Guest guest Posted October 27, 2009 Report Share Posted October 27, 2009 Dear Narasimha Rao, My obeisances! Those two photos were taken by me at Oct 27 2009, the first photo shows a practical conjunction between Moon and Jupiter: http://picasaweb.google.com/adinshi/SuspectedJhoraProblem#5397355542915753234 (Oct 27 2009, 20:44 pm, Giv'at Shmuel, Israel, 34E50, 32N4, Moon and Jupiter, clearly having a lattitudinal distance of about 3 degrees, have almost no longitudinal distance. ) The second photo is of Jhora screen taken at the same time and showing a longitude of 6 degrees between Moon and Jupiter: http://picasaweb.google.com/adinshi/SuspectedJhoraProblem#5397355594102624946 (Oct 27 2009, 20:44 pm, Giv'at Shmuel, Israel, 34E50, 32N4, Jhora, though, informs us of a whole 6 degrees of longitude between Moon and Jupiter!) How could it happen? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 28, 2009 Report Share Posted October 28, 2009 Dear Adinshi, There are several coordinate systems: equatorial, ecliptic and horizontal. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equatorial_coordinates http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecliptic_coordinate_system http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horizontal_coordinate_system There is 6 degrees of difference in ecliptic longitudes between Moon and Jupiter. But in horizontal coordinates (your photo), there is no difference. I drew 2 sky charts with Stellarium, one in equatorial coordinates (AD and DEC), and one in horizontal coordinates (Azimuth and altitude (H for hauteur in French). You will see there is no mistake in JH. ;-) Best regards, Marie-Christine Sclifet De : jhora [jhora ] De la part de adinshi Envoyé : mardi 27 octobre 2009 21:22 À : jhora Objet : Suspected problem with Jhora 7.02 Dear Narasimha Rao, My obeisances! Those two photos were taken by me at Oct 27 2009, the first photo shows a practical conjunction between Moon and Jupiter: http://picasaweb.google.com/adinshi/SuspectedJhoraProblem#5397355542915753234 (Oct 27 2009, 20:44 pm, Giv'at Shmuel, Israel, 34E50, 32N4, Moon and Jupiter, clearly having a lattitudinal distance of about 3 degrees, have almost no longitudinal distance. ) The second photo is of Jhora screen taken at the same time and showing a longitude of 6 degrees between Moon and Jupiter: http://picasaweb.google.com/adinshi/SuspectedJhoraProblem#5397355594102624946 (Oct 27 2009, 20:44 pm, Giv'at Shmuel, Israel, 34E50, 32N4, Jhora, though, informs us of a whole 6 degrees of longitude between Moon and Jupiter!) How could it happen? __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4551 (20091028) __________The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.http://www.eset.com 2 of 2 Photo(s) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 Dear Marie-CHristine, Thank you for an informative reply.This Stellarium software is amazing. Now I understand that there is no problem with Jhora, or more precisely, with the way Jhora does its calculations. Still, I think that there is a problem with the way Jhora displays data in its user interface. Behind the scenes Jhora may employ whatever system of coordinates it likes, but since we, users, see the sky in horizontal coordinates, Jhora should display the data in the same (horizontal) system of coordinates. Adin jhora , "Marie-Christine Sclifet" <mcsclifet wrote:>> Dear Adinshi,> > > > There are several coordinate systems: equatorial, ecliptic and horizontal.> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equatorial_coordinates> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ecliptic_coordinate_system> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horizontal_coordinate_system> > > > There is 6 degrees of difference in ecliptic longitudes between Moon and> Jupiter.> > But in horizontal coordinates (your photo), there is no difference.> > > > I drew 2 sky charts with Stellarium, one in equatorial coordinates (AD and> DEC), and one in horizontal coordinates (Azimuth and altitude (H for hauteur> in French).> > > > You will see there is no mistake in JH. ;-)> > > > Best regards,> > Marie-Christine Sclifet> > > > De : jhora [jhora ] De la part de> adinshi> Envoyé : mardi 27 octobre 2009 21:22> À : jhora > Objet : Suspected problem with Jhora 7.02> > Dear Narasimha Rao,> > My obeisances!> > Those two photos were taken by me at Oct 27 2009, the first photo shows a> practical conjunction between Moon and Jupiter:> > > <http://picasaweb.google.com/adinshi/SuspectedJhoraProblem#53973555429157532> 34>> http://picasaweb.google.com/adinshi/SuspectedJhoraProblem#539735554291575323> 4 > > (Oct 27 2009, 20:44 pm, Giv'at Shmuel, Israel, 34E50, 32N4, Moon and> Jupiter, clearly having a lattitudinal distance of about 3 degrees, have> almost no longitudinal distance. )> > The second photo is of Jhora screen taken at the same time and showing a> longitude of 6 degrees between Moon and Jupiter:> > > <http://picasaweb.google.com/adinshi/SuspectedJhoraProblem#53973555941026249> 46>> http://picasaweb.google.com/adinshi/SuspectedJhoraProblem#539735559410262494> 6 > > (Oct 27 2009, 20:44 pm, Giv'at Shmuel, Israel, 34E50, 32N4, Jhora, though,> informs us of a whole 6 degrees of longitude between Moon and Jupiter!)> > How could it happen?> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 30, 2009 Report Share Posted October 30, 2009 Dear Adin, JHora is an astrological software and we, astrologers, use it for astrological calculations (in ecliptic coordinates). I think that horizontal coordinates are not necessary for astrological purpose. For that, you can use Stellarium, a free astronomical software. Best regards, Marie-Christine De : jhora [jhora ] De la part de adinshi Envoyé : vendredi 30 octobre 2009 20:44 À : jhora Objet : Re: Suspected problem with Jhora 7.02 Dear Marie-CHristine, Thank you for an informative reply. This Stellarium software is amazing. Now I understand that there is no problem with Jhora, or more precisely, with the way Jhora does its calculations. Still, I think that there is a problem with the way Jhora displays data in its user interface. Behind the scenes Jhora may employ whatever system of coordinates it likes, but since we, users, see the sky in horizontal coordinates, Jhora should display the data in the same (horizontal) system of coordinates. Adin __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4559 (20091030) __________The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.http://www.eset.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 31, 2009 Report Share Posted October 31, 2009 Dear Marie-Christine, My obeisances! Thank you for your suggestion, Stellarium is indeed a great supplement to Jhora, in a way that astronomical knowledge is a complement of today's astrology. The issue we discuss isn't merely a technical issue. We, modern astrologers, have a very little knowledge of astrology in comparison to the vast knowledge possessed by Sages of the past. Sage Parashara, author of astrological magnum opus Brihad Parashara Hora Sastra,has described a reality by using his vast knowledge, divine intuition and night sky which he saw in... horizontal coordinates. If somebody insists that Risi Parashara described various astrological combinations by using ecliptical system of coordinates, I would ask this person to point out the particular sloka in Parashara's BPHS in which Parashara confirms his use of ecliptical system of coordinates. In absence of this sloka and agreeing that 5000 years ago the sky was seen in the same (horizontal) system of coordinates as today, we cannot but arrive at a disturbing conclusion that an ecliptical system of coordinates used by Jhora today, wasn't used by Risi Parashara. Hence, an employment of ecliptical system of coordinates, not used by Jyotish Acarias of the past is a deviation from Jyotish and Vedic authority. Thus, Jhora's use of this system of coordinates brings Vedic astrology a step further to the realm of maya vidya, modern illusory pseudo-science. Best Regards, Adin jhora , " Marie-Christine Sclifet " <mcsclifet wrote: > > Dear Adin, > > > > JHora is an astrological software and we, astrologers, use it for > astrological calculations (in ecliptic coordinates). > > > > I think that horizontal coordinates are not necessary for astrological > purpose. For that, you can use Stellarium, a free astronomical software. > > > > Best regards, > > Marie-Christine > > > > De : jhora [jhora ] De la part de > adinshi > Envoyé : vendredi 30 octobre 2009 20:44 > À : jhora > Objet : Re: Suspected problem with Jhora 7.02 > > > > Dear Marie-CHristine, > > Thank you for an informative reply. > This Stellarium software is amazing. > > Now I understand that there is no problem with Jhora, or more precisely, > with the way Jhora does its calculations. > > Still, I think that there is a problem with the way Jhora displays data in > its user interface. > Behind the scenes Jhora may employ whatever system of coordinates it likes, > but since we, users, see the sky in horizontal coordinates, Jhora should > display the data in the same (horizontal) system of coordinates. > > Adin > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 31, 2009 Report Share Posted October 31, 2009 Namaste Adin, > Sage Parashara, author of astrological magnum opus Brihad Parashara > Hora Sastra, has described a reality using his vast knowledge, divine > intuition and night sky which he saw in... horizontal coordinates. > > If somebody insists that Risi Parashara described various astrological > combinations by using ecliptical system of coordinates, I would ask > this person to point out the particular sloka in Parashara's BPHS in > which Parashara confirms his use of ecliptical system of coordinates. Actually, the onus is on you to point out the particular sloka in BPHS in which Parashara confirms his use of " horizontal coordinates " , as you are questioning what was used by generations of astrologers. Best regards, Narasimha Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/homam Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/tarpana Spirituality: Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.net Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.org Jyotish writings: JyotishWritings Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org ---- adinshi <adinshi wrote: > > Dear Marie-Christine, > My obeisances! > > Thank you for your suggestion, > Stellarium is indeed a great supplement to Jhora, > in a way that astronomical knowledge is complement of today's astrology. > > The issue we discuss isn't merely a technical issue. > We, modern astrologers, have a very little knoledge of astrology in comparison to the vast knowledge possessed by Sages of the past. > > Sage Parashara, author of astrological magnum opus Brihad Parashara Hora Sastra, has described a reality using his vast knowledge, divine intuition and night sky which he saw in... horizontal coordinates. > > If somebody insists that Risi Parashara described various astrological combinations by using ecliptical system of coordinates, I would ask this person to point out the particular sloka in Parashara's BPHS in which Parashara confirms his use of ecliptical system of coordinates. > > In absence of this sloka and agreeing that 5000 years ago the sky was seen in the same (horizontal) system of coordinates as today, we cannot but arrive at a disturbing conclusion that an ecliptical system of coordinates used by Jhora today, wasn't used by Risi Parashara. > > Hence, an employment of ecliptical system of coordinates, not used by Jyotish Acarias of the past is a deviation from Jyotish and Vedic authority. > > Thus, Jhora's use of this system of coordinates brings Vedic astrology a step further to the realm of maya vidya, modern illusory pseudo-science. > > Best Regards, > Adin > > jhora , " Marie-Christine Sclifet " <mcsclifet wrote: > > > > Dear Adin, > > > > JHora is an astrological software and we, astrologers, use it for > > astrological calculations (in ecliptic coordinates). > > > > I think that horizontal coordinates are not necessary for astrological > > purpose. For that, you can use Stellarium, a free astronomical software. > > > > Best regards, > > > > Marie-Christine > > > > De : jhora [jhora ] De la part de > > adinshi > > Envoyé : vendredi 30 octobre 2009 20:44 > > À : jhora > > Objet : Re: Suspected problem with Jhora 7.02 > > > > > > > > Dear Marie-CHristine, > > > > Thank you for an informative reply. > > This Stellarium software is amazing. > > > > Now I understand that there is no problem with Jhora, or more precisely, > > with the way Jhora does its calculations. > > > > Still, I think that there is a problem with the way Jhora displays data in > > its user interface. > > Behind the scenes Jhora may employ whatever system of coordinates it likes, > > but since we, users, see the sky in horizontal coordinates, Jhora should > > display the data in the same (horizontal) system of coordinates. > > > > Adin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 1, 2009 Report Share Posted November 1, 2009 Dear Adin, May I suggest to read some books of astronomy, the path of the Moon in the nakshatras, the path on the Sun on the ecliptic, the path of the planets in a band around the ecliptic (where are the signs and the nakshatras), and the Surya siddhanta and others Siddhantas. Jyotish consists in both astrology and astronomy. Before reading a classic of astrology, we would we be aware of a little astronomy (*) before interpreting planetary positions. Astrologers in the past were astronomers too, unfortunately, it's not the case today. (*) Varaha Mihira advised to read his Pancasiddhantika on the Basis of the Surya siddhanta (astronomy) for understanding the planetary calculations. Best regards. Marie-Christine > -----Message d'origine----- > De : jhora [jhora ] De la part de > adinshi > Envoyé : samedi 31 octobre 2009 12:54 > À : jhora > Objet : Re: Suspected problem with Jhora 7.02 > > > > > Dear Marie-Christine, > My obeisances! > > Thank you for your suggestion, > Stellarium is indeed a great supplement to Jhora, > in a way that astronomical knowledge is complement of today's > astrology. > > The issue we discuss isn't merely a technical issue. > We, modern astrologers, have a very little knoledge of astrology in > comparison to the vast knowledge possessed by Sages of the past. > > Sage Parashara, author of astrological magnum opus Brihad Parashara > Hora Sastra, has described a reality using his vast knowledge, divine > intuition and night sky which he saw in... horizontal coordinates. > > If somebody insists that Risi Parashara described various astrological > combinations by using ecliptical system of coordinates, I would ask > this person to point out the particular sloka in Parashara's BPHS in > which Parashara confirms his use of ecliptical system of coordinates. > > In absence of this sloka and agreeing that 5000 years ago the sky was > seen in the same (horizontal) system of coordinates as today, we cannot > but arrive at a disturbing conclusion that an ecliptical system of > coordinates used by Jhora today, wasn't used by Risi Parashara. > > Hence, an employment of ecliptical system of coordinates, not used by > Jyotish Acarias of the past is a deviation from Jyotish and Vedic > authority. > > Thus, Jhora's use of this system of coordinates brings Vedic astrology > a step further to the realm of maya vidya, modern illusory pseudo- > science. > > Best Regards, > Adin __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4562 (20091101) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 1, 2009 Report Share Posted November 1, 2009 Dear Narasimha Rao ji, First of all, I would like to express my appreciation of the time, energy and other resources you have been investing in creating and maintaining Jhora, which is indeed an impressive astrological software. You also distribute it free of charge which is quite uncommon in our days. You wrote: " Actually, the onus is on you to point out the particular sloka in BPHS in which Parashara confirms his use of " horizontal coordinates " , as you are questioning what was used by generations of astrologers. " As you correctly mentioned, I am questioning what [system of coordinates] was used by generations of astrologers. If you decide to answer my question, it would be good if you corroborate your answer with an appropriate citations from Jyotish Sastras. If you decide not to answer my question, no problem, it's as good as well. Had Jhora been another Western astro-software I haven't been bothering you with all that. But Jhora is a Vedic Astrology Jyotish Software as you mentioned on the screen displayed for a moment during Jhora's loading. If Jhora is a " Vedic " Jyotish Software, which part of Vedas you consulted prior to deciding in favor of employing an ecliptical system of coordinates? Best wishes, Adin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 1, 2009 Report Share Posted November 1, 2009 Dear Marie-Christine, Bonjour, Thank you for this extensive bibliography list. How many books... You have read all of them? Adin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 1, 2009 Report Share Posted November 1, 2009 Hi All! The purpose of astrology and astronomy is not just to mathematically locate the planets in specific places in the sky, but to predict the future using the model -- ecliptic or otherwise. The proof of the pudding is not just in making but in eating. So also the importance of astrology is in the accuracy of correct and incorrect predictions -- some what like what doctors do for the efficacy of medications. Professional astrologers are most willing to say how correct were individual predictions without any reference to how many times their predictions were wrong and why. This will give a fascinating insight into astrology. -- Vis Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 1, 2009 Report Share Posted November 1, 2009 Dear Adin, I'm trying to help you... but I don't have time for explaining everything. In the Surya siddhanta, you will see that the celestial coordinates for stars and planets are in polar longitudes and latitudes coordinates (i.e. on the ecliptic). See SS chp 1, 2, 7, 8 Extracts: SS 1-27 : bhagana means that revolution (of the planets) through the signs up to the end of(...) Revati. SS 1-58 : the place of Moon's apogee (etc.) is in a amount of signs (of the ecliptic) SS 1-68 The Moon's deflection to the N & S from the end of the declination of her corresponding point at the Ecliptic (8)... SS 2-28. The (mean) declination (of a planet or the declination point found by computation from its corresponding point in the ecliptic) increased or diminished... (...) SS 7-6 : thus the places of the planets on the ecliptic... If you want a reference in the BPHS, see the calculation for the planetary positions (and lagna) : BPHS 5/7-8 : ...the figure so arrived at will give us the position of the Moon in Signs, degrees, minutes and seconds (on the ecliptic). Best regards, Marie-Christine > -----Message d'origine----- > De : jhora [jhora ] De la part de > adinshi > Envoyé : dimanche 1 novembre 2009 18:33 > À : jhora > Objet : Re: Suspected problem with Jhora 7.02 > > Dear Marie-Christine, > Bonjour, > > Thank you for this extensive bibliography list. > How many books... > You have read all of them? > > Adin __________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4563 (20091101) __________ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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