Sri Ram’s Horoscope and the Preservation of Astrological Knowledge

[Guest guest]

Discussion on Rama's horoscope is just another expression of imagination

leading people astray. Zodiac known since the historical times of

Seleucid Era (300BC) is only sidereal and fixed. Tropical notion i.e. V.

Equinox as 0 was introduced by Hipparchus in 2nd century BC. Greek and

Babylonian horoscopes based on the sidereal fixed zodiac predates

Hipparchus.

 

Rama's horoscope may be a Jugglery just as the case with a similar

horoscope of Sankaracharya which got concocted in 9th century. Psychics

in the West is making many imaginative theories as we see in the reply

below of some so called Western Occultist.

 

chandra hari

 

 

, " robertwilkinson "

<robtw wrote:

>

> <This posting is for Lori Tompkins, a member of this forum>

>

> Sri Ram's Horoscope and the Preservation of Astrological Knowledge

[Guest guest]

I believe you have your facts wrong on this account Chandra-ji.

The widely respected scholar, Subhash Kak writes in his article -

Babylonian and Indian Astronomy: Early Connections:

" … the key ideas found in the Babylonian astronomy of 700 BC are

already present in the Vedic texts, which even by the most

conservative reckoning are older than that period. I shall also show

that the solar zodiac (ra´sis) was used in Vedic India and I shall

present a plausible derivation of the symbols of the solar zodiac from

the deities of the segments. In view of the attested presence of the

Indic people in the Mesopotamian region prior to 700 BC, it is likely

that if at all the two astronomies influenced each other, the

dependence is of the Babylonian on the Indian. " Subhash Kak -

February, 2003

The points of Kak's thesis are amply proven in his scholarly article

moreover, they are entirely consistent with the Indo-Centric Cosmology

that Ms. Norelli-Bachelet has carefully articulated in her numerous

books and essays. I think perhaps your error is derived from a

fragmented understanding of the Vedic worldview.

 

Ms. Norelli-Bachelet has published numerous examples of how Esoteric

Astology runs entirely through the Veda but none so compelling as

appear in the verses to Vishnu Trivikrama (RigVeda 1.154) who measures

out the universe in his famous 'Three Strides'. In his Secret of the

Veda, Sri Aurobindo translates these verses in a chapter entitled

Vishnu - the All Pervading Godhead. It is reasonable to believe, given

his work and mission, that he would have taken special care with these

verses. It has also come to light through hitherto unpublished

documents that Sri Aurobindo had a profound interest and faith in

astrology. When he translated Vishnu's three steps as a Lion, a Bull

and the Friend of man, there can be no question that would have

understood their esoteric astrological significance.

" Vishnu's famous three strides (to measure the universe) cannot be

more revealing. The first `step' is like a lion (Leo), according to

the Veda; the second is a bull (Taurus); the third, and most

revealing of all, is the Friend. This is the same Aquarius of

Agastya's birth, which is also known as the sign of the Friend. More

conclusively, they are given in their correct backward moving order,

and are Vishnu's own zodiacal domains because of their quality of

PRESERVATION (`Fixed' in zodiacal terminology, stable, balancing)… If

the Eagle, the fourth sign, was left out of Vishnu's measuring it is

because this Eagle is Garuda, his own carrier. He begins his measuring

from that point in the wheel, also known as Scorpio, and takes `three

steps'. Scorpio, otherwise known as the zodiacal Eagle, would be the

fourth in correct sequence, similar to [the imagery in the biblical

Revelation] John's text. " Patrizia Norelli-Bachelet

Additionally the signs are given in this backwards moving order

provide incontrovertible evidence that Vedic astronomers were

intimately familiar with the slow continuous westward movement of the

equinoxes around the ecliptic known as the 'Precession of the

Equinoxes', a phenomenon which determines the 'Cosmological Age'. The

Precession is hinted at in the Rig Veda in this hymn to Surya:

'Your two wheels, Surya, the Brahmins know in their measured rounds.

But the one wheel that is hidden, only the inspired know that.' (Rig

Veda 10.85-16)

If you believe that the Greek's knowledge of astrology predated the

Indian, please explain to us why the phenomena of Precession,

described by the Greek astronomer Hipparchus, only appeared much later

- in the 2nd century BC, long after it was mentioned in the Rig Veda.

 

 

,

" chandra_hari18 " <chandra_hari18 wrote:

>

>

> Discussion on Rama's horoscope is just another expression of

imagination

> leading people astray. Zodiac known since the historical times of

> Seleucid Era (300BC) is only sidereal and fixed. Tropical notion

i.e. V.

> Equinox as 0 was introduced by Hipparchus in 2nd century BC. Greek

and

> Babylonian horoscopes based on the sidereal fixed zodiac predates

> Hipparchus.

>

> Rama's horoscope may be a Jugglery just as the case with a similar

> horoscope of Sankaracharya which got concocted in 9th century.

Psychics

> in the West is making many imaginative theories as we see in the

reply

> below of some so called Western Occultist.

>

> chandra hari

>

>

> , " robertwilkinson "

> <robtw@> wrote:

> >

> > <This posting is for Lori Tompkins, a member of this forum>

> >

> > Sri Ram's Horoscope and the Preservation of Astrological Knowledge

>

[Guest guest]

Dear friend,

Prof. Kak is a good friend of mine. With due respect to him, I would like to tell you that the school of thought that denies Aryan invasion is gravely wrong in imagining indigenous Aryans and the Vedic cult. It is being repeatedly told that Aryan, Dravidian etc are terms invented by William Jones and other missionaries. This is not true and people parrot such views because they are not familiar with the Sanghakala literature in Tamil.

, "robertwilkinson" <robtw wrote:>> I believe you have your facts wrong on this account Chandra-ji. > The widely respected scholar, Subhash Kak writes in his article - > Babylonian and Indian Astronomy: Early Connections:> "… the key ideas found in the Babylonian astronomy of 700 BC are > already present in the Vedic texts, which even by the most > conservative reckoning are older than that period. I shall also show > that the solar zodiac (ra´sis) was used in Vedic India and I shall > present a plausible derivation of the symbols of the solar zodiac from > the deities of the segments. In view of the attested presence of the > Indic people in the Mesopotamian region prior to 700 BC, it is likely > that if at all the two astronomies influenced each other, the > dependence is of the Babylonian on the Indian." Subhash Kak - > February, 2003> The points of Kak's thesis are amply proven in his scholarly article > moreover, they are entirely consistent with the Indo-Centric Cosmology > that Ms. Norelli-Bachelet has carefully articulated in her numerous > books and essays. I think perhaps your error is derived from a > fragmented understanding of the Vedic worldview. > > Ms. Norelli-Bachelet has published numerous examples of how Esoteric > Astology runs entirely through the Veda but none so compelling as > appear in the verses to Vishnu Trivikrama (RigVeda 1.154) who measures > out the universe in his famous 'Three Strides'. In his Secret of the > Veda, Sri Aurobindo translates these verses in a chapter entitled > Vishnu - the All Pervading Godhead. It is reasonable to believe, given > his work and mission, that he would have taken special care with these > verses. It has also come to light through hitherto unpublished > documents that Sri Aurobindo had a profound interest and faith in > astrology. When he translated Vishnu's three steps as a Lion, a Bull > and the Friend of man, there can be no question that would have > understood their esoteric astrological significance. > "Vishnu's famous three strides (to measure the universe) cannot be > more revealing. The first `step' is like a lion (Leo), according to > the Veda; the second is a bull (Taurus); the third, and most > revealing of all, is the Friend. This is the same Aquarius of > Agastya's birth, which is also known as the sign of the Friend. More > conclusively, they are given in their correct backward moving order, > and are Vishnu's own zodiacal domains because of their quality of > PRESERVATION (`Fixed' in zodiacal terminology, stable, balancing)… If > the Eagle, the fourth sign, was left out of Vishnu's measuring it is > because this Eagle is Garuda, his own carrier. He begins his measuring > from that point in the wheel, also known as Scorpio, and takes `three > steps'. Scorpio, otherwise known as the zodiacal Eagle, would be the > fourth in correct sequence, similar to [the imagery in the biblical > Revelation] John's text." Patrizia Norelli-Bachelet> Additionally the signs are given in this backwards moving order > provide incontrovertible evidence that Vedic astronomers were > intimately familiar with the slow continuous westward movement of the > equinoxes around the ecliptic known as the 'Precession of the > Equinoxes', a phenomenon which determines the 'Cosmological Age'. The > Precession is hinted at in the Rig Veda in this hymn to Surya:> 'Your two wheels, Surya, the Brahmins know in their measured rounds. > But the one wheel that is hidden, only the inspired know that.' (Rig > Veda 10.85-16)> If you believe that the Greek's knowledge of astrology predated the > Indian, please explain to us why the phenomena of Precession, > described by the Greek astronomer Hipparchus, only appeared much later > - in the 2nd century BC, long after it was mentioned in the Rig Veda. > > > , > "chandra_hari18" chandra_hari18@ wrote:> >> > > > Discussion on Rama's horoscope is just another expression of > imagination> > leading people astray. Zodiac known since the historical times of> > Seleucid Era (300BC) is only sidereal and fixed. Tropical notion > i.e. V.> > Equinox as 0 was introduced by Hipparchus in 2nd century BC. Greek > and> > Babylonian horoscopes based on the sidereal fixed zodiac predates> > Hipparchus.> > > > Rama's horoscope may be a Jugglery just as the case with a similar> > horoscope of Sankaracharya which got concocted in 9th century. > Psychics> > in the West is making many imaginative theories as we see in the > reply> > below of some so called Western Occultist.> > > > chandra hari> > > > > > , "robertwilkinson"> > <robtw@> wrote:> > >> > > <This posting is for Lori Tompkins, a member of this forum>> > >> > > Sri Ram's Horoscope and the Preservation of Astrological Knowledge> >>

[Guest guest]

Dear John ji,==>> what happens soon?<== Nothing! Chandra hari ji will stick to his understanding and Subhash Kak ji to his own and both of them will continue enriching our understanding providing divergent but beutiful perspectives. Both of them are great scholars - and both of them had contributed much in their own way, to our knowledge and understanding. The same can be told about Patria ji as well. So there is no conflict - when all of them continue to contribute in their own field and does not go to others home - and attack their privacy. ) So just enjoy the learning and knowledge sharing. Note: Where ever we go – we are supposed follow the major trend there, and not cause too much confusion. For example - * if I am going to Kaul ji's group I am supposed to listen and try to understand his perspective, more than trying to propagate and impose my perspective.

* If I am going to Ash's Ashataka varga group (KAS), then to I am supposed to follow his methods and his Ayanamsa to understand his methods better – and even when speaking out my different (If any) I need to be polite and understanding. * If I am going to KP group, then too I am supposed to listen more than talk – to understand their system – and thus to improve my knowledge by accepting anything valuable. The same holds true for everyone. * If Kaul ji comes here he too supposed to follow this rule (but alas! he does not know this simple thumb rule of communication!) * When Hari goes to Kak then Hari is supposed follow this rule and when Kak comes to Hari Kak ji supposed to follow this rule.

* When Hari goes to Patricia's group Hari is supposed to follow this and when Patricia goes to Haris group Patricia is supposed to follow this. It is those who are unaware of the basic thumb rules of mutual interaction that cause problems, too much unnecessary argumentation and troubles. If we are ready to listen and not only talk, and if we are learn and not only teach – then world would have been much better than what it is! So the point in this mail is - Every individual should listen to others perspective and limit and should be to the point himself in presenting his perspective when going to others domain. Those who violate this prime rule of interaction gains more disrespect than respect! Wired is the ways of the world! Anything presented not taking into account Kala (Time), Desa (Place/Environment), Patra (The one at the receiving end) causes more negative results to emerge than the positive ones – as Srinivas ji and Raghavan ji clarified many times. Rather than the intention, sincerity or knowledge – it is several other such minor (?) parameters that have the major control over events and situations! At times it demands huge effort from people to go beyond this and look at things from a higher plane. Or in other words everywhere we have to make ourselves better patras (means better and improved ones at the receiving end) – and what would be result? The rivers will start flowing in our direction and the world will start changing! So the first lesson of management is self improvement! I wonder how can I escape from this concept of `self improvement', which seems to come in everywhere!! You see I am an escapist! :=) And does too much blah blah.... ) Your mail was 3 words and I wrote 600+ words!You see - sure, I need too much self imporvement!

Love,Sreenadh , john arment <collinpeace wrote:>> what happens soon?> > > chandra_hari18 chandra_hari18 wrote:> Dear friend, > Prof. Kak is a good friend of mine. With due respect to him, I would like to tell you that the school of thought that denies Aryan invasion is gravely wrong in imagining indigenous Aryans and the Vedic cult. It is being repeatedly told that Aryan, Dravidian etc are terms invented by William Jones and other missionaries. This is not true and people parrot such views because they are not familiar with the Sanghakala literature in Tamil. > > , "robertwilkinson" robtw@ wrote:> >> > I believe you have your facts wrong on this account Chandra-ji. > > The widely respected scholar, Subhash Kak writes in his article - > > Babylonian and Indian Astronomy: Early Connections:> > "… the key ideas found in the Babylonian astronomy of 700 BC are > > already present in the Vedic texts, which even by the most > > conservative reckoning are older than that period. I shall also show > > that the solar zodiac (ra´sis) was used in Vedic India and I shall > > present a plausible derivation of the symbols of the solar zodiac from > > the deities of the segments. In view of the attested presence of the > > Indic people in the Mesopotamian region prior to 700 BC, it is likely > > that if at all the two astronomies influenced each other, the > > dependence is of the Babylonian on the Indian." Subhash Kak - > > February, 2003> > The points of Kak's thesis are amply proven in his scholarly article > > moreover, they are entirely consistent with the Indo-Centric Cosmology > > that Ms. Norelli-Bachelet has carefully articulated in her numerous > > books and essays. I think perhaps your error is derived from a > > fragmented understanding of the Vedic worldview. > > > > Ms. Norelli-Bachelet has published numerous examples of how Esoteric > > Astology runs entirely through the Veda but none so compelling as > > appear in the verses to Vishnu Trivikrama (RigVeda 1.154) who measures > > out the universe in his famous 'Three Strides'. In his Secret of the > > Veda, Sri Aurobindo translates these verses in a chapter entitled > > Vishnu - the All Pervading Godhead. It is reasonable to believe, given > > his work and mission, that he would have taken special care with these > > verses. It has also come to light through hitherto unpublished > > documents that Sri Aurobindo had a profound interest and faith in > > astrology. When he translated Vishnu's three steps as a Lion, a Bull > > and the Friend of man, there can be no question that would have > > understood their esoteric astrological significance. > > "Vishnu's famous three strides (to measure the universe) cannot be > > more revealing. The first `step' is like a lion (Leo), according to > > the Veda; the second is a bull (Taurus); the third, and most > > revealing of all, is the Friend. This is the same Aquarius of > > Agastya's birth, which is also known as the sign of the Friend. More > > conclusively, they are given in their correct backward moving order, > > and are Vishnu's own zodiacal domains because of their quality of > > PRESERVATION (`Fixed' in zodiacal terminology, stable, balancing)… If > > the Eagle, the fourth sign, was left out of Vishnu's measuring it is > > because this Eagle is Garuda, his own carrier. He begins his measuring > > from that point in the wheel, also known as Scorpio, and takes `three > > steps'. Scorpio, otherwise known as the zodiacal Eagle, would be the > > fourth in correct sequence, similar to [the imagery in the biblical > > Revelation] John's text." Patrizia Norelli-Bachelet> > Additionally the signs are given in this backwards moving order > > provide incontrovertible evidence that Vedic astronomers were > > intimately familiar with the slow continuous westward movement of the > > equinoxes around the ecliptic known as the 'Precession of the > > Equinoxes', a phenomenon which determines the 'Cosmological Age'. The > > Precession is hinted at in the Rig Veda in this hymn to Surya:> > 'Your two wheels, Surya, the Brahmins know in their measured rounds. > > But the one wheel that is hidden, only the inspired know that.' (Rig > > Veda 10.85-16)> > If you believe that the Greek's knowledge of astrology predated the > > Indian, please explain to us why the phenomena of Precession, > > described by the Greek astronomer Hipparchus, only appeared much later > > - in the 2nd century BC, long after it was mentioned in the Rig Veda. > > > > > > , > > "chandra_hari18" chandra_hari18@ wrote:> > >> > > > > > Discussion on Rama's horoscope is just another expression of > > imagination> > > leading people astray. Zodiac known since the historical times of> > > Seleucid Era (300BC) is only sidereal and fixed. Tropical notion > > i.e. V.> > > Equinox as 0 was introduced by Hipparchus in 2nd century BC. Greek > > and> > > Babylonian horoscopes based on the sidereal fixed zodiac predates> > > Hipparchus.> > > > > > Rama's horoscope may be a Jugglery just as the case with a similar> > > horoscope of Sankaracharya which got concocted in 9th century. > > Psychics> > > in the West is making many imaginative theories as we see in the > > reply> > > below of some so called Western Occultist.> > > > > > chandra hari> > > > > > > > > , "robertwilkinson"> > > <robtw@> wrote:> > > >> > > > <This posting is for Lori Tompkins, a member of this forum>> > > >> > > > Sri Ram's Horoscope and the Preservation of Astrological Knowledge> > >> >> > > > > > > > Be a better pen pal. Text or chat with friends inside Mail. See how.>

[Guest guest]

Dear Sreenadh ji,

 

> " So the first lesson of management is self improvement! I

wonder how

> can I escape from this concept of `self improvement', which

> seems to come in everywhere!! You see I am an escapist! :=) And

does

> too much blah blah.... ) Your mail was 3 words and I wrote 600+

> words!You see - sure, I need too much self imporvement! "

 

It will not be a bad idea to remember, at least occassionally,

that 'speech is silver, but silence is golden " , which would surely

contribute for self improvement

 

But of course I do enjoy your educative postings irrespective of the

number of words....

 

blessings

 

Renu

 

 

 

>

> , john arment

> <collinpeace@> wrote:

> >

> > what happens soon?

> >

> >

> > chandra_hari18 chandra_hari18@ wrote:

> > Dear friend,

> > Prof. Kak is a good friend of mine. With due respect to him, I

would

> like to tell you that the school of thought that denies Aryan

invasion

> is gravely wrong in imagining indigenous Aryans and the Vedic

cult. It

> is being repeatedly told that Aryan, Dravidian etc are terms

invented by

> William Jones and other missionaries. This is not true and people

parrot

> such views because they are not familiar with the Sanghakala

literature

> in Tamil.

> >

> > --- In

, " robertwilkinson "

> robtw@ wrote:

> > >

> > > I believe you have your facts wrong on this account Chandra-ji.

> > > The widely respected scholar, Subhash Kak writes in his

article -

> > > Babylonian and Indian Astronomy: Early Connections:

> > > " … the key ideas found in the Babylonian astronomy of 700 BC

are

> > > already present in the Vedic texts, which even by the most

> > > conservative reckoning are older than that period. I shall

also show

> > > that the solar zodiac (ra´sis) was used in Vedic India and I

> shall

> > > present a plausible derivation of the symbols of the solar

zodiac

> from

> > > the deities of the segments. In view of the attested presence

of the

> > > Indic people in the Mesopotamian region prior to 700 BC, it is

> likely

> > > that if at all the two astronomies influenced each other, the

> > > dependence is of the Babylonian on the Indian. " Subhash Kak -

> > > February, 2003

> > > The points of Kak's thesis are amply proven in his scholarly

article

> > > moreover, they are entirely consistent with the Indo-Centric

> Cosmology

> > > that Ms. Norelli-Bachelet has carefully articulated in her

numerous

> > > books and essays. I think perhaps your error is derived from a

> > > fragmented understanding of the Vedic worldview.

> > >

> > > Ms. Norelli-Bachelet has published numerous examples of how

Esoteric

> > > Astology runs entirely through the Veda but none so compelling

as

> > > appear in the verses to Vishnu Trivikrama (RigVeda 1.154) who

> measures

> > > out the universe in his famous 'Three Strides'. In his Secret

of the

> > > Veda, Sri Aurobindo translates these verses in a chapter

entitled

> > > Vishnu - the All Pervading Godhead. It is reasonable to

believe,

> given

> > > his work and mission, that he would have taken special care

with

> these

> > > verses. It has also come to light through hitherto unpublished

> > > documents that Sri Aurobindo had a profound interest and faith

in

> > > astrology. When he translated Vishnu's three steps as a Lion,

a Bull

> > > and the Friend of man, there can be no question that would have

> > > understood their esoteric astrological significance.

> > > " Vishnu's famous three strides (to measure the universe)

cannot be

> > > more revealing. The first `step' is like a lion (Leo),

according to

> > > the Veda; the second is a bull (Taurus); the third, and most

> > > revealing of all, is the Friend. This is the same Aquarius of

> > > Agastya's birth, which is also known as the sign of the

Friend. More

> > > conclusively, they are given in their correct backward moving

order,

> > > and are Vishnu's own zodiacal domains because of their quality

of

> > > PRESERVATION (`Fixed' in zodiacal terminology, stable,

> balancing)… If

> > > the Eagle, the fourth sign, was left out of Vishnu's measuring

it is

> > > because this Eagle is Garuda, his own carrier. He begins his

> measuring

> > > from that point in the wheel, also known as Scorpio, and takes

> `three

> > > steps'. Scorpio, otherwise known as the zodiacal Eagle, would

be the

> > > fourth in correct sequence, similar to [the imagery in the

biblical

> > > Revelation] John's text. " Patrizia Norelli-Bachelet

> > > Additionally the signs are given in this backwards moving order

> > > provide incontrovertible evidence that Vedic astronomers were

> > > intimately familiar with the slow continuous westward movement

of

> the

> > > equinoxes around the ecliptic known as the 'Precession of the

> > > Equinoxes', a phenomenon which determines the 'Cosmological

Age'.

> The

> > > Precession is hinted at in the Rig Veda in this hymn to Surya:

> > > 'Your two wheels, Surya, the Brahmins know in their measured

rounds.

> > > But the one wheel that is hidden, only the inspired know

that.' (Rig

> > > Veda 10.85-16)

> > > If you believe that the Greek's knowledge of astrology

predated the

> > > Indian, please explain to us why the phenomena of Precession,

> > > described by the Greek astronomer Hipparchus, only appeared

much

> later

> > > - in the 2nd century BC, long after it was mentioned in the Rig

> Veda.

> > >

> > >

> > > ,

> > > " chandra_hari18 " chandra_hari18@ wrote:

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Discussion on Rama's horoscope is just another expression of

> > > imagination

> > > > leading people astray. Zodiac known since the historical

times of

> > > > Seleucid Era (300BC) is only sidereal and fixed. Tropical

notion

> > > i.e. V.

> > > > Equinox as 0 was introduced by Hipparchus in 2nd century BC.

Greek

> > > and

> > > > Babylonian horoscopes based on the sidereal fixed zodiac

predates

> > > > Hipparchus.

> > > >

> > > > Rama's horoscope may be a Jugglery just as the case with a

similar

> > > > horoscope of Sankaracharya which got concocted in 9th

century.

> > > Psychics

> > > > in the West is making many imaginative theories as we see in

the

> > > reply

> > > > below of some so called Western Occultist.

> > > >

> > > > chandra hari

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > --- In

, " robertwilkinson "

> > > > <robtw@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > <This posting is for Lori Tompkins, a member of this forum>

> > > > >

> > > > > Sri Ram's Horoscope and the Preservation of Astrological

> Knowledge

> > > >

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Be a better pen pal. Text or chat with friends inside

Mail. See

> how.

> >

>