Tattwa, Akasha, Moksha, Samadhi, etc

October 2, 2000

Hare Krishna

Dear Frank,

Before I answer your two questions, I would like to comment on the teaching

of the Gita re the quotes you gave (Ch 2: 45, 48). Since your questions have

to do with the state of enlightment and since I am a but a devotee on the

path, ever hopeful that one day I might become even a blade of grass in

Divine Vrindaban, I have to resort to the scriptures to give clear answers. I

also want to clarify what enlightment means to me and I also want to

distinguish between the state of God realization (Blissful union with the

Divine), liberation into Absolute Truth (mukti dham or akchar Brahm) and

Samadhi (trance). As astrologers we tend to use these terms loosely but the

teachings of the Vedas are very clear on these different states of spiritual

attainment.

I'm going to start by making reference to the verses that you referred to re

the Gita. In Chapter 2, Krishn is still trying to clear up Arjun's confusion

and even though He tells him to be without the three gunas, He has not yet

told him how to achieve that state. I believe it is true to say that the

Upanishads are the origin of all spiritual knowledge and the Gita is said to

be the essence of all the Upanshads, as it is spoken directly by Lord

Krishna. The Gita is where the path to God realization is revealed and

Beloved Krishn describes to us all about the condition of the mind and the

world in His instruction to Arjun. A summary of the whole philosophy of the

Gita is to be found in one out of the seven hundred verses (and there are

other verses that also present this same teaching) and in that verse (9/31)

Krishn makes a promise that the faithful devotee of His Personified form

never falls from his devotion. In Chapter 18, verse 64 & 65 Krishn reveals

his personal secret to Arjuna and says: " O, Arjun! Listen, you are dearly

loved by Me, so, for your good, I reveal the secret of my innermost secrets

to you, that if you will merge your mind in Me, love only Me, worship only Me

and surrender only to Me, you will definitely attain My Divine association

forever. This is my promise. "

When the importance of Divine attainment has finally dawned on the human

mind, the Gita teaches how to surrender to Krishn while living in the world

and facing worldly difficulties and surrender is done by constant and

exclusive remembrance of His Name and Form with faith and love. This is what

Krishn tells us.

Vallabacharya, one of the four Jagadgurus, said in his writings, " There are

four authoritative books among the scriptures, the Veda, the Gita, the

Brahma-sutras and the Bhagavatam. The latter ones are explanatory to the

former ones. The Bhagavatam is the final authority and is said to contain all

the philosophies of the Veda, the Brahma-sutras and the Gita. So to comment

on any spiritual principle we have to resort to the Bhagavatam. In the

writings of other decended Saints or Jagadgurus (Nimbarkacharya,

Ramanujacharya and Madhavacharya) we are presented with philosophies of God

realization that agree with the Gita and Bhagavatam about surrender and

complete dedication to the Name and Form of Krishn. Krishn tells us that His

Name and Form are one and the same.

Some time ago, it became clear to me the plight of the impossible situation

for the ego and the mind. The prospect for the mind and intellect seemed

hopeless and the tattwas explain this so well. The mind is a manifestation of

Maya itself and therefore the attraction between the objects of the senses,

the world, and the mind is eternal. The human mind, therefore, can never

overcome this Mayic attraction. The story is familiar to all of us. We desire

something because we believe it will bring us pleasure and so we develop an

attachment for it. The attachment may lead to possession of the desired thing

and if we are successful in acquiring the desired object we have temporary

pleasure. If we fail, we feel pain and loss. The end result is that we

experience stress and strain, and this is where many of the human

psychologies and philosophies spend their time... analyzing this eternal

dance of Goddess Maya.

Vedic philosophy and psychology takes us a lot further. The Scriptures tell

us that the soul is beyond mind. Scriptures also tell us that Maya is beyond

soul and God is beyond both Maya and soul. The implication here is that the

soul cannot even liberate itself as it is covered with Maya. It does not have

the power to do so. Furthermore, it tells us that no practical knowledge of

God and soul can be had by any amount of intellectual learning. Since the

mind itself is a manifestation of Maya, it cannot even conceive of that which

is Divine. These books teach that Divine knowledge is beyond the reach of the

human senses, human mind and human intelligence. If anyone desires to get

Divine knowledge and Divine enlightenment, he must surrender himself to

Godhead, and it is only through Grace alone that we can gain an understanding

of the Divine.

Now, according to the Vedas, there are five material layers (kosha) which

envelop the soul. Unless these sheaths are eliminated, the soul cannot attain

unity with Godhead. These sheaths are (i) physical body (annmaya kosha), (ii)

astral body and life breath (pranmaya kosha), (iii) mind (manomaya kosha),

(iv) trancendental intellect (vigyanmaya kosha), and (v) pleasure of pious

trancendence (anandamaya kosha). I'm assuming that these layers have a

correspondence with the tattwas.

The Bhagavatam says that by desireless devotion to Krishn, these material

sheaths are not only eliminated but completely burnt up forever, and a Divine

body is given to the devotee for the realization of His Divine Love.

The Bhagavatam further says: " As a result of devotion to me, My devotee

attains all the benefits of: (a) ritual deeds, (b) austerity, © Gyan or

Absolute Truth, (d) renunciation and asceticism, (e) all types of yoga (Laya

yoga, Nad yoga, Dhyana yoga, Hatha yoga, Kriya yoga, Raj yoga, Mantra yoga,

etc), (f) desireless charity, (g) pious deeds, and any other good actions.

Whatever My devotee desires, he receives with My Grace, whether it be the

abode of Indra (Heaven), emancipation or My own abode. " No intelligent

devotee would accept any of these when he can forever become one with Him and

reside forever in His Divine Abode. In His eight verses, Shikchastak,

Chaitanya Mahaprabhu Ji, describes the stages of devotion and tells us that

in the end the devotee's heart becomes completely free from material

defilments (Maya) and remains forever an eternal servant of Shree Krishna.

Where then does Gyan-marg and Samadhi take us. The Gyani desires

emancipation, the relaization of Absolute Truth, paravidya, Brahma-Gyan, and

because of the impossible situation of the mind and its oneness with Maya,

the Gyani can only reach this stage of enlightment by complete surrender to

God.

Then what of Samadhi? There are gross and subtle Lokas that make up the Mayic

world, seven in all. Beyond the material world, the celestial worlds exist

and beyond the celestial worlds " the great nothingness, " the absolute

abstract or mahashoonya exists... also called Prakruti. This all belongs to

Maya, but the most refined state of Maya is nontheless Maya. As I understand

it, this is where Samadhi takes us. It is not enlightment in the true sense

and once the mind leave the state of Samadhi, it once again is subject to all

the attractions.

The follower of the path of the Self experience the reflections of the

qualities of his own soul and from above we see that the soul cannot liberate

itself and he therefore stays in his own pious or Sattvic field under the

power of Maya. Sattva is a power of Maya. Whereas, those who are devoted to

Godhead receive the reflection of His Divine Grace/Love.

As I understand it, even after attaining Divine knowledge, the reflection of

Maya, lashavidya, remains until the physical death, but as ripples of Divne

Grace. So do the planets hold sway over such great beings? For those who have

received the Grace of Krishn, the eternal Devotee and the Gyani who has

received mukti-dham, I would say that maya and all its fluctuations become

those ripples of Divine Grace. For those who follow the path of the Self or

Samadhi, maya still has her grip on such individuals.

The philosophy of the Vedas is so deep! This is a long answer but your

question provoked me to delve into material that has been a preoccupation of

mine for almost 20 years.

Jai Shree Radhey

Brendan

> Om Sri Ram Jai Jai Ram Om

>

> Namaste Brendan, ( et. all)

> You have done an excellent job bringing additional light to this wonderful

> subject.

>

> Let me pose a question on the Navgraha's influence on a individual that

> transcends the Pancha Mahabhutas.

>

> Let me set the stage: ( question for consideration is at the end)

>

> It is interesting to note that Sri Kasava's ( " beautiful haired " or ka =

> Brahma, + a = Vishnu,

> + isa = Siva) instuctions to Arjuna in the Bhagavad Gita ( Chapt 2 verse

> 45):

> " trigunnayavisaya veda nistraigunyo bhava rijuna

> nirdvandvo nitya-sattvastho niryogaksema atmavan "

> Key message here is for Arjuna to be without the three gunas, free from

> duality, ever firm in sattwa,

> independent of possessions and possessed of the Self.

>

> This is of great interest in the conversation of the Pancha Mahabhutas. Sri

> Kesava's instruction is to transcend the 3 gunas and be firmly established

> in the Self (Atman).

> This individual now takes on a cosmic role in life. It is not that the

> play/display and manifestation of the 3 gunas do not continue, it that this

> person is now Jivanmukta, ( some say Mukta-Kusala) firmly established in

> the Self and operates there from.

> Sri Kesava goes on then and gives instructions: ( Chapt 2, verse 48)

> ... " Yogastha kuru karmani " established

> or fixed in Yoga ( this union with Self) perform action. Action within

the

> field of the gunas.

>

> According to Maharishi Patanjali in his Yoga Sutra's - the bringing about

of

> Samadhi " sterilizes " Klesas ( or or 5 afflictions) like roasted seeds and

> the absense of the manifestation of the Gunas. This results in a liberated

> soul ( Yoga Sutra's Chapter Two - On Practice).

>

> The individual now in this state of freedom enjoys 200% of life 100%

> Pursua + 100% Prakiti - balance and no longer bonded or influenced by the

> Gunas.

> Question:

> 1. Hence the Pancha Mahabhutas continue for the maintence of the body yet

> no longer bind?( additional karma)

>

> 2. What role or influence does the Navgraha's now have on this Jivanmuki?

> We can see liberation from several varga charts... what then can be seen

> from various charts

> once an individual becomes Enlightened? Does it apply?

>

> Siksyati Iti sisya

> Praanam,

October 3, 2000

Namaste Brendan,

Very insightful and rich with knowledge.... thank you for your comprehensive reply.

Just think what we have in store for those that choose this path.

pranams,

Bpfeeley [bpfeeley]Monday, October 02, 2000 9:09 AMvarahamihira Subject: Re: [sri Guru] Tattwa, Akasha, Moksha, Samadhi, etcHare KrishnaDear Frank,Before I answer your two questions, I would like to comment on the teaching of the Gita re the quotes you gave (Ch 2: 45, 48). Since your questions have to do with the state of enlightment and since I am a but a devotee on the path, ever hopeful that one day I might become even a blade of grass in Divine Vrindaban, I have to resort to the scriptures to give clear answers. I also want to clarify what enlightment means to me and I also want to distinguish between the state of God realization (Blissful union with the Divine), liberation into Absolute Truth (mukti dham or akchar Brahm) and Samadhi (trance). As astrologers we tend to use these terms loosely but the teachings of the Vedas are very clear on these different states of spiritual attainment.I'm going to start by making reference to the verses that you referred to re the Gita. In Chapter 2, Krishn is still trying to clear up Arjun's confusion and even though He tells him to be without the three gunas, He has not yet told him how to achieve that state. I believe it is true to say that the Upanishads are the origin of all spiritual knowledge and the Gita is said to be the essence of all the Upanshads, as it is spoken directly by Lord Krishna. The Gita is where the path to God realization is revealed and Beloved Krishn describes to us all about the condition of the mind and the world in His instruction to Arjun. A summary of the whole philosophy of the Gita is to be found in one out of the seven hundred verses (and there are other verses that also present this same teaching) and in that verse (9/31) Krishn makes a promise that the faithful devotee of His Personified form never falls from his devotion. In Chapter 18, verse 64 & 65 Krishn reveals his personal secret to Arjuna and says: "O, Arjun! Listen, you are dearly loved by Me, so, for your good, I reveal the secret of my innermost secrets to you, that if you will merge your mind in Me, love only Me, worship only Me and surrender only to Me, you will definitely attain My Divine association forever. This is my promise."When the importance of Divine attainment has finally dawned on the human mind, the Gita teaches how to surrender to Krishn while living in the world and facing worldly difficulties and surrender is done by constant and exclusive remembrance of His Name and Form with faith and love. This is what Krishn tells us.Vallabacharya, one of the four Jagadgurus, said in his writings, "There are four authoritative books among the scriptures, the Veda, the Gita, the Brahma-sutras and the Bhagavatam. The latter ones are explanatory to the former ones. The Bhagavatam is the final authority and is said to contain all the philosophies of the Veda, the Brahma-sutras and the Gita. So to comment on any spiritual principle we have to resort to the Bhagavatam. In the writings of other decended Saints or Jagadgurus (Nimbarkacharya, Ramanujacharya and Madhavacharya) we are presented with philosophies of God realization that agree with the Gita and Bhagavatam about surrender and complete dedication to the Name and Form of Krishn. Krishn tells us that His Name and Form are one and the same.Some time ago, it became clear to me the plight of the impossible situation for the ego and the mind. The prospect for the mind and intellect seemed hopeless and the tattwas explain this so well. The mind is a manifestation of Maya itself and therefore the attraction between the objects of the senses, the world, and the mind is eternal. The human mind, therefore, can never overcome this Mayic attraction. The story is familiar to all of us. We desire something because we believe it will bring us pleasure and so we develop an attachment for it. The attachment may lead to possession of the desired thing and if we are successful in acquiring the desired object we have temporary pleasure. If we fail, we feel pain and loss. The end result is that we experience stress and strain, and this is where many of the human psychologies and philosophies spend their time... analyzing this eternal dance of Goddess Maya.Vedic philosophy and psychology takes us a lot further. The Scriptures tell us that the soul is beyond mind. Scriptures also tell us that Maya is beyond soul and God is beyond both Maya and soul. The implication here is that the soul cannot even liberate itself as it is covered with Maya. It does not have the power to do so. Furthermore, it tells us that no practical knowledge of God and soul can be had by any amount of intellectual learning. Since the mind itself is a manifestation of Maya, it cannot even conceive of that which is Divine. These books teach that Divine knowledge is beyond the reach of the human senses, human mind and human intelligence. If anyone desires to get Divine knowledge and Divine enlightenment, he must surrender himself to Godhead, and it is only through Grace alone that we can gain an understanding of the Divine.Now, according to the Vedas, there are five material layers (kosha) which envelop the soul. Unless these sheaths are eliminated, the soul cannot attain unity with Godhead. These sheaths are (i) physical body (annmaya kosha), (ii) astral body and life breath (pranmaya kosha), (iii) mind (manomaya kosha), (iv) trancendental intellect (vigyanmaya kosha), and (v) pleasure of pious trancendence (anandamaya kosha). I'm assuming that these layers have a correspondence with the tattwas.The Bhagavatam says that by desireless devotion to Krishn, these material sheaths are not only eliminated but completely burnt up forever, and a Divine body is given to the devotee for the realization of His Divine Love.The Bhagavatam further says: "As a result of devotion to me, My devotee attains all the benefits of: (a) ritual deeds, (b) austerity, © Gyan or Absolute Truth, (d) renunciation and asceticism, (e) all types of yoga (Laya yoga, Nad yoga, Dhyana yoga, Hatha yoga, Kriya yoga, Raj yoga, Mantra yoga, etc), (f) desireless charity, (g) pious deeds, and any other good actions. Whatever My devotee desires, he receives with My Grace, whether it be the abode of Indra (Heaven), emancipation or My own abode." No intelligent devotee would accept any of these when he can forever become one with Him and reside forever in His Divine Abode. In His eight verses, Shikchastak, Chaitanya Mahaprabhu Ji, describes the stages of devotion and tells us that in the end the devotee's heart becomes completely free from material defilments (Maya) and remains forever an eternal servant of Shree Krishna.Where then does Gyan-marg and Samadhi take us. The Gyani desires emancipation, the relaization of Absolute Truth, paravidya, Brahma-Gyan, and because of the impossible situation of the mind and its oneness with Maya, the Gyani can only reach this stage of enlightment by complete surrender to God.Then what of Samadhi? There are gross and subtle Lokas that make up the Mayic world, seven in all. Beyond the material world, the celestial worlds exist and beyond the celestial worlds "the great nothingness," the absolute abstract or mahashoonya exists... also called Prakruti. This all belongs to Maya, but the most refined state of Maya is nontheless Maya. As I understand it, this is where Samadhi takes us. It is not enlightment in the true sense and once the mind leave the state of Samadhi, it once again is subject to all the attractions.The follower of the path of the Self experience the reflections of the qualities of his own soul and from above we see that the soul cannot liberate itself and he therefore stays in his own pious or Sattvic field under the power of Maya. Sattva is a power of Maya. Whereas, those who are devoted to Godhead receive the reflection of His Divine Grace/Love.As I understand it, even after attaining Divine knowledge, the reflection of Maya, lashavidya, remains until the physical death, but as ripples of Divne Grace. So do the planets hold sway over such great beings? For those who have received the Grace of Krishn, the eternal Devotee and the Gyani who has received mukti-dham, I would say that maya and all its fluctuations become those ripples of Divine Grace. For those who follow the path of the Self or Samadhi, maya still has her grip on such individuals.The philosophy of the Vedas is so deep! This is a long answer but your question provoked me to delve into material that has been a preoccupation of mine for almost 20 years.Jai Shree RadheyBrendan> Om Sri Ram Jai Jai Ram Om> > Namaste Brendan, ( et. all)> You have done an excellent job bringing additional light to this wonderful> subject.> > Let me pose a question on the Navgraha's influence on a individual that> transcends the Pancha Mahabhutas.> > Let me set the stage: ( question for consideration is at the end)> > It is interesting to note that Sri Kasava's ( "beautiful haired" or ka => Brahma, + a = Vishnu,> + isa = Siva) instuctions to Arjuna in the Bhagavad Gita ( Chapt 2 verse> 45):> "trigunnayavisaya veda nistraigunyo bhava rijuna> nirdvandvo nitya-sattvastho niryogaksema atmavan"> Key message here is for Arjuna to be without the three gunas, free from> duality, ever firm in sattwa,> independent of possessions and possessed of the Self.> > This is of great interest in the conversation of the Pancha Mahabhutas. Sri> Kesava's instruction is to transcend the 3 gunas and be firmly established> in the Self (Atman).> This individual now takes on a cosmic role in life. It is not that the> play/display and manifestation of the 3 gunas do not continue, it that this> person is now Jivanmukta, ( some say Mukta-Kusala) firmly established in> the Self and operates there from.> Sri Kesava goes on then and gives instructions: ( Chapt 2, verse 48)> ..."Yogastha kuru karmani" established> or fixed in Yoga ( this union with Self) perform action. Action within the> field of the gunas.> > According to Maharishi Patanjali in his Yoga Sutra's - the bringing about of> Samadhi "sterilizes" Klesas ( or or 5 afflictions) like roasted seeds and> the absense of the manifestation of the Gunas. This results in a liberated> soul ( Yoga Sutra's Chapter Two - On Practice).> > The individual now in this state of freedom enjoys 200% of life 100%> Pursua + 100% Prakiti - balance and no longer bonded or influenced by the> Gunas.> Question:> 1. Hence the Pancha Mahabhutas continue for the maintence of the body yet> no longer bind?( additional karma)> > 2. What role or influence does the Navgraha's now have on this Jivanmuki?> We can see liberation from several varga charts... what then can be seen> from various charts> once an individual becomes Enlightened? Does it apply?> > Siksyati Iti sisya> Praanam,OM TAT SATArchive: varahamihiraInfo: varahamihira/info.html