Guest guest Posted May 22, 2008 Report Share Posted May 22, 2008 On May 21, 2008, at 9:53 PM, vreality_au wrote: > How very interesting Wendy...Checked my dates, seemed to hve > received intiation during Ve/mars/ve. Ve is 4/9L while mars is 3L. > This shorthand means? Venus is lord of 4th and 9th while Mars is Lord of only the 3rd (not possible of course) Can you give more info... which signs and houses are venus and mars in? what aspects are they recipients of? What type of discipline were you initiated into? Bhakti, Jnana, Karma, something else? Venus is Brahmana and Mars gives energy. So perhaps there is a link. Please give more info! - Vic Music: www.weare108.com Astrology: http://web.mac.com/vicdicara/Vedic_Astrology_by_Victor_DiCara___Vraja_Kishor/ Gita: http://web.mac.com/vicdicara Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 Dear Pandiyan, //Moksha is one of the indications that Ketu represents. Primarily, Ketu is a malefic planet and this fact should not be lost sight of.// Absolutely! //Ketu himself becomes an hindrance, at times, being placed in 9th house for the pursuit of religion or spiritual activities, if his dispositor is not in dignity.// Again, I'm in full agreement. It's stated that Ketu indicates enlightenment (providing the horoscope as a whole supports this) as well as the difficulties encountered (along the way).. //The moksha houses and their lords should also support the signification in question.// Yes! Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com ___ - " pandiyanmudaliyar " <pandiyanmudaliyar <jyotish-vidya > Friday, May 23, 2008 1:11 PM Re: Spiritual Astrology Friends, Moksha is one of the indications that Ketu represents. Primarily, Ketu is a malefic planet and this fact should not be lost sight of. Ketu himself becomes an hindrance, at times, being placed in 9th house for the pursuit of religion or spiritual activities, if his dispositor is not in dignity. The moksha houses and their lords should also support the signification in question. No chart is full of vibrant with moksha energy. It is a mixture of worldly and mundane. With Regards, Pandiyan Mudaliyar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 Learned Sages, Many thanks to Pandiya and Wendy for their experienced comments. For example: > Moksha is one of the indications that Ketu represents. Primarily, > Ketu is a malefic planet and this fact should not be lost sight of. What is " malefic " to one cause is " benefic " to another. " Good " and " bad " are relative terms - they obtain meaning only relative to a particular goal. If you want to eat, a radio is " bad " , but if you want to listen to music a samosa is " bad " ... If your goal is accumulation of wealth than Sanyas, for example, is Ashub, or " bad " - but if your goal is self-realization, then perhaps Sanyas is Shubh or " Good " . Most people have materialistic intentions - therefore we hear that a planet like Ketu or my good friend and well wisher Saturn are " inauspicious " or " malefic " or " bad " . This is because they are bad for material gains. This same quality of theirs makes them auspicious, benefic and " good " for spiritual gains ***IF***... ~~~ IF is the most important word in regards to topics of Moksha and planets like Saturn and Ketu ~~~ Astrologers often fall into the trap of giving TOO MUCH importance to Astrology. You must not leave out the element of Jiva, Paramatma... " freewill " . There is the " if " . Thus these so-called " inauspicious " things are the very same things which make a planet such as Ketu auspicious for moksha and enlightenment IF and ONLY IF the native is wise and fortunate enough to use his or her freewill correctly and BENEFIT from what most others see as only negative energy. > Ketu himself becomes an hindrance, at times, being placed in 9th > house for the pursuit of religion or spiritual activities, Religious activities THEMSELVES are a *potential* hindrance to Moksha. Viz Gita 18.66 " Sarva DHARMAN parityaja! " Though I agree that Ketu in a Dharma house is a difficult " poker hand " to make a winning spiritual game out of " . > The moksha houses and their lords should also support the > signification in question. Thank you for making this point - which is obviously a mark of the thoroughness which comes from wisdom and experience. > No chart is full of vibrant with moksha energy. It is a mixture of > worldly and mundane. Why can a chart not be strong for pursuit of Moksha??? Of course it is a mixture of spirituality and materialism in everyone's karma, yet for some the mixture may be 9 parts materialism to 1 part spirituality and for others the mixture may be 1 part materialism and 9 parts spirituality. No? I deeply appreciate your making yourselves available for conversation! Thanks! -Vic On May 22, 2008, at 10:11 PM, pandiyanmudaliyar wrote: > Friends, > > Moksha is one of the indications that Ketu represents. Primarily, > Ketu is a malefic planet and this fact should not be lost sight of. > Ketu himself becomes an hindrance, at times, being placed in 9th > house for the pursuit of religion or spiritual activities, if his > dispositor is not in dignity. The moksha houses and their lords > should also support the signification in question. > > No chart is full of vibrant with moksha energy. It is a mixture of > worldly and mundane. > > With Regards, > > Pandiyan Mudaliyar > > >>>>Actually, no matter where Ketu is... if it occupies a moksha bhav > it will be very powerful for the native's inclination to pursue moksha > because from any moksha bhav ketu will aspect both the other moksha > bhav's and thus generate a lot of moksha energy in the chart!>>>> > > Here's is an interesting phenomena: > > Ketu = planetary karaka of Moksha. > > If it occupies VIII, it will have strong aspects on XII and IV. 4, 8, > 12 are the three moksha bhavas! > > Thus it feels like Ketu in VIII is a indication of a lot of energy > moving towards the pursuit of moksha. > > Actually, no matter where Ketu is... if it occupies a moksha bhav it > will be very powerful for the native's inclination to pursue moksha > because from any moksha bhav ketu will aspect both the other moksha > bhav's and thus generate a lot of moksha energy in the chart! > > Agreement? Disagreement? > > - Vic > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 23, 2008 Report Share Posted May 23, 2008 As I slowly learn astro, I begin to see that most people including myself are as much bound by astro as the planet earth is bound to revolve around the sun. Anyone knows any great guru (in current times) who has transformed their pupils ir-respective of their astrological states? Most guru's tend to select favourable times to intiate their pupils,, in which time pupil himself would have done something good, anyway.!! Astrological state is a state of evolution, and I think the lower the evolved state, more strongly the astro theories apply. Vivekananda wrote that if one is sufficiently strong willed, he can get liberation in 24 hours. (perhaps a week).. Any live examples? I found none, may be apart from himself. As human minds develop it becomes more thoughful, from impulsive. there are cases when mind was suddenly made to leave all impulsive tendencies. In some accidents, some people got some inner impulsive section of their mind cut of from the rest of it. What came out was very different individual. Zero emotional response, but very sharp calculative mind? He was healthy, and became very wealthy in a few years, since he was no longer the same " foolish " emotional individual. Does the effect of various meditative practises or yoga in general have the same effect? Do cut of too much emotions and to make thoughts more powerful. They talk of focus on forehead, and that is an important area for thinking. Since this persons, emotional centres were cut off, he over night lost all his previous emotional habits, inclinations etc. His wife and children were sad that this person is not the same happy go lucky, bumpy man, but more like a computer. Was it a good thing for this man? No emotional issues and much more wealth and more serene mind?? What astro situation can lead to this kind of unique accidents? (there are many examples of such accidents) thoughts or examples? Regards Rajeev Vic D <vicdicara jyotish-vidya Friday, 23 May, 2008 9:54:18 PM Re: Re: Spiritual Astrology Learned Sages, Many thanks to Pandiya and Wendy for their experienced comments. For example: > Moksha is one of the indications that Ketu represents. Primarily, > Ketu is a malefic planet and this fact should not be lost sight of. What is " malefic " to one cause is " benefic " to another. " Good " and " bad " are relative terms - they obtain meaning only relative to a particular goal. If you want to eat, a radio is " bad " , but if you want to listen to music a samosa is " bad " ... If your goal is accumulation of wealth than Sanyas, for example, is Ashub, or " bad " - but if your goal is self-realization, then perhaps Sanyas is Shubh or " Good " . Most people have materialistic intentions - therefore we hear that a planet like Ketu or my good friend and well wisher Saturn are " inauspicious " or " malefic " or " bad " . This is because they are bad for material gains. This same quality of theirs makes them auspicious, benefic and " good " for spiritual gains ***IF***... ~~~ IF is the most important word in regards to topics of Moksha and planets like Saturn and Ketu ~~~ Astrologers often fall into the trap of giving TOO MUCH importance to Astrology. You must not leave out the element of Jiva, Paramatma... " freewill " . There is the " if " . Thus these so-called " inauspicious "  things are the very same things which make a planet such as Ketu auspicious for moksha and enlightenment IF and ONLY IF the native is wise and fortunate enough to use his or her freewill correctly and BENEFIT from what most others see as only negative energy. > Ketu himself becomes an hindrance, at times, being placed in 9th > house for the pursuit of religion or spiritual activities, Religious activities THEMSELVES are a *potential* hindrance to Moksha. Viz Gita 18.66 " Sarva DHARMAN parityaja! " Though I agree that Ketu in a Dharma house is a difficult " poker hand "  to make a winning spiritual game out of " . > The moksha houses and their lords should also support the > signification in question. Thank you for making this point - which is obviously a mark of the thoroughness which comes from wisdom and experience.. > No chart is full of vibrant with moksha energy. It is a mixture of > worldly and mundane. Why can a chart not be strong for pursuit of Moksha??? Of course it is a mixture of spirituality and materialism in everyone's karma, yet for some the mixture may be 9 parts materialism to 1 part spirituality and for others the mixture may be 1 part materialism and 9 parts spirituality. No? I deeply appreciate your making yourselves available for conversation! Thanks! -Vic On May 22, 2008, at 10:11 PM, pandiyanmudaliyar wrote: > Friends, > > Moksha is one of the indications that Ketu represents. Primarily, > Ketu is a malefic planet and this fact should not be lost sight of. > Ketu himself becomes an hindrance, at times, being placed in 9th > house for the pursuit of religion or spiritual activities, if his > dispositor is not in dignity. The moksha houses and their lords > should also support the signification in question. > > No chart is full of vibrant with moksha energy. It is a mixture of > worldly and mundane. > > With Regards, > > Pandiyan Mudaliyar > > >>>>Actually, no matter where Ketu is... if it occupies a moksha bhav > it will be very powerful for the native's inclination to pursue moksha > because from any moksha bhav ketu will aspect both the other moksha > bhav's and thus generate a lot of moksha energy in the chart!>>>> > > Here's is an interesting phenomena: > > Ketu = planetary karaka of Moksha. > > If it occupies VIII, it will have strong aspects on XII and IV. 4, 8, > 12 are the three moksha bhavas! > > Thus it feels like Ketu in VIII is a indication of a lot of energy > moving towards the pursuit of moksha. > > Actually, no matter where Ketu is... if it occupies a moksha bhav it > will be very powerful for the native's inclination to pursue moksha > because from any moksha bhav ketu will aspect both the other moksha > bhav's and thus generate a lot of moksha energy in the chart! > > Agreement? Disagreement? > > - Vic > > > --- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 27, 2008 Report Share Posted May 27, 2008 On May 23, 2008, at 9:28 PM, EagleEye Trader wrote: > Anyone knows any great guru (in current times) who has transformed > their pupils ir-respective of their astrological states? > Yes of course! Guru's bound by astrology are baddha-jiva! Many mantras have bija power to act independantly of planetary government. I personally accept the Hare Krishna maha-mantra as a great friend. Also Gayatri's begginning with Om, Klim, etc. Guru's of bhakti or jnana- marg SHOULD be empowered by bhagavan to bestow blessing independant of Karma governed by planets. Gurus of Karma-marg, karma-kandis, may not always have such potency. > Astrological state is a state of evolution, and I think the lower > the evolved state, more strongly the astro theories apply. > I agree. The more one's will is liberated from tri-guna-baddha the more one can react to his or her karma out of freewill and thus act unpredictably. > Vivekananda wrote that if one is sufficiently strong willed, he can > get liberation in 24 hours. (perhaps a week).. Any live examples? I > found none, may be apart from himself. > I'm not sure why speed is a factor to you. Time itself (as we experience it) is a perception caused by maya. For the liberated, 24 hours or 24 thousand lifetimes is the same amount of time. However, for a quick-fix ;-) i would cast a glance over to Japan and see how they transformed Dhyana from Chinese Chyan into their own Zen. There are branches which focus on instantaneous realization and liberation. I have a brother-relative in Japan who is a buddhist priest, his (birth) name is Satoru. I believe that's the Japanese word for instant realization. Just add boiling water. =) > He was healthy, and became very wealthy in a few years, since he was > no longer the same " foolish " emotional individual. > Sounds like mr. spock from Star Trek > Does the effect of various meditative practises or yoga in general > have the same effect? Do cut of too much emotions and to make > thoughts more powerful. > There are so many different schools of yoga (marg). Bhakti marg, jnana marg, siddhi marg, etc. In Jnana marg the technique is to attain liberation through the force of the intellect. This path with try to do away with emotions, which they see as a hindrance (poor guys). The bhakti marg, however, identifies emotions as being more primal and powerful than intellect and thus bhakti yoga practices involve amplification of emotions and focus of them upon Param Ashraya. (I believe you are Orissan, right? Are you familiar with Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu's system? It is EXTREMELY emotional) > Since this persons, emotional centres were cut off, he over night > lost all his previous emotional habits, inclinations etc. > His wife and children were sad that this person is not the same > happy go lucky, bumpy man, but more like a computer. > Was it a good thing for this man? No emotional issues and much more > wealth and more serene mind?? > I'm going to shoot from the hip and make an uncontrolled, unthought- out response (what else is new) and say NO. And then I'm going to say, " well, yes and no. " And then I'm going to say, " like everything else - it is NEITHER good nor bad in itself. The goodness or badness of it will be determined by how he and they REACT to the situation, and what they MAKE of it. > > What astro situation can lead to this kind of unique accidents? > (there are many examples of such accidents) > thoughts or examples? > My first suspicion would be Mercury. I would expect to see mercury (nerves, brain and fun) getting into some sort of astrological accident in the birth chart. yours, vic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 27, 2008 Report Share Posted May 27, 2008 On May 27, 2008, at 11:37 AM, EagleEye Trader wrote: > I am sure you have not read geeta thoroughly. > Krishna explicity states in later chapters that all roads lead to > janana. > You are incorrect. I have studied this book in Sanskrit and English for 19 years. Quote the shlok you are referring to and I will gladly explain. If Mrs. Wendy feels this is not pertinent to Astrology we can discuss in private email. If you do not know of the Gita resources I have authored on the web please request URLs from me in a private email. You should familiarize yourself with them if you wish to hold a deep conversation with me on the matter. > Bhakti and karma yoga was designed for times and people who cannot > directly make the big quantum leap of getting their minds fixed on > the one idea... or those who have mind sharp enough to cut through > maya, by just saying with utter conviction, " this is not it " , " this > is not it " . > That's what you've been told. Please read Vishvanath Chakravarti's Tikka on Gita and Baladev Vidyabhushan's tikka on Vedanta Sutra. I'm very serious. Please seek out these books and read them. > One tries to keep his heart and soul fixed on the one, and tries to > keep other things out.. Bhakti? > What happens at last? > ananyas cintayanto mam ye janah paryupasate tesham nityabhiyuktanam yoga-ksemam vahamy aham (9:22) yanti mad-yajino ’pi mam (9:25) man-mana bhava mad-bhakto mad-yaji mam namaskuru mam evaishyasi yuktvaivam atmanam mat-parayanah (9:34) > > One knows that he is the one.. What does one become then? janani.? > The knower? Sat? > To become the knower is inferior, as love is more pleasant than knowledge. To become one and distinct from the knower is prefered because unity and speration allow divine love. This is called Acintya BhedAbhed Tattva. Being Orisan, you should be able to learn about this school easily, since it was founded in Orissa and Bengal. Seek out a Gaudiya Vashnav and make inquiry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2008 Report Share Posted May 28, 2008 Hello Vic Great knowing that you have spent so much time with gita. I was wrong. It is said that lord divided himself into many jivas, so that some hankering for sense pleasures, attainments, knowledge, bank acounts, books, long matted hair and beard, friends and enemies, wifes and kids may be attained and at last all jivas would quit the ever looped drama of sense enjoyment and come back to being what they were before they entered the drama... their own true self. What is the goal? Love or Realization? Realization leads to love or Love to Realization? Or both go hand in hand or are different names of the same phenomena? One who knows will love and one who loves will know? But still at last when strong love and great karma slowly lift the viel, the jiva attains the truth. Deducations from Gita strongly depends on whose version of Gita was read, since the translation mostly reflects the authors ideals. Which as it is " has " to be biased to one side or another. Truly, it is difficult to comprehend or digest the structure, and talking for such lofty ideals is worse than blind man feeling the elephant. So whatever u say, I am 99.99% ok with that. divine Devotion, divine Love or divine Jnana.. all same wth only microscopic differences. They all go hand in hand and all the more they cannot be seperated for long. " " If you do not know of the Gita resources I have authored on the web please request URLs from me in a private email. " " Kindly send links... All of us will read and get some pearls. " " Vishvanath Chakravarti's Tikka on Gita and Baladev Vidyabhushan's tikka on Vedanta Sutra " " I will find out. How do you compare them with Vivekanandas commentary on Gita. (8 volume one?) Also the big jupiter is getting overly inflated accolades. Divinity wise and when looked from the plane of earth and not fantasy, Saturn seems to be the greatest planet to start and hasten the process of self realization. Its molds, shapes, creates the space for divinity to enter. The space which was earlier chocked full of various non divine stuff... Saturn creates the urge and forces one to jump, to try to seek, change and develop. To me it seems as if Saturn wishes to liberate while jupiter gives the staying power, to hold on to this body and learn the lessons which saturn has to give. If jupiter was not there, saturn would probably burn away most people in too much hurry and fury. (again only a biased pictorial view) It is said that devtas who wish to go beyond the heavens have to come to earth to develop further. Mrityu Loka holds the key to self-realization. Why Mrityu Loka has such potency? Spirituality wise, the hard core malefics seems to be greatest benefics, while the benefics look the worst malefics. The material malefics purge out and make the mind ready (spiritual benefics), while the material benefics would mostly endow all kinds of pleasures. This discussions can be done for ever, with every line re-re-scrutinised. But I wished to make a point that on a human level pains (small or big, long or small) is more divine than pleasure but that depends on divinity being the goal. Pain turns the mind. Pain cuases hunger to get rid of the pain. The Supreme lord would probably never get trillions of jivas back into his folds, if saturn didnot trash the hell out of jivas with his schemes. Strong hunger is the start and ever lasting hunger is the end. Mr. Bhaskar (who is a member here) can say something on this if he happens to read this. He wrote an excellent article on Saturn being a " Dharma Sthapak " . Jai Saturn. Regards Rajeev Vic D <vicdicara jyotish-vidya Wednesday, 28 May, 2008 12:20:35 AM Re: Re: Spiritual Astrology On May 27, 2008, at 11:37 AM, EagleEye Trader wrote: > I am sure you have not read geeta thoroughly. > Krishna explicity states in later chapters that all roads lead to > janana. > You are incorrect. I have studied this book in Sanskrit and English for 19 years. Quote the shlok you are referring to and I will gladly explain. If Mrs. Wendy feels this is not pertinent to Astrology we can discuss in private email. If you do not know of the Gita resources I have authored on the web please request URLs from me in a private email. You should familiarize yourself with them if you wish to hold a deep conversation with me on the matter. > Bhakti and karma yoga was designed for times and people who cannot > directly make the big quantum leap of getting their minds fixed on > the one idea... or those who have mind sharp enough to cut through > maya, by just saying with utter conviction, " this is not it " , " this > is not it " . > That's what you've been told. Please read Vishvanath Chakravarti's Tikka on Gita and Baladev Vidyabhushan's tikka on Vedanta Sutra. I'm very serious. Please seek out these books and read them. > One tries to keep his heart and soul fixed on the one, and tries to > keep other things out.. Bhakti? > What happens at last? > ananyas cintayanto mam ye janah paryupasate tesham nityabhiyuktanam yoga-ksemam vahamy aham (9:22) yanti mad-yajino ’pi mam (9:25) man-mana bhava mad-bhakto mad-yaji mam namaskuru mam evaishyasi yuktvaivam atmanam mat-parayanah (9:34) > > One knows that he is the one.. What does one become then? janani.? > The knower? Sat? > To become the knower is inferior, as love is more pleasant than knowledge. To become one and distinct from the knower is prefered because unity and speration allow divine love. This is called Acintya BhedAbhed Tattva. Being Orisan, you should be able to learn about this school easily, since it was founded in Orissa and Bengal. Seek out a Gaudiya Vashnav and make inquiry. --- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2008 Report Share Posted May 28, 2008 Dear Vic, //If you do not know of the Gita resources I have authored on the web please request URLs from me in a private email.// I have placed the link to your Gita blog in our group's links section... You can access the link here (I hope) jyotish-vidya/links?yguid=324189969 Best Wishes, Mrs. Wendy http://JyotishVidya.com ___ - " Vic D " <vicdicara <jyotish-vidya > Wednesday, May 28, 2008 2:50 AM Re: Re: Spiritual Astrology On May 27, 2008, at 11:37 AM, EagleEye Trader wrote: > I am sure you have not read geeta thoroughly. > Krishna explicity states in later chapters that all roads lead to > janana. > You are incorrect. I have studied this book in Sanskrit and English for 19 years. Quote the shlok you are referring to and I will gladly explain. If Mrs. Wendy feels this is not pertinent to Astrology we can discuss in private email. If you do not know of the Gita resources I have authored on the web please request URLs from me in a private email. You should familiarize yourself with them if you wish to hold a deep conversation with me on the matter. > Bhakti and karma yoga was designed for times and people who cannot > directly make the big quantum leap of getting their minds fixed on > the one idea... or those who have mind sharp enough to cut through > maya, by just saying with utter conviction, " this is not it " , " this > is not it " . > That's what you've been told. Please read Vishvanath Chakravarti's Tikka on Gita and Baladev Vidyabhushan's tikka on Vedanta Sutra. I'm very serious. Please seek out these books and read them. > One tries to keep his heart and soul fixed on the one, and tries to > keep other things out.. Bhakti? > What happens at last? > ananyas cintayanto mam ye janah paryupasate tesham nityabhiyuktanam yoga-ksemam vahamy aham (9:22) yanti mad-yajino ’pi mam (9:25) man-mana bhava mad-bhakto mad-yaji mam namaskuru mam evaishyasi yuktvaivam atmanam mat-parayanah (9:34) > > One knows that he is the one.. What does one become then? janani.? > The knower? Sat? > To become the knower is inferior, as love is more pleasant than knowledge. To become one and distinct from the knower is prefered because unity and speration allow divine love. This is called Acintya BhedAbhed Tattva. Being Orisan, you should be able to learn about this school easily, since it was founded in Orissa and Bengal. Seek out a Gaudiya Vashnav and make inquiry. --- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2008 Report Share Posted May 28, 2008 Thanks so much for the Honor, Mrs. Wendy! On May 28, 2008, at 5:54 AM, Wendy Vasicek wrote: > Dear Vic, > > //If you do not know of the Gita resources I have authored on the web > please request URLs from me in a private email.// > > I have placed the link to your Gita blog in our group's links > section... > You can access the link here (I hope) > jyotish-vidya/links?yguid=324189969 > > Best Wishes, > Mrs. Wendy > http://JyotishVidya.com > ___ > > > > - > " Vic D " <vicdicara > <jyotish-vidya > > Wednesday, May 28, 2008 2:50 AM > Re: Re: Spiritual Astrology > > > On May 27, 2008, at 11:37 AM, EagleEye Trader wrote: >> I am sure you have not read geeta thoroughly. >> Krishna explicity states in later chapters that all roads lead to >> janana. >> > You are incorrect. I have studied this book in Sanskrit and English > for 19 years. > > Quote the shlok you are referring to and I will gladly explain. If > Mrs. Wendy feels this is not pertinent to Astrology we can discuss in > private email. If you do not know of the Gita resources I have > authored on the web please request URLs from me in a private email. > You should familiarize yourself with them if you wish to hold a deep > conversation with me on the matter. > >> Bhakti and karma yoga was designed for times and people who cannot >> directly make the big quantum leap of getting their minds fixed on >> the one idea... or those who have mind sharp enough to cut through >> maya, by just saying with utter conviction, " this is not it " , " this >> is not it " . >> > That's what you've been told. Please read Vishvanath Chakravarti's > Tikka on Gita and Baladev Vidyabhushan's tikka on Vedanta Sutra. I'm > very serious. Please seek out these books and read them. > > >> One tries to keep his heart and soul fixed on the one, and tries to >> keep other things out.. Bhakti? >> What happens at last? >> > ananyas cintayanto mam > ye janah paryupasate > tesham nityabhiyuktanam > yoga-ksemam vahamy aham (9:22) > > yanti mad-yajino ’pi mam (9:25) > > man-mana bhava mad-bhakto > mad-yaji mam namaskuru > mam evaishyasi yuktvaivam > atmanam mat-parayanah (9:34) > > >> >> One knows that he is the one.. What does one become then? janani.? >> The knower? Sat? >> > > To become the knower is inferior, as love is more pleasant than > knowledge. To become one and distinct from the knower is prefered > because unity and speration allow divine love. This is called Acintya > BhedAbhed Tattva. Being Orisan, you should be able to learn about this > school easily, since it was founded in Orissa and Bengal. Seek out a > Gaudiya Vashnav and make inquiry. > > > > --- > > > > --- > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2008 Report Share Posted May 28, 2008 On May 27, 2008, at 10:57 PM, EagleEye Trader wrote: > Great knowing that you have spent so much time with gita. I was wrong. > It is said that lord divided himself into many jivas, so that some > hankering for sense pleasures, attainments, knowledge, bank acounts, > books, long matted hair and beard, friends and enemies, wifes and > kids may be attained and at last all jivas would quit the ever > looped drama of sense enjoyment and come back to being what they > were before they entered the drama... their own true self. > Yes, " Eko bahu syam " ... and " Anandamay'AbhyAsat " > What is the goal? Love or Realization? > > Realization leads to love or Love to Realization? > Or both go hand in hand or are different names of the same phenomena? Yes, real Jnana leads to understanding the truth that the supreme being is Supremely Loveable, and that we, the amsha of that supreme being are the (in concert) the Supreme Lovers. Realization of this divine love is the paramount goal of all the purusharthas - kama, artha, dharma AND moksha. " Prema-PumArtha Mahan " > Deducations from Gita strongly depends on whose version of Gita was > read, since the translation mostly reflects the authors ideals. > Therefore I have learned it directly from Sanskrit. > " " If you do not know of the Gita resources I have > authored on the web please request URLs from me in a private email. > " " > Kindly send links... All of us will read and get some pearls. > Mrs. Wendy kindly put one of them up in the links section of Jyotish Vidya. I am honored. There's some others besides the one she wrote. I will send you one in a private email. > " " Vishvanath Chakravarti's Tikka on Gita and Baladev Vidyabhushan's > tikka on Vedanta Sutra " " > I will find out. > How do you compare them with Vivekanandas commentary on Gita. (8 > volume one?) > I have not read but would like to. Can you direct me to a resource if it is available on the web? > Also the big jupiter is getting overly inflated accolades. > Divinity wise and when looked from the plane of earth and not > fantasy, Saturn seems to be the greatest planet to start and hasten > the process of self realization. > Its molds, shapes, creates the space for divinity to enter. The > space which was earlier chocked full of various non divine stuff... > Saturn creates the urge and forces one to jump, to try to seek, > change and develop. > I love your enthusiasm for Saturn. I am Capricorn Ascending. I am a big Saturn supporter! > Spirituality wise, the hard core malefics seems to be greatest > benefics, while the benefics look the worst malefics. > Yes, but interesting not Mars as far as I understand. I think it's because anger is so detrimental to clear perception... tri-vidham narakasyedam dvaram nasanam atmanah kamah krodhas tatha lobhas tasmad etat trayam tyajet (gita 16.21) Anger is one of the three gates to hell. Mars is so militant and angry. Thus it seems to be the one malefic which has the least spiritual value. However, I do associate Mars primarily with simple " energy " and I think sometimes you can find that having a happy mars aspect or occupy some House gives good energy to it. Thus in combination with a spiritual planet or House, sometimes I read Mars as positive for spirituality in that way. Does anyone confirm or counter this idea? Thanks, Vic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2008 Report Share Posted May 28, 2008 Hi Vic There is a school of which " Prabhupad " (sorry if spell mistakes) is the founder, which says the same thing you say. I dont know how revered Shankracharya is in rest of world, but read this Gita. (google for this, should come up) Shankaryacharya is known almost as god incarnate who came to throw light on vedas, combine a lot of things and cleanse the rot in established schools and similar stuff. Then there is Vivekananda (disciple of Shri RamKrishna Paramhansha). His writing is also similar to that of Shankaracharya with more focus on work, progress and meditation. He exudes a lot of positive martian energy. (also sometimes called as the militant monk) On similar lines there is Paramhansha Yogananda (whose book autobiography of a yogi is great to read) The above mentioned sages give balanced treatment to all kinds of paths. All classes of people can use it. Become better at work and life in general, and pick things which they find easy to digest and assimilate and develop spiritually. But the Prabhupad variety knows only one thing, and that is the hero and heroine thing. I recall one phrase, God comes in whatever form he is asked to come.. So all are right, nothing is ahead and nothing is behind, god is centre, rest all circumference. But yet, karma and bhakti lead to ture knowledge and that is the end. Since the game started with a " viel of ignorance " and knowledge clears the ignorance. and saturn punishes the ignorant.... Jai Saturn.!! Regards Rajeev Vic D <vicdicara jyotish-vidya Wednesday, 28 May, 2008 9:52:22 PM Re: Re: Spiritual Astrology On May 27, 2008, at 10:57 PM, EagleEye Trader wrote: > Great knowing that you have spent so much time with gita. I was wrong. > It is said that lord divided himself into many jivas, so that some > hankering for sense pleasures, attainments, knowledge, bank acounts, > books, long matted hair and beard, friends and enemies, wifes and > kids may be attained and at last all jivas would quit the ever > looped drama of sense enjoyment and come back to being what they > were before they entered the drama... their own true self. > Yes, " Eko bahu syam " .... and " Anandamay'AbhyAsat " > What is the goal? Love or Realization? > > Realization leads to love or Love to Realization? > Or both go hand in hand or are different names of the same phenomena? Yes, real Jnana leads to understanding the truth that the supreme being is Supremely Loveable, and that we, the amsha of that supreme being are the (in concert) the Supreme Lovers. Realization of this divine love is the paramount goal of all the purusharthas - kama, artha, dharma AND moksha. " Prema-PumArtha Mahan " > Deducations from Gita strongly depends on whose version of Gita was > read, since the translation mostly reflects the authors ideals. > Therefore I have learned it directly from Sanskrit. > " " If you do not know of the Gita resources I have > authored on the web please request URLs from me in a private email. > " " > Kindly send links.... All of us will read and get some pearls. > Mrs. Wendy kindly put one of them up in the links section of Jyotish Vidya. I am honored. There's some others besides the one she wrote. I will send you one in a private email. > " " Vishvanath Chakravarti' s Tikka on Gita and Baladev Vidyabhushan' s > tikka on Vedanta Sutra " " > I will find out. > How do you compare them with Vivekanandas commentary on Gita. (8 > volume one?) > I have not read but would like to. Can you direct me to a resource if it is available on the web? > Also the big jupiter is getting overly inflated accolades. > Divinity wise and when looked from the plane of earth and not > fantasy, Saturn seems to be the greatest planet to start and hasten > the process of self realization. > Its molds, shapes, creates the space for divinity to enter. The > space which was earlier chocked full of various non divine stuff... > Saturn creates the urge and forces one to jump, to try to seek, > change and develop. > I love your enthusiasm for Saturn. I am Capricorn Ascending. I am a big Saturn supporter! > Spirituality wise, the hard core malefics seems to be greatest > benefics, while the benefics look the worst malefics. > Yes, but interesting not Mars as far as I understand. I think it's because anger is so detrimental to clear perception.. . tri-vidham narakasyedam dvaram nasanam atmanah kamah krodhas tatha lobhas tasmad etat trayam tyajet (gita 16.21) Anger is one of the three gates to hell. Mars is so militant and angry. Thus it seems to be the one malefic which has the least spiritual value. However, I do associate Mars primarily with simple " energy " and I think sometimes you can find that having a happy mars aspect or occupy some House gives good energy to it. Thus in combination with a spiritual planet or House, sometimes I read Mars as positive for spirituality in that way. Does anyone confirm or counter this idea? Thanks, Vic From Chandigarh to Chennai - find friends all over India. Go to http://in.promos../groups/citygroups/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted May 28, 2008 Report Share Posted May 28, 2008 Rajeevji, " Prabhupada " is a generic title given to saints. Bhaktivedanta Swami is probably the proper name of person you refer to, although it may be Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati or others. Neither of them *founded* any schools, but Bhaktivedanta Prabhupada made a very significant to the Sri Chaitanya school by brining it out of India and making it known to the rest of the world. The school itself is called Gaudiya Vaishnavism, and was founded by Sri Caitanya and codified by the genius Sri Rupa Goswami and his 5 contemporaries. Sankaracarya and yourself are followers of the Jnana Marg. So you have your perspective. In my perspective Avidya is defined as aversion to conceive of one's self in relation to parambrahman. Therefore bhakti (stressing relationship) is more effective to dissolve the knot of avidya than jnana is in that task. You have your own opinions, but have not quoted any scriptural reference. If you search you will find some to support your opinion, because Jnana marg is a valid path. However, if you judge " the whole chart " and pray for good intuition, your inner emotions will awaken and you may understand the superiority of bhakti over jnana. Till then, rock on! =) Bhagavad Gita itself is an excellent example of the relation between Karma, Bhakti and Jnana. The first 6 chapters are the Karma-khand of Gita. The middle 6 are the bhakti-khand. The final 6 are the Jnana- Khand. One keeps treasures safely in the middle of his home, not on either wall. Thus the greatest secrets of gita are at the end of chapter 9 and beginning of chapter 10. one also looks to a finality, thus the secrets are reiterated again at the end, in the 60ish shlokas of the final chapter 18. Bhakti is placed in the middle (like Kendras), not only because treasures are kept safe there, but also because Karma and Jnana become significant when they have contact with Bhakti. When karma and jnana support the development of Bhakti, then there is a great harmony and balance between the margas. I myself attempt to utilize all three. With love, Vic On May 28, 2008, at 12:26 PM, EagleEye Trader wrote: > Hi Vic > There is a school of which " Prabhupad " (sorry if spell mistakes) is > the founder, which says the same thing you say. > I dont know how revered Shankracharya is in rest of world, but read > this Gita. (google for this, should come up) > Shankaryacharya is known almost as god incarnate who came to throw > light on vedas, combine a lot of things and cleanse the rot in > established schools and similar stuff. > Then there is Vivekananda (disciple of Shri RamKrishna Paramhansha). > His writing is also similar to that of Shankaracharya with more > focus on work, progress and meditation. He exudes a lot of positive > martian energy. (also sometimes called as the militant monk) > On similar lines there is Paramhansha Yogananda (whose book > autobiography of a yogi is great to read) > The above mentioned sages give balanced treatment to all kinds of > paths. All classes of people can use it. Become better at work and > life in general, and pick things which they find easy to digest and > assimilate and develop spiritually. > > But the Prabhupad variety knows only one thing, and that is the hero > and heroine thing. > I recall one phrase, God comes in whatever form he is asked to come.. > So all are right, nothing is ahead and nothing is behind, god is > centre, rest all circumference. > But yet, karma and bhakti lead to ture knowledge and that is the end. > Since the game started with a " viel of ignorance " and knowledge > clears the ignorance. > and saturn punishes the ignorant.... > Jai Saturn.!! > Regards > Rajeev > > > Vic D <vicdicara > jyotish-vidya > Wednesday, 28 May, 2008 9:52:22 PM > Re: Re: Spiritual Astrology > > On May 27, 2008, at 10:57 PM, EagleEye Trader wrote: > > Great knowing that you have spent so much time with gita. I was > wrong. > > It is said that lord divided himself into many jivas, so that some > > hankering for sense pleasures, attainments, knowledge, bank acounts, > > books, long matted hair and beard, friends and enemies, wifes and > > kids may be attained and at last all jivas would quit the ever > > looped drama of sense enjoyment and come back to being what they > > were before they entered the drama... their own true self. > > > Yes, " Eko bahu syam " .... and " Anandamay'AbhyAsat " > > What is the goal? Love or Realization? > > > > Realization leads to love or Love to Realization? > > Or both go hand in hand or are different names of the same > phenomena? > > Yes, real Jnana leads to understanding the truth that the supreme > being is Supremely Loveable, and that we, the amsha of that supreme > being are the (in concert) the Supreme Lovers. > > Realization of this divine love is the paramount goal of all the > purusharthas - kama, artha, dharma AND moksha. " Prema-PumArtha Mahan " > > > Deducations from Gita strongly depends on whose version of Gita was > > read, since the translation mostly reflects the authors ideals. > > > Therefore I have learned it directly from Sanskrit. > > > " " If you do not know of the Gita resources I have > > authored on the web please request URLs from me in a private email. > > " " > > Kindly send links.... All of us will read and get some pearls. > > > Mrs. Wendy kindly put one of them up in the links section of Jyotish > Vidya. I am honored. There's some others besides the one she wrote. I > will send you one in a private email. > > > " " Vishvanath Chakravarti' s Tikka on Gita and Baladev > Vidyabhushan' s > > tikka on Vedanta Sutra " " > > I will find out. > > How do you compare them with Vivekanandas commentary on Gita. (8 > > volume one?) > > > I have not read but would like to. Can you direct me to a resource if > it is available on the web? > > > Also the big jupiter is getting overly inflated accolades. > > Divinity wise and when looked from the plane of earth and not > > fantasy, Saturn seems to be the greatest planet to start and hasten > > the process of self realization. > > Its molds, shapes, creates the space for divinity to enter. The > > space which was earlier chocked full of various non divine stuff... > > Saturn creates the urge and forces one to jump, to try to seek, > > change and develop. > > > I love your enthusiasm for Saturn. I am Capricorn Ascending. I am a > big Saturn supporter! > > > Spirituality wise, the hard core malefics seems to be greatest > > benefics, while the benefics look the worst malefics. > > > Yes, but interesting not Mars as far as I understand. I think it's > because anger is so detrimental to clear perception.. . > > tri-vidham narakasyedam > dvaram nasanam atmanah > kamah krodhas tatha lobhas > tasmad etat trayam tyajet (gita 16.21) > > Anger is one of the three gates to hell. Mars is so militant and > angry. Thus it seems to be the one malefic which has the least > spiritual value. However, I do associate Mars primarily with simple > " energy " and I think sometimes you can find that having a happy mars > aspect or occupy some House gives good energy to it. Thus in > combination with a spiritual planet or House, sometimes I read Mars as > positive for spirituality in that way. Does anyone confirm or counter > this idea? > > Thanks, > Vic > > > From Chandigarh to Chennai - find friends all over India. Go to http://in.promos > ../groups/citygroups/ > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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