heard that rahu represents mlechchaas or 'other cultures/foreign cultures' > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Often plays a part according to what jyotishis " claim " that it has to do with journey abroad or marrying into other cultures and religions and so on. Just another wrinkle, I suppose! But by no means uncommon, based on the queries received by jyotishis working actively on the " Jyotish HOT-LINE! " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As touched upon in my astrotreasures article written long ago and posted on boloji years later -- BPHS changed its perspective between the ibetadh and inteha! That was a clue for me that I tuned-in profitably (in terms of learning!) -- and the fact that it was placed so close to Sudarshan completed the clue for me! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Krishna was the awataar of Vishnu that carried the Sudarshan Chakra and was Poorna Purusha! If I write anything further on this matter in this august forum, I will be insulting the intelligence and Gnan of the inhabitants on this huge Island! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inderjee, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that might not be the case always. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results during its dasha. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > inder > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM > > > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting. Let me give my submissions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry remark to chhaya graha RAHU. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the mordern times real Rahu is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in contact. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter + Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno sites, sports sites etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite outside. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas, processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc. > > > > > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet whirlpool and will not have peace of mind. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of earth, Moon and Sun. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere. > > > > > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all the people in formless networking. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not matter to them] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji, > > > > > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote " > > > > > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first line of > > > > > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the > > > > > > > > > > prostitutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants movement > > > > > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately > > > > > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further > > > > > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed > > > > > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native village, > > > > > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M) in the > > > > > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began against > > > > > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and slowly > > > > > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first posting > > > > > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari village , > > > > > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968. Movements > > > > > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly > > > > > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the > > > > > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga. He also > > > > > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with my > > > > > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back from > > > > > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded in > > > > > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri, and > > > > > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle > > > > > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back > > > > > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a number > > > > > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light area. > > > > > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence > > > > > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there was > > > > > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil police > > > > > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and throwing > > > > > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer running > > > > > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A fat > > > > > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking very > > > > > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing towards back > > > > > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment, our > > > > > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to be > > > > > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the > > > > > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had stopped, > > > > > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at her > > > > > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small rear > > > > > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply. > > > > > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything , like me > > > > > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again peeped > > > > > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I kept > > > > > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as I > > > > > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself. She told > > > > > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her to > > > > > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help her to > > > > > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the way. As > > > > > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and commanded him > > > > > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it to > > > > > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should just > > > > > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and not to > > > > > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down, the > > > > > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I > > > > > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it near > > > > > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear > > > > > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the vehicle. I > > > > > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and > > > > > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so > > > > > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is > > > > > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can place me > > > > > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge sheet > > > > > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me no > > > > > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I will kill > > > > > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed guide to > > > > > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But nothing ever > > > > > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling sorry > > > > > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder whether > > > > > > > > > > she ever reached her home ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej Mantra, > > > > > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these memories > > > > > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the description > > > > > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's direct > > > > > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename it > > > > > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names like > > > > > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire needs > > > > > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I > > > > > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find any > > > > > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And lastly, > > > > > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966 to > > > > > > > > > > 01-01-1969. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to examine in > > > > > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The joker in > > > > > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This is why > > > > > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona and > > > > > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose sign > > > > > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving > > > > > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the qualities > > > > > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or > > > > > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected loses > > > > > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or bad! So > > > > > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest- like nature', moon could lose > > > > > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its > > > > > > > > > > aggression.. . etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a reduction in > > > > > > > > > > the qualities. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual > > > > > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific chart! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk! In fact > > > > > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY THIS > > > > > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My prayers > > > > > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my Dadas! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 " > > > > > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really very > > > > > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and smiling > > > > > > > > > > while > > > > > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely > > > > > > > > > > relaxed. My > > > > > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger > > > > > > > > > > daughter > > > > > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed with > > > > > > > > > > smile on > > > > > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got intermangled > > > > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya, Deekshya, traditions; cunturies old and the > > > > > > > > > > > > current traits. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also > > > > > > > > > > included), > > > > > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their knowledge; > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go on > > > > > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not > > > > > > > > > > withstanding > > > > > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis have > > > > > > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If this is > > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do bit of > > > > > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read, how > > > > > > > > > > quick > > > > > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we > > > > > > > > > > prepare > > > > > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a shape > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and > > > > > > > > > > satisfaction. > > > > > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also have no > > > > > > > > > > doubt > > > > > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what appears > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > the group. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I were to > > > > > > > > > > say > > > > > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are living. In > > > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it is > > > > > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any > > > > > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and > > > > > > > > > > opportunity > > > > > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and every > > > > > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and languages. > > > > > > > > > > One > > > > > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they will > > > > > > > > > > use > > > > > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was also > > > > > > > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have been > > > > > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " . Why > > > > > > > > > > such > > > > > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but Rahu > > > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been given the > > > > > > > > > > name > > > > > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is > > > > > > > > > > feared by > > > > > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a learner > > > > > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of > > > > > > > > > > problems in > > > > > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take names of > > > > > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the > > > > > > > > > > problems. > > > > > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and somehow > > > > > > > > > > tend > > > > > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real sense. > > > > > > > > > > His > > > > > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very very > > > > > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The image of > > > > > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes all the > > > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada. When > > > > > > > > > > our > > > > > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must have all > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > rishis,munis, gurus who had dual personalities. There is no need to > > > > > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems to have > > > > > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a Shishya > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the Shishya, > > > > > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his silence > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing the > > > > > > > > > > Guru. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who perhaps > > > > > > > > > > never > > > > > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question which is > > > > > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of Jyotish did > > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or > > > > > > > > > > called as > > > > > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do ghabraa > > > > > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey Kaul > > > > > > > > > > usday > > > > > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib hai > > > > > > > > > > yeh > > > > > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/ Parmeshwar/ God day bachchoon-di! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik saal to > > > > > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor seekh-layngay, jo > > > > > > > > > > raha > > > > > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali! ! ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @ . com<% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word; > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je MANSOOR na > > > > > > > > > > > > bolda taan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor wouldn't > > > > > > > > > > > > have been > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *To:* @ . com<% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra sadhana's ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given by > > > > > > > > > > > > competent > > > > > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to bring > > > > > > > > > > > > salvation to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already attained > > > > > > > > > > > > salvation! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being given > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of Gurus > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and humanity > > > > > > > > > > > > suffering so > > > > > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai duniya > > > > > > > > > > > > walon kay > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Yeah yeah, Not needing hat and shoes saves lot of money. If we also donot understand the things we save lot of efforts andtime and energy!! Inder , " rohinicrystal " <jyotish_vani wrote: > > Why Vohrajee! > > Rahu is dragon's head while ketu is the headless part or the tail! > > Rahu does not need shoes and ketu does not need a hat! > > RR_, > > , " inder " <indervohra2001@> wrote: > > > > Dear RR_jee, > > well written but not understood by me. > > Inder > > > > , " rohinicrystal " <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > Chandrashekhar_jee, > > > > > > I have noticed that those too preoccupied and focused on nodes run into a situational problem which has an allegoric correlation! Rahu, unmitigated* could result in the feet not touching the ground, while ketu unmitigated* could result in one losing one's head (common sense!) and the analogy should be obvious given what Vishnu's Chakra did to Swarbhanu :-) > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > *Important conditional consideration!! > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini, > > > > > > > > Do not be modest unnecessarily. > > > > > > > > Being Chaya grahas they express themselves through others, so the laser analogy seems appropriate. > > > > > > > > It is also wondrous that though we are in a way living on the surface of Rahu we fail to recognize the Prithvi, as such. > > > > > > > > Take care, > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > - > > > > rohinicrystal > > > > > > > > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 4:02 AM > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar_jee, > > > > > > > > I may not have the profound experience of many of the currently famous and vocal Jyotish-pragnaas (Internet and otherwise), but I have been consistently impressed by the enormous spectrum and capability and potential of both Rahu and Ketu in the lives of human beings -- particularly those who have diverse experience as opposed to those who are stuck in a groove, as the expression goes. > > > > > > > > The lunar nodes have enormous potential but like a hologram trapped in a crystal they remain just a piece of decoration unless and until they are ignited by a beam of laser! Then their message comes alive (I hate to use a movie reference in this fairly heavy duty serious forum but those still young at heart may recall the modern EPIC Starwars and Princess Leah's entry and message!) > > > > > > > > This has reference to my recent message to, I believe Kulbir, where I referred to the laser, albeit not directly! Parashara did not write about Laser but BPHS (I dare say, any version, perhaps) refers to it very clearly and convincingly! > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inderji, > > > > > > > > > > Is Rahu also not said to cause understanding of complex subjects (when in 5th) and give one Ganga snan(When in 10th)? > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > - > > > > > inder > > > > > > > > > > Monday, March 29, 2010 3:11 PM > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No dear, we shall not fight. I am again refering to imaginary situation that if we start fighting here it becomes Guru-Chaandal situation. > > > > > Rahu creats sudden, unexpected, good or nasty situations. Rahu is all about effects. > > > > > Inder > > > > > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inderji, > > > > > > > > > > > > I thought we were talking about effects of Guru Chandal yoga. It seems like I was wrong and you were alluding to Guru Chandal situation. > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway why should we start fight on this as we are obviously talking about two different things? > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > inder > > > > > > > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:05 PM > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chanrashekhar ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Think of a hypothetical situation say 200 hundred years ago. > > > > > > Two Vidvan Pandit ji are sitting together and nicely exchanging pleasantries. Now they come out and join a vast gathering of people. > > > > > > Very soon they would pick up fight with difference of opinion on some ritual procedures or some interpretations in presence of mass gathering saving their egos and creating mass hysteria which would be further spread into village/town and house discussion.This is sort of Guru Chaandal situation.This is one example. So they loose their GURUDUM with Rahu effect. > > > > > > > > > > > > Donot take chaandal in literal terms, most of the people doing menial, small jobs, even dead body falls under Saturn.May be people carrying petty tales or rumours fall under Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > If we start fight here for example on this issue, it would certainly be Rahu effect. > > > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inderjee, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that might not be the case always. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results during its dasha. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > inder > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM > > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting.Let me give my submissions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry remark to chhaya graha RAHU. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the mordern times real Rahu is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in contact. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter + Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno sites, sports sites etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite outside. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas, processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc. > > > > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet whirlpool and will not have peace of mind. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of earth, Moon and Sun. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere. > > > > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all the people in formless networking. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not matter to them] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji, > > > > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote " > > > > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first line of > > > > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the > > > > > > > > > prostitutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants movement > > > > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately > > > > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further > > > > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed > > > > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native village, > > > > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M) in the > > > > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began against > > > > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and slowly > > > > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first posting > > > > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari village , > > > > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968. Movements > > > > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly > > > > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the > > > > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga. He also > > > > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with my > > > > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back from > > > > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded in > > > > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri, and > > > > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle > > > > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back > > > > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a number > > > > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light area. > > > > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence > > > > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there was > > > > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil police > > > > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and throwing > > > > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer running > > > > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A fat > > > > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking very > > > > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing towards back > > > > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment, our > > > > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to be > > > > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the > > > > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had stopped, > > > > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at her > > > > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small rear > > > > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply. > > > > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything , like me > > > > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again peeped > > > > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I kept > > > > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as I > > > > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself. She told > > > > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her to > > > > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help her to > > > > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the way. As > > > > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and commanded him > > > > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it to > > > > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should just > > > > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and not to > > > > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down, the > > > > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I > > > > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it near > > > > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear > > > > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the vehicle. I > > > > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and > > > > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so > > > > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is > > > > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can place me > > > > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge sheet > > > > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me no > > > > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I will kill > > > > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed guide to > > > > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But nothing ever > > > > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling sorry > > > > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder whether > > > > > > > > > she ever reached her home ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej Mantra, > > > > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these memories > > > > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the description > > > > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's direct > > > > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename it > > > > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names like > > > > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire needs > > > > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I > > > > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find any > > > > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And lastly, > > > > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966 to > > > > > > > > > 01-01-1969. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to examine in > > > > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The joker in > > > > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This is why > > > > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona and > > > > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose sign > > > > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving > > > > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the qualities > > > > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or > > > > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected loses > > > > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or bad! So > > > > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest-like nature', moon could lose > > > > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its > > > > > > > > > aggression... etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a reduction in > > > > > > > > > the qualities. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual > > > > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific chart! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk! In fact > > > > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY THIS > > > > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My prayers > > > > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my Dadas! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 " > > > > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really very > > > > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and smiling > > > > > > > > > while > > > > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely > > > > > > > > > relaxed. My > > > > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger > > > > > > > > > daughter > > > > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed with > > > > > > > > > smile on > > > > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got intermangled > > > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya,Deekshya,traditions; cunturies old and the > > > > > > > > > > > current traits. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also > > > > > > > > > included), > > > > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their knowledge; > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go on > > > > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not > > > > > > > > > withstanding > > > > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis have > > > > > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If this is > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do bit of > > > > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read, how > > > > > > > > > quick > > > > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we > > > > > > > > > prepare > > > > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a shape > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and > > > > > > > > > satisfaction. > > > > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also have no > > > > > > > > > doubt > > > > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what appears > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > the group. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I were to > > > > > > > > > say > > > > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are living. In > > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it is > > > > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any > > > > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and > > > > > > > > > opportunity > > > > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and every > > > > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and languages. > > > > > > > > > One > > > > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they will > > > > > > > > > use > > > > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was also > > > > > > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have been > > > > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " . Why > > > > > > > > > such > > > > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but Rahu > > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been given the > > > > > > > > > name > > > > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is > > > > > > > > > feared by > > > > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a learner > > > > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of > > > > > > > > > problems in > > > > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take names of > > > > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the > > > > > > > > > problems. > > > > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and somehow > > > > > > > > > tend > > > > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real sense. > > > > > > > > > His > > > > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very very > > > > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The image of > > > > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes all the > > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada. When > > > > > > > > > our > > > > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must have all > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > rishis,munis,gurus who had dual personalities. There is no need to > > > > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems to have > > > > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a Shishya > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the Shishya, > > > > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his silence > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing the > > > > > > > > > Guru. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who perhaps > > > > > > > > > never > > > > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question which is > > > > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of Jyotish did > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or > > > > > > > > > called as > > > > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do ghabraa > > > > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey Kaul > > > > > > > > > usday > > > > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib hai > > > > > > > > > yeh > > > > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/Parmeshwar/God day bachchoon-di! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik saal to > > > > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor seekh-layngay, jo > > > > > > > > > raha > > > > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali!! ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word; > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je MANSOOR na > > > > > > > > > > > bolda taan > > > > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor wouldn't > > > > > > > > > > > have been > > > > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@ > > > > > > > > > > > > > *To:* <%40> > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra sadhana's ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given by > > > > > > > > > > > competent > > > > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to bring > > > > > > > > > > > salvation to > > > > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already attained > > > > > > > > > > > salvation! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being given > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of Gurus > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and humanity > > > > > > > > > > > suffering so > > > > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai duniya > > > > > > > > > > > walon kay > > > > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Dear Kulbir jee, Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman. But but.. Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak. Inder , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote: > > Dear Inder; > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan. > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me. > Regards > Kulbir Bains > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM > > > Dear Kulbir, > I donot agree with you. > Anyway does'nt matter. > Inder > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ ...> > wrote: > > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic > way > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says. > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred > karma > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it). > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on Saturn's > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda ko hazir > > mankar). > > Regards > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct or > incorrect] > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking. > > > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but thinking > > > makes it so] > > > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law books he > would > > > give arguments which may win him. > > > > > > Inder > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote: > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic way > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11. represents SABKI > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the seat of > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu before > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the drishti > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda > ko hazir mankar). > > Regards > > Kulbir Bains. > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001 wrote: > > Dear Kulbir, > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter + Saturn > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it so]Mars with > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give > arguments which may win him. > > Inder > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Inder Sahib, Bad Acha; Badnaam Bura. Kare koi ,Bhare koi? Why blame poor Rahu?, Tughlaq's farmaans planning was meticulous just ahead of time. EXECUTION went wrong. Just to drive home the point Jupiter in 3rd house surrounded by Mercury, Venus, Rahu , Saturn. and Moon in 12. makes a fit Tughlaq Sahib's nature/case. Regards Kulbir Bains , " inder " <indervohra2001 wrote: > > Dear Kulbir jee, > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman. > But but.. > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak. > Inder > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@> wrote: > > > > Dear Inder; > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan. > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me. > > Regards > > Kulbir Bains > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > I donot agree with you. > > Anyway does'nt matter. > > Inder > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ ...> > > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic > > way > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says. > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred > > karma > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it). > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on Saturn's > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda ko hazir > > > mankar). > > > Regards > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct or > > incorrect] > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking. > > > > > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but thinking > > > > makes it so] > > > > > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law books he > > would > > > > give arguments which may win him. > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@> wrote: > > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic way > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11. represents SABKI > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the seat of > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu before > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the drishti > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda > > ko hazir mankar). > > > > Regards > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@> wrote: > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter + Saturn > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it so]Mars with > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give > > arguments which may win him. > > > > Inder > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Inder Sahib, Bad Acha; Badnaam Bura. Kare koi ,Bhare koi? Why blame poor Rahu?, Tughlaq's farmaans planning was meticulous just ahead of time. EXECUTION went wrong. Just to drive home the point Jupiter in 3rd house surrounded by Mercury, Venus, Rahu , Saturn. and Moon in 12. makes a fit Tughlaq Sahib's nature/case. Regards Kulbir Bains , " inder " <indervohra2001 wrote: > > Dear Kulbir jee, > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman. > But but.. > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak. > Inder > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@> wrote: > > > > Dear Inder; > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan. > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me. > > Regards > > Kulbir Bains > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > I donot agree with you. > > Anyway does'nt matter. > > Inder > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Dear all, All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I would like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a Yoga which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and Jhas could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji maharaj. Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and Jha in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class Brahmin and Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me because Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country. I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on 10/04/2010. I have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet, which can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons, which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of romanticism after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude xxx, RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas. Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko, Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai. 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee, sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee, Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai, Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur hai…. 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai, Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai, Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main, Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai, Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..! AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti' Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya, Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya, Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna…. Raj Bhardwaj , " inder " <indervohra2001 wrote: > > Dear Kulbir jee, > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman. > But but.. > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak. > Inder > > , Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote: > > > > Dear Inder; > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan. > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me. > > Regards > > Kulbir Bains > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > I donot agree with you. > > Anyway does'nt matter. > > Inder > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ ....> > > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic > > way > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says. > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred > > karma > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it). > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on Saturn's > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda ko hazir > > > mankar). > > > Regards > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct or > > incorrect] > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking. > > > > > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but thinking > > > > makes it so] > > > > > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law books he > > would > > > > give arguments which may win him. > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote: > > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best pragmatic way > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11. represents SABKI > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the seat of > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu before > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the drishti > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda > > ko hazir mankar). > > > > Regards > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote: > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter + Saturn > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it so]Mars with > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give > > arguments which may win him. > > > > Inder > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Sir Raj Bharadwaj ji. UTHHE karman de hone ne nibede; kisse na teri puchni. Respect and Regards Kulbir Bains. On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949 wrote: > > > > Dear all, > > All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I would > like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a Yoga > which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has > been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and Jhas > could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji maharaj. > Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and Jha > in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class Brahmin and > Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also > there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me because > Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country. > > I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on 10/04/2010. I > have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet, which > can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or > Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons, > which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of romanticism > after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude xxx, > RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas. > > Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko, > > Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai. > > 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee, > > sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee, > > Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai, > > Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi > > Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur hai…. > > 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai, > > Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai, > > Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main, > > Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai, > > Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, > > Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..! > > AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti' > > Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya, > > Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya, > > Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke > > Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke > > Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna…. > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > <%40>, > " inder " <indervohra2001 > wrote: > > > > Dear Kulbir jee, > > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman. > > But but.. > > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went > topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak. > > Inder > > > > <%40>, > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Inder; > > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan. > > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me. > > > Regards > > > Kulbir Bains > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM > > > > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > I donot agree with you. > > > Anyway does'nt matter. > > > Inder > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ > ...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best > pragmatic > > > way > > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says. > > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. > In 11th > > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the > incurred > > > karma > > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat > of judge > > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it). > > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on > Saturn's > > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda > ko hazir > > > > mankar). > > > > Regards > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct > or > > > incorrect] > > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking. > > > > > > > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but > thinking > > > > > makes it so] > > > > > > > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law > books he > > > would > > > > > give arguments which may win him. > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best > pragmatic way > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11. > represents SABKI > > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the > seat of > > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu > before > > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the > drishti > > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes > it on > > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. > (khuda > > > ko hazir mankar). > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or > > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter + > Saturn > > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it > so]Mars with > > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give > > > arguments which may win him. > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Typo error Sir, UTHHE karman de hone ne nibede; na teri JAAT puchani. On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 10:16 PM, Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote: > Sir Raj Bharadwaj ji. > UTHHE karman de hone ne nibede; kisse na teri puchni. > > Respect and Regards > Kulbir Bains. > > > On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949 wrote: > >> >> >> >> Dear all, >> >> All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I would >> like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a Yoga >> which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has >> been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and Jhas >> could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji maharaj. >> Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and Jha >> in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class Brahmin and >> Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also >> there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me because >> Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country. >> >> I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on 10/04/2010. I >> have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet, which >> can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or >> Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons, >> which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of romanticism >> after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude xxx, >> RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas. >> >> Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko, >> >> Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai. >> >> 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee, >> >> sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee, >> >> Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai, >> >> Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi >> >> Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur hai…. >> >> 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai, >> >> Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai, >> >> Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main, >> >> Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai, >> >> Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, >> >> Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..! >> >> AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti' >> >> Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya, >> >> Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya, >> >> Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke >> >> Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke >> >> Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna…. >> >> Raj Bhardwaj >> >> >> <%40>, >> " inder " <indervohra2001 >> wrote: >> > >> > Dear Kulbir jee, >> > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman. >> > But but.. >> > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went >> topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak. >> > Inder >> > >> > --- In <%40>, >> Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ >> wrote: >> > > >> > > Dear Inder; >> > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan. >> > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me. >> > > Regards >> > > Kulbir Bains >> > > >> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET >> > > >> > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM >> > > >> > > >> > > Dear Kulbir, >> > > I donot agree with you. >> > > Anyway does'nt matter. >> > > Inder >> > > >> > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ >> ...> >> > > wrote: >> > > > >> > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best >> pragmatic >> > > way >> > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says. >> > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. >> In 11th >> > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the >> incurred >> > > karma >> > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat >> of judge >> > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it). >> > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on >> Saturn's >> > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda >> ko hazir >> > > > mankar). >> > > > Regards >> > > > Kulbir Bains. >> > > > >> > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...> >> wrote: >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > Dear Kulbir, >> > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct >> or >> > > incorrect] >> > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking. >> > > > > >> > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but >> thinking >> > > > > makes it so] >> > > > > >> > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law >> books he >> > > would >> > > > > give arguments which may win him. >> > > > > >> > > > > Inder >> > > >> > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote: >> > > >> > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best >> pragmatic way >> > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11. >> represents SABKI >> > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the >> seat of >> > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu >> before >> > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the >> drishti >> > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes >> it on >> > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. >> (khuda >> > > ko hazir mankar). >> > > >> > > Regards >> > > >> > > Kulbir Bains. >> > > >> > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote: >> > > >> > > Dear Kulbir, >> > > >> > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or >> > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter + >> Saturn >> > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it >> so]Mars with >> > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give >> > > arguments which may win him. >> > > >> > > Inder >> >> > > >> > > >> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Dear Rohini Ranjan, You are very kind. I must say that both the respondents to your original query did have a vivid imagination, if not rationale. Regards, Chandrashekhar - rohinicrystal Thursday, April 01, 2010 5:26 AM Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET Dear Chandrashekhar jee, Thank you for your kind and as always very thoughtful thoughts. You have struck a very resonant CHORD! I once came across, thankfully very early on during my astrological journey two charts of individuals born 'poles' apart in the sense of Longitudes within few days of one another with same ascendant and in kshetra with just one planet that was placed differently! One of them was a very skilled surgeon while the other was a serial killer! The lagna was scorpio in both cases. Your answer was way better than what I received a few years ago in other 'settings'! One astrologer of bengali origin said that " Mongol " did not refer to 'mongol' but to the cruel MONGOLS. Another Jyotish " Vidwan " in Varanasi told me that it was a clever remedial ploy to appease CRUEL LORD MANGAL just as some astrologers used to appease their protectors and sponsors: Royalty! Believe it or not...! Rohiniranjan , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Rohini, > > Mangal is called that perhaps as he is energy and also mythologically it absorbed blood of Andhakasur, thus killing him in Andhalaasura Shiva fight? > > It is perhaps like a weapon of offence giving good results in hands of the protector of the country but bad in hands of the terrorists. > > Take care, > Chandrashekhar. > - > rohinicrystal > > Wednesday, March 31, 2010 3:43 AM > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > Chandrashekhar_jee and Raj bhaisaheb, > > I have generally winced a bit when people try to equate and extrapolate directly and literally from ancient allegories and in my opinion that creates problems which creates the 'black and white' in astrology. The latest that we have observed being the words from " Rahu is uncondtionally bad " camp. > > My personal preference is to take the allegories as nice mnemonics or memory aids but not an exhaustive description of the 'planets' concerned from an astrological point of view. The story of swarbhanu, the story of Kach and Devyani, and even the story of Harishchandra in Shani Mahatmay are great pointers and make what can be a rather dry subject (Astrology with its terse rules and exceptions!) interesting and even lively! But, if we get stuck in the mindset that those stories and allegories capture the entire essence of astrological reality or astrological details, then that would be a serious loss for the astrology learners and practitioners. Particularly the ones who actually read charts or give readings (the applied and practical astrologers). > > The astrological reality (more than sun in leo in 4th will result in this or that... for instance!) is multifactorial and rather than seeing the benefic/malefic dichotomy as absolute, I wish people will consider the modification and modulation of the essential, central characteristics of planets and realize that without such nuances and influences, astrology will begin to look rather threadbare. > > I am of the opinion that the karakatwas given in Jyotish texts such as BPHS (and I do not mean BPHS alone!) describe the core properties or values of the planets and we must not stray too far from those. In contrast, texts such as uttarkalamrita despite their prolific treatment of karakas must be considered with a pinch of salt, or at least some of the labels given there in the context of karakattwas. > > Some of the problems inherent in the 'modern' labels (neokarakatwas!) while being useful raise one question. How careful was the author or proponent in making sure that what he or she is giving is the nascent karakttwa and not the result of a multifactorial influence or compound karakattwa? What one is attributing to Jupiter for instance -- if derived from astrological observations, how much of the description is for the planet itself and what component or contamination in chemical mixture terms can be attributed to a melange of influences? It is often very difficult to tease out the influences of individual participants in a property or label which sometimes is ascribed to a single planet. > > I am not saying that BPHS alone is correct in all instances but certainly a safe starting point! Others may differ in their opinion, of course. > > Speaking of names, the label MANGAL for mars is intriguing. Why is a malefic that is cruel and associated with wounds, injuries, aggression, cutting etc should be associated with mangal which represents beneficience, shubha, amelioration? > > I am sure there are many similar nomenclatural puzzles in Jyotish and I realize that one lifetime is not sufficient to figure out all the labels and what not, but certainly makes the study of astrology rather interesting. > > Rohiniranjan > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > Dear Raj, > > > > I have already read your experience with interest. I can also understand what you felt as it was an absolutely wicked situation. You did something that needed great courage, knowing the way Army works. > > > > But I am one who can not equate ideologue of a violent movement, even for good causes, with Guru. In jyotish I always prefer to keep the grahas and our concepts about what their names should mean in the light of Puranas separate. May be not exactly separate but my interpretation of the puranic stories in explaining the nature of grahas is at variance with what is generally thought and so I prefer to keep it to myself. > > > > Take care, > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > - > > Raj > > > > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 9:52 AM > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar Ji, > > I am enjoying your posts. But, I feel you could have missed my msg No.73157 and what was the context of Guru-Rahu yuti,in the present times. ! I hope you will like reading it, as the thread began from there.! With my best regards. > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Vattem Krishnan, > > > > > > I was responding to Rohini's mail. I have already made clear what is meant by Chandal and what by MlecCha. I had said " One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. " > > > > > > Regards, > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > - > > > Vattem Krishnan > > > > > > Monday, March 29, 2010 12:37 PM > > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > It is true that persons opeartating from burial grounds are referred with this term.It's application however to Rahu in litteral terms is not properly substantiated.mlechas are not chandals. > > > In our epics more so when we recollect about Raja Satya Harischndra Story,we find the reference of " Chandal " the one who burns dead bodies and keeps watch at burial grounds. > > > Doms are not falling under chandal category.Some where it is also mentioned to cannibals or narbhakshas as chnadals. > > > > > > Vattem Krishnan Cyber Jyotish Services(For all counseling services)Dr.B.V.Raman " Fools Obey Planets While Wisemen Can Control Them " Planets are neutral Controllers of Mans Karma > > > > > > --- On Sun, 3/28/10, Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar@> > > > Re: Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010, 3:15 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan, > > > > > > I am trying to acquire its manuscript, through one of my friends and hope to learn some more about Paraashara. > > > > > > Yes, Chandal is an interesting term. They are generally thought to be those who operate at funeral sites. > > > > > > Rahu is enigmatic planet and so has not rest or does not allow others to rest. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > - > > > > > > rohinicrystal > > > > > > > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 11:57 PM > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > Chandrashekhar jee, > > > > > > Thanks for taking the time, Sir. I have not had the good fortune of having seen Vriddha Parashari. I have only studied BPHS, Parashara Samhita and Laghu/madhya parashari. > > > > > > My urdu is rather limited, actually. > > > > > > Chandaal is a very interesting term and at one point were thought of as the '5th caste'! In MP they were called Dom and in bengal nomoshuddoor. > > > > > > Poor Rahu! Even on its home-turf (internet according to some) there is no rest for the wicked :-) > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini Ranjan, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One meaning of Chandal is worst amongst men and that of Mlecha is a wicked man, a foreigner, one who does not speak Sanskrit etc. So that too is right. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So your contention is also correct. I liked the comment about change of perception between ibtedah and inteha. You must be pretty good at Urdu? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Have you heard of a manuscript called Vriddha Parashari? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > rohinicrystal > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:45 AM > > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar jee, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have also heard that rahu represents mlechchaas or 'other cultures/foreign cultures' > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Often plays a part according to what jyotishis " claim " that it has to do with journey abroad or marrying into other cultures and religions and so on. Just another wrinkle, I suppose! But by no means uncommon, based on the queries received by jyotishis working actively on the " Jyotish HOT-LINE! " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As touched upon in my astrotreasures article written long ago and posted on boloji years later -- BPHS changed its perspective between the ibetadh and inteha! That was a clue for me that I tuned-in profitably (in terms of learning!) -- and the fact that it was placed so close to Sudarshan completed the clue for me! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Krishna was the awataar of Vishnu that carried the Sudarshan Chakra and was Poorna Purusha! If I write anything further on this matter in this august forum, I will be insulting the intelligence and Gnan of the inhabitants on this huge Island! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inderjee, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that might not be the case always. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results during its dasha. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > inder > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM > > > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting. Let me give my submissions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry remark to chhaya graha RAHU. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the mordern times real Rahu is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in contact. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter + Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno sites, sports sites etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite outside. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas, processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc. > > > > > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet whirlpool and will not have peace of mind. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of earth, Moon and Sun. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere. > > > > > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all the people in formless networking. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not matter to them] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji, > > > > > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote " > > > > > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first line of > > > > > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the > > > > > > > > > > prostitutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants movement > > > > > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately > > > > > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further > > > > > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed > > > > > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native village, > > > > > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M) in the > > > > > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began against > > > > > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and slowly > > > > > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first posting > > > > > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari village , > > > > > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968. Movements > > > > > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly > > > > > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the > > > > > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga. He also > > > > > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with my > > > > > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back from > > > > > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded in > > > > > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri, and > > > > > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle > > > > > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back > > > > > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a number > > > > > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light area. > > > > > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence > > > > > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there was > > > > > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil police > > > > > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and throwing > > > > > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer running > > > > > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A fat > > > > > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking very > > > > > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing towards back > > > > > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment, our > > > > > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to be > > > > > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the > > > > > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had stopped, > > > > > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at her > > > > > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small rear > > > > > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply. > > > > > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything , like me > > > > > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again peeped > > > > > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I kept > > > > > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as I > > > > > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself. She told > > > > > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her to > > > > > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help her to > > > > > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the way. As > > > > > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and commanded him > > > > > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it to > > > > > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should just > > > > > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and not to > > > > > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down, the > > > > > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I > > > > > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it near > > > > > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear > > > > > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the vehicle. I > > > > > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and > > > > > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so > > > > > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is > > > > > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can place me > > > > > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge sheet > > > > > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me no > > > > > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I will kill > > > > > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed guide to > > > > > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But nothing ever > > > > > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling sorry > > > > > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder whether > > > > > > > > > > she ever reached her home ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej Mantra, > > > > > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these memories > > > > > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the description > > > > > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's direct > > > > > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename it > > > > > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names like > > > > > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire needs > > > > > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I > > > > > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find any > > > > > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And lastly, > > > > > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966 to > > > > > > > > > > 01-01-1969. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to examine in > > > > > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The joker in > > > > > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This is why > > > > > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona and > > > > > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose sign > > > > > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving > > > > > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the qualities > > > > > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or > > > > > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected loses > > > > > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or bad! So > > > > > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest- like nature', moon could lose > > > > > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its > > > > > > > > > > aggression.. . etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a reduction in > > > > > > > > > > the qualities. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual > > > > > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific chart! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk! In fact > > > > > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY THIS > > > > > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My prayers > > > > > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my Dadas! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 " > > > > > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really very > > > > > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and smiling > > > > > > > > > > while > > > > > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely > > > > > > > > > > relaxed. My > > > > > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger > > > > > > > > > > daughter > > > > > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed with > > > > > > > > > > smile on > > > > > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got intermangled > > > > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya, Deekshya, traditions; cunturies old and the > > > > > > > > > > > > current traits. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also > > > > > > > > > > included), > > > > > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their knowledge; > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go on > > > > > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not > > > > > > > > > > withstanding > > > > > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis have > > > > > > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If this is > > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do bit of > > > > > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read, how > > > > > > > > > > quick > > > > > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we > > > > > > > > > > prepare > > > > > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a shape > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and > > > > > > > > > > satisfaction. > > > > > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also have no > > > > > > > > > > doubt > > > > > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what appears > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > the group. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I were to > > > > > > > > > > say > > > > > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are living. In > > > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it is > > > > > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any > > > > > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and > > > > > > > > > > opportunity > > > > > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and every > > > > > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and languages. > > > > > > > > > > One > > > > > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they will > > > > > > > > > > use > > > > > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was also > > > > > > > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have been > > > > > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " . Why > > > > > > > > > > such > > > > > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but Rahu > > > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been given the > > > > > > > > > > name > > > > > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is > > > > > > > > > > feared by > > > > > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a learner > > > > > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of > > > > > > > > > > problems in > > > > > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take names of > > > > > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the > > > > > > > > > > problems. > > > > > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and somehow > > > > > > > > > > tend > > > > > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real sense. > > > > > > > > > > His > > > > > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very very > > > > > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The image of > > > > > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes all the > > > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada. When > > > > > > > > > > our > > > > > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must have all > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > rishis,munis, gurus who had dual personalities. There is no need to > > > > > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems to have > > > > > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a Shishya > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the Shishya, > > > > > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his silence > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing the > > > > > > > > > > Guru. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who perhaps > > > > > > > > > > never > > > > > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question which is > > > > > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of Jyotish did > > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or > > > > > > > > > > called as > > > > > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do ghabraa > > > > > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey Kaul > > > > > > > > > > usday > > > > > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib hai > > > > > > > > > > yeh > > > > > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/ Parmeshwar/ God day bachchoon-di! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik saal to > > > > > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor seekh-layngay, jo > > > > > > > > > > raha > > > > > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali! ! ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > @ . com<% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word; > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je MANSOOR na > > > > > > > > > > > > bolda taan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor wouldn't > > > > > > > > > > > > have been > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *To:* @ . com<% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra sadhana's ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given by > > > > > > > > > > > > competent > > > > > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to bring > > > > > > > > > > > > salvation to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already attained > > > > > > > > > > > > salvation! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being given > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of Gurus > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and humanity > > > > > > > > > > > > suffering so > > > > > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai duniya > > > > > > > > > > > > walon kay > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Sir Raj Bharadwaj ji, I am preparing a detailed note on the topic but for immediate reference sake. lalkitab 1952 for Ketu 6 says *'sher kad khunkhaar kutta' * * " hazam kutta gar ghee duniya mein karta,* * chupe firta har ghar mein buzdil na darta " * Page no 75 of 1940 edition says " khanna no 8 mein mangal shanichar ki buri nazar ko khanna no.2 ka maalik brahspat dekh kar hi pehchan lega magar bolega nahin. us bure nazar ke asar ko brahspat jab khanna no. 6 ke malik ketu ke yahan bhejega to wahan budh bhi hone ketu bol kar (budh ki taqat) bata dega. This refers to/explains shishya chandal yog. as to how Ketu disobeys Guru and is/becomes responsible for creating enmity between Jupiter and Mercury. Regards Kulbir bains. On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949 wrote: > > > > Dear all, > > All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I would > like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a Yoga > which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has > been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and Jhas > could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji maharaj. > Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and Jha > in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class Brahmin and > Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also > there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me because > Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country. > > I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on 10/04/2010. I > have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet, which > can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or > Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons, > which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of romanticism > after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude xxx, > RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas. > > Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko, > > Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai. > > 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee, > > sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee, > > Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai, > > Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi > > Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur hai…. > > 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai, > > Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai, > > Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main, > > Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai, > > Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, > > Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..! > > AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti' > > Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya, > > Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya, > > Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke > > Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke > > Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna…. > > Raj Bhardwaj > > <%40>, > " inder " <indervohra2001 > wrote: > > > > Dear Kulbir jee, > > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman. > > But but.. > > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went > topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak. > > > Inder > > > > <%40>, > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Inder; > > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan. > > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me. > > > Regards > > > Kulbir Bains > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM > > > > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > I donot agree with you. > > > Anyway does'nt matter. > > > > Inder > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ > ...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best > pragmatic > > > way > > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says. > > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. > In 11th > > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the > incurred > > > karma > > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat > of judge > > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it). > > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on > Saturn's > > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda > ko hazir > > > > mankar). > > > > Regards > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct > or > > > incorrect] > > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking. > > > > > > > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but > thinking > > > > > makes it so] > > > > > > > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law > books he > > > would > > > > > give arguments which may win him. > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best > pragmatic way > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11. > represents SABKI > > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the > seat of > > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu > before > > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the > drishti > > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes > it on > > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. > (khuda > > > ko hazir mankar). > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or > > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter + > Saturn > > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it > so]Mars with > > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give > > > arguments which may win him. > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 1, 2010 Report Share Posted April 1, 2010 Pyare Kulbeer Jio, Chaanga hai Pooranmasi noon nan jam ke main Nauvin noo hi jam giya see, nahin te mainu saare Rajoo Bawra kahinde ! Thoda hi farak te safar reh giya hai hun taan ! Dhallan da safar shuru ho gaya hai......... Where is Adi Shankaracharya,Tagore,Nur-ul-Islam, Bade Ghulam Ali , MS Subbulakshmi,Bismillah Khan, Mirza Ghalib, Shiv Batalvi, Kavi Kaalidas, Tulsidas, Soordas,Meera, Subramanyam Bharti, Bhagat Singh , our great Soofi Saints, and to top them all Kabir, all the Sagunas and Nirgunas(list is really long one) AND lastly Sri Guru Granth Sahib - The only Granth,which is great collection of rachnaas of Saints poets of all dharmas of whole country and each Chhanda of this Greatest Grantha is sung only on all the Hindustaani Raggas by the Raagis in Guru-Dwaras. AND the 10th Guru ,the Saint-Warrior Guru Gobind Singh who delivered his his last surmon - Agya Bhai Akkal ki sabhi chalaio Panth, Sab Sikhan(THE learned one, the initiated one, the skilled one ,the trained ones - followers of Satkarmas and Satmargas ) ko Hukum hai Guru manio GRANTH. All these great Indians were born with beautiful minds, listned to their inner-self , with exalted minds and souls- Did they have any GURU...really....??? There are quite a few countrieswhere I have met students and ask them something about India- I get only one name " 'GANDHI " Enough ! Not the other one who could order Indian Army to attack Shri Harmandir Sahib in Amritsar with Tanks and Infantry..just to flush out terrorists, her own creation....and the whole Panjab burned for 8 longs years, but never any other place of worship of any other religion in the Dharam Nirpeksha Bharat what to say of even arrest the so called Gurus of other religions,beliefs,sects. Perhaps I have gone too far ! -Ashkon se jo paya hai, wo geeton main diya hai, iss par bhi sunaa hai ki ..zamaane ko gilaa hai....! Let it be the Last Post and.. ...reverse arms ! With my lots of love to you and the sweet little daughter. I will be in touch with you and the legacy of second Deepak ! Raj Bhardwaj , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb wrote: > > Typo error Sir, > UTHHE karman de hone ne nibede; na teri JAAT puchani. > > On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 10:16 PM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb wrote: > > > Sir Raj Bharadwaj ji. > > UTHHE karman de hone ne nibede; kisse na teri puchni. > > > > Respect and Regards > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Raj rajbhardwaj1949 wrote: > > > >> > >> > >> > >> Dear all, > >> > >> All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I would > >> like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a Yoga > >> which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has > >> been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and Jhas > >> could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji maharaj. > >> Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and Jha > >> in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class Brahmin and > >> Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also > >> there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me because > >> Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country. > >> > >> I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on 10/04/2010. I > >> have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet, which > >> can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or > >> Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons, > >> which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of romanticism > >> after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude xxx, > >> RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas. > >> > >> Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko, > >> > >> Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai. > >> > >> 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee, > >> > >> sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee, > >> > >> Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai, > >> > >> Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi > >> > >> Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur hai…. > >> > >> 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai, > >> > >> Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai, > >> > >> Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main, > >> > >> Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai, > >> > >> Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, > >> > >> Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..! > >> > >> AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti' > >> > >> Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya, > >> > >> Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya, > >> > >> Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke > >> > >> Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke > >> > >> Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna…. > >> > >> Raj Bhardwaj > >> > >> > >> --- In <%40>, > >> " inder " indervohra2001@ > >> wrote: > >> > > >> > Dear Kulbir jee, > >> > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman. > >> > But but.. > >> > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went > >> topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak. > >> > Inder > >> > > >> > --- In <%40>, > >> Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > >> wrote: > >> > > > >> > > Dear Inder; > >> > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan. > >> > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me. > >> > > Regards > >> > > Kulbir Bains > >> > > > >> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > >> > > > >> > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > Dear Kulbir, > >> > > I donot agree with you. > >> > > Anyway does'nt matter. > >> > > Inder > >> > > > >> > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ > >> ...> > >> > > wrote: > >> > > > > >> > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best > >> pragmatic > >> > > way > >> > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says. > >> > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. > >> In 11th > >> > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the > >> incurred > >> > > karma > >> > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat > >> of judge > >> > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it). > >> > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on > >> Saturn's > >> > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda > >> ko hazir > >> > > > mankar). > >> > > > Regards > >> > > > Kulbir Bains. > >> > > > > >> > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...> > >> wrote: > >> > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > Dear Kulbir, > >> > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct > >> or > >> > > incorrect] > >> > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking. > >> > > > > > >> > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but > >> thinking > >> > > > > makes it so] > >> > > > > > >> > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law > >> books he > >> > > would > >> > > > > give arguments which may win him. > >> > > > > > >> > > > > Inder > >> > > > >> > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote: > >> > > > >> > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best > >> pragmatic way > >> > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11. > >> represents SABKI > >> > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the > >> seat of > >> > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu > >> before > >> > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the > >> drishti > >> > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes > >> it on > >> > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. > >> (khuda > >> > > ko hazir mankar). > >> > > > >> > > Regards > >> > > > >> > > Kulbir Bains. > >> > > > >> > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote: > >> > > > >> > > Dear Kulbir, > >> > > > >> > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or > >> > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter + > >> Saturn > >> > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it > >> so]Mars with > >> > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give > >> > > arguments which may win him. > >> > > > >> > > Inder > >> > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 2, 2010 Report Share Posted April 2, 2010 Two exclamation points = 20 units of energy! ;-) Keep spending, Vohra jee... RR_, , " inder " <indervohra2001 wrote: > > > Yeah yeah, > Not needing hat and shoes saves lot of money. > If we also donot understand the things we save lot of efforts andtime and energy!! > Inder > , " rohinicrystal " <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > Why Vohrajee! > > > > Rahu is dragon's head while ketu is the headless part or the tail! > > > > Rahu does not need shoes and ketu does not need a hat! > > > > RR_, > > > > , " inder " <indervohra2001@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear RR_jee, > > > well written but not understood by me. > > > Inder > > > > > > , " rohinicrystal " <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar_jee, > > > > > > > > I have noticed that those too preoccupied and focused on nodes run into a situational problem which has an allegoric correlation! Rahu, unmitigated* could result in the feet not touching the ground, while ketu unmitigated* could result in one losing one's head (common sense!) and the analogy should be obvious given what Vishnu's Chakra did to Swarbhanu :-) > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > *Important conditional consideration!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rohini, > > > > > > > > > > Do not be modest unnecessarily. > > > > > > > > > > Being Chaya grahas they express themselves through others, so the laser analogy seems appropriate. > > > > > > > > > > It is also wondrous that though we are in a way living on the surface of Rahu we fail to recognize the Prithvi, as such. > > > > > > > > > > Take care, > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > - > > > > > rohinicrystal > > > > > > > > > > Tuesday, March 30, 2010 4:02 AM > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekhar_jee, > > > > > > > > > > I may not have the profound experience of many of the currently famous and vocal Jyotish-pragnaas (Internet and otherwise), but I have been consistently impressed by the enormous spectrum and capability and potential of both Rahu and Ketu in the lives of human beings -- particularly those who have diverse experience as opposed to those who are stuck in a groove, as the expression goes. > > > > > > > > > > The lunar nodes have enormous potential but like a hologram trapped in a crystal they remain just a piece of decoration unless and until they are ignited by a beam of laser! Then their message comes alive (I hate to use a movie reference in this fairly heavy duty serious forum but those still young at heart may recall the modern EPIC Starwars and Princess Leah's entry and message!) > > > > > > > > > > This has reference to my recent message to, I believe Kulbir, where I referred to the laser, albeit not directly! Parashara did not write about Laser but BPHS (I dare say, any version, perhaps) refers to it very clearly and convincingly! > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inderji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Is Rahu also not said to cause understanding of complex subjects (when in 5th) and give one Ganga snan(When in 10th)? > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > - > > > > > > inder > > > > > > > > > > > > Monday, March 29, 2010 3:11 PM > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No dear, we shall not fight. I am again refering to imaginary situation that if we start fighting here it becomes Guru-Chaandal situation. > > > > > > Rahu creats sudden, unexpected, good or nasty situations. Rahu is all about effects. > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inderji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I thought we were talking about effects of Guru Chandal yoga. It seems like I was wrong and you were alluding to Guru Chandal situation. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Anyway why should we start fight on this as we are obviously talking about two different things? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > inder > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sunday, March 28, 2010 5:05 PM > > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chanrashekhar ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Think of a hypothetical situation say 200 hundred years ago. > > > > > > > Two Vidvan Pandit ji are sitting together and nicely exchanging pleasantries. Now they come out and join a vast gathering of people. > > > > > > > Very soon they would pick up fight with difference of opinion on some ritual procedures or some interpretations in presence of mass gathering saving their egos and creating mass hysteria which would be further spread into village/town and house discussion.This is sort of Guru Chaandal situation.This is one example. So they loose their GURUDUM with Rahu effect. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Donot take chaandal in literal terms, most of the people doing menial, small jobs, even dead body falls under Saturn.May be people carrying petty tales or rumours fall under Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > If we start fight here for example on this issue, it would certainly be Rahu effect. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > > , " Chandrashekhar " <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inderjee, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Does not Rahu rule over the Chandals? That is why he is also called Chandal. So Guru Chandala yoga is nothing but conjunction of Guru and Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Personally I think that though people tend to connect the word chandal with the morals or behaviour of a person who has Guru Chandal yoga, that might not be the case always. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rahu gives results of the bhavesha whom he conjoins so Rahu will give results of Guru while Guru himself may not be able to give his full results during its dasha. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > > > > > inder > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturday, March 27, 2010 5:12 PM > > > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This discussion on Guru-Chaandal Yoga is very interesting.Let me give my submissions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Rahu was called Chaandal was perhaps to give some derogatotry remark to chhaya graha RAHU. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier I gave one theory:Karaka for internet is Rahu.So in the mordern times real Rahu is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Beauty of Rahu is that it is infinite, shapeless, colourless and formless and takes shape and characterstics of the planet with which it comes in contact. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet astrology is all about Mercury+ Rahu or Mercury + Jupiter + Rahu. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Internet can take any shape and character as gets associated with the type of people-- astro sites, religious sites, terrorists sits , porno sites, sports sites etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Why Chanadal-- as it distracts mind, makes the mind hazy and infinite. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Once with internet religious site or astro site or any site you will have distracted mind, cannot perform even your Yoga or daily religious rituals with concentration. You can not go and expand inwards when expanding infinite outside. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Earlier olden days Rahu effects were in the form of Melas, processions, committees, rumours, epidemics, foreign influences etc. > > > > > > > > But the moderm dayday epidemic is internet. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My experience is when you are running bhukti/antra /prana [lahiri] of planet which is in star sub or subsub of Rahu, you get engulfed in internet whirlpool and will not have peace of mind. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also I have feeling that if you are seeing a chart of a real Yogi who is not at-all connected to out world but only internal Samadhi , we should remove Rahu-Ketu from the chart.In any case Rahu is MAYA of relative position of earth, Moon and Sun. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Some members crtisize that internet astrology is spoiled and it is hasty, irreligious etc, but this Chanadal has some positive aspects also as like it expands your knowledge to limitless sphere. > > > > > > > > Moreover internet is democratic- leaves you no choice except to tolerate difference of opinion. It equilizes[learned and ordinary people] all the people in formless networking. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It captures you, engulfs you.For your family members ,it is really a Chaandal[Guru chandal or budhha chanda or shukra or shani chandal doen not matter to them] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sir Raj Bhardwaj ji, > > > > > > > > > Kamaal kar diya ji aapne, Zinda undhaharan pesh kar di. MARHABA > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Mar 27, 2010 at 12:12 AM, Raj <rajbhardwaj1949@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes Rohini and Kulbeer Bhai, I tend to agree with your anecdote " > > > > > > > > > > Shape Shifter " ! Here I would just try to also cover the first line of > > > > > > > > > > Kulbeer on the subject - Gurus plays a social role so do the > > > > > > > > > > prostitutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just 4 days ago , Kanu Sanyal, the man who started a peasants movement > > > > > > > > > > in a very small village named " Naxalbari " , which ultimately > > > > > > > > > > became to be known the Naxals or Naxalites ; and it's further > > > > > > > > > > carnation , the present day's PWG(People's War Group), committed > > > > > > > > > > suicide,found hanging in his one room hutment in his native village, > > > > > > > > > > frustrated with the changes in the ideology of the present CPI(M) in the > > > > > > > > > > garb of PWG. He was the GURU of Naxalite movement,which began against > > > > > > > > > > the Zamindars in the end of year 1966 or begening of 1967, and slowly > > > > > > > > > > and steadily spearead in the most states of India. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I had finished my 1 year training in the Air Force and my first posting > > > > > > > > > > was in a place called Bengdubi, about 30 Kms from Naxalbari village , > > > > > > > > > > near Baghdogra, in Siliguri,Distt Darjeeling in October,1968. Movements > > > > > > > > > > of defence personnel in this region were well guarded. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On a holiday, I was doing the duty as deputy of the `Orderly > > > > > > > > > > Officer'(who looks after each happenings within the Unit). In the > > > > > > > > > > evening, he just called his driver to take out the Nissan Jonga. He also > > > > > > > > > > called me out and asked me to sit in the back side of vehicle,with my > > > > > > > > > > Sten Gun. The vehicle moved out of the Unit, and he looked back from > > > > > > > > > > the rear window and asked me Lal-Batti dekhi hai kabhi ? I nodded in > > > > > > > > > > negative. After about 20 minutes drive, we entered the Siliguri, and > > > > > > > > > > headed towards a small colony of huts and mud houses. The vehicle > > > > > > > > > > stopped. He got down and told me just see around, I shall be back > > > > > > > > > > quickly. I was looking out and also had to stretch my head out a number > > > > > > > > > > of times , to fathom out that this place was indeed a Red Light area. > > > > > > > > > > Such areas are strictly `Out of Bounds' for the defence > > > > > > > > > > personnel ,which was taught in our training manuals. And Lo, there was > > > > > > > > > > suddenly a big commotion in the area and I saw a number of civil police > > > > > > > > > > personnel forcing out the women from their living places ; and throwing > > > > > > > > > > them in the police lorry. Then I looked at my Orderly Officer running > > > > > > > > > > running towards our vehicle, trying to hold his pants tightly. A fat > > > > > > > > > > man,must be about 55 years, on the verge of retirement, looking very > > > > > > > > > > funny to me. Then in a flash I noticed a young girl dashing towards back > > > > > > > > > > of our vehicle, trying to catch it and enter. At the same moment, our > > > > > > > > > > vehicle started. I just extended my arm out , the girl found it to be > > > > > > > > > > helping hand, I pulled her inside and she sat on the floor of the > > > > > > > > > > vehicle. Few policemen did try to run after her, but they had stopped, > > > > > > > > > > having seen that ours was a defence vehicle. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > She was trying to get her breathing normal and I was looking at her > > > > > > > > > > nonchalantly. After few minutes the O.O peeped back from the small rear > > > > > > > > > > window' and shouted " Who the bitch is this?. I did not reply. > > > > > > > > > > But I think that the driver must have also noticed everything , like me > > > > > > > > > > in the tript to Lal Batti. After about 5 minutes the O.O. again peeped > > > > > > > > > > back and said ` Hey boy I will take this girl to my Barrack. I kept > > > > > > > > > > mum. My mind was blank. No thought was crossing my mind, as far as I > > > > > > > > > > still remember. In the meantime I asked the girl about herself. She told > > > > > > > > > > that she is from Rajasthan and one of her uncles had brought her to > > > > > > > > > > this place 6 months back and she will be grateful if I can help her to > > > > > > > > > > go to Rajasthan. I knew that the Railway Station was just on the way. As > > > > > > > > > > we reached near the main gate, I called out the driver and commanded him > > > > > > > > > > to stop the vehicle. I had just about 3 Rupees with me and gave it to > > > > > > > > > > the girl and apologized that I cannot help her further, she should just > > > > > > > > > > catch any available train and try to take help from any one and not to > > > > > > > > > > worry, YOU will reach your Home. As the vehicle was slowing down, the > > > > > > > > > > O.O. shouted at me and ordered me that the girl with go with us. I > > > > > > > > > > simply pointed my Sten Gun in his direction and slowly brought it near > > > > > > > > > > his nose where he could feel the heat ..and he closed the rear > > > > > > > > > > window. The vehicle stopped and I helped the girl out of the vehicle. I > > > > > > > > > > still carry the memory of her tearful eyes with full of karuna and > > > > > > > > > > thanks giving , till the vehicle moved out of her sight. I felt so > > > > > > > > > > tired and exhausted , I simply slumped on my seat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On the way back thoughts started crossing my mind that a senior is > > > > > > > > > > always a senior in the armed forces, if the O.O. wants he can place me > > > > > > > > > > under arrest after reaching the unit and frame any flimsy charge sheet > > > > > > > > > > against me and I could even face a court martial. My soul told me no > > > > > > > > > > fears so be it. Then I took a resolve that if it so happens, I will kill > > > > > > > > > > this son of a Gun senior- the Teacher-the Mentor-The supposed guide to > > > > > > > > > > me, by virtue of his being senior to me in rank in age. But nothing ever > > > > > > > > > > happened further on this count. For years on, I went on feeling sorry > > > > > > > > > > that I could not help her any further and would always wonder whether > > > > > > > > > > she ever reached her home ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now after such a long gap the discussion on Gurus, Deeksha, Beej Mantra, > > > > > > > > > > Guru Chaandal Yoga, Kanu Sanyal, Naxalbari has brought these memories > > > > > > > > > > back to me as fresh as ever before. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As far me I feel that I have also fully understood that the description > > > > > > > > > > of this yoga in Shastras was indirect and not so direct but it's direct > > > > > > > > > > and literal meaning or name is CHAANDAL GURU-YOGA, If I may rename it > > > > > > > > > > in direct form. The O.O. must have called me by thousand names like > > > > > > > > > > CHAANDAL or manay more direct expletives , because he was in dire needs > > > > > > > > > > of the wants of his body and mind....and after the police raid, I > > > > > > > > > > deprived him of this real good oprtunity. But then, I do not find any > > > > > > > > > > such yoga which can directly label me as CHAANDAL SHISHYA. And lastly, > > > > > > > > > > that time I was running the mahadasha of Rahu-Rahu from 19-09-1966 to > > > > > > > > > > 01-01-1969. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Just an anecdotal suggestion, Raj_dada, if I may for you to examine in > > > > > > > > > > your collection of charts or test bench. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have always considered the lunar node as 'wild-cards' (The joker in > > > > > > > > > > a game of cards! A chalnaa, a mimic, a 'Shape-shifter' etc). This is why > > > > > > > > > > perhaps it is considered as a 'surrogate' that assumes the persona and > > > > > > > > > > role of the planet it is associated with or failing that in whose sign > > > > > > > > > > and nakshatra it is placed in). Particularly when a node is moving > > > > > > > > > > towards the planet it is co-occuping a varga, it imbibes the qualities > > > > > > > > > > and abilities of the planet concerned (I call it suction-yoga or > > > > > > > > > > Hoover-Yoga -- after the vacuum cleaner!). The planet so affected loses > > > > > > > > > > some or all of its propensity and natural qualities for good or bad! So > > > > > > > > > > a jupiter could lose its 'Teacher/priest-like nature', moon could lose > > > > > > > > > > its sensitive, emotional side or memory, mars could lose its > > > > > > > > > > aggression... etc!). It may not be a complete loss but a reduction in > > > > > > > > > > the qualities. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Such influence is not necessarily good or bad for the individual > > > > > > > > > > depending on the personal nature of the node in the specific chart! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Please remember that it is anecdotal! Try it at your own risk! In fact > > > > > > > > > > for other novice readers, I would venture to add: PLEASE DON'T TRY THIS > > > > > > > > > > AT HOME WITHOUT YOUR TEACHER OR PARENT BEING PRESENT CLOSE BY! :-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So nice to hear that cheerfulness is back in your heart. My prayers > > > > > > > > > > and best wishes that Ma always shower Her blessings on ALL my Dadas! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > > > > " rajbhardwaj1949 " > > > > > > > > > > rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bhai Rohini, Kulbir and Krishnan and all Jyotishis, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The thread on " Beej Mantra " and " I disagree " have been really very > > > > > > > > > > > > interesting for me. After a long time I was enjoying and smiling > > > > > > > > > > while > > > > > > > > > > > > reading the exchange, and at times I was humming. Completely > > > > > > > > > > relaxed. My > > > > > > > > > > > > wife had observed me at a few occasions and called my younger > > > > > > > > > > daughter > > > > > > > > > > > > to observe me silently and also enjoyed finding me relaxed with > > > > > > > > > > smile on > > > > > > > > > > > > my face. Somehow the subject in both the threads got intermangled > > > > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > > > beautifully. Guru,Shishya,Deekshya,traditions; cunturies old and the > > > > > > > > > > > > current traits. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have firm belief that almost all of us(other jyotishis also > > > > > > > > > > included), > > > > > > > > > > > > who try to give answers to the queries to best of their knowledge; > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > most of the times face brickbats and get No thanks, still go on > > > > > > > > > > > > participating in their respective groups ,like addicts, not > > > > > > > > > > withstanding > > > > > > > > > > > > the skirmishes here and there. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This further strengthens my belief, that all such jyotishis have > > > > > > > > > > learned > > > > > > > > > > > > jyotish with their own efforts, with no Guru or Gurukul. If this is > > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > Junoon, then what else. The will to learn and the will to do bit of > > > > > > > > > > > > experiment too in the process.How much time it takes to read, how > > > > > > > > > > quick > > > > > > > > > > > > reactions or delayed reactions take seeds in our minds, how we > > > > > > > > > > prepare > > > > > > > > > > > > ourselves to gather the thoughts and type these to give them a shape > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > not expecting anything in return. Just the pure joy and > > > > > > > > > > satisfaction. > > > > > > > > > > > > This is a continuous process of learning for us and I also have no > > > > > > > > > > doubt > > > > > > > > > > > > that the young learner also must be picking a lots from what appears > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > the group. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be hanged and stoned by the so called purists, if I were to > > > > > > > > > > say > > > > > > > > > > > > that there is no need to have Guru, in the times we are living. In > > > > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > > > > > words every learner of Jyotish has his own free Will , if it is > > > > > > > > > > > > Operational , to learn the Jyotish without being bound by any > > > > > > > > > > > > Rules,Paramparas etc. This is so because the material and > > > > > > > > > > opportunity > > > > > > > > > > > > for picking up Jyotish is now really very easily available and every > > > > > > > > > > > > learner has good faculties in the field of education and languages. > > > > > > > > > > One > > > > > > > > > > > > just needs to have a keen eye and belief in himself. How they will > > > > > > > > > > use > > > > > > > > > > > > their knowledge will depend solely on themselves. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While on the subject of , I (like many other Jyotishis) was also > > > > > > > > > > witness > > > > > > > > > > > > to few other happenings involving a Guru and Shishya. I have been > > > > > > > > > > > > thinking for quite some time about the " Guru-Chaandal Yoga " . Why > > > > > > > > > > such > > > > > > > > > > > > yoga was mentioned in BPHS. Guru was specifically Jupiter, but Rahu > > > > > > > > > > was > > > > > > > > > > > > not specifically Chandaal. I am not sure if Rahu has been given the > > > > > > > > > > name > > > > > > > > > > > > of Chaandal in it's various descriptions. Now how this Yoga is > > > > > > > > > > feared by > > > > > > > > > > > > all like Rahu dasha,Shani dasha, Shani Sade Sati etc. When a learner > > > > > > > > > > > > like me perhaps does not get any reason to show the cause of > > > > > > > > > > problems in > > > > > > > > > > > > facing the jataka , we the lesser known jyotishis just take names of > > > > > > > > > > > > such yogas or positions of Shani as the root cause of all the > > > > > > > > > > problems. > > > > > > > > > > > > Very easy way out indeed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I have been thinking a lot about The Guru-Chaandal Yoga and somehow > > > > > > > > > > tend > > > > > > > > > > > > to believe, that Guru can become like a Chaandal in the real sense. > > > > > > > > > > His > > > > > > > > > > > > all faculties are shut and whatever he does and utters is very very > > > > > > > > > > > > surprising, it hits everything and everybody very hard. The image of > > > > > > > > > > > > Guru becomes that of a Satan,as he breathes fire and breakes all the > > > > > > > > > > so > > > > > > > > > > > > called maryada of a Guru, if there is anything called maryada. When > > > > > > > > > > our > > > > > > > > > > > > Rishis mentioned this Guru -Chaandal Yoga, they really must have all > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > rishis,munis,gurus who had dual personalities. There is no need to > > > > > > > > > > > > elaborate this. The real meaning of Guru Chaandal Yoga seems to have > > > > > > > > > > > > sink in now. It simply sinks the esteerm of a Guru, where a Shishya > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > forced to challenge his Guru, and more the Guru accuses the Shishya, > > > > > > > > > > > > more he exposes himself, and forces the Shishya to break his silence > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > > he starts hesitatingly initially but goes full blast exposing the > > > > > > > > > > Guru. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, then the Shishya also has to be a real learner, who perhaps > > > > > > > > > > never > > > > > > > > > > > > depends solely and blindly on one Guru. Now a big question which is > > > > > > > > > > > > staring me and I have been wondering why the fathers of Jyotish did > > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > > mention about any yoga specifically , which could be termed or > > > > > > > > > > called as > > > > > > > > > > > > " SHISHYA CHAANDAL " Yoga in the Jyotish ! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > > > > " rohinicrystal " > > > > > > > > > > > > <jyotish_vani@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But Praajee...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > IK HORE thaa jo Dasyaa gadheriyaan de-vichh, unna kol...! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Varah (12) thay unna-di banday! Jotish main jaisay!! Ek do ghabraa > > > > > > > > > > > > gayey shaayad, aisaa sanu sunaa noo! Pher laut aayey US dey Kaul > > > > > > > > > > usday > > > > > > > > > > > > 'marnay' day baad! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kis-day kaul woh sab logaan lautay, mainu nai pataa! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Asi to sirf dekhnaay may zindagi gawaan dittay! Kinni - Azib hai > > > > > > > > > > yeh > > > > > > > > > > > > kahaniyan bachchon di! Raab/Khudaa/Parmeshwar/God day bachchoon-di! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maaf karnaa praa -- punjabi bhot pyaari lagdii si magar ik saal to > > > > > > > > > > > > nahin naa kafi! Shaayad aglay janam main kuch hor seekh-layngay, jo > > > > > > > > > > raha > > > > > > > > > > > > giya si is janam-vich baki! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aankhaan khulie rakhiyo! Aandar_waali!! ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Happy Easter!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In <%40>, > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SiRR ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > HUSH is the word; > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bolan naalon chup changeri, chup de naalon parda; je MANSOOR na > > > > > > > > > > > > bolda taan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sooli kahnu Chadhda. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Silence is golden; veil of secrecy even better, Mansoor wouldn't > > > > > > > > > > > > have been > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hanged on gallows ;had he preferred silence. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ** rohinicrystal jyotish_vani@ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *To:* <%40> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Sent:* Sun, 21 March, 2010 6:15:54 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *Subject:* Re: Information about beej mantra sadhana's ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Kulbir_praaji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This 'regulation' , " ...if deeksha of beej mantra is given by > > > > > > > > > > > > competent > > > > > > > > > > > > > > guru, then it becomes the responsibility of the guru to bring > > > > > > > > > > > > salvation to > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the disciple. " -- has an interesting wrinkle! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It implies that the Guru himself/herself has already attained > > > > > > > > > > > > salvation! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I think it is safe to assume that such deekshas are being given > > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hundreds of thousands, if not millions, world-wide ;-) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now Chelaa poochtaa hai, " If there are so many millions of Gurus > > > > > > > > > > who > > > > > > > > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > > > > > attained salvation already... Why is the earth and humanity > > > > > > > > > > > > suffering so > > > > > > > > > > > > > > much? " :-B > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ~Sab kuch seekha humnay, naa seekhie hoshiyari, Sach hai duniya > > > > > > > > > > > > walon kay > > > > > > > > > > > > > > hum SUB hain anadi/anari! ~ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rohiniranjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 2, 2010 Report Share Posted April 2, 2010 Raj Wadday praaji (Wp)! Yeh 'knotty/naughty' Kulbir Veeraa main_noo *sambhodit* kaardaa si Wp aur main twaanoo! I suppose the three of us make a sort of lineage sort of:-) Isn't this how lineages get established? Humnavaas finding a common island where they find one another! WOH SUB Waddhay Praaji exist right here (pointing to the heart chakra!) but while They try to reach out, how can THEY be found and touched if ONE is never trying to reach and touch the INSIDE? Macrocosm is OUTSIDE while microcosm is inside. Including the inner physician, inner teacher, inner deity, inner oracle, and inner friend! The biggest MAYA that exists in our current reality is that 'we will bring about a change' We pit ourselves against MA NATURE when we begin to think like that! She watches our puny half-hearted attempts to bring about a GREEN change in the world and some go with Global warming, the others with Global cooling (confusions similar to the parade we are seeing in Jyotish about what is pure and what is KNOT!) and then when SHE has had enough of our infantile noise, SHE reminds us brats WHO is RULING the REALITY: by sending an Earthquake, Tsunami and so on and so forth! Rohiniranjan , " Raj " <rajbhardwaj1949 wrote: > > > Pyare Kulbeer Jio, > Chaanga hai Pooranmasi noon nan jam ke main Nauvin noo hi jam giya see, > nahin te mainu saare Rajoo Bawra kahinde ! Thoda hi farak te safar reh > giya hai hun taan ! Dhallan da safar shuru ho gaya hai......... > > > Where is Adi Shankaracharya,Tagore,Nur-ul-Islam, Bade Ghulam Ali , MS > Subbulakshmi,Bismillah Khan, Mirza Ghalib, Shiv Batalvi, Kavi Kaalidas, > Tulsidas, Soordas,Meera, Subramanyam Bharti, Bhagat Singh , our great > Soofi Saints, and to top them all Kabir, all the Sagunas and > Nirgunas(list is really long one) AND lastly Sri Guru Granth Sahib - The > only Granth,which is great collection of rachnaas of Saints poets of all > dharmas of whole country and each Chhanda of this Greatest Grantha is > sung only on all the Hindustaani Raggas by the Raagis in Guru-Dwaras. > AND the 10th Guru ,the Saint-Warrior Guru Gobind Singh who delivered his > his last surmon - Agya Bhai Akkal ki sabhi chalaio Panth, Sab Sikhan(THE > learned one, the initiated one, the skilled one ,the trained ones - > followers of Satkarmas and Satmargas ) ko Hukum hai Guru manio GRANTH. > All these great Indians were born with beautiful minds, listned to > their inner-self , with exalted minds and souls- Did they have any > GURU...really....??? There are quite a few countrieswhere I have met > students and ask them something about India- I get only one name > " 'GANDHI " Enough ! Not the other one who could order Indian Army to > attack Shri Harmandir Sahib in Amritsar with Tanks and Infantry..just > to flush out terrorists, her own creation....and the whole Panjab burned > for 8 longs years, but never any other place of worship of any other > religion in the Dharam Nirpeksha Bharat what to say of even arrest the > so called Gurus of other religions,beliefs,sects. Perhaps I have gone > too far ! > > -Ashkon se jo paya hai, wo geeton main diya hai, iss par bhi sunaa hai > ki ..zamaane ko gilaa hai....! Let it be the Last Post and.. ...reverse > arms ! With my lots of love to you and the sweet little daughter. I will > be in touch with you and the legacy of second Deepak ! > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@> > wrote: > > > > Typo error Sir, > > UTHHE karman de hone ne nibede; na teri JAAT puchani. > > > > On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 10:16 PM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote: > > > > > Sir Raj Bharadwaj ji. > > > UTHHE karman de hone ne nibede; kisse na teri puchni. > > > > > > Respect and Regards > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Apr 1, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Raj rajbhardwaj1949@ wrote: > > > > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> Dear all, > > >> > > >> All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I > would > > >> like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a > Yoga > > >> which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has > > >> been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and > Jhas > > >> could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji > maharaj. > > >> Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and > Jha > > >> in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class > Brahmin and > > >> Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also > > >> there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me > because > > >> Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country. > > >> > > >> I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on > 10/04/2010. I > > >> have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet, > which > > >> can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or > > >> Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons, > > >> which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of > romanticism > > >> after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude > xxx, > > >> RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas. > > >> > > >> Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko, > > >> > > >> Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai. > > >> > > >> 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee, > > >> > > >> sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee, > > >> > > >> Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai, > > >> > > >> Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi > > >> > > >> Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur > hai…. > > >> > > >> 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai, > > >> > > >> Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai, > > >> > > >> Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main, > > >> > > >> Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai, > > >> > > >> Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, > > >> > > >> Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..! > > >> > > >> AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti' > > >> > > >> Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya, > > >> > > >> Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya, > > >> > > >> Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke > > >> > > >> Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke > > >> > > >> Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna…. > > >> > > >> Raj Bhardwaj > > >> > > >> > > >> --- In > <%40>, > > >> " inder " indervohra2001@ > > >> wrote: > > >> > > > >> > Dear Kulbir jee, > > >> > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman. > > >> > But but.. > > >> > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went > > >> topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak. > > >> > Inder > > >> > > > >> > --- In > <%40>, > > >> Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > > >> wrote: > > >> > > > > >> > > Dear Inder; > > >> > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki > Farmaan. > > >> > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me. > > >> > > Regards > > >> > > Kulbir Bains > > >> > > > > >> > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > >> > > > > >> > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > Dear Kulbir, > > >> > > I donot agree with you. > > >> > > Anyway does'nt matter. > > >> > > Inder > > >> > > > > >> > > , Kulbir Bains > <lalkitabkb@ > > >> ...> > > >> > > wrote: > > >> > > > > > >> > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best > > >> pragmatic > > >> > > way > > >> > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says. > > >> > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN > earning. > > >> In 11th > > >> > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the > > >> incurred > > >> > > karma > > >> > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the > seat > > >> of judge > > >> > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it). > > >> > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on > > >> Saturn's > > >> > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. > (khuda > > >> ko hazir > > >> > > > mankar). > > >> > > > Regards > > >> > > > Kulbir Bains. > > >> > > > > > >> > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...> > > >> wrote: > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > >> > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. > [correct > > >> or > > >> > > incorrect] > > >> > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking. > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, > but > > >> thinking > > >> > > > > makes it so] > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law > > >> books he > > >> > > would > > >> > > > > give arguments which may win him. > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > Inder > > >> > > > > >> > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > wrote: > > >> > > > > >> > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best > > >> pragmatic way > > >> > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11. > > >> represents SABKI > > >> > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is > the > > >> seat of > > >> > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and > Ketu > > >> before > > >> > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is > the > > >> drishti > > >> > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter > passes > > >> it on > > >> > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in > mind. > > >> (khuda > > >> > > ko hazir mankar). > > >> > > > > >> > > Regards > > >> > > > > >> > > Kulbir Bains. > > >> > > > > >> > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote: > > >> > > > > >> > > Dear Kulbir, > > >> > > > > >> > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct > or > > >> > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be > correct],thinking.Jupiter + > > >> Saturn > > >> > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it > > >> so]Mars with > > >> > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would > give > > >> > > arguments which may win him. > > >> > > > > >> > > Inder > > >> > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 2, 2010 Report Share Posted April 2, 2010 Dear Raj, As compared to poised and elagant and fatty Jupiter, Shishya may be a Mercury-weak fellow. Rahu can not magnify the fatty Jupiter but Mercury gets more vibrant, manificant and so on with Rahu and Ketu. So Shishya Chandal match is perfect match. With the effects Rahu so many kingdoms and Tughlaks are destroyed. Mordern days elections are all about effects.Election are won and lost by ripples and effects. And for post martem analysis on TV etc our Mecurian bhais journalists magnfy their expainations to make you understand the things which are not there. Chaandal Shishya effects. Inder , " Raj " <rajbhardwaj1949 wrote: > > > Dear all, > > All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I would > like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a Yoga > which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has > been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and Jhas > could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji maharaj. > Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and Jha > in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class Brahmin and > Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also > there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me because > Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country. > > I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on 10/04/2010. I > have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet, which > can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or > Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons, > which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of romanticism > after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude xxx, > RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas. > > Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko, > > Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai. > > 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee, > > sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee, > > Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai, > > Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi > > Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur hai…. > > 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai, > > Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai, > > Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main, > > Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai, > > Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, > > Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..! > > AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti' > > Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya, > > Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya, > > Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke > > Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke > > Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna…. > > Raj Bhardwaj > > , " inder " <indervohra2001@> > wrote: > > > > Dear Kulbir jee, > > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman. > > But but.. > > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went > topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak. > > Inder > > > > , Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Inder; > > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan. > > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me. > > > Regards > > > Kulbir Bains > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM > > > > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > I donot agree with you. > > > Anyway does'nt matter. > > > Inder > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ > ...> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best > pragmatic > > > way > > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says. > > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. > In 11th > > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the > incurred > > > karma > > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat > of judge > > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it). > > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on > Saturn's > > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda > ko hazir > > > > mankar). > > > > Regards > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct > or > > > incorrect] > > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking. > > > > > > > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but > thinking > > > > > makes it so] > > > > > > > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law > books he > > > would > > > > > give arguments which may win him. > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best > pragmatic way > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11. > represents SABKI > > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the > seat of > > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu > before > > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the > drishti > > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes > it on > > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. > (khuda > > > ko hazir mankar). > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or > > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter + > Saturn > > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it > so]Mars with > > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give > > > arguments which may win him. > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 2, 2010 Report Share Posted April 2, 2010 Given all the typos in your posting, Inder bhai, perhaps you meant: " Shishya may be a Mercury-weak fOllow... " Mercury and Saturn make poor followers for obvious reasons! And ketu too! RR_, , " inder " <indervohra2001 wrote: > > Dear Raj, > > As compared to poised and elagant and fatty Jupiter, Shishya may be a Mercury-weak fellow. > > Rahu can not magnify the fatty Jupiter but Mercury gets more vibrant, manificant and so on with Rahu and Ketu. > > So Shishya Chandal match is perfect match. > > With the effects Rahu so many kingdoms and Tughlaks are destroyed. > > Mordern days elections are all about effects.Election are won and lost by ripples and effects. > > And for post martem analysis on TV etc our Mecurian bhais journalists magnfy their expainations to make you understand the things which are not there. Chaandal Shishya effects. > > Inder > > , " Raj " <rajbhardwaj1949@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear all, > > > > All my dears who have commented on the Guru-Chaandal so far, I would > > like to request that I am still waiting for my query about such a Yoga > > which can be termed as 'CHAANDAL SHISHYA `. The thread so far has > > been very lively and en-lightening! There is fear that Mishras and Jhas > > could hijack this thread too, like the Mahapandit Raavaan Ji maharaj. > > Because as it is, there is centuries old rivalry between Mishr and Jha > > in Darbhanga side of Bihar. Mishr says , he is the top class Brahmin and > > Jha says he is the Number One. It is other matter that Ojha is also > > there somewhere in North India. At least I have a shield with me because > > Bhardwaj, Bharadwaj and Bharadwaja are in all parts of the country. > > > > I am in bit of hurry, as my Shani-Shukra-Ketu is ending on 10/04/2010. I > > have one more feeling that in the end I may have to sing a duet, which > > can be between lovers ( Premi and Premika) or Guru-Shishya or > > Shishya-Guru or may be....any two less or more enlighted persons, > > which Sahir Ludhianavi Saheb gave to the world in the era of romanticism > > after we won our freedom. Now there is no romanticism only crude xxx, > > RDxxx.. in all it's perceived Roopas or Ku-roopas. > > > > Tum mujhe Bhool bhi jayo, toh yeh hak hai tumko, > > > > Meri Baat aur hai, maine to Mohabbat ki hai. > > > > 1. " Tumkoo duniya ke ghamo daard se phursaat na sahee, > > > > sabse ulfaat sahee, mujhse hi Mohabbat na sahee, > > > > Main tumhara (i) hoon , yahee mere liye kya kam hai, > > > > Tum mere ho ke raho , yeh meri kismet naa sahi > > > > Tum agar jee ko churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, meri baat aur hai…. > > > > 2. Zindagee sirf mohabbat nahin, kuchh aur bhi hai, > > > > Zulf-o-rukhsaar ki jannat nahin kuchh aur bhi hai, > > > > Bhookh aur Pyaas ki maree hui iss duniya main, > > > > Ishq hi ek haqeeqat nahin kuchh aur bhee hai, > > > > Tum agar aankh churayo, toh yeh haq hai tumko, > > > > Maine Tumse hi nahin Sab se Mohabbat ki hai………..! > > > > AND... another great poet Kavi Pradeep in `Jagriti' > > > > Atom bamo ke zor pe ainthee hai ye duniya, > > > > Barood ke ik dher pe baithee hai ye duniya, > > > > Tum har kaadam uthaana zaara dekh-bhaal ke > > > > Iss Desh ko rakhna mere Bachho sambhal ke > > > > Ham layen hai toofan se kishti nikaal ke , iss desh ko rakhna…. > > > > Raj Bhardwaj > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , " inder " <indervohra2001@> > > wrote: > > > > > > Dear Kulbir jee, > > > Not Tughlaki farman, it was well and deep thought of farman. > > > But but.. > > > Tughlaki farmans were also well planned,and thought off, but went > > topsy turvy. Rahu was not favorable to poor Tughlak. > > > Inder > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Inder; > > > > Some reasoned reply may help me instead of this Tughlaki Farmaan. > > > > I have come to learn here so it matters at least to me. > > > > Regards > > > > Kulbir Bains > > > > > > > > Re: Guru Chaandal Yoga & INTERNET > > > > > > > > Wednesday, 31 March, 2010 6:10 AM > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > > I donot agree with you. > > > > Anyway does'nt matter. > > > > Inder > > > > > > > > , Kulbir Bains <lalkitabkb@ > > ...> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best > > pragmatic > > > > way > > > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says. > > > > > House no 11. represents SABKI APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. > > In 11th > > > > > house itself, is the seat of justice/judge. Saturn takes the > > incurred > > > > karma > > > > > via Rahu and Ketu before Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat > > of judge > > > > > but Saturn is the drishti to guide it). > > > > > Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes it on > > Saturn's > > > > > recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. (khuda > > ko hazir > > > > > mankar). > > > > > Regards > > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder <indervohra2001@ ...> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement. [correct > > or > > > > incorrect] > > > > > > Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking. > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupiter + Saturn becomes philospher.[ nothing good or bad, but > > thinking > > > > > > makes it so] > > > > > > > > > > > > Mars with Jupiter logic[logician] , without reading the law > > books he > > > > would > > > > > > give arguments which may win him. > > > > > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > > > On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 8:53 AM, Kulbir Bains lalkitabkb@ wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Inder Ji , Although RR ji has answered the query in best > > pragmatic way > > > > possible; I am just adding what Lalkitab says.House no 11. > > represents SABKI > > > > APNI APNI AAMDANI one's OWN earning. In 11th house itself, is the > > seat of > > > > justice/judge. Saturn takes the incurred karma via Rahu and Ketu > > before > > > > Jupiter. (Jupiter is sitting on the seat of judge but Saturn is the > > drishti > > > > to guide it).Here Saturn proposes the judgement but Jupiter passes > > it on > > > > Saturn's recommendation and keeping presence of omniscient in mind. > > (khuda > > > > ko hazir mankar). > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > > > Kulbir Bains. > > > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 1:02 PM, inder indervohra2001@ wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Kulbir, > > > > > > > > Jupiter is Judge-ruleful, lawful, pro-cons,judgement.[correct or > > > > incorrect]Saturn is illegal,[but may be correct],thinking.Jupiter + > > Saturn > > > > becomes philospher.[nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it > > so]Mars with > > > > Jupiter logic[logician], without reading the law books he would give > > > > arguments which may win him. > > > > > > > > Inder > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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