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we need to explain to people how lists work. they are meant for people to

gather and discuss things. there shouldn't be necessarily a clique intended

unless that was the purpose of the list. I know the creator/founder of this

group very well, ben Collins, he didn't form this group for a clique

actually he openly invited many prominent or serious astrologers that he

knew to the group and also as a result any other astrologers could

participate as well. there is no defined group here within the group. most

lists run this way. just an open exchange forum that has been devised in a

listserve manner. that is all. well this technology was devised in America

so we have supposedly setup the etiquette for this and I thought it was my

duty as an American to explain this to the group. it seems others don't

understand this etiquette and as a result we seem to have people who mock

others or intimidate others or seem to have some kind of superiority trip

which to my understanding is contrary to this whole groups function. also if

people can't attend to all messages that is their prerogative. most people

who are on lists such as myself look at the list's messages scan what they

like and avoid what they don't like or care to participate in. however if

someone on the group states that this conversation is between only two

people that should be respected. I mean its not like this group has some

hierarchal function. so attacking people on this list is very provocative I

guess. now in the past I have had heated arguments due to the nature of some

but that is water under the bridge. I would expect some common decency now.

I am just saying that somep people are attacking below the belt and as a

result they will have provocation.

 

 

 

 

 

sincerely,

 

 

 

__________

 

Raja G. Gursahani

*: 314.761.3134 (Clovis, CA)

*: rajagursahani(atgmail.com)

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Raja,

 

// it seems others don't

understand this etiquette and as a result we seem to have people who

mock

others or intimidate others or seem to have some kind of superiority

trip

which to my understanding is contrary to this whole groups function.

also if

people can't attend to all messages that is their prerogative. most

people

who are on lists such as myself look at the list's messages scan what

they

like and avoid what they don't like or care to participate in.

 

now in the past I have had heated arguments due to the nature of some

but that is water under the bridge. I would expect some common

decency now.

I am just saying that somep people are attacking below the belt and

as a

result they will have provocation. //

 

 

You have a big mouth, we know how it has become big, we know You

lend your mouth for services to the Americans for your living,

but dont shoot it here.

 

You are the only foolish person here, who is not meant for this

Group and who disturbs others with your third grade views hitting

below the belt.

 

You are the one who accused my parents and myself of being engaged in

illegal means of living Life etc.

You are the one who passes such type of comments frequently, but never

able to explain them astrologically.

You are the one who picks up on ascendants of people

who share their ascendants and experiences for

general good and understanding of all. If it was in my hands I would

have certainly

sent you to the hospital for such serious offences,

but You are not near me, so You are fortunate , but if you

have some little shame left in Your worthless

existence, you should immediately resign your

membership from this Forum and leave this space for serious

discussions.

 

Your are now getting too much on our heads.

Be careful , if you overstep now, I will have to leave my boundaries

and show you your real place.

 

There are other three more members here who are talking

all nonsense other than astrology.

I will take them, when the provocation is more.

For now let them enjoy.

 

Bhaskar.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

, " Raja Gursahani "

<rajagursahani wrote:

>

> we need to explain to people how lists work. they are meant for

people to

> gather and discuss things. there shouldn't be necessarily a clique

intended

> unless that was the purpose of the list. I know the creator/founder

of this

> group very well, ben Collins, he didn't form this group for a clique

> actually he openly invited many prominent or serious astrologers

that he

> knew to the group and also as a result any other astrologers could

> participate as well. there is no defined group here within the

group. most

> lists run this way. just an open exchange forum that has been

devised in a

> listserve manner. that is all. well this technology was devised in

America

> so we have supposedly setup the etiquette for this and I thought it

was my

> duty as an American to explain this to the group. it seems others

don't

> understand this etiquette and as a result we seem to have people

who mock

> others or intimidate others or seem to have some kind of

superiority trip

> which to my understanding is contrary to this whole groups

function. also if

> people can't attend to all messages that is their prerogative. most

people

> who are on lists such as myself look at the list's messages scan

what they

> like and avoid what they don't like or care to participate in.

however if

> someone on the group states that this conversation is between only

two

> people that should be respected. I mean its not like this group has

some

> hierarchal function. so attacking people on this list is very

provocative I

> guess. now in the past I have had heated arguments due to the

nature of some

> but that is water under the bridge. I would expect some common

decency now.

> I am just saying that somep people are attacking below the belt and

as a

> result they will have provocation.

>

>

>

>

>

> sincerely,

>

>

>

> __________

>

> Raja G. Gursahani

> *: 314.761.3134 (Clovis, CA)

> *: rajagursahani(atgmail.com)

>

>

>

>

>

>

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Dear Raj

I appreciate your thoughts on the nature of the list.

Of course it might be a good idea to post the general intro of guidelines,

delivered to members at subscription, of posting to the list, but it is the

nature of existence that at times even these will be ignored, which is why we

need a moderator such as yourself.

I have stayed with the list due to the openness and free exchange which

generally overtakes any imbalances which set in from time to time, and have now

many good and dear friends I met through the forum. I also am not in favour of

censorship either, otherwise we get into dictating to others and ordering them

around, ironic that avoidance of censorship by the list philosophy attracts so

many censors!

 

best wishes

M

 

 

 

 

-

Raja Gursahani

Saturday, November 17, 2007 4:51 PM

you see marg i think

 

 

we need to explain to people how lists work. they are meant for people to

gather and discuss things. there shouldn't be necessarily a clique intended

unless that was the purpose of the list. I know the creator/founder of this

group very well, ben Collins, he didn't form this group for a clique

actually he openly invited many prominent or serious astrologers that he

knew to the group and also as a result any other astrologers could

participate as well. there is no defined group here within the group. most

lists run this way. just an open exchange forum that has been devised in a

listserve manner. that is all. well this technology was devised in America

so we have supposedly setup the etiquette for this and I thought it was my

duty as an American to explain this to the group. it seems others don't

understand this etiquette and as a result we seem to have people who mock

others or intimidate others or seem to have some kind of superiority trip

which to my understanding is contrary to this whole groups function. also if

people can't attend to all messages that is their prerogative. most people

who are on lists such as myself look at the list's messages scan what they

like and avoid what they don't like or care to participate in. however if

someone on the group states that this conversation is between only two

people that should be respected. I mean its not like this group has some

hierarchal function. so attacking people on this list is very provocative I

guess. now in the past I have had heated arguments due to the nature of some

but that is water under the bridge. I would expect some common decency now.

I am just saying that somep people are attacking below the belt and as a

result they will have provocation.

 

sincerely,

 

________

 

Raja G. Gursahani

*: 314.761.3134 (Clovis, CA)

*: rajagursahani(atgmail.com)

 

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oh please marg let me clarify. I am not the raj who is the moderator of the

group. I am a participant like yourself who just feels that the group needs

some sort of balance. I don't want to offend Bhaskar. he takes every slight

so personally that he still holds resentment. I don't understand why he

can't let anything go. I have let things go along time ago. it is the only

way spiritually is to surrender somehow. slowly but surely it will happen

for all of us. well I just wanted to say that I don't mean to create sides

once again but it happens because of the nature of this group. it used to be

a free exchange of very decent astrologers. yes some astrologers are clearly

more knowledgable than others but some of their knowledge is contrary to the

others. that doesn't mean they are wrong however just their techniques are

more advanced or they just maybe from an altogether different point of view.

so I once again apologize for my behavior however I don't want to feel

inferior in this group and I don't want others made to feel inferior as

well.

 

 

 

sincerely,

 

 

 

__________

 

Raja G. Gursahani

*: 314.761.3134 (Clovis, CA)

*: rajagursahani(atgmail.com)

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Dear Raja,

 

I want to make a clarification here. Yes, once there used to be a

group of very good astrologers in this participating in this

newsgroup; however, they never discussed the horoscopes of Mahatmas

and great incarnations, as once even Sri KN Rao mentioned he would

not discuss horoscopes of Mahatmas. If he himself was so humble, what

are we?

 

With half-half knowledge, I am seeing that the members discuss here

nothing less than Mahatma's horoscopes, or even question their birth

details. Then the trend further continued to even question sages'

quotations, where none was confident of what they were talking of.

Then the trend further continued to the extent of questioning the

origins of Vedic astrology. This gives a clear indication of the

interest of members to question the existence of some of the

fundamentals itself, rather than utilize what they know in actual

predictions.

 

THe maximum human life in Kaliyuga is 100 to 120 yrs. Within this

time, the maximum active time of a person is about 50 yrs, taking

away all other activities of the individual. Now within this 50 yrs

of duration, what kind of physical proof one can obtain for a very

spiritual subject like Vedic astrology.

 

Remember, this is a Jyothish group dedicated to discuss Hindu

astrology, which is a spiritual science. Therefore, freedom of

expression in this group does not and should not mean to question the

basis of the subject itself. When the person goes to that extent,

then he/she is violating the concepts of Hindu astrology. Yesterday I

raised the question of 9 incarnations of Vishnu representing the 9

planets. Here there is subtle representation of the planets through

these incarnations. No one comes back to that question, since they

can conveniently avoid it. The Great Brihat Parashara Hora Sastra

does not discuss any thing basic principle without a refernce to Lord

Vishnu. If one cannot accept the existence of Lord Vishnu, then I

have to doubt their understanding of Hindu astrology, and the

intentions behind.

 

On the one hand we talk of vedic astrology, where we use all the

Hindu deity names and their nature to make predictions, and on the

other hand we question the members such as 'show me proof that it is

possible to find planetary motion thousads of years ago without the

tools that we have today', or someone else qeustions about birth time

or Lord Rama, or some other person questions even on the birth of

Rama itself. What nonsense we are discussing here? This kind of

discussion should not be allowed in a Hindu/Vedic astrology forum

like this.

 

Persons of any ethnic group can certainly participate in the

discussion; there is no question about it; however, once they

participate in the discussion, they should do it whole-heartedly

accepting the validity of the underlying principles.

 

We should understand the limits within which one has to discuss the

subject. That is the real freedom of expression here.

 

Regards,

Satya S Kolachina

 

 

 

 

, " Raja Gursahani "

<rajagursahani wrote:

>

> oh please marg let me clarify. I am not the raj who is the

moderator of the

> group. I am a participant like yourself who just feels that the

group needs

> some sort of balance. I don't want to offend Bhaskar. he takes

every slight

> so personally that he still holds resentment. I don't understand

why he

> can't let anything go. I have let things go along time ago. it is

the only

> way spiritually is to surrender somehow. slowly but surely it will

happen

> for all of us. well I just wanted to say that I don't mean to

create sides

> once again but it happens because of the nature of this group. it

used to be

> a free exchange of very decent astrologers. yes some astrologers

are clearly

> more knowledgable than others but some of their knowledge is

contrary to the

> others. that doesn't mean they are wrong however just their

techniques are

> more advanced or they just maybe from an altogether different point

of view.

> so I once again apologize for my behavior however I don't want to

feel

> inferior in this group and I don't want others made to feel

inferior as

> well.

>

>

>

> sincerely,

>

>

>

> __________

>

> Raja G. Gursahani

> *: 314.761.3134 (Clovis, CA)

> *: rajagursahani(atgmail.com)

>

>

>

>

>

>

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Dear Raj,

 

I do know that Raj Rao is moderator of the group, and yes you are someone who

recognises some sort of balance is needed, which is also a form of moderating.

I didn't feel you had anything to apologise for to be honest, your meaning was

quite clear,

unless I have missed a mail which is possible as, like many others with very

little time to spare,

I moderate my own personal list, though

I doubt you would be on it, as your language is decent, honest, legal and

truthful:-)

 

Yes I too miss the equanimity of the decent and respectable astrologers who have

left,

though a few have remained and I enjoy reading their contributions,

though dont always get time to reply. As for your spiritual surrender well

even Parasara says only good follows those who are peacefully

disposed.............and

the good follow them.

 

best wishes

M

 

 

 

 

 

 

-

Raja Gursahani

Sunday, November 18, 2007 10:57 PM

Re: you see marg i think

 

 

oh please marg let me clarify. I am not the raj who is the moderator of the

group. I am a participant like yourself who just feels that the group needs

some sort of balance. I don't want to offend Bhaskar. he takes every slight

so personally that he still holds resentment. I don't understand why he

can't let anything go. I have let things go along time ago. it is the only

way spiritually is to surrender somehow. slowly but surely it will happen

for all of us. well I just wanted to say that I don't mean to create sides

once again but it happens because of the nature of this group. it used to be

a free exchange of very decent astrologers. yes some astrologers are clearly

more knowledgable than others but some of their knowledge is contrary to the

others. that doesn't mean they are wrong however just their techniques are

more advanced or they just maybe from an altogether different point of view.

so I once again apologize for my behavior however I don't want to feel

inferior in this group and I don't want others made to feel inferior as

well.

 

sincerely,

 

________

 

Raja G. Gursahani

*: 314.761.3134 (Clovis, CA)

*: rajagursahani(atgmail.com)

 

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// and yes you are someone who recognises some sort of

balance is needed //

// I didn't feel you had anything to apologise for to be honest,

your meaning was quite clear //

// I doubt you would be on it, as your language is decent, honest,

legal and truthful //

// As for your spiritual surrender well even Parasara says only good

follows those who are peacefully disposed.............and

the good follow them. //

 

What type of wrong signals are you sending to

people like Raja who are now realsing ( It seems apparently)

that he has uttered wrong statenments in past, and willing to

forget these ?

 

He was honest ? He was decent ? He was legal ?

he was truthful ? He is peacefully disposed ?

What rubbish thrash are you talking here ? He has picked

on my parents and uttered heinous statements in

past. He has picked on my ascendant and tried to throw

me out many times unsuccessfully by pooling in like

minded people . Is this what You call as truthful,decent,

peaceful disposition, legal and honesty ?

Is this what you have been taught ? I wonder what type of

profession your mother must be in, and what type of

upbringing you must have had, if you call such

actions as truthful, decent, honest and peacefully

disposed . Your definitions of truthfuly, honesty,

decency is perverted and psychotic. You seem

to come from a scrizhophenic family.

You have not seen the provocations made by

him umpteen of times here ? What type of civil war you

are trying to create over here by your baseless siding of

such activities and putting your rubber stamp of approval

on same ? let me know what profession Your father is into.

I hope he is not doing some illegal work

in support of your mother who too it seems is into illegal

type of work, the way you resulted, I

wish to know seriously. And I also wish to know how was

Raja creating balance in this Group by his aforesaid

activities ?

 

Bhaskar.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

, " Marg " <margie9 wrote:

>

> Dear Raj,

>

> I do know that Raj Rao is moderator of the group, and yes you are

someone who

> recognises some sort of balance is needed, which is also a form of

moderating.

> I didn't feel you had anything to apologise for to be honest, your

meaning was quite clear,

> unless I have missed a mail which is possible as, like many others

with very little time to spare,

> I moderate my own personal list, though

> I doubt you would be on it, as your language is decent, honest,

legal and truthful:-)

>

> Yes I too miss the equanimity of the decent and respectable

astrologers who have left,

> though a few have remained and I enjoy reading their contributions,

> though dont always get time to reply. As for your spiritual

surrender well

> even Parasara says only good follows those who are peacefully

disposed.............and

> the good follow them.

>

> best wishes

> M

-

> Raja Gursahani

>

> Sunday, November 18, 2007 10:57 PM

> Re: you see marg i think

>

>

> oh please marg let me clarify. I am not the raj who is the

moderator of the

> group. I am a participant like yourself who just feels that the

group needs

> some sort of balance. I don't want to offend Bhaskar. he takes

every slight

> so personally that he still holds resentment. I don't understand

why he

> can't let anything go. I have let things go along time ago. it is

the only

> way spiritually is to surrender somehow. slowly but surely it

will happen

> for all of us. well I just wanted to say that I don't mean to

create sides

> once again but it happens because of the nature of this group. it

used to be

> a free exchange of very decent astrologers. yes some astrologers

are clearly

> more knowledgable than others but some of their knowledge is

contrary to the

> others. that doesn't mean they are wrong however just their

techniques are

> more advanced or they just maybe from an altogether different

point of view.

> so I once again apologize for my behavior however I don't want to

feel

> inferior in this group and I don't want others made to feel

inferior as

> well.

>

> sincerely,

>

> ________

>

> Raja G. Gursahani

> *: 314.761.3134 (Clovis, CA)

> *: rajagursahani(atgmail.com)

>

>

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Dear Margaret,

 

I have been noticing You ignoring my last

few mails , which is a wise step rather than

confrontations. I do appreciate this attitude

from You. Now please allow me to

put the record straight.

 

But I was eliciting a response from You for

my last mail, which unfortunately

did not come. I had wished you to feel the

hurt and pain which I felt

when my parents were spoken bad of,

and respond caustically so that I

could have replied in full force.

But you did not fall for this trap apparently

and evidently ,

and I admire you for this. I also

admire you for most of Your mails let me

confess, save a few (We of course cant be

perfect all the times),where you have sided with

wrong utterances and people, but that is my

perception, for you it may be the right approach.

 

Now since You have not given me any opportunity

and neither responded the way I wished,

Let me take this opportunity to beg pardon for

having spoken wrong of Your parents Profession,

who of course must be highly respected, and

about whom I have no right to talk and comment.

believe me I am not that type of

person to talk dirty of anyone, unnecessarily

and the previous mail was just to

arouse the responses which I

experienced so that You could come in my seat,

where I was, a few months ago.

What I mentioned in my last mail was artificial

and had to reluctantly and half heartedly

write that, for the aforesaid reaons.

It pained me to write what I did. I am

from a family which respects its own elders

and elders of other families too.

 

I am not here to hurt anyone It was

done deliberately , but not actually meant

from the heart.

 

Hope issue is cleared. And you

do not nurture any untowards feelings for me.

 

regards,

Bhaskar.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

, " Bhaskar " <bhaskar_jyotish

wrote:

>

>

> // and yes you are someone who recognises some sort of

> balance is needed //

> // I didn't feel you had anything to apologise for to be honest,

> your meaning was quite clear //

> // I doubt you would be on it, as your language is decent, honest,

> legal and truthful //

> // As for your spiritual surrender well even Parasara says only

good

> follows those who are peacefully disposed.............and

> the good follow them. //

>

> What type of wrong signals are you sending to

> people like Raja who are now realsing ( It seems apparently)

> that he has uttered wrong statenments in past, and willing to

> forget these ?

>

> He was honest ? He was decent ? He was legal ?

> he was truthful ? He is peacefully disposed ?

> What rubbish thrash are you talking here ? He has picked

> on my parents and uttered heinous statements in

> past. He has picked on my ascendant and tried to throw

> me out many times unsuccessfully by pooling in like

> minded people . Is this what You call as truthful,decent,

> peaceful disposition, legal and honesty ?

> Is this what you have been taught ? I wonder what type of

> profession your mother must be in, and what type of

> upbringing you must have had, if you call such

> actions as truthful, decent, honest and peacefully

> disposed . Your definitions of truthfuly, honesty,

> decency is perverted and psychotic. You seem

> to come from a scrizhophenic family.

> You have not seen the provocations made by

> him umpteen of times here ? What type of civil war you

> are trying to create over here by your baseless siding of

> such activities and putting your rubber stamp of approval

> on same ? let me know what profession Your father is into.

> I hope he is not doing some illegal work

> in support of your mother who too it seems is into illegal

> type of work, the way you resulted, I

> wish to know seriously. And I also wish to know how was

> Raja creating balance in this Group by his aforesaid

> activities ?

>

> Bhaskar.

>

>

>

>

, " Marg " <margie9@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Raj,

> >

> > I do know that Raj Rao is moderator of the group, and yes you are

> someone who

> > recognises some sort of balance is needed, which is also a form

of

> moderating.

> > I didn't feel you had anything to apologise for to be honest,

your

> meaning was quite clear,

> > unless I have missed a mail which is possible as, like many

others

> with very little time to spare,

> > I moderate my own personal list, though

> > I doubt you would be on it, as your language is decent, honest,

> legal and truthful:-)

> >

> > Yes I too miss the equanimity of the decent and respectable

> astrologers who have left,

> > though a few have remained and I enjoy reading their

contributions,

> > though dont always get time to reply. As for your spiritual

> surrender well

> > even Parasara says only good follows those who are peacefully

> disposed.............and

> > the good follow them.

> >

> > best wishes

> > M

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > -

> > Raja Gursahani

> >

> > Sunday, November 18, 2007 10:57 PM

> > Re: you see marg i think

> >

> >

> > oh please marg let me clarify. I am not the raj who is the

> moderator of the

> > group. I am a participant like yourself who just feels that the

> group needs

> > some sort of balance. I don't want to offend Bhaskar. he takes

> every slight

> > so personally that he still holds resentment. I don't

understand

> why he

> > can't let anything go. I have let things go along time ago. it

is

> the only

> > way spiritually is to surrender somehow. slowly but surely it

> will happen

> > for all of us. well I just wanted to say that I don't mean to

> create sides

> > once again but it happens because of the nature of this group.

it

> used to be

> > a free exchange of very decent astrologers. yes some

astrologers

> are clearly

> > more knowledgable than others but some of their knowledge is

> contrary to the

> > others. that doesn't mean they are wrong however just their

> techniques are

> > more advanced or they just maybe from an altogether different

> point of view.

> > so I once again apologize for my behavior however I don't want

to

> feel

> > inferior in this group and I don't want others made to feel

> inferior as

> > well.

> >

> > sincerely,

> >

> > ________

> >

> > Raja G. Gursahani

> > *: 314.761.3134 (Clovis, CA)

> > *: rajagursahani(atgmail.com)

> >

> >

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