[VRI] Vedanga Jyotisha--Is Rashi mantra spurious and nothing but spurious?

[Guest guest]

Dear friends,

 

Namaste,

 

It is nice that Shri Kaul has uploaded the few pages out of the more than 500

pages of Dr. Shivaraj's edition of Somaakara's  commentary on the Yajur

Vedanga Jyotisha (Y-VJ), in his own HinduCalendar group as well as in the Vedic

Research Institute group. But it is regrettable that Shri Kaul did not

highlight Dr. Shivaraj's own comment in page 424 that according to

Sudhakara the verse 43 was not there in the Somakaara's bhashya (and yet he

included that in his edition).

 

Now coming to the Rashi verse Shri Kaul should also quote Dr. Shivaraj as to why

he (Dr. Shicaraj) omitted that from his book even though he added one verse (as

shown above), which was not there in Somakara's bhashya. This is important as

in the edition of Kupanna Sastry it is mentioned in page 31 that the Rashi verse

was there in all the seven manuscripts, which he consulted.

 

In his eagerness to show that Rashis were imported from the Greeks Shri Kaul

should not act with bias.

 

Moreover why should Shri Kaul single me out as Parokshya professor. Parokshya

jnana is nothing but logical inference. For example, we see that the Sun rises

in the east and sets in the west and that this movement of the Sun round the

Earth is Pratyaksha jnana. But we with the Paroksha jnana know that in reality

the Earth moves round the Sun and not the reverse. All people with brains are

Parokshya jnanis. Why does Shri Kaul not think of himself as one of the

Parokshya jnanis?

 

Regards,

 

Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

 

 

 

 

 

--- On Fri, 8/7/09, Avtar Krishen Kaul <jyotirved wrote:

 

 

Avtar Krishen Kaul <jyotirved

[VRI] Vedana Jyotisha--Rashi mantra is spurious and nothing but

spurious!

vedic_research_institute

Friday, August 7, 2009, 6:20 AM

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dear friends,

Namastey!

A zip file named " from vedanga jyotisha " has been uploaded in the files section

by me. These are scanned pages of Yajur-Jyotisham, with a commentary by

Somakara, who was around several centuries back.

This file has been obtained from Shri Hari Malla of HinduCalendar /

Parvasudhar2065 forum. The original work is published by Chaukhamba, Varanasi.

From perusal of these pages it will be clear that the so called " Mina rashi

mantra " does not exist in this edition as well, which means it is an addition of

the last few centuries, by some inept jyotishi, who did not known ABC of

astronomy, either sidhantic or modern!

I hope the " Parokshya Professor " will not come out now with the argument that

Somakara must have been haunted by the ghost of Pingre through his previous

janma and that is why he has omitted the spurious mantra!

If any mentor of the " Parokshya Professor " does have any copy that shows the

spurious mantra as original, it is the " Parokshya Professor's " duty to present

it to the members indicating the publisher and year of publication. Why is he

trying to keep the gun on other's shoulders, since it is he who has quoted his

mentor referring to the spurious mantra as mantra No. 5 in the Yajur Jyotisham.

As such, Mesha etc. rashis, which are actually non-existent imaginary " animals "

of a non-existent " circle of animals " are nothing but direct imports from other

coutnries like Babylonia via Greeks.

With regards,

A K Kaul

 

vedic_research_ institute, Sunil Bhattacharjya

<sunil_bhattacharjy a wrote:

>

> Dear friends,

>  

> It is regrettable that Shri Kaul had not understtod my mail properly, which

even a schoolboy will understand. The original verse mentioning the Meena Rashi

was verse No. 4 in the Yajur Vedfanga Jyotisha (Y-VJ) and the editors who were

influenced by Pingree's views thought that the Greeks had taught Rashi to the

Indians much after the  Vedanga Jyotisha was composed and that is why the

verse must be spurious. So they brought in the verse No. 35 from the Rig Vedanga

Jyotisha (R-VJ) and placed it in position No. 4 in the Y-VJ. Naturally the

original verse was pushed to the fifth place and they numbered it as Zero. 

>  

> Nobody is beating around the bush and nobody is trying to obfuscate the issue.

You are calling Sreenadhji my mentor just because he mentioned about the verse

in his mail. Then  Shri Kaul should better  ask Sreenadhji directly if he

has any difficulty in understanding what I wrote. In fact in stead of me the

last mail should have been written by Sreenadhji as it was he who was the first

to point out the verse in the Y-VJ. Further if Shri Kaul thinks that Rashis

are not mentioned in the Veda, Vedanga Jyotisha and the Puranas and that the

Indians learnt Astrology from the Greeks I have nothing to say. I am not

compelling him to accept my views. Let him take it or leave it.

>  

> Regards,

>  

> Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

>

> --- On Thu, 7/30/09, Avtar Krishen Kaul <jyotirved@. ..> wrote:

>

>

> Avtar Krishen Kaul <jyotirved@. ..>

> Re: [VRI] Vedana Jyotisha--Rashi mantra is spurioius and nothing but

spurious!

> vedic_research_ institute

> Thursday, July 30, 2009, 7:48 AM

>

>

>  

>

>

>

> Shri Bhatacharjya has quoted, in h is original message to WAVES-Vedic, his

mentor as saying,

> quote

> " Some preliminary evidence to prove the existence of Meshadi month names in

Vedic period is given below –

>

> 1) Take the Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha text and read the 5th sloka. It reads as

follows -

>

> Ye brihaspatina bhuktva MEENAN prabbriti rasayaH

>

> te hritaH panchabhiryataH yaH seshaH sa parigrihaH

>

> (Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha - sloka 5) "

> End quote

>

> Where is that fifth shloka, pl.?

> Why beat about the bush and obfuscate the issue to such an extent that the

readers get distracted from " the eye of the fish " i.e. the fact that ths mantra

is nothing but spurious. If there does exist ay work that has not listed the

spurious mantra as " zero " Why not scan the page of that work, indicating its

editor, publisher and year of publisher?

> Regards,

> A K Kaul

>

> vedic_research_ institute, Sunil Bhattacharjya

<sunil_bhattacharjy a wrote:

> >

> > Dear friends,

> >

> > Namaste,

> >

> > 1)

> > Yes it was I (S.K.Bhattacharjya) who said that the Vedanga Jyorisha (VJ)

(which was edited by Dr. K.V.Sharma) and published by INSA is available on the

Internet and that was because  to my knowledge no other copy  is available in

the Internet. If Mr. A.K.Kaul kniws of any copy edited by any other editor he

may let us know.

> >

> > 2)

> > In the INSA copy the editor Dr. K.V.Sharma had relegated the Verse no. 4 of

Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha (Y-VJ), which mentioned Meena rashi and sidelined it and

commented in page 50 that it is patently an interpolated verse as Rashi is of

foreign origin and came to India only during the 1st Century AD  along with

Greek astrology. However at the same time he stresses the importance of this

verse and he says that this verse serves a useful purpose and that is why it is

interpolated. Thus Dr.K.V.Sharma admittd that this verse is an essential verse

but was relegated just because of the prejudice because of the thinking that the

Rashis were not known to the Indians before 1st century AD (CE) This essential 

verse was substituted by bringing in the concluding verse no. 35 of Rig Vedanga

Jyotisha (R-VJ), which is the unimportant concluding verse of RV-J as you can

see yourself from the meaning of the verse as given by Dr. K.V.Sharma himself as

follows:

> >

> > R-VJ: 35 : " Like the combs of the peacocks and the crest jewels of the

serpents so does the lore of Jyotisha stand at the head of all the lores forming

the auxilliaries of the Vedas. "

> >

> > 3)

> > Mr.A.K.Kaul does not know that Dr. Kuppanna Sastry died in 1978 and that his

book was to be originally

> > published by the Bharataiya Vidya Bhavan but finally INSA got it edited

> > by Dr. K.V.Sharma and published it in 1984. That is why A.K.Kaul mentions

about the Holay's book. which he did not know that it was published in 1986 (in

Marathi) and in 1989 (in English), ie. several years after the publication of

the INSA book. Similarly Dr Suresh Chndra Mishra's book was also published in

2003 ie nine years after the INSA book. Once the INSA book mentioned the

maligned YVJ - 4 as interpolated the other authors also automatically followed

suit and did not make an issue about it as long the verse remained in the text.

Incidentally Mr. Holay had imagined the presence of a 19-year yuga cycle in VJ

but Dr. Abhyankar had proved it beyond doubt that Holay was wrong. However Mr.

Chandrahari seems to support Holay.

> >

> > 4)

> > In the INSA book there is another unnumbered verse after verse no.43 This

verse is important as it mentions that it is Lagadha's work. Dr. K.V.Sharma says

in page 36 that in Weber's first edition this verse appeared unnumbered before

the last verse 43 of Y-VJ buthe says that in Shama Sastry's book this verse is

numbered 43 and the last verse as 44.

> >

> > Friends now you can see for yourself that original verse Y-VJ:4 was made

verse no.5 without numbering  and was looked down upon with suspicion by the 

people, who were holding Pingreean views and thus they have attempted to damage

the Vedanga Jyotisha, which is considered the eye of the Veda.

> >

> > Regards,

> >

> > Sunil K.Bhattacharjya

> >

> >

> > --- On Sun, 7/26/09, jyotirved <jyotirved@ ..> wrote:

> >

> > jyotirved <jyotirved@ ..>

> > [VRI] Vedana Jyotisha--Rashi mantra is spurioius and nothing but

spurious!

> > vedic_research_ institute

> > Cc: indian_astrology_ group_daily_ digest@grou ps.com, hinducalendar@

. com

> > Sunday, July 26, 2009, 2:20 AM

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >  

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Dear friends,

> >

> > Namastey!

> >

> > Below is a copy of Message No. 2807 by Shri S. Bhattacharjya

> > in WAVES-VEDIC forum.

> >

> > Then In message No.  2874 of June 26, 09, Shri Bhattacharjya

> > had said further:

> >

> > “ 6)INSA stands for Indian national Science Academy. The

> > Vedanga Jyotisha was published in their " Indian Journal of History of

> > Science, Vol.19, No. 4, Supplement. Their website is  www.insa.ac. inâ€

> >

> >   Now the same Shri Bhjattacharjya says that that work of INSA has

> > been published/edited under the influence of Pingree!

> >

> > These are the prevarications “Vedic astrologers†make!

> >

> > Surprisingly, Holay’s edition shows the Mina Rashi mantra as

> > spurious! Hindi edition of a Delhi publisher shows that mantra as

spurious!  INSA

> > edition shows that mantra as spurious!  S. B. Dikshit has just not thought

it

> > fit even to refer to such a spurious mantra in his magnum opus, “History

of

> > Indian astronomyâ€, and he has declared, like all the true scholars of

eminence,

> > that there are no Rashis in the Vedas or the Vedanga Jyotisha!  Somakar,

the

> > earliest recorded Sanskrit commentator of an unknown era on the Vedanga

> > Jyotisha also has shown that mantra as spurious!

> >

> > Have all these commentators and translators been under

> > Pingree’s influence?  Were Somakar of yore  and S. B. Dikshit, a

redoubtable

> > scholar of nineteenth century, also influenced by Pingree even before he

> > (Pingree)was born?

> >

> >  

> >

> > In any case, why does  Shri Bhjattacharjya not upload a copy

> > of the page, indicating the edition and publisher, that contains the

spurious

> > mantra as the original mantra, as claimed by Shri Bhattacharyjay and his

mentor

> > in his post in AIA.

> >

> > With regards,

> >

> > A K Kaul

> >

> > ****                                    

***                                      Â\

 Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 

*****                                  

*****                                  

*****                                  

*****                                   ****

> >

> >  

> >

> > #2807 in WAVES-VEDIC by Shri Sunil Bhattacharjya

> >

> > Dear Sreenadhji,

> >

> >  

> >

> > Thank you very much for such a comprehensive reply.  I

> > am sending copies of this mail to the other groups also. Avinash Sathaye

seems

> > to be an ardent admirer of  Avtar Krishen Kaul and hence Sathaye

> >  was doubting my mention of Vedanga Jyotisha and AKK also

> > seems to be conveniently conniving at the lapse of Sathaye. Thank you once

> > again.

> >

> >  

> >

> > Regards,

> >

> >  

> >

> > Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

> >

> >

> >

> > --- On Tue, 5/26/09, Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:

> >

> >

> >

> > Sreenadh <sreesog@>

> >

> > [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Fw: [VRI] Fwd: Reference for

Rashi's in

> > Vedas

> >

> > ancient_indian_ astrology

> >

> > Tuesday, May 26, 2009, 6:41 PM

> >

> > Dear Sunil Bhattacharjya ji,

> >

> >    Give him the following references . If more references are

> > required, that also is available.

> >

> > ============ ==

> >

> >    AIA Website Article: Vendic Month Names

> >

> > Some preliminary evidence to prove the existence of Meshadi

> > month names in Vedic period is given below –

> >

> > 1) Take the Yajur

> > Vedanga Jyotisha text and read the 5th sloka. It reads as follows -

> >

> > Ye brihaspatina bhuktva MEENAN prabbriti rasayaH

> >

> > te hritaH panchabhiryataH yaH seshaH sa parigrihaH

> >

> > (Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha - sloka 5)

> >

> > [Take the sign count of Jupiter counting from Meena Rasi

> > (Pisces Sign), ............ .......etc] I believe you have noticed the words

> > 'Meenan prabhriti RasayaH' [signs counted from Meena Rasi (Pisces Sign)].

That

> > proves the existence of signs like Meena, Mesha etc in Vedanga Jyotisha

period.

> >

> >

> > 2) Take the Rk Vedanga

> > Jyotisha text next. Flip the pages to reach the 11th sloka. It reads

–

> >

> > Sravishtabhyam gunabhyastan prag-viLAGNAN vinirdiset

> >

> > Suryat masan palabhyastan vidyacchandramasanr itun

> >

> > (Rk Vedanga Jyotisha - sloka 11)

> >

> > Please notice the words - " Prag vilangnan " (From

> > the eastern LAGNA; from the eastern RISING SIGN) " Lagna " means,

> > " Raseenam Udayo Lagna " (The SIGN rising in the east is termed LAGNA).

> >

> >

> > 3) Take the copy of

> > Boudhayana Sutra. In it you will find a quote that reads - " Meena Meshayor

> > Mesha Vrishabhayor VasantaH " [The Vasanta Ritu could be either in

> > Meena-Mesha or in Mesha-Vrishabha (as per the period of time and

geographical

> > location)]

> >

> > 4) Then take the

> > Rigveda itself and try to understand the wordings such as - " Dwadasaram

> > nahi tajjaraya " , " Dwadaya pradhayaschakrameka m " etc etc.

> >

> > 5) Take Maitreya Sutra

> > and in it you will find a quote as follows –

> >

> > Ravina langhito masaschandraH khyato malipluchaH

> >

> > masadwaye yadapyekaRASIM Sankrametadityastat radyo

> > malipluchaH

> >

> > [if two lunar months falls with a single sidereal solar

> > month (Rasi; Sign) - i.e. if Sun TRANSITS two lunar months with in Rasis

(Sign)

> > - then that month is known with the special name " Maliplucha " (the

> > unclean month)]

> >

> > This quote proves that sidereal solar months where clearly

> > in existence and use during Vedic period.

> >

> > 6) If even this is not

> > enough then kid like stories are better for you. So take the Puranas and you

> > will find numerous references to Signs in all of them, Such as in Garuda

> > Purana, Agni Purana or numerous other Puranas.

> >

> > Love and regards,

> >

> > Sreenadh

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >  

> >

>

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear friends,

 

Namaste,

 

It is nice that Shri Kaul has uploaded the few pages out of the more than 500 pages of Dr. Shivaraj's edition of Somaakara's commentary on the Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha (Y-VJ), in his own HinduCalendar group as well as in the Vedic Research Institute group. But it is regrettable that Shri Kaul did not highlight Dr. Shivaraj's own comment in page 424 that according to Sudhakara the verse 43 was not there in the Somakaara's bhashya (and yet he included that in his edition).

 

Now coming to the Rashi verse Shri Kaul should also quote Dr. Shivaraj as to why he (Dr. Shicaraj) omitted that from his book even though he added one verse (as shown above), which was not there in Somakara's bhashya. This is important as in the edition of Kupanna Sastry it is mentioned in page 31 that the Rashi verse was there in all the seven manuscripts, which he consulted.

 

In his eagerness to show that Rashis were imported from the Greeks Shri Kaul should not act with bias.

 

Moreover why should Shri Kaul single me out as Parokshya professor. Parokshya jnana is nothing but logical inference. For example, we see that the Sun rises in the east and sets in the west and that this movement of the Sun round the Earth is Pratyaksha jnana. But we with the Paroksha jnana know that in reality the Earth moves round the Sun and not the reverse. All people with brains are Parokshya jnanis. Why does Shri Kaul not think of himself as one of the Parokshya jnanis?

 

Regards,

 

Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

 

 

 

--- On Fri, 8/7/09, Avtar Krishen Kaul <jyotirved wrote:

Avtar Krishen Kaul <jyotirved[VRI] Vedana Jyotisha--Rashi mantra is spurious and nothing but spurious!vedic_research_institute Date: Friday, August 7, 2009, 6:20 AM

Dear friends,Namastey!A zip file named "from vedanga jyotisha" has been uploaded in the files section by me. These are scanned pages of Yajur-Jyotisham, with a commentary by Somakara, who was around several centuries back.This file has been obtained from Shri Hari Malla of HinduCalendar / Parvasudhar2065 forum. The original work is published by Chaukhamba, Varanasi.From perusal of these pages it will be clear that the so called "Mina rashi mantra" does not exist in this edition as well, which means it is an addition of the last few centuries, by some inept jyotishi, who did not known ABC of astronomy, either sidhantic or modern!I hope the "Parokshya Professor" will not come out now with the argument that Somakara must have been haunted by the ghost of Pingre through his previous janma and that is why he has omitted the spurious mantra!If any mentor of the "Parokshya Professor" does have any copy that shows the spurious mantra

as original, it is the "Parokshya Professor's" duty to present it to the members indicating the publisher and year of publication. Why is he trying to keep the gun on other's shoulders, since it is he who has quoted his mentor referring to the spurious mantra as mantra No. 5 in the Yajur Jyotisham.As such, Mesha etc. rashis, which are actually non-existent imaginary "animals" of a non-existent "circle of animals" are nothing but direct imports from other coutnries like Babylonia via Greeks.With regards,A K Kaulvedic_research_ institute, Sunil Bhattacharjya <sunil_bhattacharjy a wrote:>> Dear friends,> > It is regrettable that Shri Kaul had not understtod my mail properly,

which even a schoolboy will understand. The original verse mentioning the Meena Rashi was verse No. 4 in the Yajur Vedfanga Jyotisha (Y-VJ) and the editors who were influenced by Pingree's views thought that the Greeks had taught Rashi to the Indians much after the Vedanga Jyotisha was composed and that is why the verse must be spurious. So they brought in the verse No. 35 from the Rig Vedanga Jyotisha (R-VJ) and placed it in position No. 4 in the Y-VJ. Naturally the original verse was pushed to the fifth place and they numbered it as Zero. > > Nobody is beating around the bush and nobody is trying to obfuscate the issue. You are calling Sreenadhji my mentor just because he mentioned about the verse in his mail. Then Shri Kaul should better ask Sreenadhji directly if he has any difficulty in understanding what I wrote. In fact in stead of me the

last mail should have been written by Sreenadhji as it was he who was the first to point out the verse in the Y-VJ. Further if Shri Kaul thinks that Rashis are not mentioned in the Veda, Vedanga Jyotisha and the Puranas and that the Indians learnt Astrology from the Greeks I have nothing to say. I am not compelling him to accept my views. Let him take it or leave it. > > Regards,> > Sunil K. Bhattacharjya> > --- On Thu, 7/30/09, Avtar Krishen Kaul <jyotirved@. ..> wrote:> > > Avtar Krishen Kaul <jyotirved@. ..>> Re: [VRI] Vedana Jyotisha--Rashi mantra is spurioius and nothing but spurious!> vedic_research_ institute@ .

com> Thursday, July 30, 2009, 7:48 AM> > > > > > > Shri Bhatacharjya has quoted, in h is original message to WAVES-Vedic, his mentor as saying, > quote> "Some preliminary evidence to prove the existence of Meshadi month names in Vedic period is given below – > > 1) Take the Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha text and read the 5th sloka. It reads as follows -> > Ye brihaspatina bhuktva MEENAN prabbriti rasayaH> > te hritaH panchabhiryataH yaH seshaH sa parigrihaH > > (Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha - sloka 5)"> End quote> > Where is that fifth shloka, pl.?> Why beat about the bush and obfuscate the issue to such an extent that the readers get distracted from "the eye of the fish" i.e. the fact that ths mantra is nothing but spurious. If there does exist ay work that has not listed the spurious

mantra as "zero" Why not scan the page of that work, indicating its editor, publisher and year of publisher?> Regards,> A K Kaul > > vedic_research_ institute, Sunil Bhattacharjya <sunil_bhattacharjy a wrote:> >> > Dear friends,> > > > Namaste,> > > > 1)> > Yes it was I (S.K.Bhattacharjya) who said that the Vedanga Jyorisha (VJ) (which was edited by Dr. K.V.Sharma) and published by INSA is available on the Internet and that was because to my knowledge no other copy is available in the Internet. If Mr. A.K.Kaul kniws of any copy edited by any other editor he may let us know.> > > > 2)> > In the INSA copy the editor Dr. K.V.Sharma had relegated the Verse no. 4 of Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha (Y-VJ), which mentioned Meena rashi and sidelined it and commented in page 50 that it is patently

an interpolated verse as Rashi is of foreign origin and came to India only during the 1st Century AD along with Greek astrology. However at the same time he stresses the importance of this verse and he says that this verse serves a useful purpose and that is why it is interpolated. Thus Dr.K.V.Sharma admittd that this verse is an essential verse but was relegated just because of the prejudice because of the thinking that the Rashis were not known to the Indians before 1st century AD (CE) This essential verse was substituted by bringing in the concluding verse no. 35 of Rig Vedanga Jyotisha (R-VJ), which is the unimportant concluding verse of RV-J as you can see yourself from the meaning of the verse as given by Dr. K.V.Sharma himself as follows:> > > > R-VJ: 35 : "Like the combs of the peacocks and the crest jewels of the serpents so does the lore of Jyotisha stand at the head of all the lores forming the auxilliaries of

the Vedas."> > > > 3)> > Mr.A.K.Kaul does not know that Dr. Kuppanna Sastry died in 1978 and that his book was to be originally> > published by the Bharataiya Vidya Bhavan but finally INSA got it edited> > by Dr. K.V.Sharma and published it in 1984. That is why A.K.Kaul mentions about the Holay's book. which he did not know that it was published in 1986 (in Marathi) and in 1989 (in English), ie. several years after the publication of the INSA book. Similarly Dr Suresh Chndra Mishra's book was also published in 2003 ie nine years after the INSA book. Once the INSA book mentioned the maligned YVJ - 4 as interpolated the other authors also automatically followed suit and did not make an issue about it as long the verse remained in the text. Incidentally Mr. Holay had imagined the presence of a 19-year yuga cycle in VJ but Dr. Abhyankar had proved it beyond doubt that Holay was wrong. However Mr. Chandrahari

seems to support Holay.> > > > 4)> > In the INSA book there is another unnumbered verse after verse no.43 This verse is important as it mentions that it is Lagadha's work. Dr. K.V.Sharma says in page 36 that in Weber's first edition this verse appeared unnumbered before the last verse 43 of Y-VJ buthe says that in Shama Sastry's book this verse is numbered 43 and the last verse as 44. > > > > Friends now you can see for yourself that original verse Y-VJ:4 was made verse no.5 without numbering and was looked down upon with suspicion by the people, who were holding Pingreean views and thus they have attempted to damage the Vedanga Jyotisha, which is considered the eye of the Veda.> > > > Regards,> > > > Sunil K.Bhattacharjya> > > > > > --- On Sun, 7/26/09, jyotirved <jyotirved@ ..> wrote:> > > >

jyotirved <jyotirved@ ..>> > [VRI] Vedana Jyotisha--Rashi mantra is spurioius and nothing but spurious!> > vedic_research_ institute> > Cc: indian_astrology_ group_daily_ digest@grou ps.com, hinducalendar> > Sunday, July 26, 2009, 2:20 AM> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear friends, > > > > Namastey! > > > > Below is a copy of Message No. 2807 by Shri S. Bhattacharjya> > in WAVES-VEDIC forum. > > > > Then In message No. 2874 of June 26, 09, Shri Bhattacharjya> > had said further: > >

> > “ 6)INSA stands for Indian national Science Academy. The> > Vedanga Jyotisha was published in their "Indian Journal of History of> > Science, Vol.19, No. 4, Supplement. Their website is www.insa.ac. inâ€> > > > Now the same Shri Bhjattacharjya says that that work of INSA has> > been published/edited under the influence of Pingree! > > > > These are the prevarications “Vedic astrologers†make! > > > > Surprisingly, Holay’s edition shows the Mina Rashi mantra as> > spurious! Hindi edition of a Delhi publisher shows that mantra as spurious! INSA> > edition shows that mantra as spurious! S. B. Dikshit has just not thought it> > fit even to refer to such a spurious mantra in his magnum opus, “History of> > Indian astronomyâ€, and he has declared, like all the true scholars of

eminence,> > that there are no Rashis in the Vedas or the Vedanga Jyotisha! Somakar, the> > earliest recorded Sanskrit commentator of an unknown era on the Vedanga> > Jyotisha also has shown that mantra as spurious! > > > > Have all these commentators and translators been under> > Pingree’s influence? Were Somakar of yore and S. B. Dikshit, a redoubtable> > scholar of nineteenth century, also influenced by Pingree even before he> > (Pingree)was born? > > > > > > > > In any case, why does Shri Bhjattacharjya not upload a copy> > of the page, indicating the edition and publisher, that contains the spurious> > mantra as the original mantra, as claimed by Shri Bhattacharyjay and his mentor> > in his post in AIA. > > > > With regards, > > >

> A K Kaul > > > > **** *** *****

***** ***** ***** **** > > > > > > > > #2807 in WAVES-VEDIC by Shri Sunil Bhattacharjya > > > > Dear Sreenadhji, > > > > > > > > Thank you very much for such a comprehensive reply. I> > am sending copies of this mail to the other

groups also. Avinash Sathaye seems> > to be an ardent admirer of Avtar Krishen Kaul and hence Sathaye> > was doubting my mention of Vedanga Jyotisha and AKK also> > seems to be conveniently conniving at the lapse of Sathaye. Thank you once> > again. > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Sunil K. Bhattacharjya> > > > > > > > --- On Tue, 5/26/09, Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Sreenadh <sreesog@>> > > > [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Fw: [VRI] Fwd: Reference for Rashi's in> > Vedas> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology> > > > Tuesday, May 26, 2009, 6:41 PM > > >

> Dear Sunil Bhattacharjya ji, > > > > Give him the following references . If more references are> > required, that also is available. > > > > ============ ==> > > > AIA Website Article: Vendic Month Names > > > > Some preliminary evidence to prove the existence of Meshadi> > month names in Vedic period is given below – > > > > 1) Take the Yajur> > Vedanga Jyotisha text and read the 5th sloka. It reads as follows - > > > > Ye brihaspatina bhuktva MEENAN prabbriti rasayaH > > > > te hritaH panchabhiryataH yaH seshaH sa parigrihaH > > > > (Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha - sloka 5) > > > > [Take the sign count of Jupiter counting from Meena Rasi> > (Pisces Sign), ............ .......etc] I believe you have

noticed the words> > 'Meenan prabhriti RasayaH' [signs counted from Meena Rasi (Pisces Sign)]. That> > proves the existence of signs like Meena, Mesha etc in Vedanga Jyotisha period.> > > > > > 2) Take the Rk Vedanga> > Jyotisha text next. Flip the pages to reach the 11th sloka. It reads – > > > > Sravishtabhyam gunabhyastan prag-viLAGNAN vinirdiset > > > > Suryat masan palabhyastan vidyacchandramasanr itun > > > > (Rk Vedanga Jyotisha - sloka 11) > > > > Please notice the words - "Prag vilangnan" (From> > the eastern LAGNA; from the eastern RISING SIGN) "Lagna" means,> > "Raseenam Udayo Lagna" (The SIGN rising in the east is termed LAGNA).> > > > > > 3) Take the copy of> > Boudhayana Sutra. In it you will find a quote that reads - "Meena

Meshayor> > Mesha Vrishabhayor VasantaH" [The Vasanta Ritu could be either in> > Meena-Mesha or in Mesha-Vrishabha (as per the period of time and geographical> > location)] > > > > 4) Then take the> > Rigveda itself and try to understand the wordings such as - "Dwadasaram> > nahi tajjaraya" , "Dwadaya pradhayaschakrameka m" etc etc. > > > > 5) Take Maitreya Sutra> > and in it you will find a quote as follows – > > > > Ravina langhito masaschandraH khyato malipluchaH > > > > masadwaye yadapyekaRASIM Sankrametadityastat radyo> > malipluchaH > > > > [if two lunar months falls with a single sidereal solar> > month (Rasi; Sign) - i.e. if Sun TRANSITS two lunar months with in Rasis (Sign)> > - then that month is known with the special name "Maliplucha" (the>

> unclean month)] > > > > This quote proves that sidereal solar months where clearly> > in existence and use during Vedic period. > > > > 6) If even this is not> > enough then kid like stories are better for you. So take the Puranas and you> > will find numerous references to Signs in all of them, Such as in Garuda> > Purana, Agni Purana or numerous other Puranas. > > > > Love and regards, > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>

[Guest guest]

parvasudhar2065 , " samodacharya " <svadhyaya@> wrote:

 

 

 

The RASHI-SHLOKA found in later manuscri¬pts of VEDANGA JYOTISHA is spurious. It

is out of Vedic context. To understand this matter fully you may go through the

ACHARYA KAUNDINNYA¬YANA'S introduction to VEDANGA JYOTISHA, Chaukhamba

Vidyabhavan 2005. The old commentator SOMAKAR has not mentioned the

RASHI-SHLOKA. Modern commentators like SUDHAKAR DVIVEDI etc. also accept that

the RASHI-SHLOKA is PRAKSHIPTA.

Being just a concluding remark there was no need to comment separately on the

43rd SHLOKA of VEDANGA JYOTISHA. SOMAKARA has included it in the commentary of

44rth SHLOKA. SUDHA¬KARA DVIVEDI was not able to understand SOMA¬KARA'S

commentary. ACHARYA KAUNDI¬NNYA¬YANA has elucidated this important conclusion of

SOMAKARA.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

parvasudhar2065 , " harimalla@ " <harimalla@> wrote:

>

> , Sunil Bhattacharjya

<sunil_bhattacharjya@> wrote:

>

> Dear friends,

>  

> Namaste,

>  

> It is nice that Shri Kaul has uploaded the few pages out of the more than

500 pages of Dr. Shivaraj's edition of Somaakara's  commentary on the Yajur

Vedanga Jyotisha (Y-VJ), in his own HinduCalendar group as well as in the Vedic

Research Institute group. But it is regrettable that Shri Kaul did not

highlight Dr. Shivaraj's own comment in page 424 that according to

Sudhakara the verse 43 was not there in the Somakaara's bhashya (and yet he

included that in his edition).

>  

> Now coming to the Rashi verse Shri Kaul should also quote Dr. Shivaraj as to

why he (Dr. Shicaraj) omitted that from his book even though he added one verse

(as shown above), which was not there in Somakara's bhashya. This is important

as in the edition of Kupanna Sastry it is mentioned in page 31 that the Rashi

verse was there in all the seven manuscripts, which he consulted.

>  

> In his eagerness to show that Rashis were imported from the Greeks Shri Kaul

should not act with bias.

>  

> Moreover why should Shri Kaul single me out as Parokshya professor.

Parokshya jnana is nothing but logical inference. For example, we see that the

Sun rises in the east and sets in the west and that this movement of the Sun

round the Earth is Pratyaksha jnana. But we with the Paroksha jnana know that in

reality the Earth moves round the Sun and not the reverse. All people with

brains are Parokshya jnanis. Why does Shri Kaul not think of himself as one of

the Parokshya jnanis?

>  

> Regards,

>  

> Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

>  

>  

>  

>

>

> --- On Fri, 8/7/09, Avtar Krishen Kaul <jyotirved@> wrote:

>

>

> Avtar Krishen Kaul <jyotirved@>

> [VRI] Vedana Jyotisha--Rashi mantra is spurious and nothing but

spurious!

> vedic_research_institute

> Friday, August 7, 2009, 6:20 AM

>

>

>  

>

>

>

> Dear friends,

> Namastey!

> A zip file named " from vedanga jyotisha " has been uploaded in the files

section by me. These are scanned pages of Yajur-Jyotisham, with a commentary by

Somakara, who was around several centuries back.

> This file has been obtained from Shri Hari Malla of HinduCalendar /

Parvasudhar2065 forum. The original work is published by Chaukhamba, Varanasi.

> From perusal of these pages it will be clear that the so called " Mina rashi

mantra " does not exist in this edition as well, which means it is an addition of

the last few centuries, by some inept jyotishi, who did not known ABC of

astronomy, either sidhantic or modern!

> I hope the " Parokshya Professor " will not come out now with the argument that

Somakara must have been haunted by the ghost of Pingre through his previous

janma and that is why he has omitted the spurious mantra!

> If any mentor of the " Parokshya Professor " does have any copy that shows the

spurious mantra as original, it is the " Parokshya Professor's " duty to present

it to the members indicating the publisher and year of publication. Why is he

trying to keep the gun on other's shoulders, since it is he who has quoted his

mentor referring to the spurious mantra as mantra No. 5 in the Yajur Jyotisham.

> As such, Mesha etc. rashis, which are actually non-existent imaginary

" animals " of a non-existent " circle of animals " are nothing but direct imports

from other coutnries like Babylonia via Greeks.

> With regards,

> A K Kaul

>

> vedic_research_ institute, Sunil Bhattacharjya

<sunil_bhattacharjy a wrote:

> >

> > Dear friends,

> >  

> > It is regrettable that Shri Kaul had not understtod my mail properly, which

even a schoolboy will understand. The original verse mentioning the Meena Rashi

was verse No. 4 in the Yajur Vedfanga Jyotisha (Y-VJ) and the editors who were

influenced by Pingree's views thought that the Greeks had taught Rashi to the

Indians much after the  Vedanga Jyotisha was composed and that is why the

verse must be spurious. So they brought in the verse No. 35 from the Rig Vedanga

Jyotisha (R-VJ) and placed it in position No. 4 in the Y-VJ. Naturally the

original verse was pushed to the fifth place and they numbered it as Zero. 

> >  

> > Nobody is beating around the bush and nobody is trying to obfuscate the

issue. You are calling Sreenadhji my mentor just because he mentioned about

the verse in his mail. Then  Shri Kaul should better  ask Sreenadhji

directly if he has any difficulty in understanding what I wrote. In fact in

stead of me the last mail should have been written by Sreenadhji as it was he

who was the first to point out the verse in the Y-VJ. Further if Shri

Kaul thinks that Rashis are not mentioned in the Veda, Vedanga Jyotisha and the

Puranas and that the Indians learnt Astrology from the Greeks I have nothing to

say. I am not compelling him to accept my views. Let him take it or leave it.

> >  

> > Regards,

> >  

> > Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

> >

> > --- On Thu, 7/30/09, Avtar Krishen Kaul <jyotirved@ ..> wrote:

> >

> >

> > Avtar Krishen Kaul <jyotirved@ ..>

> > Re: [VRI] Vedana Jyotisha--Rashi mantra is spurioius and nothing

but spurious!

> > vedic_research_ institute

> > Thursday, July 30, 2009, 7:48 AM

> >

> >

> >  

> >

> >

> >

> > Shri Bhatacharjya has quoted, in h is original message to WAVES-Vedic, his

mentor as saying,

> > quote

> > " Some preliminary evidence to prove the existence of Meshadi month names in

Vedic period is given below –

> >

> > 1) Take the Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha text and read the 5th sloka. It reads as

follows -

> >

> > Ye brihaspatina bhuktva MEENAN prabbriti rasayaH

> >

> > te hritaH panchabhiryataH yaH seshaH sa parigrihaH

> >

> > (Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha - sloka 5) "

> > End quote

> >

> > Where is that fifth shloka, pl.?

> > Why beat about the bush and obfuscate the issue to such an extent that the

readers get distracted from " the eye of the fish " i.e. the fact that ths mantra

is nothing but spurious. If there does exist ay work that has not listed the

spurious mantra as " zero " Why not scan the page of that work, indicating its

editor, publisher and year of publisher?

> > Regards,

> > A K Kaul

> >

> > vedic_research_ institute, Sunil Bhattacharjya

<sunil_bhattacharjy a wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear friends,

> > >

> > > Namaste,

> > >

> > > 1)

> > > Yes it was I (S.K.Bhattacharjya) who said that the Vedanga Jyorisha (VJ)

(which was edited by Dr. K.V.Sharma) and published by INSA is available on the

Internet and that was because  to my knowledge no other copy  is available in

the Internet. If Mr. A.K.Kaul kniws of any copy edited by any other editor he

may let us know.

> > >

> > > 2)

> > > In the INSA copy the editor Dr. K.V.Sharma had relegated the Verse no. 4

of Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha (Y-VJ), which mentioned Meena rashi and sidelined it

and commented in page 50 that it is patently an interpolated verse as Rashi is

of foreign origin and came to India only during the 1st Century AD  along with

Greek astrology. However at the same time he stresses the importance of this

verse and he says that this verse serves a useful purpose and that is why it is

interpolated. Thus Dr.K.V.Sharma admittd that this verse is an essential verse

but was relegated just because of the prejudice because of the thinking that the

Rashis were not known to the Indians before 1st century AD (CE) This essential 

verse was substituted by bringing in the concluding verse no. 35 of Rig Vedanga

Jyotisha (R-VJ), which is the unimportant concluding verse of RV-J as you can

see yourself from the meaning of the verse as given by Dr. K.V.Sharma himself as

follows:

> > >

> > > R-VJ: 35 : " Like the combs of the peacocks and the crest jewels of the

serpents so does the lore of Jyotisha stand at the head of all the lores forming

the auxilliaries of the Vedas. "

> > >

> > > 3)

> > > Mr.A.K.Kaul does not know that Dr. Kuppanna Sastry died in 1978 and that

his book was to be originally

> > > published by the Bharataiya Vidya Bhavan but finally INSA got it edited

> > > by Dr. K.V.Sharma and published it in 1984. That is why A.K.Kaul mentions

about the Holay's book. which he did not know that it was published in 1986 (in

Marathi) and in 1989 (in English), ie. several years after the publication of

the INSA book. Similarly Dr Suresh Chndra Mishra's book was also published in

2003 ie nine years after the INSA book. Once the INSA book mentioned the

maligned YVJ - 4 as interpolated the other authors also automatically followed

suit and did not make an issue about it as long the verse remained in the text.

Incidentally Mr. Holay had imagined the presence of a 19-year yuga cycle in VJ

but Dr. Abhyankar had proved it beyond doubt that Holay was wrong. However Mr.

Chandrahari seems to support Holay.

> > >

> > > 4)

> > > In the INSA book there is another unnumbered verse after verse no.43 This

verse is important as it mentions that it is Lagadha's work. Dr. K.V.Sharma says

in page 36 that in Weber's first edition this verse appeared unnumbered before

the last verse 43 of Y-VJ buthe says that in Shama Sastry's book this verse is

numbered 43 and the last verse as 44.

> > >

> > > Friends now you can see for yourself that original verse Y-VJ:4 was made

verse no.5 without numbering  and was looked down upon with suspicion by the 

people, who were holding Pingreean views and thus they have attempted to damage

the Vedanga Jyotisha, which is considered the eye of the Veda.

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > >

> > > Sunil K.Bhattacharjya

> > >

> > >

> > > --- On Sun, 7/26/09, jyotirved <jyotirved@ ..> wrote:

> > >

> > > jyotirved <jyotirved@ ..>

> > > [VRI] Vedana Jyotisha--Rashi mantra is spurioius and nothing but

spurious!

> > > vedic_research_ institute

> > > Cc: indian_astrology_ group_daily_ digest@grou ps.com, hinducalendar@

. com

> > > Sunday, July 26, 2009, 2:20 AM

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >  

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear friends,

> > >

> > > Namastey!

> > >

> > > Below is a copy of Message No. 2807 by Shri S. Bhattacharjya

> > > in WAVES-VEDIC forum.

> > >

> > > Then In message No.  2874 of June 26, 09, Shri Bhattacharjya

> > > had said further:

> > >

> > > “ 6)INSA stands for Indian national Science Academy. The

> > > Vedanga Jyotisha was published in their " Indian Journal of History of

> > > Science, Vol.19, No. 4, Supplement. Their website is  www.insa.ac. inâ€

> > >

> > >   Now the same Shri Bhjattacharjya says that that work of INSA has

> > > been published/edited under the influence of Pingree!

> > >

> > > These are the prevarications “Vedic astrologers†make!

> > >

> > > Surprisingly, Holay’s edition shows the Mina Rashi mantra as

> > > spurious! Hindi edition of a Delhi publisher shows that mantra as

spurious!  INSA

> > > edition shows that mantra as spurious!  S. B. Dikshit has just not

thought it

> > > fit even to refer to such a spurious mantra in his magnum opus, “History

of

> > > Indian astronomyâ€, and he has declared, like all the true scholars of

eminence,

> > > that there are no Rashis in the Vedas or the Vedanga Jyotisha!  Somakar,

the

> > > earliest recorded Sanskrit commentator of an unknown era on the Vedanga

> > > Jyotisha also has shown that mantra as spurious!

> > >

> > > Have all these commentators and translators been under

> > > Pingree’s influence?  Were Somakar of yore  and S. B. Dikshit, a

redoubtable

> > > scholar of nineteenth century, also influenced by Pingree even before he

> > > (Pingree)was born?

> > >

> > >  

> > >

> > > In any case, why does  Shri Bhjattacharjya not upload a copy

> > > of the page, indicating the edition and publisher, that contains the

spurious

> > > mantra as the original mantra, as claimed by Shri Bhattacharyjay and his

mentor

> > > in his post in AIA.

> > >

> > > With regards,

> > >

> > > A K Kaul

> > >

> > >

****                                    

***                                      Â\

 Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 

*****                                  

*****                                  

*****                                  

*****                                   ****

> > >

> > >  

> > >

> > > #2807 in WAVES-VEDIC by Shri Sunil Bhattacharjya

> > >

> > > Dear Sreenadhji,

> > >

> > >  

> > >

> > > Thank you very much for such a comprehensive reply.  I

> > > am sending copies of this mail to the other groups also. Avinash Sathaye

seems

> > > to be an ardent admirer of  Avtar Krishen Kaul and hence Sathaye

> > >  was doubting my mention of Vedanga Jyotisha and AKK also

> > > seems to be conveniently conniving at the lapse of Sathaye. Thank you once

> > > again.

> > >

> > >  

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > >

> > >  

> > >

> > > Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > --- On Tue, 5/26/09, Sreenadh <sreesog@> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Sreenadh <sreesog@>

> > >

> > > [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Fw: [VRI] Fwd: Reference for

Rashi's in

> > > Vedas

> > >

> > > ancient_indian_ astrology

> > >

> > > Tuesday, May 26, 2009, 6:41 PM

> > >

> > > Dear Sunil Bhattacharjya ji,

> > >

> > >    Give him the following references . If more references are

> > > required, that also is available.

> > >

> > > ============ ==

> > >

> > >    AIA Website Article: Vendic Month Names

> > >

> > > Some preliminary evidence to prove the existence of Meshadi

> > > month names in Vedic period is given below –

> > >

> > > 1) Take the Yajur

> > > Vedanga Jyotisha text and read the 5th sloka. It reads as follows -

> > >

> > > Ye brihaspatina bhuktva MEENAN prabbriti rasayaH

> > >

> > > te hritaH panchabhiryataH yaH seshaH sa parigrihaH

> > >

> > > (Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha - sloka 5)

> > >

> > > [Take the sign count of Jupiter counting from Meena Rasi

> > > (Pisces Sign), ............ .......etc] I believe you have noticed the

words

> > > 'Meenan prabhriti RasayaH' [signs counted from Meena Rasi (Pisces Sign)].

That

> > > proves the existence of signs like Meena, Mesha etc in Vedanga Jyotisha

period.

> > >

> > >

> > > 2) Take the Rk Vedanga

> > > Jyotisha text next. Flip the pages to reach the 11th sloka. It reads

–

> > >

> > > Sravishtabhyam gunabhyastan prag-viLAGNAN vinirdiset

> > >

> > > Suryat masan palabhyastan vidyacchandramasanr itun

> > >

> > > (Rk Vedanga Jyotisha - sloka 11)

> > >

> > > Please notice the words - " Prag vilangnan " (From

> > > the eastern LAGNA; from the eastern RISING SIGN) " Lagna " means,

> > > " Raseenam Udayo Lagna " (The SIGN rising in the east is termed LAGNA).

> > >

> > >

> > > 3) Take the copy of

> > > Boudhayana Sutra. In it you will find a quote that reads - " Meena Meshayor

> > > Mesha Vrishabhayor VasantaH " [The Vasanta Ritu could be either in

> > > Meena-Mesha or in Mesha-Vrishabha (as per the period of time and

geographical

> > > location)]

> > >

> > > 4) Then take the

> > > Rigveda itself and try to understand the wordings such as - " Dwadasaram

> > > nahi tajjaraya " , " Dwadaya pradhayaschakrameka m " etc etc.

> > >

> > > 5) Take Maitreya Sutra

> > > and in it you will find a quote as follows –

> > >

> > > Ravina langhito masaschandraH khyato malipluchaH

> > >

> > > masadwaye yadapyekaRASIM Sankrametadityastat radyo

> > > malipluchaH

> > >

> > > [if two lunar months falls with a single sidereal solar

> > > month (Rasi; Sign) - i.e. if Sun TRANSITS two lunar months with in Rasis

(Sign)

> > > - then that month is known with the special name " Maliplucha " (the

> > > unclean month)]

> > >

> > > This quote proves that sidereal solar months where clearly

> > > in existence and use during Vedic period.

> > >

> > > 6) If even this is not

> > > enough then kid like stories are better for you. So take the Puranas and

you

> > > will find numerous references to Signs in all of them, Such as in Garuda

> > > Purana, Agni Purana or numerous other Puranas.

> > >

> > > Love and regards,

> > >

> > > Sreenadh

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >  

> > >

> >

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

 

[Guest guest]

Dear friends,

 

I have not sent any query to Shri Harimalla or nor to Shri Samodacharya nor I

have any intention to humiliate respected Dr. Shivaraj Kaundinyayan. Yet I have

to reply to Shri Harimalla as he had sent the mail to me. I think this

discussion will be of interest to you too.

 

I have mentioned earlier that according to Kuppanna Sastry the Rashi-verse

appears in all the seven manuscripts seen by him. Some scholars have assumed

that the Rashi-verse is interpolated as Kupanna Sastry himself mentioned about

the belief that the Indians learnt Astrology from the Greeks and hence according

to him any mention of Rashi could not have been there in the Vedanga Jyotisha.

 

Rashi-verse is not out of context in the Veda. I have already shown that Rashis

have been mentioned in the Veda, Vedanga jyotisha as well as in the Puranas (the

fifth veda). Even from the common sense point of view the Rashi-concept is as

old as the ancient Indian astronomy as otherwise that in the wide open sky how

could the ancient astronomers have identified the individual Nakshatra

positions? Even though the Orion is the brightest of the stars I have not found

any mention anywhere in any of the ancient texts about the use of any star-light

measuring nequipment like the  light-meters  or fkux-meters, in the olden times

to measure the brightness of the stars and to have the comparative figures of

brightness of the stars to make them distinguishable. To my mind the Rashis,

which recognised the shapes of the Nakshatra-formations within the rashi was

essential for identifying the positions of the grahas of the Solar system at any

time in terms of

the Nakshatra and Rashi. Thus the concept of the Rashis is as old as

the ancient Indian Astronomy. The twelve divisions of ecliptic mentioned in the

Rig veda cannot be anything other the Rashis.

 

The Rashi-verse in the Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha Y-VJ) mentions how from the

position of Jupiter in any year one can count the number of the remaining years

in the Yuga. This is a very valid point as without that how can anyone know from

when the Yuga cycle starts? The five-year yuga cycle cannot start every year. It

has to start once in five years and that is how this verse is related to the

Yuga cycle. In his commentary on Taittiriya Brahmana the great Sayanacharya

talks about the 60- year cycle as consisting of twelve of the five year yuga

cycles. Every year of this yuga cycles have specific names. This shows that

without the Rashi-verse the Y-VJ is incomplete. Even Kuppanna Sastri admits the

usefulness of the Rashi-verse..

 

Now coming to Shri Samodacharya's brushing aside the commentary of Sudhakar

Dvivedi as that of a modern writer nothing can be further from the truth.

Sudhakar dvivedin wrole his commentary more than hundred years ago and he is not

one of the modern writers like Dr. Shivaraj Kaundinyayan. Where did Sudhakar

Dvivedi say that Rashi-verse is prakshipta? His (Sudhakar

Dvivedin's) family owned the oldest manuscript of the Vedanga Jyotisha, dated

1526 CE. (Tiubingen document).

 

Further you will be surprised Somakara refers to Veda (Satapatha Brahmana) to

say that the Veda had mentioned that the yuga started from the fullmoon night.

Thus the  Yuga of the Vedanga Jyotisha started from the first day of the Magha

(Purnimata) and in those days the seasonal month Tapa starting from the

Shukla-pratipada fell within that month.  People like Shri Kaul are wrongly

insisting that the year started from the Tapa. Tapa will fall in whichever month

the Winter Solstice occurs. In the times of Vedanga Jyotisha the Winter Solstice

occurred in the month of Magha (Purnimanta). Even in the Mahabharata, the dying

man Bhishma waited for the Winter Solstice to occur in Magha and  Tapa was not

mentioned there (because it was not necessary to mention Tapa as it is  always

associated with Winter Solstice). The Winter Solstice would not occur in Magha

for ever.

 

Regards,

 

Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

 

 

parvasudhar2065 , " harimalla " <harimalla wrote:

 

Dear Samodacharyaji,

Thank you for your reply to shri Bhattacharjyaji's quories.I will get back to

after receiving the reaction to the said reply.

Please convey my regards to guru Shivaraj Acharyaji. thanks,

Hari Malla

 

 

parvasudhar2065 , " samodacharya " <svadhyaya@> wrote:

>

 

> The RASHI-SHLOKA found in later manuscri¬pts of VEDANGA JYOTISHA is spurious.

It is out of Vedic context. To understand this matter fully you may go through

the ACHARYA KAUNDINNYA¬YANA'S introduction to VEDANGA JYOTISHA, Chaukhamba

Vidyabhavan 2005. The old commentator SOMAKAR has not mentioned the

RASHI-SHLOKA. Modern commentators like SUDHAKAR DVIVEDI etc. also accept that

the RASHI-SHLOKA is PRAKSHIPTA.

> Being just a concluding remark there was no need to comment separately on the

43rd SHLOKA of VEDANGA JYOTISHA. SOMAKARA has included it in the commentary of

44rth SHLOKA.   SUDHA¬KARA DVIVEDI was not able to understand SOMA¬KARA'S

commentary. ACHARYA KAUNDI¬NNYA¬YANA has elucidated this important conclusion of

SOMAKARA.

 

>

> parvasudhar2065 , " harimalla@ " <harimalla@> wrote:

> >

> > , Sunil Bhattacharjya

<sunil_bhattacharjya@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear friends,

> >  

> > Namaste,

> >  

> > It is nice that Shri Kaul has uploaded the few pages out of the more than

500 pages of Dr. Shivaraj's edition of Somaakara's  commentary on the Yajur

Vedanga Jyotisha (Y-VJ), in his own HinduCalendar group as well as in the Vedic

Research Institute group. But it is regrettable that Shri Kaul did not

highlight Dr. Shivaraj's own comment in page 424 that according to

Sudhakara the verse 43 was not there in the Somakaara's bhashya (and yet he

included that in his edition).

> >  

> > Now coming to the Rashi verse Shri Kaul should also quote Dr. Shivaraj as to

why he (Dr. Shicaraj) omitted that from his book even though he added one verse

(as shown above), which was not there in Somakara's bhashya. This is important

as in the edition of Kupanna Sastry it is mentioned in page 31 that the Rashi

verse was there in all the seven manuscripts, which he consulted.

> >  

> > In his eagerness to show that Rashis were imported from the Greeks Shri Kaul

should not act with bias.

> >  

> > Moreover why should Shri Kaul single me out as Parokshya professor.

Parokshya jnana is nothing but logical inference. For example, we see that the

Sun rises in the east and sets in the west and that this movement of the Sun

round the Earth is Pratyaksha jnana. But we with the Paroksha jnana know that in

reality the Earth moves round the Sun and not the reverse. All people with

brains are Parokshya jnanis. Why does Shri Kaul not think of himself as one of

the Parokshya jnanis?

> >  

> > Regards,

> >  

> > Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

> >  

> >  

> >  

> >

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear friends,

 

I have not sent any query to Shri Harimalla or nor to Shri Samodacharya nor I

have any intention to humiliate respected Dr. Shivaraj Kaundinyayan. Yet I have

to reply to Shri Harimalla as he had sent the mail to me. I think this

discussion will be of interest to you too.

 

I have mentioned earlier that according to Kuppanna Sastry the Rashi-verse

appears in all the seven manuscripts seen by him. Some scholars have assumed

that the Rashi-verse is interpolated as Kupanna Sastry himself mentioned about

the belief that the Indians learnt Astrology from the Greeks and hence according

to him any mention of Rashi could not have been there in the Vedanga Jyotisha.

 

Rashi-verse is not out of context in the Veda. I have already shown that Rashis

have been mentioned in the Veda, Vedanga jyotisha as well as in the Puranas (the

fifth veda). Even from the common sense point of view the Rashi-concept is as

old as the ancient Indian astronomy as otherwise that in the wide open sky how

could the ancient astronomers have identified the individual Nakshatra

positions? Even though the Orion is the brightest of the stars I have not found

any mention anywhere in any of the ancient texts about the use of any star-light

measuring nequipment like the  light-meters  or fkux-meters, in the olden times

to measure the brightness of the stars and to have the comparative figures of

brightness of the stars to make them distinguishable. To my mind the Rashis,

which recognised the shapes of the Nakshatra-formations within the rashi was

essential for identifying the positions of the grahas of the Solar system at any

time in terms of

the Nakshatra and Rashi. Thus the concept of the Rashis is as old as

the ancient Indian Astronomy. The twelve divisions of ecliptic mentioned in the

Rig veda cannot be anything other the Rashis.

 

The Rashi-verse in the Yajur Vedanga Jyotisha Y-VJ) mentions how from the

position of Jupiter in any year one can count the number of the remaining years

in the Yuga. This is a very valid point as without that how can anyone know from

when the Yuga cycle starts? The five-year yuga cycle cannot start every year. It

has to start once in five years and that is how this verse is related to the

Yuga cycle. In his commentary on Taittiriya Brahmana the great Sayanacharya

talks about the 60- year cycle as consisting of twelve of the five year yuga

cycles. Every year of this yuga cycles have specific names. This shows that

without the Rashi-verse the Y-VJ is incomplete. Even Kuppanna Sastri admits the

usefulness of the Rashi-verse..

 

Now coming to Shri Samodacharya's brushing aside the commentary of Sudhakar

Dvivedi as that of a modern writer nothing can be further from the truth.

Sudhakar dvivedin wrole his commentary more than hundred years ago and he is not

one of the modern writers like Dr. Shivaraj Kaundinyayan. Where did Sudhakar

Dvivedi say that Rashi-verse is prakshipta? His (Sudhakar

Dvivedin's) family owned the oldest manuscript of the Vedanga Jyotisha, dated

1526 CE. (Tiubingen document).

 

Further you will be surprised Somakara refers to Veda (Satapatha Brahmana) to

say that the Veda had mentioned that the yuga started from the fullmoon night.

Thus the  Yuga of the Vedanga Jyotisha started from the first day of the Magha

(Purnimata) and in those days the seasonal month Tapa starting from the

Shukla-pratipada fell within that month.  People like Shri Kaul are wrongly

insisting that the year started from the Tapa. Tapa will fall in whichever month

the Winter Solstice occurs. In the times of Vedanga Jyotisha the Winter Solstice

occurred in the month of Magha (Purnimanta). Even in the Mahabharata, the dying

man Bhishma waited for the Winter Solstice to occur in Magha and  Tapa was not

mentioned there (because it was not necessary to mention Tapa as it is  always

associated with Winter Solstice). The Winter Solstice would not occur in Magha

for ever.

 

Regards,

 

Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

 

 

parvasudhar2065 , " harimalla " <harimalla wrote:

 

Dear Samodacharyaji,

Thank you for your reply to shri Bhattacharjyaji's quories.I will get back to

after receiving the reaction to the said reply.

Please convey my regards to guru Shivaraj Acharyaji. thanks,

Hari Malla

 

 

parvasudhar2065 , " samodacharya " <svadhyaya@> wrote:

>

 

> The RASHI-SHLOKA found in later manuscri¬pts of VEDANGA JYOTISHA is spurious.

It is out of Vedic context. To understand this matter fully you may go through

the ACHARYA KAUNDINNYA¬YANA'S introduction to VEDANGA JYOTISHA, Chaukhamba

Vidyabhavan 2005. The old commentator SOMAKAR has not mentioned the

RASHI-SHLOKA. Modern commentators like SUDHAKAR DVIVEDI etc. also accept that

the RASHI-SHLOKA is PRAKSHIPTA.

> Being just a concluding remark there was no need to comment separately on the

43rd SHLOKA of VEDANGA JYOTISHA. SOMAKARA has included it in the commentary of

44rth SHLOKA.   SUDHA¬KARA DVIVEDI was not able to understand SOMA¬KARA'S

commentary. ACHARYA KAUNDI¬NNYA¬YANA has elucidated this important conclusion of

SOMAKARA.

 

>

> parvasudhar2065 , " harimalla@ " <harimalla@> wrote:

> >

> > , Sunil Bhattacharjya

<sunil_bhattacharjya@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear friends,

> >  

> > Namaste,

> >  

> > It is nice that Shri Kaul has uploaded the few pages out of the more than

500 pages of Dr. Shivaraj's edition of Somaakara's  commentary on the Yajur

Vedanga Jyotisha (Y-VJ), in his own HinduCalendar group as well as in the Vedic

Research Institute group. But it is regrettable that Shri Kaul did not

highlight Dr. Shivaraj's own comment in page 424 that according to

Sudhakara the verse 43 was not there in the Somakaara's bhashya (and yet he

included that in his edition).

> >  

> > Now coming to the Rashi verse Shri Kaul should also quote Dr. Shivaraj as to

why he (Dr. Shicaraj) omitted that from his book even though he added one verse

(as shown above), which was not there in Somakara's bhashya. This is important

as in the edition of Kupanna Sastry it is mentioned in page 31 that the Rashi

verse was there in all the seven manuscripts, which he consulted.

> >  

> > In his eagerness to show that Rashis were imported from the Greeks Shri Kaul

should not act with bias.

> >  

> > Moreover why should Shri Kaul single me out as Parokshya professor.

Parokshya jnana is nothing but logical inference. For example, we see that the

Sun rises in the east and sets in the west and that this movement of the Sun

round the Earth is Pratyaksha jnana. But we with the Paroksha jnana know that in

reality the Earth moves round the Sun and not the reverse. All people with

brains are Parokshya jnanis. Why does Shri Kaul not think of himself as one of

the Parokshya jnanis?

> >  

> > Regards,

> >  

> > Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

> >  

> >  

> >  

> >