Vasishth -- Mean places of Stars from 10000 BC to 12030 AD!

[Guest guest]

Dear friends,

Namaskar!

 

As you would be aware, I was preparing a

program/software for generating the Mean places of junction stars of all the

twenty-eight Vedic/Vedanga-Jyotisha/Pauranic nakshatras (including Abhijit)

besides the seven Stars of Saptarshi (constellation Ursa Major) and other

important stars like Agastya (Sirius), Lubdhaka (Canopus), Dhruva (Polaris) etc.

etc.

 

It is with great deal of labour and after a lot of experimentation

that I have succeeded in doing so! A program “Vasishth” has

been uploaded on HinduCalendar forum. It has the following features:

1. Based

as it is on FK5 data, it is one of the most accurate and the latest programs

available as on date anywhere in the world!

2. It

generates the Mean places of as many as 47 Stars.

3. The

generated table will contain the following data: a) FK5 Star Catalogue No.;(b) Greek

(astronomical) name; © Star name (common name); (d) Indian name (e) Magnitude

(f) Distance in Light Years (g) Longitudes (DMS)---Degrees, minutes, seconds; (h)

+/- (i.e. N/S) latitudes in DMS; (i) Right Ascension (HMS); (j) +/- (i.e. N/S)

Declinations (DMS).

4. The

above details can be generated for any date from 10000 BC to 12030 AD.

5. All

the information about names of the stars etc. is based on the Saha Report of

the Calendar Reform Committee and as contained in the Indian Astronomical

Ephemeris published by India Meteorological Department, New Delhi, year after year. Some

nakshatra groups contain more than one Star and both those Stars have been

included.

6. All

the data are generated for Mean Equator and Equinox of date.

7. Since

the data in the FK5 catalogue are in equatorial co-ordinates, due care has been

taken while precessing them and highly sophisticated matrix manipulation tables

for X, Y and Z co-ordinates have been used so that the results are as correct

as is humanly possible!

8. For

converting Equatorial to Ecliptic co-ordinates, Mean Obliquity of Ecliptic has

been used and since the IAU formula for the same is not satisfactory over a

long period of time, as such, Laskar’s OE formula, as given in “Astronomy

and Astrophysics”, Vol. 157, page 68 (1986) has been used.

9. The

accuracy of the data generated is about 10 arc-seconds plus/minus (at the most)

between 3000 BC and 3000 AD and beyond those periods it may be at the

most up-to plus/minus sixty arc-seconds i.e. just one arc-minute!

10. The

data generated are actually for FK5 time which is slightly different from Dynamical

(i.e. Ephemeris) Time. But the precessional motion being about 50.3

arc-seconds per year, it does not make much difference for a short period of

time of a few seconds/minutes! Similarly, while converting the data to

Ecliptic co-ordinates, corrections involving the Plane of Ecliptic have been

ignored since they too are negligible!

11. Due

care has been taken about the accuracy of manipulating Proper Motion of the

Stars which is miniscule, being usually less than one hundredth of an

arc-second per year!

12. The

positions of the Stars are from Vernal Equinox of the date for which they are

generated! In the jargon of “Vedic astrologers” you can say

they are Sayana longitudes, when actually such a term is meaningless in

astronomy!

13. You

can, however, calculate even “almighty” Lahiri “nirayana”

( actually niradhara---baseless!) longitudes also from the same table for any

date from 10000 BC to 12030 AD. Just give it a try and you will be

convinced as to how anti-Vedic and devoid of common-sense such longitudes are!

 

It Must be mentioned here that all this exercise is

being done just to show to the so called “Vedic astrologers” as to

how baseless their claims of linking the so called nirayana Rashis to

nakshatras, whether the so called sayana or the so called nirayana are! Similarly,

linking nakshatras to the so called Sayana Rashis is much more than madness, since

that declares to the whole world as to how bankrupt we are about the

astronomical knowledge of our own calendars!

 

It will also go a long way to help us to prove as to

how useless and misleading our sidhantas like the Surya Sidhanta, the

Aryabhati, the Brahma-sphuta-Sidhata etc. have been as far as their knowledge

of stars goes!

 

This is a Beta version and there is every

possibility that in spite of best efforts, some “bugs” may be

there. I shall, therefore, be obliged for the feedback.

 

It was pointed out by some people that I am doing

all this exercise since I am getting some funds from some “institutions”.

No, it is all a labour of love and the only reward I am asking for is that

WE MUST PUT OUR CALENDARS BACK ON THE TRACKS SINCE IT HAS BEEN DERAILED BY “VEDIC

ASTROLOGERS” AND “DHARMACHARYAS” WHO DO NOT KNOW EVEN ABC OF

EITHER SIDHANTIC OR MODERN ASTRONOMY – LEAST OF ALL OUR DHARMASHASTRAS!

 

As such, just log on to

http://grouops.HinduCalendar

and download the program without any obligation.

 

With regards,

Avtar Krishen Kaul

[Guest guest]

akandabaratam , " Avtar Krishen Kaul "

<jyotirved wrote:

 

Shri Paul Kekai Manansala ji,

Namaskar!

 

<Understanding " Vedic " astronomy/astrology may require a program that

can give the approximate helical risings and settings of stars>

 

Your suggestions are always quite eye-opening!

 

More than a year back you had pointed out that the Vedic rishis

could not be talking of imaginary nakshatras/stars when they

said " krittikasu agnim adadheeta " and as such, the nakshatras could

not be linked to sayana rashis! Those words were a real turning

point in my thinking since till then, like S. B. Dikshit and others,

I was clubbing so called Sayana Rashis with nakshatras, thinking

that that was what was done in the past!

 

Anyway, since heliacal rising and setting of stars requires

different degrees of difference for different latitudes for

different stars, the easiest way out is to include the Right

Ascension of the sun for that date for which the longitudes etc. are

generated. That way, anyone who wants to check as to which stars,

if any, were " comubst " , on that date, can find the mutual

difference of the RA of the sun and the concerned star to have a

rough idea about the heliacal rising/setting.

 

Many thanks once again for the suggestion.

With regards,

Avtar Krishen Kaul

PS Through this post, I request other members as well to send their

suggestion for further improvement int he program.

AKK

 

akandabaratam , " Paul Kekai Manansala " <pkm@>

wrote:

>

> Understanding " Vedic " astronomy/astrology may require a program

that

> can give the approximate helical risings and settings of stars.

>

> Regards,

> Paul Kekai Manansala

> Quests of the Dragon and Bird Clan

> http://sambali.blogspot.com/

>

 

--- End forwarded message ---

[Guest guest]

Dear Avtar Krishen Kaul,

 

>>...like S. B. Dikshit and others, I was clubbing so called Sayana

Rashis with nakshatras, thinking that that was what was done in the

past!...<<

 

Please correct me if I am wrong, but didn't Professor David Pingree

also make the mistake of clubbing the Sayana Rashis with the

Nakshatras? I seem to remember that he did exactly that.

 

In my opinion the astronomical descriptions from the Vedic period only

only make sense if we consider the fact that they had two different

zodiacs, 1) A day-time zodiac based on the Solar movement, i.e. the

Sayana zodiac, for calendar making and agricultural purposes. In

addition to this they had a Night-time zodiac, i.e. 2) the Nirayana

zodiac, for the Nakshatras and recording the movements of the Moon and

planets.

 

According to Vedanga Jyotisha by Lagadha the very purpose of Jyotish

is to find out the right timings for the worships and rituals. Lagadha

has mentioned certain Nakshatras to be consider as inauspicious for

rituals. It does however seem likely that both Sayana and Nirayana

were used in connection to the timing of rituals, depending upon the

circumstances and the kinds of rituals.

 

It makes sense to realize the fact that Ayana and Ritus were based on

Sayana, since it is based on the equinox-points. But certain

astrological classics like Horaratnam of Balabhadra makes the claim

that this should be based on Nirayana, which seems absurd. There are

actually a number of astronomical flaws like that in Horaratnam.

 

Anyway, from an astrological point of view it is perhaps more

interesting to find out how and when the Nirayana zodiac originated. I

believe the Maitrayana Brahmaya Upanishad (verse 6.14) gives the

earliest description of the Nirayana zodiac. Please read the following

quotation:

 

>>...And thus it has been said elsewhere: Food is the cause of all

this, time of food, and the sun is the cause of time. The (visible)

form of time is the year, consisting of twelve months, made up of

Nimeshas (twinklings) and other measures. Of the year one half (when

the sun moves northward) belongs to Agni, the other to Varuna (when

the sun moves southward). That which belongs to Agni begins with the

asterism of Magha and ends with half of the asterism of Sravishtha,

the sun stepping down northward. That which belongs to Soma (instead

of Varuna) begins with the asterism (of Aslesha), sacred to the

Serpents, and ends with half of the asterism of Sravishtha, the sun

stepping up southward. And then there (are the months) one by one,

belonging to the year, each consisting of nine-fourths of asterisms

(two asterisms and a quarter being the twelfth part of the passage of

the sun through the twenty-seven Nakshatras), each determined by the

sun moving together with the asterisms. Because time is imperceptible

by sense, therefore this (the progress of the stin, & c.) is its

evidence, and by it alone is time proved to exist...<<

 

Very friendly,

Finn Wandahl

[Guest guest]

Dear Finn ji & Kaul ji,

==>

I believe the Maitrayana Brahmaya Upanishad (verse 6.14) gives the

earliest description of the Nirayana zodiac. Please read the following

quotation:

" And then there (are the months) one by one, belonging to the year,

each consisting of nine-fourths of asterisms (two asterisms and a

quarter being the twelfth part of the passage of the sun through the

twenty-seven Nakshatras), each determined by the sun moving together

with the asterisms. "

<==

Can any of you provide me the exact quote in Sanskrit? It seems to

be very interesting information and quote. Thanks to Finn ji for

providing this info.

Love and Hugs,

Sreenadh

 

, " Finn Wandahl "

<finn.wandahl wrote:

>

> Dear Avtar Krishen Kaul,

>

> >>...like S. B. Dikshit and others, I was clubbing so called Sayana

> Rashis with nakshatras, thinking that that was what was done in the

> past!...<<

>

> Please correct me if I am wrong, but didn't Professor David Pingree

> also make the mistake of clubbing the Sayana Rashis with the

> Nakshatras? I seem to remember that he did exactly that.

>

> In my opinion the astronomical descriptions from the Vedic period only

> only make sense if we consider the fact that they had two different

> zodiacs, 1) A day-time zodiac based on the Solar movement, i.e. the

> Sayana zodiac, for calendar making and agricultural purposes. In

> addition to this they had a Night-time zodiac, i.e. 2) the Nirayana

> zodiac, for the Nakshatras and recording the movements of the Moon and

> planets.

>

> According to Vedanga Jyotisha by Lagadha the very purpose of Jyotish

> is to find out the right timings for the worships and rituals. Lagadha

> has mentioned certain Nakshatras to be consider as inauspicious for

> rituals. It does however seem likely that both Sayana and Nirayana

> were used in connection to the timing of rituals, depending upon the

> circumstances and the kinds of rituals.

>

> It makes sense to realize the fact that Ayana and Ritus were based on

> Sayana, since it is based on the equinox-points. But certain

> astrological classics like Horaratnam of Balabhadra makes the claim

> that this should be based on Nirayana, which seems absurd. There are

> actually a number of astronomical flaws like that in Horaratnam.

>

> Anyway, from an astrological point of view it is perhaps more

> interesting to find out how and when the Nirayana zodiac originated. I

> believe the Maitrayana Brahmaya Upanishad (verse 6.14) gives the

> earliest description of the Nirayana zodiac. Please read the following

> quotation:

>

> >>...And thus it has been said elsewhere: Food is the cause of all

> this, time of food, and the sun is the cause of time. The (visible)

> form of time is the year, consisting of twelve months, made up of

> Nimeshas (twinklings) and other measures. Of the year one half (when

> the sun moves northward) belongs to Agni, the other to Varuna (when

> the sun moves southward). That which belongs to Agni begins with the

> asterism of Magha and ends with half of the asterism of Sravishtha,

> the sun stepping down northward. That which belongs to Soma (instead

> of Varuna) begins with the asterism (of Aslesha), sacred to the

> Serpents, and ends with half of the asterism of Sravishtha, the sun

> stepping up southward. And then there (are the months) one by one,

> belonging to the year, each consisting of nine-fourths of asterisms

> (two asterisms and a quarter being the twelfth part of the passage of

> the sun through the twenty-seven Nakshatras), each determined by the

> sun moving together with the asterisms. Because time is imperceptible

> by sense, therefore this (the progress of the stin, & c.) is its

> evidence, and by it alone is time proved to exist...<<

>

> Very friendly,

> Finn Wandahl

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Sreenadh,

 

Unfortunately I cannot help you there, but being one of the 11 major

upanishads the " Maitrayana Brahmaya Upanishad " should not be too

difficult to find in its original sanskrit version.

 

However, if you are interested I can email you the version that I have

got, but for that I would need your email address.

 

:-)

 

Finn

 

 

, " Sreenadh "

<sreesog wrote:

>

> Dear Finn ji & Kaul ji,

> ==>

> I believe the Maitrayana Brahmaya Upanishad (verse 6.14) gives the

> earliest description of the Nirayana zodiac. Please read the following

> quotation:

> " And then there (are the months) one by one, belonging to the year,

> each consisting of nine-fourths of asterisms (two asterisms and a

> quarter being the twelfth part of the passage of the sun through the

> twenty-seven Nakshatras), each determined by the sun moving together

> with the asterisms. "

> <==

> Can any of you provide me the exact quote in Sanskrit? It seems to

> be very interesting information and quote. Thanks to Finn ji for

> providing this info.

> Love and Hugs,

> Sreenadh

>

> , " Finn Wandahl "

> <finn.wandahl@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Avtar Krishen Kaul,

> >

> > >>...like S. B. Dikshit and others, I was clubbing so called Sayana

> > Rashis with nakshatras, thinking that that was what was done in the

> > past!...<<

> >

> > Please correct me if I am wrong, but didn't Professor David Pingree

> > also make the mistake of clubbing the Sayana Rashis with the

> > Nakshatras? I seem to remember that he did exactly that.

> >

> > In my opinion the astronomical descriptions from the Vedic period only

> > only make sense if we consider the fact that they had two different

> > zodiacs, 1) A day-time zodiac based on the Solar movement, i.e. the

> > Sayana zodiac, for calendar making and agricultural purposes. In

> > addition to this they had a Night-time zodiac, i.e. 2) the Nirayana

> > zodiac, for the Nakshatras and recording the movements of the Moon and

> > planets.

> >

> > According to Vedanga Jyotisha by Lagadha the very purpose of Jyotish

> > is to find out the right timings for the worships and rituals. Lagadha

> > has mentioned certain Nakshatras to be consider as inauspicious for

> > rituals. It does however seem likely that both Sayana and Nirayana

> > were used in connection to the timing of rituals, depending upon the

> > circumstances and the kinds of rituals.

> >

> > It makes sense to realize the fact that Ayana and Ritus were based on

> > Sayana, since it is based on the equinox-points. But certain

> > astrological classics like Horaratnam of Balabhadra makes the claim

> > that this should be based on Nirayana, which seems absurd. There are

> > actually a number of astronomical flaws like that in Horaratnam.

> >

> > Anyway, from an astrological point of view it is perhaps more

> > interesting to find out how and when the Nirayana zodiac originated. I

> > believe the Maitrayana Brahmaya Upanishad (verse 6.14) gives the

> > earliest description of the Nirayana zodiac. Please read the following

> > quotation:

> >

> > >>...And thus it has been said elsewhere: Food is the cause of all

> > this, time of food, and the sun is the cause of time. The (visible)

> > form of time is the year, consisting of twelve months, made up of

> > Nimeshas (twinklings) and other measures. Of the year one half (when

> > the sun moves northward) belongs to Agni, the other to Varuna (when

> > the sun moves southward). That which belongs to Agni begins with the

> > asterism of Magha and ends with half of the asterism of Sravishtha,

> > the sun stepping down northward. That which belongs to Soma (instead

> > of Varuna) begins with the asterism (of Aslesha), sacred to the

> > Serpents, and ends with half of the asterism of Sravishtha, the sun

> > stepping up southward. And then there (are the months) one by one,

> > belonging to the year, each consisting of nine-fourths of asterisms

> > (two asterisms and a quarter being the twelfth part of the passage of

> > the sun through the twenty-seven Nakshatras), each determined by the

> > sun moving together with the asterisms. Because time is imperceptible

> > by sense, therefore this (the progress of the stin, & c.) is its

> > evidence, and by it alone is time proved to exist...<<

> >

> > Very friendly,

> > Finn Wandahl

> >

>

[Guest guest]

, " Avtar Krishen

Kaul " <jyotirved wrote:

 

Shri Sreenadh ji,

Namaskar!

<Can any of you provide me the exact quote in Sanskrit? It seems to

be very interesting information and quote. >

 

The exact mantra in Sanskrit is from Maitrayani Upanishad (5/14) and

not 6/14 as suggested by Shri Finn Wandahl. There is a collection

of about three hundred Upanishadas published by Motilal Banarasi

Dass, Delhi. It conains just the original Sanskrit mantras and

Maitrayani Upanishad is listed as 25th Upanishad in that

collection. That collection also does not refer to any Maitrayani

Hamsopanishad, or Maitrayanai Brahmopanishad though there is a

separate Hamsopanishad as well as a Brahmopanishad in that

collection.

The prominent eleven Upanishadas are:

1) Isha, 2) Kena 3) Katha 4) Prashna 5) Mundaka 6) Mandukya 7)

Taittiriya 8) Aitreya 9) Chhandogya 10) Brihadarnyaka and 11)

Shvetashvatra

 

These are suppoed to be a part of " Prasthana trayee " i.e. " three

stages of evolution of a human being -- the Gita, the Upanishadas

and the Brahmasutras " It was on this very " Prasthana trayee " that

Acharya Shankara has writtern commentaries/gloss!

 

 

In any case, the exact mantra of Mairayani Upanishad 5/14 is:

 

" atha anyatra api uktam annam va asya sarvasya yonih Kalashchai

annasyai suryo yonih kalasya

tasyatad roopam yannimeshadi kala sambritam-------dwaadashatmakam

vatsaram etasyagneyam ardham ardham varunam

Maghadyam shravishthardham agneyam kramen utkramen sarpardham

shravishthardhantam saumyam

tatraikaikamatmano navamshaka sacharakvidham saukshmyatvad etat

prmanam anenaiv prameeyate hi kalah-------

na vina pramanena prameyasyoplabdhih

prameyo api pramantam prithaktvadupati aatma sambodhanartham itevam

hi aha

yavatyo vai kalasya kalastavateeshu charati asav yah kalam brahmeti

upaseeta kalstasyasti dooram aprsarati itevam hi aaha

kalat sravanti bhootani kalad vridhim prayanti cha kale chastam

niyachhatnti kalo moortiramoortiman "

 

I have put the relevant portion of the mantra between two dashes (--

-)

Regards,

AKK

, " Sreenadh "

<sreesog@> wrote:

>

> Dear Finn ji & Kaul ji,

> ==>

> I believe the Maitrayana Brahmaya Upanishad (verse 6.14) gives the

> earliest description of the Nirayana zodiac. Please read the

following

> quotation:

> " And then there (are the months) one by one, belonging to the

year,

> each consisting of nine-fourths of asterisms (two asterisms and a

> quarter being the twelfth part of the passage of the sun through

the

> twenty-seven Nakshatras), each determined by the sun moving

together

> with the asterisms. "

> <==

> Can any of you provide me the exact quote in Sanskrit? It seems

to

> be very interesting information and quote. Thanks to Finn ji for

> providing this info.

> Love and Hugs,

> Sreenadh

>

> , " Finn Wandahl "

> <finn.wandahl@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Avtar Krishen Kaul,

> >

> > >>...like S. B. Dikshit and others, I was clubbing so called

Sayana

> > Rashis with nakshatras, thinking that that was what was done in

the

> > past!...<<

> >

> > Please correct me if I am wrong, but didn't Professor David

Pingree

> > also make the mistake of clubbing the Sayana Rashis with the

> > Nakshatras? I seem to remember that he did exactly that.

> >

> > In my opinion the astronomical descriptions from the Vedic

period only

> > only make sense if we consider the fact that they had two

different

> > zodiacs, 1) A day-time zodiac based on the Solar movement, i.e.

the

> > Sayana zodiac, for calendar making and agricultural purposes. In

> > addition to this they had a Night-time zodiac, i.e. 2) the

Nirayana

> > zodiac, for the Nakshatras and recording the movements of the

Moon and

> > planets.

> >

> > According to Vedanga Jyotisha by Lagadha the very purpose of

Jyotish

> > is to find out the right timings for the worships and rituals.

Lagadha

> > has mentioned certain Nakshatras to be consider as inauspicious

for

> > rituals. It does however seem likely that both Sayana and

Nirayana

> > were used in connection to the timing of rituals, depending upon

the

> > circumstances and the kinds of rituals.

> >

> > It makes sense to realize the fact that Ayana and Ritus were

based on

> > Sayana, since it is based on the equinox-points. But certain

> > astrological classics like Horaratnam of Balabhadra makes the

claim

> > that this should be based on Nirayana, which seems absurd. There

are

> > actually a number of astronomical flaws like that in

Horaratnam.

> >

> > Anyway, from an astrological point of view it is perhaps more

> > interesting to find out how and when the Nirayana zodiac

originated. I

> > believe the Maitrayana Brahmaya Upanishad (verse 6.14) gives the

> > earliest description of the Nirayana zodiac. Please read the

following

> > quotation:

> >

> > >>...And thus it has been said elsewhere: Food is the cause of

all

> > this, time of food, and the sun is the cause of time. The

(visible)

> > form of time is the year, consisting of twelve months, made up of

> > Nimeshas (twinklings) and other measures. Of the year one half

(when

> > the sun moves northward) belongs to Agni, the other to Varuna

(when

> > the sun moves southward). That which belongs to Agni begins with

the

> > asterism of Magha and ends with half of the asterism of

Sravishtha,

> > the sun stepping down northward. That which belongs to Soma

(instead

> > of Varuna) begins with the asterism (of Aslesha), sacred to the

> > Serpents, and ends with half of the asterism of Sravishtha, the

sun

> > stepping up southward. And then there (are the months) one by

one,

> > belonging to the year, each consisting of nine-fourths of

asterisms

> > (two asterisms and a quarter being the twelfth part of the

passage of

> > the sun through the twenty-seven Nakshatras), each determined by

the

> > sun moving together with the asterisms. Because time is

imperceptible

> > by sense, therefore this (the progress of the stin, & c.) is its

> > evidence, and by it alone is time proved to exist...<<

> >

> > Very friendly,

> > Finn Wandahl

> >

>

 

--- End forwarded message ---