Guest guest Posted April 4, 2010 Report Share Posted April 4, 2010 Dear Shri Srivastav Ji and members, Sutra is always a short statement that signifies many principles involved and canbe open to test and application. It is modern day's Statement of Purpose carrying research content.Yogas on other hand are arising out of planets mutuality as well as other incidenal issues for yogas to be effective in reality and is subject to native's own pursuits.It is certainly not the application as theory exists for planetary combination. The least of course is not the stage when yogas present in a chart can really express and give results to the native.The astrologers need all acumen in prediction when yogas are present in a chart to raise hopes of native to present the future as rosy.we also be cautious to think of conditional yogas and their capabilities to give result as per classicals. Suresh Ji is also right in questioning who has tested how many yogas work well or not. No one will be able to answer this question with assurance.// we have very classical examples of eminent people who despite yogas could not have benifits yielding to them.In some cases yogas have given effect but by that time the prime life has already been passed. we have the example lare shri krishna kant who despite his illustrous conduct could not fulfil his ambition .also HIS PREMATURE DEATH at a crucila stage of life.Also the case of late shri Pramod Mahajan etc. //I agree with Rohiniranjan Ji's guess that many yogas do not work properly (either due to faults in Ganita or due to faults in manuscripts)// . In the context of results as projected and as perceived by the native there might be huge disparity in the yogas endorsing results to native. Ultimately if yogas r indicative for success in life,it is certain that no success will be in reach with out struggle and ambition to attain name and fame. In some cases of hard work and attainment of success it is difficult to say that yogas have not given results.other wise the native what ever he has achieved would not have but for feeble expression of yogas. About internet and sharing of knowledge by scholars,it is certainly a great positive effort indicating their willingness to provide guidance to resolve sevral complex issues.It is for the users/members to take positive spirit and willingness to learn from the valuable efforts being made selflessly by these scholars. Vattem Krishnan Cyber Jyotish Services(For all counseling services)Dr.B.V.Raman " Fools Obey Planets While  Wisemen Can Control Them " Planets are neutral Controllers of Mans Karma --- On Sat, 4/3/10, R C Srivastava <swami.rcs wrote: R C Srivastava <swami.rcs Sutra literature & sanskrit Saturday, April 3, 2010, 10:59 PM  OM Guruve Namah //If we replace Adarsh with Darsh, the sutras become senseless. Then, first sutra would refer to one topic and next sutra to another, which is ruled out by the syntax. Such problems can be solved by consulting Sanskrit scholars, not by deriding them. It is foolish to waste one's time in shaastraarthas over internet which has no regulating authority. Why these people do not visit Sanskrit universities and take the opinions of various scholars?? Internet is not a reliable source of authentic academic opinion.// The above quote from one of the mails on list speaks volumes in it. Please look at tone and meaning. To understand the context new students need awareness of a few fundamentals, before we carry forward meaningful discussion. Introduction: After crystilasition of knowledge preceding Upanishadic period it took centuries to develop philosophic thought .Then arose to systematization of each school of thought. Jyotish was not different. From 18 Rsi great volume of knowledge arose and here also Sutra Literature were created. So Systematic treatises were written in short aphorism called Sutras, meaning clues, and were Intended to memory aids to long discussion on any topic which the student has learned with his guru. The main thought used to be highly condensed and much was taken for granted. See ALpa]rmsiNdGx sarviÖñtaemuom AStaeÉmnvx c suÇ! suÇivdae ivÊ> alpäkñaramasandigdha säravadviçvatomukhama astobhamanavadha ca sutr sutravido viduù ( Note there is slight mistake in reproduction of sloka for technical error Please read it duly corrected) People learned in Sutra literature , say, that a Sutra should be oncise and UNAMBIGUOUS, give the essenceof the arguments on the topic but at the same time deal with all aspect of the question , be free from repetetion and faultless. However the definition is too strict and desire for brevity was carried to such heights that in practice that most part of sutra literatre is now unintelligible. Jaimini does not appears to be founder of any system, and evidently it is possible that System of knowledge may embrace more than one system propunded by rsis among 18 whose works are no more avaiable. Because of larger interests in sutra literary writings evolved in form of Vakyas, Vrittis. Karika and Bhashyas, Each of them giving more and more elaborate then previous type of writing. I will quote just one Sutra and move ahead. Sutra 1.1.35 states haerady> isÃa> horädayaù siddhäù ShB.S.Rao has translated it From General literature Of astrology learn all The details about HORA Drekkana Saptamsa, Navamsa Etc. Now Neelkanth has` also taken from AADI to mean as above. Hora and other division should be prepared from other texts. One who is not initiated can also read between the lines. Hora is formed by dropping of Aaa in beginning and Tra in end from Ahoraaatra. In common parlance Hora menas whole Jyotish shastra. So One an think Sutra says Jaimini sutra are for those who have mastered Hora shastra So Sutra literature has different Dimension than expertise in grammar rules of Language se-man-tics (si man'tiks) n. (used with a sing. v.) 1. a. a branch of linguistics dealing with the study of meaning, including the ways meaning is structured in language and changes in meaning and form over time. 2. the branch of semiotics or logic dealing with the relationship between signs or symbols and what they denote. 3. the meaning, or an interpretation of the meaning, of a word, sign, sentence, etc.: Let's not argue about semantics. 4. GENERAL SEMANTICS. ************ ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* ********* * ************ ********* ********* ********* *****1. Then, first sutra would refer to one topic and next sutra to another, which is ruled out by the syntax Context has been Sutra 2.3.1 and 2.3.2. When The ascendant is an odd sign the Navamsa dasa begins from it. When Ascendant is an even sign the Navamsa dasa begins from the Adarsa Sign. Simply stating Adarsa sign is the other sign owned by the lord of ascendant excepting Lumaniries and Saturn. Another group of astrologers use principle of Abhimukh, but this does not guarantee initiation of dasa from Odd sign. Another set of astrologers interpret adarsa to mean the fourth. Actual discussion centered about these view points. Now one can blissfully assume that what grammar says , but these are the views of great Sanskrit scholars whose knowledge of Sanskrit was not supposed to be less. Prof P.S.Shastri has stated in his notes adarsa literally means a mirror. The mirror image faces the observer directly, and hence it is called abhimukha. Then He Goes on narrating what should be correct meaning. Therefore Dear Knowledge of Sanskrit Grammar is needed but is not everything ,in interpreting Para vidhya, That every scholar knows well. 2.* consulting Sanskrit scholars, not by deriding them Sanskrit scholars are crown of knowledge But if , Like a Brahmin who learned all the sashtra And asked boatman to help crossing the river which was in spate. Brahman was intoxicated by knowledge. So he start humiliating boatman by asking question have you read Vyakaran Have you read arthshastra etc Boatman said NO sir Then as luck would have it, Boat trapped in bhawar.Boatman Asked Brahma Have you learned swimming. Reply was NO. Boatman saved his life saying , Look you are going to lose life . What’s the use, If you knew swimming Could be You might have saved your life. So is the case of People who show off their knowledge by shastrath. Times have changed. one should Make correct prediction to help people if possible. There is hardly any need to show knowledge. 3. shaastraarthas over internet which has no regulating authority We are not living in age of adi sankaracharya. Much water has` flown in Ganges. We could be flexible. 4. reliable source of authentic academic opinion. APp dIpae Év> appa dépo bhavaù 5. My students are teaching Jyotisha in PG departments of recognized Sanskrit universities ; they know only a master of Sanskrit grammar is allowed to give his/her own opinion on grammatical aspects, others can only quote the masters. Well Does this apply to Vedas , vedanga and Sutra literature. My dear friend just contemplates. There are six layers of meaning of Vedas and several of vedanga and sutra. Here grammar is helpful but real help is from other sources , That is fundamental to creation . With best regard. RC 6. The difference between Adarsh and Darsh is simply due to wrong sandhi-vichchheda by modern commentators. Those who are recognized experts of this field should be consulted. Anything published on paper or on internet is not gold. Suresh Ji is also right in questioning who has tested how many yogas work well or not. No one will be able to answer this question with assurance. But I agree with Rohiniranjan Ji's guess that many yogas do not work properly (either due to faults in Ganita or due to faults in manuscripts) . The only thing I do not like is the idea of PARKING. If I have no time for researching a particular thing, I will certainly park it off temporarily, but I will never ask others to do the same, because that would lead to permanent parking off of that topic without proper investigation OM TAT SAT R. C. SRIVASTAVA Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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