Guest guest Posted June 22, 2007 Report Share Posted June 22, 2007 Hi Group, It may be of interest to some of the list members who are applying SA to equity markets to use the recent listing of The BlackStone Group as an on going case study. As many of you will know the stock (BX) was listed on the NYSE on Friday 22nd of June 2007 in New York. The " listing " time is of some interest. The INITIAL trade was at $45.00 at 9:32:56am EDT on the electronic trading platform - THRD - for 2000 shares. The stock was then " opened " on the floor of the NYSE at 9:52:40am EDT at $36.45 on 17, 171, 700 shares. This data comes from the consolidated " Time & Sales " data from the NYSE. I am using the initial trade time of 9:32:56am as the actual commencement of trading. I would be interested in any group feedback on this point and the chart. Is anyone persuaded to use the NYSE time of 9:52:40am? If so, why? Clearly this is of some importance as the " 2nd time " gives a Leo Ascendant - the 1st time gives a Cancer Ascendant. So often we have problems with the exact timing of an event. At least with this case study we have some absolute times to work with and test the SA principles as applied to forecasting equity prices. Perhaps of further interest is the birth data on the managing partner of BlackStone - Mr Stephen Schwarzman -born Febuary 14th 1947 in the Eastern USA. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 23, 2007 Report Share Posted June 23, 2007 Dear Peter and list members,Thanks for sharing this information, Peter. It is very interesting for the fact that previously we have followed charts based on more limited information concerning the timing of the first market trade. We have used the following data:1. Company: Company name (ticker symbol): 2. Day of initial public offer (IPO) 3. HQ location: City where the company is headquartered (HQ). 4. Time: Local time at the HQ location equivalent to the time when NYSE opens up for business in NYC. The stock exchange has opened at 9:30 am in recent decades. This is the so-called opening bell. The NYSE opened at 10 am prior to September 1984, I think. With regard to 4. Time, you have brought more specific information on the actual timing of the first trade. Moreover, the information opens up the very interesting question of what actually constitutes the first trade. It seems the Initial trade is made to set an opening price (at $45.00), perhaps reflecting what the seller or stock exchange members think is the appropriate price. The second trade is then what the real market forces think ($36.45). The second price is clealy based on actual bidding on the stock exchange, where the seller decides to sell and a buyer agrees to buy at a given price. To me, this would be the actual market determined price. Hence, I would be in favour of using the latter time.In other words, I would think the latter time is the real time when the stock is actually trading on the exchange, but I could very well be wrong on this. 1. Blackstone Group (BX) 2. June 22, 20073. HQ location: New York city 4. Time: 9:52:40 am (EDT)Ascendant: 0° 10' Leo rising (chart attached as .gif file)Clearly, if the latter time is the correct time to use, this implies the actual market trade in the stock can be some time later than the opening bell. This would suggest there is more scope for error in earlier work based on the opening bell at 9:30 am. I´d be interested in other views on the actual timing to use.Finally, Peter, is it possible to get information about historical IPOs based on such accuracy of timing of trades?Best wishes,Thorght451 <ght451 wrote: Hi Group,It may be of interest to some of the list members who are applying SA to equity markets to use the recent listing of The BlackStone Group as an on going case study.As many of you will know the stock (BX) was listed on the NYSE on Friday 22nd of June 2007 in New York.The "listing" time is of some interest. The INITIAL trade was at $45.00 at 9:32:56am EDT on the electronic trading platform - THRD - for 2000 shares. The stock was then "opened" on the floor of the NYSE at 9:52:40am EDT at $36.45 on 17, 171, 700 shares. This data comes from the consolidated "Time & Sales" data from the NYSE.I am using the initial trade time of 9:32:56am as the actual commencement of trading. I would be interested in any group feedback on this point and the chart. Is anyone persuaded to use the NYSE time of 9:52:40am? If so, why? Clearly this is of some importance as the "2nd time" gives a Leo Ascendant - the 1st time gives a Cancer Ascendant. So often we have problems with the exact timing of an event. At least with this case study we have some absolute times to work with and test the SA principles as applied to forecasting equity prices.Perhaps of further interest is the birth data on the managing partner of BlackStone - Mr Stephen Schwarzman -born Febuary 14th 1947 in the Eastern USA.Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 23, 2007 Report Share Posted June 23, 2007 Dear Thor and list members, Thanks for your reply. It certainly is an interesting issue with regard to the "correct" time to use. The 1st time & trade of $45.00 was followed by 22 seperate transactions at prices heading towards the 2nd "opening" price of $36.45. The 1st price represents the 1st actual "free" market transaction in the stock. The 2nd trade of 36.45 is the NYSE specialist's opening of the stock. As you are no doubt aware NASDAQ & NYSE stocks are traded in slightly different ways. Trading in NYSE stocks is "managed"/"assisted" by a specialist who is charged with matching buy & sell orders in such a manner as to smooth out stock movements - in essence making sure there is a buyer or seller at a "reasonable" price if no other trader is willing to trade. Therefore the 2nd opening price of BX is the price arrived at by the specialist on the floor of the NYSE taking and matching all the orders he has - from both the buy & sell side of the market. He does this by actually standing on the floor and traders giving him their orders and also by "upstairs" traders entering there orders electronically to his order book. Once he can match all the orders at a certain price that trade is completed and hence trading moves from there. The initial price the specialist arrived at was $36.45 for the volume of 17, 171, 700 shares. All that being said, which price is the 1st one? The spontaneous price of $45.00 arrived at by free & independant traders having their orders matched in cyberspace or the managed opening price of the specialist. This situation doesn't occur in NASDAQ listed IPO's as all orders are matched by the computer trading platform. Clearly for a NASDAQ traded issue the $45.00 would be the 1st trade. I tend to feel that the earlier time of 20:32:56 at 45.00 is the best time to use but I am not sure. Clearly by running both charts we should be able to see, via our predictions, what ASC is correct. As Blackstone is currently in the eye of a very public TAX storm in the US Congress, we should have a number of "data points" to gauge. Just to clarrify, in the 22 seperate trades between the 1st trade of 21:32:56 and the specialist opening trade of 21:52:40, a total of aproximately 23,000 shares traded at prices ranging from $45.00 to $36.24. I will certainly be interested in your comments. It should be possible to get this "time & Sales" information on other IPO's from the various stock exchanges. Although it may take some digging to get old data I would imagine. I was interested to get the Blackstone data as it was the largest IPO in the US for the past 4-5 years and has almost become a "poster boy" for the current US bull market. The opportunity to have such accurate data for the chart was also encouraging. Rarely do we have absolute times noted to the second - as we do in this case. The only remaining question is which "exact" time to use? ALl the best, Peter. All New Mail – Tired of unwanted email come-ons? Let our SpamGuard protect you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 23, 2007 Report Share Posted June 23, 2007 Hi Thor and Peter, It may be a good idea to backtest this idea using the first trade data for Microsoft - the volume is apprecaible and a good amount of time has past since the first trade. Best regards, Vyas Munidas - " Cosmologer " <cosmologer <SAMVA > Saturday, June 23, 2007 4:28 AM Re: Case Study - The BlackStone Group Dear Peter and list members, Thanks for sharing this information, Peter. It is very interesting for the fact that previously we have followed charts based on more limited information concerning the timing of the first market trade. We have used the following data: 1. Company: Company name (ticker symbol): 2. Day of initial public offer (IPO) 3. HQ location: City where the company is headquartered (HQ). 4. Time: Local time at the HQ location equivalent to the time when NYSE opens up for business in NYC. The stock exchange has opened at 9:30 am in recent decades. This is the so-called opening bell. The NYSE opened at 10 am prior to September 1984, I think. With regard to 4. Time, you have brought more specific information on the actual timing of the first trade. Moreover, the information opens up the very interesting question of what actually constitutes the first trade. It seems the Initial trade is made to set an opening price (at $45.00), perhaps reflecting what the seller or stock exchange members think is the appropriate price. The second trade is then what the real market forces think ($36.45). The second price is clealy based on actual bidding on the stock exchange, where the seller decides to sell and a buyer agrees to buy at a given price. To me, this would be the actual market determined price. Hence, I would be in favour of using the latter time. In other words, I would think the latter time is the real time when the stock is actually trading on the exchange, but I could very well be wrong on this. 1. Blackstone Group (BX) 2. June 22, 2007 3. HQ location: New York city 4. Time: 9:52:40 am (EDT) Ascendant: 0° 10' Leo rising (chart attached as .gif file) Clearly, if the latter time is the correct time to use, this implies the actual market trade in the stock can be some time later than the opening bell. This would suggest there is more scope for error in earlier work based on the opening bell at 9:30 am. I´d be interested in other views on the actual timing to use. Finally, Peter, is it possible to get information about historical IPOs based on such accuracy of timing of trades? Best wishes, Thor ght451 <ght451 wrote: Hi Group, It may be of interest to some of the list members who are applying SA to equity markets to use the recent listing of The BlackStone Group as an on going case study. As many of you will know the stock (BX) was listed on the NYSE on Friday 22nd of June 2007 in New York. The " listing " time is of some interest. The INITIAL trade was at $45.00 at 9:32:56am EDT on the electronic trading platform - THRD - for 2000 shares. The stock was then " opened " on the floor of the NYSE at 9:52:40am EDT at $36.45 on 17, 171, 700 shares. This data comes from the consolidated " Time & Sales " data from the NYSE. I am using the initial trade time of 9:32:56am as the actual commencement of trading. I would be interested in any group feedback on this point and the chart. Is anyone persuaded to use the NYSE time of 9:52:40am? If so, why? Clearly this is of some importance as the " 2nd time " gives a Leo Ascendant - the 1st time gives a Cancer Ascendant. So often we have problems with the exact timing of an event. At least with this case study we have some absolute times to work with and test the SA principles as applied to forecasting equity prices. Perhaps of further interest is the birth data on the managing partner of BlackStone - Mr Stephen Schwarzman -born Febuary 14th 1947 in the Eastern USA. Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 23, 2007 Report Share Posted June 23, 2007 Dear Vyas, Peter and list,One chart that stands out is that of Apple Computer Company. It is based on the 09:30 am time in NYC, adjusted for San Jose. Even if we move the time back some minutes, it makes little difference for the overall strength. However, it would move the rising degree from 17° 03' to say 19° 09' if the first trade took place ten minutes after the open December 12, 1980. This would mean the important yoga of L2 Jupiter at 14° 00' Virgo H11 and L4 Saturn at 14° 58' Virgo would partially move out of MEP. This is not likely as during the Jupiter - Jupiter period, which began according to the 09:30 time on July 7, 2004, the share price began to rise. If we move the time to say 09:40 the period would begin around June 20 and Jupiter would no longer be in H11 MEP. What has happened with the share prices since the onset of this dasa and the Jupiter and then also Saturn bukhti is that the share price jumped. The company has introduced one hit after the other.There seems to be little let up in sight as the next bukhti is that of L11 Mercury at 16° 47' Scorpio H1 from March 2009. In short, the chart is working very well based on a time close to the opening bell. It is not likely that a chart beyond 09:40 would be so fitting. This supports Peters thesis that the first trade is the one to use, assuming this trade also took place shortly after the open back in late 1980.Best wishes,ThorVyas Munidas <muni> wrote: Hi Thor and Peter,It may be a good idea to backtest this idea using the first trade data for Microsoft - the volume is apprecaible and a good amount of time has past since the first trade.Best regards,Vyas Munidas- "Cosmologer" To: Saturday, June 23, 2007 4:28 AMRe: Case Study - The BlackStone GroupDear Peter and list members,Thanks for sharing this information, Peter. It is very interesting for the fact that previously we have followed charts based on more limited information concerning the timing of the first market trade.We have used the following data:1. Company: Company name (ticker symbol):2. Day of initial public offer (IPO)3. HQ location: City where the company is headquartered (HQ).4. Time: Local time at the HQ location equivalent to the time when NYSE opens up for business in NYC. The stock exchange has opened at 9:30 am in recent decades. This is the so-called opening bell. The NYSE opened at 10 am prior to September 1984, I think.With regard to 4. Time, you have brought more specific information on the actual timing of the first trade. Moreover, the information opens up the very interesting question of what actually constitutes the first trade. It seems the Initial trade is made to set an opening price (at $45.00), perhaps reflecting what the seller or stock exchange members think is the appropriate price. The second trade is then what the real market forces think ($36.45). The second price is clealy based on actual bidding on the stock exchange, where the seller decides to sell and a buyer agrees to buy at a given price. To me, this would be the actual market determined price. Hence, I would be in favour of using the latter time.In other words, I would think the latter time is the real time when the stock is actually trading on the exchange, but I could very well be wrong on this.1. Blackstone Group (BX) 2. June 22, 20073. HQ location: New York city 4. Time: 9:52:40 am (EDT)Ascendant: 0° 10' Leo rising (chart attached as .gif file)Clearly, if the latter time is the correct time to use, this implies the actual market trade in the stock can be some time later than the opening bell. This would suggest there is more scope for error in earlier work based on the opening bell at 9:30 am.I´d be interested in other views on the actual timing to use.Finally, Peter, is it possible to get information about historical IPOs based on such accuracy of timing of trades?Best wishes,Thorght451 wrote:Hi Group,It may be of interest to some of the list members who are applying SAto equity markets to use the recent listing of The BlackStone Group asan on going case study.As many of you will know the stock (BX) was listed on the NYSE onFriday 22nd of June 2007 in New York.The "listing" time is of some interest. The INITIAL trade was at$45.00 at 9:32:56am EDT on the electronic trading platform - THRD - for2000 shares. The stock was then "opened" on the floor of the NYSE at9:52:40am EDT at $36.45 on 17, 171, 700 shares. This data comes fromthe consolidated "Time & Sales" data from the NYSE.I am using the initial trade time of 9:32:56am as the actualcommencement of trading. I would be interested in any group feedbackon this point and the chart. Is anyone persuaded to use the NYSE timeof 9:52:40am? If so, why? Clearly this is of some importance asthe "2nd time" gives a Leo Ascendant - the 1st time gives a CancerAscendant. So often we have problems with the exact timing of anevent. At least with this case study we have some absolute times towork with and test the SA principles as applied to forecasting equityprices.Perhaps of further interest is the birth data on the managing partnerof BlackStone - Mr Stephen Schwarzman -born Febuary 14th 1947 in theEastern USA.Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 23, 2007 Report Share Posted June 23, 2007 PS here is the share price chart for AAPL and the link to the data.http://finance./q/hp?s=AAPL & a=00 & b=1 & c=1999 & d=07 & e=2 & f=2007 & g=dCosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Dear Vyas, Peter and list,One chart that stands out is that of Apple Computer Company. It is based on the 09:30 am time in NYC, adjusted for San Jose. Even if we move the time back some minutes, it makes little difference for the overall strength. However, it would move the rising degree from 17° 03' to say 19° 09' if the first trade took place ten minutes after the open December 12, 1980. This would mean the important yoga of L2 Jupiter at 14° 00' Virgo H11 and L4 Saturn at 14° 58' Virgo would partially move out of MEP. This is not likely as during the Jupiter - Jupiter period, which began according to the 09:30 time on July 7, 2004, the share price began to rise. If we move the time to say 09:40 the period would begin around June 20 and Jupiter would no longer be in H11 MEP. What has happened with the share prices since the onset of this dasa and the Jupiter and then also Saturn bukhti is that the share price jumped. The company has introduced one hit after the other.There seems to be little let up in sight as the next bukhti is that of L11 Mercury at 16° 47' Scorpio H1 from March 2009. In short, the chart is working very well based on a time close to the opening bell. It is not likely that a chart beyond 09:40 would be so fitting. This supports Peters thesis that the first trade is the one to use, assuming this trade also took place shortly after the open back in late 1980.Best wishes,ThorVyas Munidas <muni> wrote: Hi Thor and Peter,It may be a good idea to backtest this idea using the first trade data for Microsoft - the volume is apprecaible and a good amount of time has past since the first trade.Best regards,Vyas Munidas- "Cosmologer" Saturday, June 23, 2007 4:28 AMRe: Case Study - The BlackStone GroupDear Peter and list members,Thanks for sharing this information, Peter. It is very interesting for the fact that previously we have followed charts based on more limited information concerning the timing of the first market trade.We have used the following data:1. Company: Company name (ticker symbol):2. Day of initial public offer (IPO)3. HQ location: City where the company is headquartered (HQ).4. Time: Local time at the HQ location equivalent to the time when NYSE opens up for business in NYC. The stock exchange has opened at 9:30 am in recent decades. This is the so-called opening bell. The NYSE opened at 10 am prior to September 1984, I think.With regard to 4. Time, you have brought more specific information on the actual timing of the first trade. Moreover, the information opens up the very interesting question of what actually constitutes the first trade. It seems the Initial trade is made to set an opening price (at $45.00), perhaps reflecting what the seller or stock exchange members think is the appropriate price. The second trade is then what the real market forces think ($36.45). The second price is clealy based on actual bidding on the stock exchange, where the seller decides to sell and a buyer agrees to buy at a given price. To me, this would be the actual market determined price. Hence, I would be in favour of using the latter time.In other words, I would think the latter time is the real time when the stock is actually trading on the exchange, but I could very well be wrong on this.1. Blackstone Group (BX) 2. June 22, 20073. HQ location: New York city 4. Time: 9:52:40 am (EDT)Ascendant: 0° 10' Leo rising (chart attached as .gif file)Clearly, if the latter time is the correct time to use, this implies the actual market trade in the stock can be some time later than the opening bell. This would suggest there is more scope for error in earlier work based on the opening bell at 9:30 am.I´d be interested in other views on the actual timing to use.Finally, Peter, is it possible to get information about historical IPOs based on such accuracy of timing of trades?Best wishes,Thorght451 wrote:Hi Group,It may be of interest to some of the list members who are applying SAto equity markets to use the recent listing of The BlackStone Group asan on going case study.As many of you will know the stock (BX) was listed on the NYSE onFriday 22nd of June 2007 in New York.The "listing" time is of some interest. The INITIAL trade was at$45.00 at 9:32:56am EDT on the electronic trading platform - THRD - for2000 shares. The stock was then "opened" on the floor of the NYSE at9:52:40am EDT at $36.45 on 17, 171, 700 shares. This data comes fromthe consolidated "Time & Sales" data from the NYSE.I am using the initial trade time of 9:32:56am as the actualcommencement of trading. I would be interested in any group feedbackon this point and the chart. Is anyone persuaded to use the NYSE timeof 9:52:40am? If so, why? Clearly this is of some importance asthe "2nd time" gives a Leo Ascendant - the 1st time gives a CancerAscendant. So often we have problems with the exact timing of anevent. At least with this case study we have some absolute times towork with and test the SA principles as applied to forecasting equityprices.Perhaps of further interest is the birth data on the managing partnerof BlackStone - Mr Stephen Schwarzman -born Febuary 14th 1947 in theEastern USA.Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 2007 Report Share Posted June 25, 2007 Dear financial astrologers:For Apple Computer, I have been using chart based on Dec 12, 1980, 11:30AM, EST, New York. This is because most of the stocks open on NASDAQ around 11AM, not 9:30AM. It puts two FB's on 8th MEP, explaining substancial rise in Jup/Jup and Jup/Sat period. This chart also expalins why the stock was underperformer in the 18 years of Rahu period.I do not understand why would you adjust for San Jose time. I would appreciate if you substantiate your reasons with examples.ThanksRajCosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Dear Vyas, Peter and list,One chart that stands out is that of Apple Computer Company. It is based on the 09:30 am time in NYC, adjusted for San Jose. Even if we move the time back some minutes, it makes little difference for the overall strength. However, it would move the rising degree from 17° 03' to say 19° 09' if the first trade took place ten minutes after the open December 12, 1980. This would mean the important yoga of L2 Jupiter at 14° 00' Virgo H11 and L4 Saturn at 14° 58' Virgo would partially move out of MEP. This is not likely as during the Jupiter - Jupiter period, which began according to the 09:30 time on July 7, 2004, the share price began to rise. If we move the time to say 09:40 the period would begin around June 20 and Jupiter would no longer be in H11 MEP. What has happened with the share prices since the onset of this dasa and the Jupiter and then also Saturn bukhti is that the share price jumped. The company has introduced one hit after the other.There seems to be little let up in sight as the next bukhti is that of L11 Mercury at 16° 47' Scorpio H1 from March 2009. In short, the chart is working very well based on a time close to the opening bell. It is not likely that a chart beyond 09:40 would be so fitting. This supports Peters thesis that the first trade is the one to use, assuming this trade also took place shortly after the open back in late 1980.Best wishes,ThorVyas Munidas <munidas (AT) rogers (DOT) com> wrote: Hi Thor and Peter,It may be a good idea to backtest this idea using the first trade data for Microsoft - the volume is apprecaible and a good amount of time has past since the first trade.Best regards,Vyas Munidas- "Cosmologer" Saturday, June 23, 2007 4:28 AMRe: Case Study - The BlackStone GroupDear Peter and list members,Thanks for sharing this information, Peter. It is very interesting for the fact that previously we have followed charts based on more limited information concerning the timing of the first market trade.We have used the following data:1. Company: Company name (ticker symbol):2. Day of initial public offer (IPO)3. HQ location: City where the company is headquartered (HQ).4. Time: Local time at the HQ location equivalent to the time when NYSE opens up for business in NYC. The stock exchange has opened at 9:30 am in recent decades. This is the so-called opening bell. The NYSE opened at 10 am prior to September 1984, I think.With regard to 4. Time, you have brought more specific information on the actual timing of the first trade. Moreover, the information opens up the very interesting question of what actually constitutes the first trade. It seems the Initial trade is made to set an opening price (at $45.00), perhaps reflecting what the seller or stock exchange members think is the appropriate price. The second trade is then what the real market forces think ($36.45). The second price is clealy based on actual bidding on the stock exchange, where the seller decides to sell and a buyer agrees to buy at a given price. To me, this would be the actual market determined price. Hence, I would be in favour of using the latter time.In other words, I would think the latter time is the real time when the stock is actually trading on the exchange, but I could very well be wrong on this.1. Blackstone Group (BX) 2. June 22, 20073. HQ location: New York city 4. Time: 9:52:40 am (EDT)Ascendant: 0° 10' Leo rising (chart attached as .gif file)Clearly, if the latter time is the correct time to use, this implies the actual market trade in the stock can be some time later than the opening bell. This would suggest there is more scope for error in earlier work based on the opening bell at 9:30 am.I´d be interested in other views on the actual timing to use.Finally, Peter, is it possible to get information about historical IPOs based on such accuracy of timing of trades?Best wishes,Thorght451 wrote:Hi Group,It may be of interest to some of the list members who are applying SAto equity markets to use the recent listing of The BlackStone Group asan on going case study.As many of you will know the stock (BX) was listed on the NYSE onFriday 22nd of June 2007 in New York.The "listing" time is of some interest. The INITIAL trade was at$45.00 at 9:32:56am EDT on the electronic trading platform - THRD - for2000 shares. The stock was then "opened" on the floor of the NYSE at9:52:40am EDT at $36.45 on 17, 171, 700 shares. This data comes fromthe consolidated "Time & Sales" data from the NYSE.I am using the initial trade time of 9:32:56am as the actualcommencement of trading. I would be interested in any group feedbackon this point and the chart. Is anyone persuaded to use the NYSE timeof 9:52:40am? If so, why? Clearly this is of some importance asthe "2nd time" gives a Leo Ascendant - the 1st time gives a CancerAscendant. So often we have problems with the exact timing of anevent. At least with this case study we have some absolute times towork with and test the SA principles as applied to forecasting equityprices.Perhaps of further interest is the birth data on the managing partnerof BlackStone - Mr Stephen Schwarzman -born Febuary 14th 1947 in theEastern USA.Peter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 2007 Report Share Posted June 25, 2007 Hello Raj, As per , the following scheme is used: Event is first trade at IPO Place: New York, NY mm/dd/yy Local time: 09:30 Chart is based on same moment but at headquarters location (deg W min, deg N min), mm/dd/yy, making adjustment for local time: 09:30 - time zone difference (if different from EST). What is the source of your information that the Nasdaq market has opened later than NYSE? The 17° Scorpio rising chart for Apple Co. allowed me to correctly predict a rise in the share price from July 2004. Best wishes, Thor SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech wrote: > > Dear financial astrologers: > > For Apple Computer, I have been using chart based on Dec 12, 1980, 11:30AM, EST, New York. This is because most of the stocks open on NASDAQ around 11AM, not 9:30AM. It puts two FB's on 8th MEP, explaining substancial rise in Jup/Jup and Jup/Sat period. This chart also expalins why the stock was underperformer in the 18 years of Rahu period. > > I do not understand why would you adjust for San Jose time. I would appreciate if you substantiate your reasons with examples. > > Thanks > > Raj > > Cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Dear Vyas, Peter and list, > > One chart that stands out is that of Apple Computer Company. It is based on the 09:30 am time in NYC, adjusted for San Jose. Even if we move the time back some minutes, it makes little difference for the overall strength. However, it would move the rising degree from 17° 03' to say 19° 09' if the first trade took place ten minutes after the open December 12, 1980. This would mean the important yoga of L2 Jupiter at 14° 00' Virgo H11 and L4 Saturn at 14° 58' Virgo would partially move out of MEP. This is not likely as during the Jupiter - Jupiter period, which began according to the 09:30 time on July 7, 2004, the share price began to rise. If we move the time to say 09:40 the period would begin around June 20 and Jupiter would no longer be in H11 MEP. What has happened with the share prices since the onset of this dasa and the Jupiter and then also Saturn bukhti is that the share price jumped. The company has introduced one hit after the other. > There seems to be little let up in sight as the next bukhti is that of L11 Mercury at 16° 47' Scorpio H1 from March 2009. In short, the chart is working very well based on a time close to the opening bell. It is not likely that a chart beyond 09:40 would be so fitting. This supports Peters thesis that the first trade is the one to use, assuming this trade also took place shortly after the open back in late 1980. > > Best wishes, > > Thor > > Vyas Munidas <muni> wrote: > Hi Thor and Peter, > > It may be a good idea to backtest this idea using the first trade data for > Microsoft - the volume is apprecaible and a good amount of time has past > since the first trade. > > > Best regards, > > Vyas Munidas > > > - > " Cosmologer " > To: > Saturday, June 23, 2007 4:28 AM > Re: Case Study - The BlackStone Group > > > Dear Peter and list members, > > Thanks for sharing this information, Peter. It is very interesting for the > fact that previously we have followed charts based on more limited > information concerning the timing of the first market trade. > > We have used the following data: > 1. Company: Company name (ticker symbol): > 2. Day of initial public offer (IPO) > 3. HQ location: City where the company is headquartered (HQ). > 4. Time: Local time at the HQ location equivalent to the time when NYSE > opens up for business in NYC. The stock exchange has opened at 9:30 am in > recent decades. This is the so-called opening bell. The NYSE opened at 10 am > prior to September 1984, I think. > > With regard to 4. Time, you have brought more specific information on the > actual timing of the first trade. Moreover, the information opens up the > very interesting question of what actually constitutes the first trade. It > seems the Initial trade is made to set an opening price (at $45.00), perhaps > reflecting what the seller or stock exchange members think is the > appropriate price. The second trade is then what the real market forces > think ($36.45). The second price is clealy based on actual bidding on the > stock exchange, where the seller decides to sell and a buyer agrees to buy > at a given price. To me, this would be the actual market determined price. > Hence, I would be in favour of using the latter time. > > In other words, I would think the latter time is the real time when the > stock is actually trading on the exchange, but I could very well be wrong on > this. > > 1. Blackstone Group (BX) > 2. June 22, 2007 > 3. HQ location: New York city > 4. Time: 9:52:40 am (EDT) > Ascendant: 0° 10' Leo rising (chart attached as .gif file) > > Clearly, if the latter time is the correct time to use, this implies the > actual market trade in the stock can be some time later than the opening > bell. This would suggest there is more scope for error in earlier work based > on the opening bell at 9:30 am. > > I´d be interested in other views on the actual timing to use. > > Finally, Peter, is it possible to get information about historical IPOs > based on such accuracy of timing of trades? > > Best wishes, > > Thor > > ght451 wrote: > Hi Group, > > It may be of interest to some of the list members who are applying SA > to equity markets to use the recent listing of The BlackStone Group as > an on going case study. > > As many of you will know the stock (BX) was listed on the NYSE on > Friday 22nd of June 2007 in New York. > > The " listing " time is of some interest. The INITIAL trade was at > $45.00 at 9:32:56am EDT on the electronic trading platform - THRD - for > 2000 shares. The stock was then " opened " on the floor of the NYSE at > 9:52:40am EDT at $36.45 on 17, 171, 700 shares. This data comes from > the consolidated " Time & Sales " data from the NYSE. > > I am using the initial trade time of 9:32:56am as the actual > commencement of trading. I would be interested in any group feedback > on this point and the chart. Is anyone persuaded to use the NYSE time > of 9:52:40am? If so, why? Clearly this is of some importance as > the " 2nd time " gives a Leo Ascendant - the 1st time gives a Cancer > Ascendant. So often we have problems with the exact timing of an > event. At least with this case study we have some absolute times to > work with and test the SA principles as applied to forecasting equity > prices. > > Perhaps of further interest is the birth data on the managing partner > of BlackStone - Mr Stephen Schwarzman -born Febuary 14th 1947 in the > Eastern USA. > > > Peter > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 2007 Report Share Posted June 25, 2007 Thor:I could not find any justification to make an adjustment for headquarter location.NYSE and NASDAQ open at the same time. But it is the first trade time that you need, not market open time. There may be 4 IPO's on one day. If you use market open time, they all will have the same chart.Apple's advance can be predicted from my chart also.Rajcosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Hello Raj, As per , the following scheme is used: Event is first trade at IPO Place: New York, NY mm/dd/yy Local time: 09:30 Chart is based on same moment but at headquarters location (deg W min, deg N min), mm/dd/yy, making adjustment for local time: 09:30 - time zone difference (if different from EST). What is the source of your information that the Nasdaq market has opened later than NYSE? The 17° Scorpio rising chart for Apple Co. allowed me to correctly predict a rise in the share price from July 2004. Best wishes, Thor SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech wrote: > > Dear financial astrologers: > > For Apple Computer, I have been using chart based on Dec 12, 1980, 11:30AM, EST, New York. This is because most of the stocks open on NASDAQ around 11AM, not 9:30AM. It puts two FB's on 8th MEP, explaining substancial rise in Jup/Jup and Jup/Sat period. This chart also expalins why the stock was underperformer in the 18 years of Rahu period. > > I do not understand why would you adjust for San Jose time. I would appreciate if you substantiate your reasons with examples. > > Thanks > > Raj > > Cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Dear Vyas, Peter and list, > > One chart that stands out is that of Apple Computer Company. It is based on the 09:30 am time in NYC, adjusted for San Jose. Even if we move the time back some minutes, it makes little difference for the overall strength. However, it would move the rising degree from 17° 03' to say 19° 09' if the first trade took place ten minutes after the open December 12, 1980. This would mean the important yoga of L2 Jupiter at 14° 00' Virgo H11 and L4 Saturn at 14° 58' Virgo would partially move out of MEP. This is not likely as during the Jupiter - Jupiter period, which began according to the 09:30 time on July 7, 2004, the share price began to rise. If we move the time to say 09:40 the period would begin around June 20 and Jupiter would no longer be in H11 MEP. What has happened with the share prices since the onset of this dasa and the Jupiter and then also Saturn bukhti is that the share price jumped. The company has introduced one hit after the other. > There seems to be little let up in sight as the next bukhti is that of L11 Mercury at 16° 47' Scorpio H1 from March 2009. In short, the chart is working very well based on a time close to the opening bell. It is not likely that a chart beyond 09:40 would be so fitting. This supports Peters thesis that the first trade is the one to use, assuming this trade also took place shortly after the open back in late 1980. > > Best wishes, > > Thor > > Vyas Munidas <muni> wrote: > Hi Thor and Peter, > > It may be a good idea to backtest this idea using the first trade data for > Microsoft - the volume is apprecaible and a good amount of time has past > since the first trade. > > > Best regards, > > Vyas Munidas > > > - > "Cosmologer" > > Saturday, June 23, 2007 4:28 AM > Re: Case Study - The BlackStone Group > > > Dear Peter and list members, > > Thanks for sharing this information, Peter. It is very interesting for the > fact that previously we have followed charts based on more limited > information concerning the timing of the first market trade. > > We have used the following data: > 1. Company: Company name (ticker symbol): > 2. Day of initial public offer (IPO) > 3. HQ location: City where the company is headquartered (HQ). > 4. Time: Local time at the HQ location equivalent to the time when NYSE > opens up for business in NYC. The stock exchange has opened at 9:30 am in > recent decades. This is the so-called opening bell. The NYSE opened at 10 am > prior to September 1984, I think. > > With regard to 4. Time, you have brought more specific information on the > actual timing of the first trade. Moreover, the information opens up the > very interesting question of what actually constitutes the first trade. It > seems the Initial trade is made to set an opening price (at $45.00), perhaps > reflecting what the seller or stock exchange members think is the > appropriate price. The second trade is then what the real market forces > think ($36.45). The second price is clealy based on actual bidding on the > stock exchange, where the seller decides to sell and a buyer agrees to buy > at a given price. To me, this would be the actual market determined price. > Hence, I would be in favour of using the latter time. > > In other words, I would think the latter time is the real time when the > stock is actually trading on the exchange, but I could very well be wrong on > this. > > 1. Blackstone Group (BX) > 2. June 22, 2007 > 3. HQ location: New York city > 4. Time: 9:52:40 am (EDT) > Ascendant: 0° 10' Leo rising (chart attached as .gif file) > > Clearly, if the latter time is the correct time to use, this implies the > actual market trade in the stock can be some time later than the opening > bell. This would suggest there is more scope for error in earlier work based > on the opening bell at 9:30 am. > > I´d be interested in other views on the actual timing to use. > > Finally, Peter, is it possible to get information about historical IPOs > based on such accuracy of timing of trades? > > Best wishes, > > Thor > > ght451 wrote: > Hi Group, > > It may be of interest to some of the list members who are applying SA > to equity markets to use the recent listing of The BlackStone Group as > an on going case study. > > As many of you will know the stock (BX) was listed on the NYSE on > Friday 22nd of June 2007 in New York. > > The "listing" time is of some interest. The INITIAL trade was at > $45.00 at 9:32:56am EDT on the electronic trading platform - THRD - for > 2000 shares. The stock was then "opened" on the floor of the NYSE at > 9:52:40am EDT at $36.45 on 17, 171, 700 shares. This data comes from > the consolidated "Time & Sales" data from the NYSE. > > I am using the initial trade time of 9:32:56am as the actual > commencement of trading. I would be interested in any group feedback > on this point and the chart. Is anyone persuaded to use the NYSE time > of 9:52:40am? If so, why? Clearly this is of some importance as > the "2nd time" gives a Leo Ascendant - the 1st time gives a Cancer > Ascendant. So often we have problems with the exact timing of an > event. At least with this case study we have some absolute times to > work with and test the SA principles as applied to forecasting equity > prices. > > Perhaps of further interest is the birth data on the managing partner > of BlackStone - Mr Stephen Schwarzman -born Febuary 14th 1947 in the > Eastern USA. > > > Peter > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 2007 Report Share Posted June 25, 2007 Hello Raj, Thanks for confirming the Nasdaq stock exchange has the same opening time as the NYSES. The matter of which location to use is settled by the insight of . He thinks that the very same moment the trade is made in NY is relevant at the location of the company. We presume it is a fairly standard practice for the IPO to be offered for trade at the open, even if multiple IPOs occur in the same day. With detailed records it is possible to identify exactly the time of first trade in any given stock. The incidence of first trade has with the example of the Blackstone Group been shown by Peter to occur close to the open. I expect this would be the case for most IPOs, however, more research is needed to establish this point beyond doubt. Best wishes, Thor SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech wrote: > > Thor: > > I could not find any justification to make an adjustment for headquarter location. > > NYSE and NASDAQ open at the same time. But it is the first trade time that you need, not market open time. There may be 4 IPO's on one day. If you use market open time, they all will have the same chart. > > Apple's advance can be predicted from my chart also. > > Raj > > cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Hello Raj, > > As per , the following scheme is used: > > Event is first trade at IPO > Place: New York, NY > mm/dd/yy > Local time: 09:30 > > Chart is based on same moment but at headquarters location (deg W min, > deg N min), mm/dd/yy, making adjustment for local time: 09:30 - > time zone difference (if different from EST). > > What is the source of your information that the Nasdaq market has > opened later than NYSE? > > The 17° Scorpio rising chart for Apple Co. allowed me to correctly > predict a rise in the share price from July 2004. > > Best wishes, > > Thor > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech@> wrote: > > > > Dear financial astrologers: > > > > For Apple Computer, I have been using chart based on Dec 12, 1980, > 11:30AM, EST, New York. This is because most of the stocks open on > NASDAQ around 11AM, not 9:30AM. It puts two FB's on 8th MEP, > explaining substancial rise in Jup/Jup and Jup/Sat period. This chart > also expalins why the stock was underperformer in the 18 years of Rahu > period. > > > > I do not understand why would you adjust for San Jose time. I would > appreciate if you substantiate your reasons with examples. > > > > Thanks > > > > Raj > > > > Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote: > Dear Vyas, Peter and list, > > > > One chart that stands out is that of Apple Computer Company. It is > based on the 09:30 am time in NYC, adjusted for San Jose. Even if we > move the time back some minutes, it makes little difference for the > overall strength. However, it would move the rising degree from 17° > 03' to say 19° 09' if the first trade took place ten minutes after the > open December 12, 1980. This would mean the important yoga of L2 > Jupiter at 14° 00' Virgo H11 and L4 Saturn at 14° 58' Virgo would > partially move out of MEP. This is not likely as during the Jupiter - > Jupiter period, which began according to the 09:30 time on July 7, > 2004, the share price began to rise. If we move the time to say 09:40 > the period would begin around June 20 and Jupiter would no longer be > in H11 MEP. What has happened with the share prices since the onset of > this dasa and the Jupiter and then also Saturn bukhti is that the > share price jumped. The company has introduced one hit after the other. > > There seems to be little let up in sight as the next bukhti is that > of L11 Mercury at 16° 47' Scorpio H1 from March 2009. In short, the > chart is working very well based on a time close to the opening bell. > It is not likely that a chart beyond 09:40 would be so fitting. This > supports Peters thesis that the first trade is the one to use, > assuming this trade also took place shortly after the open back in > late 1980. > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Thor > > > > Vyas Munidas <munidas@> wrote: > > Hi Thor and Peter, > > > > It may be a good idea to backtest this idea using the first trade > data for > > Microsoft - the volume is apprecaible and a good amount of time has > past > > since the first trade. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > Vyas Munidas > > > > > > - > > " Cosmologer " > > To: > > Saturday, June 23, 2007 4:28 AM > > Re: Case Study - The BlackStone Group > > > > > > Dear Peter and list members, > > > > Thanks for sharing this information, Peter. It is very interesting > for the > > fact that previously we have followed charts based on more limited > > information concerning the timing of the first market trade. > > > > We have used the following data: > > 1. Company: Company name (ticker symbol): > > 2. Day of initial public offer (IPO) > > 3. HQ location: City where the company is headquartered (HQ). > > 4. Time: Local time at the HQ location equivalent to the time when NYSE > > opens up for business in NYC. The stock exchange has opened at 9:30 > am in > > recent decades. This is the so-called opening bell. The NYSE opened > at 10 am > > prior to September 1984, I think. > > > > With regard to 4. Time, you have brought more specific information > on the > > actual timing of the first trade. Moreover, the information opens > up the > > very interesting question of what actually constitutes the first > trade. It > > seems the Initial trade is made to set an opening price (at $45.00), > perhaps > > reflecting what the seller or stock exchange members think is the > > appropriate price. The second trade is then what the real market forces > > think ($36.45). The second price is clealy based on actual bidding > on the > > stock exchange, where the seller decides to sell and a buyer agrees > to buy > > at a given price. To me, this would be the actual market determined > price. > > Hence, I would be in favour of using the latter time. > > > > In other words, I would think the latter time is the real time when the > > stock is actually trading on the exchange, but I could very well be > wrong on > > this. > > > > 1. Blackstone Group (BX) > > 2. June 22, 2007 > > 3. HQ location: New York city > > 4. Time: 9:52:40 am (EDT) > > Ascendant: 0° 10' Leo rising (chart attached as .gif file) > > > > Clearly, if the latter time is the correct time to use, this implies > the > > actual market trade in the stock can be some time later than the > opening > > bell. This would suggest there is more scope for error in earlier > work based > > on the opening bell at 9:30 am. > > > > I´d be interested in other views on the actual timing to use. > > > > Finally, Peter, is it possible to get information about historical IPOs > > based on such accuracy of timing of trades? > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Thor > > > > ght451 wrote: > > Hi Group, > > > > It may be of interest to some of the list members who are applying SA > > to equity markets to use the recent listing of The BlackStone Group as > > an on going case study. > > > > As many of you will know the stock (BX) was listed on the NYSE on > > Friday 22nd of June 2007 in New York. > > > > The " listing " time is of some interest. The INITIAL trade was at > > $45.00 at 9:32:56am EDT on the electronic trading platform - THRD - for > > 2000 shares. The stock was then " opened " on the floor of the NYSE at > > 9:52:40am EDT at $36.45 on 17, 171, 700 shares. This data comes from > > the consolidated " Time & Sales " data from the NYSE. > > > > I am using the initial trade time of 9:32:56am as the actual > > commencement of trading. I would be interested in any group feedback > > on this point and the chart. Is anyone persuaded to use the NYSE time > > of 9:52:40am? If so, why? Clearly this is of some importance as > > the " 2nd time " gives a Leo Ascendant - the 1st time gives a Cancer > > Ascendant. So often we have problems with the exact timing of an > > event. At least with this case study we have some absolute times to > > work with and test the SA principles as applied to forecasting equity > > prices. > > > > Perhaps of further interest is the birth data on the managing partner > > of BlackStone - Mr Stephen Schwarzman -born Febuary 14th 1947 in the > > Eastern USA. > > > > > > Peter > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 2007 Report Share Posted June 25, 2007 Thor:I will compare some charts for the location of NY and headquarter myself before accepting 's insight. However you are definitely not right when you say most stock open near the openeing of stock exchange. GOOG, for example opened at noon, EBAY at 12:20 pm. Rajcosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Hello Raj, Thanks for confirming the Nasdaq stock exchange has the same opening time as the NYSES. The matter of which location to use is settled by the insight of . He thinks that the very same moment the trade is made in NY is relevant at the location of the company. We presume it is a fairly standard practice for the IPO to be offered for trade at the open, even if multiple IPOs occur in the same day. With detailed records it is possible to identify exactly the time of first trade in any given stock. The incidence of first trade has with the example of the Blackstone Group been shown by Peter to occur close to the open. I expect this would be the case for most IPOs, however, more research is needed to establish this point beyond doubt. Best wishes, Thor SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech wrote: > > Thor: > > I could not find any justification to make an adjustment for headquarter location. > > NYSE and NASDAQ open at the same time. But it is the first trade time that you need, not market open time. There may be 4 IPO's on one day. If you use market open time, they all will have the same chart. > > Apple's advance can be predicted from my chart also. > > Raj > > cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Hello Raj, > > As per , the following scheme is used: > > Event is first trade at IPO > Place: New York, NY > mm/dd/yy > Local time: 09:30 > > Chart is based on same moment but at headquarters location (deg W min, > deg N min), mm/dd/yy, making adjustment for local time: 09:30 - > time zone difference (if different from EST). > > What is the source of your information that the Nasdaq market has > opened later than NYSE? > > The 17° Scorpio rising chart for Apple Co. allowed me to correctly > predict a rise in the share price from July 2004. > > Best wishes, > > Thor > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech@> wrote: > > > > Dear financial astrologers: > > > > For Apple Computer, I have been using chart based on Dec 12, 1980, > 11:30AM, EST, New York. This is because most of the stocks open on > NASDAQ around 11AM, not 9:30AM. It puts two FB's on 8th MEP, > explaining substancial rise in Jup/Jup and Jup/Sat period. This chart > also expalins why the stock was underperformer in the 18 years of Rahu > period. > > > > I do not understand why would you adjust for San Jose time. I would > appreciate if you substantiate your reasons with examples. > > > > Thanks > > > > Raj > > > > Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote: > Dear Vyas, Peter and list, > > > > One chart that stands out is that of Apple Computer Company. It is > based on the 09:30 am time in NYC, adjusted for San Jose. Even if we > move the time back some minutes, it makes little difference for the > overall strength. However, it would move the rising degree from 17° > 03' to say 19° 09' if the first trade took place ten minutes after the > open December 12, 1980. This would mean the important yoga of L2 > Jupiter at 14° 00' Virgo H11 and L4 Saturn at 14° 58' Virgo would > partially move out of MEP. This is not likely as during the Jupiter - > Jupiter period, which began according to the 09:30 time on July 7, > 2004, the share price began to rise. If we move the time to say 09:40 > the period would begin around June 20 and Jupiter would no longer be > in H11 MEP. What has happened with the share prices since the onset of > this dasa and the Jupiter and then also Saturn bukhti is that the > share price jumped. The company has introduced one hit after the other. > > There seems to be little let up in sight as the next bukhti is that > of L11 Mercury at 16° 47' Scorpio H1 from March 2009. In short, the > chart is working very well based on a time close to the opening bell. > It is not likely that a chart beyond 09:40 would be so fitting. This > supports Peters thesis that the first trade is the one to use, > assuming this trade also took place shortly after the open back in > late 1980. > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Thor > > > > Vyas Munidas <munidas@> wrote: > > Hi Thor and Peter, > > > > It may be a good idea to backtest this idea using the first trade > data for > > Microsoft - the volume is apprecaible and a good amount of time has > past > > since the first trade. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > Vyas Munidas > > > > > > - > > "Cosmologer" > > > > Saturday, June 23, 2007 4:28 AM > > Re: Case Study - The BlackStone Group > > > > > > Dear Peter and list members, > > > > Thanks for sharing this information, Peter. It is very interesting > for the > > fact that previously we have followed charts based on more limited > > information concerning the timing of the first market trade. > > > > We have used the following data: > > 1. Company: Company name (ticker symbol): > > 2. Day of initial public offer (IPO) > > 3. HQ location: City where the company is headquartered (HQ). > > 4. Time: Local time at the HQ location equivalent to the time when NYSE > > opens up for business in NYC. The stock exchange has opened at 9:30 > am in > > recent decades. This is the so-called opening bell. The NYSE opened > at 10 am > > prior to September 1984, I think. > > > > With regard to 4. Time, you have brought more specific information > on the > > actual timing of the first trade. Moreover, the information opens > up the > > very interesting question of what actually constitutes the first > trade. It > > seems the Initial trade is made to set an opening price (at $45.00), > perhaps > > reflecting what the seller or stock exchange members think is the > > appropriate price. The second trade is then what the real market forces > > think ($36.45). The second price is clealy based on actual bidding > on the > > stock exchange, where the seller decides to sell and a buyer agrees > to buy > > at a given price. To me, this would be the actual market determined > price. > > Hence, I would be in favour of using the latter time. > > > > In other words, I would think the latter time is the real time when the > > stock is actually trading on the exchange, but I could very well be > wrong on > > this. > > > > 1. Blackstone Group (BX) > > 2. June 22, 2007 > > 3. HQ location: New York city > > 4. Time: 9:52:40 am (EDT) > > Ascendant: 0° 10' Leo rising (chart attached as .gif file) > > > > Clearly, if the latter time is the correct time to use, this implies > the > > actual market trade in the stock can be some time later than the > opening > > bell. This would suggest there is more scope for error in earlier > work based > > on the opening bell at 9:30 am. > > > > I´d be interested in other views on the actual timing to use. > > > > Finally, Peter, is it possible to get information about historical IPOs > > based on such accuracy of timing of trades? > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Thor > > > > ght451 wrote: > > Hi Group, > > > > It may be of interest to some of the list members who are applying SA > > to equity markets to use the recent listing of The BlackStone Group as > > an on going case study. > > > > As many of you will know the stock (BX) was listed on the NYSE on > > Friday 22nd of June 2007 in New York. > > > > The "listing" time is of some interest. The INITIAL trade was at > > $45.00 at 9:32:56am EDT on the electronic trading platform - THRD - for > > 2000 shares. The stock was then "opened" on the floor of the NYSE at > > 9:52:40am EDT at $36.45 on 17, 171, 700 shares. This data comes from > > the consolidated "Time & Sales" data from the NYSE. > > > > I am using the initial trade time of 9:32:56am as the actual > > commencement of trading. I would be interested in any group feedback > > on this point and the chart. Is anyone persuaded to use the NYSE time > > of 9:52:40am? If so, why? Clearly this is of some importance as > > the "2nd time" gives a Leo Ascendant - the 1st time gives a Cancer > > Ascendant. So often we have problems with the exact timing of an > > event. At least with this case study we have some absolute times to > > work with and test the SA principles as applied to forecasting equity > > prices. > > > > Perhaps of further interest is the birth data on the managing partner > > of BlackStone - Mr Stephen Schwarzman -born Febuary 14th 1947 in the > > Eastern USA. > > > > > > Peter > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 2007 Report Share Posted June 25, 2007 Hello Raj, It would be good if you could back up your claims concerning the first trade in GOOG and EBAY occuring around noon time with a source. For the record, I didn´t say " most stocks trade at the open " . Rather I said " We presume most stocks trade at the open " and " I expect this would be the case for most IPOs, however, more research is needed to establish this point beyond doubt " . Certainly, I have been well served to rely on the insight of Professor Choudhry. Best wishes, Thor SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech wrote: > > Thor: > > I will compare some charts for the location of NY and headquarter myself before accepting 's insight. > > However you are definitely not right when you say most stock open near the openeing of stock exchange. GOOG, for example opened at noon, EBAY at 12:20 pm. > > Raj > > cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Hello Raj, > > Thanks for confirming the Nasdaq stock exchange has the same opening > time as the NYSES. > > The matter of which location to use is settled by the insight of > . He thinks that the very same moment the trade is > made in NY is relevant at the location of the company. > > We presume it is a fairly standard practice for the IPO to be offered > for trade at the open, even if multiple IPOs occur in the same day. > With detailed records it is possible to identify exactly the time of > first trade in any given stock. The incidence of first trade has with > the example of the Blackstone Group been shown by Peter to occur close > to the open. I expect this would be the case for most IPOs, however, > more research is needed to establish this point beyond doubt. > > Best wishes, > > Thor > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech@> wrote: > > > > Thor: > > > > I could not find any justification to make an adjustment for > headquarter location. > > > > NYSE and NASDAQ open at the same time. But it is the first trade > time that you need, not market open time. There may be 4 IPO's on one > day. If you use market open time, they all will have the same chart. > > > > Apple's advance can be predicted from my chart also. > > > > Raj > > > > cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote: > Hello Raj, > > > > As per , the following scheme is used: > > > > Event is first trade at IPO > > Place: New York, NY > > mm/dd/yy > > Local time: 09:30 > > > > Chart is based on same moment but at headquarters location (deg W min, > > deg N min), mm/dd/yy, making adjustment for local time: 09:30 - > > time zone difference (if different from EST). > > > > What is the source of your information that the Nasdaq market has > > opened later than NYSE? > > > > The 17° Scorpio rising chart for Apple Co. allowed me to correctly > > predict a rise in the share price from July 2004. > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Thor > > > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear financial astrologers: > > > > > > For Apple Computer, I have been using chart based on Dec 12, 1980, > > 11:30AM, EST, New York. This is because most of the stocks open on > > NASDAQ around 11AM, not 9:30AM. It puts two FB's on 8th MEP, > > explaining substancial rise in Jup/Jup and Jup/Sat period. This chart > > also expalins why the stock was underperformer in the 18 years of Rahu > > period. > > > > > > I do not understand why would you adjust for San Jose time. I would > > appreciate if you substantiate your reasons with examples. > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > Raj > > > > > > Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote: > > Dear Vyas, Peter and list, > > > > > > One chart that stands out is that of Apple Computer Company. It is > > based on the 09:30 am time in NYC, adjusted for San Jose. Even if we > > move the time back some minutes, it makes little difference for the > > overall strength. However, it would move the rising degree from 17° > > 03' to say 19° 09' if the first trade took place ten minutes after the > > open December 12, 1980. This would mean the important yoga of L2 > > Jupiter at 14° 00' Virgo H11 and L4 Saturn at 14° 58' Virgo would > > partially move out of MEP. This is not likely as during the Jupiter - > > Jupiter period, which began according to the 09:30 time on July 7, > > 2004, the share price began to rise. If we move the time to say 09:40 > > the period would begin around June 20 and Jupiter would no longer be > > in H11 MEP. What has happened with the share prices since the onset of > > this dasa and the Jupiter and then also Saturn bukhti is that the > > share price jumped. The company has introduced one hit after the > other. > > > There seems to be little let up in sight as the next bukhti is that > > of L11 Mercury at 16° 47' Scorpio H1 from March 2009. In short, the > > chart is working very well based on a time close to the opening bell. > > It is not likely that a chart beyond 09:40 would be so fitting. This > > supports Peters thesis that the first trade is the one to use, > > assuming this trade also took place shortly after the open back in > > late 1980. > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > > Thor > > > > > > Vyas Munidas <munidas@> wrote: > > > Hi Thor and Peter, > > > > > > It may be a good idea to backtest this idea using the first trade > > data for > > > Microsoft - the volume is apprecaible and a good amount of time has > > past > > > since the first trade. > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > Vyas Munidas > > > > > > > > > - > > > " Cosmologer " > > > To: > > > Saturday, June 23, 2007 4:28 AM > > > Re: Case Study - The BlackStone Group > > > > > > > > > Dear Peter and list members, > > > > > > Thanks for sharing this information, Peter. It is very interesting > > for the > > > fact that previously we have followed charts based on more limited > > > information concerning the timing of the first market trade. > > > > > > We have used the following data: > > > 1. Company: Company name (ticker symbol): > > > 2. Day of initial public offer (IPO) > > > 3. HQ location: City where the company is headquartered (HQ). > > > 4. Time: Local time at the HQ location equivalent to the time > when NYSE > > > opens up for business in NYC. The stock exchange has opened at 9:30 > > am in > > > recent decades. This is the so-called opening bell. The NYSE opened > > at 10 am > > > prior to September 1984, I think. > > > > > > With regard to 4. Time, you have brought more specific information > > on the > > > actual timing of the first trade. Moreover, the information opens > > up the > > > very interesting question of what actually constitutes the first > > trade. It > > > seems the Initial trade is made to set an opening price (at $45.00), > > perhaps > > > reflecting what the seller or stock exchange members think is the > > > appropriate price. The second trade is then what the real market > forces > > > think ($36.45). The second price is clealy based on actual bidding > > on the > > > stock exchange, where the seller decides to sell and a buyer agrees > > to buy > > > at a given price. To me, this would be the actual market determined > > price. > > > Hence, I would be in favour of using the latter time. > > > > > > In other words, I would think the latter time is the real time > when the > > > stock is actually trading on the exchange, but I could very well be > > wrong on > > > this. > > > > > > 1. Blackstone Group (BX) > > > 2. June 22, 2007 > > > 3. HQ location: New York city > > > 4. Time: 9:52:40 am (EDT) > > > Ascendant: 0° 10' Leo rising (chart attached as .gif file) > > > > > > Clearly, if the latter time is the correct time to use, this implies > > the > > > actual market trade in the stock can be some time later than the > > opening > > > bell. This would suggest there is more scope for error in earlier > > work based > > > on the opening bell at 9:30 am. > > > > > > I´d be interested in other views on the actual timing to use. > > > > > > Finally, Peter, is it possible to get information about > historical IPOs > > > based on such accuracy of timing of trades? > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > > Thor > > > > > > ght451 wrote: > > > Hi Group, > > > > > > It may be of interest to some of the list members who are applying SA > > > to equity markets to use the recent listing of The BlackStone > Group as > > > an on going case study. > > > > > > As many of you will know the stock (BX) was listed on the NYSE on > > > Friday 22nd of June 2007 in New York. > > > > > > The " listing " time is of some interest. The INITIAL trade was at > > > $45.00 at 9:32:56am EDT on the electronic trading platform - > THRD - for > > > 2000 shares. The stock was then " opened " on the floor of the NYSE at > > > 9:52:40am EDT at $36.45 on 17, 171, 700 shares. This data comes from > > > the consolidated " Time & Sales " data from the NYSE. > > > > > > I am using the initial trade time of 9:32:56am as the actual > > > commencement of trading. I would be interested in any group feedback > > > on this point and the chart. Is anyone persuaded to use the NYSE time > > > of 9:52:40am? If so, why? Clearly this is of some importance as > > > the " 2nd time " gives a Leo Ascendant - the 1st time gives a Cancer > > > Ascendant. So often we have problems with the exact timing of an > > > event. At least with this case study we have some absolute times to > > > work with and test the SA principles as applied to forecasting equity > > > prices. > > > > > > Perhaps of further interest is the birth data on the managing partner > > > of BlackStone - Mr Stephen Schwarzman -born Febuary 14th 1947 in the > > > Eastern USA. > > > > > > > > > Peter > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 2007 Report Share Posted June 25, 2007 i have the first trade in goog 8/19/04 11:55:01am edt ny,ny @ 100.01. hope this helps, tom --- cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: > Hello Raj, > > It would be good if you could back up your claims > concerning the first > trade in GOOG and EBAY occuring around noon time > with a source. > > For the record, I didn´t say " most stocks trade at > the open " . Rather I > said " We presume most stocks trade at the open " and > " I expect this > would be the case for most IPOs, however, more > research is needed to > establish this point beyond doubt " . > > Certainly, I have been well served to rely on the > insight of Professor > Choudhry. > > Best wishes, > > Thor > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha > <rkctech wrote: > > > > Thor: > > > > I will compare some charts for the location of NY > and headquarter > myself before accepting 's insight. > > > > However you are definitely not right when you say > most stock open > near the openeing of stock exchange. GOOG, for > example opened at noon, > EBAY at 12:20 pm. > > > > Raj > > > > cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: > > Hello Raj, > > > > Thanks for confirming the Nasdaq stock exchange > has the same opening > > time as the NYSES. > > > > The matter of which location to use is settled by > the insight of > > . He thinks that the very same > moment the trade is > > made in NY is relevant at the location of the > company. > > > > We presume it is a fairly standard practice for > the IPO to be offered > > for trade at the open, even if multiple IPOs > occur in the same day. > > With detailed records it is possible to identify > exactly the time of > > first trade in any given stock. The incidence of > first trade has with > > the example of the Blackstone Group been shown by > Peter to occur close > > to the open. I expect this would be the case for > most IPOs, however, > > more research is needed to establish this point > beyond doubt. > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Thor > > > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha > <rkctech@> wrote: > > > > > > Thor: > > > > > > I could not find any justification to make an > adjustment for > > headquarter location. > > > > > > NYSE and NASDAQ open at the same time. But it > is the first trade > > time that you need, not market open time. There > may be 4 IPO's on one > > day. If you use market open time, they all will > have the same chart. > > > > > > Apple's advance can be predicted from my chart > also. > > > > > > Raj > > > > > > cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote: > > > Hello Raj, > > > > > > As per , the following > scheme is used: > > > > > > Event is first trade at IPO > > > Place: New York, NY > > > mm/dd/yy > > > Local time: 09:30 > > > > > > Chart is based on same moment but at > headquarters location (deg > W min, > > > deg N min), mm/dd/yy, making adjustment > for local time: > 09:30 - > > > time zone difference (if different from EST). > > > > > > What is the source of your information that > the Nasdaq market has > > > opened later than NYSE? > > > > > > The 17° Scorpio rising chart for Apple Co. > allowed me to correctly > > > predict a rise in the share price from July > 2004. > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > > Thor > > > > > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha > <rkctech@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear financial astrologers: > > > > > > > > For Apple Computer, I have been using chart > based on Dec 12, 1980, > > > 11:30AM, EST, New York. This is because most > of the stocks open on > > > NASDAQ around 11AM, not 9:30AM. It puts two > FB's on 8th MEP, > > > explaining substancial rise in Jup/Jup and > Jup/Sat period. This > chart > > > also expalins why the stock was underperformer > in the 18 years > of Rahu > > > period. > > > > > > > > I do not understand why would you adjust for > San Jose time. I > would > > > appreciate if you substantiate your reasons > with examples. > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > Raj > > > > > > > > Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote: > > > > Dear Vyas, Peter and list, > > > > > > > > One chart that stands out is that of Apple > Computer Company. It is > > > based on the 09:30 am time in NYC, adjusted > for San Jose. Even if we > > > move the time back some minutes, it makes > little difference for the > > > overall strength. However, it would move the > rising degree from 17° > > > 03' to say 19° 09' if the first trade took > place ten minutes > after the > > > open December 12, 1980. This would mean the > important yoga of L2 > > > Jupiter at 14° 00' Virgo H11 and L4 Saturn at > 14° 58' Virgo would > > > partially move out of MEP. This is not likely > as during the > Jupiter - > > > Jupiter period, which began according to the > 09:30 time on July 7, > > > 2004, the share price began to rise. If we > move the time to say > 09:40 > > > the period would begin around June 20 and > Jupiter would no longer be > > > in H11 MEP. What has happened with the share > prices since the > onset of > > > this dasa and the Jupiter and then also Saturn > bukhti is that the > > > share price jumped. The company has introduced > one hit after the > > other. > > > > There seems to be little let up in sight as > the next bukhti is > that > > > of L11 Mercury at 16° 47' Scorpio H1 from > March 2009. In short, the > > > chart is working very well based on a time > close to the opening > === message truncated === ______________________________\ ____ Building a website is a piece of cake. Small Business gives you all the tools to get online. http://smallbusiness./webhosting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 25, 2007 Report Share Posted June 25, 2007 Hi Tom, Thanks for this. It is very helpful - as is the discussion with Raj. Best wishes, Thor SAMVA , tom <gwizitsfree wrote: > > i have the first trade in goog 8/19/04 11:55:01am edt > ny,ny @ 100.01. > hope this helps, > tom > > > --- cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: > > > Hello Raj, > > > > It would be good if you could back up your claims > > concerning the first > > trade in GOOG and EBAY occuring around noon time > > with a source. > > > > For the record, I didn´t say " most stocks trade at > > the open " . Rather I > > said " We presume most stocks trade at the open " and > > " I expect this > > would be the case for most IPOs, however, more > > research is needed to > > establish this point beyond doubt " . > > > > Certainly, I have been well served to rely on the > > insight of Professor > > Choudhry. > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Thor > > > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha > > <rkctech@> wrote: > > > > > > Thor: > > > > > > I will compare some charts for the location of NY > > and headquarter > > myself before accepting 's insight. > > > > > > However you are definitely not right when you say > > most stock open > > near the openeing of stock exchange. GOOG, for > > example opened at noon, > > EBAY at 12:20 pm. > > > > > > Raj > > > > > > cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote: > > > > Hello Raj, > > > > > > Thanks for confirming the Nasdaq stock exchange > > has the same opening > > > time as the NYSES. > > > > > > The matter of which location to use is settled by > > the insight of > > > . He thinks that the very same > > moment the trade is > > > made in NY is relevant at the location of the > > company. > > > > > > We presume it is a fairly standard practice for > > the IPO to be offered > > > for trade at the open, even if multiple IPOs > > occur in the same day. > > > With detailed records it is possible to identify > > exactly the time of > > > first trade in any given stock. The incidence of > > first trade has with > > > the example of the Blackstone Group been shown by > > Peter to occur close > > > to the open. I expect this would be the case for > > most IPOs, however, > > > more research is needed to establish this point > > beyond doubt. > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > > Thor > > > > > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha > > <rkctech@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Thor: > > > > > > > > I could not find any justification to make an > > adjustment for > > > headquarter location. > > > > > > > > NYSE and NASDAQ open at the same time. But it > > is the first trade > > > time that you need, not market open time. There > > may be 4 IPO's on one > > > day. If you use market open time, they all will > > have the same chart. > > > > > > > > Apple's advance can be predicted from my chart > > also. > > > > > > > > Raj > > > > > > > > cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote: > > > > > Hello Raj, > > > > > > > > As per , the following > > scheme is used: > > > > > > > > Event is first trade at IPO > > > > Place: New York, NY > > > > mm/dd/yy > > > > Local time: 09:30 > > > > > > > > Chart is based on same moment but at > > headquarters location (deg > > W min, > > > > deg N min), mm/dd/yy, making adjustment > > for local time: > > 09:30 - > > > > time zone difference (if different from EST). > > > > > > > > What is the source of your information that > > the Nasdaq market has > > > > opened later than NYSE? > > > > > > > > The 17° Scorpio rising chart for Apple Co. > > allowed me to correctly > > > > predict a rise in the share price from July > > 2004. > > > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > > > > Thor > > > > > > > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha > > <rkctech@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear financial astrologers: > > > > > > > > > > For Apple Computer, I have been using chart > > based on Dec 12, 1980, > > > > 11:30AM, EST, New York. This is because most > > of the stocks open on > > > > NASDAQ around 11AM, not 9:30AM. It puts two > > FB's on 8th MEP, > > > > explaining substancial rise in Jup/Jup and > > Jup/Sat period. This > > chart > > > > also expalins why the stock was underperformer > > in the 18 years > > of Rahu > > > > period. > > > > > > > > > > I do not understand why would you adjust for > > San Jose time. I > > would > > > > appreciate if you substantiate your reasons > > with examples. > > > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > > Raj > > > > > > > > > > Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Vyas, Peter and list, > > > > > > > > > > One chart that stands out is that of Apple > > Computer Company. It is > > > > based on the 09:30 am time in NYC, adjusted > > for San Jose. Even if we > > > > move the time back some minutes, it makes > > little difference for the > > > > overall strength. However, it would move the > > rising degree from 17° > > > > 03' to say 19° 09' if the first trade took > > place ten minutes > > after the > > > > open December 12, 1980. This would mean the > > important yoga of L2 > > > > Jupiter at 14° 00' Virgo H11 and L4 Saturn at > > 14° 58' Virgo would > > > > partially move out of MEP. This is not likely > > as during the > > Jupiter - > > > > Jupiter period, which began according to the > > 09:30 time on July 7, > > > > 2004, the share price began to rise. If we > > move the time to say > > 09:40 > > > > the period would begin around June 20 and > > Jupiter would no longer be > > > > in H11 MEP. What has happened with the share > > prices since the > > onset of > > > > this dasa and the Jupiter and then also Saturn > > bukhti is that the > > > > share price jumped. The company has introduced > > one hit after the > > > other. > > > > > There seems to be little let up in sight as > > the next bukhti is > > that > > > > of L11 Mercury at 16° 47' Scorpio H1 from > > March 2009. In short, the > > > > chart is working very well based on a time > > close to the opening > > > === message truncated === > > > > > ______________________________\ ____ > Building a website is a piece of cake. Small Business gives you all the tools to get online. > http://smallbusiness./webhosting > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 26, 2007 Report Share Posted June 26, 2007 Thor:For first-trade-time source, you have to dig old news archives. Another example of late afternoon open: WYNN resorts 12:55PM.If you want to use Astrology to invest, this time is a must. This is my conclusion.Raj Chadhacosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Hello Raj, It would be good if you could back up your claims concerning the first trade in GOOG and EBAY occuring around noon time with a source. For the record, I didn´t say "most stocks trade at the open". Rather I said "We presume most stocks trade at the open" and "I expect this would be the case for most IPOs, however, more research is needed to establish this point beyond doubt". Certainly, I have been well served to rely on the insight of . Best wishes, Thor SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech wrote: > > Thor: > > I will compare some charts for the location of NY and headquarter myself before accepting 's insight. > > However you are definitely not right when you say most stock open near the openeing of stock exchange. GOOG, for example opened at noon, EBAY at 12:20 pm. > > Raj > > cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Hello Raj, > > Thanks for confirming the Nasdaq stock exchange has the same opening > time as the NYSES. > > The matter of which location to use is settled by the insight of > . He thinks that the very same moment the trade is > made in NY is relevant at the location of the company. > > We presume it is a fairly standard practice for the IPO to be offered > for trade at the open, even if multiple IPOs occur in the same day. > With detailed records it is possible to identify exactly the time of > first trade in any given stock. The incidence of first trade has with > the example of the Blackstone Group been shown by Peter to occur close > to the open. I expect this would be the case for most IPOs, however, > more research is needed to establish this point beyond doubt. > > Best wishes, > > Thor > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech@> wrote: > > > > Thor: > > > > I could not find any justification to make an adjustment for > headquarter location. > > > > NYSE and NASDAQ open at the same time. But it is the first trade > time that you need, not market open time. There may be 4 IPO's on one > day. If you use market open time, they all will have the same chart. > > > > Apple's advance can be predicted from my chart also. > > > > Raj > > > > cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote: > Hello Raj, > > > > As per , the following scheme is used: > > > > Event is first trade at IPO > > Place: New York, NY > > Date: mm/dd/yy > > Local time: 09:30 > > > > Chart is based on same moment but at headquarters location (deg W min, > > deg N min), mm/dd/yy, making adjustment for local time: 09:30 - > > time zone difference (if different from EST). > > > > What is the source of your information that the Nasdaq market has > > opened later than NYSE? > > > > The 17° Scorpio rising chart for Apple Co. allowed me to correctly > > predict a rise in the share price from July 2004. > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Thor > > > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear financial astrologers: > > > > > > For Apple Computer, I have been using chart based on Dec 12, 1980, > > 11:30AM, EST, New York. This is because most of the stocks open on > > NASDAQ around 11AM, not 9:30AM. It puts two FB's on 8th MEP, > > explaining substancial rise in Jup/Jup and Jup/Sat period. This chart > > also expalins why the stock was underperformer in the 18 years of Rahu > > period. > > > > > > I do not understand why would you adjust for San Jose time. I would > > appreciate if you substantiate your reasons with examples. > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > Raj > > > > > > Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote: > > Dear Vyas, Peter and list, > > > > > > One chart that stands out is that of Apple Computer Company. It is > > based on the 09:30 am time in NYC, adjusted for San Jose. Even if we > > move the time back some minutes, it makes little difference for the > > overall strength. However, it would move the rising degree from 17° > > 03' to say 19° 09' if the first trade took place ten minutes after the > > open December 12, 1980. This would mean the important yoga of L2 > > Jupiter at 14° 00' Virgo H11 and L4 Saturn at 14° 58' Virgo would > > partially move out of MEP. This is not likely as during the Jupiter - > > Jupiter period, which began according to the 09:30 time on July 7, > > 2004, the share price began to rise. If we move the time to say 09:40 > > the period would begin around June 20 and Jupiter would no longer be > > in H11 MEP. What has happened with the share prices since the onset of > > this dasa and the Jupiter and then also Saturn bukhti is that the > > share price jumped. The company has introduced one hit after the > other. > > > There seems to be little let up in sight as the next bukhti is that > > of L11 Mercury at 16° 47' Scorpio H1 from March 2009. In short, the > > chart is working very well based on a time close to the opening bell. > > It is not likely that a chart beyond 09:40 would be so fitting. This > > supports Peters thesis that the first trade is the one to use, > > assuming this trade also took place shortly after the open back in > > late 1980. > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > > Thor > > > > > > Vyas Munidas <munidas@> wrote: > > > Hi Thor and Peter, > > > > > > It may be a good idea to backtest this idea using the first trade > > data for > > > Microsoft - the volume is apprecaible and a good amount of time has > > past > > > since the first trade. > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > Vyas Munidas > > > > > > > > > - > > > "Cosmologer" > > > > > > Saturday, June 23, 2007 4:28 AM > > > Re: Case Study - The BlackStone Group > > > > > > > > > Dear Peter and list members, > > > > > > Thanks for sharing this information, Peter. It is very interesting > > for the > > > fact that previously we have followed charts based on more limited > > > information concerning the timing of the first market trade. > > > > > > We have used the following data: > > > 1. Company: Company name (ticker symbol): > > > 2. Day of initial public offer (IPO) > > > 3. HQ location: City where the company is headquartered (HQ). > > > 4. Time: Local time at the HQ location equivalent to the time > when NYSE > > > opens up for business in NYC. The stock exchange has opened at 9:30 > > am in > > > recent decades. This is the so-called opening bell. The NYSE opened > > at 10 am > > > prior to September 1984, I think. > > > > > > With regard to 4. Time, you have brought more specific information > > on the > > > actual timing of the first trade. Moreover, the information opens > > up the > > > very interesting question of what actually constitutes the first > > trade. It > > > seems the Initial trade is made to set an opening price (at $45.00), > > perhaps > > > reflecting what the seller or stock exchange members think is the > > > appropriate price. The second trade is then what the real market > forces > > > think ($36.45). The second price is clealy based on actual bidding > > on the > > > stock exchange, where the seller decides to sell and a buyer agrees > > to buy > > > at a given price. To me, this would be the actual market determined > > price. > > > Hence, I would be in favour of using the latter time. > > > > > > In other words, I would think the latter time is the real time > when the > > > stock is actually trading on the exchange, but I could very well be > > wrong on > > > this. > > > > > > 1. Blackstone Group (BX) > > > 2. June 22, 2007 > > > 3. HQ location: New York city > > > 4. Time: 9:52:40 am (EDT) > > > Ascendant: 0° 10' Leo rising (chart attached as .gif file) > > > > > > Clearly, if the latter time is the correct time to use, this implies > > the > > > actual market trade in the stock can be some time later than the > > opening > > > bell. This would suggest there is more scope for error in earlier > > work based > > > on the opening bell at 9:30 am. > > > > > > I´d be interested in other views on the actual timing to use. > > > > > > Finally, Peter, is it possible to get information about > historical IPOs > > > based on such accuracy of timing of trades? > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > > Thor > > > > > > ght451 wrote: > > > Hi Group, > > > > > > It may be of interest to some of the list members who are applying SA > > > to equity markets to use the recent listing of The BlackStone > Group as > > > an on going case study. > > > > > > As many of you will know the stock (BX) was listed on the NYSE on > > > Friday 22nd of June 2007 in New York. > > > > > > The "listing" time is of some interest. The INITIAL trade was at > > > $45.00 at 9:32:56am EDT on the electronic trading platform - > THRD - for > > > 2000 shares. The stock was then "opened" on the floor of the NYSE at > > > 9:52:40am EDT at $36.45 on 17, 171, 700 shares. This data comes from > > > the consolidated "Time & Sales" data from the NYSE. > > > > > > I am using the initial trade time of 9:32:56am as the actual > > > commencement of trading. I would be interested in any group feedback > > > on this point and the chart. Is anyone persuaded to use the NYSE time > > > of 9:52:40am? If so, why? Clearly this is of some importance as > > > the "2nd time" gives a Leo Ascendant - the 1st time gives a Cancer > > > Ascendant. So often we have problems with the exact timing of an > > > event. At least with this case study we have some absolute times to > > > work with and test the SA principles as applied to forecasting equity > > > prices. > > > > > > Perhaps of further interest is the birth data on the managing partner > > > of BlackStone - Mr Stephen Schwarzman -born Febuary 14th 1947 in the > > > Eastern USA. > > > > > > > > > Peter > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 26, 2007 Report Share Posted June 26, 2007 SAMVA , " cosmologer " <cosmologer wrote: > > > > > Dear Thor and list: I direct you to the website of Bill Meridian, who is a well known and succesful stock market cycles predictor. I append a part of his description of his methodolgy to erect first trade charts, and it seems the opening bell is the key. You should note he does not use SA, but that does not have an impact on his conclusion to use the opening bell, in my opinion. > > " A major new issue of a leading company may be listed directly on the NYSE, as Readers Digest was on February 15,1990. The two dates, IPO and first-listing, occur close together. I have found the first trade date to be the more important of the two. Customarily, the chairman or president of the company will go to the floor of the exchange and make a token, personal purchase of 100 or 1,000 shares to kick off the trading. In the words of a NYSE official, trading begins " almost immediately. " Thus, the choice of the 9:30 or 10:00 am time for the charts is supported by fact " > > Best personal regards, Chuck > > > > > ____________________ ______________ > > Building a website is a piece of cake. Small Business gives > you all the tools to get online. > > http://smallbusiness./webhosting > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 26, 2007 Report Share Posted June 26, 2007 Hello Raj, Where are you finding this specific information. Is it available on the net? By the way, I am not a professional trader and have only been following share prices out of curiosity. The ample data about share price movements makes stocks an opportune thing to follow in terms of the periods and transits of a given IPO chart. The The aim of the study is to see if and to what extent the otherwise accurate SA astrology allows us to accurately predict the share price movements. I look forward to the next phase of this research based on the detailed information about the first trade in a stock as part of its initial public offer (IPO). Thanks for alerting us to the fact that the actual timing of the first trade is sometimes quite different from the time when the market opens in the morning. Indeed, we are making progress here. Best wishes, Thor SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech wrote: > > Thor: > > For first-trade-time source, you have to dig old news archives. > Another example of late afternoon open: WYNN resorts 12:55PM. > If you want to use Astrology to invest, this time is a must. This is my conclusion. > > Raj Chadha > > cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Hello Raj, > > It would be good if you could back up your claims concerning the first > trade in GOOG and EBAY occuring around noon time with a source. > > For the record, I didn´t say " most stocks trade at the open " . Rather I > said " We presume most stocks trade at the open " and " I expect this > would be the case for most IPOs, however, more research is needed to > establish this point beyond doubt " . > > Certainly, I have been well served to rely on the insight of Professor > Choudhry. > > Best wishes, > > Thor > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech@> wrote: > > > > Thor: > > > > I will compare some charts for the location of NY and headquarter > myself before accepting 's insight. > > > > However you are definitely not right when you say most stock open > near the openeing of stock exchange. GOOG, for example opened at noon, > EBAY at 12:20 pm. > > > > Raj > > > > cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote: > Hello Raj, > > > > Thanks for confirming the Nasdaq stock exchange has the same opening > > time as the NYSES. > > > > The matter of which location to use is settled by the insight of > > . He thinks that the very same moment the trade is > > made in NY is relevant at the location of the company. > > > > We presume it is a fairly standard practice for the IPO to be offered > > for trade at the open, even if multiple IPOs occur in the same day. > > With detailed records it is possible to identify exactly the time of > > first trade in any given stock. The incidence of first trade has with > > the example of the Blackstone Group been shown by Peter to occur close > > to the open. I expect this would be the case for most IPOs, however, > > more research is needed to establish this point beyond doubt. > > > > Best wishes, > > > > Thor > > > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech@> wrote: > > > > > > Thor: > > > > > > I could not find any justification to make an adjustment for > > headquarter location. > > > > > > NYSE and NASDAQ open at the same time. But it is the first trade > > time that you need, not market open time. There may be 4 IPO's on one > > day. If you use market open time, they all will have the same chart. > > > > > > Apple's advance can be predicted from my chart also. > > > > > > Raj > > > > > > cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote: > > Hello Raj, > > > > > > As per , the following scheme is used: > > > > > > Event is first trade at IPO > > > Place: New York, NY > > > mm/dd/yy > > > Local time: 09:30 > > > > > > Chart is based on same moment but at headquarters location (deg > W min, > > > deg N min), mm/dd/yy, making adjustment for local time: > 09:30 - > > > time zone difference (if different from EST). > > > > > > What is the source of your information that the Nasdaq market has > > > opened later than NYSE? > > > > > > The 17° Scorpio rising chart for Apple Co. allowed me to correctly > > > predict a rise in the share price from July 2004. > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > > Thor > > > > > > SAMVA , Raj Cgadha <rkctech@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear financial astrologers: > > > > > > > > For Apple Computer, I have been using chart based on Dec 12, 1980, > > > 11:30AM, EST, New York. This is because most of the stocks open on > > > NASDAQ around 11AM, not 9:30AM. It puts two FB's on 8th MEP, > > > explaining substancial rise in Jup/Jup and Jup/Sat period. This > chart > > > also expalins why the stock was underperformer in the 18 years > of Rahu > > > period. > > > > > > > > I do not understand why would you adjust for San Jose time. I > would > > > appreciate if you substantiate your reasons with examples. > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > Raj > > > > > > > > Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote: > > > Dear Vyas, Peter and list, > > > > > > > > One chart that stands out is that of Apple Computer Company. It is > > > based on the 09:30 am time in NYC, adjusted for San Jose. Even if we > > > move the time back some minutes, it makes little difference for the > > > overall strength. However, it would move the rising degree from 17° > > > 03' to say 19° 09' if the first trade took place ten minutes > after the > > > open December 12, 1980. This would mean the important yoga of L2 > > > Jupiter at 14° 00' Virgo H11 and L4 Saturn at 14° 58' Virgo would > > > partially move out of MEP. This is not likely as during the > Jupiter - > > > Jupiter period, which began according to the 09:30 time on July 7, > > > 2004, the share price began to rise. If we move the time to say > 09:40 > > > the period would begin around June 20 and Jupiter would no longer be > > > in H11 MEP. What has happened with the share prices since the > onset of > > > this dasa and the Jupiter and then also Saturn bukhti is that the > > > share price jumped. The company has introduced one hit after the > > other. > > > > There seems to be little let up in sight as the next bukhti is > that > > > of L11 Mercury at 16° 47' Scorpio H1 from March 2009. In short, the > > > chart is working very well based on a time close to the opening > bell. > > > It is not likely that a chart beyond 09:40 would be so fitting. This > > > supports Peters thesis that the first trade is the one to use, > > > assuming this trade also took place shortly after the open back in > > > late 1980. > > > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > > > > Thor > > > > > > > > Vyas Munidas <munidas@> wrote: > > > > Hi Thor and Peter, > > > > > > > > It may be a good idea to backtest this idea using the first trade > > > data for > > > > Microsoft - the volume is apprecaible and a good amount of > time has > > > past > > > > since the first trade. > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > Vyas Munidas > > > > > > > > > > > > - > > > > " Cosmologer " > > > > To: > > > > Saturday, June 23, 2007 4:28 AM > > > > Re: Case Study - The BlackStone Group > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Peter and list members, > > > > > > > > Thanks for sharing this information, Peter. It is very interesting > > > for the > > > > fact that previously we have followed charts based on more > limited > > > > information concerning the timing of the first market trade. > > > > > > > > We have used the following data: > > > > 1. Company: Company name (ticker symbol): > > > > 2. Day of initial public offer (IPO) > > > > 3. HQ location: City where the company is headquartered (HQ). > > > > 4. Time: Local time at the HQ location equivalent to the time > > when NYSE > > > > opens up for business in NYC. The stock exchange has opened at > 9:30 > > > am in > > > > recent decades. This is the so-called opening bell. The NYSE > opened > > > at 10 am > > > > prior to September 1984, I think. > > > > > > > > With regard to 4. Time, you have brought more specific information > > > on the > > > > actual timing of the first trade. Moreover, the information opens > > > up the > > > > very interesting question of what actually constitutes the first > > > trade. It > > > > seems the Initial trade is made to set an opening price (at > $45.00), > > > perhaps > > > > reflecting what the seller or stock exchange members think is the > > > > appropriate price. The second trade is then what the real market > > forces > > > > think ($36.45). The second price is clealy based on actual bidding > > > on the > > > > stock exchange, where the seller decides to sell and a buyer > agrees > > > to buy > > > > at a given price. To me, this would be the actual market > determined > > > price. > > > > Hence, I would be in favour of using the latter time. > > > > > > > > In other words, I would think the latter time is the real time > > when the > > > > stock is actually trading on the exchange, but I could very > well be > > > wrong on > > > > this. > > > > > > > > 1. Blackstone Group (BX) > > > > 2. June 22, 2007 > > > > 3. HQ location: New York city > > > > 4. Time: 9:52:40 am (EDT) > > > > Ascendant: 0° 10' Leo rising (chart attached as .gif file) > > > > > > > > Clearly, if the latter time is the correct time to use, this > implies > > > the > > > > actual market trade in the stock can be some time later than the > > > opening > > > > bell. This would suggest there is more scope for error in earlier > > > work based > > > > on the opening bell at 9:30 am. > > > > > > > > I´d be interested in other views on the actual timing to use. > > > > > > > > Finally, Peter, is it possible to get information about > > historical IPOs > > > > based on such accuracy of timing of trades? > > > > > > > > Best wishes, > > > > > > > > Thor > > > > > > > > ght451 wrote: > > > > Hi Group, > > > > > > > > It may be of interest to some of the list members who are > applying SA > > > > to equity markets to use the recent listing of The BlackStone > > Group as > > > > an on going case study. > > > > > > > > As many of you will know the stock (BX) was listed on the NYSE on > > > > Friday 22nd of June 2007 in New York. > > > > > > > > The " listing " time is of some interest. The INITIAL trade was at > > > > $45.00 at 9:32:56am EDT on the electronic trading platform - > > THRD - for > > > > 2000 shares. The stock was then " opened " on the floor of the > NYSE at > > > > 9:52:40am EDT at $36.45 on 17, 171, 700 shares. This data > comes from > > > > the consolidated " Time & Sales " data from the NYSE. > > > > > > > > I am using the initial trade time of 9:32:56am as the actual > > > > commencement of trading. I would be interested in any group > feedback > > > > on this point and the chart. Is anyone persuaded to use the > NYSE time > > > > of 9:52:40am? If so, why? Clearly this is of some importance as > > > > the " 2nd time " gives a Leo Ascendant - the 1st time gives a > Cancer > > > > Ascendant. So often we have problems with the exact timing of an > > > > event. At least with this case study we have some absolute > times to > > > > work with and test the SA principles as applied to forecasting > equity > > > > prices. > > > > > > > > Perhaps of further interest is the birth data on the managing > partner > > > > of BlackStone - Mr Stephen Schwarzman -born Febuary 14th 1947 > in the > > > > Eastern USA. > > > > > > > > > > > > Peter > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 26, 2007 Report Share Posted June 26, 2007 Dear Chuck, Thanks for this piece of information. I have to admit this is becoming a bit confusing for us non-traders. I guess, we have to make some side-by-side comparisons of charts for the time of the open for an IPO (which I presume are the same date that a stock is first traded) and then the first actual recorded trade, which may occur later. This question may be easier to answer once more data is there about the first trade in stocks that I know fairly well, like AAPL and DCGN. Best wishes, Thor SAMVA , " wakefieldvedic " <radiopro55 wrote: > > SAMVA , " cosmologer " <cosmologer@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Dear Thor and list: > I direct you to the website of Bill Meridian, who is a well known and > succesful stock market cycles predictor. I append a part of his > description of his methodolgy to erect first trade charts, and it > seems the opening bell is the key. You should note he does not use > SA, but that does not have an impact on his conclusion to use the > opening bell, in my opinion. > > > " A major new issue of a leading company may be listed directly on > the NYSE, as Readers Digest was on February 15,1990. The two dates, > IPO and first-listing, occur close together. I have found the first > trade date to be the more important of the two. Customarily, the > chairman or president of the company will go to the floor of the > exchange and make a token, personal purchase of 100 or 1,000 shares > to kick off the trading. In the words of a NYSE official, trading > begins " almost immediately. " Thus, the choice of the 9:30 or 10:00 am > time for the charts is supported by fact " > > > Best personal regards, Chuck > > > > > > > > > ____________________ > ______________ > > > Building a website is a piece of cake. Small Business gives > > you all the tools to get online. > > > http://smallbusiness./webhosting > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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