A definitive chart for America [Sally/Vyas]John

[Guest guest]

the morning of July 5, 1776 and [2] the ratifying moment of the Bill of

Rights, by the Virginia Assembly in the late morning of December 15,

1791 [exactly 14 years-to-the-day after Virginia ratified the Articles

of Confederation, on December 15, 1777. Virginia's of 1777 was the

first; Maryland's, on February 2, 1781, was the 13th and final.] For

the cosmic " connexity " of these two events, one finds the [1] Moon

15Aq11 of 1776 conjunct the [2] Ascendant of 1791.

 

 

John,

 

Yes, this connects..the Moon, the mind of Jefferson being played out that day.

 

Those astrologers

who assent to the principles of muhurta in this context (as explained

in an earlier post by Vyas), may appreciate the significance of such a

concurrence.

 

 

By the way, I also realized the July 5 chart earily depicts the US '

gains from foreign occupation! Mars 10L on the 11mep in the

twelfth!

 

 

Could you clarify these statements for me, I don't see the connection that well. Which dates fro example?

 

Declaration of Independence, as stated in a previous post, would

be to explore the connection it shares to the final ratification of the

Bill of Rights.

 

 

 

And for February 2, 1781

I do consider the event of that day to signify, thanks largely to Thor

and concurring astrologers, the birth event of the quote

" United States " unquote.

 

 

Thanks.

Sally

On 1/24/07, JohnTWB <blazingstar1776 wrote:

 

Hi Sally & Vyas I share Sally's

excitement for the meaning of the text of the Declaration of

Independence, and for the soul and character of the man who wrote it,

Thomas Jefferson. But, for mundane astrology, first must be considered the historical significance of the event. Here

I believe I ay have to part company with Sally's estimate, but

join with Vyas in looking at the relevance of the " architecture of

muhurta " . In an earlier post I pointed

out the possible " conception/birth " relationship of the events of [1]

the Declaration, as initialed by Jefferson (a signature, of sorts) in

the morning of July 5, 1776 and [2] the ratifying moment of the

Bill of Rights, by the Virginia Assembly in the late morning of

December 15, 1791 [exactly 14 years-to-the-day after Virginia

ratified the Articles of Confederation, on December 15, 1777.

Virginia's of 1777 was the first; Maryland's, on February 2, 1781, was

the 13th and final.] For the cosmic " connexity " of these two

events, one finds the [1] Moon 15Aq11 of 1776 conjunct the [2]

Ascendant of 1791. Those astrologers who assent to the principles of

muhurta in this context (as explained in an earlier post by Vyas), may

appreciate the significance of such a concurrence. However,

I have found that the July 5, 1776 Jefferson event doesn't work out if

applied to any other major subsequent political event marking the

progress of America in its early years. There is, however, such a

conception/birth relationship between September 9, 1776 and

February 2, 1781 [Luna to Ascendant : : 20Ca48.] One

finds on September 9, 1776, late morning, that Congress first

" resolved " (enacted) to alter the name identification, the

" stile " , of all official acts of Congress, altered from the " United

Colonies " to become the " United States " . And for February 2, 1781

I do consider the event of that day to signify, thanks largely to Thor

and concurring astrologers, the birth event of the quote

" United States " unquote. Again, for those who appreciate Vyas' point

about muhurta and the life cycles of all incorporate entities, in

particular manifestation as the relationship of the first pre-natal

moment, " conception " , to the next moment after the final pre-natal

moment, there does appear to be a cosmic connexity, possibly

expressed in the respective charts cast for the two events, events only

considered by the casual observer as loosely related,

historically, with the passage of time. And

so I sincerely believe astrologers will get nowhere in there predictive

exercises, if they try and connect the event of Declaration,

initialed, to the events forming the bodies politic of America's

State and Government. I think the useful alternative for the

Declaration of Independence, as stated in a previous post, would

be to explore the connection it shares to the final ratification of the

Bill of Rights. Could it really be otherwise for Thomas Jefferson, the

author patriot, who on March 1, 1792, in the morning, sat down at the

desk of the Secretary of State in Philadelphia, Jefferson's own desk

(HE was the Secretary), and penned a letter to " 14 " State Governors

[the original " 13 " plus Vermont], penned a " circular " , a letter of

transmittal informing the States' Governors that both houses of

Congress had been served formal notice by President George Washington,

in the morning of January 18, 1792, that enough States had by then

ratified the Bill of Rights, and so the Constitution was

henceforth duly amended, by the ten " Articles " , famously known, after

the pioneering example set by the patriots of Virginia, on June 12,

1776, known as the U.S. Bill of Rights. The delay in

distribution to the Governors of the letter and copies of the

Bill, delayed between January and March, is partly to be accounted

for by the time taken for the first official printings of the Bill to

be prepared. Alas, Jefferson was responsible for the work of that

printer too, just as he was on the Friday morning of July 5,

1776. How

can the American nation ever repay in memory the successful and

devoted efforts of this patriot of such genius, this patriot so

pure in soul ? CHEERS, JOHN Sally Spencer <sally234 wrote:

Jorge, John and Group,Some

thoughts on the 1781 chart and some research on the 7/5/1776

chart. As you say Jorge, some countries' charts are enacted by

the rulers-maybe this applies now in the 1781 chart.... " Some countries/states are born by enactment of their previous/actual rulers. " Also..: " the 1781 chart explains the

events also under this perspective[country] but more under the national administration perspective; " For

this reason, I don't cater to the 1781 chart, because it now becomes

the reality of dealing with issues of governing, not the initial

breakthrough state of the nation's conception. Maybe however, it

was conceived with Jefferson and later born five years later in 1781.Thanks.SallyP.S.In

researching the transit time of 2/2/1781 in the chart of 1776,

July 5, the period was Rahu, Mars. Rahu is both worldly and busy.

Rahu is not strong but unafflicting. Mars has some clout on the Mep of

four houses. Mars rules the tenth, of administration on the eleventh of

gains and aspirations. Many of the planets then are well placed

and strong. Especially status lord, Sun in the seventh of

contracts, bonds of the masses and foreign affairs. On 1/23/07, Jorge Angelino <

jorge.angelino wrote: Dear Sally, I

am in the process of rectifying the exact minute and second of the

February 2, 1781, chart. So far, I have already checked 15 events in

both charts, but more than 150 will be carefully examined. At this stage, let me share some ideas with you and all the other list members: 1)

The two charts explain all the events, but under different

perspectives: the 1776 chart explains the events under the country

perspective, and the 1781 chart explains the events also under this

perspective but more under the national administration perspective; -- Sally Spencer, Jyotish KovidA Gentle Journey to Deep Healing Ascension work, Vedic Astrology*,Western Astrology reports www.Devi3.byregion.net

sally234 *Vedic Astrology, a co creative sacred science,which determines, strengthens or propitiatesplanetary results.

www.EnlightenedLiving/AscensionJoys http://health.ElectroMagneticHealth/EMF Products:

http://www.mybiopro.com/Home.aspx?ID=SallySpencerWaves of LoveEntering the Planet

It's inevitable. It's contagious~

Food fight? Enjoy some healthy debatein the

Answers Food & Drink Q & A.

 

 

-- Sally Spencer, Jyotish KovidA Gentle Journey to Deep Healing Ascension work, Vedic Astrology*,Western Astrology reports

www.Devi3.byregion.netsally234 *Vedic Astrology, a co creative sacred science, which determines, strengthens or propitiates planetary results.

www.EnlightenedLiving/AscensionJoys

http://health.ElectroMagneticHealth/EMF Products:

http://www.mybiopro.com/Home.aspx?ID=SallySpencerWaves of LoveEntering the PlanetIt's inevitable. It's contagious~

[Guest guest]

Hi Sally APOLOGIES. I should have realized BEFORE sending it. A PERFECT SUCCESS IN COBBLING TOGETHER A RUN-ON SENTENCE WHICH ADDED INSULT TO INJURY TO THE READER BY TAKING THE STORY ALL OVER THE PLACE, ON THE MATTERS OF EVENT DATES. VIRGINIA DATES Admitted, I should have radically re-phrased before sending. What a garble.! The Relationship of the State of Virginia's two DECEMBER 15s . .. being 1777 . . . and 1791. BOTH are not unimportant dates, each in its own right. I'm sure that in 1791 the members of the Burgesses, well in advance, aimed their ratifying shot for December 15 [this "shot" being, the10th of 14 States to ratify, and so, the "10-of-14" minimum threshhold was achieved of the States' ratification of the Bill of Rights, by Virginia's vote.] This

"shot" brought the voting process to a close on the 14th anniversary date of Virginia's "ratification" of the Articles of Confederation. Please observe here, that the "ratification" in the State capital should not be confused with its subsequent "confirmation" in Congress, along with seven other confirming States, on July 9, 1778, in Philadelphia, between 12:00/13:00 hrs that day [25Virgo up to 7Libra]. That day in 1778, eight States' delegations of various sizes, amounting to 35 delegates' signatures. It would require five more such confirmation signing ceremonies in Congress, but each for just a single State (8 + 5 =13), in order to finish the job, as was achieved by Maryland's confirmation on March 1, 1781. [Caution, MARYLAND: "Ratified" February 2, 1781; then after, on March 1, 1781, "Confirmed" (its earlier ratification). Historians more often than note do not distinguish the two verbs. This accounts, in the main, for the

fact of the burial-without-grave-marker in American history texts of this historic "February" date. See the proceedings of Congress for February 16, 1776, in the Journals of Congress, for an instance of the proper distinguishing usage.] MUHURTA, as adverted in my previous post, does not apply in comparing the two Virginia dates, 1777 to 1791. The cosmic connexity manifests by JULY 5, 1776 EARLY MORNING's Moon "determining" DECEMBER 15, 1791 LATE MORNING's Ascendant, where, narrowly speaking, both positions occupy the same sign and the same degree, being Aquarius, in the 16th degree. This concept of conception/birth manifesting in the respective charts of one person is in origin Babylonian astrology/cosmology, and ""may"" have become Vedic, as well. May be Vyas can help here. The same connexity between two events holds

for the birth of the United States in February 1781, following its conception event, in September 1776 [yesterday's post]. The same connexity between two events holds for the birth of American Independence, July 2, 1776 and the agreement to the TEXT of the U.S. (second) constitution [not to be confused with the birth of the constitution itself, by required ratification, in the following year, 1788. ]. So please find that on July 2, 1776, Jorge's rectified time for enactment shows the Moon 7Cap23 (Asc 15Sc30); Now fast forward to 1787, where the constitution's TEXT was "adopted" at around 3:30 p.m., on September 17, 1787 [approximately 3:30 p.m. as per the historical record. AstroDatabank's 11:29 a.m. chart was Grant & Kraum's in 1949,.and turns out to be just failed guesswork on their

part.]. Then, one finds for around 3:30 p.m., the Ascendant in the 8th degree of Capricorn (and the Moon in the 16th degree of Scorpio). The repective positions 1776 : : 1787, same sign & degree, where Luna to Asc : : Asc to Luna. Q.E.D. . . . VOILA !!!!!! Cheers, JOHNSally Spencer <sally234 wrote: the morning of July 5, 1776 and [2] the ratifying moment of the Bill of Rights, by the Virginia Assembly in the late morning of December 15, 1791 [exactly 14 years-to-the-day after Virginia ratified the Articles of Confederation, on December 15, 1777. Virginia's of 1777 was the first; Maryland's, on February 2, 1781, was the 13th and final.] For the cosmic "connexity" of these

two events, one finds the [1] Moon 15Aq11 of 1776 conjunct the [2] Ascendant of 1791. John,Yes, this connects..the Moon, the mind of Jefferson being played out that day. Those astrologers who assent to the principles of muhurta in this context (as explained in an earlier post by Vyas), may appreciate the significance of such a concurrence. By the way, I also realized the July 5 chart earily depicts the US ' gains from foreign occupation! Mars 10L on the 11mep in the twelfth! Could you clarify these statements for me, I don't see the connection that well. Which dates fro example? Declaration of Independence, as stated in a previous post, would be to explore the connection it shares to the

final ratification of the Bill of Rights. And for February 2, 1781 I do consider the event of that day to signify, thanks largely to Thor and concurring astrologers, the birth event of the quote "United States" unquote. Thanks. Sally On 1/24/07, JohnTWB <blazingstar1776 > wrote: Hi Sally & Vyas I share Sally's excitement for the meaning of the text of the Declaration of Independence, and for the soul and character of the man who wrote it, Thomas Jefferson. But, for mundane astrology, first must be

considered the historical significance of the event. Here I believe I ay have to part company with Sally's estimate, but join with Vyas in looking at the relevance of the "architecture of muhurta". In an earlier post I pointed out the possible "conception/birth" relationship of the events of [1] the Declaration, as initialed by Jefferson (a signature, of sorts) in the morning of July 5, 1776 and [2] the ratifying moment of the Bill of Rights, by the Virginia Assembly in the late morning of December 15, 1791 [exactly 14 years-to-the-day after Virginia ratified the Articles of Confederation, on December 15, 1777. Virginia's of 1777 was the first; Maryland's, on February 2, 1781, was the 13th and final.] For the cosmic "connexity" of these two events, one finds the [1] Moon 15Aq11 of 1776 conjunct the [2] Ascendant of 1791. Those astrologers who assent to the principles of muhurta

in this context (as explained in an earlier post by Vyas), may appreciate the significance of such a concurrence. However, I have found that the July 5, 1776 Jefferson event doesn't work out if applied to any other major subsequent political event marking the progress of America in its early years. There is, however, such a conception/birth relationship between September 9, 1776 and February 2, 1781 [Luna to Ascendant : : 20Ca48.] One finds on September 9, 1776, late morning, that Congress first "resolved" (enacted) to alter the name identification, the "stile", of all official acts of Congress, altered from the "United Colonies" to become the "United States". And for February 2, 1781 I do consider the event of that day to signify, thanks largely to Thor and concurring astrologers, the birth event of the quote "United States" unquote. Again, for those who appreciate Vyas' point about

muhurta and the life cycles of all incorporate entities, in particular manifestation as the relationship of the first pre-natal moment, "conception", to the next moment after the final pre-natal moment, there does appear to be a cosmic connexity, possibly expressed in the respective charts cast for the two events, events only considered by the casual observer as loosely related, historically, with the passage of time. And so I sincerely believe astrologers will get nowhere in there predictive exercises, if they try and connect the event of Declaration, initialed, to the events forming the bodies politic of America's State and Government. I think the useful alternative for the Declaration of Independence, as stated in a previous post, would be to explore the connection it shares to the final ratification of the Bill of Rights. Could it really be otherwise for Thomas Jefferson, the author patriot, who on March 1,

1792, in the morning, sat down at the desk of the Secretary of State in Philadelphia, Jefferson's own desk (HE was the Secretary), and penned a letter to "14" State Governors [the original "13" plus Vermont], penned a "circular", a letter of transmittal informing the States' Governors that both houses of Congress had been served formal notice by President George Washington, in the morning of January 18, 1792, that enough States had by then ratified the Bill of Rights, and so the Constitution was henceforth duly amended, by the ten "Articles", famously known, after the pioneering example set by the patriots of Virginia, on June 12, 1776, known as the U.S. Bill of Rights. The delay in distribution to the Governors of the letter and copies of the Bill, delayed between January and March, is partly to be accounted for by the time taken for the first official printings of the Bill to be prepared. Alas, Jefferson was responsible for the work of that

printer too, just as he was on the Friday morning of July 5, 1776. How can the American nation ever repay in memory the successful and devoted efforts of this patriot of such genius, this patriot so pure in soul ? CHEERS, JOHN Sally Spencer <sally234 > wrote: Jorge, John and Group,Some thoughts on the 1781 chart and some research on the 7/5/1776 chart. As you say Jorge, some countries' charts are enacted by the rulers-maybe this applies now in the 1781 chart...." Some countries/states are born by enactment of their previous/actual rulers. "Also..:"the 1781 chart explains the events also under this perspective[country] but more under the national administration perspective;"For this reason, I don't cater to the 1781 chart, because it now becomes the reality of

dealing with issues of governing, not the initial breakthrough state of the nation's conception. Maybe however, it was conceived with Jefferson and later born five years later in 1781.Thanks.SallyP.S.In researching the transit time of 2/2/1781 in the chart of 1776, July 5, the period was Rahu, Mars. Rahu is both worldly and busy. Rahu is not strong but unafflicting. Mars has some clout on the Mep of four houses. Mars rules the tenth, of administration on the eleventh of gains and aspirations. Many of the planets then are well placed and strong. Especially status lord, Sun in the seventh of contracts, bonds of the masses and foreign affairs. On 1/23/07, Jorge Angelino < jorge.angelino > wrote: Dear Sally, I am in the process of rectifying the exact minute and second of the February 2, 1781, chart. So far, I have already checked 15 events in both charts, but more than 150 will be carefully examined. At this stage, let me share some ideas with you and all the other list members: 1) The two charts explain all the events, but under different perspectives: the 1776 chart explains the events under the country perspective, and the 1781 chart explains the events also under this perspective but more under the national administration perspective; -- Sally Spencer, Jyotish KovidA Gentle Journey to Deep Healing Ascension work, Vedic Astrology*,Western Astrology reports www.Devi3.byregion.netsally234 (AT) earthlink (DOT) net *Vedic Astrology, a co creative sacred science,which determines, strengthens or propitiatesplanetary results. www.EnlightenedLiving/AscensionJoys http://health.ElectroMagneticHealth/EMF Products: http://www.mybiopro.com/Home.aspx?ID=SallySpencerWaves of LoveEntering the Planet It's inevitable. It's contagious~ Food fight? Enjoy some healthy debatein the Answers Food & Drink Q & A. -- Sally Spencer, Jyotish KovidA Gentle Journey to Deep Healing Ascension work, Vedic Astrology*,Western Astrology reports www.Devi3.byregion.netsally234 (AT) earthlink (DOT) net *Vedic Astrology, a co

creative sacred science,which determines, strengthens or propitiatesplanetary results. www.EnlightenedLiving/AscensionJoys http://health.ElectroMagneticHealth/EMF Products:http://www.mybiopro.com/Home.aspx?ID=SallySpencerWaves of LoveEntering the PlanetIt's inevitable. It's contagious~

Bored stiff? Loosen up...Download and play hundreds of games for free on Games.

[Guest guest]

Thank you John;))) That is one mouth full.

 

Voila indeed~

 

SallyOn 1/24/07, JohnTWB <blazingstar1776 wrote:

 

Hi Sally APOLOGIES. I should have

realized BEFORE sending it. A PERFECT SUCCESS IN COBBLING

TOGETHER A RUN-ON SENTENCE WHICH ADDED INSULT TO INJURY TO THE READER

BY TAKING THE STORY ALL OVER THE PLACE, ON THE MATTERS OF EVENT

DATES. VIRGINIA DATES Admitted, I should have radically re-phrased before sending. What a garble.! The

Relationship of the State of Virginia's two DECEMBER 15s

.. .. being 1777 . . . and 1791. BOTH are not unimportant dates,

each in its own right. I'm sure that in 1791 the members of the

Burgesses, well in advance, aimed their ratifying shot for December

15 [this " shot " being, the10th of 14 States to

ratify, and so, the " 10-of-14 " minimum threshhold was

achieved of the States' ratification of the Bill of

Rights, by Virginia's vote.] This " shot " brought the

voting process to a close on the 14th anniversary date

of Virginia's " ratification " of the Articles of Confederation.

Please observe here, that the " ratification " in the State

capital should not be confused with its subsequent " confirmation "

in Congress, along with seven other confirming States, on July 9, 1778,

in Philadelphia, between 12:00/13:00 hrs that day [25Virgo up to

7Libra]. That day in 1778, eight States' delegations of various sizes,

amounting to 35 delegates' signatures. It would require five

more such confirmation signing ceremonies in Congress, but each for

just a single State (8 + 5 =13), in order to finish the job, as

was achieved by Maryland's confirmation on March 1, 1781.

[Caution, MARYLAND: " Ratified " February 2, 1781; then after, on March

1, 1781, " Confirmed " (its earlier ratification). Historians more often

than note do not distinguish the two verbs. This accounts, in the

main, for the fact of the burial-without-grave-marker in American

history texts of this historic " February " date. See the proceedings of

Congress for February 16, 1776, in the Journals of Congress, for an

instance of the proper distinguishing usage.] MUHURTA, as adverted in my previous post, does not apply in comparing the two Virginia dates, 1777 to 1791.

The

cosmic connexity manifests by JULY 5, 1776 EARLY MORNING's

Moon " determining " DECEMBER 15, 1791 LATE MORNING's Ascendant, where,

narrowly speaking, both positions occupy the same sign and the

same degree, being Aquarius, in the 16th degree. This concept of

conception/birth manifesting in the respective charts of one

person is in origin Babylonian astrology/cosmology, and

" " may " " have become Vedic, as well. May be Vyas can help here. The same connexity between two events holds

for the birth of the United States in February 1781, following its conception event, in September 1776 [yesterday's post]. The

same connexity between two events holds for the birth of American

Independence, July 2, 1776 and the agreement to the TEXT of the U.S.

(second) constitution [not to be confused with the birth of

the constitution itself, by required ratification, in the

following year, 1788. ]. So please find that on July 2,

1776, Jorge's rectified time for enactment shows the Moon

7Cap23 (Asc 15Sc30); Now fast forward to 1787, where the constitution's

TEXT was " adopted " at around 3:30 p.m., on September 17, 1787

[approximately 3:30 p.m. as per the historical record. AstroDatabank's

11:29 a.m. chart was Grant & Kraum's in 1949,.and turns out to

be just failed guesswork on their

part.]. Then,

one finds for around 3:30 p.m., the Ascendant in the 8th degree of

Capricorn (and the Moon in the 16th degree of Scorpio). The repective

positions 1776 : : 1787, same sign & degree, where Luna to Asc : :

Asc to Luna. Q.E.D. . . . VOILA !!!!!! Cheers, JOHNSally Spencer <sally234 wrote:

the morning

of July 5, 1776 and [2] the ratifying moment of the Bill of Rights, by

the Virginia Assembly in the late morning of December 15, 1791 [exactly

14 years-to-the-day after Virginia ratified the Articles of

Confederation, on December 15, 1777. Virginia's of 1777 was the first;

Maryland's, on February 2, 1781, was the 13th and final.] For the

cosmic " connexity " of these two events, one finds the [1] Moon

15Aq11 of 1776 conjunct the [2] Ascendant of 1791. John,Yes, this connects..the Moon, the mind of Jefferson being played out that day.

Those

astrologers who assent to the principles of muhurta in this context (as

explained in an earlier post by Vyas), may appreciate the

significance of such a concurrence. By the

way, I also realized the July 5 chart earily depicts the US ' gains

from foreign occupation! Mars 10L on the 11mep in the

twelfth! Could you clarify these statements for me, I don't see the connection that well. Which dates fro example?

Declaration of Independence, as stated in a previous post, would be to explore the connection it shares to the

final ratification of the Bill of Rights. And for

February 2, 1781 I do consider the event of that day to signify, thanks

largely to Thor and concurring astrologers, the birth

event of the quote " United States " unquote. Thanks. Sally Waves of LoveEntering the PlanetIt's inevitable. It's contagious~