Guest guest Posted September 1, 2009 Report Share Posted September 1, 2009 Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Maja,Yes, allergy. The allergy is to a particular graha. Take lactose intolerance - would we not be looking for Moon? Why not look at the allergen itself - it is the nimitta for a karmic disfunction.I remember another small point. Take the weekday order. The graha who rules the day previous to AK is something the person cannot eat. Mars AK cannot take milk, Moon AK cannot take wheat etc.Regards,MichalMaja Å trbac <majastrbacastrosohamsa Sent: Tuesday, 1 September, 2009 10:56:38 PMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Om Gurave NamahDear Michal, namasteI do see a point in first paragraph of your email. Everything I write in my replies, please understand it as a big question, even though there is no question mark. It is loud thinking. Because this protein is typical for wheat, we should probably take Sy in consideration after all. But Krishnamurthy gave a very good point there in reply to us: wheat is not causing this problem. I will add one question to this in next reply.You were saying: "Badhakesh is for unseen problems that are drastic and shocking (like Rahu)." You just gave definition how it started. When first symptoms of celiac syndrome appear it is not so easy to give correct diagnosis. It is very shocking, drastic, weight loosing, swelling, elimination of everything one eats without absorption etc. Think of suffering this havoc for almost two months and listening to wrong diagnosys, even cancer at one point. This is one of the easiest illnesses she was experiencing so far. All of them were "drastic, shocking" and hard for determining correct diagnosis (or she was very "lucky" with choice of MD every time). I will have to ask what was the illness for which doctors told her she is about to die and they are powerless to help her (that was decade ago). That is why I was not giving up adding Rahu and Badhakstan to this story. My initial question was: should we just search karaka for autoimmune disease in chart, or stick to symptoms and karaka for area where they appear? I see both in this chart. Am I alone in this?Autoimmune diseases are not so simple as they may appear at first. Why there is no standard therapy which can bring to complete healing? "Celiac disease is quite standard, easily understood (diagnosed), and easily managed. " Only if you don't eat wheat. There is no other way known to allopathic medicine to manage it. This can manage symptomes, but can not cancel the cause.Classifying it as autoimmune disease is not a big discovery. It is easy to explain physiological background of what is happening during allergic reaction, but this is not including root cause (we are not all alergic). Problem is to determine which factors unleash this reaction of immune system (I am not aiming on allergen). Bottom line, it is still unknown. Do you notice any similarity with Rahu?Warm Regards,Maja Strbac--- On Mon, 8/31/09, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote:Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal >Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .comMonday, August 31, 2009, 6:41 PM Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Maja,There is protein in milk and peanuts. When we are dealing with the level of the graha should we look at the foods represented by them or microscopic levels they represent?In this case I am more inclined to look at 8th lord Sun. Badhakesh is for unseen problems that are drastic and shocking (like Rahu). Celiac disease is quite standard, easily understood (diagnosed), and easily managed. With this being the case why do you insist on looking at badhakstan? Perhaps the person has other health problems that may be due to this. Nodes on 1/7 axis definitely gives stomach problems but not necessarily celiac disease.Regards,MichalMaja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ >sohamsa@ .comTuesday, 1 September, 2009 12:33:16 PMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Om Gurave NamahDear Michal, namasteOne little detail, it can be relevant: Surya is karaka for wheat, but karaka for proteins is Mangal (I can point you to recent lessons where Sanjay was mentioning this). 6th and 8th lords joined-giving digestion related problems sounds pretty much common sense to me (as additional factor along with lagnesh in 6th. Celiac syndrome is not one and only serious health problem she was experiencing until nowadays), but I still see big Rahu/mangal parivartana "screaming" from badhakstan aspecting Lagna (health) by Rasi dristi. I just can't skip this part.Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Mon, 8/31/09, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote: Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal >Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .comMonday, August 31, 2009, 3:25 PM Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Maja and Krishna,Coeliac disease is caused by a reaction to gliadin, a gluten protein found in wheatSo is Sun not the culprit as Sun is karaka for wheat? Something external the body cannot digest - we have to look at 6th house. Lagnesh is in the 6th house for a start and it is Saturn. (Interestingly this will cause the AL to fall in the 11th house and thus Lagnesh is in the 8th from AL).In the chart provided Sun is 8th lord. When the 8th lord has anything to do with 6th house or lord it can give chronic digestive disease. Here Sun is conjoined 6th lord Mercury and in the 8th house from Moon - confirming the health issue. Narayana dasa of Leo was just running.Regards,MichalKrishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .comMonday, 31 August, 2009 9:42:46 PMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Maja,Frankly, when I first opened the chart, I too looked at Venus, as it is in Rahu-Ketu axis and also aspected by Marsand in papakartari. This could have its own ramifications at the appropriate time and may not be relevant to Celiac Disorder. I googled to get some details on Celiac disorder. From what I understand, I don't think it is a problem related to Mars, though it is a digestive disorder. The small intestine is affected and is unable to absorb some of the nutrients. Since it is the small intestine, one should look at the 6th house and the sign Virgo. In this case, the lord of both 6th house and Virgo both is Mercury. Mercury is combust and also disposits Saturn. Mercury and Rahu have a common dispositor and Saturn is in the nakshatra of Rahu, one can assume that rahu affects Mercury as well. The problem is on the lining of the small intestine which has some functions akin to skin also. That too calls for a look at Mercury as well. This is not a conclusion but my preliminary line of analysis. I need to look at more charts (thanks to Tarun for providing more charts and I am yet to take a look at them).Regards, KrishnaOn Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: Om Gurave NamahDear Krishnamurthy, namaste(Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for "water" also For a start, here is Celiac disorder native:DOB: 25th of April 1975TOB: 01:44 AMPOB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 Time zone is 01h East of GMTYou should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion?Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem sohamsa@ .comSunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM Dear Maja,Another good name :-)You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle.Regards,Krishna On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: Om Gurave NamahDear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste(two wonderful names indeed Your discussion made me think over some examples of "root cause" and manifestation of disease. Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine.Asthma - lungsVitiligo-skin All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this "global epidemic"), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join me to go through them together? Warm Regards to both,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .comFriday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM Dear Lakshmi,Yours is a good name too :-)Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question.OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic.Regards,KrishnaOn Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: Hare Rama Krishna Dear Krishnamurthy, Nice name! I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro. Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet. There is the seed , or origin, and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal "symptoms". Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind. Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are, where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved. Im saying Venus must be at the root of it. Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. Hope you understand my point. One "symptom" of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? Not at the skin, it is just one of many "symptoms". Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. Best wishes Lakshmi Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .com Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Lakshmi, I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. Did you want to say: - It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or - It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus Please clarify. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: Hare Rama Krishna Dear Krishnamurthy, Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body. Many skin problems are the result of "body chemistry" out of wack. Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue. Bottom line Many of these things overlap ( i mean karaka wise) Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? So I see it all as inter related. See primary issue, and then secondary issue. In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. Best wishes Lakshmi Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .com Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Sanjay, Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on "Essentials of Medical Astrology" puts leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. Comments welcome. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Krishna, Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted.In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house.In another sense Vayu tattva is "Sense object" for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. Warm Regards,Sanjay P 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Dear Sanjayji, Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? Regards, Krishna On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Jani, Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma.In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana.Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka.Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. Warm RegardsSanjay P2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani >>> >> Birth details of one my relative are follows. >> DOB 14/7/1972> Place: Navsari/Gujarat> Time: 20:20 Hrs>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice.>> M H Jani Natal Chart July 14, 1972 Time: 20:20:00Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT) Place: 72 E 55' 00", 20 N 51' 00" Navsari, India Altitude: 0.00 metersLunar Yr-Mo: Paridhavi - Ashadha Tithi: Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left)Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) Nakshatra: Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left)Yoga: Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) Karana: Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left)Hora Lord: Venus (5 min sign: Cn) Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi)Kaala Lord: Mars (Mahakala: Mars) Sunrise: 6:05:28Sunset: 19:22:37 Janma Ghatis: 35.6057Ayanamsa: 23-28-21.04 Sidereal Time: 15:11:56Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa Lagna 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp TaSun - AK 28 Ge 46' 16.46" Puna 3 Ge Ge Moon - GK 16 Le 30' 41.26" PPha 1 Le LeMars - PK 16 Cn 39' 20.95" Push 4 Cn Sc Mercury - MK 24 Cn 45' 21.10" Asre 3 Cn AqJupiter ® - DK 7 Sg 33' 17.92" Mool 3 Sg Ge Venus - BK 25 Ta 10' 43.28" Mrig 1 Ta LeSaturn - PiK 21 Ta 58' 15.19" Rohi 4 Ta CnRahu - AmK 2 Cp 48' 03.08" USha 2 Cp Cp Ketu 2 Cn 48' 03.08" Puna 4 Cn CnMaandi 19 Ar 25' 49.18" Bhar 2 Ar Vi Gulika 7 Ar 26' 28.59" Aswi 3 Ar GeBhava Lagna 1 Aq 50' 22.21" Dhan 3 Aq Li Hora Lagna 5 Vi 28' 25.28" UPha 3 Vi AqGhati Lagna 16 Ge 22' 34.48" Ardr 3 Ge Aq Vighati Lagna 10 Ta 53' 20.48" Rohi 1 Ta ArVarnada Lagna 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge Ar Sree Lagna 10 Ar 42' 53.24" Aswi 4 Ar CnPranapada Lagna 11 Vi 27' 17.80" Hast 1 Vi Ar Indu Lagna 16 Vi 30' 41.26" Hast 2 Vi TaBhrigu Bindu 24 Ar 39' 22.17" Bhar 4 Ar ScDhooma 12 Sc 06' 16.46" Anu 3 Sc Li Vyatipata 17 Le 53' 43.54" PPha 2 Le ViParivesha 17 Aq 53' 43.54" Sata 4 Aq Pi Indra Chapa 12 Ta 06' 16.46" Rohi 1 Ta ArUpaketu 28 Ta 46' 16.46" Mrig 2 Ta Vi Kaala 1 Ge 04' 56.04" Mrig 3 Ge LiMrityu 10 Cp 12' 36.34" Srav 1 Cp Ar Artha Prahara 3 Aq 14' 51.48" Dhan 3 Aq LiYama Ghantaka 28 Aq 41' 23.20" PBha 3 Aq GePrana Sphuta 21 Pi 58' 04.14" Reva 2 Pi Cp Deha Sphuta 19 Ar 31' 58.71" Bhar 2 Ar ViMrityu Sphuta 20 Le 51' 36.61" PPha 3 Le Li Sookshma TriSphuta 2 Vi 21' 39.45" UPha 2 Vi CpTriSphuta 8 Ge 51' 28.97" Ardr 1 Ge Sg ChatusSphuta 7 Vi 37' 45.43" UPha 4 Vi PiPanchaSphuta 10 Ge 25' 48.50" Ardr 2 Ge Cp V2 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi TaV3 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li LeV4 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Vi V5 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq SgV6 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta Ta V7 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge ArV8 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi Ta V9 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li SgV10 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Vi V11 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq LeV12 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta Ta Kunda 7 Ta 19' 47.81" Krit 4 Ta Pi+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + | |Md Gk |Ve Sa |Su GL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | | |Ma Me || | |Ke | | | | || | | || | | | |----------- | Rasi |----------- ||As Ra | |Mo || | | | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | |JuR | | |HL AL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +| | |As |Su JuR | | | | |Gk || | | | | | | | | || | | | | |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- ||Me HL | |Sa Ke | |GL | | || | | || | | | | | Navamsa | ||----------- | |----------- | |Ra | D-9 |Mo Ve || | |AL | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | |Ma | |Md || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + Vimsottari Dasa (): Ven Ven 1967-10-10 Sun 1971-02-05 Moon 1972-02-05 Mars 1973-10-09 Rah 1974-12-08 Jup 1977-12-08 Sat 1980-08-08 Merc 1983-10-10 Ket 1986-08-09 Sun Sun 1987-10-10 Moon 1988-01-25 Mars 1988-07-27 Rah 1988-12-02 Jup 1989-10-27 Sat 1990-08-15 Merc 1991-07-28 Ket 1992-05-31 Ven 1992-10-09 Moon Moon 1993-10-09 Mars 1994-08-09 Rah 1995-03-07 Jup 1996-09-09 Sat 1998-01-07 Merc 1999-08-09 Ket 2001-01-06 Ven 2001-08-09 Sun 2003-04-06 Mars Mars 2003-10-10 Rah 2004-03-03 Jup 2005-03-22 Sat 2006-02-26 Merc 2007-04-06 Ket 2008-04-03 Ven 2008-09-02 Sun 2009-11-03 Moon 2010-03-07 Rah Rah 2010-10-10 Jup 2013-06-19 Sat 2015-11-15 Merc 2018-09-21 Ket 2021-04-06 Ven 2022-04-25 Sun 2025-04-24 Moon 2026-03-19 Mars 2027-09-22 Jup Jup 2028-10-09 Sat 2030-11-27 Merc 2033-06-07 Ket 2035-09-16 Ven 2036-08-21 Sun 2039-04-19 Moon 2040-02-06 Mars 2041-06-07 Rah 2042-05-13 Sat Sat 2044-10-09 Merc 2047-10-13 Ket 2050-06-20 Ven 2051-07-31 Sun 2054-10-01 Moon 2055-09-13 Mars 2057-04-09 Rah 2058-05-20 Jup 2061-03-25 Merc Merc 2063-10-10 Ket 2066-03-04 Ven 2067-03-02 Sun 2070-01-01 Moon 2070-11-09 Mars 2072-04-06 Rah 2073-04-03 Jup 2075-10-25 Sat 2078-01-28 Ket Ket 2080-10-10 Ven 2081-03-04 Sun 2082-05-04 Moon 2082-09-13 Mars 2083-04-10 Rah 2083-09-10 Jup 2084-09-28 Sat 2085-09-03 Merc 2086-10-13 Need mail bonding? 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Guest guest Posted September 2, 2009 Report Share Posted September 2, 2009 Dear Michal,You said:Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. It is clear that I am focusing on the root cause of the problem and you are focusing on the remedies for the problem. It appears to me that we are at different ends of the domain that we need to address. But, a remedy suggested without understanding the cause fully could be incomplete and ineffective. It is like treating just the symptoms and not addressing the root cause. Regards, Krishna On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal wrote:  Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Krishna,It is the earth that revolves around the Sun. Nevertheless we take the geocentric viewpoint. So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. So which do we use? It is like chicken and egg situation - which came first? For a person with celiac disorder, they are fine as long as they don't eat wheat (Sun). When they see a loaf of bread they say no thanks. This is how it is manifesting in their experiential world. That the doctor tells them about this protein and this immune system is something secondary as far as they're concerned because the primary thing the doctor tells them is don't eat anything which contains gluten. So when we look at the chart we need to be clear what we are looking at ie. which level are we going to. Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. Regards,Michal Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 sohamsa Sent: Tuesday, 1 September, 2009 4:56:56 PM Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem  Dear Michal, It depends on how one is looking at the problem. From my perspective, the native will not be able to digest Gluten etc., after the damage is caused. And, Gluten by itself does not cause the damage to start with. Hence, what you are describing as the cause is an after effect of having the damage already in place. What causes the damage is the autoimmune reaction in the first place. Dear Maja, Yes, I am the same SY SY... person :-) Virgo has two malefic aspects and not just one. Both Mars and Ketu aspect Virgo. And, it is a good observation from Amit that Mercury is conjunct (and combust by) 8th lord Sun. In addition, Mercury occupies 8th house from Virgo. It is evident that Virgo, 6H and Mercury are all  afflicted. Regards, KrishnaOn Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote:  Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Maja and Krishna,Coeliac disease is caused by a reaction to gliadin, a gluten protein found in wheat So is Sun not the culprit as Sun is karaka for wheat? Something external the body cannot digest - we have to look at 6th house. Lagnesh is in the 6th house for a start and it is Saturn. (Interestingly this will cause the AL to fall in the 11th house and thus Lagnesh is in the 8th from AL). In the chart provided Sun is 8th lord. When the 8th lord has anything to do with 6th house or lord it can give chronic digestive disease. Here Sun is conjoined 6th lord Mercury and in the 8th house from Moon - confirming the health issue. Narayana dasa of Leo was just running.Regards,Michal Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> sohamsa@ .comMonday, 31 August, 2009 9:42:46 PM Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem  Dear Maja,Frankly, when I first opened the chart, I too looked at Venus, as it is in Rahu-Ketu axis and also aspected by Marsand in papakartari. This could have its own ramifications at the appropriate time and may not be relevant to Celiac Disorder. I googled to get some details on Celiac disorder. From what I understand, I don't think it is a problem related to Mars, though it is a digestive disorder. The small intestine is affected and is unable to absorb some of the nutrients. Since it is the small intestine, one should look at the 6th house and the sign Virgo. In this case, the lord of both 6th house and Virgo both is Mercury. Mercury is combust and also disposits Saturn. Mercury and Rahu have a common dispositor and Saturn is in the nakshatra of Rahu, one can assume that rahu affects Mercury as well. The problem is on the lining of the small intestine which has some functions akin to skin also. That too calls for a look at Mercury as well. This is not a conclusion but my preliminary line of analysis. I need to look at more charts (thanks to Tarun for providing more charts and I am yet to take a look at them).Regards, KrishnaOn Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote:  Om Gurave NamahDear Krishnamurthy, namaste(Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for " water " also For a start, here is Celiac disorder native:DOB: 25th of April 1975TOB: 01:44 AMPOB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 Time zone is 01h East of GMTYou should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion?Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem sohamsa@ .comSunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM  Dear Maja,Another good name :-)You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle.Regards,Krishna On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote:  Om Gurave NamahDear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste(two wonderful names indeed Your discussion made me think over some examples of " root cause " and manifestation of disease. Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine.Asthma - lungsVitiligo-skin All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this " global epidemic " ), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join me to go through them together? Warm Regards to both,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .comFriday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM  Dear Lakshmi,Yours is a good name too :-)Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question.OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic.Regards,KrishnaOn Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote:  Hare Rama Krishna Dear Krishnamurthy, Nice name!  I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro.  Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet.  There is the seed , or origin,  and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal " symptoms " . Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind.  Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are,  where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved.  Im saying Venus must be at the root of it.  Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. Hope you understand my point. One " symptom " of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? Not at the skin, it is just one of many " symptoms " . Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. Best wishes Lakshmi     Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .com Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem  Dear Lakshmi, I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. Did you want to say: - It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or - It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus Please clarify. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote:  Hare Rama Krishna Dear Krishnamurthy, Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body.  Many skin problems are the result of " body chemistry " out of wack. Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue.  Bottom line Many of these things overlap ( i mean karaka wise)  Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? So I see it all as inter related. See primary issue, and then secondary issue. In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. Best wishes Lakshmi    Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .com Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem  Dear Sanjay, Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on " Essentials of Medical Astrology " puts  leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out  leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. Comments welcome. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote:  || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Krishna, Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted.In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house.In another sense Vayu tattva is " Sense object " for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. Warm Regards,Sanjay P 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Dear Sanjayji, Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? Regards, Krishna On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote:  || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Jani, Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma.In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana.Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka.Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. Warm RegardsSanjay P2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani >>>  >> Birth details of one my relative are follows. >> DOB 14/7/1972> Place: Navsari/Gujarat> Time: 20:20 Hrs>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice.>> M H Jani Natal Chart     July 14, 1972 Time:      20:20:00Time Zone:   5:30:00 (East of GMT) Place:     72 E 55' 00 " , 20 N 51' 00 "        Navsari, India Altitude:    0.00 metersLunar Yr-Mo:  Paridhavi - Ashadha Tithi:     Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left)Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) Nakshatra:   Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left)Yoga:      Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) Karana:     Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left)Hora Lord:   Venus (5 min sign: Cn) Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi)Kaala Lord:   Mars (Mahakala: Mars) Sunrise:    6:05:28Sunset:     19:22:37 Janma Ghatis:  35.6057Ayanamsa:    23-28-21.04 Sidereal Time: 15:11:56Body         Longitude     Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa Lagna        14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  TaSun - AK       28 Ge 46' 16.46 " Puna    3   Ge  Ge Moon - GK      16 Le 30' 41.26 " PPha    1   Le  LeMars - PK      16 Cn 39' 20.95 " Push    4   Cn  Sc Mercury - MK     24 Cn 45' 21.10 " Asre    3   Cn  AqJupiter ® - DK   7 Sg 33' 17.92 " Mool    3   Sg  Ge Venus - BK      25 Ta 10' 43.28 " Mrig    1   Ta  LeSaturn - PiK     21 Ta 58' 15.19 " Rohi    4   Ta  CnRahu - AmK      2 Cp 48' 03.08 " USha    2   Cp  Cp Ketu         2 Cn 48' 03.08 " Puna    4   Cn  CnMaandi        19 Ar 25' 49.18 " Bhar    2   Ar  Vi Gulika        7 Ar 26' 28.59 " Aswi    3   Ar  GeBhava Lagna      1 Aq 50' 22.21 " Dhan    3   Aq  Li Hora Lagna      5 Vi 28' 25.28 " UPha    3   Vi  AqGhati Lagna     16 Ge 22' 34.48 " Ardr    3   Ge  Aq Vighati Lagna    10 Ta 53' 20.48 " Rohi    1   Ta  ArVarnada Lagna    14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr    3   Ge  Ar Sree Lagna      10 Ar 42' 53.24 " Aswi    4   Ar  CnPranapada Lagna   11 Vi 27' 17.80 " Hast    1   Vi  Ar Indu Lagna      16 Vi 30' 41.26 " Hast    2   Vi  TaBhrigu Bindu     24 Ar 39' 22.17 " Bhar    4   Ar  ScDhooma        12 Sc 06' 16.46 " Anu    3   Sc  Li Vyatipata      17 Le 53' 43.54 " PPha    2   Le  ViParivesha      17 Aq 53' 43.54 " Sata    4   Aq  Pi Indra Chapa     12 Ta 06' 16.46 " Rohi    1   Ta  ArUpaketu       28 Ta 46' 16.46 " Mrig    2   Ta  Vi Kaala         1 Ge 04' 56.04 " Mrig    3   Ge  LiMrityu        10 Cp 12' 36.34 " Srav    1   Cp  Ar Artha Prahara     3 Aq 14' 51.48 " Dhan    3   Aq  LiYama Ghantaka    28 Aq 41' 23.20 " PBha    3   Aq  GePrana Sphuta     21 Pi 58' 04.14 " Reva    2   Pi  Cp Deha Sphuta     19 Ar 31' 58.71 " Bhar    2   Ar  ViMrityu Sphuta    20 Le 51' 36.61 " PPha    3   Le  Li Sookshma TriSphuta  2 Vi 21' 39.45 " UPha    2   Vi  CpTriSphuta       8 Ge 51' 28.97 " Ardr    1   Ge  Sg ChatusSphuta     7 Vi 37' 45.43 " UPha    4   Vi  PiPanchaSphuta     10 Ge 25' 48.50 " Ardr    2   Ge  Cp V2          14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast    2   Vi  TaV3          14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat    3   Li  LeV4          14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Vi V5          14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata    3   Aq  SgV6          14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi    2   Ta  Ta V7          14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr    3   Ge  ArV8          14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast    2   Vi  Ta V9          14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat    3   Li  SgV10         14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Vi V11         14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata    3   Aq  LeV12         14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi    2   Ta  Ta Kunda         7 Ta 19' 47.81 " Krit    4   Ta  Pi+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + |      |Md  Gk   |Ve  Sa   |Su  GL   ||      |      |      |      | |      |      |      |      ||      |      |      |      | |      |      |      |      ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | |      |            |Ma  Me   ||      |            |Ke     | |      |            |      ||      |            |      ||      |            |      | |----------- |     Rasi      |----------- ||As  Ra   |            |Mo     ||      |            |      | |      |            |      ||      |            |      | |      |            |      ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | |JuR     |      |      |HL  AL   ||      |      |      |      | |      |      |      |      ||      |      |      |      | |      |      |      |      |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +|      |      |As     |Su  JuR  | |      |      |      |Gk     ||      |      |      |      | |      |      |      |      ||      |      |      |      | |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- ||Me  HL   |            |Sa  Ke   | |GL     |            |      ||      |            |      ||      |            |      | |      |     Navamsa     |      ||----------- |            |----------- | |Ra     |      D-9      |Mo  Ve   ||      |            |AL     | |      |            |      ||      |            |      | |      |            |      ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | |      |Ma     |      |Md     ||      |      |      |      | |      |      |      |      ||      |      |      |      | |      |      |      |      |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + Vimsottari Dasa (): Ven  Ven 1967-10-10  Sun 1971-02-05  Moon 1972-02-05    Mars 1973-10-09  Rah 1974-12-08  Jup 1977-12-08    Sat 1980-08-08  Merc 1983-10-10  Ket 1986-08-09  Sun  Sun 1987-10-10  Moon 1988-01-25  Mars 1988-07-27    Rah 1988-12-02  Jup 1989-10-27  Sat 1990-08-15    Merc 1991-07-28  Ket 1992-05-31  Ven 1992-10-09  Moon  Moon 1993-10-09  Mars 1994-08-09  Rah 1995-03-07     Jup 1996-09-09  Sat 1998-01-07  Merc 1999-08-09     Ket 2001-01-06  Ven 2001-08-09  Sun 2003-04-06  Mars  Mars 2003-10-10  Rah 2004-03-03  Jup 2005-03-22     Sat 2006-02-26  Merc 2007-04-06  Ket 2008-04-03     Ven 2008-09-02  Sun 2009-11-03  Moon 2010-03-07  Rah  Rah 2010-10-10  Jup 2013-06-19  Sat 2015-11-15    Merc 2018-09-21  Ket 2021-04-06  Ven 2022-04-25    Sun 2025-04-24  Moon 2026-03-19  Mars 2027-09-22  Jup  Jup 2028-10-09  Sat 2030-11-27  Merc 2033-06-07    Ket 2035-09-16  Ven 2036-08-21  Sun 2039-04-19    Moon 2040-02-06  Mars 2041-06-07  Rah 2042-05-13  Sat  Sat 2044-10-09  Merc 2047-10-13  Ket 2050-06-20    Ven 2051-07-31  Sun 2054-10-01  Moon 2055-09-13    Mars 2057-04-09  Rah 2058-05-20  Jup 2061-03-25  Merc  Merc 2063-10-10  Ket 2066-03-04  Ven 2067-03-02     Sun 2070-01-01  Moon 2070-11-09  Mars 2072-04-06     Rah 2073-04-03  Jup 2075-10-25  Sat 2078-01-28  Ket  Ket 2080-10-10  Ven 2081-03-04  Sun 2082-05-04    Moon 2082-09-13  Mars 2083-04-10  Rah 2083-09-10    Jup 2084-09-28  Sat 2085-09-03  Merc 2086-10-13   Need mail bonding? 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Guest guest Posted September 2, 2009 Report Share Posted September 2, 2009 Om Gurave NamahDear Amit, namasteMe being so late with reply, please understand it as a big compliment. I needed time to go through your email few times and think over it.First, I would leave Nakshatras out of health discussion for now. I would not mix physical problems with mentality and social environment. Besides, my level of knowledge related to Nakshatras is quite poor, so I can't give any comments in this regard.Second, Chandra and Sukra are both Jala tatva, that is true, but I would not blame Sukra afflictions for blood disorders. I would rather take Chandra for this instead. I was writing something about Vargotama Ch AK in my second reply to Krishnamurthy, I would like to read your comment on it.You were saying: "Maha dasa of guru (lord of 3rd and A8,12th house in badhka amsa)was going on which is functional malfic hemmed between mars and surya under curse from rahu from the badhka. bhukti of shukra which is 5th lord and 10th lord afflicted by badhka rahu and mars .. "OK, now please imagine I am uneducated girl who cant even read and write. Imagine I don't have a clue what Jyotish is. How would you explain me what this paragraph means? I have a reason why I chose this paragraph. I consider it relevant for this issue. BTW native is female.Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Mon, 8/31/09, Amit Puri <amitpuri20 wrote:Amit Puri <amitpuri20Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa Date: Monday, August 31, 2009, 9:10 PM Namskar majachk and let me know your comments native is makkra lagna chirta nakshtra lagna lord in 6th house first indication for ill heath 6th lord and 9th lord budha is paka lagna lord joining the 8th lord second indication for chronic problem surya lording natural 5th house.. bahdka ketu with shukra creating problem for 5th house. jala tattwa affication is must for immune system disorder this is happening in the 5th house by the badhka …… shurka is only benefic influence on the lagna where as ketu and rahu aspecting the lagna by rashi dristi to do worst. Maha dasa of guru (lord of 3rd and A8,12th house in badhka amsa)was going on which is functional malfic hemmed between mars and surya under curse from rahu from the badhka. bhukti of shukra which is 5th lord and 10th lord afflicted by badhka rahu and mars .. ..moola dasa of shani is going on at that time antra was of 6th lord budha which is paka lagna lord too.when we chk navmansh the venus is 4 lord from lagna .. In whole rahu placed in badhka house third from AK in rashi played big role in this.. now rahu remedy can do some better job for her.. Transit .. rahu vargootma was transiting on mesha in badhka nakshtra Ashwani in mesha which is paka lagna lord 8th lord surya placed .. the satrun was also in its natal position at that time i.,e 6th house .. I think you will get some guide line to calm down his naga dosha.. RegaredAmit puri 2009/8/31 Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > Om Gurave NamahDear Amit, namasteIt started during February 2005. Problem is still present. Warm Regards,Maja--- On Sun, 8/30/09, amitpuri20 <amitpuri20 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: amitpuri20 <amitpuri20 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .com Sunday, August 30, 2009, 6:12 PM Namskar maja please mention the date of manifestation of this problem .. regard sohamsa@ .com, Maja Ã… trbac <majastrbacastro@ ...> wrote: > > Om Gurave Namah > > Dear Krishnamurthy, namaste > > (Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for "water" also > > For a start, here is Celiac disorder native: > DOB: 25th of April 1975 > TOB: 01:44 AM > POB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 > Time zone is 01h East of GMT > > You should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. > > Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion? > > Warm Regards, > Maja Strbac > > Hari Om Tat Sat > > --- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ ...> wrote: > > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ ...> > Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > sohamsa@ .com > Sunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM > > > > > > >  > > > > > > Dear Maja, > Another good name :-) > You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. > > Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle. > Regards,Krishna > > > On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Ã… trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah > > Dear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste > > (two wonderful names indeed > > > Your discussion made me think over some examples of "root cause" and manifestation of disease. > Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine. > Asthma - lungs > Vitiligo-skin > > > All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). > > > Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this "global epidemic"), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? > > > I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join > me to go through them together? > > Warm Regards to both, > Maja Strbac > > Hari Om Tat Sat > > > > --- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> wrote: > > > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > > Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > sohamsa@ .com > Friday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM > > > > > > > >  > > > Dear Lakshmi, > Yours is a good name too :-) > Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question. > OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. > > > I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic. > Regards,Krishna > > On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > Hare Rama Krishna > Dear Krishnamurthy, > Nice name! >  > I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro. >  > Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet. >  > There is the seed , or origin, >  and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, > it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal "symptoms". > Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind. >  > Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, > to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are, >  where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. > In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) > But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved. >  Im saying Venus must be at the root of it. >  > Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. > Hope you understand my point. > One "symptom" of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. > One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. > One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. > So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? > Not at the skin, it is just one of many "symptoms". > Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . > Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. > Best wishes > Lakshmi >  >  >  > >  > > > > > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > sohamsa@ .com > > > Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PM > Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > > > >  > > Dear Lakshmi, > > > I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. > > > Did you want to say: > > > - It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or > - It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus > > > Please clarify. > > > Regards, > Krishna > > > On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > > > >  > > > > > > Hare Rama Krishna > Dear Krishnamurthy, > Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. > When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body. >  > Many skin problems are the result of "body chemistry" out of wack. > Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. > Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue. >  > Bottom line Many of these things overlap > ( i mean karaka wise) >  > Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? > So I see it all as inter related. > See primary issue, and then secondary issue. > In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. > Best wishes > Lakshmi >  >  > >  > > > > > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > sohamsa@ .com > > > Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AM > Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > > > > >  > > Dear Sanjay, > > > Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. > > > > > Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on "Essentials of Medical Astrology" puts  leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out  leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. > > > > > Comments welcome. > > > Regards, > Krishna > > > > On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > > > > >  > > > > || Om Gurave Namah || > Dear Krishna, > >  Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). > > > > But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted. > > In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. > > > > Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's > house. > > In another sense Vayu tattva is "Sense object" for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. > > > > Warm Regards, > Sanjay P > > > > > 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > > > > > > > > Dear Sanjayji, > > > Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? > > > > Regards, > Krishna > > > > > > On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > > > > >  > > > > || Om Gurave Namah || > > Dear Jani, > >  Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma. > In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. > > > We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana. > > Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka. > > Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, > > > > Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. > > I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. > > > > Warm Regards > Sanjay P > > > > 2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani > > > > >  > > > > Birth details of one my relative are follows. > > > > > > DOB 14/7/1972 > > Place: Navsari/Gujarat > > Time: 20:20 Hrs > > > > Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice. > > > > M H Jani > > > > > > Natal Chart > >      July 14, 1972 > > > Time:      20:20:00 > Time Zone:   5:30:00 (East of GMT) > > > Place:     72 E 55' 00", 20 N 51' 00" >        Navsari, India > > > Altitude:    0.00 meters > > Lunar Yr-Mo:  Paridhavi - Ashadha > > > Tithi:     Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left) > Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) > > > Nakshatra:   Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left) > Yoga:      Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) > > > Karana:     Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left) > Hora Lord:   Venus (5 min sign: Cn) > > > Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi) > Kaala Lord:   Mars (Mahakala: Mars) > > > > Sunrise:    6:05:28 > Sunset:     19:22:37 > > > Janma Ghatis:  35.6057 > > Ayanamsa:    23-28-21.04 > > > Sidereal Time: 15:11:56 > > Body         Longitude     Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa > > > > Lagna        14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav    2   Cp  Ta > Sun - AK       28 Ge 46' 16.46" Puna    3   Ge  Ge > > > Moon - GK      16 Le 30' 41.26" PPha    1   Le  Le > Mars - PK      16 Cn 39' 20.95" Push    4   Cn  Sc > > > Mercury - MK     24 Cn 45' 21.10" Asre    3   Cn  Aq > Jupiter ® - DK   7 Sg 33' 17.92" Mool    3   Sg  Ge > > > Venus - BK      25 Ta 10' 43.28" Mrig    1   Ta  Le > Saturn - PiK     21 Ta 58' > 15.19" Rohi    4   Ta  Cn > Rahu - AmK      2 Cp 48' 03.08" USha    2   Cp  Cp > > > Ketu         2 Cn 48' 03.08" Puna    4   Cn  Cn > Maandi        19 Ar 25' 49.18" Bhar    2   Ar  Vi > > > Gulika        7 Ar 26' 28.59" Aswi    3   Ar  > Ge > Bhava Lagna      1 Aq 50' 22.21" Dhan    3   Aq  Li > > > Hora Lagna      5 Vi 28' 25.28" UPha    3   Vi  Aq > Ghati Lagna     16 Ge 22' 34.48" Ardr    3   Ge  Aq > > > Vighati Lagna    10 Ta 53' 20.48" Rohi    1   Ta  Ar > Varnada Lagna    14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr    3   Ge  Ar > > > Sree Lagna      10 Ar 42' 53.24" Aswi    4   Ar  Cn > Pranapada Lagna   11 Vi 27' 17.80" Hast    1   Vi  Ar > > > Indu Lagna      16 Vi 30' 41.26" Hast    2   Vi  Ta > Bhrigu Bindu     24 Ar 39' 22.17" Bhar    4   Ar >  Sc > Dhooma        12 Sc 06' 16.46" Anu    3   Sc  Li > > > Vyatipata      17 Le 53' 43.54" PPha    2   Le  Vi > Parivesha      17 Aq 53' 43.54" Sata    4   Aq  Pi > > > Indra Chapa     12 Ta 06' 16.46" Rohi    1   Ta  Ar > Upaketu       28 Ta 46' 16.46" Mrig    2   Ta  Vi > > > Kaala         1 Ge 04' 56.04" Mrig    3   Ge  Li > Mrityu        10 Cp 12' 36.34" Srav    1   Cp  Ar > > > Artha Prahara     3 Aq 14' 51.48" Dhan    3   Aq  Li > Yama Ghantaka  >   28 Aq 41' 23.20" PBha    3   Aq  Ge > Prana Sphuta     21 Pi 58' 04.14" Reva    2   Pi  Cp > > > Deha Sphuta     19 Ar 31' 58.71" Bhar    2   Ar  Vi > Mrityu Sphuta    20 Le 51' 36.61" PPha    3   Le  Li > > > Sookshma TriSphuta  2 Vi 21' 39.45" UPha    2   Vi  Cp > TriSphuta       8 Ge 51' 28.97" Ardr    1   Ge  Sg > > > ChatusSphuta     7 Vi 37' 45.43" UPha    4   Vi  Pi > PanchaSphuta     10 Ge 25' 48.50" Ardr    2   Ge  Cp > > > V2          14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast    2   Vi  Ta > V3  >         14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat    3   Li  Le > V4          14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav    2   Cp  Vi > > > V5          14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata    3   Aq  Sg > V6          14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi    2   Ta  Ta > > > V7   >        14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr    3   Ge  Ar > V8          14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast    2   Vi  Ta > > > V9          14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat    3   Li  Sg > V10         14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav    2   Cp  Vi > > > V11     >     14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata    3   Aq  Le > V12         14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi    2   Ta  Ta > > > Kunda         7 Ta 19' 47.81" Krit    4   Ta  Pi > > +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > > > |      |Md  Gk   |Ve  Sa  >  |Su  GL   | > |      |      |      |      | > > |      |      |      |      | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |      |     >  |      |      | > |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > > > |      |            |Ma  Me   | > |      |            |Ke     | > > > |      |            | >      | > |      |            |      | > |      |            |      | > > > |----------- |     Rasi      |----------- | > |As  Ra   |            > |Mo     | > |      |            |      | > > |      |            |      | > |      |            |      | > > > |      |   >          |      | > |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > > > |JuR     |      |      |HL  AL   | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |      |      |     >  |      | > |      |      |      |      | > > |      |      |      |      | > +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > > > +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > |      |      |As     |Su  JuR  | > > > |      |      |      |Gk     | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |      |      |      |      | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > |Me  HL   |            |Sa  Ke   | > > > |GL     |            |      | > |   >    |            |      | > |      |            |      | > > > |      |     Navamsa     |      | > |----------- |            |----------- | > > > |Ra  >    |      D-9      |Mo  Ve   | > |      |            |AL     | > > > |      |            |      | > |      |            |      | > > > |      |            |      | > |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > > > |      |Ma     |      |Md     | > |      |      |      |      | > > > | >      |      |      |      | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |      |      |      |      | > +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (): > > > > Ven  Ven 1967-10-10  Sun 1971-02-05  Moon 1972-02-05  >   Mars 1973-10-09  Rah 1974-12-08  Jup 1977-12-08  > > >   Sat 1980-08-08  Merc 1983-10-10  Ket 1986-08-09  > Sun  Sun 1987-10-10  Moon 1988-01-25  Mars 1988-07-27  > > >   Rah 1988-12-02  Jup 1989-10-27  Sat 1990-08-15  >   Merc 1991-07-28  Ket 1992-05-31  Ven 1992-10-09  > > > Moon  Moon 1993-10-09  Mars 1994-08-09  Rah 1995-03-07  >    Jup 1996-09-09  Sat 1998-01-07  Merc 1999-08-09  > > >    Ket 2001-01-06  Ven 2001-08-09  Sun 2003-04-06  > Mars  Mars 2003-10-10  Rah 2004-03-03  Jup 2005-03-22  > > >    Sat 2006-02-26  Merc 2007-04-06  Ket 2008-04-03  >    Ven 2008-09-02  Sun 2009-11-03  Moon 2010-03-07  > > > Rah  Rah 2010-10-10  Jup 2013-06-19  Sat 2015-11-15  >   Merc 2018-09-21  Ket 2021-04-06  Ven 2022-04-25  > > >   Sun 2025-04-24 >  Moon 2026-03-19  Mars 2027-09-22  > Jup  Jup 2028-10-09  Sat 2030-11-27  Merc 2033-06-07  > > >   Ket 2035-09-16  Ven 2036-08-21  Sun 2039-04-19  >   Moon 2040-02-06  Mars 2041-06-07  Rah 2042-05-13  > > > Sat  Sat 2044-10-09  Merc 2047-10-13  Ket 2050-06-20  >   Ven 2051-07-31  Sun 2054-10-01  Moon 2055-09-13  > > >   Mars 2057-04-09  Rah 2058-05-20  Jup 2061-03-25  > Merc  Merc 2063-10-10  Ket 2066-03-04  Ven 2067-03-02  > > >    Sun 2070-01-01  Moon 2070-11-09  Mars 2072-04-06  >    Rah 2073-04-03  Jup 2075-10-25  Sat 2078-01-28  > > > Ket  Ket 2080-10-10  Ven 2081-03-04  Sun 2082-05-04  >   Moon 2082-09-13  Mars 2083-04-10  Rah 2083-09-10  > > >   Jup 2084-09-28  Sat 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Guest guest Posted September 2, 2009 Report Share Posted September 2, 2009 Om Gurave NamahDear Michal and Krishnamurthy, namasteIt is a little bit of a problem to understand each other and continue dialogue if we are not looking at same subject from same perspective.Michal: "So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. "No, scientifically it is a problem with immune system which secondary leads to problems with digestion. I am trying to agree on this order of symptoms and find them in charts. Do you still consider this order to be wrong? I see no chicken/egg dilemma in this order. I completely agree on including Graha signifying particular allergen, but I would not start or end chart observation with this. That is what I am trying to say, and I think Krishnamurthy is trying same among rest of his points. Getting rid of allergen is not curing anything, problem is still there in body. People suffering celiac syndrome are not perfectly fine if they exclude 80% of grains (only corn, rice and buckwheat don't contain gluten). They are excluding valuable source for large number of vitamins from B group (especially if they are ovo-lacto, lacto or ovo vegetarians). Synthetic supplements can't replace it perfectly speaking in long terms. What I am trying to say is: excluding gluten is just a small patch over a big, open wound. It is like someone is having Kala Sarpa Yoga on 5/11th axis in chart (and imagine that positions related to KSY are really pointing on problems related to progeny), and you give them advice to chant Santana Gopala mantra (and maybe add prasidha Savitur Gayatri for just in case) to accomplish progeny. It is a good advice, but... it is skipping the root cause.Let me rephrase my initial question: What is primary for observation about autoimmune diseases: positions in chart pointing on autoimmune disorders (probably signified by Rahu) or secondary symptoms (lungs, digestion, skin)? When we determine positions pointing on autoimmune disorders, how do we relate them with particular body part where they manifest? I would also like to read reply on Tarun's question.Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Tue, 9/1/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 wrote:Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma ProblemTo: sohamsa Date: Tuesday, September 1, 2009, 8:12 PM Dear Michal,You said:Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. It is clear that I am focusing on the root cause of the problem and you are focusing on the remedies for the problem. It appears to me that we are at different ends of the domain that we need to address. But, a remedy suggested without understanding the cause fully could be incomplete and ineffective. It is like treating just the symptoms and not addressing the root cause. Regards, Krishna On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote: Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Krishna,It is the earth that revolves around the Sun. Nevertheless we take the geocentric viewpoint. So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. So which do we use? It is like chicken and egg situation - which came first? For a person with celiac disorder, they are fine as long as they don't eat wheat (Sun). When they see a loaf of bread they say no thanks. This is how it is manifesting in their experiential world. That the doctor tells them about this protein and this immune system is something secondary as far as they're concerned because the primary thing the doctor tells them is don't eat anything which contains gluten. So when we look at the chart we need to be clear what we are looking at ie. which level are we going to. Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. Regards,Michal Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> sohamsa@ .comTuesday, 1 September, 2009 4:56:56 PM Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Michal, It depends on how one is looking at the problem. From my perspective, the native will not be able to digest Gluten etc., after the damage is caused. And, Gluten by itself does not cause the damage to start with. Hence, what you are describing as the cause is an after effect of having the damage already in place. What causes the damage is the autoimmune reaction in the first place. Dear Maja, Yes, I am the same SY SY... person :-) Virgo has two malefic aspects and not just one. Both Mars and Ketu aspect Virgo. And, it is a good observation from Amit that Mercury is conjunct (and combust by) 8th lord Sun. In addition, Mercury occupies 8th house from Virgo. It is evident that Virgo, 6H and Mercury are all afflicted. Regards, KrishnaOn Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote: Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Maja and Krishna,Coeliac disease is caused by a reaction to gliadin, a gluten protein found in wheat So is Sun not the culprit as Sun is karaka for wheat? Something external the body cannot digest - we have to look at 6th house. Lagnesh is in the 6th house for a start and it is Saturn. (Interestingly this will cause the AL to fall in the 11th house and thus Lagnesh is in the 8th from AL). In the chart provided Sun is 8th lord. When the 8th lord has anything to do with 6th house or lord it can give chronic digestive disease. Here Sun is conjoined 6th lord Mercury and in the 8th house from Moon - confirming the health issue. Narayana dasa of Leo was just running.Regards,Michal Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> sohamsa@ .comMonday, 31 August, 2009 9:42:46 PM Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Maja,Frankly, when I first opened the chart, I too looked at Venus, as it is in Rahu-Ketu axis and also aspected by Marsand in papakartari. This could have its own ramifications at the appropriate time and may not be relevant to Celiac Disorder. I googled to get some details on Celiac disorder. From what I understand, I don't think it is a problem related to Mars, though it is a digestive disorder. The small intestine is affected and is unable to absorb some of the nutrients. Since it is the small intestine, one should look at the 6th house and the sign Virgo. In this case, the lord of both 6th house and Virgo both is Mercury. Mercury is combust and also disposits Saturn. Mercury and Rahu have a common dispositor and Saturn is in the nakshatra of Rahu, one can assume that rahu affects Mercury as well. The problem is on the lining of the small intestine which has some functions akin to skin also. That too calls for a look at Mercury as well. This is not a conclusion but my preliminary line of analysis. I need to look at more charts (thanks to Tarun for providing more charts and I am yet to take a look at them).Regards, KrishnaOn Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: Om Gurave NamahDear Krishnamurthy, namaste(Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for "water" also For a start, here is Celiac disorder native:DOB: 25th of April 1975TOB: 01:44 AMPOB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 Time zone is 01h East of GMTYou should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion?Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem sohamsa@ .comSunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM Dear Maja,Another good name :-)You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle.Regards,Krishna On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: Om Gurave NamahDear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste(two wonderful names indeed Your discussion made me think over some examples of "root cause" and manifestation of disease. Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine.Asthma - lungsVitiligo-skin All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this "global epidemic"), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join me to go through them together? Warm Regards to both,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .comFriday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM Dear Lakshmi,Yours is a good name too :-)Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question.OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic.Regards,KrishnaOn Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: Hare Rama Krishna Dear Krishnamurthy, Nice name! I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro. Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet. There is the seed , or origin, and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal "symptoms". Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind. Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are, where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved. Im saying Venus must be at the root of it. Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. Hope you understand my point. One "symptom" of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? Not at the skin, it is just one of many "symptoms". Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. Best wishes Lakshmi Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .com Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Lakshmi, I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. Did you want to say: - It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or - It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus Please clarify. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: Hare Rama Krishna Dear Krishnamurthy, Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body. Many skin problems are the result of "body chemistry" out of wack. Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue. Bottom line Many of these things overlap ( i mean karaka wise) Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? So I see it all as inter related. See primary issue, and then secondary issue. In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. Best wishes Lakshmi Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .com Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Sanjay, Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on "Essentials of Medical Astrology" puts leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. Comments welcome. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Krishna, Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted.In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house.In another sense Vayu tattva is "Sense object" for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. Warm Regards,Sanjay P 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Dear Sanjayji, Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? Regards, Krishna On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Jani, Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma.In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana.Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka.Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. Warm RegardsSanjay P2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani >>> >> Birth details of one my relative are follows. >> DOB 14/7/1972> Place: Navsari/Gujarat> Time: 20:20 Hrs>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice.>> M H Jani Natal Chart July 14, 1972 Time: 20:20:00Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT) Place: 72 E 55' 00", 20 N 51' 00" Navsari, India Altitude: 0.00 metersLunar Yr-Mo: Paridhavi - Ashadha Tithi: Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left)Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) Nakshatra: Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left)Yoga: Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) Karana: Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left)Hora Lord: Venus (5 min sign: Cn) Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi)Kaala Lord: Mars (Mahakala: Mars) Sunrise: 6:05:28Sunset: 19:22:37 Janma Ghatis: 35.6057Ayanamsa: 23-28-21.04 Sidereal Time: 15:11:56Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa Lagna 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp TaSun - AK 28 Ge 46' 16.46" Puna 3 Ge Ge Moon - GK 16 Le 30' 41.26" PPha 1 Le LeMars - PK 16 Cn 39' 20.95" Push 4 Cn Sc Mercury - MK 24 Cn 45' 21.10" Asre 3 Cn AqJupiter ® - DK 7 Sg 33' 17.92" Mool 3 Sg Ge Venus - BK 25 Ta 10' 43.28" Mrig 1 Ta LeSaturn - PiK 21 Ta 58' 15.19" Rohi 4 Ta CnRahu - AmK 2 Cp 48' 03.08" USha 2 Cp Cp Ketu 2 Cn 48' 03.08" Puna 4 Cn CnMaandi 19 Ar 25' 49.18" Bhar 2 Ar Vi Gulika 7 Ar 26' 28.59" Aswi 3 Ar GeBhava Lagna 1 Aq 50' 22.21" Dhan 3 Aq Li Hora Lagna 5 Vi 28' 25.28" UPha 3 Vi AqGhati Lagna 16 Ge 22' 34.48" Ardr 3 Ge Aq Vighati Lagna 10 Ta 53' 20.48" Rohi 1 Ta ArVarnada Lagna 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge Ar Sree Lagna 10 Ar 42' 53.24" Aswi 4 Ar CnPranapada Lagna 11 Vi 27' 17.80" Hast 1 Vi Ar Indu Lagna 16 Vi 30' 41.26" Hast 2 Vi TaBhrigu Bindu 24 Ar 39' 22.17" Bhar 4 Ar ScDhooma 12 Sc 06' 16.46" Anu 3 Sc Li Vyatipata 17 Le 53' 43.54" PPha 2 Le ViParivesha 17 Aq 53' 43.54" Sata 4 Aq Pi Indra Chapa 12 Ta 06' 16.46" Rohi 1 Ta ArUpaketu 28 Ta 46' 16.46" Mrig 2 Ta Vi Kaala 1 Ge 04' 56.04" Mrig 3 Ge LiMrityu 10 Cp 12' 36.34" Srav 1 Cp Ar Artha Prahara 3 Aq 14' 51.48" Dhan 3 Aq LiYama Ghantaka 28 Aq 41' 23.20" PBha 3 Aq GePrana Sphuta 21 Pi 58' 04.14" Reva 2 Pi Cp Deha Sphuta 19 Ar 31' 58.71" Bhar 2 Ar ViMrityu Sphuta 20 Le 51' 36.61" PPha 3 Le Li Sookshma TriSphuta 2 Vi 21' 39.45" UPha 2 Vi CpTriSphuta 8 Ge 51' 28.97" Ardr 1 Ge Sg ChatusSphuta 7 Vi 37' 45.43" UPha 4 Vi PiPanchaSphuta 10 Ge 25' 48.50" Ardr 2 Ge Cp V2 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi TaV3 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li LeV4 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Vi V5 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq SgV6 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta Ta V7 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge ArV8 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi Ta V9 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li SgV10 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Vi V11 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq LeV12 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta Ta Kunda 7 Ta 19' 47.81" Krit 4 Ta Pi+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + | |Md Gk |Ve Sa |Su GL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | | |Ma Me || | |Ke | | | | || | | || | | | |----------- | Rasi |----------- ||As Ra | |Mo || | | | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | |JuR | | |HL AL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +| | |As |Su JuR | | | | |Gk || | | | | | | | | || | | | | |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- ||Me HL | |Sa Ke | |GL | | || | | || | | | | | Navamsa | ||----------- | |----------- | |Ra | D-9 |Mo Ve || | |AL | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | |Ma | |Md || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + Vimsottari Dasa (): Ven Ven 1967-10-10 Sun 1971-02-05 Moon 1972-02-05 Mars 1973-10-09 Rah 1974-12-08 Jup 1977-12-08 Sat 1980-08-08 Merc 1983-10-10 Ket 1986-08-09 Sun Sun 1987-10-10 Moon 1988-01-25 Mars 1988-07-27 Rah 1988-12-02 Jup 1989-10-27 Sat 1990-08-15 Merc 1991-07-28 Ket 1992-05-31 Ven 1992-10-09 Moon Moon 1993-10-09 Mars 1994-08-09 Rah 1995-03-07 Jup 1996-09-09 Sat 1998-01-07 Merc 1999-08-09 Ket 2001-01-06 Ven 2001-08-09 Sun 2003-04-06 Mars Mars 2003-10-10 Rah 2004-03-03 Jup 2005-03-22 Sat 2006-02-26 Merc 2007-04-06 Ket 2008-04-03 Ven 2008-09-02 Sun 2009-11-03 Moon 2010-03-07 Rah Rah 2010-10-10 Jup 2013-06-19 Sat 2015-11-15 Merc 2018-09-21 Ket 2021-04-06 Ven 2022-04-25 Sun 2025-04-24 Moon 2026-03-19 Mars 2027-09-22 Jup Jup 2028-10-09 Sat 2030-11-27 Merc 2033-06-07 Ket 2035-09-16 Ven 2036-08-21 Sun 2039-04-19 Moon 2040-02-06 Mars 2041-06-07 Rah 2042-05-13 Sat Sat 2044-10-09 Merc 2047-10-13 Ket 2050-06-20 Ven 2051-07-31 Sun 2054-10-01 Moon 2055-09-13 Mars 2057-04-09 Rah 2058-05-20 Jup 2061-03-25 Merc Merc 2063-10-10 Ket 2066-03-04 Ven 2067-03-02 Sun 2070-01-01 Moon 2070-11-09 Mars 2072-04-06 Rah 2073-04-03 Jup 2075-10-25 Sat 2078-01-28 Ket Ket 2080-10-10 Ven 2081-03-04 Sun 2082-05-04 Moon 2082-09-13 Mars 2083-04-10 Rah 2083-09-10 Jup 2084-09-28 Sat 2085-09-03 Merc 2086-10-13 Need mail bonding? 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Guest guest Posted September 2, 2009 Report Share Posted September 2, 2009 You were saying: " Maha dasa of guru (lord of 3rd and A8,12th house in badhka amsa) was going on which is functional malfic hemmed between  mars and surya under curse from  rahu from the badhka. bhukti of shukra which is 5th lord and 10th lord afflicted by badhka rahu and mars ... please read this way:- In makkra lagna Maha dasa of Jupiter who is lording the 3rd and 12th house from lagna where mirtyupada is placed .. for makkra lagna jupiter is functional malefic hemmed between  4th lord and lord mangal and the 8th lord sura .. the shukra is  under shapa from Rahu placed in badhka Stahan  and satrun.. antra dasa of shukra which is 5th lord and 10th lord from lagna and this is also shapit by ketu/rahu and mars and ... i hope this is clear now.. REgard 2009/9/2 Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro  Om Gurave NamahDear Amit, namasteMe being so late with reply, please understand it as a big compliment. I needed time to go through your email few times and think over it. First, I would leave Nakshatras out of health discussion for now. I would not mix physical problems with mentality and social environment. Besides, my level of knowledge related to Nakshatras is quite poor, so I can't give any comments in this regard. Second, Chandra and Sukra are both Jala tatva, that is true, but I would not blame Sukra afflictions for blood disorders. I would rather take Chandra for this instead. I was writing something about Vargotama Ch AK in my second reply to Krishnamurthy, I would like to read your comment on it. You were saying: " Maha dasa of guru (lord of 3rd and A8,12th house in badhka amsa)was going on which is functional malfic hemmed between mars and surya under curse from rahu from the badhka. bhukti of shukra which is 5th lord and 10th lord afflicted by badhka rahu and mars .. " OK, now please imagine I am uneducated girl who cant even read and write. Imagine I don't have a clue what Jyotish is. How would you explain me what this paragraph means? I have a reason why I chose this paragraph. I consider it relevant for this issue. BTW native is female. Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Mon, 8/31/09, Amit Puri <amitpuri20 wrote: Amit Puri <amitpuri20Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa Monday, August 31, 2009, 9:10 PM  Namskar majachk and let me know your comments native  is makkra lagna chirta nakshtra lagna lord in 6th house first indication  for ill heath 6th lord and 9th lord budha is paka lagna lord joining the 8th lord second indication for chronic problem surya lording natural 5th house.. bahdka ketu with shukra creating problem for 5th house. jala tattwa affication is must for immune system disorder this is happening in the 5th house by the badhka …… shurka is only benefic influence on the lagna where as ketu and rahu aspecting the lagna by rashi dristi to do worst. Maha dasa of guru (lord of 3rd and A8,12th house in badhka amsa)was going on which is functional malfic hemmed between mars and surya under curse from rahu from the badhka. bhukti of shukra which is 5th lord and 10th lord afflicted by badhka rahu and mars ..  ..moola dasa of  shani is going on at that time antra was of 6th lord budha which is paka lagna lord too.when we chk navmansh the venus is 4 lord from lagna .. In whole rahu placed in badhka house third from AK in rashi played big role in this..  now rahu remedy can do some better job for her.. Transit .. rahu vargootma was transiting on mesha in badhka nakshtra Ashwani in mesha  which  is paka lagna lord  8th lord surya  placed ..  the satrun was also in its natal position at that time i.,e 6th house .. I think you will get some guide line to calm down his naga dosha..  RegaredAmit puri  2009/8/31 Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ >  Om Gurave NamahDear Amit, namasteIt started during February 2005. Problem is still present. Warm Regards,Maja--- On Sun, 8/30/09, amitpuri20 <amitpuri20 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: amitpuri20 <amitpuri20 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .com Sunday, August 30, 2009, 6:12 PM  Namskar maja please mention the date of manifestation of this problem .. regard sohamsa@ .com, Maja Ã…Â trbac <majastrbacastro@ ...> wrote: > > Om Gurave Namah > > Dear Krishnamurthy, namaste > > (Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for " water " also > > For a start, here is Celiac disorder native: > DOB: 25th of April 1975 > TOB: 01:44 AM > POB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 > Time zone is 01h East of GMT > > You should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. > > Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion? > > Warm Regards, > Maja Strbac > > Hari Om Tat Sat > > --- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ ...> wrote: > > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ ...> > Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > sohamsa@ .com > Sunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM > > > > > > >  > > > > > > Dear Maja, > Another good name :-) > You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. > > Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle. > Regards,Krishna > > > On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Ã…Â trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah > > Dear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste > > (two wonderful names indeed > > > Your discussion made me think over some examples of " root cause " and manifestation of disease. > Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine. > Asthma - lungs > Vitiligo-skin > > > All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). > > > Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this " global epidemic " ), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? > > > I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join > me to go through them together? > > Warm Regards to both, > Maja Strbac > > Hari Om Tat Sat > > > > --- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> wrote: > > > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > > Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > sohamsa@ .com > Friday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM > > > > > > > >  > > > Dear Lakshmi, > Yours is a good name too :-) > Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question. > OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. > > > I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic. > Regards,Krishna > > On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > Hare Rama Krishna > Dear Krishnamurthy, > Nice name! >  > I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro. >  > Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet. >  > There is the seed , or origin, >  and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, > it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal " symptoms " . > Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind. >  > Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, > to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are, >  where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. > In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) > But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved. >  Im saying Venus must be at the root of it. >  > Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. > Hope you understand my point. > One " symptom " of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. > One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. > One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. > So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? > Not at the skin, it is just one of many " symptoms " . > Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . > Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. > Best wishes > Lakshmi >  >  >  > >  > > > > > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > sohamsa@ .com > > > Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PM > Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > > > >  > > Dear Lakshmi, > > > I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. > > > Did you want to say: > > > - It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or > - It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus > > > Please clarify. > > > Regards, > Krishna > > > On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > > > >  > > > > > > Hare Rama Krishna > Dear Krishnamurthy, > Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. > When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body. >  > Many skin problems are the result of " body chemistry " out of wack. > Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. > Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue. >  > Bottom line Many of these things overlap > ( i mean karaka wise) >  > Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? > So I see it all as inter related. > See primary issue, and then secondary issue. > In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. > Best wishes > Lakshmi >  >  > >  > > > > > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > sohamsa@ .com > > > Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AM > Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > > > > >  > > Dear Sanjay, > > > Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. > > > > > Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on " Essentials of Medical Astrology " puts  leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out  leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. > > > > > Comments welcome. > > > Regards, > Krishna > > > > On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > > > > >  > > > > || Om Gurave Namah || > Dear Krishna, > >  Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). > > > > But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted. > > In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. > > > > Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's > house. > > In another sense Vayu tattva is " Sense object " for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. > > > > Warm Regards, > Sanjay P > > > > > 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > > > > > > > > Dear Sanjayji, > > > Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? > > > > Regards, > Krishna > > > > > > On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > > > > >  > > > > || Om Gurave Namah || > > Dear Jani, > >  Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma. > In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. > > > We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana. > > Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka. > > Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, > > > > Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. > > I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. > > > > Warm Regards > Sanjay P > > > > 2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani > > > > >  > > > > Birth details of one my relative are follows. > > > > > > DOB 14/7/1972 > > Place: Navsari/Gujarat > > Time: 20:20 Hrs > > > > Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice. > > > > M H Jani > > > > > > Natal Chart > >      July 14, 1972 > > > Time:      20:20:00 > Time Zone:   5:30:00 (East of GMT) > > > Place:     72 E 55' 00 " , 20 N 51' 00 " >        Navsari, India > > > Altitude:    0.00 meters > > Lunar Yr-Mo:  Paridhavi - Ashadha > > > Tithi:     Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left) > Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) > > > Nakshatra:   Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left) > Yoga:      Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) > > > Karana:     Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left) > Hora Lord:   Venus (5 min sign: Cn) > > > Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi) > Kaala Lord:   Mars (Mahakala: Mars) > > > > Sunrise:    6:05:28 > Sunset:     19:22:37 > > > Janma Ghatis:  35.6057 > > Ayanamsa:    23-28-21.04 > > > Sidereal Time: 15:11:56 > > Body         Longitude     Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa > > > > Lagna        14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Ta > Sun - AK       28 Ge 46' 16.46 " Puna    3   Ge  Ge > > > Moon - GK      16 Le 30' 41.26 " PPha    1   Le  Le > Mars - PK      16 Cn 39' 20.95 " Push    4   Cn  Sc > > > Mercury - MK     24 Cn 45' 21.10 " Asre    3   Cn  Aq > Jupiter ® - DK   7 Sg 33' 17.92 " Mool    3   Sg  Ge > > > Venus - BK      25 Ta 10' 43.28 " Mrig    1   Ta  Le > Saturn - PiK     21 Ta 58' > 15.19 " Rohi    4   Ta  Cn > Rahu - AmK      2 Cp 48' 03.08 " USha    2   Cp  Cp > > > Ketu         2 Cn 48' 03.08 " Puna    4   Cn  Cn > Maandi        19 Ar 25' 49.18 " Bhar    2   Ar  Vi > > > Gulika        7 Ar 26' 28.59 " Aswi    3   Ar  > Ge > Bhava Lagna      1 Aq 50' 22.21 " Dhan    3   Aq  Li > > > Hora Lagna      5 Vi 28' 25.28 " UPha    3   Vi  Aq > Ghati Lagna     16 Ge 22' 34.48 " Ardr    3   Ge  Aq > > > Vighati Lagna    10 Ta 53' 20.48 " Rohi    1   Ta  Ar > Varnada Lagna    14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr    3   Ge  Ar > > > Sree Lagna      10 Ar 42' 53.24 " Aswi    4   Ar  Cn > Pranapada Lagna   11 Vi 27' 17.80 " Hast    1   Vi  Ar > > > Indu Lagna      16 Vi 30' 41.26 " Hast    2   Vi  Ta > Bhrigu Bindu     24 Ar 39' 22.17 " Bhar    4   Ar >  Sc > Dhooma        12 Sc 06' 16.46 " Anu    3   Sc  Li > > > Vyatipata      17 Le 53' 43.54 " PPha    2   Le  Vi > Parivesha      17 Aq 53' 43.54 " Sata    4   Aq  Pi > > > Indra Chapa     12 Ta 06' 16.46 " Rohi    1   Ta  Ar > Upaketu       28 Ta 46' 16.46 " Mrig    2   Ta  Vi > > > Kaala         1 Ge 04' 56.04 " Mrig    3   Ge  Li > Mrityu        10 Cp 12' 36.34 " Srav    1   Cp  Ar > > > Artha Prahara     3 Aq 14' 51.48 " Dhan    3   Aq  Li > Yama Ghantaka  >   28 Aq 41' 23.20 " PBha    3   Aq  Ge > Prana Sphuta     21 Pi 58' 04.14 " Reva    2   Pi  Cp > > > Deha Sphuta     19 Ar 31' 58.71 " Bhar    2   Ar  Vi > Mrityu Sphuta    20 Le 51' 36.61 " PPha    3   Le  Li > > > Sookshma TriSphuta  2 Vi 21' 39.45 " UPha    2   Vi  Cp > TriSphuta       8 Ge 51' 28.97 " Ardr    1   Ge  Sg > > > ChatusSphuta     7 Vi 37' 45.43 " UPha    4   Vi  Pi > PanchaSphuta     10 Ge 25' 48.50 " Ardr    2   Ge  Cp > > > V2          14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast    2   Vi  Ta > V3  >         14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat    3   Li  Le > V4          14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Vi > > > V5          14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata    3   Aq  Sg > V6          14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi    2   Ta  Ta > > > V7   >        14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr    3   Ge  Ar > V8          14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast    2   Vi  Ta > > > V9          14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat    3   Li  Sg > V10         14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Vi > > > V11     >     14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata    3   Aq  Le > V12         14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi    2   Ta  Ta > > > Kunda         7 Ta 19' 47.81 " Krit    4   Ta  Pi > > +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > > > |      |Md  Gk   |Ve  Sa  >  |Su  GL   | > |      |      |      |      | > > |      |      |      |      | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |      |     >  |      |      | > |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > > > |      |            |Ma  Me   | > |      |            |Ke     | > > > |      |            | >      | > |      |            |      | > |      |            |      | > > > |----------- |     Rasi      |----------- | > |As  Ra   |            > |Mo     | > |      |            |      | > > |      |            |      | > |      |            |      | > > > |      |   >          |      | > |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > > > |JuR     |      |      |HL  AL   | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |      |      |     >  |      | > |      |      |      |      | > > |      |      |      |      | > +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > > > +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > |      |      |As     |Su  JuR  | > > > |      |      |      |Gk     | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |      |      |      |      | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > |Me  HL   |            |Sa  Ke   | > > > |GL     |            |      | > |   >    |            |      | > |      |            |      | > > > |      |     Navamsa     |      | > |----------- |            |----------- | > > > |Ra  >    |      D-9      |Mo  Ve   | > |      |            |AL     | > > > |      |            |      | > |      |            |      | > > > |      |            |      | > |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > > > |      |Ma     |      |Md     | > |      |      |      |      | > > > | >      |      |      |      | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |      |      |      |      | > +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (): > > > > Ven  Ven 1967-10-10  Sun 1971-02-05  Moon 1972-02-05  >   Mars 1973-10-09  Rah 1974-12-08  Jup 1977-12-08  > > >   Sat 1980-08-08  Merc 1983-10-10  Ket 1986-08-09  > Sun  Sun 1987-10-10  Moon 1988-01-25  Mars 1988-07-27  > > >   Rah 1988-12-02  Jup 1989-10-27  Sat 1990-08-15  >   Merc 1991-07-28  Ket 1992-05-31  Ven 1992-10-09  > > > Moon  Moon 1993-10-09  Mars 1994-08-09  Rah 1995-03-07  >    Jup 1996-09-09  Sat 1998-01-07  Merc 1999-08-09  > > >    Ket 2001-01-06  Ven 2001-08-09  Sun 2003-04-06  > Mars  Mars 2003-10-10  Rah 2004-03-03  Jup 2005-03-22  > > >    Sat 2006-02-26  Merc 2007-04-06  Ket 2008-04-03  >    Ven 2008-09-02  Sun 2009-11-03  Moon 2010-03-07  > > > Rah  Rah 2010-10-10  Jup 2013-06-19  Sat 2015-11-15  >   Merc 2018-09-21  Ket 2021-04-06  Ven 2022-04-25  > > >   Sun 2025-04-24 >  Moon 2026-03-19  Mars 2027-09-22  > Jup  Jup 2028-10-09  Sat 2030-11-27  Merc 2033-06-07  > > >   Ket 2035-09-16  Ven 2036-08-21  Sun 2039-04-19  >   Moon 2040-02-06  Mars 2041-06-07  Rah 2042-05-13  > > > Sat  Sat 2044-10-09  Merc 2047-10-13  Ket 2050-06-20  >   Ven 2051-07-31  Sun 2054-10-01  Moon 2055-09-13  > > >   Mars 2057-04-09  Rah 2058-05-20  Jup 2061-03-25  > Merc  Merc 2063-10-10  Ket 2066-03-04  Ven 2067-03-02  > > >    Sun 2070-01-01  Moon 2070-11-09  Mars 2072-04-06  >    Rah 2073-04-03  Jup 2075-10-25  Sat 2078-01-28  > > > Ket  Ket 2080-10-10  Ven 2081-03-04  Sun 2082-05-04  >   Moon 2082-09-13  Mars 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Guest guest Posted September 2, 2009 Report Share Posted September 2, 2009 Dear Maja,Good, we seem to have similar views about the problem and the approach. You have raised a pertinent question - What is primary for observation about autoimmune diseases: positions in chart pointing on autoimmune disorders (probably signified by Rahu) or secondary symptoms (lungs, digestion, skin)? When we determine positions pointing on autoimmune disorders, how do we relate them with particular body part where they manifest? To start with, I feel that the auto-immune disease could manifest if a particular planet (or planets, representing a particular organ) is weak and on top of that it is afflicted by the nodes. We have to check for a given disease if the weakness and affliction to just one planet or more planets is a necessary condition. For example: 1. In case of juvenile diabetes, weak Venus(pancreas), 5H/5L (location of pancreas) and Mars(marrow) all afflicted by Rahu is a necessary condition.2. Based on a few charts, I feel that for leucoderma, weak Mercury(skin) and Venus(appearance) afflicted by Rahu/Ketu could be the answer. I need to look at some more charts before I start believing this. Similarly, for Celiac Disorder, one thing that we could agree on without dispute is that 6H/6L should be looked into. I also feel that Mercury(small intestine lining) should also be considered. But, not 100% sure at this point in time. I will try to study the few charts available to see if I could come up with something. Any inputs or more charts from you are welcome. Regards,KrishnaOn Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 4:41 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro wrote:  Om Gurave NamahDear Michal and Krishnamurthy, namasteIt is a little bit of a problem to understand each other and continue dialogue if we are not looking at same subject from same perspective. Michal: " So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. " No, scientifically it is a problem with immune system which secondary leads to problems with digestion. I am trying to agree on this order of symptoms and find them in charts. Do you still consider this order to be wrong? I see no chicken/egg dilemma in this order. I completely agree on including Graha signifying particular allergen, but I would not start or end chart observation with this. That is what I am trying to say, and I think Krishnamurthy is trying same among rest of his points. Getting rid of allergen is not curing anything, problem is still there in body. People suffering celiac syndrome are not perfectly fine if they exclude 80% of grains (only corn, rice and buckwheat don't contain gluten). They are excluding valuable source for large number of vitamins from B group (especially if they are ovo-lacto, lacto or ovo vegetarians). Synthetic supplements can't replace it perfectly speaking in long terms. What I am trying to say is: excluding gluten is just a small patch over a big, open wound. It is like someone is having Kala Sarpa Yoga on 5/11th axis in chart (and imagine that positions related to KSY are really pointing on problems related to progeny), and you give them advice to chant Santana Gopala mantra (and maybe add prasidha Savitur Gayatri for just in case) to accomplish progeny. It is a good advice, but... it is skipping the root cause. Let me rephrase my initial question: What is primary for observation about autoimmune diseases: positions in chart pointing on autoimmune disorders (probably signified by Rahu) or secondary symptoms (lungs, digestion, skin)? When we determine positions pointing on autoimmune disorders, how do we relate them with particular body part where they manifest? I would also like to read reply on Tarun's question.Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Tue, 9/1/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem To: sohamsa Date: Tuesday, September 1, 2009, 8:12 PM  Dear Michal,You said:Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. It is clear that I am focusing on the root cause of the problem and you are focusing on the remedies for the problem. It appears to me that we are at different ends of the domain that we need to address. But, a remedy suggested without understanding the cause fully could be incomplete and ineffective. It is like treating just the symptoms and not addressing the root cause. Regards, Krishna On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote:  Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Krishna,It is the earth that revolves around the Sun. Nevertheless we take the geocentric viewpoint. So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. So which do we use? It is like chicken and egg situation - which came first? For a person with celiac disorder, they are fine as long as they don't eat wheat (Sun). When they see a loaf of bread they say no thanks. This is how it is manifesting in their experiential world. That the doctor tells them about this protein and this immune system is something secondary as far as they're concerned because the primary thing the doctor tells them is don't eat anything which contains gluten. So when we look at the chart we need to be clear what we are looking at ie. which level are we going to. Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. Regards,Michal Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> sohamsa@ .comTuesday, 1 September, 2009 4:56:56 PM Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem  Dear Michal, It depends on how one is looking at the problem. From my perspective, the native will not be able to digest Gluten etc., after the damage is caused. And, Gluten by itself does not cause the damage to start with. Hence, what you are describing as the cause is an after effect of having the damage already in place. What causes the damage is the autoimmune reaction in the first place. Dear Maja, Yes, I am the same SY SY... person :-) Virgo has two malefic aspects and not just one. Both Mars and Ketu aspect Virgo. And, it is a good observation from Amit that Mercury is conjunct (and combust by) 8th lord Sun. In addition, Mercury occupies 8th house from Virgo. It is evident that Virgo, 6H and Mercury are all  afflicted. Regards, KrishnaOn Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote:  Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Maja and Krishna,Coeliac disease is caused by a reaction to gliadin, a gluten protein found in wheat So is Sun not the culprit as Sun is karaka for wheat? Something external the body cannot digest - we have to look at 6th house. Lagnesh is in the 6th house for a start and it is Saturn. (Interestingly this will cause the AL to fall in the 11th house and thus Lagnesh is in the 8th from AL). In the chart provided Sun is 8th lord. When the 8th lord has anything to do with 6th house or lord it can give chronic digestive disease. Here Sun is conjoined 6th lord Mercury and in the 8th house from Moon - confirming the health issue. Narayana dasa of Leo was just running.Regards,Michal Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> sohamsa@ .comMonday, 31 August, 2009 9:42:46 PM Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem  Dear Maja,Frankly, when I first opened the chart, I too looked at Venus, as it is in Rahu-Ketu axis and also aspected by Marsand in papakartari. This could have its own ramifications at the appropriate time and may not be relevant to Celiac Disorder. I googled to get some details on Celiac disorder. From what I understand, I don't think it is a problem related to Mars, though it is a digestive disorder. The small intestine is affected and is unable to absorb some of the nutrients. Since it is the small intestine, one should look at the 6th house and the sign Virgo. In this case, the lord of both 6th house and Virgo both is Mercury. Mercury is combust and also disposits Saturn. Mercury and Rahu have a common dispositor and Saturn is in the nakshatra of Rahu, one can assume that rahu affects Mercury as well. The problem is on the lining of the small intestine which has some functions akin to skin also. That too calls for a look at Mercury as well. This is not a conclusion but my preliminary line of analysis. I need to look at more charts (thanks to Tarun for providing more charts and I am yet to take a look at them). Regards, KrishnaOn Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote:  Om Gurave NamahDear Krishnamurthy, namaste(Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for " water " also For a start, here is Celiac disorder native:DOB: 25th of April 1975TOB: 01:44 AMPOB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 Time zone is 01h East of GMTYou should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion?Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem sohamsa@ .comSunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM  Dear Maja,Another good name :-)You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle.Regards,Krishna On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote:  Om Gurave NamahDear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste(two wonderful names indeed Your discussion made me think over some examples of " root cause " and manifestation of disease. Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine.Asthma - lungsVitiligo-skin All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this " global epidemic " ), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join me to go through them together? Warm Regards to both,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .comFriday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM  Dear Lakshmi,Yours is a good name too :-)Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question.OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic.Regards,Krishna On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote:  Hare Rama Krishna Dear Krishnamurthy, Nice name!  I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro.  Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet.  There is the seed , or origin,  and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal " symptoms " . Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind.  Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are,  where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved.  Im saying Venus must be at the root of it.  Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. Hope you understand my point. One " symptom " of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? Not at the skin, it is just one of many " symptoms " . Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. Best wishes Lakshmi     Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .com Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem  Dear Lakshmi, I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. Did you want to say: - It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or - It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus Please clarify. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote:  Hare Rama Krishna Dear Krishnamurthy, Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body.  Many skin problems are the result of " body chemistry " out of wack. Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue.  Bottom line Many of these things overlap ( i mean karaka wise)  Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? So I see it all as inter related. See primary issue, and then secondary issue. In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. Best wishes Lakshmi    Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .com Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem  Dear Sanjay, Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on " Essentials of Medical Astrology " puts  leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out  leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. Comments welcome. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote:  || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Krishna, Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted.In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house.In another sense Vayu tattva is " Sense object " for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. Warm Regards,Sanjay P 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Dear Sanjayji, Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? Regards, Krishna On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote:  || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Jani, Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma.In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana.Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka.Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. Warm RegardsSanjay P2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani >>>  > > Birth details of one my relative are follows. >> DOB 14/7/1972> Place: Navsari/Gujarat> Time: 20:20 Hrs>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice.> > M H Jani Natal Chart     July 14, 1972 Time:      20:20:00Time Zone:   5:30:00 (East of GMT) Place:     72 E 55' 00 " , 20 N 51' 00 "        Navsari, India Altitude:    0.00 metersLunar Yr-Mo:  Paridhavi - Ashadha Tithi:     Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left)Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) Nakshatra:   Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left)Yoga:      Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) Karana:     Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left)Hora Lord:   Venus (5 min sign: Cn) Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi)Kaala Lord:   Mars (Mahakala: Mars) Sunrise:    6:05:28Sunset:     19:22:37 Janma Ghatis:  35.6057Ayanamsa:    23-28-21.04 Sidereal Time: 15:11:56Body         Longitude     Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa Lagna        14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  TaSun - AK       28 Ge 46' 16.46 " Puna    3   Ge  Ge Moon - GK      16 Le 30' 41.26 " PPha    1   Le  LeMars - PK      16 Cn 39' 20.95 " Push    4   Cn  Sc Mercury - MK     24 Cn 45' 21.10 " Asre    3   Cn  AqJupiter ® - DK   7 Sg 33' 17.92 " Mool    3   Sg  Ge Venus - BK      25 Ta 10' 43.28 " Mrig    1   Ta  LeSaturn - PiK     21 Ta 58' 15.19 " Rohi    4   Ta  CnRahu - AmK      2 Cp 48' 03.08 " USha    2   Cp  Cp Ketu         2 Cn 48' 03.08 " Puna    4   Cn  CnMaandi        19 Ar 25' 49.18 " Bhar    2   Ar  Vi Gulika        7 Ar 26' 28.59 " Aswi    3   Ar  GeBhava Lagna      1 Aq 50' 22.21 " Dhan    3   Aq  Li Hora Lagna      5 Vi 28' 25.28 " UPha    3   Vi  AqGhati Lagna     16 Ge 22' 34.48 " Ardr    3   Ge  Aq Vighati Lagna    10 Ta 53' 20.48 " Rohi    1   Ta  ArVarnada Lagna    14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr    3   Ge  Ar Sree Lagna      10 Ar 42' 53.24 " Aswi    4   Ar  CnPranapada Lagna   11 Vi 27' 17.80 " Hast    1   Vi  Ar Indu Lagna      16 Vi 30' 41.26 " Hast    2   Vi  TaBhrigu Bindu     24 Ar 39' 22.17 " Bhar    4   Ar  ScDhooma        12 Sc 06' 16.46 " Anu    3   Sc  Li Vyatipata      17 Le 53' 43.54 " PPha    2   Le  ViParivesha      17 Aq 53' 43.54 " Sata    4   Aq  Pi Indra Chapa     12 Ta 06' 16.46 " Rohi    1   Ta  ArUpaketu       28 Ta 46' 16.46 " Mrig    2   Ta  Vi Kaala         1 Ge 04' 56.04 " Mrig    3   Ge  LiMrityu        10 Cp 12' 36.34 " Srav    1   Cp  Ar Artha Prahara     3 Aq 14' 51.48 " Dhan    3   Aq  LiYama Ghantaka    28 Aq 41' 23.20 " PBha    3   Aq  GePrana Sphuta     21 Pi 58' 04.14 " Reva    2   Pi  Cp Deha Sphuta     19 Ar 31' 58.71 " Bhar    2   Ar  ViMrityu Sphuta    20 Le 51' 36.61 " PPha    3   Le  Li Sookshma TriSphuta  2 Vi 21' 39.45 " UPha    2   Vi  CpTriSphuta       8 Ge 51' 28.97 " Ardr    1   Ge  Sg ChatusSphuta     7 Vi 37' 45.43 " UPha    4   Vi  PiPanchaSphuta     10 Ge 25' 48.50 " Ardr    2   Ge  Cp V2          14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast    2   Vi  TaV3          14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat    3   Li  LeV4          14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Vi V5          14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata    3   Aq  SgV6          14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi    2   Ta  Ta V7          14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr    3   Ge  ArV8          14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast    2   Vi  Ta V9          14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat    3   Li  SgV10         14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Vi V11         14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata    3   Aq  LeV12         14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi    2   Ta  Ta Kunda         7 Ta 19' 47.81 " Krit    4   Ta  Pi+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + |      |Md  Gk   |Ve  Sa   |Su  GL   ||      |      |      |      | |      |      |      |      ||      |      |      |      | |      |      |      |      ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | |      |            |Ma  Me   ||      |            |Ke     | |      |            |      ||      |            |      ||      |            |      | |----------- |     Rasi      |----------- ||As  Ra   |            |Mo     ||      |            |      | |      |            |      ||      |            |      | |      |            |      ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | |JuR     |      |      |HL  AL   ||      |      |      |      | |      |      |      |      ||      |      |      |      | |      |      |      |      |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +|      |      |As     |Su  JuR  | |      |      |      |Gk     ||      |      |      |      | |      |      |      |      ||      |      |      |      | |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- ||Me  HL   |            |Sa  Ke   | |GL     |            |      ||      |            |      ||      |            |      | |      |     Navamsa     |      ||----------- |            |----------- | |Ra     |      D-9      |Mo  Ve   ||      |            |AL     | |      |            |      ||      |            |      | |      |            |      ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | |      |Ma     |      |Md     ||      |      |      |      | |      |      |      |      ||      |      |      |      | |      |      |      |      |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + Vimsottari Dasa (): Ven  Ven 1967-10-10  Sun 1971-02-05  Moon 1972-02-05    Mars 1973-10-09  Rah 1974-12-08  Jup 1977-12-08    Sat 1980-08-08  Merc 1983-10-10  Ket 1986-08-09  Sun  Sun 1987-10-10  Moon 1988-01-25  Mars 1988-07-27    Rah 1988-12-02  Jup 1989-10-27  Sat 1990-08-15    Merc 1991-07-28  Ket 1992-05-31  Ven 1992-10-09  Moon  Moon 1993-10-09  Mars 1994-08-09  Rah 1995-03-07     Jup 1996-09-09  Sat 1998-01-07  Merc 1999-08-09     Ket 2001-01-06  Ven 2001-08-09  Sun 2003-04-06  Mars  Mars 2003-10-10  Rah 2004-03-03  Jup 2005-03-22     Sat 2006-02-26  Merc 2007-04-06  Ket 2008-04-03     Ven 2008-09-02  Sun 2009-11-03  Moon 2010-03-07  Rah  Rah 2010-10-10  Jup 2013-06-19  Sat 2015-11-15    Merc 2018-09-21  Ket 2021-04-06  Ven 2022-04-25    Sun 2025-04-24  Moon 2026-03-19  Mars 2027-09-22  Jup  Jup 2028-10-09  Sat 2030-11-27  Merc 2033-06-07    Ket 2035-09-16  Ven 2036-08-21  Sun 2039-04-19    Moon 2040-02-06  Mars 2041-06-07  Rah 2042-05-13  Sat  Sat 2044-10-09  Merc 2047-10-13  Ket 2050-06-20    Ven 2051-07-31  Sun 2054-10-01  Moon 2055-09-13    Mars 2057-04-09  Rah 2058-05-20  Jup 2061-03-25  Merc  Merc 2063-10-10  Ket 2066-03-04  Ven 2067-03-02     Sun 2070-01-01  Moon 2070-11-09  Mars 2072-04-06     Rah 2073-04-03  Jup 2075-10-25  Sat 2078-01-28  Ket  Ket 2080-10-10  Ven 2081-03-04  Sun 2082-05-04    Moon 2082-09-13  Mars 2083-04-10  Rah 2083-09-10    Jup 2084-09-28  Sat 2085-09-03  Merc 2086-10-13   Need mail bonding? 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Guest guest Posted September 2, 2009 Report Share Posted September 2, 2009 Om Gurave NamahDear Amit, namasteI can understand chart positions and find them in chart.What I was asking from you is different: translate it to every day language of someone who is not versed in Jyotish. How would you explain meanings of those positions to my mother, for example?She doesn't have a clue what is bhava, graha, functional malefic, badhak stan etc. Warm Regards,Maja Strbac--- On Wed, 9/2/09, Amit Puri <amitpuri20 wrote:Amit Puri <amitpuri20Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa Date: Wednesday, September 2, 2009, 6:00 AM You were saying: "Maha dasa of guru (lord of 3rd and A8,12th house in badhka amsa) was going on which is functional malfic hemmed between mars and surya under curse from rahu from the badhka. bhukti of shukra which is 5th lord and 10th lord afflicted by badhka rahu and mars ... please read this way:- In makkra lagna Maha dasa of Jupiter who is lording the 3rd and 12th house from lagna where mirtyupada is placed .. for makkra lagna jupiter is functional malefic hemmed between 4th lord and lord mangal and the 8th lord sura .. the shukra is under shapa from Rahu placed in badhka Stahan and satrun.. antra dasa of shukra which is 5th lord and 10th lord from lagna and this is also shapit by ketu/rahu and mars and ... i hope this is clear now.. REgard 2009/9/2 Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > Om Gurave NamahDear Amit, namasteMe being so late with reply, please understand it as a big compliment. I needed time to go through your email few times and think over it. First, I would leave Nakshatras out of health discussion for now. I would not mix physical problems with mentality and social environment. Besides, my level of knowledge related to Nakshatras is quite poor, so I can't give any comments in this regard. Second, Chandra and Sukra are both Jala tatva, that is true, but I would not blame Sukra afflictions for blood disorders. I would rather take Chandra for this instead. I was writing something about Vargotama Ch AK in my second reply to Krishnamurthy, I would like to read your comment on it. You were saying: "Maha dasa of guru (lord of 3rd and A8,12th house in badhka amsa)was going on which is functional malfic hemmed between mars and surya under curse from rahu from the badhka. bhukti of shukra which is 5th lord and 10th lord afflicted by badhka rahu and mars .. "OK, now please imagine I am uneducated girl who cant even read and write. Imagine I don't have a clue what Jyotish is. How would you explain me what this paragraph means? I have a reason why I chose this paragraph. I consider it relevant for this issue. BTW native is female. Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Mon, 8/31/09, Amit Puri <amitpuri20 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Amit Puri <amitpuri20 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .com Monday, August 31, 2009, 9:10 PM Namskar majachk and let me know your comments native is makkra lagna chirta nakshtra lagna lord in 6th house first indication for ill heath 6th lord and 9th lord budha is paka lagna lord joining the 8th lord second indication for chronic problem surya lording natural 5th house.. bahdka ketu with shukra creating problem for 5th house. jala tattwa affication is must for immune system disorder this is happening in the 5th house by the badhka …… shurka is only benefic influence on the lagna where as ketu and rahu aspecting the lagna by rashi dristi to do worst. Maha dasa of guru (lord of 3rd and A8,12th house in badhka amsa)was going on which is functional malfic hemmed between mars and surya under curse from rahu from the badhka. bhukti of shukra which is 5th lord and 10th lord afflicted by badhka rahu and mars .. ..moola dasa of shani is going on at that time antra was of 6th lord budha which is paka lagna lord too.when we chk navmansh the venus is 4 lord from lagna .. In whole rahu placed in badhka house third from AK in rashi played big role in this.. now rahu remedy can do some better job for her.. Transit .. rahu vargootma was transiting on mesha in badhka nakshtra Ashwani in mesha which is paka lagna lord 8th lord surya placed .. the satrun was also in its natal position at that time i.,e 6th house .. I think you will get some guide line to calm down his naga dosha.. RegaredAmit puri 2009/8/31 Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > Om Gurave NamahDear Amit, namasteIt started during February 2005. Problem is still present. Warm Regards,Maja--- On Sun, 8/30/09, amitpuri20 <amitpuri20 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: amitpuri20 <amitpuri20 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .com Sunday, August 30, 2009, 6:12 PM Namskar maja please mention the date of manifestation of this problem .. regard sohamsa@ .com, Maja Ã… trbac <majastrbacastro@ ...> wrote: > > Om Gurave Namah > > Dear Krishnamurthy, namaste > > (Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for "water" also > > For a start, here is Celiac disorder native: > DOB: 25th of April 1975 > TOB: 01:44 AM > POB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 > Time zone is 01h East of GMT > > You should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. > > Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion? > > Warm Regards, > Maja Strbac > > Hari Om Tat Sat > > --- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ ...> wrote: > > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ ...> > Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > sohamsa@ .com > Sunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM > > > > > > >  > > > > > > Dear Maja, > Another good name :-) > You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. > > Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle. > Regards,Krishna > > > On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Ã… trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah > > Dear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste > > (two wonderful names indeed > > > Your discussion made me think over some examples of "root cause" and manifestation of disease. > Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine. > Asthma - lungs > Vitiligo-skin > > > All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). > > > Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this "global epidemic"), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? > > > I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join > me to go through them together? > > Warm Regards to both, > Maja Strbac > > Hari Om Tat Sat > > > > --- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> wrote: > > > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > > Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > sohamsa@ .com > Friday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM > > > > > > > >  > > > Dear Lakshmi, > Yours is a good name too :-) > Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question. > OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. > > > I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic. > Regards,Krishna > > On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > Hare Rama Krishna > Dear Krishnamurthy, > Nice name! >  > I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro. >  > Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet. >  > There is the seed , or origin, >  and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, > it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal "symptoms". > Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind. >  > Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, > to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are, >  where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. > In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) > But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved. >  Im saying Venus must be at the root of it. >  > Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. > Hope you understand my point. > One "symptom" of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. > One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. > One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. > So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? > Not at the skin, it is just one of many "symptoms". > Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . > Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. > Best wishes > Lakshmi >  >  >  > >  > > > > > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > sohamsa@ .com > > > Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PM > Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > > > >  > > Dear Lakshmi, > > > I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. > > > Did you want to say: > > > - It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or > - It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus > > > Please clarify. > > > Regards, > Krishna > > > On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > > > >  > > > > > > Hare Rama Krishna > Dear Krishnamurthy, > Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. > When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body. >  > Many skin problems are the result of "body chemistry" out of wack. > Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. > Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue. >  > Bottom line Many of these things overlap > ( i mean karaka wise) >  > Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? > So I see it all as inter related. > See primary issue, and then secondary issue. > In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. > Best wishes > Lakshmi >  >  > >  > > > > > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > sohamsa@ .com > > > Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AM > Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > > > > >  > > Dear Sanjay, > > > Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. > > > > > Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on "Essentials of Medical Astrology" puts  leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out  leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. > > > > > Comments welcome. > > > Regards, > Krishna > > > > On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > > > > >  > > > > || Om Gurave Namah || > Dear Krishna, > >  Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). > > > > But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted. > > In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. > > > > Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's > house. > > In another sense Vayu tattva is "Sense object" for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. > > > > Warm Regards, > Sanjay P > > > > > 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > > > > > > > > Dear Sanjayji, > > > Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? > > > > Regards, > Krishna > > > > > > On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > > > > >  > > > > || Om Gurave Namah || > > Dear Jani, > >  Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma. > In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. > > > We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana. > > Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka. > > Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, > > > > Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. > > I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. > > > > Warm Regards > Sanjay P > > > > 2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani > > > > >  > > > > Birth details of one my relative are follows. > > > > > > DOB 14/7/1972 > > Place: Navsari/Gujarat > > Time: 20:20 Hrs > > > > Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice. > > > > M H Jani > > > > > > Natal Chart > >      July 14, 1972 > > > Time:      20:20:00 > Time Zone:   5:30:00 (East of GMT) > > > Place:     72 E 55' 00", 20 N 51' 00" >        Navsari, India > > > Altitude:    0.00 meters > > Lunar Yr-Mo:  Paridhavi - Ashadha > > > Tithi:     Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left) > Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) > > > Nakshatra:   Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left) > Yoga:      Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) > > > Karana:     Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left) > Hora Lord:   Venus (5 min sign: Cn) > > > Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi) > Kaala Lord:   Mars (Mahakala: Mars) > > > > Sunrise:    6:05:28 > Sunset:     19:22:37 > > > Janma Ghatis:  35.6057 > > Ayanamsa:    23-28-21.04 > > > Sidereal Time: 15:11:56 > > Body         Longitude     Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa > > > > Lagna        14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav    2   Cp  Ta > Sun - AK       28 Ge 46' 16.46" Puna    3   Ge  Ge > > > Moon - GK      16 Le 30' 41.26" PPha    1   Le  Le > Mars - PK      16 Cn 39' 20.95" Push    4   Cn  Sc > > > Mercury - MK     24 Cn 45' 21.10" Asre    3   Cn  Aq > Jupiter ® - DK   7 Sg 33' 17.92" Mool    3   Sg  Ge > > > Venus - BK      25 Ta 10' 43.28" Mrig    1   Ta  Le > Saturn - PiK     21 Ta 58' > 15.19" Rohi    4   Ta  Cn > Rahu - AmK      2 Cp 48' 03.08" USha    2   Cp  Cp > > > Ketu         2 Cn 48' 03.08" Puna    4   Cn  Cn > Maandi        19 Ar 25' 49.18" Bhar    2   Ar  Vi > > > Gulika        7 Ar 26' 28.59" Aswi    3   Ar  > Ge > Bhava Lagna      1 Aq 50' 22.21" Dhan    3   Aq  Li > > > Hora Lagna      5 Vi 28' 25.28" UPha    3   Vi  Aq > Ghati Lagna     16 Ge 22' 34.48" Ardr    3   Ge  Aq > > > Vighati Lagna    10 Ta 53' 20.48" Rohi    1   Ta  Ar > Varnada Lagna    14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr    3   Ge  Ar > > > Sree Lagna      10 Ar 42' 53.24" Aswi    4   Ar  Cn > Pranapada Lagna   11 Vi 27' 17.80" Hast    1   Vi  Ar > > > Indu Lagna      16 Vi 30' 41.26" Hast    2   Vi  Ta > Bhrigu Bindu     24 Ar 39' 22.17" Bhar    4   Ar >  Sc > Dhooma        12 Sc 06' 16.46" Anu    3   Sc  Li > > > Vyatipata      17 Le 53' 43.54" PPha    2   Le  Vi > Parivesha      17 Aq 53' 43.54" Sata    4   Aq  Pi > > > Indra Chapa     12 Ta 06' 16.46" Rohi    1   Ta  Ar > Upaketu       28 Ta 46' 16.46" Mrig    2   Ta  Vi > > > Kaala         1 Ge 04' 56.04" Mrig    3   Ge  Li > Mrityu        10 Cp 12' 36.34" Srav    1   Cp  Ar > > > Artha Prahara     3 Aq 14' 51.48" Dhan    3   Aq  Li > Yama Ghantaka  >   28 Aq 41' 23.20" PBha    3   Aq  Ge > Prana Sphuta     21 Pi 58' 04.14" Reva    2   Pi  Cp > > > Deha Sphuta     19 Ar 31' 58.71" Bhar    2   Ar  Vi > Mrityu Sphuta    20 Le 51' 36.61" PPha    3   Le  Li > > > Sookshma TriSphuta  2 Vi 21' 39.45" UPha    2   Vi  Cp > TriSphuta       8 Ge 51' 28.97" Ardr    1   Ge  Sg > > > ChatusSphuta     7 Vi 37' 45.43" UPha    4   Vi  Pi > PanchaSphuta     10 Ge 25' 48.50" Ardr    2   Ge  Cp > > > V2          14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast    2   Vi  Ta > V3  >         14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat    3   Li  Le > V4          14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav    2   Cp  Vi > > > V5          14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata    3   Aq  Sg > V6          14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi    2   Ta  Ta > > > V7   >        14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr    3   Ge  Ar > V8          14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast    2   Vi  Ta > > > V9          14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat    3   Li  Sg > V10         14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav    2   Cp  Vi > > > V11     >     14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata    3   Aq  Le > V12         14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi    2   Ta  Ta > > > Kunda         7 Ta 19' 47.81" Krit    4   Ta  Pi > > +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > > > |      |Md  Gk   |Ve  Sa  >  |Su  GL   | > |      |      |      |      | > > |      |      |      |      | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |      |     >  |      |      | > |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > > > |      |            |Ma  Me   | > |      |            |Ke     | > > > |      |            | >      | > |      |            |      | > |      |            |      | > > > |----------- |     Rasi      |----------- | > |As  Ra   |            > |Mo     | > |      |            |      | > > |      |            |      | > |      |            |      | > > > |      |   >          |      | > |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > > > |JuR     |      |      |HL  AL   | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |      |      |     >  |      | > |      |      |      |      | > > |      |      |      |      | > +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > > > +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > |      |      |As     |Su  JuR  | > > > |      |      |      |Gk     | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |      |      |      |      | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > |Me  HL   |            |Sa  Ke   | > > > |GL     |            |      | > |   >    |            |      | > |      |            |      | > > > |      |     Navamsa     |      | > |----------- |            |----------- | > > > |Ra  >    |      D-9      |Mo  Ve   | > |      |            |AL     | > > > |      |            |      | > |      |            |      | > > > |      |            |      | > |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > > > |      |Ma     |      |Md     | > |      |      |      |      | > > > | >      |      |      |      | > |      |      |      |      | > > > |      |      |      |      | > +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > > > > > > Vimsottari Dasa (): > > > > Ven  Ven 1967-10-10  Sun 1971-02-05  Moon 1972-02-05  >   Mars 1973-10-09  Rah 1974-12-08  Jup 1977-12-08  > > >   Sat 1980-08-08  Merc 1983-10-10  Ket 1986-08-09  > Sun  Sun 1987-10-10  Moon 1988-01-25  Mars 1988-07-27  > > >   Rah 1988-12-02  Jup 1989-10-27  Sat 1990-08-15  >   Merc 1991-07-28  Ket 1992-05-31  Ven 1992-10-09  > > > Moon  Moon 1993-10-09  Mars 1994-08-09  Rah 1995-03-07  >    Jup 1996-09-09  Sat 1998-01-07  Merc 1999-08-09  > > >    Ket 2001-01-06  Ven 2001-08-09  Sun 2003-04-06  > Mars  Mars 2003-10-10  Rah 2004-03-03  Jup 2005-03-22  > > >    Sat 2006-02-26  Merc 2007-04-06  Ket 2008-04-03  >    Ven 2008-09-02  Sun 2009-11-03  Moon 2010-03-07  > > > Rah  Rah 2010-10-10  Jup 2013-06-19  Sat 2015-11-15  >   Merc 2018-09-21  Ket 2021-04-06  Ven 2022-04-25  > > >   Sun 2025-04-24 >  Moon 2026-03-19  Mars 2027-09-22  > Jup  Jup 2028-10-09  Sat 2030-11-27  Merc 2033-06-07  > > >   Ket 2035-09-16  Ven 2036-08-21  Sun 2039-04-19  >   Moon 2040-02-06  Mars 2041-06-07  Rah 2042-05-13  > > > Sat  Sat 2044-10-09  Merc 2047-10-13  Ket 2050-06-20  >   Ven 2051-07-31  Sun 2054-10-01  Moon 2055-09-13  > > >   Mars 2057-04-09  Rah 2058-05-20  Jup 2061-03-25  > Merc  Merc 2063-10-10  Ket 2066-03-04  Ven 2067-03-02  > > >    Sun 2070-01-01  Moon 2070-11-09  Mars 2072-04-06  >    Rah 2073-04-03  Jup 2075-10-25  Sat 2078-01-28  > > > Ket  Ket 2080-10-10  Ven 2081-03-04  Sun 2082-05-04  >   Moon 2082-09-13  Mars 2083-04-10  Rah 2083-09-10  > > >   Jup 2084-09-28  Sat 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Guest guest Posted September 2, 2009 Report Share Posted September 2, 2009 Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Maja,So what is the 'root cause' of autoimmune disorder? Essentially it is the body attacking its own cells. 6th house is something else attacking the body, 8th house is nija dosha. Nija - innate, of one's own party or country, an enemy in one's own country (MW). So how about the 8th house/lord?Regards,MichalMaja Å trbac <majastrbacastrosohamsa Sent: Wednesday, 2 September, 2009 11:11:29 PMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Om Gurave NamahDear Michal and Krishnamurthy, namasteIt is a little bit of a problem to understand each other and continue dialogue if we are not looking at same subject from same perspective.Michal: "So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. "No, scientifically it is a problem with immune system which secondary leads to problems with digestion. I am trying to agree on this order of symptoms and find them in charts. Do you still consider this order to be wrong? I see no chicken/egg dilemma in this order. I completely agree on including Graha signifying particular allergen, but I would not start or end chart observation with this. That is what I am trying to say, and I think Krishnamurthy is trying same among rest of his points. Getting rid of allergen is not curing anything, problem is still there in body. People suffering celiac syndrome are not perfectly fine if they exclude 80% of grains (only corn, rice and buckwheat don't contain gluten). They are excluding valuable source for large number of vitamins from B group (especially if they are ovo-lacto, lacto or ovo vegetarians) . Synthetic supplements can't replace it perfectly speaking in long terms. What I am trying to say is: excluding gluten is just a small patch over a big, open wound. It is like someone is having Kala Sarpa Yoga on 5/11th axis in chart (and imagine that positions related to KSY are really pointing on problems related to progeny), and you give them advice to chant Santana Gopala mantra (and maybe add prasidha Savitur Gayatri for just in case) to accomplish progeny. It is a good advice, but... it is skipping the root cause.Let me rephrase my initial question: What is primary for observation about autoimmune diseases: positions in chart pointing on autoimmune disorders (probably signified by Rahu) or secondary symptoms (lungs, digestion, skin)? When we determine positions pointing on autoimmune disorders, how do we relate them with particular body part where they manifest? I would also like to read reply on Tarun's question.Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Tue, 9/1/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote:Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma ProblemTo: sohamsa@ .comTuesday, September 1, 2009, 8:12 PM Dear Michal,You said:Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. It is clear that I am focusing on the root cause of the problem and you are focusing on the remedies for the problem. It appears to me that we are at different ends of the domain that we need to address. But, a remedy suggested without understanding the cause fully could be incomplete and ineffective. It is like treating just the symptoms and not addressing the root cause. Regards, Krishna On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote: Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Krishna,It is the earth that revolves around the Sun. Nevertheless we take the geocentric viewpoint. So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. So which do we use? It is like chicken and egg situation - which came first? For a person with celiac disorder, they are fine as long as they don't eat wheat (Sun). When they see a loaf of bread they say no thanks. This is how it is manifesting in their experiential world. That the doctor tells them about this protein and this immune system is something secondary as far as they're concerned because the primary thing the doctor tells them is don't eat anything which contains gluten. So when we look at the chart we need to be clear what we are looking at ie. which level are we going to. Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. Regards,Michal Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> sohamsa@ .comTuesday, 1 September, 2009 4:56:56 PM Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Michal, It depends on how one is looking at the problem. From my perspective, the native will not be able to digest Gluten etc., after the damage is caused. And, Gluten by itself does not cause the damage to start with. Hence, what you are describing as the cause is an after effect of having the damage already in place. What causes the damage is the autoimmune reaction in the first place. Dear Maja, Yes, I am the same SY SY... person :-) Virgo has two malefic aspects and not just one. Both Mars and Ketu aspect Virgo. And, it is a good observation from Amit that Mercury is conjunct (and combust by) 8th lord Sun. In addition, Mercury occupies 8th house from Virgo. It is evident that Virgo, 6H and Mercury are all afflicted. Regards, KrishnaOn Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote: Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Maja and Krishna,Coeliac disease is caused by a reaction to gliadin, a gluten protein found in wheat So is Sun not the culprit as Sun is karaka for wheat? Something external the body cannot digest - we have to look at 6th house. Lagnesh is in the 6th house for a start and it is Saturn. (Interestingly this will cause the AL to fall in the 11th house and thus Lagnesh is in the 8th from AL). In the chart provided Sun is 8th lord. When the 8th lord has anything to do with 6th house or lord it can give chronic digestive disease. Here Sun is conjoined 6th lord Mercury and in the 8th house from Moon - confirming the health issue. Narayana dasa of Leo was just running.Regards,Michal Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> sohamsa@ .comMonday, 31 August, 2009 9:42:46 PM Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Maja,Frankly, when I first opened the chart, I too looked at Venus, as it is in Rahu-Ketu axis and also aspected by Marsand in papakartari. This could have its own ramifications at the appropriate time and may not be relevant to Celiac Disorder. I googled to get some details on Celiac disorder. From what I understand, I don't think it is a problem related to Mars, though it is a digestive disorder. The small intestine is affected and is unable to absorb some of the nutrients. Since it is the small intestine, one should look at the 6th house and the sign Virgo. In this case, the lord of both 6th house and Virgo both is Mercury. Mercury is combust and also disposits Saturn. Mercury and Rahu have a common dispositor and Saturn is in the nakshatra of Rahu, one can assume that rahu affects Mercury as well. The problem is on the lining of the small intestine which has some functions akin to skin also. That too calls for a look at Mercury as well. This is not a conclusion but my preliminary line of analysis. I need to look at more charts (thanks to Tarun for providing more charts and I am yet to take a look at them).Regards, KrishnaOn Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: Om Gurave NamahDear Krishnamurthy, namaste(Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for "water" also For a start, here is Celiac disorder native:DOB: 25th of April 1975TOB: 01:44 AMPOB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 Time zone is 01h East of GMTYou should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion?Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem sohamsa@ .comSunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM Dear Maja,Another good name :-)You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle.Regards,Krishna On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: Om Gurave NamahDear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste(two wonderful names indeed Your discussion made me think over some examples of "root cause" and manifestation of disease. Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine.Asthma - lungsVitiligo-skin All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this "global epidemic"), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join me to go through them together? Warm Regards to both,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .comFriday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM Dear Lakshmi,Yours is a good name too :-)Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question.OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic.Regards,KrishnaOn Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: Hare Rama Krishna Dear Krishnamurthy, Nice name! I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro. Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet. There is the seed , or origin, and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal "symptoms". Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind. Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are, where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved. Im saying Venus must be at the root of it. Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. Hope you understand my point. One "symptom" of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? Not at the skin, it is just one of many "symptoms". Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. Best wishes Lakshmi Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .com Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Lakshmi, I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. Did you want to say: - It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or - It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus Please clarify. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: Hare Rama Krishna Dear Krishnamurthy, Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body. Many skin problems are the result of "body chemistry" out of wack. Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue. Bottom line Many of these things overlap ( i mean karaka wise) Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? So I see it all as inter related. See primary issue, and then secondary issue. In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. Best wishes Lakshmi Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .com Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Sanjay, Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on "Essentials of Medical Astrology" puts leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. Comments welcome. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Krishna, Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted.In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house.In another sense Vayu tattva is "Sense object" for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. Warm Regards,Sanjay P 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Dear Sanjayji, Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? Regards, Krishna On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Jani, Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma.In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana.Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka.Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. Warm RegardsSanjay P2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani >>> >> Birth details of one my relative are follows. >> DOB 14/7/1972> Place: Navsari/Gujarat> Time: 20:20 Hrs>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice.>> M H Jani Natal Chart July 14, 1972 Time: 20:20:00Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT) Place: 72 E 55' 00", 20 N 51' 00" Navsari, India Altitude: 0.00 metersLunar Yr-Mo: Paridhavi - Ashadha Tithi: Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left)Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) Nakshatra: Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left)Yoga: Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) Karana: Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left)Hora Lord: Venus (5 min sign: Cn) Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi)Kaala Lord: Mars (Mahakala: Mars) Sunrise: 6:05:28Sunset: 19:22:37 Janma Ghatis: 35.6057Ayanamsa: 23-28-21.04 Sidereal Time: 15:11:56Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa Lagna 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp TaSun - AK 28 Ge 46' 16.46" Puna 3 Ge Ge Moon - GK 16 Le 30' 41.26" PPha 1 Le LeMars - PK 16 Cn 39' 20.95" Push 4 Cn Sc Mercury - MK 24 Cn 45' 21.10" Asre 3 Cn AqJupiter ® - DK 7 Sg 33' 17.92" Mool 3 Sg Ge Venus - BK 25 Ta 10' 43.28" Mrig 1 Ta LeSaturn - PiK 21 Ta 58' 15.19" Rohi 4 Ta CnRahu - AmK 2 Cp 48' 03.08" USha 2 Cp Cp Ketu 2 Cn 48' 03.08" Puna 4 Cn CnMaandi 19 Ar 25' 49.18" Bhar 2 Ar Vi Gulika 7 Ar 26' 28.59" Aswi 3 Ar GeBhava Lagna 1 Aq 50' 22.21" Dhan 3 Aq Li Hora Lagna 5 Vi 28' 25.28" UPha 3 Vi AqGhati Lagna 16 Ge 22' 34.48" Ardr 3 Ge Aq Vighati Lagna 10 Ta 53' 20.48" Rohi 1 Ta ArVarnada Lagna 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge Ar Sree Lagna 10 Ar 42' 53.24" Aswi 4 Ar CnPranapada Lagna 11 Vi 27' 17.80" Hast 1 Vi Ar Indu Lagna 16 Vi 30' 41.26" Hast 2 Vi TaBhrigu Bindu 24 Ar 39' 22.17" Bhar 4 Ar ScDhooma 12 Sc 06' 16.46" Anu 3 Sc Li Vyatipata 17 Le 53' 43.54" PPha 2 Le ViParivesha 17 Aq 53' 43.54" Sata 4 Aq Pi Indra Chapa 12 Ta 06' 16.46" Rohi 1 Ta ArUpaketu 28 Ta 46' 16.46" Mrig 2 Ta Vi Kaala 1 Ge 04' 56.04" Mrig 3 Ge LiMrityu 10 Cp 12' 36.34" Srav 1 Cp Ar Artha Prahara 3 Aq 14' 51.48" Dhan 3 Aq LiYama Ghantaka 28 Aq 41' 23.20" PBha 3 Aq GePrana Sphuta 21 Pi 58' 04.14" Reva 2 Pi Cp Deha Sphuta 19 Ar 31' 58.71" Bhar 2 Ar ViMrityu Sphuta 20 Le 51' 36.61" PPha 3 Le Li Sookshma TriSphuta 2 Vi 21' 39.45" UPha 2 Vi CpTriSphuta 8 Ge 51' 28.97" Ardr 1 Ge Sg ChatusSphuta 7 Vi 37' 45.43" UPha 4 Vi PiPanchaSphuta 10 Ge 25' 48.50" Ardr 2 Ge Cp V2 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi TaV3 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li LeV4 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Vi V5 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq SgV6 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta Ta V7 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge ArV8 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi Ta V9 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li SgV10 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Vi V11 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq LeV12 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta Ta Kunda 7 Ta 19' 47.81" Krit 4 Ta Pi+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + | |Md Gk |Ve Sa |Su GL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | | |Ma Me || | |Ke | | | | || | | || | | | |----------- | Rasi |----------- ||As Ra | |Mo || | | | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | |JuR | | |HL AL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +| | |As |Su JuR | | | | |Gk || | | | | | | | | || | | | | |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- ||Me HL | |Sa Ke | |GL | | || | | || | | | | | Navamsa | ||----------- | |----------- | |Ra | D-9 |Mo Ve || | |AL | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | |Ma | |Md || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + Vimsottari Dasa (): Ven Ven 1967-10-10 Sun 1971-02-05 Moon 1972-02-05 Mars 1973-10-09 Rah 1974-12-08 Jup 1977-12-08 Sat 1980-08-08 Merc 1983-10-10 Ket 1986-08-09 Sun Sun 1987-10-10 Moon 1988-01-25 Mars 1988-07-27 Rah 1988-12-02 Jup 1989-10-27 Sat 1990-08-15 Merc 1991-07-28 Ket 1992-05-31 Ven 1992-10-09 Moon Moon 1993-10-09 Mars 1994-08-09 Rah 1995-03-07 Jup 1996-09-09 Sat 1998-01-07 Merc 1999-08-09 Ket 2001-01-06 Ven 2001-08-09 Sun 2003-04-06 Mars Mars 2003-10-10 Rah 2004-03-03 Jup 2005-03-22 Sat 2006-02-26 Merc 2007-04-06 Ket 2008-04-03 Ven 2008-09-02 Sun 2009-11-03 Moon 2010-03-07 Rah Rah 2010-10-10 Jup 2013-06-19 Sat 2015-11-15 Merc 2018-09-21 Ket 2021-04-06 Ven 2022-04-25 Sun 2025-04-24 Moon 2026-03-19 Mars 2027-09-22 Jup Jup 2028-10-09 Sat 2030-11-27 Merc 2033-06-07 Ket 2035-09-16 Ven 2036-08-21 Sun 2039-04-19 Moon 2040-02-06 Mars 2041-06-07 Rah 2042-05-13 Sat Sat 2044-10-09 Merc 2047-10-13 Ket 2050-06-20 Ven 2051-07-31 Sun 2054-10-01 Moon 2055-09-13 Mars 2057-04-09 Rah 2058-05-20 Jup 2061-03-25 Merc Merc 2063-10-10 Ket 2066-03-04 Ven 2067-03-02 Sun 2070-01-01 Moon 2070-11-09 Mars 2072-04-06 Rah 2073-04-03 Jup 2075-10-25 Sat 2078-01-28 Ket Ket 2080-10-10 Ven 2081-03-04 Sun 2082-05-04 Moon 2082-09-13 Mars 2083-04-10 Rah 2083-09-10 Jup 2084-09-28 Sat 2085-09-03 Merc 2086-10-13 Need mail bonding? 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Guest guest Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 Namskar Zoran ji outstanding explanation .........thanks for your teachings.......regard 2009/9/3 ahimsavm <ahimsans Om Namah Shivaya, Dear Michal and friends, Autoimmune disease do come from 8th house which is nija dosha, and due to badhak also which is our own karma causing the wrath of the Devatas.In natural zodiac 8th house is ruled by Mangal and Ketu, where Ketu gives primary cause of disease, while secondary reactions and accompaning disease come from Mangal. If the disease is caused by Rahu, then Rahu causes primary disase, while Shani causes secondary diseases. Notice that Rahu and Shani rule natural Badhak house. Since both nodes are involved, in Kala Sarpa and Kala Mrita Yogas one can sometimes see the autoimmune diseases, yet there are some factors to be checked too. If you look at the karmic cause of this disease, here are some hints. 1.Take the sign in the 8th house or badhak whichever is causing the disease and mark it! See if there are planets in there. 2. Observe that sign in karakamsa. Count from Ak planet in Navamsa from that sign. This house shows the anger of the Devata causing the disease, and karma of that house is the cause. For example, in celiac syndrom lady chart Maja gave, Simha Rasi is in the 8th house and Vrischika rashi is showing Badhak. Rahu is there in Vrischika. If you look at the Karakamsa Sign it is Virgo. Simha shows Ishta devata, so there is an anger of Ishtadevata in her chart (It is always the form of Vishnu - Akash in this method)and Sun shows the disease. Since Sun has to do with gluten, this normally caused intolarnce to Gluten due to such Anger. Sun is placed in 4th house (zero Digbala) and is weak, and is further conjoined with 6th lord (external factor) which is Budha (digestive system), so external factors such as certain food becomes an enemy for her. Budha is also in MKS destroying the mituna rashi which is the place of Lagnesha, so Budha furthers shows the body. Mituna is in the 6th house again, digestive system. There are further points about this disease, please check the Meena Rasi in Both D1 and D9 and you will get the answer. Meena rasi suffers curse of the Sun/Agni/. Kindly, get more charts with this disease and we can go more into detail about this point. Once you have seen the positions from Karakamsa and located that the anger of Ista Devata has caused the problem, check the position of the Sun in Navamsa too. Sun is in Lagna, which causes widowhood or early loss of partnerships. That is another place where this anger will operate. Since UL in Rashi chart is Meena with Guru in MKS, Surya is sitting in the 2nd house to it (cursing Meena), the relationships cannot last. Shukra is further cursed to confirm that. Hope that this helped... Best wishes Zoran Radosavljevic www.siva-edu.info www.ahimsazr1.wordpress.com sohamsa , Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal wrote: > > Hare Rama Krsna || > > Dear Maja, > > So what is the 'root cause' of autoimmune disorder? Essentially it is the body attacking its own cells. 6th house is something else attacking the body, 8th house is nija dosha. Nija - innate, of one's own party or country, an enemy in one's own country (MW). So how about the 8th house/lord? > > Regards, > Michal > > > > > ________________________________ > Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro > sohamsa > Wednesday, 2 September, 2009 11:11:29 PM > Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > > > Om Gurave Namah > > Dear Michal and Krishnamurthy, namaste > > It is a little bit of a problem to understand each other and continue dialogue if we are not looking at same subject from same perspective. > > Michal: " So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's > digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. " > > No, scientifically it is a problem with immune system which secondary leads to problems with digestion. I am trying to agree on this order of symptoms and find them in charts. Do you still consider this order to be wrong? I see no chicken/egg dilemma in this order. > > I completely agree on including Graha signifying particular allergen, but I would not start or end chart observation with this. That is what I am trying to say, and I think Krishnamurthy is trying same among rest of his points. Getting rid of allergen is not curing anything, problem is still there in body. > > People suffering celiac syndrome are not perfectly fine if they exclude 80% of grains (only corn, rice and buckwheat don't contain gluten). They are excluding valuable source for large number of vitamins from B group (especially if they are ovo-lacto, lacto or ovo vegetarians) . Synthetic supplements can't replace it perfectly speaking in long terms. > > What I am trying to say is: excluding gluten is just a small patch over a big, open wound. It is like someone is having Kala Sarpa Yoga on 5/11th axis in chart (and imagine that positions related to KSY are really pointing on problems related to progeny), and you give them advice to chant Santana Gopala mantra (and maybe add prasidha Savitur Gayatri for just in case) to accomplish progeny. It is a good advice, but... it is skipping the root cause. > > Let me rephrase my initial question: What is primary for observation about autoimmune diseases: positions in chart pointing on autoimmune disorders (probably signified by Rahu) or secondary symptoms (lungs, digestion, skin)? When we determine positions pointing on autoimmune disorders, how do we relate them with particular body part where they manifest? > > I would also like to read reply on Tarun's question. > > Warm Regards, > Maja Strbac > > Hari Om Tat Sat > > --- On Tue, 9/1/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: > > > >Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >To: > > sohamsa@ .com > >Tuesday, September 1, 2009, 8:12 PM > > > > > > > > >Dear Michal, > > > > > >You said: > > > > > >Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. > > > > > >It is clear that I am focusing on the root cause of the problem and you are focusing on the remedies for the problem. It appears to me that we are at different ends of the domain that we need to address. But, a remedy suggested without understanding the cause fully could be incomplete and ineffective. It is like treating just the symptoms and not addressing the root cause. > > > > > >Regards, > >Krishna > > > > > > > >On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote: > > > > >> > >>Hare Rama Krsna || > >> > >>Dear Krishna, > >> > >>It is the earth that revolves around the Sun. Nevertheless we take the geocentric viewpoint. So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. So which do we use? It is like chicken and egg situation - which came first? > >> > >>For a person with celiac disorder, they are fine as long as they don't eat wheat (Sun). When they see a loaf of bread they say no thanks. This is how it is manifesting in their experiential world. That the doctor tells them about this protein and this immune system is something secondary as far as they're concerned because the primary thing the doctor tells them is don't eat anything which contains > >> gluten. So when we look at the chart we need to be clear what we are looking at ie. which level are we going to. Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. > >> > >>Regards, > >>Michal > >> > >> > >> > >> > ________________________________ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>sohamsa@ .com > >>Tuesday, 1 September, 2009 4:56:56 PM > >> > >>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >> > >> > >> >> > >>Dear Michal, > >> > >> > >>It depends on how one is looking at the problem. From my perspective, the native will not be able to digest Gluten etc., after the damage is caused. And, Gluten by itself does not cause the damage to start with. Hence, what you are describing as the cause is an after effect of having the damage already in place. What causes the damage is the autoimmune reaction in the first place. > >> > >> > >>Dear Maja, > >> > >> > >>Yes, I am the same SY SY... person :-) > >> > >> > >>Virgo has two malefic aspects and not just one. Both Mars and Ketu aspect Virgo. And, it is a good observation from Amit that Mercury is conjunct (and combust by) 8th lord Sun. In addition, Mercury occupies 8th house from Virgo. It is evident that Virgo, 6H and Mercury are all afflicted. > >> > >> > >>Regards, > >>Krishna > >> > >> > >>On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote: > >> > >> >>> > >>>Hare Rama Krsna || > >>> > >>>Dear Maja and Krishna, > >>> > >>>Coeliac disease is caused by a reaction to gliadin, a gluten protein found in wheat > >>> > >>>So is Sun not the culprit as Sun is karaka for wheat? Something external the body cannot digest - we have to look at 6th house. Lagnesh is in the 6th house for a start and it is Saturn. (Interestingly this will cause the AL to fall in the 11th house and thus Lagnesh is in the 8th from AL). > >>> > >>>In the chart provided Sun is 8th lord. When the 8th lord has anything to do with 6th house or lord it can give chronic digestive > >>> disease. Here Sun is conjoined 6th lord Mercury and in the 8th house from Moon - confirming the health issue. Narayana dasa of Leo was just running. > >>> > >>>Regards, > >>>Michal > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > ________________________________ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>Monday, 31 August, 2009 9:42:46 PM > >>> > >>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>> > >>> > >>> >>> > >>>Dear Maja, > >>> > >>> > >>>Frankly, when I first opened the chart, I too looked at Venus, as it is in Rahu-Ketu axis and also aspected by Marsand in papakartari. This could have its own ramifications at the appropriate time and may not be relevant to Celiac Disorder. > >>> > >>> > >>>I googled to get some details on Celiac disorder. From what I understand, I don't think it is a problem related to Mars, though it is a digestive disorder. The small intestine is affected and is unable to absorb some of the nutrients. Since it is the small intestine, one should look at the 6th house and the sign Virgo. In this case, the lord of both 6th house and Virgo both is Mercury. Mercury is combust and also disposits Saturn. Mercury and Rahu have a common dispositor and Saturn is in the nakshatra of Rahu, one can assume that rahu affects Mercury as well. The problem is on the lining of the small intestine which has some functions akin to skin also. That too calls for a look at Mercury as well. > >>> > >>> > >>>This is not a conclusion but my preliminary line of analysis. I need to look at more charts (thanks to Tarun for providing more charts and I am yet to take a look at them). > >>> > >>> > >>>Regards, > >>>Krishna > >>> > >>> > >>>On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > >>> > >>> >>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>Om Gurave Namah > >>>> > >>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, namaste > >>>> > >>>>(Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for " water " also > >>>> > >>>>For a start, here is Celiac disorder native: > >>>>DOB: 25th of April 1975 > >>>>TOB: 01:44 AM > >>>>POB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 > >>>>Time zone is 01h East of GMT > >>>> > >>>>You should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. > >>>> > >>>>Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion? > >>>> > >>>>Warm > >>>> Regards, > >>>> > >>>>Maja Strbac > >>>> > >>>>Hari Om Tat Sat > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>--- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>Sunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> >>>>> > >>>>>Dear Maja, > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Another good name :-) > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Regards, > >>>>>Krishna > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> >>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Om Gurave Namah > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Dear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste > >>>>>> > >>>>>>(two wonderful names indeed > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Your discussion made me think over some examples of " root cause " and manifestation of disease. > >>>>>>Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine. > >>>>>>Asthma - lungs > >>>>>>Vitiligo-skin > >>>>>> > >>>>>>All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this " global epidemic " ), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? > >>>>>> > >>>>>>I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join > >>>>>> me to go through them together? > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Warm Regards to both, > >>>>>>Maja Strbac > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Hari Om Tat Sat > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>--- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>>Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Dear Lakshmi, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Yours is a good name too :-) > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Hare Rama Krishna > >>>>>>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, > >>>>>>>>Nice name! > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>There is the seed , or origin, > >>>>>>>> and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, > >>>>>>>>it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal " symptoms " . > >>>>>>>>Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, > >>>>>>>>to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are, > >>>>>>>> where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. > >>>>>>>>In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) > >>>>>>>>But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved. > >>>>>>>> Im saying Venus must be at the root of it. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. > >>>>>>>>Hope you understand my point. > >>>>>>>>One " symptom " of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. > >>>>>>>>One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. > >>>>>>>>One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. > >>>>>>>>So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? > >>>>>>>>Not at the skin, it is just one of many " symptoms " . > >>>>>>>>Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . > >>>>>>>>Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. > >>>>>>>>Best wishes > >>>>>>>>Lakshmi > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > ________________________________ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PM > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Dear Lakshmi, > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Did you want to say: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>- It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or > >>>>>>>>- It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Please clarify. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Hare Rama Krishna > >>>>>>>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, > >>>>>>>>>Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. > >>>>>>>>>When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Many skin problems are the result of " body chemistry " out of wack. > >>>>>>>>>Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. > >>>>>>>>>Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Bottom line Many of these things overlap > >>>>>>>>>( i mean karaka wise) > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? > >>>>>>>>>So I see it all as inter related. > >>>>>>>>>See primary issue, and then secondary issue. > >>>>>>>>>In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. > >>>>>>>>>Best wishes > >>>>>>>>>Lakshmi > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > ________________________________ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AM > >>>>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Dear Sanjay, > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on " Essentials of Medical Astrology " puts leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Comments welcome. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>|| Om Gurave Namah || > >>>>>>>>>>Dear Krishna, > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's > >>>>>>>>>> house. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>In another sense Vayu tattva is " Sense object " for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Warm Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>Sanjay P > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Dear Sanjayji, > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>|| Om Gurave Namah || > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Dear Jani, > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma. > >>>>>>>>>>>>In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Warm Regards > >>>>>>>>>>>>Sanjay P > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Birth details of one my relative are follows. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> DOB 14/7/1972 > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Place: Navsari/Gujarat > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Time: 20:20 Hrs > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice. > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> M H Jani > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Natal Chart > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>July 14, 1972 > >>>>>>>>>>>>Time: 20:20:00 > >>>>>>>>>>>>Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT) > >>>>>>>>>>>>Place: 72 E 55' 00 " , 20 N 51' 00 " > >>>>>>>>>>>> Navsari, India > >>>>>>>>>>>>Altitude: 0.00 meters > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Lunar Yr-Mo: Paridhavi - Ashadha > >>>>>>>>>>>>Tithi: Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>>Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) > >>>>>>>>>>>>Nakshatra: Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>>Yoga: Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>>Karana: Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>>Hora Lord: Venus (5 min sign: Cn) > >>>>>>>>>>>>Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi) > >>>>>>>>>>>>Kaala Lord: Mars (Mahakala: Mars) > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Sunrise: 6:05:28 > >>>>>>>>>>>>Sunset: 19:22:37 > >>>>>>>>>>>>Janma Ghatis: 35.6057 > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Ayanamsa: 23-28-21.04 > >>>>>>>>>>>>Sidereal Time: 15:11:56 > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Lagna 14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav 2 Cp Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>Sun - AK 28 Ge 46' 16.46 " Puna 3 Ge Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>>Moon - GK 16 Le 30' 41.26 " PPha 1 Le Le > >>>>>>>>>>>>Mars - PK 16 Cn 39' 20.95 " Push 4 Cn Sc > >>>>>>>>>>>>Mercury - MK 24 Cn 45' 21.10 " Asre 3 Cn Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>>Jupiter ® - DK 7 Sg 33' 17.92 " Mool 3 Sg Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>>Venus - BK 25 Ta 10' 43.28 " Mrig 1 Ta Le > >>>>>>>>>>>>Saturn - PiK 21 Ta 58' > >>>>>>>>>>>> 15.19 " Rohi 4 Ta Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>>Rahu - AmK 2 Cp 48' 03.08 " USha 2 Cp Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>>Ketu 2 Cn 48' 03.08 " Puna 4 Cn Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>>Maandi 19 Ar 25' 49.18 " Bhar 2 Ar Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>Gulika 7 Ar 26' 28.59 " Aswi 3 Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>>Bhava Lagna 1 Aq 50' 22.21 " Dhan 3 Aq Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>Hora Lagna 5 Vi 28' 25.28 " UPha 3 Vi Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>>Ghati Lagna 16 Ge 22' 34.48 " Ardr 3 Ge Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>>Vighati Lagna 10 Ta 53' 20.48 " Rohi 1 Ta Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>Varnada Lagna 14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr 3 Ge Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>Sree Lagna 10 Ar 42' 53.24 " Aswi 4 Ar Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>>Pranapada Lagna 11 Vi 27' 17.80 " Hast 1 Vi Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>Indu Lagna 16 Vi 30' 41.26 " Hast 2 Vi Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>Bhrigu Bindu 24 Ar 39' 22.17 " Bhar 4 Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sc > >>>>>>>>>>>>Dhooma 12 Sc 06' 16.46 " Anu 3 Sc Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>Vyatipata 17 Le 53' 43.54 " PPha 2 Le Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>Parivesha 17 Aq 53' 43.54 " Sata 4 Aq Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>>Indra Chapa 12 Ta 06' 16.46 " Rohi 1 Ta Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>Upaketu 28 Ta 46' 16.46 " Mrig 2 Ta Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>Kaala 1 Ge 04' 56.04 " Mrig 3 Ge Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>Mrityu 10 Cp 12' 36.34 " Srav 1 Cp Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>Artha Prahara 3 Aq 14' 51.48 " Dhan 3 Aq Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>Yama Ghantaka > >>>>>>>>>>>> 28 Aq 41' 23.20 " PBha 3 Aq Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>>Prana Sphuta 21 Pi 58' 04.14 " Reva 2 Pi Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>>Deha Sphuta 19 Ar 31' 58.71 " Bhar 2 Ar Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>Mrityu Sphuta 20 Le 51' 36.61 " PPha 3 Le Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>Sookshma TriSphuta 2 Vi 21' 39.45 " UPha 2 Vi Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>>TriSphuta 8 Ge 51' 28.97 " Ardr 1 Ge Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>>ChatusSphuta 7 Vi 37' 45.43 " UPha 4 Vi Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>>PanchaSphuta 10 Ge 25' 48.50 " Ardr 2 Ge Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>>V2 14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast 2 Vi Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>V3 > >>>>>>>>>>>> 14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat 3 Li Le > >>>>>>>>>>>>V4 14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav 2 Cp Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>V5 14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata 3 Aq Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>>V6 14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi 2 Ta Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>V7 > >>>>>>>>>>>> 14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr 3 Ge Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>V8 14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast 2 Vi Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>V9 14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat 3 Li Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>>V10 14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav 2 Cp Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>V11 > >>>>>>>>>>>> 14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata 3 Aq Le > >>>>>>>>>>>>V12 14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi 2 Ta Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>Kunda 7 Ta 19' 47.81 " Krit 4 Ta Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>>| |Md Gk |Ve Sa > >>>>>>>>>>>> |Su GL | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | |Ma Me | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | |Ke | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- | Rasi |----------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>|As Ra | > >>>>>>>>>>>> |Mo | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>|JuR | | |HL AL | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>>+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | |As |Su JuR | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | |Gk | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>|Me HL | |Sa Ke | > >>>>>>>>>>>>|GL | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | Navamsa | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- | |----------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>|Ra > >>>>>>>>>>>> | D-9 |Mo Ve | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | |AL | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| |Ma | |Md | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>| | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>>+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Vimsottari Dasa (): > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Ven Ven 1967-10-10 Sun 1971-02-05 Moon 1972-02-05 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Mars 1973-10-09 Rah 1974-12-08 Jup 1977-12-08 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sat 1980-08-08 Merc 1983-10-10 Ket 1986-08-09 > >>>>>>>>>>>>Sun Sun 1987-10-10 Moon 1988-01-25 Mars 1988-07-27 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Rah 1988-12-02 Jup 1989-10-27 Sat 1990-08-15 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Merc 1991-07-28 Ket 1992-05-31 Ven 1992-10-09 > >>>>>>>>>>>>Moon Moon 1993-10-09 Mars 1994-08-09 Rah 1995-03-07 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Jup 1996-09-09 Sat 1998-01-07 Merc 1999-08-09 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ket 2001-01-06 Ven 2001-08-09 Sun 2003-04-06 > >>>>>>>>>>>>Mars Mars 2003-10-10 Rah 2004-03-03 Jup 2005-03-22 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sat 2006-02-26 Merc 2007-04-06 Ket 2008-04-03 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ven 2008-09-02 Sun 2009-11-03 Moon 2010-03-07 > >>>>>>>>>>>>Rah Rah 2010-10-10 Jup 2013-06-19 Sat 2015-11-15 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Merc 2018-09-21 Ket 2021-04-06 Ven 2022-04-25 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sun 2025-04-24 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Moon 2026-03-19 Mars 2027-09-22 > >>>>>>>>>>>>Jup Jup 2028-10-09 Sat 2030-11-27 Merc 2033-06-07 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ket 2035-09-16 Ven 2036-08-21 Sun 2039-04-19 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Moon 2040-02-06 Mars 2041-06-07 Rah 2042-05-13 > >>>>>>>>>>>>Sat Sat 2044-10-09 Merc 2047-10-13 Ket 2050-06-20 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ven 2051-07-31 Sun 2054-10-01 Moon 2055-09-13 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Mars 2057-04-09 Rah 2058-05-20 Jup 2061-03-25 > >>>>>>>>>>>>Merc Merc 2063-10-10 Ket 2066-03-04 Ven 2067-03-02 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sun 2070-01-01 Moon 2070-11-09 Mars 2072-04-06 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Rah 2073-04-03 Jup 2075-10-25 Sat 2078-01-28 > >>>>>>>>>>>>Ket Ket 2080-10-10 Ven 2081-03-04 Sun 2082-05-04 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Moon 2082-09-13 Mars 2083-04-10 Rah 2083-09-10 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Jup 2084-09-28 Sat 2085-09-03 Merc 2086-10-13 > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> > >>> > >>>>>> > >>> > >>> Need mail bonding? 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Guest guest Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 Om Gurave NamahDear Michal, namaste"Essentially it is the body attacking its own cells. "Precisely. Self destruction. There is obvious way of self destruction:http://www.mypointless.com/2009/02/nurse-sets-off-metal-detectors.htmlOr similar, but wrapped in shiny paper:http://www.hitsville.org/wp/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/michael-jackson-neverland.jpgThe only difference between autoimmune respond and obvious self injuring lies in fact that it is not superficial or done by scalpel, needle etc. It is a little bit subtle way of self destruction and it is not conscious choice."Self" and "destruction", now this is not my personal wisdom, I will just retell that we need paka lagna to be involved in a way for that part "self", for applied intelligence used in a wrong way. I was mentioning Rahu a while ago and I still think we need nodes and preferably Mangal for destruction. Badhaka involved by all means. Check all those charts, not just this with celiac syndrome.And how to relate this with specific body part where respond manifests? That is the reason why I included in this discussion.Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Wed, 9/2/09, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal wrote:Michal Dziwulski <nearmichalRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa Date: Wednesday, September 2, 2009, 1:50 PM Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Maja,So what is the 'root cause' of autoimmune disorder? Essentially it is the body attacking its own cells. 6th house is something else attacking the body, 8th house is nija dosha. Nija - innate, of one's own party or country, an enemy in one's own country (MW). So how about the 8th house/lord?Regards,MichalMaja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ >sohamsa@ .comWednesday, 2 September, 2009 11:11:29 PMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Om Gurave NamahDear Michal and Krishnamurthy, namasteIt is a little bit of a problem to understand each other and continue dialogue if we are not looking at same subject from same perspective.Michal: "So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. "No, scientifically it is a problem with immune system which secondary leads to problems with digestion. I am trying to agree on this order of symptoms and find them in charts. Do you still consider this order to be wrong? I see no chicken/egg dilemma in this order. I completely agree on including Graha signifying particular allergen, but I would not start or end chart observation with this. That is what I am trying to say, and I think Krishnamurthy is trying same among rest of his points. Getting rid of allergen is not curing anything, problem is still there in body. People suffering celiac syndrome are not perfectly fine if they exclude 80% of grains (only corn, rice and buckwheat don't contain gluten). They are excluding valuable source for large number of vitamins from B group (especially if they are ovo-lacto, lacto or ovo vegetarians) . Synthetic supplements can't replace it perfectly speaking in long terms. What I am trying to say is: excluding gluten is just a small patch over a big, open wound. It is like someone is having Kala Sarpa Yoga on 5/11th axis in chart (and imagine that positions related to KSY are really pointing on problems related to progeny), and you give them advice to chant Santana Gopala mantra (and maybe add prasidha Savitur Gayatri for just in case) to accomplish progeny. It is a good advice, but... it is skipping the root cause.Let me rephrase my initial question: What is primary for observation about autoimmune diseases: positions in chart pointing on autoimmune disorders (probably signified by Rahu) or secondary symptoms (lungs, digestion, skin)? When we determine positions pointing on autoimmune disorders, how do we relate them with particular body part where they manifest? I would also like to read reply on Tarun's question.Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Tue, 9/1/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote:Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma ProblemTo: sohamsa@ .comTuesday, September 1, 2009, 8:12 PM Dear Michal,You said:Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. It is clear that I am focusing on the root cause of the problem and you are focusing on the remedies for the problem. It appears to me that we are at different ends of the domain that we need to address. But, a remedy suggested without understanding the cause fully could be incomplete and ineffective. It is like treating just the symptoms and not addressing the root cause. Regards, Krishna On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote: Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Krishna,It is the earth that revolves around the Sun. Nevertheless we take the geocentric viewpoint. So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. So which do we use? It is like chicken and egg situation - which came first? For a person with celiac disorder, they are fine as long as they don't eat wheat (Sun). When they see a loaf of bread they say no thanks. This is how it is manifesting in their experiential world. That the doctor tells them about this protein and this immune system is something secondary as far as they're concerned because the primary thing the doctor tells them is don't eat anything which contains gluten. So when we look at the chart we need to be clear what we are looking at ie. which level are we going to. Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. Regards,Michal Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> sohamsa@ .comTuesday, 1 September, 2009 4:56:56 PM Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Michal, It depends on how one is looking at the problem. From my perspective, the native will not be able to digest Gluten etc., after the damage is caused. And, Gluten by itself does not cause the damage to start with. Hence, what you are describing as the cause is an after effect of having the damage already in place. What causes the damage is the autoimmune reaction in the first place. Dear Maja, Yes, I am the same SY SY... person :-) Virgo has two malefic aspects and not just one. Both Mars and Ketu aspect Virgo. And, it is a good observation from Amit that Mercury is conjunct (and combust by) 8th lord Sun. In addition, Mercury occupies 8th house from Virgo. It is evident that Virgo, 6H and Mercury are all afflicted. Regards, KrishnaOn Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote: Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Maja and Krishna,Coeliac disease is caused by a reaction to gliadin, a gluten protein found in wheat So is Sun not the culprit as Sun is karaka for wheat? Something external the body cannot digest - we have to look at 6th house. Lagnesh is in the 6th house for a start and it is Saturn. (Interestingly this will cause the AL to fall in the 11th house and thus Lagnesh is in the 8th from AL). In the chart provided Sun is 8th lord. When the 8th lord has anything to do with 6th house or lord it can give chronic digestive disease. Here Sun is conjoined 6th lord Mercury and in the 8th house from Moon - confirming the health issue. Narayana dasa of Leo was just running.Regards,Michal Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> sohamsa@ .comMonday, 31 August, 2009 9:42:46 PM Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Maja,Frankly, when I first opened the chart, I too looked at Venus, as it is in Rahu-Ketu axis and also aspected by Marsand in papakartari. This could have its own ramifications at the appropriate time and may not be relevant to Celiac Disorder. I googled to get some details on Celiac disorder. From what I understand, I don't think it is a problem related to Mars, though it is a digestive disorder. The small intestine is affected and is unable to absorb some of the nutrients. Since it is the small intestine, one should look at the 6th house and the sign Virgo. In this case, the lord of both 6th house and Virgo both is Mercury. Mercury is combust and also disposits Saturn. Mercury and Rahu have a common dispositor and Saturn is in the nakshatra of Rahu, one can assume that rahu affects Mercury as well. The problem is on the lining of the small intestine which has some functions akin to skin also. That too calls for a look at Mercury as well. This is not a conclusion but my preliminary line of analysis. I need to look at more charts (thanks to Tarun for providing more charts and I am yet to take a look at them).Regards, KrishnaOn Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: Om Gurave NamahDear Krishnamurthy, namaste(Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for "water" also For a start, here is Celiac disorder native:DOB: 25th of April 1975TOB: 01:44 AMPOB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 Time zone is 01h East of GMTYou should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion?Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem sohamsa@ .comSunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM Dear Maja,Another good name :-)You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle.Regards,Krishna On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: Om Gurave NamahDear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste(two wonderful names indeed Your discussion made me think over some examples of "root cause" and manifestation of disease. Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine.Asthma - lungsVitiligo-skin All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this "global epidemic"), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join me to go through them together? Warm Regards to both,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .comFriday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM Dear Lakshmi,Yours is a good name too :-)Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question.OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic.Regards,KrishnaOn Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: Hare Rama Krishna Dear Krishnamurthy, Nice name! I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro. Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet. There is the seed , or origin, and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal "symptoms". Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind. Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are, where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved. Im saying Venus must be at the root of it. Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. Hope you understand my point. One "symptom" of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? Not at the skin, it is just one of many "symptoms". Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. Best wishes Lakshmi Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .com Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Lakshmi, I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. Did you want to say: - It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or - It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus Please clarify. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: Hare Rama Krishna Dear Krishnamurthy, Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body. Many skin problems are the result of "body chemistry" out of wack. Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue. Bottom line Many of these things overlap ( i mean karaka wise) Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? So I see it all as inter related. See primary issue, and then secondary issue. In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. Best wishes Lakshmi Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .com Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Sanjay, Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on "Essentials of Medical Astrology" puts leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. Comments welcome. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Krishna, Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted.In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house.In another sense Vayu tattva is "Sense object" for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. Warm Regards,Sanjay P 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Dear Sanjayji, Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? Regards, Krishna On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Jani, Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma.In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana.Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka.Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. Warm RegardsSanjay P2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani >>> >> Birth details of one my relative are follows. >> DOB 14/7/1972> Place: Navsari/Gujarat> Time: 20:20 Hrs>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice.>> M H Jani Natal Chart July 14, 1972 Time: 20:20:00Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT) Place: 72 E 55' 00", 20 N 51' 00" Navsari, India Altitude: 0.00 metersLunar Yr-Mo: Paridhavi - Ashadha Tithi: Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left)Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) Nakshatra: Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left)Yoga: Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) Karana: Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left)Hora Lord: Venus (5 min sign: Cn) Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi)Kaala Lord: Mars (Mahakala: Mars) Sunrise: 6:05:28Sunset: 19:22:37 Janma Ghatis: 35.6057Ayanamsa: 23-28-21.04 Sidereal Time: 15:11:56Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa Lagna 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp TaSun - AK 28 Ge 46' 16.46" Puna 3 Ge Ge Moon - GK 16 Le 30' 41.26" PPha 1 Le LeMars - PK 16 Cn 39' 20.95" Push 4 Cn Sc Mercury - MK 24 Cn 45' 21.10" Asre 3 Cn AqJupiter ® - DK 7 Sg 33' 17.92" Mool 3 Sg Ge Venus - BK 25 Ta 10' 43.28" Mrig 1 Ta LeSaturn - PiK 21 Ta 58' 15.19" Rohi 4 Ta CnRahu - AmK 2 Cp 48' 03.08" USha 2 Cp Cp Ketu 2 Cn 48' 03.08" Puna 4 Cn CnMaandi 19 Ar 25' 49.18" Bhar 2 Ar Vi Gulika 7 Ar 26' 28.59" Aswi 3 Ar GeBhava Lagna 1 Aq 50' 22.21" Dhan 3 Aq Li Hora Lagna 5 Vi 28' 25.28" UPha 3 Vi AqGhati Lagna 16 Ge 22' 34.48" Ardr 3 Ge Aq Vighati Lagna 10 Ta 53' 20.48" Rohi 1 Ta ArVarnada Lagna 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge Ar Sree Lagna 10 Ar 42' 53.24" Aswi 4 Ar CnPranapada Lagna 11 Vi 27' 17.80" Hast 1 Vi Ar Indu Lagna 16 Vi 30' 41.26" Hast 2 Vi TaBhrigu Bindu 24 Ar 39' 22.17" Bhar 4 Ar ScDhooma 12 Sc 06' 16.46" Anu 3 Sc Li Vyatipata 17 Le 53' 43.54" PPha 2 Le ViParivesha 17 Aq 53' 43.54" Sata 4 Aq Pi Indra Chapa 12 Ta 06' 16.46" Rohi 1 Ta ArUpaketu 28 Ta 46' 16.46" Mrig 2 Ta Vi Kaala 1 Ge 04' 56.04" Mrig 3 Ge LiMrityu 10 Cp 12' 36.34" Srav 1 Cp Ar Artha Prahara 3 Aq 14' 51.48" Dhan 3 Aq LiYama Ghantaka 28 Aq 41' 23.20" PBha 3 Aq GePrana Sphuta 21 Pi 58' 04.14" Reva 2 Pi Cp Deha Sphuta 19 Ar 31' 58.71" Bhar 2 Ar ViMrityu Sphuta 20 Le 51' 36.61" PPha 3 Le Li Sookshma TriSphuta 2 Vi 21' 39.45" UPha 2 Vi CpTriSphuta 8 Ge 51' 28.97" Ardr 1 Ge Sg ChatusSphuta 7 Vi 37' 45.43" UPha 4 Vi PiPanchaSphuta 10 Ge 25' 48.50" Ardr 2 Ge Cp V2 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi TaV3 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li LeV4 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Vi V5 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq SgV6 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta Ta V7 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge ArV8 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi Ta V9 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li SgV10 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Vi V11 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq LeV12 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta Ta Kunda 7 Ta 19' 47.81" Krit 4 Ta Pi+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + | |Md Gk |Ve Sa |Su GL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | | |Ma Me || | |Ke | | | | || | | || | | | |----------- | Rasi |----------- ||As Ra | |Mo || | | | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | |JuR | | |HL AL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +| | |As |Su JuR | | | | |Gk || | | | | | | | | || | | | | |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- ||Me HL | |Sa Ke | |GL | | || | | || | | | | | Navamsa | ||----------- | |----------- | |Ra | D-9 |Mo Ve || | |AL | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | |Ma | |Md || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + Vimsottari Dasa (): Ven Ven 1967-10-10 Sun 1971-02-05 Moon 1972-02-05 Mars 1973-10-09 Rah 1974-12-08 Jup 1977-12-08 Sat 1980-08-08 Merc 1983-10-10 Ket 1986-08-09 Sun Sun 1987-10-10 Moon 1988-01-25 Mars 1988-07-27 Rah 1988-12-02 Jup 1989-10-27 Sat 1990-08-15 Merc 1991-07-28 Ket 1992-05-31 Ven 1992-10-09 Moon Moon 1993-10-09 Mars 1994-08-09 Rah 1995-03-07 Jup 1996-09-09 Sat 1998-01-07 Merc 1999-08-09 Ket 2001-01-06 Ven 2001-08-09 Sun 2003-04-06 Mars Mars 2003-10-10 Rah 2004-03-03 Jup 2005-03-22 Sat 2006-02-26 Merc 2007-04-06 Ket 2008-04-03 Ven 2008-09-02 Sun 2009-11-03 Moon 2010-03-07 Rah Rah 2010-10-10 Jup 2013-06-19 Sat 2015-11-15 Merc 2018-09-21 Ket 2021-04-06 Ven 2022-04-25 Sun 2025-04-24 Moon 2026-03-19 Mars 2027-09-22 Jup Jup 2028-10-09 Sat 2030-11-27 Merc 2033-06-07 Ket 2035-09-16 Ven 2036-08-21 Sun 2039-04-19 Moon 2040-02-06 Mars 2041-06-07 Rah 2042-05-13 Sat Sat 2044-10-09 Merc 2047-10-13 Ket 2050-06-20 Ven 2051-07-31 Sun 2054-10-01 Moon 2055-09-13 Mars 2057-04-09 Rah 2058-05-20 Jup 2061-03-25 Merc Merc 2063-10-10 Ket 2066-03-04 Ven 2067-03-02 Sun 2070-01-01 Moon 2070-11-09 Mars 2072-04-06 Rah 2073-04-03 Jup 2075-10-25 Sat 2078-01-28 Ket Ket 2080-10-10 Ven 2081-03-04 Sun 2082-05-04 Moon 2082-09-13 Mars 2083-04-10 Rah 2083-09-10 Jup 2084-09-28 Sat 2085-09-03 Merc 2086-10-13 Need mail bonding? 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Guest guest Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 *Why I insist on nodes in context of destruction?Ketu destroys Rajas, Rahu destroys Satva. --- On Thu, 9/3/09, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro wrote:Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastroRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa Date: Thursday, September 3, 2009, 2:21 AMOm Gurave NamahDear Michal, namaste"Essentially it is the body attacking its own cells. "Precisely. Self destruction. There is obvious way of self destruction:http://www.mypointless.com/2009/02/nurse-sets-off-metal-detectors.htmlOr similar, but wrapped in shiny paper:http://www.hitsville.org/wp/wp-content/uploads/2009/06/michael-jackson-neverland.jpgThe only difference between autoimmune respond and obvious self injuring lies in fact that it is not superficial or done by scalpel, needle etc. It is a little bit subtle way of self destruction and it is not conscious choice."Self" and "destruction", now this is not my personal wisdom, I will just retell that we need paka lagna to be involved in a way for that part "self", for applied intelligence used in a wrong way. I was mentioning Rahu a while ago and I still think we need nodes and preferably Mangal for destruction. Badhaka involved by all means. Check all those charts, not just this with celiac syndrome.And how to relate this with specific body part where respond manifests? That is the reason why I included in this discussion.Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Wed, 9/2/09, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal wrote:Michal Dziwulski <nearmichalRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa Date: Wednesday, September 2, 2009, 1:50 PM Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Maja,So what is the 'root cause' of autoimmune disorder? Essentially it is the body attacking its own cells. 6th house is something else attacking the body, 8th house is nija dosha. Nija - innate, of one's own party or country, an enemy in one's own country (MW). So how about the 8th house/lord?Regards,MichalMaja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ >sohamsa@ .comWednesday, 2 September, 2009 11:11:29 PMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Om Gurave NamahDear Michal and Krishnamurthy, namasteIt is a little bit of a problem to understand each other and continue dialogue if we are not looking at same subject from same perspective.Michal: "So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. "No, scientifically it is a problem with immune system which secondary leads to problems with digestion. I am trying to agree on this order of symptoms and find them in charts. Do you still consider this order to be wrong? I see no chicken/egg dilemma in this order. I completely agree on including Graha signifying particular allergen, but I would not start or end chart observation with this. That is what I am trying to say, and I think Krishnamurthy is trying same among rest of his points. Getting rid of allergen is not curing anything, problem is still there in body. People suffering celiac syndrome are not perfectly fine if they exclude 80% of grains (only corn, rice and buckwheat don't contain gluten). They are excluding valuable source for large number of vitamins from B group (especially if they are ovo-lacto, lacto or ovo vegetarians) . Synthetic supplements can't replace it perfectly speaking in long terms. What I am trying to say is: excluding gluten is just a small patch over a big, open wound. It is like someone is having Kala Sarpa Yoga on 5/11th axis in chart (and imagine that positions related to KSY are really pointing on problems related to progeny), and you give them advice to chant Santana Gopala mantra (and maybe add prasidha Savitur Gayatri for just in case) to accomplish progeny. It is a good advice, but... it is skipping the root cause.Let me rephrase my initial question: What is primary for observation about autoimmune diseases: positions in chart pointing on autoimmune disorders (probably signified by Rahu) or secondary symptoms (lungs, digestion, skin)? When we determine positions pointing on autoimmune disorders, how do we relate them with particular body part where they manifest? I would also like to read reply on Tarun's question.Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Tue, 9/1/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote:Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma ProblemTo: sohamsa@ .comTuesday, September 1, 2009, 8:12 PM Dear Michal,You said:Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. It is clear that I am focusing on the root cause of the problem and you are focusing on the remedies for the problem. It appears to me that we are at different ends of the domain that we need to address. But, a remedy suggested without understanding the cause fully could be incomplete and ineffective. It is like treating just the symptoms and not addressing the root cause. Regards, Krishna On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote: Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Krishna,It is the earth that revolves around the Sun. Nevertheless we take the geocentric viewpoint. So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. So which do we use? It is like chicken and egg situation - which came first? For a person with celiac disorder, they are fine as long as they don't eat wheat (Sun). When they see a loaf of bread they say no thanks. This is how it is manifesting in their experiential world. That the doctor tells them about this protein and this immune system is something secondary as far as they're concerned because the primary thing the doctor tells them is don't eat anything which contains gluten. So when we look at the chart we need to be clear what we are looking at ie. which level are we going to. Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. Regards,Michal Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> sohamsa@ .comTuesday, 1 September, 2009 4:56:56 PM Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Michal, It depends on how one is looking at the problem. From my perspective, the native will not be able to digest Gluten etc., after the damage is caused. And, Gluten by itself does not cause the damage to start with. Hence, what you are describing as the cause is an after effect of having the damage already in place. What causes the damage is the autoimmune reaction in the first place. Dear Maja, Yes, I am the same SY SY... person :-) Virgo has two malefic aspects and not just one. Both Mars and Ketu aspect Virgo. And, it is a good observation from Amit that Mercury is conjunct (and combust by) 8th lord Sun. In addition, Mercury occupies 8th house from Virgo. It is evident that Virgo, 6H and Mercury are all afflicted. Regards, KrishnaOn Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal > wrote: Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Maja and Krishna,Coeliac disease is caused by a reaction to gliadin, a gluten protein found in wheat So is Sun not the culprit as Sun is karaka for wheat? Something external the body cannot digest - we have to look at 6th house. Lagnesh is in the 6th house for a start and it is Saturn. (Interestingly this will cause the AL to fall in the 11th house and thus Lagnesh is in the 8th from AL). In the chart provided Sun is 8th lord. When the 8th lord has anything to do with 6th house or lord it can give chronic digestive disease. Here Sun is conjoined 6th lord Mercury and in the 8th house from Moon - confirming the health issue. Narayana dasa of Leo was just running.Regards,Michal Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> sohamsa@ .comMonday, 31 August, 2009 9:42:46 PM Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Maja,Frankly, when I first opened the chart, I too looked at Venus, as it is in Rahu-Ketu axis and also aspected by Marsand in papakartari. This could have its own ramifications at the appropriate time and may not be relevant to Celiac Disorder. I googled to get some details on Celiac disorder. From what I understand, I don't think it is a problem related to Mars, though it is a digestive disorder. The small intestine is affected and is unable to absorb some of the nutrients. Since it is the small intestine, one should look at the 6th house and the sign Virgo. In this case, the lord of both 6th house and Virgo both is Mercury. Mercury is combust and also disposits Saturn. Mercury and Rahu have a common dispositor and Saturn is in the nakshatra of Rahu, one can assume that rahu affects Mercury as well. The problem is on the lining of the small intestine which has some functions akin to skin also. That too calls for a look at Mercury as well. This is not a conclusion but my preliminary line of analysis. I need to look at more charts (thanks to Tarun for providing more charts and I am yet to take a look at them).Regards, KrishnaOn Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: Om Gurave NamahDear Krishnamurthy, namaste(Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for "water" also For a start, here is Celiac disorder native:DOB: 25th of April 1975TOB: 01:44 AMPOB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 Time zone is 01h East of GMTYou should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion?Warm Regards,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem sohamsa@ .comSunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM Dear Maja,Another good name :-)You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle.Regards,Krishna On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: Om Gurave NamahDear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste(two wonderful names indeed Your discussion made me think over some examples of "root cause" and manifestation of disease. Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine.Asthma - lungsVitiligo-skin All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this "global epidemic"), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join me to go through them together? Warm Regards to both,Maja StrbacHari Om Tat Sat--- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .comFriday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM Dear Lakshmi,Yours is a good name too :-)Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question.OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic.Regards,KrishnaOn Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: Hare Rama Krishna Dear Krishnamurthy, Nice name! I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro. Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet. There is the seed , or origin, and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal "symptoms". Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind. Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are, where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved. Im saying Venus must be at the root of it. Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. Hope you understand my point. One "symptom" of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? Not at the skin, it is just one of many "symptoms". Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. Best wishes Lakshmi Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .com Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Lakshmi, I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. Did you want to say: - It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or - It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus Please clarify. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: Hare Rama Krishna Dear Krishnamurthy, Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body. Many skin problems are the result of "body chemistry" out of wack. Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue. Bottom line Many of these things overlap ( i mean karaka wise) Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? So I see it all as inter related. See primary issue, and then secondary issue. In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. Best wishes Lakshmi Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>sohamsa@ .com Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AMRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Dear Sanjay, Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on "Essentials of Medical Astrology" puts leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. Comments welcome. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Krishna, Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted.In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house.In another sense Vayu tattva is "Sense object" for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. Warm Regards,Sanjay P 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Dear Sanjayji, Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? Regards, Krishna On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Jani, Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma.In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana.Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka.Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. Warm RegardsSanjay P2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani >>> >> Birth details of one my relative are follows. >> DOB 14/7/1972> Place: Navsari/Gujarat> Time: 20:20 Hrs>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice.>> M H Jani Natal Chart July 14, 1972 Time: 20:20:00Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT) Place: 72 E 55' 00", 20 N 51' 00" Navsari, India Altitude: 0.00 metersLunar Yr-Mo: Paridhavi - Ashadha Tithi: Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left)Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) Nakshatra: Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left)Yoga: Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) Karana: Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left)Hora Lord: Venus (5 min sign: Cn) Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi)Kaala Lord: Mars (Mahakala: Mars) Sunrise: 6:05:28Sunset: 19:22:37 Janma Ghatis: 35.6057Ayanamsa: 23-28-21.04 Sidereal Time: 15:11:56Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa Lagna 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp TaSun - AK 28 Ge 46' 16.46" Puna 3 Ge Ge Moon - GK 16 Le 30' 41.26" PPha 1 Le LeMars - PK 16 Cn 39' 20.95" Push 4 Cn Sc Mercury - MK 24 Cn 45' 21.10" Asre 3 Cn AqJupiter ® - DK 7 Sg 33' 17.92" Mool 3 Sg Ge Venus - BK 25 Ta 10' 43.28" Mrig 1 Ta LeSaturn - PiK 21 Ta 58' 15.19" Rohi 4 Ta CnRahu - AmK 2 Cp 48' 03.08" USha 2 Cp Cp Ketu 2 Cn 48' 03.08" Puna 4 Cn CnMaandi 19 Ar 25' 49.18" Bhar 2 Ar Vi Gulika 7 Ar 26' 28.59" Aswi 3 Ar GeBhava Lagna 1 Aq 50' 22.21" Dhan 3 Aq Li Hora Lagna 5 Vi 28' 25.28" UPha 3 Vi AqGhati Lagna 16 Ge 22' 34.48" Ardr 3 Ge Aq Vighati Lagna 10 Ta 53' 20.48" Rohi 1 Ta ArVarnada Lagna 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge Ar Sree Lagna 10 Ar 42' 53.24" Aswi 4 Ar CnPranapada Lagna 11 Vi 27' 17.80" Hast 1 Vi Ar Indu Lagna 16 Vi 30' 41.26" Hast 2 Vi TaBhrigu Bindu 24 Ar 39' 22.17" Bhar 4 Ar ScDhooma 12 Sc 06' 16.46" Anu 3 Sc Li Vyatipata 17 Le 53' 43.54" PPha 2 Le ViParivesha 17 Aq 53' 43.54" Sata 4 Aq Pi Indra Chapa 12 Ta 06' 16.46" Rohi 1 Ta ArUpaketu 28 Ta 46' 16.46" Mrig 2 Ta Vi Kaala 1 Ge 04' 56.04" Mrig 3 Ge LiMrityu 10 Cp 12' 36.34" Srav 1 Cp Ar Artha Prahara 3 Aq 14' 51.48" Dhan 3 Aq LiYama Ghantaka 28 Aq 41' 23.20" PBha 3 Aq GePrana Sphuta 21 Pi 58' 04.14" Reva 2 Pi Cp Deha Sphuta 19 Ar 31' 58.71" Bhar 2 Ar ViMrityu Sphuta 20 Le 51' 36.61" PPha 3 Le Li Sookshma TriSphuta 2 Vi 21' 39.45" UPha 2 Vi CpTriSphuta 8 Ge 51' 28.97" Ardr 1 Ge Sg ChatusSphuta 7 Vi 37' 45.43" UPha 4 Vi PiPanchaSphuta 10 Ge 25' 48.50" Ardr 2 Ge Cp V2 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi TaV3 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li LeV4 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Vi V5 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq SgV6 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta Ta V7 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge ArV8 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi Ta V9 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li SgV10 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Vi V11 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq LeV12 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta Ta Kunda 7 Ta 19' 47.81" Krit 4 Ta Pi+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + | |Md Gk |Ve Sa |Su GL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | | |Ma Me || | |Ke | | | | || | | || | | | |----------- | Rasi |----------- ||As Ra | |Mo || | | | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | |JuR | | |HL AL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +| | |As |Su JuR | | | | |Gk || | | | | | | | | || | | | | |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- ||Me HL | |Sa Ke | |GL | | || | | || | | | | | Navamsa | ||----------- | |----------- | |Ra | D-9 |Mo Ve || | |AL | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | |Ma | |Md || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + Vimsottari Dasa (): Ven Ven 1967-10-10 Sun 1971-02-05 Moon 1972-02-05 Mars 1973-10-09 Rah 1974-12-08 Jup 1977-12-08 Sat 1980-08-08 Merc 1983-10-10 Ket 1986-08-09 Sun Sun 1987-10-10 Moon 1988-01-25 Mars 1988-07-27 Rah 1988-12-02 Jup 1989-10-27 Sat 1990-08-15 Merc 1991-07-28 Ket 1992-05-31 Ven 1992-10-09 Moon Moon 1993-10-09 Mars 1994-08-09 Rah 1995-03-07 Jup 1996-09-09 Sat 1998-01-07 Merc 1999-08-09 Ket 2001-01-06 Ven 2001-08-09 Sun 2003-04-06 Mars Mars 2003-10-10 Rah 2004-03-03 Jup 2005-03-22 Sat 2006-02-26 Merc 2007-04-06 Ket 2008-04-03 Ven 2008-09-02 Sun 2009-11-03 Moon 2010-03-07 Rah Rah 2010-10-10 Jup 2013-06-19 Sat 2015-11-15 Merc 2018-09-21 Ket 2021-04-06 Ven 2022-04-25 Sun 2025-04-24 Moon 2026-03-19 Mars 2027-09-22 Jup Jup 2028-10-09 Sat 2030-11-27 Merc 2033-06-07 Ket 2035-09-16 Ven 2036-08-21 Sun 2039-04-19 Moon 2040-02-06 Mars 2041-06-07 Rah 2042-05-13 Sat Sat 2044-10-09 Merc 2047-10-13 Ket 2050-06-20 Ven 2051-07-31 Sun 2054-10-01 Moon 2055-09-13 Mars 2057-04-09 Rah 2058-05-20 Jup 2061-03-25 Merc Merc 2063-10-10 Ket 2066-03-04 Ven 2067-03-02 Sun 2070-01-01 Moon 2070-11-09 Mars 2072-04-06 Rah 2073-04-03 Jup 2075-10-25 Sat 2078-01-28 Ket Ket 2080-10-10 Ven 2081-03-04 Sun 2082-05-04 Moon 2082-09-13 Mars 2083-04-10 Rah 2083-09-10 Jup 2084-09-28 Sat 2085-09-03 Merc 2086-10-13 Need mail bonding? 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Guest guest Posted September 3, 2009 Report Share Posted September 3, 2009 Om Gurave NamahDear Zoran, namasteThank you so much for including. I believe we all needed systematical step-by-step explanation which gathers all mentioned factors."Budha is also in MKS destroying the mituna rashi which is the place of Lagnesha, so Budha furthers shows the body. Mituna is in the 6th house again, digestive system."I will just say "WOW!" This is the best explanation which includes paka lagna. I was looking forward reading something like this.Since you asked for more charts with this disease (and you were mentioning a while ago your general research on medical Jyotish), the least I can do in return for this detailed explanation is to provide you one more chart.13th of May 1977.10 05 AM20 E 41, 43 N 43 (Kraljevo, Serbia)Time zone 01h East of GMTKark lagna, Dhanu D9 lagna. Gender is female. (There are similarities I must say)This girl is also suffering celiac syndrome. Additionally she is constantly suffering anorexia since 1993. It is probably Guinness world record for this illness, save this chart. One more question: You said Meena rasi for Surya related issues, so Kumbha rasi for Chandra problems? Mithuna rasi for Sukra problems? Tula rasi for Mangal related issues?Warm Regards,Maja Strbac--- On Wed, 9/2/09, ahimsavm <ahimsans wrote:ahimsavm <ahimsans Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa Date: Wednesday, September 2, 2009, 6:40 PM Om Namah Shivaya, Dear Michal and friends, Autoimmune disease do come from 8th house which is nija dosha, and due to badhak also which is our own karma causing the wrath of the Devatas.In natural zodiac 8th house is ruled by Mangal and Ketu, where Ketu gives primary cause of disease, while secondary reactions and accompaning disease come from Mangal. If the disease is caused by Rahu, then Rahu causes primary disase, while Shani causes secondary diseases. Notice that Rahu and Shani rule natural Badhak house. Since both nodes are involved, in Kala Sarpa and Kala Mrita Yogas one can sometimes see the autoimmune diseases, yet there are some factors to be checked too. If you look at the karmic cause of this disease, here are some hints. 1.Take the sign in the 8th house or badhak whichever is causing the disease and mark it! See if there are planets in there. 2. Observe that sign in karakamsa. Count from Ak planet in Navamsa from that sign. This house shows the anger of the Devata causing the disease, and karma of that house is the cause. For example, in celiac syndrom lady chart Maja gave, Simha Rasi is in the 8th house and Vrischika rashi is showing Badhak. Rahu is there in Vrischika. If you look at the Karakamsa Sign it is Virgo. Simha shows Ishta devata, so there is an anger of Ishtadevata in her chart (It is always the form of Vishnu - Akash in this method)and Sun shows the disease. Since Sun has to do with gluten, this normally caused intolarnce to Gluten due to such Anger. Sun is placed in 4th house (zero Digbala) and is weak, and is further conjoined with 6th lord (external factor) which is Budha (digestive system), so external factors such as certain food becomes an enemy for her. Budha is also in MKS destroying the mituna rashi which is the place of Lagnesha, so Budha furthers shows the body. Mituna is in the 6th house again, digestive system. There are further points about this disease, please check the Meena Rasi in Both D1 and D9 and you will get the answer. Meena rasi suffers curse of the Sun/Agni/. Kindly, get more charts with this disease and we can go more into detail about this point. Once you have seen the positions from Karakamsa and located that the anger of Ista Devata has caused the problem, check the position of the Sun in Navamsa too. Sun is in Lagna, which causes widowhood or early loss of partnerships. That is another place where this anger will operate. Since UL in Rashi chart is Meena with Guru in MKS, Surya is sitting in the 2nd house to it (cursing Meena), the relationships cannot last. Shukra is further cursed to confirm that. Hope that this helped... Best wishes Zoran Radosavljevic www.siva-edu. info www.ahimsazr1. wordpress. com sohamsa@ .com, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal@ ...> wrote: > > Hare Rama Krsna || > > Dear Maja, > > So what is the 'root cause' of autoimmune disorder? Essentially it is the body attacking its own cells. 6th house is something else attacking the body, 8th house is nija dosha. Nija - innate, of one's own party or country, an enemy in one's own country (MW). So how about the 8th house/lord? > > Regards, > Michal > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > Maja Ã… trbac <majastrbacastro@ ...> > sohamsa@ .com > Wednesday, 2 September, 2009 11:11:29 PM > Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > > > Om Gurave Namah > > Dear Michal and Krishnamurthy, namaste > > It is a little bit of a problem to understand each other and continue dialogue if we are not looking at same subject from same perspective. > > Michal: "So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's > digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. " > > No, scientifically it is a problem with immune system which secondary leads to problems with digestion. I am trying to agree on this order of symptoms and find them in charts. Do you still consider this order to be wrong? I see no chicken/egg dilemma in this order. > > I completely agree on including Graha signifying particular allergen, but I would not start or end chart observation with this. That is what I am trying to say, and I think Krishnamurthy is trying same among rest of his points. Getting rid of allergen is not curing anything, problem is still there in body. > > People suffering celiac syndrome are not perfectly fine if they exclude 80% of grains (only corn, rice and buckwheat don't contain gluten). They are excluding valuable source for large number of vitamins from B group (especially if they are ovo-lacto, lacto or ovo vegetarians) . Synthetic supplements can't replace it perfectly speaking in long terms. > > What I am trying to say is: excluding gluten is just a small patch over a big, open wound. It is like someone is having Kala Sarpa Yoga on 5/11th axis in chart (and imagine that positions related to KSY are really pointing on problems related to progeny), and you give them advice to chant Santana Gopala mantra (and maybe add prasidha Savitur Gayatri for just in case) to accomplish progeny. It is a good advice, but... it is skipping the root cause. > > Let me rephrase my initial question: What is primary for observation about autoimmune diseases: positions in chart pointing on autoimmune disorders (probably signified by Rahu) or secondary symptoms (lungs, digestion, skin)? When we determine positions pointing on autoimmune disorders, how do we relate them with particular body part where they manifest? > > I would also like to read reply on Tarun's question. > > Warm Regards, > Maja Strbac > > Hari Om Tat Sat > > --- On Tue, 9/1/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> wrote: > > > >Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > >Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >To: > > sohamsa@ .com > >Tuesday, September 1, 2009, 8:12 PM > > > > > > > > >Dear Michal, > > > > > >You said: > > > > > >Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. > > > > > >It is clear that I am focusing on the root cause of the problem and you are focusing on the remedies for the problem. It appears to me that we are at different ends of the domain that we need to address. But, a remedy suggested without understanding the cause fully could be incomplete and ineffective. It is like treating just the symptoms and not addressing the root cause. > > > > > >Regards, > >Krishna > > > > > > > >On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal> wrote: > > > > >> > >>Hare Rama Krsna || > >> > >>Dear Krishna, > >> > >>It is the earth that revolves around the Sun. Nevertheless we take the geocentric viewpoint. So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. So which do we use? It is like chicken and egg situation - which came first? > >> > >>For a person with celiac disorder, they are fine as long as they don't eat wheat (Sun). When they see a loaf of bread they say no thanks. This is how it is manifesting in their experiential world. That the doctor tells them about this protein and this immune system is something secondary as far as they're concerned because the primary thing the doctor tells them is don't eat anything which contains > >> gluten. So when we look at the chart we need to be clear what we are looking at ie. which level are we going to. Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. > >> > >>Regards, > >>Michal > >> > >> > >> > >> > ____________ _________ _________ __ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > >>sohamsa@ .com > >>Tuesday, 1 September, 2009 4:56:56 PM > >> > >>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >> > >> > >> >> > >>Dear Michal, > >> > >> > >>It depends on how one is looking at the problem. From my perspective, the native will not be able to digest Gluten etc., after the damage is caused. And, Gluten by itself does not cause the damage to start with. Hence, what you are describing as the cause is an after effect of having the damage already in place. What causes the damage is the autoimmune reaction in the first place. > >> > >> > >>Dear Maja, > >> > >> > >>Yes, I am the same SY SY... person :-) > >> > >> > >>Virgo has two malefic aspects and not just one. Both Mars and Ketu aspect Virgo. And, it is a good observation from Amit that Mercury is conjunct (and combust by) 8th lord Sun. In addition, Mercury occupies 8th house from Virgo. It is evident that Virgo, 6H and Mercury are all afflicted. > >> > >> > >>Regards, > >>Krishna > >> > >> > >>On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal> wrote: > >> > >> >>> > >>>Hare Rama Krsna || > >>> > >>>Dear Maja and Krishna, > >>> > >>>Coeliac disease is caused by a reaction to gliadin, a gluten protein found in wheat > >>> > >>>So is Sun not the culprit as Sun is karaka for wheat? Something external the body cannot digest - we have to look at 6th house. Lagnesh is in the 6th house for a start and it is Saturn. (Interestingly this will cause the AL to fall in the 11th house and thus Lagnesh is in the 8th from AL). > >>> > >>>In the chart provided Sun is 8th lord. When the 8th lord has anything to do with 6th house or lord it can give chronic digestive > >>> disease. Here Sun is conjoined 6th lord Mercury and in the 8th house from Moon - confirming the health issue. Narayana dasa of Leo was just running. > >>> > >>>Regards, > >>>Michal > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > ____________ _________ _________ __ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > >>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>Monday, 31 August, 2009 9:42:46 PM > >>> > >>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>> > >>> > >>> >>> > >>>Dear Maja, > >>> > >>> > >>>Frankly, when I first opened the chart, I too looked at Venus, as it is in Rahu-Ketu axis and also aspected by Marsand in papakartari. This could have its own ramifications at the appropriate time and may not be relevant to Celiac Disorder. > >>> > >>> > >>>I googled to get some details on Celiac disorder. From what I understand, I don't think it is a problem related to Mars, though it is a digestive disorder. The small intestine is affected and is unable to absorb some of the nutrients. Since it is the small intestine, one should look at the 6th house and the sign Virgo. In this case, the lord of both 6th house and Virgo both is Mercury. Mercury is combust and also disposits Saturn. Mercury and Rahu have a common dispositor and Saturn is in the nakshatra of Rahu, one can assume that rahu affects Mercury as well. The problem is on the lining of the small intestine which has some functions akin to skin also. That too calls for a look at Mercury as well. > >>> > >>> > >>>This is not a conclusion but my preliminary line of analysis. I need to look at more charts (thanks to Tarun for providing more charts and I am yet to take a look at them). > >>> > >>> > >>>Regards, > >>>Krishna > >>> > >>> > >>>On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Maja Ã… trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > >>> > >>> >>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>Om Gurave Namah > >>>> > >>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, namaste > >>>> > >>>>(Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for "water" also > >>>> > >>>>For a start, here is Celiac disorder native: > >>>>DOB: 25th of April 1975 > >>>>TOB: 01:44 AM > >>>>POB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 > >>>>Time zone is 01h East of GMT > >>>> > >>>>You should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. > >>>> > >>>>Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion? > >>>> > >>>>Warm > >>>> Regards, > >>>> > >>>>Maja Strbac > >>>> > >>>>Hari Om Tat Sat > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>--- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> wrote: > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > >>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>Sunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> >>>>> > >>>>>Dear Maja, > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Another good name :-) > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Regards, > >>>>>Krishna > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Ã… trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> >>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Om Gurave Namah > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Dear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste > >>>>>> > >>>>>>(two wonderful names indeed > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Your discussion made me think over some examples of "root cause" and manifestation of disease. > >>>>>>Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine. > >>>>>>Asthma - lungs > >>>>>>Vitiligo- skin > >>>>>> > >>>>>>All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this "global epidemic"), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? > >>>>>> > >>>>>>I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join > >>>>>> me to go through them together? > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Warm Regards to both, > >>>>>>Maja Strbac > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Hari Om Tat Sat > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>--- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>>Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Dear Lakshmi, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Yours is a good name too :-) > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Hare Rama Krishna > >>>>>>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, > >>>>>>>>Nice name! > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>There is the seed , or origin, > >>>>>>>> and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, > >>>>>>>>it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal "symptoms". > >>>>>>>>Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, > >>>>>>>>to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are, > >>>>>>>> where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. > >>>>>>>>In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) > >>>>>>>>But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved. > >>>>>>>> Im saying Venus must be at the root of it. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. > >>>>>>>>Hope you understand my point. > >>>>>>>>One "symptom" of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. > >>>>>>>>One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. > >>>>>>>>One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. > >>>>>>>>So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? > >>>>>>>>Not at the skin, it is just one of many "symptoms". > >>>>>>>>Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . > >>>>>>>>Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. > >>>>>>>>Best wishes > >>>>>>>>Lakshmi > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > ____________ _________ _________ __ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > >>>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PM > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Dear Lakshmi, > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Did you want to say: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>- It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or > >>>>>>>>- It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Please clarify. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Hare Rama Krishna > >>>>>>>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, > >>>>>>>>>Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. > >>>>>>>>>When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Many skin problems are the result of "body chemistry" out of wack. > >>>>>>>>>Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. > >>>>>>>>>Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Bottom line Many of these things overlap > >>>>>>>>>( i mean karaka wise) > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? > >>>>>>>>>So I see it all as inter related. > >>>>>>>>>See primary issue, and then secondary issue. > >>>>>>>>>In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. > >>>>>>>>>Best wishes > >>>>>>>>>Lakshmi > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > ____________ _________ _________ __ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > >>>>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AM > >>>>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Dear Sanjay, > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Interestin gly, Dr. Charak in his book on "Essentials of Medical Astrology" puts leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Comments welcome. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>|| Om Gurave Namah || > >>>>>>>>>>Dear Krishna, > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's > >>>>>>>>>> house. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>In another sense Vayu tattva is "Sense object" for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Warm Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>Sanjay P > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>2009/ 8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58@ gmail. com> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Dear Sanjayji, > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> || Om Gurave Namah || > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Jani, > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma. > >>>>>>>>>>>> In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Warm Regards > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sanjay P > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> 2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > Birth details of one my relative are follows. > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > DOB 14/7/1972 > >>>>>>>>>>>> > Place: Navsari/Gujarat > >>>>>>>>>>>> > Time: 20:20 Hrs > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > M H Jani > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Natal Chart > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> July 14, 1972 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Time: 20:20:00 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT) > >>>>>>>>>>>> Place: 72 E 55' 00", 20 N 51' 00" > >>>>>>>>>>>> Navsari, India > >>>>>>>>>>>> Altitude: 0.00 meters > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Lunar Yr-Mo: Paridhavi - Ashadha > >>>>>>>>>>>> Tithi: Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>> Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) > >>>>>>>>>>>> Nakshatra: Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>> Yoga: Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>> Karana: Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>> Hora Lord: Venus (5 min sign: Cn) > >>>>>>>>>>>> Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi) > >>>>>>>>>>>> Kaala Lord: Mars (Mahakala: Mars) > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sunrise: 6:05:28 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sunset: 19:22:37 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Janma Ghatis: 35.6057 > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ayanamsa: 23-28-21.04 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sidereal Time: 15:11:56 > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Lagna 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sun - AK 28 Ge 46' 16.46" Puna 3 Ge Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>> Moon - GK 16 Le 30' 41.26" PPha 1 Le Le > >>>>>>>>>>>> Mars - PK 16 Cn 39' 20.95" Push 4 Cn Sc > >>>>>>>>>>>> Mercury - MK 24 Cn 45' 21.10" Asre 3 Cn Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>> Jupiter ® - DK 7 Sg 33' 17.92" Mool 3 Sg Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>> Venus - BK 25 Ta 10' 43.28" Mrig 1 Ta Le > >>>>>>>>>>>> Saturn - PiK 21 Ta 58' > >>>>>>>>>>>> 15.19" Rohi 4 Ta Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>> Rahu - AmK 2 Cp 48' 03.08" USha 2 Cp Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ketu 2 Cn 48' 03.08" Puna 4 Cn Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>> Maandi 19 Ar 25' 49.18" Bhar 2 Ar Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>> Gulika 7 Ar 26' 28.59" Aswi 3 Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>> Bhava Lagna 1 Aq 50' 22.21" Dhan 3 Aq Li > >>>>>>>>>>>> Hora Lagna 5 Vi 28' 25.28" UPha 3 Vi Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ghati Lagna 16 Ge 22' 34.48" Ardr 3 Ge Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>> Vighati Lagna 10 Ta 53' 20.48" Rohi 1 Ta Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> Varnada Lagna 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sree Lagna 10 Ar 42' 53.24" Aswi 4 Ar Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>> Pranapada Lagna 11 Vi 27' 17.80" Hast 1 Vi Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> Indu Lagna 16 Vi 30' 41.26" Hast 2 Vi Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>> Bhrigu Bindu 24 Ar 39' 22.17" Bhar 4 Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sc > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dhooma 12 Sc 06' 16.46" Anu 3 Sc Li > >>>>>>>>>>>> Vyatipata 17 Le 53' 43.54" PPha 2 Le Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>> Parivesha 17 Aq 53' 43.54" Sata 4 Aq Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>> Indra Chapa 12 Ta 06' 16.46" Rohi 1 Ta Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> Upaketu 28 Ta 46' 16.46" Mrig 2 Ta Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>> Kaala 1 Ge 04' 56.04" Mrig 3 Ge Li > >>>>>>>>>>>> Mrityu 10 Cp 12' 36.34" Srav 1 Cp Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> Artha Prahara 3 Aq 14' 51.48" Dhan 3 Aq Li > >>>>>>>>>>>> Yama Ghantaka > >>>>>>>>>>>> 28 Aq 41' 23.20" PBha 3 Aq Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>> Prana Sphuta 21 Pi 58' 04.14" Reva 2 Pi Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>> Deha Sphuta 19 Ar 31' 58.71" Bhar 2 Ar Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>> Mrityu Sphuta 20 Le 51' 36.61" PPha 3 Le Li > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sookshma TriSphuta 2 Vi 21' 39.45" UPha 2 Vi Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>> TriSphuta 8 Ge 51' 28.97" Ardr 1 Ge Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>> ChatusSphuta 7 Vi 37' 45.43" UPha 4 Vi Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>> PanchaSphuta 10 Ge 25' 48.50" Ardr 2 Ge Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>> V2 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>> V3 > >>>>>>>>>>>> 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li Le > >>>>>>>>>>>> V4 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>> V5 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>> V6 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>> V7 > >>>>>>>>>>>> 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> V8 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>> V9 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>> V10 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>> V11 > >>>>>>>>>>>> 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq Le > >>>>>>>>>>>> V12 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>> Kunda 7 Ta 19' 47.81" Krit 4 Ta Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> +-------- --- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>> | |Md Gk |Ve Sa > >>>>>>>>>>>> |Su GL | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> |-------- --- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | |Ma Me | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | |Ke | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> |-------- --- | Rasi |----------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>> |As Ra | > >>>>>>>>>>>> |Mo | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> |-------- --- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>> |JuR | | |HL AL | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> +-------- --- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>> +-------- --- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | |As |Su JuR | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | |Gk | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> |-------- --- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>> |Me HL | |Sa Ke | > >>>>>>>>>>>> |GL | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | Navamsa | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> |-------- --- | |----------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>> |Ra > >>>>>>>>>>>> | D-9 |Mo Ve | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | |AL | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> |-------- --- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | |Ma | |Md | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> | | | | | > >>>>>>>>>>>> +-------- --- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Vimsottari Dasa (): > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ven Ven 1967-10-10 Sun 1971-02-05 Moon 1972-02-05 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Mars 1973-10-09 Rah 1974-12-08 Jup 1977-12-08 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sat 1980-08-08 Merc 1983-10-10 Ket 1986-08-09 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sun Sun 1987-10-10 Moon 1988-01-25 Mars 1988-07-27 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Rah 1988-12-02 Jup 1989-10-27 Sat 1990-08-15 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Merc 1991-07-28 Ket 1992-05-31 Ven 1992-10-09 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Moon Moon 1993-10-09 Mars 1994-08-09 Rah 1995-03-07 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Jup 1996-09-09 Sat 1998-01-07 Merc 1999-08-09 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ket 2001-01-06 Ven 2001-08-09 Sun 2003-04-06 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Mars Mars 2003-10-10 Rah 2004-03-03 Jup 2005-03-22 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sat 2006-02-26 Merc 2007-04-06 Ket 2008-04-03 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ven 2008-09-02 Sun 2009-11-03 Moon 2010-03-07 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Rah Rah 2010-10-10 Jup 2013-06-19 Sat 2015-11-15 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Merc 2018-09-21 Ket 2021-04-06 Ven 2022-04-25 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sun 2025-04-24 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Moon 2026-03-19 Mars 2027-09-22 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Jup Jup 2028-10-09 Sat 2030-11-27 Merc 2033-06-07 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ket 2035-09-16 Ven 2036-08-21 Sun 2039-04-19 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Moon 2040-02-06 Mars 2041-06-07 Rah 2042-05-13 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sat Sat 2044-10-09 Merc 2047-10-13 Ket 2050-06-20 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ven 2051-07-31 Sun 2054-10-01 Moon 2055-09-13 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Mars 2057-04-09 Rah 2058-05-20 Jup 2061-03-25 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Merc Merc 2063-10-10 Ket 2066-03-04 Ven 2067-03-02 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sun 2070-01-01 Moon 2070-11-09 Mars 2072-04-06 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Rah 2073-04-03 Jup 2075-10-25 Sat 2078-01-28 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Ket Ket 2080-10-10 Ven 2081-03-04 Sun 2082-05-04 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Moon 2082-09-13 Mars 2083-04-10 Rah 2083-09-10 > >>>>>>>>>>>> Jup 2084-09-28 Sat 2085-09-03 Merc 2086-10-13 > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>> > >>> > >>>>>> > >>> > >>> Need mail bonding? 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Guest guest Posted September 6, 2009 Report Share Posted September 6, 2009 Some pointers to handling this case. Leucoderma - Cancer (Rahu) of Skin (Mercury) which involves body (Gross) - Lagna and its manifested form (Surya Lagna). Chart: July 14, 1972 at 20.20 in Navsari, India In the natives chart, Rahu is in Lagna, causing affliction. Mercury (Skin), lord of the 6th (disease), is viewing the native with negative energy and is in Aslesha Naksahtra. Surya Lagna is in the 6th house from Lagna which indicates that disease carries more weightage in its manifested form. While prescribing remedial measures astrologically, we have three options a) Remedial b) Curtailing c) Destroying To understand it better, let us consider our above case - Not to allow the cancer to start is acheived by Remedial Measures. 2nd option is to CURTAIL the growth of cancer and 3rd option is to DESTROY the existing cancerous cells. Since the 1st option is not possible now, let us look at the remaining two options. Curtailing - Rahu in Vargottama is not favorable, and Mercury 9th ownership is facilitating the growth. Rahu can be controlled by reciting Rahu Kavacham, while Mercury can be tackled with the help of Jupiter. Jupiter is a enemy of Mercury and if we empower Jupiter with enough ammo, and allow them to fight, he will defeat Mercury and take away all his weapons/energy. Destroying - Surya Lagna is very strong. Further Rahu is Vargottama, in Uttarashada, gives it enough strength to fight back if needed. Mercury as the 6th lord is equally dangerous. Destroying the cells would become very difficult. The native can try the this - Take a vacation to any preferred beach. On a Wednesday evening, go knee deep (not more than that as Jupiter is in the 12th), face South direction, and recite " Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya " for 108 times and then sprinkle the sea water all over the body. Repeating this every year is suggested. Hope this framework would be helpful to astrologers and students while analyzing charts. Best wishes, Raman Suprajarama http://www.astrologicalmagazine.com sohamsa , nalini swamy <nalini2818 wrote: > > Hare Rama Krishna > > Dear Maja, > Namaskar. > > Autoimmune disorders occur when the body 'recognises' its own cells as antigenic and mounts an immune response, basically starting with an inflammatory response - swelling, thrombocyte activity and the cells being destroyed and new tissue/cells building leading to formation of repeated layers of fibrous tissue/fibrosis. This tissue most often than not cannot perform all the functions of the original tissue, for example when the inflammatory response occurs in the lungs, the resultant tissue causes scarring on the lungs and the lungs/that part of the lungs loses the function of gas exchange - its porus nature and less of the surface of the lungs are capable of their normal function. Immune responses are directly connected to the lymphatic system, lymph/ lymph glands/ lymphocytes. Now, lymph travels all over the body and is collected and drained at the lymph nodes and swelling of the lymph nodes is also a signal of infection and is due to the > initiation of the immune response. Some typical lymph nodes ... armpits, groin.. These also have a link to the endocrine functions.. for example extreme stress, leading to excessive secretion of stress hormone, cortisol also is thought to be a precursor to immune system breakdown/ autoimmune disorders. > Some biology background for a thorough astrological discussion that has been going on (: > > Regards > Nalini > > >  > > > > ________________________________ > Maja Å trbac majastrbacastro > sohamsa > Thursday, 3 September, 2009 9:33:46 PM > Fw: Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >  > *Why I insist on nodes in context of destruction? > Ketu destroys Rajas, Rahu destroys Satva. > > --- On Thu, 9/3/09, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > > > >Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > > >Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >sohamsa@ .com > >Thursday, September 3, 2009, 2:21 AM > > > > > >Om Gurave Namah > > > >Dear Michal, namaste > > > > " Essentially it is the body attacking its own cells. " > > > >Precisely. Self destruction. > > > >There is obvious way of self destruction: > >http://www.mypointl ess.com/2009/ 02/nurse- sets-off- metal-detectors. html > > > >Or similar, but wrapped in shiny paper: > >http://www.hitsvill e.org/wp/ wp-content/ uploads/2009/ 06/michael- jackson-neverlan d.jpg > > > >The only difference between autoimmune respond and obvious self injuring lies in fact that it is not superficial or done by scalpel, needle etc. It is a little bit subtle way of self destruction and it is not conscious choice. > > > > " Self " and " destruction " , now this is not my personal wisdom, I will just retell that we need paka lagna to be involved in a way for that part " self " , for applied intelligence used in a wrong way. I was mentioning Rahu a while ago and I still think we need nodes and preferably Mangal for destruction. Badhaka involved by all means. Check all those charts, not just this with celiac syndrome. > > > >And how to relate this with specific body part where respond manifests? That is the reason why I included in this discussion. > > > > > >Warm Regards, > >Maja Strbac > > > >Hari Om Tat Sat > > > >--- On Wed, 9/2/09, Michal Dziwulski nearmichal > wrote: > > > > > >>Michal Dziwulski nearmichal > > >>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>sohamsa@ .com > >>Wednesday, September 2, 2009, 1:50 PM > >> > >> > >> > >>Hare Rama Krsna || > >> > >>Dear Maja, > >> > >>So what is the 'root cause' of autoimmune disorder? Essentially it is the body attacking its own cells. 6th house is something else attacking the body, 8th house is nija dosha. Nija - innate, of one's own party or country, an enemy in one's own country (MW). So how about the 8th house/lord? > >> > >>Regards, > >>Michal > >> > >> > >> > >> > ________________________________ > Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > > >>sohamsa@ .com > >>Wednesday, 2 September, 2009 11:11:29 PM > >>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >> > >> > >>Om Gurave Namah > >> > >>Dear Michal and Krishnamurthy, namaste > >> > >>It is a little bit of a problem to understand each other and continue dialogue if we are not looking at same subject from same perspective. > >> > >>Michal: " So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. " > >> > >>No, scientifically it is a problem with immune system which secondary leads to problems with digestion. I am trying to agree on this order of symptoms and find them in charts. Do you still consider this order to be wrong? I see no chicken/egg dilemma in this order. > >> > >>I completely agree on including Graha signifying particular allergen, but I would not start or end chart observation with this. That is what I am trying to say, and I think Krishnamurthy is trying same among rest of his points. Getting rid of allergen is not curing anything, problem is still there in body. > >> > >>People suffering celiac syndrome are not perfectly fine if they exclude 80% of grains (only corn, rice and buckwheat don't contain gluten). They are excluding valuable source for large number of vitamins from B group (especially if they are ovo-lacto, lacto or ovo vegetarians) . Synthetic supplements can't replace it perfectly speaking in long terms. > >> > >>What I am trying to say is: excluding gluten is just a small patch over a big, open wound. It is like someone is having Kala Sarpa Yoga on 5/11th axis in chart (and imagine that positions related to KSY are really pointing on problems related to progeny), and you give them advice to chant Santana Gopala mantra (and maybe add prasidha Savitur Gayatri for just in case) to accomplish progeny. It is a good advice, but... it is skipping the root cause. > >> > >>Let me rephrase my initial question: What is primary for observation about autoimmune diseases: positions in chart pointing on autoimmune disorders (probably signified by Rahu) or secondary symptoms (lungs, digestion, skin)? When we determine positions pointing on autoimmune disorders, how do we relate them with particular body part where they manifest? > >> > >>I would also like to read reply on Tarun's question. > >> > >>Warm Regards, > >>Maja Strbac > >> > >>Hari Om Tat Sat > >> > >>--- On Tue, 9/1/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: > >> > >> > >>>Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>Tuesday, September 1, 2009, 8:12 PM > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>Dear Michal, > >>> > >>> > >>>You said: > >>> > >>> > >>>Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. > >>> > >>> > >>>It is clear that I am focusing on the root cause of the problem and you are focusing on the remedies for the problem. It appears to me that we are at different ends of the domain that we need to address. But, a remedy suggested without understanding the cause fully could be incomplete and ineffective. It is like treating just the symptoms and not addressing the root cause. > >>> > >>> > >>>Regards, > >>>Krishna > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Michal Dziwulski nearmichal > wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>>>Hare Rama Krsna || > >>>> > >>>>Dear Krishna, > >>>> > >>>>It is the earth that revolves around the Sun. Nevertheless we take the geocentric viewpoint. So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. So which do we use? It is like chicken and egg situation - which came first? > >>>> > >>>>For a person with celiac disorder, they are fine as long as they don't eat wheat (Sun). When they see a loaf of bread they say no thanks. This is how it is manifesting in their experiential world. That the doctor tells them about this protein and this immune system is something secondary as far as they're concerned because the primary thing the doctor tells them is don't eat anything which contains gluten. So when we look at the chart we need to be clear what we are looking at ie. which level are we going to. Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. > >>>> > >>>>Regards, > >>>>Michal > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > ________________________________ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>Tuesday, 1 September, 2009 4:56:56 PM > >>>> > >>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Dear Michal, > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>It depends on how one is looking at the problem. From my perspective, the native will not be able to digest Gluten etc., after the damage is caused. And, Gluten by itself does not cause the damage to start with. Hence, what you are describing as the cause is an after effect of having the damage already in place. What causes the damage is the autoimmune reaction in the first place. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Dear Maja, > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Yes, I am the same SY SY... person :-) > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Virgo has two malefic aspects and not just one. Both Mars and Ketu aspect Virgo. And, it is a good observation from Amit that Mercury is conjunct (and combust by) 8th lord Sun. In addition, Mercury occupies 8th house from Virgo. It is evident that Virgo, 6H and Mercury are all  afflicted. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Regards, > >>>>Krishna > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Michal Dziwulski nearmichal > wrote: > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>Hare Rama Krsna || > >>>>> > >>>>>Dear Maja and Krishna, > >>>>> > >>>>>Coeliac disease is caused by a reaction to gliadin, a gluten protein found in wheat > >>>>> > >>>>>So is Sun not the culprit as Sun is karaka for wheat? Something external the body cannot digest - we have to look at 6th house. Lagnesh is in the 6th house for a start and it is Saturn. (Interestingly this will cause the AL to fall in the 11th house and thus Lagnesh is in the 8th from AL). > >>>>> > >>>>>In the chart provided Sun is 8th lord. When the 8th lord has anything to do with 6th house or lord it can give chronic digestive disease. Here Sun is conjoined 6th lord Mercury and in the 8th house from Moon - confirming the health issue. Narayana dasa of Leo was just running. > >>>>> > >>>>>Regards, > >>>>>Michal > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > ________________________________ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>Monday, 31 August, 2009 9:42:46 PM > >>>>> > >>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Dear Maja, > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Frankly, when I first opened the chart, I too looked at Venus, as it is in Rahu-Ketu axis and also aspected by Marsand in papakartari. This could have its own ramifications at the appropriate time and may not be relevant to Celiac Disorder. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>I googled to get some details on Celiac disorder. From what I understand, I don't think it is a problem related to Mars, though it is a digestive disorder. The small intestine is affected and is unable to absorb some of the nutrients. Since it is the small intestine, one should look at the 6th house and the sign Virgo. In this case, the lord of both 6th house and Virgo both is Mercury. Mercury is combust and also disposits Saturn. Mercury and Rahu have a common dispositor and Saturn is in the nakshatra of Rahu, one can assume that rahu affects Mercury as well. The problem is on the lining of the small intestine which has some functions akin to skin also. That too calls for a look at Mercury as well. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>This is not a conclusion but my preliminary line of analysis. I need to look at more charts (thanks to Tarun for providing more charts and I am yet to take a look at them). > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Regards, > >>>>>Krishna > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>>Om Gurave Namah > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, namaste > >>>>>> > >>>>>>(Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for " water " also > >>>>>> > >>>>>>For a start, here is Celiac disorder native: > >>>>>>DOB: 25th of April 1975 > >>>>>>TOB: 01:44 AM > >>>>>>POB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 > >>>>>>Time zone is 01h East of GMT > >>>>>> > >>>>>>You should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion? > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Warm Regards, > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Maja Strbac > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Hari Om Tat Sat > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>--- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>>Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>Sunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Dear Maja, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Another good name :-) > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Om Gurave Namah > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Dear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>(two wonderful names indeed > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Your discussion made me think over some examples of " root cause " and manifestation of disease. > >>>>>>>>Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine. > >>>>>>>>Asthma - lungs > >>>>>>>>Vitiligo-skin > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this " global epidemic " ), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join me to go through them together? > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Warm Regards to both, > >>>>>>>>Maja Strbac > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Hari Om Tat Sat > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>--- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Dear Lakshmi, > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Yours is a good name too :-) > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Hare Rama Krishna > >>>>>>>>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, > >>>>>>>>>>Nice name! > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>There is the seed , or origin, > >>>>>>>>>> and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, > >>>>>>>>>>it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal " symptoms " . > >>>>>>>>>>Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, > >>>>>>>>>>to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are, > >>>>>>>>>> where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. > >>>>>>>>>>In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) > >>>>>>>>>>But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved. > >>>>>>>>>> Im saying Venus must be at the root of it. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. > >>>>>>>>>>Hope you understand my point. > >>>>>>>>>>One " symptom " of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. > >>>>>>>>>>One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. > >>>>>>>>>>One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. > >>>>>>>>>>So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? > >>>>>>>>>>Not at the skin, it is just one of many " symptoms " . > >>>>>>>>>>Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . > >>>>>>>>>>Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. > >>>>>>>>>>Best wishes > >>>>>>>>>>Lakshmi > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > ________________________________ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PM > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Dear Lakshmi, > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Did you want to say: > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>- It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or > >>>>>>>>>>- It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Please clarify. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Hare Rama Krishna > >>>>>>>>>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, > >>>>>>>>>>>Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. > >>>>>>>>>>>When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Many skin problems are the result of " body chemistry " out of wack. > >>>>>>>>>>>Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. > >>>>>>>>>>>Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Bottom line Many of these things overlap > >>>>>>>>>>>( i mean karaka wise) > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? > >>>>>>>>>>>So I see it all as inter related. > >>>>>>>>>>>See primary issue, and then secondary issue. > >>>>>>>>>>>In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. > >>>>>>>>>>>Best wishes > >>>>>>>>>>>Lakshmi > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > ________________________________ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AM > >>>>>>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Dear Sanjay, > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on " Essentials of Medical Astrology " puts  leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out  leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Comments welcome. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>|| Om Gurave Namah || > >>>>>>>>>>>>Dear Krishna, > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>In another sense Vayu tattva is " Sense object " for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Warm Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>>>Sanjay P > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>Dear Sanjayji, > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|| Om Gurave Namah || > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Dear Jani, > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Warm Regards > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sanjay P > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>2009/8/27 Jani Minesh mhjani > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Birth details of one my relative are follows. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> DOB 14/7/1972 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Place: Navsari/Gujarat > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Time: 20:20 Hrs > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> M H Jani > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Natal Chart > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>     July 14, 1972 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Time:      20:20:00 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Time Zone:   5:30:00 (East of GMT) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Place:     72 E 55' 00 " , 20 N 51' 00 " > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>       Navsari, India > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Altitude:    0.00 meters > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Lunar Yr-Mo:  Paridhavi - Ashadha > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Tithi:     Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Nakshatra:   Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Yoga:      Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Karana:     Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Hora Lord:   Venus (5 min sign: Cn) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Kaala Lord:   Mars (Mahakala: Mars) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sunrise:    6:05:28 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sunset:     19:22:37 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Janma Ghatis:  35.6057 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ayanamsa:    23-28-21.04 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sidereal Time: 15:11:56 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Body         Longitude     Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Lagna        14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sun - AK       28 Ge 46' 16.46 " Puna    3   Ge  Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Moon - GK      16 Le 30' 41.26 " PPha    1   Le  Le > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Mars - PK      16 Cn 39' 20.95 " Push    4   Cn  Sc > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Mercury - MK     24 Cn 45' 21.10 " Asre    3   Cn  Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Jupiter ® - DK   7 Sg 33' 17.92 " Mool    3   Sg  Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Venus - BK      25 Ta 10' 43.28 " Mrig    1   Ta  Le > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Saturn - PiK     21 Ta 58' 15.19 " Rohi    4   Ta  Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Rahu - AmK      2 Cp 48' 03.08 " USha    2   Cp  Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ketu         2 Cn 48' 03.08 " Puna    4   Cn  Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Maandi        19 Ar 25' 49.18 " Bhar    2   Ar  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Gulika        7 Ar 26' 28.59 " Aswi    3   Ar  Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Bhava Lagna      1 Aq 50' 22.21 " Dhan    3   Aq  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Hora Lagna      5 Vi 28' 25.28 " UPha    3   Vi  Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ghati Lagna     16 Ge 22' 34.48 " Ardr    3   Ge  Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Vighati Lagna    10 Ta 53' 20.48 " Rohi    1   Ta  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Varnada Lagna    14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr    3   Ge  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sree Lagna      10 Ar 42' 53.24 " Aswi    4   Ar  Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Pranapada Lagna   11 Vi 27' 17.80 " Hast    1   Vi  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Indu Lagna      16 Vi 30' 41.26 " Hast    2   Vi  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Bhrigu Bindu     24 Ar 39' 22.17 " Bhar    4   Ar  Sc > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Dhooma        12 Sc 06' 16.46 " Anu    3   Sc  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Vyatipata      17 Le 53' 43.54 " PPha    2   Le  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Parivesha      17 Aq 53' 43.54 " Sata    4   Aq  Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Indra Chapa     12 Ta 06' 16.46 " Rohi    1   Ta  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Upaketu       28 Ta 46' 16.46 " Mrig    2   Ta  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Kaala         1 Ge 04' 56.04 " Mrig    3   Ge  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Mrityu        10 Cp 12' 36.34 " Srav    1   Cp  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Artha Prahara     3 Aq 14' 51.48 " Dhan    3   Aq  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Yama Ghantaka    28 Aq 41' 23.20 " PBha    3   Aq  Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Prana Sphuta     21 Pi 58' 04.14 " Reva    2   Pi  Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Deha Sphuta     19 Ar 31' 58.71 " Bhar    2   Ar  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Mrityu Sphuta    20 Le 51' 36.61 " PPha    3   Le  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sookshma TriSphuta  2 Vi 21' 39.45 " UPha    2   Vi  Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>TriSphuta       8 Ge 51' 28.97 " Ardr    1   Ge  Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>ChatusSphuta     7 Vi 37' 45.43 " UPha    4   Vi  Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>PanchaSphuta     10 Ge 25' 48.50 " Ardr    2   Ge  Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V2          14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast    2   Vi  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V3          14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat    3   Li  Le > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V4          14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V5          14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata    3   Aq  Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V6          14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi    2   Ta  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V7          14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr    3   Ge  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V8          14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast    2   Vi  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V9          14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat    3   Li  Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V10         14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V11         14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata    3   Aq  Le > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V12         14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi    2   Ta  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Kunda         7 Ta 19' 47.81 " Krit    4   Ta  Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |Md  Gk   |Ve  Sa   |Su  GL   | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |Ma  Me   | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |Ke     | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- |     Rasi      |----------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|As  Ra   |            |Mo     | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|JuR     |      |      |HL  AL   | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |As     |Su  JuR  | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |Gk     | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|Me  HL   |            |Sa  Ke   | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|GL     |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |     Navamsa     |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- |            |----------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|Ra     |      D-9      |Mo  Ve   | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |AL     | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |Ma     |      |Md     | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Vimsottari Dasa (): > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ven  Ven 1967-10-10  Sun 1971-02-05  Moon 1972-02-05  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Mars 1973-10-09  Rah 1974-12-08  Jup 1977-12-08  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Sat 1980-08-08  Merc 1983-10-10  Ket 1986-08-09  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sun  Sun 1987-10-10  Moon 1988-01-25  Mars 1988-07-27  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Rah 1988-12-02  Jup 1989-10-27  Sat 1990-08-15  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Merc 1991-07-28  Ket 1992-05-31  Ven 1992-10-09  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Moon  Moon 1993-10-09  Mars 1994-08-09  Rah 1995-03-07  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>   Jup 1996-09-09  Sat 1998-01-07  Merc 1999-08-09  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>   Ket 2001-01-06  Ven 2001-08-09  Sun 2003-04-06  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Mars  Mars 2003-10-10  Rah 2004-03-03  Jup 2005-03-22  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>   Sat 2006-02-26  Merc 2007-04-06  Ket 2008-04-03  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>   Ven 2008-09-02  Sun 2009-11-03  Moon 2010-03-07  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Rah  Rah 2010-10-10  Jup 2013-06-19  Sat 2015-11-15  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Merc 2018-09-21  Ket 2021-04-06  Ven 2022-04-25  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Sun 2025-04-24  Moon 2026-03-19  Mars 2027-09-22  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Jup  Jup 2028-10-09  Sat 2030-11-27  Merc 2033-06-07  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Ket 2035-09-16  Ven 2036-08-21  Sun 2039-04-19  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Moon 2040-02-06  Mars 2041-06-07  Rah 2042-05-13  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sat  Sat 2044-10-09  Merc 2047-10-13  Ket 2050-06-20  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Ven 2051-07-31  Sun 2054-10-01  Moon 2055-09-13  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Mars 2057-04-09  Rah 2058-05-20  Jup 2061-03-25  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Merc  Merc 2063-10-10  Ket 2066-03-04  Ven 2067-03-02  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>   Sun 2070-01-01  Moon 2070-11-09  Mars 2072-04-06  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>   Rah 2073-04-03  Jup 2075-10-25  Sat 2078-01-28  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ket  Ket 2080-10-10  Ven 2081-03-04  Sun 2082-05-04  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Moon 2082-09-13  Mars 2083-04-10  Rah 2083-09-10  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Jup 2084-09-28  Sat 2085-09-03  Merc 2086-10-13  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Need mail bonding? 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Guest guest Posted September 6, 2009 Report Share Posted September 6, 2009 leucoderma has nothing to do with cancer. It is just a skin discoloration. ________________________________ cru115 <cru115 vedic astrology Sunday, September 6, 2009 2:55:30 AM Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem Some pointers to handling this case. Leucoderma - Cancer (Rahu) of Skin (Mercury) which involves body (Gross) - Lagna and its manifested form (Surya Lagna). Chart: July 14, 1972 at 20.20 in Navsari, India In the natives chart, Rahu is in Lagna, causing affliction. Mercury (Skin), lord of the 6th (disease), is viewing the native with negative energy and is in Aslesha Naksahtra. Surya Lagna is in the 6th house from Lagna which indicates that disease carries more weightage in its manifested form. While prescribing remedial measures astrologically, we have three options a) Remedial b) Curtailing c) Destroying To understand it better, let us consider our above case - Not to allow the cancer to start is acheived by Remedial Measures. 2nd option is to CURTAIL the growth of cancer and 3rd option is to DESTROY the existing cancerous cells. Since the 1st option is not possible now, let us look at the remaining two options. Curtailing - Rahu in Vargottama is not favorable, and Mercury 9th ownership is facilitating the growth. Rahu can be controlled by reciting Rahu Kavacham, while Mercury can be tackled with the help of Jupiter. Jupiter is a enemy of Mercury and if we empower Jupiter with enough ammo, and allow them to fight, he will defeat Mercury and take away all his weapons/energy. Destroying - Surya Lagna is very strong. Further Rahu is Vargottama, in Uttarashada, gives it enough strength to fight back if needed. Mercury as the 6th lord is equally dangerous. Destroying the cells would become very difficult. The native can try the this - Take a vacation to any preferred beach. On a Wednesday evening, go knee deep (not more than that as Jupiter is in the 12th), face South direction, and recite " Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya " for 108 times and then sprinkle the sea water all over the body. Repeating this every year is suggested. Hope this framework would be helpful to astrologers and students while analyzing charts. Best wishes, Raman Suprajarama http://www.astrolog icalmagazine. com sohamsa@ .com, nalini swamy <nalini2818@ ...> wrote: > > Hare Rama Krishna > > Dear Maja, > Namaskar. > > Autoimmune disorders occur when the body 'recognises' its own cells as antigenic and mounts an immune response, basically starting with an inflammatory response - swelling, thrombocyte activity and the cells being destroyed and new tissue/cells building leading to formation of repeated layers of fibrous tissue/fibrosis. This tissue most often than not cannot perform all the functions of the original tissue, for example when the inflammatory response occurs in the lungs, the resultant tissue causes scarring on the lungs and the lungs/that part of the lungs loses the function of gas exchange - its porus nature and less of the surface of the lungs are capable of their normal function. Immune responses are directly connected to the lymphatic system, lymph/ lymph glands/ lymphocytes. Now, lymph travels all over the body and is collected and drained at the lymph nodes and swelling of the lymph nodes is also a signal of infection and is due to the > initiation of the immune response. Some typical lymph nodes ... armpits, groin.. These also have a link to the endocrine functions.. for example extreme stress, leading to excessive secretion of stress hormone, cortisol also is thought to be a precursor to immune system breakdown/ autoimmune disorders. > Some biology background for a thorough astrological discussion that has been going on (: > > Regards > Nalini > > >  > > > > ____________ _________ _________ __ > Maja Å trbac majastrbacastro@ ... > sohamsa@ .com > Thursday, 3 September, 2009 9:33:46 PM > Fw: Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >  > *Why I insist on nodes in context of destruction? > Ketu destroys Rajas, Rahu destroys Satva. > > --- On Thu, 9/3/09, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > > > >Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > > >Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >sohamsa@ .com > >Thursday, September 3, 2009, 2:21 AM > > > > > >Om Gurave Namah > > > >Dear Michal, namaste > > > > " Essentially it is the body attacking its own cells. " > > > >Precisely. Self destruction. > > > >There is obvious way of self destruction: > >http://www.mypointl ess.com/2009/ 02/nurse- sets-off- metal-detectors. html > > > >Or similar, but wrapped in shiny paper: > >http://www.hitsvill e.org/wp/ wp-content/ uploads/2009/ 06/michael- jackson-neverlan d.jpg > > > >The only difference between autoimmune respond and obvious self injuring lies in fact that it is not superficial or done by scalpel, needle etc. It is a little bit subtle way of self destruction and it is not conscious choice. > > > > " Self " and " destruction " , now this is not my personal wisdom, I will just retell that we need paka lagna to be involved in a way for that part " self " , for applied intelligence used in a wrong way. I was mentioning Rahu a while ago and I still think we need nodes and preferably Mangal for destruction. Badhaka involved by all means. Check all those charts, not just this with celiac syndrome. > > > >And how to relate this with specific body part where respond manifests? That is the reason why I included in this discussion. > > > > > >Warm Regards, > >Maja Strbac > > > >Hari Om Tat Sat > > > >--- On Wed, 9/2/09, Michal Dziwulski nearmichal > wrote: > > > > > >>Michal Dziwulski nearmichal > > >>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>sohamsa@ .com > >>Wednesday, September 2, 2009, 1:50 PM > >> > >> > >> > >>Hare Rama Krsna || > >> > >>Dear Maja, > >> > >>So what is the 'root cause' of autoimmune disorder? Essentially it is the body attacking its own cells. 6th house is something else attacking the body, 8th house is nija dosha. Nija - innate, of one's own party or country, an enemy in one's own country (MW). So how about the 8th house/lord? > >> > >>Regards, > >>Michal > >> > >> > >> > >> > ____________ _________ _________ __ > Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > > >>sohamsa@ .com > >>Wednesday, 2 September, 2009 11:11:29 PM > >>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >> > >> > >>Om Gurave Namah > >> > >>Dear Michal and Krishnamurthy, namaste > >> > >>It is a little bit of a problem to understand each other and continue dialogue if we are not looking at same subject from same perspective. > >> > >>Michal: " So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. " > >> > >>No, scientifically it is a problem with immune system which secondary leads to problems with digestion. I am trying to agree on this order of symptoms and find them in charts. Do you still consider this order to be wrong? I see no chicken/egg dilemma in this order. > >> > >>I completely agree on including Graha signifying particular allergen, but I would not start or end chart observation with this. That is what I am trying to say, and I think Krishnamurthy is trying same among rest of his points. Getting rid of allergen is not curing anything, problem is still there in body. > >> > >>People suffering celiac syndrome are not perfectly fine if they exclude 80% of grains (only corn, rice and buckwheat don't contain gluten). They are excluding valuable source for large number of vitamins from B group (especially if they are ovo-lacto, lacto or ovo vegetarians) . Synthetic supplements can't replace it perfectly speaking in long terms. > >> > >>What I am trying to say is: excluding gluten is just a small patch over a big, open wound. It is like someone is having Kala Sarpa Yoga on 5/11th axis in chart (and imagine that positions related to KSY are really pointing on problems related to progeny), and you give them advice to chant Santana Gopala mantra (and maybe add prasidha Savitur Gayatri for just in case) to accomplish progeny. It is a good advice, but... it is skipping the root cause. > >> > >>Let me rephrase my initial question: What is primary for observation about autoimmune diseases: positions in chart pointing on autoimmune disorders (probably signified by Rahu) or secondary symptoms (lungs, digestion, skin)? When we determine positions pointing on autoimmune disorders, how do we relate them with particular body part where they manifest? > >> > >>I would also like to read reply on Tarun's question. > >> > >>Warm Regards, > >>Maja Strbac > >> > >>Hari Om Tat Sat > >> > >>--- On Tue, 9/1/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: > >> > >> > >>>Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>Tuesday, September 1, 2009, 8:12 PM > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>Dear Michal, > >>> > >>> > >>>You said: > >>> > >>> > >>>Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. > >>> > >>> > >>>It is clear that I am focusing on the root cause of the problem and you are focusing on the remedies for the problem. It appears to me that we are at different ends of the domain that we need to address. But, a remedy suggested without understanding the cause fully could be incomplete and ineffective. It is like treating just the symptoms and not addressing the root cause. > >>> > >>> > >>>Regards, > >>>Krishna > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Michal Dziwulski nearmichal > wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>>>Hare Rama Krsna || > >>>> > >>>>Dear Krishna, > >>>> > >>>>It is the earth that revolves around the Sun. Nevertheless we take the geocentric viewpoint. So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. So which do we use? It is like chicken and egg situation - which came first? > >>>> > >>>>For a person with celiac disorder, they are fine as long as they don't eat wheat (Sun). When they see a loaf of bread they say no thanks. This is how it is manifesting in their experiential world. That the doctor tells them about this protein and this immune system is something secondary as far as they're concerned because the primary thing the doctor tells them is don't eat anything which contains gluten. So when we look at the chart we need to be clear what we are looking at ie. which level are we going to. Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. > >>>> > >>>>Regards, > >>>>Michal > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > ____________ _________ _________ __ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>Tuesday, 1 September, 2009 4:56:56 PM > >>>> > >>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Dear Michal, > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>It depends on how one is looking at the problem. From my perspective, the native will not be able to digest Gluten etc., after the damage is caused. And, Gluten by itself does not cause the damage to start with. Hence, what you are describing as the cause is an after effect of having the damage already in place. What causes the damage is the autoimmune reaction in the first place. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Dear Maja, > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Yes, I am the same SY SY... person :-) > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Virgo has two malefic aspects and not just one. Both Mars and Ketu aspect Virgo. And, it is a good observation from Amit that Mercury is conjunct (and combust by) 8th lord Sun. In addition, Mercury occupies 8th house from Virgo. It is evident that Virgo, 6H and Mercury are all  afflicted. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Regards, > >>>>Krishna > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Michal Dziwulski nearmichal > wrote: > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>Hare Rama Krsna || > >>>>> > >>>>>Dear Maja and Krishna, > >>>>> > >>>>>Coeliac disease is caused by a reaction to gliadin, a gluten protein found in wheat > >>>>> > >>>>>So is Sun not the culprit as Sun is karaka for wheat? Something external the body cannot digest - we have to look at 6th house. Lagnesh is in the 6th house for a start and it is Saturn. (Interestingly this will cause the AL to fall in the 11th house and thus Lagnesh is in the 8th from AL). > >>>>> > >>>>>In the chart provided Sun is 8th lord. When the 8th lord has anything to do with 6th house or lord it can give chronic digestive disease. Here Sun is conjoined 6th lord Mercury and in the 8th house from Moon - confirming the health issue. Narayana dasa of Leo was just running. > >>>>> > >>>>>Regards, > >>>>>Michal > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > ____________ _________ _________ __ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>Monday, 31 August, 2009 9:42:46 PM > >>>>> > >>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Dear Maja, > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Frankly, when I first opened the chart, I too looked at Venus, as it is in Rahu-Ketu axis and also aspected by Marsand in papakartari. This could have its own ramifications at the appropriate time and may not be relevant to Celiac Disorder. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>I googled to get some details on Celiac disorder. From what I understand, I don't think it is a problem related to Mars, though it is a digestive disorder. The small intestine is affected and is unable to absorb some of the nutrients. Since it is the small intestine, one should look at the 6th house and the sign Virgo. In this case, the lord of both 6th house and Virgo both is Mercury. Mercury is combust and also disposits Saturn. Mercury and Rahu have a common dispositor and Saturn is in the nakshatra of Rahu, one can assume that rahu affects Mercury as well. The problem is on the lining of the small intestine which has some functions akin to skin also. That too calls for a look at Mercury as well. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>This is not a conclusion but my preliminary line of analysis. I need to look at more charts (thanks to Tarun for providing more charts and I am yet to take a look at them). > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Regards, > >>>>>Krishna > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>>Om Gurave Namah > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, namaste > >>>>>> > >>>>>>(Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for " water " also > >>>>>> > >>>>>>For a start, here is Celiac disorder native: > >>>>>>DOB: 25th of April 1975 > >>>>>>TOB: 01:44 AM > >>>>>>POB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 > >>>>>>Time zone is 01h East of GMT > >>>>>> > >>>>>>You should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion? > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Warm Regards, > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Maja Strbac > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Hari Om Tat Sat > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>--- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>>Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>Sunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Dear Maja, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Another good name :-) > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Om Gurave Namah > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Dear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>(two wonderful names indeed > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Your discussion made me think over some examples of " root cause " and manifestation of disease. > >>>>>>>>Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine. > >>>>>>>>Asthma - lungs > >>>>>>>>Vitiligo- skin > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this " global epidemic " ), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join me to go through them together? > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Warm Regards to both, > >>>>>>>>Maja Strbac > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Hari Om Tat Sat > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>--- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Dear Lakshmi, > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Yours is a good name too :-) > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Hare Rama Krishna > >>>>>>>>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, > >>>>>>>>>>Nice name! > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>There is the seed , or origin, > >>>>>>>>>> and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, > >>>>>>>>>>it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal " symptoms " . > >>>>>>>>>>Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, > >>>>>>>>>>to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are, > >>>>>>>>>> where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. > >>>>>>>>>>In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) > >>>>>>>>>>But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved. > >>>>>>>>>> Im saying Venus must be at the root of it. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. > >>>>>>>>>>Hope you understand my point. > >>>>>>>>>>One " symptom " of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. > >>>>>>>>>>One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. > >>>>>>>>>>One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. > >>>>>>>>>>So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? > >>>>>>>>>>Not at the skin, it is just one of many " symptoms " . > >>>>>>>>>>Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . > >>>>>>>>>>Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. > >>>>>>>>>>Best wishes > >>>>>>>>>>Lakshmi > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > ____________ _________ _________ __ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PM > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Dear Lakshmi, > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Did you want to say: > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>- It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or > >>>>>>>>>>- It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Please clarify. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Hare Rama Krishna > >>>>>>>>>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, > >>>>>>>>>>>Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. > >>>>>>>>>>>When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Many skin problems are the result of " body chemistry " out of wack. > >>>>>>>>>>>Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. > >>>>>>>>>>>Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Bottom line Many of these things overlap > >>>>>>>>>>>( i mean karaka wise) > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? > >>>>>>>>>>>So I see it all as inter related. > >>>>>>>>>>>See primary issue, and then secondary issue. > >>>>>>>>>>>In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. > >>>>>>>>>>>Best wishes > >>>>>>>>>>>Lakshmi > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > ____________ _________ _________ __ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AM > >>>>>>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Dear Sanjay, > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Interest ingly, Dr. Charak in his book on " Essentials of Medical Astrology " puts  leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out  leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Comments welcome. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> || Om Gurave Namah || > >>>>>>>>>>>> Dear Krishna, > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> In another sense Vayu tattva is " Sense object " for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Warm Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>>> Sanjay P > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> >Dear Sanjayji, > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> >Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> >Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>>> >Krishna > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> >On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|| Om Gurave Namah || > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Dear Jani, > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma. > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana. > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka. > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Warm Regards > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Sanjay P > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>2009/8/ 27 Jani Minesh mhjani > > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>> Birth details of one my relative are follows. > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>> DOB 14/7/1972 > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>> Place: Navsari/Gujarat > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>> Time: 20:20 Hrs > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice. > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>> M H Jani > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Natal Chart > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>     July 14, 1972 > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Time:      20:20:00 > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Time Zone:   5:30:00 (East of GMT) > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Place:     72 E 55' 00 " , 20 N 51' 00 " > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>       Navsari, India > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Altitude:    0.00 meters > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Lunar Yr-Mo:  Paridhavi - Ashadha > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Tithi:     Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Nakshatra:   Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Yoga:      Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Karana:     Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Hora Lord:   Venus (5 min sign: Cn) > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi) > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Kaala Lord:   Mars (Mahakala: Mars) > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Sunrise:    6:05:28 > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Sunset:     19:22:37 > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Janma Ghatis:  35.6057 > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Ayanamsa:    23-28-21.04 > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Sidereal Time: 15:11:56 > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Body         Longitude     Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Lagna        14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Sun - AK       28 Ge 46' 16.46 " Puna    3   Ge  Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Moon - GK      16 Le 30' 41.26 " PPha    1   Le  Le > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Mars - PK      16 Cn 39' 20.95 " Push    4   Cn  Sc > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Mercury - MK     24 Cn 45' 21.10 " Asre    3   Cn  Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Jupiter ® - DK   7 Sg 33' 17.92 " Mool    3   Sg  Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Venus - BK      25 Ta 10' 43.28 " Mrig    1   Ta  Le > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Saturn - PiK     21 Ta 58' 15.19 " Rohi    4   Ta  Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Rahu - AmK      2 Cp 48' 03.08 " USha    2   Cp  Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Ketu         2 Cn 48' 03.08 " Puna    4   Cn  Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Maandi        19 Ar 25' 49.18 " Bhar    2   Ar  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Gulika        7 Ar 26' 28.59 " Aswi    3   Ar  Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Bhava Lagna      1 Aq 50' 22.21 " Dhan    3   Aq  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Hora Lagna      5 Vi 28' 25.28 " UPha    3   Vi  Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Ghati Lagna     16 Ge 22' 34.48 " Ardr    3   Ge  Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Vighati Lagna    10 Ta 53' 20.48 " Rohi    1   Ta  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Varnada Lagna    14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr    3   Ge  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Sree Lagna      10 Ar 42' 53.24 " Aswi    4   Ar  Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Pranapada Lagna   11 Vi 27' 17.80 " Hast    1   Vi  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Indu Lagna      16 Vi 30' 41.26 " Hast    2   Vi  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Bhrigu Bindu     24 Ar 39' 22.17 " Bhar    4   Ar  Sc > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Dhooma        12 Sc 06' 16.46 " Anu    3   Sc  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Vyatipata      17 Le 53' 43.54 " PPha    2   Le  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Parivesha      17 Aq 53' 43.54 " Sata    4   Aq  Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Indra Chapa     12 Ta 06' 16.46 " Rohi    1   Ta  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Upaketu       28 Ta 46' 16.46 " Mrig    2   Ta  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Kaala         1 Ge 04' 56.04 " Mrig    3   Ge  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Mrityu        10 Cp 12' 36.34 " Srav    1   Cp  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Artha Prahara     3 Aq 14' 51.48 " Dhan    3   Aq  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Yama Ghantaka    28 Aq 41' 23.20 " PBha    3   Aq  Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Prana Sphuta     21 Pi 58' 04.14 " Reva    2   Pi  Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Deha Sphuta     19 Ar 31' 58.71 " Bhar    2   Ar  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Mrityu Sphuta    20 Le 51' 36.61 " PPha    3   Le  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Sookshma TriSphuta  2 Vi 21' 39.45 " UPha    2   Vi  Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>TriSphuta       8 Ge 51' 28.97 " Ardr    1   Ge  Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>ChatusSphuta     7 Vi 37' 45.43 " UPha    4   Vi  Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>PanchaSphuta     10 Ge 25' 48.50 " Ardr    2   Ge  Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>V2          14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast    2   Vi  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>V3          14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat    3   Li  Le > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>V4          14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>V5          14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata    3   Aq  Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>V6          14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi    2   Ta  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>V7          14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr    3   Ge  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>V8          14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast    2   Vi  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>V9          14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat    3   Li  Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>V10         14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>V11         14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata    3   Aq  Le > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>V12         14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi    2   Ta  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Kunda         7 Ta 19' 47.81 " Krit    4   Ta  Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>+------ ----- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |Md  Gk   |Ve  Sa   |Su  GL   | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|------ ----- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |Ma  Me   | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |Ke     | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|------ ----- |     Rasi      |----------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|As  Ra   |            |Mo     | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|------ ----- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|JuR     |      |      |HL  AL   | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>+------ ----- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>+------ ----- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |As     |Su  JuR  | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |Gk     | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|------ ----- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|Me  HL   |            |Sa  Ke   | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|GL     |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |     Navamsa     |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|------ ----- |            |----------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|Ra     |      D-9      |Mo  Ve   | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |AL     | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|------ ----- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |Ma     |      |Md     | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>+------ ----- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Vimsottari Dasa (): > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Ven  Ven 1967-10-10  Sun 1971-02-05  Moon 1972-02-05  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>  Mars 1973-10-09  Rah 1974-12-08  Jup 1977-12-08  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>  Sat 1980-08-08  Merc 1983-10-10  Ket 1986-08-09  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Sun  Sun 1987-10-10  Moon 1988-01-25  Mars 1988-07-27  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>  Rah 1988-12-02  Jup 1989-10-27  Sat 1990-08-15  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>  Merc 1991-07-28  Ket 1992-05-31  Ven 1992-10-09  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Moon  Moon 1993-10-09  Mars 1994-08-09  Rah 1995-03-07  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>   Jup 1996-09-09  Sat 1998-01-07  Merc 1999-08-09  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>   Ket 2001-01-06  Ven 2001-08-09  Sun 2003-04-06  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Mars  Mars 2003-10-10  Rah 2004-03-03  Jup 2005-03-22  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>   Sat 2006-02-26  Merc 2007-04-06  Ket 2008-04-03  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>   Ven 2008-09-02  Sun 2009-11-03  Moon 2010-03-07  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Rah  Rah 2010-10-10  Jup 2013-06-19  Sat 2015-11-15  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>  Merc 2018-09-21  Ket 2021-04-06  Ven 2022-04-25  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>  Sun 2025-04-24  Moon 2026-03-19  Mars 2027-09-22  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Jup  Jup 2028-10-09  Sat 2030-11-27  Merc 2033-06-07  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>  Ket 2035-09-16  Ven 2036-08-21  Sun 2039-04-19  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>  Moon 2040-02-06  Mars 2041-06-07  Rah 2042-05-13  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Sat  Sat 2044-10-09  Merc 2047-10-13  Ket 2050-06-20  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>  Ven 2051-07-31  Sun 2054-10-01  Moon 2055-09-13  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>  Mars 2057-04-09  Rah 2058-05-20  Jup 2061-03-25  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Merc  Merc 2063-10-10  Ket 2066-03-04  Ven 2067-03-02  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>   Sun 2070-01-01  Moon 2070-11-09  Mars 2072-04-06  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>   Rah 2073-04-03  Jup 2075-10-25  Sat 2078-01-28  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>Ket  Ket 2080-10-10  Ven 2081-03-04  Sun 2082-05-04  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>  Moon 2082-09-13  Mars 2083-04-10  Rah 2083-09-10  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >>  Jup 2084-09-28  Sat 2085-09-03  Merc 2086-10-13  > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> >> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Need mail bonding? 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Guest guest Posted September 6, 2009 Report Share Posted September 6, 2009 Some pointers to handling this case. Leucoderma - Cancer (Rahu) of Skin (Mercury) which involves body (Gross) - Lagna and its manifested form (Surya Lagna). Chart: July 14, 1972 at 20.20 in Navsari, India In the natives chart, Rahu is in Lagna, causing affliction. Mercury (Skin), lord of the 6th (disease), is viewing the native with negative energy and is in Aslesha Naksahtra. Surya Lagna is in the 6th house from Lagna which indicates that disease carries more weightage in its manifested form. While prescribing remedial measures astrologically, we have three options a) Remedial b) Curtailing c) Destroying To understand it better, let us consider our above case - Not to allow the cancer to start is acheived by Remedial Measures. 2nd option is to CURTAIL the growth of cancer and 3rd option is to DESTROY the existing cancerous cells. Since the 1st option is not possible now, let us look at the remaining two options. Curtailing - Rahu in Vargottama is not favorable, and Mercury 9th ownership is facilitating the growth. Rahu can be controlled by reciting Rahu Kavacham, while Mercury can be tackled with the help of Jupiter. Jupiter is a enemy of Mercury and if we empower Jupiter with enough ammo, and allow them to fight, he will defeat Mercury and take away all his weapons/energy. Destroying - Surya Lagna is very strong. Further Rahu is Vargottama, in Uttarashada, gives it enough strength to fight back if needed. Mercury as the 6th lord is equally dangerous. Destroying the cells would become very difficult. The native can try the this - Take a vacation to any preferred beach. On a Wednesday evening, go knee deep (not more than that as Jupiter is in the 12th), face South direction, and recite " Om Namo Bhagavate Vasudevaya " for 108 times and then sprinkle the sea water all over the body. Repeating this every year is suggested. Hope this framework would be helpful to astrologers and students while analyzing charts. Best wishes, Raman Suprajarama http://www.astrologicalmagazine.com sohamsa , nalini swamy <nalini2818 wrote: > > Hare Rama Krishna > > Dear Maja, > Namaskar. > > Autoimmune disorders occur when the body 'recognises' its own cells as antigenic and mounts an immune response, basically starting with an inflammatory response - swelling, thrombocyte activity and the cells being destroyed and new tissue/cells building leading to formation of repeated layers of fibrous tissue/fibrosis. This tissue most often than not cannot perform all the functions of the original tissue, for example when the inflammatory response occurs in the lungs, the resultant tissue causes scarring on the lungs and the lungs/that part of the lungs loses the function of gas exchange - its porus nature and less of the surface of the lungs are capable of their normal function. Immune responses are directly connected to the lymphatic system, lymph/ lymph glands/ lymphocytes. Now, lymph travels all over the body and is collected and drained at the lymph nodes and swelling of the lymph nodes is also a signal of infection and is due to the > initiation of the immune response. Some typical lymph nodes ... armpits, groin.. These also have a link to the endocrine functions.. for example extreme stress, leading to excessive secretion of stress hormone, cortisol also is thought to be a precursor to immune system breakdown/ autoimmune disorders. > Some biology background for a thorough astrological discussion that has been going on (: > > Regards > Nalini > > >  > > > > ________________________________ > Maja Å trbac majastrbacastro > sohamsa > Thursday, 3 September, 2009 9:33:46 PM > Fw: Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >  > *Why I insist on nodes in context of destruction? > Ketu destroys Rajas, Rahu destroys Satva. > > --- On Thu, 9/3/09, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > > > >Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > > >Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >sohamsa@ .com > >Thursday, September 3, 2009, 2:21 AM > > > > > >Om Gurave Namah > > > >Dear Michal, namaste > > > > " Essentially it is the body attacking its own cells. " > > > >Precisely. Self destruction. > > > >There is obvious way of self destruction: > >http://www.mypointl ess.com/2009/ 02/nurse- sets-off- metal-detectors. html > > > >Or similar, but wrapped in shiny paper: > >http://www.hitsvill e.org/wp/ wp-content/ uploads/2009/ 06/michael- jackson-neverlan d.jpg > > > >The only difference between autoimmune respond and obvious self injuring lies in fact that it is not superficial or done by scalpel, needle etc. It is a little bit subtle way of self destruction and it is not conscious choice. > > > > " Self " and " destruction " , now this is not my personal wisdom, I will just retell that we need paka lagna to be involved in a way for that part " self " , for applied intelligence used in a wrong way. I was mentioning Rahu a while ago and I still think we need nodes and preferably Mangal for destruction. Badhaka involved by all means. Check all those charts, not just this with celiac syndrome. > > > >And how to relate this with specific body part where respond manifests? That is the reason why I included in this discussion. > > > > > >Warm Regards, > >Maja Strbac > > > >Hari Om Tat Sat > > > >--- On Wed, 9/2/09, Michal Dziwulski nearmichal > wrote: > > > > > >>Michal Dziwulski nearmichal > > >>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>sohamsa@ .com > >>Wednesday, September 2, 2009, 1:50 PM > >> > >> > >> > >>Hare Rama Krsna || > >> > >>Dear Maja, > >> > >>So what is the 'root cause' of autoimmune disorder? Essentially it is the body attacking its own cells. 6th house is something else attacking the body, 8th house is nija dosha. Nija - innate, of one's own party or country, an enemy in one's own country (MW). So how about the 8th house/lord? > >> > >>Regards, > >>Michal > >> > >> > >> > >> > ________________________________ > Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > > >>sohamsa@ .com > >>Wednesday, 2 September, 2009 11:11:29 PM > >>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >> > >> > >>Om Gurave Namah > >> > >>Dear Michal and Krishnamurthy, namaste > >> > >>It is a little bit of a problem to understand each other and continue dialogue if we are not looking at same subject from same perspective. > >> > >>Michal: " So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. " > >> > >>No, scientifically it is a problem with immune system which secondary leads to problems with digestion. I am trying to agree on this order of symptoms and find them in charts. Do you still consider this order to be wrong? I see no chicken/egg dilemma in this order. > >> > >>I completely agree on including Graha signifying particular allergen, but I would not start or end chart observation with this. That is what I am trying to say, and I think Krishnamurthy is trying same among rest of his points. Getting rid of allergen is not curing anything, problem is still there in body. > >> > >>People suffering celiac syndrome are not perfectly fine if they exclude 80% of grains (only corn, rice and buckwheat don't contain gluten). They are excluding valuable source for large number of vitamins from B group (especially if they are ovo-lacto, lacto or ovo vegetarians) . Synthetic supplements can't replace it perfectly speaking in long terms. > >> > >>What I am trying to say is: excluding gluten is just a small patch over a big, open wound. It is like someone is having Kala Sarpa Yoga on 5/11th axis in chart (and imagine that positions related to KSY are really pointing on problems related to progeny), and you give them advice to chant Santana Gopala mantra (and maybe add prasidha Savitur Gayatri for just in case) to accomplish progeny. It is a good advice, but... it is skipping the root cause. > >> > >>Let me rephrase my initial question: What is primary for observation about autoimmune diseases: positions in chart pointing on autoimmune disorders (probably signified by Rahu) or secondary symptoms (lungs, digestion, skin)? When we determine positions pointing on autoimmune disorders, how do we relate them with particular body part where they manifest? > >> > >>I would also like to read reply on Tarun's question. > >> > >>Warm Regards, > >>Maja Strbac > >> > >>Hari Om Tat Sat > >> > >>--- On Tue, 9/1/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: > >> > >> > >>>Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>Tuesday, September 1, 2009, 8:12 PM > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>Dear Michal, > >>> > >>> > >>>You said: > >>> > >>> > >>>Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. > >>> > >>> > >>>It is clear that I am focusing on the root cause of the problem and you are focusing on the remedies for the problem. It appears to me that we are at different ends of the domain that we need to address. But, a remedy suggested without understanding the cause fully could be incomplete and ineffective. It is like treating just the symptoms and not addressing the root cause. > >>> > >>> > >>>Regards, > >>>Krishna > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>On Wed, Sep 2, 2009 at 2:45 AM, Michal Dziwulski nearmichal > wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>>>Hare Rama Krsna || > >>>> > >>>>Dear Krishna, > >>>> > >>>>It is the earth that revolves around the Sun. Nevertheless we take the geocentric viewpoint. So you are right, scientifically it is a problem in the person's digestion tract, but experientially it is a problem with gluten. So which do we use? It is like chicken and egg situation - which came first? > >>>> > >>>>For a person with celiac disorder, they are fine as long as they don't eat wheat (Sun). When they see a loaf of bread they say no thanks. This is how it is manifesting in their experiential world. That the doctor tells them about this protein and this immune system is something secondary as far as they're concerned because the primary thing the doctor tells them is don't eat anything which contains gluten. So when we look at the chart we need to be clear what we are looking at ie. which level are we going to. Autoimmune disorders are extremely complicated - even doctors who train for years can't do anything about them - so what could I possibly do? I see the person is having a problem with the Sun, and there are remedies for this. Gluten intolerance is just a physical manifestation of a karmic problem. > >>>> > >>>>Regards, > >>>>Michal > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > ________________________________ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>Tuesday, 1 September, 2009 4:56:56 PM > >>>> > >>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Dear Michal, > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>It depends on how one is looking at the problem. From my perspective, the native will not be able to digest Gluten etc., after the damage is caused. And, Gluten by itself does not cause the damage to start with. Hence, what you are describing as the cause is an after effect of having the damage already in place. What causes the damage is the autoimmune reaction in the first place. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Dear Maja, > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Yes, I am the same SY SY... person :-) > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Virgo has two malefic aspects and not just one. Both Mars and Ketu aspect Virgo. And, it is a good observation from Amit that Mercury is conjunct (and combust by) 8th lord Sun. In addition, Mercury occupies 8th house from Virgo. It is evident that Virgo, 6H and Mercury are all  afflicted. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Regards, > >>>>Krishna > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 3:55 AM, Michal Dziwulski nearmichal > wrote: > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>Hare Rama Krsna || > >>>>> > >>>>>Dear Maja and Krishna, > >>>>> > >>>>>Coeliac disease is caused by a reaction to gliadin, a gluten protein found in wheat > >>>>> > >>>>>So is Sun not the culprit as Sun is karaka for wheat? Something external the body cannot digest - we have to look at 6th house. Lagnesh is in the 6th house for a start and it is Saturn. (Interestingly this will cause the AL to fall in the 11th house and thus Lagnesh is in the 8th from AL). > >>>>> > >>>>>In the chart provided Sun is 8th lord. When the 8th lord has anything to do with 6th house or lord it can give chronic digestive disease. Here Sun is conjoined 6th lord Mercury and in the 8th house from Moon - confirming the health issue. Narayana dasa of Leo was just running. > >>>>> > >>>>>Regards, > >>>>>Michal > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > ________________________________ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>Monday, 31 August, 2009 9:42:46 PM > >>>>> > >>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Dear Maja, > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Frankly, when I first opened the chart, I too looked at Venus, as it is in Rahu-Ketu axis and also aspected by Marsand in papakartari. This could have its own ramifications at the appropriate time and may not be relevant to Celiac Disorder. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>I googled to get some details on Celiac disorder. From what I understand, I don't think it is a problem related to Mars, though it is a digestive disorder. The small intestine is affected and is unable to absorb some of the nutrients. Since it is the small intestine, one should look at the 6th house and the sign Virgo. In this case, the lord of both 6th house and Virgo both is Mercury. Mercury is combust and also disposits Saturn. Mercury and Rahu have a common dispositor and Saturn is in the nakshatra of Rahu, one can assume that rahu affects Mercury as well. The problem is on the lining of the small intestine which has some functions akin to skin also. That too calls for a look at Mercury as well. > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>This is not a conclusion but my preliminary line of analysis. I need to look at more charts (thanks to Tarun for providing more charts and I am yet to take a look at them). > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Regards, > >>>>>Krishna > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 9:09 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>>Om Gurave Namah > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, namaste > >>>>>> > >>>>>>(Heh, got me! I forgot origin of my name for a moment. This is Hebrew for " water " also > >>>>>> > >>>>>>For a start, here is Celiac disorder native: > >>>>>>DOB: 25th of April 1975 > >>>>>>TOB: 01:44 AM > >>>>>>POB: 20 E 30, 44 N 50 > >>>>>>Time zone is 01h East of GMT > >>>>>> > >>>>>>You should get Makara lagna in Rasi chart and Kark lagna in Navamsa. Now tell me honestly, would you ever say that this native is suffering serious problems with digestion after quick peek on her chart (native is female)? I would never guess without knowing it in advance. I would probably bet on Sukra related issues (ovaries for example) because it is joined with badhakesh. > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Yet true, Rahu is in Badhakstan, so this could include a.i. disorders. In parivartana with Mangal... would you take this Mangal in consideration for agni7digestion? > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Warm Regards, > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Maja Strbac > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Hari Om Tat Sat > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>--- On Sun, 8/30/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>>Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>Sunday, August 30, 2009, 7:46 AM > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Dear Maja, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Another good name :-) > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>You are correct that in case of autoimmune diseases the nodes play an important role. In fact, I have already documented that Rahu plays an important role in Juvenile Diabetes which is again caused due to autoimmune reaction. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Though I don't have much exposure on all the three diseases that you have mentioned, it would be interesting to study them from autoimmune angle. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>On Sun, Aug 30, 2009 at 8:02 PM, Maja Å trbac <majastrbacastro@ > wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Om Gurave Namah > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Dear Lakshmi and Krishnamurthy, namaste > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>(two wonderful names indeed > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Your discussion made me think over some examples of " root cause " and manifestation of disease. > >>>>>>>>Celiac syndrome (gluten allergy)-main symptom is located on intestine. > >>>>>>>>Asthma - lungs > >>>>>>>>Vitiligo-skin > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>All above mentioned belongs to group of autoimmune diseases (most of opinions at least agree on this being main factor). Last info I got related to this type of diseases was that nodes should signify this disorder (what do you think?). > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Number and variety of autoimmune disorders is growing more and more each day (there is opinion that vaccines are root cause for this " global epidemic " ), so my question is: how to make difference between root cause and obvious symptom in chart? > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>I have chart examples for all 3 mentioned. Would you join me to go through them together? > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Warm Regards to both, > >>>>>>>>Maja Strbac > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Hari Om Tat Sat > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>--- On Fri, 8/28/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009, 9:51 PM > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Dear Lakshmi, > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Yours is a good name too :-) > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Thanks for taking time to explain and clarify my question. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>OK, I understand your view point now. Your point is - Venus is the primary cause for leucoderma. And, you also agree that we should look beyond Venus to confirm the disease. Fair enough. Thanks for expressing your views. My logic was that unless the dhatu (Mercury) is weak/afflicted, it may not carry a disease related to it even if other related planets are afflicted. Of course, skin could have multiple types of diseases depending upon what all planets are involved. But, if it is a skin problem, the issue should be revolving around Mercury is my point. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>I raised this issue as Mercury was not even mentioned in Sanjay's first mail on the topic. > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>On Sat, Aug 29, 2009 at 9:51 AM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Hare Rama Krishna > >>>>>>>>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, > >>>>>>>>>>Nice name! > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>I was just making some points when trying to understand disease in astro. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Yes, disease is usually a multi planet project, it isnt so simple to point finger at one planet. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>There is the seed , or origin, > >>>>>>>>>> and then it manifests and grows,in the right environment due to karma, > >>>>>>>>>>it often changes and can become a multitude of external and internal " symptoms " . > >>>>>>>>>>Many think the origin of most DIS EASE begins with the mind. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Thats the value of ayurveda combined with astro, > >>>>>>>>>>to determine where the intrinsic weak parts are, > >>>>>>>>>> where are the imbalances,etc. Then perform remedies, change diet etc. > >>>>>>>>>>In regards to Leucoderma, im pretty sure I read in Jaimini Sutras that Venus is connected to it. Why? I dont know, except Venus plays a role with hormones,lymph, rejuvenation( or lack thereof) > >>>>>>>>>>But Venus by itself isnt going to be the sole planet involved. > >>>>>>>>>> Im saying Venus must be at the root of it. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Most diseases end up involving many parts of the body. > >>>>>>>>>>Hope you understand my point. > >>>>>>>>>>One " symptom " of lupus is a rash on the cheeks. > >>>>>>>>>>One symptom of chicken pox is a rash. > >>>>>>>>>>One indication of AIDS is a distinct type of skin cancer. > >>>>>>>>>>So where are we going to look for the basis of these disease? > >>>>>>>>>>Not at the skin, it is just one of many " symptoms " . > >>>>>>>>>>Planets, signs and houses, have multiple karaka . > >>>>>>>>>>Hopefully you understand what i was getting at. > >>>>>>>>>>Best wishes > >>>>>>>>>>Lakshmi > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > ________________________________ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009 8:24:56 PM > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Dear Lakshmi, > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>I am not clear as to what you really wanted to convey. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Did you want to say: > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>- It is sufficient to just look at Venus for leucoderma, or > >>>>>>>>>>- It is necessary to look beyond Mercury and Venus > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Please clarify. > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Lakshmi Kary <lakshmikary@ > wrote: > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Hare Rama Krishna > >>>>>>>>>>>Dear Krishnamurthy, > >>>>>>>>>>>Venus is associated with all types fluids in the body, and lymph and hormones are involved. > >>>>>>>>>>>When hormones or lympth has problem the person can have problems with regulating fluids in the whole or part of body. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Many skin problems are the result of " body chemistry " out of wack. > >>>>>>>>>>>Yes, autoimmune responses make the body attach own tissues. > >>>>>>>>>>>Often skin problems are a Symptom! of an underlying -in the body- issue. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Bottom line Many of these things overlap > >>>>>>>>>>>( i mean karaka wise) > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Just think how many disease process can manifest with some skin condition attached to it? > >>>>>>>>>>>So I see it all as inter related. > >>>>>>>>>>>See primary issue, and then secondary issue. > >>>>>>>>>>>In india the ayurvedic doctor treats underlying dosha, imbalance to correct, and america is backwards, treating symptoms first and forgetting or be oblivious to underlying cause. > >>>>>>>>>>>Best wishes > >>>>>>>>>>>Lakshmi > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > ________________________________ > Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>>>>sohamsa@ .com > >>>>>>>>>>>Friday, August 28, 2009 2:49:28 AM > >>>>>>>>>>>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Dear Sanjay, > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on " Essentials of Medical Astrology " puts  leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out  leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Comments welcome. > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>|| Om Gurave Namah || > >>>>>>>>>>>>Dear Krishna, > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>In another sense Vayu tattva is " Sense object " for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>Warm Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>>>Sanjay P > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>Dear Sanjayji, > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>Regards, > >>>>>>>>>>>>>Krishna > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|| Om Gurave Namah || > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Dear Jani, > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Warm Regards > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sanjay P > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>2009/8/27 Jani Minesh mhjani > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Birth details of one my relative are follows. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> DOB 14/7/1972 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Place: Navsari/Gujarat > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Time: 20:20 Hrs > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> M H Jani > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Natal Chart > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>     July 14, 1972 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Time:      20:20:00 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Time Zone:   5:30:00 (East of GMT) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Place:     72 E 55' 00 " , 20 N 51' 00 " > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>       Navsari, India > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Altitude:    0.00 meters > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Lunar Yr-Mo:  Paridhavi - Ashadha > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Tithi:     Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Nakshatra:   Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Yoga:      Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Karana:     Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Hora Lord:   Venus (5 min sign: Cn) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Kaala Lord:   Mars (Mahakala: Mars) > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sunrise:    6:05:28 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sunset:     19:22:37 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Janma Ghatis:  35.6057 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ayanamsa:    23-28-21.04 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sidereal Time: 15:11:56 > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Body         Longitude     Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Lagna        14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sun - AK       28 Ge 46' 16.46 " Puna    3   Ge  Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Moon - GK      16 Le 30' 41.26 " PPha    1   Le  Le > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Mars - PK      16 Cn 39' 20.95 " Push    4   Cn  Sc > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Mercury - MK     24 Cn 45' 21.10 " Asre    3   Cn  Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Jupiter ® - DK   7 Sg 33' 17.92 " Mool    3   Sg  Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Venus - BK      25 Ta 10' 43.28 " Mrig    1   Ta  Le > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Saturn - PiK     21 Ta 58' 15.19 " Rohi    4   Ta  Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Rahu - AmK      2 Cp 48' 03.08 " USha    2   Cp  Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ketu         2 Cn 48' 03.08 " Puna    4   Cn  Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Maandi        19 Ar 25' 49.18 " Bhar    2   Ar  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Gulika        7 Ar 26' 28.59 " Aswi    3   Ar  Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Bhava Lagna      1 Aq 50' 22.21 " Dhan    3   Aq  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Hora Lagna      5 Vi 28' 25.28 " UPha    3   Vi  Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ghati Lagna     16 Ge 22' 34.48 " Ardr    3   Ge  Aq > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Vighati Lagna    10 Ta 53' 20.48 " Rohi    1   Ta  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Varnada Lagna    14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr    3   Ge  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sree Lagna      10 Ar 42' 53.24 " Aswi    4   Ar  Cn > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Pranapada Lagna   11 Vi 27' 17.80 " Hast    1   Vi  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Indu Lagna      16 Vi 30' 41.26 " Hast    2   Vi  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Bhrigu Bindu     24 Ar 39' 22.17 " Bhar    4   Ar  Sc > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Dhooma        12 Sc 06' 16.46 " Anu    3   Sc  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Vyatipata      17 Le 53' 43.54 " PPha    2   Le  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Parivesha      17 Aq 53' 43.54 " Sata    4   Aq  Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Indra Chapa     12 Ta 06' 16.46 " Rohi    1   Ta  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Upaketu       28 Ta 46' 16.46 " Mrig    2   Ta  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Kaala         1 Ge 04' 56.04 " Mrig    3   Ge  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Mrityu        10 Cp 12' 36.34 " Srav    1   Cp  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Artha Prahara     3 Aq 14' 51.48 " Dhan    3   Aq  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Yama Ghantaka    28 Aq 41' 23.20 " PBha    3   Aq  Ge > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Prana Sphuta     21 Pi 58' 04.14 " Reva    2   Pi  Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Deha Sphuta     19 Ar 31' 58.71 " Bhar    2   Ar  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Mrityu Sphuta    20 Le 51' 36.61 " PPha    3   Le  Li > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sookshma TriSphuta  2 Vi 21' 39.45 " UPha    2   Vi  Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>TriSphuta       8 Ge 51' 28.97 " Ardr    1   Ge  Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>ChatusSphuta     7 Vi 37' 45.43 " UPha    4   Vi  Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>PanchaSphuta     10 Ge 25' 48.50 " Ardr    2   Ge  Cp > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V2          14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast    2   Vi  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V3          14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat    3   Li  Le > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V4          14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V5          14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata    3   Aq  Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V6          14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi    2   Ta  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V7          14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr    3   Ge  Ar > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V8          14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast    2   Vi  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V9          14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat    3   Li  Sg > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V10         14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav    2   Cp  Vi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V11         14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata    3   Aq  Le > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>V12         14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi    2   Ta  Ta > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Kunda         7 Ta 19' 47.81 " Krit    4   Ta  Pi > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |Md  Gk   |Ve  Sa   |Su  GL   | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |Ma  Me   | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |Ke     | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- |     Rasi      |----------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|As  Ra   |            |Mo     | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|JuR     |      |      |HL  AL   | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |As     |Su  JuR  | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |Gk     | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|Me  HL   |            |Sa  Ke   | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|GL     |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |     Navamsa     |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- |            |----------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|Ra     |      D-9      |Mo  Ve   | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |AL     | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |            |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |Ma     |      |Md     | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>|      |      |      |      | > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Vimsottari Dasa (): > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ven  Ven 1967-10-10  Sun 1971-02-05  Moon 1972-02-05  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Mars 1973-10-09  Rah 1974-12-08  Jup 1977-12-08  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Sat 1980-08-08  Merc 1983-10-10  Ket 1986-08-09  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sun  Sun 1987-10-10  Moon 1988-01-25  Mars 1988-07-27  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Rah 1988-12-02  Jup 1989-10-27  Sat 1990-08-15  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Merc 1991-07-28  Ket 1992-05-31  Ven 1992-10-09  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Moon  Moon 1993-10-09  Mars 1994-08-09  Rah 1995-03-07  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>   Jup 1996-09-09  Sat 1998-01-07  Merc 1999-08-09  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>   Ket 2001-01-06  Ven 2001-08-09  Sun 2003-04-06  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Mars  Mars 2003-10-10  Rah 2004-03-03  Jup 2005-03-22  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>   Sat 2006-02-26  Merc 2007-04-06  Ket 2008-04-03  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>   Ven 2008-09-02  Sun 2009-11-03  Moon 2010-03-07  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Rah  Rah 2010-10-10  Jup 2013-06-19  Sat 2015-11-15  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Merc 2018-09-21  Ket 2021-04-06  Ven 2022-04-25  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Sun 2025-04-24  Moon 2026-03-19  Mars 2027-09-22  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Jup  Jup 2028-10-09  Sat 2030-11-27  Merc 2033-06-07  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Ket 2035-09-16  Ven 2036-08-21  Sun 2039-04-19  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Moon 2040-02-06  Mars 2041-06-07  Rah 2042-05-13  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sat  Sat 2044-10-09  Merc 2047-10-13  Ket 2050-06-20  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Ven 2051-07-31  Sun 2054-10-01  Moon 2055-09-13  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Mars 2057-04-09  Rah 2058-05-20  Jup 2061-03-25  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Merc  Merc 2063-10-10  Ket 2066-03-04  Ven 2067-03-02  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>   Sun 2070-01-01  Moon 2070-11-09  Mars 2072-04-06  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>   Rah 2073-04-03  Jup 2075-10-25  Sat 2078-01-28  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>Ket  Ket 2080-10-10  Ven 2081-03-04  Sun 2082-05-04  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Moon 2082-09-13  Mars 2083-04-10  Rah 2083-09-10  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>  Jup 2084-09-28  Sat 2085-09-03  Merc 2086-10-13  > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>Need mail bonding? 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Guest guest Posted September 14, 2009 Report Share Posted September 14, 2009 Dear Sir,Thanks for the data. This certainly helps my study.Regards,KrishnaOn Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 4:51 PM, Balasubramaniam Ramachandran <balsu46 wrote: Dear Shri Krishnaji, Pranams. I am giving a horoscope detail for your analysis on Leucoderma problem. DOB: 26/9/1945 : TOB: 2.15 A.M. : POB: Long: 78E10 ; Latit: 11 N 14 The native has this problem for more than 45 years since his childhood. The affliction is on his lower lips and some parts of his hands. If it is useful you can see the chart. with regards S.R.Balasubramaniam--- On Fri, 28/8/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem sohamsa Date: Friday, 28 August, 2009, 3:19 PM Dear Sanjay, Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on " Essentials of Medical Astrology " puts leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. Comments welcome. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Krishna, Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted.In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house.In another sense Vayu tattva is " Sense object " for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. Warm Regards,Sanjay P 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Dear Sanjayji, Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? Regards, Krishna On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Jani, Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma.In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana.Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka.Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. Warm RegardsSanjay P2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani >>> > > Birth details of one my relative are follows.>> DOB 14/7/1972> Place: Navsari/Gujarat> Time: 20:20 Hrs>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice. >> M H JaniNatal Chart July 14, 1972Time: 20:20:00 Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT)Place: 72 E 55' 00 " , 20 N 51' 00 " Navsari, IndiaAltitude: 0.00 meters Lunar Yr-Mo: Paridhavi - AshadhaTithi: Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left) Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve)Nakshatra: Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left) Yoga: Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left)Karana: Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left) Hora Lord: Venus (5 min sign: Cn)Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi) Kaala Lord: Mars (Mahakala: Mars)Sunrise: 6:05:28 Sunset: 19:22:37Janma Ghatis: 35.6057 Ayanamsa: 23-28-21.04Sidereal Time: 15:11:56 Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa Lagna 14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav 2 Cp TaSun - AK 28 Ge 46' 16.46 " Puna 3 Ge Ge Moon - GK 16 Le 30' 41.26 " PPha 1 Le LeMars - PK 16 Cn 39' 20.95 " Push 4 Cn Sc Mercury - MK 24 Cn 45' 21.10 " Asre 3 Cn AqJupiter ® - DK 7 Sg 33' 17.92 " Mool 3 Sg Ge Venus - BK 25 Ta 10' 43.28 " Mrig 1 Ta LeSaturn - PiK 21 Ta 58' 15.19 " Rohi 4 Ta CnRahu - AmK 2 Cp 48' 03.08 " USha 2 Cp Cp Ketu 2 Cn 48' 03.08 " Puna 4 Cn CnMaandi 19 Ar 25' 49.18 " Bhar 2 Ar Vi Gulika 7 Ar 26' 28.59 " Aswi 3 Ar GeBhava Lagna 1 Aq 50' 22.21 " Dhan 3 Aq Li Hora Lagna 5 Vi 28' 25.28 " UPha 3 Vi AqGhati Lagna 16 Ge 22' 34.48 " Ardr 3 Ge Aq Vighati Lagna 10 Ta 53' 20.48 " Rohi 1 Ta ArVarnada Lagna 14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr 3 Ge Ar Sree Lagna 10 Ar 42' 53.24 " Aswi 4 Ar CnPranapada Lagna 11 Vi 27' 17.80 " Hast 1 Vi Ar Indu Lagna 16 Vi 30' 41.26 " Hast 2 Vi TaBhrigu Bindu 24 Ar 39' 22.17 " Bhar 4 Ar ScDhooma 12 Sc 06' 16.46 " Anu 3 Sc Li Vyatipata 17 Le 53' 43.54 " PPha 2 Le ViParivesha 17 Aq 53' 43.54 " Sata 4 Aq Pi Indra Chapa 12 Ta 06' 16.46 " Rohi 1 Ta ArUpaketu 28 Ta 46' 16.46 " Mrig 2 Ta Vi Kaala 1 Ge 04' 56.04 " Mrig 3 Ge LiMrityu 10 Cp 12' 36.34 " Srav 1 Cp Ar Artha Prahara 3 Aq 14' 51.48 " Dhan 3 Aq LiYama Ghantaka 28 Aq 41' 23.20 " PBha 3 Aq GePrana Sphuta 21 Pi 58' 04.14 " Reva 2 Pi Cp Deha Sphuta 19 Ar 31' 58.71 " Bhar 2 Ar ViMrityu Sphuta 20 Le 51' 36.61 " PPha 3 Le Li Sookshma TriSphuta 2 Vi 21' 39.45 " UPha 2 Vi CpTriSphuta 8 Ge 51' 28.97 " Ardr 1 Ge Sg ChatusSphuta 7 Vi 37' 45.43 " UPha 4 Vi PiPanchaSphuta 10 Ge 25' 48.50 " Ardr 2 Ge Cp V2 14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast 2 Vi TaV3 14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat 3 Li LeV4 14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav 2 Cp Vi V5 14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata 3 Aq SgV6 14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi 2 Ta Ta V7 14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr 3 Ge ArV8 14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast 2 Vi Ta V9 14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat 3 Li SgV10 14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav 2 Cp Vi V11 14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata 3 Aq LeV12 14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi 2 Ta Ta Kunda 7 Ta 19' 47.81 " Krit 4 Ta Pi+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + | |Md Gk |Ve Sa |Su GL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | | |Ma Me || | |Ke | | | | || | | || | | | |----------- | Rasi |----------- ||As Ra | |Mo || | | | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | |JuR | | |HL AL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +| | |As |Su JuR | | | | |Gk || | | | | | | | | || | | | | |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- ||Me HL | |Sa Ke | |GL | | || | | || | | | | | Navamsa | ||----------- | |----------- | |Ra | D-9 |Mo Ve || | |AL | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | |Ma | |Md || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + Vimsottari Dasa (): Ven Ven 1967-10-10 Sun 1971-02-05 Moon 1972-02-05 Mars 1973-10-09 Rah 1974-12-08 Jup 1977-12-08 Sat 1980-08-08 Merc 1983-10-10 Ket 1986-08-09 Sun Sun 1987-10-10 Moon 1988-01-25 Mars 1988-07-27 Rah 1988-12-02 Jup 1989-10-27 Sat 1990-08-15 Merc 1991-07-28 Ket 1992-05-31 Ven 1992-10-09 Moon Moon 1993-10-09 Mars 1994-08-09 Rah 1995-03-07 Jup 1996-09-09 Sat 1998-01-07 Merc 1999-08-09 Ket 2001-01-06 Ven 2001-08-09 Sun 2003-04-06 Mars Mars 2003-10-10 Rah 2004-03-03 Jup 2005-03-22 Sat 2006-02-26 Merc 2007-04-06 Ket 2008-04-03 Ven 2008-09-02 Sun 2009-11-03 Moon 2010-03-07 Rah Rah 2010-10-10 Jup 2013-06-19 Sat 2015-11-15 Merc 2018-09-21 Ket 2021-04-06 Ven 2022-04-25 Sun 2025-04-24 Moon 2026-03-19 Mars 2027-09-22 Jup Jup 2028-10-09 Sat 2030-11-27 Merc 2033-06-07 Ket 2035-09-16 Ven 2036-08-21 Sun 2039-04-19 Moon 2040-02-06 Mars 2041-06-07 Rah 2042-05-13 Sat Sat 2044-10-09 Merc 2047-10-13 Ket 2050-06-20 Ven 2051-07-31 Sun 2054-10-01 Moon 2055-09-13 Mars 2057-04-09 Rah 2058-05-20 Jup 2061-03-25 Merc Merc 2063-10-10 Ket 2066-03-04 Ven 2067-03-02 Sun 2070-01-01 Moon 2070-11-09 Mars 2072-04-06 Rah 2073-04-03 Jup 2075-10-25 Sat 2078-01-28 Ket Ket 2080-10-10 Ven 2081-03-04 Sun 2082-05-04 Moon 2082-09-13 Mars 2083-04-10 Rah 2083-09-10 Jup 2084-09-28 Sat 2085-09-03 Merc 2086-10-13 Love Cricket? 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Guest guest Posted September 14, 2009 Report Share Posted September 14, 2009 Sh. S.R. Balasubramaniam, Thanks for the data. But is should be accompanied with time zone also or the country name. Love --- On Mon, 9/14/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa Date: Monday, September 14, 2009, 7:21 PM Dear Sir, Thanks for the data. This certainly helps my study. Regards, Krishna On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 4:51 PM, Balasubramaniam Ramachandran <balsu46 (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote: Dear Shri Krishnaji, Pranams. I am giving a horoscope detail for your analysis on Leucoderma problem. DOB: 26/9/1945 : TOB: 2.15 A.M. : POB: Long: 78E10 ; Latit: 11 N 14 The native has this problem for more than 45 years since his childhood. The affliction is on his lower lips and some parts of his hands. If it is useful you can see the chart. with regards S.R.Balasubramaniam--- On Fri, 28/8/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .comFriday, 28 August, 2009, 3:19 PM Dear Sanjay, Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on "Essentials of Medical Astrology" puts leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. Comments welcome. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Krishna, Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue).But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted.In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house.In another sense Vayu tattva is "Sense object" for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions.Warm Regards,Sanjay P 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Dear Sanjayji, Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? Regards, Krishna On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Jani, Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma.In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu.We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana.Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka.Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy,Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi.Warm RegardsSanjay P2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani >>> >> Birth details of one my relative are follows.>> DOB 14/7/1972> Place: Navsari/Gujarat> Time: 20:20 Hrs>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice.>> M H JaniNatal Chart July 14, 1972Time: 20:20:00Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT)Place: 72 E 55' 00", 20 N 51' 00" Navsari, IndiaAltitude: 0.00 metersLunar Yr-Mo: Paridhavi - AshadhaTithi: Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left)Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve)Nakshatra: Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left)Yoga: Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left)Karana: Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left)Hora Lord: Venus (5 min sign: Cn)Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi)Kaala Lord: Mars (Mahakala: Mars)Sunrise: 6:05:28Sunset: 19:22:37Janma Ghatis: 35.6057Ayanamsa: 23-28-21.04Sidereal Time: 15:11:56Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi NavamsaLagna 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp TaSun - AK 28 Ge 46' 16.46" Puna 3 Ge GeMoon - GK 16 Le 30' 41.26" PPha 1 Le LeMars - PK 16 Cn 39' 20.95" Push 4 Cn ScMercury - MK 24 Cn 45' 21.10" Asre 3 Cn AqJupiter ® - DK 7 Sg 33' 17.92" Mool 3 Sg GeVenus - BK 25 Ta 10' 43.28" Mrig 1 Ta LeSaturn - PiK 21 Ta 58' 15.19" Rohi 4 Ta CnRahu - AmK 2 Cp 48' 03.08" USha 2 Cp CpKetu 2 Cn 48' 03.08" Puna 4 Cn CnMaandi 19 Ar 25' 49.18" Bhar 2 Ar ViGulika 7 Ar 26' 28.59" Aswi 3 Ar GeBhava Lagna 1 Aq 50' 22.21" Dhan 3 Aq LiHora Lagna 5 Vi 28' 25.28" UPha 3 Vi AqGhati Lagna 16 Ge 22' 34.48" Ardr 3 Ge AqVighati Lagna 10 Ta 53' 20.48" Rohi 1 Ta ArVarnada Lagna 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge ArSree Lagna 10 Ar 42' 53.24" Aswi 4 Ar CnPranapada Lagna 11 Vi 27' 17.80" Hast 1 Vi ArIndu Lagna 16 Vi 30' 41.26" Hast 2 Vi TaBhrigu Bindu 24 Ar 39' 22.17" Bhar 4 Ar ScDhooma 12 Sc 06' 16.46" Anu 3 Sc LiVyatipata 17 Le 53' 43.54" PPha 2 Le ViParivesha 17 Aq 53' 43.54" Sata 4 Aq PiIndra Chapa 12 Ta 06' 16.46" Rohi 1 Ta ArUpaketu 28 Ta 46' 16.46" Mrig 2 Ta ViKaala 1 Ge 04' 56.04" Mrig 3 Ge LiMrityu 10 Cp 12' 36.34" Srav 1 Cp ArArtha Prahara 3 Aq 14' 51.48" Dhan 3 Aq LiYama Ghantaka 28 Aq 41' 23.20" PBha 3 Aq GePrana Sphuta 21 Pi 58' 04.14" Reva 2 Pi CpDeha Sphuta 19 Ar 31' 58.71" Bhar 2 Ar ViMrityu Sphuta 20 Le 51' 36.61" PPha 3 Le LiSookshma TriSphuta 2 Vi 21' 39.45" UPha 2 Vi CpTriSphuta 8 Ge 51' 28.97" Ardr 1 Ge SgChatusSphuta 7 Vi 37' 45.43" UPha 4 Vi PiPanchaSphuta 10 Ge 25' 48.50" Ardr 2 Ge CpV2 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi TaV3 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li LeV4 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp ViV5 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq SgV6 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta TaV7 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge ArV8 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi TaV9 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li SgV10 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp ViV11 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq LeV12 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta TaKunda 7 Ta 19' 47.81" Krit 4 Ta Pi+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +| |Md Gk |Ve Sa |Su GL || | | | || | | | || | | | || | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- || | |Ma Me || | |Ke || | | || | | || | | ||----------- | Rasi |----------- ||As Ra | |Mo || | | || | | || | | || | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- ||JuR | | |HL AL || | | | || | | | || | | | || | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ++----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +| | |As |Su JuR || | | |Gk || | | | || | | | || | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- ||Me HL | |Sa Ke ||GL | | || | | || | | || | Navamsa | ||----------- | |----------- ||Ra | D-9 |Mo Ve || | |AL || | | || | | || | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- || |Ma | |Md || | | | || | | | || | | | || | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +Vimsottari Dasa ():Ven Ven 1967-10-10 Sun 1971-02-05 Moon 1972-02-05 Mars 1973-10-09 Rah 1974-12-08 Jup 1977-12-08 Sat 1980-08-08 Merc 1983-10-10 Ket 1986-08-09 Sun Sun 1987-10-10 Moon 1988-01-25 Mars 1988-07-27 Rah 1988-12-02 Jup 1989-10-27 Sat 1990-08-15 Merc 1991-07-28 Ket 1992-05-31 Ven 1992-10-09 Moon Moon 1993-10-09 Mars 1994-08-09 Rah 1995-03-07 Jup 1996-09-09 Sat 1998-01-07 Merc 1999-08-09 Ket 2001-01-06 Ven 2001-08-09 Sun 2003-04-06 Mars Mars 2003-10-10 Rah 2004-03-03 Jup 2005-03-22 Sat 2006-02-26 Merc 2007-04-06 Ket 2008-04-03 Ven 2008-09-02 Sun 2009-11-03 Moon 2010-03-07 Rah Rah 2010-10-10 Jup 2013-06-19 Sat 2015-11-15 Merc 2018-09-21 Ket 2021-04-06 Ven 2022-04-25 Sun 2025-04-24 Moon 2026-03-19 Mars 2027-09-22 Jup Jup 2028-10-09 Sat 2030-11-27 Merc 2033-06-07 Ket 2035-09-16 Ven 2036-08-21 Sun 2039-04-19 Moon 2040-02-06 Mars 2041-06-07 Rah 2042-05-13 Sat Sat 2044-10-09 Merc 2047-10-13 Ket 2050-06-20 Ven 2051-07-31 Sun 2054-10-01 Moon 2055-09-13 Mars 2057-04-09 Rah 2058-05-20 Jup 2061-03-25 Merc Merc 2063-10-10 Ket 2066-03-04 Ven 2067-03-02 Sun 2070-01-01 Moon 2070-11-09 Mars 2072-04-06 Rah 2073-04-03 Jup 2075-10-25 Sat 2078-01-28 Ket Ket 2080-10-10 Ven 2081-03-04 Sun 2082-05-04 Moon 2082-09-13 Mars 2083-04-10 Rah 2083-09-10 Jup 2084-09-28 Sat 2085-09-03 Merc 2086-10-13 Love Cricket? 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Guest guest Posted September 20, 2009 Report Share Posted September 20, 2009 Dear Shri Kursijaji, Pranams. The data is that of the native born in Namakkal, Salem District,Tamilnadu. Hence the time zone is known. Please forgive me for the omission. with regards S.R.Balasubramaniam--- On Mon, 14/9/09, S.C. Kursija <sckursija wrote: S.C. Kursija <sckursijaRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa Date: Monday, 14 September, 2009, 7:34 PM Sh. S.R. Balasubramaniam, Thanks for the data. But is should be accompanied with time zone also or the country name. Love --- On Mon, 9/14/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .comMonday, September 14, 2009, 7:21 PM Dear Sir, Thanks for the data. This certainly helps my study. Regards, Krishna On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 4:51 PM, Balasubramaniam Ramachandran <balsu46 (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote: Dear Shri Krishnaji, Pranams. I am giving a horoscope detail for your analysis on Leucoderma problem. DOB: 26/9/1945 : TOB: 2.15 A.M. : POB: Long: 78E10 ; Latit: 11 N 14 The native has this problem for more than 45 years since his childhood. The affliction is on his lower lips and some parts of his hands. If it is useful you can see the chart. with regards S.R.Balasubramaniam--- On Fri, 28/8/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ ..comFriday, 28 August, 2009, 3:19 PM Dear Sanjay, Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on "Essentials of Medical Astrology" puts leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. Comments welcome. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Krishna, Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue).But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted.In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house.In another sense Vayu tattva is "Sense object" for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions.Warm Regards,Sanjay P 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Dear Sanjayji, Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? Regards, Krishna On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Jani, Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma.In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu.We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana.Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka.Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy,Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi.Warm RegardsSanjay P2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani >>> >> Birth details of one my relative are follows.>> DOB 14/7/1972> Place: Navsari/Gujarat> Time: 20:20 Hrs>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice.>> M H JaniNatal Chart July 14, 1972Time: 20:20:00Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT)Place: 72 E 55' 00", 20 N 51' 00" Navsari, IndiaAltitude: 0.00 metersLunar Yr-Mo: Paridhavi - AshadhaTithi: Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left)Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve)Nakshatra: Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left)Yoga: Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left)Karana: Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left)Hora Lord: Venus (5 min sign: Cn)Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi)Kaala Lord: Mars (Mahakala: Mars)Sunrise: 6:05:28Sunset: 19:22:37Janma Ghatis: 35.6057Ayanamsa: 23-28-21.04Sidereal Time: 15:11:56Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi NavamsaLagna 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp TaSun - AK 28 Ge 46' 16.46" Puna 3 Ge GeMoon - GK 16 Le 30' 41.26" PPha 1 Le LeMars - PK 16 Cn 39' 20.95" Push 4 Cn ScMercury - MK 24 Cn 45' 21.10" Asre 3 Cn AqJupiter ® - DK 7 Sg 33' 17.92" Mool 3 Sg GeVenus - BK 25 Ta 10' 43.28" Mrig 1 Ta LeSaturn - PiK 21 Ta 58' 15.19" Rohi 4 Ta CnRahu - AmK 2 Cp 48' 03.08" USha 2 Cp CpKetu 2 Cn 48' 03.08" Puna 4 Cn CnMaandi 19 Ar 25' 49.18" Bhar 2 Ar ViGulika 7 Ar 26' 28.59" Aswi 3 Ar GeBhava Lagna 1 Aq 50' 22.21" Dhan 3 Aq LiHora Lagna 5 Vi 28' 25.28" UPha 3 Vi AqGhati Lagna 16 Ge 22' 34.48" Ardr 3 Ge AqVighati Lagna 10 Ta 53' 20.48" Rohi 1 Ta ArVarnada Lagna 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge ArSree Lagna 10 Ar 42' 53.24" Aswi 4 Ar CnPranapada Lagna 11 Vi 27' 17.80" Hast 1 Vi ArIndu Lagna 16 Vi 30' 41.26" Hast 2 Vi TaBhrigu Bindu 24 Ar 39' 22.17" Bhar 4 Ar ScDhooma 12 Sc 06' 16.46" Anu 3 Sc LiVyatipata 17 Le 53' 43.54" PPha 2 Le ViParivesha 17 Aq 53' 43.54" Sata 4 Aq PiIndra Chapa 12 Ta 06' 16.46" Rohi 1 Ta ArUpaketu 28 Ta 46' 16.46" Mrig 2 Ta ViKaala 1 Ge 04' 56.04" Mrig 3 Ge LiMrityu 10 Cp 12' 36.34" Srav 1 Cp ArArtha Prahara 3 Aq 14' 51.48" Dhan 3 Aq LiYama Ghantaka 28 Aq 41' 23.20" PBha 3 Aq GePrana Sphuta 21 Pi 58' 04.14" Reva 2 Pi CpDeha Sphuta 19 Ar 31' 58.71" Bhar 2 Ar ViMrityu Sphuta 20 Le 51' 36.61" PPha 3 Le LiSookshma TriSphuta 2 Vi 21' 39.45" UPha 2 Vi CpTriSphuta 8 Ge 51' 28.97" Ardr 1 Ge SgChatusSphuta 7 Vi 37' 45.43" UPha 4 Vi PiPanchaSphuta 10 Ge 25' 48.50" Ardr 2 Ge CpV2 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi TaV3 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li LeV4 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp ViV5 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq SgV6 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta TaV7 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge ArV8 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi TaV9 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li SgV10 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp ViV11 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq LeV12 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta TaKunda 7 Ta 19' 47.81" Krit 4 Ta Pi+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +| |Md Gk |Ve Sa |Su GL || | | | || | | | || | | | || | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- || | |Ma Me || | |Ke || | | || | | || | | ||----------- | Rasi |----------- ||As Ra | |Mo || | | || | | || | | || | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- ||JuR | | |HL AL || | | | || | | | || | | | || | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- ++----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +| | |As |Su JuR || | | |Gk || | | | || | | | || | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- ||Me HL | |Sa Ke ||GL | | || | | || | | || | Navamsa | ||----------- | |----------- ||Ra | D-9 |Mo Ve || | |AL || | | || | | || | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- || |Ma | |Md || | | | || | | | || | | | || | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +Vimsottari Dasa ():Ven Ven 1967-10-10 Sun 1971-02-05 Moon 1972-02-05 Mars 1973-10-09 Rah 1974-12-08 Jup 1977-12-08 Sat 1980-08-08 Merc 1983-10-10 Ket 1986-08-09 Sun Sun 1987-10-10 Moon 1988-01-25 Mars 1988-07-27 Rah 1988-12-02 Jup 1989-10-27 Sat 1990-08-15 Merc 1991-07-28 Ket 1992-05-31 Ven 1992-10-09 Moon Moon 1993-10-09 Mars 1994-08-09 Rah 1995-03-07 Jup 1996-09-09 Sat 1998-01-07 Merc 1999-08-09 Ket 2001-01-06 Ven 2001-08-09 Sun 2003-04-06 Mars Mars 2003-10-10 Rah 2004-03-03 Jup 2005-03-22 Sat 2006-02-26 Merc 2007-04-06 Ket 2008-04-03 Ven 2008-09-02 Sun 2009-11-03 Moon 2010-03-07 Rah Rah 2010-10-10 Jup 2013-06-19 Sat 2015-11-15 Merc 2018-09-21 Ket 2021-04-06 Ven 2022-04-25 Sun 2025-04-24 Moon 2026-03-19 Mars 2027-09-22 Jup Jup 2028-10-09 Sat 2030-11-27 Merc 2033-06-07 Ket 2035-09-16 Ven 2036-08-21 Sun 2039-04-19 Moon 2040-02-06 Mars 2041-06-07 Rah 2042-05-13 Sat Sat 2044-10-09 Merc 2047-10-13 Ket 2050-06-20 Ven 2051-07-31 Sun 2054-10-01 Moon 2055-09-13 Mars 2057-04-09 Rah 2058-05-20 Jup 2061-03-25 Merc Merc 2063-10-10 Ket 2066-03-04 Ven 2067-03-02 Sun 2070-01-01 Moon 2070-11-09 Mars 2072-04-06 Rah 2073-04-03 Jup 2075-10-25 Sat 2078-01-28 Ket Ket 2080-10-10 Ven 2081-03-04 Sun 2082-05-04 Moon 2082-09-13 Mars 2083-04-10 Rah 2083-09-10 Jup 2084-09-28 Sat 2085-09-03 Merc 2086-10-13 Love Cricket? 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Guest guest Posted September 29, 2009 Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 Dear Balasubramaniam,Wartime correction is required for births in India from Sep 1, 1942 and Oct. 14, 1945. This person's birth falls in that range. I would like to know if the time has been already corrected for 'war time' or we should make the correction over the given time? Regards,KrishnaJonathan Swift - " May you live every day of your life. " On Sun, Sep 20, 2009 at 8:22 AM, Balasubramaniam Ramachandran <balsu46 wrote: Dear Shri Kursijaji, Pranams. The data is that of the native born in Namakkal, Salem District,Tamilnadu. Hence the time zone is known. Please forgive me for the omission. with regards S.R.Balasubramaniam--- On Mon, 14/9/09, S.C. Kursija <sckursija wrote: S.C. Kursija <sckursijaRe: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem sohamsa Date: Monday, 14 September, 2009, 7:34 PM Sh. S.R. Balasubramaniam, Thanks for the data. But is should be accompanied with time zone also or the country name. Love --- On Mon, 9/14/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .com Monday, September 14, 2009, 7:21 PM Dear Sir, Thanks for the data. This certainly helps my study. Regards, Krishna On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 4:51 PM, Balasubramaniam Ramachandran <balsu46 (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote: Dear Shri Krishnaji, Pranams. I am giving a horoscope detail for your analysis on Leucoderma problem. DOB: 26/9/1945 : TOB: 2.15 A.M. : POB: Long: 78E10 ; Latit: 11 N 14 The native has this problem for more than 45 years since his childhood. The affliction is on his lower lips and some parts of his hands. If it is useful you can see the chart. with regards S.R.Balasubramaniam--- On Fri, 28/8/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ ..comFriday, 28 August, 2009, 3:19 PM Dear Sanjay, Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on " Essentials of Medical Astrology " puts leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better. Comments welcome. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Krishna, Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted.In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house.In another sense Vayu tattva is " Sense object " for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. Warm Regards,Sanjay P 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Dear Sanjayji, Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? Regards, Krishna On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Jani, Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma.In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana.Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka.Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. Warm RegardsSanjay P2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani >>> > > Birth details of one my relative are follows.>> DOB 14/7/1972> Place: Navsari/Gujarat> Time: 20:20 Hrs>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice. >> M H JaniNatal Chart July 14, 1972Time: 20:20:00 Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT)Place: 72 E 55' 00 " , 20 N 51' 00 " Navsari, IndiaAltitude: 0.00 meters Lunar Yr-Mo: Paridhavi - AshadhaTithi: Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left) Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve)Nakshatra: Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left) Yoga: Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left)Karana: Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left) Hora Lord: Venus (5 min sign: Cn)Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi) Kaala Lord: Mars (Mahakala: Mars)Sunrise: 6:05:28 Sunset: 19:22:37Janma Ghatis: 35.6057 Ayanamsa: 23-28-21.04Sidereal Time: 15:11:56 Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa Lagna 14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav 2 Cp TaSun - AK 28 Ge 46' 16.46 " Puna 3 Ge Ge Moon - GK 16 Le 30' 41.26 " PPha 1 Le LeMars - PK 16 Cn 39' 20.95 " Push 4 Cn Sc Mercury - MK 24 Cn 45' 21.10 " Asre 3 Cn AqJupiter ® - DK 7 Sg 33' 17.92 " Mool 3 Sg Ge Venus - BK 25 Ta 10' 43.28 " Mrig 1 Ta LeSaturn - PiK 21 Ta 58' 15.19 " Rohi 4 Ta CnRahu - AmK 2 Cp 48' 03.08 " USha 2 Cp Cp Ketu 2 Cn 48' 03.08 " Puna 4 Cn CnMaandi 19 Ar 25' 49.18 " Bhar 2 Ar Vi Gulika 7 Ar 26' 28.59 " Aswi 3 Ar GeBhava Lagna 1 Aq 50' 22.21 " Dhan 3 Aq Li Hora Lagna 5 Vi 28' 25.28 " UPha 3 Vi AqGhati Lagna 16 Ge 22' 34.48 " Ardr 3 Ge Aq Vighati Lagna 10 Ta 53' 20.48 " Rohi 1 Ta ArVarnada Lagna 14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr 3 Ge Ar Sree Lagna 10 Ar 42' 53.24 " Aswi 4 Ar CnPranapada Lagna 11 Vi 27' 17.80 " Hast 1 Vi Ar Indu Lagna 16 Vi 30' 41.26 " Hast 2 Vi TaBhrigu Bindu 24 Ar 39' 22.17 " Bhar 4 Ar ScDhooma 12 Sc 06' 16.46 " Anu 3 Sc Li Vyatipata 17 Le 53' 43.54 " PPha 2 Le ViParivesha 17 Aq 53' 43.54 " Sata 4 Aq Pi Indra Chapa 12 Ta 06' 16.46 " Rohi 1 Ta ArUpaketu 28 Ta 46' 16.46 " Mrig 2 Ta Vi Kaala 1 Ge 04' 56.04 " Mrig 3 Ge LiMrityu 10 Cp 12' 36.34 " Srav 1 Cp Ar Artha Prahara 3 Aq 14' 51.48 " Dhan 3 Aq LiYama Ghantaka 28 Aq 41' 23.20 " PBha 3 Aq GePrana Sphuta 21 Pi 58' 04.14 " Reva 2 Pi Cp Deha Sphuta 19 Ar 31' 58.71 " Bhar 2 Ar ViMrityu Sphuta 20 Le 51' 36.61 " PPha 3 Le Li Sookshma TriSphuta 2 Vi 21' 39.45 " UPha 2 Vi CpTriSphuta 8 Ge 51' 28.97 " Ardr 1 Ge Sg ChatusSphuta 7 Vi 37' 45.43 " UPha 4 Vi PiPanchaSphuta 10 Ge 25' 48.50 " Ardr 2 Ge Cp V2 14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast 2 Vi TaV3 14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat 3 Li LeV4 14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav 2 Cp Vi V5 14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata 3 Aq SgV6 14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi 2 Ta Ta V7 14 Ge 54' 19.11 " Ardr 3 Ge ArV8 14 Vi 54' 19.11 " Hast 2 Vi Ta V9 14 Li 54' 19.11 " Swat 3 Li SgV10 14 Cp 54' 19.11 " Srav 2 Cp Vi V11 14 Aq 54' 19.11 " Sata 3 Aq LeV12 14 Ta 54' 19.11 " Rohi 2 Ta Ta Kunda 7 Ta 19' 47.81 " Krit 4 Ta Pi+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + | |Md Gk |Ve Sa |Su GL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | | |Ma Me || | |Ke | | | | || | | || | | | |----------- | Rasi |----------- ||As Ra | |Mo || | | | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | |JuR | | |HL AL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +| | |As |Su JuR | | | | |Gk || | | | | | | | | || | | | | |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- ||Me HL | |Sa Ke | |GL | | || | | || | | | | | Navamsa | ||----------- | |----------- | |Ra | D-9 |Mo Ve || | |AL | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | |Ma | |Md || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + Vimsottari Dasa (): Ven Ven 1967-10-10 Sun 1971-02-05 Moon 1972-02-05 Mars 1973-10-09 Rah 1974-12-08 Jup 1977-12-08 Sat 1980-08-08 Merc 1983-10-10 Ket 1986-08-09 Sun Sun 1987-10-10 Moon 1988-01-25 Mars 1988-07-27 Rah 1988-12-02 Jup 1989-10-27 Sat 1990-08-15 Merc 1991-07-28 Ket 1992-05-31 Ven 1992-10-09 Moon Moon 1993-10-09 Mars 1994-08-09 Rah 1995-03-07 Jup 1996-09-09 Sat 1998-01-07 Merc 1999-08-09 Ket 2001-01-06 Ven 2001-08-09 Sun 2003-04-06 Mars Mars 2003-10-10 Rah 2004-03-03 Jup 2005-03-22 Sat 2006-02-26 Merc 2007-04-06 Ket 2008-04-03 Ven 2008-09-02 Sun 2009-11-03 Moon 2010-03-07 Rah Rah 2010-10-10 Jup 2013-06-19 Sat 2015-11-15 Merc 2018-09-21 Ket 2021-04-06 Ven 2022-04-25 Sun 2025-04-24 Moon 2026-03-19 Mars 2027-09-22 Jup Jup 2028-10-09 Sat 2030-11-27 Merc 2033-06-07 Ket 2035-09-16 Ven 2036-08-21 Sun 2039-04-19 Moon 2040-02-06 Mars 2041-06-07 Rah 2042-05-13 Sat Sat 2044-10-09 Merc 2047-10-13 Ket 2050-06-20 Ven 2051-07-31 Sun 2054-10-01 Moon 2055-09-13 Mars 2057-04-09 Rah 2058-05-20 Jup 2061-03-25 Merc Merc 2063-10-10 Ket 2066-03-04 Ven 2067-03-02 Sun 2070-01-01 Moon 2070-11-09 Mars 2072-04-06 Rah 2073-04-03 Jup 2075-10-25 Sat 2078-01-28 Ket Ket 2080-10-10 Ven 2081-03-04 Sun 2082-05-04 Moon 2082-09-13 Mars 2083-04-10 Rah 2083-09-10 Jup 2084-09-28 Sat 2085-09-03 Merc 2086-10-13 Love Cricket? 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Guest guest Posted September 29, 2009 Report Share Posted September 29, 2009 Dear Krishnaji, Namaste. I am unaware of that. I shall check up and come back to you. Kindly bear with me till then. He is my friend and hence the check up is possible.with regardsS.R.Balasubramaniam--- On Tue, 29/9/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 wrote:Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa Date: Tuesday, 29 September, 2009, 12:46 PM Dear Balasubramaniam ,Wartime correction is required for births in India from Sep 1, 1942 and Oct. 14, 1945. This person's birth falls in that range. I would like to know if the time has been already corrected for 'war time' or we should make the correction over the given time? Regards,KrishnaJonathan Swift - "May you live every day of your life." On Sun, Sep 20, 2009 at 8:22 AM, Balasubramaniam Ramachandran <balsu46 (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote: Dear Shri Kursijaji, Pranams. The data is that of the native born in Namakkal, Salem District,Tamilnadu. Hence the time zone is known. Please forgive me for the omission. with regards S.R.Balasubramaniam--- On Mon, 14/9/09, S.C. Kursija <sckursija > wrote: S.C. Kursija <sckursija >Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problem sohamsa@ .comMonday, 14 September, 2009, 7:34 PM Sh. S.R. Balasubramaniam, Thanks for the data. But is should be accompanied with time zone also or the country name.. Love --- On Mon, 9/14/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ .com Monday, September 14, 2009, 7:21 PM Dear Sir, Thanks for the data. This certainly helps my study. Regards, Krishna On Mon, Aug 31, 2009 at 4:51 PM, Balasubramaniam Ramachandran <balsu46 (AT) (DOT) co.in> wrote: Dear Shri Krishnaji, Pranams. I am giving a horoscope detail for your analysis on Leucoderma problem. DOB: 26/9/1945 : TOB: 2.15 A.M. : POB: Long: 78E10 ; Latit: 11 N 14 The native has this problem for more than 45 years since his childhood. The affliction is on his lower lips and some parts of his hands. If it is useful you can see the chart. with regards S.R.Balasubramaniam--- On Fri, 28/8/09, Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Re: Re: [vedic astrology] Leucoderma Problemsohamsa@ ..comFriday, 28 August, 2009, 3:19 PM Dear Sanjay, Your argument about beauty and hence the relation to Venus seems to be reasonable. However, I feel that is a secondary issue. Mercury represents the basic dhatu. Unless that is afflicted, diseases related to it may not show up. In the cited chart, I notice that Ketu is in trines to Mercury in both D6 and D30 in addition to being conjunct Mercury in Rasi. It appears that, in essence, Mercury is afflicted by Ketu. Now, on top of that we could add your argument about Venus. Interestingly, Dr. Charak in his book on "Essentials of Medical Astrology" puts leucoderma under both Mercury and Venus. Hence, I guess one should look for afflictions to both Mercury and Venus to check out leucoderma. It would be interesting to check out a few more charts understand this better.. Comments welcome. Regards, Krishna On Fri, Aug 28, 2009 at 11:49 AM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Krishna, Yes Mercury is taken for skin and Jaimini Sutra mentions that boils and rashes can be caused if Ak or Badhakesh is in Mercury ruled amshas (Recently in the list there was another case posted for a small child who has this issue). But, When specific dictum's for specific deceases are mentioned it's preferred to take that specific remedy. Here we already have one from Prashna Marga and hence it was opted.In Vedic terms all deceases are due some negative karma. The prime object of a Jyotisha should be to delineate in as specific terms as possible the particular karma which causes the trouble. Now, Skin as basic sense of duty of protecting the inner organs is well performed in Leucoderma the beauty aspect of skin which is ruled by Venus is trouble here so Prashna Marga's recommendation for Venus is not so far off from logic, If you consider that Venus get debilitated in Mercury's house.In another sense Vayu tattva is "Sense object" for Skin so can we say Saturn is also kaaraka for Skin?, That was one logic I was thinking about, when I try to delienate as per Panch Tattva and Indriyas. Please give your opinions. Warm Regards,Sanjay P 2009/8/27 Krishnamurthy Seetharama <kmurthys58 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Dear Sanjayji, Since leucoderma is a problem associate with skin, don't you think the karaka for skin, Mercury should some how be associated with this problem? Does Ketu with Mercury cause this? Regards, Krishna On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 6:13 PM, Sanjay Prabhakaran <sanjaychettiar@ gmail.com> wrote: || Om Gurave Namah ||Dear Jani, Prashna Marga 12.72 says venus brings about leucoderma.In this chart we see that Venus is conjoined Saturn and aspected by Rahu. The Venus kaaraka bhava is having badhakesha Mars,ketu and is aspected by Saturn and Rahu. We see 7th house (venus kaaraka) lord moon in 8th house in marana kaaraka staana.Moon is in 64th Navamsa i.e 4th house in Navamsa with Venus. 4th lord (64th Navamsa lord) is Sun who is the atmakaaraka.Prashna Marga recomends the following remedy, Stanza 23.7. Stealing the wealth of the Deities and Brahmins and eating forbidden foods give rise to leucoderma. Performance of kushmanda homa and gifting of gold are the palliatives. I addition I would recomend worship of Lakshmi. Warm RegardsSanjay P2009/8/27 Jani Minesh <mhjani >>> > > Birth details of one my relative are follows.>> DOB 14/7/1972> Place: Navsari/Gujarat> Time: 20:20 Hrs>> Suffering from leucoderma. Will wearing Mangal Stone help reducing disease? Pl. advice. >> M H JaniNatal Chart July 14, 1972Time: 20:20:00 Time Zone: 5:30:00 (East of GMT)Place: 72 E 55' 00", 20 N 51' 00" Navsari, IndiaAltitude: 0.00 meters Lunar Yr-Mo: Paridhavi - AshadhaTithi: Sukla Chaturthi (Me) (2.16% left) Vedic Weekday: Friday (Ve)Nakshatra: Poorva Phalguni (Ve) (76.16% left) Yoga: Vyatipata (Ra) (10.38% left)Karana: Vishti (Sa) (4.33% left) Hora Lord: Venus (5 min sign: Cn)Mahakala Hora: Sun (5 min sign: Pi) Kaala Lord: Mars (Mahakala: Mars)Sunrise: 6:05:28 Sunset: 19:22:37Janma Ghatis: 35.6057 Ayanamsa: 23-28-21.04Sidereal Time: 15:11:56 Body Longitude Nakshatra Pada Rasi Navamsa Lagna 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp TaSun - AK 28 Ge 46' 16.46" Puna 3 Ge Ge Moon - GK 16 Le 30' 41.26" PPha 1 Le LeMars - PK 16 Cn 39' 20.95" Push 4 Cn Sc Mercury - MK 24 Cn 45' 21.10" Asre 3 Cn AqJupiter ® - DK 7 Sg 33' 17.92" Mool 3 Sg Ge Venus - BK 25 Ta 10' 43.28" Mrig 1 Ta LeSaturn - PiK 21 Ta 58' 15.19" Rohi 4 Ta CnRahu - AmK 2 Cp 48' 03.08" USha 2 Cp Cp Ketu 2 Cn 48' 03.08" Puna 4 Cn CnMaandi 19 Ar 25' 49.18" Bhar 2 Ar Vi Gulika 7 Ar 26' 28.59" Aswi 3 Ar GeBhava Lagna 1 Aq 50' 22.21" Dhan 3 Aq Li Hora Lagna 5 Vi 28' 25.28" UPha 3 Vi AqGhati Lagna 16 Ge 22' 34.48" Ardr 3 Ge Aq Vighati Lagna 10 Ta 53' 20.48" Rohi 1 Ta ArVarnada Lagna 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge Ar Sree Lagna 10 Ar 42' 53.24" Aswi 4 Ar CnPranapada Lagna 11 Vi 27' 17.80" Hast 1 Vi Ar Indu Lagna 16 Vi 30' 41.26" Hast 2 Vi TaBhrigu Bindu 24 Ar 39' 22.17" Bhar 4 Ar ScDhooma 12 Sc 06' 16.46" Anu 3 Sc Li Vyatipata 17 Le 53' 43.54" PPha 2 Le ViParivesha 17 Aq 53' 43.54" Sata 4 Aq Pi Indra Chapa 12 Ta 06' 16.46" Rohi 1 Ta ArUpaketu 28 Ta 46' 16.46" Mrig 2 Ta Vi Kaala 1 Ge 04' 56.04" Mrig 3 Ge LiMrityu 10 Cp 12' 36.34" Srav 1 Cp Ar Artha Prahara 3 Aq 14' 51.48" Dhan 3 Aq LiYama Ghantaka 28 Aq 41' 23.20" PBha 3 Aq GePrana Sphuta 21 Pi 58' 04.14" Reva 2 Pi Cp Deha Sphuta 19 Ar 31' 58.71" Bhar 2 Ar ViMrityu Sphuta 20 Le 51' 36.61" PPha 3 Le Li Sookshma TriSphuta 2 Vi 21' 39.45" UPha 2 Vi CpTriSphuta 8 Ge 51' 28..97" Ardr 1 Ge Sg ChatusSphuta 7 Vi 37' 45.43" UPha 4 Vi PiPanchaSphuta 10 Ge 25' 48.50" Ardr 2 Ge Cp V2 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi TaV3 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li LeV4 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Vi V5 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq SgV6 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta Ta V7 14 Ge 54' 19.11" Ardr 3 Ge ArV8 14 Vi 54' 19.11" Hast 2 Vi Ta V9 14 Li 54' 19.11" Swat 3 Li SgV10 14 Cp 54' 19.11" Srav 2 Cp Vi V11 14 Aq 54' 19.11" Sata 3 Aq LeV12 14 Ta 54' 19.11" Rohi 2 Ta Ta Kunda 7 Ta 19' 47.81" Krit 4 Ta Pi+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + | |Md Gk |Ve Sa |Su GL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | | |Ma Me || | |Ke | | | | || | | || | | | |----------- | Rasi |----------- ||As Ra | |Mo || | | | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | |JuR | | |HL AL || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + +----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- +| | |As |Su JuR | | | | |Gk || | | | | | | | | || | | | | |----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- ||Me HL | |Sa Ke | |GL | | || | | || | | | | | Navamsa | ||----------- | |----------- | |Ra | D-9 |Mo Ve || | |AL | | | | || | | | | | | ||----------- +-------- --------- ------+-- --------- | | |Ma | |Md || | | | | | | | | || | | | | | | | | |+----------- --------- --------- --------- --------- + Vimsottari Dasa (): Ven Ven 1967-10-10 Sun 1971-02-05 Moon 1972-02-05 Mars 1973-10-09 Rah 1974-12-08 Jup 1977-12-08 Sat 1980-08-08 Merc 1983-10-10 Ket 1986-08-09 Sun Sun 1987-10-10 Moon 1988-01-25 Mars 1988-07-27 Rah 1988-12-02 Jup 1989-10-27 Sat 1990-08-15 Merc 1991-07-28 Ket 1992-05-31 Ven 1992-10-09 Moon Moon 1993-10-09 Mars 1994-08-09 Rah 1995-03-07 Jup 1996-09-09 Sat 1998-01-07 Merc 1999-08-09 Ket 2001-01-06 Ven 2001-08-09 Sun 2003-04-06 Mars Mars 2003-10-10 Rah 2004-03-03 Jup 2005-03-22 Sat 2006-02-26 Merc 2007-04-06 Ket 2008-04-03 Ven 2008-09-02 Sun 2009-11-03 Moon 2010-03-07 Rah Rah 2010-10-10 Jup 2013-06-19 Sat 2015-11-15 Merc 2018-09-21 Ket 2021-04-06 Ven 2022-04-25 Sun 2025-04-24 Moon 2026-03-19 Mars 2027-09-22 Jup Jup 2028-10-09 Sat 2030-11-27 Merc 2033-06-07 Ket 2035-09-16 Ven 2036-08-21 Sun 2039-04-19 Moon 2040-02-06 Mars 2041-06-07 Rah 2042-05-13 Sat Sat 2044-10-09 Merc 2047-10-13 Ket 2050-06-20 Ven 2051-07-31 Sun 2054-10-01 Moon 2055-09-13 Mars 2057-04-09 Rah 2058-05-20 Jup 2061-03-25 Merc Merc 2063-10-10 Ket 2066-03-04 Ven 2067-03-02 Sun 2070-01-01 Moon 2070-11-09 Mars 2072-04-06 Rah 2073-04-03 Jup 2075-10-25 Sat 2078-01-28 Ket Ket 2080-10-10 Ven 2081-03-04 Sun 2082-05-04 Moon 2082-09-13 Mars 2083-04-10 Rah 2083-09-10 Jup 2084-09-28 Sat 2085-09-03 Merc 2086-10-13 Love Cricket? 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