Re.2- MARK Astrology freedom & determinism,...

[Guest guest]

Hi ALL,

 

I have always seen life is splitted with a two paths

at each and every turn of it and everyone has a choice

of it's own.Now to think about it is my fate to choose

a wrong one or a right one when you reach after a

distant on that path is foolishness.

 

What I think is there is nothing such as wrong path or

right path.It is more over time determine factor.We

are currently standing at a place with our whole past

and looking towards future.Here past,just doesn't mean

past of these Life,But life after Life(Karmas) and

looking towards Life after Life in future.

 

For example we consider for time being only this

Life,A mother has to choose wether she wants ot be

total devotee of a son or Husband or professional life

etc etc.Every person having a time factor of 24hrs a

day is splitted into responsibilities.His life is

scattered or divided into all these objects.Now she

knows what she is doing and what she is going through

and I believe in Law of Nature,as you saw,so shall you

get.But a same for a ascetic person it will be totally

devoted to GOD and welfare of a people.So for him

water in not the one in a sea,But the one in his

Bowl,He has made his Life,you can say focused to a

point.

 

But for people like us there will always be right and

Left path or wrong, till we learn from the wrong ones,

we will never take a right path.And I believe in

Karmas, that more you become focus on a prime aspect

of our existence, more we will take a right turn in

our life.And day will come when there will be no right

or Left,But a straight road towards destination.And

that will be our destiny,destined for.

 

Considering whether Astrology can give us a grip

towards our Life,I will say yes.As you find more and

more malefics things in your chart and through your

free will and focus of mind to control it,you can

change a timing of your destiny.That is every born

person's in every Life destiny is defined,so it cannot

be changed,But a time to achieve can be changed.Rather

than taking to many births, in lesser time we can have

it.

 

It is like working very hard in a office and getting

promotion at a early age.

 

Question will arise,whether this was our destiny,I

will say,till you explorer yourself in these world of

magic,power and illusions, you will never know whom

you are destined for.Free will of every person is

always there, he knows it whether to go for it or

not.It is a fear which blocks our path towards

unknown.

 

 

--- Mark Kincaid <m.kincaid wrote:

 

> Dear Durga:

>

> I think you're right. If we on the other hand,

> believe somehow we're not

> responsible for our actions, that others are,

> including God, then we're

> giving up our live's to others, and one of the

> greatest problems I see in

> life, and in Astrology, being 'blame' pops up.

>

> Those that blame others, keep themselves, in a very

> perilous, and weakened

> situation, vulnerable, and imprisoned, by 'others'

> including the Universe.

>

> But, the truth is that our charts show us that our

> lives, are predictable,

> and being predictable, is rather, a good example of

> 'karma' or actions &

> predictable consequences, which was not meant to be

> an example of 'fate' but

> rather of freedom of choice, and evolution.

>

> Those individuals who cease their life, and own up

> the many various details

> of their lives, and their charts, have the best

> chance of gaining control

> and becoming a success in life.

>

> Nice talking to you.

>

> take care

>

>

> Mark Kincaid

>

>

>

> " gkdurga " <gkdurga

>

> Sun, 13 Mar 2005 13:14:38 -0000

>

> Re: 2-Vinita, Jyothi &

> All.....,

>

>

>

> Good morning all,

> I think all the gurus, elders, parents and freinds

> tell us to take

> resposibility our own actions because that is the

> truth. They are

> never there in the juxtaposition and so can never

> really tell what

> could have been done. So it is always upto you.

> This thought process will lead to exhilarated joy

> when we meet

> success due to our actions, nuetrality when we didnt

> do anything and

> becoming a completely depressed when we meet

> failure.

>

> I think we have to try new things to console

> ourselves later that

> atleast we tried.

> Have great day all.

> Durga.

>

> , Mark

> Kincaid

> <m.kincaid@m...> wrote:

> > Dear Vinita:

> >

> > I like your point here about living more in the

> 'moment'.

> >

> > Jyotish/Astrology, also, has this great ability to

> decipher, the

> good & the

> > bad, within us,

> > even in that eternity of the present.

> >

> > Our 'Astrology' tells us, even in every moment,

> that 'these' are

> our

> > benefics, and 'these' our

> > malefics.

> >

> > Therefore, with this greater Jyotish

> discrimination, which is like

> our own

> > private Guru.

> > Jyotish, is a Guru.

> > It makes value judgements.

> > This is better then that and this should evolve

> into 'that'.

> > Knowing all this, being presented with this

> wonderful Jyotish

> > discrimination, allows us to

> > consider growing in, therefore, the 'right'

> direction.

> >

> > And if we're able to do, 'that', then, life

> smooths out.

> >

> > If we are told to strengthen Saturn, and put more

> attention on

> acting from

> > more restfulness, and balance...and we learn to

> meditate, to go to

> bed

> > earlier, and eat and act, at more 'right' times,

> and natural Saturn

> > discrimination, develops...

> > then, with all that improvement, the actions and

> vibrations of

> ourselves,

> > being 'better', then, natually translates into

> better 'future'

> consequences.

> >

> > You're right though it's always in the present...

> > but, if we're going to learn how to make the

> 'future', a more

> happy,

> > present,...then,

> > we need to learn to transform these malefics.

> >

> > The ironic think is this isn't something we have

> to re-learn, or

> cognize,

> > etc....

> > This reality of working on and deciphering the

> lessons of our

> lives, is the

> > very purpose of our hearts and minds.

> >

> > We are beings that want to become better.

> > We want to become more loving,

> > to understand better,

> > to achieve more inner happiness, and outer

> success.

> > It's in the very tissues of our cells.

> >

> > And, since that's who we are, the naturalness, of

> the Wisdom of

> Jyotish, has

> > a chance to go

> > right to those complications, or blocks, or

> hinderances, or

> illusions,

> > delusions, if you were,....

> > which are out malefics...

> >

> > The art and science of transforming malefics, is a

> very deep, and

> not well

> > understood, phenomena, even for most people

> practicing

> Astrology/Jyotish

> > today.

> >

> > Some time in the future we can talk more about why

> this is so

> challenging

> > for most, and yet, how with a little Vedic

> insight, we can master

> this most

> > pressing and illusive, reality.

> >

> > Nice talking with you, all.

> >

> >

> > Sincerely,

> >

> >

> > Mark Kincaid

> >

> >

> > Jai Guru....

> >

> >

> >

> > " vinita kumar " <shankar_mamta>

> > vedic astrology

> > Sun, 13 Mar 2005 05:22:07 -0000

> > vedic astrology

> > [vedic astrology] Re: 2-Jyothi, re. Is

> Life/or Astrology

> > pre-determined, or free?, > Mark Kincaid

> >

> >

> >

> > Dear Jyothi,

> >

> > I was also asking similar questions some time

> back. The conflict

> > arose because I thought study of astrology is

> contrary to what my

> > understanding is of what my guru has been telling

> us. What he has

> > been saying is this - IT IS THE PRESENT MOMENT

> WHICH ALONE IS

> > IMPORTANT. LIVE WITH YOUR FULL INVOLVEMENT AND

> AWARENESS IN THE

> > PRESENT MOMENT. THE PAST IS DEAD. THE FUTURE IS A

> HALLUCINATION. BE

> > RESPONSIBLE FOR WHATEVER YOU DO IN THE PRESENT.

> THAT IS THE ONLY

> > THING THAT MATTERS.

> >

> > So going by what he says we alone are responsible

> for what we are

> and

> > what we do. No blaming destiny.

> >

> > There is no right path or wrong left turning down

> the road we

> travel.

> > Each moment is what we have to tackle to the best

> of our

> capability.

> > (The capability itself grows with greater

> conciousness and full

> > involvement in life while at the same time being

> detached - the

> lotus

> > analogy, etc.)

> >

> > So where does astrology come into all this? MAybe

> astrology makes

> us

> > understand better who we are and what is this

> thing called life.

> >

> > Vinita

> >

> > vedic astrology ,

> " jyothi_lakshmi_b "

> > <jyothi_lakshmi_b> wrote:

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > Dear Sir,

> > >

> > > Thank you for the prompt response. Your

> quotations were

> really

> > > interesting. If you are interested, and if you

> dont think that I

> am

> > > arguing, please I would like to ask some thing

> regarding the

> first

> > > quotation. (Consider my queries just as my

> curisoity to reach the

> > > final truth). If I consider life as a journey

> down the road, and

> > > suppose at the end, I choose the right path

> instaed of left, my

> > doubt

> > > now is, who made me choose the right path and

> why I didnt feel to

> > > choose the left? I feel that if I chose right

> and suppose some

> odds

> > > are waiting for me there, then I would believe

> that I was

> > predestined

> > > by God that I should go by right and suffer

> those odds. (We

> usually

> > > have experiences in our life when we chose to go

> by a particular

> > bus,

> > > but unfortunately couldnt catch it or we later

> feel that will go

> by

> > > next bus, without any particular reason and end

> either in a minor

> > > accident or fortunately escape from an accident.

> Both are

> possible.)

> > > Am I right or wrong ?

> > >

> > > Sincerly,

> > > Jyothi.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > vedic astrology , Mark

> Kincaid

> > <m.kincaid@m...>

> > > wrote:

> > > > Dear Jyothi:

> > > >

> > > > You bring up a good point.

> > > >

> > > > Because if LIFE, or Astrology is really

> deterministic, than

> there

> > > really is

> > > > no point to try and

> > > > change,.....anything.

> > > >

> > > > But, I don't believe, life is 100%

> deterministic.

> > > > I believe life, is both.

> > > >

> > > > I heard one great scholor express this

> 'debate' once, this way.

> > > >

> > > > " Predeterminism & free will is like you're

> going down a road.

> > > > When you get to the end you can go to the left

> or the right.

> > > > You have a choice.

> > > > But, once you make the choice, it's

> inevitable, or pre-

> > determined,

> > > that

> > > > first you'll

> > > > see a white house, then a green and yellow

> one.

> > > > However, at every moment you're still free to

> stop, and turn

> > around

> > > and go

> > > > back,

> > > > but once you do, it's again pre-determined,

> that along the

> other

> > > road,

> > > > you'll see

> > > > first a brown house, then, a blue and white

> ones.

> > > > Determinism & freedom, both co-exist. "

> > > >

> > > > Another great quote:

> > > >

> > > > " If all we could do was predict the future and

> not change it.

> > > > Being able to see the dangers on the horizon

> > > > but not change for better, would be very

> cruel. "

> > > >

> > > > Personally, I think this is one of the

> greatest fallacies, of

> > > present

> > > > Jyotish, or even Indian

> > > > culture. If the West have anything to teach

> the World, it is

> the

> > > fact, that

> > > > life is not fate,

> > > > and to put in common vernacular: " we believe

> that anyone can

> > become

> > > > President. "

> > > >

> > > > Good discussion, topic.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Sincerely,

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Mark Kincaid

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > " jyothi_lakshmi_b "

> <jyothi_lakshmi_b>

> > > > vedic astrology

> > > > Sun, 13 Mar 2005 01:32:55 -0000

> > > > vedic astrology

> > > > [vedic astrology] Inviting a

> discussion- To what

> extent

> > is

> > > > astrology relevant?

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Respected Sirs,

> > > >

> > > > I would like to invite all members to a

> discussion on how far

> > > > astrology is relevant. I am a strong believer

> in God and thinks

> > that

> > > > whatever we are destined to experience, we

> have to and that is

> > > > inevitable. My doubt is that if this is the

> case, what is the

> > > purpose

> > > > of checking horoscopes and doing Pariharas?

> > > > I am not at all questioning astrology (I am a

> passionate

> learner

> > of

> > > > the subject). But would like to get a

> satisfying answer from

> > > scholars

> > > > for this question which has been haunting me

> since I started

> > > learning

> > > > astrology.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Jyothi.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > Archives:

> vedic astrology

> > > >

> > > > Group info:

> vedic-

> astrology/info.html

> > > >

> > > > To UNSUBSCRIBE: Blank mail to vedic astrology-

> > >

> > > >

> > > > ....... May Jupiter's light shine on us

> .......

> > > >

> > > > || Om Tat Sat || Sarvam Sri

> Krishnaarpanamastu ||

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >