Guest guest Posted October 2, 2009 Report Share Posted October 2, 2009 Guruji, This refferance is only in the context that the planet which is exalted in any house gets deblitated in its 7th house. In lalkitab the aspect of 1 to 6 to 7 to 12 are considered. Exception of 2nd house where 8th house aspects 2nd. Saturn in 6 can aspect 2nd. Sun and Moon cast aspect upon 5th from 9th. Saturn in 10 and mercury in 12 have special aspects. The detailed explanation of planets in various houses proves this principle. It would be very kind of you if you can quote any planet which gets affected by the reverse aspect. Then this topic will be resolved beyond doubt. Regards . Kulbir On 10/3/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya < wrote: > > Dear Kulbir ji, > > > > > > The aam halat drishti is also known as ‘apne se satve ko > dekhana’. This is a universally accepted drishti in all paddhatis > of astrology world over. > > > > Now let me quote the relevant passage from the Lal Kitab for this: > > > > 100 feesadi aur apane se baad ke satve ko dekhane ka farq > > > > 100 feesadi wala khana apane se baad ke khane mein doodh mein khaand > ki tarah apana asar aise ka vaisa hi mila deta hai / magar apane se > saatve wala apane se baad ke ghar ke asar ko ulta kar deta hai / goya > doodh ka bartan hi zahreela kar diya hai / dono halaton mein drishti ka > asar to 100 feesadi hota hai [ page 107 ; 1952 urdu edition] > > > > { the original urdu passage has been uploaded} > > > > It means that the Kendra houses, 1,4,7 and 10 [ known as 100feesadi wale > khane] have an aspect which assimilates like sugar in the milk. The rest > of the houses fall under the category of ‘apane se baad ke satve > ghar’. The drishti in both the cases is 100 %. > > > > I was talking of the apane se baad ka satvan ghar drishti when trying to > understand the sun/saturn placements in 6/12 houses. > > > > Three uploads: > > > > [a] Page 107 quoted above > > > > As desired by you the page showing diagram ‘ aam halat number > 1’ with transliteration has also been uploaded.[ page 102; 1952 > urdu edition] > > > > [c] Another table showing the Aam halat drishti has also been uploaded.[ > page 112; 1952 urdu edition] > > > > God bless you, > > > > Bhooshan Priya > > > > > > , kulbir bance > <kulbirbance wrote: >> >> Guruji, >> >> >> Kindly have a look at diagram under topic Grah Drishti, Aam >> haalat no.1 the arrow from 6th to 12th is there but no arrow from 12 >> to 6th. 2ndly a table is there which has 2 columns 1st the house from >> which arrow starts and 2nd where it ends. Here also 6 - 12 is there >> but no 12 - 6. Next Ulte ghar (aam haalat no. 2) explains the whole >> case in detail. The table you are quoting shows direct and reverse >> aspect on every house in 1-7 position. That too 100%. Secondly the >> concept of percentage/quantum is not explained thirdly aspecting >> example of saturn and sun in 6-12 explains it beyond doubt. Kindly >> upload the Grah drishti aam haalat no.1 diagram alongwith >> transliteration and ulte ghar aam haalat no.2 and grahon ki baham >> drishti v rashiyon se talook also. >> >> Regards. >> >> Kulbir. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On 10/2/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya wrote: >> > >> > Dear Kulbir ji, >> > >> > >> > >> > I too believed in this axiom till I saw the drishti diagram on page > 115 >> > of the 1952 urdu edition. In the diagram for aam haalat [ under > normal >> > circumstances] it is shown that the 6th aspects the 12th and > similarly >> > the 12th also aspects the 6th. The page has been uploaded in the > file >> > section for you to see. I am also providing the transliteration of > the >> > urdu script. >> > >> > Have a look at the diagram. >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > Aam Haalat >> > >> > >> > >> > is halat mein baithe huye grahon ki vahi drishti vagairah ki halat > hogi >> > jo ki aam halat mein hua karti hai; yani 1,7,4,10 ya 5,9,3,11 > vagairah >> > vagairah. Ab vahami dosti dushmani ka usool qayam rahega. >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > God bless you. >> > >> > >> > >> > Bhooshan Priya >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > , kulbir bance >> > kulbirbance@ wrote: >> >> >> >> Guruji, >> >> >> >> the book says '' chatta 12 ko dekhta hai magar 12 van chatte >> >> me apna asar nahin daal sakta sivaye khanna no. 12 ke budh ke''. So >> >> how can sun of 12 cast aspect upon saturn in 6th. >> >> >> >> regards. >> >> >> >> Kulbir >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On 10/2/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya @ wrote: >> >> > Dear Kulbir ji, >> >> > >> >> > In this context the karkatwa remains the same i.e. grahasth sukh > for >> > both >> >> > the situations and the results differ. >> >> > >> >> > Going deeper into the analysis, may be just loud thinking on my >> > part, but >> >> > then this is how inquisitive research proceeds. >> >> > >> >> > Sun [venus+mercury] from the 6th aspecting Saturn [venus+Jupiter] > in >> > the >> >> > 12th. >> >> > >> >> > The venus component will be aspecting its exaltation house and > hence >> > should >> >> > have a positive aspect [ Ref: page 109 line # 17 onwards; 1952 > urdu >> > ed] on >> >> > its friend Saturn in the house representing ‘shayya >> > sukh’. This aspect >> >> > of venus component on Saturn [which includes a venus component in >> > the house >> >> > of exaltation] should not harm the significations of Venus; but > as >> > the >> >> > result shows, it does. >> >> > >> >> > Where as in the reverse situation, sun in the 12th aspecting > Saturn >> > in the >> >> > 6th, for the same karkatwa i.e. grahasth sukh the same venus >> > component of >> >> > the sun will be aspecting its house of debility and could > possibly >> > adversely >> >> > affect the Saturn; but as the result shows, it doesn’t. >> >> > >> >> > Although the book does accept that the venus will be >> > ‘raddi’, probably >> >> > because the venus component of the sun will aspect into debility >> > onto the >> >> > venus component of Saturn which itself will be in the house of >> > debility. >> >> > >> >> > May be I am trying to read a bit too much into it, which I >> > shouldn’t be >> >> > doing. Sorry to have bothered you all with my wild musings. I am > so >> > deeply >> >> > involved in the book that I possibly couldn’t help. >> >> > >> >> > God bless you, >> >> > >> >> > Bhooshan Priya >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > , kulbir bance >> > kulbirbance@ >> >> > wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> Guruji, >> >> >> >> >> >> The aspect is from 6th to 12th. End results are expected in >> >> >> 12th. Both houses have different nature regarding ownership, >> >> >> exaltation, deblitation, place in kaal purash kundali, > karakakatwas >> >> >> items, so it is but natural that combination resulting from 1/4 >> > aspect >> >> >> of sun of 6th house and saturn in 12th house will be different > from >> >> >> combination of 1/4aspect of saturn of 6th and sun in 12th. >> >> >> >> >> >> Regards . >> >> >> >> >> >> Kulbir. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On 10/2/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya @ wrote: >> >> >> > Dear Kulbir ji, >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Yes, that sounds logical and makes sense. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > It is a well accepted axiom of the Lal Kitab that when the Sun >> > aspects >> >> >> > saturn it is the significations of Venus which get adversely >> > affected >> >> >> > [scapegoat concept]. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > The dichotomy arose because whether the sun is placed in the > 6th >> > and >> >> >> > aspects >> >> >> > the Saturn in the 12th, or the sun placed in the 12th and > aspects >> > the >> >> >> > saturn >> >> >> > in the 6th, the results should have been similar. If the > results >> > get >> >> >> > modified then why? >> >> >> > >> >> >> > God bless you, >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Bhooshan Priya >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > , kulbir bance >> > <kulbirbance@> >> >> >> > wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Guruji, >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> 1941 page 172 says that by defult saturn in 12th house grants >> >> >> >> immunity from rahu ketu and mercury, the matrimonial bliss is >> >> >> >> exclusively subject to quantum of darkness of saturn. Sun in > 6th >> >> >> >> reduces the darkness of Saturn. This could be one of possible >> > reasons. >> >> >> >> 2ndly for saturn in 6th house page 163 has that the presence > of >> > sun in >> >> >> >> 12th; saturn comes under pledge that it will cause no adverse >> > effects. >> >> >> >> 3rdly House no 6 has 1/4th aspect on house no 12. 1/4th > darkness >> > in >> >> >> >> fact helps sun with its relation with venus ref. Page 89 trik >> > bhavon >> >> >> >> ki gatha- the native with sun in 12 should have a spouse that >> > has >> >> >> >> least traits of saturn. but this very 1/4 light of sun from > 6th >> > to 12 >> >> >> >> th can cause serious trouble for saturn in 12th thereby > damaging >> >> >> >> results of venus. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Regards. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Kulbir >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On 9/30/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya <@> wrote: >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > Dear Lal Kitab Scholars, >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > [ Pt. Umesh Sharma ji, Vipin Shukla ji, Kulbir ji , Mahajan >> > ji, S >> >> >> >> > Leekha >> >> >> >> > ji, Kapatjal ji, Anand jotish ji,] >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > Could you please help me understand the following > dichotomy? >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > If the Sun is placed in the 6th house and the Saturn is > placed >> > in the >> >> >> >> > 12th house the book says: page 334 ;note # 4; 1952 urdu >> > edition >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > “ stree bhaag aur khud stree barbad ho�� >> > [shanishchar # 12 >> >> >> >> > ] >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > Where as if the Sun is placed in the 12th and the Saturn in >> > the 6th >> >> >> >> > the >> >> >> >> > book says : page 355 ; 1952 urdu edition >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > “ ab shukra { grahast stree}barbad na hoga balki > shukra >> > raddi >> >> >> >> > hote huye bhi nek aur uttam phal dega�� [ > shanishchar # >> > 6 ] >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > Therefore: >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > [a] Why should this combination affect, either way, > grahasth >> > and >> >> >> >> > stree? >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > What could be the logic for this reversal of results > when >> > the same >> >> >> >> > two planets, sun and Saturn, are involved? >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > [c] In either case the two planets will be associated > through >> > aspect, >> >> >> >> > and still give different results for the same area of life >> > i.e. >> >> >> >> > grahast >> >> >> >> > and stree. Why? >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > With respect to you all >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > Bhooshan Priya >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 3, 2009 Report Share Posted October 3, 2009 Dear Kulbir ji, You have said: This reference is only in the context that the planet whichis exalted in any house gets debilitated in its 7th house. Then wouldn’t you consider venus exalted in the 12th house aspecting the 6th house of its debility. If yes, then wouldn’t it be an example of reverse aspect? How about Mars, exalted in the 10th and debilitated in the 4th, or the Jupiter the other way round. This axiom will be true for all planets only if the reverse aspect is also taken into consideration. Now, as you have asked, I quote an example of reverse aspect from the 1952 urdu edition: Page 952 ; 1952 urdu edition: Khana # 4 : Chandra ka ghar hai / is ghar ko khana 10 ke grah 100 feesadi nazar se dekhate hain / khana 10 ka brahaspati nek nazar rakhega / Now the Jupiter placed in the 10th is in debility house. The reverse aspect of the Jupiter on the 4th will be nek ‘ nek nazar rakhega’. This statement also breaks the myth that baad ke grah pahale gharon ko nahi dekhate. As per your own statement, I hope this topic is now “resolved beyond doubt.†God bless you Bhooshan Priya , kulbir bance <kulbirbance wrote:>> Guruji,> > This refferance is only in the context that the planet which> is exalted in any house gets deblitated in its 7th house. In> lalkitab the aspect of 1 to 6 to 7 to 12 are considered. Exception of> 2nd house where 8th house aspects 2nd. Saturn in 6 can aspect 2nd. Sun> and Moon cast aspect upon 5th from 9th. Saturn in 10 and mercury in 12> have special aspects. The detailed explanation of planets in various> houses proves this principle. It would be very kind of you if you can> quote any planet which gets affected by the reverse aspect. Then this> topic will be resolved beyond doubt.> > Regards .> > Kulbir> > > > > > > > > > On 10/3/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya wrote:> >> > Dear Kulbir ji,> >> >> >> >> >> > The aam halat drishti is also known as ‘apne se satve ko> > dekhana’. This is a universally accepted drishti in all paddhatis> > of astrology world over.> >> >> >> > Now let me quote the relevant passage from the Lal Kitab for this:> >> >> >> > 100 feesadi aur apane se baad ke satve ko dekhane ka farq> >> >> >> > 100 feesadi wala khana apane se baad ke khane mein doodh mein khaand> > ki tarah apana asar aise ka vaisa hi mila deta hai / magar apane se> > saatve wala apane se baad ke ghar ke asar ko ulta kar deta hai / goya> > doodh ka bartan hi zahreela kar diya hai / dono halaton mein drishti ka> > asar to 100 feesadi hota hai [ page 107 ; 1952 urdu edition]> >> >> >> > { the original urdu passage has been uploaded}> >> >> >> > It means that the Kendra houses, 1,4,7 and 10 [ known as 100feesadi wale> > khane] have an aspect which assimilates like sugar in the milk. The rest> > of the houses fall under the category of ‘apane se baad ke satve> > ghar’. The drishti in both the cases is 100 %.> >> >> >> > I was talking of the apane se baad ka satvan ghar drishti when trying to> > understand the sun/saturn placements in 6/12 houses.> >> >> >> > Three uploads:> >> >> >> > [a] Page 107 quoted above> >> >> >> > As desired by you the page showing diagram ‘ aam halat number> > 1’ with transliteration has also been uploaded.[ page 102; 1952> > urdu edition]> >> >> >> > [c] Another table showing the Aam halat drishti has also been uploaded.[> > page 112; 1952 urdu edition]> >> >> >> > God bless you,> >> >> >> > Bhooshan Priya> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > , kulbir bance> > kulbirbance@ wrote:> >>> >> Guruji,> >>> >>> >> Kindly have a look at diagram under topic Grah Drishti, Aam> >> haalat no.1 the arrow from 6th to 12th is there but no arrow from 12> >> to 6th. 2ndly a table is there which has 2 columns 1st the house from> >> which arrow starts and 2nd where it ends. Here also 6 - 12 is there> >> but no 12 - 6. Next Ulte ghar (aam haalat no. 2) explains the whole> >> case in detail. The table you are quoting shows direct and reverse> >> aspect on every house in 1-7 position. That too 100%. Secondly the> >> concept of percentage/quantum is not explained thirdly aspecting> >> example of saturn and sun in 6-12 explains it beyond doubt. Kindly> >> upload the Grah drishti aam haalat no.1 diagram alongwith> >> transliteration and ulte ghar aam haalat no.2 and grahon ki baham> >> drishti v rashiyon se talook also.> >>> >> Regards.> >>> >> Kulbir.> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> On 10/2/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya @ wrote:> >> >> >> > Dear Kulbir ji,> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > I too believed in this axiom till I saw the drishti diagram on page> > 115> >> > of the 1952 urdu edition. In the diagram for aam haalat [ under> > normal> >> > circumstances] it is shown that the 6th aspects the 12th and> > similarly> >> > the 12th also aspects the 6th. The page has been uploaded in the> > file> >> > section for you to see. I am also providing the transliteration of> > the> >> > urdu script.> >> >> >> > Have a look at the diagram.> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Aam Haalat> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > is halat mein baithe huye grahon ki vahi drishti vagairah ki halat> > hogi> >> > jo ki aam halat mein hua karti hai; yani 1,7,4,10 ya 5,9,3,11> > vagairah> >> > vagairah. Ab vahami dosti dushmani ka usool qayam rahega.> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > God bless you.> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Bhooshan Priya> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > , kulbir bance> >> > kulbirbance@ wrote:> >> >>> >> >> Guruji,> >> >>> >> >> the book says '' chatta 12 ko dekhta hai magar 12 van chatte> >> >> me apna asar nahin daal sakta sivaye khanna no. 12 ke budh ke''. So> >> >> how can sun of 12 cast aspect upon saturn in 6th.> >> >>> >> >> regards.> >> >>> >> >> Kulbir> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >> >> On 10/2/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya @ wrote:> >> >> > Dear Kulbir ji,> >> >> >> >> >> > In this context the karkatwa remains the same i.e. grahasth sukh> > for> >> > both> >> >> > the situations and the results differ.> >> >> >> >> >> > Going deeper into the analysis, may be just loud thinking on my> >> > part, but> >> >> > then this is how inquisitive research proceeds.> >> >> >> >> >> > Sun [venus+mercury] from the 6th aspecting Saturn [venus+Jupiter]> > in> >> > the> >> >> > 12th.> >> >> >> >> >> > The venus component will be aspecting its exaltation house and> > hence> >> > should> >> >> > have a positive aspect [ Ref: page 109 line # 17 onwards; 1952> > urdu> >> > ed] on> >> >> > its friend Saturn in the house representing ‘shayya> >> > sukh’. This aspect> >> >> > of venus component on Saturn [which includes a venus component in> >> > the house> >> >> > of exaltation] should not harm the significations of Venus; but> > as> >> > the> >> >> > result shows, it does.> >> >> >> >> >> > Where as in the reverse situation, sun in the 12th aspecting> > Saturn> >> > in the> >> >> > 6th, for the same karkatwa i.e. grahasth sukh the same venus> >> > component of> >> >> > the sun will be aspecting its house of debility and could> > possibly> >> > adversely> >> >> > affect the Saturn; but as the result shows, it doesn’t.> >> >> >> >> >> > Although the book does accept that the venus will be> >> > ‘raddi’, probably> >> >> > because the venus component of the sun will aspect into debility> >> > onto the> >> >> > venus component of Saturn which itself will be in the house of> >> > debility.> >> >> >> >> >> > May be I am trying to read a bit too much into it, which I> >> > shouldn’t be> >> >> > doing. Sorry to have bothered you all with my wild musings. I am> > so> >> > deeply> >> >> > involved in the book that I possibly couldn’t help.> >> >> >> >> >> > God bless you,> >> >> >> >> >> > Bhooshan Priya> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > , kulbir bance> >> > kulbirbance@> >> >> > wrote:> >> >> >>> >> >> >> Guruji,> >> >> >>> >> >> >> The aspect is from 6th to 12th. End results are expected in> >> >> >> 12th. Both houses have different nature regarding ownership,> >> >> >> exaltation, deblitation, place in kaal purash kundali,> > karakakatwas> >> >> >> items, so it is but natural that combination resulting from 1/4> >> > aspect> >> >> >> of sun of 6th house and saturn in 12th house will be different> > from> >> >> >> combination of 1/4aspect of saturn of 6th and sun in 12th.> >> >> >>> >> >> >> Regards .> >> >> >>> >> >> >> Kulbir.> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >>> >> >> >> On 10/2/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya @ wrote:> >> >> >> > Dear Kulbir ji,> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Yes, that sounds logical and makes sense.> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > It is a well accepted axiom of the Lal Kitab that when the Sun> >> > aspects> >> >> >> > saturn it is the significations of Venus which get adversely> >> > affected> >> >> >> > [scapegoat concept].> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > The dichotomy arose because whether the sun is placed in the> > 6th> >> > and> >> >> >> > aspects> >> >> >> > the Saturn in the 12th, or the sun placed in the 12th and> > aspects> >> > the> >> >> >> > saturn> >> >> >> > in the 6th, the results should have been similar. If the> > results> >> > get> >> >> >> > modified then why?> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > God bless you,> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Bhooshan Priya> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > , kulbir bance> >> > <kulbirbance@>> >> >> >> > wrote:> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >> Guruji,> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >> 1941 page 172 says that by defult saturn in 12th house grants> >> >> >> >> immunity from rahu ketu and mercury, the matrimonial bliss is> >> >> >> >> exclusively subject to quantum of darkness of saturn. Sun in> > 6th> >> >> >> >> reduces the darkness of Saturn. This could be one of possible> >> > reasons.> >> >> >> >> 2ndly for saturn in 6th house page 163 has that the presence> > of> >> > sun in> >> >> >> >> 12th; saturn comes under pledge that it will cause no adverse> >> > effects.> >> >> >> >> 3rdly House no 6 has 1/4th aspect on house no 12. 1/4th> > darkness> >> > in> >> >> >> >> fact helps sun with its relation with venus ref. Page 89 trik> >> > bhavon> >> >> >> >> ki gatha- the native with sun in 12 should have a spouse that> >> > has> >> >> >> >> least traits of saturn. but this very 1/4 light of sun from> > 6th> >> > to 12> >> >> >> >> th can cause serious trouble for saturn in 12th thereby> > damaging> >> >> >> >> results of venus.> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >> Regards.> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >> Kulbir> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >> On 9/30/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya <@> wrote:> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Dear Lal Kitab Scholars,> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > [ Pt. Umesh Sharma ji, Vipin Shukla ji, Kulbir ji , Mahajan> >> > ji, S> >> >> >> >> > Leekha> >> >> >> >> > ji, Kapatjal ji, Anand jotish ji,]> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Could you please help me understand the following> > dichotomy?> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > If the Sun is placed in the 6th house and the Saturn is> > placed> >> > in the> >> >> >> >> > 12th house the book says: page 334 ;note # 4; 1952 urdu> >> > edition> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > “ stree bhaag aur khud stree barbad ho��> >> > [shanishchar # 12> >> >> >> >> > ]> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Where as if the Sun is placed in the 12th and the Saturn in> >> > the 6th> >> >> >> >> > the> >> >> >> >> > book says : page 355 ; 1952 urdu edition> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > “ ab shukra { grahast stree}barbad na hoga balki> > shukra> >> > raddi> >> >> >> >> > hote huye bhi nek aur uttam phal dega�� [> > shanishchar #> >> > 6 ]> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Therefore:> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > [a] Why should this combination affect, either way,> > grahasth> >> > and> >> >> >> >> > stree?> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > What could be the logic for this reversal of results> > when> >> > the same> >> >> >> >> > two planets, sun and Saturn, are involved?> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > [c] In either case the two planets will be associated> > through> >> > aspect,> >> >> >> >> > and still give different results for the same area of life> >> > i.e.> >> >> >> >> > grahast> >> >> >> >> > and stree. Why?> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > With respect to you all> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Bhooshan Priya> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> >>> >> >> >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 3, 2009 Report Share Posted October 3, 2009 Guruji, Thanks for taking out that much time for this topic. I have learnt some valuable leads regarding aspects, which otherwise would have remained unnoticed. Regards. Kulbir On 10/3/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya < wrote: > > Dear Kulbir ji, > > > > You have said: > > > > This reference is only in the context that the planet which > is exalted in any house gets debilitated in its 7th house. > > > > Then wouldn’t you consider venus exalted in the 12th house > aspecting the 6th house of its debility. If yes, then wouldn’t it > be an example of reverse aspect? > > How about Mars, exalted in the 10th and debilitated in the 4th, or the > Jupiter the other way round. This axiom will be true for all planets > only if the reverse aspect is also taken into consideration. > > > > Now, as you have asked, I quote an example of reverse aspect from the > 1952 urdu edition: > > > > Page 952 ; 1952 urdu edition: > > > > Khana # 4 : Chandra ka ghar hai / is ghar ko khana 10 ke grah 100 > feesadi nazar se dekhate hain / khana 10 ka brahaspati nek nazar > rakhega / > > > > Now the Jupiter placed in the 10th is in debility house. The reverse > aspect of the Jupiter on the 4th will be nek ‘ nek nazar > rakhega’. This statement also breaks the myth that baad ke grah > pahale gharon ko nahi dekhate. > > > > As per your own statement, I hope this topic is now “resolved > beyond doubt.�� > > > > God bless you > > > > Bhooshan Priya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , kulbir bance > <kulbirbance wrote: >> >> Guruji, >> >> This refferance is only in the context that the planet which >> is exalted in any house gets deblitated in its 7th house. In >> lalkitab the aspect of 1 to 6 to 7 to 12 are considered. Exception of >> 2nd house where 8th house aspects 2nd. Saturn in 6 can aspect 2nd. Sun >> and Moon cast aspect upon 5th from 9th. Saturn in 10 and mercury in 12 >> have special aspects. The detailed explanation of planets in various >> houses proves this principle. It would be very kind of you if you can >> quote any planet which gets affected by the reverse aspect. Then this >> topic will be resolved beyond doubt. >> >> Regards . >> >> Kulbir >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On 10/3/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya wrote: >> > >> > Dear Kulbir ji, >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > The aam halat drishti is also known as ‘apne se satve ko >> > dekhana’. This is a universally accepted drishti in all > paddhatis >> > of astrology world over. >> > >> > >> > >> > Now let me quote the relevant passage from the Lal Kitab for this: >> > >> > >> > >> > 100 feesadi aur apane se baad ke satve ko dekhane ka farq >> > >> > >> > >> > 100 feesadi wala khana apane se baad ke khane mein doodh mein khaand >> > ki tarah apana asar aise ka vaisa hi mila deta hai / magar apane se >> > saatve wala apane se baad ke ghar ke asar ko ulta kar deta hai / > goya >> > doodh ka bartan hi zahreela kar diya hai / dono halaton mein drishti > ka >> > asar to 100 feesadi hota hai [ page 107 ; 1952 urdu edition] >> > >> > >> > >> > { the original urdu passage has been uploaded} >> > >> > >> > >> > It means that the Kendra houses, 1,4,7 and 10 [ known as 100feesadi > wale >> > khane] have an aspect which assimilates like sugar in the milk. The > rest >> > of the houses fall under the category of ‘apane se baad ke > satve >> > ghar’. The drishti in both the cases is 100 %. >> > >> > >> > >> > I was talking of the apane se baad ka satvan ghar drishti when > trying to >> > understand the sun/saturn placements in 6/12 houses. >> > >> > >> > >> > Three uploads: >> > >> > >> > >> > [a] Page 107 quoted above >> > >> > >> > >> > As desired by you the page showing diagram ‘ aam halat > number >> > 1’ with transliteration has also been uploaded.[ page 102; > 1952 >> > urdu edition] >> > >> > >> > >> > [c] Another table showing the Aam halat drishti has also been > uploaded.[ >> > page 112; 1952 urdu edition] >> > >> > >> > >> > God bless you, >> > >> > >> > >> > Bhooshan Priya >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > , kulbir bance >> > kulbirbance@ wrote: >> >> >> >> Guruji, >> >> >> >> >> >> Kindly have a look at diagram under topic Grah Drishti, Aam >> >> haalat no.1 the arrow from 6th to 12th is there but no arrow from > 12 >> >> to 6th. 2ndly a table is there which has 2 columns 1st the house > from >> >> which arrow starts and 2nd where it ends. Here also 6 - 12 is there >> >> but no 12 - 6. Next Ulte ghar (aam haalat no. 2) explains the whole >> >> case in detail. The table you are quoting shows direct and reverse >> >> aspect on every house in 1-7 position. That too 100%. Secondly the >> >> concept of percentage/quantum is not explained thirdly aspecting >> >> example of saturn and sun in 6-12 explains it beyond doubt. Kindly >> >> upload the Grah drishti aam haalat no.1 diagram alongwith >> >> transliteration and ulte ghar aam haalat no.2 and grahon ki baham >> >> drishti v rashiyon se talook also. >> >> >> >> Regards. >> >> >> >> Kulbir. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On 10/2/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya @ wrote: >> >> > >> >> > Dear Kulbir ji, >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > I too believed in this axiom till I saw the drishti diagram on > page >> > 115 >> >> > of the 1952 urdu edition. In the diagram for aam haalat [ under >> > normal >> >> > circumstances] it is shown that the 6th aspects the 12th and >> > similarly >> >> > the 12th also aspects the 6th. The page has been uploaded in the >> > file >> >> > section for you to see. I am also providing the transliteration > of >> > the >> >> > urdu script. >> >> > >> >> > Have a look at the diagram. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > Aam Haalat >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > is halat mein baithe huye grahon ki vahi drishti vagairah ki > halat >> > hogi >> >> > jo ki aam halat mein hua karti hai; yani 1,7,4,10 ya 5,9,3,11 >> > vagairah >> >> > vagairah. Ab vahami dosti dushmani ka usool qayam rahega. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > God bless you. >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > Bhooshan Priya >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > , kulbir bance >> >> > kulbirbance@ wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> Guruji, >> >> >> >> >> >> the book says '' chatta 12 ko dekhta hai magar 12 van chatte >> >> >> me apna asar nahin daal sakta sivaye khanna no. 12 ke budh ke''. > So >> >> >> how can sun of 12 cast aspect upon saturn in 6th. >> >> >> >> >> >> regards. >> >> >> >> >> >> Kulbir >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On 10/2/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya @ wrote: >> >> >> > Dear Kulbir ji, >> >> >> > >> >> >> > In this context the karkatwa remains the same i.e. grahasth > sukh >> > for >> >> > both >> >> >> > the situations and the results differ. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Going deeper into the analysis, may be just loud thinking on > my >> >> > part, but >> >> >> > then this is how inquisitive research proceeds. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Sun [venus+mercury] from the 6th aspecting Saturn > [venus+Jupiter] >> > in >> >> > the >> >> >> > 12th. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > The venus component will be aspecting its exaltation house and >> > hence >> >> > should >> >> >> > have a positive aspect [ Ref: page 109 line # 17 onwards; 1952 >> > urdu >> >> > ed] on >> >> >> > its friend Saturn in the house representing ‘shayya >> >> > sukh’. This aspect >> >> >> > of venus component on Saturn [which includes a venus component > in >> >> > the house >> >> >> > of exaltation] should not harm the significations of Venus; > but >> > as >> >> > the >> >> >> > result shows, it does. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Where as in the reverse situation, sun in the 12th aspecting >> > Saturn >> >> > in the >> >> >> > 6th, for the same karkatwa i.e. grahasth sukh the same venus >> >> > component of >> >> >> > the sun will be aspecting its house of debility and could >> > possibly >> >> > adversely >> >> >> > affect the Saturn; but as the result shows, it doesn’t. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Although the book does accept that the venus will be >> >> > ‘raddi’, probably >> >> >> > because the venus component of the sun will aspect into > debility >> >> > onto the >> >> >> > venus component of Saturn which itself will be in the house of >> >> > debility. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > May be I am trying to read a bit too much into it, which I >> >> > shouldn’t be >> >> >> > doing. Sorry to have bothered you all with my wild musings. I > am >> > so >> >> > deeply >> >> >> > involved in the book that I possibly couldn’t help. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > God bless you, >> >> >> > >> >> >> > Bhooshan Priya >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > , kulbir bance >> >> > kulbirbance@ >> >> >> > wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Guruji, >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> The aspect is from 6th to 12th. End results are expected in >> >> >> >> 12th. Both houses have different nature regarding ownership, >> >> >> >> exaltation, deblitation, place in kaal purash kundali, >> > karakakatwas >> >> >> >> items, so it is but natural that combination resulting from > 1/4 >> >> > aspect >> >> >> >> of sun of 6th house and saturn in 12th house will be > different >> > from >> >> >> >> combination of 1/4aspect of saturn of 6th and sun in 12th. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Regards . >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Kulbir. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On 10/2/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya @ wrote: >> >> >> >> > Dear Kulbir ji, >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > Yes, that sounds logical and makes sense. >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > It is a well accepted axiom of the Lal Kitab that when the > Sun >> >> > aspects >> >> >> >> > saturn it is the significations of Venus which get > adversely >> >> > affected >> >> >> >> > [scapegoat concept]. >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > The dichotomy arose because whether the sun is placed in > the >> > 6th >> >> > and >> >> >> >> > aspects >> >> >> >> > the Saturn in the 12th, or the sun placed in the 12th and >> > aspects >> >> > the >> >> >> >> > saturn >> >> >> >> > in the 6th, the results should have been similar. If the >> > results >> >> > get >> >> >> >> > modified then why? >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > God bless you, >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > Bhooshan Priya >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > , kulbir bance >> >> > <kulbirbance@> >> >> >> >> > wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Guruji, >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> 1941 page 172 says that by defult saturn in 12th house > grants >> >> >> >> >> immunity from rahu ketu and mercury, the matrimonial bliss > is >> >> >> >> >> exclusively subject to quantum of darkness of saturn. Sun > in >> > 6th >> >> >> >> >> reduces the darkness of Saturn. This could be one of > possible >> >> > reasons. >> >> >> >> >> 2ndly for saturn in 6th house page 163 has that the > presence >> > of >> >> > sun in >> >> >> >> >> 12th; saturn comes under pledge that it will cause no > adverse >> >> > effects. >> >> >> >> >> 3rdly House no 6 has 1/4th aspect on house no 12. 1/4th >> > darkness >> >> > in >> >> >> >> >> fact helps sun with its relation with venus ref. Page 89 > trik >> >> > bhavon >> >> >> >> >> ki gatha- the native with sun in 12 should have a spouse > that >> >> > has >> >> >> >> >> least traits of saturn. but this very 1/4 light of sun > from >> > 6th >> >> > to 12 >> >> >> >> >> th can cause serious trouble for saturn in 12th thereby >> > damaging >> >> >> >> >> results of venus. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Regards. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Kulbir >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On 9/30/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya <@> > wrote: >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > Dear Lal Kitab Scholars, >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > [ Pt. Umesh Sharma ji, Vipin Shukla ji, Kulbir ji , > Mahajan >> >> > ji, S >> >> >> >> >> > Leekha >> >> >> >> >> > ji, Kapatjal ji, Anand jotish ji,] >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > Could you please help me understand the following >> > dichotomy? >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > If the Sun is placed in the 6th house and the Saturn is >> > placed >> >> > in the >> >> >> >> >> > 12th house the book says: page 334 ;note # 4; 1952 urdu >> >> > edition >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > “ stree bhaag aur khud stree barbad ho�� >> >> > [shanishchar # 12 >> >> >> >> >> > ] >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > Where as if the Sun is placed in the 12th and the Saturn > in >> >> > the 6th >> >> >> >> >> > the >> >> >> >> >> > book says : page 355 ; 1952 urdu edition >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > “ ab shukra { grahast stree}barbad na hoga balki >> > shukra >> >> > raddi >> >> >> >> >> > hote huye bhi nek aur uttam phal dega�� [ >> > shanishchar # >> >> > 6 ] >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > Therefore: >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > [a] Why should this combination affect, either way, >> > grahasth >> >> > and >> >> >> >> >> > stree? >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > What could be the logic for this reversal of results >> > when >> >> > the same >> >> >> >> >> > two planets, sun and Saturn, are involved? >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > [c] In either case the two planets will be associated >> > through >> >> > aspect, >> >> >> >> >> > and still give different results for the same area of > life >> >> > i.e. >> >> >> >> >> > grahast >> >> >> >> >> > and stree. Why? >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > With respect to you all >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > Bhooshan Priya >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 3, 2009 Report Share Posted October 3, 2009 Dear Kulbir ji, You are always welcome to seek clarifications. I will try to answer them honestly and to the best of my ability. We as a group do not believe in hiding knowledge. For us it is a pilgrim's progress together. You, me and others, every one is in the journey to seek the Lal Kitab truth. God bless you Bhooshan Priya , kulbir bance <kulbirbance wrote: > > Guruji, > > Thanks for taking out that much time for this topic. I have > learnt some valuable leads regarding aspects, which otherwise would > have remained unnoticed. > > Regards. > > Kulbir > > > > > On 10/3/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya < wrote: > > > > Dear Kulbir ji, > > > > > > > > You have said: > > > > > > > > This reference is only in the context that the planet which > > is exalted in any house gets debilitated in its 7th house. > > > > > > > > Then wouldn’t you consider venus exalted in the 12th house > > aspecting the 6th house of its debility. If yes, then wouldn’t it > > be an example of reverse aspect? > > > > How about Mars, exalted in the 10th and debilitated in the 4th, or the > > Jupiter the other way round. This axiom will be true for all planets > > only if the reverse aspect is also taken into consideration. > > > > > > > > Now, as you have asked, I quote an example of reverse aspect from the > > 1952 urdu edition: > > > > > > > > Page 952 ; 1952 urdu edition: > > > > > > > > Khana # 4 : Chandra ka ghar hai / is ghar ko khana 10 ke grah 100 > > feesadi nazar se dekhate hain / khana 10 ka brahaspati nek nazar > > rakhega / > > > > > > > > Now the Jupiter placed in the 10th is in debility house. The reverse > > aspect of the Jupiter on the 4th will be nek ‘ nek nazar > > rakhega’. This statement also breaks the myth that baad ke grah > > pahale gharon ko nahi dekhate. > > > > > > > > As per your own statement, I hope this topic is now “resolved > > beyond doubt.�� > > > > > > > > God bless you > > > > > > > > Bhooshan Priya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > , kulbir bance > > <kulbirbance@> wrote: > >> > >> Guruji, > >> > >> This refferance is only in the context that the planet which > >> is exalted in any house gets deblitated in its 7th house. In > >> lalkitab the aspect of 1 to 6 to 7 to 12 are considered. Exception of > >> 2nd house where 8th house aspects 2nd. Saturn in 6 can aspect 2nd. Sun > >> and Moon cast aspect upon 5th from 9th. Saturn in 10 and mercury in 12 > >> have special aspects. The detailed explanation of planets in various > >> houses proves this principle. It would be very kind of you if you can > >> quote any planet which gets affected by the reverse aspect. Then this > >> topic will be resolved beyond doubt. > >> > >> Regards . > >> > >> Kulbir > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> On 10/3/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya @ wrote: > >> > > >> > Dear Kulbir ji, > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > The aam halat drishti is also known as ‘apne se satve ko > >> > dekhana’. This is a universally accepted drishti in all > > paddhatis > >> > of astrology world over. > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > Now let me quote the relevant passage from the Lal Kitab for this: > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > 100 feesadi aur apane se baad ke satve ko dekhane ka farq > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > 100 feesadi wala khana apane se baad ke khane mein doodh mein khaand > >> > ki tarah apana asar aise ka vaisa hi mila deta hai / magar apane se > >> > saatve wala apane se baad ke ghar ke asar ko ulta kar deta hai / > > goya > >> > doodh ka bartan hi zahreela kar diya hai / dono halaton mein drishti > > ka > >> > asar to 100 feesadi hota hai [ page 107 ; 1952 urdu edition] > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > { the original urdu passage has been uploaded} > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > It means that the Kendra houses, 1,4,7 and 10 [ known as 100feesadi > > wale > >> > khane] have an aspect which assimilates like sugar in the milk. The > > rest > >> > of the houses fall under the category of ‘apane se baad ke > > satve > >> > ghar’. The drishti in both the cases is 100 %. > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > I was talking of the apane se baad ka satvan ghar drishti when > > trying to > >> > understand the sun/saturn placements in 6/12 houses. > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > Three uploads: > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > [a] Page 107 quoted above > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > As desired by you the page showing diagram ‘ aam halat > > number > >> > 1’ with transliteration has also been uploaded.[ page 102; > > 1952 > >> > urdu edition] > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > [c] Another table showing the Aam halat drishti has also been > > uploaded.[ > >> > page 112; 1952 urdu edition] > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > God bless you, > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > Bhooshan Priya > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > , kulbir bance > >> > kulbirbance@ wrote: > >> >> > >> >> Guruji, > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> Kindly have a look at diagram under topic Grah Drishti, Aam > >> >> haalat no.1 the arrow from 6th to 12th is there but no arrow from > > 12 > >> >> to 6th. 2ndly a table is there which has 2 columns 1st the house > > from > >> >> which arrow starts and 2nd where it ends. Here also 6 - 12 is there > >> >> but no 12 - 6. Next Ulte ghar (aam haalat no. 2) explains the whole > >> >> case in detail. The table you are quoting shows direct and reverse > >> >> aspect on every house in 1-7 position. That too 100%. Secondly the > >> >> concept of percentage/quantum is not explained thirdly aspecting > >> >> example of saturn and sun in 6-12 explains it beyond doubt. Kindly > >> >> upload the Grah drishti aam haalat no.1 diagram alongwith > >> >> transliteration and ulte ghar aam haalat no.2 and grahon ki baham > >> >> drishti v rashiyon se talook also. > >> >> > >> >> Regards. > >> >> > >> >> Kulbir. > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> > >> >> On 10/2/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya @ wrote: > >> >> > > >> >> > Dear Kulbir ji, > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > I too believed in this axiom till I saw the drishti diagram on > > page > >> > 115 > >> >> > of the 1952 urdu edition. In the diagram for aam haalat [ under > >> > normal > >> >> > circumstances] it is shown that the 6th aspects the 12th and > >> > similarly > >> >> > the 12th also aspects the 6th. The page has been uploaded in the > >> > file > >> >> > section for you to see. I am also providing the transliteration > > of > >> > the > >> >> > urdu script. > >> >> > > >> >> > Have a look at the diagram. > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > Aam Haalat > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > is halat mein baithe huye grahon ki vahi drishti vagairah ki > > halat > >> > hogi > >> >> > jo ki aam halat mein hua karti hai; yani 1,7,4,10 ya 5,9,3,11 > >> > vagairah > >> >> > vagairah. Ab vahami dosti dushmani ka usool qayam rahega. > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > God bless you. > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > Bhooshan Priya > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > , kulbir bance > >> >> > kulbirbance@ wrote: > >> >> >> > >> >> >> Guruji, > >> >> >> > >> >> >> the book says '' chatta 12 ko dekhta hai magar 12 van chatte > >> >> >> me apna asar nahin daal sakta sivaye khanna no. 12 ke budh ke''. > > So > >> >> >> how can sun of 12 cast aspect upon saturn in 6th. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> regards. > >> >> >> > >> >> >> Kulbir > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> > >> >> >> On 10/2/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya @ wrote: > >> >> >> > Dear Kulbir ji, > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > In this context the karkatwa remains the same i.e. grahasth > > sukh > >> > for > >> >> > both > >> >> >> > the situations and the results differ. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > Going deeper into the analysis, may be just loud thinking on > > my > >> >> > part, but > >> >> >> > then this is how inquisitive research proceeds. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > Sun [venus+mercury] from the 6th aspecting Saturn > > [venus+Jupiter] > >> > in > >> >> > the > >> >> >> > 12th. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > The venus component will be aspecting its exaltation house and > >> > hence > >> >> > should > >> >> >> > have a positive aspect [ Ref: page 109 line # 17 onwards; 1952 > >> > urdu > >> >> > ed] on > >> >> >> > its friend Saturn in the house representing ‘shayya > >> >> > sukh’. This aspect > >> >> >> > of venus component on Saturn [which includes a venus component > > in > >> >> > the house > >> >> >> > of exaltation] should not harm the significations of Venus; > > but > >> > as > >> >> > the > >> >> >> > result shows, it does. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > Where as in the reverse situation, sun in the 12th aspecting > >> > Saturn > >> >> > in the > >> >> >> > 6th, for the same karkatwa i.e. grahasth sukh the same venus > >> >> > component of > >> >> >> > the sun will be aspecting its house of debility and could > >> > possibly > >> >> > adversely > >> >> >> > affect the Saturn; but as the result shows, it doesn’t. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > Although the book does accept that the venus will be > >> >> > ‘raddi’, probably > >> >> >> > because the venus component of the sun will aspect into > > debility > >> >> > onto the > >> >> >> > venus component of Saturn which itself will be in the house of > >> >> > debility. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > May be I am trying to read a bit too much into it, which I > >> >> > shouldn’t be > >> >> >> > doing. Sorry to have bothered you all with my wild musings. I > > am > >> > so > >> >> > deeply > >> >> >> > involved in the book that I possibly couldn’t help. > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > God bless you, > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > Bhooshan Priya > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > , kulbir bance > >> >> > kulbirbance@ > >> >> >> > wrote: > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> Guruji, > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> The aspect is from 6th to 12th. End results are expected in > >> >> >> >> 12th. Both houses have different nature regarding ownership, > >> >> >> >> exaltation, deblitation, place in kaal purash kundali, > >> > karakakatwas > >> >> >> >> items, so it is but natural that combination resulting from > > 1/4 > >> >> > aspect > >> >> >> >> of sun of 6th house and saturn in 12th house will be > > different > >> > from > >> >> >> >> combination of 1/4aspect of saturn of 6th and sun in 12th. > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> Regards . > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> Kulbir. > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> On 10/2/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya @ wrote: > >> >> >> >> > Dear Kulbir ji, > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > Yes, that sounds logical and makes sense. > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > It is a well accepted axiom of the Lal Kitab that when the > > Sun > >> >> > aspects > >> >> >> >> > saturn it is the significations of Venus which get > > adversely > >> >> > affected > >> >> >> >> > [scapegoat concept]. > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > The dichotomy arose because whether the sun is placed in > > the > >> > 6th > >> >> > and > >> >> >> >> > aspects > >> >> >> >> > the Saturn in the 12th, or the sun placed in the 12th and > >> > aspects > >> >> > the > >> >> >> >> > saturn > >> >> >> >> > in the 6th, the results should have been similar. If the > >> > results > >> >> > get > >> >> >> >> > modified then why? > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > God bless you, > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > Bhooshan Priya > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > , kulbir bance > >> >> > <kulbirbance@> > >> >> >> >> > wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> Guruji, > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> 1941 page 172 says that by defult saturn in 12th house > > grants > >> >> >> >> >> immunity from rahu ketu and mercury, the matrimonial bliss > > is > >> >> >> >> >> exclusively subject to quantum of darkness of saturn. Sun > > in > >> > 6th > >> >> >> >> >> reduces the darkness of Saturn. This could be one of > > possible > >> >> > reasons. > >> >> >> >> >> 2ndly for saturn in 6th house page 163 has that the > > presence > >> > of > >> >> > sun in > >> >> >> >> >> 12th; saturn comes under pledge that it will cause no > > adverse > >> >> > effects. > >> >> >> >> >> 3rdly House no 6 has 1/4th aspect on house no 12. 1/4th > >> > darkness > >> >> > in > >> >> >> >> >> fact helps sun with its relation with venus ref. Page 89 > > trik > >> >> > bhavon > >> >> >> >> >> ki gatha- the native with sun in 12 should have a spouse > > that > >> >> > has > >> >> >> >> >> least traits of saturn. but this very 1/4 light of sun > > from > >> > 6th > >> >> > to 12 > >> >> >> >> >> th can cause serious trouble for saturn in 12th thereby > >> > damaging > >> >> >> >> >> results of venus. > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> Regards. > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> Kulbir > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> >> On 9/30/09, Pandit Bhooshan Priya <@> > > wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > Dear Lal Kitab Scholars, > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > [ Pt. Umesh Sharma ji, Vipin Shukla ji, Kulbir ji , > > Mahajan > >> >> > ji, S > >> >> >> >> >> > Leekha > >> >> >> >> >> > ji, Kapatjal ji, Anand jotish ji,] > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > Could you please help me understand the following > >> > dichotomy? > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > If the Sun is placed in the 6th house and the Saturn is > >> > placed > >> >> > in the > >> >> >> >> >> > 12th house the book says: page 334 ;note # 4; 1952 urdu > >> >> > edition > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > “ stree bhaag aur khud stree barbad ho�� > >> >> > [shanishchar # 12 > >> >> >> >> >> > ] > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > Where as if the Sun is placed in the 12th and the Saturn > > in > >> >> > the 6th > >> >> >> >> >> > the > >> >> >> >> >> > book says : page 355 ; 1952 urdu edition > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > “ ab shukra { grahast stree}barbad na hoga balki > >> > shukra > >> >> > raddi > >> >> >> >> >> > hote huye bhi nek aur uttam phal dega�� [ > >> > shanishchar # > >> >> > 6 ] > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > Therefore: > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > [a] Why should this combination affect, either way, > >> > grahasth > >> >> > and > >> >> >> >> >> > stree? > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > What could be the logic for this reversal of results > >> > when > >> >> > the same > >> >> >> >> >> > two planets, sun and Saturn, are involved? > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > [c] In either case the two planets will be associated > >> > through > >> >> > aspect, > >> >> >> >> >> > and still give different results for the same area of > > life > >> >> > i.e. > >> >> >> >> >> > grahast > >> >> >> >> >> > and stree. Why? > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > With respect to you all > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > Bhooshan Priya > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > > >> >> >> >> > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > > >> >> >> > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > > >> >> > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted October 18, 2009 Report Share Posted October 18, 2009 Dear Lal Kitab scholars, [umesh Sharma ji,Lalkitabee ji,Leekha ji, Mahajan ji, Kulbir ji, Kapatjal ji] Sun and venus together form a masnuyee Jupiter. In the Lal Kitab there is yet another resultant form of this combination and that is mercury: Sun + Venus: aur dono grahon {sooraj shukra} ke milap se budh paida hoga. yani phool to honge magar phal na hoga [ page 798 ; line # 5-6 ; 1952 urdu edition] The book further reiterates the same for this combination in the 7th house : dono grahon ke bajay ab khali budh # 7 ka diya hua phal hoga [ page 800; 5th from bottom line; 1952 urdu edition] Therefore: [1] Does the combination of these two planets[ sun and venus] have two masnuyee forms? [2] If so, how can the combination form two contradictory and mutual enemy masnuyee planets like Jupiter and mercury at the same time? [3] If yes, then which masnuyee form will operate and under what circumstances? Any guidelines in the Book? Sincerely, Bhooshan Priya Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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