Guest guest Posted July 2, 2003 Report Share Posted July 2, 2003 Dear Rao, Namaste. Mind if I blurt in? - " Rao Nemani " <raonemani <jhora > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 6:42 PM Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ? > Dear Rao Ji, > > I have seen the following options available in JH 5 , > for " Sunrise Defintion Selection " :- > > 1) The center of Sun's Disk is truly on the eastern > horizon > 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern > horizon > 3) The tip of Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern > horizon > > Default is options-3: > > Can you please tell me on what situation we should use > these options, and I was told by a friend of mine to > use Option-1 for an accurate PranaPada Calculation. > Please confirm this?. > > I am currently using Option-1, which impacts the > calculation of the longitudes of special lagnas like > HL, GL and Upagrahas like Kaal, Mrityu, Gulika snd > Mandi. Definitely all this gets ifluenced by the sunrise point. However there's different sampradayas on this, so you should experiment to find the best for your taste. One method to do this is as follows: read the Pranapada definitons from BPHS and Jaimini Sutram, and take several cases with exactly known birth time. Try out potions 1, 2, and 3 and see if PPL changes signs. Read which reading is more suitable to the native. After a few experiments you will see which one you prefer. I use the default potion, as I believe this was used by the sages, as this is observable with the help of sloar observatories like they had in Ujjain, Jaipur or Delhi. > I am interested to get a very accurate PranaPada > Lagna, so me using Option-1 is correct?. > > Also I am using " Normal Solar Year ( 365.2425 days) " > as my customized option, please tell me where do I see > the difference of results if I use one of the > following:- > > Also What definition of the year you are using > a) Solar Longitude based year ( 360 deg per year) > b) Normal Solar Year ( 365.2425 days) > c) Savana year ( 360 days) > d) Solar Longitude based year ( 360 deg) > e) year with 360 Tithis. This makes difference with Dasas. Some astrologers use Savana years or tithi years for Nakshatra dasas, althoguh Sanjay emphatically uses normal solar year. For rasi dasas 360 deg year fits better, although it does not differ much from normal sloar year. Yours, Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer gauranga Jyotish Remedies: WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET Phone:+36-309-140-839 > Regards > Rao > > > > > SBC DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! > http://sbc. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 3, 2003 Report Share Posted July 3, 2003 Dear Gauranga Ji, Namaste, Thank you very much for the reply and it really did helped to some extent, but still I am struggling to understand the following: I have changed to JH default values for the Sunrise Definitions ( for all default values option), I have found the following value was set as default: 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern horizon May I ask you one more time, is this option you have set for your calculations, because this is Option-2 not Option-3 as I have mentioned earlier. Thanks for your help in advance. Regards Rao ================== 1) The center of Sun's Disk is truly on the eastern > horizon > 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern > horizon > 3) The tip of Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern > horizon > > Default is options-3: jhora , Gauranga Das <gauranga@b...> wrote: > Dear Rao, > > Namaste. > > Mind if I blurt in? > > - > " Rao Nemani " <raonemani> > <jhora > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 6:42 PM > Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ? > > > > Dear Rao Ji, > > > > I have seen the following options available in JH 5 , > > for " Sunrise Defintion Selection " :- > > > > 1) The center of Sun's Disk is truly on the eastern > > horizon > > 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern > > horizon > > 3) The tip of Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern > > horizon > > > > Default is options-3: > > > > Can you please tell me on what situation we should use > > these options, and I was told by a friend of mine to > > use Option-1 for an accurate PranaPada Calculation. > > Please confirm this?. > > > > I am currently using Option-1, which impacts the > > calculation of the longitudes of special lagnas like > > HL, GL and Upagrahas like Kaal, Mrityu, Gulika snd > > Mandi. > > Definitely all this gets ifluenced by the sunrise point. However there's > different sampradayas on this, so you should experiment to find the best for > your taste. One method to do this is as follows: read the Pranapada > definitons from BPHS and Jaimini Sutram, and take several cases with exactly > known birth time. Try out potions 1, 2, and 3 and see if PPL changes signs. > Read which reading is more suitable to the native. After a few experiments > you will see which one you prefer. I use the default potion, as I believe > this was used by the sages, as this is observable with the help of sloar > observatories like they had in Ujjain, Jaipur or Delhi. > > > I am interested to get a very accurate PranaPada > > Lagna, so me using Option-1 is correct?. > > > > Also I am using " Normal Solar Year ( 365.2425 days) " > > as my customized option, please tell me where do I see > > the difference of results if I use one of the > > following:- > > > > Also What definition of the year you are using > > a) Solar Longitude based year ( 360 deg per year) > > b) Normal Solar Year ( 365.2425 days) > > c) Savana year ( 360 days) > > d) Solar Longitude based year ( 360 deg) > > e) year with 360 Tithis. > > This makes difference with Dasas. Some astrologers use Savana years or tithi > years for Nakshatra dasas, althoguh Sanjay emphatically uses normal solar > year. For rasi dasas 360 deg year fits better, although it does not differ > much from normal sloar year. > > Yours, > > Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer > gauranga@b... > Jyotish Remedies: > WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET > Phone:+36-309-140-839 > > > > Regards > > Rao > > > > > > > > > > SBC DSL - Now only $29.95 per month! > > http://sbc. > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 3, 2003 Report Share Posted July 3, 2003 Namaste all, For sunrise, Sanjay taught option 3. So I made that the default. However, I personally don't like using an ill-defined phenomenon to define something. Definition 3 depends on the refraction angle and the atmospheric conditions. What if there are heavy clouds and Sun is not visible? One may say "we'll take the time when Sun would've been visible had there been no clouds". But, had there been no clouds, perhaps the atmospheric pressure would've been slightly different and the refraction angle slightly different. How can you guess at all? To me, apparent visibility is an ill-definition. I still give it as the default because Sanjay teaches it. BTW, you should note that JHora takes the average atmospheric conditions into account for calculating the apparent sunrise. There is no way anyone can predict it accurately, unless average atmospheric conditions are assumed. As per dasa years, I leave it to you to experiment. But never use normal solar years (365.2425 days). Always solar longitude based years (360 deg years) are more accurate. In normal solar years, a year is taken to be 365.2425 civil days. In 360 degree years, a year is taken as a period when Sun changes by 360 deg. To divide it further, Sun's degrees are used as a measure of time! Best regards,Narasimha - Rao Nemani jhora Thursday, July 03, 2003 8:35 AM Re: Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ? Dear Gauranga Ji,Namaste,Thank you very much for the reply and it really did helped to some extent, but still I am struggling to understand the following:I have changed to JH default values for the Sunrise Definitions ( for all default values option), I have found the following value was set as default:2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern horizonMay I ask you one more time, is this option you have set for your calculations, because this is Option-2 not Option-3 as I have mentioned earlier.Thanks for your help in advance.RegardsRao==================1) The center of Sun's Disk is truly on the eastern> horizon> 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern> horizon> 3) The tip of Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern> horizon>> Default is options-3:jhora , Gauranga Das <gauranga@b...> wrote:> Dear Rao,> > Namaste.> > Mind if I blurt in?> > -> "Rao Nemani" <raonemani>> <jhora >> Wednesday, July 02, 2003 6:42 PM> Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ?> > > > Dear Rao Ji,> >> > I have seen the following options available in JH 5 ,> > for "Sunrise Defintion Selection":-> >> > 1) The center of Sun's Disk is truly on the eastern> > horizon> > 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern> > horizon> > 3) The tip of Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern> > horizon> >> > Default is options-3:> >> > Can you please tell me on what situation we should use> > these options, and I was told by a friend of mine to> > use Option-1 for an accurate PranaPada Calculation.> > Please confirm this?.> >> > I am currently using Option-1, which impacts the> > calculation of the longitudes of special lagnas like> > HL, GL and Upagrahas like Kaal, Mrityu, Gulika snd> > Mandi.> > Definitely all this gets ifluenced by the sunrise point. However there's> different sampradayas on this, so you should experiment to find the best for> your taste. One method to do this is as follows: read the Pranapada> definitons from BPHS and Jaimini Sutram, and take several cases with exactly> known birth time. Try out potions 1, 2, and 3 and see if PPL changes signs.> Read which reading is more suitable to the native. After a few experiments> you will see which one you prefer. I use the default potion, as I believe> this was used by the sages, as this is observable with the help of sloar> observatories like they had in Ujjain, Jaipur or Delhi.> > > I am interested to get a very accurate PranaPada> > Lagna, so me using Option-1 is correct?.> >> > Also I am using "Normal Solar Year ( 365.2425 days)"> > as my customized option, please tell me where do I see> > the difference of results if I use one of the> > following:-> >> > Also What definition of the year you are using> > a) Solar Longitude based year ( 360 deg per year)> > b) Normal Solar Year ( 365.2425 days)> > c) Savana year ( 360 days)> > d) Solar Longitude based year ( 360 deg)> > e) year with 360 Tithis.> > This makes difference with Dasas. Some astrologers use Savana years or tithi> years for Nakshatra dasas, althoguh Sanjay emphatically uses normal solar> year. For rasi dasas 360 deg year fits better, although it does not differ> much from normal sloar year.> > Yours,> > Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer> gauranga@b...> Jyotish Remedies:> WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET> Phone:+36-309-140-839> > > > Regards> > Rao Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 3, 2003 Report Share Posted July 3, 2003 Dear Narasimha Rao Ji, Namaste, Thank you for answering my question promptly and I really appreciate and my seach for knowledge is now continued, otherwise, I am stuck if I do not get the answers quickly. Based on your suggesion and Sanjay Ji's teaching, I have decided to use Option-3 in the drop down list, which is: * The tip of Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern horizon But, when I have asked JH Software to set " Restore Default Calculations Options " , I get the the following setting as default: * The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern horizon Please help me, am I doing some thing incorrect here. When you said, third one hould be the default, but I am getting second option as dafualt. Thanks for your help in advance and help me to go forward quickly. Regards Rao jhora , " Narasimha P.V.R. Rao " <pvr@c...> wrote: > Namaste all, > > For sunrise, Sanjay taught option 3. So I made that the default. > > However, I personally don't like using an ill-defined phenomenon to define something. Definition 3 depends on the refraction angle and the atmospheric conditions. What if there are heavy clouds and Sun is not visible? One may say " we'll take the time when Sun would've been visible had there been no clouds " . But, had there been no clouds, perhaps the atmospheric pressure would've been slightly different and the refraction angle slightly different. How can you guess at all? > > To me, apparent visibility is an ill-definition. I still give it as the default because Sanjay teaches it. > > BTW, you should note that JHora takes the average atmospheric conditions into account for calculating the apparent sunrise. There is no way anyone can predict it accurately, unless average atmospheric conditions are assumed. > > As per dasa years, I leave it to you to experiment. But never use normal solar years (365.2425 days). Always solar longitude based years (360 deg years) are more accurate. > > In normal solar years, a year is taken to be 365.2425 civil days. In 360 degree years, a year is taken as a period when Sun changes by 360 deg. To divide it further, Sun's degrees are used as a measure of time! > > Best regards, > Narasimha > - > Rao Nemani > jhora > Thursday, July 03, 2003 8:35 AM > Re: Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ? > > > Dear Gauranga Ji, > > Namaste, > > Thank you very much for the reply and it really did helped to some > extent, but still I am struggling to understand the following: > > I have changed to JH default values for the Sunrise Definitions ( for > all default values option), I have found the following value was set > as default: > > 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern horizon > > May I ask you one more time, is this option you have set for your > calculations, because this is Option-2 not Option-3 as I have > mentioned earlier. > > Thanks for your help in advance. > > Regards > Rao > ================== > > 1) The center of Sun's Disk is truly on the eastern > > horizon > > 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern > > horizon > > 3) The tip of Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern > > horizon > > > > Default is options-3: > > > jhora , Gauranga Das <gauranga@b...> wrote: > > Dear Rao, > > > > Namaste. > > > > Mind if I blurt in? > > > > - > > " Rao Nemani " <raonemani> > > <jhora > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 6:42 PM > > Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ? > > > > > > > Dear Rao Ji, > > > > > > I have seen the following options available in JH 5 , > > > for " Sunrise Defintion Selection " :- > > > > > > 1) The center of Sun's Disk is truly on the eastern > > > horizon > > > 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern > > > horizon > > > 3) The tip of Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern > > > horizon > > > > > > Default is options-3: > > > > > > Can you please tell me on what situation we should use > > > these options, and I was told by a friend of mine to > > > use Option-1 for an accurate PranaPada Calculation. > > > Please confirm this?. > > > > > > I am currently using Option-1, which impacts the > > > calculation of the longitudes of special lagnas like > > > HL, GL and Upagrahas like Kaal, Mrityu, Gulika snd > > > Mandi. > > > > Definitely all this gets ifluenced by the sunrise point. However > there's > > different sampradayas on this, so you should experiment to find the > best for > > your taste. One method to do this is as follows: read the Pranapada > > definitons from BPHS and Jaimini Sutram, and take several cases > with exactly > > known birth time. Try out potions 1, 2, and 3 and see if PPL > changes signs. > > Read which reading is more suitable to the native. After a few > experiments > > you will see which one you prefer. I use the default potion, as I > believe > > this was used by the sages, as this is observable with the help of > sloar > > observatories like they had in Ujjain, Jaipur or Delhi. > > > > > I am interested to get a very accurate PranaPada > > > Lagna, so me using Option-1 is correct?. > > > > > > Also I am using " Normal Solar Year ( 365.2425 days) " > > > as my customized option, please tell me where do I see > > > the difference of results if I use one of the > > > following:- > > > > > > Also What definition of the year you are using > > > a) Solar Longitude based year ( 360 deg per year) > > > b) Normal Solar Year ( 365.2425 days) > > > c) Savana year ( 360 days) > > > d) Solar Longitude based year ( 360 deg) > > > e) year with 360 Tithis. > > > > This makes difference with Dasas. Some astrologers use Savana years > or tithi > > years for Nakshatra dasas, althoguh Sanjay emphatically uses normal > solar > > year. For rasi dasas 360 deg year fits better, although it does not > differ > > much from normal sloar year. > > > > Yours, > > > > Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer > > gauranga@b... > > Jyotish Remedies: > > WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET > > Phone:+36-309-140-839 > > > > > > > Regards > > > Rao Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 3, 2003 Report Share Posted July 3, 2003 Dear Rao garu, Sorry, I made a mistake. The default used to be 3. Just before the software was released, I changed it to 2 in the general release. *I* personally use 2. Only in the special build I made for Sanjay ji, I made 3 the default. Sanjay ji prefers 3. But because 3 is ill-defined, I did not like it. I did not think pranapada lagna, GL etc would depend on an ill-defined quantity. My conscience simply did not allow me to make it the default. If you prefer 3, you can always change the preference. Best regards,Narasimha - Rao Nemani jhora Thursday, July 03, 2003 10:57 AM Re: Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ? Dear Narasimha Rao Ji,Namaste,Thank you for answering my question promptly and I really appreciate and my seach for knowledge is now continued, otherwise, I am stuck if I do not get the answers quickly.Based on your suggesion and Sanjay Ji's teaching, I have decided to use Option-3 in the drop down list, which is: * The tip of Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern horizonBut, when I have asked JH Software to set "Restore Default Calculations Options", I get the the following setting as default: * The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern horizonPlease help me, am I doing some thing incorrect here. When you said, third one hould be the default, but I am getting second option as dafualt.Thanks for your help in advance and help me to go forward quickly.RegardsRaojhora , "Narasimha P.V.R. Rao" <pvr@c...> wrote:> Namaste all,> > For sunrise, Sanjay taught option 3. So I made that the default.> > However, I personally don't like using an ill-defined phenomenon to define something. Definition 3 depends on the refraction angle and the atmospheric conditions. What if there are heavy clouds and Sun is not visible? One may say "we'll take the time when Sun would've been visible had there been no clouds". But, had there been no clouds, perhaps the atmospheric pressure would've been slightly different and the refraction angle slightly different. How can you guess at all?> > To me, apparent visibility is an ill-definition. I still give it as the default because Sanjay teaches it.> > BTW, you should note that JHora takes the average atmospheric conditions into account for calculating the apparent sunrise. There is no way anyone can predict it accurately, unless average atmospheric conditions are assumed.> > As per dasa years, I leave it to you to experiment. But never use normal solar years (365.2425 days). Always solar longitude based years (360 deg years) are more accurate.> > In normal solar years, a year is taken to be 365.2425 civil days. In 360 degree years, a year is taken as a period when Sun changes by 360 deg. To divide it further, Sun's degrees are used as a measure of time!> > Best regards,> Narasimha> - > Rao Nemani > jhora > Thursday, July 03, 2003 8:35 AM> Re: Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ?> > > Dear Gauranga Ji,> > Namaste,> > Thank you very much for the reply and it really did helped to some > extent, but still I am struggling to understand the following:> > I have changed to JH default values for the Sunrise Definitions ( for > all default values option), I have found the following value was set > as default:> > 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern horizon> > May I ask you one more time, is this option you have set for your > calculations, because this is Option-2 not Option-3 as I have > mentioned earlier.> > Thanks for your help in advance.> > Regards> Rao> ==================> > 1) The center of Sun's Disk is truly on the eastern> > horizon> > 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern> > horizon> > 3) The tip of Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern> > horizon> >> > Default is options-3:> > > jhora , Gauranga Das <gauranga@b...> wrote:> > Dear Rao,> > > > Namaste.> > > > Mind if I blurt in?> > > > -> > "Rao Nemani" <raonemani>> > <jhora >> > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 6:42 PM> > Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ?> > > > > > > Dear Rao Ji,> > >> > > I have seen the following options available in JH 5 ,> > > for "Sunrise Defintion Selection":-> > >> > > 1) The center of Sun's Disk is truly on the eastern> > > horizon> > > 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern> > > horizon> > > 3) The tip of Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern> > > horizon> > >> > > Default is options-3:> > >> > > Can you please tell me on what situation we should use> > > these options, and I was told by a friend of mine to> > > use Option-1 for an accurate PranaPada Calculation.> > > Please confirm this?.> > >> > > I am currently using Option-1, which impacts the> > > calculation of the longitudes of special lagnas like> > > HL, GL and Upagrahas like Kaal, Mrityu, Gulika snd> > > Mandi.> > > > Definitely all this gets ifluenced by the sunrise point. However > there's> > different sampradayas on this, so you should experiment to find the > best for> > your taste. One method to do this is as follows: read the Pranapada> > definitons from BPHS and Jaimini Sutram, and take several cases > with exactly> > known birth time. Try out potions 1, 2, and 3 and see if PPL > changes signs.> > Read which reading is more suitable to the native. After a few > experiments> > you will see which one you prefer. I use the default potion, as I > believe> > this was used by the sages, as this is observable with the help of > sloar> > observatories like they had in Ujjain, Jaipur or Delhi.> > > > > I am interested to get a very accurate PranaPada> > > Lagna, so me using Option-1 is correct?.> > >> > > Also I am using "Normal Solar Year ( 365.2425 days)"> > > as my customized option, please tell me where do I see> > > the difference of results if I use one of the> > > following:-> > >> > > Also What definition of the year you are using> > > a) Solar Longitude based year ( 360 deg per year)> > > b) Normal Solar Year ( 365.2425 days)> > > c) Savana year ( 360 days)> > > d) Solar Longitude based year ( 360 deg)> > > e) year with 360 Tithis.> > > > This makes difference with Dasas. Some astrologers use Savana years > or tithi> > years for Nakshatra dasas, althoguh Sanjay emphatically uses normal > solar> > year. For rasi dasas 360 deg year fits better, although it does not > differ> > much from normal sloar year.> > > > Yours,> > > > Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer> > gauranga@b...> > Jyotish Remedies:> > WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET> > Phone:+36-309-140-839> > > > > > > Regards> > > Rao Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 3, 2003 Report Share Posted July 3, 2003 Dear Narasimha Rao Ji, Thank you for your qick reply again. So my understanding is Option-2, as default with the following value: * The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern horizon Is the above value you have made for Sanjay Ji as Option-3 as a default for a special Build. Thanks for this final confirmation, then I am all set to go forward. Regards Rao jhora , " Narasimha P.V.R. Rao " <pvr@c...> wrote: > Dear Rao garu, > > Sorry, I made a mistake. The default used to be 3. Just before the software was released, I changed it to 2 in the general release. *I* personally use 2. > > Only in the special build I made for Sanjay ji, I made 3 the default. Sanjay ji prefers 3. > > But because 3 is ill-defined, I did not like it. I did not think pranapada lagna, GL etc would depend on an ill-defined quantity. My conscience simply did not allow me to make it the default. > > If you prefer 3, you can always change the preference. > > Best regards, > Narasimha > - > Rao Nemani > jhora > Thursday, July 03, 2003 10:57 AM > Re: Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ? > > > Dear Narasimha Rao Ji, > > Namaste, > > Thank you for answering my question promptly and I really appreciate > and my seach for knowledge is now continued, otherwise, I am stuck if > I do not get the answers quickly. > > Based on your suggesion and Sanjay Ji's teaching, I have decided to > use > Option-3 in the drop down list, which is: > * The tip of Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern horizon > > But, when I have asked JH Software to set " Restore Default > Calculations Options " , > I get the the following setting as default: > * The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern horizon > > Please help me, am I doing some thing incorrect here. When you said, > third one > hould be the default, but I am getting second option as dafualt. > > Thanks for your help in advance and help me to go forward quickly. > > Regards > Rao > > jhora , " Narasimha P.V.R. Rao " <pvr@c...> wrote: > > Namaste all, > > > > For sunrise, Sanjay taught option 3. So I made that the default. > > > > However, I personally don't like using an ill-defined phenomenon to > define something. Definition 3 depends on the refraction angle and > the atmospheric conditions. What if there are heavy clouds and Sun is > not visible? One may say " > we'll take the time when Sun would've been visible had there been no > clouds " . But, had there been no clouds, perhaps the atmospheric > pressure would've been slightly different and the refraction angle > slightly different. How can you guess at all? > > > > To me, apparent visibility is an ill-definition. I still give it as > the default because Sanjay teaches it. > > > > BTW, you should note that JHora takes the average atmospheric > conditions into account for calculating the apparent sunrise. There > is no way anyone can predict it accurately, unless average > atmospheric conditions are assumed. > > > > As per dasa years, I leave it to you to experiment. But never use > normal solar years (365.2425 days). Always solar longitude based > years (360 deg years) are more accurate. > > > > In normal solar years, a year is taken to be 365.2425 civil days. > In 360 degree years, a year is taken as a period when Sun changes by > 360 deg. To divide it further, Sun's degrees are used as a measure of > time! > > > > Best regards, > > Narasimha > > - > > Rao Nemani > > jhora > > Thursday, July 03, 2003 8:35 AM > > Re: Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ? > > > > > > Dear Gauranga Ji, > > > > Namaste, > > > > Thank you very much for the reply and it really did helped to > some > > extent, but still I am struggling to understand the following: > > > > I have changed to JH default values for the Sunrise Definitions ( > for > > all default values option), I have found the following value was > set > > as default: > > > > 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern horizon > > > > May I ask you one more time, is this option you have set for your > > calculations, because this is Option-2 not Option-3 as I have > > mentioned earlier. > > > > Thanks for your help in advance. > > > > Regards > > Rao > > ================== > > > > 1) The center of Sun's Disk is truly on the eastern > > > horizon > > > 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern > > > horizon > > > 3) The tip of Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern > > > horizon > > > > > > Default is options-3: > > > > > > jhora , Gauranga Das <gauranga@b...> wrote: > > > Dear Rao, > > > > > > Namaste. > > > > > > Mind if I blurt in? > > > > > > - > > > " Rao Nemani " <raonemani> > > > <jhora > > > > Wednesday, July 02, 2003 6:42 PM > > > Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ? > > > > > > > > > > Dear Rao Ji, > > > > > > > > I have seen the following options available in JH 5 , > > > > for " Sunrise Defintion Selection " :- > > > > > > > > 1) The center of Sun's Disk is truly on the eastern > > > > horizon > > > > 2) The tip of Sun's disk is truly on the eastern > > > > horizon > > > > 3) The tip of Sun's disk appears to be on the eastern > > > > horizon > > > > > > > > Default is options-3: > > > > > > > > Can you please tell me on what situation we should use > > > > these options, and I was told by a friend of mine to > > > > use Option-1 for an accurate PranaPada Calculation. > > > > Please confirm this?. > > > > > > > > I am currently using Option-1, which impacts the > > > > calculation of the longitudes of special lagnas like > > > > HL, GL and Upagrahas like Kaal, Mrityu, Gulika snd > > > > Mandi. > > > > > > Definitely all this gets ifluenced by the sunrise point. > However > > there's > > > different sampradayas on this, so you should experiment to find > the > > best for > > > your taste. One method to do this is as follows: read the > Pranapada > > > definitons from BPHS and Jaimini Sutram, and take several cases > > with exactly > > > known birth time. Try out potions 1, 2, and 3 and see if PPL > > changes signs. > > > Read which reading is more suitable to the native. After a few > > experiments > > > you will see which one you prefer. I use the default potion, as > I > > believe > > > this was used by the sages, as this is observable with the help > of > > sloar > > > observatories like they had in Ujjain, Jaipur or Delhi. > > > > > > > I am interested to get a very accurate PranaPada > > > > Lagna, so me using Option-1 is correct?. > > > > > > > > Also I am using " Normal Solar Year ( 365.2425 days) " > > > > as my customized option, please tell me where do I see > > > > the difference of results if I use one of the > > > > following:- > > > > > > > > Also What definition of the year you are using > > > > a) Solar Longitude based year ( 360 deg per year) > > > > b) Normal Solar Year ( 365.2425 days) > > > > c) Savana year ( 360 days) > > > > d) Solar Longitude based year ( 360 deg) > > > > e) year with 360 Tithis. > > > > > > This makes difference with Dasas. Some astrologers use Savana > years > > or tithi > > > years for Nakshatra dasas, althoguh Sanjay emphatically uses > normal > > solar > > > year. For rasi dasas 360 deg year fits better, although it does > not > > differ > > > much from normal sloar year. > > > > > > Yours, > > > > > > Gauranga Das Vedic Astrologer > > > gauranga@b... > > > Jyotish Remedies: > > > WWW.BRIHASPATI.NET > > > Phone:+36-309-140-839 > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > Rao Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 16, 2003 Report Share Posted July 16, 2003 Dear Rao and Narasimha, Hare Rama Krsna! Just wanted to give my two pence opinion about the sunrise definition. Option-3 The tip of Sun appearing on eastern horizon, I don't really understand what is meant with this. Is it the apparent rising of Sun disk taking into account parallax factor or something? Or is it what is actually seen as Sun's tip rising, depending on the place one observes it? In the last case, the sunrise will be different from meter to meter, as one can live in a mountainous place, and thus see the sunrise considerably different from say a 100 m distance from there. Also, trees, houses, can block the vision so one cannot really trust what is the actual sunrise time then. Considering the other two options, it doesn't really matter to take tip or center, from the point of view of actually observing the sunrise, for the same reason as given above. Therefore the option I prefer is option - 1, center of Sun's disk. In the case of Vimsottari dasha - do we calculate from Moon's tip or Moon's center for the correct longitude of Moon? In the same way, then why would we calculate Sun's tip rather than Sun's center for the actual longitude of Sun? We do count from the ascending degree to the descending degree (180° from each other) in 7th house for the invisible half of zodiac and from 7th to lagna for visible half of the zodiac. Then isn't it the actual longitude of Sun (center) crossing the ascending degree which marks Sunrise? Anyway, this is my opinion. I'm sure it's shared by many others as well. For research, have a look at the attached chart - from a jyotishi's daughter who had the time of birth taken accurately to the second (if we can believe the doctor who did the caesarean birth) and this is the time of cutting umbilical cord. Yours, Dhira Krsna dasa, Jyotisha http://www.radhadesh.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 Namaste, To see the meaning of the three definitions, please go to vedic astrologysunrise.gif Pictures 1, 2 and 3 respectively illustrate options 3, 2 and 1 given in JH. Best regards, Narasimha ------------------------- Narasimha P.V.R. Rao www.VedicAstrologer.org email: pvr email2: pvr108 Tel: +1 508 839 1218 ------------------------- - Dhira Krsna BCS jhora Wednesday, July 16, 2003 3:35 PM Re: Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ? Dear Rao and Narasimha, Hare Rama Krsna! Just wanted to give my two pence opinion about the sunrise definition. Option-3 The tip of Sun appearing on eastern horizon, I don't really understand what is meant with this. Is it the apparent rising of Sun disk taking into account parallax factor or something? Or is it what is actually seen as Sun's tip rising, depending on the place one observes it? In the last case, the sunrise will be different from meter to meter, as one can live in a mountainous place, and thus see the sunrise considerably different from say a 100 m distance from there. Also, trees, houses, can block the vision so one cannot really trust what is the actual sunrise time then. Considering the other two options, it doesn't really matter to take tip or center, from the point of view of actually observing the sunrise, for the same reason as given above. Therefore the option I prefer is option - 1, center of Sun's disk. In the case of Vimsottari dasha - do we calculate from Moon's tip or Moon's center for the correct longitude of Moon? In the same way, then why would we calculate Sun's tip rather than Sun's center for the actual longitude of Sun? We do count from the ascending degree to the descending degree (180° from each other) in 7th house for the invisible half of zodiac and from 7th to lagna for visible half of the zodiac. Then isn't it the actual longitude of Sun (center) crossing the ascending degree which marks Sunrise? Anyway, this is my opinion. I'm sure it's shared by many others as well. For research, have a look at the attached chart - from a jyotishi's daughter who had the time of birth taken accurately to the second (if we can believe the doctor who did the caesarean birth) and this is the time of cutting umbilical cord. Yours, Dhira Krsna dasa, Jyotisha http://www.radhadesh.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 17, 2003 Report Share Posted July 17, 2003 || Jaya Jagannath || Dear Dhira Krsna dasa, My comments below: Best Wishes Sarajit Poddar SJC- Asia ---- jhora Thursday, July 17, 2003 4:02:45 AM jhora Re: Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ? Dear Rao and Narasimha,Hare Rama Krsna!Just wanted to give my two pence opinion about the sunrise definition.Option-3 The tip of Sun appearing on eastern horizon, I don't reallyunderstand what is meant with this. Is it the apparent rising of Sun disktaking into account parallax factor or something? Or is it what isactually seen as Sun's tip rising, depending on the place one observes it?In the last case, the sunrise will be different from meter to meter, asone can live in a mountainous place, and thus see the sunrise considerablydifferent from say a 100 m distance from there. Also, trees, houses, canblock the vision so one cannot really trust what is the actual sunrisetime then. [sP] Ancient times all the activites used to be closely link to the Sun's movement and hence the rising and setting time of the Sun was given prime importance. Now what is meant by rising is the issue here. For those people, rising meant when the first ray of Sun was visible on the horizon. This cannot be the center of the Sun rising on the horizon as by that time the half of the solar disk would have risen on the horizon. But now, what is the difference between the apparent rising and real rising of the Sun's upper tip? We know that the earth is covered by a thick layer of atmosphere, which due to refraction, bends the light. Thus, the first ray of Sun appears on the Horizon, even if the Tip of the sun is below the horizon. Thus the apparent rising would be the time when we see the Sunlight on the horizon, irrespective of whether it has reached the horizon. Now as you said the apparent rising could be difficult as the environment can be blocked by Trees or Mountains or like... but I think this would only make differences in few secs in Sunlight.... However, I "feel" that this should be the time, when Sun's first ray would be visible on the Horizon on a plane and not obstructed by anything. Moreover the day should be a clear and normal day as the refractive index of the atmosphere would vary with the quality of the Atmosphere. Considering the other two options, it doesn't really matter to take tip orcenter, from the point of view of actually observing the sunrise, for thesame reason as given above. Therefore the option I prefer is option - 1,center of Sun's disk. In the case of Vimsottari dasha - do we calculatefrom Moon's tip or Moon's center for the correct longitude of Moon? In thesame way, then why would we calculate Sun's tip rather than Sun's centerfor the actual longitude of Sun? We do count from the ascending degree tothe descending degree (180° from each other) in 7th house for theinvisible half of zodiac and from 7th to lagna for visible half of thezodiac. Then isn't it the actual longitude of Sun (center) crossing theascending degree which marks Sunrise? [sP] When we map the Sun in the zodiac, we use the center of the Sun and not any tip like any other planet. For illustration, when we say that Sun is in the 10deg Aries, we mean that Sun's Center is in 10deg Aries. This is the reason, why we cannot take the Lagna starting from the Sun's longitude but some 50-60 Arcsecs behind the solar longitude at Sunrise... Or, the Lagna Transits over the Solar Longitude approximately after 4 mins. If Center of Sun option is chosen, then at Sunrise, the Lagna and the solar longitude would be the same. As we know that anything rises (center of that planet) above the horizon, when Lagna moves over that body. So the solar tip would rise, when Lagna moves over it! and hence if solar tip option is chosen, at sunrise, the lagna transits the tip of the Sun, which is approximately 1deg (longitude) away from the Sun's center (which is Sun's longitude). In this case, the Sun's logitude (Sun's Center) rises approximately after 4 mins.Anyway, this is my opinion. I'm sure it's shared by many others as well.For research, have a look at the attached chart - from a jyotishi'sdaughter who had the time of birth taken accurately to the second (if wecan believe the doctor who did the caesarean birth) and this is the timeof cutting umbilical cord.Yours,Dhira Krsna dasa,Jyotishahttp://www.radhadesh.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 18, 2003 Report Share Posted July 18, 2003 Dear Sarajit, Hare Rama Krsna! I'll just reply with a verse from BPHS. You say sunrise is when first rays of the Sun become apparent in the sky. As far as my eyes can observe and knowledge reaches, sunrays already appear in the sky at dawn, long before the Sun rises. Then how can you say it denotes Sunrise? >[sP] Ancient times all the activites used to be closely link to the Sun's >movement and hence the rising and setting time of the Sun was given >prime importance. Now what is meant by rising is the issue here. For >those people, rising meant when the first ray of Sun was visible on the >horizon. This cannot be the center of the Sun rising on the horizon as by >that time the half of the solar disk would have risen on the horizon. Let's quote Parasara in BPHS Ch. 9 text 14 Definition of Sandhya: " 3 Ghatikas before the sight of the semi disc (half) of the rising Sun and a similar duration following the Sun set are called as morning twilight and evening twilight respectively. " Similarly, another description of sandhya is there in Ch. 46, texts 44-49 with reference to semi-disc of Sun. Why Parasara mentioned the semi disc here, and not the tip of the disc, as Sunrise? Please explain. Yours, Dhira Krsna dasa, Jyotisha http://www.radhadesh.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 19, 2003 Report Share Posted July 19, 2003 || Jaya Jagannath || Dear Dhira Krsna, In those slokas Maharishi Parashara gave the definition of the Muhurthas which are considered inauspicious for childbirth and considered evil, viz, the Sandhyas, the junction points of day and night... The junction of the day and night although associated with Sunrise and Sunset, is not the exact time of Sunrise and Sunset. 3 Ghatikas is 1.5 muhurthas (1 muhurtha = 48 mins). Here, he was not referring to the Sunrise and Sunset, as the Sunrise cannot be before 72 minutes before half rise of Solar Disk. Only after a few minutes from apprearing of the Sunrays, the solar disc rises on the horizon, so you see, that the 72 min before the rise of half of solar disk, is strickly for the Sandhya Duration. Now if somebody asks, why the Sandhyas are not exactly during the Sunrise and Sunset is a different question altogether. Best Wishes Sarajit - Dhira Krsna BCS vedic astrology ; jhora Cc: Varahamihira Saturday, July 19, 2003 3:15 AM [vedic astrology] Re: Re: Sunrise Defintion Selection Question ? Dear Sarajit,Hare Rama Krsna!I'll just reply with a verse from BPHS. You say sunrise is when first raysof the Sun become apparent in the sky. As far as my eyes can observe andknowledge reaches, sunrays already appear in the sky at dawn, long beforethe Sun rises. Then how can you say it denotes Sunrise?>[sP] Ancient times all the activites used to be closely link to the Sun's>movement and hence the rising and setting time of the Sun was given>prime importance. Now what is meant by rising is the issue here. For>those people, rising meant when the first ray of Sun was visible on the>horizon. This cannot be the center of the Sun rising on the horizon as by>that time the half of the solar disk would have risen on the horizon.Let's quote Parasara in BPHS Ch. 9 text 14 Definition of Sandhya:"3 Ghatikas before the sight of the semi disc (half) of the rising Sun anda similar duration following the Sun set are called as morning twilightand evening twilight respectively."Similarly, another description of sandhya is there in Ch. 46, texts 44-49with reference to semi-disc of Sun.Why Parasara mentioned the semi disc here, and not the tip of the disc, asSunrise? Please explain.Yours,Dhira Krsna dasa,Jyotishahttp://www.radhadesh.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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