Re:Meshadi and Makaradi in 11th century AD!

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Dear Sunil Nairji,

 

Will you like to comment on AKK's views including the one on Pathani Samanta. To my mind Pathani Samanta did believe that the planets revolve round the Sun in the Heliocentric model and that all the grahas (including the planets, the Sun and the Moon) revolve round the earth in the Geocentric model. It is foolish on the part of AKK to criticize Pathani Samanta.

 

Regards,

 

Sunil K. Bhattacharjya--- On Tue, 6/16/09, Avtar Krishen Kaul <jyotirved wrote:

Avtar Krishen Kaul <jyotirved[VRI] Re: [hc] Fwd: Meshadi and Makaradi in 11th century AD!vedic_research_institute Date: Tuesday, June 16, 2009, 12:03 PM

 

 

hinducivilization, "Avtar Krishen Kaul" <jyotirved@. ..> wrote:Shri Ramveer Singhji,Namaskar!<Mr Kaul doesnt not know that all ppl can't become fighter pilot, only some can>It is a dharmayudha. Every Hindu has to be a "fighter pilot" to save Hindu dharma from such "friends" as are worse than enemies.<EACH AND EVERYTIME some thread on astrology starts, it invaribaly ends with name-calling and personal attacks. Invariably. EVERYTIME such a thread takes on the same look and feel.>It is nothing new in "Indian astronomy". Brahma-Gupta, whose fundamental arguments of Brahmasphuta Sidhanta, have been purloined in Vishnudharmotara Purana as Pitamaha Sidhanta, without compunction, has literally abused Aryabhata left

and right since the latter had claimed the earth to be revolving round the sun.I wonder whether you are aware that Chandrashekhar Singh Samant, an Indian astronomer from Orissa, of early twentieth century, has said in his Sidhanta Darpana, 17th Prakasha, that the earth is sationary and the sun and planets revolve around it! He has said so because the Surya Sidhanta has said so, because Varahamihira has praised the Surya Sidhanta to be the most accurate!A "Vedic astrologer" calls Chandrashekhara a "naked eyed jyotishi" and believes that in ancient India, Vedic seers like Vasishtha and Vishvamitra and even Agastya, were similar "naked eyed jyotishis".That is the condition of Indian astronomy, of which "Vedic astrologers" are boasting to the whole world! The fact of the matter is that Vedic Hindus were never interested in predictive hocus-pocus till the time of Greek influx and that is why the Seers never bothered about the longitudes

of Mangal and Shani vis-a-vis non-existent Mesha, Vrisha etc. Rashis!With regards,AKK hinducivilization, Ramveer Singh <singh_ramveer@ > wrote:>> Yes Mr Kaul is in delusion and he takes all ppl's grasp of his own level> > Mr Kaul doesnt not know that all ppl can't become fighter pilot, only some can> > --- On Tue, 16/6/09, Jit Majumder <jitmajumder212@ > wrote:> > > Jit Majumder <jitmajumder212@ >> Re: [hc] Fwd: Meshadi and Makaradi in 11th century AD!> hinducivilization> Tuesday, 16 June, 2009, 1:15 PM> > > > > > > > > > EACH AND EVERYTIME some thread on astrology starts, it invaribaly ends> with name-calling and personal attacks. Invariably. EVERYTIME such a> thread takes on the same look and feel.> > I wonder what Mr. Avatar K. Kaul tires to prove each time and everytime,> when he insists on explaining the technicalities of astrology to all and> sundry, who are in absolutely no position to undestand ever what he> talks about. I wonder if Mr. Kaul is under a delusion that everyone has> an equal capacity like him to really understand, or care for, his> quibbling on the myriad technical details about ayanas, sayanas,> nirayanas, meshas, makaras, rashis and so on. He, with his

exclamation> marks, constantly tries to "correct" and change the minds of a bunch of> people who are themselves CLUELESS ABOUT what they constantly quibble> about or what they know or believe, and who give a rat's ass for Avatar> Kaul's corrections. The ned result everytime is a lot of sentences from> Mr. Kaul all with exclamation marks, and a lot of name-calling and> personal attacks from the others.> > It is just another matter altogether that this idiotic bunch of people> (look at the english language of this guy sunil) are only capable of> doing that, and dropping technical words and terms in their incessant> quibbles, in order to look "learned" and 'knowledgeable" in astrology.> And Mr. Kaul never seems to get the message, somehow. He never seems to> be done with warning us about the fake nature of "vedic astrology".> Maybe another few thousand times

of repeating the same, and then he> just might become assured that we have got his message.> > -- Jit.> > hinducivilization, "Ravi" <ravi7640@ .> wrote:> >> > I think this sort of debate (?) is not welcome in this list. Please> find some other group where this subject(I cannot find any debating> point since it is mostly abuse). Also what Sunil writes would be> understandable to him only.> > Hence we would urge both Sunil and AKK to stop and desist further> posts. If you have some thing to debate it could be done in some> astrological groups where the readers might appreciate the points.> > Moderator> >> > -> > "Sunil Nair" astro_tellerkerala@ ...> > hinducivilization> > Tuesday, June 16, 2009 1:37

AM> > [hc] Fwd: Meshadi and Makaradi in 11th century AD!> >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Own a website.Get an unlimited package.Pay next to nothing.*Go to http://in.business. /> >

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dear sunil Bhattacharjya ji The problem with many memebrs in other forums dont know what is we r talking .it is because of the intricacy of subjuct called astronomy,astrology and vedas and allied litterture 2nd thing u or me cannot quote and twist due to various reasons ( my case i dont know how to copy or download many net copies and put it in mails ) where as Kaul always find some reasons to twist and eat the past vomit always when ever he find not easy with us we know that 1)kaul is against a concept of zodiac wheter it is sayana or Nirayana2 ) kaul dont blv or dont like to blv there where observations abt Non luminaries as planets during vedic period ( u can call it antiquity in hindu periods wheter vedic or pre vedic or saraswathan culture etc ) 3) kaul dont allows or blvs in any division of zodiac 4) he blvs in ignorence of grp memebrs to gather support for his wrong ideas than he is serious with a real calender or his idea is illuminate others 5) we all know that kaul cannot make a real calender based on his own claims who even reject solar year and zodiacal signs which is a must for solar months which is infused automaticaly with luanr months and same is used for adi masa ,mala maasa concepts ever since the period of rig or yajurjyothisha 6) pre vedic ,vedic ,pre sidhanthic ( i mean the matter available in text form than oral traditions ) all where period of continous evolutions in concepts so we cannot declare a cut of date for anything other than corrcting what ever abonormalities happened now .But he seems to destroy even the scientific growth of hindus as he blvs everything is imported and we simply copied it ,how such a person can b fighter pilot or even foot soldier even for hindu dharma (tho that ids which ever supporting him was his own in diffrnt names which i find even attacking u in various foras --to silence a person this is the best method in net foras where as he can keep his clean face always and in case moderator is angry u or me will face axe and he is safe with his agendas as to keep his money flow frm various funding agencies it is a must for him ) 7 ) astrology and astronomy and even theology of hindus where intermixed and no one can seperate it as there 1000s of allegaries in vedas ( gavayamana ,ritual sacrifices for each events ,sankranties etc ) also in puranas the story of moon with 27 wifes ,the rahu -ketu story during amrita manthan ,and guru shukra conflicts ,indra varuna etc ,etc etc to war time fixing in mahabharatha by pandava brothers for kaurava s and we know how Lord srikrishna averted that muhurtha which is givn by nakula-sahadeva--the JR Pandava s ( they were good astrologers too ) ( see the blf ofgoodness in astrologer and astrology even the duryodhan takes the muhurtha for war frm his enmy ) ,also so many nimittas discussed in various epics ,even during the birth of Ravana ,duryodhana and during the time fo Mahabharath war the spl combinations and nimittas were discussed by veda vyasa in text ,the discussions of it even by Lord krishna and karna all r exmples of astrological uses of asronomical knowledge 8 ) some hindu cultural grps are under the effect of arya samajies who with some modern scientific temper of their Guru dont blv in astrology and kaul is trying to get their support ( sure they r like that only in net and not in real life )So kauls attacks and tirade against astrology is only with purpose of destroying the whole religious littearature of hindus which our hindus in net foras due to ignorence in the subjuct and misunderstanding and with the covered sarcastic remarks of kaul ( kauls acidic language is only to provoke than intented to attain any change or it cannot b blved that it is for a calender reforms ) with the cunningness of twisting ( as he already prepared his notes already extracted frm diffrnt sources and it is with him since last 25 yrs,again it proovs that he has nothing to say anything new ) so to sent mails with unlimited bandwidth is not a problem for kaul ,where as u or me is answering to the points also has our own jobs to take care of within limited time ,where as kauls main income is frm this job only as he is working for anti hindu forces .( even time stamps of his posts in various 100 grp proovs he is 24x 7 working ,for what to change some 30000 hindus ?? in all over forums , which in india itself hindus may b 90 crores ) In the post I was asking kaul ,as his mail he used Northern declination and southern declination ( in astronomy it is used for uttarayan and dakhishinayan) start frm meshadi rasies to tula and tula rasies to mesha but we all know that it is vishuva bindus and he quoted the mail as if it is frm some AL beruni 's some text ,i was asking him if uttarayana shud happen then astronomicaly ( as per modern astronomy it shud b BC 7000 /or 34000 or even 61000 ,and asked him to clarify it ,so he took as another opportunity to twist every thing and strted crying to grp that i dont know anything kaul knows the context and where he faild ,but do u think he will ever admit who said he will stop tirade against astrology if u show him the rasies in veda or vedic litterrature ( so now he came with supporting sayan rasies ) so he decided to twist whole mail and strted teaching me as if i dont know anything ,it is what happened now abt Samantha chandrasekhar every one can even make fun of fastest animal on earth cheetha so long as we r using fastest bikes ,own our own what is our cappacity is the question ,so u know except some good english kaul is realy a laughing stock and his intention is not pure atleast for thinking minds .i can even make fun of chatrapathy sivaji for walking miles and miles he did for each war ,as now i hav motor cars ,is it proovs i am some way gr8esr than that maratha LION ??so when cats r away mouse is playing ,it is what is happening in those hindu grps .kaul compare that gaint shri samantha chandrasekhar ji who dont hav any modern gadgets ( even NASA sites and indian astronomers calls him gr8 naked eyed jyothishi ) who already got appreciation frm british Govrnmnt for his works on astronomy for the correctness of his observation modern earth movement theoreis of modern astronomy he rejects outrightly with his own logic .Even when many requested him he was not ready to change it ( i need time to post abt his observations as he showed in diffrnt model how earth and sun revolves together than modern theory ) he is still respected as Gr8 scientist even by astronomical society of india and astronomers of world at large ( as they know what is his contributions ) and even By NASA because of originality and geniousness of that gaint who never got corrupted by any modern views or he was not even aware of any diffrnt theoreis floating in the world of modern astronomy .i already quoted it in past mails the kaulian tamasahas ( here is one of it )((((((Kaul has kept before the readers the facts that as in the Bhagawata Puranaor Vishnu Purana or Shiva Purana or the Mahabharata, Tantraloka etc. etc. oreven the sidhantas, there are no so called nirayana Mesha, Vrisha etc.Rashis, but only so called sayana rashis, similarly, during the 11th centuryAD, India was celebrating all the festivals as per a Sayana Rashichakra.That very sayana Rashichakra was used for phalita-jyotisha! You can seethis information in npj3.doc also.))))))))))))))))))U can see that he strted approving meshadi rasies ,then how his own arguemnts that it is imported frm greece will b true even according to him ?? or do he has licence to twist every thing according to his own conveinnce and fancies and the modern educated so called moderators has no problem abt it ??Now see he says all festivals were celebrated exact on date during the time fo AL beruni in 11th century AD if so then why he was calling names against surya sidhantha and varahamihira and other sidhanthic seers which is even according to his own dates may b frm BC 200 onwars to AD 500 ( actualy he is quoting western christian preists some old stale arugements than he knows any devlpmnts and changes of their own opinions happened later ,even if heknows it he cannot accept that as it will b against His own agendas )even he goes on saying the phalita jyothisha was based on sayana rasies and even puranas accepts it ,if so why he is again attacking old seers who ever where jyothisha pravarthakas ,why he says we got everything frm greece or some outside civilisations ??? Then why he cant attack modern jyothishies and why cant he spare old seers ?? even i can quote his silence on when some one said in science of astrology forum our seers dont know anything abt astronomy ( one of my men invited his attenetion 10 times and asked him to commnt on it ,then i understand that what was his real mission ,it was not calender ,it is total chaos and confusions to hindu phycho and if possible destroy totaly this sidhanthic tradtion as if it will b prooved correct tomorrow and it will debaptisation time for even vatican and pope ,so if a leagcy is destroyed they can praise it even later like mayan civilisation caught attention of world at large ) he paint astrology is the main curse on society as it was was main obstacle for christain agendas to proov their might among uneducated hindus and convert them ,u can see how easily the modern educated one fall for christian agendas as they were already frm day one slwly injected everything and they r almost ready for a change atleast mentaly .every one knows what an astrologer may b getting as fees even if he is fixing muhurthas for big industrial Houses marriage ceremony ,except the call of respect like maharaj or pandit the poor fellow will not get even the money for a nice meal where as those ppl may b spending milions and millions for 7 cource dinners for marriages and even the money they spend for booze etc ( criminal way waisting moeny for marriage to show off ) dont seems to caught any kaulian attention .Even due to govrnmnt policies Millions of farmers r suiciding ,that is not a problem for kaulians i think it may b good for hindu culture rgrds sunil nair ps --due to inability of launguage i cannot fully express my views pls bear with me even kaul is telling what ever i do is tru ghost writers as if i hav anough money to pay them . ( another Tamasha) ) , Sunil Bhattacharjya <sunil_bhattacharjya wrote:>> Dear Sunil Nairji,> > Will you like to comment on AKK's views including the one on Pathani Samanta. To my mind Pathani Samanta did believe that the planets revolve round the Sun in the Heliocentric model and that all the grahas (including the planets, the Sun and the Moon) revolve round the earth in the Geocentric model. It is foolish on the part of AKK to criticize Pathani Samanta.> > Regards,> > Sunil K. Bhattacharjya> > --- On Tue, 6/16/09, Avtar Krishen Kaul jyotirved wrote:> > > Avtar Krishen Kaul jyotirved [VRI] Re: [hc] Fwd: Meshadi and Makaradi in 11th century AD!> vedic_research_institute > Tuesday, June 16, 2009, 12:03 PM> > > > > > > > > hinducivilization, "Avtar Krishen Kaul" jyotirved@ ..> wrote:> > Shri Ramveer Singhji,> Namaskar!> <Mr Kaul doesnt not know that all ppl can't become fighter pilot, only some can>> It is a dharmayudha. Every Hindu has to be a "fighter pilot" to save Hindu dharma from such "friends" as are worse than enemies.> <EACH AND EVERYTIME some thread on astrology starts, it invaribaly ends with name-calling and personal attacks. Invariably. EVERYTIME such a thread takes on the same look and feel.>> It is nothing new in "Indian astronomy". Brahma-Gupta, whose fundamental arguments of Brahmasphuta Sidhanta, have been purloined in Vishnudharmotara Purana as Pitamaha Sidhanta, without compunction, has literally abused Aryabhata left and right since the latter had claimed the earth to be revolving round the sun.> I wonder whether you are aware that Chandrashekhar Singh Samant, an Indian astronomer from Orissa, of early twentieth century, has said in his Sidhanta Darpana, 17th Prakasha, that the earth is sationary and the sun and planets revolve around it! He has said so because the Surya Sidhanta has said so, because Varahamihira has praised the Surya Sidhanta to be the most accurate!> A "Vedic astrologer" calls Chandrashekhara a "naked eyed jyotishi" and believes that in ancient India, Vedic seers like Vasishtha and Vishvamitra and even Agastya, were similar "naked eyed jyotishis".> > That is the condition of Indian astronomy, of which "Vedic astrologers" are boasting to the whole world!> The fact of the matter is that Vedic Hindus were never interested in predictive hocus-pocus till the time of Greek influx and that is why the Seers never bothered about the longitudes of Mangal and Shani vis-a-vis non-existent Mesha, Vrisha etc. Rashis!> With regards,> AKK> hinducivilization, Ramveer Singh <singh_ramveer@ > wrote:> >> > Yes Mr Kaul is in delusion and he takes all ppl's grasp of his own level> > > > Mr Kaul doesnt not know that all ppl can't become fighter pilot, only some can> >> > --- On Tue, 16/6/09, Jit Majumder <jitmajumder212@ > wrote:> >> >> > Jit Majumder <jitmajumder212@ >> > Re: [hc] Fwd: Meshadi and Makaradi in 11th century AD!> > hinducivilization> > Tuesday, 16 June, 2009, 1:15 PM> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > EACH AND EVERYTIME some thread on astrology starts, it invaribaly ends> > with name-calling and personal attacks. Invariably. EVERYTIME such a> > thread takes on the same look and feel.> >> > I wonder what Mr. Avatar K. Kaul tires to prove each time and everytime,> > when he insists on explaining the technicalities of astrology to all and> > sundry, who are in absolutely no position to undestand ever what he> > talks about. I wonder if Mr. Kaul is under a delusion that everyone has> > an equal capacity like him to really understand, or care for, his> > quibbling on the myriad technical details about ayanas, sayanas,> > nirayanas, meshas, makaras, rashis and so on. He, with his exclamation> > marks, constantly tries to "correct" and change the minds of a bunch of> > people who are themselves CLUELESS ABOUT what they constantly quibble> > about or what they know or believe, and who give a rat's ass for Avatar> > Kaul's corrections. The ned result everytime is a lot of sentences from> > Mr. Kaul all with exclamation marks, and a lot of name-calling and> > personal attacks from the others.> >> > It is just another matter altogether that this idiotic bunch of people> > (look at the english language of this guy sunil) are only capable of> > doing that, and dropping technical words and terms in their incessant> > quibbles, in order to look "learned" and 'knowledgeable" in astrology.> > And Mr. Kaul never seems to get the message, somehow. He never seems to> > be done with warning us about the fake nature of "vedic astrology".> > Maybe another few thousand times of repeating the same, and then he> > just might become assured that we have got his message.> >> > -- Jit.> >> > hinducivilization, "Ravi" <ravi7640@ .> wrote:> > >> > > I think this sort of debate (?) is not welcome in this list. Please> > find some other group where this subject(I cannot find any debating> > point since it is mostly abuse). Also what Sunil writes would be> > understandable to him only.> > > Hence we would urge both Sunil and AKK to stop and desist further> > posts. If you have some thing to debate it could be done in some> > astrological groups where the readers might appreciate the points.> > > Moderator> > >> > > -> > > "Sunil Nair" astro_tellerkerala@ ...> > > hinducivilization> > > Tuesday, June 16, 2009 1:37 AM> > > [hc] Fwd: Meshadi and Makaradi in 11th century AD!> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Own a website.Get an unlimited package.Pay next to nothing.*Go to http://in.business. /> >> >