[WAVES-Vedic] Fw: Dating of Ramayana Period

[Guest guest]

Dear friends,

 

In doing all the dating exercises most of the researchers forget to take into

account (a) the living traditions as well as (b) the precessional data, at all.

 

In doing the dating of the Mahabharata if only the researchers would have cared

to take into account the continuing tradition of the Saptarshi calendar and also

the Precessional data like Dr. Abhyankar did, they would have found that the

Mahabharata war was fought in 3139 BCE. This also meets all the astronomical

data given by Vedavyasa in the Mahabharata.

 

In doing the dating of Lord Rama's time Dr. Vartak closed in on the date through

precessional data and then of course he gave importance to the Buddhist

tradition that Lord Rama was born about 5,500 years before the Nirvana of Lord

Buddha (in 1807 BCE). Lord Buddha himself claimed to belong to the Ikshaku

Vamsha (lineage,) to which Lord Rama too belonged. So one has to look for the

date of Lord Rama somewhere around 7,307 BCE (1,807 + 5500 = 7307 BCE). Then Dr.

Vartak came out with the date of 7.323 BCE. While the perfectionists will want

the exact time of the day when Lord Rama was born, the historian in me  (can I

claim to be so?)  is quite satisfied with the date found by Dr. Vartak though I

would think that L:ord Rama was actually born in 7319 BCE,  just four years

later than Dr. Vartak proposed.

 

Now coming to Shri Kaul's mentioning that Lord Rama ruled for eleven thousand

years, he is obviously unaware of the fact that Lord Rama has been presented in

the Bala Kanda and the Uttara kanda as God whereas in the other Kandas he is

treataed as a human being.and for this very reason it is beyond doubt that the

Bala Kanda and th Uttara Kanda have been  interpolated into the Ramayana at a

much later date and these two Kandas were not composed by Valmiki. In all

probability Lord Rama ruled for about 30 years and 6 months  and considering

Lord Rama to be God and assuming the years associated with him to be the year of

the gods, the period of  30 years were wrongly multiplied by 360 to arrive at

11,000 human years. One can know about the length of the human life span in the

ancient days  from the phrase " Jivet Sharadam shatam " , though there were

exceptions, such as Lord Krishna lived for 125 years and the Pandavas lived

still longer.

 

Shri Kaul rightly refers to me as a Parokshya professor because of my looking at

things, which normally escape the attention of the Pratyaksha professors.

However I wish to tell Shri kaul that in 1963, ie before my joing the Atomic

ranergy Establishment as a scientist. I  was teaching Chemistry in a Degree

college for a few months.  So he may call me as Chemistry professor too.

 

Regards,

 

Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

 

 

--- On Fri, 9/11/09, subash razdan <subashrazdan wrote:

 

subash razdan <subashrazdan

[WAVES-Vedic] Fw: Dating of Ramayana Period

" World Association " <waves-vedic >

Friday, September 11, 2009, 8:54 AM

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

----- Forwarded Message ----

jyotirved <jyotirved (AT) sify (DOT) com>

subash razdan <subashrazdan@ >

Cc: pvr (AT) mediaone (DOT) net; vedic_research_ institute;

hinducalendar; indian_astrology_ group_daily_ digest@grou

ps.com; hinducivilization@ l. com

Friday, September 11, 2009 5:16:20 AM

Subject:

 

 

 

 

 

Dear Subashji,

Thanks for forwarding me the full text of Shri Purshkar Bhatnagar's views

about his own publication.  A similar post/mail has appeared on several

forums! 

 

" Vedic astronomers " have a symbiotic relation with " Vedic astrologers " and, as

such, are hardly any better than them in exhibiting their ignorance of

astronomy!  And they are flaunting, like a talisman,  software like

Planetarium etc. to show to the whole world as to how ignorant they actually

are about their own cultural matters, whether about the Ramayana or the

Mahabharata.

Shri Pushkar Bhatnagar has said in his book, as quoted by him " Maharishi Valmiki

has recorded in Bal Kaand sarga 19 and shloka eight and nine (1/18/8,9) that

Shri Ram was born on ninth tithi of Chaitra month when the position of different

planets vis-a-vis zodiac constellations and nakshatras (visible stars) were: i)

Sun in Aries; ii) Saturn in Libra; iii) Jupiter in Cancer; iv) Venus in Pisces;

v) Mars in Capricorn; vi) Lunar month of Chaitra; vii) Ninth day after

no moon; viii) Lagna as Cancer (cancer was rising in the east); ix) Moon on the

Punarvasu (Gemini constellation & Pllux star); x) Day time (around noon).

This data was fed into the software. The results indicated that this was exactly

the location of planets/stars in the noon of January 10, 5114 BC. Thus Shri Ram

was born on January 10, 5114 BC (7123 years back). As per the Indian calendar it

was the ninth day of Shukla Paksha in Chaitra month and the time was around 12

to 1 noontime. This is exactly the time and date when Ram Navmi is celebrated

all over India " . 

In several of his earlier posts, Shri Bhatnagar had talked of using

" Planetarium " software.

Let us analyze the actual facts.

There is a program by P. V. R. Narasimha Rao, (owner, vedic astrology

groups) named JHora.  Its latest version, 7.33 calculates planetary longitudes,

lagna, nakshatra etc. from about 5500 BCE to about 5500 AD rather quite

accurately.  It can be downloaded for free from the internet.  Anybody can use

in it any Ayanamsha including the " almighty " Lahiri or Ramana or even zero,

which is euphemistically known as Sayana! 

Swiss Ephemeris, that is based on VSOP 87 and also DE/LE data, is as well quite

accurate and calculates planetary longitudes, both sayana or nirayana, etc. for

a similar period. That also can be downloaded free from the web or purchased

for a nominal price for commercial purposes.

Both these software tally almost exactly with the Vishnu program in

HinduCalendar forum for tithi, nakshatra etc. from 10000 BCE to 12030 AD!

 

Following are the " almighty " Lahiri details copied from the JHora

7.33 software for January 10, 5114 BCE (-5113 AD) for Ayodhya at Noon, LMT:

 

1.

Natal Chart Shri Ram

Date:          January 10, -5113

Time:          12:00:00

Time Zone:     5:30:00 (East of GMT)

Place:         82 E 12' 00 " , 26 N 48' 00 "

               Ayodhya, India

Altitude:      0.00 meters

 

Lunar Yr-Mo:   Parabhava - Phalguna

Tithi:         Sukla Sapthami (Sa) (48.25% left)

Vedic Weekday: Thursday (Ju)

Nakshatra:     Rohini (Mo) (62.35% left)

Yoga:          Vishkambha (Sa) (11.29% left)

Karana:        Vanija (Ve) (96.49% left)

Hora Lord:     Moon (5 min sign: Le)

Mahakala Hora: Moon (5 min sign: Cn)

Kaala Lord:    Saturn (Mahakala: Moon)

 

Sunrise:       6:58:32

Sunset:        17:19:31

Janma Ghatis:  12.5612

 

Ayanamsa:      285-52-47.49

Sidereal Time: 16:35:26

 

Body                Longitude        Nakshatra Pada Rasi

Navamsa

 

Lagna               14 Ta 52' 07.38 " Rohi      2    Ta  

Ta

Sun - BK            26 Aq 48' 32.38 " PBha      3    Aq   Ge

Moon - PiK          15 Ta 01' 10.38 " Rohi      2    Ta   Ta

Mars - AmK          28 Ar 17' 42.38 " Krit      1    Ar   Sg

Mercury - AK        29 Cp 18' 42.32 " Dhan      2    Cp   Vi

Jupiter ® - MK    18 Le 51' 39.03 "

PPha      2    Le   Vi

Venus ® - DK       1 Pi 59' 24.70 " PBha      4    Pi   Cn

Saturn - PK         13 Sc 47' 26.51 " Anu       4    Sc   Sc

Rahu - GK           22 Sg 16' 56.06 " PSha      3    Sg   Li

Ketu                22 Ge 16' 56.06 " Puna      1   

Ge   Ar

****            ****                       

*****                        *****               

    *****                                *****

Following are the so called Sayana details as per the same J Hora 7.33 software

2.

Natal Chart Shri Ram

 

Date:          January 10, -5113

Time:          12:00:00

Time Zone:     5:30:00 (East of GMT)

Place:         82 E 12' 00 " , 26 N 48' 00 "

               Ayodhya, India

Altitude:      0.00 meters

 

Lunar Yr-Mo:   Parabhava - Pushya

Tithi:         Sukla Sapthami (Sa) (48.25% left)

Vedic Weekday: Thursday (Ju)

Nakshatra:     Poorvabhadra (Ju) (18.25% left)

Yoga:          Vyatipata (Ra) (23.08% left)

Karana:        Vanija (Ve) (96.49% left)

Hora Lord:     Moon (5 min sign: Le)

Mahakala Hora: Moon (5 min sign: Cn)

Kaala Lord:    Saturn (Mahakala: Moon)

 

Sunrise:       6:58:32

Sunset:        17:19:31

Janma Ghatis:  12.5612

 

Ayanamsa:      0-00-00.00

Sidereal Time: 16:35:26

 

Body                Longitude        Nakshatra Pada Rasi

Navamsa

 

Lagna                0 Pi 44' 54.87 " PBha      4   

Pi   Cn

Sun - PK            12 Sg 41' 21.93 " Mool      4    Sg   Cn

Moon - DK            0 Pi 53' 59.93 " PBha      4    Pi   Cn

Mars - PiK          14 Aq 10' 31.93 " Sata      3    Aq   Aq

Mercury - MK        15 Sc 11' 31.87 " Anu       4    Sc   Sc

Jupiter ® - GK     4 Ge

44' 28.58 " Mrig      4    Ge   Sc

Venus ® - BK      17 Sg 52' 14.25 " PSha      2    Sg   Vi

Saturn - AK         29 Le 40' 16.06 " UPha      1    Le   Sg

Rahu - AmK           8 Li 09' 45.60 " Swat      1    Li   Sg

Ketu                 8 Ar 09' 45.60 " Aswi      3   

Ar   Ge

*****               *****                ****   

                                    ******   

                    ****

 

The (Sayana) planetary details as per the Swiss Ephemeris are:

*** CHART ANALYSIS REPORT ***

 3.

 Shri Ram - Male Chart

 

 DeltaT = +162894s; ET = 3:46:06 am Jan 12 5114 BC; JDE = -146454.342978

 ST(0°) = 11:08:42; LST = 16:37:30; Ob = 24°10'19''; Eq.Time = -2m33s

 ACD(0h) = Oct 4 5114 BC; ACD(12h) = Apr 5 5114 BC

 

CHART ANGLES

 Ascendant  01°Pi26'08''   Midheaven  11°Sg02'58''

CHART POINTS

 Mon 02°Pi29'03''  

 Sun 12°Sg48'44''  

 Mer 15°Sc19'34''  

 Ven 17°Sg48'30'' R  

 Mar 14°Aq15'05''  

 Jup 04°Ge44'21'' R  

 Sat 29°Le40'55''  

  Nod 09°Li03'37'' R   

SNo 09°Ar03'37'' R  

*** END REPORT ***

 

You can see it for your self that there is not much difference between the

Swiss Ephemeris data and that of the latest J.Hora.

As claimed by Shri Pushkar Bhatnagar, The Valmiki Ramayana, Balakanda 18/8-9

actually says, " In the meantime six seasons (from the last Vasanta) rolled away

after the sacrifice was over.  Then on the ninth lunar day of the bright

fortnight of Chaitra, the twelfth month after the conclusion of the sacrifices,

when the asterism Punarvasu, presided over by Aditi, was in the ascendant and as

many as five planets viz. the Sun, Mars, Saturn and Venus happened to be exalted

(appeared in zodiacal signs of Mesha or Aries, Makara or Capricornus, Tula or

Libra, Karka or Cancer and Mina or Pisces respectively) , and Jupiter in

conjunction with the moon appeared in the zodiacal sign of Karka, mother

Kaushalya, the eldest wife of Dhasharatha, gave birth to a highly blessed son

named Shri Ram, who was no other than the Lord of the universe.. " (Gita Press

translation) 

 

The salient features of this " Divine " chart by Shri Pushkar Bhatnagar,

however, are:

1. Janma month is neither Madhu nor Chaitra but the month of Sahasya and

Margashirsha/ Pausha!

2. Janma ritu is not Vasanta but Hemanta Ritu!

3. Janma tithi is Shukla Saptami  instead of Shukla Navmi!

4. Janma Nakshatra is either Purvabhadra (Sayana) or Rohini (Lahiri) instead

of Punarvasu!

5. Moon is neither in sayana nor in nirayana Karkata but in either Mina or

Vrisha!

6. Sun is neither in nirayana nor in sayana Mesha but either in Dhanush or in

Kumbha!

7. Lagna is neither sayana nor nirayana Karkata but either Mina or Vrisha!

8. Brihaspati is neither in Sayana nor in nirayana Karkata but in Mithuna or

Simha!

9. Mangal is neither in Sayana nor in nirayana Makara but in Kumbha or Mesha

10. Shani is neither in Sayana nor in nirayana Tula but in Simha or Vrischika

11. Shukra is the only planet that can be said to be in Mina, that also provided

that we presuppose that " almighty " Lahiri had incarnated even prior to

" Bhatnagar Ram " since it is only as per Lahiri Ayanamsha that Shukra is in Mina!

12  Thus leave alone five planets being either exalted or in their own signs,

not even a single planet is exalted or in its own sign!

And the rest is history, as the saying goes, since if the birth particulars

themselves are inaccurate to such an extent, it is futile to go into other

details!

So long live " Bhatnagar Ram " !

And I am sure " Vedic astrologers " will continue to delineate the chart of

" Bhatnagar Ram " for ages together with correct predictions, since they can make

correct predictions only from incorrect data!

And the billion dollar question that no " Vedic astronomer " or " Vedic astrologer "

can answer is as to how could Mesha etc. Rashis be included in the Valmiki

Ramayana if they sre  conspicuous by their absence in a much later work viz.

the Mahabharata, ( " Paroskhya Professor's " Brahma Rashi notwithstanding! ) as

there were no rashis till the advent of Maya the mlechha, again, " parokshya

professor's " visualization of spurious mantra as original in the Vedanga

Jyotisha notwithstanding!

 

But then people like you and me are helpless in the face of an avalanche of

" proofs " by " prominent scholars " , thanks to their " philosophers' stones "  like

" Planetarium " software etc.!

 

It also appears that these scholars like  Dr. Vartak or " Parokshya Professor "

or Pushkar Bhatnagar or Prafulla Vamana Mendaki etc. etc., have not read the

original Valmiki Ramayana at all, since they would have at least given some

explanation as to how Shri Ram could have Incarnated in fifth or even seventh

millennium BCE, if He is supposed to have ruled for eleven thousand years for

this is what the Valmiki Ramayana says,  " Having served His kingdom for eleven

thousand years, Shri Ram will ascend to Brahmaloka "  (Balakanda 1/97--Gita Press

translation) and " (Now that You have ruled for eleven thousand years,

as desired by You Yourself, You will  have now to ascend to

Brahmaloka "  (Uttarakanda 104/12--Gita Press translation) .

What is most pathetic is the statement by Shri Pushkar Bhatnagar " The following

document is the 'MOST' authentic scientific work that does not need further

scientific verification. "   Obviously, some of the scholars consider themselves

more exalted than the Vedic Seers or even Maharshi Valmiki and would not like

their findings to be subjected to any peer review!

The fact of the matter is that these astrological combinations in the Varlmiki

Ramayana and Adhyatma Ramayana etc. are astronomically impossible and are

interpolations of a much later date by some good for nothing jyotishi! This

will be clear from:

1.  It is practically impossible for anybody to have been or be born in

Punarvasu nakshatra with the Moon in Karkata and Navmi tithi, with the sun in

Mesha!

2. Similarly, as per the Valmiki Ramayana Balakanda 18/15-16, " Bharata of

cheerful mind was born when the constellation Pushya was in the ascendant and

the Sun had entered the zodiacal sign of Pisces, while the twin sons of Sumitra

were born when the constellation Ashlesha was in the Ascendant and the sun had

reached the meredian, touching the zodiacal sign of Karkata, i.e. Cancer " . (Gita

Press translation)

Anybody knowing even a bit of astronomy, can immediately see through the

blunders committed by those good for nothing jyotishis who made such

interpolations to prove their jyotisha prowess, that if the sun is in Mesha as

in the case of Bhagwan Rama and in Mina in the case of Bharata, the latter is

either younger by eleven months or elder by one month to the former, since Mesha

follows Mina and not the other way round! 

3. Similarly, if Bharata's sun is in Mina, and that of Lakshmana and Shatrugna

in Karkata, they are either younger than Bharata by four months or elder to him

by eight months!  However, as per the same Valmiki Ramayana, all the four

brothers are supposed to have been born within a gap of a day or two and not

several months.

 

4. Last but not the least, almost all the “Vedic astronomers†and “Vedic

astrologers†are of the view that Rama-Setu is hundreds of thousands years old

as it was built by the Vanara-Sena of Bhagwan Ram!  They are claiming the

support of NASA also in such matters!  Now if as per these very  “Vedic

astronomers†and “Vedic astrologersâ€, He Incarnated just about seven or

nine thousand years back, what can be the fate of the plea pending in the

Supreme Court of India can well be imagined!

 

No " Vedic astrologer " has commented on such anachronisms in the Ramayana, simply

because they would not then be able to make a fool of a common man with such

words as, " Rama was exiled when He had Sade-Sati " or " even Bhagwan Ram was

separated from His wife since He was a Mangalik as He had Mars in the seventh "

and so on!

 

But then this is Kaliyuga and that is why Goswami Tulsidas had said, in the

Ramacharitamanasa, in Balakanda, 14th Doha: " Banchak Bhagat Kahai Ram ke, kinkar

kanchan koh kama ke " .

Aakhir paapi pet ka saval jo hai!

With regards,

Avtar

 

-

subash razdan

World Association ; Avtar K. Kaul ; namaste bombay ; nfia ; senior citizens

program

Thursday, September 03, 2009 2:47 AM

Fw: Dating of the Ramayana Period

 

 

 

----- Forwarded Message ----

Krishan Bhatnagar <krishan.kb (AT) verizon (DOT) net>

Undisclosed- Recipient@

Wednesday, September 2, 2009 10:55:09 AM

Dating of the Ramayana

Period

Dating the Era of Lord Ram :

Discover the Actual Dates of the Lifetime of Lord Ram

Pushkar Bhatnagar

Rupa and Co, 2004, pbk, x, 161 p, 59 Slides, ISBN : 81-291-0498- 9, $22.00

 

Excerpts…(The following document is the 'MOST' authentic scientific work

that does not need further scientific verification. )

 

The story of Shri Ram's life was first narrated by Maharishi Valmiki in the

Ramayana, which was written after Shri Ram was crowned as the king of Ayodhya.

Maharishi Valmiki was a great astronomer as he has made sequential astronomical

references on important dates related to the life of Shri Ram indicating the

location of planets vis-a-vis zodiac constellations and the other stars

(nakshatras) . Needless to add that similar position of planets and nakshatras

is not repeated in thousands of years. By entering the precise details of the

planetary configuration

of the important events in the life of Shri Ram as given in the Valmiki Ramayan

in the software named " Planetarium " corresponding exact dates of these events

according to the English calendar can be known.

 

Mr Pushkar Bhatnagar of the Indian Revenue Service had acquired this software

from the US.. It is used to predict the solar/lunar eclipses and distance and

location of other planets from earth. He entered the relevant details about the

planetary positions narrated by Maharishi Valmiki and obtained very interesting

and convincing results, which almost determine the important dates starting from

the birth of Shri Ram to the date of his coming back to Ayodhya after 14 years

of exile.

 

Maharishi Valmiki has recorded in Bal Kaand sarga 19 and shloka eight and nine

(1/18/8,9) that Shri Ram was born on ninth tithi of Chaitra month when the

position of different planets vis-a-vis zodiac constellations and nakshatras

(visible stars) were: i) Sun

in Aries; ii) Saturn in Libra; iii) Jupiter in Cancer; iv) Venus in Pisces; v)

Mars in Capricorn; vi) Lunar month of Chaitra; vii) Ninth day after no moon;

viii) Lagna as Cancer (cancer was rising in the east); ix) Moon on the Punarvasu

(Gemini constellation & Pllux star); x) Day time (around noon).

 

This data was fed into the software. The results indicated that this was exactly

the location of planets/stars in the noon of January 10, 5114 BC. Thus Shri Ram

was born on January 10, 5114 BC (7123 years back). As per the Indian calendar it

was the ninth day of Shukla Paksha in Chaitra month and the time was around 12

to 1 noontime. This is exactly the time and date when Ram Navmi is celebrated

all over India.

 

Shri Ram was born in Ayodhya. This fact can be ascertained from several books

written by Indian and foreign authors before and after the birth of Christ -

Valmiki Ramayan, Tulsi Ramayan, Kalidasa's Raghuvansam, Baudh and Jain

literature, etc. These books have narrated in great detail the location, rich

architecture and beauty of Ayodhya which had many palaces and temples built all

over the kingdom. Ayodhya was located on the banks of the Saryu river with Ganga

and Panchal Pradesh on one side and Mithila on the other side. Normally 7,000

years is a very long period during which earthquakes, storms, floods and foreign

invasions change the course of rivers, destroy the towns/buildings and alter the

territories. Therefore, the task of unearthing the facts is monumental. The

present Ayodhya has shrunk in size and the rivers have changed their course

about 40 km north/south.

 

Shri Ram went out of Ayodhya in his childhood (13th year as per Valmiki Ramayan)

with Rishi Vishwamitra who lived in Tapovan (Sidhhashram) . From there he went

to Mithila, King Janaka's kingdom. Here he married Sita after breaking

Shiv Dhanusha. Researchers have gone along the route adopted by Shri Ram as

narrated in the Valmiki Ramayan and found 23 places which have memorials that

commemorate the events related to the life of Shri Ram. These

include Shringi Ashram, Ramghat, Tadka Van, Sidhhashram, Gautamashram, Janakpur

(now in Nepal), Sita Kund, etc. Memorials are built for great men and not for

fictitious characters.

 

Date of exile of Shri Ram: It is mentioned in Valmiki Ramayan's Ayodhya Kand

(2/4/18) that Dashratha wanted to make Shri Ram the king because Sun, Mars and

Rahu had surrounded his nakshatra and normally under such planetary

configuration the king dies or becomes a victim of conspiracies. Dashratha's

zodiac sign was Pisces and his nakshatra was Rewati. This planetary

configuration was prevailing on the January 5, 5089 BC, and it was on this day

that Shri Ram left Ayodhya for 14 years of exile. Thus, he was 25 years old at

that time (5114-5089). There are

several shlokas in Valmiki Ramayan which indicate that Shri Ram was

25-years-old when he left Ayodhya for exile.

 

Valmiki Ramayan refers to the solar eclipse at the time of war with Khardushan

in later half of 13th year of Shri Ram's exile. It is also mentioned it was

amavasya day and Mars was in the middle ... When this data was entered, the

software indicated that there was a solar eclipse on October 7, 5077 BC,

(amavasya day) which could be seen from Panchvati. The planetary configuration

was also the same - Mars was in the middle, on one side were Venus and Mercury

and on the other side were Sun and Saturn. On the basis of planetary

configurations described in various other chapters, the date on which Ravana was

killed works out to be December 4, 5076 BC, and Shri Ram completed 14 years of

exile on January 2, 5075 BC, and that day was also Navami of Shukla Paksha in

Chaitra month. Thus Shri Ram had come back to Ayodhya at the age of 39

(5114-5075).

 

A colleague, Dr Ram Avtar, researched on places visited by Shri Ram during his

exile, and sequentially moved to the places stated as visited by Shri Ram in the

Valmiki Ramayan, starting from Ayodhya he went right upto Rameshwaram. He found

195 places which still have the memorials connected to the events narrated in

the Ramayana relating to the life of Shri Ram and Sita. These include Tamsa Tal

(Mandah), Shringverpur (Singraur), Bhardwaj Ashram (situated near Allahabad),

Atri Ashram, Markandaya Ashram (Markundi), Chitrakoot, Pamakuti (on banks of

Godavari), Panchvati, Sita Sarovar, Ram Kund in Triambakeshwar near Nasik,

Shabari Ashram, Kishkindha (village Annagorai), Dhanushkoti and Rameshwar

temple.

 

In Valmiki Ramayan it is mentioned that Shri Ram's army constructed a bridge

over the sea between Rameshwaram and Lanka. After crossing this bridge, Shri

Ram's army had defeated Ravana. Recently, NASA put pictures on the Internet

of a man-made bridge, the ruins of which are lying submerged in Palk Strait

between Rameshwaram and Sri Lanka. Recently the Sri Lankan Government had

expressed the desire to develop Sita Vatika as a tourist spot. Sri Lankans

believe this was Ashok Vatika where Ravana had kept Sita as a prisoner (in 5076

BC).

 

Indian history has recorded that Shri Ram belonged to the Suryavansh and he was

the 64th ruler of this dynasty. The names and other relevant particulars of

previous 63 kings are listed in Ayodhya Ka Itihas written about 80 years ago by

Rai Bahadur Sita Ram. Professor Subhash Kak of Lousiana University, in his book,

The Astronomical Code of the Rig Veda, has also listed 63 ancestors of Shri Ram

who ruled over Ayodhya. Sri Ram's ancestors have been traced out as: Shri Ram,

King Dashratha, King Aja, King Raghu, King Dilip and so on.. From Kashmir to

Kanyakumari and from Bengal to Gujarat, everywhere people believe in the reality

of Shri Ram's

existence, particularly in the tribal areas of Himachal, Rajasthan, Madhya

Pradesh and the North-East. Most of the festivals celebrated in these areas

revolve around the events in the life of Shri Ram and Shri Krishna.

 

The events and places related to the life of Shri Ram and Sita are true cultural

and social heritage of every Indian irrespective of caste and creed. Therefore,

it is common heritage. After all, Shri Ram belonged to the period when Prophet

Mohammed or Jesus Christ were not born and Muslim or Christian faiths were

unknown to the world. The words Hindu (resident of Hindustan) and Indian

(resident of India) were synonymous.. India was also known as Bharat (land of

knowledge) and Aryavarta (where Aryans live) and Hindustan (land of " Hindus " -

derived from word Indus).

 

During Ram Rajya, the evils of caste system based on birth were non-existent. In

fact, Maharishi Valmiki

is stated to be of shudra class (scheduled caste), still Sita lived with him as

his adopted daughter after she was banished from Ayodhya. Luv and Kush grew in

his ashram as his disciples. We need to be proud of the fact that Valmiki was

perhaps the first great astronomer and that his study of planetary

configurations has stood the test of times. Even the latest computer softwares

have corroborated his astronomical calculations, which proves that he did not

commit any error. Shabari is stated to be belonging to the Bheel tribe. Shri

Ram's army, which succeeded in defeating Ravana, was formed by various tribals

from Central and South India.... The facts, events and all other details

relating to the life of Shri Ram are the common heritage of all the Indians

including scheduled castes, scheduled tribes, Muslims, Christians, etc.

 

Prophet Mohammad was born 1,400 years ago. Jesus Christ was born 2,000 years

back. Gautam Buddha was born

2,600 years back, whereas Ram was born 7,000 years back. Hence, discovering the

details relating to Shri Ram's life would be lot more difficult as destruction

caused by floods, earthquakes and invasions etc., would be far greater. But,

should that stop our quest for learning more about our cultural heritage?

 

As people of Indian origin, let us all take pride in the fact that the Indian

civilization is the most ancient civilisation today. It is certainly more than

10,000 years old. Therefore, let us reject the story of Aryan invasion in India

in 1,500 BC as motivated implantation. In fact Max Mueller, who was the creator

of this theory had himself rejected it. Let us admit that during the British

Rule, we were educated in the schools based on Macaulay school of thinking which

believed that everything Indian was inferior and that entire " Indian literature

was not worth even

one book rack in England " . If there were similarities in certain features of

Indian people and people from Central Europe, then automatic inference drawn was

that the Aryans coming from Europe invaded India and settled here. No one dared

of thinking in any other way.

 

Therefore, there is urgency for the historians and all other intellectuals to

stop reducing Indian history to myth. There is need to gather, dig out, search,

unearth and analyze all the evidences, which would throw more light on ancient

Indian civilization and culture.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Guest guest]

Dear friends,In doing all the dating exercises most of the researchers forget to take into account (a) the living traditions as well as (b) the precessional data, at all. In doing the dating of the Mahabharata if only the researchers would have cared to take into account the continuing tradition of the Saptarshi calendar and also the Precessional data like Dr. Abhyankar did, they would have found that the Mahabharata war was fought in 3139 BCE. This also meets all the astronomical data given by Vedavyasa in the Mahabharata.In doing the dating of Lord Rama's time Dr. Vartak closed in on the date through precessional data and then of course he gave importance to the Buddhist tradition that Lord Rama was born about 5,500 years before the Nirvana of Lord Buddha (in 1807 BCE). Lord Buddha himself claimed to belong to the Ikshaku Vamsha

(lineage,) to which Lord Rama too belonged. So one has to look for the date of Lord Rama somewhere around 7,307 BCE (1,807 + 5500 = 7307 BCE). Then Dr. Vartak came out with the date of 7.323 BCE. While the perfectionists will want the exact time of the day when Lord Rama was born, the historian in me (can I claim to be so?) is quite satisfied with the date found by Dr. Vartak though I would think that L:ord Rama was actually born in 7319 BCE, just four years later than Dr. Vartak proposed.Now coming to Shri Kaul's mentioning that Lord Rama ruled for eleven thousand years, he is obviously unaware of the fact that Lord Rama has been presented in the Bala Kanda and the Uttara kanda as God whereas in the other Kandas he is treataed as a human being.and for this very reason it is beyond doubt that the Bala Kanda and th Uttara Kanda have been interpolated into the Ramayana at a much later date and these two Kandas were not

composed by Valmiki. In all probability Lord Rama ruled for about 30 years and 6 months and considering Lord Rama to be God and assuming the years associated with him to be the year of the gods, the period of 30 years were wrongly multiplied by 360 to arrive at 11,000 human years. One can know about the length of the human life span in the ancient days from the phrase "Jivet Sharadam shatam", though there were exceptions, such as Lord Krishna lived for 125 years and the Pandavas lived still longer.Shri Kaul rightly refers to me as a Parokshya professor because of my looking at things, which normally escape the attention of the Pratyaksha professors. However I wish to tell Shri kaul that in 1963, ie before my joing the Atomic ranergy Establishment as a scientist. I was teaching Chemistry in a Degree college for a few months. So he may call me as Chemistry professor too. Regards,Sunil K.

Bhattacharjya--- On Fri, 9/11/09, subash razdan <subashrazdan wrote:subash razdan <subashrazdan[WAVES-Vedic] Fw: Dating of Ramayana Period"World Association" <waves-vedic >Friday, September 11, 2009, 8:54 AM

 

 

 

 

----- Forwarded Message ----jyotirved <jyotirved (AT) sify (DOT) com>subash razdan <subashrazdan@ >Cc: pvr (AT) mediaone (DOT) net; vedic_research_ institute; hinducalendar; indian_astrology_ group_daily_ digest@grou ps.com; hinducivilization@ l. comFriday, September 11, 2009 5:16:20 AM

 

Dear Subashji,Thanks for forwarding me the full text of Shri Purshkar Bhatnagar's views about his own publication. A similar post/mail has appeared on several forums!

"Vedic astronomers" have a symbiotic relation with "Vedic astrologers" and, as such, are hardly any better than them in exhibiting their ignorance of astronomy! And they are flaunting, like a talisman, software like Planetarium etc. to show to the whole world as to how ignorant they actually are about their own cultural matters, whether about the Ramayana or the Mahabharata.Shri Pushkar Bhatnagar has said in his book, as quoted by him "Maharishi Valmiki has recorded in Bal Kaand sarga 19 and shloka eight and nine (1/18/8,9) that Shri Ram was born on ninth tithi of Chaitra month when the position of different planets vis-a-vis zodiac constellations and nakshatras (visible stars) were: i) Sun in Aries; ii) Saturn in Libra; iii) Jupiter in Cancer; iv) Venus in Pisces; v) Mars in Capricorn; vi) Lunar month of Chaitra; vii) Ninth day after

no moon; viii) Lagna as Cancer (cancer was rising in the east); ix) Moon on the Punarvasu (Gemini constellation & Pllux star); x) Day time (around noon).This data was fed into the software. The results indicated that this was exactly the location of planets/stars in the noon of January 10, 5114 BC. Thus Shri Ram was born on January 10, 5114 BC (7123 years back). As per the Indian calendar it was the ninth day of Shukla Paksha in Chaitra month and the time was around 12 to 1 noontime. This is exactly the time and date when Ram Navmi is celebrated all over India".

In several of his earlier posts, Shri Bhatnagar had talked of using "Planetarium" software.Let us analyze the actual facts.

There is a program by P. V. R. Narasimha Rao, (owner, vedic astrology ) named JHora. Its latest version, 7.33 calculates planetary longitudes, lagna, nakshatra etc. from about 5500 BCE to about 5500 AD rather quite accurately. It can be downloaded for free from the internet. Anybody can use in it any Ayanamsha including the "almighty" Lahiri or Ramana or even zero, which is euphemistically known as Sayana!

Swiss Ephemeris, that is based on VSOP 87 and also DE/LE data, is as well quite accurate and calculates planetary longitudes, both sayana or nirayana, etc. for a similar period. That also can be downloaded free from the web or purchased for a nominal price for commercial purposes.

Both these software tally almost exactly with the Vishnu program in HinduCalendar forum for tithi, nakshatra etc. from 10000 BCE to 12030 AD!

 

Following are the "almighty" Lahiri details copied from the JHora 7.33 software for January 10, 5114 BCE (-5113 AD) for Ayodhya at Noon, LMT:

 

1.

Natal Chart Shri Ram

January 10, -5113Time: 12:00:00Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT)Place: 82 E 12' 00", 26 N 48' 00" Ayodhya, IndiaAltitude: 0.00 meters

 

Lunar Yr-Mo: Parabhava - PhalgunaTithi: Sukla Sapthami (Sa) (48.25% left)Vedic Weekday: Thursday (Ju)Nakshatra: Rohini (Mo) (62.35% left)Yoga: Vishkambha (Sa) (11.29% left)Karana: Vanija (Ve) (96.49% left)Hora Lord: Moon (5 min sign: Le)Mahakala Hora: Moon (5 min sign: Cn)Kaala Lord: Saturn (Mahakala: Moon)

 

Sunrise: 6:58:32Sunset: 17:19:31Janma Ghatis: 12.5612

 

Ayanamsa: 285-52-47.49Sidereal Time: 16:35:26

 

Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa

 

Lagna 14 Ta 52' 07.38" Rohi 2 Ta TaSun - BK 26 Aq 48' 32.38" PBha 3 Aq GeMoon - PiK 15 Ta 01' 10.38" Rohi 2 Ta TaMars - AmK 28 Ar 17' 42.38" Krit 1 Ar SgMercury - AK 29 Cp 18' 42.32" Dhan 2 Cp ViJupiter ® - MK 18 Le 51' 39.03"

PPha 2 Le ViVenus ® - DK 1 Pi 59' 24.70" PBha 4 Pi CnSaturn - PK 13 Sc 47' 26.51" Anu 4 Sc ScRahu - GK 22 Sg 16' 56.06" PSha 3 Sg LiKetu 22 Ge 16' 56.06" Puna 1 Ge Ar

**** **** ***** ***** ***** *****

Following are the so called Sayana details as per the same J Hora 7.33 software

2.

Natal Chart Shri Ram

 

January 10, -5113Time: 12:00:00Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT)Place: 82 E 12' 00", 26 N 48' 00" Ayodhya, IndiaAltitude: 0.00 meters

 

Lunar Yr-Mo: Parabhava - PushyaTithi: Sukla Sapthami (Sa) (48.25% left)Vedic Weekday: Thursday (Ju)Nakshatra: Poorvabhadra (Ju) (18.25% left)Yoga: Vyatipata (Ra) (23.08% left)Karana: Vanija (Ve) (96.49% left)Hora Lord: Moon (5 min sign: Le)Mahakala Hora: Moon (5 min sign: Cn)Kaala Lord: Saturn (Mahakala: Moon)

 

Sunrise: 6:58:32Sunset: 17:19:31Janma Ghatis: 12.5612

 

Ayanamsa: 0-00-00.00Sidereal Time: 16:35:26

 

Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa

 

Lagna 0 Pi 44' 54.87" PBha 4 Pi CnSun - PK 12 Sg 41' 21.93" Mool 4 Sg CnMoon - DK 0 Pi 53' 59.93" PBha 4 Pi CnMars - PiK 14 Aq 10' 31.93" Sata 3 Aq AqMercury - MK 15 Sc 11' 31.87" Anu 4 Sc ScJupiter ® - GK 4 Ge

44' 28.58" Mrig 4 Ge ScVenus ® - BK 17 Sg 52' 14.25" PSha 2 Sg ViSaturn - AK 29 Le 40' 16.06" UPha 1 Le SgRahu - AmK 8 Li 09' 45.60" Swat 1 Li SgKetu 8 Ar 09' 45.60" Aswi 3 Ar Ge

***** ***** **** ****** ****

 

The (Sayana) planetary details as per the Swiss Ephemeris are:

*** CHART ANALYSIS REPORT ***

3.

Shri Ram - Male Chart

 

DeltaT = +162894s; ET = 3:46:06 am Jan 12 5114 BC; JDE = -146454.342978 ST(0°) = 11:08:42; LST = 16:37:30; Ob = 24°10'19''; Eq.Time = -2m33s ACD(0h) = Oct 4 5114 BC; ACD(12h) = Apr 5 5114 BC

 

CHART ANGLES Ascendant 01°Pi26'08'' Midheaven 11°Sg02'58''

CHART POINTS Mon 02°Pi29'03'' Sun 12°Sg48'44''

Mer 15°Sc19'34''

Ven 17°Sg48'30'' R

Mar 14°Aq15'05''

Jup 04°Ge44'21'' R Sat 29°Le40'55''

Nod 09°Li03'37'' R

SNo 09°Ar03'37'' R

*** END REPORT ***

 

You can see it for your self that there is not much difference between the Swiss Ephemeris data and that of the latest J.Hora.

As claimed by Shri Pushkar Bhatnagar, The Valmiki Ramayana, Balakanda 18/8-9 actually says, "In the meantime six seasons (from the last Vasanta) rolled away after the sacrifice was over. Then on the ninth lunar day of the bright fortnight of Chaitra, the twelfth month after the conclusion of the sacrifices, when the asterism Punarvasu, presided over by Aditi, was in the ascendant and as many as five planets viz. the Sun, Mars, Saturn and Venus happened to be exalted (appeared in zodiacal signs of Mesha or Aries, Makara or Capricornus, Tula or Libra, Karka or Cancer and Mina or Pisces respectively) , and Jupiter in conjunction with the moon appeared in the zodiacal sign of Karka, mother Kaushalya, the eldest wife of Dhasharatha, gave birth to a highly blessed son named Shri Ram, who was no other than the Lord of the universe.." (Gita Press

translation)

 

The salient features of this "Divine" chart by Shri Pushkar Bhatnagar, however, are:

1. Janma month is neither Madhu nor Chaitra but the month of Sahasya and Margashirsha/ Pausha!

2. Janma ritu is not Vasanta but Hemanta Ritu!

3. Janma tithi is Shukla Saptami instead of Shukla Navmi!

4. Janma Nakshatra is either Purvabhadra (Sayana) or Rohini (Lahiri) instead of Punarvasu!

5. Moon is neither in sayana nor in nirayana Karkata but in either Mina or Vrisha!

6. Sun is neither in nirayana nor in sayana Mesha but either in Dhanush or in Kumbha!

7. Lagna is neither sayana nor nirayana Karkata but either Mina or Vrisha!

8. Brihaspati is neither in Sayana nor in nirayana Karkata but in Mithuna or Simha!

9. Mangal is neither in Sayana nor in nirayana Makara but in Kumbha or Mesha

10. Shani is neither in Sayana nor in nirayana Tula but in Simha or Vrischika

11. Shukra is the only planet that can be said to be in Mina, that also provided that we presuppose that "almighty" Lahiri had incarnated even prior to "Bhatnagar Ram" since it is only as per Lahiri Ayanamsha that Shukra is in Mina!

12 Thus leave alone five planets being either exalted or in their own signs, not even a single planet is exalted or in its own sign!

And the rest is history, as the saying goes, since if the birth particulars themselves are inaccurate to such an extent, it is futile to go into other details!

So long live "Bhatnagar Ram"!

And I am sure "Vedic astrologers" will continue to delineate the chart of "Bhatnagar Ram" for ages together with correct predictions, since they can make correct predictions only from incorrect data!

And the billion dollar question that no "Vedic astronomer" or "Vedic astrologer" can answer is as to how could Mesha etc. Rashis be included in the Valmiki Ramayana if they sre conspicuous by their absence in a much later work viz. the Mahabharata, ("Paroskhya Professor's" Brahma Rashi notwithstanding! ) as there were no rashis till the advent of Maya the mlechha, again, "parokshya professor's" visualization of spurious mantra as original in the Vedanga Jyotisha notwithstanding!

 

But then people like you and me are helpless in the face of an avalanche of "proofs" by "prominent scholars", thanks to their "philosophers' stones" like "Planetarium" software etc.!

 

It also appears that these scholars like Dr. Vartak or "Parokshya Professor" or Pushkar Bhatnagar or Prafulla Vamana Mendaki etc. etc., have not read the original Valmiki Ramayana at all, since they would have at least given some explanation as to how Shri Ram could have Incarnated in fifth or even seventh millennium BCE, if He is supposed to have ruled for eleven thousand years for this is what the Valmiki Ramayana says, "Having served His kingdom for eleven thousand years, Shri Ram will ascend to Brahmaloka" (Balakanda 1/97--Gita Press translation) and "(Now that You have ruled for eleven thousand years, as desired by You Yourself, You will have now to ascend to Brahmaloka" (Uttarakanda 104/12--Gita Press translation) .

What is most pathetic is the statement by Shri Pushkar Bhatnagar "The following document is the 'MOST' authentic scientific work that does not need further scientific verification. " Obviously, some of the scholars consider themselves more exalted than the Vedic Seers or even Maharshi Valmiki and would not like their findings to be subjected to any peer review!

The fact of the matter is that these astrological combinations in the Varlmiki Ramayana and Adhyatma Ramayana etc. are astronomically impossible and are interpolations of a much later date by some good for nothing jyotishi! This will be clear from:

1. It is practically impossible for anybody to have been or be born in Punarvasu nakshatra with the Moon in Karkata and Navmi tithi, with the sun in Mesha!

2. Similarly, as per the Valmiki Ramayana Balakanda 18/15-16, "Bharata of cheerful mind was born when the constellation Pushya was in the ascendant and the Sun had entered the zodiacal sign of Pisces, while the twin sons of Sumitra were born when the constellation Ashlesha was in the Ascendant and the sun had reached the meredian, touching the zodiacal sign of Karkata, i.e. Cancer". (Gita Press translation)

Anybody knowing even a bit of astronomy, can immediately see through the blunders committed by those good for nothing jyotishis who made such interpolations to prove their jyotisha prowess, that if the sun is in Mesha as in the case of Bhagwan Rama and in Mina in the case of Bharata, the latter is either younger by eleven months or elder by one month to the former, since Mesha follows Mina and not the other way round!

3. Similarly, if Bharata's sun is in Mina, and that of Lakshmana and Shatrugna in Karkata, they are either younger than Bharata by four months or elder to him by eight months! However, as per the same Valmiki Ramayana, all the four brothers are supposed to have been born within a gap of a day or two and not several months.

 

4. Last but not the least, almost all the “Vedic astronomers†and “Vedic astrologers†are of the view that Rama-Setu is hundreds of thousands years old as it was built by the Vanara-Sena of Bhagwan Ram! They are claiming the support of NASA also in such matters! Now if as per these very “Vedic astronomers†and “Vedic astrologersâ€, He Incarnated just about seven or nine thousand years back, what can be the fate of the plea pending in the Supreme Court of India can well be imagined!

 

No "Vedic astrologer" has commented on such anachronisms in the Ramayana, simply because they would not then be able to make a fool of a common man with such words as, "Rama was exiled when He had Sade-Sati" or "even Bhagwan Ram was separated from His wife since He was a Mangalik as He had Mars in the seventh" and so on!

 

But then this is Kaliyuga and that is why Goswami Tulsidas had said, in the Ramacharitamanasa, in Balakanda, 14th Doha:"Banchak Bhagat Kahai Ram ke, kinkar kanchan koh kama ke".

Aakhir paapi pet ka saval jo hai!

With regards,

Avtar

 

-

subash razdan

World Association ; Avtar K. Kaul ; namaste bombay ; nfia ; senior citizens program

Thursday, September 03, 2009 2:47 AM

Fw: Dating of the Ramayana Period

 

 

 

----- Forwarded Message ----Krishan Bhatnagar <krishan.kb (AT) verizon (DOT) net>Undisclosed- Recipient@ Wednesday, September 2, 2009 10:55:09 AMDating of the Ramayana

Period

Dating the Era of Lord Ram :Discover the Actual Dates of the Lifetime of Lord Ram

Pushkar BhatnagarRupa and Co, 2004, pbk, x, 161 p, 59 Slides, ISBN : 81-291-0498- 9, $22.00 Excerpts…(The following document is the 'MOST' authentic scientific work that does not need further scientific verification. )The story of Shri Ram's life was first narrated by Maharishi Valmiki in the Ramayana, which was written after Shri Ram was crowned as the king of Ayodhya. Maharishi Valmiki was a great astronomer as he has made sequential astronomical references on important dates related to the life of Shri Ram indicating the location of planets vis-a-vis zodiac constellations and the other stars (nakshatras) . Needless to add that similar position of planets and nakshatras is not repeated in thousands of years. By entering the precise details of the planetary configuration

of the important events in the life of Shri Ram as given in the Valmiki Ramayan in the software named "Planetarium" corresponding exact dates of these events according to the English calendar can be known.Mr Pushkar Bhatnagar of the Indian Revenue Service had acquired this software from the US.. It is used to predict the solar/lunar eclipses and distance and location of other planets from earth. He entered the relevant details about the planetary positions narrated by Maharishi Valmiki and obtained very interesting and convincing results, which almost determine the important dates starting from the birth of Shri Ram to the date of his coming back to Ayodhya after 14 years of exile.Maharishi Valmiki has recorded in Bal Kaand sarga 19 and shloka eight and nine (1/18/8,9) that Shri Ram was born on ninth tithi of Chaitra month when the position of different planets vis-a-vis zodiac constellations and nakshatras (visible stars) were: i) Sun

in Aries; ii) Saturn in Libra; iii) Jupiter in Cancer; iv) Venus in Pisces; v) Mars in Capricorn; vi) Lunar month of Chaitra; vii) Ninth day after no moon; viii) Lagna as Cancer (cancer was rising in the east); ix) Moon on the Punarvasu (Gemini constellation & Pllux star); x) Day time (around noon).This data was fed into the software. The results indicated that this was exactly the location of planets/stars in the noon of January 10, 5114 BC. Thus Shri Ram was born on January 10, 5114 BC (7123 years back). As per the Indian calendar it was the ninth day of Shukla Paksha in Chaitra month and the time was around 12 to 1 noontime. This is exactly the time and date when Ram Navmi is celebrated all over India.Shri Ram was born in Ayodhya. This fact can be ascertained from several books written by Indian and foreign authors before and after the birth of Christ -

Valmiki Ramayan, Tulsi Ramayan, Kalidasa's Raghuvansam, Baudh and Jain literature, etc. These books have narrated in great detail the location, rich architecture and beauty of Ayodhya which had many palaces and temples built all over the kingdom. Ayodhya was located on the banks of the Saryu river with Ganga and Panchal Pradesh on one side and Mithila on the other side. Normally 7,000 years is a very long period during which earthquakes, storms, floods and foreign invasions change the course of rivers, destroy the towns/buildings and alter the territories. Therefore, the task of unearthing the facts is monumental. The present Ayodhya has shrunk in size and the rivers have changed their course about 40 km north/south.Shri Ram went out of Ayodhya in his childhood (13th year as per Valmiki Ramayan) with Rishi Vishwamitra who lived in Tapovan (Sidhhashram) . From there he went to Mithila, King Janaka's kingdom. Here he married Sita after breaking

Shiv Dhanusha. Researchers have gone along the route adopted by Shri Ram as narrated in the Valmiki Ramayan and found 23 places which have memorials that commemorate the events related to the life of Shri Ram. Theseinclude Shringi Ashram, Ramghat, Tadka Van, Sidhhashram, Gautamashram, Janakpur (now in Nepal), Sita Kund, etc. Memorials are built for great men and not for fictitious characters.Date of exile of Shri Ram: It is mentioned in Valmiki Ramayan's Ayodhya Kand (2/4/18) that Dashratha wanted to make Shri Ram the king because Sun, Mars and Rahu had surrounded his nakshatra and normally under such planetary configuration the king dies or becomes a victim of conspiracies. Dashratha's zodiac sign was Pisces and his nakshatra was Rewati. This planetary configuration was prevailing on the January 5, 5089 BC, and it was on this day that Shri Ram left Ayodhya for 14 years of exile. Thus, he was 25 years old at that time (5114-5089). There are

several shlokas in Valmiki Ramayan which indicate that Shri Ram was 25-years-old when he left Ayodhya for exile.Valmiki Ramayan refers to the solar eclipse at the time of war with Khardushan in later half of 13th year of Shri Ram's exile. It is also mentioned it was amavasya day and Mars was in the middle ... When this data was entered, the software indicated that there was a solar eclipse on October 7, 5077 BC, (amavasya day) which could be seen from Panchvati. The planetary configuration was also the same - Mars was in the middle, on one side were Venus and Mercury and on the other side were Sun and Saturn. On the basis of planetary configurations described in various other chapters, the date on which Ravana was killed works out to be December 4, 5076 BC, and Shri Ram completed 14 years of exile on January 2, 5075 BC, and that day was also Navami of Shukla Paksha in Chaitra month. Thus Shri Ram had come back to Ayodhya at the age of 39

(5114-5075).A colleague, Dr Ram Avtar, researched on places visited by Shri Ram during his exile, and sequentially moved to the places stated as visited by Shri Ram in the Valmiki Ramayan, starting from Ayodhya he went right upto Rameshwaram. He found 195 places which still have the memorials connected to the events narrated in the Ramayana relating to the life of Shri Ram and Sita. These include Tamsa Tal (Mandah), Shringverpur (Singraur), Bhardwaj Ashram (situated near Allahabad), Atri Ashram, Markandaya Ashram (Markundi), Chitrakoot, Pamakuti (on banks of Godavari), Panchvati, Sita Sarovar, Ram Kund in Triambakeshwar near Nasik, Shabari Ashram, Kishkindha (village Annagorai), Dhanushkoti and Rameshwar temple.In Valmiki Ramayan it is mentioned that Shri Ram's army constructed a bridge over the sea between Rameshwaram and Lanka. After crossing this bridge, Shri Ram's army had defeated Ravana. Recently, NASA put pictures on the Internet

of a man-made bridge, the ruins of which are lying submerged in Palk Strait between Rameshwaram and Sri Lanka. Recently the Sri Lankan Government had expressed the desire to develop Sita Vatika as a tourist spot. Sri Lankans believe this was Ashok Vatika where Ravana had kept Sita as a prisoner (in 5076 BC).Indian history has recorded that Shri Ram belonged to the Suryavansh and he was the 64th ruler of this dynasty. The names and other relevant particulars of previous 63 kings are listed in Ayodhya Ka Itihas written about 80 years ago by Rai Bahadur Sita Ram. Professor Subhash Kak of Lousiana University, in his book, The Astronomical Code of the Rig Veda, has also listed 63 ancestors of Shri Ram who ruled over Ayodhya. Sri Ram's ancestors have been traced out as: Shri Ram, King Dashratha, King Aja, King Raghu, King Dilip and so on.. From Kashmir to Kanyakumari and from Bengal to Gujarat, everywhere people believe in the reality of Shri Ram's

existence, particularly in the tribal areas of Himachal, Rajasthan, Madhya Pradesh and the North-East. Most of the festivals celebrated in these areas revolve around the events in the life of Shri Ram and Shri Krishna.The events and places related to the life of Shri Ram and Sita are true cultural and social heritage of every Indian irrespective of caste and creed. Therefore, it is common heritage. After all, Shri Ram belonged to the period when Prophet Mohammed or Jesus Christ were not born and Muslim or Christian faiths were unknown to the world. The words Hindu (resident of Hindustan) and Indian (resident of India) were synonymous.. India was also known as Bharat (land of knowledge) and Aryavarta (where Aryans live) and Hindustan (land of "Hindus" - derived from word Indus).During Ram Rajya, the evils of caste system based on birth were non-existent. In fact, Maharishi Valmiki

is stated to be of shudra class (scheduled caste), still Sita lived with him as his adopted daughter after she was banished from Ayodhya. Luv and Kush grew in his ashram as his disciples. We need to be proud of the fact that Valmiki was perhaps the first great astronomer and that his study of planetary configurations has stood the test of times. Even the latest computer softwares have corroborated his astronomical calculations, which proves that he did not commit any error. Shabari is stated to be belonging to the Bheel tribe. Shri Ram's army, which succeeded in defeating Ravana, was formed by various tribals from Central and South India.... The facts, events and all other details relating to the life of Shri Ram are the common heritage of all the Indians including scheduled castes, scheduled tribes, Muslims, Christians, etc.Prophet Mohammad was born 1,400 years ago. Jesus Christ was born 2,000 years back. Gautam Buddha was born

2,600 years back, whereas Ram was born 7,000 years back. Hence, discovering the details relating to Shri Ram's life would be lot more difficult as destruction caused by floods, earthquakes and invasions etc., would be far greater. But, should that stop our quest for learning more about our cultural heritage?As people of Indian origin, let us all take pride in the fact that the Indian civilization is the most ancient civilisation today. It is certainly more than 10,000 years old. Therefore, let us reject the story of Aryan invasion in India in 1,500 BC as motivated implantation. In fact Max Mueller, who was the creator of this theory had himself rejected it. Let us admit that during the British Rule, we were educated in the schools based on Macaulay school of thinking which believed that everything Indian was inferior and that entire "Indian literature was not worth even

one book rack in England". If there were similarities in certain features of Indian people and people from Central Europe, then automatic inference drawn was that the Aryans coming from Europe invaded India and settled here. No one dared of thinking in any other way.

 

Therefore, there is urgency for the historians and all other intellectuals to stop reducing Indian history to myth. There is need to gather, dig out, search, unearth and analyze all the evidences, which would throw more light on ancient Indian civilization and culture.

 

[Guest guest]

, "a_krishen" <jyotirved wrote:

 

Re: [WAVES-Vedic] Fw: Dating of Ramayana Period

Dear friends,

Namastey!

My friend Dr. Bhattacharjya has said, "Now coming to Shri Kaul's mentioning that Lord Rama ruled for eleven thousand years,

he is obviously unaware of the fact that Lord Rama has been presented in the Bala Kanda and the Uttara kanda as God whereas in

the other Kandas he is treataed as a human being.and for this very reason it is beyond doubt that the Bala Kanda and th Uttara Kanda havebeen interpolated into the Ramayana at a much later date and these two Kandas were not composed by Valmiki."

 

Ironically, the astrologicalcombinations of the birth chart of Bhagwan Ram and his siblings have been given in Balakanda, eighteenth adhyaya itself.

And if the entire Balakanda and also Uttarakanda are interpolations of a much later date in the Valmiki Ramayana and these two kandas were not composed byMaharshi Valmiki himslf at all, Dr. Bhattacharjy is exactly proving the same fact that I have said in my post, and I quote, "The fact of the matter is that these

astrological combinations in the Varlmiki Ramayana and Adhyatma Ramayana etc. are astronomically impossible and are interpolations of a much later date

by some good for nothing jyotishi!"

I highly appreciate Dr. Bhattacharjya's truthfulness, though personally, I would not go to the length of calling the whole Balakanda and Uttarakanda as later inpolations

and not written by Valmiki himself at all. But I respect Dr. Bhattacharjya's views and his courage to admit that astrological combinations in the Valmiki Ramayana are a much laterinterpolation.

With regards,

A. K. Kaul , Sunil Bhattacharjya<sunil_bhattacharjya wrote:>> Dear friends,>> In doing all the dating exercises most of the researchers forget totake into account (a) the living traditions as well as (b) theprecessional data, at all.>> In doing the dating of the Mahabharata if only the researchers wouldhave cared to take into account the continuing tradition of theSaptarshi calendar and also the Precessional data like Dr. Abhyankardid, they would have found that the Mahabharata war was fought in 3139BCE. This also meets all the astronomical data given by Vedavyasa in theMahabharata.>> In doing the dating of Lord Rama's time Dr. Vartak closed in on thedate through precessional data and then of course he gave importance tothe Buddhist tradition that Lord Rama was born about 5,500 years beforethe Nirvana of Lord Buddha (in 1807 BCE). Lord Buddha himself claimed tobelong to the Ikshaku Vamsha (lineage,) to which Lord Rama too belonged.So one has to look for the date of Lord Rama somewhere around 7,307 BCE(1,807 + 5500 = 7307 BCE). Then Dr. Vartak came out with the date of7.323 BCE. While the perfectionists will want the exact time of the daywhen Lord Rama was born, the historian in me (can I claim to beso?) is quite satisfied with the date found by Dr. Vartak though Iwould think that L:ord Rama was actually born in 7319 BCE, justfour years later than Dr. Vartak proposed.>> Now coming to Shri Kaul's mentioning that Lord Rama ruled for eleventhousand years, he is obviously unaware of the fact that Lord Rama hasbeen presented in the Bala Kanda and the Uttara kanda as God whereas inthe other Kandas he is treataed as a human being.and for this veryreason it is beyond doubt that the Bala Kanda and th Uttara Kanda havebeen interpolated into the Ramayana at a much later date and thesetwo Kandas were not composed by Valmiki. In all probability Lord Ramaruled for about 30 years and 6 months and considering Lord Rama tobe God and assuming the years associated with him to be the year of thegods, the period of 30 years were wrongly multiplied by 360 toarrive at 11,000 human years. One can know about the length of the humanlife span in the ancient days from the phrase "Jivet Sharadamshatam", though there were exceptions, such as Lord Krishna lived for125 years and the Pandavas lived still longer.>> Shri Kaul rightly refers to me as a Parokshya professor because of mylooking at things, which normally escape the attention of the Pratyakshaprofessors. However I wish to tell Shri kaul that in 1963, ie before myjoing the Atomic ranergy Establishment as a scientist. I wasteaching Chemistry in a Degree college for a few months. So he maycall me as Chemistry professor too.>> Regards,>> Sunil K. Bhattacharjya>>> --- On Fri, 9/11/09, subash razdan subashrazdan wrote:>> subash razdan subashrazdan [WAVES-Vedic] Fw: Dating of Ramayana Period> "World Association" waves-vedic > Friday, September 11, 2009, 8:54 AM>>>>>>> Â>>>>>>>>>> ----- Forwarded Message ----> jyotirved jyotirved (AT) sify (DOT) com>> subash razdan <subashrazdan@ >> Cc: pvr (AT) mediaone (DOT) net; vedic_research_ institute;hinducalendar; indian_astrology_ group_daily_digest@grou ps.com; hinducivilization@ l. com> Friday, September 11, 2009 5:16:20 AM> Subject:>>>>>> Dear Subashji,> Thanks for forwarding me the full text of Shri PurshkarBhatnagar's views about his own publication. A similarpost/mail has appeared on several forums!Â>

[Guest guest]

Dear friends, Namastey! My friend Dr. Bhattacharjya has said, " Now

coming to Shri Kaul's mentioning that Lord Rama ruled for eleven

thousand years, he is obviously unaware of the fact that Lord Rama has

been presented in the Bala Kanda and the Uttara kanda as God whereas in

the other Kandas he is treataed as a human being.and for this very

reason it is beyond doubt that the Bala Kanda and th Uttara Kanda have

been interpolated into the Ramayana at a much later date and these two

Kandas were not composed by Valmiki. " Ironically, the astrological

combinations of the birth chart of Bhagwan Ram and his siblings have

been given in Balakanda, eighteenth adhyaya itself. And if the entire

Balakanda and also Uttarakanda are interpolations of a much later date

in the Valmiki Ramayana and these two kandas were not composed by

Maharshi Valmiki himslf at all, Dr. Bhattacharjy is exactly proving the

same fact that I have said in my post, and I quote, " The fact of the

matter is that these astrological combinations in the Varlmiki Ramayana

and Adhyatma Ramayana etc. are astronomically impossible and are

interpolations of a much later date by some good for nothing jyotishi! "

I highly appreciate Dr. Bhattacharjya's truthfulness, though personally,

I would not go to the length of calling the whole Balakanda and

Uttarakanda as later inpolations and not written by Valmiki himself at

all. But I respect Dr. Bhattacharjya's views and his courage to admit

that astrological combinations in the Valmiki Ramayana are a much later

interpolation. With regards, A. K. Kaul

, Sunil Bhattacharjya

<sunil_bhattacharjya wrote:

>

> Dear friends,

>

> In doing all the dating exercises most of the researchers forget to

take into account (a) the living traditions as well as (b) the

precessional data, at all.

>

> In doing the dating of the Mahabharata if only the researchers would

have cared to take into account the continuing tradition of the

Saptarshi calendar and also the Precessional data like Dr. Abhyankar

did, they would have found that the Mahabharata war was fought in 3139

BCE. This also meets all the astronomical data given by Vedavyasa in the

Mahabharata.

>

> In doing the dating of Lord Rama's time Dr. Vartak closed in on the

date through precessional data and then of course he gave importance to

the Buddhist tradition that Lord Rama was born about 5,500 years before

the Nirvana of Lord Buddha (in 1807 BCE). Lord Buddha himself claimed to

belong to the Ikshaku Vamsha (lineage,) to which Lord Rama too belonged.

So one has to look for the date of Lord Rama somewhere around 7,307 BCE

(1,807 + 5500 = 7307 BCE). Then Dr. Vartak came out with the date of

7.323 BCE. While the perfectionists will want the exact time of the day

when Lord Rama was born, the historian in me (can I claim to be

so?)Â is quite satisfied with the date found by Dr. Vartak though I

would think that L:ord Rama was actually born in 7319 BCE, just

four years later than Dr. Vartak proposed.

>

> Now coming to Shri Kaul's mentioning that Lord Rama ruled for eleven

thousand years, he is obviously unaware of the fact that Lord Rama has

been presented in the Bala Kanda and the Uttara kanda as God whereas in

the other Kandas he is treataed as a human being.and for this very

reason it is beyond doubt that the Bala Kanda and th Uttara Kanda have

been interpolated into the Ramayana at a much later date and these

two Kandas were not composed by Valmiki. In all probability Lord Rama

ruled for about 30 years and 6 months and considering Lord Rama to

be God and assuming the years associated with him to be the year of the

gods, the period of 30 years were wrongly multiplied by 360 to

arrive at 11,000 human years. One can know about the length of the human

life span in the ancient days from the phrase " Jivet Sharadam

shatam " , though there were exceptions, such as Lord Krishna lived for

125 years and the Pandavas lived still longer.

>

> Shri Kaul rightly refers to me as a Parokshya professor because of my

looking at things, which normally escape the attention of the Pratyaksha

professors. However I wish to tell Shri kaul that in 1963, ie before my

joing the Atomic ranergy Establishment as a scientist. IÂ was

teaching Chemistry in a Degree college for a few months. So he may

call me as Chemistry professor too.

>

> Regards,

>

> Sunil K. Bhattacharjya

>

>

> --- On Fri, 9/11/09, subash razdan subashrazdan wrote:

>

> subash razdan subashrazdan

> [WAVES-Vedic] Fw: Dating of Ramayana Period

> " World Association " waves-vedic

> Friday, September 11, 2009, 8:54 AM

Â

>

>

>

----- Forwarded Message ----

> jyotirved jyotirved (AT) sify (DOT) com>

> subash razdan <subashrazdan@ >

> Cc: pvr (AT) mediaone (DOT) net; vedic_research_ institute;

hinducalendar; indian_astrology_ group_daily_

digest@grou ps.com; hinducivilization@ l. com

> Friday, September 11, 2009 5:16:20 AM

> Subject:

>

>

>

>

>

> Dear Subashji,

> Thanks for forwarding me the full text of Shri Purshkar

Bhatnagar's views about his own publication. A similar

post/mail has appeared on several forums!Â

>

> " Vedic astronomers " have a symbiotic relation with " Vedic astrologers "

and, as such, are hardly any better than them in exhibiting

their ignorance of astronomy! And they are flaunting, like a

talisman, software like Planetarium etc. to show to the whole

world as to how ignorant they actually are about their own cultural

matters, whether about the Ramayana or the Mahabharata.

> Shri Pushkar Bhatnagar has said in his book, as quoted by him

" Maharishi Valmiki has recorded in Bal Kaand sarga 19 and shloka eight

and nine (1/18/8,9) that Shri Ram was born on ninth tithi of Chaitra

month when the position of different planets vis-a-vis zodiac

constellations and nakshatras (visible stars) were: i) Sun in Aries; ii)

Saturn in Libra; iii) Jupiter in Cancer; iv) Venus in Pisces; v) Mars in

Capricorn; vi) Lunar month of Chaitra; vii) Ninth day after

> no moon; viii) Lagna as Cancer (cancer was rising in the east); ix)

Moon on the Punarvasu (Gemini constellation & Pllux star); x) Day time

(around noon).

> This data was fed into the software. The results indicated that this

was exactly the location of planets/stars in the noon of January 10,

5114 BC. Thus Shri Ram was born on January 10, 5114 BC (7123 years

back). As per the Indian calendar it was the ninth day of Shukla Paksha

in Chaitra month and the time was around 12 to 1 noontime. This is

exactly the time and date when Ram Navmi is celebrated all over

India " .Â

> In several of his earlier posts, Shri Bhatnagar had talked of using

" Planetarium " software.

> Let us analyze the actual facts.

> There is a program by P. V. R. Narasimha Rao, (owner, vedic astrology

) named JHora. Its latest version, 7.33 calculates

planetary longitudes, lagna, nakshatra etc. from about 5500 BCE to about

5500 AD rather quite accurately. It can be downloaded for free from

the internet. Anybody can use in it any Ayanamsha including the

" almighty " Lahiri or Ramana or even zero, which is euphemistically known

as Sayana!Â

> Swiss Ephemeris, that is based on VSOP 87 and also DE/LE data, is

as well quite accurate and calculates planetary longitudes, both sayana

or nirayana, etc. for a similar period. That also can be

downloaded free from the web or purchased for a nominal price for

commercial purposes.

> Both these software tally almost exactly with the Vishnu program

in HinduCalendar forum for tithi, nakshatra etc. from 10000 BCE to 12030

AD!

> Â

> Following are the " almighty " Lahiri details copied fromÂ

the JHora 7.33 software for January 10, 5114 BCE (-5113 AD)Â

for Ayodhya at Noon, LMT:

> Â

> 1.

> Natal Chart Shri Ram

> Date:Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â January 10, -5113

> Time:Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 12:00:00

> Time Zone:Â Â Â Â 5:30:00 (East of GMT)

> Place:Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 82 E 12' 00 " , 26 N 48'

00 "

> Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â

Ayodhya, India

> Altitude:Â Â Â Â Â 0.00 meters

> Â

> Lunar Yr-Mo:Â Â Parabhava - Phalguna

> Tithi:Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Sukla Sapthami (Sa)

(48.25% left)

> Vedic Weekday: Thursday (Ju)

> Nakshatra:Â Â Â Â Rohini (Mo) (62.35% left)

> Yoga:Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Vishkambha (Sa)

(11.29% left)

> Karana:Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Vanija (Ve) (96.49% left)

> Hora Lord:Â Â Â Â Moon (5 min sign: Le)

> Mahakala Hora: Moon (5 min sign: Cn)

> Kaala Lord:Â Â Â Saturn (Mahakala: Moon)

> Â

> Sunrise:Â Â Â Â Â Â 6:58:32

> Sunset:Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 17:19:31

> Janma Ghatis:Â 12.5612

> Â

> Ayanamsa:Â Â Â Â Â 285-52-47.49

> Sidereal Time: 16:35:26

> Â

> Body            Â

  Longitude       Nakshatra Pada

Rasi Navamsa

> Â

> Lagna            Â

 14 Ta 52' 07.38 " Rohi     2  Â

Ta  Ta

> Sun - BKÂ Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 26 Aq

48' 32.38 " PBha     3   Aq Â

Ge

> Moon - PiKÂ Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 15 Ta 01'

10.38 " Rohi     2   Ta  Ta

> Mars - AmKÂ Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 28 Ar 17'

42.38 " Krit     1   Ar  Sg

> Mercury - AKÂ Â Â Â Â Â Â 29 Cp 18' 42.32 "

Dhan     2   Cp  Vi

> Jupiter ® - MKÂ Â Â 18 Le 51' 39.03 "

> PPha     2   Le  Vi

> Venus ® - DKÂ Â Â Â Â Â 1 Pi 59' 24.70 " PBhaÂ

    4   Pi  Cn

> Saturn - PKÂ Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 13 Sc 47' 26.51 "

Anu      4   Sc  Sc

> Rahu - GKÂ Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 22 Sg 16'

56.06 " PSha     3   Sg  Li

> Ketu            Â

  22 Ge 16' 56.06 " Puna     1 Â

 Ge  Ar

> ****Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â ****Â Â Â

            Â

  *****         Â

        *****   Â

           *****Â

            Â

          *****

> Following are the so called Sayana details as per the same J Hora 7.33

software

> 2.

> Natal Chart Shri Ram

> Â

> Date:Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â January 10, -5113

> Time:Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 12:00:00

> Time Zone:Â Â Â Â 5:30:00 (East of GMT)

> Place:Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 82 E 12' 00 " , 26 N 48'

00 "

> Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â

Ayodhya, India

> Altitude:Â Â Â Â Â 0.00 meters

> Â

> Lunar Yr-Mo:Â Â Parabhava - Pushya

> Tithi:Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Sukla Sapthami (Sa)

(48.25% left)

> Vedic Weekday: Thursday (Ju)

> Nakshatra:Â Â Â Â Poorvabhadra (Ju) (18.25% left)

> Yoga:Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Vyatipata (Ra)

(23.08% left)

> Karana:Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Vanija (Ve) (96.49% left)

> Hora Lord:Â Â Â Â Moon (5 min sign: Le)

> Mahakala Hora: Moon (5 min sign: Cn)

> Kaala Lord:Â Â Â Saturn (Mahakala: Moon)

> Â

> Sunrise:Â Â Â Â Â Â 6:58:32

> Sunset:Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 17:19:31

> Janma Ghatis:Â 12.5612

> Â

> Ayanamsa:Â Â Â Â Â 0-00-00.00

> Sidereal Time: 16:35:26

> Â

> Body            Â

  Longitude       Nakshatra Pada

Rasi Navamsa

> Â

> Lagna            Â

  0 Pi 44' 54.87 " PBha     4  Â

Pi  Cn

> Sun - PKÂ Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 12 Sg

41' 21.93 " Mool     4   Sg Â

Cn

> Moon - DKÂ Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 0 Pi

53' 59.93 " PBha     4   Pi Â

Cn

> Mars - PiKÂ Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 14 Aq 10'

31.93 " Sata     3   Aq  Aq

> Mercury - MKÂ Â Â Â Â Â Â 15 Sc 11' 31.87 "

Anu      4   Sc  Sc

> Jupiter ® - GKÂ Â Â Â 4 Ge

> 44' 28.58 " Mrig     4   Ge Â

Sc

> Venus ® - BK     17 Sg 52' 14.25 " PSha Â

   2   Sg  Vi

> Saturn - AKÂ Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 29 Le 40' 16.06 "

UPha     1   Le  Sg

> Rahu - AmKÂ Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â 8 Li 09'

45.60 " Swat     1   Li  Sg

> Ketu            Â

   8 Ar 09' 45.60 " Aswi     3 Â

 Ar  Ge

> *****Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â

*****Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â

****Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â

            Â

    ******       Â

          ****

> Â

> The (Sayana) planetary details as per the Swiss Ephemeris are:

> *** CHART ANALYSIS REPORT ***

> Â 3.

> Â Shri Ram - Male Chart

> Â

> Â DeltaT = +162894s; ET = 3:46:06 am Jan 12 5114 BC; JDE =

-146454.342978

>  ST(0°) = 11:08:42; LST = 16:37:30; Ob = 24°10'19'';

Eq.Time = -2m33s

> Â ACD(0h) = Oct 4 5114 BC; ACD(12h) = Apr 5 5114 BC

> Â

> CHART ANGLES

>  Ascendant  01°Pi26'08''   MidheavenÂ

 11°Sg02'58''

> CHART POINTS

>  Mon 02°Pi29'03'' Â

>  Sun 12°Sg48'44'' Â

>  Mer 15°Sc19'34'' Â

>  Ven 17°Sg48'30'' R Â

>  Mar 14°Aq15'05'' Â

>  Jup 04°Ge44'21'' R Â

>  Sat 29°Le40'55'' Â

>   Nod 09°Li03'37'' R  Â

> SNo 09°Ar03'37'' R Â

> *** END REPORT ***

> Â

> You can see it for your self that there is not much difference

between the Swiss Ephemeris data and that of the latest J.Hora.

> As claimed by Shri Pushkar Bhatnagar, The Valmiki Ramayana, Balakanda

18/8-9 actually says, " In the meantime six seasons (from the last

Vasanta) rolled away after the sacrifice was over. Then on the

ninth lunar day of the bright fortnight of Chaitra, the twelfth month

after the conclusion of the sacrifices, when the asterism Punarvasu,

presided over by Aditi, was in the ascendant and as many as five planets

viz. the Sun, Mars, Saturn and Venus happened to be exalted (appeared in

zodiacal signs of Mesha or Aries, Makara or Capricornus, Tula or Libra,

Karka or Cancer and Mina or Pisces respectively) , and Jupiter in

conjunction with the moon appeared in the zodiacal sign of Karka, mother

Kaushalya, the eldest wife of Dhasharatha, gave birth to a highly

blessed son named Shri Ram, who was no other than the Lord of the

universe.. " (Gita Press

> translation)Â

> Â

> The salient features of this " Divine " chart by Shri Pushkar Bhatnagar,

however, are:

> 1. Janma month is neither Madhu nor Chaitra but the month of

Sahasya and Margashirsha/ Pausha!

> 2. Janma ritu is not Vasanta but Hemanta Ritu!

> 3. Janma tithi is Shukla Saptami  instead of Shukla Navmi!

> 4. Janma Nakshatra is either Purvabhadra (Sayana) or Rohini

(Lahiri)Â instead of Punarvasu!

> 5. Moon is neither in sayana nor in nirayana Karkata but in eitherÂ

Mina or Vrisha!

> 6. Sun is neither in nirayana nor in sayana Mesha but either in

Dhanush or in Kumbha!

> 7. Lagna is neither sayana nor nirayana Karkata but either Mina or

Vrisha!

> 8. Brihaspati is neither in Sayana nor in nirayana Karkata but in

Mithuna or Simha!

> 9. Mangal is neither in Sayana nor in nirayana Makara but in Kumbha or

Mesha

> 10. Shani is neither in Sayana nor in nirayana Tula but in Simha or

Vrischika

> 11. Shukra is the only planet that can be said to be in Mina, that

also provided that we presuppose that " almighty " Lahiri had incarnated

even prior to " Bhatnagar Ram " since it is only as per Lahiri Ayanamsha

that Shukra is in Mina!

> 12Â Thus leave alone five planets being either exalted or in their

own signs, not even a single planet is exalted or in its own sign!

> And the rest is history, as the saying goes, since if the birth

particulars themselves are inaccurate to such an extent, it is futile to

go into other details!

> So long live " Bhatnagar Ram " !

> And I am sure " Vedic astrologers " will continue to delineate the chart

of " Bhatnagar Ram " for ages together with correct predictions, since

they can make correct predictions only from incorrect data!

> And the billion dollar question that no " Vedic astronomer " or " Vedic

astrologer " can answer is as to how could Mesha etc. Rashis be included

in the Valmiki Ramayana if they sre conspicuous by their absence in

a much later work viz. the Mahabharata, ( " Paroskhya Professor's " Brahma

Rashi notwithstanding! )Â as there were no rashis till the advent of

Maya the mlechha, again, " parokshya professor's " visualization of

spurious mantra as original in the Vedanga Jyotisha notwithstanding!

> Â

> But then people like you and me are helpless in the face of an

avalanche of " proofs " by " prominent scholars " , thanks to their

" philosophers' stones " Â like " Planetarium " software etc.!

> Â

> It also appears that these scholars like Dr. Vartak or

" Parokshya Professor " or Pushkar Bhatnagar or Prafulla Vamana Mendaki

etc. etc., have not read the original Valmiki Ramayana at all, since

they would have at least given some explanation as to how Shri Ram could

have Incarnated in fifth or even seventh millennium BCE, if He is

supposed to have ruled for eleven thousand years for this is what

the Valmiki Ramayana says, " Having served His kingdom for eleven

thousand years, Shri Ram will ascend to Brahmaloka " Â (Balakanda

1/97--Gita Press translation)Â and " (Now that You have ruled for

eleven thousand years, as desired by You Yourself, You willÂ

have now to ascend to Brahmaloka " Â (Uttarakanda 104/12--Gita Press

translation) .

> What is most pathetic is the statement by Shri Pushkar Bhatnagar " The

following document is the 'MOST' authentic scientific work that does not

need further scientific verification. " Â Obviously, some of the

scholars consider themselves more exalted than the Vedic Seers or even

Maharshi Valmiki and would not like their findings to be subjected

to any peer review!

> The fact of the matter is that these astrological combinations in

the Varlmiki Ramayana and Adhyatma Ramayana etc. are astronomically

impossible and are interpolations of a much later date by some good for

nothing jyotishi! This will be clear from:

> 1. Â It is practically impossible for anybody to have been or

be born in Punarvasu nakshatra with the Moon in Karkata and Navmi

tithi, with the sun in Mesha!

> 2. Similarly, as per the Valmiki Ramayana Balakanda 18/15-16, " Bharata

of cheerful mind was born when the constellation Pushya was in the

ascendant and the Sun had entered the zodiacal sign of Pisces, while the

twin sons of Sumitra were born when the constellation Ashlesha was in

the Ascendant and the sun had reached the meredian, touching the

zodiacal sign of Karkata, i.e. Cancer " . (Gita Press translation)

> Anybody knowing even a bit of astronomy, can immediately see through

the blunders committed by those good for nothing jyotishis who made such

interpolations to prove their jyotisha prowess, that if the sun is in

Mesha as in the case of Bhagwan Rama and in Mina in the case of Bharata,

the latter is either younger by eleven months or elder by one month to

the former, since Mesha follows Mina and not the other way round!Â

> 3. Similarly, if Bharata's sun is in Mina, and that of Lakshmana and

Shatrugna in Karkata, they are either younger than Bharata by four

months or elder to him by eight months! However, as per the same

Valmiki Ramayana, all the four brothers are supposed to have

been born within a gap of a day or two and not several months.

> Â

> 4. Last but not the least, almost all the “Vedic

astronomers†and “Vedic astrologers†are of the

view that Rama-Setu is hundreds of thousands years old as it was built

by the Vanara-Sena of Bhagwan Ram! They are claiming the support of

NASA also in such matters! Now if as per these very Â

“Vedic astronomers†and “Vedic astrologersâ€,

He Incarnated just about seven or nine thousand years back, what can be

the fate of the plea pending in the Supreme Court of India can well be

imagined!

> Â

> No " Vedic astrologer " has commented on such anachronisms in the

Ramayana, simply because they would not then be able to make a fool of a

common man with such words as, " Rama was exiled when He had Sade-Sati "

or " even Bhagwan Ram was separated from His wife since He was a Mangalik

as He had Mars in the seventh " and so on!

> Â

> But then this is Kaliyuga and that is why Goswami Tulsidas had said,

in the Ramacharitamanasa, in Balakanda, 14th Doha: " Banchak Bhagat

Kahai Ram ke, kinkar kanchan koh kama ke " .

> Aakhir paapi pet ka saval jo hai!

> With regards,

> Avtar

> Â

> -

> subash razdan

> World Association ; Avtar K. Kaul ; namaste bombay ; nfia ; senior

citizens program

> Thursday, September 03, 2009 2:47 AM

> Fw: Dating of the Ramayana Period

> Â

> Â

> Â

> ----- Forwarded Message ----

> Krishan Bhatnagar krishan.kb (AT) verizon (DOT) net>

> Undisclosed- Recipient@

> Wednesday, September 2, 2009 10:55:09 AM

> Dating of the Ramayana

> Period

> Dating the Era of Lord Ram :

> Discover the Actual Dates of the Lifetime of Lord Ram

> Pushkar Bhatnagar

> Rupa and Co, 2004, pbk, x, 161 p, 59 Slides, ISBN : 81-291-0498- 9,

$22.00

>

> Excerpts…(The following document is the 'MOST' authentic

scientific work that does not need further scientific verification. )

>

> The story of Shri Ram's life was first narrated by Maharishi Valmiki

in the Ramayana, which was written after Shri Ram was crowned as the

king of Ayodhya. Maharishi Valmiki was a great astronomer as he has made

sequential astronomical references on important dates related to the

life of Shri Ram indicating the location of planets vis-a-vis zodiac

constellations and the other stars (nakshatras) . Needless to add that

similar position of planets and nakshatras is not repeated in thousands

of years. By entering the precise details of the planetary configuration

> of the important events in the life of Shri Ram as given in the

Valmiki Ramayan in the software named " Planetarium " corresponding exact

dates of these events according to the English calendar can be known.

>

> Mr Pushkar Bhatnagar of the Indian Revenue Service had acquired this

software from the US.. It is used to predict the solar/lunar eclipses

and distance and location of other planets from earth. He entered the

relevant details about the planetary positions narrated by Maharishi

Valmiki and obtained very interesting and convincing results, which

almost determine the important dates starting from the birth of Shri Ram

to the date of his coming back to Ayodhya after 14 years of exile.

>

> Maharishi Valmiki has recorded in Bal Kaand sarga 19 and shloka eight

and nine (1/18/8,9) that Shri Ram was born on ninth tithi of Chaitra

month when the position of different planets vis-a-vis zodiac

constellations and nakshatras (visible stars) were: i) Sun

> in Aries; ii) Saturn in Libra; iii) Jupiter in Cancer; iv) Venus in

Pisces; v) Mars in Capricorn; vi) Lunar month of Chaitra; vii) Ninth day

after no moon; viii) Lagna as Cancer (cancer was rising in the east);

ix) Moon on the Punarvasu (Gemini constellation & Pllux star); x) Day

time (around noon).

>

> This data was fed into the software. The results indicated that this

was exactly the location of planets/stars in the noon of January 10,

5114 BC. Thus Shri Ram was born on January 10, 5114 BC (7123 years

back). As per the Indian calendar it was the ninth day of Shukla Paksha

in Chaitra month and the time was around 12 to 1 noontime. This is

exactly the time and date when Ram Navmi is celebrated all over India.

>

> Shri Ram was born in Ayodhya. This fact can be ascertained from

several books written by Indian and foreign authors before and after the

birth of Christ -

> Valmiki Ramayan, Tulsi Ramayan, Kalidasa's Raghuvansam, Baudh and Jain

literature, etc. These books have narrated in great detail the location,

rich architecture and beauty of Ayodhya which had many palaces and

temples built all over the kingdom. Ayodhya was located on the banks of

the Saryu river with Ganga and Panchal Pradesh on one side and Mithila

on the other side. Normally 7,000 years is a very long period during

which earthquakes, storms, floods and foreign invasions change the

course of rivers, destroy the towns/buildings and alter the territories.

Therefore, the task of unearthing the facts is monumental. The present

Ayodhya has shrunk in size and the rivers have changed their course

about 40 km north/south.

>

> Shri Ram went out of Ayodhya in his childhood (13th year as per

Valmiki Ramayan) with Rishi Vishwamitra who lived in Tapovan

(Sidhhashram) . From there he went to Mithila, King Janaka's kingdom.

Here he married Sita after breaking

> Shiv Dhanusha. Researchers have gone along the route adopted by Shri

Ram as narrated in the Valmiki Ramayan and found 23 places which have

memorials that commemorate the events related to the life of Shri Ram.

These

> include Shringi Ashram, Ramghat, Tadka Van, Sidhhashram, Gautamashram,

Janakpur (now in Nepal), Sita Kund, etc. Memorials are built for great

men and not for fictitious characters.

>

> Date of exile of Shri Ram: It is mentioned in Valmiki Ramayan's

Ayodhya Kand (2/4/18) that Dashratha wanted to make Shri Ram the king

because Sun, Mars and Rahu had surrounded his nakshatra and normally

under such planetary configuration the king dies or becomes a victim of

conspiracies. Dashratha's zodiac sign was Pisces and his nakshatra was

Rewati. This planetary configuration was prevailing on the January 5,

5089 BC, and it was on this day that Shri Ram left Ayodhya for 14 years

of exile. Thus, he was 25 years old at that time (5114-5089). There are

> several shlokas in Valmiki Ramayan which indicate that Shri Ram was

25-years-old when he left Ayodhya for exile.

>

> Valmiki Ramayan refers to the solar eclipse at the time of war with

Khardushan in later half of 13th year of Shri Ram's exile. It is also

mentioned it was amavasya day and Mars was in the middle ... When this

data was entered, the software indicated that there was a solar eclipse

on October 7, 5077 BC, (amavasya day) which could be seen from

Panchvati. The planetary configuration was also the same - Mars was in

the middle, on one side were Venus and Mercury and on the other side

were Sun and Saturn. On the basis of planetary configurations described

in various other chapters, the date on which Ravana was killed works out

to be December 4, 5076 BC, and Shri Ram completed 14 years of exile on

January 2, 5075 BC, and that day was also Navami of Shukla Paksha in

Chaitra month. Thus Shri Ram had come back to Ayodhya at the age of 39

> (5114-5075).

>

> A colleague, Dr Ram Avtar, researched on places visited by Shri Ram

during his exile, and sequentially moved to the places stated as visited

by Shri Ram in the Valmiki Ramayan, starting from Ayodhya he went right

upto Rameshwaram. He found 195 places which still have the memorials

connected to the events narrated in the Ramayana relating to the life of

Shri Ram and Sita. These include Tamsa Tal (Mandah), Shringverpur

(Singraur), Bhardwaj Ashram (situated near Allahabad), Atri Ashram,

Markandaya Ashram (Markundi), Chitrakoot, Pamakuti (on banks of

Godavari), Panchvati, Sita Sarovar, Ram Kund in Triambakeshwar near

Nasik, Shabari Ashram, Kishkindha (village Annagorai), Dhanushkoti and

Rameshwar temple.

>

> In Valmiki Ramayan it is mentioned that Shri Ram's army constructed a

bridge over the sea between Rameshwaram and Lanka. After crossing this

bridge, Shri Ram's army had defeated Ravana. Recently, NASA put pictures

on the Internet

> of a man-made bridge, the ruins of which are lying submerged in Palk

Strait between Rameshwaram and Sri Lanka. Recently the Sri Lankan

Government had expressed the desire to develop Sita Vatika as a tourist

spot. Sri Lankans believe this was Ashok Vatika where Ravana had kept

Sita as a prisoner (in 5076 BC).

>

> Indian history has recorded that Shri Ram belonged to the Suryavansh

and he was the 64th ruler of this dynasty. The names and other relevant

particulars of previous 63 kings are listed in Ayodhya Ka Itihas written

about 80 years ago by Rai Bahadur Sita Ram. Professor Subhash Kak of

Lousiana University, in his book, The Astronomical Code of the Rig Veda,

has also listed 63 ancestors of Shri Ram who ruled over Ayodhya. Sri

Ram's ancestors have been traced out as: Shri Ram, King Dashratha, King

Aja, King Raghu, King Dilip and so on.. From Kashmir to Kanyakumari and

from Bengal to Gujarat, everywhere people believe in the reality of Shri

Ram's

> existence, particularly in the tribal areas of Himachal, Rajasthan,

Madhya Pradesh and the North-East. Most of the festivals celebrated in

these areas revolve around the events in the life of Shri Ram and Shri

Krishna.

>

> The events and places related to the life of Shri Ram and Sita are

true cultural and social heritage of every Indian irrespective of caste

and creed. Therefore, it is common heritage. After all, Shri Ram

belonged to the period when Prophet Mohammed or Jesus Christ were not

born and Muslim or Christian faiths were unknown to the world. The words

Hindu (resident of Hindustan) and Indian (resident of India) were

synonymous.. India was also known as Bharat (land of knowledge) and

Aryavarta (where Aryans live) and Hindustan (land of " Hindus " - derived

from word Indus).

>

> During Ram Rajya, the evils of caste system based on birth were

non-existent. In fact, Maharishi Valmiki

> is stated to be of shudra class (scheduled caste), still Sita lived

with him as his adopted daughter after she was banished from Ayodhya.

Luv and Kush grew in his ashram as his disciples. We need to be proud of

the fact that Valmiki was perhaps the first great astronomer and that

his study of planetary configurations has stood the test of times. Even

the latest computer softwares have corroborated his astronomical

calculations, which proves that he did not commit any error. Shabari is

stated to be belonging to the Bheel tribe. Shri Ram's army, which

succeeded in defeating Ravana, was formed by various tribals from

Central and South India.... The facts, events and all other details

relating to the life of Shri Ram are the common heritage of all the

Indians including scheduled castes, scheduled tribes, Muslims,

Christians, etc.

>

> Prophet Mohammad was born 1,400 years ago. Jesus Christ was born 2,000

years back. Gautam Buddha was born

> 2,600 years back, whereas Ram was born 7,000 years back. Hence,

discovering the details relating to Shri Ram's life would be lot more

difficult as destruction caused by floods, earthquakes and invasions

etc., would be far greater. But, should that stop our quest for learning

more about our cultural heritage?

>

> As people of Indian origin, let us all take pride in the fact that the

Indian civilization is the most ancient civilisation today. It is

certainly more than 10,000 years old. Therefore, let us reject the story

of Aryan invasion in India in 1,500 BC as motivated implantation. In

fact Max Mueller, who was the creator of this theory had himself

rejected it. Let us admit that during the British Rule, we were educated

in the schools based on Macaulay school of thinking which believed that

everything Indian was inferior and that entire " Indian literature was

not worth even

> one book rack in England " . If there were similarities in certain

features of Indian people and people from Central Europe, then automatic

inference drawn was that the Aryans coming from Europe invaded India and

settled here. No one dared of thinking in any other way.

> Â

> Therefore, there is urgency for the historians and all other

intellectuals to stop reducing Indian history to myth. There is need to

gather, dig out, search, unearth and analyze all the evidences, which

would throw more light on ancient Indian civilization and culture.

> Â

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