Test of tropical versus side re al zodiac

[Guest guest]

Dear Sunil-ji,

 

I was referring to similar debates in internet that crops up from time

to time. I did write that in the 1st sentence of my mail. I never said that

I am referring to this particular exchange only

 

I am also aware of such attempts (applying sidereal principle in Tropical

charts) that has been tried by few astrologers (mainly Westerners).

 

I don't think that I have misread the topics /discussions so far. My point

was

aimed at Mr. Boaz who suggested that the attempt is giving good results in

some 378 cases.

 

Anyway, I would not want to comment on this topic any further.

 

regards

 

 

[Chakraborty, PL]

 

sunil nair [astro_tellerkerala]

Saturday, May 16, 2009 1:58 PM

 

] Re: Test of tropical versus sidere al

zodiac

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dear chakraborty ji

 

I think u miss read the whole topic

 

here there is no question of western astrology or vedic astrology which is

correct where as what is happening is some one who says he is vedic

astrologer and wanted to adopt tropical zodiac for applying vedic astrology

principles and he dont hav any valid textual ,sastraic or own exprnce

support to claim such arguemnt other than some misunderstanding of texts

 

so i was pointing out the flaws in this approach

 

Hope u got the point

 

rgrds sunil nair

 

 

 

 

, CHAKRABORTYP2 wrote:

>

> Dear Boaz and other friends,

>

> I have seen the debate about sidereal and tropical astrology crops up from

> time to time.

>

> The debate generally revolves about different stance taken by the

followers.

> These are generally :

>

> Sidereal is correct vs Tropical is correct.

> Sidereal is more accurate vs Tropical is more accurate.

>

> To decide in favor of any side (sidereal or tropical), the judge must be

> supremely knowledgeable and skilled in both the sidereal and tropical

> astrology. Alas, it is difficult to find such Judges who would really

> bother

> to spend his precious time on this topic.

>

> Let us accept that both system follows the planetary movement and draws

> inference from that. The frame of reference is different. It is like

having

> two

> different observatories... both are seeing from their own vantage point

and

> arriving at some conclusions.

>

> I have noticed that both Sidereal and Tropical Astrologers give stunning

> predictions... both systems have large following... SO how can be any one

> of them be wrong ? And any verification of any system would need some

> thousands of charts .... few hundreds of charts will not be enough.

>

> regards

>

> Chakraborty

>

>

>

>

> zaobnali [zaob16]

> Saturday, May 16, 2009 10:19 AM

>

> Re: Test of tropical versus sidereal

> zodiac

>

>

>

>

>

> Hello,

>

> I think it is important to understand conceptually what the rasis mean.

The

> rasis, for example, have certain qualities, mobile, fixed and mutable, as

> well as the four elements. These qualities 3x4 = 12 rasis. The Sun sets

> these qualities in motion and the tropical zodiac is Sun based. The

moveable

> signs Aries, Cancer, Libra and Capricorn coincide with the solstices and

> equinoxes. In addition it turns out that the ancient scripts actually seem

> to suggest that the rishis used the tropical zodiac (see Ernst's article

on

> Ayanamsha). It may be that the sidereal zodiac will eventually be proven

> correct but we can not ignore the tropical zodiac and the reasoning

behind,

> which is why such studies are important.

>

> Thanks

> Boaz

>

> ancient_indian_ <%40>

> astrology , Sunil Bhattacharjya sunil_bhattacharjya@

> wrote:

> >

> > Dear All,

> >

> > The positions of all the nine grahas in the Tropical Zodiac are

> ayanamsha-corrected in the Sidereal Zodiac. So this means the a reoriented

> Tropical Ziodiac fits in the Sidereal Zodiac and the interaction between

the

> grahas based on the angles relative to each other are the same in both the

> Zodiacs. On top of it the Sidereal Zodiac takes into account the

additional

> effects of the Nakshatras. So in my opinion the Sidereal predictions are

> bound to be more precise.

> >

> > Regards,

> >

> > Sunl K. Bhattacharjya

> >

> > --- On Fri, 5/15/09, zaobnali zaob16@ wrote:

> >

> >

> > zaobnali zaob16@

> > Test of tropical versus sidereal

> zodiac

> > ancient_indian_ <%40>

> astrology

> > Friday, May 15, 2009, 4:27 AM

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Dear All,

> >

> > Glad to join this forum.

> >

> > Vedic astrologer Ersnt Wilhelm is conducting a statistical query to

> determine which of the zodiacs - tropical or sidereal - works better.

Those

> of you who are interested and have an accurate time of birth are

encouraged

> to fill out the test. Ernst reports that test 2 is showing some quite

> rewarding results. So far more than 378 people have taken the test and

> results are consistently aligning with the same calculations on all three

> questions, which is quite exciting. Hopefully a few hundred more people

will

> take the test over the weekend and then he can reveal the results to you

> all.

> >

> > http://www.isjyotis <http://www.isjyotis> h.com/

> >

> > Thanks,

> > Boaz

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information contained in this electronic message and any attachments to this

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[Guest guest]

dear chakraborty ji Ok ,sorry ,then i miss read ur post I was fully aware of this reserch what shri Boazji says ,since one month i think if my memory is correct .But i answered also their claims called experimnts tru our grp itself ( even it was discussed between me and sreenadh ji b4 2 weeks i think tru personal mails ) and posted one chart also for verifying for grp memebrs ,other than claims of 378 successful predictions no reserch paper also provided to verify it also all availble hora texts deal with siderial zodiac and degrees and pointers in it ,so if some one misread it or trying to propogate some wrong theories we cannot sit silently practising modesty and we shud able to say what is correct and what is not correct with our knowledge and exprnce other wise what is the use of a life time practising astrology and then even the mission of this grp is re constructing lost principles as we know it is working marvellously still without any failure .Astrologers individualy failing or successful has nothing to do with the zodiac s i blv .Even if some one feels it is wrong approach then what stopped him to consult some masters in this field and discuss it b4 launching a reserch and trumpeting to the world b4 arriving at any results .So this so called reserch itself is doubtful u r free to express ur feeling and if u prefer to not to commnt again i respect ur discision rgrds sunil nair . , CHAKRABORTYP2 wrote:>> Dear Sunil-ji,> > I was referring to similar debates in internet that crops up from time> to time. I did write that in the 1st sentence of my mail. I never said that> I am referring to this particular exchange only> > I am also aware of such attempts (applying sidereal principle in Tropical> charts) that has been tried by few astrologers (mainly Westerners).> > I don't think that I have misread the topics /discussions so far. My point> was> aimed at Mr. Boaz who suggested that the attempt is giving good results in> some 378 cases. > > Anyway, I would not want to comment on this topic any further. > > regards> > > [Chakraborty, PL] > > > sunil nair [astro_tellerkerala]> Saturday, May 16, 2009 1:58 PM> > ] Re: Test of tropical versus sidere al> zodiac> > > > > > > Dear chakraborty ji > > I think u miss read the whole topic > > here there is no question of western astrology or vedic astrology which is> correct where as what is happening is some one who says he is vedic> astrologer and wanted to adopt tropical zodiac for applying vedic astrology> principles and he dont hav any valid textual ,sastraic or own exprnce> support to claim such arguemnt other than some misunderstanding of texts > > so i was pointing out the flaws in this approach > > Hope u got the point > > rgrds sunil nair > > > > > , CHAKRABORTYP2@ wrote:> >> > Dear Boaz and other friends,> > > > I have seen the debate about sidereal and tropical astrology crops up from> > time to time.> > > > The debate generally revolves about different stance taken by the> followers.> > These are generally :> > > > Sidereal is correct vs Tropical is correct. > > Sidereal is more accurate vs Tropical is more accurate.> > > > To decide in favor of any side (sidereal or tropical), the judge must be > > supremely knowledgeable and skilled in both the sidereal and tropical> > astrology. Alas, it is difficult to find such Judges who would really> > bother> > to spend his precious time on this topic.> > > > Let us accept that both system follows the planetary movement and draws> > inference from that. The frame of reference is different. It is like> having> > two> > different observatories... both are seeing from their own vantage point> and> > arriving at some conclusions. > > > > I have noticed that both Sidereal and Tropical Astrologers give stunning > > predictions... both systems have large following... SO how can be any one> > of them be wrong ? And any verification of any system would need some > > thousands of charts .... few hundreds of charts will not be enough.> > > > regards> > > > Chakraborty> > > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear all,

 

There cannot be and must not be any test between Tropical or Sidereal,

and it is only for those who have enough time to while away. Even

Spaghetti or Chinese Fried Rice can be prepared tastily and deliciously

by westerners, and so can we, prepare a tasty Bhelpuri with our

ingredients and mix. Both ways stomache can be filled.

 

It all depends on who is a master or expert in what. I agree to Shri

Sunil Nairji in his views that Tropical is good for certain predective

modules like Mundane. Being a student of Tropical astrology let me also

add, that its good for even Horary astrology. But its difficult to

master and there is too much of ambiguity and predictions are broad

based in the hands of a non expert when he uses Tropical. But for a

expert he can predict very well using Tropical. Those experts are not

to be seen in these days because it requires deep and concentrated study

for years to become good at Tropical. .

 

For us, we have so many techniques in India, which are still lying

untapped and unexplored to the hilt, that we actually do not need

Tropical. But persay this does not imply that it does not work.

 

I have said this many times before, a good barber can cut the hair of a

man with a blunt scissors and make him look more smarter, while a bad

barber even with sharp scissors will spoil his clients face.

 

regards,

 

Bhaskar.

[Guest guest]

I personally use only Nirayan Astrology for predictive astrology.

 

regards/Bhaskar

 

 

 

 

, " Bhaskar "

<bhaskar_jyotish wrote:

>

>

> Dear all,

>

> There cannot be and must not be any test between Tropical or Sidereal,

> and it is only for those who have enough time to while away. Even

> Spaghetti or Chinese Fried Rice can be prepared tastily and

deliciously

> by westerners, and so can we, prepare a tasty Bhelpuri with our

> ingredients and mix. Both ways stomache can be filled.

>

> It all depends on who is a master or expert in what. I agree to Shri

> Sunil Nairji in his views that Tropical is good for certain predective

> modules like Mundane. Being a student of Tropical astrology let me

also

> add, that its good for even Horary astrology. But its difficult to

> master and there is too much of ambiguity and predictions are broad

> based in the hands of a non expert when he uses Tropical. But for a

> expert he can predict very well using Tropical. Those experts are not

> to be seen in these days because it requires deep and concentrated

study

> for years to become good at Tropical. .

>

> For us, we have so many techniques in India, which are still lying

> untapped and unexplored to the hilt, that we actually do not need

> Tropical. But persay this does not imply that it does not work.

>

> I have said this many times before, a good barber can cut the hair of

a

> man with a blunt scissors and make him look more smarter, while a bad

> barber even with sharp scissors will spoil his clients face.

>

> regards,

>

> Bhaskar.

>

[Guest guest]

respected bhaskar ji There is a mistake happened in ur mail i think I never supported or used Tropical charts for Mundane predictions ,also i realy dont know mundane predictions and i am still a student and what ever i predicted is by using siderial charts and vedic astrology principle's U can see i was using chaitra shukla paksha prathama chart ( hindu new yr) and mesha samkranti ( astrological new yr ) charts for even predicting any national events ( tho i am yet to perfect it ) so i would like to point out this mistake happened in ur mail .rgrds sunil nair , "Bhaskar" <bhaskar_jyotish wrote:>> > Dear all,> > There cannot be and must not be any test between Tropical or Sidereal,> and it is only for those who have enough time to while away. Even> Spaghetti or Chinese Fried Rice can be prepared tastily and deliciously> by westerners, and so can we, prepare a tasty Bhelpuri with our> ingredients and mix. Both ways stomache can be filled.> > It all depends on who is a master or expert in what. I agree to Shri> Sunil Nairji in his views that Tropical is good for certain predective> modules like Mundane. Being a student of Tropical astrology let me also> add, that its good for even Horary astrology. But its difficult to> master and there is too much of ambiguity and predictions are broad> based in the hands of a non expert when he uses Tropical. But for a> expert he can predict very well using Tropical. Those experts are not> to be seen in these days because it requires deep and concentrated study> for years to become good at Tropical. .> > For us, we have so many techniques in India, which are still lying> untapped and unexplored to the hilt, that we actually do not need> Tropical. But persay this does not imply that it does not work.> > I have said this many times before, a good barber can cut the hair of a> man with a blunt scissors and make him look more smarter, while a bad> barber even with sharp scissors will spoil his clients face.> > regards,> > Bhaskar.>

[Guest guest]

Dear Shri Sunil Nairji,

 

Apparently yes, looks like a mistake. I think Shri Kursija mentiond some

support for mundane astrology using Tropical, if not your goodself.

 

regards/Bhaskar.

 

 

 

 

 

 

, " sunil nair "

<astro_tellerkerala wrote:

>

>

> respected bhaskar ji

>

> There is a mistake happened in ur mail i think

>

> I never supported or used Tropical charts for Mundane predictions

,also

> i realy dont know mundane predictions and i am still a student and

what

> ever i predicted is by using siderial charts and vedic astrology

> principle's

>

> U can see i was using chaitra shukla paksha prathama chart ( hindu new

> yr) and mesha samkranti ( astrological new yr ) charts for even

> predicting any national events ( tho i am yet to perfect it )

>

> so i would like to point out this mistake happened in ur mail .

>

> rgrds sunil nair

>

>

> , " Bhaskar "

> bhaskar_jyotish@ wrote:

> >

> >

> > Dear all,

> >

> > There cannot be and must not be any test between Tropical or

Sidereal,

> > and it is only for those who have enough time to while away. Even

> > Spaghetti or Chinese Fried Rice can be prepared tastily and

> deliciously

> > by westerners, and so can we, prepare a tasty Bhelpuri with our

> > ingredients and mix. Both ways stomache can be filled.

> >

> > It all depends on who is a master or expert in what. I agree to Shri

> > Sunil Nairji in his views that Tropical is good for certain

predective

> > modules like Mundane. Being a student of Tropical astrology let me

> also

> > add, that its good for even Horary astrology. But its difficult to

> > master and there is too much of ambiguity and predictions are broad

> > based in the hands of a non expert when he uses Tropical. But for a

> > expert he can predict very well using Tropical. Those experts are

not

> > to be seen in these days because it requires deep and concentrated

> study

> > for years to become good at Tropical. .

> >

> > For us, we have so many techniques in India, which are still lying

> > untapped and unexplored to the hilt, that we actually do not need

> > Tropical. But persay this does not imply that it does not work.

> >

> > I have said this many times before, a good barber can cut the hair

of

> a

> > man with a blunt scissors and make him look more smarter, while a

bad

> > barber even with sharp scissors will spoil his clients face.

> >

> > regards,

> >

> > Bhaskar.

> >

>

[Guest guest]

respected Bhaskar ji many thanks rgrds sunil nair , "Bhaskar" <bhaskar_jyotish wrote:>> > Dear Shri Sunil Nairji,> > Apparently yes, looks like a mistake. I think Shri Kursija mentiond some> support for mundane astrology using Tropical, if not your goodself.> > regards/Bhaskar.> > > > > > > , "sunil nair"> astro_tellerkerala@ wrote:> >> >> > respected bhaskar ji> >> > There is a mistake happened in ur mail i think> >> > I never supported or used Tropical charts for Mundane predictions> ,also> > i realy dont know mundane predictions and i am still a student and> what> > ever i predicted is by using siderial charts and vedic astrology> > principle's> >> > U can see i was using chaitra shukla paksha prathama chart ( hindu new> > yr) and mesha samkranti ( astrological new yr ) charts for even> > predicting any national events ( tho i am yet to perfect it )> >> > so i would like to point out this mistake happened in ur mail .> >> > rgrds sunil nair> >> >> > , "Bhaskar"> > bhaskar_jyotish@ wrote:> > >> > >> > > Dear all,> > >> > > There cannot be and must not be any test between Tropical or> Sidereal,> > > and it is only for those who have enough time to while away. Even> > > Spaghetti or Chinese Fried Rice can be prepared tastily and> > deliciously> > > by westerners, and so can we, prepare a tasty Bhelpuri with our> > > ingredients and mix. Both ways stomache can be filled.> > >> > > It all depends on who is a master or expert in what. I agree to Shri> > > Sunil Nairji in his views that Tropical is good for certain> predective> > > modules like Mundane. Being a student of Tropical astrology let me> > also> > > add, that its good for even Horary astrology. But its difficult to> > > master and there is too much of ambiguity and predictions are broad> > > based in the hands of a non expert when he uses Tropical. But for a> > > expert he can predict very well using Tropical. Those experts are> not> > > to be seen in these days because it requires deep and concentrated> > study> > > for years to become good at Tropical. .> > >> > > For us, we have so many techniques in India, which are still lying> > > untapped and unexplored to the hilt, that we actually do not need> > > Tropical. But persay this does not imply that it does not work.> > >> > > I have said this many times before, a good barber can cut the hair> of> > a> > > man with a blunt scissors and make him look more smarter, while a> bad> > > barber even with sharp scissors will spoil his clients face.> > >> > > regards,> > >> > > Bhaskar.> > >> >>