Guest guest Posted March 21, 2008 Report Share Posted March 21, 2008 I contined to be curious about the term 'Vehlow.' Here is the reason I've never heard of the Vehlow house system. The man whose name is given to this house system wasn't born until 1980! When I typed 'Vehlow' into a search engine, a really good article on the houses came up. http://www.geocities.com/astrologyhouses/housesystems.htm I don't know how ADB calculates these houses, whether it's like the ancient Indian system or like the Meridian system below. Here is the part of the article that discusses Vehlow houses: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Meridian or Vehlow-Equal or Zariel: The Meridian house system was proposed by the Australian astrologer Zariel (David Cope) in the early 1900s. It has never received much attention, but was investigated by American astrologers Bruce Lloyd and Garth Allen in the late 1950s. This system is also referred to as the " Axial Rotation System, " a term which is somewhat misleading, as no rotation is involved, but derives from the use of the North and South Celestial poles for the construction of the great circles. Circles are drawn through the poles and twelve points that divide the equator equally, starting at the meridian. These points are then projected onto the ecliptic. The Midheaven is identical to the 10th house cusp. The Ascendant is not equal to the 1st cusp, but is equivalent to the so called " East Point " or equatorial ascendant. This system works in extreme latitudes [the poles]. The Meridian house system is most popular with Uranian astrologers. [From the alphabetical listing of house systems in the article:] Vehlow: An equal house system promulgated by Johannes Vehlow (b 1980 Germany). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 22, 2008 Report Share Posted March 22, 2008 Hi Therese, I found the same article, but it's a bit misleading. The Vehlow houses in ADB are exactly the same house system that you're using: equal houses with the house cusp in the middle. I've checked it. Best, Sari - " Therese Hamilton " <eastwest Friday, March 21, 2008 9:13 PM Vehlow Houses >I contined to be curious about the term 'Vehlow.' Here is the reason I've > never heard of the Vehlow house system. The man whose name is given to > this > house system wasn't born until 1980! When I typed 'Vehlow' into a search > engine, a really good article on the houses came up. > > http://www.geocities.com/astrologyhouses/housesystems.htm > > I don't know how ADB calculates these houses, whether it's like the > ancient > Indian system or like the Meridian system below. Here is the part of the > article that discusses Vehlow houses: > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Meridian or Vehlow-Equal or Zariel: > > The Meridian house system was proposed by the Australian astrologer Zariel > (David Cope) in the early 1900s. It has never received much attention, but > was investigated by American astrologers Bruce Lloyd and Garth Allen in > the > late 1950s. This system is also referred to as the " Axial Rotation > System, " > a term which is somewhat misleading, as no rotation is involved, but > derives from the use of the North and South Celestial poles for the > construction of the great circles. Circles are drawn through the poles and > twelve points that divide the equator equally, starting at the meridian. > > These points are then projected onto the ecliptic. The Midheaven is > identical to the 10th house cusp. The Ascendant is not equal to the 1st > cusp, but is equivalent to the so called " East Point " or equatorial > ascendant. This system works in extreme latitudes [the poles]. The > Meridian > house system is most popular with Uranian astrologers. > > > [From the alphabetical listing of house systems in the article:] > > Vehlow: An equal house system promulgated by Johannes Vehlow (b 1980 > Germany). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 22, 2008 Report Share Posted March 22, 2008 At 10:14 AM 3/22/08 +0200, Sari wrote: > >I found the same article, but it's a bit misleading. The Vehlow houses in >ADB are exactly the same house system that you're using: equal houses with >the house cusp in the middle. I've checked it. -- Sari, it seems like ADB should re-name that house system so as to avoid confusion. I'm sure you checked it before using it. I was just wondering about the name. I'm still confused as to the house system Mr. Velow devised. The article didn't make that clear since they listed his sytem as the same as Meridian or Zarial. The author seemed like he knew what he was taling about. It's the best history of houses I've seen. therese Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 24, 2008 Report Share Posted March 24, 2008 Hi all Can I ask a personal question here. I have a sidereal Gem ascendant 24 degs, Saturn 11 degs Gem and south node ketu 8 degs in Gemini. Jyotisically they all fall in first house. Two malefics in lagna is considered very bad there usually. I read the earlier posts but probably missed some conclusion if there was one. What would be your take on it. Even in Jyotish there is this Bhava/ Chalita chart which apparently is used selectively. There Ketu goes in 12th. Should a late Gem rising still be Gem.?I was hoping I was more mature ) Thanks for any inputs Shiv -- In , Therese Hamilton <eastwest wrote: > > At 10:14 AM 3/22/08 +0200, Sari wrote: > > > >I found the same article, but it's a bit misleading. The Vehlow houses in > >ADB are exactly the same house system that you're using: equal houses with > >the house cusp in the middle. I've checked it. > -- > > Sari, it seems like ADB should re-name that house system so as to avoid > confusion. I'm sure you checked it before using it. I was just wondering > about the name. I'm still confused as to the house system Mr. Velow > devised. The article didn't make that clear since they listed his sytem as > the same as Meridian or Zarial. The author seemed like he knew what he was > taling about. It's the best history of houses I've seen. > > therese > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 25, 2008 Report Share Posted March 25, 2008 At 08:35 AM 3/24/08 -0000, Shiv wrote: >Hi all >Can I ask a personal question here. >I have a sidereal Gem ascendant 24 degs, Saturn 11 degs Gem and south >node ketu 8 degs in Gemini. >Jyotisically they all fall in first house. Two malefics in lagna is >considered very bad there usually. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Shiv, both of these are rather far from the ascendant which cuts down on their effect. Ketu is in the 12th with equal bhavas. Saturn is a benefic/yogakaraka for a Gemini ascendant, though it might bring some trouble as lord of the 8th. I hope Bettina replies to your post. She has Saturn on a Gemini ascendant. >Should a late Gem rising still be Gem.? I was hoping I was more mature ) Gemini itself is not so important as Mercury and its aspects. I give very little attention to the sign itself on a house cusp. Was it on this forum that (Sari, I think?) posted charts with Sun/Moon/Asc in the same sign? Sometimes a small effect is noted, sometimes none at all in my experience. Right now I'm running off lists of charts with a planet on the ascendant in the various nakshatras. Some types of work and careers seem to be associated with asc/planets in nakshatras, but ADB has very, very few personality traits for these positions. Saturn with Ketu, however--Saturn ruling 8th and 9th. Ketu's influence should be on those houses somewhat. But since these planets are not near an equal house cusp, the influence shouldn't be so strong. Their dispositor Mercury is key here since Mecury is also ascendant lord. It's not possible to thoroughly judge a planet without the dispositor. Therese Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 25, 2008 Report Share Posted March 25, 2008 Thanks for the insights Therese. The dispositor Merc is in 5th house using equal house system, late libra, is also the Atmakaraka in addition to being lagna lord. Sure must be important. I haven't quite figured out though what it means in my life. You mentioned that 8th lord in ascendant. Perhaps it has to do with losses etc.? Will have to figure how that has played out. But about the ninth lord in first,I can't deny the importance of my dad in my life, if that is what it means. For good or for worse he doesn't seem to leave my mental horizon for long. My whole life so far has been a struggle to go beyond him in a real way, to find my independent path. But it doesn't happen and he too refuses to let go and wants to actively maintain that dynamic. My active shadow boxing with him continues and continues to hurt me bad. I either fear authorities or hate them or rebel against them or all of them. I think that dynamic has been a major reason I have seriously abhor the eastern idea 'traditional authority is wise and good' and have found the west so conducive to trying to find my own identity, which I have not,but the search continues and hence the attraction to astrology. It's actually very ironic that here in the US I have stumbled upon Jyotish which is as eastern as it gets in an attempt to get as far away from the east as possible ) Thanks for the info about Bettina. Bettina, excited to hear you too have this Saturn in Gem. Seems you are my soul sister of some sorts ) Hugs!I have read many conflicting reports of what Saturn does in Gemini.Some say it makes folks less Gemini like and more saturnian in how they communicate. Would love to hear from you as to what have been your experiences. From your explanation on another thread it seems that vedically the first house for me would run from 9 Gem to 9 cancer and so on.. ( ascendant degree 24-15=9). So my ketu 8 degs in Gem would nearly conjunct the first house cusp? Does this seem a better system in your experience than the one where this 24 deg itself would be the first house cusp and run to 24 cancer as the second house cusp and so on... From my rather primitive imagination as the first ray of the Sun hit the eastern horizon that time it was 24 degs. Why would be wanna go around one hour back before Sunrise and include that time also within the first house. Any insights would be very appreciate. BTW how long have you been into Jyotish if I may ask. Thanks Shiv , Therese Hamilton <eastwest wrote: > > At 08:35 AM 3/24/08 -0000, Shiv wrote: > >Hi all > >Can I ask a personal question here. > >I have a sidereal Gem ascendant 24 degs, Saturn 11 degs Gem and south > >node ketu 8 degs in Gemini. > >Jyotisically they all fall in first house. Two malefics in lagna is > >considered very bad there usually. > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > Shiv, both of these are rather far from the ascendant which cuts down on > their effect. Ketu is in the 12th with equal bhavas. Saturn is a > benefic/yogakaraka for a Gemini ascendant, though it might bring some > trouble as lord of the 8th. > > I hope Bettina replies to your post. She has Saturn on a Gemini ascendant. > > >Should a late Gem rising still be Gem.? I was hoping I was more mature ) > > Gemini itself is not so important as Mercury and its aspects. I give very > little attention to the sign itself on a house cusp. Was it on this forum > that (Sari, I think?) posted charts with Sun/Moon/Asc in the same sign? > Sometimes a small effect is noted, sometimes none at all in my experience. > Right now I'm running off lists of charts with a planet on the ascendant in > the various nakshatras. Some types of work and careers seem to be > associated with asc/planets in nakshatras, but ADB has very, very few > personality traits for these positions. > > Saturn with Ketu, however--Saturn ruling 8th and 9th. Ketu's influence > should be on those houses somewhat. But since these planets are not near an > equal house cusp, the influence shouldn't be so strong. Their dispositor > Mercury is key here since Mecury is also ascendant lord. It's not possible > to thoroughly judge a planet without the dispositor. > > Therese > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 25, 2008 Report Share Posted March 25, 2008 Shiv, it's kinda hard to discuss a chart without having the entire birth data. Do you want to post it? Thanks, Therese At 06:46 AM 3/25/08 -0000, you wrote: >Thanks for the insights Therese. >The dispositor Merc is in 5th house using equal house system, late >libra, is also the Atmakaraka in addition to being lagna lord. Sure >must be important. I haven't quite figured out though what it means in >my life... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 Shiv... The sign a slow moving planet like Saturn is in isn't that important unless it's doing something important like cnj Sun or Moon or on an angle. I'll try to describe my personality/physical traits as I think they pertain to my rising Saturn in Gemini: nervous, anxious, talkative, high Vata, high metabolism, tending toward thinness, shy (when young but have overcome it), not good at making a good impression on people, perhaps socially awkward (again, I've pretty much overcome these traits). Since Saturn rules my 8th and 9th houses it's a mixed bag of good and bad. I've had some debilitating but not life threatening health problems. But all in all I think I've had a good life...lots of interest in mysticism, spirituality, metaphysics. I'm a regular meditator and a nature lover to the max. Not much of one for any kind of religious dogma tho admire the Great Ones like Yogananda. I've found that a rising Saturn gets easier to deal with as one grows older. What is your Saturn doing, house-wise, etc? ...Bettina _____ On Behalf Of Shiv Monday, March 24, 2008 11:46 PM Re: Vehlow Houses Thanks for the insights Therese. The dispositor Merc is in 5th house using equal house system, late libra, is also the Atmakaraka in addition to being lagna lord. Sure must be important. I haven't quite figured out though what it means in my life. You mentioned that 8th lord in ascendant. Perhaps it has to do with losses etc.? Will have to figure how that has played out. But about the ninth lord in first,I can't deny the importance of my dad in my life, if that is what it means. For good or for worse he doesn't seem to leave my mental horizon for long. My whole life so far has been a struggle to go beyond him in a real way, to find my independent path. But it doesn't happen and he too refuses to let go and wants to actively maintain that dynamic. My active shadow boxing with him continues and continues to hurt me bad. I either fear authorities or hate them or rebel against them or all of them. I think that dynamic has been a major reason I have seriously abhor the eastern idea 'traditional authority is wise and good' and have found the west so conducive to trying to find my own identity, which I have not,but the search continues and hence the attraction to astrology. It's actually very ironic that here in the US I have stumbled upon Jyotish which is as eastern as it gets in an attempt to get as far away from the east as possible ) Thanks for the info about Bettina. Bettina, excited to hear you too have this Saturn in Gem. Seems you are my soul sister of some sorts ) Hugs!I have read many conflicting reports of what Saturn does in Gemini.Some say it makes folks less Gemini like and more saturnian in how they communicate. Would love to hear from you as to what have been your experiences. From your explanation on another thread it seems that vedically the first house for me would run from 9 Gem to 9 cancer and so on.. ( ascendant degree 24-15=9). So my ketu 8 degs in Gem would nearly conjunct the first house cusp? Does this seem a better system in your experience than the one where this 24 deg itself would be the first house cusp and run to 24 cancer as the second house cusp and so on... From my rather primitive imagination as the first ray of the Sun hit the eastern horizon that time it was 24 degs. Why would be wanna go around one hour back before Sunrise and include that time also within the first house. Any insights would be very appreciate. BTW how long have you been into Jyotish if I may ask. Thanks Shiv @ <%40> , Therese Hamilton <eastwest wrote: > > At 08:35 AM 3/24/08 -0000, Shiv wrote: > >Hi all > >Can I ask a personal question here. > >I have a sidereal Gem ascendant 24 degs, Saturn 11 degs Gem and south > >node ketu 8 degs in Gemini. > >Jyotisically they all fall in first house. Two malefics in lagna is > >considered very bad there usually. > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > Shiv, both of these are rather far from the ascendant which cuts down on > their effect. Ketu is in the 12th with equal bhavas. Saturn is a > benefic/yogakaraka for a Gemini ascendant, though it might bring some > trouble as lord of the 8th. > > I hope Bettina replies to your post. She has Saturn on a Gemini ascendant. > > >Should a late Gem rising still be Gem.? I was hoping I was more mature ) > > Gemini itself is not so important as Mercury and its aspects. I give very > little attention to the sign itself on a house cusp. Was it on this forum > that (Sari, I think?) posted charts with Sun/Moon/Asc in the same sign? > Sometimes a small effect is noted, sometimes none at all in my experience. > Right now I'm running off lists of charts with a planet on the ascendant in > the various nakshatras. Some types of work and careers seem to be > associated with asc/planets in nakshatras, but ADB has very, very few > personality traits for these positions. > > Saturn with Ketu, however--Saturn ruling 8th and 9th. Ketu's influence > should be on those houses somewhat. But since these planets are not near an > equal house cusp, the influence shouldn't be so strong. Their dispositor > Mercury is key here since Mecury is also ascendant lord. It's not possible > to thoroughly judge a planet without the dispositor. > > Therese > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 Sure Therese, would love to, it is 20th Oct, 1973 23.22 hours, Saturday Vadodara,Gujrat, India 22n18, 73e12 Thanks Shiv , Therese Hamilton <eastwest wrote: > > Shiv, it's kinda hard to discuss a chart without having the entire birth > data. Do you want to post it? > > Thanks, > Therese > > At 06:46 AM 3/25/08 -0000, you wrote: > >Thanks for the insights Therese. > >The dispositor Merc is in 5th house using equal house system, late > >libra, is also the Atmakaraka in addition to being lagna lord. Sure > >must be important. I haven't quite figured out though what it means in > >my life... > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 Thanks for that Bettina. I do share many of those traits. In my case Saturn is retro though, so perhaps it makes them more pronounced. So Saturn in ascendant being in an angle would be important...is what I gather you are saying? Have posted my birth data on another message just now. Maybe that can reveal something about its nature and traits better,if you could glance at it. Some famous folks like Indira Gandhi, George W etc. have had this. So I trust your word that it gets better with time. Hope so! I was curious to know what you think of this vis-a-vis the house 1st/12th as the case maybe and the impact of ketu. I do hate working in full view in public. I despise making calls when colleagues are around for one.I believe that's more of a ketu influence than Saturn per se. Thanks Shiv , " Bettina " <chiria wrote: > > Shiv... > > > The sign a slow moving planet like Saturn is in isn't that important unless > it's doing something important like cnj Sun or Moon or on an angle. > > I'll try to describe my personality/physical traits as I think they pertain > to my rising Saturn in Gemini: nervous, anxious, talkative, high Vata, high > metabolism, tending toward thinness, shy (when young but have overcome it), > not good at making a good impression on people, perhaps socially awkward > (again, I've pretty much overcome these traits). Since Saturn rules my 8th > and 9th houses it's a mixed bag of good and bad. I've had some debilitating > but not life threatening health problems. But all in all I think I've had a > good life...lots of interest in mysticism, spirituality, metaphysics. I'm a > regular meditator and a nature lover to the max. Not much of one for any > kind of religious dogma tho admire the Great Ones like Yogananda. > > I've found that a rising Saturn gets easier to deal with as one grows older. > What is your Saturn doing, house-wise, etc? > > > ..Bettina > > _____ > > > On Behalf Of Shiv > Monday, March 24, 2008 11:46 PM > > Re: Vehlow Houses > > > > Thanks for the insights Therese. > The dispositor Merc is in 5th house using equal house system, late > libra, is also the Atmakaraka in addition to being lagna lord. Sure > must be important. I haven't quite figured out though what it means in > my life. > > You mentioned that 8th lord in ascendant. Perhaps it has to do with > losses etc.? Will have to figure how that has played out. But about > the ninth lord in first,I can't deny the importance of my dad in my > life, if that is what it means. For good or for worse he doesn't seem > to leave my mental horizon for long. My whole life so far has been a > struggle to go beyond him in a real way, to find my independent path. > But it doesn't happen and he too refuses to let go and wants to > actively maintain that dynamic. My active shadow boxing with him > continues and continues to hurt me bad. I either fear authorities or > hate them or rebel against them or all of them. > I think that dynamic has been a major reason I have seriously abhor > the eastern idea 'traditional authority is wise and good' and have > found the west so conducive to trying to find my own identity, which I > have not,but the search continues and hence the attraction to > astrology. It's actually very ironic that here in the US I have > stumbled upon Jyotish which is as eastern as it gets in an attempt to > get as far away from the east as possible ) > > Thanks for the info about Bettina. > > Bettina, excited to hear you too have this Saturn in Gem. Seems you > are my soul sister of some sorts ) Hugs!I have read many conflicting > reports of what Saturn does in Gemini.Some say it makes folks less > Gemini like and more saturnian in how they communicate. Would love to > hear from you as to what have been your experiences. > > From your explanation on another thread it seems that vedically the > first house for me would run from 9 Gem to 9 cancer and so on.. ( > ascendant degree 24-15=9). So my ketu 8 degs in Gem would nearly > conjunct the first house cusp? > > Does this seem a better system in your experience than the one where > this 24 deg itself would be the first house cusp and run to 24 cancer > as the second house cusp and so on... From my rather primitive > imagination as the first ray of the Sun hit the eastern horizon that > time it was 24 degs. Why would be wanna go around one hour back before > Sunrise and include that time also within the first house. > > Any insights would be very appreciate. BTW how long have you been into > Jyotish if I may ask. > > Thanks > Shiv > > @ <%40> > , Therese Hamilton > <eastwest@> wrote: > > > > At 08:35 AM 3/24/08 -0000, Shiv wrote: > > >Hi all > > >Can I ask a personal question here. > > >I have a sidereal Gem ascendant 24 degs, Saturn 11 degs Gem and south > > >node ketu 8 degs in Gemini. > > >Jyotisically they all fall in first house. Two malefics in lagna is > > >considered very bad there usually. > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > > Shiv, both of these are rather far from the ascendant which cuts down on > > their effect. Ketu is in the 12th with equal bhavas. Saturn is a > > benefic/yogakaraka for a Gemini ascendant, though it might bring some > > trouble as lord of the 8th. > > > > I hope Bettina replies to your post. She has Saturn on a Gemini > ascendant. > > > > >Should a late Gem rising still be Gem.? I was hoping I was more > mature ) > > > > Gemini itself is not so important as Mercury and its aspects. I give > very > > little attention to the sign itself on a house cusp. Was it on this > forum > > that (Sari, I think?) posted charts with Sun/Moon/Asc in the same sign? > > Sometimes a small effect is noted, sometimes none at all in my > experience. > > Right now I'm running off lists of charts with a planet on the > ascendant in > > the various nakshatras. Some types of work and careers seem to be > > associated with asc/planets in nakshatras, but ADB has very, very few > > personality traits for these positions. > > > > Saturn with Ketu, however--Saturn ruling 8th and 9th. Ketu's influence > > should be on those houses somewhat. But since these planets are not > near an > > equal house cusp, the influence shouldn't be so strong. Their dispositor > > Mercury is key here since Mecury is also ascendant lord. It's not > possible > > to thoroughly judge a planet without the dispositor. > > > > Therese > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 Shiv... Sorry, I must have missed your post with your birth data. Could you run it by me? ....Bettina _____ On Behalf Of Shiv Tuesday, March 25, 2008 5:12 PM Re: Vehlow Houses Thanks for that Bettina. I do share many of those traits. In my case Saturn is retro though, so perhaps it makes them more pronounced. So Saturn in ascendant being in an angle would be important...is what I gather you are saying? Have posted my birth data on another message just now. Maybe that can reveal something about its nature and traits better,if you could glance at it. Some famous folks like Indira Gandhi, George W etc. have had this. So I trust your word that it gets better with time. Hope so! I was curious to know what you think of this vis-a-vis the house 1st/12th as the case maybe and the impact of ketu. I do hate working in full view in public. I despise making calls when colleagues are around for one.I believe that's more of a ketu influence than Saturn per se. Thanks Shiv @ <%40> , " Bettina " <chiria wrote: > > Shiv... > > > The sign a slow moving planet like Saturn is in isn't that important unless > it's doing something important like cnj Sun or Moon or on an angle. > > I'll try to describe my personality/physical traits as I think they pertain > to my rising Saturn in Gemini: nervous, anxious, talkative, high Vata, high > metabolism, tending toward thinness, shy (when young but have overcome it), > not good at making a good impression on people, perhaps socially awkward > (again, I've pretty much overcome these traits). Since Saturn rules my 8th > and 9th houses it's a mixed bag of good and bad. I've had some debilitating > but not life threatening health problems. But all in all I think I've had a > good life...lots of interest in mysticism, spirituality, metaphysics. I'm a > regular meditator and a nature lover to the max. Not much of one for any > kind of religious dogma tho admire the Great Ones like Yogananda. > > I've found that a rising Saturn gets easier to deal with as one grows older. > What is your Saturn doing, house-wise, etc? > > > ..Bettina > > _____ > > @ <%40> > [@ <%40> ] On Behalf Of Shiv > Monday, March 24, 2008 11:46 PM > @ <%40> > Re: Vehlow Houses > > > > Thanks for the insights Therese. > The dispositor Merc is in 5th house using equal house system, late > libra, is also the Atmakaraka in addition to being lagna lord. Sure > must be important. I haven't quite figured out though what it means in > my life. > > You mentioned that 8th lord in ascendant. Perhaps it has to do with > losses etc.? Will have to figure how that has played out. But about > the ninth lord in first,I can't deny the importance of my dad in my > life, if that is what it means. For good or for worse he doesn't seem > to leave my mental horizon for long. My whole life so far has been a > struggle to go beyond him in a real way, to find my independent path. > But it doesn't happen and he too refuses to let go and wants to > actively maintain that dynamic. My active shadow boxing with him > continues and continues to hurt me bad. I either fear authorities or > hate them or rebel against them or all of them. > I think that dynamic has been a major reason I have seriously abhor > the eastern idea 'traditional authority is wise and good' and have > found the west so conducive to trying to find my own identity, which I > have not,but the search continues and hence the attraction to > astrology. It's actually very ironic that here in the US I have > stumbled upon Jyotish which is as eastern as it gets in an attempt to > get as far away from the east as possible ) > > Thanks for the info about Bettina. > > Bettina, excited to hear you too have this Saturn in Gem. Seems you > are my soul sister of some sorts ) Hugs!I have read many conflicting > reports of what Saturn does in Gemini.Some say it makes folks less > Gemini like and more saturnian in how they communicate. Would love to > hear from you as to what have been your experiences. > > From your explanation on another thread it seems that vedically the > first house for me would run from 9 Gem to 9 cancer and so on.. ( > ascendant degree 24-15=9). So my ketu 8 degs in Gem would nearly > conjunct the first house cusp? > > Does this seem a better system in your experience than the one where > this 24 deg itself would be the first house cusp and run to 24 cancer > as the second house cusp and so on... From my rather primitive > imagination as the first ray of the Sun hit the eastern horizon that > time it was 24 degs. Why would be wanna go around one hour back before > Sunrise and include that time also within the first house. > > Any insights would be very appreciate. BTW how long have you been into > Jyotish if I may ask. > > Thanks > Shiv > > @ <%40> > , Therese Hamilton > <eastwest@> wrote: > > > > At 08:35 AM 3/24/08 -0000, Shiv wrote: > > >Hi all > > >Can I ask a personal question here. > > >I have a sidereal Gem ascendant 24 degs, Saturn 11 degs Gem and south > > >node ketu 8 degs in Gemini. > > >Jyotisically they all fall in first house. Two malefics in lagna is > > >considered very bad there usually. > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > > Shiv, both of these are rather far from the ascendant which cuts down on > > their effect. Ketu is in the 12th with equal bhavas. Saturn is a > > benefic/yogakaraka for a Gemini ascendant, though it might bring some > > trouble as lord of the 8th. > > > > I hope Bettina replies to your post. She has Saturn on a Gemini > ascendant. > > > > >Should a late Gem rising still be Gem.? I was hoping I was more > mature ) > > > > Gemini itself is not so important as Mercury and its aspects. I give > very > > little attention to the sign itself on a house cusp. Was it on this > forum > > that (Sari, I think?) posted charts with Sun/Moon/Asc in the same sign? > > Sometimes a small effect is noted, sometimes none at all in my > experience. > > Right now I'm running off lists of charts with a planet on the > ascendant in > > the various nakshatras. Some types of work and careers seem to be > > associated with asc/planets in nakshatras, but ADB has very, very few > > personality traits for these positions. > > > > Saturn with Ketu, however--Saturn ruling 8th and 9th. Ketu's influence > > should be on those houses somewhat. But since these planets are not > near an > > equal house cusp, the influence shouldn't be so strong. Their dispositor > > Mercury is key here since Mecury is also ascendant lord. It's not > possible > > to thoroughly judge a planet without the dispositor. > > > > Therese > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 Oh, and as I think Therese mentioned, the sign Mercury is in is very important when Saturn is in Gemini (or Virgo). ....Bettina _____ On Behalf Of Shiv Tuesday, March 25, 2008 5:12 PM Re: Vehlow Houses Thanks for that Bettina. I do share many of those traits. In my case Saturn is retro though, so perhaps it makes them more pronounced. So Saturn in ascendant being in an angle would be important...is what I gather you are saying? Have posted my birth data on another message just now. Maybe that can reveal something about its nature and traits better,if you could glance at it. Some famous folks like Indira Gandhi, George W etc. have had this. So I trust your word that it gets better with time. Hope so! I was curious to know what you think of this vis-a-vis the house 1st/12th as the case maybe and the impact of ketu. I do hate working in full view in public. I despise making calls when colleagues are around for one.I believe that's more of a ketu influence than Saturn per se. Thanks Shiv @ <%40> , " Bettina " <chiria wrote: > > Shiv... > > > The sign a slow moving planet like Saturn is in isn't that important unless > it's doing something important like cnj Sun or Moon or on an angle. > > I'll try to describe my personality/physical traits as I think they pertain > to my rising Saturn in Gemini: nervous, anxious, talkative, high Vata, high > metabolism, tending toward thinness, shy (when young but have overcome it), > not good at making a good impression on people, perhaps socially awkward > (again, I've pretty much overcome these traits). Since Saturn rules my 8th > and 9th houses it's a mixed bag of good and bad. I've had some debilitating > but not life threatening health problems. But all in all I think I've had a > good life...lots of interest in mysticism, spirituality, metaphysics. I'm a > regular meditator and a nature lover to the max. Not much of one for any > kind of religious dogma tho admire the Great Ones like Yogananda. > > I've found that a rising Saturn gets easier to deal with as one grows older. > What is your Saturn doing, house-wise, etc? > > > ..Bettina > > _____ > > @ <%40> > [@ <%40> ] On Behalf Of Shiv > Monday, March 24, 2008 11:46 PM > @ <%40> > Re: Vehlow Houses > > > > Thanks for the insights Therese. > The dispositor Merc is in 5th house using equal house system, late > libra, is also the Atmakaraka in addition to being lagna lord. Sure > must be important. I haven't quite figured out though what it means in > my life. > > You mentioned that 8th lord in ascendant. Perhaps it has to do with > losses etc.? Will have to figure how that has played out. But about > the ninth lord in first,I can't deny the importance of my dad in my > life, if that is what it means. For good or for worse he doesn't seem > to leave my mental horizon for long. My whole life so far has been a > struggle to go beyond him in a real way, to find my independent path. > But it doesn't happen and he too refuses to let go and wants to > actively maintain that dynamic. My active shadow boxing with him > continues and continues to hurt me bad. I either fear authorities or > hate them or rebel against them or all of them. > I think that dynamic has been a major reason I have seriously abhor > the eastern idea 'traditional authority is wise and good' and have > found the west so conducive to trying to find my own identity, which I > have not,but the search continues and hence the attraction to > astrology. It's actually very ironic that here in the US I have > stumbled upon Jyotish which is as eastern as it gets in an attempt to > get as far away from the east as possible ) > > Thanks for the info about Bettina. > > Bettina, excited to hear you too have this Saturn in Gem. Seems you > are my soul sister of some sorts ) Hugs!I have read many conflicting > reports of what Saturn does in Gemini.Some say it makes folks less > Gemini like and more saturnian in how they communicate. Would love to > hear from you as to what have been your experiences. > > From your explanation on another thread it seems that vedically the > first house for me would run from 9 Gem to 9 cancer and so on.. ( > ascendant degree 24-15=9). So my ketu 8 degs in Gem would nearly > conjunct the first house cusp? > > Does this seem a better system in your experience than the one where > this 24 deg itself would be the first house cusp and run to 24 cancer > as the second house cusp and so on... From my rather primitive > imagination as the first ray of the Sun hit the eastern horizon that > time it was 24 degs. Why would be wanna go around one hour back before > Sunrise and include that time also within the first house. > > Any insights would be very appreciate. BTW how long have you been into > Jyotish if I may ask. > > Thanks > Shiv > > @ <%40> > , Therese Hamilton > <eastwest@> wrote: > > > > At 08:35 AM 3/24/08 -0000, Shiv wrote: > > >Hi all > > >Can I ask a personal question here. > > >I have a sidereal Gem ascendant 24 degs, Saturn 11 degs Gem and south > > >node ketu 8 degs in Gemini. > > >Jyotisically they all fall in first house. Two malefics in lagna is > > >considered very bad there usually. > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > > > Shiv, both of these are rather far from the ascendant which cuts down on > > their effect. Ketu is in the 12th with equal bhavas. Saturn is a > > benefic/yogakaraka for a Gemini ascendant, though it might bring some > > trouble as lord of the 8th. > > > > I hope Bettina replies to your post. She has Saturn on a Gemini > ascendant. > > > > >Should a late Gem rising still be Gem.? I was hoping I was more > mature ) > > > > Gemini itself is not so important as Mercury and its aspects. I give > very > > little attention to the sign itself on a house cusp. Was it on this > forum > > that (Sari, I think?) posted charts with Sun/Moon/Asc in the same sign? > > Sometimes a small effect is noted, sometimes none at all in my > experience. > > Right now I'm running off lists of charts with a planet on the > ascendant in > > the various nakshatras. Some types of work and careers seem to be > > associated with asc/planets in nakshatras, but ADB has very, very few > > personality traits for these positions. > > > > Saturn with Ketu, however--Saturn ruling 8th and 9th. Ketu's influence > > should be on those houses somewhat. But since these planets are not > near an > > equal house cusp, the influence shouldn't be so strong. Their dispositor > > Mercury is key here since Mecury is also ascendant lord. It's not > possible > > to thoroughly judge a planet without the dispositor. > > > > Therese > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 At 11:54 PM 3/25/08 -0000, Shiv wrote: >Sure Therese, would love to, it is >20th Oct, 1973 >23.22 hours, Saturday >Vadodara,Gujrat, India >22n18, 73e12 Thanks, Shiv. I think Bettina will get back to you on your chart. She's a Gemini expert! Therese Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 Shiv, where are you living now? t 11:54 PM 3/25/08 -0000, you wrote: >Sure Therese, would love to, it is >20th Oct, 1973 >23.22 hours, Saturday >Vadodara,Gujrat, India >22n18, 73e12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted March 26, 2008 Report Share Posted March 26, 2008 Hello Currently I am at Alburtis, PA, US but perhaps not for long. Been here on the east coast for about an year. I might leave this country soon,not sure where I am going though. That depends on many factors, job offers for one. I would have loved to stay to gain some more work experience here but my doctoral fiasco led to strange situations regarding visa, so that's where things are.People keep asking me why I don't head back to the land of my birth. Perhaps it's that Rahu in 7th, a very serious attraction to foreign lands and the need to explore that makes me want to get more global work experience. Wish I had a clearer idea of the next destination. I have a feeling this has something to do with rahu moving away from my 9th house to 8th pretty soon, 9th house being long travels? Thanks Shiv , Therese Hamilton <eastwest wrote: > > Shiv, where are you living now? > > t 11:54 PM 3/25/08 -0000, you wrote: > >Sure Therese, would love to, it is > >20th Oct, 1973 > >23.22 hours, Saturday > >Vadodara,Gujrat, India > >22n18, 73e12 > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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