Guest guest Posted April 6, 2008 Report Share Posted April 6, 2008 Hari Om. Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give person right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some spiritual inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make Asura yoga, nothing seriously. But generally I think that such placement is bad for understanding universal principles of God and implementation of such principles in real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. Best regards, ashwini Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2008 Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 Dear Ashwini, You are right, a wrongly placed Guru means, not clean inclination towards basic morality required to do denance and thus attaint at spirituality, sometimes the native lacks seriousness or some other times he is not eligible or some other time he has to face problems in getting enlightenment. mind and intellect leaves behind, before u take a dip deep into divine ocean of spirituality, no intelligence and no memory is required, what's required is clean heart, clean conciouseness which guru can give. mind and memory is required to learn and remember spiritual texts but to realize spirituality or to become spiritual (I always mean bhakti) Well placed Guru is a must, however, whole chart does matter. If u r into any discussion, pls. present chart of lord Rama, Krishna, Jesus or Siddhas. those chart will be different from chart of those who are in process of developing their spirituality in their lifetime. and there will be more chart different from them who are into rituals and have knowledge of classics like pandits, priests etc. there are different layers, in the they are ptretenders, dont discuss anything with them. they will try to prove each and every thing good as bad. regards, Lalit. Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " <ashwinikumaras wrote: > > Hari Om. > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give person > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some spiritual > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make Asura > yoga, nothing seriously. > But generally I think that such placement is bad for understanding > universal principles of God and implementation of such principles in > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > Best regards, > ashwini > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2008 Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " litsol " <mishra.lalit wrote: > Hari Om. Dear Lalit,discussion in Jyotish matter is very simple in own nature. Facts, and logic is the most powerful weapons in Jyotish. If is Guru placed for example in six bhava, that mean something good, but not in the sense of proper realizing of Atmavidya, not in the sense of supportive facts in that matters. So, debating and discussion in Jyotish matters must be in that manner: Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. If don't exist something like that story is closed. That is the way of Jyotish discussions. If we failed in basic things, such is karakatvas of bhavas and Grahas, of what purport will be that debate. I will telling you that you are a lier, you telling mi that I m lier, and on the end nobody will bi profiting of such debate. Only because we are not stick to basic principles of Jyotish discussions, discussions with the facts. Best regards, ashwini > Dear Ashwini, > > You are right, a wrongly placed Guru means, not clean inclination > towards basic morality required to do denance and thus attaint at > spirituality, sometimes the native lacks seriousness or some other > times he is not eligible or some other time he has to face problems > in getting enlightenment. > > mind and intellect leaves behind, before u take a dip deep into > divine ocean of spirituality, no intelligence and no memory is > required, what's required is clean heart, clean conciouseness which > guru can give. > > mind and memory is required to learn and remember spiritual texts but > to realize spirituality or to become spiritual (I always mean bhakti) > > Well placed Guru is a must, however, whole chart does matter. If u r > into any discussion, pls. present chart of lord Rama, Krishna, Jesus > or Siddhas. > > those chart will be different from chart of those who are in process > of developing their spirituality in their lifetime. > > and there will be more chart different from them who are into rituals > and have knowledge of classics like pandits, priests etc. > > there are different layers, in the they are ptretenders, > dont discuss anything with them. they will try to prove each and > every thing good as bad. > > regards, > Lalit. > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > Hari Om. > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give person > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > spiritual > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make Asura > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for understanding > > universal principles of God and implementation of such principles in > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > Best regards, > > ashwini > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2008 Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 Dear Petar, I have my Guru placed in the 6th house. So I dont want to get dragged into this discussion. (8.3.1976 00.21 Ettumanur). Just want to say that Guru's position itself dont block realization. And please dont predict a very bad nature only with a Guru placed in dustana. << Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. >> The basic rule is " bhaavaanaam tadiisa karaka vihanganaam trayaanamapi " meaning from bhava, its lord and karaka. Karaka comes third. What you speak is like saying Venus the karaka for marriage in 12th(rejection) wont give marriage. Jyotish is not a straight forward subject. Do you advocate a well placed Guru itself will make a great man? I advocate opposite and have many charts to prove it. Best regards, Saaji Bhaskaran Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " <ashwinikumaras wrote: > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " litsol " > <mishra.lalit@> wrote: > > > > Hari Om. > > Dear Lalit,discussion in Jyotish matter is very simple in own nature. > Facts, and logic is the most powerful weapons in Jyotish. If is Guru > placed for example in six bhava, that mean something good, but not in > the sense of proper realizing of Atmavidya, not in the sense of > supportive facts in that matters. > > So, debating and discussion in Jyotish matters must be in that manner: > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. > If don't exist something like that story is closed. That is the way of > Jyotish discussions. > > If we failed in basic things, such is karakatvas of bhavas and Grahas, > of what purport will be that debate. I will telling you that you are a > lier, you telling mi that I m lier, and on the end nobody will bi > profiting of such debate. Only because we are not stick to basic > principles of Jyotish discussions, discussions with the facts. > > Best regards, > ashwini > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > You are right, a wrongly placed Guru means, not clean inclination > > towards basic morality required to do denance and thus attaint at > > spirituality, sometimes the native lacks seriousness or some other > > times he is not eligible or some other time he has to face problems > > in getting enlightenment. > > > > mind and intellect leaves behind, before u take a dip deep into > > divine ocean of spirituality, no intelligence and no memory is > > required, what's required is clean heart, clean conciouseness which > > guru can give. > > > > mind and memory is required to learn and remember spiritual texts but > > to realize spirituality or to become spiritual (I always mean bhakti) > > > > Well placed Guru is a must, however, whole chart does matter. If u r > > into any discussion, pls. present chart of lord Rama, Krishna, Jesus > > or Siddhas. > > > > those chart will be different from chart of those who are in process > > of developing their spirituality in their lifetime. > > > > and there will be more chart different from them who are into rituals > > and have knowledge of classics like pandits, priests etc. > > > > there are different layers, in the they are ptretenders, > > dont discuss anything with them. they will try to prove each and > > every thing good as bad. > > > > regards, > > Lalit. > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " > > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give person > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > spiritual > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make Asura > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for understanding > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such principles in > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > ashwini > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2008 Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Saaji Bhaskaran " <saajik wrote: > Hari Om. Dear Bhaskaran, of course that I have not telling that such person it will not be good person, or satvick person,or spiritaul person of course not. But my interest of that specific position is that such position is not favorable for higher state on realization of Brahmavidya or Atmavidya. That statement is product of researchering not just mine than of other respectable Jyotishis but not respectable with own name but with knowledge. Guru in six bhava give some favorable qualities, but what kind of qualities? I will seeing later your entire chart, but I m not telling that such persons will be not spiritual inclined, on the contrary, such persons may thru karma yoga for example to do big uplifment in spiritual life, etc. But my wish is that we talk in way of the facts thru prism of Jyotish reality and Jyotish facts, like karakatvas, nature of bhava, etc. Because we people, and my self, in many cases we are not objective when analyzing own chart. I m not telling that you are such person, but I telling that in generally manner. Because of our non objectivity it is very important that we talk in science language and science manner about some theme in Jyotish. Best regards, ashwini > Dear Petar, > > I have my Guru placed in the 6th house. So I dont want to get dragged > into this discussion. (8.3.1976 00.21 Ettumanur). > > Just want to say that Guru's position itself dont block realization. > And please dont predict a very bad nature only with a Guru placed in > dustana. > > << > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. > >> > The basic rule is " bhaavaanaam tadiisa karaka vihanganaam > trayaanamapi " meaning from bhava, its lord and karaka. Karaka comes > third. What you speak is like saying Venus the karaka for marriage in > 12th(rejection) wont give marriage. Jyotish is not a straight forward > subject. > > Do you advocate a well placed Guru itself will make a great man? I > advocate opposite and have many charts to prove it. > > Best regards, > > Saaji Bhaskaran > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " litsol " > > <mishra.lalit@> wrote: > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > Dear Lalit,discussion in Jyotish matter is very simple in own > nature. > > Facts, and logic is the most powerful weapons in Jyotish. If is Guru > > placed for example in six bhava, that mean something good, but not > in > > the sense of proper realizing of Atmavidya, not in the sense of > > supportive facts in that matters. > > > > So, debating and discussion in Jyotish matters must be in that > manner: > > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. > > If don't exist something like that story is closed. That is the way > of > > Jyotish discussions. > > > > If we failed in basic things, such is karakatvas of bhavas and > Grahas, > > of what purport will be that debate. I will telling you that you > are a > > lier, you telling mi that I m lier, and on the end nobody will bi > > profiting of such debate. Only because we are not stick to basic > > principles of Jyotish discussions, discussions with the facts. > > > > Best regards, > > ashwini > > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > You are right, a wrongly placed Guru means, not clean inclination > > > towards basic morality required to do denance and thus attaint at > > > spirituality, sometimes the native lacks seriousness or some > other > > > times he is not eligible or some other time he has to face > problems > > > in getting enlightenment. > > > > > > mind and intellect leaves behind, before u take a dip deep into > > > divine ocean of spirituality, no intelligence and no memory is > > > required, what's required is clean heart, clean conciouseness > which > > > guru can give. > > > > > > mind and memory is required to learn and remember spiritual texts > but > > > to realize spirituality or to become spiritual (I always mean > bhakti) > > > > > > Well placed Guru is a must, however, whole chart does matter. If > u r > > > into any discussion, pls. present chart of lord Rama, Krishna, > Jesus > > > or Siddhas. > > > > > > those chart will be different from chart of those who are in > process > > > of developing their spirituality in their lifetime. > > > > > > and there will be more chart different from them who are into > rituals > > > and have knowledge of classics like pandits, priests etc. > > > > > > there are different layers, in the they are > ptretenders, > > > dont discuss anything with them. they will try to prove each and > > > every thing good as bad. > > > > > > regards, > > > Lalit. > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " > > > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give > person > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > > spiritual > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make > Asura > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for > understanding > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such > principles in > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2008 Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 Dear Saji, Pls. rest assured that u r a good friend and a good person as well as u r quite good in astrology, there is no doubt about u, 6'th is a upachaya, so if ur Guru is placed there, means Guru's karkatwa will grow further more. I do sadhan and i know at what layer of mind Guru functions and i m not very good in english so i m not able to express it fully, my testimony is specifically related to sadhana or atmvidya or spirituality. I tried it once, wil try once more in the night, in one word, can say guru enables u to have divine wisdom underneath the intellect and thoughts. whole chart does matter, not one portion of it. Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Saaji Bhaskaran " <saajik wrote: > > Dear Petar, > > I have my Guru placed in the 6th house. So I dont want to get dragged > into this discussion. (8.3.1976 00.21 Ettumanur). > > Just want to say that Guru's position itself dont block realization. > And please dont predict a very bad nature only with a Guru placed in > dustana. > > << > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. > >> > The basic rule is " bhaavaanaam tadiisa karaka vihanganaam > trayaanamapi " meaning from bhava, its lord and karaka. Karaka comes > third. What you speak is like saying Venus the karaka for marriage in > 12th(rejection) wont give marriage. Jyotish is not a straight forward > subject. > > Do you advocate a well placed Guru itself will make a great man? I > advocate opposite and have many charts to prove it. > > Best regards, > > Saaji Bhaskaran > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " litsol " > > <mishra.lalit@> wrote: > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > Dear Lalit,discussion in Jyotish matter is very simple in own > nature. > > Facts, and logic is the most powerful weapons in Jyotish. If is Guru > > placed for example in six bhava, that mean something good, but not > in > > the sense of proper realizing of Atmavidya, not in the sense of > > supportive facts in that matters. > > > > So, debating and discussion in Jyotish matters must be in that > manner: > > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. > > If don't exist something like that story is closed. That is the way > of > > Jyotish discussions. > > > > If we failed in basic things, such is karakatvas of bhavas and > Grahas, > > of what purport will be that debate. I will telling you that you > are a > > lier, you telling mi that I m lier, and on the end nobody will bi > > profiting of such debate. Only because we are not stick to basic > > principles of Jyotish discussions, discussions with the facts. > > > > Best regards, > > ashwini > > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > You are right, a wrongly placed Guru means, not clean inclination > > > towards basic morality required to do denance and thus attaint at > > > spirituality, sometimes the native lacks seriousness or some > other > > > times he is not eligible or some other time he has to face > problems > > > in getting enlightenment. > > > > > > mind and intellect leaves behind, before u take a dip deep into > > > divine ocean of spirituality, no intelligence and no memory is > > > required, what's required is clean heart, clean conciouseness > which > > > guru can give. > > > > > > mind and memory is required to learn and remember spiritual texts > but > > > to realize spirituality or to become spiritual (I always mean > bhakti) > > > > > > Well placed Guru is a must, however, whole chart does matter. If > u r > > > into any discussion, pls. present chart of lord Rama, Krishna, > Jesus > > > or Siddhas. > > > > > > those chart will be different from chart of those who are in > process > > > of developing their spirituality in their lifetime. > > > > > > and there will be more chart different from them who are into > rituals > > > and have knowledge of classics like pandits, priests etc. > > > > > > there are different layers, in the they are > ptretenders, > > > dont discuss anything with them. they will try to prove each and > > > every thing good as bad. > > > > > > regards, > > > Lalit. > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " > > > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give > person > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > > spiritual > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make > Asura > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for > understanding > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such > principles in > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2008 Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 Dear Petar, My reply below: Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " <ashwinikumaras wrote: > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Saaji Bhaskaran " > <saajik@> wrote: > > > > Hari Om. > > Dear Bhaskaran, of course that I have not telling that such person it > will not be good person, or satvick person,or spiritaul person of > course not. > > But my interest of that specific position is that such position is not > favorable for higher state on realization of Brahmavidya or Atmavidya. If you are speaking about Brahma Vidya, how many people do you think knows Brahma Vidya? And how many do think agree on something is there like atma vidya? And how many realise it? Ramana Maharshi, the chart that Narasimha ji refered is said to be geniune as its given by his brother to late Dr BV Raman. He is one of the greatest masters of recent times who realised self. > That statement is product of researchering not just mine than of other > respectable Jyotishis but not respectable with own name but with > knowledge. > > Guru in six bhava give some favorable qualities, but what kind of > qualities? > > I will seeing later your entire chart, but I m not telling that such My chart please dont mix up. What I was telling, since I had Guru in 6th it wont be prudent to discuss this topic. What I am and whats my spiritual practices I dont want to share with anyone. But only onething I will share that I do sandhya vandana both times (if I reach home very late, I miss it) and recite Gayatri atleast 36 times. > persons will be not spiritual inclined, on the contrary, such persons > may thru karma yoga for example to do big uplifment in spiritual life, > etc. I dont agree on this. > > But my wish is that we talk in way of the facts thru prism of Jyotish > reality and Jyotish facts, like karakatvas, nature of bhava, etc. > Because we people, and my self, in many cases we are not objective > when analyzing own chart. I m not telling that you are such person, > but I telling that in generally manner. > > Because of our non objectivity it is very important that we talk in > science language and science manner about some theme in Jyotish. > > Best regards, > ashwini > > > > Dear Petar, > > > > I have my Guru placed in the 6th house. So I dont want to get dragged > > into this discussion. (8.3.1976 00.21 Ettumanur). > > > > Just want to say that Guru's position itself dont block realization. > > And please dont predict a very bad nature only with a Guru placed in > > dustana. > > > > << > > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. > > >> > > The basic rule is " bhaavaanaam tadiisa karaka vihanganaam > > trayaanamapi " meaning from bhava, its lord and karaka. Karaka comes > > third. What you speak is like saying Venus the karaka for marriage in > > 12th(rejection) wont give marriage. Jyotish is not a straight forward > > subject. > > > > Do you advocate a well placed Guru itself will make a great man? I > > advocate opposite and have many charts to prove it. > > > > Best regards, > > > > Saaji Bhaskaran > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " > > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " litsol " > > > <mishra.lalit@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > Dear Lalit,discussion in Jyotish matter is very simple in own > > nature. > > > Facts, and logic is the most powerful weapons in Jyotish. If is Guru > > > placed for example in six bhava, that mean something good, but not > > in > > > the sense of proper realizing of Atmavidya, not in the sense of > > > supportive facts in that matters. > > > > > > So, debating and discussion in Jyotish matters must be in that > > manner: > > > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. > > > If don't exist something like that story is closed. That is the way > > of > > > Jyotish discussions. > > > > > > If we failed in basic things, such is karakatvas of bhavas and > > Grahas, > > > of what purport will be that debate. I will telling you that you > > are a > > > lier, you telling mi that I m lier, and on the end nobody will bi > > > profiting of such debate. Only because we are not stick to basic > > > principles of Jyotish discussions, discussions with the facts. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > > > You are right, a wrongly placed Guru means, not clean inclination > > > > towards basic morality required to do denance and thus attaint at > > > > spirituality, sometimes the native lacks seriousness or some > > other > > > > times he is not eligible or some other time he has to face > > problems > > > > in getting enlightenment. > > > > > > > > mind and intellect leaves behind, before u take a dip deep into > > > > divine ocean of spirituality, no intelligence and no memory is > > > > required, what's required is clean heart, clean conciouseness > > which > > > > guru can give. > > > > > > > > mind and memory is required to learn and remember spiritual texts > > but > > > > to realize spirituality or to become spiritual (I always mean > > bhakti) > > > > > > > > Well placed Guru is a must, however, whole chart does matter. If > > u r > > > > into any discussion, pls. present chart of lord Rama, Krishna, > > Jesus > > > > or Siddhas. > > > > > > > > those chart will be different from chart of those who are in > > process > > > > of developing their spirituality in their lifetime. > > > > > > > > and there will be more chart different from them who are into > > rituals > > > > and have knowledge of classics like pandits, priests etc. > > > > > > > > there are different layers, in the they are > > ptretenders, > > > > dont discuss anything with them. they will try to prove each and > > > > every thing good as bad. > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " > > > > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give > > person > > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > > > spiritual > > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make > > Asura > > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for > > understanding > > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such > > principles in > > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2008 Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 Dear Lalit, << > Pls. rest assured that u r a good friend and a good person as well as > u r quite good in astrology, there is no doubt about u, 6'th is a > upachaya, so if ur Guru is placed there, means Guru's karkatwa will > grow further more. >> Thank you. I only disagree attributing only good for a well placed Guru and bad for a ill placed Guru. Real achievement is spiritual growth and realisation, all the best in your sadhana. Best regards, Saaji Bhaskaran Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " litsol " <mishra.lalit wrote: > > Dear Saji, > > Pls. rest assured that u r a good friend and a good person as well as > u r quite good in astrology, there is no doubt about u, 6'th is a > upachaya, so if ur Guru is placed there, means Guru's karkatwa will > grow further more. > > I do sadhan and i know at what layer of mind Guru functions and i m > not very good in english so i m not able to express it fully, my > testimony is specifically related to sadhana or atmvidya or > spirituality. > > I tried it once, wil try once more in the night, in one word, can say > guru enables u to have divine wisdom underneath the intellect and > thoughts. > > whole chart does matter, not one portion of it. > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Saaji Bhaskaran " > <saajik@> wrote: > > > > Dear Petar, > > > > I have my Guru placed in the 6th house. So I dont want to get > dragged > > into this discussion. (8.3.1976 00.21 Ettumanur). > > > > Just want to say that Guru's position itself dont block > realization. > > And please dont predict a very bad nature only with a Guru placed > in > > dustana. > > > > << > > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. > > >> > > The basic rule is " bhaavaanaam tadiisa karaka vihanganaam > > trayaanamapi " meaning from bhava, its lord and karaka. Karaka comes > > third. What you speak is like saying Venus the karaka for marriage > in > > 12th(rejection) wont give marriage. Jyotish is not a straight > forward > > subject. > > > > Do you advocate a well placed Guru itself will make a great man? I > > advocate opposite and have many charts to prove it. > > > > Best regards, > > > > Saaji Bhaskaran > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " > > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " litsol " > > > <mishra.lalit@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > Dear Lalit,discussion in Jyotish matter is very simple in own > > nature. > > > Facts, and logic is the most powerful weapons in Jyotish. If is > Guru > > > placed for example in six bhava, that mean something good, but > not > > in > > > the sense of proper realizing of Atmavidya, not in the sense of > > > supportive facts in that matters. > > > > > > So, debating and discussion in Jyotish matters must be in that > > manner: > > > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such > thing. > > > If don't exist something like that story is closed. That is the > way > > of > > > Jyotish discussions. > > > > > > If we failed in basic things, such is karakatvas of bhavas and > > Grahas, > > > of what purport will be that debate. I will telling you that you > > are a > > > lier, you telling mi that I m lier, and on the end nobody will bi > > > profiting of such debate. Only because we are not stick to basic > > > principles of Jyotish discussions, discussions with the facts. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > > > You are right, a wrongly placed Guru means, not clean > inclination > > > > towards basic morality required to do denance and thus attaint > at > > > > spirituality, sometimes the native lacks seriousness or some > > other > > > > times he is not eligible or some other time he has to face > > problems > > > > in getting enlightenment. > > > > > > > > mind and intellect leaves behind, before u take a dip deep into > > > > divine ocean of spirituality, no intelligence and no memory is > > > > required, what's required is clean heart, clean conciouseness > > which > > > > guru can give. > > > > > > > > mind and memory is required to learn and remember spiritual > texts > > but > > > > to realize spirituality or to become spiritual (I always mean > > bhakti) > > > > > > > > Well placed Guru is a must, however, whole chart does matter. > If > > u r > > > > into any discussion, pls. present chart of lord Rama, Krishna, > > Jesus > > > > or Siddhas. > > > > > > > > those chart will be different from chart of those who are in > > process > > > > of developing their spirituality in their lifetime. > > > > > > > > and there will be more chart different from them who are into > > rituals > > > > and have knowledge of classics like pandits, priests etc. > > > > > > > > there are different layers, in the they are > > ptretenders, > > > > dont discuss anything with them. they will try to prove each > and > > > > every thing good as bad. > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " > > > > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru > in > > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give > > person > > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > > > spiritual > > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is > in > > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make > > Asura > > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for > > understanding > > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such > > principles in > > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2008 Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 Dear Ashwini, It is more Saturn who is connected with spirituality than Guru, per pravrajya yoga combinations. Guru is about religion, tradition, knowledge and teaching. Of course others may hold a different view. Chandrashekhar. Petar wrote: Hari Om. Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give person right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some spiritual inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make Asura yoga, nothing seriously. But generally I think that such placement is bad for understanding universal principles of God and implementation of such principles in real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. Best regards, ashwini Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2008 Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 Dear Saji, Guru has a tendency to harm the bhava occupied and Guru in the 6th should therefore give good results. That is also aspects the 10th a, 12th and the 2nd is also indicative of a fair amount of worldly success. Chandrashekhar. Saaji Bhaskaran wrote: Dear Petar, I have my Guru placed in the 6th house. So I dont want to get dragged into this discussion. (8.3.1976 00.21 Ettumanur). Just want to say that Guru's position itself dont block realization. And please dont predict a very bad nature only with a Guru placed in dustana. << Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. >> The basic rule is "bhaavaanaam tadiisa karaka vihanganaam trayaanamapi" meaning from bhava, its lord and karaka. Karaka comes third. What you speak is like saying Venus the karaka for marriage in 12th(rejection) wont give marriage. Jyotish is not a straight forward subject. Do you advocate a well placed Guru itself will make a great man? I advocate opposite and have many charts to prove it. Best regards, Saaji Bhaskaran Vedic Astrologyandhealing , "Petar" <ashwinikumaras wrote: > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , "litsol" > <mishra.lalit@> wrote: > > > > Hari Om. > > Dear Lalit,discussion in Jyotish matter is very simple in own nature. > Facts, and logic is the most powerful weapons in Jyotish. If is Guru > placed for example in six bhava, that mean something good, but not in > the sense of proper realizing of Atmavidya, not in the sense of > supportive facts in that matters. > > So, debating and discussion in Jyotish matters must be in that manner: > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. > If don't exist something like that story is closed. That is the way of > Jyotish discussions. > > If we failed in basic things, such is karakatvas of bhavas and Grahas, > of what purport will be that debate. I will telling you that you are a > lier, you telling mi that I m lier, and on the end nobody will bi > profiting of such debate. Only because we are not stick to basic > principles of Jyotish discussions, discussions with the facts. > > Best regards, > ashwini > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > You are right, a wrongly placed Guru means, not clean inclination > > towards basic morality required to do denance and thus attaint at > > spirituality, sometimes the native lacks seriousness or some other > > times he is not eligible or some other time he has to face problems > > in getting enlightenment. > > > > mind and intellect leaves behind, before u take a dip deep into > > divine ocean of spirituality, no intelligence and no memory is > > required, what's required is clean heart, clean conciouseness which > > guru can give. > > > > mind and memory is required to learn and remember spiritual texts but > > to realize spirituality or to become spiritual (I always mean bhakti) > > > > Well placed Guru is a must, however, whole chart does matter. If u r > > into any discussion, pls. present chart of lord Rama, Krishna, Jesus > > or Siddhas. > > > > those chart will be different from chart of those who are in process > > of developing their spirituality in their lifetime. > > > > and there will be more chart different from them who are into rituals > > and have knowledge of classics like pandits, priests etc. > > > > there are different layers, in the they are ptretenders, > > dont discuss anything with them. they will try to prove each and > > every thing good as bad. > > > > regards, > > Lalit. > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , "Petar" > > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give person > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > spiritual > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make Asura > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for understanding > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such principles in > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > ashwini > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 7, 2008 Report Share Posted April 7, 2008 namaste Chandrashekhar ji, That is also aspects the 10th a, > 12th and the 2nd is also indicative of a fair amount of worldly success. What you say is true for my chart. As for worldly success, Amitabh Bachchan is the famous person who stands for 6th house Guru. Best regards, Saaji Bhaskaran Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Saji, > > Guru has a tendency to harm the bhava occupied and Guru in the 6th > should therefore give good results. That is also aspects the 10th a, > 12th and the 2nd is also indicative of a fair amount of worldly success. > > Chandrashekhar. > > Saaji Bhaskaran wrote: > > > > Dear Petar, > > > > I have my Guru placed in the 6th house. So I dont want to get dragged > > into this discussion. (8.3.1976 00.21 Ettumanur). > > > > Just want to say that Guru's position itself dont block realization. > > And please dont predict a very bad nature only with a Guru placed in > > dustana. > > > > << > > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. > > >> > > The basic rule is " bhaavaanaam tadiisa karaka vihanganaam > > trayaanamapi " meaning from bhava, its lord and karaka. Karaka comes > > third. What you speak is like saying Venus the karaka for marriage in > > 12th(rejection) wont give marriage. Jyotish is not a straight forward > > subject. > > > > Do you advocate a well placed Guru itself will make a great man? I > > advocate opposite and have many charts to prove it. > > > > Best regards, > > > > Saaji Bhaskaran > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, " Petar " > > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, " litsol " > > > <mishra.lalit@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > Dear Lalit,discussion in Jyotish matter is very simple in own > > nature. > > > Facts, and logic is the most powerful weapons in Jyotish. If is Guru > > > placed for example in six bhava, that mean something good, but not > > in > > > the sense of proper realizing of Atmavidya, not in the sense of > > > supportive facts in that matters. > > > > > > So, debating and discussion in Jyotish matters must be in that > > manner: > > > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. > > > If don't exist something like that story is closed. That is the way > > of > > > Jyotish discussions. > > > > > > If we failed in basic things, such is karakatvas of bhavas and > > Grahas, > > > of what purport will be that debate. I will telling you that you > > are a > > > lier, you telling mi that I m lier, and on the end nobody will bi > > > profiting of such debate. Only because we are not stick to basic > > > principles of Jyotish discussions, discussions with the facts. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > > > You are right, a wrongly placed Guru means, not clean inclination > > > > towards basic morality required to do denance and thus attaint at > > > > spirituality, sometimes the native lacks seriousness or some > > other > > > > times he is not eligible or some other time he has to face > > problems > > > > in getting enlightenment. > > > > > > > > mind and intellect leaves behind, before u take a dip deep into > > > > divine ocean of spirituality, no intelligence and no memory is > > > > required, what's required is clean heart, clean conciouseness > > which > > > > guru can give. > > > > > > > > mind and memory is required to learn and remember spiritual texts > > but > > > > to realize spirituality or to become spiritual (I always mean > > bhakti) > > > > > > > > Well placed Guru is a must, however, whole chart does matter. If > > u r > > > > into any discussion, pls. present chart of lord Rama, Krishna, > > Jesus > > > > or Siddhas. > > > > > > > > those chart will be different from chart of those who are in > > process > > > > of developing their spirituality in their lifetime. > > > > > > > > and there will be more chart different from them who are into > > rituals > > > > and have knowledge of classics like pandits, priests etc. > > > > > > > > there are different layers, in the they are > > ptretenders, > > > > dont discuss anything with them. they will try to prove each and > > > > every thing good as bad. > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, " Petar " > > > > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give > > person > > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > > > spiritual > > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make > > Asura > > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for > > understanding > > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such > > principles in > > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2008 Report Share Posted April 8, 2008 Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Saaji Bhaskaran " <saajik wrote: > Hari Om. Dear Bhaskaran, yes I was thinking of Brahmavidya. Well, I don't telling that such position of Guru is bad for may other things, but for realizing in proper way principles and aim of Vedas it is not so good. For example some people whole life spending on Jyotish and not in sadhana and self realizing. Or some spend whole life in some other Vedic science and not in sadhana and Yoga. We all know which science is for self realizing, that science is Yoga, not some other science. In Gurukuls nobody leararning Jyotish, just things for uplifment and realizing of true self. Jyotish is science who deal with material side of creation, but our true nature is not material. So, if is someone Jyotishi that those mean that is such person spiritually and in own understanding on the right path. Person may will be engaged in spirituality with such Guru, but understanding this is another story. Or Guru in eight bhava, person may research Jyotish but he never be finishing and realizing many things in Jyotish, he will be just researcher. Such person will fail in predictions with such Guru in dushtana bhavas. He will be good predictor if he heve prayog or some sidhis, but not thru classical Jyotish way. If he failed in Jyotish, what can be espect of such person in higher knowledge. But Guru in six have other benefit of course. But generally in my experience it is not good there. Karakatvas of dushtana bhava don't support karakatvas of Guru for such matters. Charts of famous persons is in most cases wrong, so I cant comment any such chart. But I will like to we speak in way of science language thru karakatvas of bhava, karakatvas of planet, nature of bhava, etc. Jyotish is science and practical science not theoretical or philosophical. So I cant discuss on that way of Jyotish, that is impossible. If somebody have discuss of that theme in Jyotish manner, it will be the best thing. Because we will be able to see some conclusions on scientific way. Best regards, ashwini Best regards, ashwini > Dear Petar, > > My reply below: > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Saaji Bhaskaran " > > <saajik@> wrote: > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > Dear Bhaskaran, of course that I have not telling that such person > it > > will not be good person, or satvick person,or spiritaul person of > > course not. > > > > But my interest of that specific position is that such position is > not > > favorable for higher state on realization of Brahmavidya or > Atmavidya. > > If you are speaking about Brahma Vidya, how many people do you think > knows Brahma Vidya? And how many do think agree on something is > there like atma vidya? And how many realise it? > > Ramana Maharshi, the chart that Narasimha ji refered is said to be > geniune as its given by his brother to late Dr BV Raman. He is one of > the greatest masters of recent times who realised self. > > > > That statement is product of researchering not just mine than of > other > > respectable Jyotishis but not respectable with own name but with > > knowledge. > > > > Guru in six bhava give some favorable qualities, but what kind of > > qualities? > > > > I will seeing later your entire chart, but I m not telling that such > > My chart please dont mix up. What I was telling, since I had Guru in > 6th it wont be prudent to discuss this topic. What I am and whats my > spiritual practices I dont want to share with anyone. But only > onething I will share that I do sandhya vandana both times (if I > reach home very late, I miss it) and recite Gayatri atleast 36 times. > > > > persons will be not spiritual inclined, on the contrary, such > persons > > may thru karma yoga for example to do big uplifment in spiritual > life, > > etc. > > I dont agree on this. > > > > > But my wish is that we talk in way of the facts thru prism of > Jyotish > > reality and Jyotish facts, like karakatvas, nature of bhava, etc. > > Because we people, and my self, in many cases we are not objective > > when analyzing own chart. > I m not telling that you are such person, > > but I telling that in generally manner. > > > > Because of our non objectivity it is very important that we talk in > > science language and science manner about some theme in Jyotish. > > > > Best regards, > > ashwini > > > > > > > Dear Petar, > > > > > > I have my Guru placed in the 6th house. So I dont want to get > dragged > > > into this discussion. (8.3.1976 00.21 Ettumanur). > > > > > > Just want to say that Guru's position itself dont block > realization. > > > And please dont predict a very bad nature only with a Guru placed > in > > > dustana. > > > > > > << > > > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such > thing. > > > >> > > > The basic rule is " bhaavaanaam tadiisa karaka vihanganaam > > > trayaanamapi " meaning from bhava, its lord and karaka. Karaka > comes > > > third. What you speak is like saying Venus the karaka for > marriage in > > > 12th(rejection) wont give marriage. Jyotish is not a straight > forward > > > subject. > > > > > > Do you advocate a well placed Guru itself will make a great man? > I > > > advocate opposite and have many charts to prove it. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > Saaji Bhaskaran > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " > > > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " litsol " > > > > <mishra.lalit@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit,discussion in Jyotish matter is very simple in own > > > nature. > > > > Facts, and logic is the most powerful weapons in Jyotish. If is > Guru > > > > placed for example in six bhava, that mean something good, but > not > > > in > > > > the sense of proper realizing of Atmavidya, not in the sense of > > > > supportive facts in that matters. > > > > > > > > So, debating and discussion in Jyotish matters must be in that > > > manner: > > > > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such > thing. > > > > If don't exist something like that story is closed. That is the > way > > > of > > > > Jyotish discussions. > > > > > > > > If we failed in basic things, such is karakatvas of bhavas and > > > Grahas, > > > > of what purport will be that debate. I will telling you that > you > > > are a > > > > lier, you telling mi that I m lier, and on the end nobody will > bi > > > > profiting of such debate. Only because we are not stick to basic > > > > principles of Jyotish discussions, discussions with the facts. > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > > > > > You are right, a wrongly placed Guru means, not clean > inclination > > > > > towards basic morality required to do denance and thus > attaint at > > > > > spirituality, sometimes the native lacks seriousness or some > > > other > > > > > times he is not eligible or some other time he has to face > > > problems > > > > > in getting enlightenment. > > > > > > > > > > mind and intellect leaves behind, before u take a dip deep > into > > > > > divine ocean of spirituality, no intelligence and no memory > is > > > > > required, what's required is clean heart, clean conciouseness > > > which > > > > > guru can give. > > > > > > > > > > mind and memory is required to learn and remember spiritual > texts > > > but > > > > > to realize spirituality or to become spiritual (I always mean > > > bhakti) > > > > > > > > > > Well placed Guru is a must, however, whole chart does matter. > If > > > u r > > > > > into any discussion, pls. present chart of lord Rama, > Krishna, > > > Jesus > > > > > or Siddhas. > > > > > > > > > > those chart will be different from chart of those who are in > > > process > > > > > of developing their spirituality in their lifetime. > > > > > > > > > > and there will be more chart different from them who are into > > > rituals > > > > > and have knowledge of classics like pandits, priests etc. > > > > > > > > > > there are different layers, in the they are > > > ptretenders, > > > > > dont discuss anything with them. they will try to prove each > and > > > > > every thing good as bad. > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " Petar " > > > > > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of > Guru in > > > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give > > > person > > > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > > > > spiritual > > > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because > is in > > > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru > make > > > Asura > > > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for > > > understanding > > > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such > > > principles in > > > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2008 Report Share Posted April 8, 2008 Om Namah Shivaye. Dear Chandrashekarji, Namaste.. I agree that Shani Mahraj has significant influence on spirituality.. Furthermore, Guru in dustana cannot be totally blemished just because he is in dustana, other qualities and conjuctions too need to be assesed. e.g. for dhanus or meen lagna, Guru is lagnesh. For Dhanu rasi, he is exalted when placed in 8H kark rasi. Further the association with a trikona lord will enhance it further.. For aquarius lagna, guru in 6H is exalted also.. etc etc. Guru in own house or exalted, will usually be auspicious, unless it is a malefic for the chart.. Also when looking for spiritual upliftment, should we not also consider which planet is the atmakarka and how is it placed in the chart? warmest regards Sheevani Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Ashwini, > > It is more Saturn who is connected with spirituality than Guru, per > pravrajya yoga combinations. Guru is about religion, tradition, > knowledge and teaching. Of course others may hold a different view. > > Chandrashekhar. > > Petar wrote: > > > > Hari Om. > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give person > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some spiritual > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make Asura > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for understanding > > universal principles of God and implementation of such principles in > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > Best regards, > > ashwini > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2008 Report Share Posted April 8, 2008 Dear Saaji, So you are in elite company. Chandrashekhar. Saaji Bhaskaran wrote: namaste Chandrashekhar ji, That is also aspects the 10th a, > 12th and the 2nd is also indicative of a fair amount of worldly success. What you say is true for my chart. As for worldly success, Amitabh Bachchan is the famous person who stands for 6th house Guru. Best regards, Saaji Bhaskaran Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Saji, > > Guru has a tendency to harm the bhava occupied and Guru in the 6th > should therefore give good results. That is also aspects the 10th a, > 12th and the 2nd is also indicative of a fair amount of worldly success. > > Chandrashekhar. > > Saaji Bhaskaran wrote: > > > > Dear Petar, > > > > I have my Guru placed in the 6th house. So I dont want to get dragged > > into this discussion. (8.3.1976 00.21 Ettumanur). > > > > Just want to say that Guru's position itself dont block realization. > > And please dont predict a very bad nature only with a Guru placed in > > dustana. > > > > << > > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. > > >> > > The basic rule is "bhaavaanaam tadiisa karaka vihanganaam > > trayaanamapi" meaning from bhava, its lord and karaka. Karaka comes > > third. What you speak is like saying Venus the karaka for marriage in > > 12th(rejection) wont give marriage. Jyotish is not a straight forward > > subject. > > > > Do you advocate a well placed Guru itself will make a great man? I > > advocate opposite and have many charts to prove it. > > > > Best regards, > > > > Saaji Bhaskaran > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, "Petar" > > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, "litsol" > > > <mishra.lalit@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > Dear Lalit,discussion in Jyotish matter is very simple in own > > nature. > > > Facts, and logic is the most powerful weapons in Jyotish. If is Guru > > > placed for example in six bhava, that mean something good, but not > > in > > > the sense of proper realizing of Atmavidya, not in the sense of > > > supportive facts in that matters. > > > > > > So, debating and discussion in Jyotish matters must be in that > > manner: > > > Which karakatvas of six bhava is good and supportive for such thing. > > > If don't exist something like that story is closed. That is the way > > of > > > Jyotish discussions. > > > > > > If we failed in basic things, such is karakatvas of bhavas and > > Grahas, > > > of what purport will be that debate. I will telling you that you > > are a > > > lier, you telling mi that I m lier, and on the end nobody will bi > > > profiting of such debate. Only because we are not stick to basic > > > principles of Jyotish discussions, discussions with the facts. > > > > > > Best regards, > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > > > You are right, a wrongly placed Guru means, not clean inclination > > > > towards basic morality required to do denance and thus attaint at > > > > spirituality, sometimes the native lacks seriousness or some > > other > > > > times he is not eligible or some other time he has to face > > problems > > > > in getting enlightenment. > > > > > > > > mind and intellect leaves behind, before u take a dip deep into > > > > divine ocean of spirituality, no intelligence and no memory is > > > > required, what's required is clean heart, clean conciouseness > > which > > > > guru can give. > > > > > > > > mind and memory is required to learn and remember spiritual texts > > but > > > > to realize spirituality or to become spiritual (I always mean > > bhakti) > > > > > > > > Well placed Guru is a must, however, whole chart does matter. If > > u r > > > > into any discussion, pls. present chart of lord Rama, Krishna, > > Jesus > > > > or Siddhas. > > > > > > > > those chart will be different from chart of those who are in > > process > > > > of developing their spirituality in their lifetime. > > > > > > > > and there will be more chart different from them who are into > > rituals > > > > and have knowledge of classics like pandits, priests etc. > > > > > > > > there are different layers, in the they are > > ptretenders, > > > > dont discuss anything with them. they will try to prove each and > > > > every thing good as bad. > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, "Petar" > > > > <ashwinikumaras@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give > > person > > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > > > spiritual > > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make > > Asura > > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for > > understanding > > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such > > principles in > > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2008 Report Share Posted April 8, 2008 Dear Sheevani, I think atmakaraka (you mean Chara I believe) also has a role to play in spirituality. No doubt about it, as it will indicate the strength of soul or actually self control. The dispositor of Saturn and Moon also have a role in spirituality indicators. Take care, Chandrashekhar. sheevani147 wrote: Om Namah Shivaye. Dear Chandrashekarji, Namaste.. I agree that Shani Mahraj has significant influence on spirituality.. Furthermore, Guru in dustana cannot be totally blemished just because he is in dustana, other qualities and conjuctions too need to be assesed. e.g. for dhanus or meen lagna, Guru is lagnesh. For Dhanu rasi, he is exalted when placed in 8H kark rasi. Further the association with a trikona lord will enhance it further.. For aquarius lagna, guru in 6H is exalted also.. etc etc. Guru in own house or exalted, will usually be auspicious, unless it is a malefic for the chart.. Also when looking for spiritual upliftment, should we not also consider which planet is the atmakarka and how is it placed in the chart? warmest regards Sheevani Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Ashwini, > > It is more Saturn who is connected with spirituality than Guru, per > pravrajya yoga combinations. Guru is about religion, tradition, > knowledge and teaching. Of course others may hold a different view. > > Chandrashekhar. > > Petar wrote: > > > > Hari Om. > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give person > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some spiritual > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make Asura > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for understanding > > universal principles of God and implementation of such principles in > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > Best regards, > > ashwini > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2008 Report Share Posted April 8, 2008 Chandrashekarji I'd like to throw a permutation at you, if you don't mind, based on your point below - how would one interpret the Chara Atmakarak (identical to the Sthira in this case as it is the Sun) as dispositor of Saturn, Moon and Lagna lord? Thanks, Maniv Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Sheevani, > > I think atmakaraka (you mean Chara I believe) also has a role to play in > spirituality. No doubt about it, as it will indicate the strength of > soul or actually self control. The dispositor of Saturn and Moon also > have a role in spirituality indicators. > > Take care, > Chandrashekhar. > > sheevani147 wrote: > > > > Om Namah Shivaye. > > > > Dear Chandrashekarji, > > > > Namaste.. > > > > I agree that Shani Mahraj has significant influence on spirituality.. > > Furthermore, Guru in dustana cannot be totally blemished just because > > he is in dustana, other qualities and conjuctions too need to be > > assesed. e.g. for dhanus or meen lagna, Guru is lagnesh. For Dhanu > > rasi, he is exalted when placed in 8H kark rasi. Further the > > association with a trikona lord will enhance it further.. For > > aquarius lagna, guru in 6H is exalted also.. etc etc. Guru in own > > house or exalted, will usually be auspicious, unless it is a malefic > > for the chart.. > > > > Also when looking for spiritual upliftment, should we not also > > consider which planet is the atmakarka and how is it placed in the > > chart? > > > > warmest regards > > Sheevani > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, Chandrashekhar > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > It is more Saturn who is connected with spirituality than Guru, per > > > pravrajya yoga combinations. Guru is about religion, tradition, > > > knowledge and teaching. Of course others may hold a different view. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > Petar wrote: > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give person > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > spiritual > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make > > Asura > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for understanding > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such principles > > in > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 8, 2008 Report Share Posted April 8, 2008 Dear Chandrashekarji, Namaste. Thank you for your response. Yes I was talking about the Charakarkas, when discussing atmakarka..its placement in rasi and navamsha and also which planet it is,, to know what qualities need to be modified or controlled etc.. eg.. sun as 9th lord- need to control ego and have satwik thoughts and actions, mars need to control aggression and remain focused, action orientated etc.. By depositor of shani and chandra, you refer to the sign depositor, who should also be well placed and in strength...What if there is mutual exchange of the nakshatra lords of guru and shani, both planets being exalted and in kendra to each other in the chandra- lagna chart? i.e. moon, shani and guru are all in kendra to each other? Personally I think that guru in 8H is viewed negatively only because in the natural horoscope with aries lagna, the 9H is the house of Dharma, and being in 8H, indicates loss of dharma etc If guru was the lord of the 9H, but placed in the 8H, then negative or inauspicious results can be predicted,, but not when guru is in own house or exalted, warmest regards Sheevani Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Sheevani, > > I think atmakaraka (you mean Chara I believe) also has a role to play in > spirituality. No doubt about it, as it will indicate the strength of > soul or actually self control. The dispositor of Saturn and Moon also > have a role in spirituality indicators. > > Take care, > Chandrashekhar. > > sheevani147 wrote: > > > > Om Namah Shivaye. > > > > Dear Chandrashekarji, > > > > Namaste.. > > > > I agree that Shani Mahraj has significant influence on spirituality.. > > Furthermore, Guru in dustana cannot be totally blemished just because > > he is in dustana, other qualities and conjuctions too need to be > > assesed. e.g. for dhanus or meen lagna, Guru is lagnesh. For Dhanu > > rasi, he is exalted when placed in 8H kark rasi. Further the > > association with a trikona lord will enhance it further.. For > > aquarius lagna, guru in 6H is exalted also.. etc etc. Guru in own > > house or exalted, will usually be auspicious, unless it is a malefic > > for the chart.. > > > > Also when looking for spiritual upliftment, should we not also > > consider which planet is the atmakarka and how is it placed in the > > chart? > > > > warmest regards > > Sheevani > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, Chandrashekhar > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > It is more Saturn who is connected with spirituality than Guru, per > > > pravrajya yoga combinations. Guru is about religion, tradition, > > > knowledge and teaching. Of course others may hold a different view. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > Petar wrote: > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give person > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > spiritual > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make > > Asura > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for understanding > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such principles > > in > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Dear Maniv, I think you mixed the two things. Chara atmakaraka is to be analyzed for its strength, like being in exaltation, own, friend's rasi, in square or trine and so on in both rasi and navamsha. This coupled with aspect of dispositor of Moon (who is unaspected by other grahas) on Saturn, or aspect of Saturn on a weak dispositor of Chandra and so on as given in Pravrajya yogas, will indicate not only if the person has potential for highest degree of spirituality like renunciation or not. The strength of the chara atmakaraka can indicate the level to which the spirituality can be attained if the jataka strives for it. strength of Chara atmakaraka will indicate if he has the capacity to sustain the efforts required to achieve the final goal. Chandrashekhar. maniv_pathak wrote: Chandrashekarji I'd like to throw a permutation at you, if you don't mind, based on your point below - how would one interpret the Chara Atmakarak (identical to the Sthira in this case as it is the Sun) as dispositor of Saturn, Moon and Lagna lord? Thanks, Maniv Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Sheevani, > > I think atmakaraka (you mean Chara I believe) also has a role to play in > spirituality. No doubt about it, as it will indicate the strength of > soul or actually self control. The dispositor of Saturn and Moon also > have a role in spirituality indicators. > > Take care, > Chandrashekhar. > > sheevani147 wrote: > > > > Om Namah Shivaye. > > > > Dear Chandrashekarji, > > > > Namaste.. > > > > I agree that Shani Mahraj has significant influence on spirituality.. > > Furthermore, Guru in dustana cannot be totally blemished just because > > he is in dustana, other qualities and conjuctions too need to be > > assesed. e.g. for dhanus or meen lagna, Guru is lagnesh. For Dhanu > > rasi, he is exalted when placed in 8H kark rasi. Further the > > association with a trikona lord will enhance it further.. For > > aquarius lagna, guru in 6H is exalted also.. etc etc. Guru in own > > house or exalted, will usually be auspicious, unless it is a malefic > > for the chart.. > > > > Also when looking for spiritual upliftment, should we not also > > consider which planet is the atmakarka and how is it placed in the > > chart? > > > > warmest regards > > Sheevani > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, Chandrashekhar > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > It is more Saturn who is connected with spirituality than Guru, per > > > pravrajya yoga combinations. Guru is about religion, tradition, > > > knowledge and teaching. Of course others may hold a different view. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > Petar wrote: > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give person > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > spiritual > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make > > Asura > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for understanding > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such principles > > in > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Dear Sheevani, Yes there is a thought amongst astrologers that Sun as atmakaraka indicates ego needing to be controlled and so on. I do not find anything supporting that premise in classics, which merely state that it is the strongest amongst grahas as a King is in his kingdom. So I look at a strong atmakaraka giving one atmabala or courage of conviction or capacity to perceive one's goal, choose the term you like. This mental strength is required if one has to achieve the aim of attaining the highest level of spirituality that may be indicated by a chart. This indication is given by unaspected lord of the rasi tenanted by Chandra aspecting Saturn or Saturn aspecting a weak lord of the rasi occupied by Chandra, amongst other yogas for pravrajya, including combination of 4 or more planets in one bhava. Lacking the perseverance and road blocks in way of spirituality, it is not necessary that every jataka whose chart shows the potential to obtain a good level of spirituality to necessarily attain it. Guru in 8th is not always bad. Guru does have a propensity to harm the house occupied and 8th being Ayush sthana Guru there could indicate some health problems that could be hereditary. Guru also indicates gulma or lymphatic glands/ sudden growth of tissues and that is another indication of disease that a person might have a tendency to have. Guru is also referred to as Jeeva the life force and his being in 8th is something I do not think needs to be explained to the learned of the list. Chandrashekhar. sheevani147 wrote: Dear Chandrashekarji, Namaste. Thank you for your response. Yes I was talking about the Charakarkas, when discussing atmakarka..its placement in rasi and navamsha and also which planet it is,, to know what qualities need to be modified or controlled etc.. eg.. sun as 9th lord- need to control ego and have satwik thoughts and actions, mars need to control aggression and remain focused, action orientated etc.. By depositor of shani and chandra, you refer to the sign depositor, who should also be well placed and in strength...What if there is mutual exchange of the nakshatra lords of guru and shani, both planets being exalted and in kendra to each other in the chandra- lagna chart? i.e. moon, shani and guru are all in kendra to each other? Personally I think that guru in 8H is viewed negatively only because in the natural horoscope with aries lagna, the 9H is the house of Dharma, and being in 8H, indicates loss of dharma etc If guru was the lord of the 9H, but placed in the 8H, then negative or inauspicious results can be predicted,, but not when guru is in own house or exalted, warmest regards Sheevani Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Sheevani, > > I think atmakaraka (you mean Chara I believe) also has a role to play in > spirituality. No doubt about it, as it will indicate the strength of > soul or actually self control. The dispositor of Saturn and Moon also > have a role in spirituality indicators. > > Take care, > Chandrashekhar. > > sheevani147 wrote: > > > > Om Namah Shivaye. > > > > Dear Chandrashekarji, > > > > Namaste.. > > > > I agree that Shani Mahraj has significant influence on spirituality.. > > Furthermore, Guru in dustana cannot be totally blemished just because > > he is in dustana, other qualities and conjuctions too need to be > > assesed. e.g. for dhanus or meen lagna, Guru is lagnesh. For Dhanu > > rasi, he is exalted when placed in 8H kark rasi. Further the > > association with a trikona lord will enhance it further.. For > > aquarius lagna, guru in 6H is exalted also.. etc etc. Guru in own > > house or exalted, will usually be auspicious, unless it is a malefic > > for the chart.. > > > > Also when looking for spiritual upliftment, should we not also > > consider which planet is the atmakarka and how is it placed in the > > chart? > > > > warmest regards > > Sheevani > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, Chandrashekhar > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > It is more Saturn who is connected with spirituality than Guru, per > > > pravrajya yoga combinations. Guru is about religion, tradition, > > > knowledge and teaching. Of course others may hold a different view. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > Petar wrote: > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru in > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give person > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > spiritual > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is in > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make > > Asura > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for understanding > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such principles > > in > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 9, 2008 Report Share Posted April 9, 2008 Chandrashekarji My question related to the placement of Moon,Saturn and Lagna lord in Leo. In this particular case, the dispositor Sun is also the Chara Atmakaraka, and is aspected by Saturn. Apologies for the confusion, the fault lies in my ambigious communication! Thanks, Maniv Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Maniv, > > I think you mixed the two things. Chara atmakaraka is to be analyzed for > its strength, like being in exaltation, own, friend's rasi, in square or > trine and so on in both rasi and navamsha. This coupled with aspect of > dispositor of Moon (who is unaspected by other grahas) on Saturn, or > aspect of Saturn on a weak dispositor of Chandra and so on as given in > Pravrajya yogas, will indicate not only if the person has potential for > highest degree of spirituality like renunciation or not. The strength of > the chara atmakaraka can indicate the level to which the spirituality > can be attained if the jataka strives for it. strength of Chara > atmakaraka will indicate if he has the capacity to sustain the efforts > required to achieve the final goal. > > Chandrashekhar. > > maniv_pathak wrote: > > > > Chandrashekarji > > > > I'd like to throw a permutation at you, if you don't mind, based on > > your point below - how would one interpret the Chara Atmakarak > > (identical to the Sthira in this case as it is the Sun) as dispositor > > of Saturn, Moon and Lagna lord? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Maniv > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, Chandrashekhar > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sheevani, > > > > > > I think atmakaraka (you mean Chara I believe) also has a role to > > play in > > > spirituality. No doubt about it, as it will indicate the strength > > of > > > soul or actually self control. The dispositor of Saturn and Moon > > also > > > have a role in spirituality indicators. > > > > > > Take care, > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > sheevani147 wrote: > > > > > > > > Om Namah Shivaye. > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekarji, > > > > > > > > Namaste.. > > > > > > > > I agree that Shani Mahraj has significant influence on > > spirituality.. > > > > Furthermore, Guru in dustana cannot be totally blemished just > > because > > > > he is in dustana, other qualities and conjuctions too need to be > > > > assesed. e.g. for dhanus or meen lagna, Guru is lagnesh. For Dhanu > > > > rasi, he is exalted when placed in 8H kark rasi. Further the > > > > association with a trikona lord will enhance it further.. For > > > > aquarius lagna, guru in 6H is exalted also.. etc etc. Guru in own > > > > house or exalted, will usually be auspicious, unless it is a > > malefic > > > > for the chart.. > > > > > > > > Also when looking for spiritual upliftment, should we not also > > > > consider which planet is the atmakarka and how is it placed in the > > > > chart? > > > > > > > > warmest regards > > > > Sheevani > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > > > > > It is more Saturn who is connected with spirituality than Guru, > > per > > > > > pravrajya yoga combinations. Guru is about religion, tradition, > > > > > knowledge and teaching. Of course others may hold a different > > view. > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > Petar wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru > > in > > > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give > > person > > > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > > > spiritual > > > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is > > in > > > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make > > > > Asura > > > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for > > understanding > > > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such > > principles > > > > in > > > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 10, 2008 Report Share Posted April 10, 2008 Dear Chandrashekarji, Namaste. Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge and your patient guidance. May I ask your personal take on using Rahu.. some only consider 7 planets when analysing atmakarka status, others use rahu too.. In my case, when using 8 planets,, rahu becomes atma karka, otherwise surya becomes atmakarka.. As rahu in lagna aspects surya in 7H, it creates a rajyoga or atmakarka/atmayakarka, otherwise surya does not aspect shani who becomes atmyakarka if rahu is not used.. which interpretation is more valid? Thank you for your kind imput.. warmest regards Sheevani Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Sheevani, > > Yes there is a thought amongst astrologers that Sun as atmakaraka > indicates ego needing to be controlled and so on. I do not find anything > supporting that premise in classics, which merely state that it is the > strongest amongst grahas as a King is in his kingdom. So I look at a > strong atmakaraka giving one atmabala or courage of conviction or > capacity to perceive one's goal, choose the term you like. This mental > strength is required if one has to achieve the aim of attaining the > highest level of spirituality that may be indicated by a chart. This > indication is given by unaspected lord of the rasi tenanted by Chandra > aspecting Saturn or Saturn aspecting a weak lord of the rasi occupied by > Chandra, amongst other yogas for pravrajya, including combination of 4 > or more planets in one bhava. Lacking the perseverance and road blocks > in way of spirituality, it is not necessary that every jataka whose > chart shows the potential to obtain a good level of spirituality to > necessarily attain it. > > Guru in 8th is not always bad. Guru does have a propensity to harm the > house occupied and 8th being Ayush sthana Guru there could indicate some > health problems that could be hereditary. Guru also indicates gulma or > lymphatic glands/ sudden growth of tissues and that is another > indication of disease that a person might have a tendency to have. Guru > is also referred to as Jeeva the life force and his being in 8th is > something I do not think needs to be explained to the learned of the list. > > Chandrashekhar. > > sheevani147 wrote: > > > > Dear Chandrashekarji, > > > > Namaste. > > > > Thank you for your response. Yes I was talking about the Charakarkas, > > when discussing atmakarka..its placement in rasi and navamsha and > > also which planet it is,, to know what qualities need to be modified > > or controlled etc.. eg.. sun as 9th lord- need to control ego and > > have satwik thoughts and actions, mars need to control aggression and > > remain focused, action orientated etc.. > > > > By depositor of shani and chandra, you refer to the sign depositor, > > who should also be well placed and in strength...What if there is > > mutual exchange of the nakshatra lords of guru and shani, both > > planets being exalted and in kendra to each other in the chandra- > > lagna chart? i.e. moon, shani and guru are all in kendra to each > > other? > > > > Personally I think that guru in 8H is viewed negatively only because > > in the natural horoscope with aries lagna, the 9H is the house of > > Dharma, and being in 8H, indicates loss of dharma etc If guru was the > > lord of the 9H, but placed in the 8H, then negative or inauspicious > > results can be predicted,, but not when guru is in own house or > > exalted, > > > > warmest regards > > Sheevani > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, Chandrashekhar > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sheevani, > > > > > > I think atmakaraka (you mean Chara I believe) also has a role to > > play in > > > spirituality. No doubt about it, as it will indicate the strength > > of > > > soul or actually self control. The dispositor of Saturn and Moon > > also > > > have a role in spirituality indicators. > > > > > > Take care, > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > sheevani147 wrote: > > > > > > > > Om Namah Shivaye. > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekarji, > > > > > > > > Namaste.. > > > > > > > > I agree that Shani Mahraj has significant influence on > > spirituality.. > > > > Furthermore, Guru in dustana cannot be totally blemished just > > because > > > > he is in dustana, other qualities and conjuctions too need to be > > > > assesed. e.g. for dhanus or meen lagna, Guru is lagnesh. For Dhanu > > > > rasi, he is exalted when placed in 8H kark rasi. Further the > > > > association with a trikona lord will enhance it further.. For > > > > aquarius lagna, guru in 6H is exalted also.. etc etc. Guru in own > > > > house or exalted, will usually be auspicious, unless it is a > > malefic > > > > for the chart.. > > > > > > > > Also when looking for spiritual upliftment, should we not also > > > > consider which planet is the atmakarka and how is it placed in the > > > > chart? > > > > > > > > warmest regards > > > > Sheevani > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > > > > > It is more Saturn who is connected with spirituality than Guru, > > per > > > > > pravrajya yoga combinations. Guru is about religion, tradition, > > > > > knowledge and teaching. Of course others may hold a different > > view. > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > Petar wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru > > in > > > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give > > person > > > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > > > spiritual > > > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is > > in > > > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make > > > > Asura > > > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for > > understanding > > > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such > > principles > > > > in > > > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 10, 2008 Report Share Posted April 10, 2008 Dear Maniv, You may have to be more specific. Saturn has 3 aspects. You have also to specify the bhava in which Moon, Saturn and Lagna lord are placed. If Sun is weak and unaspected by any other planets, aspect of Saturn on it could give spiritual abilities or tendencies. Chandrashekhar. maniv_pathak wrote: Chandrashekarji My question related to the placement of Moon,Saturn and Lagna lord in Leo. In this particular case, the dispositor Sun is also the Chara Atmakaraka, and is aspected by Saturn. Apologies for the confusion, the fault lies in my ambigious communication! Thanks, Maniv Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Maniv, > > I think you mixed the two things. Chara atmakaraka is to be analyzed for > its strength, like being in exaltation, own, friend's rasi, in square or > trine and so on in both rasi and navamsha. This coupled with aspect of > dispositor of Moon (who is unaspected by other grahas) on Saturn, or > aspect of Saturn on a weak dispositor of Chandra and so on as given in > Pravrajya yogas, will indicate not only if the person has potential for > highest degree of spirituality like renunciation or not. The strength of > the chara atmakaraka can indicate the level to which the spirituality > can be attained if the jataka strives for it. strength of Chara > atmakaraka will indicate if he has the capacity to sustain the efforts > required to achieve the final goal. > > Chandrashekhar. > > maniv_pathak wrote: > > > > Chandrashekarji > > > > I'd like to throw a permutation at you, if you don't mind, based on > > your point below - how would one interpret the Chara Atmakarak > > (identical to the Sthira in this case as it is the Sun) as dispositor > > of Saturn, Moon and Lagna lord? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Maniv > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, Chandrashekhar > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sheevani, > > > > > > I think atmakaraka (you mean Chara I believe) also has a role to > > play in > > > spirituality. No doubt about it, as it will indicate the strength > > of > > > soul or actually self control. The dispositor of Saturn and Moon > > also > > > have a role in spirituality indicators. > > > > > > Take care, > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > sheevani147 wrote: > > > > > > > > Om Namah Shivaye. > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekarji, > > > > > > > > Namaste.. > > > > > > > > I agree that Shani Mahraj has significant influence on > > spirituality.. > > > > Furthermore, Guru in dustana cannot be totally blemished just > > because > > > > he is in dustana, other qualities and conjuctions too need to be > > > > assesed. e.g. for dhanus or meen lagna, Guru is lagnesh. For Dhanu > > > > rasi, he is exalted when placed in 8H kark rasi. Further the > > > > association with a trikona lord will enhance it further.. For > > > > aquarius lagna, guru in 6H is exalted also.. etc etc. Guru in own > > > > house or exalted, will usually be auspicious, unless it is a > > malefic > > > > for the chart.. > > > > > > > > Also when looking for spiritual upliftment, should we not also > > > > consider which planet is the atmakarka and how is it placed in the > > > > chart? > > > > > > > > warmest regards > > > > Sheevani > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > > > > > It is more Saturn who is connected with spirituality than Guru, > > per > > > > > pravrajya yoga combinations. Guru is about religion, tradition, > > > > > knowledge and teaching. Of course others may hold a different > > view. > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > Petar wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru > > in > > > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give > > person > > > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > > > spiritual > > > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is > > in > > > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make > > > > Asura > > > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for > > understanding > > > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such > > principles > > > > in > > > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 10, 2008 Report Share Posted April 10, 2008 Dear Sheevani, Since rahu and Surya in 1/7 means Surya is conjunct Ketu. Now if natural and chara atmakaraka are devoid of strength, the spouse could be devoid of atma bala. If that is the case you could consider that Rahu could not be the AK. That to me would be the easiest way to find out who should be considered the Chara Atmakaraka. Most of the Jaimini texts seem to consider only 7 chara karakas. Parashara however does indicate considering rahu as AK. So you have to apply principles and find for yourself. Take care, Chandrashekhar. sheevani147 wrote: Dear Chandrashekarji, Namaste. Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge and your patient guidance. May I ask your personal take on using Rahu.. some only consider 7 planets when analysing atmakarka status, others use rahu too.. In my case, when using 8 planets,, rahu becomes atma karka, otherwise surya becomes atmakarka.. As rahu in lagna aspects surya in 7H, it creates a rajyoga or atmakarka/atmayakarka, otherwise surya does not aspect shani who becomes atmyakarka if rahu is not used.. which interpretation is more valid? Thank you for your kind imput.. warmest regards Sheevani Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Sheevani, > > Yes there is a thought amongst astrologers that Sun as atmakaraka > indicates ego needing to be controlled and so on. I do not find anything > supporting that premise in classics, which merely state that it is the > strongest amongst grahas as a King is in his kingdom. So I look at a > strong atmakaraka giving one atmabala or courage of conviction or > capacity to perceive one's goal, choose the term you like. This mental > strength is required if one has to achieve the aim of attaining the > highest level of spirituality that may be indicated by a chart. This > indication is given by unaspected lord of the rasi tenanted by Chandra > aspecting Saturn or Saturn aspecting a weak lord of the rasi occupied by > Chandra, amongst other yogas for pravrajya, including combination of 4 > or more planets in one bhava. Lacking the perseverance and road blocks > in way of spirituality, it is not necessary that every jataka whose > chart shows the potential to obtain a good level of spirituality to > necessarily attain it. > > Guru in 8th is not always bad. Guru does have a propensity to harm the > house occupied and 8th being Ayush sthana Guru there could indicate some > health problems that could be hereditary. Guru also indicates gulma or > lymphatic glands/ sudden growth of tissues and that is another > indication of disease that a person might have a tendency to have. Guru > is also referred to as Jeeva the life force and his being in 8th is > something I do not think needs to be explained to the learned of the list. > > Chandrashekhar. > > sheevani147 wrote: > > > > Dear Chandrashekarji, > > > > Namaste. > > > > Thank you for your response. Yes I was talking about the Charakarkas, > > when discussing atmakarka..its placement in rasi and navamsha and > > also which planet it is,, to know what qualities need to be modified > > or controlled etc.. eg.. sun as 9th lord- need to control ego and > > have satwik thoughts and actions, mars need to control aggression and > > remain focused, action orientated etc.. > > > > By depositor of shani and chandra, you refer to the sign depositor, > > who should also be well placed and in strength...What if there is > > mutual exchange of the nakshatra lords of guru and shani, both > > planets being exalted and in kendra to each other in the chandra- > > lagna chart? i.e. moon, shani and guru are all in kendra to each > > other? > > > > Personally I think that guru in 8H is viewed negatively only because > > in the natural horoscope with aries lagna, the 9H is the house of > > Dharma, and being in 8H, indicates loss of dharma etc If guru was the > > lord of the 9H, but placed in the 8H, then negative or inauspicious > > results can be predicted,, but not when guru is in own house or > > exalted, > > > > warmest regards > > Sheevani > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, Chandrashekhar > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sheevani, > > > > > > I think atmakaraka (you mean Chara I believe) also has a role to > > play in > > > spirituality. No doubt about it, as it will indicate the strength > > of > > > soul or actually self control. The dispositor of Saturn and Moon > > also > > > have a role in spirituality indicators. > > > > > > Take care, > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > sheevani147 wrote: > > > > > > > > Om Namah Shivaye. > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekarji, > > > > > > > > Namaste.. > > > > > > > > I agree that Shani Mahraj has significant influence on > > spirituality.. > > > > Furthermore, Guru in dustana cannot be totally blemished just > > because > > > > he is in dustana, other qualities and conjuctions too need to be > > > > assesed. e.g. for dhanus or meen lagna, Guru is lagnesh. For Dhanu > > > > rasi, he is exalted when placed in 8H kark rasi. Further the > > > > association with a trikona lord will enhance it further.. For > > > > aquarius lagna, guru in 6H is exalted also.. etc etc. Guru in own > > > > house or exalted, will usually be auspicious, unless it is a > > malefic > > > > for the chart.. > > > > > > > > Also when looking for spiritual upliftment, should we not also > > > > consider which planet is the atmakarka and how is it placed in the > > > > chart? > > > > > > > > warmest regards > > > > Sheevani > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > > > > > It is more Saturn who is connected with spirituality than Guru, > > per > > > > > pravrajya yoga combinations. Guru is about religion, tradition, > > > > > knowledge and teaching. Of course others may hold a different > > view. > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > Petar wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of Guru > > in > > > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give > > person > > > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give some > > > > spiritual > > > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But because is > > in > > > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru make > > > > Asura > > > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for > > understanding > > > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such > > principles > > > > in > > > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 10, 2008 Report Share Posted April 10, 2008 Chandrashekarji The conjunction of Moon, Saturn and Mars (lagna lord) occurs in the 5th house. Saturn aspects the Sun by its 3rd aspect;Sun is also tightly conjunct Mercury (2nd house, Tauras). Maniv Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Maniv, > > You may have to be more specific. Saturn has 3 aspects. You have also to > specify the bhava in which Moon, Saturn and Lagna lord are placed. If > Sun is weak and unaspected by any other planets, aspect of Saturn on it > could give spiritual abilities or tendencies. > > Chandrashekhar. > > maniv_pathak wrote: > > > > Chandrashekarji > > > > My question related to the placement of Moon,Saturn and Lagna lord > > in Leo. In this particular case, the dispositor Sun is also the Chara > > Atmakaraka, and is aspected by Saturn. > > > > Apologies for the confusion, the fault lies in my ambigious > > communication! > > > > Thanks, > > > > Maniv > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, Chandrashekhar > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Maniv, > > > > > > I think you mixed the two things. Chara atmakaraka is to be > > analyzed for > > > its strength, like being in exaltation, own, friend's rasi, in > > square or > > > trine and so on in both rasi and navamsha. This coupled with aspect > > of > > > dispositor of Moon (who is unaspected by other grahas) on Saturn, > > or > > > aspect of Saturn on a weak dispositor of Chandra and so on as given > > in > > > Pravrajya yogas, will indicate not only if the person has potential > > for > > > highest degree of spirituality like renunciation or not. The > > strength of > > > the chara atmakaraka can indicate the level to which the > > spirituality > > > can be attained if the jataka strives for it. strength of Chara > > > atmakaraka will indicate if he has the capacity to sustain the > > efforts > > > required to achieve the final goal. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > maniv_pathak wrote: > > > > > > > > Chandrashekarji > > > > > > > > I'd like to throw a permutation at you, if you don't mind, based > > on > > > > your point below - how would one interpret the Chara Atmakarak > > > > (identical to the Sthira in this case as it is the Sun) as > > dispositor > > > > of Saturn, Moon and Lagna lord? > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > Maniv > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sheevani, > > > > > > > > > > I think atmakaraka (you mean Chara I believe) also has a role to > > > > play in > > > > > spirituality. No doubt about it, as it will indicate the > > strength > > > > of > > > > > soul or actually self control. The dispositor of Saturn and Moon > > > > also > > > > > have a role in spirituality indicators. > > > > > > > > > > Take care, > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > sheevani147 wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Namah Shivaye. > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekarji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste.. > > > > > > > > > > > > I agree that Shani Mahraj has significant influence on > > > > spirituality.. > > > > > > Furthermore, Guru in dustana cannot be totally blemished just > > > > because > > > > > > he is in dustana, other qualities and conjuctions too need to > > be > > > > > > assesed. e.g. for dhanus or meen lagna, Guru is lagnesh. For > > Dhanu > > > > > > rasi, he is exalted when placed in 8H kark rasi. Further the > > > > > > association with a trikona lord will enhance it further.. For > > > > > > aquarius lagna, guru in 6H is exalted also.. etc etc. Guru in > > own > > > > > > house or exalted, will usually be auspicious, unless it is a > > > > malefic > > > > > > for the chart.. > > > > > > > > > > > > Also when looking for spiritual upliftment, should we not also > > > > > > consider which planet is the atmakarka and how is it placed > > in the > > > > > > chart? > > > > > > > > > > > > warmest regards > > > > > > Sheevani > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is more Saturn who is connected with spirituality than > > Guru, > > > > per > > > > > > > pravrajya yoga combinations. Guru is about religion, > > tradition, > > > > > > > knowledge and teaching. Of course others may hold a > > different > > > > view. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Petar wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of > > Guru > > > > in > > > > > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give > > > > person > > > > > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give > > some > > > > > > spiritual > > > > > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But > > because is > > > > in > > > > > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru > > make > > > > > > Asura > > > > > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for > > > > understanding > > > > > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such > > > > principles > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 10, 2008 Report Share Posted April 10, 2008 Dear Chandrashekarji, Namaste. Thank you for your kind, tolerant guidance.. I have learnt something new. Thank you. warmest regards Sheevani Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Sheevani, > > Since rahu and Surya in 1/7 means Surya is conjunct Ketu. Now if natural > and chara atmakaraka are devoid of strength, the spouse could be devoid > of atma bala. If that is the case you could consider that Rahu could not > be the AK. That to me would be the easiest way to find out who should be > considered the Chara Atmakaraka. Most of the Jaimini texts seem to > consider only 7 chara karakas. Parashara however does indicate > considering rahu as AK. So you have to apply principles and find for > yourself. > > Take care, > Chandrashekhar. > > sheevani147 wrote: > > > > Dear Chandrashekarji, > > > > Namaste. > > > > Thank you so much for sharing your knowledge and your patient > > guidance. > > > > May I ask your personal take on using Rahu.. some only consider 7 > > planets when analysing atmakarka status, others use rahu too.. > > > > In my case, when using 8 planets,, rahu becomes atma karka, otherwise > > surya becomes atmakarka.. As rahu in lagna aspects surya in 7H, it > > creates a rajyoga or atmakarka/atmayakarka, otherwise surya does not > > aspect shani who becomes atmyakarka if rahu is not used.. which > > interpretation is more valid? > > > > Thank you for your kind imput.. > > > > warmest regards > > Sheevani > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, Chandrashekhar > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sheevani, > > > > > > Yes there is a thought amongst astrologers that Sun as atmakaraka > > > indicates ego needing to be controlled and so on. I do not find > > anything > > > supporting that premise in classics, which merely state that it is > > the > > > strongest amongst grahas as a King is in his kingdom. So I look at > > a > > > strong atmakaraka giving one atmabala or courage of conviction or > > > capacity to perceive one's goal, choose the term you like. This > > mental > > > strength is required if one has to achieve the aim of attaining the > > > highest level of spirituality that may be indicated by a chart. > > This > > > indication is given by unaspected lord of the rasi tenanted by > > Chandra > > > aspecting Saturn or Saturn aspecting a weak lord of the rasi > > occupied by > > > Chandra, amongst other yogas for pravrajya, including combination > > of 4 > > > or more planets in one bhava. Lacking the perseverance and road > > blocks > > > in way of spirituality, it is not necessary that every jataka whose > > > chart shows the potential to obtain a good level of spirituality to > > > necessarily attain it. > > > > > > Guru in 8th is not always bad. Guru does have a propensity to harm > > the > > > house occupied and 8th being Ayush sthana Guru there could indicate > > some > > > health problems that could be hereditary. Guru also indicates gulma > > or > > > lymphatic glands/ sudden growth of tissues and that is another > > > indication of disease that a person might have a tendency to have. > > Guru > > > is also referred to as Jeeva the life force and his being in 8th is > > > something I do not think needs to be explained to the learned of > > the list. > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > sheevani147 wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekarji, > > > > > > > > Namaste. > > > > > > > > Thank you for your response. Yes I was talking about the > > Charakarkas, > > > > when discussing atmakarka..its placement in rasi and navamsha and > > > > also which planet it is,, to know what qualities need to be > > modified > > > > or controlled etc.. eg.. sun as 9th lord- need to control ego and > > > > have satwik thoughts and actions, mars need to control aggression > > and > > > > remain focused, action orientated etc.. > > > > > > > > By depositor of shani and chandra, you refer to the sign > > depositor, > > > > who should also be well placed and in strength...What if there is > > > > mutual exchange of the nakshatra lords of guru and shani, both > > > > planets being exalted and in kendra to each other in the chandra- > > > > lagna chart? i.e. moon, shani and guru are all in kendra to each > > > > other? > > > > > > > > Personally I think that guru in 8H is viewed negatively only > > because > > > > in the natural horoscope with aries lagna, the 9H is the house of > > > > Dharma, and being in 8H, indicates loss of dharma etc If guru was > > the > > > > lord of the 9H, but placed in the 8H, then negative or > > inauspicious > > > > results can be predicted,, but not when guru is in own house or > > > > exalted, > > > > > > > > warmest regards > > > > Sheevani > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sheevani, > > > > > > > > > > I think atmakaraka (you mean Chara I believe) also has a role to > > > > play in > > > > > spirituality. No doubt about it, as it will indicate the > > strength > > > > of > > > > > soul or actually self control. The dispositor of Saturn and Moon > > > > also > > > > > have a role in spirituality indicators. > > > > > > > > > > Take care, > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > sheevani147 wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Namah Shivaye. > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekarji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Namaste.. > > > > > > > > > > > > I agree that Shani Mahraj has significant influence on > > > > spirituality.. > > > > > > Furthermore, Guru in dustana cannot be totally blemished just > > > > because > > > > > > he is in dustana, other qualities and conjuctions too need to > > be > > > > > > assesed. e.g. for dhanus or meen lagna, Guru is lagnesh. For > > Dhanu > > > > > > rasi, he is exalted when placed in 8H kark rasi. Further the > > > > > > association with a trikona lord will enhance it further.. For > > > > > > aquarius lagna, guru in 6H is exalted also.. etc etc. Guru in > > own > > > > > > house or exalted, will usually be auspicious, unless it is a > > > > malefic > > > > > > for the chart.. > > > > > > > > > > > > Also when looking for spiritual upliftment, should we not also > > > > > > consider which planet is the atmakarka and how is it placed > > in the > > > > > > chart? > > > > > > > > > > > > warmest regards > > > > > > Sheevani > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Ashwini, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > It is more Saturn who is connected with spirituality than > > Guru, > > > > per > > > > > > > pravrajya yoga combinations. Guru is about religion, > > tradition, > > > > > > > knowledge and teaching. Of course others may hold a > > different > > > > view. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Petar wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hari Om. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear members, what is yours opinion of that placement of > > Guru > > > > in > > > > > > > > chart. In my opinion such Guru will not be capable to give > > > > person > > > > > > > > right understanding of real aim of Vedas. But can give > > some > > > > > > spiritual > > > > > > > > inclination when is in twelve and eight bhava. But > > because is > > > > in > > > > > > > > dushtana bhavas especially in eight bhava when that Guru > > make > > > > > > Asura > > > > > > > > yoga, nothing seriously. > > > > > > > > But generally I think that such placement is bad for > > > > understanding > > > > > > > > universal principles of God and implementation of such > > > > principles > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > real life, it doesn't matters in which bhava is. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > > > > > ashwini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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