Guest guest Posted September 7, 2009 Report Share Posted September 7, 2009 Dear All, I invite you all to discuss the logic behind Vimsottari Dasa system in detail. This is a thread that could reveal much information if approached properly. Let me start - We will try to approach and answer the following questions - 1) What is the base logic behind Vimsottari dasa system and what is the year length to be used? 2) Why the Star lords are in the order Ke-Ve-Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa-Me? 3) Why the planets are ascribed dasa periods such as 6 years for Sun, 10 years for Moon etc? 4) From the historic perspective who proposed this Dasa system first, and how old it could be? 5) Why even the various Nadi systems refer to and use Vimsottari dasa system? Both Parasara and Mihira refer to this dasa system - was it in existence prior to these sages as well? As you could see, there are several questions to attend and answer to. We may not be able to provide or arrive at a definitive answer to many of these questions, but a systematic approach can reveal much information. I will start by attempting the first question only in this mail.1) What is the base logic behind Vimsottari dasa system and what is the year length to be used? Vimsottari dasa system spring from the base logic that 1 deg = 1 year while calculating dasa. Thus 360 degree = 360 years. But as we all know, maximum human life is not that long, but only 1/3rd of it - i.e. 120 years approx. Further it is to be noted that we are using 3 x 9 = 27 Nakshatra system; also knon as Nava tara system. In this system one cycle (of Nakshatra lords) is composed of only Nakshatras - i.e. 120 deg. Dasa means the "period or duration of life time provided by the corresponding graha"; Thus if the life span of an individual is indicated by one cycle of Nakahstra lords, then the life span is indicated by 120 deg of the zodiac. Since as per the sages 1 deg = 1 year, the life span of a human being should be 120 years. This is the very reason for Vimsottari dasa being composed of 120 years. (In the same way ashottari dasa springs from the base concept that the zodiac is composed of 108 navamsas and one Navamsa indicate an year - and thus 108 navamsas = 108 years). From the above point it is well evident that the year of 360 savana days (Surya siddhanta defines 360 savana days as 360 degree) is nothing but 360 deg of the zodiac itself. Thus it is well evident that the year length to be used is 360 degree sidereal year. This is an argument doubly corroborated both by Surya Siddhanta statement and also by the above base logic of Vimsottari dasa system. If we agree upon the above point, spontaneously it also become evident that the Dasa period that should be ascribed to each graha will correspond to 13 deg 20 min of a Nakshatra. Thus clearly the Dasa period that should be ascribed to every planet is 13 years and 4 months each! No planet should escape this argument if the above basics are correct. (This is a system anyone interested in equal dasa period distribution for each planet can try) But as we know the dasa period is NOT equal but unequal - Sun having only 6 years and Saturn having 19 years! Why is it so? How the 13 years 4 months ascribed to each planet got redistributed this way? The answer to this question lies in exaltation of planets in various Nakshatras and the rules for redistribution consider there off!! Interested? I will discuss this question in another mail - This much for today. Note: I invite you all also to discuss the above questions in your own way and provide more information. Love and regards,Sreenadh Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 8, 2009 Report Share Posted September 8, 2009 Dear Sreenadh ji,welcome back after festivities.With you back again we are back to astrology as well.....Love and regards,gopi. , "sreesog" <sreesog wrote:>> Dear All,> I invite you all to discuss the logic behind Vimsottari Dasa system> in detail. This is a thread that could reveal much information if> approached properly. Let me start -> We will try to approach and answer the following questions -> 1) What is the base logic behind Vimsottari dasa system and what is> the year length to be used?> 2) Why the Star lords are in the order Ke-Ve-Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa-Me?> 3) Why the planets are ascribed dasa periods such as 6 years for Sun,> 10 years for Moon etc?> 4) From the historic perspective who proposed this Dasa system first,> and how old it could be?> 5) Why even the various Nadi systems refer to and use Vimsottari dasa> system? Both Parasara and Mihira refer to this dasa system - was it in> existence prior to these sages as well?> As you could see, there are several questions to attend and answer to.> We may not be able to provide or arrive at a definitive answer to many> of these questions, but a systematic approach can reveal much> information. I will start by attempting the first question only in this> mail.> > 1) What is the base logic behind Vimsottari dasa system and what is the> year length to be used?> Vimsottari dasa system spring from the base logic that 1 deg = 1 year> while calculating dasa. Thus 360 degree = 360 years. But as we all know,> maximum human life is not that long, but only 1/3rd of it - i.e. 120> years approx. Further it is to be noted that we are using 3 x 9 = 27> Nakshatra system; also knon as Nava tara system. In this system one> cycle (of Nakshatra lords) is composed of only Nakshatras - i.e. 120> deg. Dasa means the "period or duration of life time provided by the> corresponding graha"; Thus if the life span of an individual is> indicated by one cycle of Nakahstra lords, then the life span is> indicated by 120 deg of the zodiac. Since as per the sages 1 deg = 1> year, the life span of a human being should be 120 years. This is the> very reason for Vimsottari dasa being composed of 120 years. (In the> same way ashottari dasa springs from the base concept that the zodiac is> composed of 108 navamsas and one Navamsa indicate an year - and thus 108> navamsas = 108 years).> From the above point it is well evident that the year of 360 savana> days (Surya siddhanta defines 360 savana days as 360 degree) is nothing> but 360 deg of the zodiac itself. Thus it is well evident that the year> length to be used is 360 degree sidereal year. This is an argument> doubly corroborated both by Surya Siddhanta statement and also by the> above base logic of Vimsottari dasa system.> If we agree upon the above point, spontaneously it also become> evident that the Dasa period that should be ascribed to each graha will> correspond to 13 deg 20 min of a Nakshatra. Thus clearly the Dasa period> that should be ascribed to every planet is 13 years and 4 months each!> No planet should escape this argument if the above basics are correct.> (This is a system anyone interested in equal dasa period distribution> for each planet can try) But as we know the dasa period is NOT equal but> unequal - Sun having only 6 years and Saturn having 19 years! Why is> it so? How the 13 years 4 months ascribed to each planet got> redistributed this way? The answer to this question lies in exaltation> of planets in various Nakshatras and the rules for redistribution> consider there off!! Interested? I will discuss this question in> another mail - This much for today. > Note: I invite you all also to discuss the above questions in your own> way and provide more information.> Love and regards,> Sreenadh> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 8, 2009 Report Share Posted September 8, 2009 Dear Kursija Ji sure ,sreenadh Ji is talking abt that only One surya paryaya over 360 dgree zodiac ( siderial fixed ) one will take almost 365.25 days .I think it is what suryasidhantha also mentions may b he will explain more when full post is available .rgrds sunil nair , "S.C. Kursija" <sckursija wrote:>> Dear Sreenadha ji, > I liked the thread. I like to add that people who use 365.25 days a year for dasha period are correct or wrong? > Regards> > --- On Mon, 9/7/09, sreesog sreesog wrote:> > > sreesog sreesog Logic Behind Vimsottari Dasa> > Monday, September 7, 2009, 9:10 PM> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear All,> I invite you all to discuss the logic behind Vimsottari Dasa system in detail. This is a thread that could reveal much information if approached properly. Let me start -> We will try to approach and answer the following questions -> 1) What is the base logic behind Vimsottari dasa system and what is the year length to be used?> 2) Why the Star lords are in the order Ke-Ve-Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa-Me?> 3) Why the planets are ascribed dasa periods such as 6 years for Sun, 10 years for Moon etc?> 4) From the historic perspective who proposed this Dasa system first, and how old it could be? > 5) Why even the various Nadi systems refer to and use Vimsottari dasa system? Both Parasara and Mihira refer to this dasa system - was it in existence prior to these sages as well? > As you could see, there are several questions to attend and answer to. We may not be able to provide or arrive at a definitive answer to many of these questions, but a systematic approach can reveal much information. I will start by attempting the first question only in this mail.> > 1) What is the base logic behind Vimsottari dasa system and what is the year length to be used?> Vimsottari dasa system spring from the base logic that 1 deg = 1 year while calculating dasa. Thus 360 degree = 360 years. But as we all know, maximum human life is not that long, but only 1/3rd of it - i.e. 120 years approx. Further it is to be noted that we are using 3 x 9 = 27 Nakshatra system; also knon as Nava tara system. In this system one cycle (of Nakshatra lords) is composed of only Nakshatras - i.e. 120 deg. Dasa means the "period or duration of life time provided by the corresponding graha"; Thus if the life span of an individual is indicated by one cycle of Nakahstra lords, then the life span is indicated by 120 deg of the zodiac. Since as per the sages 1 deg = 1 year, the life span of a human being should be 120 years. This is the very reason for Vimsottari dasa being composed of 120 years. (In the same way ashottari dasa springs from the base concept that the zodiac is composed of 108 navamsas and one Navamsa indicate an> year - and thus 108 navamsas = 108 years).> From the above point it is well evident that the year of 360 savana days (Surya siddhanta defines 360 savana days as 360 degree) is nothing but 360 deg of the zodiac itself. Thus it is well evident that the year length to be used is 360 degree sidereal year. This is an argument doubly corroborated both by Surya Siddhanta statement and also by the above base logic of Vimsottari dasa system.> If we agree upon the above point, spontaneously it also become evident that the Dasa period that should be ascribed to each graha will correspond to 13 deg 20 min of a Nakshatra. Thus clearly the Dasa period that should be ascribed to every planet is 13 years and 4 months each! No planet should escape this argument if the above basics are correct. (This is a system anyone interested in equal dasa period distribution for each planet can try) But as we know the dasa period is NOT equal but unequal - Sun having only 6 years and Saturn having 19 years! Why is it so? How the 13 years 4 months ascribed to each planet got redistributed this way? The answer to this question lies in exaltation of planets in various Nakshatras and the rules for redistribution consider there off!! Interested? I will discuss this question in another mail - This much for today. > Note: I invite you all also to discuss the above questions in your own way and provide more information. > Love and regards,> Sreenadh> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 8, 2009 Report Share Posted September 8, 2009 Dear All, Thanks to Vinita ji and Gopi ji for the Onam wishes; thanks to Sunil ji for the informative words. Let me answer the question posed by Kursija ji -//people who use 365.25 days a year for dasha period are correct or wrong? // Defenitions provided by Surya Siddhanta for Savana year as 360 degree solar siderial year, the curresponding guidance by numerous texts to use Savana year, the base logic of Vimsottari dasa, the phaladeepika statement to use the (360 deg) longitudinal movement of Sun - all guide us to the conclusion that the use of 360 degree solar siderial year (Time taken by Sun to cover 360 degrees) is the only correct method of year recconning to be used with Vimsottari dasa system. This is more or less very near to the standard solar year of 365.25 solar days. Therefore it cannnot be said that the use of 365.25 days is wrong. For example if you use JHora opting 360 degree solar year or 365.25 solar days year does not make much of a difference (even though minor difference does exist) - This is my opinion; others may differ.Hope I have satisfactorly answered your question.Love and regards,Sreenadh , "sreesog" <sreesog wrote:>> Dear All,> I invite you all to discuss the logic behind Vimsottari Dasa system> in detail. This is a thread that could reveal much information if> approached properly. Let me start -> We will try to approach and answer the following questions -> 1) What is the base logic behind Vimsottari dasa system and what is> the year length to be used?> 2) Why the Star lords are in the order Ke-Ve-Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa-Me?> 3) Why the planets are ascribed dasa periods such as 6 years for Sun,> 10 years for Moon etc?> 4) From the historic perspective who proposed this Dasa system first,> and how old it could be?> 5) Why even the various Nadi systems refer to and use Vimsottari dasa> system? Both Parasara and Mihira refer to this dasa system - was it in> existence prior to these sages as well?> As you could see, there are several questions to attend and answer to.> We may not be able to provide or arrive at a definitive answer to many> of these questions, but a systematic approach can reveal much> information. I will start by attempting the first question only in this> mail.> > 1) What is the base logic behind Vimsottari dasa system and what is the> year length to be used?> Vimsottari dasa system spring from the base logic that 1 deg = 1 year> while calculating dasa. Thus 360 degree = 360 years. But as we all know,> maximum human life is not that long, but only 1/3rd of it - i.e. 120> years approx. Further it is to be noted that we are using 3 x 9 = 27> Nakshatra system; also knon as Nava tara system. In this system one> cycle (of Nakshatra lords) is composed of only Nakshatras - i.e. 120> deg. Dasa means the "period or duration of life time provided by the> corresponding graha"; Thus if the life span of an individual is> indicated by one cycle of Nakahstra lords, then the life span is> indicated by 120 deg of the zodiac. Since as per the sages 1 deg = 1> year, the life span of a human being should be 120 years. This is the> very reason for Vimsottari dasa being composed of 120 years. (In the> same way ashottari dasa springs from the base concept that the zodiac is> composed of 108 navamsas and one Navamsa indicate an year - and thus 108> navamsas = 108 years).> From the above point it is well evident that the year of 360 savana> days (Surya siddhanta defines 360 savana days as 360 degree) is nothing> but 360 deg of the zodiac itself. Thus it is well evident that the year> length to be used is 360 degree sidereal year. This is an argument> doubly corroborated both by Surya Siddhanta statement and also by the> above base logic of Vimsottari dasa system.> If we agree upon the above point, spontaneously it also become> evident that the Dasa period that should be ascribed to each graha will> correspond to 13 deg 20 min of a Nakshatra. Thus clearly the Dasa period> that should be ascribed to every planet is 13 years and 4 months each!> No planet should escape this argument if the above basics are correct.> (This is a system anyone interested in equal dasa period distribution> for each planet can try) But as we know the dasa period is NOT equal but> unequal - Sun having only 6 years and Saturn having 19 years! Why is> it so? How the 13 years 4 months ascribed to each planet got> redistributed this way? The answer to this question lies in exaltation> of planets in various Nakshatras and the rules for redistribution> consider there off!! Interested? I will discuss this question in> another mail - This much for today. > Note: I invite you all also to discuss the above questions in your own> way and provide more information.> Love and regards,> Sreenadh> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 8, 2009 Report Share Posted September 8, 2009 Dear All, In this mail I will try to address the 2nd question - i.e. 2) Why the Star lords are in the order Ke-Ve-Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa-Me? I am aware that even though the first question is already answered satisfactorily, the connected discussion leads to the 3rd question and I am yet to answer that fully; yes, I will address that later. This mail is mainly for the second question and to present some extra information to stair your curiosity. OK. So to the 2nd question. 2) Why the Star lords are in the order Ke-Ve-Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa-Me? The traditional answer given to this question is as follows. The Nakshatra lords follow a specific and systematic sequence. * First is Earth; since the observation is from earth and since while observing from earth the movement of earth around sun is observed as the movement of Sun through ecliptic - Earth should be replaced with Sun. * On the left of earth should come the inner planets: Me -Ve * Immediately after earth should come the satellite of earth - i.e. Moon * On the right should come the outer planets: Ma-Ju-Sa * Thus the sequence availed is: Me-Ve---Sun (Earth) ---Mo-Ma-Ju-Sa * Now comes the nodal planets Ke and Ra. Ke is placed in the middle of inner planets - i.e. between Me and Ve; making the sequence Me-Ke-Ve. Ra is placed in the middle of outer planets - i.e between Mo-Ma and Ju-Sa; making the sequence Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa. Yes, ofcourse you may ask the question why Ketu should be placed between Me and Ve and Rahu between Ma and Ju. Currently I don't have an answer to this question - but someone might have a logical answer to the same as well. (It is a group effort - right?) Thus finally we have the total sequence in place as - Me-(Ke)-Ve ---Sun (Earth) ---Mo-Ma-(Ra)-Ju-Sa Or in short as - Me-Ke-Ve -Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa * Since the Nakshatra counting starts from Aswini the Yugadi Nakshatra, if we count the Nakshatras from Aswini the Nakshatra lordship sequence become : Ke-Ve -Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa-Me. But if some one prefer to start the count from the Nakshatra ascribed to Sun, i.e. Kartika then the sequence become : Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa-Me - Ke-Ve. Actually it is irrelevent from where you start counting, since the Nakshatra lordship is predefined - the same nakshatra lords come of nava taras recorsively, and thus forms the Nava Tara system based on Nakshtra lords. Now you debate the above points and make it a more informative discussion based on your inputs. OK. Now it is time to address the 3rd question. 3) Why the planets are ascribed dasa periods such as 6 years for Sun, 10 years for Moon etc (instead of 13 years 4 months for each Nakshatra)? I will be answering this question (based on traditional teaching) only in the next mail. But I would love to share some basic rules and information that leads to such dasa period ascribing in this mail itself. (You can think about and debate upon their logical base) 1) Rahu and Ketu are one and the same. Rule 1: Therefor the it can be said that the dasa period that should be ascribed to Rahu is 13.4 +13.4 = 26 years 8 months. (If considered so Ketu's dasa period will have to be treated as Zero) 2) Sun and Moon are called Prakasa garaha (bright planets). Rule 2: If exaltation is ascribed to any Tara Graha (star like planet such as Ma-Me-Ju-Ve-Sa) in the Nakshatras of these bright planets then half of the dasa period ascribed to these bright plaents should be given to the said Tara graha. Sun and Moon are considered as Siva-Sakti (Father and Monther) in astrology and all other grahas are their children - because of this too, this rule is logical. 3) Rule 3: If exaltation is ascribed to any Tara Graha (star like planet such as Ma-Me-Ju-Ve-Sa) in the Nakshatras of any other Tara graha then 1/4 th of the dasa period ascribed to the tara graha having nakshatra lordship should be given to the other Tara graha having exaltation power on the same nakshatra. This too is logical, since it is like the sharing of wealth between co-born. 4) Rule 4: Shadow planets does not give anything to anybody. But they are always willing to accept dasa periods from anyone. 5) Rule 5: The bright planets does not take anything from shadow planets (others) or tara grahas (their children). But they are (as husband and wife, as Siva-Sakti) are willing share between themselves. 6) Rule 6: Out of the remaining dasa period, only the full number of years will be given to any planet. The remaining dasa months will be carried over to the next graha in order (of nakshatra lordship list) when ever such remainder occurs. These are the base rules (as per a traditional teaching), that govers the re-distribution of 13 years 4 months dasa periods ascribed to each Nakshatra; leading to the final result 6 years for Sun, 10 years for Moon etc. In the next mail, I will address the question - exactly how the result is arrived at. Till that time, you can try to maths. :=) Note: I have heared this and several other logics that speak about the logic behind Nakshatra dasa period destribution. I am not of the opinion that the above story like narration (or the remaining story that would be presented in the next mail) is a defenite and conclusive answer. But defenitly it is informative and is a great pointer.Love and regards,Sreenadh , "sreesog" <sreesog wrote:>> Dear All,> I invite you all to discuss the logic behind Vimsottari Dasa system> in detail. This is a thread that could reveal much information if> approached properly. Let me start -> We will try to approach and answer the following questions -> 1) What is the base logic behind Vimsottari dasa system and what is> the year length to be used?> 2) Why the Star lords are in the order Ke-Ve-Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa-Me?> 3) Why the planets are ascribed dasa periods such as 6 years for Sun,> 10 years for Moon etc?> 4) From the historic perspective who proposed this Dasa system first,> and how old it could be?> 5) Why even the various Nadi systems refer to and use Vimsottari dasa> system? Both Parasara and Mihira refer to this dasa system - was it in> existence prior to these sages as well?> As you could see, there are several questions to attend and answer to.> We may not be able to provide or arrive at a definitive answer to many> of these questions, but a systematic approach can reveal much> information. I will start by attempting the first question only in this> mail.> > 1) What is the base logic behind Vimsottari dasa system and what is the> year length to be used?> Vimsottari dasa system spring from the base logic that 1 deg = 1 year> while calculating dasa. Thus 360 degree = 360 years. But as we all know,> maximum human life is not that long, but only 1/3rd of it - i.e. 120> years approx. Further it is to be noted that we are using 3 x 9 = 27> Nakshatra system; also knon as Nava tara system. In this system one> cycle (of Nakshatra lords) is composed of only Nakshatras - i.e. 120> deg. Dasa means the "period or duration of life time provided by the> corresponding graha"; Thus if the life span of an individual is> indicated by one cycle of Nakahstra lords, then the life span is> indicated by 120 deg of the zodiac. Since as per the sages 1 deg = 1> year, the life span of a human being should be 120 years. This is the> very reason for Vimsottari dasa being composed of 120 years. (In the> same way ashottari dasa springs from the base concept that the zodiac is> composed of 108 navamsas and one Navamsa indicate an year - and thus 108> navamsas = 108 years).> From the above point it is well evident that the year of 360 savana> days (Surya siddhanta defines 360 savana days as 360 degree) is nothing> but 360 deg of the zodiac itself. Thus it is well evident that the year> length to be used is 360 degree sidereal year. This is an argument> doubly corroborated both by Surya Siddhanta statement and also by the> above base logic of Vimsottari dasa system.> If we agree upon the above point, spontaneously it also become> evident that the Dasa period that should be ascribed to each graha will> correspond to 13 deg 20 min of a Nakshatra. Thus clearly the Dasa period> that should be ascribed to every planet is 13 years and 4 months each!> No planet should escape this argument if the above basics are correct.> (This is a system anyone interested in equal dasa period distribution> for each planet can try) But as we know the dasa period is NOT equal but> unequal - Sun having only 6 years and Saturn having 19 years! Why is> it so? How the 13 years 4 months ascribed to each planet got> redistributed this way? The answer to this question lies in exaltation> of planets in various Nakshatras and the rules for redistribution> consider there off!! Interested? I will discuss this question in> another mail - This much for today. > Note: I invite you all also to discuss the above questions in your own> way and provide more information.> Love and regards,> Sreenadh> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 9, 2009 Report Share Posted September 9, 2009 Dear Sreenadh ji, Hard work indeed, coming from you in form of these postings. Here is another mail (Method) which also shows the why of Vimsottari Dasa divisions. The 120 Years alloted to the Vimsottari dasa is not the actual Life span of a native, as is understood to be. 13 1/3 X 9 = 120 Years. Where 13 1/3 is equal to the span of a Nakshatra 9 equals to the number of Planets. Before clocks came into existence time was measured by Nimesa, Guru akshara, Prana,Pala,danda, Here 27 Nimesa = 1 Guru akshara 10 Guru akshar = 1 Prana 6 Prana = 1 Pala 60 Pala = 1 Danda 60 Danda = 1 Nakshatra 30 Nakshatra = 1 Month. 27 Nimesa correspond to 27 Nakshatras and are equal to 1 Guru akshara. The 10 Guru aksharas and 6 Pranas are the minutest division of time. The Mana measure and Prana measure are represented by the Moon and the Sun respectively. On this basis is the period of Chandra as 10 and of the Sun as 6, as given in the Vimsottari dasha. Rahu and Ketu are the two nodes of the Mana ( Mind- Mana). Due to Kranti or the inclination of the axis by 24 degrees , they are 180 degrees apart and divide the zodiac of 360 degrees by two equal halves. Deduct the number of years of the period of Sun and Moon from the Vimsottari Dasa, from 24, and the result is - 24 - 6 = 18 Years fo Rahu 24 -10 = 14 years ( Deduct half because the node stands at half of the circle of 360 degrees ) So we get the figure of Ketu which is 7 years. This is the way to mathematically and logically derive the number of years for all the planets. I am not giving the detailed and exhaustive explanations for the above, because this will take a lot of time, and I only look for serious astrologers to indulge in this. But when I do this, then it will be easy to undestand. Probably in a few months time...... The above is not my invention, but ancient jyotirvidya, which is lost to the time of the day, which i wish to revive within two years time. In the ancient jyotirvidya, Graha, Nakshatra and Raashi re taken in form of ideas and numerical value is attached to them, which allow us the knowledge of the event and the timing of the event. For instance if one has Lagna in Magha ( No.10 ), at age of 10 this native will show a powerful body , because Lagna stands for body, and Magha stands for powerful and strong. Now further suppose Ketu is in the same nakshatra inh Lagna. Ketu is representd by 9. Ketu shows disease and sickness, now at age of 10 the native will suffer from some strong disease, which will also be repeated at age of 19 ( 10 + 9 ). The above is another way of prognosis, but will come some day later on this. regards, Bhaskar. , "sreesog" <sreesog wrote:>> Dear All,> Let us continue from our previous mail - the effort to answer the> question - > 3) Why the planets are ascribed dasa periods such as 6> years for Sun, 10 years for Moon etc?> As mentioned in previous mail, let us assume that each graha> (Nakshatra lord) should be ascribed a period of 13 years 4 months each;> further let us Rahu has 26 years 8 months and Ketu zero years as of now.> Remember the six rules mentioned in the previous mail. Now let us start> calculating -> 1) Sun has a period of 13 years 4 months. But as per Rule 1, since> Moon is exalted in Krittika Nakshatra owned by Sun, the half of Sun's> dasa period (i.e. 6 years 8 months) should be given to Moon. Thus> temporarily Moon gets a dasa period of 13 years 4 months + 6 years 8> months = 20 years. Thus Sun will only have a dasa period of 6 years 8> months only. But as per Rule 6, Sun can have only the full dasa period> of 6 years only, and the remaining 8 months should be carried over to> the next graha in sequence. Since the above exchange happened with Moon,> it cannot be Moon but the next graha in sequence i.e. Mars. Thus we will> have to add the remaining 8 months with Mars dasa period of 13 years 4> months; Thus Mars will temporarily get 13 years 4 months + 8 months = 14> years, which should be equally divided between Mars and Ketu due to the> dictum Kujavat Keto (Ketu is like Mars). Thus Mars gets a dasa period> of 7 years and Ketu 7 years.> Thus at the end of the above calculations we have -> * Sun = 6 years> * Moon = 20 years> * Mars = 7 years> * Ketu = 7 years> 2) In the above section we said that Moon gains a total of 20 years as> dasa period. But Mercury is exalted in Hasta nakshatra owned by Moon,> and so as per Rule 2, Moon will have to give half of its dasa period to> Mercury. Thus Moon will have a dasa period of 10 years only; and Mercury> will get 13 years 4 months + 10 years = 23 years 4 months.> Thus at the end of the above calculations we have -> * Moon = 10 years> * Mercury = 23 years 4 months> 3) Jupiter is exalted in Pushya nakshatra owned by Saturn. Thus as> per Rule 3, Saturn will have to give 1/4th of its dasa period (3 years> 4 months) to Jupiter from Saturn's own dasa period of 13 years 4 months.> Thus Saturn will have only 10 years; and Jupiter will gain 13 years 4> months + 3 years 4 months = 16 years 8 months. But Jupiter has the right> to have only the full dasa years i.e. 16 years only from the same as per> Rule 6. (Remember that Jupiter has a remainder of 8 months which we will> have to carry over to Saturn. This we will consider later only)> Thus at the end of the above calculations we have -> * Jupiter = 16 years> * Saturn = 10 years> 4) As per the rule "Sanivat Rahu" (Rahu is like Saturn), the dasa> period available to Rahu and Saturn should be divided equally among> them. Now Saturn has 10 years and Rahu has 26 years 8 months. Together> it is 36 years 8 months. Dividing equally Rahu and Saturn should get 18> years 4 months each. Out of this the complete number 18 years is the> real dasa period of Rahu. The remainder 4 months should carry over to> Saturn. Also remember that earlier there is a carry over of 8 months> from Jupiter which also should be added to the period of Saturn. Thus> Saturn will have 18 years 4 months + 4 months + 8 months = 19 years.> Thus at the end of the above calculations we have -> * Rahu = 18 years> * Saturn = 19 years> 5) As mentioned earlier Mercury currently has 23 years 4 months. But> Venus is exalted in Revati Nakshatra owned by Mercury and therefore> 1/4th of Mercury's dasa period (i.e. 5 years 11 months) should be given> to Venus. Thus Mercury will have only 17 years 9 months, and Venus will> have 13 years 4 months + 5 years 11 months = 19 years 3 months. Out of> this as per Rule 6, Mercury will have only 17 years, and the remaining 9> months will carry over to Venus thus providing it a dasa period of 19> years 3 months + 9 months = 20 years.> Thus at the end of the above calculations we have -> * Mercury = 17 years> * Venus = 20 years> Thus we have the complete list as in the order of Nakshatra lords as -> > * Ketu = 7 years> * Venus = 20 years> * Sun = 6 years> * Moon = 10 years> * Mars = 7 years> * Rahu = 18 years> * Jupiter = 16 years> * Saturn = 19 years> > The whole story and maths seems to be like a made up one, even though it> gives a strong pointer to the involvement of exaltation of planets in> Nakshatras as deciding factor in Nakshatr4a dasa period> calculation/distribution.> Since I have finished presenting a traditional story of family wealth> distribution of dasa periods ( ha ha just joking) , I stop here and may> or may not continue the same thread in the next mail. > Argue, discuss and enjoy! There could be believers and non-believers> in this case as well as in every case. :=)> Love and regards,> Sreenadh> > , "sreesog" sreesog@> wrote:> >> > Dear All,> > In this mail I will try to address the 2nd question - i.e. 2) Why> the> > Star lords are in the order Ke-Ve-Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa-Me?> > I am aware that even though the first question is already answered> > satisfactorily, the connected discussion leads to the 3rd question and> I> > am yet to answer that fully; yes, I will address that later. This> > mail is mainly for the second question and to present some extra> > information to stair your curiosity. OK. So to the 2nd question.> > 2) Why the Star lords are in the order Ke-Ve-Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa-Me?> > The traditional answer given to this question is as follows.> > The Nakshatra lords follow a specific and systematic sequence.> > * First is Earth; since the observation is from earth and since> while> > observing from earth the movement of earth around sun is observed as> the> > movement of Sun through ecliptic - Earth should be replaced with Sun.> > * On the left of earth should come the inner planets: Me -Ve> > * Immediately after earth should come the satellite of earth - i.e.> > Moon> > * On the right should come the outer planets: Ma-Ju-Sa> > * Thus the sequence availed is: Me-Ve---Sun (Earth) ---Mo-Ma-Ju-Sa> > * Now comes the nodal planets Ke and Ra. Ke is placed in the middle> of> > inner planets - i.e. between Me and Ve; making the sequence Me-Ke-Ve.> Ra> > is placed in the middle of outer planets - i.e between Mo-Ma and> Ju-Sa;> > making the sequence Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa.> > Yes, ofcourse you may ask the question why Ketu should be placed> > between Me and Ve and Rahu between Ma and Ju. Currently I don't have> > an answer to this question - but someone might have a logical answer> to> > the same as well. (It is a group effort - right?)> > Thus finally we have the total sequence in place as -> > Me-(Ke)-Ve ---Sun (Earth) ---Mo-Ma-(Ra)-Ju-Sa> > Or in short as -> > Me-Ke-Ve -Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa> > * Since the Nakshatra counting starts from Aswini the Yugadi> > Nakshatra, if we count the Nakshatras from Aswini the Nakshatra> lordship> > sequence become : Ke-Ve -Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa-Me. But if some one> prefer> > to start the count from the Nakshatra ascribed to Sun, i.e. Kartika> then> > the sequence become : Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa-Me - Ke-Ve. Actually it is> > irrelevent from where you start counting, since the Nakshatra lordship> > is predefined - the same nakshatra lords come of nava taras> recorsively,> > and thus forms the Nava Tara system based on Nakshtra lords.> > Now you debate the above points and make it a more informative> > discussion based on your inputs.> > OK. Now it is time to address the 3rd question.> > 3) Why the planets are ascribed dasa periods such as 6 years for> Sun,> > 10 years for Moon etc (instead of 13 years 4 months for each> Nakshatra)?> > I will be answering this question (based on traditional teaching)> > only in the next mail. But I would love to share some basic rules and> > information that leads to such dasa period ascribing in this mail> > itself. (You can think about and debate upon their logical base)> >> > 1) Rahu and Ketu are one and the same. Rule 1: Therefor the it can> be> > said that the dasa period that should be ascribed to Rahu is 13.4> +13.4> > = 26 years 8 months. (If considered so Ketu's dasa period will have to> > be treated as Zero)> > 2) Sun and Moon are called Prakasa garaha (bright planets). Rule> 2:> > If exaltation is ascribed to any Tara Graha (star like planet such as> > Ma-Me-Ju-Ve-Sa) in the Nakshatras of these bright planets then half of> > the dasa period ascribed to these bright plaents should be given to> the> > said Tara graha. Sun and Moon are considered as Siva-Sakti (Father and> > Monther) in astrology and all other grahas are their children -> because> > of this too, this rule is logical.> > 3) Rule 3: If exaltation is ascribed to any Tara Graha (star like> > planet such as Ma-Me-Ju-Ve-Sa) in the Nakshatras of any other Tara> graha> > then 1/4 th of the dasa period ascribed to the tara graha having> > nakshatra lordship should be given to the other Tara graha having> > exaltation power on the same nakshatra. This too is logical, since it> is> > like the sharing of wealth between co-born.> > 4) Rule 4: Shadow planets does not give anything to anybody. But> they> > are always willing to accept dasa periods from anyone.> > 5) Rule 5: The bright planets does not take anything from shadow> > planets (others) or tara grahas (their children). But they are (as> > husband and wife, as Siva-Sakti) are willing share between themselves.> > 6) Rule 6: Out of the remaining dasa period, only the full number> of> > years will be given to any planet. The remaining dasa months will be> > carried over to the next graha in order (of nakshatra lordship list)> > when ever such remainder occurs.> > These are the base rules (as per a traditional teaching), that> govers> > the re-distribution of 13 years 4 months dasa periods ascribed to each> > Nakshatra; leading to the final result 6 years for Sun, 10 years for> > Moon etc.> > In the next mail, I will address the question - exactly how the> > result is arrived at. Till that time, you can try to maths. :=)> > Note: I have heared this and several other logics that speak about> the> > logic behind Nakshatra dasa period destribution. I am not of the> opinion> > that the above story like narration (or the remaining story that would> > be presented in the next mail) is a defenite and conclusive answer.> But> > defenitly it is informative and is a great pointer.> > Love and regards,> > Sreenadh> >> > , "sreesog" sreesog@> > wrote:> > >> > > Dear All,> > > I invite you all to discuss the logic behind Vimsottari Dasa> > system> > > in detail. This is a thread that could reveal much information if> > > approached properly. Let me start -> > > We will try to approach and answer the following questions -> > > 1) What is the base logic behind Vimsottari dasa system and what> is> > > the year length to be used?> > > 2) Why the Star lords are in the order> Ke-Ve-Su-Mo-Ma-Ra-Ju-Sa-Me?> > > 3) Why the planets are ascribed dasa periods such as 6 years for> > Sun,> > > 10 years for Moon etc?> > > 4) From the historic perspective who proposed this Dasa system> > first,> > > and how old it could be?> > > 5) Why even the various Nadi systems refer to and use Vimsottari> > dasa> > > system? Both Parasara and Mihira refer to this dasa system - was it> in> > > existence prior to these sages as well?> > > As you could see, there are several questions to attend and> answer> > to.> > > We may not be able to provide or arrive at a definitive answer to> many> > > of these questions, but a systematic approach can reveal much> > > information. I will start by attempting the first question only in> > this> > > mail.> > >> > > 1) What is the base logic behind Vimsottari dasa system and what is> > the> > > year length to be used?> > > Vimsottari dasa system spring from the base logic that 1 deg = 1> > year> > > while calculating dasa. Thus 360 degree = 360 years. But as we all> > know,> > > maximum human life is not that long, but only 1/3rd of it - i.e. > 120> > > years approx. Further it is to be noted that we are using 3 x 9 => 27> > > Nakshatra system; also knon as Nava tara system. In this system one> > > cycle (of Nakshatra lords) is composed of only Nakshatras - i.e.> 120> > > deg. Dasa means the "period or duration of life time provided by the> > > corresponding graha"; Thus if the life span of an individual is> > > indicated by one cycle of Nakahstra lords, then the life span is> > > indicated by 120 deg of the zodiac. Since as per the sages 1 deg = 1> > > year, the life span of a human being should be 120 years. This is> the> > > very reason for Vimsottari dasa being composed of 120 years. (In the> > > same way ashottari dasa springs from the base concept that the> zodiac> > is> > > composed of 108 navamsas and one Navamsa indicate an year - and thus> > 108> > > navamsas = 108 years).> > > From the above point it is well evident that the year of 360> > savana> > > days (Surya siddhanta defines 360 savana days as 360 degree) is> > nothing> > > but 360 deg of the zodiac itself. Thus it is well evident that the> > year> > > length to be used is 360 degree sidereal year. This is an argument> > > doubly corroborated both by Surya Siddhanta statement and also by> the> > > above base logic of Vimsottari dasa system.> > > If we agree upon the above point, spontaneously it also become> > > evident that the Dasa period that should be ascribed to each graha> > will> > > correspond to 13 deg 20 min of a Nakshatra. Thus clearly the Dasa> > period> > > that should be ascribed to every planet is 13 years and 4 months> each!> > > No planet should escape this argument if the above basics are> correct.> > > (This is a system anyone interested in equal dasa period> distribution> > > for each planet can try) But as we know the dasa period is NOT equal> > but> > > unequal - Sun having only 6 years and Saturn having 19 years! Why> is> > > it so? How the 13 years 4 months ascribed to each planet got> > > redistributed this way? The answer to this question lies in> > exaltation> > > of planets in various Nakshatras and the rules for redistribution> > > consider there off!! Interested? I will discuss this question in> > > another mail - This much for today. > > > Note: I invite you all also to discuss the above questions in your> own> > > way and provide more information.> > > Love and regards,> > > Sreenadh> > >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 12, 2009 Report Share Posted September 12, 2009 Dear vijay Ji can u post the article of shri sanjay rath Ji in this grp ,pls try to post in grp discussion board than uploading in file section .rgrds sunil nair , "vijay.goel" <goyalvj wrote:>> Dear Sreenadh ji,> > Namaskar!> > Shri Sanjay Rath has also presented the nice logic behind this vimsottari dasa about its sequence and for the years allotment. he had even presented the logic for Astottari dasa also.> > Thanks> Love & regards,> Vijay Goel> Jaipur.> > > , "sreesog" sreesog@ wrote:> >> > Dear Bhaskar ji,> > That was much informative.> > //The above is another way of prognosis, but will come some day later> > on this.//> > I hope to hear more on this from you at the earliest.> > Love and regards,> > Sreenadh> > , "bhaskar_jyotish"> > <bhaskar_jyotish@> wrote:> > >> > >> > > Dear Sreenadh ji,> > >> > > Hard work indeed, coming from you in form of these postings.> > >> > > Here is another mail (Method) which also shows the why of Vimsottari> > > Dasa divisions.> > > The 120 Years alloted to the Vimsottari dasa is not the actual Life> > span> > > of a native, as is understood to be. 13 1/3 X 9 = 120 Years. Where> > 13> > > 1/3 is equal to the span of a Nakshatra 9 equals to the number of> > > Planets. Before clocks came into existence time was measured by> > > Nimesa, Guru akshara, Prana,Pala,danda, Here 27 Nimesa = 1 Guru> > > akshara 10 Guru akshar = 1 Prana 6 Prana = 1 Pala 60 Pala = 1 Danda 60> > > Danda = 1 Nakshatra 30 Nakshatra = 1 Month. 27 Nimesa correspond to> > 27> > > Nakshatras and are equal to 1 Guru akshara. The 10 Guru aksharas and 6> > > Pranas are the minutest division of time. The Mana measure and Prana> > > measure are represented by the Moon and the Sun respectively. On this> > > basis is the period of Chandra as 10 and of the Sun as 6, as given in> > > the Vimsottari dasha. Rahu and Ketu are the two nodes of the Mana (> > > Mind- Mana). Due to Kranti or the inclination of the axis by 24> > degrees> > > , they are 180 degrees apart and divide the zodiac of 360 degrees by> > > two equal halves. Deduct the number of years of the period of Sun> > and> > > Moon from the Vimsottari Dasa, from 24, and the result is - 24 - 6 => > 18> > > Years fo Rahu 24 -10 = 14 years ( Deduct half because the node stands> > > at half of the circle of 360 degrees ) So we get the figure of Ketu> > > which is 7 years. This is the way to mathematically and logically> > > derive the number of years for all the planets. I am not giving the> > > detailed and exhaustive explanations for the above, because this will> > > take a lot of time, and I only look for serious astrologers to indulge> > > in this. But when I do this, then it will be easy to undestand.> > Probably> > > in a few months time...... The above is not my invention, but> > ancient> > > jyotirvidya, which is lost to the time of the day, which i wish to> > > revive within two years time. In the ancient jyotirvidya, Graha,> > > Nakshatra and Raashi re taken in form of ideas and numerical value is> > > attached to them, which allow us the knowledge of the event and the> > > timing of the event. For instance if one has Lagna in Magha (> > No.10> > > ), at age of 10 this native will show a powerful body , because Lagna> > > stands for body, and Magha stands for powerful and strong. Now> > further> > > suppose Ketu is in the same nakshatra inh Lagna. Ketu is representd by> > > 9. Ketu shows disease and sickness, now at age of 10 the native will> > > suffer from some strong disease, which will also be repeated at age of> > > 19 ( 10 + 9 ). The above is another way of prognosis, but will come> > > some day later on this. regards, Bhaskar.> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 13, 2009 Report Share Posted September 13, 2009 Dear Vinita ji, //> Starting with the luminaries should be a very good place to start as this would make sun-moon / soul-mind duo the centre of everything in astrology. The planet closest to the sun is Mercury, so we have Gemini and Virgo on either side of this duo. This is followed by Venus lording Taurus and Libra, Mars lording Aries and Scorpio and so on...till we converge with Saturn lording Acquarius and Capricorn. So it appears that the sequence of the planets and dashas of planets are in the same order as their distance from the sun. With Saturn being the farthest from the Sun, it is directly opposite / at 180 degrees from the luminaries.// That is beautiful! Well presented! //> As regards the duration of the vimsottari dasha, as shreenadh ji has explained, this is related to 360 degrees...but i did not understand why we should take 1/3 of that for vimsottari dasha.// It might be because - the sages thought that maximum human life span is around 12o years. Possibly that is why the instead of 27 Naksharas cycle, 1/3rd of it, i/e/ 9 Nakshatra cycle based on 120 degree and 120 year cycle was introduced. //Very few people live to the age of 120 now whereas in the olden times the longevity of people was much more. // I doubt this statement - human life span must be same or similar even in BC 1500, BC 3000 or even BC 6000 period when astrology emerged and got systematized by the sages of various ages. If we treat 120 years as the maximum age (except for the people with Amitayur yoga), I think this does not provide any logical hurdle even if the usual/common life span is around 65 years only. //If our yugas are divided into four, can we presume that in the first yuga the age of people could have been 360, in the 2nd age it could have been 180, in the third age it might have been 120...but in Kaliyuga it should be around 90??? Does this make vimsottari dasha a little irrelevent in our times?// There seems to be a logical flaw in the above statement. * If you are dividing it always by half then the sequence should be 360 - 180 - 90 -45 * If you are eliminating 1/4 of 360 then, the sequence should be 360 - 270 - 180-90 Any way, I don't agree to the above argument, and considers Vimsottari as equally relevant both during the ancient past of BC 5000 and now - since maximum human life span can be considered as around 120 for all periods. And yes - the proof of the pudding is in the eating (and that is why the Vimsottari dasa system survives even today). //> But then it brings us back to the history of astrology. When did the existing systems evolve? What was true five thousand years back, is it equally applicable now? As there is precession / wobbles of the earth, should there not be im-precisions in tools / logic to explain ancient astrology...???// When most of the nadies such as the one told by - Siva, Suka, Kaka Bhusunda, Agastya, Vasishta depend on Vimsottari dasa; if Skanda, Garga, Parasara, Lomasa and Mihira mentions and uses this ancient dasa system; if various Puranas mention it - how can we come to a conclusion how old it is?! If Vimottari was used by our ancient scholars (Mihira, Maya), Our ancient Rishis (Skanda, Parasara, Agastya, Garga, Lomasa) by our ancient gods (Siva, Skanda) then how are we going to date this system??? The use of this system goes back to the mist of our ancient memories and originates from something that seems to be beyond our current grasp and understanding. Love and regards,Sreenadh , "shankar_mamta" <shankar_mamta wrote:>> Dear Shreenadhji / friends,> > its interesting to understand the "logic" of vimsottary dasha...> even though i found the explanation of number of years per dasha i little too complicated for my non-mathematical brain...the explanation of the sequence of the dashas was much simpler and straightforward.> > Barring the position of Rahu-Ketu, who remain as mysterious as ever, the sequence of the planets / sequence of the dashas can be understood easily based on the planetary positions from the sun.> > Starting with the luminaries should be a very good place to start as this would make sun-moon / soul-mind duo the centre of everything in astrology. The planet closest to the sun is Mercury, so we have Gemini and Virgo on either side of this duo. This is followed by Venus lording Taurus and Libra, Mars lording Aries and Scorpio and so on...till we converge with Saturn lording Acquarius and Capricorn. So it appears that the sequence of the planets and dashas of planets are in the same order as their distance from the sun. With Saturn being the farthest from the Sun, it is directly opposite / at 180 degrees from the luminaries.> > I found it interesting that each and every dual lordship of signs is paired as male-female / odd-even signs...something like the double helix of the DNA at the biological level and shiva-parvati / yan-yin / positive-negative forces at the macro-micro energy levels.> > As regards the duration of the vimsottari dasha, as shreenadh ji has explained, this is related to 360 degrees...but i did not understand why we should take 1/3 of that for vimsottari dasha. Very few people live to the age of 120 now whereas in the olden times the longevity of people was much more. If our yugas are divided into four, can we presume that in the first yuga the age of people could have been 360, in the 2nd age it could have been 180, in the third age it might have been 120...but in Kaliyuga it should be around 90??? Does this make vimsottari dasha a little irrelevent in our times?> > Of course, this ridiculous assumption would throw all calculations out of gear. And of course, the proof of the pudding is in the eating. Many astrologers can predict things pretty accurately based on vimsottari dasha.> > But then it brings us back to the history of astrology. When did the existing systems evolve? What was true five thousand years back, is it equally applicable now? As there is precession / wobbles of the earth, should there not be im-precisions in tools / logic to explain ancient astrology...???> > This is just a flight of fantasy that can be ignored by more serious astrologers on this forum:):)> > Best wishes,> > vinita Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 13, 2009 Report Share Posted September 13, 2009 Dear shankar_mamta, Have you read "The Rationale of the Vimshottari dasa" by the late Pt.K.R.Kar", which appeared in the Magazine K.P. & Astrology,many years ago ? He has very succintly and very nicely explained the rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa. I had sent it to this site many yesrs ago... With best wishes, Yogesh Lajmi. GOOD LUCK ! shankar_mamta <shankar_mamta Sent: Sunday, September 13, 2009 4:28:49 PM Re: Logic Behind Vimsottari Dasa Dear Shreenadhji / friends,its interesting to understand the "logic" of vimsottary dasha...even though i found the explanation of number of years per dasha i little too complicated for my non-mathematical brain...the explanation of the sequence of the dashas was much simpler and straightforward.Barring the position of Rahu-Ketu, who remain as mysterious as ever, the sequence of the planets / sequence of the dashas can be understood easily based on the planetary positions from the sun.Starting with the luminaries should be a very good place to start as this would make sun-moon / soul-mind duo the centre of everything in astrology. The planet closest to the sun is Mercury, so we have Gemini and Virgo on either side of this duo. This is followed by Venus lording Taurus and Libra, Mars lording Aries and Scorpio and so on...till we converge with Saturn lording Acquarius and Capricorn. So it appears that the sequence of the planets and dashas of planets are in the same order as their distance from the sun. With Saturn being the farthest from the Sun, it is directly opposite / at 180 degrees from the luminaries.I found it interesting that each and every dual lordship of signs is paired as male-female / odd-even signs...something like the double helix of the DNA at the biological level and shiva-parvati / yan-yin / positive-negative forces at the macro-micro energy levels.As regards the duration of the vimsottari dasha, as shreenadh ji has explained, this is related to 360 degrees...but i did not understand why we should take 1/3 of that for vimsottari dasha. Very few people live to the age of 120 now whereas in the olden times the longevity of people was much more. If our yugas are divided into four, can we presume that in the first yuga the age of people could have been 360, in the 2nd age it could have been 180, in the third age it might have been 120...but in Kaliyuga it should be around 90??? Does this make vimsottari dasha a little irrelevent in our times?Of course, this ridiculous assumption would throw all calculations out of gear. And of course, the proof of the pudding is in the eating. Many astrologers can predict things pretty accurately based on vimsottari dasha.But then it brings us back to the history of astrology. When did the existing systems evolve? What was true five thousand years back, is it equally applicable now? As there is precession / wobbles of the earth, should there not be im-precisions in tools / logic to explain ancient astrology... ???This is just a flight of fantasy that can be ignored by more serious astrologers on this forum:):)Best wishes,vinitaancient_indian_ astrology, "vijay.goel" <goyalvj > wrote:>> I think he had explained in some audio lectures, i am not having any article on this subject right now.I think i listen them in early 2007 or late 2006.> Some student of him or Shri Gopal Goel who is also member of this forum can provide with more details.> > Vijay Goel> Jaipur> > ancient_indian_ astrology, "astro_tellerkerala " <astro_tellerkerala @> wrote:> >> > Dear vijay Ji> > > > can u post the article of shri sanjay rath Ji in this grp ,pls try to> > post in grp discussion board than uploading in file section .> > > > rgrds sunil nair> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, "vijay.goel"> > <goyalvj@> wrote:> > >> > > Dear Sreenadh ji,> > >> > > Namaskar!> > >> > > Shri Sanjay Rath has also presented the nice logic behind this> > vimsottari dasa about its sequence and for the years allotment. he had> > even presented the logic for Astottari dasa also.> > >> > > Thanks> > > Love & regards,> > > Vijay Goel> > > Jaipur.> > >> > >> > > ancient_indian_ astrology@ . com, "sreesog" sreesog@> > wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear Bhaskar ji,> > > > That was much informative.> > > > //The above is another way of prognosis, but will come some day> > later> > > > on this.//> > > > I hope to hear more on this from you at the earliest.> > > > Love and regards,> > > > Sreenadh> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, "bhaskar_jyotish"> > > > <bhaskar_jyotish@ > wrote:> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji,> > > > >> > > > > Hard work indeed, coming from you in form of these postings.> > > > >> > > > > Here is another mail (Method) which also shows the why of> > Vimsottari> > > > > Dasa divisions.> > > > > The 120 Years alloted to the Vimsottari dasa is not the actual> > Life> > > > span> > > > > of a native, as is understood to be. 13 1/3 X 9 = 120 Years.> > Where> > > > 13> > > > > 1/3 is equal to the span of a Nakshatra 9 equals to the number of> > > > > Planets. Before clocks came into existence time was measured > > by> > > > > Nimesa, Guru akshara, Prana,Pala,danda, Here 27 Nimesa = 1 Guru> > > > > akshara 10 Guru akshar = 1 Prana 6 Prana = 1 Pala 60 Pala = 1> > Danda 60> > > > > Danda = 1 Nakshatra 30 Nakshatra = 1 Month. 27 Nimesa correspond> > to> > > > 27> > > > > Nakshatras and are equal to 1 Guru akshara. The 10 Guru aksharas> > and 6> > > > > Pranas are the minutest division of time. The Mana measure and> > Prana> > > > > measure are represented by the Moon and the Sun respectively. On> > this> > > > > basis is the period of Chandra as 10 and of the Sun as 6, as> > given in> > > > > the Vimsottari dasha. Rahu and Ketu are the two nodes of the> > Mana (> > > > > Mind- Mana). Due to Kranti or the inclination of the axis by 24> > > > degrees> > > > > , they are 180 degrees apart and divide the zodiac of 360 degrees> > by> > > > > two equal halves. Deduct the number of years of the period of> > Sun> > > > and> > > > > Moon from the Vimsottari Dasa, from 24, and the result is - 24 -> > 6 => > > > 18> > > > > Years fo Rahu 24 -10 = 14 years ( Deduct half because the node> > stands> > > > > at half of the circle of 360 degrees ) So we get the figure of> > Ketu> > > > > which is 7 years. This is the way to mathematically and> > logically> > > > > derive the number of years for all the planets. I am not giving> > the> > > > > detailed and exhaustive explanations for the above, because this> > will> > > > > take a lot of time, and I only look for serious astrologers to> > indulge> > > > > in this. But when I do this, then it will be easy to undestand.> > > > Probably> > > > > in a few months time...... The above is not my invention, but> > > > ancient> > > > > jyotirvidya, which is lost to the time of the day, which i wish> > to> > > > > revive within two years time. In the ancient jyotirvidya,> > Graha,> > > > > Nakshatra and Raashi re taken in form of ideas and numerical value> > is> > > > > attached to them, which allow us the knowledge of the event and> > the> > > > > timing of the event. For instance if one has Lagna in Magha (> > > > No.10> > > > > ), at age of 10 this native will show a powerful body , because> > Lagna> > > > > stands for body, and Magha stands for powerful and strong. Now> > > > further> > > > > suppose Ketu is in the same nakshatra inh Lagna. Ketu is> > representd by> > > > > 9. Ketu shows disease and sickness, now at age of 10 the native> > will> > > > > suffer from some strong disease, which will also be repeated at> > age of> > > > > 19 ( 10 + 9 ). The above is another way of prognosis, but will> > come> > > > > some day later on this. regards, Bhaskar.> > > >> > >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 15, 2009 Report Share Posted September 15, 2009 Dear Yogesh Lajmi ji, Thank you for referring me to the article by Mr. Kar. Once again i found the " logic " behind all the calculations of dashas and antardashas a bit too much for my understanding. However, i was happy to note that he has treated sun and moon as a unit...and as a starting point around which everything else revolves... There are a few questions in my mind that i though you and others on this forum could throw more light on... We still havn't solved the mystery of placement of rahu - ketu in the scheme of things, isn't it? i am quite interested in these two guys... if anyone cares to introduce them to me. They are very intriguing forces...that i would like to know more about. Secondly, i am also intrigued by the neat division of the trine...the 120 degrees house 9 nakshatras, the house lordship of each planet adds up to 9 (Mars rules 1st and 8th house...and so on as nicely explained by Mr. Kar).....there are 9 planets...and so on.... There has to be something extremely mystical about number 9. (Funnily, the table of 9 also adds up to 9.....9, 18, 27,36,45 and so on.....) So when we divide vimsottari dahsa into 120 years and further divide this into 9 dashas is there something more to it than just the average life span of an individual? My third question is why at the end of each set of 9 nakshatras is there a co-incidence of nakshatra ruled by Mercury (Asresha, Jyestha and Revati), just as at the beginning of each set of 9 nakshatras we have a ketu ruled nakshatra (Ashwin, Magha and Mula)? Is there some significance / meaning attached to this Mercury-Ketu nexus in each gandata? In other words, is there any LOGIC to all this??? Regards and best wishes, vinita , Yogesh Lajmi <yogeshlajmi wrote: > > Dear shankar_mamta, > Have you read " The Rationale of the Vimshottari dasa " by the late Pt.K.R.Kar " , which appeared in the Magazine K.P. & Astrology,many years ago ? > He has very succintly and very nicely explained the rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa. > I had sent it to this site many yesrs ago... > With best wishes, > Yogesh Lajmi. > GOOD LUCK ! > > > > > ________________________________ > shankar_mamta shankar_mamta > > Sunday, September 13, 2009 4:28:49 PM > Re: Logic Behind Vimsottari Dasa > > > Dear Shreenadhji / friends, > > its interesting to understand the " logic " of vimsottary dasha... > even though i found the explanation of number of years per dasha i little too complicated for my non-mathematical brain...the explanation of the sequence of the dashas was much simpler and straightforward. > > Barring the position of Rahu-Ketu, who remain as mysterious as ever, the sequence of the planets / sequence of the dashas can be understood easily based on the planetary positions from the sun. > > Starting with the luminaries should be a very good place to start as this would make sun-moon / soul-mind duo the centre of everything in astrology. The planet closest to the sun is Mercury, so we have Gemini and Virgo on either side of this duo. This is followed by Venus lording Taurus and Libra, Mars lording Aries and Scorpio and so on...till we converge with Saturn lording Acquarius and Capricorn. So it appears that the sequence of the planets and dashas of planets are in the same order as their distance from the sun. With Saturn being the farthest from the Sun, it is directly opposite / at 180 degrees from the luminaries. > > I found it interesting that each and every dual lordship of signs is paired as male-female / odd-even signs...something like the double helix of the DNA at the biological level and shiva-parvati / yan-yin / positive-negative forces at the macro-micro energy levels. > > As regards the duration of the vimsottari dasha, as shreenadh ji has explained, this is related to 360 degrees...but i did not understand why we should take 1/3 of that for vimsottari dasha. Very few people live to the age of 120 now whereas in the olden times the longevity of people was much more. If our yugas are divided into four, can we presume that in the first yuga the age of people could have been 360, in the 2nd age it could have been 180, in the third age it might have been 120...but in Kaliyuga it should be around 90??? Does this make vimsottari dasha a little irrelevent in our times? > > Of course, this ridiculous assumption would throw all calculations out of gear. And of course, the proof of the pudding is in the eating. Many astrologers can predict things pretty accurately based on vimsottari dasha. > > But then it brings us back to the history of astrology. When did the existing systems evolve? What was true five thousand years back, is it equally applicable now? As there is precession / wobbles of the earth, should there not be im-precisions in tools / logic to explain ancient astrology... ??? > > This is just a flight of fantasy that can be ignored by more serious astrologers on this forum:):) > > Best wishes, > > vinita > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " vijay.goel " goyalvj@ > wrote: > > > > I think he had explained in some audio lectures, i am not having any article on this subject right now.I think i listen them in early 2007 or late 2006. > > Some student of him or Shri Gopal Goel who is also member of this forum can provide with more details. > > > > Vijay Goel > > Jaipur > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " astro_tellerkerala " <astro_tellerkerala @> wrote: > > > > > > Dear vijay Ji > > > > > > can u post the article of shri sanjay rath Ji in this grp ,pls try to > > > post in grp discussion board than uploading in file section . > > > > > > rgrds sunil nair > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " vijay.goel " > > > <goyalvj@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji, > > > > > > > > Namaskar! > > > > > > > > Shri Sanjay Rath has also presented the nice logic behind this > > > vimsottari dasa about its sequence and for the years allotment. he had > > > even presented the logic for Astottari dasa also. > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > Love & regards, > > > > Vijay Goel > > > > Jaipur. > > > > > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " sreesog " sreesog@ > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bhaskar ji, > > > > > That was much informative. > > > > > //The above is another way of prognosis, but will come some day > > > later > > > > > on this.// > > > > > I hope to hear more on this from you at the earliest. > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " bhaskar_jyotish " > > > > > <bhaskar_jyotish@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Hard work indeed, coming from you in form of these postings. > > > > > > > > > > > > Here is another mail (Method) which also shows the why of > > > Vimsottari > > > > > > Dasa divisions. > > > > > > The 120 Years alloted to the Vimsottari dasa is not the actual > > > Life > > > > > span > > > > > > of a native, as is understood to be. 13 1/3 X 9 = 120 Years. > > > Where > > > > > 13 > > > > > > 1/3 is equal to the span of a Nakshatra 9 equals to the number of > > > > > > Planets. Before clocks came into existence time was measured > > > by > > > > > > Nimesa, Guru akshara, Prana,Pala,danda, Here 27 Nimesa = 1 Guru > > > > > > akshara 10 Guru akshar = 1 Prana 6 Prana = 1 Pala 60 Pala = 1 > > > Danda 60 > > > > > > Danda = 1 Nakshatra 30 Nakshatra = 1 Month. 27 Nimesa correspond > > > to > > > > > 27 > > > > > > Nakshatras and are equal to 1 Guru akshara. The 10 Guru aksharas > > > and 6 > > > > > > Pranas are the minutest division of time. The Mana measure and > > > Prana > > > > > > measure are represented by the Moon and the Sun respectively. On > > > this > > > > > > basis is the period of Chandra as 10 and of the Sun as 6, as > > > given in > > > > > > the Vimsottari dasha. Rahu and Ketu are the two nodes of the > > > Mana ( > > > > > > Mind- Mana). Due to Kranti or the inclination of the axis by 24 > > > > > degrees > > > > > > , they are 180 degrees apart and divide the zodiac of 360 degrees > > > by > > > > > > two equal halves. Deduct the number of years of the period of > > > Sun > > > > > and > > > > > > Moon from the Vimsottari Dasa, from 24, and the result is - 24 - > > > 6 = > > > > > 18 > > > > > > Years fo Rahu 24 -10 = 14 years ( Deduct half because the node > > > stands > > > > > > at half of the circle of 360 degrees ) So we get the figure of > > > Ketu > > > > > > which is 7 years. This is the way to mathematically and > > > logically > > > > > > derive the number of years for all the planets. I am not giving > > > the > > > > > > detailed and exhaustive explanations for the above, because this > > > will > > > > > > take a lot of time, and I only look for serious astrologers to > > > indulge > > > > > > in this. But when I do this, then it will be easy to undestand.. > > > > > Probably > > > > > > in a few months time...... The above is not my invention, but > > > > > ancient > > > > > > jyotirvidya, which is lost to the time of the day, which i wish > > > to > > > > > > revive within two years time. In the ancient jyotirvidya, > > > Graha, > > > > > > Nakshatra and Raashi re taken in form of ideas and numerical value > > > is > > > > > > attached to them, which allow us the knowledge of the event and > > > the > > > > > > timing of the event. For instance if one has Lagna in Magha ( > > > > > No.10 > > > > > > ), at age of 10 this native will show a powerful body , because > > > Lagna > > > > > > stands for body, and Magha stands for powerful and strong. Now > > > > > further > > > > > > suppose Ketu is in the same nakshatra inh Lagna. Ketu is > > > representd by > > > > > > 9. Ketu shows disease and sickness, now at age of 10 the native > > > will > > > > > > suffer from some strong disease, which will also be repeated at > > > age of > > > > > > 19 ( 10 + 9 ). The above is another way of prognosis, but will > > > come > > > > > > some day later on this. regards, Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 Dear friend, Why wasting time over personal gesticulations of people over why Sage Parasara allotted 7 years to ketu Mahadasa and 18 years to Rahu under vimshottari scheme. Does this have any impact on enhancing our predictive utility either quantitatively or qualitatively ? I think the learned moderators should contribute/ guide the discussions before going it derailed or out of focus. Regards, Mrutyunjay Tripathy , " shankar_mamta " <shankar_mamta wrote: > > > Dear Yogesh Lajmi ji, > > Thank you for referring me to the article by Mr. Kar. Once again i found > the " logic " behind all the calculations of dashas and antardashas a bit > too much for my understanding. However, i was happy to note that he has > treated sun and moon as a unit...and as a starting point around which > everything else revolves... > > There are a few questions in my mind that i though you and others on > this forum could throw more light on... > > We still havn't solved the mystery of placement of rahu - ketu in the > scheme of things, isn't it? i am quite interested in these two guys... > if anyone cares to introduce them to me. They are very intriguing > forces...that i would like to know more about. > > Secondly, i am also intrigued by the neat division of the trine...the > 120 degrees house 9 nakshatras, the house lordship of each planet adds > up to 9 (Mars rules 1st and 8th house...and so on as nicely explained by > Mr. Kar).....there are 9 planets...and so on.... > > There has to be something extremely mystical about number 9. (Funnily, > the table of 9 also adds up to 9.....9, 18, 27,36,45 and so on.....) > > So when we divide vimsottari dahsa into 120 years and further divide > this into 9 dashas is there something more to it than just the average > life span of an individual? > > My third question is why at the end of each set of 9 nakshatras is there > a co-incidence of nakshatra ruled by Mercury (Asresha, Jyestha and > Revati), just as at the beginning of each set of 9 nakshatras we have a > ketu ruled nakshatra (Ashwin, Magha and Mula)? Is there some > significance / meaning attached to this Mercury-Ketu nexus in each > gandata? > > In other words, is there any LOGIC to all this??? > > Regards and best wishes, > > vinita > > > > > > , Yogesh Lajmi > <yogeshlajmi@> wrote: > > > > Dear shankar_mamta, > > Have you read " The Rationale of the > Vimshottari dasa " by the late Pt.K.R.Kar " , which appeared in the > Magazine K.P. & Astrology,many years ago ? > > He has very succintly and very nicely > explained the rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa. > > I had sent it to this site many yesrs > ago... > > With best wishes, > > Yogesh Lajmi. > > GOOD LUCK ! > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > shankar_mamta shankar_mamta@ > > > > Sunday, September 13, 2009 4:28:49 PM > > Re: Logic Behind Vimsottari Dasa > > > > > > Dear Shreenadhji / friends, > > > > its interesting to understand the " logic " of vimsottary dasha... > > even though i found the explanation of number of years per dasha i > little too complicated for my non-mathematical brain...the explanation > of the sequence of the dashas was much simpler and straightforward. > > > > Barring the position of Rahu-Ketu, who remain as mysterious as ever, > the sequence of the planets / sequence of the dashas can be understood > easily based on the planetary positions from the sun. > > > > Starting with the luminaries should be a very good place to start as > this would make sun-moon / soul-mind duo the centre of everything in > astrology. The planet closest to the sun is Mercury, so we have Gemini > and Virgo on either side of this duo. This is followed by Venus lording > Taurus and Libra, Mars lording Aries and Scorpio and so on...till we > converge with Saturn lording Acquarius and Capricorn. So it appears that > the sequence of the planets and dashas of planets are in the same order > as their distance from the sun. With Saturn being the farthest from the > Sun, it is directly opposite / at 180 degrees from the luminaries. > > > > I found it interesting that each and every dual lordship of signs is > paired as male-female / odd-even signs...something like the double helix > of the DNA at the biological level and shiva-parvati / yan-yin / > positive-negative forces at the macro-micro energy levels. > > > > As regards the duration of the vimsottari dasha, as shreenadh ji has > explained, this is related to 360 degrees...but i did not understand why > we should take 1/3 of that for vimsottari dasha. Very few people live to > the age of 120 now whereas in the olden times the longevity of people > was much more. If our yugas are divided into four, can we presume that > in the first yuga the age of people could have been 360, in the 2nd age > it could have been 180, in the third age it might have been 120...but in > Kaliyuga it should be around 90??? Does this make vimsottari dasha a > little irrelevent in our times? > > > > Of course, this ridiculous assumption would throw all calculations out > of gear. And of course, the proof of the pudding is in the eating. Many > astrologers can predict things pretty accurately based on vimsottari > dasha. > > > > But then it brings us back to the history of astrology. When did the > existing systems evolve? What was true five thousand years back, is it > equally applicable now? As there is precession / wobbles of the earth, > should there not be im-precisions in tools / logic to explain ancient > astrology... ??? > > > > This is just a flight of fantasy that can be ignored by more serious > astrologers on this forum:):) > > > > Best wishes, > > > > vinita > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " vijay.goel " > goyalvj@ > wrote: > > > > > > I think he had explained in some audio lectures, i am not having any > article on this subject right now.I think i listen them in early 2007 or > late 2006. > > > Some student of him or Shri Gopal Goel who is also member of this > forum can provide with more details. > > > > > > Vijay Goel > > > Jaipur > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, > " astro_tellerkerala " <astro_tellerkerala @> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear vijay Ji > > > > > > > > can u post the article of shri sanjay rath Ji in this grp ,pls try > to > > > > post in grp discussion board than uploading in file section . > > > > > > > > rgrds sunil nair > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " vijay.goel " > > > > <goyalvj@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji, > > > > > > > > > > Namaskar! > > > > > > > > > > Shri Sanjay Rath has also presented the nice logic behind this > > > > vimsottari dasa about its sequence and for the years allotment. he > had > > > > even presented the logic for Astottari dasa also. > > > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > Love & regards, > > > > > Vijay Goel > > > > > Jaipur. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, " sreesog " > sreesog@ > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bhaskar ji, > > > > > > That was much informative. > > > > > > //The above is another way of prognosis, but will come some > day > > > > later > > > > > > on this.// > > > > > > I hope to hear more on this from you at the earliest. > > > > > > Love and regards, > > > > > > Sreenadh > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, > " bhaskar_jyotish " > > > > > > <bhaskar_jyotish@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hard work indeed, coming from you in form of these postings. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Here is another mail (Method) which also shows the why of > > > > Vimsottari > > > > > > > Dasa divisions. > > > > > > > The 120 Years alloted to the Vimsottari dasa is not the > actual > > > > Life > > > > > > span > > > > > > > of a native, as is understood to be. 13 1/3 X 9 = 120 Years. > > > > Where > > > > > > 13 > > > > > > > 1/3 is equal to the span of a Nakshatra 9 equals to the > number of > > > > > > > Planets. Before clocks came into existence time was measured > > > > by > > > > > > > Nimesa, Guru akshara, Prana,Pala,danda, Here 27 Nimesa = 1 > Guru > > > > > > > akshara 10 Guru akshar = 1 Prana 6 Prana = 1 Pala 60 Pala = > 1 > > > > Danda 60 > > > > > > > Danda = 1 Nakshatra 30 Nakshatra = 1 Month. 27 Nimesa > correspond > > > > to > > > > > > 27 > > > > > > > Nakshatras and are equal to 1 Guru akshara. The 10 Guru > aksharas > > > > and 6 > > > > > > > Pranas are the minutest division of time. The Mana measure > and > > > > Prana > > > > > > > measure are represented by the Moon and the Sun > respectively. On > > > > this > > > > > > > basis is the period of Chandra as 10 and of the Sun as 6, as > > > > given in > > > > > > > the Vimsottari dasha. Rahu and Ketu are the two nodes of the > > > > Mana ( > > > > > > > Mind- Mana). Due to Kranti or the inclination of the axis by > 24 > > > > > > degrees > > > > > > > , they are 180 degrees apart and divide the zodiac of 360 > degrees > > > > by > > > > > > > two equal halves. Deduct the number of years of the period > of > > > > Sun > > > > > > and > > > > > > > Moon from the Vimsottari Dasa, from 24, and the result is - > 24 - > > > > 6 = > > > > > > 18 > > > > > > > Years fo Rahu 24 -10 = 14 years ( Deduct half because the > node > > > > stands > > > > > > > at half of the circle of 360 degrees ) So we get the figure > of > > > > Ketu > > > > > > > which is 7 years. This is the way to mathematically and > > > > logically > > > > > > > derive the number of years for all the planets. I am not > giving > > > > the > > > > > > > detailed and exhaustive explanations for the above, because > this > > > > will > > > > > > > take a lot of time, and I only look for serious astrologers > to > > > > indulge > > > > > > > in this. But when I do this, then it will be easy to > undestand.. > > > > > > Probably > > > > > > > in a few months time...... The above is not my invention, > but > > > > > > ancient > > > > > > > jyotirvidya, which is lost to the time of the day, which i > wish > > > > to > > > > > > > revive within two years time. In the ancient jyotirvidya, > > > > Graha, > > > > > > > Nakshatra and Raashi re taken in form of ideas and numerical > value > > > > is > > > > > > > attached to them, which allow us the knowledge of the event > and > > > > the > > > > > > > timing of the event. For instance if one has Lagna in Magha > ( > > > > > > No.10 > > > > > > > ), at age of 10 this native will show a powerful body , > because > > > > Lagna > > > > > > > stands for body, and Magha stands for powerful and strong. > Now > > > > > > further > > > > > > > suppose Ketu is in the same nakshatra inh Lagna. Ketu is > > > > representd by > > > > > > > 9. Ketu shows disease and sickness, now at age of 10 the > native > > > > will > > > > > > > suffer from some strong disease, which will also be repeated > at > > > > age of > > > > > > > 19 ( 10 + 9 ). The above is another way of prognosis, but > will > > > > come > > > > > > > some day later on this. regards, Bhaskar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 16, 2009 Report Share Posted September 16, 2009 Dear Tripathy ji,i can not help but second you in this regard.....warm regards,gopi. , "astrologer_mrutyunjay" <astrologer_mrutyunjay wrote:>> Dear friend,> > Why wasting time over> > personal gesticulations of people> > over why Sage Parasara allotted 7 years to ketu Mahadasa and 18 years to Rahu under vimshottari scheme.> > Does this have any impact on enhancing our predictive utility > > either quantitatively or qualitatively ?> > I think the learned moderators should contribute/ guide the discussions> > before going it derailed or out of focus.> > Regards,> > Mrutyunjay Tripathy> > , "shankar_mamta" shankar_mamta@ wrote:> >> > > > Dear Yogesh Lajmi ji,> > > > Thank you for referring me to the article by Mr. Kar. Once again i found> > the "logic" behind all the calculations of dashas and antardashas a bit> > too much for my understanding. However, i was happy to note that he has> > treated sun and moon as a unit...and as a starting point around which> > everything else revolves...> > > > There are a few questions in my mind that i though you and others on> > this forum could throw more light on...> > > > We still havn't solved the mystery of placement of rahu - ketu in the> > scheme of things, isn't it? i am quite interested in these two guys...> > if anyone cares to introduce them to me. They are very intriguing> > forces...that i would like to know more about.> > > > Secondly, i am also intrigued by the neat division of the trine...the> > 120 degrees house 9 nakshatras, the house lordship of each planet adds> > up to 9 (Mars rules 1st and 8th house...and so on as nicely explained by> > Mr. Kar).....there are 9 planets...and so on....> > > > There has to be something extremely mystical about number 9. (Funnily,> > the table of 9 also adds up to 9.....9, 18, 27,36,45 and so on.....)> > > > So when we divide vimsottari dahsa into 120 years and further divide> > this into 9 dashas is there something more to it than just the average> > life span of an individual?> > > > My third question is why at the end of each set of 9 nakshatras is there> > a co-incidence of nakshatra ruled by Mercury (Asresha, Jyestha and> > Revati), just as at the beginning of each set of 9 nakshatras we have a> > ketu ruled nakshatra (Ashwin, Magha and Mula)? Is there some> > significance / meaning attached to this Mercury-Ketu nexus in each> > gandata?> > > > In other words, is there any LOGIC to all this???> > > > Regards and best wishes,> > > > vinita> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , Yogesh Lajmi> > <yogeshlajmi@> wrote:> > >> > > Dear shankar_mamta,> > > Have you read "The Rationale of the> > Vimshottari dasa" by the late Pt.K.R.Kar", which appeared in the> > Magazine K.P. & Astrology,many years ago ?> > > He has very succintly and very nicely> > explained the rationale of the Vimshottari Dasa.> > > I had sent it to this site many yesrs> > ago...> > > With best wishes,> > > Yogesh Lajmi.> > > GOOD LUCK !> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > ________________________________> > > shankar_mamta shankar_mamta@> > > > > > Sunday, September 13, 2009 4:28:49 PM> > > Re: Logic Behind Vimsottari Dasa> > >> > >> > > Dear Shreenadhji / friends,> > >> > > its interesting to understand the "logic" of vimsottary dasha...> > > even though i found the explanation of number of years per dasha i> > little too complicated for my non-mathematical brain...the explanation> > of the sequence of the dashas was much simpler and straightforward.> > >> > > Barring the position of Rahu-Ketu, who remain as mysterious as ever,> > the sequence of the planets / sequence of the dashas can be understood> > easily based on the planetary positions from the sun.> > >> > > Starting with the luminaries should be a very good place to start as> > this would make sun-moon / soul-mind duo the centre of everything in> > astrology. The planet closest to the sun is Mercury, so we have Gemini> > and Virgo on either side of this duo. This is followed by Venus lording> > Taurus and Libra, Mars lording Aries and Scorpio and so on...till we> > converge with Saturn lording Acquarius and Capricorn. So it appears that> > the sequence of the planets and dashas of planets are in the same order> > as their distance from the sun. With Saturn being the farthest from the> > Sun, it is directly opposite / at 180 degrees from the luminaries.> > >> > > I found it interesting that each and every dual lordship of signs is> > paired as male-female / odd-even signs...something like the double helix> > of the DNA at the biological level and shiva-parvati / yan-yin /> > positive-negative forces at the macro-micro energy levels.> > >> > > As regards the duration of the vimsottari dasha, as shreenadh ji has> > explained, this is related to 360 degrees...but i did not understand why> > we should take 1/3 of that for vimsottari dasha. Very few people live to> > the age of 120 now whereas in the olden times the longevity of people> > was much more. If our yugas are divided into four, can we presume that> > in the first yuga the age of people could have been 360, in the 2nd age> > it could have been 180, in the third age it might have been 120...but in> > Kaliyuga it should be around 90??? Does this make vimsottari dasha a> > little irrelevent in our times?> > >> > > Of course, this ridiculous assumption would throw all calculations out> > of gear. And of course, the proof of the pudding is in the eating. Many> > astrologers can predict things pretty accurately based on vimsottari> > dasha.> > >> > > But then it brings us back to the history of astrology. When did the> > existing systems evolve? What was true five thousand years back, is it> > equally applicable now? As there is precession / wobbles of the earth,> > should there not be im-precisions in tools / logic to explain ancient> > astrology... ???> > >> > > This is just a flight of fantasy that can be ignored by more serious> > astrologers on this forum:):)> > >> > > Best wishes,> > >> > > vinita> > >> > > ancient_indian_ astrology, "vijay.goel"> > goyalvj@ > wrote:> > > >> > > > I think he had explained in some audio lectures, i am not having any> > article on this subject right now.I think i listen them in early 2007 or> > late 2006.> > > > Some student of him or Shri Gopal Goel who is also member of this> > forum can provide with more details.> > > >> > > > Vijay Goel> > > > Jaipur> > > >> > > > ancient_indian_ astrology,> > "astro_tellerkerala " <astro_tellerkerala @> wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Dear vijay Ji> > > > >> > > > > can u post the article of shri sanjay rath Ji in this grp ,pls try> > to> > > > > post in grp discussion board than uploading in file section .> > > > >> > > > > rgrds sunil nair> > > > >> > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, "vijay.goel"> > > > > <goyalvj@> wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji,> > > > > >> > > > > > Namaskar!> > > > > >> > > > > > Shri Sanjay Rath has also presented the nice logic behind this> > > > > vimsottari dasa about its sequence and for the years allotment. he> > had> > > > > even presented the logic for Astottari dasa also.> > > > > >> > > > > > Thanks> > > > > > Love & regards,> > > > > > Vijay Goel> > > > > > Jaipur.> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology, "sreesog"> > sreesog@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Dear Bhaskar ji,> > > > > > > That was much informative.> > > > > > > //The above is another way of prognosis, but will come some> > day> > > > > later> > > > > > > on this.//> > > > > > > I hope to hear more on this from you at the earliest.> > > > > > > Love and regards,> > > > > > > Sreenadh> > > > > > > ancient_indian_ astrology,> > "bhaskar_jyotish"> > > > > > > <bhaskar_jyotish@ > wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Dear Sreenadh ji,> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Hard work indeed, coming from you in form of these postings.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Here is another mail (Method) which also shows the why of> > > > > Vimsottari> > > > > > > > Dasa divisions.> > > > > > > > The 120 Years alloted to the Vimsottari dasa is not the> > actual> > > > > Life> > > > > > > span> > > > > > > > of a native, as is understood to be. 13 1/3 X 9 = 120 Years.> > > > > Where> > > > > > > 13> > > > > > > > 1/3 is equal to the span of a Nakshatra 9 equals to the> > number of> > > > > > > > Planets. Before clocks came into existence time was measured> > > > > by> > > > > > > > Nimesa, Guru akshara, Prana,Pala,danda, Here 27 Nimesa = 1> > Guru> > > > > > > > akshara 10 Guru akshar = 1 Prana 6 Prana = 1 Pala 60 Pala => > 1> > > > > Danda 60> > > > > > > > Danda = 1 Nakshatra 30 Nakshatra = 1 Month. 27 Nimesa> > correspond> > > > > to> > > > > > > 27> > > > > > > > Nakshatras and are equal to 1 Guru akshara. The 10 Guru> > aksharas> > > > > and 6> > > > > > > > Pranas are the minutest division of time. The Mana measure> > and> > > > > Prana> > > > > > > > measure are represented by the Moon and the Sun> > respectively. On> > > > > this> > > > > > > > basis is the period of Chandra as 10 and of the Sun as 6, as> > > > > given in> > > > > > > > the Vimsottari dasha. Rahu and Ketu are the two nodes of the> > > > > Mana (> > > > > > > > Mind- Mana). Due to Kranti or the inclination of the axis by> > 24> > > > > > > degrees> > > > > > > > , they are 180 degrees apart and divide the zodiac of 360> > degrees> > > > > by> > > > > > > > two equal halves. Deduct the number of years of the period> > of> > > > > Sun> > > > > > > and> > > > > > > > Moon from the Vimsottari Dasa, from 24, and the result is -> > 24 -> > > > > 6 => > > > > > > 18> > > > > > > > Years fo Rahu 24 -10 = 14 years ( Deduct half because the> > node> > > > > stands> > > > > > > > at half of the circle of 360 degrees ) So we get the figure> > of> > > > > Ketu> > > > > > > > which is 7 years. This is the way to mathematically and> > > > > logically> > > > > > > > derive the number of years for all the planets. I am not> > giving> > > > > the> > > > > > > > detailed and exhaustive explanations for the above, because> > this> > > > > will> > > > > > > > take a lot of time, and I only look for serious astrologers> > to> > > > > indulge> > > > > > > > in this. But when I do this, then it will be easy to> > undestand..> > > > > > > Probably> > > > > > > > in a few months time...... The above is not my invention,> > but> > > > > > > ancient> > > > > > > > jyotirvidya, which is lost to the time of the day, which i> > wish> > > > > to> > > > > > > > revive within two years time. In the ancient jyotirvidya,> > > > > Graha,> > > > > > > > Nakshatra and Raashi re taken in form of ideas and numerical> > value> > > > > is> > > > > > > > attached to them, which allow us the knowledge of the event> > and> > > > > the> > > > > > > > timing of the event. For instance if one has Lagna in Magha> > (> > > > > > > No.10> > > > > > > > ), at age of 10 this native will show a powerful body ,> > because> > > > > Lagna> > > > > > > > stands for body, and Magha stands for powerful and strong.> > Now> > > > > > > further> > > > > > > > suppose Ketu is in the same nakshatra inh Lagna. Ketu is> > > > > representd by> > > > > > > > 9. Ketu shows disease and sickness, now at age of 10 the> > native> > > > > will> > > > > > > > suffer from some strong disease, which will also be repeated> > at> > > > > age of> > > > > > > > 19 ( 10 + 9 ). The above is another way of prognosis, but> > will> > > > > come> > > > > > > > some day later on this. regards, Bhaskar.> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 17, 2009 Report Share Posted September 17, 2009 Dear Tripathy ji, Gopi ji,//why Sage Parasara allotted 7 years to ketu Mahadasa and 18 years to Rahu under vimshottari scheme. Does this have any impact on enhancing our predictive utility either quantitatively or qualitatively?Our universe is full of mysteries. We’ve been able to find reason and logic for some and for some others we have no logic. That might or might not imact the existence. Sometimes, finding the logic makes the phenomenon more alive in our consciousness and opens up a host of possibilities for further growth and developments. Even when this does not happen, is it not human nature to be curious and questioning? The ever-seeking mind tries to find answers to everything we do not understand around us. This is the only way any growth, scientific or spiritual can happen. Why do we bother to explore, even argue, and try to find reason and logic? Does it really matter or does it really help anyone?Without logic we are just memorizing facts, not understanding them. If one link is lost in the books of history, or one typo, the whole concept is distorted and becomes useless. Logic sustains the concepts for longer or till it is disproved. No one can deny that assigning the years for planets under the VMD would have had a sound logic. So also in other dasha systems or even Ayumaans of planets. We might’ve lost those reasons and logics since our records are so fragmented. If we, as astrologers, cannot debate and find good convincing reason/reasons, we might fail to convince the questioning minds of the validity of such principles. Coming generations might think that there is something wrong and question these principles, without being able to identify the truth or fallacy involved. When any principle is backed by reason and logic, we have the ability to communicate it more clearly and effectively. Muddled writing tends to come from muddled thinking, and that in turn tends to come from a poor understanding of what someone is trying to convey and why. With logic, it is easier to un-muddle such ideas and reform them into a stronger pattern. This is a group dealing with Ancient Indian Astrology and all its various aspects including the revival of lost texts and principles. The forum, thus, is a good place where we can thrash out ideas and opinions to try and find answers to what may be bothering us. We may or may not succeed, but the process will definitely enhance our level of understanding and some good arguments will sow the seed in fertile minds which will germinate to give us the answer one day.Those who’ve been reading and participating, must have had the opportunity to learn quite a lot. Many of the participants will readily acknowledge that such discussions improve their ability to think and express on such issues. //I think the learned moderators should contribute/ guide the discussions//I hope you’ve got the answer!Thanks and RegardsNeelam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 17, 2009 Report Share Posted September 17, 2009 Dear Neelamji, Am sorry to butt in...but I cannot agree agree with you more...the days of blind faith are disappearing fast today. More and more people are more interested in the whys,hows and whens....a definite precursor to Human Progress...as well as the Progress of Knowledge... Soon I shall try and give you the reason for fixing the specific years for each Planet...in the scheme of things in Vimshottari Dasa... With kind regards, Yogesh Lajmi... neelam gupta <neelamgupta07 Sent: Thursday, September 17, 2009 4:59:49 PMRe: Re: Logic Behind Vimsottari Dasa Dear Tripathy ji, Gopi ji,//why Sage Parasara allotted 7 years to ketu Mahadasa and 18 years to Rahu under vimshottari scheme. Does this have any impact on enhancing our predictive utilityeither quantitatively or qualitatively?Our universe is full of mysteries. We’ve been able to find reason and logic for some and for some others we have no logic. That might or might not imact the existence. Sometimes, finding the logic makes the phenomenon more alive in our consciousness and opens up a host of possibilities for further growth and developments. Even when this does not happen, is it not human nature to be curious and questioning? The ever-seeking mind tries to find answers to everything we do not understand around us. This is the only way any growth, scientific or spiritual can happen.Why do we bother to explore, even argue, and try to find reason and logic? Does it really matter or does it really help anyone?Without logic we are just memorizing facts, not understanding them. If one link is lost in the books of history, or one typo, the whole concept is distorted and becomes useless. Logic sustains the concepts for longer or till it is disproved.No one can deny that assigning the years for planets under the VMD would have had a sound logic. So also in other dasha systems or even Ayumaans of planets. We might’ve lost those reasons and logics since our records are so fragmented. If we, as astrologers, cannot debate and find good convincing reason/reasons, we might fail to convince the questioning minds of the validity of such principles. Coming generations might think that there is something wrong and question these principles, without being able to identify the truth or fallacy involved.When any principle is backed by reason and logic, we have the ability to communicate it more clearly and effectively. Muddled writing tends to come from muddled thinking, and that in turn tends to come from a poor understanding of what someone is trying to convey and why. With logic, it is easier to un-muddle such ideas and reform them into a stronger pattern.This is a group dealing with Ancient Indian Astrology and all its various aspects including the revival of lost texts and principles. The forum, thus, is a good place where we can thrash out ideas and opinions to try and find answers to what may be bothering us.We may or may not succeed, but the process will definitely enhance our level of understanding and some good arguments will sow the seed in fertile minds which will germinate to give us the answer one day.Those who’ve been reading and participating, must have had the opportunity to learn quite a lot. Many of the participants will readily acknowledge that such discussions improve their ability to think and express on such issues.//I think the learned moderators should contribute/ guide the discussions/ /I hope you’ve got the answer!Thanks and RegardsNeelam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 17, 2009 Report Share Posted September 17, 2009 Respected Yogesh Lajmi ji,No butting in here.... It is a privilege to have the views from the learned and experienced ones. Kindly do share your views on the reason for fixing the years in VMD.For all we know, we might come up with several logics!! As they say, many ways to skin a cat! Thanks and RegardsNeelam2009/9/17 Yogesh Lajmi <yogeshlajmi Dear Neelamji, Am sorry to butt in...but I cannot agree agree with you more...the days of blind faith are disappearing fast today. More and more people are more interested in the whys,hows and whens....a definite precursor to Human Progress...as well as the Progress of Knowledge... Soon I shall try and give you the reason for fixing the specific years for each Planet...in the scheme of things in Vimshottari Dasa... With kind regards, Yogesh Lajmi... neelam gupta <neelamgupta07 Thursday, September 17, 2009 4:59:49 PMRe: Re: Logic Behind Vimsottari Dasa Dear Tripathy ji, Gopi ji,//why Sage Parasara allotted 7 years to ketu Mahadasa and 18 years to Rahu under vimshottari scheme. Does this have any impact on enhancing our predictive utility either quantitatively or qualitatively?Our universe is full of mysteries. We’ve been able to find reason and logic for some and for some others we have no logic. That might or might not imact the existence. Sometimes, finding the logic makes the phenomenon more alive in our consciousness and opens up a host of possibilities for further growth and developments. Even when this does not happen, is it not human nature to be curious and questioning? The ever-seeking mind tries to find answers to everything we do not understand around us. This is the only way any growth, scientific or spiritual can happen. Why do we bother to explore, even argue, and try to find reason and logic? Does it really matter or does it really help anyone?Without logic we are just memorizing facts, not understanding them. If one link is lost in the books of history, or one typo, the whole concept is distorted and becomes useless. Logic sustains the concepts for longer or till it is disproved. No one can deny that assigning the years for planets under the VMD would have had a sound logic. So also in other dasha systems or even Ayumaans of planets. We might’ve lost those reasons and logics since our records are so fragmented. If we, as astrologers, cannot debate and find good convincing reason/reasons, we might fail to convince the questioning minds of the validity of such principles. Coming generations might think that there is something wrong and question these principles, without being able to identify the truth or fallacy involved. When any principle is backed by reason and logic, we have the ability to communicate it more clearly and effectively. Muddled writing tends to come from muddled thinking, and that in turn tends to come from a poor understanding of what someone is trying to convey and why. With logic, it is easier to un-muddle such ideas and reform them into a stronger pattern. This is a group dealing with Ancient Indian Astrology and all its various aspects including the revival of lost texts and principles. The forum, thus, is a good place where we can thrash out ideas and opinions to try and find answers to what may be bothering us. We may or may not succeed, but the process will definitely enhance our level of understanding and some good arguments will sow the seed in fertile minds which will germinate to give us the answer one day.Those who’ve been reading and participating, must have had the opportunity to learn quite a lot. Many of the participants will readily acknowledge that such discussions improve their ability to think and express on such issues.//I think the learned moderators should contribute/ guide the discussions/ / I hope you’ve got the answer!Thanks and RegardsNeelam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 17, 2009 Report Share Posted September 17, 2009 Dear Neelam ji,thanks for the nice and educative post as usual.I have nothing to say but agree......warm regards,gopi. , neelam gupta <neelamgupta07 wrote:>> Dear Tripathy ji, Gopi ji,> > //why Sage Parasara allotted 7 years to ketu Mahadasa and 18 years to Rahu> under vimshottari scheme. Does this have any impact on enhancing our> predictive utility> either quantitatively or qualitatively?> > Our universe is full of mysteries. We've been able to find reason and logic> for some and for some others we have no logic. That might or might not imact> the existence. Sometimes, finding the logic makes the phenomenon more alive> in our consciousness and opens up a host of possibilities for further growth> and developments. Even when this does not happen, is it not human nature to> be curious and questioning? The ever-seeking mind tries to find answers to> everything we do not understand around us. This is the only way any growth,> scientific or spiritual can happen.> > Why do we bother to explore, even argue, and try to find reason and logic?> Does it really matter or does it really help anyone?> > Without logic we are just memorizing facts, not understanding them. If one> link is lost in the books of history, or one typo, the whole concept is> distorted and becomes useless. Logic sustains the concepts for longer or> till it is disproved.> > No one can deny that assigning the years for planets under the VMD would> have had a sound logic. So also in other dasha systems or even Ayumaans of> planets. We might've lost those reasons and logics since our records are so> fragmented.> > If we, as astrologers, cannot debate and find good convincing> reason/reasons, we might fail to convince the questioning minds of the> validity of such principles. Coming generations might think that there is> something wrong and question these principles, without being able to> identify the truth or fallacy involved.> > When any principle is backed by reason and logic, we have the ability to> communicate it more clearly and effectively. Muddled writing tends to come> from muddled thinking, and that in turn tends to come from a poor> understanding of what someone is trying to convey and why. With logic, it is> easier to un-muddle such ideas and reform them into a stronger pattern.> > This is a group dealing with Ancient Indian Astrology and all its various> aspects including the revival of lost texts and principles. The forum, thus,> is a good place where we can thrash out ideas and opinions to try and find> answers to what may be bothering us.> > We may or may not succeed, but the process will definitely enhance our level> of understanding and some good arguments will sow the seed in fertile minds> which will germinate to give us the answer one day.> > Those who've been reading and participating, must have had the opportunity> to learn quite a lot. Many of the participants will readily acknowledge that> such discussions improve their ability to think and express on such issues.> > //I think the learned moderators should contribute/ guide the discussions//> I hope you've got the answer!> > Thanks and Regards> Neelam> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 17, 2009 Report Share Posted September 17, 2009 Dear Yogesh ji, You say soon you will give the rationale behind fixation of the years of VMD. Why not now? And I think if you wanted you could have given it straight away without testing anyone's knowledge because in my opinion that is the way of sharing knowledge. No offence meant here just the way I look at things. Anyway, this rationale is already given in a book called Jatak Pradeepak published from Ratlam in 1945 and this book is out of print these days. Did anyone try to check whether there is any astronomical reasoning behind all this. regards, Mouji--- On Thu, 9/17/09, neelam gupta <neelamgupta07 wrote: neelam gupta <neelamgupta07Re: Re: Logic Behind Vimsottari Dasa Date: Thursday, September 17, 2009, 5:19 PM Respected Yogesh Lajmi ji,No butting in here.... It is a privilege to have the views from the learned and experienced ones. Kindly do share your views on the reason for fixing the years in VMD.For all we know, we might come up with several logics!! As they say, many ways to skin a cat! Thanks and RegardsNeelam 2009/9/17 Yogesh Lajmi <yogeshlajmi@ > Dear Neelamji, Am sorry to butt in...but I cannot agree agree with you more...the days of blind faith are disappearing fast today. More and more people are more interested in the whys,hows and whens....a definite precursor to Human Progress...as well as the Progress of Knowledge... Soon I shall try and give you the reason for fixing the specific years for each Planet...in the scheme of things in Vimshottari Dasa... With kind regards, Yogesh Lajmi... neelam gupta <neelamgupta07@ gmail.com> ancient_indian_ astrologyThursday, September 17, 2009 4:59:49 PMRe: [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Logic Behind Vimsottari Dasa Dear Tripathy ji, Gopi ji,//why Sage Parasara allotted 7 years to ketu Mahadasa and 18 years to Rahu under vimshottari scheme. Does this have any impact on enhancing our predictive utilityeither quantitatively or qualitatively?Our universe is full of mysteries. We’ve been able to find reason and logic for some and for some others we have no logic. That might or might not imact the existence. Sometimes, finding the logic makes the phenomenon more alive in our consciousness and opens up a host of possibilities for further growth and developments. Even when this does not happen, is it not human nature to be curious and questioning? The ever-seeking mind tries to find answers to everything we do not understand around us. This is the only way any growth, scientific or spiritual can happen.Why do we bother to explore, even argue, and try to find reason and logic? Does it really matter or does it really help anyone?Without logic we are just memorizing facts, not understanding them. If one link is lost in the books of history, or one typo, the whole concept is distorted and becomes useless. Logic sustains the concepts for longer or till it is disproved.No one can deny that assigning the years for planets under the VMD would have had a sound logic. So also in other dasha systems or even Ayumaans of planets. We might’ve lost those reasons and logics since our records are so fragmented. If we, as astrologers, cannot debate and find good convincing reason/reasons, we might fail to convince the questioning minds of the validity of such principles. Coming generations might think that there is something wrong and question these principles, without being able to identify the truth or fallacy involved.When any principle is backed by reason and logic, we have the ability to communicate it more clearly and effectively. Muddled writing tends to come from muddled thinking, and that in turn tends to come from a poor understanding of what someone is trying to convey and why. With logic, it is easier to un-muddle such ideas and reform them into a stronger pattern.This is a group dealing with Ancient Indian Astrology and all its various aspects including the revival of lost texts and principles. The forum, thus, is a good place where we can thrash out ideas and opinions to try and find answers to what may be bothering us.We may or may not succeed, but the process will definitely enhance our level of understanding and some good arguments will sow the seed in fertile minds which will germinate to give us the answer one day.Those who’ve been reading and participating, must have had the opportunity to learn quite a lot. Many of the participants will readily acknowledge that such discussions improve their ability to think and express on such issues.//I think the learned moderators should contribute/ guide the discussions/ /I hope you’ve got the answer!Thanks and RegardsNeelam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 17, 2009 Report Share Posted September 17, 2009 Dear Manoj ji, Thanks for pointing towards this reference. Please do share the rationale if you have the book or if you can recall from your sharp memory! Thanks and Regards Neelam 2009/9/17 Manoj Kumar <mouji99 > > > Dear Yogesh ji, > > You say soon you will give the rationale behind fixation of the years of > VMD. Why not now? And I think if you wanted you could have given it straight > away without testing anyone's knowledge because in my opinion that is the > way of sharing knowledge. No offence meant here just the way I look at > things. > > Anyway, this rationale is already given in a book called Jatak Pradeepak > published from Ratlam in 1945 and this book is out of print these days. Did > anyone try to check whether there is any astronomical reasoning behind all > this. > > regards, > > Mouji > > --- On *Thu, 9/17/09, neelam gupta <neelamgupta07* wrote: > > > neelam gupta <neelamgupta07 > Re: Re: Logic Behind Vimsottari Dasa > > Thursday, September 17, 2009, 5:19 PM > > > Respected Yogesh Lajmi ji, > > No butting in here.... It is a privilege to have the views from the learned > and experienced ones. > > Kindly do share your views on the reason for fixing the years in VMD. > For all we know, we might come up with several logics!! As they say, many > ways to skin a cat! > > Thanks and Regards > Neelam > > > > 2009/9/17 Yogesh Lajmi <yogeshlajmi@ <http://us.mc305.mail./mc/compose?to=yogeshlajmi > > > > >> >> Dear Neelamji, >> Am sorry to butt in...but I cannot agree agree with >> you more...the days of *blind faith are disappearing fast today. More and >> more people are more interested in the whys,hows and whens....a definite >> precursor to Human Progress...as well as the Progress of Knowledge...* >> * Soon I shall try and give you the reason for >> fixing the specific years for each Planet...in the scheme of things in >> Vimshottari Dasa...* >> * *With kind regards, >> Yogesh Lajmi... >> >> ------------------------------ >> ** neelam gupta <neelamgupta07@ gmail.com<http://us.mc305.mail./mc/compose?to=neelamgupta07 >> >> >> *To:* ancient_indian_ astrology@ . com<http://us.mc305.mail./mc/compose?to=@g\ roups.com> >> *Sent:* Thursday, September 17, 2009 4:59:49 PM >> *Subject:* Re: [ancient_indian_ astrology] Re: Logic Behind Vimsottari >> Dasa >> >> Dear Tripathy ji, Gopi ji, >> >> //why Sage Parasara allotted 7 years to ketu Mahadasa and 18 years to Rahu >> under vimshottari scheme. Does this have any impact on enhancing our >> predictive utility >> either quantitatively or qualitatively? >> >> Our universe is full of mysteries. We’ve been able to find reason and >> logic for some and for some others we have no logic. That might or might not >> imact the existence. Sometimes, finding the logic makes the phenomenon more >> alive in our consciousness and opens up a host of possibilities for further >> growth and developments. Even when this does not happen, is it not human >> nature to be curious and questioning? The ever-seeking mind tries to find >> answers to everything we do not understand around us. This is the only way >> any growth, scientific or spiritual can happen. >> >> Why do we bother to explore, even argue, and try to find reason and logic? >> Does it really matter or does it really help anyone? >> >> Without logic we are just memorizing facts, not understanding them. If one >> link is lost in the books of history, or one typo, the whole concept is >> distorted and becomes useless. Logic sustains the concepts for longer or >> till it is disproved. >> >> No one can deny that assigning the years for planets under the VMD would >> have had a sound logic. So also in other dasha systems or even Ayumaans of >> planets. We might’ve lost those reasons and logics since our records are so >> fragmented. >> >> If we, as astrologers, cannot debate and find good convincing >> reason/reasons, we might fail to convince the questioning minds of the >> validity of such principles. Coming generations might think that there is >> something wrong and question these principles, without being able to >> identify the truth or fallacy involved. >> >> When any principle is backed by reason and logic, we have the ability to >> communicate it more clearly and effectively. Muddled writing tends to come >> from muddled thinking, and that in turn tends to come from a poor >> understanding of what someone is trying to convey and why. With logic, it is >> easier to un-muddle such ideas and reform them into a stronger pattern. >> >> This is a group dealing with Ancient Indian Astrology and all its various >> aspects including the revival of lost texts and principles. The forum, thus, >> is a good place where we can thrash out ideas and opinions to try and find >> answers to what may be bothering us. >> >> We may or may not succeed, but the process will definitely enhance our >> level of understanding and some good arguments will sow the seed in fertile >> minds which will germinate to give us the answer one day. >> >> Those who’ve been reading and participating, must have had the opportunity >> to learn quite a lot. Many of the participants will readily acknowledge that >> such discussions improve their ability to think and express on such issues. >> >> //I think the learned moderators should contribute/ guide the discussions/ >> / >> I hope you’ve got the answer! >> >> Thanks and Regards >> Neelam >> >> > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 18, 2009 Report Share Posted September 18, 2009 Dear Sir, Our ancients talked about the 7 planets...in the early years...there being no mention of Rahu & Kethu... However,Hindu mythology has in its characteristic way,symbolised these as two parts of a single body...( the Puranic stories are known to all), and have described their natures and the divine law governing them... These descriptions are surprisingly accurate...These profound truths contained in Hindu Puranas,can be understood,only by deep and reverential study.. Scoffers,of these Puranic stories,mostly allegorical,and also of K.P., if I may add,can only clutch at their apparent absurdities... " Pearls are not gatthered by surf riders. Only those who dive deep,harvest them..." goes the saying...Today Man has reached the stage of artificial and cultured pearls...is this a sign of progress or regression , ...is for readers to decide..but the fact remains that genuine pearls fetch a huge price.. as compared to cultured ones ! Today everybody knows about the relationship of Rahu and Kethu and Eclipses...Isn't it...? But,the irony of it is that the Traditional Astrologers did not even once criticise Parasara at all...but they hasten to clan up together to criticise K.S.Krishnamurthiji and his Padhdhati...any stick will do for them,it seems...even today... ! ! Wake up Astrologer Mrutyunjay...do not languish in orthodoxy...for ever...Times are changing fast, like all Science,Astrology is also crossing new barriers and demolishing long-held myths and beliefs... More details about Rahu & Kethu are given in K.P. books....kindly peruse them...which will help you understand "the mystery of Rahu & Kethu" (sic)... Wishing you the very best, Yogesh Lajmi GOOD LUCK ! [Moderator Note: Dear Yogesh Lajmi ji, Please take care of your language. We request you to please stop playing the wrangler] astrologer_mrutyunjay <astrologer_mrutyunjay Sent: Wednesday, September 16, 2009 4:04:00 PM Re: Logic Behind Vimsottari Dasa Dear friend,Why wasting time overpersonal gesticulations of peopleover why Sage Parasara allotted 7 years to ketu Mahadasa and 18 years to Rahu under vimshottari scheme.Does this have any impact on enhancing our predictive utility either quantitatively or qualitatively ?I think the learned moderators should contribute/ guide the discussionsbefore going it derailed or out of focus.Regards,Mrutyunjay Tripathy--- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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