What should be predicted for Lagna lord in Various houses? / Rules and Routes

September 15, 2007

I agree to this point to some extent, It's not always a good try to

understand one house on the basis of how far it is from some house,

there are only 12 houses, so each and every house comes n'th from

1'st to 12'th from remaining houses.

Better way of understanding the houses is trying to understand basic

charactersitic like if upchaya say 3rd house, why 3'rd is an upachaya

etc. and then learning trikonas like dharma trikona, Bhoga trikona

etc.

regards,

Lalit.

, rk dash

<arkaydash wrote:

>

> Sreenadh,

>

> Yes, I think so. They probably are from the Meenaraj

Hora/Horapradeepam sources now that I get to see your PDF file.

>

> What I meant when I said: " Examples will of course pour in. But

we have to

> see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a

> particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration " is this. When

we take up example charts (and we haven't come to that as yet), we

have to be careful not to confuse any particular experience emanating

from other configurations/patterns and a bhavashraya phala of a house

lord. That is how we correctly validate the derivation in slokas. We

all know what drama the 'yogaja phala' can introduce in a chart. The

task is arduous; it requires rigours. I was doing some loud thinking

on the methodological rigours staring at us, in advance.

>

> I went thru your PDF file. Umm, I would say some of your logic

searches overshoot themselves. Take this one. The result of wealth

with lagna lord in 4th house. You say, 4th is 3rd from 2nd, ie

upachaya from 2nd, which is how. Not very elegant as a rationale. The

reason, to my mind, is the wealth of siginfications the 4th hse

holds -- house, vehicle and what have you. Now, applying your well-

plucked Rule Four, which says lagna lord amplifies (the goodness of)

the house it goes to, the logic behind wealth is valid.

>

> I do like your Rule reminders. Commendable.

>

> Best,

> RK

>

> PS: I will take your hugs when we proceed on 'sustained topics'

in a more organised fashion...

>

> Sreenadh <sreesog wrote:

> Dear RK ji,

> Thanks. The derivations given are good - and looks as if solely

> based on " Houses " alone.

> ==>

> Now, the rationale. Examples will of course pour in. But we have to

> see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a

> particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?

> <==

> Apart from houses, I don't think anything such as Planet/lords etc

> comes in to play in the derivations you provided.

> *Lord are of Signs; Houses does not have any lords - and so the

same

> is discarded.

> * Planets are not at all considered in house based derivation - and

> so the same is discarded.

>

> I ascertain, the derivations are solely based on houses, and so

> should be the logic behind. Yah, RK ji, you can proceed with

> explaining the logic behid each of those derivations...

> Love and Hugs,

> Sreenadh

>

> , rk dash

> <arkaydash@> wrote:

> >

> > Shreenadh,

> > Here is the bhavashraya phala of L1 as found in the compedium.

> There is an 'result' for the 5th hse, but I 'll take time to make

out

> what is meant.

> >

> > In 1st house

> > Healthy, long-lived, king(ly), strong, gain of land

> >

> > 2nd hse

> > Wealthy, engaged in right action, head of the locality, life of

> plenty, corpulent

> >

> > 3rd hse

> > Has good friends, religiosity, generosity; brave, strong

> >

> > 4th hse

> > King's favourite, lives life to the full (could also mean 'very

> long-lived,' the expression being prachura-jivita), earns by right

> means, devoted to father, voracious

> >

> > 5th hse

> > Good children, engaged in good deeds, has humility, known his for

> good qualities

> >

> > 6th hse

> > Healthy, strong, gain of land, miserly, rich, subdues enemies, on

> the side of good deeds

> >

> > 7th hse

> > Brilliant, good manners, cultured wife, spends himself fast

> during coitus, good-looking

> >

> > 8th hse

> > Miserly, unreliable in financial matters, very long-lived, harsh

> in speech if the planet is a malefic, large physique if a benefic

> >

> > 9th hse

> > Good people are his friends, good deeds, balanced (without

> extremes), cultured, known for his good deeds, brilliant

> >

> > 10th hse

> > Gains from ruler (state), learned, cultured, reverent towards

> guru and mother, king, famous

> >

> > 11th hse

> > Long-lived, has progeny, spends himself fast during coitus,

> powerful

> >

> > 12th hse

> > Harsh speech, very sharp mind, goes abroad, a free loader

> >

> > Now, the rationale. Examples will of couse pour in. But we have

> to see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a

> particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?

> >

> > RK

> >

> > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:

> > Dear RK ji,

> > ==>

> > I know of a compendium in vernacular which collates the best

(best

> as

> > the compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to be)

> > available, which goes into this aspect (lord going to different

> houses)

> > <==

> > Can you provide the results derived/provided by that book

for " lagna

> > lord going to various houses " ? That could be much beneficial to

our

> > current study - we will try to find the logic used behind those

> > derivations, and accept or reject each of those derivations; as

> usual

> > based on conditions such as -

> > * logical or not

> > * Real life experience supports the same or not

> > It doesn't matter whether the source mention or the Sanskrit

> original

> > is available or not - as long as the derivations are logical, and

> > reflect the actual experience.

> > > the 'material' looks very insightful stuff.

> > That is very good point - which itself I think indicate that it

> could

> > be valuable material.

> > Love,

> > Sreenadh

> >

> > , rk dash

> > <arkaydash@> wrote:

> > >

> > > OK, Sree, that about sums up the scenario on one of the 7-fold

> > method. But the search, esp. for rishi hora source must be kept

on.

> I

> > know of a compedium in vernacular which collates the best (best

as

> the

> > compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to be)

> > available, which goes into this aspect (lord going to different

> > houses) but there is no source mention for the portion nor is

there

> > the Sanskrit original for it unlike most other portions in the

> > compendium. Nevertheless the 'material' looks very insightful

stuff.

> > It is things like this that I had in mind. Let's see.

> > >

> > > Best,

> > > RK

> > >

> > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:

> > > Dear RK ji,

> > > ==>

> > > Now we have to agree on who next to Parasara we take on board

for

> > > comparison. You have named two: Meenaraja Hora, and Hora

> Pradeepam.

> > > Who else? We don't have to go by the overall reputation of the

> text.

> > > We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of

interpretation

> in

> > > question in a treatise that may not otherwise be rated very

high.

> What

> > > say?

> > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or classics?

> > > <==

> > > This question is really difficult to answer. Apart from

> Parasara

> > > (for whom various versions of the slokas are available for the

> same in

> > > almost all instances) Meena Raja Hora discusses it. The

statements

> > > from Meena Raja Hora is mentioned with utmost importance in

Hora

> Ratna

> > > as well (at times they slightly variant versions of the slokas

> > > available in current printed verion of Meena raja hora). Hora

> > > pradeepam is a text quoted with reverance by the auther of Hora

> Sara

> > > (i.e. Nrisimha Daivanjna), a well known scholar of 17th

century.

> Thus -

> > > Meenaraja hora gets double importance since supported by Hora

> Ratna.

> > > Hora Pradeepam gets double importance since supported by Hora

> Sara.

> > >

> > > Some other later day texts MIGHT have discussed the same at

times

> > > (though not extensively), but I am yet to make an elaborate

> search for

> > > the same in texts like Sarvartha Chintamani, Jataka Parijata,

> > > Saravali, Phaladeepika etc. One or two rudimentary slokas

> > > the same we may find in these texts as well. Some slokas

relevant

> to

> > > the may find a place in many ancient Rishi horas (Whereever I

find

> > > such a reference I will quote them for sure). But for sure none

> of the

> > > other texts (except BPHS, Meenaraja hora, Hora Pradeepam)

> discusses

> > > this subject extensively in detail as per my current knowledge

and

> > > understanding. As far as ancient texts (Rishi horas) are

> concerned it

> > > is possible that the slokas that discuss this subject

extensively

> are

> > > lost, even though they might have done the same (since they use

7-

> fold

> > > method).

> > > Love,

> > > Sreenadh

> > >

> > > , rk dash

> > > <arkaydash@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Yes, you are homing in on the " pure " point. That's what this

> > > particular aspect of interpretation of a chart is about. That's

> the

> > > way (the part-way) to go about it -- core task, winkling the

> secrets

> > > out of a chart. Now we have to agree on who next to Parasara we

> take

> > > on board for comparision. You have named two: Meenaraja Hora,

and

> Hora

> > > Pradeepam. Who else? We don't have to go by the overall

> reputation of

> > > the text. We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of

> > > interpretation in question in a treatise that may not otherwise

be

> > > rated very high. What say?

> > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or classics?

> > > >

> > > > Sotto Voce: I don't want us, you and me, to be cynosures of

(the

> > > galaxy of) our star-gazers in this firmament. Onlookers all?

> > > >

> > > > RK

> > > >

> > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:

> > > > Dear RK ji,

> > > > You are right - to the point. I agree. But as far as LL going

> to H-7

> > > > is concerned, the special point regarding ' if LL is a

malefic'

> is

> > > > mentioned in the sloka itself; there for we cannot discount

it

> as far

> > > > as the prediction related to the same given in the sloka is

> concerned.

> > > > For other results regarding LL in H-7 (which we would discuss

in

> > > > detail as this discussion progresses) I agree absolutely with

> your

> > > > logic and argument.

> > > > As far as LL in H-5 is concerned, I think there could be the

> point

> > > > I mentioned under consideration (for BPHS results) even

though

> the

> > > > same is NOT mentioned in the sloka. But as you have clearly

> stated,

> > > > the normal expected result for the same SHOULD BE ''susuta'

> (good

> > > > child, or birth of children). Let us keep this doubt open

till

> we

> > > > cross verify the results with the derivations given in other

> texts and

> > > > come to a logical conclusion/derivation.

> > > > We always have 2 options open to cross check the results

> predicted

> > > > by BPHS in this context-

> > > > 1) Cross verify the results with the predictions given in

other

> > > > texts (especially Meenaraja Hora & Hora Pradeepam)

> > > > 2) Compare the predicted results with actual results observed.

> > > > But still, the base rule as you pointed out is -

> > > > ==>

> > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is: L-1

> goes

> > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly discounted.

> Clear?

> > > > <==

> > > > To state in other words, the base rule is -

> > > > " LL going to H-1, H-2, H-3 etc ONLY should be considered, and

> other

> > > > factors (such as LL being malefic/benefic, LL being aspected

by

> > > > malefic/benefic etc) should be clearly discounted "

> > > > We will even touch this base rule with corollaries, ONLY WHEN

> the

> > > > special condition is mentioned in the sloka itself; just not

to

> > > > contaminate the result indicated by the sloka.

> > > > If this corollary is not there, I agree to your statement

> completely.

> > > > Love,

> > > > Sreenadh

> > > >

> > > > , rk dash

> > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Sreenadh,

> > > > > I think we should keep out the factor of L1 being a natural

> > > > malefic -- the logic you have used for those outcomes of L-1

> going to

> > > > 5th, 7th hse (death of first child, uninterested in life/wife

> etc). If

> > > > we must, then we have to qualify the deduction, saying " where

L-

> 5 (or

> > > > L-7) is a malefic or is afflicted " .

> > > > >

> > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is: L-1

> goes

> > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly discounted.

> Clear?

> > > > >

> > > > > Let's carry on,

> > > > > RK

> > > > >

> > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:

> > > > > Dear RK ji,

> > > > > Your concerns are right - important points mentioned. Let

us

> > > > > together try to find out the reasons based on our logic.

> > > > > > When in 1st : Uncertain in decision

> > > > > Lagna lord in lagna gives the native all the good qualities

> such as

> > > > > compassion, kindness, softness of mind, emotional approach

> etc.

> > > > > Result? Uncertainty in decision. I think this account for

the

> > logical

> > > > > basis of the above derivation.

> > > > > > When in 2nd: Many wives

> > > > > That is just natural. 2nd and 11th house signify second

> marriage.

> > > > > When the lagna lord comes in contact with any house the

> native is

> > > > > sure to get the results related to that. Lagna lord in 2nd

> house

> > > > > makes the native beautiful, talkative, liked by women etc.

> Thus it

> > > > > turns out that it is natural to have many relations

(wives).

> It

> > > > > should be noted that for lagna lord in lagna, and lagna

lord

> in 2nd

> > > > > house - 2 wives and many wives are derived - NOT as a bad

> > result, but

> > > > > as a good result; indicating that the native will have every

> > kind of

> > > > > luxury including women.

> > > > > > When in 3rd : Many kinds of wealth, 2 wives

> > > > > Valorous - thus many kinds of wealth; 3rd is a house

usually

> is of

> > > > > MIXED nature indicating mixed/various/many results. That is

> why the

> > > > > derivation 'Many kinds of wealth'. 2nd from 2nd - many

kinds

> of

> > > > > wealth - i think this is why you doubt that it could be due

to

> > bhavat

> > > > > bhavam. 2 wives - i have no idea supply in this regard.

> > > > > > When in 4th: Lust

> > > > > No idea as of now.

> > > > > > When in 5th: Angry, loss of the 1st child

> > > > > If lagna lord is in 5th, any affliction to it can affect

both

> 5th

> > > > > house and lagna equally - making a double impact. That is

why

> the

> > > > > prediction 'loss of child'. Why 1st child - 5th signify 1st

> child

> > > > > more i doubt. Possibly here Parasara deviates a bit from

the

> > > > > conventional prediction owing to the possibility of 'double

> > impact' i

> > > > > think. The standard prediction should be (we will verify)

> gain of

> > > > > child, as you mentioned. (But first the child should be

born

> for it

> > > > > to perish - this may make both the derivations consistent)

> > > > > > When in 7th: Uninterested in worldly life and wife

> > > > > This applies only if lagna lord is a malefic. Therefore it

is

> > > > > logically ok.

> > > > > > When in 12th: Good health

> > > > > No idea as of now.

> > > > > Love,

> > > > > Sreenadh

> > > > >

> > > > > , rk dash

> > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Good start. I agree. First theoretical consideration then

> we test

> > > > > the rules against actual charts. Here's a small beginning

of

> the

> > > > > examination of lagna lord's bhavashraya phala in BHPH. I'll

go

> > about

> > > > > it by first picking out those phala (results) which are not

> self-

> > > > > evident. Here they are:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > When in 1st

> > > > > > Uncertain in decision

> > > > > >

> > > > > > When in 2nd

> > > > > > Many wives

> > > > > >

> > > > > > When in 3rd

> > > > > > Many kinds of wealth (bhavat bhavam?), 2 wives

> > > > > >

> > > > > > When in 4th

> > > > > > Lust

> > > > > >

> > > > > > When in 5th

> > > > > > Angry, loss of the 1st child

> > > > > >

> > > > > > When in 7th

> > > > > > Uninterested in worldly life and wife

> > > > > >

> > > > > > When in 12th

> > > > > > Good health

> > > > > >

> > > > > > These results are not easy to discern, given the first

> factor

> > > > > (the linkage of the the self to the department represented

by

> the

> > > > > house the lagna lord tenants) and the sweeping good that

> lagna lord

> > > > > brings to the bhava it goes to. Take its placement in 5th.

> Why loss

> > > > > of child at all? Most other works declare, 'susuta',

meaning

> good

> > > > > progeny. I'll cite one such at a later stage for all house

of

> > tenancy

> > > > > as far as 1st lord is concerned.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > One more thing I'd like to think aloud about. Rule says

> that any

> > > > > lord that goes to a dusthana will bring detriment to the

> house the

> > > > > planet is lord of. Now how do we reconcile the L1 in 12th

> ensuring

> > > > > good health? Will it take care of the attrition of body

(12th

> from

> > > > > 1st hse, ie body) without itself being subject to

detriment?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > RK

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:

> > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > The primary derivations for Lagna lord in various houses

as

> per

> > > > > BPHS is given below. I invite all to start a discussion on

the

> > same.

> > > > > > =================================

> > > > > > As per BPHS, for Lagna lord in -

> > > > > > Lagna: healthy body, courageous, uncertain in decisions,

2

> wives

> > > > > > 2nd house: knowledgeable, good earnings, happiness, good

> habits,

> > > > > righteous, many wives, good qualities.

> > > > > > 3rd house: valorous like a lion, all kinds of wealth, 2

> wives,

> > > > > intelligent.

> > > > > > 4th house: love and affection from healthy mother with

good

> > > > > longevity, many brothers/sisters, lust, beauty and good

> qualities.

> > > > > > 5th house: angry, moderate happiness from children, loss

of

> first

> > > > > born (child), admired by government and authorities.

> > > > > > 6th house: (especially if aspected by malefics) trouble

> from

> > > > > enemies, bad health.

> > > > > > 7th house: (especially if Lagna lord is a malefic) his

wife

> will

> > > > > die early (or married life will not go long), he will

become

> > > > > uninterested in worldly life and wife, will be detached

> towards his

> > > > > native land and wander/visit many places, It is possible

that

> he

> > > > > won't be much wealthy (he would be a poor man) or also that

he

> > would

> > > > > be a very wealthy person like a king.

> > > > > > 8th house: master of some branch of knowledge, troubled

by

> > > > > diseases, interested in others wives, will be interested in

> all

> > kinds

> > > > > of games such as cards, chess, dice, lottery and so on,

very

> much

> > > > > angry.

> > > > > > 9th house: lucky, loved by the public, devotee of Vishnu,

> > master of

> > > > > words and oratory, will have good wealth wife and children.

> > > > > > 10th house: admired by government and people in power

(the

> native

> > > > > will have a good job), he would be a government servant,

very

> much

> > > > > popular.

> > > > > > 11th house: much income from many sources, good

popularity

> > > > > (popularity due to good deeds, celebrity), good qualities,

> many

> > wives.

> > > > > > 12th house: good health, extravagant without reason,

angry

> > > > > (especially if not benefics are present in 12th and if no

> benefic

> > > > > aspects 12th)

> > > > > > =================================

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Love,

> > > > > > Sreenadh

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , manju

> chawla

> > > > > <manjuch2001@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Thank You Sreenadhji

> > > > > > > we would learn this subject in this way.You are really

> > helping us

> > > > > God bless you

> > > > > > > regards

> > > > > > > manju

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:

> > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > Let us start a new discussion on the subject " What

should

> be

> > > > > > > predicted for Lagna lord in Various houses? " - let the

> > discussion

> > > > > go

> > > > > > > first and then comparison of it with actual results.

> > > > > > > Love,

> > > > > > > Sreenadh

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > " I am careful not to confuse excellence with

> > > > > perfection,Excellence-I can reach for,Perfection is God's

> > business---

> > > > > Michael J.Fox

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top

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September 15, 2007

Hare rama krishna,

dear lalit ,

The upachayas are 3,6,10,11 and 6 is both dustana and upachaya,Upachaya houses are supposed to be houses of free will u can execute in this life concerned with that bhava and also known as houses of growth .That is why generaly says planets in upachaya gives good results .

Now let us take 2nd house and its upachaya houses.

4th house being 3rd from 2nd ( house of family or kutumba where one born or even this place is to see kula devata according to prashna maaraga) ,7th house being 6th from 2nd house (house of marriage,partnership and even how we interact with out side world also madhana bhava and yatra bhava) ,and 11th house being 10th from 2nd house ( house of all kinf of gains and incomes ,frnds,and even our elder siblings) and the 12th house ( the house of expenditure and loses and even our house of bed room pleasures ) ,

Now if we apply logic we can see all this houses has a great say in accumulation of money which is one of the characteristics of 2nd house.

waiting comments from all scholars and members.

regrds sunil nair.

om shreem mahalaxmai namah.

, "litsol" <mishra.lalit wrote:>> I agree to this point to some extent, It's not always a good try to > understand one house on the basis of how far it is from some house, > there are only 12 houses, so each and every house comes n'th from > 1'st to 12'th from remaining houses.> > Better way of understanding the houses is trying to understand basic > charactersitic like if upchaya say 3rd house, why 3'rd is an upachaya > etc. and then learning trikonas like dharma trikona, Bhoga trikona > etc. > > regards,> Lalit.> > , rk dash > arkaydash@ wrote:> >> > Sreenadh,> > > > Yes, I think so. They probably are from the Meenaraj > Hora/Horapradeepam sources now that I get to see your PDF file. > > > > What I meant when I said: "Examples will of course pour in. But > we have to > > see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration" is this. When > we take up example charts (and we haven't come to that as yet), we > have to be careful not to confuse any particular experience emanating > from other configurations/patterns and a bhavashraya phala of a house > lord. That is how we correctly validate the derivation in slokas. We > all know what drama the 'yogaja phala' can introduce in a chart. The > task is arduous; it requires rigours. I was doing some loud thinking > on the methodological rigours staring at us, in advance.> > > > I went thru your PDF file. Umm, I would say some of your logic > searches overshoot themselves. Take this one. The result of wealth > with lagna lord in 4th house. You say, 4th is 3rd from 2nd, ie > upachaya from 2nd, which is how. Not very elegant as a rationale. The > reason, to my mind, is the wealth of siginfications the 4th hse > holds -- house, vehicle and what have you. Now, applying your well-> plucked Rule Four, which says lagna lord amplifies (the goodness of) > the house it goes to, the logic behind wealth is valid. > > > > I do like your Rule reminders. Commendable. > > > > Best,> > RK> > > > PS: I will take your hugs when we proceed on 'sustained topics' > in a more organised fashion...> > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > Dear RK ji,> > Thanks. The derivations given are good - and looks as if solely > > based on "Houses" alone.> > ==>> > Now, the rationale. Examples will of course pour in. But we have to > > see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?> > <==> > Apart from houses, I don't think anything such as Planet/lords etc > > comes in to play in the derivations you provided. > > *Lord are of Signs; Houses does not have any lords - and so the > same > > is discarded. > > * Planets are not at all considered in house based derivation - and > > so the same is discarded.> > > > I ascertain, the derivations are solely based on houses, and so > > should be the logic behind. Yah, RK ji, you can proceed with > > explaining the logic behid each of those derivations... > > Love and Hugs,> > Sreenadh > > > > , rk dash > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > >> > > Shreenadh, > > > Here is the bhavashraya phala of L1 as found in the compedium. > > There is an 'result' for the 5th hse, but I 'll take time to make > out > > what is meant. > > > > > > In 1st house> > > Healthy, long-lived, king(ly), strong, gain of land> > > > > > 2nd hse> > > Wealthy, engaged in right action, head of the locality, life of > > plenty, corpulent> > > > > > 3rd hse> > > Has good friends, religiosity, generosity; brave, strong> > > > > > 4th hse> > > King's favourite, lives life to the full (could also mean 'very > > long-lived,' the expression being prachura-jivita), earns by right > > means, devoted to father, voracious > > > > > > 5th hse> > > Good children, engaged in good deeds, has humility, known his for > > good qualities > > > > > > 6th hse> > > Healthy, strong, gain of land, miserly, rich, subdues enemies, on > > the side of good deeds> > > > > > 7th hse> > > Brilliant, good manners, cultured wife, spends himself fast > > during coitus, good-looking> > > > > > 8th hse> > > Miserly, unreliable in financial matters, very long-lived, harsh > > in speech if the planet is a malefic, large physique if a benefic> > > > > > 9th hse> > > Good people are his friends, good deeds, balanced (without > > extremes), cultured, known for his good deeds, brilliant> > > > > > 10th hse > > > Gains from ruler (state), learned, cultured, reverent towards > > guru and mother, king, famous> > > > > > 11th hse > > > Long-lived, has progeny, spends himself fast during coitus, > > powerful> > > > > > 12th hse> > > Harsh speech, very sharp mind, goes abroad, a free loader > > > > > > > > > Now, the rationale. Examples will of couse pour in. But we have > > to see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?> > > > > > RK> > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > Dear RK ji,> > > ==>> > > I know of a compendium in vernacular which collates the best > (best > > as> > > the compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to be)> > > available, which goes into this aspect (lord going to different > > houses)> > > <==> > > Can you provide the results derived/provided by that book > for "lagna> > > lord going to various houses"? That could be much beneficial to > our> > > current study - we will try to find the logic used behind those> > > derivations, and accept or reject each of those derivations; as > > usual> > > based on conditions such as -> > > * logical or not> > > * Real life experience supports the same or not> > > It doesn't matter whether the source mention or the Sanskrit > > original> > > is available or not - as long as the derivations are logical, and> > > reflect the actual experience. > > > > the 'material' looks very insightful stuff. > > > That is very good point - which itself I think indicate that it > > could> > > be valuable material.> > > Love,> > > Sreenadh > > > > > > , rk dash> > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > >> > > > OK, Sree, that about sums up the scenario on one of the 7-fold> > > method. But the search, esp. for rishi hora source must be kept > on. > > I> > > know of a compedium in vernacular which collates the best (best > as > > the> > > compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to be)> > > available, which goes into this aspect (lord going to different> > > houses) but there is no source mention for the portion nor is > there> > > the Sanskrit original for it unlike most other portions in the> > > compendium. Nevertheless the 'material' looks very insightful > stuff.> > > It is things like this that I had in mind. Let's see.> > > > > > > > Best,> > > > RK > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > ==>> > > > Now we have to agree on who next to Parasara we take on board > for> > > > comparison. You have named two: Meenaraja Hora, and Hora > > Pradeepam.> > > > Who else? We don't have to go by the overall reputation of the > > text.> > > > We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of > interpretation > > in> > > > question in a treatise that may not otherwise be rated very > high. > > What> > > > say? > > > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or classics? > > > > <==> > > > This question is really difficult to answer. Apart from > > Parasara> > > > (for whom various versions of the slokas are available for the > > same in> > > > almost all instances) Meena Raja Hora discusses it. The > statements> > > > from Meena Raja Hora is mentioned with utmost importance in > Hora > > Ratna> > > > as well (at times they slightly variant versions of the slokas> > > > available in current printed verion of Meena raja hora). Hora> > > > pradeepam is a text quoted with reverance by the auther of Hora > > Sara > > > > (i.e. Nrisimha Daivanjna), a well known scholar of 17th > century. > > Thus -> > > > Meenaraja hora gets double importance since supported by Hora > > Ratna.> > > > Hora Pradeepam gets double importance since supported by Hora > > Sara.> > > > > > > > Some other later day texts MIGHT have discussed the same at > times> > > > (though not extensively), but I am yet to make an elaborate > > search for> > > > the same in texts like Sarvartha Chintamani, Jataka Parijata,> > > > Saravali, Phaladeepika etc. One or two rudimentary slokas > related > > to> > > > the same we may find in these texts as well. Some slokas > relevant > > to> > > > the may find a place in many ancient Rishi horas (Whereever I > find> > > > such a reference I will quote them for sure). But for sure none > > of the> > > > other texts (except BPHS, Meenaraja hora, Hora Pradeepam) > > discusses> > > > this subject extensively in detail as per my current knowledge > and> > > > understanding. As far as ancient texts (Rishi horas) are > > concerned it> > > > is possible that the slokas that discuss this subject > extensively > > are> > > > lost, even though they might have done the same (since they use > 7-> > fold> > > > method).> > > > Love,> > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Yes, you are homing in on the "pure" point. That's what this> > > > particular aspect of interpretation of a chart is about. That's > > the> > > > way (the part-way) to go about it -- core task, winkling the > > secrets> > > > out of a chart. Now we have to agree on who next to Parasara we > > take> > > > on board for comparision. You have named two: Meenaraja Hora, > and > > Hora> > > > Pradeepam. Who else? We don't have to go by the overall > > reputation of> > > > the text. We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of> > > > interpretation in question in a treatise that may not otherwise > be> > > > rated very high. What say? > > > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or classics? > > > > > > > > > > Sotto Voce: I don't want us, you and me, to be cynosures of > (the> > > > galaxy of) our star-gazers in this firmament. Onlookers all? > > > > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > You are right - to the point. I agree. But as far as LL going > > to H-7> > > > > is concerned, the special point regarding ' if LL is a > malefic' > > is> > > > > mentioned in the sloka itself; there for we cannot discount > it > > as far> > > > > as the prediction related to the same given in the sloka is > > concerned.> > > > > For other results regarding LL in H-7 (which we would discuss > in> > > > > detail as this discussion progresses) I agree absolutely with > > your> > > > > logic and argument. > > > > > As far as LL in H-5 is concerned, I think there could be the > > point> > > > > I mentioned under consideration (for BPHS results) even > though > > the> > > > > same is NOT mentioned in the sloka. But as you have clearly > > stated,> > > > > the normal expected result for the same SHOULD BE ''susuta' > > (good> > > > > child, or birth of children). Let us keep this doubt open > till > > we> > > > > cross verify the results with the derivations given in other > > texts and> > > > > come to a logical conclusion/derivation.> > > > > We always have 2 options open to cross check the results > > predicted> > > > > by BPHS in this context-> > > > > 1) Cross verify the results with the predictions given in > other> > > > > texts (especially Meenaraja Hora & Hora Pradeepam)> > > > > 2) Compare the predicted results with actual results observed.> > > > > But still, the base rule as you pointed out is -> > > > > ==>> > > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is: L-1 > > goes > > > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly discounted. > > Clear?> > > > > <==> > > > > To state in other words, the base rule is -> > > > > "LL going to H-1, H-2, H-3 etc ONLY should be considered, and > > other> > > > > factors (such as LL being malefic/benefic, LL being aspected > by> > > > > malefic/benefic etc) should be clearly discounted"> > > > > We will even touch this base rule with corollaries, ONLY WHEN > > the> > > > > special condition is mentioned in the sloka itself; just not > to> > > > > contaminate the result indicated by the sloka.> > > > > If this corollary is not there, I agree to your statement > > completely.> > > > > Love,> > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Sreenadh,> > > > > > I think we should keep out the factor of L1 being a natural> > > > > malefic -- the logic you have used for those outcomes of L-1 > > going to> > > > > 5th, 7th hse (death of first child, uninterested in life/wife > > etc). If> > > > > we must, then we have to qualify the deduction, saying "where > L-> > 5 (or> > > > > L-7) is a malefic or is afflicted". > > > > > > > > > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is: L-1 > > goes> > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly discounted. > > Clear?> > > > > > > > > > > > Let's carry on,> > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > > Your concerns are right - important points mentioned. Let > us > > > > > > together try to find out the reasons based on our logic.> > > > > > > When in 1st : Uncertain in decision> > > > > > Lagna lord in lagna gives the native all the good qualities > > such as > > > > > > compassion, kindness, softness of mind, emotional approach > > etc. > > > > > > Result? Uncertainty in decision. I think this account for > the> > > logical > > > > > > basis of the above derivation.> > > > > > > When in 2nd: Many wives> > > > > > That is just natural. 2nd and 11th house signify second > > marriage. > > > > > > When the lagna lord comes in contact with any house the > > native is > > > > > > sure to get the results related to that. Lagna lord in 2nd > > house > > > > > > makes the native beautiful, talkative, liked by women etc. > > Thus it > > > > > > turns out that it is natural to have many relations > (wives). > > It > > > > > > should be noted that for lagna lord in lagna, and lagna > lord > > in 2nd > > > > > > house - 2 wives and many wives are derived - NOT as a bad> > > result, but > > > > > > as a good result; indicating that the native will have every> > > kind of > > > > > > luxury including women.> > > > > > > When in 3rd : Many kinds of wealth, 2 wives> > > > > > Valorous - thus many kinds of wealth; 3rd is a house > usually > > is of > > > > > > MIXED nature indicating mixed/various/many results. That is > > why the > > > > > > derivation 'Many kinds of wealth'. 2nd from 2nd - many > kinds > > of > > > > > > wealth - i think this is why you doubt that it could be due > to> > > bhavat > > > > > > bhavam. 2 wives - i have no idea supply in this regard.> > > > > > > When in 4th: Lust> > > > > > No idea as of now.> > > > > > > When in 5th: Angry, loss of the 1st child > > > > > > If lagna lord is in 5th, any affliction to it can affect > both > > 5th > > > > > > house and lagna equally - making a double impact. That is > why > > the > > > > > > prediction 'loss of child'. Why 1st child - 5th signify 1st > > child > > > > > > more i doubt. Possibly here Parasara deviates a bit from > the > > > > > > conventional prediction owing to the possibility of 'double> > > impact' i > > > > > > think. The standard prediction should be (we will verify) > > gain of > > > > > > child, as you mentioned. (But first the child should be > born > > for it > > > > > > to perish - this may make both the derivations consistent)> > > > > > > When in 7th: Uninterested in worldly life and wife > > > > > > This applies only if lagna lord is a malefic. Therefore it > is > > > > > > logically ok.> > > > > > > When in 12th: Good health> > > > > > No idea as of now.> > > > > > Love,> > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > , rk dash > > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Good start. I agree. First theoretical consideration then > > we test > > > > > > the rules against actual charts. Here's a small beginning > of > > the > > > > > > examination of lagna lord's bhavashraya phala in BHPH. I'll > go> > > about > > > > > > it by first picking out those phala (results) which are not > > self-> > > > > > evident. Here they are:> > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 1st> > > > > > > Uncertain in decision> > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 2nd> > > > > > > Many wives> > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 3rd> > > > > > > Many kinds of wealth (bhavat bhavam?), 2 wives> > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 4th> > > > > > > Lust> > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 5th> > > > > > > Angry, loss of the 1st child > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 7th> > > > > > > Uninterested in worldly life and wife > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 12th> > > > > > > Good health> > > > > > > > > > > > > > These results are not easy to discern, given the first > > factor > > > > > > (the linkage of the the self to the department represented > by > > the > > > > > > house the lagna lord tenants) and the sweeping good that > > lagna lord > > > > > > brings to the bhava it goes to. Take its placement in 5th. > > Why loss > > > > > > of child at all? Most other works declare, 'susuta', > meaning > > good > > > > > > progeny. I'll cite one such at a later stage for all house > of> > > tenancy > > > > > > as far as 1st lord is concerned. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One more thing I'd like to think aloud about. Rule says > > that any > > > > > > lord that goes to a dusthana will bring detriment to the > > house the > > > > > > planet is lord of. Now how do we reconcile the L1 in 12th > > ensuring > > > > > > good health? Will it take care of the attrition of body > (12th > > from > > > > > > 1st hse, ie body) without itself being subject to > detriment? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > Dear All,> > > > > > > The primary derivations for Lagna lord in various houses > as > > per > > > > > > BPHS is given below. I invite all to start a discussion on > the> > > same. > > > > > > > =================================> > > > > > > As per BPHS, for Lagna lord in -> > > > > > > Lagna: healthy body, courageous, uncertain in decisions, > 2 > > wives> > > > > > > 2nd house: knowledgeable, good earnings, happiness, good > > habits, > > > > > > righteous, many wives, good qualities.> > > > > > > 3rd house: valorous like a lion, all kinds of wealth, 2 > > wives, > > > > > > intelligent.> > > > > > > 4th house: love and affection from healthy mother with > good > > > > > > longevity, many brothers/sisters, lust, beauty and good > > qualities.> > > > > > > 5th house: angry, moderate happiness from children, loss > of > > first > > > > > > born (child), admired by government and authorities. > > > > > > > 6th house: (especially if aspected by malefics) trouble > > from > > > > > > enemies, bad health.> > > > > > > 7th house: (especially if Lagna lord is a malefic) his > wife > > will > > > > > > die early (or married life will not go long), he will > become > > > > > > uninterested in worldly life and wife, will be detached > > towards his > > > > > > native land and wander/visit many places, It is possible > that > > he > > > > > > won't be much wealthy (he would be a poor man) or also that > he> > > would > > > > > > be a very wealthy person like a king.> > > > > > > 8th house: master of some branch of knowledge, troubled > by > > > > > > diseases, interested in others wives, will be interested in > > all> > > kinds > > > > > > of games such as cards, chess, dice, lottery and so on, > very > > much > > > > > > angry.> > > > > > > 9th house: lucky, loved by the public, devotee of Vishnu,> > > master of > > > > > > words and oratory, will have good wealth wife and children. > > > > > > > 10th house: admired by government and people in power > (the > > native > > > > > > will have a good job), he would be a government servant, > very > > much > > > > > > popular.> > > > > > > 11th house: much income from many sources, good > popularity > > > > > > (popularity due to good deeds, celebrity), good qualities, > > many> > > wives.> > > > > > > 12th house: good health, extravagant without reason, > angry > > > > > > (especially if not benefics are present in 12th and if no > > benefic > > > > > > aspects 12th) > > > > > > > =================================> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > > > , manju > > chawla > > > > > > <manjuch2001@> wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Thank You Sreenadhji> > > > > > > > we would learn this subject in this way.You are really> > > helping us > > > > > > God bless you> > > > > > > > regards> > > > > > > > manju> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > > > > > > Dear All,> > > > > > > > Let us start a new discussion on the subject "What > should > > be> > > > > > > > predicted for Lagna lord in Various houses?" - let the> > > discussion > > > > > > go> > > > > > > > first and then comparison of it with actual results.> > > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "I am careful not to confuse excellence with > > > > > > perfection,Excellence-I can reach for,Perfection is God's> > > business---> > > > > > Michael J.Fox> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top> > > picks on > > > > > > TV.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Get the freedom to save as many mails as you wish. Click > > here to > > > > > > know how.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Get the freedom to save as many mails as you wish. Click > here > > to> > > > > know how.> > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Try the revolutionary next-gen Mail. > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Get the freedom to save as many mails as you wish. Click here to > > know how.> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Get the freedom to save as many mails as you wish. Click here to > know how.> >>

September 16, 2007

Sunil Ji,

I had doubts, i m trying to put forth like this -

Can we apply this logic to 4'th and 5'th houses, 4'th being 12'th to

5'th should denote some kind of loss to 5'th house, that i think is

not true.

Same is relation between 3'rd and 11'th, 3'rd is 6'th from 11'th,

3'rd might be complementary to 11'th but not the contrary.

Like if one does efforts, he will have gains.

regards,

Lalit.

, " sunil nair "

<astro_tellerkerala wrote:

>

> Hare rama krishna,

>

> dear lalit ,

>

> The upachayas are 3,6,10,11 and 6 is both dustana

and

> upachaya,Upachaya houses are supposed to be houses of free will u

can

> execute in this life concerned with that bhava and also known as

houses

> of growth .That is why generaly says planets in upachaya gives good

> results .

>

> Now let us take 2nd house and its upachaya houses.

>

> 4th house being 3rd from 2nd ( house of family or kutumba where

one

> born or even this place is to see kula devata according to prashna

> maaraga) ,7th house being 6th from 2nd house (house of

> marriage,partnership and even how we interact with out side world

also

> madhana bhava and yatra bhava) ,and 11th house being 10th from 2nd

house

> ( house of all kinf of gains and incomes ,frnds,and even our elder

> siblings) and the 12th house ( the house of expenditure and loses

and

> even our house of bed room pleasures ) ,

>

> Now if we apply logic we can see all this houses has a great say in

> accumulation of money which is one of the characteristics of 2nd

house.

>

> waiting comments from all scholars and members.

>

> regrds sunil nair.

>

> om shreem mahalaxmai namah.

, " litsol "

> <mishra.lalit@> wrote:

> >

> > I agree to this point to some extent, It's not always a good try

to

> > understand one house on the basis of how far it is from some

house,

> > there are only 12 houses, so each and every house comes n'th from

> > 1'st to 12'th from remaining houses.

> >

> > Better way of understanding the houses is trying to understand

basic

> > charactersitic like if upchaya say 3rd house, why 3'rd is an

upachaya

> > etc. and then learning trikonas like dharma trikona, Bhoga trikona

> > etc.

> >

> > regards,

> > Lalit.

> >

> > , rk dash

> > arkaydash@ wrote:

> > >

> > > Sreenadh,

> > >

> > > Yes, I think so. They probably are from the Meenaraj

> > Hora/Horapradeepam sources now that I get to see your PDF file.

> > >

> > > What I meant when I said: " Examples will of course pour in. But

> > we have to

> > > see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a

> > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration " is this.

When

> > we take up example charts (and we haven't come to that as yet), we

> > have to be careful not to confuse any particular experience

emanating

> > from other configurations/patterns and a bhavashraya phala of a

house

> > lord. That is how we correctly validate the derivation in slokas.

We

> > all know what drama the 'yogaja phala' can introduce in a chart.

The

> > task is arduous; it requires rigours. I was doing some loud

thinking

> > on the methodological rigours staring at us, in advance.

> > >

> > > I went thru your PDF file. Umm, I would say some of your logic

> > searches overshoot themselves. Take this one. The result of wealth

> > with lagna lord in 4th house. You say, 4th is 3rd from 2nd, ie

> > upachaya from 2nd, which is how. Not very elegant as a rationale.

The

> > reason, to my mind, is the wealth of siginfications the 4th hse

> > holds -- house, vehicle and what have you. Now, applying your

well-

> > plucked Rule Four, which says lagna lord amplifies (the goodness

of)

> > the house it goes to, the logic behind wealth is valid.

> > >

> > > I do like your Rule reminders. Commendable.

> > >

> > > Best,

> > > RK

> > >

> > > PS: I will take your hugs when we proceed on 'sustained topics'

> > in a more organised fashion...

> > >

> > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:

> > > Dear RK ji,

> > > Thanks. The derivations given are good - and looks as if solely

> > > based on " Houses " alone.

> > > ==>

> > > Now, the rationale. Examples will of course pour in. But we

have to

> > > see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a

> > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?

> > > <==

> > > Apart from houses, I don't think anything such as Planet/lords

etc

> > > comes in to play in the derivations you provided.

> > > *Lord are of Signs; Houses does not have any lords - and so the

> > same

> > > is discarded.

> > > * Planets are not at all considered in house based derivation -

and

> > > so the same is discarded.

> > >

> > > I ascertain, the derivations are solely based on houses, and so

> > > should be the logic behind. Yah, RK ji, you can proceed with

> > > explaining the logic behid each of those derivations...

> > > Love and Hugs,

> > > Sreenadh

> > >

> > > , rk dash

> > > <arkaydash@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Shreenadh,

> > > > Here is the bhavashraya phala of L1 as found in the compedium.

> > > There is an 'result' for the 5th hse, but I 'll take time to

make

> > out

> > > what is meant.

> > > >

> > > > In 1st house

> > > > Healthy, long-lived, king(ly), strong, gain of land

> > > >

> > > > 2nd hse

> > > > Wealthy, engaged in right action, head of the locality, life

of

> > > plenty, corpulent

> > > >

> > > > 3rd hse

> > > > Has good friends, religiosity, generosity; brave, strong

> > > >

> > > > 4th hse

> > > > King's favourite, lives life to the full (could also

mean 'very

> > > long-lived,' the expression being prachura-jivita), earns by

right

> > > means, devoted to father, voracious

> > > >

> > > > 5th hse

> > > > Good children, engaged in good deeds, has humility, known his

for

> > > good qualities

> > > >

> > > > 6th hse

> > > > Healthy, strong, gain of land, miserly, rich, subdues

enemies, on

> > > the side of good deeds

> > > >

> > > > 7th hse

> > > > Brilliant, good manners, cultured wife, spends himself fast

> > > during coitus, good-looking

> > > >

> > > > 8th hse

> > > > Miserly, unreliable in financial matters, very long-lived,

harsh

> > > in speech if the planet is a malefic, large physique if a

benefic

> > > >

> > > > 9th hse

> > > > Good people are his friends, good deeds, balanced (without

> > > extremes), cultured, known for his good deeds, brilliant

> > > >

> > > > 10th hse

> > > > Gains from ruler (state), learned, cultured, reverent towards

> > > guru and mother, king, famous

> > > >

> > > > 11th hse

> > > > Long-lived, has progeny, spends himself fast during coitus,

> > > powerful

> > > >

> > > > 12th hse

> > > > Harsh speech, very sharp mind, goes abroad, a free loader

> > > >

> > > > Now, the rationale. Examples will of couse pour in. But we

have

> > > to see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a

> > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?

> > > >

> > > > RK

> > > >

> > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:

> > > > Dear RK ji,

> > > > ==>

> > > > I know of a compendium in vernacular which collates the best

> > (best

> > > as

> > > > the compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to

be)

> > > > available, which goes into this aspect (lord going to

different

> > > houses)

> > > > <==

> > > > Can you provide the results derived/provided by that book

> > for " lagna

> > > > lord going to various houses " ? That could be much beneficial

to

> > our

> > > > current study - we will try to find the logic used behind

those

> > > > derivations, and accept or reject each of those derivations;

as

> > > usual

> > > > based on conditions such as -

> > > > * logical or not

> > > > * Real life experience supports the same or not

> > > > It doesn't matter whether the source mention or the Sanskrit

> > > original

> > > > is available or not - as long as the derivations are logical,

and

> > > > reflect the actual experience.

> > > > > the 'material' looks very insightful stuff.

> > > > That is very good point - which itself I think indicate that

it

> > > could

> > > > be valuable material.

> > > > Love,

> > > > Sreenadh

> > > >

> > > > , rk dash

> > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > OK, Sree, that about sums up the scenario on one of the 7-

fold

> > > > method. But the search, esp. for rishi hora source must be

kept

> > on.

> > > I

> > > > know of a compedium in vernacular which collates the best

(best

> > as

> > > the

> > > > compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to be)

> > > > available, which goes into this aspect (lord going to

different

> > > > houses) but there is no source mention for the portion nor is

> > there

> > > > the Sanskrit original for it unlike most other portions in the

> > > > compendium. Nevertheless the 'material' looks very insightful

> > stuff.

> > > > It is things like this that I had in mind. Let's see.

> > > > >

> > > > > Best,

> > > > > RK

> > > > >

> > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:

> > > > > Dear RK ji,

> > > > > ==>

> > > > > Now we have to agree on who next to Parasara we take on

board

> > for

> > > > > comparison. You have named two: Meenaraja Hora, and Hora

> > > Pradeepam.

> > > > > Who else? We don't have to go by the overall reputation of

the

> > > text.

> > > > > We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of

> > interpretation

> > > in

> > > > > question in a treatise that may not otherwise be rated very

> > high.

> > > What

> > > > > say?

> > > > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or

classics?

> > > > > <==

> > > > > This question is really difficult to answer. Apart from

> > > Parasara

> > > > > (for whom various versions of the slokas are available for

the

> > > same in

> > > > > almost all instances) Meena Raja Hora discusses it. The

> > statements

> > > > > from Meena Raja Hora is mentioned with utmost importance in

> > Hora

> > > Ratna

> > > > > as well (at times they slightly variant versions of the

slokas

> > > > > available in current printed verion of Meena raja hora).

Hora

> > > > > pradeepam is a text quoted with reverance by the auther of

Hora

> > > Sara

> > > > > (i.e. Nrisimha Daivanjna), a well known scholar of 17th

> > century.

> > > Thus -

> > > > > Meenaraja hora gets double importance since supported by

Hora

> > > Ratna.

> > > > > Hora Pradeepam gets double importance since supported by

Hora

> > > Sara.

> > > > >

> > > > > Some other later day texts MIGHT have discussed the same at

> > times

> > > > > (though not extensively), but I am yet to make an elaborate

> > > search for

> > > > > the same in texts like Sarvartha Chintamani, Jataka

Parijata,

> > > > > Saravali, Phaladeepika etc. One or two rudimentary slokas

> > related

> > > to

> > > > > the same we may find in these texts as well. Some slokas

> > relevant

> > > to

> > > > > the may find a place in many ancient Rishi horas (Whereever

I

> > find

> > > > > such a reference I will quote them for sure). But for sure

none

> > > of the

> > > > > other texts (except BPHS, Meenaraja hora, Hora Pradeepam)

> > > discusses

> > > > > this subject extensively in detail as per my current

knowledge

> > and

> > > > > understanding. As far as ancient texts (Rishi horas) are

> > > concerned it

> > > > > is possible that the slokas that discuss this subject

> > extensively

> > > are

> > > > > lost, even though they might have done the same (since they

use

> > 7-

> > > fold

> > > > > method).

> > > > > Love,

> > > > > Sreenadh

> > > > >

> > > > > , rk dash

> > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Yes, you are homing in on the " pure " point. That's what

this

> > > > > particular aspect of interpretation of a chart is about.

That's

> > > the

> > > > > way (the part-way) to go about it -- core task, winkling the

> > > secrets

> > > > > out of a chart. Now we have to agree on who next to

Parasara we

> > > take

> > > > > on board for comparision. You have named two: Meenaraja

Hora,

> > and

> > > Hora

> > > > > Pradeepam. Who else? We don't have to go by the overall

> > > reputation of

> > > > > the text. We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of

> > > > > interpretation in question in a treatise that may not

otherwise

> > be

> > > > > rated very high. What say?

> > > > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or

classics?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sotto Voce: I don't want us, you and me, to be cynosures

of

> > (the

> > > > > galaxy of) our star-gazers in this firmament. Onlookers all?

> > > > > >

> > > > > > RK

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:

> > > > > > Dear RK ji,

> > > > > > You are right - to the point. I agree. But as far as LL

going

> > > to H-7

> > > > > > is concerned, the special point regarding ' if LL is a

> > malefic'

> > > is

> > > > > > mentioned in the sloka itself; there for we cannot

discount

> > it

> > > as far

> > > > > > as the prediction related to the same given in the sloka

is

> > > concerned.

> > > > > > For other results regarding LL in H-7 (which we would

discuss

> > in

> > > > > > detail as this discussion progresses) I agree absolutely

with

> > > your

> > > > > > logic and argument.

> > > > > > As far as LL in H-5 is concerned, I think there could be

the

> > > point

> > > > > > I mentioned under consideration (for BPHS results) even

> > though

> > > the

> > > > > > same is NOT mentioned in the sloka. But as you have

clearly

> > > stated,

> > > > > > the normal expected result for the same SHOULD

BE ''susuta'

> > > (good

> > > > > > child, or birth of children). Let us keep this doubt open

> > till

> > > we

> > > > > > cross verify the results with the derivations given in

other

> > > texts and

> > > > > > come to a logical conclusion/derivation.

> > > > > > We always have 2 options open to cross check the results

> > > predicted

> > > > > > by BPHS in this context-

> > > > > > 1) Cross verify the results with the predictions given in

> > other

> > > > > > texts (especially Meenaraja Hora & Hora Pradeepam)

> > > > > > 2) Compare the predicted results with actual results

observed.

> > > > > > But still, the base rule as you pointed out is -

> > > > > > ==>

> > > > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is:

L-1

> > > goes

> > > > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly

discounted.

> > > Clear?

> > > > > > <==

> > > > > > To state in other words, the base rule is -

> > > > > > " LL going to H-1, H-2, H-3 etc ONLY should be considered,

and

> > > other

> > > > > > factors (such as LL being malefic/benefic, LL being

aspected

> > by

> > > > > > malefic/benefic etc) should be clearly discounted "

> > > > > > We will even touch this base rule with corollaries, ONLY

WHEN

> > > the

> > > > > > special condition is mentioned in the sloka itself; just

not

> > to

> > > > > > contaminate the result indicated by the sloka.

> > > > > > If this corollary is not there, I agree to your statement

> > > completely.

> > > > > > Love,

> > > > > > Sreenadh

> > > > > >

> > > > > > , rk dash

> > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sreenadh,

> > > > > > > I think we should keep out the factor of L1 being a

natural

> > > > > > malefic -- the logic you have used for those outcomes of

L-1

> > > going to

> > > > > > 5th, 7th hse (death of first child, uninterested in

life/wife

> > > etc). If

> > > > > > we must, then we have to qualify the deduction,

saying " where

> > L-

> > > 5 (or

> > > > > > L-7) is a malefic or is afflicted " .

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is:

L-1

> > > goes

> > > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly

discounted.

> > > Clear?

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Let's carry on,

> > > > > > > RK

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:

> > > > > > > Dear RK ji,

> > > > > > > Your concerns are right - important points mentioned.

Let

> > us

> > > > > > > together try to find out the reasons based on our logic.

> > > > > > > > When in 1st : Uncertain in decision

> > > > > > > Lagna lord in lagna gives the native all the good

qualities

> > > such as

> > > > > > > compassion, kindness, softness of mind, emotional

approach

> > > etc.

> > > > > > > Result? Uncertainty in decision. I think this account

for

> > the

> > > > logical

> > > > > > > basis of the above derivation.

> > > > > > > > When in 2nd: Many wives

> > > > > > > That is just natural. 2nd and 11th house signify second

> > > marriage.

> > > > > > > When the lagna lord comes in contact with any house the

> > > native is

> > > > > > > sure to get the results related to that. Lagna lord in

2nd

> > > house

> > > > > > > makes the native beautiful, talkative, liked by women

etc.

> > > Thus it

> > > > > > > turns out that it is natural to have many relations

> > (wives).

> > > It

> > > > > > > should be noted that for lagna lord in lagna, and lagna

> > lord

> > > in 2nd

> > > > > > > house - 2 wives and many wives are derived - NOT as a

bad

> > > > result, but

> > > > > > > as a good result; indicating that the native will have

every

> > > > kind of

> > > > > > > luxury including women.

> > > > > > > > When in 3rd : Many kinds of wealth, 2 wives

> > > > > > > Valorous - thus many kinds of wealth; 3rd is a house

> > usually

> > > is of

> > > > > > > MIXED nature indicating mixed/various/many results.

That is

> > > why the

> > > > > > > derivation 'Many kinds of wealth'. 2nd from 2nd - many

> > kinds

> > > of

> > > > > > > wealth - i think this is why you doubt that it could be

due

> > to

> > > > bhavat

> > > > > > > bhavam. 2 wives - i have no idea supply in this regard.

> > > > > > > > When in 4th: Lust

> > > > > > > No idea as of now.

> > > > > > > > When in 5th: Angry, loss of the 1st child

> > > > > > > If lagna lord is in 5th, any affliction to it can affect

> > both

> > > 5th

> > > > > > > house and lagna equally - making a double impact. That

is

> > why

> > > the

> > > > > > > prediction 'loss of child'. Why 1st child - 5th signify

1st

> > > child

> > > > > > > more i doubt. Possibly here Parasara deviates a bit from

> > the

> > > > > > > conventional prediction owing to the possibility

of 'double

> > > > impact' i

> > > > > > > think. The standard prediction should be (we will

verify)

> > > gain of

> > > > > > > child, as you mentioned. (But first the child should be

> > born

> > > for it

> > > > > > > to perish - this may make both the derivations

consistent)

> > > > > > > > When in 7th: Uninterested in worldly life and wife

> > > > > > > This applies only if lagna lord is a malefic. Therefore

it

> > is

> > > > > > > logically ok.

> > > > > > > > When in 12th: Good health

> > > > > > > No idea as of now.

> > > > > > > Love,

> > > > > > > Sreenadh

> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > , rk dash

> > > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Good start. I agree. First theoretical consideration

then

> > > we test

> > > > > > > the rules against actual charts. Here's a small

beginning

> > of

> > > the

> > > > > > > examination of lagna lord's bhavashraya phala in BHPH.

I'll

> > go

> > > > about

> > > > > > > it by first picking out those phala (results) which are

not

> > > self-

> > > > > > > evident. Here they are:

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > When in 1st

> > > > > > > > Uncertain in decision

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > When in 2nd

> > > > > > > > Many wives

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > When in 3rd

> > > > > > > > Many kinds of wealth (bhavat bhavam?), 2 wives

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > When in 4th

> > > > > > > > Lust

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > When in 5th

> > > > > > > > Angry, loss of the 1st child

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > When in 7th

> > > > > > > > Uninterested in worldly life and wife

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > When in 12th

> > > > > > > > Good health

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > These results are not easy to discern, given the first

> > > factor

> > > > > > > (the linkage of the the self to the department

represented

> > by

> > > the

> > > > > > > house the lagna lord tenants) and the sweeping good that

> > > lagna lord

> > > > > > > brings to the bhava it goes to. Take its placement in

5th.

> > > Why loss

> > > > > > > of child at all? Most other works declare, 'susuta',

> > meaning

> > > good

> > > > > > > progeny. I'll cite one such at a later stage for all

house

> > of

> > > > tenancy

> > > > > > > as far as 1st lord is concerned.

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > One more thing I'd like to think aloud about. Rule

says

> > > that any

> > > > > > > lord that goes to a dusthana will bring detriment to the

> > > house the

> > > > > > > planet is lord of. Now how do we reconcile the L1 in

12th

> > > ensuring

> > > > > > > good health? Will it take care of the attrition of body

> > (12th

> > > from

> > > > > > > 1st hse, ie body) without itself being subject to

> > detriment?

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > RK

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > > The primary derivations for Lagna lord in various

houses

> > as

> > > per

> > > > > > > BPHS is given below. I invite all to start a discussion

on

> > the

> > > > same.

> > > > > > > > =================================

> > > > > > > > As per BPHS, for Lagna lord in -

> > > > > > > > Lagna: healthy body, courageous, uncertain in

decisions,

> > 2

> > > wives

> > > > > > > > 2nd house: knowledgeable, good earnings, happiness,

good

> > > habits,

> > > > > > > righteous, many wives, good qualities.

> > > > > > > > 3rd house: valorous like a lion, all kinds of wealth,

2

> > > wives,

> > > > > > > intelligent.

> > > > > > > > 4th house: love and affection from healthy mother with

> > good

> > > > > > > longevity, many brothers/sisters, lust, beauty and good

> > > qualities.

> > > > > > > > 5th house: angry, moderate happiness from children,

loss

> > of

> > > first

> > > > > > > born (child), admired by government and authorities.

> > > > > > > > 6th house: (especially if aspected by malefics)

trouble

> > > from

> > > > > > > enemies, bad health.

> > > > > > > > 7th house: (especially if Lagna lord is a malefic) his

> > wife

> > > will

> > > > > > > die early (or married life will not go long), he will

> > become

> > > > > > > uninterested in worldly life and wife, will be detached

> > > towards his

> > > > > > > native land and wander/visit many places, It is possible

> > that

> > > he

> > > > > > > won't be much wealthy (he would be a poor man) or also

that

> > he

> > > > would

> > > > > > > be a very wealthy person like a king.

> > > > > > > > 8th house: master of some branch of knowledge,

troubled

> > by

> > > > > > > diseases, interested in others wives, will be

interested in

> > > all

> > > > kinds

> > > > > > > of games such as cards, chess, dice, lottery and so on,

> > very

> > > much

> > > > > > > angry.

> > > > > > > > 9th house: lucky, loved by the public, devotee of

Vishnu,

> > > > master of

> > > > > > > words and oratory, will have good wealth wife and

children.

> > > > > > > > 10th house: admired by government and people in power

> > (the

> > > native

> > > > > > > will have a good job), he would be a government servant,

> > very

> > > much

> > > > > > > popular.

> > > > > > > > 11th house: much income from many sources, good

> > popularity

> > > > > > > (popularity due to good deeds, celebrity), good

qualities,

> > > many

> > > > wives.

> > > > > > > > 12th house: good health, extravagant without reason,

> > angry

> > > > > > > (especially if not benefics are present in 12th and if

no

> > > benefic

> > > > > > > aspects 12th)

> > > > > > > > =================================

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > Love,

> > > > > > > > Sreenadh

> > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > , manju

> > > chawla

> > > > > > > <manjuch2001@> wrote:

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Thank You Sreenadhji

> > > > > > > > > we would learn this subject in this way.You are

really

> > > > helping us

> > > > > > > God bless you

> > > > > > > > > regards

> > > > > > > > > manju

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:

> > > > > > > > > Dear All,

> > > > > > > > > Let us start a new discussion on the subject " What

> > should

> > > be

> > > > > > > > > predicted for Lagna lord in Various houses? " - let

the

> > > > discussion

> > > > > > > go

> > > > > > > > > first and then comparison of it with actual results.

> > > > > > > > > Love,

> > > > > > > > > Sreenadh

> > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > " I am careful not to confuse excellence with

> > > > > > > perfection,Excellence-I can reach for,Perfection is

God's

> > > > business---

> > > > > > > Michael J.Fox

> > > > > > > > >

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September 16, 2007

SairamanDear Sir,yr msg is wounderful and new thought for food IE upachacha for every house if we go steps we canhave good idea if we consider our body as 12 houses we can see the armsthirde house hip the 6th house knee is 10th house and the y can add the food which highly projected from our body 12th house house of sleep and 3rd of the 10th extension of new job etc without foot hand knee we there is no use in life without eating we an befor few days but without sleep we cannot act for days andthe foot the 12th house is major extension like hand in our body without foot we cannot stnd in earth may be with cruches how far fast he can go with cruches i have seen people with 3,6,10th11th house strong are very powerful wealthy active improving even from the lower end in my office people joined astypist (not even steno) as raisen tothe cader of chif finance managers (just by a small dep.test) where we can see 10th 3rd 6th occupied by

planets more likely 3rd with a benefic 3rd house house ofefforts in right direction with positive spirit for self improvement may be occupied or aspected by benefics is reallygood more over it isthe 8th house of 8th ie giving lot of trouble so mans efforts can ahieve things in spite of hurdles FOR ANY PARIHARA CONSIDER THE 3RD HOUSE OF THE CONCERNED HOUSE AND PARIHARA RELATED TO THAT WILL GIVE GOOD RESULTS3RD HOUSE IS 11TH HOUSE OF 5TH HOUSE PRE EXISTING POORVAPUNYA (YR ELDER BROTHER BORN IN EARTH BEFORE YOU IE 11TH PRWE EXISTING) the most successful person is one habving powerful lagna connected to 3,6,10,113 effiorts 6 winning opponets 10 status and 11 the achievements extremet satisfactionThanking y for giving member for goodfood for thought Sairamansunil nair <astro_tellerkerala wrote: Hare rama krishna, dear lalit , The upachayas are 3,6,10,11 and 6 is both dustana and upachaya,Upachaya houses are supposed to be houses of free will u can execute in this life concerned with that bhava and also known as houses of growth .That is why generaly says planets in upachaya gives good results . Now let us take 2nd house and its upachaya houses. 4th house being 3rd from 2nd ( house of family or

kutumba where one born or even this place is to see kula devata according to prashna maaraga) ,7th house being 6th from 2nd house (house of marriage,partnership and even how we interact with out side world also madhana bhava and yatra bhava) ,and 11th house being 10th from 2nd house ( house of all kinf of gains and incomes ,frnds,and even our elder siblings) and the 12th house ( the house of expenditure and loses and even our house of bed room pleasures ) , Now if we apply logic we can see all this houses has a great say in accumulation of money which is one of the characteristics of 2nd house. waiting comments from all scholars and members. regrds sunil nair. om shreem mahalaxmai namah. --- In

, "litsol" <mishra.lalit wrote:>> I agree to this point to some extent, It's not always a good try to > understand one house on the basis of how far it is from some house, > there are only 12 houses, so each and every house comes n'th from > 1'st to 12'th from remaining houses.> > Better way of understanding the houses is trying to understand basic > charactersitic like if upchaya say 3rd house, why 3'rd is an upachaya > etc. and then learning trikonas like dharma trikona, Bhoga trikona > etc. > > regards,> Lalit.> > , rk dash > arkaydash@ wrote:> >> > Sreenadh,> > > > Yes, I think so. They probably are from the Meenaraj > Hora/Horapradeepam sources now that I get to see your PDF file.

> > > > What I meant when I said: "Examples will of course pour in. But > we have to > > see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration" is this. When > we take up example charts (and we haven't come to that as yet), we > have to be careful not to confuse any particular experience emanating > from other configurations/patterns and a bhavashraya phala of a house > lord. That is how we correctly validate the derivation in slokas. We > all know what drama the 'yogaja phala' can introduce in a chart. The > task is arduous; it requires rigours. I was doing some loud thinking > on the methodological rigours staring at us, in advance.> > > > I went thru your PDF file. Umm, I would say some of your logic > searches overshoot themselves. Take this one. The result of wealth >

with lagna lord in 4th house. You say, 4th is 3rd from 2nd, ie > upachaya from 2nd, which is how. Not very elegant as a rationale. The > reason, to my mind, is the wealth of siginfications the 4th hse > holds -- house, vehicle and what have you. Now, applying your well-> plucked Rule Four, which says lagna lord amplifies (the goodness of) > the house it goes to, the logic behind wealth is valid. > > > > I do like your Rule reminders. Commendable. > > > > Best,> > RK> > > > PS: I will take your hugs when we proceed on 'sustained topics' > in a more organised fashion...> > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > Dear RK ji,> > Thanks. The derivations given are good - and looks as if solely > > based on "Houses" alone.> > ==>> > Now, the rationale. Examples will of course pour in. But we have to

> > see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?> > <==> > Apart from houses, I don't think anything such as Planet/lords etc > > comes in to play in the derivations you provided. > > *Lord are of Signs; Houses does not have any lords - and so the > same > > is discarded. > > * Planets are not at all considered in house based derivation - and > > so the same is discarded.> > > > I ascertain, the derivations are solely based on houses, and so > > should be the logic behind. Yah, RK ji, you can proceed with > > explaining the logic behid each of those derivations... > > Love and Hugs,> > Sreenadh > > > > , rk dash > > <arkaydash@>

wrote:> > >> > > Shreenadh, > > > Here is the bhavashraya phala of L1 as found in the compedium. > > There is an 'result' for the 5th hse, but I 'll take time to make > out > > what is meant. > > > > > > In 1st house> > > Healthy, long-lived, king(ly), strong, gain of land> > > > > > 2nd hse> > > Wealthy, engaged in right action, head of the locality, life of > > plenty, corpulent> > > > > > 3rd hse> > > Has good friends, religiosity, generosity; brave, strong> > > > > > 4th hse> > > King's favourite, lives life to the full (could also mean 'very > > long-lived,' the expression being prachura-jivita), earns by right > > means, devoted to father, voracious > > > > > > 5th hse> > >

Good children, engaged in good deeds, has humility, known his for > > good qualities > > > > > > 6th hse> > > Healthy, strong, gain of land, miserly, rich, subdues enemies, on > > the side of good deeds> > > > > > 7th hse> > > Brilliant, good manners, cultured wife, spends himself fast > > during coitus, good-looking> > > > > > 8th hse> > > Miserly, unreliable in financial matters, very long-lived, harsh > > in speech if the planet is a malefic, large physique if a benefic> > > > > > 9th hse> > > Good people are his friends, good deeds, balanced (without > > extremes), cultured, known for his good deeds, brilliant> > > > > > 10th hse > > > Gains from ruler (state), learned, cultured, reverent towards > > guru and mother,

king, famous> > > > > > 11th hse > > > Long-lived, has progeny, spends himself fast during coitus, > > powerful> > > > > > 12th hse> > > Harsh speech, very sharp mind, goes abroad, a free loader > > > > > > > > > Now, the rationale. Examples will of couse pour in. But we have > > to see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?> > > > > > RK> > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > Dear RK ji,> > > ==>> > > I know of a compendium in vernacular which collates the best > (best > > as> > > the compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to be)> > > available, which goes into this aspect (lord

going to different > > houses)> > > <==> > > Can you provide the results derived/provided by that book > for "lagna> > > lord going to various houses"? That could be much beneficial to > our> > > current study - we will try to find the logic used behind those> > > derivations, and accept or reject each of those derivations; as > > usual> > > based on conditions such as -> > > * logical or not> > > * Real life experience supports the same or not> > > It doesn't matter whether the source mention or the Sanskrit > > original> > > is available or not - as long as the derivations are logical, and> > > reflect the actual experience. > > > > the 'material' looks very insightful stuff. > > > That is very good point - which itself I think indicate that it >

> could> > > be valuable material.> > > Love,> > > Sreenadh > > > > > > , rk dash> > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > >> > > > OK, Sree, that about sums up the scenario on one of the 7-fold> > > method. But the search, esp. for rishi hora source must be kept > on. > > I> > > know of a compedium in vernacular which collates the best (best > as > > the> > > compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to be)> > > available, which goes into this aspect (lord going to different> > > houses) but there is no source mention for the portion nor is > there> > > the Sanskrit original for it unlike most other portions in the> > > compendium. Nevertheless the 'material'

looks very insightful > stuff.> > > It is things like this that I had in mind. Let's see.> > > > > > > > Best,> > > > RK > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > ==>> > > > Now we have to agree on who next to Parasara we take on board > for> > > > comparison. You have named two: Meenaraja Hora, and Hora > > Pradeepam.> > > > Who else? We don't have to go by the overall reputation of the > > text.> > > > We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of > interpretation > > in> > > > question in a treatise that may not otherwise be rated very > high. > > What> > > > say? > > > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or

classics? > > > > <==> > > > This question is really difficult to answer. Apart from > > Parasara> > > > (for whom various versions of the slokas are available for the > > same in> > > > almost all instances) Meena Raja Hora discusses it. The > statements> > > > from Meena Raja Hora is mentioned with utmost importance in > Hora > > Ratna> > > > as well (at times they slightly variant versions of the slokas> > > > available in current printed verion of Meena raja hora). Hora> > > > pradeepam is a text quoted with reverance by the auther of Hora > > Sara > > > > (i.e. Nrisimha Daivanjna), a well known scholar of 17th > century. > > Thus -> > > > Meenaraja hora gets double importance since supported by Hora > > Ratna.> >

> > Hora Pradeepam gets double importance since supported by Hora > > Sara.> > > > > > > > Some other later day texts MIGHT have discussed the same at > times> > > > (though not extensively), but I am yet to make an elaborate > > search for> > > > the same in texts like Sarvartha Chintamani, Jataka Parijata,> > > > Saravali, Phaladeepika etc. One or two rudimentary slokas > related > > to> > > > the same we may find in these texts as well. Some slokas > relevant > > to> > > > the may find a place in many ancient Rishi horas (Whereever I > find> > > > such a reference I will quote them for sure). But for sure none > > of the> > > > other texts (except BPHS, Meenaraja hora, Hora Pradeepam) > > discusses> > > > this

subject extensively in detail as per my current knowledge > and> > > > understanding. As far as ancient texts (Rishi horas) are > > concerned it> > > > is possible that the slokas that discuss this subject > extensively > > are> > > > lost, even though they might have done the same (since they use > 7-> > fold> > > > method).> > > > Love,> > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Yes, you are homing in on the "pure" point. That's what this> > > > particular aspect of interpretation of a chart is about. That's > > the> > > > way (the part-way) to go about it -- core task, winkling the >

> secrets> > > > out of a chart. Now we have to agree on who next to Parasara we > > take> > > > on board for comparision. You have named two: Meenaraja Hora, > and > > Hora> > > > Pradeepam. Who else? We don't have to go by the overall > > reputation of> > > > the text. We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of> > > > interpretation in question in a treatise that may not otherwise > be> > > > rated very high. What say? > > > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or classics? > > > > > > > > > > Sotto Voce: I don't want us, you and me, to be cynosures of > (the> > > > galaxy of) our star-gazers in this firmament. Onlookers all? > > > > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > >

> > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > You are right - to the point. I agree. But as far as LL going > > to H-7> > > > > is concerned, the special point regarding ' if LL is a > malefic' > > is> > > > > mentioned in the sloka itself; there for we cannot discount > it > > as far> > > > > as the prediction related to the same given in the sloka is > > concerned.> > > > > For other results regarding LL in H-7 (which we would discuss > in> > > > > detail as this discussion progresses) I agree absolutely with > > your> > > > > logic and argument. > > > > > As far as LL in H-5 is concerned, I think there could be the > > point> > > > > I mentioned under consideration (for BPHS

results) even > though > > the> > > > > same is NOT mentioned in the sloka. But as you have clearly > > stated,> > > > > the normal expected result for the same SHOULD BE ''susuta' > > (good> > > > > child, or birth of children). Let us keep this doubt open > till > > we> > > > > cross verify the results with the derivations given in other > > texts and> > > > > come to a logical conclusion/derivation.> > > > > We always have 2 options open to cross check the results > > predicted> > > > > by BPHS in this context-> > > > > 1) Cross verify the results with the predictions given in > other> > > > > texts (especially Meenaraja Hora & Hora Pradeepam)> > > > > 2) Compare the predicted results with

actual results observed.> > > > > But still, the base rule as you pointed out is -> > > > > ==>> > > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is: L-1 > > goes > > > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly discounted. > > Clear?> > > > > <==> > > > > To state in other words, the base rule is -> > > > > "LL going to H-1, H-2, H-3 etc ONLY should be considered, and > > other> > > > > factors (such as LL being malefic/benefic, LL being aspected > by> > > > > malefic/benefic etc) should be clearly discounted"> > > > > We will even touch this base rule with corollaries, ONLY WHEN > > the> > > > > special condition is mentioned in the sloka itself; just not > to> > >

> > contaminate the result indicated by the sloka.> > > > > If this corollary is not there, I agree to your statement > > completely.> > > > > Love,> > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Sreenadh,> > > > > > I think we should keep out the factor of L1 being a natural> > > > > malefic -- the logic you have used for those outcomes of L-1 > > going to> > > > > 5th, 7th hse (death of first child, uninterested in life/wife > > etc). If> > > > > we must, then we have to qualify the deduction, saying "where > L-> > 5 (or> > > > > L-7) is a malefic or

is afflicted". > > > > > > > > > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is: L-1 > > goes> > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly discounted. > > Clear?> > > > > > > > > > > > Let's carry on,> > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > > Your concerns are right - important points mentioned. Let > us > > > > > > together try to find out the reasons based on our logic.> > > > > > > When in 1st : Uncertain in decision> > > > > > Lagna lord in lagna gives the native all the good qualities > > such as > > > > > >

compassion, kindness, softness of mind, emotional approach > > etc. > > > > > > Result? Uncertainty in decision. I think this account for > the> > > logical > > > > > > basis of the above derivation.> > > > > > > When in 2nd: Many wives> > > > > > That is just natural. 2nd and 11th house signify second > > marriage. > > > > > > When the lagna lord comes in contact with any house the > > native is > > > > > > sure to get the results related to that. Lagna lord in 2nd > > house > > > > > > makes the native beautiful, talkative, liked by women etc. > > Thus it > > > > > > turns out that it is natural to have many relations > (wives). > > It > > > > > > should be noted that for lagna lord in

lagna, and lagna > lord > > in 2nd > > > > > > house - 2 wives and many wives are derived - NOT as a bad> > > result, but > > > > > > as a good result; indicating that the native will have every> > > kind of > > > > > > luxury including women.> > > > > > > When in 3rd : Many kinds of wealth, 2 wives> > > > > > Valorous - thus many kinds of wealth; 3rd is a house > usually > > is of > > > > > > MIXED nature indicating mixed/various/many results. That is > > why the > > > > > > derivation 'Many kinds of wealth'. 2nd from 2nd - many > kinds > > of > > > > > > wealth - i think this is why you doubt that it could be due > to> > > bhavat > > > > > > bhavam. 2 wives - i

have no idea supply in this regard.> > > > > > > When in 4th: Lust> > > > > > No idea as of now.> > > > > > > When in 5th: Angry, loss of the 1st child > > > > > > If lagna lord is in 5th, any affliction to it can affect > both > > 5th > > > > > > house and lagna equally - making a double impact. That is > why > > the > > > > > > prediction 'loss of child'. Why 1st child - 5th signify 1st > > child > > > > > > more i doubt. Possibly here Parasara deviates a bit from > the > > > > > > conventional prediction owing to the possibility of 'double> > > impact' i > > > > > > think. The standard prediction should be (we will verify) > > gain of > > > > > > child, as you mentioned. (But

first the child should be > born > > for it > > > > > > to perish - this may make both the derivations consistent)> > > > > > > When in 7th: Uninterested in worldly life and wife > > > > > > This applies only if lagna lord is a malefic. Therefore it > is > > > > > > logically ok.> > > > > > > When in 12th: Good health> > > > > > No idea as of now.> > > > > > Love,> > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > , rk dash > > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Good start. I agree. First theoretical consideration then > > we test > > > > > > the

rules against actual charts. Here's a small beginning > of > > the > > > > > > examination of lagna lord's bhavashraya phala in BHPH. I'll > go> > > about > > > > > > it by first picking out those phala (results) which are not > > self-> > > > > > evident. Here they are:> > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 1st> > > > > > > Uncertain in decision> > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 2nd> > > > > > > Many wives> > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 3rd> > > > > > > Many kinds of wealth (bhavat bhavam?), 2 wives> > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 4th> > > > > > > Lust>

> > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 5th> > > > > > > Angry, loss of the 1st child > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 7th> > > > > > > Uninterested in worldly life and wife > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 12th> > > > > > > Good health> > > > > > > > > > > > > > These results are not easy to discern, given the first > > factor > > > > > > (the linkage of the the self to the department represented > by > > the > > > > > > house the lagna lord tenants) and the sweeping good that > > lagna lord > > > > > > brings to the bhava it goes to. Take its placement in 5th. > > Why loss > > > >

> > of child at all? Most other works declare, 'susuta', > meaning > > good > > > > > > progeny. I'll cite one such at a later stage for all house > of> > > tenancy > > > > > > as far as 1st lord is concerned. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One more thing I'd like to think aloud about. Rule says > > that any > > > > > > lord that goes to a dusthana will bring detriment to the > > house the > > > > > > planet is lord of. Now how do we reconcile the L1 in 12th > > ensuring > > > > > > good health? Will it take care of the attrition of body > (12th > > from > > > > > > 1st hse, ie body) without itself being subject to > detriment? > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> RK> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > Dear All,> > > > > > > The primary derivations for Lagna lord in various houses > as > > per > > > > > > BPHS is given below. I invite all to start a discussion on > the> > > same. > > > > > > > =================================> > > > > > > As per BPHS, for Lagna lord in -> > > > > > > Lagna: healthy body, courageous, uncertain in decisions, > 2 > > wives> > > > > > > 2nd house: knowledgeable, good earnings, happiness, good > > habits, > > > > > > righteous, many wives, good qualities.> > > > > > > 3rd house:

valorous like a lion, all kinds of wealth, 2 > > wives, > > > > > > intelligent.> > > > > > > 4th house: love and affection from healthy mother with > good > > > > > > longevity, many brothers/sisters, lust, beauty and good > > qualities.> > > > > > > 5th house: angry, moderate happiness from children, loss > of > > first > > > > > > born (child), admired by government and authorities. > > > > > > > 6th house: (especially if aspected by malefics) trouble > > from > > > > > > enemies, bad health.> > > > > > > 7th house: (especially if Lagna lord is a malefic) his > wife > > will > > > > > > die early (or married life will not go long), he will > become > > > > > >

uninterested in worldly life and wife, will be detached > > towards his > > > > > > native land and wander/visit many places, It is possible > that > > he > > > > > > won't be much wealthy (he would be a poor man) or also that > he> > > would > > > > > > be a very wealthy person like a king.> > > > > > > 8th house: master of some branch of knowledge, troubled > by > > > > > > diseases, interested in others wives, will be interested in > > all> > > kinds > > > > > > of games such as cards, chess, dice, lottery and so on, > very > > much > > > > > > angry.> > > > > > > 9th house: lucky, loved by the public, devotee of Vishnu,> > > master of > > > > > > words and

oratory, will have good wealth wife and children. > > > > > > > 10th house: admired by government and people in power > (the > > native > > > > > > will have a good job), he would be a government servant, > very > > much > > > > > > popular.> > > > > > > 11th house: much income from many sources, good > popularity > > > > > > (popularity due to good deeds, celebrity), good qualities, > > many> > > wives.> > > > > > > 12th house: good health, extravagant without reason, > angry > > > > > > (especially if not benefics are present in 12th and if no > > benefic > > > > > > aspects 12th) > > > > > > > =================================> > > > > > >

> > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > > > , manju > > chawla > > > > > > <manjuch2001@> wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Thank You Sreenadhji> > > > > > > > we would learn this subject in this way.You are really> > > helping us > > > > > > God bless you> > > > > > > > regards> > > > > > > > manju> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > > > > > > Dear All,> > > > > > > > Let us start a new discussion on the subject "What > should >

> be> > > > > > > > predicted for Lagna lord in Various houses?" - let the> > > discussion > > > > > > go> > > > > > > > first and then comparison of it with actual results.> > > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "I am careful not to confuse excellence with > > > > > > perfection,Excellence-I can reach for,Perfection is God's> > > business---> > > > > > Michael J.Fox> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

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September 16, 2007

Hare ramakrishna,

dear lalit .

very good question from a great man from rewa (kidding) .

12th need not indicate loses ,it may be expenses,like 12th house and 1st house.

so body(represented by 1st house) needed some expenditure(12th house ) for its growth and sustenance .

Think this way 4th is house of our mind where as 5th is creativity ,higher education may be upto degree level and also mantra place .so u can guess well now .

so if u r a painter its shows 5th house and it takes it s energy from 4th house of mind.(like a car uses petrol for its functioning)

But planets positioned in 5th may be some times prove bad in thier dasas for 4th house matters (mother ,vehicle ,land ).if other conditions also favrable.

i expect others like madhu ji and sree nadh ji and one and only sree ram sreenivas ji can illuminate us more into it.

I just put my observations

regrds sunil nair .

om shreem mahalaxmai namah.

, "litsol" <mishra.lalit wrote:>> Sunil Ji,> > I had doubts, i m trying to put forth like this - > > Can we apply this logic to 4'th and 5'th houses, 4'th being 12'th to > 5'th should denote some kind of loss to 5'th house, that i think is > not true.> > Same is relation between 3'rd and 11'th, 3'rd is 6'th from 11'th, > 3'rd might be complementary to 11'th but not the contrary.> > Like if one does efforts, he will have gains.> > regards,> Lalit.> > , "sunil nair" > astro_tellerkerala@ wrote:> >> > > > Hare rama krishna,> > > > dear lalit ,> > > > The upachayas are 3,6,10,11 and 6 is both dustana > and> > upachaya,Upachaya houses are supposed to be houses of free will u > can> > execute in this life concerned with that bhava and also known as > houses> > of growth .That is why generaly says planets in upachaya gives good> > results .> > > > Now let us take 2nd house and its upachaya houses.> > > > 4th house being 3rd from 2nd ( house of family or kutumba where > one> > born or even this place is to see kula devata according to prashna> > maaraga) ,7th house being 6th from 2nd house (house of> > marriage,partnership and even how we interact with out side world > also> > madhana bhava and yatra bhava) ,and 11th house being 10th from 2nd > house> > ( house of all kinf of gains and incomes ,frnds,and even our elder> > siblings) and the 12th house ( the house of expenditure and loses > and> > even our house of bed room pleasures ) ,> > > > Now if we apply logic we can see all this houses has a great say in> > accumulation of money which is one of the characteristics of 2nd > house.> > > > waiting comments from all scholars and members.> > > > regrds sunil nair.> > > > om shreem mahalaxmai namah.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > , "litsol"> > <mishra.lalit@> wrote:> > >> > > I agree to this point to some extent, It's not always a good try > to> > > understand one house on the basis of how far it is from some > house,> > > there are only 12 houses, so each and every house comes n'th from> > > 1'st to 12'th from remaining houses.> > >> > > Better way of understanding the houses is trying to understand > basic> > > charactersitic like if upchaya say 3rd house, why 3'rd is an > upachaya> > > etc. and then learning trikonas like dharma trikona, Bhoga trikona> > > etc.> > >> > > regards,> > > Lalit.> > >> > > , rk dash> > > arkaydash@ wrote:> > > >> > > > Sreenadh,> > > >> > > > Yes, I think so. They probably are from the Meenaraj> > > Hora/Horapradeepam sources now that I get to see your PDF file.> > > >> > > > What I meant when I said: "Examples will of course pour in. But> > > we have to> > > > see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a> > > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration" is this. > When> > > we take up example charts (and we haven't come to that as yet), we> > > have to be careful not to confuse any particular experience > emanating> > > from other configurations/patterns and a bhavashraya phala of a > house> > > lord. That is how we correctly validate the derivation in slokas. > We> > > all know what drama the 'yogaja phala' can introduce in a chart. > The> > > task is arduous; it requires rigours. I was doing some loud > thinking> > > on the methodological rigours staring at us, in advance.> > > >> > > > I went thru your PDF file. Umm, I would say some of your logic> > > searches overshoot themselves. Take this one. The result of wealth> > > with lagna lord in 4th house. You say, 4th is 3rd from 2nd, ie> > > upachaya from 2nd, which is how. Not very elegant as a rationale. > The> > > reason, to my mind, is the wealth of siginfications the 4th hse> > > holds -- house, vehicle and what have you. Now, applying your > well-> > > plucked Rule Four, which says lagna lord amplifies (the goodness > of)> > > the house it goes to, the logic behind wealth is valid.> > > >> > > > I do like your Rule reminders. Commendable.> > > >> > > > Best,> > > > RK> > > >> > > > PS: I will take your hugs when we proceed on 'sustained topics'> > > in a more organised fashion...> > > >> > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > Thanks. The derivations given are good - and looks as if solely> > > > based on "Houses" alone.> > > > ==>> > > > Now, the rationale. Examples will of course pour in. But we > have to> > > > see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a> > > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?> > > > <==> > > > Apart from houses, I don't think anything such as Planet/lords > etc> > > > comes in to play in the derivations you provided.> > > > *Lord are of Signs; Houses does not have any lords - and so the> > > same> > > > is discarded.> > > > * Planets are not at all considered in house based derivation - > and> > > > so the same is discarded.> > > >> > > > I ascertain, the derivations are solely based on houses, and so> > > > should be the logic behind. Yah, RK ji, you can proceed with> > > > explaining the logic behid each of those derivations... > > > > Love and Hugs,> > > > Sreenadh> > > >> > > > , rk dash> > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Shreenadh,> > > > > Here is the bhavashraya phala of L1 as found in the compedium.> > > > There is an 'result' for the 5th hse, but I 'll take time to > make> > > out> > > > what is meant.> > > > >> > > > > In 1st house> > > > > Healthy, long-lived, king(ly), strong, gain of land> > > > >> > > > > 2nd hse> > > > > Wealthy, engaged in right action, head of the locality, life > of> > > > plenty, corpulent> > > > >> > > > > 3rd hse> > > > > Has good friends, religiosity, generosity; brave, strong> > > > >> > > > > 4th hse> > > > > King's favourite, lives life to the full (could also > mean 'very> > > > long-lived,' the expression being prachura-jivita), earns by > right> > > > means, devoted to father, voracious> > > > >> > > > > 5th hse> > > > > Good children, engaged in good deeds, has humility, known his > for> > > > good qualities> > > > >> > > > > 6th hse> > > > > Healthy, strong, gain of land, miserly, rich, subdues > enemies, on> > > > the side of good deeds> > > > >> > > > > 7th hse> > > > > Brilliant, good manners, cultured wife, spends himself fast> > > > during coitus, good-looking> > > > >> > > > > 8th hse> > > > > Miserly, unreliable in financial matters, very long-lived, > harsh> > > > in speech if the planet is a malefic, large physique if a > benefic> > > > >> > > > > 9th hse> > > > > Good people are his friends, good deeds, balanced (without> > > > extremes), cultured, known for his good deeds, brilliant> > > > >> > > > > 10th hse> > > > > Gains from ruler (state), learned, cultured, reverent towards> > > > guru and mother, king, famous> > > > >> > > > > 11th hse> > > > > Long-lived, has progeny, spends himself fast during coitus,> > > > powerful> > > > >> > > > > 12th hse> > > > > Harsh speech, very sharp mind, goes abroad, a free loader> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > Now, the rationale. Examples will of couse pour in. But we > have> > > > to see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a> > > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?> > > > >> > > > > RK> > > > >> > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > ==>> > > > > I know of a compendium in vernacular which collates the best> > > (best> > > > as> > > > > the compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to > be)> > > > > available, which goes into this aspect (lord going to > different> > > > houses)> > > > > <==> > > > > Can you provide the results derived/provided by that book> > > for "lagna> > > > > lord going to various houses"? That could be much beneficial > to> > > our> > > > > current study - we will try to find the logic used behind > those> > > > > derivations, and accept or reject each of those derivations; > as> > > > usual> > > > > based on conditions such as -> > > > > * logical or not> > > > > * Real life experience supports the same or not> > > > > It doesn't matter whether the source mention or the Sanskrit> > > > original> > > > > is available or not - as long as the derivations are logical, > and> > > > > reflect the actual experience.> > > > > > the 'material' looks very insightful stuff.> > > > > That is very good point - which itself I think indicate that > it> > > > could> > > > > be valuable material.> > > > > Love,> > > > > Sreenadh> > > > >> > > > > , rk dash> > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > OK, Sree, that about sums up the scenario on one of the 7-> fold> > > > > method. But the search, esp. for rishi hora source must be > kept> > > on.> > > > I> > > > > know of a compedium in vernacular which collates the best > (best> > > as> > > > the> > > > > compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to be)> > > > > available, which goes into this aspect (lord going to > different> > > > > houses) but there is no source mention for the portion nor is> > > there> > > > > the Sanskrit original for it unlike most other portions in the> > > > > compendium. Nevertheless the 'material' looks very insightful> > > stuff.> > > > > It is things like this that I had in mind. Let's see.> > > > > >> > > > > > Best,> > > > > > RK> > > > > >> > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > > ==>> > > > > > Now we have to agree on who next to Parasara we take on > board> > > for> > > > > > comparison. You have named two: Meenaraja Hora, and Hora> > > > Pradeepam.> > > > > > Who else? We don't have to go by the overall reputation of > the> > > > text.> > > > > > We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of> > > interpretation> > > > in> > > > > > question in a treatise that may not otherwise be rated very> > > high.> > > > What> > > > > > say?> > > > > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or > classics?> > > > > > <==> > > > > > This question is really difficult to answer. Apart from> > > > Parasara> > > > > > (for whom various versions of the slokas are available for > the> > > > same in> > > > > > almost all instances) Meena Raja Hora discusses it. The> > > statements> > > > > > from Meena Raja Hora is mentioned with utmost importance in> > > Hora> > > > Ratna> > > > > > as well (at times they slightly variant versions of the > slokas> > > > > > available in current printed verion of Meena raja hora). > Hora> > > > > > pradeepam is a text quoted with reverance by the auther of > Hora> > > > Sara> > > > > > (i.e. Nrisimha Daivanjna), a well known scholar of 17th> > > century.> > > > Thus -> > > > > > Meenaraja hora gets double importance since supported by > Hora> > > > Ratna.> > > > > > Hora Pradeepam gets double importance since supported by > Hora> > > > Sara.> > > > > >> > > > > > Some other later day texts MIGHT have discussed the same at> > > times> > > > > > (though not extensively), but I am yet to make an elaborate> > > > search for> > > > > > the same in texts like Sarvartha Chintamani, Jataka > Parijata,> > > > > > Saravali, Phaladeepika etc. One or two rudimentary slokas> > > related> > > > to> > > > > > the same we may find in these texts as well. Some slokas> > > relevant> > > > to> > > > > > the may find a place in many ancient Rishi horas (Whereever > I> > > find> > > > > > such a reference I will quote them for sure). But for sure > none> > > > of the> > > > > > other texts (except BPHS, Meenaraja hora, Hora Pradeepam)> > > > discusses> > > > > > this subject extensively in detail as per my current > knowledge> > > and> > > > > > understanding. As far as ancient texts (Rishi horas) are> > > > concerned it> > > > > > is possible that the slokas that discuss this subject> > > extensively> > > > are> > > > > > lost, even though they might have done the same (since they > use> > > 7-> > > > fold> > > > > > method).> > > > > > Love,> > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > >> > > > > > , rk dash> > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Yes, you are homing in on the "pure" point. That's what > this> > > > > > particular aspect of interpretation of a chart is about. > That's> > > > the> > > > > > way (the part-way) to go about it -- core task, winkling the> > > > secrets> > > > > > out of a chart. Now we have to agree on who next to > Parasara we> > > > take> > > > > > on board for comparision. You have named two: Meenaraja > Hora,> > > and> > > > Hora> > > > > > Pradeepam. Who else? We don't have to go by the overall> > > > reputation of> > > > > > the text. We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of> > > > > > interpretation in question in a treatise that may not > otherwise> > > be> > > > > > rated very high. What say?> > > > > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or > classics?> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Sotto Voce: I don't want us, you and me, to be cynosures > of> > > (the> > > > > > galaxy of) our star-gazers in this firmament. Onlookers all?> > > > > > >> > > > > > > RK> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > > > You are right - to the point. I agree. But as far as LL > going> > > > to H-7> > > > > > > is concerned, the special point regarding ' if LL is a> > > malefic'> > > > is> > > > > > > mentioned in the sloka itself; there for we cannot > discount> > > it> > > > as far> > > > > > > as the prediction related to the same given in the sloka > is> > > > concerned.> > > > > > > For other results regarding LL in H-7 (which we would > discuss> > > in> > > > > > > detail as this discussion progresses) I agree absolutely > with> > > > your> > > > > > > logic and argument.> > > > > > > As far as LL in H-5 is concerned, I think there could be > the> > > > point> > > > > > > I mentioned under consideration (for BPHS results) even> > > though> > > > the> > > > > > > same is NOT mentioned in the sloka. But as you have > clearly> > > > stated,> > > > > > > the normal expected result for the same SHOULD > BE ''susuta'> > > > (good> > > > > > > child, or birth of children). Let us keep this doubt open> > > till> > > > we> > > > > > > cross verify the results with the derivations given in > other> > > > texts and> > > > > > > come to a logical conclusion/derivation.> > > > > > > We always have 2 options open to cross check the results> > > > predicted> > > > > > > by BPHS in this context-> > > > > > > 1) Cross verify the results with the predictions given in> > > other> > > > > > > texts (especially Meenaraja Hora & Hora Pradeepam)> > > > > > > 2) Compare the predicted results with actual results > observed.> > > > > > > But still, the base rule as you pointed out is -> > > > > > > ==>> > > > > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is: > L-1> > > > goes> > > > > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly > discounted.> > > > Clear?> > > > > > > <==> > > > > > > To state in other words, the base rule is -> > > > > > > "LL going to H-1, H-2, H-3 etc ONLY should be considered, > and> > > > other> > > > > > > factors (such as LL being malefic/benefic, LL being > aspected> > > by> > > > > > > malefic/benefic etc) should be clearly discounted"> > > > > > > We will even touch this base rule with corollaries, ONLY > WHEN> > > > the> > > > > > > special condition is mentioned in the sloka itself; just > not> > > to> > > > > > > contaminate the result indicated by the sloka.> > > > > > > If this corollary is not there, I agree to your statement> > > > completely.> > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > >> > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Sreenadh,> > > > > > > > I think we should keep out the factor of L1 being a > natural> > > > > > > malefic -- the logic you have used for those outcomes of > L-1> > > > going to> > > > > > > 5th, 7th hse (death of first child, uninterested in > life/wife> > > > etc). If> > > > > > > we must, then we have to qualify the deduction, > saying "where> > > L-> > > > 5 (or> > > > > > > L-7) is a malefic or is afflicted".> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is: > L-1> > > > goes> > > > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly > discounted.> > > > Clear?> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Let's carry on,> > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > > > > Your concerns are right - important points mentioned. > Let> > > us> > > > > > > > together try to find out the reasons based on our logic.> > > > > > > > > When in 1st : Uncertain in decision> > > > > > > > Lagna lord in lagna gives the native all the good > qualities> > > > such as> > > > > > > > compassion, kindness, softness of mind, emotional > approach> > > > etc.> > > > > > > > Result? Uncertainty in decision. I think this account > for> > > the> > > > > logical> > > > > > > > basis of the above derivation.> > > > > > > > > When in 2nd: Many wives> > > > > > > > That is just natural. 2nd and 11th house signify second> > > > marriage.> > > > > > > > When the lagna lord comes in contact with any house the> > > > native is> > > > > > > > sure to get the results related to that. Lagna lord in > 2nd> > > > house> > > > > > > > makes the native beautiful, talkative, liked by women > etc.> > > > Thus it> > > > > > > > turns out that it is natural to have many relations> > > (wives).> > > > It> > > > > > > > should be noted that for lagna lord in lagna, and lagna> > > lord> > > > in 2nd> > > > > > > > house - 2 wives and many wives are derived - NOT as a > bad> > > > > result, but> > > > > > > > as a good result; indicating that the native will have > every> > > > > kind of> > > > > > > > luxury including women.> > > > > > > > > When in 3rd : Many kinds of wealth, 2 wives> > > > > > > > Valorous - thus many kinds of wealth; 3rd is a house> > > usually> > > > is of> > > > > > > > MIXED nature indicating mixed/various/many results. > That is> > > > why the> > > > > > > > derivation 'Many kinds of wealth'. 2nd from 2nd - many> > > kinds> > > > of> > > > > > > > wealth - i think this is why you doubt that it could be > due> > > to> > > > > bhavat> > > > > > > > bhavam. 2 wives - i have no idea supply in this regard.> > > > > > > > > When in 4th: Lust> > > > > > > > No idea as of now.> > > > > > > > > When in 5th: Angry, loss of the 1st child> > > > > > > > If lagna lord is in 5th, any affliction to it can affect> > > both> > > > 5th> > > > > > > > house and lagna equally - making a double impact. That > is> > > why> > > > the> > > > > > > > prediction 'loss of child'. Why 1st child - 5th signify > 1st> > > > child> > > > > > > > more i doubt. Possibly here Parasara deviates a bit from> > > the> > > > > > > > conventional prediction owing to the possibility > of 'double> > > > > impact' i> > > > > > > > think. The standard prediction should be (we will > verify)> > > > gain of> > > > > > > > child, as you mentioned. (But first the child should be> > > born> > > > for it> > > > > > > > to perish - this may make both the derivations > consistent)> > > > > > > > > When in 7th: Uninterested in worldly life and wife> > > > > > > > This applies only if lagna lord is a malefic. Therefore > it> > > is> > > > > > > > logically ok.> > > > > > > > > When in 12th: Good health> > > > > > > > No idea as of now.> > > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Good start. I agree. First theoretical consideration > then> > > > we test> > > > > > > > the rules against actual charts. Here's a small > beginning> > > of> > > > the> > > > > > > > examination of lagna lord's bhavashraya phala in BHPH. > I'll> > > go> > > > > about> > > > > > > > it by first picking out those phala (results) which are > not> > > > self-> > > > > > > > evident. Here they are:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > When in 1st> > > > > > > > > Uncertain in decision> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > When in 2nd> > > > > > > > > Many wives> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > When in 3rd> > > > > > > > > Many kinds of wealth (bhavat bhavam?), 2 wives> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > When in 4th> > > > > > > > > Lust> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > When in 5th> > > > > > > > > Angry, loss of the 1st child> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > When in 7th> > > > > > > > > Uninterested in worldly life and wife> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > When in 12th> > > > > > > > > Good health> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > These results are not easy to discern, given the first> > > > factor> > > > > > > > (the linkage of the the self to the department > represented> > > by> > > > the> > > > > > > > house the lagna lord tenants) and the sweeping good that> > > > lagna lord> > > > > > > > brings to the bhava it goes to. Take its placement in > 5th.> > > > Why loss> > > > > > > > of child at all? Most other works declare, 'susuta',> > > meaning> > > > good> > > > > > > > progeny. I'll cite one such at a later stage for all > house> > > of> > > > > tenancy> > > > > > > > as far as 1st lord is concerned.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > One more thing I'd like to think aloud about. Rule > says> > > > that any> > > > > > > > lord that goes to a dusthana will bring detriment to the> > > > house the> > > > > > > > planet is lord of. Now how do we reconcile the L1 in > 12th> > > > ensuring> > > > > > > > good health? Will it take care of the attrition of body> > > (12th> > > > from> > > > > > > > 1st hse, ie body) without itself being subject to> > > detriment?> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > Dear All,> > > > > > > > > The primary derivations for Lagna lord in various > houses> > > as> > > > per> > > > > > > > BPHS is given below. I invite all to start a discussion > on> > > the> > > > > same.> > > > > > > > > =================================> > > > > > > > > As per BPHS, for Lagna lord in -> > > > > > > > > Lagna: healthy body, courageous, uncertain in > decisions,> > > 2> > > > wives> > > > > > > > > 2nd house: knowledgeable, good earnings, happiness, > good> > > > habits,> > > > > > > > righteous, many wives, good qualities.> > > > > > > > > 3rd house: valorous like a lion, all kinds of wealth, > 2> > > > wives,> > > > > > > > intelligent.> > > > > > > > > 4th house: love and affection from healthy mother with> > > good> > > > > > > > longevity, many brothers/sisters, lust, beauty and good> > > > qualities.> > > > > > > > > 5th house: angry, moderate happiness from children, > loss> > > of> > > > first> > > > > > > > born (child), admired by government and authorities.> > > > > > > > > 6th house: (especially if aspected by malefics) > trouble> > > > from> > > > > > > > enemies, bad health.> > > > > > > > > 7th house: (especially if Lagna lord is a malefic) his> > > wife> > > > will> > > > > > > > die early (or married life will not go long), he will> > > become> > > > > > > > uninterested in worldly life and wife, will be detached> > > > towards his> > > > > > > > native land and wander/visit many places, It is possible> > > that> > > > he> > > > > > > > won't be much wealthy (he would be a poor man) or also > that> > > he> > > > > would> > > > > > > > be a very wealthy person like a king.> > > > > > > > > 8th house: master of some branch of knowledge, > troubled> > > by> > > > > > > > diseases, interested in others wives, will be > interested in> > > > all> > > > > kinds> > > > > > > > of games such as cards, chess, dice, lottery and so on,> > > very> > > > much> > > > > > > > angry.> > > > > > > > > 9th house: lucky, loved by the public, devotee of > Vishnu,> > > > > master of> > > > > > > > words and oratory, will have good wealth wife and > children.> > > > > > > > > 10th house: admired by government and people in power> > > (the> > > > native> > > > > > > > will have a good job), he would be a government servant,> > > very> > > > much> > > > > > > > popular.> > > > > > > > > 11th house: much income from many sources, good> > > popularity> > > > > > > > (popularity due to good deeds, celebrity), good > qualities,> > > > many> > > > > wives.> > > > > > > > > 12th house: good health, extravagant without reason,> > > angry> > > > > > > > (especially if not benefics are present in 12th and if > no> > > > benefic> > > > > > > > aspects 12th)> > > > > > > > > =================================> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > , manju> > > > chawla> > > > > > > > <manjuch2001@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Thank You Sreenadhji> > > > > > > > > > we would learn this subject in this way.You are > really> > > > > helping us> > > > > > > > God bless you> > > > > > > > > > regards> > > > > > > > > > manju> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > > > > > > > > Dear All,> > > > > > > > > > Let us start a new discussion on the subject "What> > > should> > > > be> > > > > > > > > > predicted for Lagna lord in Various houses?" - let > the> > > > > discussion> > > > > > > > go> > > > > > > > > > first and then comparison of it with actual results.> > > > > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > "I am careful not to confuse excellence with> > > > > > > > perfection,Excellence-I can reach for,Perfection is > God's> > > > > business---> > > > > > > > Michael J.Fox> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ready for the edge of your seat? 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September 16, 2007

Hare rama krishna,

respected sai ram ji.

Very good post with observations and experiences .

Thanks for ur inputs and pls be tuned with us and guide us .

regrds sunil nair

om shreem mahalaxmai namah.

, sairam nat <sairaman53 wrote:>> Sairaman> > Dear Sir,> > yr msg is wounderful and new thought for food IE upachacha for every house if we go steps we canhave good idea > > if we consider our body as 12 houses we can see the armsthirde house hip the 6th house knee is 10th house and the y can add the food which highly projected from our body 12th house house of sleep and 3rd of the 10th extension of new job etc without foot hand knee we there is no use in life > > without eating we an befor few days but without sleep we cannot act for days andthe foot the 12th house is major extension like hand in our body without foot we cannot stnd in earth may be with cruches how far fast he can go with cruches > > i have seen people with 3,6,10th11th house strong are very powerful wealthy active improving even from the lower end in my office people joined astypist (not even steno) as raisen tothe cader of chif finance managers (just by a small dep.test) where we can see 10th 3rd 6th occupied by planets more likely 3rd with a benefic 3rd house house ofefforts in right direction with positive spirit for self improvement may be occupied or aspected by benefics is reallygood > > more over it isthe 8th house of 8th ie giving lot of trouble so mans efforts can ahieve things in spite of hurdles > > FOR ANY PARIHARA CONSIDER THE 3RD HOUSE OF THE CONCERNED HOUSE AND PARIHARA RELATED TO THAT WILL GIVE GOOD RESULTS> > 3RD HOUSE IS 11TH HOUSE OF 5TH HOUSE PRE EXISTING POORVAPUNYA (YR ELDER BROTHER BORN IN EARTH BEFORE YOU IE 11TH PRWE EXISTING) > > the most successful person is one habving powerful lagna connected to 3,6,10,11> 3 effiorts 6 winning opponets 10 status and 11 the achievements extremet satisfaction> > Thanking y for giving member for goodfood for thought > > > > Sairaman> > sunil nair astro_tellerkerala wrote: > Hare rama krishna,> dear lalit ,> The upachayas are 3,6,10,11 and 6 is both dustana and upachaya,Upachaya houses are supposed to be houses of free will u can execute in this life concerned with that bhava and also known as houses of growth .That is why generaly says planets in upachaya gives good results .> Now let us take 2nd house and its upachaya houses.> 4th house being 3rd from 2nd ( house of family or kutumba where one born or even this place is to see kula devata according to prashna maaraga) ,7th house being 6th from 2nd house (house of marriage,partnership and even how we interact with out side world also madhana bhava and yatra bhava) ,and 11th house being 10th from 2nd house ( house of all kinf of gains and incomes ,frnds,and even our elder siblings) and the 12th house ( the house of expenditure and loses and even our house of bed room pleasures ) ,> Now if we apply logic we can see all this houses has a great say in accumulation of money which is one of the characteristics of 2nd house.> waiting comments from all scholars and members.> regrds sunil nair.> om shreem mahalaxmai namah.> > > > , "litsol" mishra.lalit@ wrote:> >> > I agree to this point to some extent, It's not always a good try to > > understand one house on the basis of how far it is from some house, > > there are only 12 houses, so each and every house comes n'th from > > 1'st to 12'th from remaining houses.> > > > Better way of understanding the houses is trying to understand basic > > charactersitic like if upchaya say 3rd house, why 3'rd is an upachaya > > etc. and then learning trikonas like dharma trikona, Bhoga trikona > > etc. > > > > regards,> > Lalit.> > > > , rk dash > > arkaydash@ wrote:> > >> > > Sreenadh,> > > > > > Yes, I think so. They probably are from the Meenaraj > > Hora/Horapradeepam sources now that I get to see your PDF file. > > > > > > What I meant when I said: "Examples will of course pour in. But > > we have to > > > see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration" is this. When > > we take up example charts (and we haven't come to that as yet), we > > have to be careful not to confuse any particular experience emanating > > from other configurations/patterns and a bhavashraya phala of a house > > lord. That is how we correctly validate the derivation in slokas. We > > all know what drama the 'yogaja phala' can introduce in a chart. The > > task is arduous; it requires rigours. I was doing some loud thinking > > on the methodological rigours staring at us, in advance.> > > > > > I went thru your PDF file. Umm, I would say some of your logic > > searches overshoot themselves. Take this one. The result of wealth > > with lagna lord in 4th house. You say, 4th is 3rd from 2nd, ie > > upachaya from 2nd, which is how. Not very elegant as a rationale. The > > reason, to my mind, is the wealth of siginfications the 4th hse > > holds -- house, vehicle and what have you. Now, applying your well-> > plucked Rule Four, which says lagna lord amplifies (the goodness of) > > the house it goes to, the logic behind wealth is valid. > > > > > > I do like your Rule reminders. Commendable. > > > > > > Best,> > > RK> > > > > > PS: I will take your hugs when we proceed on 'sustained topics' > > in a more organised fashion...> > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > Dear RK ji,> > > Thanks. The derivations given are good - and looks as if solely > > > based on "Houses" alone.> > > ==>> > > Now, the rationale. Examples will of course pour in. But we have to > > > see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?> > > <==> > > Apart from houses, I don't think anything such as Planet/lords etc > > > comes in to play in the derivations you provided. > > > *Lord are of Signs; Houses does not have any lords - and so the > > same > > > is discarded. > > > * Planets are not at all considered in house based derivation - and > > > so the same is discarded.> > > > > > I ascertain, the derivations are solely based on houses, and so > > > should be the logic behind. Yah, RK ji, you can proceed with > > > explaining the logic behid each of those derivations... > > > Love and Hugs,> > > Sreenadh > > > > > > , rk dash > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > >> > > > Shreenadh, > > > > Here is the bhavashraya phala of L1 as found in the compedium. > > > There is an 'result' for the 5th hse, but I 'll take time to make > > out > > > what is meant. > > > > > > > > In 1st house> > > > Healthy, long-lived, king(ly), strong, gain of land> > > > > > > > 2nd hse> > > > Wealthy, engaged in right action, head of the locality, life of > > > plenty, corpulent> > > > > > > > 3rd hse> > > > Has good friends, religiosity, generosity; brave, strong> > > > > > > > 4th hse> > > > King's favourite, lives life to the full (could also mean 'very > > > long-lived,' the expression being prachura-jivita), earns by right > > > means, devoted to father, voracious > > > > > > > > 5th hse> > > > Good children, engaged in good deeds, has humility, known his for > > > good qualities > > > > > > > > 6th hse> > > > Healthy, strong, gain of land, miserly, rich, subdues enemies, on > > > the side of good deeds> > > > > > > > 7th hse> > > > Brilliant, good manners, cultured wife, spends himself fast > > > during coitus, good-looking> > > > > > > > 8th hse> > > > Miserly, unreliable in financial matters, very long-lived, harsh > > > in speech if the planet is a malefic, large physique if a benefic> > > > > > > > 9th hse> > > > Good people are his friends, good deeds, balanced (without > > > extremes), cultured, known for his good deeds, brilliant> > > > > > > > 10th hse > > > > Gains from ruler (state), learned, cultured, reverent towards > > > guru and mother, king, famous> > > > > > > > 11th hse > > > > Long-lived, has progeny, spends himself fast during coitus, > > > powerful> > > > > > > > 12th hse> > > > Harsh speech, very sharp mind, goes abroad, a free loader > > > > > > > > > > > > Now, the rationale. Examples will of couse pour in. But we have > > > to see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?> > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > ==>> > > > I know of a compendium in vernacular which collates the best > > (best > > > as> > > > the compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to be)> > > > available, which goes into this aspect (lord going to different > > > houses)> > > > <==> > > > Can you provide the results derived/provided by that book > > for "lagna> > > > lord going to various houses"? That could be much beneficial to > > our> > > > current study - we will try to find the logic used behind those> > > > derivations, and accept or reject each of those derivations; as > > > usual> > > > based on conditions such as -> > > > * logical or not> > > > * Real life experience supports the same or not> > > > It doesn't matter whether the source mention or the Sanskrit > > > original> > > > is available or not - as long as the derivations are logical, and> > > > reflect the actual experience. > > > > > the 'material' looks very insightful stuff. > > > > That is very good point - which itself I think indicate that it > > > could> > > > be valuable material.> > > > Love,> > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > OK, Sree, that about sums up the scenario on one of the 7-fold> > > > method. But the search, esp. for rishi hora source must be kept > > on. > > > I> > > > know of a compedium in vernacular which collates the best (best > > as > > > the> > > > compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to be)> > > > available, which goes into this aspect (lord going to different> > > > houses) but there is no source mention for the portion nor is > > there> > > > the Sanskrit original for it unlike most other portions in the> > > > compendium. Nevertheless the 'material' looks very insightful > > stuff.> > > > It is things like this that I had in mind. Let's see.> > > > > > > > > > Best,> > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > ==>> > > > > Now we have to agree on who next to Parasara we take on board > > for> > > > > comparison. You have named two: Meenaraja Hora, and Hora > > > Pradeepam.> > > > > Who else? We don't have to go by the overall reputation of the > > > text.> > > > > We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of > > interpretation > > > in> > > > > question in a treatise that may not otherwise be rated very > > high. > > > What> > > > > say? > > > > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or classics? > > > > > <==> > > > > This question is really difficult to answer. Apart from > > > Parasara> > > > > (for whom various versions of the slokas are available for the > > > same in> > > > > almost all instances) Meena Raja Hora discusses it. The > > statements> > > > > from Meena Raja Hora is mentioned with utmost importance in > > Hora > > > Ratna> > > > > as well (at times they slightly variant versions of the slokas> > > > > available in current printed verion of Meena raja hora). Hora> > > > > pradeepam is a text quoted with reverance by the auther of Hora > > > Sara > > > > > (i.e. Nrisimha Daivanjna), a well known scholar of 17th > > century. > > > Thus -> > > > > Meenaraja hora gets double importance since supported by Hora > > > Ratna.> > > > > Hora Pradeepam gets double importance since supported by Hora > > > Sara.> > > > > > > > > > Some other later day texts MIGHT have discussed the same at > > times> > > > > (though not extensively), but I am yet to make an elaborate > > > search for> > > > > the same in texts like Sarvartha Chintamani, Jataka Parijata,> > > > > Saravali, Phaladeepika etc. One or two rudimentary slokas > > related > > > to> > > > > the same we may find in these texts as well. Some slokas > > relevant > > > to> > > > > the may find a place in many ancient Rishi horas (Whereever I > > find> > > > > such a reference I will quote them for sure). But for sure none > > > of the> > > > > other texts (except BPHS, Meenaraja hora, Hora Pradeepam) > > > discusses> > > > > this subject extensively in detail as per my current knowledge > > and> > > > > understanding. As far as ancient texts (Rishi horas) are > > > concerned it> > > > > is possible that the slokas that discuss this subject > > extensively > > > are> > > > > lost, even though they might have done the same (since they use > > 7-> > > fold> > > > > method).> > > > > Love,> > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Yes, you are homing in on the "pure" point. That's what this> > > > > particular aspect of interpretation of a chart is about. That's > > > the> > > > > way (the part-way) to go about it -- core task, winkling the > > > secrets> > > > > out of a chart. Now we have to agree on who next to Parasara we > > > take> > > > > on board for comparision. You have named two: Meenaraja Hora, > > and > > > Hora> > > > > Pradeepam. Who else? We don't have to go by the overall > > > reputation of> > > > > the text. We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of> > > > > interpretation in question in a treatise that may not otherwise > > be> > > > > rated very high. What say? > > > > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or classics? > > > > > > > > > > > > Sotto Voce: I don't want us, you and me, to be cynosures of > > (the> > > > > galaxy of) our star-gazers in this firmament. Onlookers all? > > > > > > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > > You are right - to the point. I agree. But as far as LL going > > > to H-7> > > > > > is concerned, the special point regarding ' if LL is a > > malefic' > > > is> > > > > > mentioned in the sloka itself; there for we cannot discount > > it > > > as far> > > > > > as the prediction related to the same given in the sloka is > > > concerned.> > > > > > For other results regarding LL in H-7 (which we would discuss > > in> > > > > > detail as this discussion progresses) I agree absolutely with > > > your> > > > > > logic and argument. > > > > > > As far as LL in H-5 is concerned, I think there could be the > > > point> > > > > > I mentioned under consideration (for BPHS results) even > > though > > > the> > > > > > same is NOT mentioned in the sloka. But as you have clearly > > > stated,> > > > > > the normal expected result for the same SHOULD BE ''susuta' > > > (good> > > > > > child, or birth of children). Let us keep this doubt open > > till > > > we> > > > > > cross verify the results with the derivations given in other > > > texts and> > > > > > come to a logical conclusion/derivation.> > > > > > We always have 2 options open to cross check the results > > > predicted> > > > > > by BPHS in this context-> > > > > > 1) Cross verify the results with the predictions given in > > other> > > > > > texts (especially Meenaraja Hora & Hora Pradeepam)> > > > > > 2) Compare the predicted results with actual results observed.> > > > > > But still, the base rule as you pointed out is -> > > > > > ==>> > > > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is: L-1 > > > goes > > > > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly discounted. > > > Clear?> > > > > > <==> > > > > > To state in other words, the base rule is -> > > > > > "LL going to H-1, H-2, H-3 etc ONLY should be considered, and > > > other> > > > > > factors (such as LL being malefic/benefic, LL being aspected > > by> > > > > > malefic/benefic etc) should be clearly discounted"> > > > > > We will even touch this base rule with corollaries, ONLY WHEN > > > the> > > > > > special condition is mentioned in the sloka itself; just not > > to> > > > > > contaminate the result indicated by the sloka.> > > > > > If this corollary is not there, I agree to your statement > > > completely.> > > > > > Love,> > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Sreenadh,> > > > > > > I think we should keep out the factor of L1 being a natural> > > > > > malefic -- the logic you have used for those outcomes of L-1 > > > going to> > > > > > 5th, 7th hse (death of first child, uninterested in life/wife > > > etc). If> > > > > > we must, then we have to qualify the deduction, saying "where > > L-> > > 5 (or> > > > > > L-7) is a malefic or is afflicted". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is: L-1 > > > goes> > > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly discounted. > > > Clear?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's carry on,> > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > > > Your concerns are right - important points mentioned. Let > > us > > > > > > > together try to find out the reasons based on our logic.> > > > > > > > When in 1st : Uncertain in decision> > > > > > > Lagna lord in lagna gives the native all the good qualities > > > such as > > > > > > > compassion, kindness, softness of mind, emotional approach > > > etc. > > > > > > > Result? Uncertainty in decision. I think this account for > > the> > > > logical > > > > > > > basis of the above derivation.> > > > > > > > When in 2nd: Many wives> > > > > > > That is just natural. 2nd and 11th house signify second > > > marriage. > > > > > > > When the lagna lord comes in contact with any house the > > > native is > > > > > > > sure to get the results related to that. Lagna lord in 2nd > > > house > > > > > > > makes the native beautiful, talkative, liked by women etc. > > > Thus it > > > > > > > turns out that it is natural to have many relations > > (wives). > > > It > > > > > > > should be noted that for lagna lord in lagna, and lagna > > lord > > > in 2nd > > > > > > > house - 2 wives and many wives are derived - NOT as a bad> > > > result, but > > > > > > > as a good result; indicating that the native will have every> > > > kind of > > > > > > > luxury including women.> > > > > > > > When in 3rd : Many kinds of wealth, 2 wives> > > > > > > Valorous - thus many kinds of wealth; 3rd is a house > > usually > > > is of > > > > > > > MIXED nature indicating mixed/various/many results. That is > > > why the > > > > > > > derivation 'Many kinds of wealth'. 2nd from 2nd - many > > kinds > > > of > > > > > > > wealth - i think this is why you doubt that it could be due > > to> > > > bhavat > > > > > > > bhavam. 2 wives - i have no idea supply in this regard.> > > > > > > > When in 4th: Lust> > > > > > > No idea as of now.> > > > > > > > When in 5th: Angry, loss of the 1st child > > > > > > > If lagna lord is in 5th, any affliction to it can affect > > both > > > 5th > > > > > > > house and lagna equally - making a double impact. That is > > why > > > the > > > > > > > prediction 'loss of child'. Why 1st child - 5th signify 1st > > > child > > > > > > > more i doubt. Possibly here Parasara deviates a bit from > > the > > > > > > > conventional prediction owing to the possibility of 'double> > > > impact' i > > > > > > > think. The standard prediction should be (we will verify) > > > gain of > > > > > > > child, as you mentioned. (But first the child should be > > born > > > for it > > > > > > > to perish - this may make both the derivations consistent)> > > > > > > > When in 7th: Uninterested in worldly life and wife > > > > > > > This applies only if lagna lord is a malefic. Therefore it > > is > > > > > > > logically ok.> > > > > > > > When in 12th: Good health> > > > > > > No idea as of now.> > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , rk dash > > > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Good start. I agree. First theoretical consideration then > > > we test > > > > > > > the rules against actual charts. Here's a small beginning > > of > > > the > > > > > > > examination of lagna lord's bhavashraya phala in BHPH. I'll > > go> > > > about > > > > > > > it by first picking out those phala (results) which are not > > > self-> > > > > > > evident. Here they are:> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 1st> > > > > > > > Uncertain in decision> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 2nd> > > > > > > > Many wives> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 3rd> > > > > > > > Many kinds of wealth (bhavat bhavam?), 2 wives> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 4th> > > > > > > > Lust> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 5th> > > > > > > > Angry, loss of the 1st child > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 7th> > > > > > > > Uninterested in worldly life and wife > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 12th> > > > > > > > Good health> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > These results are not easy to discern, given the first > > > factor > > > > > > > (the linkage of the the self to the department represented > > by > > > the > > > > > > > house the lagna lord tenants) and the sweeping good that > > > lagna lord > > > > > > > brings to the bhava it goes to. Take its placement in 5th. > > > Why loss > > > > > > > of child at all? Most other works declare, 'susuta', > > meaning > > > good > > > > > > > progeny. I'll cite one such at a later stage for all house > > of> > > > tenancy > > > > > > > as far as 1st lord is concerned. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One more thing I'd like to think aloud about. Rule says > > > that any > > > > > > > lord that goes to a dusthana will bring detriment to the > > > house the > > > > > > > planet is lord of. Now how do we reconcile the L1 in 12th > > > ensuring > > > > > > > good health? Will it take care of the attrition of body > > (12th > > > from > > > > > > > 1st hse, ie body) without itself being subject to > > detriment? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > > Dear All,> > > > > > > > The primary derivations for Lagna lord in various houses > > as > > > per > > > > > > > BPHS is given below. I invite all to start a discussion on > > the> > > > same. > > > > > > > > =================================> > > > > > > > As per BPHS, for Lagna lord in -> > > > > > > > Lagna: healthy body, courageous, uncertain in decisions, > > 2 > > > wives> > > > > > > > 2nd house: knowledgeable, good earnings, happiness, good > > > habits, > > > > > > > righteous, many wives, good qualities.> > > > > > > > 3rd house: valorous like a lion, all kinds of wealth, 2 > > > wives, > > > > > > > intelligent.> > > > > > > > 4th house: love and affection from healthy mother with > > good > > > > > > > longevity, many brothers/sisters, lust, beauty and good > > > qualities.> > > > > > > > 5th house: angry, moderate happiness from children, loss > > of > > > first > > > > > > > born (child), admired by government and authorities. > > > > > > > > 6th house: (especially if aspected by malefics) trouble > > > from > > > > > > > enemies, bad health.> > > > > > > > 7th house: (especially if Lagna lord is a malefic) his > > wife > > > will > > > > > > > die early (or married life will not go long), he will > > become > > > > > > > uninterested in worldly life and wife, will be detached > > > towards his > > > > > > > native land and wander/visit many places, It is possible > > that > > > he > > > > > > > won't be much wealthy (he would be a poor man) or also that > > he> > > > would > > > > > > > be a very wealthy person like a king.> > > > > > > > 8th house: master of some branch of knowledge, troubled > > by > > > > > > > diseases, interested in others wives, will be interested in > > > all> > > > kinds > > > > > > > of games such as cards, chess, dice, lottery and so on, > > very > > > much > > > > > > > angry.> > > > > > > > 9th house: lucky, loved by the public, devotee of Vishnu,> > > > master of > > > > > > > words and oratory, will have good wealth wife and children. > > > > > > > > 10th house: admired by government and people in power > > (the > > > native > > > > > > > will have a good job), he would be a government servant, > > very > > > much > > > > > > > popular.> > > > > > > > 11th house: much income from many sources, good > > popularity > > > > > > > (popularity due to good deeds, celebrity), good qualities, > > > many> > > > wives.> > > > > > > > 12th house: good health, extravagant without reason, > > angry > > > > > > > (especially if not benefics are present in 12th and if no > > > benefic > > > > > > > aspects 12th) > > > > > > > > =================================> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , manju > > > chawla > > > > > > > <manjuch2001@> wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Thank You Sreenadhji> > > > > > > > > we would learn this subject in this way.You are really> > > > helping us > > > > > > > God bless you> > > > > > > > > regards> > > > > > > > > manju> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > > > > > > > Dear All,> > > > > > > > > Let us start a new discussion on the subject "What > > should > > > be> > > > > > > > > predicted for Lagna lord in Various houses?" - let the> > > > discussion > > > > > > > go> > > > > > > > > first and then comparison of it with actual results.> > > > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "I am careful not to confuse excellence with > > > > > > > perfection,Excellence-I can reach for,Perfection is God's> > > > business---> > > > > > > Michael J.Fox> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top> > > > picks on > > > > > > > TV.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Get the freedom to save as many mails as you wish. Click > > > here to > > > > > > > know how.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Get the freedom to save as many mails as you wish. Click > > here > > > to> > > > > > know how.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Try the revolutionary next-gen Mail. > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it now> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Get the freedom to save as many mails as you wish. 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September 16, 2007

Sairamanthank y for yr compliments i am reading only only reading imagining for pa ST 25 YEARS however not perfect people like y Shri Pranav Shri Sunil Shri Sreenath etc but imaginations are always wild i see every where in life astrological link things to practical hapennings in life may not be always righteg: my opposite door gentleman in flat purchased flat, car 4th house his two sons went abroad 12th 5 th 4th there was some talk about his transfer his office which he resisted for years in city as 4th house 7th of 10th profession (7th house constitution changes in life style after marriage) suddenly made his father inlaw 9th to 7th 3rd house to come close to him and stay 3rd house in operation as 4th and 3rd operated subsequently he was pushed out ofcity to a place 300 kms from native city and he is to travel up and downfurther 4th house is 11th of 6th preexisting like elder brother in earth before y are born

the man never met a doctor suddenly he had bleeding nose rushed to a doctor confirmed that is having high bp here it is clearly observed and told to my wife the hapenning of 4th 3rd houses in full swingif we can observe people activities we can have astro details for further proceedingsimmediately after mariage most of mothers of the son get in to friction in domestic life as 7th of 5th house is 11th which is 8th of 4th house we can always observe chain of events in life and imagine the out comes my father was sick and i coma for 2 months immediately after his death( with in neary 2 months) i quit my good govt job of 25 years as 2and and 8th house was ooperating now financially comfortable as 9th is 8th of 2nd house above reasonable or not even may not be acceptable but members can watch their own experiences in life thank y Sir with my regardsSAIRAMAN ; 8 48 PM 16TH SEP

2007sunil nair <astro_tellerkerala wrote: Hare rama krishna, respected sai ram ji. Very good post with observations and experiences . Thanks for ur inputs and pls be tuned with us and guide us . regrds sunil nair om shreem mahalaxmai namah. --- In

, sairam nat <sairaman53 wrote:>> Sairaman> > Dear Sir,> > yr msg is wounderful and new thought for food IE upachacha for every house if we go steps we canhave good idea > > if we consider our body as 12 houses we can see the armsthirde house hip the 6th house knee is 10th house and the y can add the food which highly projected from our body 12th house house of sleep and 3rd of the 10th extension of new job etc without foot hand knee we there is no use in life > > without eating we an befor few days but without sleep we cannot act for days andthe foot the 12th house is major extension like hand in our body without foot we cannot stnd in earth may be with cruches how far fast he can go with cruches > > i have seen people with 3,6,10th11th house strong are very powerful wealthy active improving even from the lower end in

my office people joined astypist (not even steno) as raisen tothe cader of chif finance managers (just by a small dep.test) where we can see 10th 3rd 6th occupied by planets more likely 3rd with a benefic 3rd house house ofefforts in right direction with positive spirit for self improvement may be occupied or aspected by benefics is reallygood > > more over it isthe 8th house of 8th ie giving lot of trouble so mans efforts can ahieve things in spite of hurdles > > FOR ANY PARIHARA CONSIDER THE 3RD HOUSE OF THE CONCERNED HOUSE AND PARIHARA RELATED TO THAT WILL GIVE GOOD RESULTS> > 3RD HOUSE IS 11TH HOUSE OF 5TH HOUSE PRE EXISTING POORVAPUNYA (YR ELDER BROTHER BORN IN EARTH BEFORE YOU IE 11TH PRWE EXISTING) > > the most successful person is one habving powerful lagna connected to 3,6,10,11> 3 effiorts 6 winning opponets 10 status and 11 the achievements extremet satisfaction> > Thanking y for giving

member for goodfood for thought > > > > Sairaman> > sunil nair astro_tellerkerala wrote: > Hare rama krishna,> dear lalit ,> The upachayas are 3,6,10,11 and 6 is both dustana and upachaya,Upachaya houses are supposed to be houses of free will u can execute in this life concerned with that bhava and also known as houses of growth .That is why generaly says planets in upachaya gives good results .> Now let us take 2nd house and its upachaya houses.> 4th house being 3rd from 2nd ( house of family or kutumba where one born or even this place is to see kula devata according to prashna maaraga) ,7th house being 6th from 2nd house (house of marriage,partnership and even how we interact with out side world also madhana bhava and yatra bhava) ,and 11th house being 10th from 2nd house ( house of all kinf of gains and incomes ,frnds,and even our elder siblings) and the 12th house ( the house of

expenditure and loses and even our house of bed room pleasures ) ,> Now if we apply logic we can see all this houses has a great say in accumulation of money which is one of the characteristics of 2nd house.> waiting comments from all scholars and members.> regrds sunil nair.> om shreem mahalaxmai namah.> > > > , "litsol" mishra.lalit@ wrote:> >> > I agree to this point to some extent, It's not always a good try to > > understand one house on the basis of how far it is from some house, > > there are only 12 houses, so each and every house comes n'th from > > 1'st to 12'th from remaining houses.> > > > Better way of understanding the houses is trying to understand basic > > charactersitic like if upchaya say 3rd house, why 3'rd is an upachaya > > etc. and then learning

trikonas like dharma trikona, Bhoga trikona > > etc. > > > > regards,> > Lalit.> > > > , rk dash > > arkaydash@ wrote:> > >> > > Sreenadh,> > > > > > Yes, I think so. They probably are from the Meenaraj > > Hora/Horapradeepam sources now that I get to see your PDF file. > > > > > > What I meant when I said: "Examples will of course pour in. But > > we have to > > > see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration" is this. When > > we take up example charts (and we haven't come to that as yet), we > > have to be careful not to confuse any particular experience emanating > > from other configurations/patterns and a

bhavashraya phala of a house > > lord. That is how we correctly validate the derivation in slokas. We > > all know what drama the 'yogaja phala' can introduce in a chart. The > > task is arduous; it requires rigours. I was doing some loud thinking > > on the methodological rigours staring at us, in advance.> > > > > > I went thru your PDF file. Umm, I would say some of your logic > > searches overshoot themselves. Take this one. The result of wealth > > with lagna lord in 4th house. You say, 4th is 3rd from 2nd, ie > > upachaya from 2nd, which is how. Not very elegant as a rationale. The > > reason, to my mind, is the wealth of siginfications the 4th hse > > holds -- house, vehicle and what have you. Now, applying your well-> > plucked Rule Four, which says lagna lord amplifies (the goodness of) > > the house it goes to, the logic behind

wealth is valid. > > > > > > I do like your Rule reminders. Commendable. > > > > > > Best,> > > RK> > > > > > PS: I will take your hugs when we proceed on 'sustained topics' > > in a more organised fashion...> > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > Dear RK ji,> > > Thanks. The derivations given are good - and looks as if solely > > > based on "Houses" alone.> > > ==>> > > Now, the rationale. Examples will of course pour in. But we have to > > > see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?> > > <==> > > Apart from houses, I don't think anything such as Planet/lords etc > > > comes in to play in the derivations you provided.

> > > *Lord are of Signs; Houses does not have any lords - and so the > > same > > > is discarded. > > > * Planets are not at all considered in house based derivation - and > > > so the same is discarded.> > > > > > I ascertain, the derivations are solely based on houses, and so > > > should be the logic behind. Yah, RK ji, you can proceed with > > > explaining the logic behid each of those derivations... > > > Love and Hugs,> > > Sreenadh > > > > > > , rk dash > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > >> > > > Shreenadh, > > > > Here is the bhavashraya phala of L1 as found in the compedium. > > > There is an 'result' for the 5th hse, but I 'll take time to make >

> out > > > what is meant. > > > > > > > > In 1st house> > > > Healthy, long-lived, king(ly), strong, gain of land> > > > > > > > 2nd hse> > > > Wealthy, engaged in right action, head of the locality, life of > > > plenty, corpulent> > > > > > > > 3rd hse> > > > Has good friends, religiosity, generosity; brave, strong> > > > > > > > 4th hse> > > > King's favourite, lives life to the full (could also mean 'very > > > long-lived,' the expression being prachura-jivita), earns by right > > > means, devoted to father, voracious > > > > > > > > 5th hse> > > > Good children, engaged in good deeds, has humility, known his for > > > good qualities > > > >

> > > > 6th hse> > > > Healthy, strong, gain of land, miserly, rich, subdues enemies, on > > > the side of good deeds> > > > > > > > 7th hse> > > > Brilliant, good manners, cultured wife, spends himself fast > > > during coitus, good-looking> > > > > > > > 8th hse> > > > Miserly, unreliable in financial matters, very long-lived, harsh > > > in speech if the planet is a malefic, large physique if a benefic> > > > > > > > 9th hse> > > > Good people are his friends, good deeds, balanced (without > > > extremes), cultured, known for his good deeds, brilliant> > > > > > > > 10th hse > > > > Gains from ruler (state), learned, cultured, reverent towards > > > guru and mother, king, famous>

> > > > > > > 11th hse > > > > Long-lived, has progeny, spends himself fast during coitus, > > > powerful> > > > > > > > 12th hse> > > > Harsh speech, very sharp mind, goes abroad, a free loader > > > > > > > > > > > > Now, the rationale. Examples will of couse pour in. But we have > > > to see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?> > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > ==>> > > > I know of a compendium in vernacular which collates the best > > (best > > > as> > > > the compiler thought any particular aspect

from a classic to be)> > > > available, which goes into this aspect (lord going to different > > > houses)> > > > <==> > > > Can you provide the results derived/provided by that book > > for "lagna> > > > lord going to various houses"? That could be much beneficial to > > our> > > > current study - we will try to find the logic used behind those> > > > derivations, and accept or reject each of those derivations; as > > > usual> > > > based on conditions such as -> > > > * logical or not> > > > * Real life experience supports the same or not> > > > It doesn't matter whether the source mention or the Sanskrit > > > original> > > > is available or not - as long as the derivations are logical, and> > > > reflect the actual

experience. > > > > > the 'material' looks very insightful stuff. > > > > That is very good point - which itself I think indicate that it > > > could> > > > be valuable material.> > > > Love,> > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > OK, Sree, that about sums up the scenario on one of the 7-fold> > > > method. But the search, esp. for rishi hora source must be kept > > on. > > > I> > > > know of a compedium in vernacular which collates the best (best > > as > > > the> > > > compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to be)> > > > available, which goes into this

aspect (lord going to different> > > > houses) but there is no source mention for the portion nor is > > there> > > > the Sanskrit original for it unlike most other portions in the> > > > compendium. Nevertheless the 'material' looks very insightful > > stuff.> > > > It is things like this that I had in mind. Let's see.> > > > > > > > > > Best,> > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > ==>> > > > > Now we have to agree on who next to Parasara we take on board > > for> > > > > comparison. You have named two: Meenaraja Hora, and Hora > > > Pradeepam.> > > > > Who else? We don't have to go by the overall reputation of the

> > > text.> > > > > We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of > > interpretation > > > in> > > > > question in a treatise that may not otherwise be rated very > > high. > > > What> > > > > say? > > > > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or classics? > > > > > <==> > > > > This question is really difficult to answer. Apart from > > > Parasara> > > > > (for whom various versions of the slokas are available for the > > > same in> > > > > almost all instances) Meena Raja Hora discusses it. The > > statements> > > > > from Meena Raja Hora is mentioned with utmost importance in > > Hora > > > Ratna> > > > > as well (at times they slightly

variant versions of the slokas> > > > > available in current printed verion of Meena raja hora). Hora> > > > > pradeepam is a text quoted with reverance by the auther of Hora > > > Sara > > > > > (i.e. Nrisimha Daivanjna), a well known scholar of 17th > > century. > > > Thus -> > > > > Meenaraja hora gets double importance since supported by Hora > > > Ratna.> > > > > Hora Pradeepam gets double importance since supported by Hora > > > Sara.> > > > > > > > > > Some other later day texts MIGHT have discussed the same at > > times> > > > > (though not extensively), but I am yet to make an elaborate > > > search for> > > > > the same in texts like Sarvartha Chintamani, Jataka Parijata,> > > > >

Saravali, Phaladeepika etc. One or two rudimentary slokas > > related > > > to> > > > > the same we may find in these texts as well. Some slokas > > relevant > > > to> > > > > the may find a place in many ancient Rishi horas (Whereever I > > find> > > > > such a reference I will quote them for sure). But for sure none > > > of the> > > > > other texts (except BPHS, Meenaraja hora, Hora Pradeepam) > > > discusses> > > > > this subject extensively in detail as per my current knowledge > > and> > > > > understanding. As far as ancient texts (Rishi horas) are > > > concerned it> > > > > is possible that the slokas that discuss this subject > > extensively > > > are> > > > > lost, even though they might

have done the same (since they use > > 7-> > > fold> > > > > method).> > > > > Love,> > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Yes, you are homing in on the "pure" point. That's what this> > > > > particular aspect of interpretation of a chart is about. That's > > > the> > > > > way (the part-way) to go about it -- core task, winkling the > > > secrets> > > > > out of a chart. Now we have to agree on who next to Parasara we > > > take> > > > > on board for comparision. You have named two: Meenaraja Hora, > > and > > > Hora> >

> > > Pradeepam. Who else? We don't have to go by the overall > > > reputation of> > > > > the text. We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of> > > > > interpretation in question in a treatise that may not otherwise > > be> > > > > rated very high. What say? > > > > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or classics? > > > > > > > > > > > > Sotto Voce: I don't want us, you and me, to be cynosures of > > (the> > > > > galaxy of) our star-gazers in this firmament. Onlookers all? > > > > > > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > > You are right - to the point. I agree. But as far as

LL going > > > to H-7> > > > > > is concerned, the special point regarding ' if LL is a > > malefic' > > > is> > > > > > mentioned in the sloka itself; there for we cannot discount > > it > > > as far> > > > > > as the prediction related to the same given in the sloka is > > > concerned.> > > > > > For other results regarding LL in H-7 (which we would discuss > > in> > > > > > detail as this discussion progresses) I agree absolutely with > > > your> > > > > > logic and argument. > > > > > > As far as LL in H-5 is concerned, I think there could be the > > > point> > > > > > I mentioned under consideration (for BPHS results) even > > though > > > the> > > >

> > same is NOT mentioned in the sloka. But as you have clearly > > > stated,> > > > > > the normal expected result for the same SHOULD BE ''susuta' > > > (good> > > > > > child, or birth of children). Let us keep this doubt open > > till > > > we> > > > > > cross verify the results with the derivations given in other > > > texts and> > > > > > come to a logical conclusion/derivation.> > > > > > We always have 2 options open to cross check the results > > > predicted> > > > > > by BPHS in this context-> > > > > > 1) Cross verify the results with the predictions given in > > other> > > > > > texts (especially Meenaraja Hora & Hora Pradeepam)> > > > > > 2) Compare the predicted

results with actual results observed.> > > > > > But still, the base rule as you pointed out is -> > > > > > ==>> > > > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is: L-1 > > > goes > > > > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly discounted. > > > Clear?> > > > > > <==> > > > > > To state in other words, the base rule is -> > > > > > "LL going to H-1, H-2, H-3 etc ONLY should be considered, and > > > other> > > > > > factors (such as LL being malefic/benefic, LL being aspected > > by> > > > > > malefic/benefic etc) should be clearly discounted"> > > > > > We will even touch this base rule with corollaries, ONLY WHEN > > > the> > > > >

> special condition is mentioned in the sloka itself; just not > > to> > > > > > contaminate the result indicated by the sloka.> > > > > > If this corollary is not there, I agree to your statement > > > completely.> > > > > > Love,> > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Sreenadh,> > > > > > > I think we should keep out the factor of L1 being a natural> > > > > > malefic -- the logic you have used for those outcomes of L-1 > > > going to> > > > > > 5th, 7th hse (death of first child, uninterested in life/wife > > >

etc). If> > > > > > we must, then we have to qualify the deduction, saying "where > > L-> > > 5 (or> > > > > > L-7) is a malefic or is afflicted". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is: L-1 > > > goes> > > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly discounted. > > > Clear?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's carry on,> > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > > > Your concerns are right - important points mentioned. Let > > us > > > > > > >

together try to find out the reasons based on our logic.> > > > > > > > When in 1st : Uncertain in decision> > > > > > > Lagna lord in lagna gives the native all the good qualities > > > such as > > > > > > > compassion, kindness, softness of mind, emotional approach > > > etc. > > > > > > > Result? Uncertainty in decision. I think this account for > > the> > > > logical > > > > > > > basis of the above derivation.> > > > > > > > When in 2nd: Many wives> > > > > > > That is just natural. 2nd and 11th house signify second > > > marriage. > > > > > > > When the lagna lord comes in contact with any house the > > > native is > > > > > > > sure to get the results related to

that. Lagna lord in 2nd > > > house > > > > > > > makes the native beautiful, talkative, liked by women etc. > > > Thus it > > > > > > > turns out that it is natural to have many relations > > (wives). > > > It > > > > > > > should be noted that for lagna lord in lagna, and lagna > > lord > > > in 2nd > > > > > > > house - 2 wives and many wives are derived - NOT as a bad> > > > result, but > > > > > > > as a good result; indicating that the native will have every> > > > kind of > > > > > > > luxury including women.> > > > > > > > When in 3rd : Many kinds of wealth, 2 wives> > > > > > > Valorous - thus many kinds of wealth; 3rd is a house > > usually >

> > is of > > > > > > > MIXED nature indicating mixed/various/many results. That is > > > why the > > > > > > > derivation 'Many kinds of wealth'. 2nd from 2nd - many > > kinds > > > of > > > > > > > wealth - i think this is why you doubt that it could be due > > to> > > > bhavat > > > > > > > bhavam. 2 wives - i have no idea supply in this regard.> > > > > > > > When in 4th: Lust> > > > > > > No idea as of now.> > > > > > > > When in 5th: Angry, loss of the 1st child > > > > > > > If lagna lord is in 5th, any affliction to it can affect > > both > > > 5th > > > > > > > house and lagna equally - making a double impact. That is > > why

> > > the > > > > > > > prediction 'loss of child'. Why 1st child - 5th signify 1st > > > child > > > > > > > more i doubt. Possibly here Parasara deviates a bit from > > the > > > > > > > conventional prediction owing to the possibility of 'double> > > > impact' i > > > > > > > think. The standard prediction should be (we will verify) > > > gain of > > > > > > > child, as you mentioned. (But first the child should be > > born > > > for it > > > > > > > to perish - this may make both the derivations consistent)> > > > > > > > When in 7th: Uninterested in worldly life and wife > > > > > > > This applies only if lagna lord is a malefic. Therefore it > > is > > > >

> > > logically ok.> > > > > > > > When in 12th: Good health> > > > > > > No idea as of now.> > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , rk dash > > > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Good start. I agree. First theoretical consideration then > > > we test > > > > > > > the rules against actual charts. Here's a small beginning > > of > > > the > > > > > > > examination of lagna lord's bhavashraya phala in BHPH. I'll > > go> > > > about > > > > > > > it by first picking out those

phala (results) which are not > > > self-> > > > > > > evident. Here they are:> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 1st> > > > > > > > Uncertain in decision> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 2nd> > > > > > > > Many wives> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 3rd> > > > > > > > Many kinds of wealth (bhavat bhavam?), 2 wives> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 4th> > > > > > > > Lust> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 5th> > > > > > > > Angry, loss of the 1st child > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > When in 7th> > > > > > > > Uninterested in worldly life and wife > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 12th> > > > > > > > Good health> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > These results are not easy to discern, given the first > > > factor > > > > > > > (the linkage of the the self to the department represented > > by > > > the > > > > > > > house the lagna lord tenants) and the sweeping good that > > > lagna lord > > > > > > > brings to the bhava it goes to. Take its placement in 5th. > > > Why loss > > > > > > > of child at all? Most other works declare, 'susuta', > > meaning > > >

good > > > > > > > progeny. I'll cite one such at a later stage for all house > > of> > > > tenancy > > > > > > > as far as 1st lord is concerned. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One more thing I'd like to think aloud about. Rule says > > > that any > > > > > > > lord that goes to a dusthana will bring detriment to the > > > house the > > > > > > > planet is lord of. Now how do we reconcile the L1 in 12th > > > ensuring > > > > > > > good health? Will it take care of the attrition of body > > (12th > > > from > > > > > > > 1st hse, ie body) without itself being subject to > > detriment? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

RK> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > > Dear All,> > > > > > > > The primary derivations for Lagna lord in various houses > > as > > > per > > > > > > > BPHS is given below. I invite all to start a discussion on > > the> > > > same. > > > > > > > > =================================> > > > > > > > As per BPHS, for Lagna lord in -> > > > > > > > Lagna: healthy body, courageous, uncertain in decisions, > > 2 > > > wives> > > > > > > > 2nd house: knowledgeable, good earnings, happiness, good > > > habits, > > > > > > >

righteous, many wives, good qualities.> > > > > > > > 3rd house: valorous like a lion, all kinds of wealth, 2 > > > wives, > > > > > > > intelligent.> > > > > > > > 4th house: love and affection from healthy mother with > > good > > > > > > > longevity, many brothers/sisters, lust, beauty and good > > > qualities.> > > > > > > > 5th house: angry, moderate happiness from children, loss > > of > > > first > > > > > > > born (child), admired by government and authorities. > > > > > > > > 6th house: (especially if aspected by malefics) trouble > > > from > > > > > > > enemies, bad health.> > > > > > > > 7th house: (especially if Lagna lord is a malefic) his > >

wife > > > will > > > > > > > die early (or married life will not go long), he will > > become > > > > > > > uninterested in worldly life and wife, will be detached > > > towards his > > > > > > > native land and wander/visit many places, It is possible > > that > > > he > > > > > > > won't be much wealthy (he would be a poor man) or also that > > he> > > > would > > > > > > > be a very wealthy person like a king.> > > > > > > > 8th house: master of some branch of knowledge, troubled > > by > > > > > > > diseases, interested in others wives, will be interested in > > > all> > > > kinds > > > > > > > of games such as cards, chess, dice, lottery and so

on, > > very > > > much > > > > > > > angry.> > > > > > > > 9th house: lucky, loved by the public, devotee of Vishnu,> > > > master of > > > > > > > words and oratory, will have good wealth wife and children. > > > > > > > > 10th house: admired by government and people in power > > (the > > > native > > > > > > > will have a good job), he would be a government servant, > > very > > > much > > > > > > > popular.> > > > > > > > 11th house: much income from many sources, good > > popularity > > > > > > > (popularity due to good deeds, celebrity), good qualities, > > > many> > > > wives.> > > > > > > > 12th house: good

health, extravagant without reason, > > angry > > > > > > > (especially if not benefics are present in 12th and if no > > > benefic > > > > > > > aspects 12th) > > > > > > > > =================================> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , manju > > > chawla > > > > > > > <manjuch2001@> wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Thank You Sreenadhji> > > > > > > > > we would learn this subject in this way.You are really> > > > helping us >

> > > > > > God bless you> > > > > > > > > regards> > > > > > > > > manju> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > > > > > > > Dear All,> > > > > > > > > Let us start a new discussion on the subject "What > > should > > > be> > > > > > > > > predicted for Lagna lord in Various houses?" - let the> > > > discussion > > > > > > > go> > > > > > > > > first and then comparison of it with actual results.> > > > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "I am careful not to confuse excellence with > > > > > > > perfection,Excellence-I can reach for,Perfection is God's> > > > business---> > > > > > > Michael J.Fox> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ready for the edge of your seat? Check out tonight's top> > > > picks on > > > > > > > TV.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

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September 17, 2007

Hare rama krishna,

respected sai raman ji .

Thanks that u r applying the discussions done here and keep applying on known persons chart .

Thanks for ur mails

regrds sunil nair.

om shreem mahalaxmai namah.

, sairam nat <sairaman53 wrote:>> Sairaman> > > thank y for yr compliments i am reading only only reading imagining for pa ST 25 YEARS however not perfect people like y Shri Pranav Shri Sunil Shri Sreenath etc but imaginations are always wild i see every where in life astrological link things to practical hapennings in life may not be always right> > eg: my opposite door gentleman in flat purchased flat, car 4th house his two sons went abroad 12th 5 th 4th there was some talk about his transfer his office which he resisted for years in city as 4th house 7th of 10th profession (7th house constitution changes in life style after marriage) suddenly made his father inlaw 9th to 7th 3rd house to come close to him and stay 3rd house in operation > as 4th and 3rd operated subsequently he was pushed out ofcity to a place 300 kms from native city and he is to travel up and down> > further 4th house is 11th of 6th preexisting like elder brother in earth before y are born the man never met a doctor suddenly he had bleeding nose rushed to a doctor confirmed that is having high bp > > here it is clearly observed and told to my wife the hapenning of 4th 3rd houses in full swing> > if we can observe people activities we can have astro details for further proceedings> > immediately after mariage most of mothers of the son get in to friction in domestic life as 7th of 5th house is 11th which is 8th of 4th house > > we can always observe chain of events in life and imagine the out comes > > my father was sick and i coma for 2 months immediately after his death( with in neary 2 months) i quit my good govt job of 25 years as 2and and 8th house was ooperating now financially comfortable as 9th is 8th of 2nd house > > above reasonable or not even may not be acceptable but members can watch their own experiences in life > > > thank y Sir with my regards> > SAIRAMAN ; 8 48 PM 16TH SEP 2007> > > > sunil nair astro_tellerkerala wrote: > Hare rama krishna,> respected sai ram ji.> Very good post with observations and experiences .> Thanks for ur inputs and pls be tuned with us and guide us .> regrds sunil nair> om shreem mahalaxmai namah.> > , sairam nat sairaman53@ wrote:> >> > Sairaman> > > > Dear Sir,> > > > yr msg is wounderful and new thought for food IE upachacha for every house if we go steps we canhave good idea > > > > if we consider our body as 12 houses we can see the armsthirde house hip the 6th house knee is 10th house and the y can add the food which highly projected from our body 12th house house of sleep and 3rd of the 10th extension of new job etc without foot hand knee we there is no use in life > > > > without eating we an befor few days but without sleep we cannot act for days andthe foot the 12th house is major extension like hand in our body without foot we cannot stnd in earth may be with cruches how far fast he can go with cruches > > > > i have seen people with 3,6,10th11th house strong are very powerful wealthy active improving even from the lower end in my office people joined astypist (not even steno) as raisen tothe cader of chif finance managers (just by a small dep.test) where we can see 10th 3rd 6th occupied by planets more likely 3rd with a benefic 3rd house house ofefforts in right direction with positive spirit for self improvement may be occupied or aspected by benefics is reallygood > > > > more over it isthe 8th house of 8th ie giving lot of trouble so mans efforts can ahieve things in spite of hurdles > > > > FOR ANY PARIHARA CONSIDER THE 3RD HOUSE OF THE CONCERNED HOUSE AND PARIHARA RELATED TO THAT WILL GIVE GOOD RESULTS> > > > 3RD HOUSE IS 11TH HOUSE OF 5TH HOUSE PRE EXISTING POORVAPUNYA (YR ELDER BROTHER BORN IN EARTH BEFORE YOU IE 11TH PRWE EXISTING) > > > > the most successful person is one habving powerful lagna connected to 3,6,10,11> > 3 effiorts 6 winning opponets 10 status and 11 the achievements extremet satisfaction> > > > Thanking y for giving member for goodfood for thought > > > > > > > > Sairaman> > > > sunil nair astro_tellerkerala@ wrote: > > Hare rama krishna,> > dear lalit ,> > The upachayas are 3,6,10,11 and 6 is both dustana and upachaya,Upachaya houses are supposed to be houses of free will u can execute in this life concerned with that bhava and also known as houses of growth .That is why generaly says planets in upachaya gives good results .> > Now let us take 2nd house and its upachaya houses.> > 4th house being 3rd from 2nd ( house of family or kutumba where one born or even this place is to see kula devata according to prashna maaraga) ,7th house being 6th from 2nd house (house of marriage,partnership and even how we interact with out side world also madhana bhava and yatra bhava) ,and 11th house being 10th from 2nd house ( house of all kinf of gains and incomes ,frnds,and even our elder siblings) and the 12th house ( the house of expenditure and loses and even our house of bed room pleasures ) ,> > Now if we apply logic we can see all this houses has a great say in accumulation of money which is one of the characteristics of 2nd house.> > waiting comments from all scholars and members.> > regrds sunil nair.> > om shreem mahalaxmai namah.> > > > > > > > , "litsol" mishra.lalit@ wrote:> > >> > > I agree to this point to some extent, It's not always a good try to > > > understand one house on the basis of how far it is from some house, > > > there are only 12 houses, so each and every house comes n'th from > > > 1'st to 12'th from remaining houses.> > > > > > Better way of understanding the houses is trying to understand basic > > > charactersitic like if upchaya say 3rd house, why 3'rd is an upachaya > > > etc. and then learning trikonas like dharma trikona, Bhoga trikona > > > etc. > > > > > > regards,> > > Lalit.> > > > > > , rk dash > > > arkaydash@ wrote:> > > >> > > > Sreenadh,> > > > > > > > Yes, I think so. They probably are from the Meenaraj > > > Hora/Horapradeepam sources now that I get to see your PDF file. > > > > > > > > What I meant when I said: "Examples will of course pour in. But > > > we have to > > > > see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration" is this. When > > > we take up example charts (and we haven't come to that as yet), we > > > have to be careful not to confuse any particular experience emanating > > > from other configurations/patterns and a bhavashraya phala of a house > > > lord. That is how we correctly validate the derivation in slokas. We > > > all know what drama the 'yogaja phala' can introduce in a chart. The > > > task is arduous; it requires rigours. I was doing some loud thinking > > > on the methodological rigours staring at us, in advance.> > > > > > > > I went thru your PDF file. Umm, I would say some of your logic > > > searches overshoot themselves. Take this one. The result of wealth > > > with lagna lord in 4th house. You say, 4th is 3rd from 2nd, ie > > > upachaya from 2nd, which is how. Not very elegant as a rationale. The > > > reason, to my mind, is the wealth of siginfications the 4th hse > > > holds -- house, vehicle and what have you. Now, applying your well-> > > plucked Rule Four, which says lagna lord amplifies (the goodness of) > > > the house it goes to, the logic behind wealth is valid. > > > > > > > > I do like your Rule reminders. Commendable. > > > > > > > > Best,> > > > RK> > > > > > > > PS: I will take your hugs when we proceed on 'sustained topics' > > > in a more organised fashion...> > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > Thanks. The derivations given are good - and looks as if solely > > > > based on "Houses" alone.> > > > ==>> > > > Now, the rationale. Examples will of course pour in. But we have to > > > > see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?> > > > <==> > > > Apart from houses, I don't think anything such as Planet/lords etc > > > > comes in to play in the derivations you provided. > > > > *Lord are of Signs; Houses does not have any lords - and so the > > > same > > > > is discarded. > > > > * Planets are not at all considered in house based derivation - and > > > > so the same is discarded.> > > > > > > > I ascertain, the derivations are solely based on houses, and so > > > > should be the logic behind. Yah, RK ji, you can proceed with > > > > explaining the logic behid each of those derivations... > > > > Love and Hugs,> > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > , rk dash > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Shreenadh, > > > > > Here is the bhavashraya phala of L1 as found in the compedium. > > > > There is an 'result' for the 5th hse, but I 'll take time to make > > > out > > > > what is meant. > > > > > > > > > > In 1st house> > > > > Healthy, long-lived, king(ly), strong, gain of land> > > > > > > > > > 2nd hse> > > > > Wealthy, engaged in right action, head of the locality, life of > > > > plenty, corpulent> > > > > > > > > > 3rd hse> > > > > Has good friends, religiosity, generosity; brave, strong> > > > > > > > > > 4th hse> > > > > King's favourite, lives life to the full (could also mean 'very > > > > long-lived,' the expression being prachura-jivita), earns by right > > > > means, devoted to father, voracious > > > > > > > > > > 5th hse> > > > > Good children, engaged in good deeds, has humility, known his for > > > > good qualities > > > > > > > > > > 6th hse> > > > > Healthy, strong, gain of land, miserly, rich, subdues enemies, on > > > > the side of good deeds> > > > > > > > > > 7th hse> > > > > Brilliant, good manners, cultured wife, spends himself fast > > > > during coitus, good-looking> > > > > > > > > > 8th hse> > > > > Miserly, unreliable in financial matters, very long-lived, harsh > > > > in speech if the planet is a malefic, large physique if a benefic> > > > > > > > > > 9th hse> > > > > Good people are his friends, good deeds, balanced (without > > > > extremes), cultured, known for his good deeds, brilliant> > > > > > > > > > 10th hse > > > > > Gains from ruler (state), learned, cultured, reverent towards > > > > guru and mother, king, famous> > > > > > > > > > 11th hse > > > > > Long-lived, has progeny, spends himself fast during coitus, > > > > powerful> > > > > > > > > > 12th hse> > > > > Harsh speech, very sharp mind, goes abroad, a free loader > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now, the rationale. Examples will of couse pour in. But we have > > > > to see where a particular result is flowing from -- from L1 in a > > > > particular hse, or other planet/lords' configuration. You agree?> > > > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > ==>> > > > > I know of a compendium in vernacular which collates the best > > > (best > > > > as> > > > > the compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to be)> > > > > available, which goes into this aspect (lord going to different > > > > houses)> > > > > <==> > > > > Can you provide the results derived/provided by that book > > > for "lagna> > > > > lord going to various houses"? That could be much beneficial to > > > our> > > > > current study - we will try to find the logic used behind those> > > > > derivations, and accept or reject each of those derivations; as > > > > usual> > > > > based on conditions such as -> > > > > * logical or not> > > > > * Real life experience supports the same or not> > > > > It doesn't matter whether the source mention or the Sanskrit > > > > original> > > > > is available or not - as long as the derivations are logical, and> > > > > reflect the actual experience. > > > > > > the 'material' looks very insightful stuff. > > > > > That is very good point - which itself I think indicate that it > > > > could> > > > > be valuable material.> > > > > Love,> > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > OK, Sree, that about sums up the scenario on one of the 7-fold> > > > > method. But the search, esp. for rishi hora source must be kept > > > on. > > > > I> > > > > know of a compedium in vernacular which collates the best (best > > > as > > > > the> > > > > compiler thought any particular aspect from a classic to be)> > > > > available, which goes into this aspect (lord going to different> > > > > houses) but there is no source mention for the portion nor is > > > there> > > > > the Sanskrit original for it unlike most other portions in the> > > > > compendium. Nevertheless the 'material' looks very insightful > > > stuff.> > > > > It is things like this that I had in mind. Let's see.> > > > > > > > > > > > Best,> > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > > ==>> > > > > > Now we have to agree on who next to Parasara we take on board > > > for> > > > > > comparison. You have named two: Meenaraja Hora, and Hora > > > > Pradeepam.> > > > > > Who else? We don't have to go by the overall reputation of the > > > > text.> > > > > > We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of > > > interpretation > > > > in> > > > > > question in a treatise that may not otherwise be rated very > > > high. > > > > What> > > > > > say? > > > > > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or classics? > > > > > > <==> > > > > > This question is really difficult to answer. Apart from > > > > Parasara> > > > > > (for whom various versions of the slokas are available for the > > > > same in> > > > > > almost all instances) Meena Raja Hora discusses it. The > > > statements> > > > > > from Meena Raja Hora is mentioned with utmost importance in > > > Hora > > > > Ratna> > > > > > as well (at times they slightly variant versions of the slokas> > > > > > available in current printed verion of Meena raja hora). Hora> > > > > > pradeepam is a text quoted with reverance by the auther of Hora > > > > Sara > > > > > > (i.e. Nrisimha Daivanjna), a well known scholar of 17th > > > century. > > > > Thus -> > > > > > Meenaraja hora gets double importance since supported by Hora > > > > Ratna.> > > > > > Hora Pradeepam gets double importance since supported by Hora > > > > Sara.> > > > > > > > > > > > Some other later day texts MIGHT have discussed the same at > > > times> > > > > > (though not extensively), but I am yet to make an elaborate > > > > search for> > > > > > the same in texts like Sarvartha Chintamani, Jataka Parijata,> > > > > > Saravali, Phaladeepika etc. One or two rudimentary slokas > > > related > > > > to> > > > > > the same we may find in these texts as well. Some slokas > > > relevant > > > > to> > > > > > the may find a place in many ancient Rishi horas (Whereever I > > > find> > > > > > such a reference I will quote them for sure). But for sure none > > > > of the> > > > > > other texts (except BPHS, Meenaraja hora, Hora Pradeepam) > > > > discusses> > > > > > this subject extensively in detail as per my current knowledge > > > and> > > > > > understanding. As far as ancient texts (Rishi horas) are > > > > concerned it> > > > > > is possible that the slokas that discuss this subject > > > extensively > > > > are> > > > > > lost, even though they might have done the same (since they use > > > 7-> > > > fold> > > > > > method).> > > > > > Love,> > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Yes, you are homing in on the "pure" point. That's what this> > > > > > particular aspect of interpretation of a chart is about. That's > > > > the> > > > > > way (the part-way) to go about it -- core task, winkling the > > > > secrets> > > > > > out of a chart. Now we have to agree on who next to Parasara we > > > > take> > > > > > on board for comparision. You have named two: Meenaraja Hora, > > > and > > > > Hora> > > > > > Pradeepam. Who else? We don't have to go by the overall > > > > reputation of> > > > > > the text. We may narrow down our selection to the aspect of> > > > > > interpretation in question in a treatise that may not otherwise > > > be> > > > > > rated very high. What say? > > > > > > > So who else? I mean which other authority/-ies or classics? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sotto Voce: I don't want us, you and me, to be cynosures of > > > (the> > > > > > galaxy of) our star-gazers in this firmament. Onlookers all? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > > > You are right - to the point. I agree. But as far as LL going > > > > to H-7> > > > > > > is concerned, the special point regarding ' if LL is a > > > malefic' > > > > is> > > > > > > mentioned in the sloka itself; there for we cannot discount > > > it > > > > as far> > > > > > > as the prediction related to the same given in the sloka is > > > > concerned.> > > > > > > For other results regarding LL in H-7 (which we would discuss > > > in> > > > > > > detail as this discussion progresses) I agree absolutely with > > > > your> > > > > > > logic and argument. > > > > > > > As far as LL in H-5 is concerned, I think there could be the > > > > point> > > > > > > I mentioned under consideration (for BPHS results) even > > > though > > > > the> > > > > > > same is NOT mentioned in the sloka. But as you have clearly > > > > stated,> > > > > > > the normal expected result for the same SHOULD BE ''susuta' > > > > (good> > > > > > > child, or birth of children). Let us keep this doubt open > > > till > > > > we> > > > > > > cross verify the results with the derivations given in other > > > > texts and> > > > > > > come to a logical conclusion/derivation.> > > > > > > We always have 2 options open to cross check the results > > > > predicted> > > > > > > by BPHS in this context-> > > > > > > 1) Cross verify the results with the predictions given in > > > other> > > > > > > texts (especially Meenaraja Hora & Hora Pradeepam)> > > > > > > 2) Compare the predicted results with actual results observed.> > > > > > > But still, the base rule as you pointed out is -> > > > > > > ==>> > > > > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is: L-1 > > > > goes > > > > > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly discounted. > > > > Clear?> > > > > > > <==> > > > > > > To state in other words, the base rule is -> > > > > > > "LL going to H-1, H-2, H-3 etc ONLY should be considered, and > > > > other> > > > > > > factors (such as LL being malefic/benefic, LL being aspected > > > by> > > > > > > malefic/benefic etc) should be clearly discounted"> > > > > > > We will even touch this base rule with corollaries, ONLY WHEN > > > > the> > > > > > > special condition is mentioned in the sloka itself; just not > > > to> > > > > > > contaminate the result indicated by the sloka.> > > > > > > If this corollary is not there, I agree to your statement > > > > completely.> > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > > > , rk dash> > > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Sreenadh,> > > > > > > > I think we should keep out the factor of L1 being a natural> > > > > > > malefic -- the logic you have used for those outcomes of L-1 > > > > going to> > > > > > > 5th, 7th hse (death of first child, uninterested in life/wife > > > > etc). If> > > > > > > we must, then we have to qualify the deduction, saying "where > > > L-> > > > 5 (or> > > > > > > L-7) is a malefic or is afflicted". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What we are concerned at this stage of the 'ruling' is: L-1 > > > > goes> > > > > > > H-5, L-1 goes to H-7 etc, other factors clearly discounted. > > > > Clear?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's carry on,> > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > > Dear RK ji,> > > > > > > > Your concerns are right - important points mentioned. Let > > > us > > > > > > > > together try to find out the reasons based on our logic.> > > > > > > > > When in 1st : Uncertain in decision> > > > > > > > Lagna lord in lagna gives the native all the good qualities > > > > such as > > > > > > > > compassion, kindness, softness of mind, emotional approach > > > > etc. > > > > > > > > Result? Uncertainty in decision. I think this account for > > > the> > > > > logical > > > > > > > > basis of the above derivation.> > > > > > > > > When in 2nd: Many wives> > > > > > > > That is just natural. 2nd and 11th house signify second > > > > marriage. > > > > > > > > When the lagna lord comes in contact with any house the > > > > native is > > > > > > > > sure to get the results related to that. Lagna lord in 2nd > > > > house > > > > > > > > makes the native beautiful, talkative, liked by women etc. > > > > Thus it > > > > > > > > turns out that it is natural to have many relations > > > (wives). > > > > It > > > > > > > > should be noted that for lagna lord in lagna, and lagna > > > lord > > > > in 2nd > > > > > > > > house - 2 wives and many wives are derived - NOT as a bad> > > > > result, but > > > > > > > > as a good result; indicating that the native will have every> > > > > kind of > > > > > > > > luxury including women.> > > > > > > > > When in 3rd : Many kinds of wealth, 2 wives> > > > > > > > Valorous - thus many kinds of wealth; 3rd is a house > > > usually > > > > is of > > > > > > > > MIXED nature indicating mixed/various/many results. That is > > > > why the > > > > > > > > derivation 'Many kinds of wealth'. 2nd from 2nd - many > > > kinds > > > > of > > > > > > > > wealth - i think this is why you doubt that it could be due > > > to> > > > > bhavat > > > > > > > > bhavam. 2 wives - i have no idea supply in this regard.> > > > > > > > > When in 4th: Lust> > > > > > > > No idea as of now.> > > > > > > > > When in 5th: Angry, loss of the 1st child > > > > > > > > If lagna lord is in 5th, any affliction to it can affect > > > both > > > > 5th > > > > > > > > house and lagna equally - making a double impact. That is > > > why > > > > the > > > > > > > > prediction 'loss of child'. Why 1st child - 5th signify 1st > > > > child > > > > > > > > more i doubt. Possibly here Parasara deviates a bit from > > > the > > > > > > > > conventional prediction owing to the possibility of 'double> > > > > impact' i > > > > > > > > think. The standard prediction should be (we will verify) > > > > gain of > > > > > > > > child, as you mentioned. (But first the child should be > > > born > > > > for it > > > > > > > > to perish - this may make both the derivations consistent)> > > > > > > > > When in 7th: Uninterested in worldly life and wife > > > > > > > > This applies only if lagna lord is a malefic. Therefore it > > > is > > > > > > > > logically ok.> > > > > > > > > When in 12th: Good health> > > > > > > > No idea as of now.> > > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , rk dash > > > > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Good start. I agree. First theoretical consideration then > > > > we test > > > > > > > > the rules against actual charts. Here's a small beginning > > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > > examination of lagna lord's bhavashraya phala in BHPH. I'll > > > go> > > > > about > > > > > > > > it by first picking out those phala (results) which are not > > > > self-> > > > > > > > evident. Here they are:> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 1st> > > > > > > > > Uncertain in decision> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 2nd> > > > > > > > > Many wives> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 3rd> > > > > > > > > Many kinds of wealth (bhavat bhavam?), 2 wives> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 4th> > > > > > > > > Lust> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 5th> > > > > > > > > Angry, loss of the 1st child > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 7th> > > > > > > > > Uninterested in worldly life and wife > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When in 12th> > > > > > > > > Good health> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > These results are not easy to discern, given the first > > > > factor > > > > > > > > (the linkage of the the self to the department represented > > > by > > > > the > > > > > > > > house the lagna lord tenants) and the sweeping good that > > > > lagna lord > > > > > > > > brings to the bhava it goes to. Take its placement in 5th. > > > > Why loss > > > > > > > > of child at all? Most other works declare, 'susuta', > > > meaning > > > > good > > > > > > > > progeny. I'll cite one such at a later stage for all house > > > of> > > > > tenancy > > > > > > > > as far as 1st lord is concerned. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One more thing I'd like to think aloud about. Rule says > > > > that any > > > > > > > > lord that goes to a dusthana will bring detriment to the > > > > house the > > > > > > > > planet is lord of. Now how do we reconcile the L1 in 12th > > > > ensuring > > > > > > > > good health? Will it take care of the attrition of body > > > (12th > > > > from > > > > > > > > 1st hse, ie body) without itself being subject to > > > detriment? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > Dear All,> > > > > > > > > The primary derivations for Lagna lord in various houses > > > as > > > > per > > > > > > > > BPHS is given below. I invite all to start a discussion on > > > the> > > > > same. > > > > > > > > > =================================> > > > > > > > > As per BPHS, for Lagna lord in -> > > > > > > > > Lagna: healthy body, courageous, uncertain in decisions, > > > 2 > > > > wives> > > > > > > > > 2nd house: knowledgeable, good earnings, happiness, good > > > > habits, > > > > > > > > righteous, many wives, good qualities.> > > > > > > > > 3rd house: valorous like a lion, all kinds of wealth, 2 > > > > wives, > > > > > > > > intelligent.> > > > > > > > > 4th house: love and affection from healthy mother with > > > good > > > > > > > > longevity, many brothers/sisters, lust, beauty and good > > > > qualities.> > > > > > > > > 5th house: angry, moderate happiness from children, loss > > > of > > > > first > > > > > > > > born (child), admired by government and authorities. > > > > > > > > > 6th house: (especially if aspected by malefics) trouble > > > > from > > > > > > > > enemies, bad health.> > > > > > > > > 7th house: (especially if Lagna lord is a malefic) his > > > wife > > > > will > > > > > > > > die early (or married life will not go long), he will > > > become > > > > > > > > uninterested in worldly life and wife, will be detached > > > > towards his > > > > > > > > native land and wander/visit many places, It is possible > > > that > > > > he > > > > > > > > won't be much wealthy (he would be a poor man) or also that > > > he> > > > > would > > > > > > > > be a very wealthy person like a king.> > > > > > > > > 8th house: master of some branch of knowledge, troubled > > > by > > > > > > > > diseases, interested in others wives, will be interested in > > > > all> > > > > kinds > > > > > > > > of games such as cards, chess, dice, lottery and so on, > > > very > > > > much > > > > > > > > angry.> > > > > > > > > 9th house: lucky, loved by the public, devotee of Vishnu,> > > > > master of > > > > > > > > words and oratory, will have good wealth wife and children. > > > > > > > > > 10th house: admired by government and people in power > > > (the > > > > native > > > > > > > > will have a good job), he would be a government servant, > > > very > > > > much > > > > > > > > popular.> > > > > > > > > 11th house: much income from many sources, good > > > popularity > > > > > > > > (popularity due to good deeds, celebrity), good qualities, > > > > many> > > > > wives.> > > > > > > > > 12th house: good health, extravagant without reason, > > > angry > > > > > > > > (especially if not benefics are present in 12th and if no > > > > benefic > > > > > > > > aspects 12th) > > > > > > > > > =================================> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , manju > > > > chawla > > > > > > > > <manjuch2001@> wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Thank You Sreenadhji> > > > > > > > > > we would learn this subject in this way.You are really> > > > > helping us > > > > > > > > God bless you> > > > > > > > > > regards> > > > > > > > > > manju> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh sreesog@ wrote:> > > > > > > > > > Dear All,> > > > > > > > > > Let us start a new discussion on the subject "What > > > should > > > > be> > > > > > > > > > predicted for Lagna lord in Various houses?" - let the> > > > > discussion > > > > > > > > go> > > > > > > > > > first and then comparison of it with actual results.> > > > > > > > > > Love,> > > > > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "I am careful not to confuse excellence with > > > > > > > > perfection,Excellence-I can reach for,Perfection is God's> > > > > business---> > > > > > > > Michael J.Fox> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ready for the edge of your seat? 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What should be predicted for Lagna lord in Various houses? / Rules and Routes

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