The Sun, Planets and the Zodiacs

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At 06:47 PM 9/1/03 -0000, Elizabeth wrote:

>2. A tropical astrologer told me that sidereal astrology is the

>astrology of *space* whereas tropical is the astrology of *time*.

 

Hello Elizabeth,

 

Sorry I'm late getting back to you. I see that Juan Oliver has replied to

your question, but I guess I'll write a few comments from a different

perspective.

 

I think this 'time-space' difference is just so many confusing words. Both

the Tropical and Sidereal zodiacs are measured along the ecliptic, though,

as we know, the Tropical zodiac is measured from the spring equinox whereas

the sidereal is measured from the fixed stars. It's still the same circle,

however.

 

> As I understand, the latter is the astrology of *time* because it is

>based on the earth's relation to the sun, which results in the

>seasons. If so, then logically shouldn't the " tropical zodiac " work

>only for the Sun alone? The other planets do not follow the

>same " time " as the sun.

 

It seems to me that the pure interpretation of the signs might work only

for the Sun, because the 'signs' are measured along the ecliptic. This

would be true in both zodiacs. I've often wondered if for the other planets

we need to take latitude (the distance from the ecliptic) into

consideration, and include the influence of the stars (whether north or

south of the ecliptic) in analyzing the influence of planets. Especially

for the Moon.

 

we know, for example, that currently Pluto has high north latitude and is

actually in the constellation of Ophiuchus while in Sidereal Scorpio and

Tropical Sagittarius. I think we can see the influence of both Scorpio and

Ophiuchus: Mars-ruled Scorpio with all the war and violence in the world

now, the sex scandals (Scorpio is the natural ruler of the genitals) and

Ophiuchus has to do with the new medical discoveries--DNA research, etc.

This is because the constellation of Ophiuchus has always been associated

with Aesculapius, who not only cured illnesses but was able to restore life

to the dead.

 

Which reminds me--Siderealists!! Do we really know our constellations?! No,

we just talk about our signs. But we really need to know all of the main

stars within the signs and study how they influence the planets. I feel

that this is so important that I'm working on a book on this topic.

 

>So how can tropical astrologers speak of Moon

>signs, Venus signs, etc? Am I missing something here?

 

I don't know, Elizabeth. It seems to me that this is also a Sidereal

problem, since only the Sun is exactly on the ecliptic. The sidereal signs

don't match the constellations exactly. The starry Scales, for example,

only fill up approximately the final ten degrees of the sidereal sign of

Libra, and edge a bit into Scorpio. The rest of Libra is in the

constellation of Virgo. What we really need to know is where the STARS are

within the signs.

 

We need to really know the mythological symbolism of the signs (the

planetary rulers and constellations) to understand the sidereal signs. In

ancient Egypt the decanates were considered, and these were aligned with

constellations north and south of the ecliptic. Should we be using these

constellations in our interpretations? Does each third of a sign manifest

somewhat differently from the other thirds to reflect these extra-zodiacal

constellations?? India more or less considers these divisions in their use

of the nakshatras or lunar mansions, which align with various asterisms in

the sky.

 

As far as I'm concerned, the Tropical zodiac is off-the-wall, because the

stars keep moving and there is no match whatsoever with the constellations

in the sky and the signs of the zodiac.

 

A really good and inexpensive book on the mythology of the constsellations

is John D. Staal's THE NEW PATTERNS IN THE SKY. I'm sure Amazon.com has it.

Then we need a computer printout of the sidereal positions of--say 300

stars. I believe that Solar Fire has this printout, and the old NOVA also

prints out the star postions in any zodiac you want.

 

Sincerely,

Therese