Guest guest Posted June 15, 2008 Report Share Posted June 15, 2008 Dear RK Daa, Sri Chandrashekhar Ji, Nalini Ji and Group, I m surprised to see following is written by RK Daa, A conclusion which has no clear endorsement in a classics - A.) 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded, with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability to devise plans B.) The core vidya sthana is 4th house - Almost similar opinion is given by Sri Chandrashekhar Ji. I examined both the statements, Sorry, both needs serious review, however, It's true that confusion between 4'th with and 9'th with 10'th for some common significations is quite normal, Great BV Raman also could not reach any visible distinction, the answer lies in tradition, since cnturies such a tradition has been continued in several pockets of india, however, our classics are quite clear on primary and secondary kind of significations of the bhavas. To remove the doubt of members and to put an end to this confusion, which sometimes forces astrologer to stretch the basics to reach a justification, i m giving some shlokas of classics. 4'th is unaminously called " Turya Sthaana " , " Mitra Alaya " or " Sukha Sthaana " , The shloka is - Turyasthan Sanstham Phalam tat Vakscha-Sthaanam Purushanam Niruktam (Principles or Ethics expressed) ! Amba (Mother) BandhuKchhoni Mitralayanam (Public Support by friends and relatives) Sarva Annanam (Food Grain, Yield of effort)GramYug Vahananaam (Land, Village, Vehicles). 5'th is unaminously called place for " Mati Prabandhaha " , " Budhi Prabandha " or Management of Mind and Intellect. The shloka goes - 1. Mati Prabandhaha Sutabhe Nijodaram (One's own Children), Vinaye(Modesty, Politeness)- Garbha-Sthiti, Mantra Sadhanam Modesty !! 2. Santan Garbha Sthitineeti Sanstha, Mantradi Siddhi Vinayash Vidya (Learning/Education), Buddhi Prabandhaha Sutabhe Vichintyam Etat annu JatakGyaha !! Now, where is the confusion, I think that was there because the 4'th denotes how u keep what u acquire, the immovables, so, the knowledge that you retain after studying a subject, is to be seen from the 4'th not the education, study or ur's learning itself. I w'd request RK Daa to review the 4'th house and education in his own case, Why this placement has not given you a bright academic education. Let's not misundersatand the primary and seconday significations. regards, Lalit. Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " arkaydash " <arkaydash wrote: > > > Dear Nalini, > > Your 4th house is aspected by its lord. Strengthened. It is aspected by > Mercury, not by any other planet. Stenghtened and imbued with Mc, right? > Capable of quick learning. Mc in water sign. Intuitive. > > My understaning is that 4th speaks of how learned one is. If it is in > the care of its benefic lord and is by and large unsullied by malefic > impact, learning is assured. If the care is with Mc, have no doubt. Mc > as 4th lord ensures that the real wealth is his or her learning; other > tangible assets will gravitate in the goodness of time via Mercury's > prasaada (grants). As lagna lord in debility, Mc spells periods of > concern; when there is a bad run of dasa etc, health may not remain > unassailed. Your fluctuating academic performances have to be seen in > the context of the then operating dasa and transit. Transit of the Big > Two. > > Third house has to do with dexeterity, manual. The act of writing & > communication & retention (dhruti) thus also patience. Benefics there: a > person writes a good hand. His patience does not run out. > > The core vidya sthana is 4th house. With a strong, unalloyed 4th house, > one cannot command vidya. Neither 5th, nor 9th can compensate. 5th is > intelligence in the sense of discernement. 9th is the ability to process > ideas, abstaract systems. 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded > with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability to > devise plans. > > Well, 9th. Some other time. > > RK > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , nalini swamy > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > Respected Chandrasekhar ji, RK da,Lalit ji and others, > > Namaskar. > > When it comes to handwriting, a native's chart where Guru is in > makara, lagna with exalted Sukra and neecha Budha yuti in Meena. > > The native is left-handed when writing, eating with implements like > spoon, fork etc. Right-handed when it comes to using bare hands. The > handwriting is terrible too. Is it due to neecha 3rd lord? The 3rd house > here is not aspected by a malefic; Native dislikes writing, even > academic. Native has not done very well academically despite being very > intelligent as he does no like even to write the answers in full but > just enough to get him through. > > Now coming to academic excellence and grades, in my chart my 4th > bhava, Kanya, has Rahu. The LL and 4th lord are in Meena, deb, with Ketu > and enemy Chandra. In Navamnsha, Budha and Ketu occupy Karka, again to > do with Chandra in the 4th, and the lagna is Rishaba( yuti dwiguru). > > I have done extremely well in school, average in Intermediate and very > well in Graduation. Again average in Post-grad. I am now doing a > Bachelors and a post grad all over again... I am so facscinated by the > fact that the grades dont follow the pattern I mentioned earlier. I > started off very,very well and nose-dived in the 2nd year. A lot to do > with Gochara I suppose. > > I also do well in abstract concepts and writing, not very good in > science when it comes to grades. Even in Jyotish, I am helped more with > intuitive stuff rather than mere astro concepts which is also why I > hesitate to discuss charts (: > > Love to have your inputs, > > Nalini > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar sharma.chandrashekhar@ > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > Friday, 13 June, 2008 5:50:13 AM > > Re: [Vedic Astrologyandhealing] Re: ShahJahan and AurangJeb - > AstroAnalysis (Related Q to Chandrashekarji) > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > There is a difference between handwriting and Likhita vidya. It is > only in these days that even 3 year old are taught to write that too two > languages. Earlier till one attained 1st standard most of the teaching > was by making one memorize tables, shlokas and so on. With time the > definition of what is Maukhik, Likhita, learnt for getting Gyaan and so > on changes. I remember the times when those who had done Matriculation > were considered highly educated. These days it is not uncommon to see > even rickshaw-wallas being graduates or even post graduates. > > > > In your case did you notice that your 4th bhava is in Papakartari and > its lord Mercury is afflicted by Ketu occupying the rasi of its enemy > Moon and that of Jupiter in Navamsha? > > > > Think about this. > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > Sri Chandrashekhar Ji and Our RK Da, > > > > I find it's important to mention that lekhan (writing) is more > > related to 3'rd house not the 4'th, I have seen dozens of the cases > > when 3rd is occupied by a malific (my own case) and if aspected by a > > malific (my 2 brother's case), one is not only poor in writing good > > stuff but his handwriting is also very very bad. > > > > Also exclusively 4'th can not be graduation, my 4'th house is > > occupied by Venus, aspected by Ju, I did very bad in my graduation, > > whereas in school and in my PG i did excellent. > > > > 5'th dominates in chart for the judgement of education. > > > > regards, > > Lalit > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com, Chandrashekhar > > <sharma.chandrashek har@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear RK da, > > > > > > I look to 2nd for education up to secondary level, 4th for > > graduation > > > and 5th for post graduation, 9th being the Doctoral or higher > > education. > > > Actually the 2nd is Maukhik (verbal) Vidya, 4th Likhita (written > > word) > > > vidya, 5th the Gyaan or acquired knowledge and 9th higher form of > > the > > > acquired knowledge. However we have to fit this in with the > > current > > > education pattern. May be if a person is doing Ph.D. only to get > > > University scales and not for any worthwhile research, we could > > look at > > > it in the 4th bhava. > > > > > > Ketu does not become lord of the Bhavas, but in Vimshottari dashas > > he > > > does give results like that of Mars who in the instant case > > happens to > > > be Maraka, being 2nd and 7th lord. Since it also gives results of > > > Saturn, depending on transits, it can also give education , or > > progeny > > > depending on the person's age. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekharji, > > > > > > > > Thanks. I would like to know how you read the graduation slab, > > which is > > > > neither higher education nor early education. Please tell. > > > > > > > > Ketu giving Mars-like results is understandable but to my mind, > > not to > > > > the extent of replicating the lordship. Besides, it is not Aries > > and > > > > Scorpio assigned secondarily to Ketu that we can deduce that, is > > it? The > > > > reading on mother and domicile front may stick. > > > > > > > > Maybe we can examine the 2nd and 7th lordship result of Ketu as > > its > > > > kuja-tulya phala after a look at the overall chart. I will post > > the > > > > chart soon. > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > I could also indicate harm to mother or giving up motherland. > > It could > > > > > also indicate problems in graduation slab of education and > > even giving > > > > > up education at that time. Ketu would also give results of > > Saturn in > > > > its > > > > > dasha and being like Mars the 2nd and 7th lord could indicate > > problems > > > > > on marital front. > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrasekharji, > > > > > > What if Saturn and Ketu are in 4th hse? You have alluded to > > Kapata > > > > Yoga > > > > > > under Sat+Moon in 4th. Saturn+Ketu ipso facto constitutes > > saintly > > > > > > disposition if I correctly remember your observation at this > > forum. > > > > The > > > > > > sign in this case is Makara. > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn- Moon in 4th could indicate an old large house and > > also the > > > > > > > possibility of a tendency of not speaking truth, > > necessarily. It > > > > could > > > > > > > also indicate a long lived mother. Saturn or Moon not > > aspecting > > > > the th > > > > > > > or 9th I do not think this could mean fanaticism. It is > > more the > > > > > > > Sun+mars combination that could sometimes indicate this > > tendency > > > > of > > > > > > > showing off his religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupitor's presence has confused me too but Sat + Moon in > > 4'th > > > > house, > > > > > > > > and Jup affliction by Saturn's aspect on it, as well as > > Mars > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > on lagna gave me thoughts to put the chart in the group > > for a > > > > > > serious > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will Sat + Moon combo in 4'th house make a person > > fanatic and > > > > > > > > barberic ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Check your source. With Aquarius and Jupiter in the > > Lagna his > > > > > > > > history > > > > > > > > > does not suit the chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Group and Elders, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Shahjahanama, author Mulla Abdul Hamid Lahori has > > given > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > unorganised astro contents, they tell u planetary > > position > > > > at > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > time of various events. Presenting Shahjahan and his > > bad son > > > > > > > > > > Aurangjeb's available horoscopic details to have an > > > > > > > > > > study of their horoscopes, focusing on - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. massive killing and oppression of siblings. > > > > > > > > > > 2. enimical behavior with their fathers. > > > > > > > > > > 3. barbaric nature (more in case of Aurangjeb) > > > > > > > > > > 4. exploitation of women ( keeping hundreds of women > > in the > > > > > > fort) > > > > > > > > > > 5. Aurangjeb's hate for music and dance > > > > > > > > > > 6. religious fanatism > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A ---> Aurangjeb > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dob : 03/11/1618 > > > > > > > > > > Tob : 20:05 (Acquarius Lagna, pls. check the time, m > > not > > > > sure) > > > > > > > > > > Pob : somewhere in Gujrat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The details i have are as follows - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius - Jup > > > > > > > > > > 4H : Sat + Moon > > > > > > > > > > 6h : Ketu > > > > > > > > > > 7H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > 9H : Sun + Merc > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Ven > > > > > > > > > > 12: Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) And Shahjahan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh my god, i forgot to note down his birth details, > > any way > > > > > > > > reproducing > > > > > > > > > > his horoscope > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius > > > > > > > > > > 2H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > 4H: Sat + Rahu > > > > > > > > > > 8H: Moon > > > > > > > > > > 10H : Ju > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Sun + Ketu+Merc+Venus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > He did a revolt against Father in Rahu/Moon/Mars but > > in > > > > > > Sani/Rahu > > > > > > > > All > > > > > > > > > > his sons were killed by Aurangjeb (another Son). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will give more details tomorrow. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > http://au.messenger. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 15, 2008 Report Share Posted June 15, 2008 Dear Lalit, I agree with RK da. Please give reference to the classic text from which you give the shlokas. If one really wants o go to the classical definitions verbatim, then only the 2nd is called Vidya bhava. Bhrigu does refer to this being opinion of the learned and says that in his opinion 4th is the house of academic education. Fifth he allots to higher learning and wisdom, intelligence spiritual practices and so on. Mantreshwar in Phaladeepika also indicates the 4th for education. So many classics do mention the 4th being related to education. take care, Chandrashekhar litsol wrote: Dear RK Daa, Sri Chandrashekhar Ji, Nalini Ji and Group, I m surprised to see following is written by RK Daa, A conclusion which has no clear endorsement in a classics - A.) 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded, with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability to devise plans B.) The core vidya sthana is 4th house - Almost similar opinion is given by Sri Chandrashekhar Ji. I examined both the statements, Sorry, both needs serious review, however, It's true that confusion between 4'th with and 9'th with 10'th for some common significations is quite normal, Great BV Raman also could not reach any visible distinction, the answer lies in tradition, since cnturies such a tradition has been continued in several pockets of india, however, our classics are quite clear on primary and secondary kind of significations of the bhavas. To remove the doubt of members and to put an end to this confusion, which sometimes forces astrologer to stretch the basics to reach a justification, i m giving some shlokas of classics. 4'th is unaminously called "Turya Sthaana", "Mitra Alaya" or "Sukha Sthaana", The shloka is - Turyasthan Sanstham Phalam tat Vakscha-Sthaanam Purushanam Niruktam (Principles or Ethics expressed) ! Amba (Mother) BandhuKchhoni Mitralayanam (Public Support by friends and relatives) Sarva Annanam (Food Grain, Yield of effort)GramYug Vahananaam (Land, Village, Vehicles). 5'th is unaminously called place for "Mati Prabandhaha" , "Budhi Prabandha" or Management of Mind and Intellect. The shloka goes - 1. Mati Prabandhaha Sutabhe Nijodaram (One's own Children), Vinaye(Modesty, Politeness)- Garbha-Sthiti, Mantra Sadhanam Modesty !! 2. Santan Garbha Sthitineeti Sanstha, Mantradi Siddhi Vinayash Vidya (Learning/Education), Buddhi Prabandhaha Sutabhe Vichintyam Etat annu JatakGyaha !! Now, where is the confusion, I think that was there because the 4'th denotes how u keep what u acquire, the immovables, so, the knowledge that you retain after studying a subject, is to be seen from the 4'th not the education, study or ur's learning itself. I w'd request RK Daa to review the 4'th house and education in his own case, Why this placement has not given you a bright academic education. Let's not misundersatand the primary and seconday significations. regards, Lalit. Vedic Astrologyandhealing , "arkaydash" <arkaydash wrote: > > > Dear Nalini, > > Your 4th house is aspected by its lord. Strengthened. It is aspected by > Mercury, not by any other planet. Stenghtened and imbued with Mc, right? > Capable of quick learning. Mc in water sign. Intuitive. > > My understaning is that 4th speaks of how learned one is. If it is in > the care of its benefic lord and is by and large unsullied by malefic > impact, learning is assured. If the care is with Mc, have no doubt. Mc > as 4th lord ensures that the real wealth is his or her learning; other > tangible assets will gravitate in the goodness of time via Mercury's > prasaada (grants). As lagna lord in debility, Mc spells periods of > concern; when there is a bad run of dasa etc, health may not remain > unassailed. Your fluctuating academic performances have to be seen in > the context of the then operating dasa and transit. Transit of the Big > Two. > > Third house has to do with dexeterity, manual. The act of writing & > communication & retention (dhruti) thus also patience. Benefics there: a > person writes a good hand. His patience does not run out. > > The core vidya sthana is 4th house. With a strong, unalloyed 4th house, > one cannot command vidya. Neither 5th, nor 9th can compensate. 5th is > intelligence in the sense of discernement. 9th is the ability to process > ideas, abstaract systems. 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded > with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability to > devise plans. > > Well, 9th. Some other time. > > RK > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , nalini swamy > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > Respected Chandrasekhar ji, RK da,Lalit ji and others, > > Namaskar. > > When it comes to handwriting, a native's chart where Guru is in > makara, lagna with exalted Sukra and neecha Budha yuti in Meena. > > The native is left-handed when writing, eating with implements like > spoon, fork etc. Right-handed when it comes to using bare hands. The > handwriting is terrible too. Is it due to neecha 3rd lord? The 3rd house > here is not aspected by a malefic; Native dislikes writing, even > academic. Native has not done very well academically despite being very > intelligent as he does no like even to write the answers in full but > just enough to get him through. > > Now coming to academic excellence and grades, in my chart my 4th > bhava, Kanya, has Rahu. The LL and 4th lord are in Meena, deb, with Ketu > and enemy Chandra. In Navamnsha, Budha and Ketu occupy Karka, again to > do with Chandra in the 4th, and the lagna is Rishaba( yuti dwiguru). > > I have done extremely well in school, average in Intermediate and very > well in Graduation. Again average in Post-grad. I am now doing a > Bachelors and a post grad all over again... I am so facscinated by the > fact that the grades dont follow the pattern I mentioned earlier. I > started off very,very well and nose-dived in the 2nd year. A lot to do > with Gochara I suppose. > > I also do well in abstract concepts and writing, not very good in > science when it comes to grades. Even in Jyotish, I am helped more with > intuitive stuff rather than mere astro concepts which is also why I > hesitate to discuss charts (: > > Love to have your inputs, > > Nalini > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar sharma.chandrashekhar@ > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > Friday, 13 June, 2008 5:50:13 AM > > Re: [Vedic Astrologyandhealing] Re: ShahJahan and AurangJeb - > AstroAnalysis (Related Q to Chandrashekarji) > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > There is a difference between handwriting and Likhita vidya. It is > only in these days that even 3 year old are taught to write that too two > languages. Earlier till one attained 1st standard most of the teaching > was by making one memorize tables, shlokas and so on. With time the > definition of what is Maukhik, Likhita, learnt for getting Gyaan and so > on changes. I remember the times when those who had done Matriculation > were considered highly educated. These days it is not uncommon to see > even rickshaw-wallas being graduates or even post graduates. > > > > In your case did you notice that your 4th bhava is in Papakartari and > its lord Mercury is afflicted by Ketu occupying the rasi of its enemy > Moon and that of Jupiter in Navamsha? > > > > Think about this. > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > Sri Chandrashekhar Ji and Our RK Da, > > > > I find it's important to mention that lekhan (writing) is more > > related to 3'rd house not the 4'th, I have seen dozens of the cases > > when 3rd is occupied by a malific (my own case) and if aspected by a > > malific (my 2 brother's case), one is not only poor in writing good > > stuff but his handwriting is also very very bad. > > > > Also exclusively 4'th can not be graduation, my 4'th house is > > occupied by Venus, aspected by Ju, I did very bad in my graduation, > > whereas in school and in my PG i did excellent. > > > > 5'th dominates in chart for the judgement of education. > > > > regards, > > Lalit > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com, Chandrashekhar > > <sharma.chandrashek har@ wrote: > > > > > > Dear RK da, > > > > > > I look to 2nd for education up to secondary level, 4th for > > graduation > > > and 5th for post graduation, 9th being the Doctoral or higher > > education. > > > Actually the 2nd is Maukhik (verbal) Vidya, 4th Likhita (written > > word) > > > vidya, 5th the Gyaan or acquired knowledge and 9th higher form of > > the > > > acquired knowledge. However we have to fit this in with the > > current > > > education pattern. May be if a person is doing Ph.D. only to get > > > University scales and not for any worthwhile research, we could > > look at > > > it in the 4th bhava. > > > > > > Ketu does not become lord of the Bhavas, but in Vimshottari dashas > > he > > > does give results like that of Mars who in the instant case > > happens to > > > be Maraka, being 2nd and 7th lord. Since it also gives results of > > > Saturn, depending on transits, it can also give education , or > > progeny > > > depending on the person's age. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekharji, > > > > > > > > Thanks. I would like to know how you read the graduation slab, > > which is > > > > neither higher education nor early education. Please tell. > > > > > > > > Ketu giving Mars-like results is understandable but to my mind, > > not to > > > > the extent of replicating the lordship. Besides, it is not Aries > > and > > > > Scorpio assigned secondarily to Ketu that we can deduce that, is > > it? The > > > > reading on mother and domicile front may stick. > > > > > > > > Maybe we can examine the 2nd and 7th lordship result of Ketu as > > its > > > > kuja-tulya phala after a look at the overall chart. I will post > > the > > > > chart soon. > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > I could also indicate harm to mother or giving up motherland. > > It could > > > > > also indicate problems in graduation slab of education and > > even giving > > > > > up education at that time. Ketu would also give results of > > Saturn in > > > > its > > > > > dasha and being like Mars the 2nd and 7th lord could indicate > > problems > > > > > on marital front. > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrasekharji, > > > > > > What if Saturn and Ketu are in 4th hse? You have alluded to > > Kapata > > > > Yoga > > > > > > under Sat+Moon in 4th. Saturn+Ketu ipso facto constitutes > > saintly > > > > > > disposition if I correctly remember your observation at this > > forum. > > > > The > > > > > > sign in this case is Makara. > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn- Moon in 4th could indicate an old large house and > > also the > > > > > > > possibility of a tendency of not speaking truth, > > necessarily. It > > > > could > > > > > > > also indicate a long lived mother. Saturn or Moon not > > aspecting > > > > the th > > > > > > > or 9th I do not think this could mean fanaticism. It is > > more the > > > > > > > Sun+mars combination that could sometimes indicate this > > tendency > > > > of > > > > > > > showing off his religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupitor's presence has confused me too but Sat + Moon in > > 4'th > > > > house, > > > > > > > > and Jup affliction by Saturn's aspect on it, as well as > > Mars > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > on lagna gave me thoughts to put the chart in the group > > for a > > > > > > serious > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will Sat + Moon combo in 4'th house make a person > > fanatic and > > > > > > > > barberic ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Check your source. With Aquarius and Jupiter in the > > Lagna his > > > > > > > > history > > > > > > > > > does not suit the chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Group and Elders, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Shahjahanama, author Mulla Abdul Hamid Lahori has > > given > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > unorganised astro contents, they tell u planetary > > position > > > > at > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > time of various events. Presenting Shahjahan and his > > bad son > > > > > > > > > > Aurangjeb's available horoscopic details to have an > > > > > > > > > > study of their horoscopes, focusing on - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. massive killing and oppression of siblings. > > > > > > > > > > 2. enimical behavior with their fathers. > > > > > > > > > > 3. barbaric nature (more in case of Aurangjeb) > > > > > > > > > > 4. exploitation of women ( keeping hundreds of women > > in the > > > > > > fort) > > > > > > > > > > 5. Aurangjeb's hate for music and dance > > > > > > > > > > 6. religious fanatism > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A ---> Aurangjeb > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dob : 03/11/1618 > > > > > > > > > > Tob : 20:05 (Acquarius Lagna, pls. check the time, m > > not > > > > sure) > > > > > > > > > > Pob : somewhere in Gujrat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The details i have are as follows - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius - Jup > > > > > > > > > > 4H : Sat + Moon > > > > > > > > > > 6h : Ketu > > > > > > > > > > 7H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > 9H : Sun + Merc > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Ven > > > > > > > > > > 12: Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) And Shahjahan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh my god, i forgot to note down his birth details, > > any way > > > > > > > > reproducing > > > > > > > > > > his horoscope > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius > > > > > > > > > > 2H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > 4H: Sat + Rahu > > > > > > > > > > 8H: Moon > > > > > > > > > > 10H : Ju > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Sun + Ketu+Merc+Venus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > He did a revolt against Father in Rahu/Moon/Mars but > > in > > > > > > Sani/Rahu > > > > > > > > All > > > > > > > > > > his sons were killed by Aurangjeb (another Son). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will give more details tomorrow. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > http://au.messenger. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 16, 2008 Report Share Posted June 16, 2008 Dear Sir, Like any science, astrology too evolved over the period and we see one concept after another for same thing till the establishment and maturity point. I have quoted shlokas from Bhava Kautuhalam, Shambu Hora, Phalit Martand. I m sorry for referring to two personal incidens but In RK Daa's chart, in the 4'th house, there is Mercury exalted, still he could not get any good achievment in academic education, in another group member, Vighnesh Ji's chart same Merc is exalted in 10'th thus aspecting 4'th prominantly still he could not do good in academic education. It's upto astrologer if they want to find right causes or not, even with wrong aproach and wrong concept sometimes one may get satisfactory justification but not always. If 4'th denotes education, I w'd have done very good in my Grad. It's vital to understand the potential and pattern of life through the chart. If 5'th is weak, there is no good potential, and during a bad dasha and transit, one can get obstacles and failures. This has no exception at all. regards, Lalit. Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Lalit, > > I agree with RK da. Please give reference to the classic text from which > you give the shlokas. If one really wants o go to the classical > definitions verbatim, then only the 2nd is called Vidya bhava. Bhrigu > does refer to this being opinion of the learned and says that in his > opinion 4th is the house of academic education. Fifth he allots to > higher learning and wisdom, intelligence spiritual practices and so on. > Mantreshwar in Phaladeepika also indicates the 4th for education. So > many classics do mention the 4th being related to education. > > take care, > Chandrashekhar > > > litsol wrote: > > > > Dear RK Daa, Sri Chandrashekhar Ji, Nalini Ji and Group, > > > > I m surprised to see following is written by RK Daa, A conclusion > > which has no clear endorsement in a classics - > > > > A.) 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded, with strength > > from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability to devise > > plans > > > > B.) The core vidya sthana is 4th house - Almost similar opinion is > > given by Sri Chandrashekhar Ji. > > > > I examined both the statements, Sorry, both needs serious review, > > however, It's true that confusion between 4'th with and 9'th with > > 10'th for some common significations is quite normal, Great BV Raman > > also could not reach any visible distinction, the answer lies in > > tradition, since cnturies such a tradition has been continued in > > several pockets of india, however, our classics are quite clear on > > primary and secondary kind of significations of the bhavas. > > > > To remove the doubt of members and to put an end to this confusion, > > which sometimes forces astrologer to stretch the basics to reach a > > justification, i m giving some shlokas of classics. > > > > 4'th is unaminously called " Turya Sthaana " , " Mitra Alaya " or " Sukha > > Sthaana " , The shloka is - > > > > Turyasthan Sanstham Phalam tat Vakscha-Sthaanam Purushanam Niruktam > > (Principles or Ethics expressed) ! > > Amba (Mother) BandhuKchhoni Mitralayanam (Public Support by friends > > and relatives) Sarva Annanam (Food Grain, Yield of effort)GramYug > > Vahananaam (Land, Village, Vehicles). > > > > 5'th is unaminously called place for " Mati Prabandhaha " , " Budhi > > Prabandha " or Management of Mind and Intellect. > > > > The shloka goes - > > > > 1. Mati Prabandhaha Sutabhe Nijodaram (One's own Children), > > Vinaye(Modesty, Politeness)- Garbha-Sthiti, Mantra Sadhanam > > Modesty !! > > > > 2. Santan Garbha Sthitineeti Sanstha, Mantradi Siddhi Vinayash Vidya > > (Learning/Education), Buddhi Prabandhaha Sutabhe Vichintyam Etat annu > > JatakGyaha !! > > > > Now, where is the confusion, I think that was there because the 4'th > > denotes how u keep what u acquire, the immovables, so, the knowledge > > that you retain after studying a subject, is to be seen from the 4'th > > not the education, study or ur's learning itself. > > > > I w'd request RK Daa to review the 4'th house and education in his > > own case, Why this placement has not given you a bright academic > > education. > > > > Let's not misundersatand the primary and seconday significations. > > > > regards, > > Lalit. > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, " arkaydash " > > <arkaydash@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Dear Nalini, > > > > > > Your 4th house is aspected by its lord. Strengthened. It is > > aspected by > > > Mercury, not by any other planet. Stenghtened and imbued with Mc, > > right? > > > Capable of quick learning. Mc in water sign. Intuitive. > > > > > > My understaning is that 4th speaks of how learned one is. If it is > > in > > > the care of its benefic lord and is by and large unsullied by > > malefic > > > impact, learning is assured. If the care is with Mc, have no doubt. > > Mc > > > as 4th lord ensures that the real wealth is his or her learning; > > other > > > tangible assets will gravitate in the goodness of time via Mercury's > > > prasaada (grants). As lagna lord in debility, Mc spells periods of > > > concern; when there is a bad run of dasa etc, health may not remain > > > unassailed. Your fluctuating academic performances have to be seen > > in > > > the context of the then operating dasa and transit. Transit of the > > Big > > > Two. > > > > > > Third house has to do with dexeterity, manual. The act of writing & > > > communication & retention (dhruti) thus also patience. Benefics > > there: a > > > person writes a good hand. His patience does not run out. > > > > > > The core vidya sthana is 4th house. With a strong, unalloyed 4th > > house, > > > one cannot command vidya. Neither 5th, nor 9th can compensate. 5th > > is > > > intelligence in the sense of discernement. 9th is the ability to > > process > > > ideas, abstaract systems. 5th can make for shrewdness even, when > > loaded > > > with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives > > ability to > > > devise plans. > > > > > > Well, 9th. Some other time. > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, nalini swamy > > > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Respected Chandrasekhar ji, RK da,Lalit ji and others, > > > > Namaskar. > > > > When it comes to handwriting, a native's chart where Guru is in > > > makara, lagna with exalted Sukra and neecha Budha yuti in Meena. > > > > The native is left-handed when writing, eating with implements > > like > > > spoon, fork etc. Right-handed when it comes to using bare hands. The > > > handwriting is terrible too. Is it due to neecha 3rd lord? The 3rd > > house > > > here is not aspected by a malefic; Native dislikes writing, even > > > academic. Native has not done very well academically despite being > > very > > > intelligent as he does no like even to write the answers in full but > > > just enough to get him through. > > > > Now coming to academic excellence and grades, in my chart my 4th > > > bhava, Kanya, has Rahu. The LL and 4th lord are in Meena, deb, with > > Ketu > > > and enemy Chandra. In Navamnsha, Budha and Ketu occupy Karka, again > > to > > > do with Chandra in the 4th, and the lagna is Rishaba( yuti dwiguru). > > > > I have done extremely well in school, average in Intermediate and > > very > > > well in Graduation. Again average in Post-grad. I am now doing a > > > Bachelors and a post grad all over again... I am so facscinated by > > the > > > fact that the grades dont follow the pattern I mentioned earlier. I > > > started off very,very well and nose-dived in the 2nd year. A lot to > > do > > > with Gochara I suppose. > > > > I also do well in abstract concepts and writing, not very good in > > > science when it comes to grades. Even in Jyotish, I am helped more > > with > > > intuitive stuff rather than mere astro concepts which is also why I > > > hesitate to discuss charts (: > > > > Love to have your inputs, > > > > Nalini > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar sharma.chandrashekhar@ > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > Friday, 13 June, 2008 5:50:13 AM > > > > Re: [Vedic Astrologyandhealing] Re: ShahJahan and > > AurangJeb - > > > AstroAnalysis (Related Q to Chandrashekarji) > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > There is a difference between handwriting and Likhita vidya. It is > > > only in these days that even 3 year old are taught to write that > > too two > > > languages. Earlier till one attained 1st standard most of the > > teaching > > > was by making one memorize tables, shlokas and so on. With time the > > > definition of what is Maukhik, Likhita, learnt for getting Gyaan > > and so > > > on changes. I remember the times when those who had done > > Matriculation > > > were considered highly educated. These days it is not uncommon to > > see > > > even rickshaw-wallas being graduates or even post graduates. > > > > > > > > In your case did you notice that your 4th bhava is in Papakartari > > and > > > its lord Mercury is afflicted by Ketu occupying the rasi of its > > enemy > > > Moon and that of Jupiter in Navamsha? > > > > > > > > Think about this. > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > Sri Chandrashekhar Ji and Our RK Da, > > > > > > > > I find it's important to mention that lekhan (writing) is more > > > > related to 3'rd house not the 4'th, I have seen dozens of the > > cases > > > > when 3rd is occupied by a malific (my own case) and if aspected > > by a > > > > malific (my 2 brother's case), one is not only poor in writing > > good > > > > stuff but his handwriting is also very very bad. > > > > > > > > Also exclusively 4'th can not be graduation, my 4'th house is > > > > occupied by Venus, aspected by Ju, I did very bad in my > > graduation, > > > > whereas in school and in my PG i did excellent. > > > > > > > > 5'th dominates in chart for the judgement of education. > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com, Chandrashekhar > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK da, > > > > > > > > > > I look to 2nd for education up to secondary level, 4th for > > > > graduation > > > > > and 5th for post graduation, 9th being the Doctoral or higher > > > > education. > > > > > Actually the 2nd is Maukhik (verbal) Vidya, 4th Likhita (written > > > > word) > > > > > vidya, 5th the Gyaan or acquired knowledge and 9th higher form > > of > > > > the > > > > > acquired knowledge. However we have to fit this in with the > > > > current > > > > > education pattern. May be if a person is doing Ph.D. only to get > > > > > University scales and not for any worthwhile research, we could > > > > look at > > > > > it in the 4th bhava. > > > > > > > > > > Ketu does not become lord of the Bhavas, but in Vimshottari > > dashas > > > > he > > > > > does give results like that of Mars who in the instant case > > > > happens to > > > > > be Maraka, being 2nd and 7th lord. Since it also gives results > > of > > > > > Saturn, depending on transits, it can also give education , or > > > > progeny > > > > > depending on the person's age. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks. I would like to know how you read the graduation slab, > > > > which is > > > > > > neither higher education nor early education. Please tell. > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu giving Mars-like results is understandable but to my > > mind, > > > > not to > > > > > > the extent of replicating the lordship. Besides, it is not > > Aries > > > > and > > > > > > Scorpio assigned secondarily to Ketu that we can deduce that, > > is > > > > it? The > > > > > > reading on mother and domicile front may stick. > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe we can examine the 2nd and 7th lordship result of Ketu > > as > > > > its > > > > > > kuja-tulya phala after a look at the overall chart. I will > > post > > > > the > > > > > > chart soon. > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I could also indicate harm to mother or giving up > > motherland. > > > > It could > > > > > > > also indicate problems in graduation slab of education and > > > > even giving > > > > > > > up education at that time. Ketu would also give results of > > > > Saturn in > > > > > > its > > > > > > > dasha and being like Mars the 2nd and 7th lord could > > indicate > > > > problems > > > > > > > on marital front. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrasekharji, > > > > > > > > What if Saturn and Ketu are in 4th hse? You have alluded > > to > > > > Kapata > > > > > > Yoga > > > > > > > > under Sat+Moon in 4th. Saturn+Ketu ipso facto constitutes > > > > saintly > > > > > > > > disposition if I correctly remember your observation at > > this > > > > forum. > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > sign in this case is Makara. > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn- Moon in 4th could indicate an old large house > > and > > > > also the > > > > > > > > > possibility of a tendency of not speaking truth, > > > > necessarily. It > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > also indicate a long lived mother. Saturn or Moon not > > > > aspecting > > > > > > the th > > > > > > > > > or 9th I do not think this could mean fanaticism. It is > > > > more the > > > > > > > > > Sun+mars combination that could sometimes indicate this > > > > tendency > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > showing off his religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupitor's presence has confused me too but Sat + Moon > > in > > > > 4'th > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > and Jup affliction by Saturn's aspect on it, as well > > as > > > > Mars > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > on lagna gave me thoughts to put the chart in the > > group > > > > for a > > > > > > > > serious > > > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will Sat + Moon combo in 4'th house make a person > > > > fanatic and > > > > > > > > > > barberic ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > > com>, > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Check your source. With Aquarius and Jupiter in the > > > > Lagna his > > > > > > > > > > history > > > > > > > > > > > does not suit the chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Group and Elders, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Shahjahanama, author Mulla Abdul Hamid Lahori > > has > > > > given > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > > > unorganised astro contents, they tell u planetary > > > > position > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > time of various events. Presenting Shahjahan and > > his > > > > bad son > > > > > > > > > > > > Aurangjeb's available horoscopic details to have > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > study of their horoscopes, focusing on - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. massive killing and oppression of siblings. > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. enimical behavior with their fathers. > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. barbaric nature (more in case of Aurangjeb) > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. exploitation of women ( keeping hundreds of > > women > > > > in the > > > > > > > > fort) > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. Aurangjeb's hate for music and dance > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. religious fanatism > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A ---> Aurangjeb > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dob : 03/11/1618 > > > > > > > > > > > > Tob : 20:05 (Acquarius Lagna, pls. check the > > time, m > > > > not > > > > > > sure) > > > > > > > > > > > > Pob : somewhere in Gujrat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The details i have are as follows - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius - Jup > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H : Sat + Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > 6h : Ketu > > > > > > > > > > > > 7H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > 9H : Sun + Merc > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Ven > > > > > > > > > > > > 12: Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) And Shahjahan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh my god, i forgot to note down his birth > > details, > > > > any way > > > > > > > > > > reproducing > > > > > > > > > > > > his horoscope > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H: Sat + Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > 8H: Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > 10H : Ju > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Sun + Ketu+Merc+Venus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > He did a revolt against Father in Rahu/Moon/Mars > > but > > > > in > > > > > > > > Sani/Rahu > > > > > > > > > > All > > > > > > > > > > > > his sons were killed by Aurangjeb (another Son). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will give more details tomorrow. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > > > http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.> > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 16, 2008 Report Share Posted June 16, 2008 Dear Sir and Group, I have more references to share with you, It seems that first learned astrologers considered 4'th for vidya or education but later they modified their finding about 4'th and gradually got confirmed that 5'th is the primary house for education,study and learning, 4'th is secondary as it act's like a container only. JataBharana : Same shloka of Shambhu Hora and Bhava Kautuhalam is repeated, It says - Budhi Prabandh-Atmja Tantra Vidya Vinaye Garbh Sthiti .... etc. Jataka Parijaata : Putra Pitra Dhi (Intellect) Punyani Sanchitaye .. But Same Jatak Parijaata declares that 4'th also is a house for Vidya, The shloka given is : " Vidya Janani Sukhani Sugandha Gobandhu .... " It's like Sri BV Raman, who considered both 4'th and 5'th and avoided the final judgement. Phaladeepka said about 5'th : a) Budhi Prasadam SutBha achha Sasthaat Peedam Piturdosham .. etc. b) SaumyaYukte Panchame va Tadishware, Vaisheshikanshe Sadbhave Dhi - Man Nishkapti Bhavat !! Phal Deepika more clarifies that in the chapter where it deals with Dasha - In the dasha of the 5'th lord, according to Mantreshwara : If 5'th lord is auspecious and has strength then - c) Putrapraptim Bandhu Vilasama NripTeenam Sachivam va Dheesham (Lord of House of intellect) Bahu Maanam (Honour and Fame ) But if 5'th lord is weak and afflicted then - d) Veeryane PratiBhaa Patau (Lord of Talent, Talent = " Pratibha " Sut Mritam Buddhi Bhramam (Aberration of Mind) cha vanchana. Hope it's enough to put astro prediction and analysis in the right track and make it error free. regards, Lalit. Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " litsol " <litsol wrote: > > Dear Sir, > > Like any science, astrology too evolved over the period and we see > one concept after another for same thing till the establishment and > maturity point. > > I have quoted shlokas from Bhava Kautuhalam, Shambu Hora, Phalit > Martand. > > I m sorry for referring to two personal incidens but In RK Daa's > chart, in the 4'th house, there is Mercury exalted, still he could > not get any good achievment in academic education, in another group > member, Vighnesh Ji's chart same Merc is exalted in 10'th thus > aspecting 4'th prominantly still he could not do good in academic > education. > > It's upto astrologer if they want to find right causes or not, even > with wrong aproach and wrong concept sometimes one may get > satisfactory justification but not always. > > If 4'th denotes education, I w'd have done very good in my Grad. > > It's vital to understand the potential and pattern of life through > the chart. If 5'th is weak, there is no good potential, and during a > bad dasha and transit, one can get obstacles and failures. This has > no exception at all. > > regards, > Lalit. > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > I agree with RK da. Please give reference to the classic text from > which > > you give the shlokas. If one really wants o go to the classical > > definitions verbatim, then only the 2nd is called Vidya bhava. > Bhrigu > > does refer to this being opinion of the learned and says that in > his > > opinion 4th is the house of academic education. Fifth he allots to > > higher learning and wisdom, intelligence spiritual practices and > so on. > > Mantreshwar in Phaladeepika also indicates the 4th for education. > So > > many classics do mention the 4th being related to education. > > > > take care, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > Dear RK Daa, Sri Chandrashekhar Ji, Nalini Ji and Group, > > > > > > I m surprised to see following is written by RK Daa, A conclusion > > > which has no clear endorsement in a classics - > > > > > > A.) 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded, with strength > > > from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability to devise > > > plans > > > > > > B.) The core vidya sthana is 4th house - Almost similar opinion > is > > > given by Sri Chandrashekhar Ji. > > > > > > I examined both the statements, Sorry, both needs serious review, > > > however, It's true that confusion between 4'th with and 9'th with > > > 10'th for some common significations is quite normal, Great BV > Raman > > > also could not reach any visible distinction, the answer lies in > > > tradition, since cnturies such a tradition has been continued in > > > several pockets of india, however, our classics are quite clear > on > > > primary and secondary kind of significations of the bhavas. > > > > > > To remove the doubt of members and to put an end to this > confusion, > > > which sometimes forces astrologer to stretch the basics to reach > a > > > justification, i m giving some shlokas of classics. > > > > > > 4'th is unaminously called " Turya Sthaana " , " Mitra Alaya " > or " Sukha > > > Sthaana " , The shloka is - > > > > > > Turyasthan Sanstham Phalam tat Vakscha-Sthaanam Purushanam > Niruktam > > > (Principles or Ethics expressed) ! > > > Amba (Mother) BandhuKchhoni Mitralayanam (Public Support by > friends > > > and relatives) Sarva Annanam (Food Grain, Yield of effort) GramYug > > > Vahananaam (Land, Village, Vehicles). > > > > > > 5'th is unaminously called place for " Mati Prabandhaha " , " Budhi > > > Prabandha " or Management of Mind and Intellect. > > > > > > The shloka goes - > > > > > > 1. Mati Prabandhaha Sutabhe Nijodaram (One's own Children), > > > Vinaye(Modesty, Politeness)- Garbha-Sthiti, Mantra Sadhanam > > > Modesty !! > > > > > > 2. Santan Garbha Sthitineeti Sanstha, Mantradi Siddhi Vinayash > Vidya > > > (Learning/Education), Buddhi Prabandhaha Sutabhe Vichintyam Etat > annu > > > JatakGyaha !! > > > > > > Now, where is the confusion, I think that was there because the > 4'th > > > denotes how u keep what u acquire, the immovables, so, the > knowledge > > > that you retain after studying a subject, is to be seen from the > 4'th > > > not the education, study or ur's learning itself. > > > > > > I w'd request RK Daa to review the 4'th house and education in > his > > > own case, Why this placement has not given you a bright academic > > > education. > > > > > > Let's not misundersatand the primary and seconday significations. > > > > > > regards, > > > Lalit. > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing% 40>, " arkaydash " > > > <arkaydash@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Nalini, > > > > > > > > Your 4th house is aspected by its lord. Strengthened. It is > > > aspected by > > > > Mercury, not by any other planet. Stenghtened and imbued with > Mc, > > > right? > > > > Capable of quick learning. Mc in water sign. Intuitive. > > > > > > > > My understaning is that 4th speaks of how learned one is. If > it is > > > in > > > > the care of its benefic lord and is by and large unsullied by > > > malefic > > > > impact, learning is assured. If the care is with Mc, have no > doubt. > > > Mc > > > > as 4th lord ensures that the real wealth is his or her > learning; > > > other > > > > tangible assets will gravitate in the goodness of time via > Mercury's > > > > prasaada (grants). As lagna lord in debility, Mc spells > periods of > > > > concern; when there is a bad run of dasa etc, health may not > remain > > > > unassailed. Your fluctuating academic performances have to be > seen > > > in > > > > the context of the then operating dasa and transit. Transit of > the > > > Big > > > > Two. > > > > > > > > Third house has to do with dexeterity, manual. The act of > writing & > > > > communication & retention (dhruti) thus also patience. Benefics > > > there: a > > > > person writes a good hand. His patience does not run out. > > > > > > > > The core vidya sthana is 4th house. With a strong, unalloyed > 4th > > > house, > > > > one cannot command vidya. Neither 5th, nor 9th can compensate. > 5th > > > is > > > > intelligence in the sense of discernement. 9th is the ability > to > > > process > > > > ideas, abstaract systems. 5th can make for shrewdness even, > when > > > loaded > > > > with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives > > > ability to > > > > devise plans. > > > > > > > > Well, 9th. Some other time. > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, nalini swamy > > > > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Respected Chandrasekhar ji, RK da,Lalit ji and others, > > > > > Namaskar. > > > > > When it comes to handwriting, a native's chart where Guru is > in > > > > makara, lagna with exalted Sukra and neecha Budha yuti in > Meena. > > > > > The native is left-handed when writing, eating with > implements > > > like > > > > spoon, fork etc. Right-handed when it comes to using bare > hands. The > > > > handwriting is terrible too. Is it due to neecha 3rd lord? The > 3rd > > > house > > > > here is not aspected by a malefic; Native dislikes writing, > even > > > > academic. Native has not done very well academically despite > being > > > very > > > > intelligent as he does no like even to write the answers in > full but > > > > just enough to get him through. > > > > > Now coming to academic excellence and grades, in my chart > my 4th > > > > bhava, Kanya, has Rahu. The LL and 4th lord are in Meena, deb, > with > > > Ketu > > > > and enemy Chandra. In Navamnsha, Budha and Ketu occupy Karka, > again > > > to > > > > do with Chandra in the 4th, and the lagna is Rishaba( yuti > dwiguru). > > > > > I have done extremely well in school, average in > Intermediate and > > > very > > > > well in Graduation. Again average in Post-grad. I am now doing > a > > > > Bachelors and a post grad all over again... I am so > facscinated by > > > the > > > > fact that the grades dont follow the pattern I mentioned > earlier. I > > > > started off very,very well and nose-dived in the 2nd year. A > lot to > > > do > > > > with Gochara I suppose. > > > > > I also do well in abstract concepts and writing, not very > good in > > > > science when it comes to grades. Even in Jyotish, I am helped > more > > > with > > > > intuitive stuff rather than mere astro concepts which is also > why I > > > > hesitate to discuss charts (: > > > > > Love to have your inputs, > > > > > Nalini > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar sharma.chandrashekhar@ > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > Friday, 13 June, 2008 5:50:13 AM > > > > > Re: [Vedic Astrologyandhealing] Re: ShahJahan and > > > AurangJeb - > > > > AstroAnalysis (Related Q to Chandrashekarji) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > There is a difference between handwriting and Likhita vidya. > It is > > > > only in these days that even 3 year old are taught to write > that > > > too two > > > > languages. Earlier till one attained 1st standard most of the > > > teaching > > > > was by making one memorize tables, shlokas and so on. With > time the > > > > definition of what is Maukhik, Likhita, learnt for getting > Gyaan > > > and so > > > > on changes. I remember the times when those who had done > > > Matriculation > > > > were considered highly educated. These days it is not uncommon > to > > > see > > > > even rickshaw-wallas being graduates or even post graduates. > > > > > > > > > > In your case did you notice that your 4th bhava is in > Papakartari > > > and > > > > its lord Mercury is afflicted by Ketu occupying the rasi of its > > > enemy > > > > Moon and that of Jupiter in Navamsha? > > > > > > > > > > Think about this. > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > Sri Chandrashekhar Ji and Our RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > I find it's important to mention that lekhan (writing) is > more > > > > > related to 3'rd house not the 4'th, I have seen dozens of the > > > cases > > > > > when 3rd is occupied by a malific (my own case) and if > aspected > > > by a > > > > > malific (my 2 brother's case), one is not only poor in > writing > > > good > > > > > stuff but his handwriting is also very very bad. > > > > > > > > > > Also exclusively 4'th can not be graduation, my 4'th house is > > > > > occupied by Venus, aspected by Ju, I did very bad in my > > > graduation, > > > > > whereas in school and in my PG i did excellent. > > > > > > > > > > 5'th dominates in chart for the judgement of education. > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com, > Chandrashekhar > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK da, > > > > > > > > > > > > I look to 2nd for education up to secondary level, 4th for > > > > > graduation > > > > > > and 5th for post graduation, 9th being the Doctoral or > higher > > > > > education. > > > > > > Actually the 2nd is Maukhik (verbal) Vidya, 4th Likhita > (written > > > > > word) > > > > > > vidya, 5th the Gyaan or acquired knowledge and 9th higher > form > > > of > > > > > the > > > > > > acquired knowledge. However we have to fit this in with the > > > > > current > > > > > > education pattern. May be if a person is doing Ph.D. only > to get > > > > > > University scales and not for any worthwhile research, we > could > > > > > look at > > > > > > it in the 4th bhava. > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu does not become lord of the Bhavas, but in Vimshottari > > > dashas > > > > > he > > > > > > does give results like that of Mars who in the instant case > > > > > happens to > > > > > > be Maraka, being 2nd and 7th lord. Since it also gives > results > > > of > > > > > > Saturn, depending on transits, it can also give > education , or > > > > > progeny > > > > > > depending on the person's age. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks. I would like to know how you read the graduation > slab, > > > > > which is > > > > > > > neither higher education nor early education. Please > tell. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu giving Mars-like results is understandable but to my > > > mind, > > > > > not to > > > > > > > the extent of replicating the lordship. Besides, it is > not > > > Aries > > > > > and > > > > > > > Scorpio assigned secondarily to Ketu that we can deduce > that, > > > is > > > > > it? The > > > > > > > reading on mother and domicile front may stick. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe we can examine the 2nd and 7th lordship result of > Ketu > > > as > > > > > its > > > > > > > kuja-tulya phala after a look at the overall chart. I > will > > > post > > > > > the > > > > > > > chart soon. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I could also indicate harm to mother or giving up > > > motherland. > > > > > It could > > > > > > > > also indicate problems in graduation slab of education > and > > > > > even giving > > > > > > > > up education at that time. Ketu would also give > results of > > > > > Saturn in > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > dasha and being like Mars the 2nd and 7th lord could > > > indicate > > > > > problems > > > > > > > > on marital front. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrasekharji, > > > > > > > > > What if Saturn and Ketu are in 4th hse? You have > alluded > > > to > > > > > Kapata > > > > > > > Yoga > > > > > > > > > under Sat+Moon in 4th. Saturn+Ketu ipso facto > constitutes > > > > > saintly > > > > > > > > > disposition if I correctly remember your observation > at > > > this > > > > > forum. > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > sign in this case is Makara. > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > com>, > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn- Moon in 4th could indicate an old large > house > > > and > > > > > also the > > > > > > > > > > possibility of a tendency of not speaking truth, > > > > > necessarily. It > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > > also indicate a long lived mother. Saturn or Moon > not > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > the th > > > > > > > > > > or 9th I do not think this could mean fanaticism. > It is > > > > > more the > > > > > > > > > > Sun+mars combination that could sometimes indicate > this > > > > > tendency > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > showing off his religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupitor's presence has confused me too but Sat + > Moon > > > in > > > > > 4'th > > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > > and Jup affliction by Saturn's aspect on it, as > well > > > as > > > > > Mars > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > > on lagna gave me thoughts to put the chart in the > > > group > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > > serious > > > > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will Sat + Moon combo in 4'th house make a person > > > > > fanatic and > > > > > > > > > > > barberic ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > com> > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > > > com>, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Check your source. With Aquarius and Jupiter > in the > > > > > Lagna his > > > > > > > > > > > history > > > > > > > > > > > > does not suit the chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Group and Elders, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Shahjahanama, author Mulla Abdul Hamid > Lahori > > > has > > > > > given > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > > > > unorganised astro contents, they tell u > planetary > > > > > position > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > time of various events. Presenting Shahjahan > and > > > his > > > > > bad son > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aurangjeb's available horoscopic details to > have > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > > study of their horoscopes, focusing on - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. massive killing and oppression of > siblings. > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. enimical behavior with their fathers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. barbaric nature (more in case of > Aurangjeb) > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. exploitation of women ( keeping hundreds > of > > > women > > > > > in the > > > > > > > > > fort) > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. Aurangjeb's hate for music and dance > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. religious fanatism > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A ---> Aurangjeb > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dob : 03/11/1618 > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tob : 20:05 (Acquarius Lagna, pls. check the > > > time, m > > > > > not > > > > > > > sure) > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pob : somewhere in Gujrat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The details i have are as follows - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius - Jup > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H : Sat + Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6h : Ketu > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > 9H : Sun + Merc > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Ven > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12: Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) And Shahjahan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh my god, i forgot to note down his birth > > > details, > > > > > any way > > > > > > > > > > > reproducing > > > > > > > > > > > > > his horoscope > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H: Sat + Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8H: Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10H : Ju > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Sun + Ketu+Merc+Venus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > He did a revolt against Father in > Rahu/Moon/Mars > > > but > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > Sani/Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > All > > > > > > > > > > > > > his sons were killed by Aurangjeb (another > Son). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will give more details tomorrow. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > > > > http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 16, 2008 Report Share Posted June 16, 2008 Dear Lalit, I thought so. Anyway, Buddhi or Buddhi prabandhan can not be equated to formal education, neither can Dhi. So the references tat you quote do not seem to say that education is to be seen from the 5th. But if you feel that you should take it as the house of formal education you are free to do so. Only the sages do not seem to agree. I do not have chart of RK da to comment about his 4th bhava. But in case of Vighnesh the 4th lord occupies the 8th bhava in both rasi and Navamsha and Mercury is in Papakartari. So the 4th bhava is not as strong as it should be. besides aspects of Jupiter and Mercury it also receives the aspect of Mars and Jupiter the 4th lord itself is in aspect of Saturn. However by not doing good education do you mean he had obstacles in education or that he did not pursue post graduation (which should be seen from the 5th as indicated by me) ? Take care, Chandrashekhar. litsol wrote: Dear Sir, Like any science, astrology too evolved over the period and we see one concept after another for same thing till the establishment and maturity point. I have quoted shlokas from Bhava Kautuhalam, Shambu Hora, Phalit Martand. I m sorry for referring to two personal incidens but In RK Daa's chart, in the 4'th house, there is Mercury exalted, still he could not get any good achievment in academic education, in another group member, Vighnesh Ji's chart same Merc is exalted in 10'th thus aspecting 4'th prominantly still he could not do good in academic education. It's upto astrologer if they want to find right causes or not, even with wrong aproach and wrong concept sometimes one may get satisfactory justification but not always. If 4'th denotes education, I w'd have done very good in my Grad. It's vital to understand the potential and pattern of life through the chart. If 5'th is weak, there is no good potential, and during a bad dasha and transit, one can get obstacles and failures. This has no exception at all. regards, Lalit. Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Lalit, > > I agree with RK da. Please give reference to the classic text from which > you give the shlokas. If one really wants o go to the classical > definitions verbatim, then only the 2nd is called Vidya bhava. Bhrigu > does refer to this being opinion of the learned and says that in his > opinion 4th is the house of academic education. Fifth he allots to > higher learning and wisdom, intelligence spiritual practices and so on. > Mantreshwar in Phaladeepika also indicates the 4th for education. So > many classics do mention the 4th being related to education. > > take care, > Chandrashekhar > > > litsol wrote: > > > > Dear RK Daa, Sri Chandrashekhar Ji, Nalini Ji and Group, > > > > I m surprised to see following is written by RK Daa, A conclusion > > which has no clear endorsement in a classics - > > > > A.) 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded, with strength > > from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability to devise > > plans > > > > B.) The core vidya sthana is 4th house - Almost similar opinion is > > given by Sri Chandrashekhar Ji. > > > > I examined both the statements, Sorry, both needs serious review, > > however, It's true that confusion between 4'th with and 9'th with > > 10'th for some common significations is quite normal, Great BV Raman > > also could not reach any visible distinction, the answer lies in > > tradition, since cnturies such a tradition has been continued in > > several pockets of india, however, our classics are quite clear on > > primary and secondary kind of significations of the bhavas. > > > > To remove the doubt of members and to put an end to this confusion, > > which sometimes forces astrologer to stretch the basics to reach a > > justification, i m giving some shlokas of classics. > > > > 4'th is unaminously called "Turya Sthaana", "Mitra Alaya" or "Sukha > > Sthaana", The shloka is - > > > > Turyasthan Sanstham Phalam tat Vakscha-Sthaanam Purushanam Niruktam > > (Principles or Ethics expressed) ! > > Amba (Mother) BandhuKchhoni Mitralayanam (Public Support by friends > > and relatives) Sarva Annanam (Food Grain, Yield of effort)GramYug > > Vahananaam (Land, Village, Vehicles). > > > > 5'th is unaminously called place for "Mati Prabandhaha" , "Budhi > > Prabandha" or Management of Mind and Intellect. > > > > The shloka goes - > > > > 1. Mati Prabandhaha Sutabhe Nijodaram (One's own Children), > > Vinaye(Modesty, Politeness)- Garbha-Sthiti, Mantra Sadhanam > > Modesty !! > > > > 2. Santan Garbha Sthitineeti Sanstha, Mantradi Siddhi Vinayash Vidya > > (Learning/Education), Buddhi Prabandhaha Sutabhe Vichintyam Etat annu > > JatakGyaha !! > > > > Now, where is the confusion, I think that was there because the 4'th > > denotes how u keep what u acquire, the immovables, so, the knowledge > > that you retain after studying a subject, is to be seen from the 4'th > > not the education, study or ur's learning itself. > > > > I w'd request RK Daa to review the 4'th house and education in his > > own case, Why this placement has not given you a bright academic > > education. > > > > Let's not misundersatand the primary and seconday significations. > > > > regards, > > Lalit. > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, "arkaydash" > > <arkaydash@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Dear Nalini, > > > > > > Your 4th house is aspected by its lord. Strengthened. It is > > aspected by > > > Mercury, not by any other planet. Stenghtened and imbued with Mc, > > right? > > > Capable of quick learning. Mc in water sign. Intuitive. > > > > > > My understaning is that 4th speaks of how learned one is. If it is > > in > > > the care of its benefic lord and is by and large unsullied by > > malefic > > > impact, learning is assured. If the care is with Mc, have no doubt. > > Mc > > > as 4th lord ensures that the real wealth is his or her learning; > > other > > > tangible assets will gravitate in the goodness of time via Mercury's > > > prasaada (grants). As lagna lord in debility, Mc spells periods of > > > concern; when there is a bad run of dasa etc, health may not remain > > > unassailed. Your fluctuating academic performances have to be seen > > in > > > the context of the then operating dasa and transit. Transit of the > > Big > > > Two. > > > > > > Third house has to do with dexeterity, manual. The act of writing & > > > communication & retention (dhruti) thus also patience. Benefics > > there: a > > > person writes a good hand. His patience does not run out. > > > > > > The core vidya sthana is 4th house. With a strong, unalloyed 4th > > house, > > > one cannot command vidya. Neither 5th, nor 9th can compensate. 5th > > is > > > intelligence in the sense of discernement. 9th is the ability to > > process > > > ideas, abstaract systems. 5th can make for shrewdness even, when > > loaded > > > with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives > > ability to > > > devise plans. > > > > > > Well, 9th. Some other time. > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, nalini swamy > > > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Respected Chandrasekhar ji, RK da,Lalit ji and others, > > > > Namaskar. > > > > When it comes to handwriting, a native's chart where Guru is in > > > makara, lagna with exalted Sukra and neecha Budha yuti in Meena. > > > > The native is left-handed when writing, eating with implements > > like > > > spoon, fork etc. Right-handed when it comes to using bare hands. The > > > handwriting is terrible too. Is it due to neecha 3rd lord? The 3rd > > house > > > here is not aspected by a malefic; Native dislikes writing, even > > > academic. Native has not done very well academically despite being > > very > > > intelligent as he does no like even to write the answers in full but > > > just enough to get him through. > > > > Now coming to academic excellence and grades, in my chart my 4th > > > bhava, Kanya, has Rahu. The LL and 4th lord are in Meena, deb, with > > Ketu > > > and enemy Chandra. In Navamnsha, Budha and Ketu occupy Karka, again > > to > > > do with Chandra in the 4th, and the lagna is Rishaba( yuti dwiguru). > > > > I have done extremely well in school, average in Intermediate and > > very > > > well in Graduation. Again average in Post-grad. I am now doing a > > > Bachelors and a post grad all over again... I am so facscinated by > > the > > > fact that the grades dont follow the pattern I mentioned earlier. I > > > started off very,very well and nose-dived in the 2nd year. A lot to > > do > > > with Gochara I suppose. > > > > I also do well in abstract concepts and writing, not very good in > > > science when it comes to grades. Even in Jyotish, I am helped more > > with > > > intuitive stuff rather than mere astro concepts which is also why I > > > hesitate to discuss charts (: > > > > Love to have your inputs, > > > > Nalini > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar sharma.chandrashekhar@ > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > Friday, 13 June, 2008 5:50:13 AM > > > > Re: [Vedic Astrologyandhealing] Re: ShahJahan and > > AurangJeb - > > > AstroAnalysis (Related Q to Chandrashekarji) > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > There is a difference between handwriting and Likhita vidya. It is > > > only in these days that even 3 year old are taught to write that > > too two > > > languages. Earlier till one attained 1st standard most of the > > teaching > > > was by making one memorize tables, shlokas and so on. With time the > > > definition of what is Maukhik, Likhita, learnt for getting Gyaan > > and so > > > on changes. I remember the times when those who had done > > Matriculation > > > were considered highly educated. These days it is not uncommon to > > see > > > even rickshaw-wallas being graduates or even post graduates. > > > > > > > > In your case did you notice that your 4th bhava is in Papakartari > > and > > > its lord Mercury is afflicted by Ketu occupying the rasi of its > > enemy > > > Moon and that of Jupiter in Navamsha? > > > > > > > > Think about this. > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > Sri Chandrashekhar Ji and Our RK Da, > > > > > > > > I find it's important to mention that lekhan (writing) is more > > > > related to 3'rd house not the 4'th, I have seen dozens of the > > cases > > > > when 3rd is occupied by a malific (my own case) and if aspected > > by a > > > > malific (my 2 brother's case), one is not only poor in writing > > good > > > > stuff but his handwriting is also very very bad. > > > > > > > > Also exclusively 4'th can not be graduation, my 4'th house is > > > > occupied by Venus, aspected by Ju, I did very bad in my > > graduation, > > > > whereas in school and in my PG i did excellent. > > > > > > > > 5'th dominates in chart for the judgement of education. > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com, Chandrashekhar > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK da, > > > > > > > > > > I look to 2nd for education up to secondary level, 4th for > > > > graduation > > > > > and 5th for post graduation, 9th being the Doctoral or higher > > > > education. > > > > > Actually the 2nd is Maukhik (verbal) Vidya, 4th Likhita (written > > > > word) > > > > > vidya, 5th the Gyaan or acquired knowledge and 9th higher form > > of > > > > the > > > > > acquired knowledge. However we have to fit this in with the > > > > current > > > > > education pattern. May be if a person is doing Ph.D. only to get > > > > > University scales and not for any worthwhile research, we could > > > > look at > > > > > it in the 4th bhava. > > > > > > > > > > Ketu does not become lord of the Bhavas, but in Vimshottari > > dashas > > > > he > > > > > does give results like that of Mars who in the instant case > > > > happens to > > > > > be Maraka, being 2nd and 7th lord. Since it also gives results > > of > > > > > Saturn, depending on transits, it can also give education , or > > > > progeny > > > > > depending on the person's age. > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks. I would like to know how you read the graduation slab, > > > > which is > > > > > > neither higher education nor early education. Please tell. > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu giving Mars-like results is understandable but to my > > mind, > > > > not to > > > > > > the extent of replicating the lordship. Besides, it is not > > Aries > > > > and > > > > > > Scorpio assigned secondarily to Ketu that we can deduce that, > > is > > > > it? The > > > > > > reading on mother and domicile front may stick. > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe we can examine the 2nd and 7th lordship result of Ketu > > as > > > > its > > > > > > kuja-tulya phala after a look at the overall chart. I will > > post > > > > the > > > > > > chart soon. > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I could also indicate harm to mother or giving up > > motherland. > > > > It could > > > > > > > also indicate problems in graduation slab of education and > > > > even giving > > > > > > > up education at that time. Ketu would also give results of > > > > Saturn in > > > > > > its > > > > > > > dasha and being like Mars the 2nd and 7th lord could > > indicate > > > > problems > > > > > > > on marital front. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrasekharji, > > > > > > > > What if Saturn and Ketu are in 4th hse? You have alluded > > to > > > > Kapata > > > > > > Yoga > > > > > > > > under Sat+Moon in 4th. Saturn+Ketu ipso facto constitutes > > > > saintly > > > > > > > > disposition if I correctly remember your observation at > > this > > > > forum. > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > sign in this case is Makara. > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn- Moon in 4th could indicate an old large house > > and > > > > also the > > > > > > > > > possibility of a tendency of not speaking truth, > > > > necessarily. It > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > also indicate a long lived mother. Saturn or Moon not > > > > aspecting > > > > > > the th > > > > > > > > > or 9th I do not think this could mean fanaticism. It is > > > > more the > > > > > > > > > Sun+mars combination that could sometimes indicate this > > > > tendency > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > showing off his religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupitor's presence has confused me too but Sat + Moon > > in > > > > 4'th > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > and Jup affliction by Saturn's aspect on it, as well > > as > > > > Mars > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > on lagna gave me thoughts to put the chart in the > > group > > > > for a > > > > > > > > serious > > > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will Sat + Moon combo in 4'th house make a person > > > > fanatic and > > > > > > > > > > barberic ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > > com>, > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Check your source. With Aquarius and Jupiter in the > > > > Lagna his > > > > > > > > > > history > > > > > > > > > > > does not suit the chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Group and Elders, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Shahjahanama, author Mulla Abdul Hamid Lahori > > has > > > > given > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > > > unorganised astro contents, they tell u planetary > > > > position > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > time of various events. Presenting Shahjahan and > > his > > > > bad son > > > > > > > > > > > > Aurangjeb's available horoscopic details to have > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > study of their horoscopes, focusing on - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. massive killing and oppression of siblings. > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. enimical behavior with their fathers. > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. barbaric nature (more in case of Aurangjeb) > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. exploitation of women ( keeping hundreds of > > women > > > > in the > > > > > > > > fort) > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. Aurangjeb's hate for music and dance > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. religious fanatism > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A ---> Aurangjeb > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dob : 03/11/1618 > > > > > > > > > > > > Tob : 20:05 (Acquarius Lagna, pls. check the > > time, m > > > > not > > > > > > sure) > > > > > > > > > > > > Pob : somewhere in Gujrat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The details i have are as follows - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius - Jup > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H : Sat + Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > 6h : Ketu > > > > > > > > > > > > 7H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > 9H : Sun + Merc > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Ven > > > > > > > > > > > > 12: Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) And Shahjahan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh my god, i forgot to note down his birth > > details, > > > > any way > > > > > > > > > > reproducing > > > > > > > > > > > > his horoscope > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H: Sat + Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > 8H: Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > 10H : Ju > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Sun + Ketu+Merc+Venus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > He did a revolt against Father in Rahu/Moon/Mars > > but > > > > in > > > > > > > > Sani/Rahu > > > > > > > > > > All > > > > > > > > > > > > his sons were killed by Aurangjeb (another Son). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will give more details tomorrow. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > > > http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.> > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 16, 2008 Report Share Posted June 16, 2008 Dear Lalit, You have taken lot of pains to read through the classics. But where do they talk about vidya connected with the 5th? Tantra vidya, Dhi Punya shanchay, Nishkapati etc. are not formal education. Or am I missing something here? Chandrashekhar. litsol wrote: Dear Sir and Group, I have more references to share with you, It seems that first learned astrologers considered 4'th for vidya or education but later they modified their finding about 4'th and gradually got confirmed that 5'th is the primary house for education,study and learning, 4'th is secondary as it act's like a container only. JataBharana : Same shloka of Shambhu Hora and Bhava Kautuhalam is repeated, It says - Budhi Prabandh-Atmja Tantra Vidya Vinaye Garbh Sthiti .... etc. Jataka Parijaata : Putra Pitra Dhi (Intellect) Punyani Sanchitaye .. But Same Jatak Parijaata declares that 4'th also is a house for Vidya, The shloka given is : "Vidya Janani Sukhani Sugandha Gobandhu ...." It's like Sri BV Raman, who considered both 4'th and 5'th and avoided the final judgement. Phaladeepka said about 5'th : a) Budhi Prasadam SutBha achha Sasthaat Peedam Piturdosham .. etc. b) SaumyaYukte Panchame va Tadishware, Vaisheshikanshe Sadbhave Dhi - Man Nishkapti Bhavat !! Phal Deepika more clarifies that in the chapter where it deals with Dasha - In the dasha of the 5'th lord, according to Mantreshwara : If 5'th lord is auspecious and has strength then - c) Putrapraptim Bandhu Vilasama NripTeenam Sachivam va Dheesham (Lord of House of intellect) Bahu Maanam (Honour and Fame ) But if 5'th lord is weak and afflicted then - d) Veeryane PratiBhaa Patau (Lord of Talent, Talent = "Pratibha" Sut Mritam Buddhi Bhramam (Aberration of Mind) cha vanchana. Hope it's enough to put astro prediction and analysis in the right track and make it error free. regards, Lalit. Vedic Astrologyandhealing , "litsol" <litsol wrote: > > Dear Sir, > > Like any science, astrology too evolved over the period and we see > one concept after another for same thing till the establishment and > maturity point. > > I have quoted shlokas from Bhava Kautuhalam, Shambu Hora, Phalit > Martand. > > I m sorry for referring to two personal incidens but In RK Daa's > chart, in the 4'th house, there is Mercury exalted, still he could > not get any good achievment in academic education, in another group > member, Vighnesh Ji's chart same Merc is exalted in 10'th thus > aspecting 4'th prominantly still he could not do good in academic > education. > > It's upto astrologer if they want to find right causes or not, even > with wrong aproach and wrong concept sometimes one may get > satisfactory justification but not always. > > If 4'th denotes education, I w'd have done very good in my Grad. > > It's vital to understand the potential and pattern of life through > the chart. If 5'th is weak, there is no good potential, and during a > bad dasha and transit, one can get obstacles and failures. This has > no exception at all. > > regards, > Lalit. > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > I agree with RK da. Please give reference to the classic text from > which > > you give the shlokas. If one really wants o go to the classical > > definitions verbatim, then only the 2nd is called Vidya bhava. > Bhrigu > > does refer to this being opinion of the learned and says that in > his > > opinion 4th is the house of academic education. Fifth he allots to > > higher learning and wisdom, intelligence spiritual practices and > so on. > > Mantreshwar in Phaladeepika also indicates the 4th for education. > So > > many classics do mention the 4th being related to education. > > > > take care, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > Dear RK Daa, Sri Chandrashekhar Ji, Nalini Ji and Group, > > > > > > I m surprised to see following is written by RK Daa, A conclusion > > > which has no clear endorsement in a classics - > > > > > > A.) 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded, with strength > > > from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability to devise > > > plans > > > > > > B.) The core vidya sthana is 4th house - Almost similar opinion > is > > > given by Sri Chandrashekhar Ji. > > > > > > I examined both the statements, Sorry, both needs serious review, > > > however, It's true that confusion between 4'th with and 9'th with > > > 10'th for some common significations is quite normal, Great BV > Raman > > > also could not reach any visible distinction, the answer lies in > > > tradition, since cnturies such a tradition has been continued in > > > several pockets of india, however, our classics are quite clear > on > > > primary and secondary kind of significations of the bhavas. > > > > > > To remove the doubt of members and to put an end to this > confusion, > > > which sometimes forces astrologer to stretch the basics to reach > a > > > justification, i m giving some shlokas of classics. > > > > > > 4'th is unaminously called "Turya Sthaana", "Mitra Alaya" > or "Sukha > > > Sthaana", The shloka is - > > > > > > Turyasthan Sanstham Phalam tat Vakscha-Sthaanam Purushanam > Niruktam > > > (Principles or Ethics expressed) ! > > > Amba (Mother) BandhuKchhoni Mitralayanam (Public Support by > friends > > > and relatives) Sarva Annanam (Food Grain, Yield of effort) GramYug > > > Vahananaam (Land, Village, Vehicles). > > > > > > 5'th is unaminously called place for "Mati Prabandhaha" , "Budhi > > > Prabandha" or Management of Mind and Intellect. > > > > > > The shloka goes - > > > > > > 1. Mati Prabandhaha Sutabhe Nijodaram (One's own Children), > > > Vinaye(Modesty, Politeness)- Garbha-Sthiti, Mantra Sadhanam > > > Modesty !! > > > > > > 2. Santan Garbha Sthitineeti Sanstha, Mantradi Siddhi Vinayash > Vidya > > > (Learning/Education), Buddhi Prabandhaha Sutabhe Vichintyam Etat > annu > > > JatakGyaha !! > > > > > > Now, where is the confusion, I think that was there because the > 4'th > > > denotes how u keep what u acquire, the immovables, so, the > knowledge > > > that you retain after studying a subject, is to be seen from the > 4'th > > > not the education, study or ur's learning itself. > > > > > > I w'd request RK Daa to review the 4'th house and education in > his > > > own case, Why this placement has not given you a bright academic > > > education. > > > > > > Let's not misundersatand the primary and seconday significations. > > > > > > regards, > > > Lalit. > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing% 40>, "arkaydash" > > > <arkaydash@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Nalini, > > > > > > > > Your 4th house is aspected by its lord. Strengthened. It is > > > aspected by > > > > Mercury, not by any other planet. Stenghtened and imbued with > Mc, > > > right? > > > > Capable of quick learning. Mc in water sign. Intuitive. > > > > > > > > My understaning is that 4th speaks of how learned one is. If > it is > > > in > > > > the care of its benefic lord and is by and large unsullied by > > > malefic > > > > impact, learning is assured. If the care is with Mc, have no > doubt. > > > Mc > > > > as 4th lord ensures that the real wealth is his or her > learning; > > > other > > > > tangible assets will gravitate in the goodness of time via > Mercury's > > > > prasaada (grants). As lagna lord in debility, Mc spells > periods of > > > > concern; when there is a bad run of dasa etc, health may not > remain > > > > unassailed. Your fluctuating academic performances have to be > seen > > > in > > > > the context of the then operating dasa and transit. Transit of > the > > > Big > > > > Two. > > > > > > > > Third house has to do with dexeterity, manual. The act of > writing & > > > > communication & retention (dhruti) thus also patience. Benefics > > > there: a > > > > person writes a good hand. His patience does not run out. > > > > > > > > The core vidya sthana is 4th house. With a strong, unalloyed > 4th > > > house, > > > > one cannot command vidya. Neither 5th, nor 9th can compensate. > 5th > > > is > > > > intelligence in the sense of discernement. 9th is the ability > to > > > process > > > > ideas, abstaract systems. 5th can make for shrewdness even, > when > > > loaded > > > > with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives > > > ability to > > > > devise plans. > > > > > > > > Well, 9th. Some other time. > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, nalini swamy > > > > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Respected Chandrasekhar ji, RK da,Lalit ji and others, > > > > > Namaskar. > > > > > When it comes to handwriting, a native's chart where Guru is > in > > > > makara, lagna with exalted Sukra and neecha Budha yuti in > Meena. > > > > > The native is left-handed when writing, eating with > implements > > > like > > > > spoon, fork etc. Right-handed when it comes to using bare > hands. The > > > > handwriting is terrible too. Is it due to neecha 3rd lord? The > 3rd > > > house > > > > here is not aspected by a malefic; Native dislikes writing, > even > > > > academic. Native has not done very well academically despite > being > > > very > > > > intelligent as he does no like even to write the answers in > full but > > > > just enough to get him through. > > > > > Now coming to academic excellence and grades, in my chart > my 4th > > > > bhava, Kanya, has Rahu. The LL and 4th lord are in Meena, deb, > with > > > Ketu > > > > and enemy Chandra. In Navamnsha, Budha and Ketu occupy Karka, > again > > > to > > > > do with Chandra in the 4th, and the lagna is Rishaba( yuti > dwiguru). > > > > > I have done extremely well in school, average in > Intermediate and > > > very > > > > well in Graduation. Again average in Post-grad. I am now doing > a > > > > Bachelors and a post grad all over again... I am so > facscinated by > > > the > > > > fact that the grades dont follow the pattern I mentioned > earlier. I > > > > started off very,very well and nose-dived in the 2nd year. A > lot to > > > do > > > > with Gochara I suppose. > > > > > I also do well in abstract concepts and writing, not very > good in > > > > science when it comes to grades. Even in Jyotish, I am helped > more > > > with > > > > intuitive stuff rather than mere astro concepts which is also > why I > > > > hesitate to discuss charts (: > > > > > Love to have your inputs, > > > > > Nalini > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar sharma.chandrashekhar@ > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > Friday, 13 June, 2008 5:50:13 AM > > > > > Re: [Vedic Astrologyandhealing] Re: ShahJahan and > > > AurangJeb - > > > > AstroAnalysis (Related Q to Chandrashekarji) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > There is a difference between handwriting and Likhita vidya. > It is > > > > only in these days that even 3 year old are taught to write > that > > > too two > > > > languages. Earlier till one attained 1st standard most of the > > > teaching > > > > was by making one memorize tables, shlokas and so on. With > time the > > > > definition of what is Maukhik, Likhita, learnt for getting > Gyaan > > > and so > > > > on changes. I remember the times when those who had done > > > Matriculation > > > > were considered highly educated. These days it is not uncommon > to > > > see > > > > even rickshaw-wallas being graduates or even post graduates. > > > > > > > > > > In your case did you notice that your 4th bhava is in > Papakartari > > > and > > > > its lord Mercury is afflicted by Ketu occupying the rasi of its > > > enemy > > > > Moon and that of Jupiter in Navamsha? > > > > > > > > > > Think about this. > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > Sri Chandrashekhar Ji and Our RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > I find it's important to mention that lekhan (writing) is > more > > > > > related to 3'rd house not the 4'th, I have seen dozens of the > > > cases > > > > > when 3rd is occupied by a malific (my own case) and if > aspected > > > by a > > > > > malific (my 2 brother's case), one is not only poor in > writing > > > good > > > > > stuff but his handwriting is also very very bad. > > > > > > > > > > Also exclusively 4'th can not be graduation, my 4'th house is > > > > > occupied by Venus, aspected by Ju, I did very bad in my > > > graduation, > > > > > whereas in school and in my PG i did excellent. > > > > > > > > > > 5'th dominates in chart for the judgement of education. > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com, > Chandrashekhar > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK da, > > > > > > > > > > > > I look to 2nd for education up to secondary level, 4th for > > > > > graduation > > > > > > and 5th for post graduation, 9th being the Doctoral or > higher > > > > > education. > > > > > > Actually the 2nd is Maukhik (verbal) Vidya, 4th Likhita > (written > > > > > word) > > > > > > vidya, 5th the Gyaan or acquired knowledge and 9th higher > form > > > of > > > > > the > > > > > > acquired knowledge. However we have to fit this in with the > > > > > current > > > > > > education pattern. May be if a person is doing Ph.D. only > to get > > > > > > University scales and not for any worthwhile research, we > could > > > > > look at > > > > > > it in the 4th bhava. > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu does not become lord of the Bhavas, but in Vimshottari > > > dashas > > > > > he > > > > > > does give results like that of Mars who in the instant case > > > > > happens to > > > > > > be Maraka, being 2nd and 7th lord. Since it also gives > results > > > of > > > > > > Saturn, depending on transits, it can also give > education , or > > > > > progeny > > > > > > depending on the person's age. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks. I would like to know how you read the graduation > slab, > > > > > which is > > > > > > > neither higher education nor early education. Please > tell. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu giving Mars-like results is understandable but to my > > > mind, > > > > > not to > > > > > > > the extent of replicating the lordship. Besides, it is > not > > > Aries > > > > > and > > > > > > > Scorpio assigned secondarily to Ketu that we can deduce > that, > > > is > > > > > it? The > > > > > > > reading on mother and domicile front may stick. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe we can examine the 2nd and 7th lordship result of > Ketu > > > as > > > > > its > > > > > > > kuja-tulya phala after a look at the overall chart. I > will > > > post > > > > > the > > > > > > > chart soon. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I could also indicate harm to mother or giving up > > > motherland. > > > > > It could > > > > > > > > also indicate problems in graduation slab of education > and > > > > > even giving > > > > > > > > up education at that time. Ketu would also give > results of > > > > > Saturn in > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > dasha and being like Mars the 2nd and 7th lord could > > > indicate > > > > > problems > > > > > > > > on marital front. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrasekharji, > > > > > > > > > What if Saturn and Ketu are in 4th hse? You have > alluded > > > to > > > > > Kapata > > > > > > > Yoga > > > > > > > > > under Sat+Moon in 4th. Saturn+Ketu ipso facto > constitutes > > > > > saintly > > > > > > > > > disposition if I correctly remember your observation > at > > > this > > > > > forum. > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > sign in this case is Makara. > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > com>, > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn- Moon in 4th could indicate an old large > house > > > and > > > > > also the > > > > > > > > > > possibility of a tendency of not speaking truth, > > > > > necessarily. It > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > > also indicate a long lived mother. Saturn or Moon > not > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > the th > > > > > > > > > > or 9th I do not think this could mean fanaticism. > It is > > > > > more the > > > > > > > > > > Sun+mars combination that could sometimes indicate > this > > > > > tendency > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > showing off his religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupitor's presence has confused me too but Sat + > Moon > > > in > > > > > 4'th > > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > > and Jup affliction by Saturn's aspect on it, as > well > > > as > > > > > Mars > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > > on lagna gave me thoughts to put the chart in the > > > group > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > > serious > > > > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will Sat + Moon combo in 4'th house make a person > > > > > fanatic and > > > > > > > > > > > barberic ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > com> > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > > > com>, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Check your source. With Aquarius and Jupiter > in the > > > > > Lagna his > > > > > > > > > > > history > > > > > > > > > > > > does not suit the chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Group and Elders, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Shahjahanama, author Mulla Abdul Hamid > Lahori > > > has > > > > > given > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > > > > unorganised astro contents, they tell u > planetary > > > > > position > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > time of various events. Presenting Shahjahan > and > > > his > > > > > bad son > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aurangjeb's available horoscopic details to > have > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > > study of their horoscopes, focusing on - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. massive killing and oppression of > siblings. > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. enimical behavior with their fathers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. barbaric nature (more in case of > Aurangjeb) > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. exploitation of women ( keeping hundreds > of > > > women > > > > > in the > > > > > > > > > fort) > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. Aurangjeb's hate for music and dance > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. religious fanatism > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A ---> Aurangjeb > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dob : 03/11/1618 > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tob : 20:05 (Acquarius Lagna, pls. check the > > > time, m > > > > > not > > > > > > > sure) > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pob : somewhere in Gujrat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The details i have are as follows - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius - Jup > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H : Sat + Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6h : Ketu > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > 9H : Sun + Merc > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Ven > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12: Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) And Shahjahan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh my god, i forgot to note down his birth > > > details, > > > > > any way > > > > > > > > > > > reproducing > > > > > > > > > > > > > his horoscope > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H: Sat + Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8H: Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10H : Ju > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Sun + Ketu+Merc+Venus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > He did a revolt against Father in > Rahu/Moon/Mars > > > but > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > Sani/Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > All > > > > > > > > > > > > > his sons were killed by Aurangjeb (another > Son). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will give more details tomorrow. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > > > > http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 17, 2008 Report Share Posted June 17, 2008 Dear Sir, This is a reply to both the mails, Pls. be open to accept a right thing, which only helps, not to me but to quality of every body's analysis. The shlokas are written following their grammer so one auther uses a term and another author may use synonym or a similar term to explain his idea. For the 5'th house they all write - Budhi Prasadam, Dhi, Buddhi Prabandha, Mati Prabanadh, PratiBhaa etc.. Can i ask you are anybody what's Budhi Prasadam,Mati Prabanadh, PratiBhaa etc. Pls. tell me why these attributes dont signify Study ? And when none of the classics except for Jatak Parijaata advocates 4'th as house for Study but along with 4'th and Jatak Parijaata supports for 5'th too to judge one's study, With this much written favoring the 5'th, why you are prone to 4'th only. There is no point in doing arguments to define what's education, somebody can say education is a process of making one's civilized, but that's not whole of the truth. I have tried this much keeping focus on academic education that we receive at school, college and university. how we groom and shape our personality in the sense of education that comes through the experience should be judged differently. regards, Lalit. Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Lalit, > > You have taken lot of pains to read through the classics. But where do > they talk about vidya connected with the 5th? Tantra vidya, Dhi Punya > shanchay, Nishkapati etc. are not formal education. Or am I missing > something here? > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > Dear Sir and Group, > > > > I have more references to share with you, It seems that first > > learned astrologers considered 4'th for vidya or education but later > > they modified their finding about 4'th and gradually got confirmed > > that 5'th is the primary house for education,study and learning, > > 4'th is secondary as it act's like a container only. > > > > JataBharana : Same shloka of Shambhu Hora and Bhava Kautuhalam is > > repeated, It says - > > > > Budhi Prabandh-Atmja Tantra Vidya Vinaye Garbh Sthiti .... etc. > > > > Jataka Parijaata : Putra Pitra Dhi (Intellect) Punyani Sanchitaye .. > > > > But Same Jatak Parijaata declares that 4'th also is a house for > > Vidya, The shloka given is : > > > > " Vidya Janani Sukhani Sugandha Gobandhu .... " > > > > It's like Sri BV Raman, who considered both 4'th and 5'th and > > avoided the final judgement. > > > > Phaladeepka said about 5'th : > > > > a) Budhi Prasadam SutBha achha Sasthaat Peedam Piturdosham .. etc. > > > > b) SaumyaYukte Panchame va Tadishware, Vaisheshikanshe Sadbhave > > Dhi - Man Nishkapti Bhavat !! > > > > Phal Deepika more clarifies that in the chapter where it deals with > > Dasha - > > > > In the dasha of the 5'th lord, according to Mantreshwara : > > > > If 5'th lord is auspecious and has strength then - > > > > c) Putrapraptim Bandhu Vilasama NripTeenam Sachivam va Dheesham > > (Lord of House of intellect) Bahu Maanam (Honour and Fame ) > > > > But if 5'th lord is weak and afflicted then - > > > > d) Veeryane PratiBhaa Patau (Lord of Talent, Talent = " Pratibha " Sut > > Mritam Buddhi Bhramam (Aberration of Mind) cha vanchana. > > > > Hope it's enough to put astro prediction and analysis in the right > > track and make it error free. > > > > regards, > > Lalit. > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, " litsol " > > <litsol@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > Like any science, astrology too evolved over the period and we see > > > one concept after another for same thing till the establishment > > and > > > maturity point. > > > > > > I have quoted shlokas from Bhava Kautuhalam, Shambu Hora, Phalit > > > Martand. > > > > > > I m sorry for referring to two personal incidens but In RK Daa's > > > chart, in the 4'th house, there is Mercury exalted, still he could > > > not get any good achievment in academic education, in another > > group > > > member, Vighnesh Ji's chart same Merc is exalted in 10'th thus > > > aspecting 4'th prominantly still he could not do good in academic > > > education. > > > > > > It's upto astrologer if they want to find right causes or not, > > even > > > with wrong aproach and wrong concept sometimes one may get > > > satisfactory justification but not always. > > > > > > If 4'th denotes education, I w'd have done very good in my Grad. > > > > > > It's vital to understand the potential and pattern of life through > > > the chart. If 5'th is weak, there is no good potential, and during > > a > > > bad dasha and transit, one can get obstacles and failures. This > > has > > > no exception at all. > > > > > > regards, > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > I agree with RK da. Please give reference to the classic text > > from > > > which > > > > you give the shlokas. If one really wants o go to the classical > > > > definitions verbatim, then only the 2nd is called Vidya bhava. > > > Bhrigu > > > > does refer to this being opinion of the learned and says that in > > > his > > > > opinion 4th is the house of academic education. Fifth he allots > > to > > > > higher learning and wisdom, intelligence spiritual practices and > > > so on. > > > > Mantreshwar in Phaladeepika also indicates the 4th for > > education. > > > So > > > > many classics do mention the 4th being related to education. > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Daa, Sri Chandrashekhar Ji, Nalini Ji and Group, > > > > > > > > > > I m surprised to see following is written by RK Daa, A > > conclusion > > > > > which has no clear endorsement in a classics - > > > > > > > > > > A.) 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded, with > > strength > > > > > from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability to > > devise > > > > > plans > > > > > > > > > > B.) The core vidya sthana is 4th house - Almost similar > > opinion > > > is > > > > > given by Sri Chandrashekhar Ji. > > > > > > > > > > I examined both the statements, Sorry, both needs serious > > review, > > > > > however, It's true that confusion between 4'th with and 9'th > > with > > > > > 10'th for some common significations is quite normal, Great BV > > > Raman > > > > > also could not reach any visible distinction, the answer lies > > in > > > > > tradition, since cnturies such a tradition has been continued > > in > > > > > several pockets of india, however, our classics are quite > > clear > > > on > > > > > primary and secondary kind of significations of the bhavas. > > > > > > > > > > To remove the doubt of members and to put an end to this > > > confusion, > > > > > which sometimes forces astrologer to stretch the basics to > > reach > > > a > > > > > justification, i m giving some shlokas of classics. > > > > > > > > > > 4'th is unaminously called " Turya Sthaana " , " Mitra Alaya " > > > or " Sukha > > > > > Sthaana " , The shloka is - > > > > > > > > > > Turyasthan Sanstham Phalam tat Vakscha-Sthaanam Purushanam > > > Niruktam > > > > > (Principles or Ethics expressed) ! > > > > > Amba (Mother) BandhuKchhoni Mitralayanam (Public Support by > > > friends > > > > > and relatives) Sarva Annanam (Food Grain, Yield of effort) > > GramYug > > > > > Vahananaam (Land, Village, Vehicles). > > > > > > > > > > 5'th is unaminously called place for " Mati > > Prabandhaha " , " Budhi > > > > > Prabandha " or Management of Mind and Intellect. > > > > > > > > > > The shloka goes - > > > > > > > > > > 1. Mati Prabandhaha Sutabhe Nijodaram (One's own Children), > > > > > Vinaye(Modesty, Politeness)- Garbha-Sthiti, Mantra Sadhanam > > > > > Modesty !! > > > > > > > > > > 2. Santan Garbha Sthitineeti Sanstha, Mantradi Siddhi Vinayash > > > Vidya > > > > > (Learning/Education), Buddhi Prabandhaha Sutabhe Vichintyam > > Etat > > > annu > > > > > JatakGyaha !! > > > > > > > > > > Now, where is the confusion, I think that was there because > > the > > > 4'th > > > > > denotes how u keep what u acquire, the immovables, so, the > > > knowledge > > > > > that you retain after studying a subject, is to be seen from > > the > > > 4'th > > > > > not the education, study or ur's learning itself. > > > > > > > > > > I w'd request RK Daa to review the 4'th house and education in > > > his > > > > > own case, Why this placement has not given you a bright > > academic > > > > > education. > > > > > > > > > > Let's not misundersatand the primary and seconday > > significations. > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing% > > 40>, " arkaydash " > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Nalini, > > > > > > > > > > > > Your 4th house is aspected by its lord. Strengthened. It is > > > > > aspected by > > > > > > Mercury, not by any other planet. Stenghtened and imbued > > with > > > Mc, > > > > > right? > > > > > > Capable of quick learning. Mc in water sign. Intuitive. > > > > > > > > > > > > My understaning is that 4th speaks of how learned one is. If > > > it is > > > > > in > > > > > > the care of its benefic lord and is by and large unsullied by > > > > > malefic > > > > > > impact, learning is assured. If the care is with Mc, have no > > > doubt. > > > > > Mc > > > > > > as 4th lord ensures that the real wealth is his or her > > > learning; > > > > > other > > > > > > tangible assets will gravitate in the goodness of time via > > > Mercury's > > > > > > prasaada (grants). As lagna lord in debility, Mc spells > > > periods of > > > > > > concern; when there is a bad run of dasa etc, health may not > > > remain > > > > > > unassailed. Your fluctuating academic performances have to > > be > > > seen > > > > > in > > > > > > the context of the then operating dasa and transit. Transit > > of > > > the > > > > > Big > > > > > > Two. > > > > > > > > > > > > Third house has to do with dexeterity, manual. The act of > > > writing & > > > > > > communication & retention (dhruti) thus also patience. > > Benefics > > > > > there: a > > > > > > person writes a good hand. His patience does not run out. > > > > > > > > > > > > The core vidya sthana is 4th house. With a strong, unalloyed > > > 4th > > > > > house, > > > > > > one cannot command vidya. Neither 5th, nor 9th can > > compensate. > > > 5th > > > > > is > > > > > > intelligence in the sense of discernement. 9th is the > > ability > > > to > > > > > process > > > > > > ideas, abstaract systems. 5th can make for shrewdness even, > > > when > > > > > loaded > > > > > > with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives > > > > > ability to > > > > > > devise plans. > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, 9th. Some other time. > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, nalini > > swamy > > > > > > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Chandrasekhar ji, RK da,Lalit ji and others, > > > > > > > Namaskar. > > > > > > > When it comes to handwriting, a native's chart where Guru > > is > > > in > > > > > > makara, lagna with exalted Sukra and neecha Budha yuti in > > > Meena. > > > > > > > The native is left-handed when writing, eating with > > > implements > > > > > like > > > > > > spoon, fork etc. Right-handed when it comes to using bare > > > hands. The > > > > > > handwriting is terrible too. Is it due to neecha 3rd lord? > > The > > > 3rd > > > > > house > > > > > > here is not aspected by a malefic; Native dislikes writing, > > > even > > > > > > academic. Native has not done very well academically despite > > > being > > > > > very > > > > > > intelligent as he does no like even to write the answers in > > > full but > > > > > > just enough to get him through. > > > > > > > Now coming to academic excellence and grades, in my chart > > > my 4th > > > > > > bhava, Kanya, has Rahu. The LL and 4th lord are in Meena, > > deb, > > > with > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > and enemy Chandra. In Navamnsha, Budha and Ketu occupy > > Karka, > > > again > > > > > to > > > > > > do with Chandra in the 4th, and the lagna is Rishaba( yuti > > > dwiguru). > > > > > > > I have done extremely well in school, average in > > > Intermediate and > > > > > very > > > > > > well in Graduation. Again average in Post-grad. I am now > > doing > > > a > > > > > > Bachelors and a post grad all over again... I am so > > > facscinated by > > > > > the > > > > > > fact that the grades dont follow the pattern I mentioned > > > earlier. I > > > > > > started off very,very well and nose-dived in the 2nd year. A > > > lot to > > > > > do > > > > > > with Gochara I suppose. > > > > > > > I also do well in abstract concepts and writing, not very > > > good in > > > > > > science when it comes to grades. Even in Jyotish, I am > > helped > > > more > > > > > with > > > > > > intuitive stuff rather than mere astro concepts which is > > also > > > why I > > > > > > hesitate to discuss charts (: > > > > > > > Love to have your inputs, > > > > > > > Nalini > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar sharma.chandrashekhar@ > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > > > Friday, 13 June, 2008 5:50:13 AM > > > > > > > Re: [Vedic Astrologyandhealing] Re: ShahJahan and > > > > > AurangJeb - > > > > > > AstroAnalysis (Related Q to Chandrashekarji) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a difference between handwriting and Likhita > > vidya. > > > It is > > > > > > only in these days that even 3 year old are taught to write > > > that > > > > > too two > > > > > > languages. Earlier till one attained 1st standard most of the > > > > > teaching > > > > > > was by making one memorize tables, shlokas and so on. With > > > time the > > > > > > definition of what is Maukhik, Likhita, learnt for getting > > > Gyaan > > > > > and so > > > > > > on changes. I remember the times when those who had done > > > > > Matriculation > > > > > > were considered highly educated. These days it is not > > uncommon > > > to > > > > > see > > > > > > even rickshaw-wallas being graduates or even post graduates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In your case did you notice that your 4th bhava is in > > > Papakartari > > > > > and > > > > > > its lord Mercury is afflicted by Ketu occupying the rasi of > > its > > > > > enemy > > > > > > Moon and that of Jupiter in Navamsha? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Think about this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > Sri Chandrashekhar Ji and Our RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I find it's important to mention that lekhan (writing) is > > > more > > > > > > > related to 3'rd house not the 4'th, I have seen dozens of > > the > > > > > cases > > > > > > > when 3rd is occupied by a malific (my own case) and if > > > aspected > > > > > by a > > > > > > > malific (my 2 brother's case), one is not only poor in > > > writing > > > > > good > > > > > > > stuff but his handwriting is also very very bad. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also exclusively 4'th can not be graduation, my 4'th house > > is > > > > > > > occupied by Venus, aspected by Ju, I did very bad in my > > > > > graduation, > > > > > > > whereas in school and in my PG i did excellent. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5'th dominates in chart for the judgement of education. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com, > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I look to 2nd for education up to secondary level, 4th > > for > > > > > > > graduation > > > > > > > > and 5th for post graduation, 9th being the Doctoral or > > > higher > > > > > > > education. > > > > > > > > Actually the 2nd is Maukhik (verbal) Vidya, 4th Likhita > > > (written > > > > > > > word) > > > > > > > > vidya, 5th the Gyaan or acquired knowledge and 9th > > higher > > > form > > > > > of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > acquired knowledge. However we have to fit this in with > > the > > > > > > > current > > > > > > > > education pattern. May be if a person is doing Ph.D. > > only > > > to get > > > > > > > > University scales and not for any worthwhile research, > > we > > > could > > > > > > > look at > > > > > > > > it in the 4th bhava. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu does not become lord of the Bhavas, but in > > Vimshottari > > > > > dashas > > > > > > > he > > > > > > > > does give results like that of Mars who in the instant > > case > > > > > > > happens to > > > > > > > > be Maraka, being 2nd and 7th lord. Since it also gives > > > results > > > > > of > > > > > > > > Saturn, depending on transits, it can also give > > > education , or > > > > > > > progeny > > > > > > > > depending on the person's age. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks. I would like to know how you read the > > graduation > > > slab, > > > > > > > which is > > > > > > > > > neither higher education nor early education. Please > > > tell. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu giving Mars-like results is understandable but to > > my > > > > > mind, > > > > > > > not to > > > > > > > > > the extent of replicating the lordship. Besides, it is > > > not > > > > > Aries > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > Scorpio assigned secondarily to Ketu that we can > > deduce > > > that, > > > > > is > > > > > > > it? The > > > > > > > > > reading on mother and domicile front may stick. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe we can examine the 2nd and 7th lordship result > > of > > > Ketu > > > > > as > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > kuja-tulya phala after a look at the overall chart. I > > > will > > > > > post > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > chart soon. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I could also indicate harm to mother or giving up > > > > > motherland. > > > > > > > It could > > > > > > > > > > also indicate problems in graduation slab of > > education > > > and > > > > > > > even giving > > > > > > > > > > up education at that time. Ketu would also give > > > results of > > > > > > > Saturn in > > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > dasha and being like Mars the 2nd and 7th lord could > > > > > indicate > > > > > > > problems > > > > > > > > > > on marital front. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrasekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > What if Saturn and Ketu are in 4th hse? You have > > > alluded > > > > > to > > > > > > > Kapata > > > > > > > > > Yoga > > > > > > > > > > > under Sat+Moon in 4th. Saturn+Ketu ipso facto > > > constitutes > > > > > > > saintly > > > > > > > > > > > disposition if I correctly remember your > > observation > > > at > > > > > this > > > > > > > forum. > > > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > > > sign in this case is Makara. > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > > > com>, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn- Moon in 4th could indicate an old large > > > house > > > > > and > > > > > > > also the > > > > > > > > > > > > possibility of a tendency of not speaking truth, > > > > > > > necessarily. It > > > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > > > > also indicate a long lived mother. Saturn or > > Moon > > > not > > > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > > > the th > > > > > > > > > > > > or 9th I do not think this could mean > > fanaticism. > > > It is > > > > > > > more the > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun+mars combination that could sometimes > > indicate > > > this > > > > > > > tendency > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > showing off his religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupitor's presence has confused me too but Sat > > + > > > Moon > > > > > in > > > > > > > 4'th > > > > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > > > > and Jup affliction by Saturn's aspect on it, > > as > > > well > > > > > as > > > > > > > Mars > > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > > > > on lagna gave me thoughts to put the chart in > > the > > > > > group > > > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > > > > serious > > > > > > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will Sat + Moon combo in 4'th house make a > > person > > > > > > > fanatic and > > > > > > > > > > > > > barberic ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ > > s.com > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > > > com> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% > > 40. > > > > > com>, > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Check your source. With Aquarius and Jupiter > > > in the > > > > > > > Lagna his > > > > > > > > > > > > > history > > > > > > > > > > > > > > does not suit the chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Group and Elders, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Shahjahanama, author Mulla Abdul Hamid > > > Lahori > > > > > has > > > > > > > given > > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > unorganised astro contents, they tell u > > > planetary > > > > > > > position > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > time of various events. Presenting > > Shahjahan > > > and > > > > > his > > > > > > > bad son > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aurangjeb's available horoscopic details > > to > > > have > > > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > study of their horoscopes, focusing on - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. massive killing and oppression of > > > siblings. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. enimical behavior with their fathers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. barbaric nature (more in case of > > > Aurangjeb) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. exploitation of women ( keeping > > hundreds > > > of > > > > > women > > > > > > > in the > > > > > > > > > > > fort) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. Aurangjeb's hate for music and dance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. religious fanatism > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A ---> Aurangjeb > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dob : 03/11/1618 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tob : 20:05 (Acquarius Lagna, pls. check > > the > > > > > time, m > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > sure) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pob : somewhere in Gujrat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The details i have are as follows - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius - Jup > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H : Sat + Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6h : Ketu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 9H : Sun + Merc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Ven > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12: Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) And Shahjahan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh my god, i forgot to note down his birth > > > > > details, > > > > > > > any way > > > > > > > > > > > > > reproducing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > his horoscope > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H: Sat + Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8H: Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10H : Ju > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Sun + Ketu+Merc+Venus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > He did a revolt against Father in > > > Rahu/Moon/Mars > > > > > but > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > Sani/Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > All > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > his sons were killed by Aurangjeb (another > > > Son). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will give more details tomorrow. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > > > > > > http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.> > > <http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 17, 2008 Report Share Posted June 17, 2008 Dear Sir, I m sorry to say that logic and eplanation given by you does seem appropriate,First let's scale the effect of good and bad aspects, Will u say : Aspect of exalted Ju + Aspect of exalted Merc < Aspect of Mars ? In vighnesh Ji's chart, 4'th receives aspect of exalted Guru from the 8'th, and again receives aspect of exalted Mercury. Mercury and Jupitor both are the karaka for study and Knowledge, Both are exalted, Now come Mars, Why only Mars's aspect w'd impact and the impact is so bad that he could not clear his CA despite multiple efforts, CA is only a graduation level education. Same is case of RK Daa, It's important to note that his lagna lord Merc is exalted in 4'th but he never got good rank, Mercury's exaltation happens in his own sign, so, there is no case of dispositor's bad effect, in his academic education, he met failures and broken the line of study, however, he is learned more than most of the people we see around us, he has real knowledge and has an autority in his profession. Take my brother's chart. Lagna is Aquarious, 4'th and 9'th lord Venus is placed in 5'th house whereas Moon is placed in 9'th,So, as per the dictum that 4'th denotes education, he should do good in graduation, should have a good academic record, but on the contrary, he had a gap of 2 yrs after his 12'th, he never scored good except for his class 10'th, He dis his Graduation with 54.7% of marx only. If u take 2nd house for study, His 2nd lord Ju is placed in 7'th in a frind rashi, So, why he was only an average student throughout his school time as well got good marx only in class 10'th. My idea is - His 5'th house receives Saturn's aspect thus chart does not have very good potential for study and he was running in saturn's dasa during his study, along with this, 5'th lord is placed in 6'th along with Rahu. Thus chart dosnt have promise for good ecucation. regards,Lalit. Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote:>> Dear Lalit,> > I thought so. Anyway, Buddhi or Buddhi prabandhan can not be equated to > formal education, neither can Dhi. So the references tat you quote do > not seem to say that education is to be seen from the 5th. But if you > feel that you should take it as the house of formal education you are > free to do so. Only the sages do not seem to agree.> > I do not have chart of RK da to comment about his 4th bhava. But in case > of Vighnesh the 4th lord occupies the 8th bhava in both rasi and > Navamsha and Mercury is in Papakartari. So the 4th bhava is not as > strong as it should be. besides aspects of Jupiter and Mercury it also > receives the aspect of Mars and Jupiter the 4th lord itself is in aspect > of Saturn. However by not doing good education do you mean he had > obstacles in education or that he did not pursue post graduation (which > should be seen from the 5th as indicated by me) ?> > Take care,> Chandrashekhar.> > litsol wrote:> >> > Dear Sir,> >> > Like any science, astrology too evolved over the period and we see> > one concept after another for same thing till the establishment and> > maturity point.> >> > I have quoted shlokas from Bhava Kautuhalam, Shambu Hora, Phalit> > Martand.> >> > I m sorry for referring to two personal incidens but In RK Daa's> > chart, in the 4'th house, there is Mercury exalted, still he could> > not get any good achievment in academic education, in another group> > member, Vighnesh Ji's chart same Merc is exalted in 10'th thus> > aspecting 4'th prominantly still he could not do good in academic> > education.> >> > It's upto astrologer if they want to find right causes or not, even> > with wrong aproach and wrong concept sometimes one may get> > satisfactory justification but not always.> >> > If 4'th denotes education, I w'd have done very good in my Grad.> >> > It's vital to understand the potential and pattern of life through> > the chart. If 5'th is weak, there is no good potential, and during a> > bad dasha and transit, one can get obstacles and failures. This has> > no exception at all.> >> > regards,> > Lalit.> >> > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, Chandrashekhar> > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote:> > >> > > Dear Lalit,> > >> > > I agree with RK da. Please give reference to the classic text from> > which> > > you give the shlokas. If one really wants o go to the classical> > > definitions verbatim, then only the 2nd is called Vidya bhava.> > Bhrigu> > > does refer to this being opinion of the learned and says that in> > his> > > opinion 4th is the house of academic education. Fifth he allots to> > > higher learning and wisdom, intelligence spiritual practices and> > so on.> > > Mantreshwar in Phaladeepika also indicates the 4th for education.> > So> > > many classics do mention the 4th being related to education.> > >> > > take care,> > > Chandrashekhar> > >> > >> > > litsol wrote:> > > >> > > > Dear RK Daa, Sri Chandrashekhar Ji, Nalini Ji and Group,> > > >> > > > I m surprised to see following is written by RK Daa, A conclusion> > > > which has no clear endorsement in a classics -> > > >> > > > A.) 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded, with strength> > > > from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability to devise> > > > plans> > > >> > > > B.) The core vidya sthana is 4th house - Almost similar opinion> > is> > > > given by Sri Chandrashekhar Ji.> > > >> > > > I examined both the statements, Sorry, both needs serious review,> > > > however, It's true that confusion between 4'th with and 9'th with> > > > 10'th for some common significations is quite normal, Great BV> > Raman> > > > also could not reach any visible distinction, the answer lies in> > > > tradition, since cnturies such a tradition has been continued in> > > > several pockets of india, however, our classics are quite clear> > on> > > > primary and secondary kind of significations of the bhavas.> > > >> > > > To remove the doubt of members and to put an end to this> > confusion,> > > > which sometimes forces astrologer to stretch the basics to reach> > a> > > > justification, i m giving some shlokas of classics.> > > >> > > > 4'th is unaminously called "Turya Sthaana", "Mitra Alaya"> > or "Sukha> > > > Sthaana", The shloka is -> > > >> > > > Turyasthan Sanstham Phalam tat Vakscha-Sthaanam Purushanam> > Niruktam> > > > (Principles or Ethics expressed) !> > > > Amba (Mother) BandhuKchhoni Mitralayanam (Public Support by> > friends> > > > and relatives) Sarva Annanam (Food Grain, Yield of effort)GramYug> > > > Vahananaam (Land, Village, Vehicles).> > > >> > > > 5'th is unaminously called place for "Mati Prabandhaha" , "Budhi> > > > Prabandha" or Management of Mind and Intellect.> > > >> > > > The shloka goes -> > > >> > > > 1. Mati Prabandhaha Sutabhe Nijodaram (One's own Children),> > > > Vinaye(Modesty, Politeness)- Garbha-Sthiti, Mantra Sadhanam> > > > Modesty !!> > > >> > > > 2. Santan Garbha Sthitineeti Sanstha, Mantradi Siddhi Vinayash> > Vidya> > > > (Learning/Education), Buddhi Prabandhaha Sutabhe Vichintyam Etat> > annu> > > > JatakGyaha !!> > > >> > > > Now, where is the confusion, I think that was there because the> > 4'th> > > > denotes how u keep what u acquire, the immovables, so, the> > knowledge> > > > that you retain after studying a subject, is to be seen from the> > 4'th> > > > not the education, study or ur's learning itself.> > > >> > > > I w'd request RK Daa to review the 4'th house and education in> > his> > > > own case, Why this placement has not given you a bright academic> > > > education.> > > >> > > > Let's not misundersatand the primary and seconday significations.> > > >> > > > regards,> > > > Lalit.> > > >> > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>> > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, "arkaydash"> > > > <arkaydash@> wrote:> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > Dear Nalini,> > > > >> > > > > Your 4th house is aspected by its lord. Strengthened. It is> > > > aspected by> > > > > Mercury, not by any other planet. Stenghtened and imbued with> > Mc,> > > > right?> > > > > Capable of quick learning. Mc in water sign. Intuitive.> > > > >> > > > > My understaning is that 4th speaks of how learned one is. If> > it is> > > > in> > > > > the care of its benefic lord and is by and large unsullied by> > > > malefic> > > > > impact, learning is assured. If the care is with Mc, have no> > doubt.> > > > Mc> > > > > as 4th lord ensures that the real wealth is his or her> > learning;> > > > other> > > > > tangible assets will gravitate in the goodness of time via> > Mercury's> > > > > prasaada (grants). As lagna lord in debility, Mc spells> > periods of> > > > > concern; when there is a bad run of dasa etc, health may not> > remain> > > > > unassailed. Your fluctuating academic performances have to be> > seen> > > > in> > > > > the context of the then operating dasa and transit. Transit of> > the> > > > Big> > > > > Two.> > > > >> > > > > Third house has to do with dexeterity, manual. The act of> > writing & > > > > > communication & retention (dhruti) thus also patience. Benefics> > > > there: a> > > > > person writes a good hand. His patience does not run out.> > > > >> > > > > The core vidya sthana is 4th house. With a strong, unalloyed> > 4th> > > > house,> > > > > one cannot command vidya. Neither 5th, nor 9th can compensate.> > 5th> > > > is> > > > > intelligence in the sense of discernement. 9th is the ability> > to> > > > process> > > > > ideas, abstaract systems. 5th can make for shrewdness even,> > when> > > > loaded> > > > > with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives> > > > ability to> > > > > devise plans.> > > > >> > > > > Well, 9th. Some other time.> > > > >> > > > > RK> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>> > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, nalini swamy> > > > > <nalini2818@> wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Respected Chandrasekhar ji, RK da,Lalit ji and others,> > > > > > Namaskar.> > > > > > When it comes to handwriting, a native's chart where Guru is> > in> > > > > makara, lagna with exalted Sukra and neecha Budha yuti in> > Meena.> > > > > > The native is left-handed when writing, eating with> > implements> > > > like> > > > > spoon, fork etc. Right-handed when it comes to using bare> > hands. The> > > > > handwriting is terrible too. Is it due to neecha 3rd lord? The> > 3rd> > > > house> > > > > here is not aspected by a malefic; Native dislikes writing,> > even> > > > > academic. Native has not done very well academically despite> > being> > > > very> > > > > intelligent as he does no like even to write the answers in> > full but> > > > > just enough to get him through.> > > > > > Now coming to academic excellence and grades, in my chart> > my 4th> > > > > bhava, Kanya, has Rahu. The LL and 4th lord are in Meena, deb,> > with> > > > Ketu> > > > > and enemy Chandra. In Navamnsha, Budha and Ketu occupy Karka,> > again> > > > to> > > > > do with Chandra in the 4th, and the lagna is Rishaba( yuti> > dwiguru).> > > > > > I have done extremely well in school, average in> > Intermediate and> > > > very> > > > > well in Graduation. Again average in Post-grad. I am now doing> > a> > > > > Bachelors and a post grad all over again... I am so> > facscinated by> > > > the> > > > > fact that the grades dont follow the pattern I mentioned> > earlier. I> > > > > started off very,very well and nose-dived in the 2nd year. A> > lot to> > > > do> > > > > with Gochara I suppose.> > > > > > I also do well in abstract concepts and writing, not very> > good in> > > > > science when it comes to grades. Even in Jyotish, I am helped> > more> > > > with> > > > > intuitive stuff rather than mere astro concepts which is also> > why I> > > > > hesitate to discuss charts (:> > > > > > Love to have your inputs,> > > > > > Nalini> > > > > >> > > > > > Â> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar sharma.chandrashekhar@> > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>> > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>> > > > > > Friday, 13 June, 2008 5:50:13 AM> > > > > > Re: [Vedic Astrologyandhealing] Re: ShahJahan and> > > > AurangJeb -> > > > > AstroAnalysis (Related Q to Chandrashekarji)> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > Dear Lalit,> > > > > >> > > > > > There is a difference between handwriting and Likhita vidya.> > It is> > > > > only in these days that even 3 year old are taught to write> > that> > > > too two> > > > > languages. Earlier till one attained 1st standard most of the> > > > teaching> > > > > was by making one memorize tables, shlokas and so on. With> > time the> > > > > definition of what is Maukhik, Likhita, learnt for getting> > Gyaan> > > > and so> > > > > on changes. I remember the times when those who had done> > > > Matriculation> > > > > were considered highly educated. These days it is not uncommon> > to> > > > see> > > > > even rickshaw-wallas being graduates or even post graduates.> > > > > >> > > > > > In your case did you notice that your 4th bhava is in> > Papakartari> > > > and> > > > > its lord Mercury is afflicted by Ketu occupying the rasi of its> > > > enemy> > > > > Moon and that of Jupiter in Navamsha?> > > > > >> > > > > > Think about this.> > > > > >> > > > > > Chandrashekhar.> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > litsol wrote:> > > > > > Sri Chandrashekhar Ji and Our RK Da,> > > > > >> > > > > > I find it's important to mention that lekhan (writing) is> > more> > > > > > related to 3'rd house not the 4'th, I have seen dozens of the> > > > cases> > > > > > when 3rd is occupied by a malific (my own case) and if> > aspected> > > > by a> > > > > > malific (my 2 brother's case), one is not only poor in> > writing> > > > good> > > > > > stuff but his handwriting is also very very bad.> > > > > >> > > > > > Also exclusively 4'th can not be graduation, my 4'th house is> > > > > > occupied by Venus, aspected by Ju, I did very bad in my> > > > graduation,> > > > > > whereas in school and in my PG i did excellent.> > > > > >> > > > > > 5'th dominates in chart for the judgement of education.> > > > > >> > > > > > regards,> > > > > > Lalit> > > > > >> > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com,> > Chandrashekhar> > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@ wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Dear RK da,> > > > > > >> > > > > > > I look to 2nd for education up to secondary level, 4th for> > > > > > graduation> > > > > > > and 5th for post graduation, 9th being the Doctoral or> > higher> > > > > > education.> > > > > > > Actually the 2nd is Maukhik (verbal) Vidya, 4th Likhita> > (written> > > > > > word)> > > > > > > vidya, 5th the Gyaan or acquired knowledge and 9th higher> > form> > > > of> > > > > > the> > > > > > > acquired knowledge. However we have to fit this in with the> > > > > > current> > > > > > > education pattern. May be if a person is doing Ph.D. only> > to get> > > > > > > University scales and not for any worthwhile research, we> > could> > > > > > look at> > > > > > > it in the 4th bhava.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Ketu does not become lord of the Bhavas, but in Vimshottari> > > > dashas> > > > > > he> > > > > > > does give results like that of Mars who in the instant case> > > > > > happens to> > > > > > > be Maraka, being 2nd and 7th lord. Since it also gives> > results> > > > of> > > > > > > Saturn, depending on transits, it can also give> > education , or> > > > > > progeny> > > > > > > depending on the person's age.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.> > > > > > >> > > > > > > arkaydash wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekharji,> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Thanks. I would like to know how you read the graduation> > slab,> > > > > > which is> > > > > > > > neither higher education nor early education. Please> > tell.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Ketu giving Mars-like results is understandable but to my> > > > mind,> > > > > > not to> > > > > > > > the extent of replicating the lordship. Besides, it is> > not> > > > Aries> > > > > > and> > > > > > > > Scorpio assigned secondarily to Ketu that we can deduce> > that,> > > > is> > > > > > it? The> > > > > > > > reading on mother and domicile front may stick.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Maybe we can examine the 2nd and 7th lordship result of> > Ketu> > > > as> > > > > > its> > > > > > > > kuja-tulya phala after a look at the overall chart. I> > will> > > > post> > > > > > the> > > > > > > > chart soon.> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com> > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>,> > > > > > Chandrashekhar> > > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Dear RK Da,> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > I could also indicate harm to mother or giving up> > > > motherland.> > > > > > It could> > > > > > > > > also indicate problems in graduation slab of education> > and> > > > > > even giving> > > > > > > > > up education at that time. Ketu would also give> > results of> > > > > > Saturn in> > > > > > > > its> > > > > > > > > dasha and being like Mars the 2nd and 7th lord could> > > > indicate> > > > > > problems> > > > > > > > > on marital front.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Chandrasekharji,> > > > > > > > > > What if Saturn and Ketu are in 4th hse? You have> > alluded> > > > to> > > > > > Kapata> > > > > > > > Yoga> > > > > > > > > > under Sat+Moon in 4th. Saturn+Ketu ipso facto> > constitutes> > > > > > saintly> > > > > > > > > > disposition if I correctly remember your observation> > at> > > > this> > > > > > forum.> > > > > > > > The> > > > > > > > > > sign in this case is Makara.> > > > > > > > > > RK> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com> > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>> > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40.> > com>,> > > > > > Chandrashekhar> > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote:> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit,> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Saturn- Moon in 4th could indicate an old large> > house> > > > and> > > > > > also the> > > > > > > > > > > possibility of a tendency of not speaking truth,> > > > > > necessarily. It> > > > > > > > could> > > > > > > > > > > also indicate a long lived mother. Saturn or Moon> > not> > > > > > aspecting> > > > > > > > the th> > > > > > > > > > > or 9th I do not think this could mean fanaticism.> > It is> > > > > > more the> > > > > > > > > > > Sun+mars combination that could sometimes indicate> > this> > > > > > tendency> > > > > > > > of> > > > > > > > > > > showing off his religion.> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > take care,> > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir,> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Jupitor's presence has confused me too but Sat +> > Moon> > > > in> > > > > > 4'th> > > > > > > > house,> > > > > > > > > > > > and Jup affliction by Saturn's aspect on it, as> > well> > > > as> > > > > > Mars> > > > > > > > aspect> > > > > > > > > > > > on lagna gave me thoughts to put the chart in the> > > > group> > > > > > for a> > > > > > > > > > serious> > > > > > > > > > > > discussion.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Will Sat + Moon combo in 4'th house make a person> > > > > > fanatic and> > > > > > > > > > > > barberic ?> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com> > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>> > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40.> > com>> > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40.> > > > com>,> > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar> > > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit,> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Check your source. With Aquarius and Jupiter> > in the> > > > > > Lagna his> > > > > > > > > > > > history> > > > > > > > > > > > > does not suit the chart.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Group and Elders,> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Shahjahanama, author Mulla Abdul Hamid> > Lahori> > > > has> > > > > > given> > > > > > > > some> > > > > > > > > > > > > > unorganised astro contents, they tell u> > planetary> > > > > > position> > > > > > > > at> > > > > > > > > > the> > > > > > > > > > > > > > time of various events. Presenting Shahjahan> > and> > > > his> > > > > > bad son> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aurangjeb's available horoscopic details to> > have> > > > an> > > > > > > > > > > > > > study of their horoscopes, focusing on -> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. massive killing and oppression of> > siblings.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. enimical behavior with their fathers.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. barbaric nature (more in case of> > Aurangjeb)> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. exploitation of women ( keeping hundreds> > of> > > > women> > > > > > in the> > > > > > > > > > fort)> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. Aurangjeb's hate for music and dance> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. religious fanatism> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > A ---> Aurangjeb> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dob : 03/11/1618> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tob : 20:05 (Acquarius Lagna, pls. check the> > > > time, m> > > > > > not> > > > > > > > sure)> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pob : somewhere in Gujrat.> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > The details i have are as follows -> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius - Jup> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H : Sat + Moon> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6h : Ketu> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7H : Mars> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 9H : Sun + Merc> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Ven> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12: Rahu> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) And Shahjahan.> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh my god, i forgot to note down his birth> > > > details,> > > > > > any way> > > > > > > > > > > > reproducing> > > > > > > > > > > > > > his horoscope> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H : Mars> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H: Sat + Rahu> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8H: Moon> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10H : Ju> > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Sun + Ketu+Merc+Venus> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > He did a revolt against Father in> > Rahu/Moon/Mars> > > > but> > > > > > in> > > > > > > > > > Sani/Rahu> > > > > > > > > > > > All> > > > > > > > > > > > > > his sons were killed by Aurangjeb (another> > Son).> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will give more details tomorrow.> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends> > > > > http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.> > > <http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.>>> > > > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > >> >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 17, 2008 Report Share Posted June 17, 2008 My typing mistake, Read like this - I m sorry to say that logic and eplanation given by you does not seem appropriate,First let's scale the effect of good and bad aspects, Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " litsol " <litsol wrote: > > > Dear Sir, > > I m sorry to say that logic and eplanation given by you does seem > appropriate,First let's scale the effect of good and bad aspects, > > Will u say : Aspect of exalted Ju + Aspect of exalted Merc < Aspect of > Mars ? > > In vighnesh Ji's chart, 4'th receives aspect of exalted Guru from the > 8'th, and again receives aspect of exalted Mercury. > > Mercury and Jupitor both are the karaka for study and Knowledge, Both > are exalted, Now come Mars, Why only Mars's aspect w'd impact and the > impact is so bad that he could not clear his CA despite multiple > efforts, CA is only a graduation level education. > > Same is case of RK Daa, It's important to note that his lagna lord Merc > is exalted in 4'th but he never got good rank, Mercury's exaltation > happens in his own sign, so, there is no case of dispositor's bad > effect, in his academic education, he met failures and broken the line > of study, however, he is learned more than most of the people we see > around us, he has real knowledge and has an autority in his profession. > > Take my brother's chart. > > Lagna is Aquarious, 4'th and 9'th lord Venus is placed in 5'th house > whereas Moon is placed in 9'th,So, as per the dictum that 4'th denotes > education, he should do good in graduation, should have a good academic > record, but on the contrary, he had a gap of 2 yrs after his 12'th, he > never scored good except for his class 10'th, He dis his Graduation with > 54.7% of marx only. > > If u take 2nd house for study, His 2nd lord Ju is placed in 7'th in a > frind rashi, So, why he was only an average student throughout his > school time as well got good marx only in class 10'th. > > My idea is - > > His 5'th house receives Saturn's aspect thus chart does not have very > good potential for study and he was running in saturn's dasa during his > study, along with this, 5'th lord is placed in 6'th along with Rahu. > Thus chart dosnt have promise for good ecucation. > > regards, > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing > , Chandrashekhar > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > I thought so. Anyway, Buddhi or Buddhi prabandhan can not be equated > to > > formal education, neither can Dhi. So the references tat you quote do > > not seem to say that education is to be seen from the 5th. But if you > > feel that you should take it as the house of formal education you are > > free to do so. Only the sages do not seem to agree. > > > > I do not have chart of RK da to comment about his 4th bhava. But in > case > > of Vighnesh the 4th lord occupies the 8th bhava in both rasi and > > Navamsha and Mercury is in Papakartari. So the 4th bhava is not as > > strong as it should be. besides aspects of Jupiter and Mercury it also > > receives the aspect of Mars and Jupiter the 4th lord itself is in > aspect > > of Saturn. However by not doing good education do you mean he had > > obstacles in education or that he did not pursue post graduation > (which > > should be seen from the 5th as indicated by me) ? > > > > Take care, > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > Like any science, astrology too evolved over the period and we see > > > one concept after another for same thing till the establishment and > > > maturity point. > > > > > > I have quoted shlokas from Bhava Kautuhalam, Shambu Hora, Phalit > > > Martand. > > > > > > I m sorry for referring to two personal incidens but In RK Daa's > > > chart, in the 4'th house, there is Mercury exalted, still he could > > > not get any good achievment in academic education, in another group > > > member, Vighnesh Ji's chart same Merc is exalted in 10'th thus > > > aspecting 4'th prominantly still he could not do good in academic > > > education. > > > > > > It's upto astrologer if they want to find right causes or not, even > > > with wrong aproach and wrong concept sometimes one may get > > > satisfactory justification but not always. > > > > > > If 4'th denotes education, I w'd have done very good in my Grad. > > > > > > It's vital to understand the potential and pattern of life through > > > the chart. If 5'th is weak, there is no good potential, and during a > > > bad dasha and transit, one can get obstacles and failures. This has > > > no exception at all. > > > > > > regards, > > > Lalit. > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> >, Chandrashekhar > > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > I agree with RK da. Please give reference to the classic text from > > > which > > > > you give the shlokas. If one really wants o go to the classical > > > > definitions verbatim, then only the 2nd is called Vidya bhava. > > > Bhrigu > > > > does refer to this being opinion of the learned and says that in > > > his > > > > opinion 4th is the house of academic education. Fifth he allots to > > > > higher learning and wisdom, intelligence spiritual practices and > > > so on. > > > > Mantreshwar in Phaladeepika also indicates the 4th for education. > > > So > > > > many classics do mention the 4th being related to education. > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Daa, Sri Chandrashekhar Ji, Nalini Ji and Group, > > > > > > > > > > I m surprised to see following is written by RK Daa, A > conclusion > > > > > which has no clear endorsement in a classics - > > > > > > > > > > A.) 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded, with strength > > > > > from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability to > devise > > > > > plans > > > > > > > > > > B.) The core vidya sthana is 4th house - Almost similar opinion > > > is > > > > > given by Sri Chandrashekhar Ji. > > > > > > > > > > I examined both the statements, Sorry, both needs serious > review, > > > > > however, It's true that confusion between 4'th with and 9'th > with > > > > > 10'th for some common significations is quite normal, Great BV > > > Raman > > > > > also could not reach any visible distinction, the answer lies in > > > > > tradition, since cnturies such a tradition has been continued in > > > > > several pockets of india, however, our classics are quite clear > > > on > > > > > primary and secondary kind of significations of the bhavas. > > > > > > > > > > To remove the doubt of members and to put an end to this > > > confusion, > > > > > which sometimes forces astrologer to stretch the basics to reach > > > a > > > > > justification, i m giving some shlokas of classics. > > > > > > > > > > 4'th is unaminously called " Turya Sthaana " , " Mitra Alaya " > > > or " Sukha > > > > > Sthaana " , The shloka is - > > > > > > > > > > Turyasthan Sanstham Phalam tat Vakscha-Sthaanam Purushanam > > > Niruktam > > > > > (Principles or Ethics expressed) ! > > > > > Amba (Mother) BandhuKchhoni Mitralayanam (Public Support by > > > friends > > > > > and relatives) Sarva Annanam (Food Grain, Yield of > effort)GramYug > > > > > Vahananaam (Land, Village, Vehicles). > > > > > > > > > > 5'th is unaminously called place for " Mati Prabandhaha " , " Budhi > > > > > Prabandha " or Management of Mind and Intellect. > > > > > > > > > > The shloka goes - > > > > > > > > > > 1. Mati Prabandhaha Sutabhe Nijodaram (One's own Children), > > > > > Vinaye(Modesty, Politeness)- Garbha-Sthiti, Mantra Sadhanam > > > > > Modesty !! > > > > > > > > > > 2. Santan Garbha Sthitineeti Sanstha, Mantradi Siddhi Vinayash > > > Vidya > > > > > (Learning/Education), Buddhi Prabandhaha Sutabhe Vichintyam Etat > > > annu > > > > > JatakGyaha !! > > > > > > > > > > Now, where is the confusion, I think that was there because the > > > 4'th > > > > > denotes how u keep what u acquire, the immovables, so, the > > > knowledge > > > > > that you retain after studying a subject, is to be seen from the > > > 4'th > > > > > not the education, study or ur's learning itself. > > > > > > > > > > I w'd request RK Daa to review the 4'th house and education in > > > his > > > > > own case, Why this placement has not given you a bright academic > > > > > education. > > > > > > > > > > Let's not misundersatand the primary and seconday > significations. > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> >, " arkaydash " > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Nalini, > > > > > > > > > > > > Your 4th house is aspected by its lord. Strengthened. It is > > > > > aspected by > > > > > > Mercury, not by any other planet. Stenghtened and imbued with > > > Mc, > > > > > right? > > > > > > Capable of quick learning. Mc in water sign. Intuitive. > > > > > > > > > > > > My understaning is that 4th speaks of how learned one is. If > > > it is > > > > > in > > > > > > the care of its benefic lord and is by and large unsullied by > > > > > malefic > > > > > > impact, learning is assured. If the care is with Mc, have no > > > doubt. > > > > > Mc > > > > > > as 4th lord ensures that the real wealth is his or her > > > learning; > > > > > other > > > > > > tangible assets will gravitate in the goodness of time via > > > Mercury's > > > > > > prasaada (grants). As lagna lord in debility, Mc spells > > > periods of > > > > > > concern; when there is a bad run of dasa etc, health may not > > > remain > > > > > > unassailed. Your fluctuating academic performances have to be > > > seen > > > > > in > > > > > > the context of the then operating dasa and transit. Transit of > > > the > > > > > Big > > > > > > Two. > > > > > > > > > > > > Third house has to do with dexeterity, manual. The act of > > > writing & > > > > > > communication & retention (dhruti) thus also patience. > Benefics > > > > > there: a > > > > > > person writes a good hand. His patience does not run out. > > > > > > > > > > > > The core vidya sthana is 4th house. With a strong, unalloyed > > > 4th > > > > > house, > > > > > > one cannot command vidya. Neither 5th, nor 9th can compensate. > > > 5th > > > > > is > > > > > > intelligence in the sense of discernement. 9th is the ability > > > to > > > > > process > > > > > > ideas, abstaract systems. 5th can make for shrewdness even, > > > when > > > > > loaded > > > > > > with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives > > > > > ability to > > > > > > devise plans. > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, 9th. Some other time. > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> >, nalini swamy > > > > > > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Chandrasekhar ji, RK da,Lalit ji and others, > > > > > > > Namaskar. > > > > > > > When it comes to handwriting, a native's chart where Guru is > > > in > > > > > > makara, lagna with exalted Sukra and neecha Budha yuti in > > > Meena. > > > > > > > The native is left-handed when writing, eating with > > > implements > > > > > like > > > > > > spoon, fork etc. Right-handed when it comes to using bare > > > hands. The > > > > > > handwriting is terrible too. Is it due to neecha 3rd lord? The > > > 3rd > > > > > house > > > > > > here is not aspected by a malefic; Native dislikes writing, > > > even > > > > > > academic. Native has not done very well academically despite > > > being > > > > > very > > > > > > intelligent as he does no like even to write the answers in > > > full but > > > > > > just enough to get him through. > > > > > > > Now coming to academic excellence and grades, in my > chart > > > my 4th > > > > > > bhava, Kanya, has Rahu. The LL and 4th lord are in Meena, deb, > > > with > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > and enemy Chandra. In Navamnsha, Budha and Ketu occupy Karka, > > > again > > > > > to > > > > > > do with Chandra in the 4th, and the lagna is Rishaba( yuti > > > dwiguru). > > > > > > > I have done extremely well in school, average in > > > Intermediate and > > > > > very > > > > > > well in Graduation. Again average in Post-grad. I am now doing > > > a > > > > > > Bachelors and a post grad all over again... I am so > > > facscinated by > > > > > the > > > > > > fact that the grades dont follow the pattern I mentioned > > > earlier. I > > > > > > started off very,very well and nose-dived in the 2nd year. A > > > lot to > > > > > do > > > > > > with Gochara I suppose. > > > > > > > I also do well in abstract concepts and writing, not very > > > good in > > > > > > science when it comes to grades. Even in Jyotish, I am helped > > > more > > > > > with > > > > > > intuitive stuff rather than mere astro concepts which is also > > > why I > > > > > > hesitate to discuss charts (: > > > > > > > Love to have your inputs, > > > > > > > Nalini > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar sharma.chandrashekhar@ > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > > > > Friday, 13 June, 2008 5:50:13 AM > > > > > > > Re: [Vedic Astrologyandhealing] Re: ShahJahan and > > > > > AurangJeb - > > > > > > AstroAnalysis (Related Q to Chandrashekarji) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a difference between handwriting and Likhita vidya. > > > It is > > > > > > only in these days that even 3 year old are taught to write > > > that > > > > > too two > > > > > > languages. Earlier till one attained 1st standard most of the > > > > > teaching > > > > > > was by making one memorize tables, shlokas and so on. With > > > time the > > > > > > definition of what is Maukhik, Likhita, learnt for getting > > > Gyaan > > > > > and so > > > > > > on changes. I remember the times when those who had done > > > > > Matriculation > > > > > > were considered highly educated. These days it is not uncommon > > > to > > > > > see > > > > > > even rickshaw-wallas being graduates or even post graduates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In your case did you notice that your 4th bhava is in > > > Papakartari > > > > > and > > > > > > its lord Mercury is afflicted by Ketu occupying the rasi of > its > > > > > enemy > > > > > > Moon and that of Jupiter in Navamsha? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Think about this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > Sri Chandrashekhar Ji and Our RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I find it's important to mention that lekhan (writing) is > > > more > > > > > > > related to 3'rd house not the 4'th, I have seen dozens of > the > > > > > cases > > > > > > > when 3rd is occupied by a malific (my own case) and if > > > aspected > > > > > by a > > > > > > > malific (my 2 brother's case), one is not only poor in > > > writing > > > > > good > > > > > > > stuff but his handwriting is also very very bad. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also exclusively 4'th can not be graduation, my 4'th house > is > > > > > > > occupied by Venus, aspected by Ju, I did very bad in my > > > > > graduation, > > > > > > > whereas in school and in my PG i did excellent. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5'th dominates in chart for the judgement of education. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ > <aling@> s.com, > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I look to 2nd for education up to secondary level, 4th for > > > > > > > graduation > > > > > > > > and 5th for post graduation, 9th being the Doctoral or > > > higher > > > > > > > education. > > > > > > > > Actually the 2nd is Maukhik (verbal) Vidya, 4th Likhita > > > (written > > > > > > > word) > > > > > > > > vidya, 5th the Gyaan or acquired knowledge and 9th higher > > > form > > > > > of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > acquired knowledge. However we have to fit this in with > the > > > > > > > current > > > > > > > > education pattern. May be if a person is doing Ph.D. only > > > to get > > > > > > > > University scales and not for any worthwhile research, we > > > could > > > > > > > look at > > > > > > > > it in the 4th bhava. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu does not become lord of the Bhavas, but in > Vimshottari > > > > > dashas > > > > > > > he > > > > > > > > does give results like that of Mars who in the instant > case > > > > > > > happens to > > > > > > > > be Maraka, being 2nd and 7th lord. Since it also gives > > > results > > > > > of > > > > > > > > Saturn, depending on transits, it can also give > > > education , or > > > > > > > progeny > > > > > > > > depending on the person's age. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks. I would like to know how you read the graduation > > > slab, > > > > > > > which is > > > > > > > > > neither higher education nor early education. Please > > > tell. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu giving Mars-like results is understandable but to > my > > > > > mind, > > > > > > > not to > > > > > > > > > the extent of replicating the lordship. Besides, it is > > > not > > > > > Aries > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > Scorpio assigned secondarily to Ketu that we can deduce > > > that, > > > > > is > > > > > > > it? The > > > > > > > > > reading on mother and domicile front may stick. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe we can examine the 2nd and 7th lordship result of > > > Ketu > > > > > as > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > kuja-tulya phala after a look at the overall chart. I > > > will > > > > > post > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > chart soon. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ > <aling@> s.com > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol <vedicastrol> ogyandhealing% > 40. com>, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I could also indicate harm to mother or giving up > > > > > motherland. > > > > > > > It could > > > > > > > > > > also indicate problems in graduation slab of education > > > and > > > > > > > even giving > > > > > > > > > > up education at that time. Ketu would also give > > > results of > > > > > > > Saturn in > > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > dasha and being like Mars the 2nd and 7th lord could > > > > > indicate > > > > > > > problems > > > > > > > > > > on marital front. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrasekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > What if Saturn and Ketu are in 4th hse? You have > > > alluded > > > > > to > > > > > > > Kapata > > > > > > > > > Yoga > > > > > > > > > > > under Sat+Moon in 4th. Saturn+Ketu ipso facto > > > constitutes > > > > > > > saintly > > > > > > > > > > > disposition if I correctly remember your observation > > > at > > > > > this > > > > > > > forum. > > > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > > > sign in this case is Makara. > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ > <aling@> s.com > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol <vedicastrol> ogyandhealing% > 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol <vedicastrol> > ogyandhealing% 40. > > > com>, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn- Moon in 4th could indicate an old large > > > house > > > > > and > > > > > > > also the > > > > > > > > > > > > possibility of a tendency of not speaking truth, > > > > > > > necessarily. It > > > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > > > > also indicate a long lived mother. Saturn or Moon > > > not > > > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > > > the th > > > > > > > > > > > > or 9th I do not think this could mean fanaticism. > > > It is > > > > > > > more the > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun+mars combination that could sometimes indicate > > > this > > > > > > > tendency > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > showing off his religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupitor's presence has confused me too but Sat + > > > Moon > > > > > in > > > > > > > 4'th > > > > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > > > > and Jup affliction by Saturn's aspect on it, as > > > well > > > > > as > > > > > > > Mars > > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > > > > on lagna gave me thoughts to put the chart in > the > > > > > group > > > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > > > > serious > > > > > > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will Sat + Moon combo in 4'th house make a > person > > > > > > > fanatic and > > > > > > > > > > > > > barberic ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ > <aling@> s.com > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol <vedicastrol> ogyandhealing% > 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol <vedicastrol> > ogyandhealing% 40. > > > com> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol <vedicastrol> > ogyandhealing% 40. > > > > > com>, > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Check your source. With Aquarius and Jupiter > > > in the > > > > > > > Lagna his > > > > > > > > > > > > > history > > > > > > > > > > > > > > does not suit the chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Group and Elders, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Shahjahanama, author Mulla Abdul Hamid > > > Lahori > > > > > has > > > > > > > given > > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > unorganised astro contents, they tell u > > > planetary > > > > > > > position > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > time of various events. Presenting Shahjahan > > > and > > > > > his > > > > > > > bad son > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aurangjeb's available horoscopic details to > > > have > > > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > study of their horoscopes, focusing on - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. massive killing and oppression of > > > siblings. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. enimical behavior with their fathers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. barbaric nature (more in case of > > > Aurangjeb) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. exploitation of women ( keeping hundreds > > > of > > > > > women > > > > > > > in the > > > > > > > > > > > fort) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. Aurangjeb's hate for music and dance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. religious fanatism > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A ---> Aurangjeb > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dob : 03/11/1618 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tob : 20:05 (Acquarius Lagna, pls. check the > > > > > time, m > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > sure) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pob : somewhere in Gujrat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The details i have are as follows - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius - Jup > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H : Sat + Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6h : Ketu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 9H : Sun + Merc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Ven > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12: Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) And Shahjahan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh my god, i forgot to note down his birth > > > > > details, > > > > > > > any way > > > > > > > > > > > > > reproducing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > his horoscope > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H: Sat + Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8H: Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10H : Ju > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Sun + Ketu+Merc+Venus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > He did a revolt against Father in > > > Rahu/Moon/Mars > > > > > but > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > Sani/Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > All > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > his sons were killed by Aurangjeb (another > > > Son). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will give more details tomorrow. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > > > > > > http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.> > <http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.> > > > > <http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.> > <http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.> >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 17, 2008 Report Share Posted June 17, 2008 Dear Lalit, If you think that intelligence and formal education is one and the same, you can think so. That is not so for me. I can not accept what is not right. There is a great difference between acquired knowledge and education. That is why you may find engineers becoming great bowlers but not engineers (Shreekanth and Kumble, if my memory serves me right) and Doctors becoming great actors but not good Doctors (Dr. Shreeram Lagoo). This again is why you see Laloo Prasad Yadav and even the Dabbewalahs of Mumbai lecturing Harvard graduates but not many of its old alumni. However my acceptance, or otherwise, does not mean others should follow what I say. They are free to interpret as they want. Take care, Chandrashekhar. litsol wrote: Dear Sir, This is a reply to both the mails, Pls. be open to accept a right thing, which only helps, not to me but to quality of every body's analysis. The shlokas are written following their grammer so one auther uses a term and another author may use synonym or a similar term to explain his idea. For the 5'th house they all write - Budhi Prasadam, Dhi, Buddhi Prabandha, Mati Prabanadh, PratiBhaa etc.. Can i ask you are anybody what's Budhi Prasadam,Mati Prabanadh, PratiBhaa etc. Pls. tell me why these attributes dont signify Study ? And when none of the classics except for Jatak Parijaata advocates 4'th as house for Study but along with 4'th and Jatak Parijaata supports for 5'th too to judge one's study, With this much written favoring the 5'th, why you are prone to 4'th only. There is no point in doing arguments to define what's education, somebody can say education is a process of making one's civilized, but that's not whole of the truth. I have tried this much keeping focus on academic education that we receive at school, college and university. how we groom and shape our personality in the sense of education that comes through the experience should be judged differently. regards, Lalit. Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Lalit, > > You have taken lot of pains to read through the classics. But where do > they talk about vidya connected with the 5th? Tantra vidya, Dhi Punya > shanchay, Nishkapati etc. are not formal education. Or am I missing > something here? > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > Dear Sir and Group, > > > > I have more references to share with you, It seems that first > > learned astrologers considered 4'th for vidya or education but later > > they modified their finding about 4'th and gradually got confirmed > > that 5'th is the primary house for education,study and learning, > > 4'th is secondary as it act's like a container only. > > > > JataBharana : Same shloka of Shambhu Hora and Bhava Kautuhalam is > > repeated, It says - > > > > Budhi Prabandh-Atmja Tantra Vidya Vinaye Garbh Sthiti .... etc. > > > > Jataka Parijaata : Putra Pitra Dhi (Intellect) Punyani Sanchitaye .. > > > > But Same Jatak Parijaata declares that 4'th also is a house for > > Vidya, The shloka given is : > > > > "Vidya Janani Sukhani Sugandha Gobandhu ...." > > > > It's like Sri BV Raman, who considered both 4'th and 5'th and > > avoided the final judgement. > > > > Phaladeepka said about 5'th : > > > > a) Budhi Prasadam SutBha achha Sasthaat Peedam Piturdosham .. etc. > > > > b) SaumyaYukte Panchame va Tadishware, Vaisheshikanshe Sadbhave > > Dhi - Man Nishkapti Bhavat !! > > > > Phal Deepika more clarifies that in the chapter where it deals with > > Dasha - > > > > In the dasha of the 5'th lord, according to Mantreshwara : > > > > If 5'th lord is auspecious and has strength then - > > > > c) Putrapraptim Bandhu Vilasama NripTeenam Sachivam va Dheesham > > (Lord of House of intellect) Bahu Maanam (Honour and Fame ) > > > > But if 5'th lord is weak and afflicted then - > > > > d) Veeryane PratiBhaa Patau (Lord of Talent, Talent = "Pratibha" Sut > > Mritam Buddhi Bhramam (Aberration of Mind) cha vanchana. > > > > Hope it's enough to put astro prediction and analysis in the right > > track and make it error free. > > > > regards, > > Lalit. > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, "litsol" > > <litsol@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > Like any science, astrology too evolved over the period and we see > > > one concept after another for same thing till the establishment > > and > > > maturity point. > > > > > > I have quoted shlokas from Bhava Kautuhalam, Shambu Hora, Phalit > > > Martand. > > > > > > I m sorry for referring to two personal incidens but In RK Daa's > > > chart, in the 4'th house, there is Mercury exalted, still he could > > > not get any good achievment in academic education, in another > > group > > > member, Vighnesh Ji's chart same Merc is exalted in 10'th thus > > > aspecting 4'th prominantly still he could not do good in academic > > > education. > > > > > > It's upto astrologer if they want to find right causes or not, > > even > > > with wrong aproach and wrong concept sometimes one may get > > > satisfactory justification but not always. > > > > > > If 4'th denotes education, I w'd have done very good in my Grad. > > > > > > It's vital to understand the potential and pattern of life through > > > the chart. If 5'th is weak, there is no good potential, and during > > a > > > bad dasha and transit, one can get obstacles and failures. This > > has > > > no exception at all. > > > > > > regards, > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, Chandrashekhar > > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > I agree with RK da. Please give reference to the classic text > > from > > > which > > > > you give the shlokas. If one really wants o go to the classical > > > > definitions verbatim, then only the 2nd is called Vidya bhava. > > > Bhrigu > > > > does refer to this being opinion of the learned and says that in > > > his > > > > opinion 4th is the house of academic education. Fifth he allots > > to > > > > higher learning and wisdom, intelligence spiritual practices and > > > so on. > > > > Mantreshwar in Phaladeepika also indicates the 4th for > > education. > > > So > > > > many classics do mention the 4th being related to education. > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Daa, Sri Chandrashekhar Ji, Nalini Ji and Group, > > > > > > > > > > I m surprised to see following is written by RK Daa, A > > conclusion > > > > > which has no clear endorsement in a classics - > > > > > > > > > > A.) 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded, with > > strength > > > > > from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability to > > devise > > > > > plans > > > > > > > > > > B.) The core vidya sthana is 4th house - Almost similar > > opinion > > > is > > > > > given by Sri Chandrashekhar Ji. > > > > > > > > > > I examined both the statements, Sorry, both needs serious > > review, > > > > > however, It's true that confusion between 4'th with and 9'th > > with > > > > > 10'th for some common significations is quite normal, Great BV > > > Raman > > > > > also could not reach any visible distinction, the answer lies > > in > > > > > tradition, since cnturies such a tradition has been continued > > in > > > > > several pockets of india, however, our classics are quite > > clear > > > on > > > > > primary and secondary kind of significations of the bhavas. > > > > > > > > > > To remove the doubt of members and to put an end to this > > > confusion, > > > > > which sometimes forces astrologer to stretch the basics to > > reach > > > a > > > > > justification, i m giving some shlokas of classics. > > > > > > > > > > 4'th is unaminously called "Turya Sthaana", "Mitra Alaya" > > > or "Sukha > > > > > Sthaana", The shloka is - > > > > > > > > > > Turyasthan Sanstham Phalam tat Vakscha-Sthaanam Purushanam > > > Niruktam > > > > > (Principles or Ethics expressed) ! > > > > > Amba (Mother) BandhuKchhoni Mitralayanam (Public Support by > > > friends > > > > > and relatives) Sarva Annanam (Food Grain, Yield of effort) > > GramYug > > > > > Vahananaam (Land, Village, Vehicles). > > > > > > > > > > 5'th is unaminously called place for "Mati > > Prabandhaha" , "Budhi > > > > > Prabandha" or Management of Mind and Intellect. > > > > > > > > > > The shloka goes - > > > > > > > > > > 1. Mati Prabandhaha Sutabhe Nijodaram (One's own Children), > > > > > Vinaye(Modesty, Politeness)- Garbha-Sthiti, Mantra Sadhanam > > > > > Modesty !! > > > > > > > > > > 2. Santan Garbha Sthitineeti Sanstha, Mantradi Siddhi Vinayash > > > Vidya > > > > > (Learning/Education), Buddhi Prabandhaha Sutabhe Vichintyam > > Etat > > > annu > > > > > JatakGyaha !! > > > > > > > > > > Now, where is the confusion, I think that was there because > > the > > > 4'th > > > > > denotes how u keep what u acquire, the immovables, so, the > > > knowledge > > > > > that you retain after studying a subject, is to be seen from > > the > > > 4'th > > > > > not the education, study or ur's learning itself. > > > > > > > > > > I w'd request RK Daa to review the 4'th house and education in > > > his > > > > > own case, Why this placement has not given you a bright > > academic > > > > > education. > > > > > > > > > > Let's not misundersatand the primary and seconday > > significations. > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing% > > 40>, "arkaydash" > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Nalini, > > > > > > > > > > > > Your 4th house is aspected by its lord. Strengthened. It is > > > > > aspected by > > > > > > Mercury, not by any other planet. Stenghtened and imbued > > with > > > Mc, > > > > > right? > > > > > > Capable of quick learning. Mc in water sign. Intuitive. > > > > > > > > > > > > My understaning is that 4th speaks of how learned one is. If > > > it is > > > > > in > > > > > > the care of its benefic lord and is by and large unsullied by > > > > > malefic > > > > > > impact, learning is assured. If the care is with Mc, have no > > > doubt. > > > > > Mc > > > > > > as 4th lord ensures that the real wealth is his or her > > > learning; > > > > > other > > > > > > tangible assets will gravitate in the goodness of time via > > > Mercury's > > > > > > prasaada (grants). As lagna lord in debility, Mc spells > > > periods of > > > > > > concern; when there is a bad run of dasa etc, health may not > > > remain > > > > > > unassailed. Your fluctuating academic performances have to > > be > > > seen > > > > > in > > > > > > the context of the then operating dasa and transit. Transit > > of > > > the > > > > > Big > > > > > > Two. > > > > > > > > > > > > Third house has to do with dexeterity, manual. The act of > > > writing & > > > > > > communication & retention (dhruti) thus also patience. > > Benefics > > > > > there: a > > > > > > person writes a good hand. His patience does not run out. > > > > > > > > > > > > The core vidya sthana is 4th house. With a strong, unalloyed > > > 4th > > > > > house, > > > > > > one cannot command vidya. Neither 5th, nor 9th can > > compensate. > > > 5th > > > > > is > > > > > > intelligence in the sense of discernement. 9th is the > > ability > > > to > > > > > process > > > > > > ideas, abstaract systems. 5th can make for shrewdness even, > > > when > > > > > loaded > > > > > > with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives > > > > > ability to > > > > > > devise plans. > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, 9th. Some other time. > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, nalini > > swamy > > > > > > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Chandrasekhar ji, RK da,Lalit ji and others, > > > > > > > Namaskar. > > > > > > > When it comes to handwriting, a native's chart where Guru > > is > > > in > > > > > > makara, lagna with exalted Sukra and neecha Budha yuti in > > > Meena. > > > > > > > The native is left-handed when writing, eating with > > > implements > > > > > like > > > > > > spoon, fork etc. Right-handed when it comes to using bare > > > hands. The > > > > > > handwriting is terrible too. Is it due to neecha 3rd lord? > > The > > > 3rd > > > > > house > > > > > > here is not aspected by a malefic; Native dislikes writing, > > > even > > > > > > academic. Native has not done very well academically despite > > > being > > > > > very > > > > > > intelligent as he does no like even to write the answers in > > > full but > > > > > > just enough to get him through. > > > > > > > Now coming to academic excellence and grades, in my chart > > > my 4th > > > > > > bhava, Kanya, has Rahu. The LL and 4th lord are in Meena, > > deb, > > > with > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > and enemy Chandra. In Navamnsha, Budha and Ketu occupy > > Karka, > > > again > > > > > to > > > > > > do with Chandra in the 4th, and the lagna is Rishaba( yuti > > > dwiguru). > > > > > > > I have done extremely well in school, average in > > > Intermediate and > > > > > very > > > > > > well in Graduation. Again average in Post-grad. I am now > > doing > > > a > > > > > > Bachelors and a post grad all over again... I am so > > > facscinated by > > > > > the > > > > > > fact that the grades dont follow the pattern I mentioned > > > earlier. I > > > > > > started off very,very well and nose-dived in the 2nd year. A > > > lot to > > > > > do > > > > > > with Gochara I suppose. > > > > > > > I also do well in abstract concepts and writing, not very > > > good in > > > > > > science when it comes to grades. Even in Jyotish, I am > > helped > > > more > > > > > with > > > > > > intuitive stuff rather than mere astro concepts which is > > also > > > why I > > > > > > hesitate to discuss charts (: > > > > > > > Love to have your inputs, > > > > > > > Nalini > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar sharma.chandrashekhar@ > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > > > Friday, 13 June, 2008 5:50:13 AM > > > > > > > Re: [Vedic Astrologyandhealing] Re: ShahJahan and > > > > > AurangJeb - > > > > > > AstroAnalysis (Related Q to Chandrashekarji) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a difference between handwriting and Likhita > > vidya. > > > It is > > > > > > only in these days that even 3 year old are taught to write > > > that > > > > > too two > > > > > > languages. Earlier till one attained 1st standard most of the > > > > > teaching > > > > > > was by making one memorize tables, shlokas and so on. With > > > time the > > > > > > definition of what is Maukhik, Likhita, learnt for getting > > > Gyaan > > > > > and so > > > > > > on changes. I remember the times when those who had done > > > > > Matriculation > > > > > > were considered highly educated. These days it is not > > uncommon > > > to > > > > > see > > > > > > even rickshaw-wallas being graduates or even post graduates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In your case did you notice that your 4th bhava is in > > > Papakartari > > > > > and > > > > > > its lord Mercury is afflicted by Ketu occupying the rasi of > > its > > > > > enemy > > > > > > Moon and that of Jupiter in Navamsha? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Think about this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > Sri Chandrashekhar Ji and Our RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I find it's important to mention that lekhan (writing) is > > > more > > > > > > > related to 3'rd house not the 4'th, I have seen dozens of > > the > > > > > cases > > > > > > > when 3rd is occupied by a malific (my own case) and if > > > aspected > > > > > by a > > > > > > > malific (my 2 brother's case), one is not only poor in > > > writing > > > > > good > > > > > > > stuff but his handwriting is also very very bad. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also exclusively 4'th can not be graduation, my 4'th house > > is > > > > > > > occupied by Venus, aspected by Ju, I did very bad in my > > > > > graduation, > > > > > > > whereas in school and in my PG i did excellent. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5'th dominates in chart for the judgement of education. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com, > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I look to 2nd for education up to secondary level, 4th > > for > > > > > > > graduation > > > > > > > > and 5th for post graduation, 9th being the Doctoral or > > > higher > > > > > > > education. > > > > > > > > Actually the 2nd is Maukhik (verbal) Vidya, 4th Likhita > > > (written > > > > > > > word) > > > > > > > > vidya, 5th the Gyaan or acquired knowledge and 9th > > higher > > > form > > > > > of > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > acquired knowledge. However we have to fit this in with > > the > > > > > > > current > > > > > > > > education pattern. May be if a person is doing Ph.D. > > only > > > to get > > > > > > > > University scales and not for any worthwhile research, > > we > > > could > > > > > > > look at > > > > > > > > it in the 4th bhava. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu does not become lord of the Bhavas, but in > > Vimshottari > > > > > dashas > > > > > > > he > > > > > > > > does give results like that of Mars who in the instant > > case > > > > > > > happens to > > > > > > > > be Maraka, being 2nd and 7th lord. Since it also gives > > > results > > > > > of > > > > > > > > Saturn, depending on transits, it can also give > > > education , or > > > > > > > progeny > > > > > > > > depending on the person's age. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks. I would like to know how you read the > > graduation > > > slab, > > > > > > > which is > > > > > > > > > neither higher education nor early education. Please > > > tell. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu giving Mars-like results is understandable but to > > my > > > > > mind, > > > > > > > not to > > > > > > > > > the extent of replicating the lordship. Besides, it is > > > not > > > > > Aries > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > Scorpio assigned secondarily to Ketu that we can > > deduce > > > that, > > > > > is > > > > > > > it? The > > > > > > > > > reading on mother and domicile front may stick. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe we can examine the 2nd and 7th lordship result > > of > > > Ketu > > > > > as > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > kuja-tulya phala after a look at the overall chart. I > > > will > > > > > post > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > chart soon. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I could also indicate harm to mother or giving up > > > > > motherland. > > > > > > > It could > > > > > > > > > > also indicate problems in graduation slab of > > education > > > and > > > > > > > even giving > > > > > > > > > > up education at that time. Ketu would also give > > > results of > > > > > > > Saturn in > > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > dasha and being like Mars the 2nd and 7th lord could > > > > > indicate > > > > > > > problems > > > > > > > > > > on marital front. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrasekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > What if Saturn and Ketu are in 4th hse? You have > > > alluded > > > > > to > > > > > > > Kapata > > > > > > > > > Yoga > > > > > > > > > > > under Sat+Moon in 4th. Saturn+Ketu ipso facto > > > constitutes > > > > > > > saintly > > > > > > > > > > > disposition if I correctly remember your > > observation > > > at > > > > > this > > > > > > > forum. > > > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > > > sign in this case is Makara. > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > > > com>, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn- Moon in 4th could indicate an old large > > > house > > > > > and > > > > > > > also the > > > > > > > > > > > > possibility of a tendency of not speaking truth, > > > > > > > necessarily. It > > > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > > > > also indicate a long lived mother. Saturn or > > Moon > > > not > > > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > > > the th > > > > > > > > > > > > or 9th I do not think this could mean > > fanaticism. > > > It is > > > > > > > more the > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun+mars combination that could sometimes > > indicate > > > this > > > > > > > tendency > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > showing off his religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupitor's presence has confused me too but Sat > > + > > > Moon > > > > > in > > > > > > > 4'th > > > > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > > > > and Jup affliction by Saturn's aspect on it, > > as > > > well > > > > > as > > > > > > > Mars > > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > > > > on lagna gave me thoughts to put the chart in > > the > > > > > group > > > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > > > > serious > > > > > > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will Sat + Moon combo in 4'th house make a > > person > > > > > > > fanatic and > > > > > > > > > > > > > barberic ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ > > s.com > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > > > com> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% > > 40. > > > > > com>, > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Check your source. With Aquarius and Jupiter > > > in the > > > > > > > Lagna his > > > > > > > > > > > > > history > > > > > > > > > > > > > > does not suit the chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Group and Elders, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Shahjahanama, author Mulla Abdul Hamid > > > Lahori > > > > > has > > > > > > > given > > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > unorganised astro contents, they tell u > > > planetary > > > > > > > position > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > time of various events. Presenting > > Shahjahan > > > and > > > > > his > > > > > > > bad son > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aurangjeb's available horoscopic details > > to > > > have > > > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > study of their horoscopes, focusing on - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. massive killing and oppression of > > > siblings. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. enimical behavior with their fathers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. barbaric nature (more in case of > > > Aurangjeb) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. exploitation of women ( keeping > > hundreds > > > of > > > > > women > > > > > > > in the > > > > > > > > > > > fort) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. Aurangjeb's hate for music and dance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. religious fanatism > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A ---> Aurangjeb > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dob : 03/11/1618 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tob : 20:05 (Acquarius Lagna, pls. check > > the > > > > > time, m > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > sure) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pob : somewhere in Gujrat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The details i have are as follows - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius - Jup > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H : Sat + Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6h : Ketu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 9H : Sun + Merc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Ven > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12: Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) And Shahjahan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh my god, i forgot to note down his birth > > > > > details, > > > > > > > any way > > > > > > > > > > > > > reproducing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > his horoscope > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H: Sat + Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8H: Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10H : Ju > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Sun + Ketu+Merc+Venus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > He did a revolt against Father in > > > Rahu/Moon/Mars > > > > > but > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > Sani/Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > All > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > his sons were killed by Aurangjeb (another > > > Son). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will give more details tomorrow. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > > > > > > http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.> > > <http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 17, 2008 Report Share Posted June 17, 2008 Dear Lalit, It appears that you have made up your mind that 4th can not be education. Did you ask Vighnesh if he began CA before or after his graduation? May be Vighnesh himself would like to comment. 4th lord going to the 8th does not make it strong and like it or not Mercury is karaka for education and is in Papakartari. Jupiter is not the karaka for education, it is karaka for knowledge, progeny, Guru, money and work. Take care, Chandrashekhar litsol wrote: Dear Sir, I m sorry to say that logic and eplanation given by you does seem appropriate,First let's scale the effect of good and bad aspects, Will u say : Aspect of exalted Ju + Aspect of exalted Merc < Aspect of Mars ? In vighnesh Ji's chart, 4'th receives aspect of exalted Guru from the 8'th, and again receives aspect of exalted Mercury. Mercury and Jupitor both are the karaka for study and Knowledge, Both are exalted, Now come Mars, Why only Mars's aspect w'd impact and the impact is so bad that he could not clear his CA despite multiple efforts, CA is only a graduation level education. Same is case of RK Daa, It's important to note that his lagna lord Merc is exalted in 4'th but he never got good rank, Mercury's exaltation happens in his own sign, so, there is no case of dispositor's bad effect, in his academic education, he met failures and broken the line of study, however, he is learned more than most of the people we see around us, he has real knowledge and has an autority in his profession. Take my brother's chart. Lagna is Aquarious, 4'th and 9'th lord Venus is placed in 5'th house whereas Moon is placed in 9'th,So, as per the dictum that 4'th denotes education, he should do good in graduation, should have a good academic record, but on the contrary, he had a gap of 2 yrs after his 12'th, he never scored good except for his class 10'th, He dis his Graduation with 54.7% of marx only. If u take 2nd house for study, His 2nd lord Ju is placed in 7'th in a frind rashi, So, why he was only an average student throughout his school time as well got good marx only in class 10'th. My idea is - His 5'th house receives Saturn's aspect thus chart does not have very good potential for study and he was running in saturn's dasa during his study, along with this, 5'th lord is placed in 6'th along with Rahu. Thus chart dosnt have promise for good ecucation. regards, Lalit. Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Lalit, > > I thought so. Anyway, Buddhi or Buddhi prabandhan can not be equated to > formal education, neither can Dhi. So the references tat you quote do > not seem to say that education is to be seen from the 5th. But if you > feel that you should take it as the house of formal education you are > free to do so. Only the sages do not seem to agree. > > I do not have chart of RK da to comment about his 4th bhava. But in case > of Vighnesh the 4th lord occupies the 8th bhava in both rasi and > Navamsha and Mercury is in Papakartari. So the 4th bhava is not as > strong as it should be. besides aspects of Jupiter and Mercury it also > receives the aspect of Mars and Jupiter the 4th lord itself is in aspect > of Saturn. However by not doing good education do you mean he had > obstacles in education or that he did not pursue post graduation (which > should be seen from the 5th as indicated by me) ? > > Take care, > Chandrashekhar. > > litsol wrote: > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > Like any science, astrology too evolved over the period and we see > > one concept after another for same thing till the establishment and > > maturity point. > > > > I have quoted shlokas from Bhava Kautuhalam, Shambu Hora, Phalit > > Martand. > > > > I m sorry for referring to two personal incidens but In RK Daa's > > chart, in the 4'th house, there is Mercury exalted, still he could > > not get any good achievment in academic education, in another group > > member, Vighnesh Ji's chart same Merc is exalted in 10'th thus > > aspecting 4'th prominantly still he could not do good in academic > > education. > > > > It's upto astrologer if they want to find right causes or not, even > > with wrong aproach and wrong concept sometimes one may get > > satisfactory justification but not always. > > > > If 4'th denotes education, I w'd have done very good in my Grad. > > > > It's vital to understand the potential and pattern of life through > > the chart. If 5'th is weak, there is no good potential, and during a > > bad dasha and transit, one can get obstacles and failures. This has > > no exception at all. > > > > regards, > > Lalit. > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, Chandrashekhar > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > I agree with RK da. Please give reference to the classic text from > > which > > > you give the shlokas. If one really wants o go to the classical > > > definitions verbatim, then only the 2nd is called Vidya bhava. > > Bhrigu > > > does refer to this being opinion of the learned and says that in > > his > > > opinion 4th is the house of academic education. Fifth he allots to > > > higher learning and wisdom, intelligence spiritual practices and > > so on. > > > Mantreshwar in Phaladeepika also indicates the 4th for education. > > So > > > many classics do mention the 4th being related to education. > > > > > > take care, > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear RK Daa, Sri Chandrashekhar Ji, Nalini Ji and Group, > > > > > > > > I m surprised to see following is written by RK Daa, A conclusion > > > > which has no clear endorsement in a classics - > > > > > > > > A.) 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded, with strength > > > > from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability to devise > > > > plans > > > > > > > > B.) The core vidya sthana is 4th house - Almost similar opinion > > is > > > > given by Sri Chandrashekhar Ji. > > > > > > > > I examined both the statements, Sorry, both needs serious review, > > > > however, It's true that confusion between 4'th with and 9'th with > > > > 10'th for some common significations is quite normal, Great BV > > Raman > > > > also could not reach any visible distinction, the answer lies in > > > > tradition, since cnturies such a tradition has been continued in > > > > several pockets of india, however, our classics are quite clear > > on > > > > primary and secondary kind of significations of the bhavas. > > > > > > > > To remove the doubt of members and to put an end to this > > confusion, > > > > which sometimes forces astrologer to stretch the basics to reach > > a > > > > justification, i m giving some shlokas of classics. > > > > > > > > 4'th is unaminously called "Turya Sthaana", "Mitra Alaya" > > or "Sukha > > > > Sthaana", The shloka is - > > > > > > > > Turyasthan Sanstham Phalam tat Vakscha-Sthaanam Purushanam > > Niruktam > > > > (Principles or Ethics expressed) ! > > > > Amba (Mother) BandhuKchhoni Mitralayanam (Public Support by > > friends > > > > and relatives) Sarva Annanam (Food Grain, Yield of effort)GramYug > > > > Vahananaam (Land, Village, Vehicles). > > > > > > > > 5'th is unaminously called place for "Mati Prabandhaha" , "Budhi > > > > Prabandha" or Management of Mind and Intellect. > > > > > > > > The shloka goes - > > > > > > > > 1. Mati Prabandhaha Sutabhe Nijodaram (One's own Children), > > > > Vinaye(Modesty, Politeness)- Garbha-Sthiti, Mantra Sadhanam > > > > Modesty !! > > > > > > > > 2. Santan Garbha Sthitineeti Sanstha, Mantradi Siddhi Vinayash > > Vidya > > > > (Learning/Education), Buddhi Prabandhaha Sutabhe Vichintyam Etat > > annu > > > > JatakGyaha !! > > > > > > > > Now, where is the confusion, I think that was there because the > > 4'th > > > > denotes how u keep what u acquire, the immovables, so, the > > knowledge > > > > that you retain after studying a subject, is to be seen from the > > 4'th > > > > not the education, study or ur's learning itself. > > > > > > > > I w'd request RK Daa to review the 4'th house and education in > > his > > > > own case, Why this placement has not given you a bright academic > > > > education. > > > > > > > > Let's not misundersatand the primary and seconday significations. > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, "arkaydash" > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Nalini, > > > > > > > > > > Your 4th house is aspected by its lord. Strengthened. It is > > > > aspected by > > > > > Mercury, not by any other planet. Stenghtened and imbued with > > Mc, > > > > right? > > > > > Capable of quick learning. Mc in water sign. Intuitive. > > > > > > > > > > My understaning is that 4th speaks of how learned one is. If > > it is > > > > in > > > > > the care of its benefic lord and is by and large unsullied by > > > > malefic > > > > > impact, learning is assured. If the care is with Mc, have no > > doubt. > > > > Mc > > > > > as 4th lord ensures that the real wealth is his or her > > learning; > > > > other > > > > > tangible assets will gravitate in the goodness of time via > > Mercury's > > > > > prasaada (grants). As lagna lord in debility, Mc spells > > periods of > > > > > concern; when there is a bad run of dasa etc, health may not > > remain > > > > > unassailed. Your fluctuating academic performances have to be > > seen > > > > in > > > > > the context of the then operating dasa and transit. Transit of > > the > > > > Big > > > > > Two. > > > > > > > > > > Third house has to do with dexeterity, manual. The act of > > writing & > > > > > communication & retention (dhruti) thus also patience. Benefics > > > > there: a > > > > > person writes a good hand. His patience does not run out. > > > > > > > > > > The core vidya sthana is 4th house. With a strong, unalloyed > > 4th > > > > house, > > > > > one cannot command vidya. Neither 5th, nor 9th can compensate. > > 5th > > > > is > > > > > intelligence in the sense of discernement. 9th is the ability > > to > > > > process > > > > > ideas, abstaract systems. 5th can make for shrewdness even, > > when > > > > loaded > > > > > with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives > > > > ability to > > > > > devise plans. > > > > > > > > > > Well, 9th. Some other time. > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>, nalini swamy > > > > > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Chandrasekhar ji, RK da,Lalit ji and others, > > > > > > Namaskar. > > > > > > When it comes to handwriting, a native's chart where Guru is > > in > > > > > makara, lagna with exalted Sukra and neecha Budha yuti in > > Meena. > > > > > > The native is left-handed when writing, eating with > > implements > > > > like > > > > > spoon, fork etc. Right-handed when it comes to using bare > > hands. The > > > > > handwriting is terrible too. Is it due to neecha 3rd lord? The > > 3rd > > > > house > > > > > here is not aspected by a malefic; Native dislikes writing, > > even > > > > > academic. Native has not done very well academically despite > > being > > > > very > > > > > intelligent as he does no like even to write the answers in > > full but > > > > > just enough to get him through. > > > > > > Now coming to academic excellence and grades, in my chart > > my 4th > > > > > bhava, Kanya, has Rahu. The LL and 4th lord are in Meena, deb, > > with > > > > Ketu > > > > > and enemy Chandra. In Navamnsha, Budha and Ketu occupy Karka, > > again > > > > to > > > > > do with Chandra in the 4th, and the lagna is Rishaba( yuti > > dwiguru). > > > > > > I have done extremely well in school, average in > > Intermediate and > > > > very > > > > > well in Graduation. Again average in Post-grad. I am now doing > > a > > > > > Bachelors and a post grad all over again... I am so > > facscinated by > > > > the > > > > > fact that the grades dont follow the pattern I mentioned > > earlier. I > > > > > started off very,very well and nose-dived in the 2nd year. A > > lot to > > > > do > > > > > with Gochara I suppose. > > > > > > I also do well in abstract concepts and writing, not very > > good in > > > > > science when it comes to grades. Even in Jyotish, I am helped > > more > > > > with > > > > > intuitive stuff rather than mere astro concepts which is also > > why I > > > > > hesitate to discuss charts (: > > > > > > Love to have your inputs, > > > > > > Nalini > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar sharma.chandrashekhar@ > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40> > > > > > > Friday, 13 June, 2008 5:50:13 AM > > > > > > Re: [Vedic Astrologyandhealing] Re: ShahJahan and > > > > AurangJeb - > > > > > AstroAnalysis (Related Q to Chandrashekarji) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a difference between handwriting and Likhita vidya. > > It is > > > > > only in these days that even 3 year old are taught to write > > that > > > > too two > > > > > languages. Earlier till one attained 1st standard most of the > > > > teaching > > > > > was by making one memorize tables, shlokas and so on. With > > time the > > > > > definition of what is Maukhik, Likhita, learnt for getting > > Gyaan > > > > and so > > > > > on changes. I remember the times when those who had done > > > > Matriculation > > > > > were considered highly educated. These days it is not uncommon > > to > > > > see > > > > > even rickshaw-wallas being graduates or even post graduates. > > > > > > > > > > > > In your case did you notice that your 4th bhava is in > > Papakartari > > > > and > > > > > its lord Mercury is afflicted by Ketu occupying the rasi of its > > > > enemy > > > > > Moon and that of Jupiter in Navamsha? > > > > > > > > > > > > Think about this. > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > Sri Chandrashekhar Ji and Our RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > I find it's important to mention that lekhan (writing) is > > more > > > > > > related to 3'rd house not the 4'th, I have seen dozens of the > > > > cases > > > > > > when 3rd is occupied by a malific (my own case) and if > > aspected > > > > by a > > > > > > malific (my 2 brother's case), one is not only poor in > > writing > > > > good > > > > > > stuff but his handwriting is also very very bad. > > > > > > > > > > > > Also exclusively 4'th can not be graduation, my 4'th house is > > > > > > occupied by Venus, aspected by Ju, I did very bad in my > > > > graduation, > > > > > > whereas in school and in my PG i did excellent. > > > > > > > > > > > > 5'th dominates in chart for the judgement of education. > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I look to 2nd for education up to secondary level, 4th for > > > > > > graduation > > > > > > > and 5th for post graduation, 9th being the Doctoral or > > higher > > > > > > education. > > > > > > > Actually the 2nd is Maukhik (verbal) Vidya, 4th Likhita > > (written > > > > > > word) > > > > > > > vidya, 5th the Gyaan or acquired knowledge and 9th higher > > form > > > > of > > > > > > the > > > > > > > acquired knowledge. However we have to fit this in with the > > > > > > current > > > > > > > education pattern. May be if a person is doing Ph.D. only > > to get > > > > > > > University scales and not for any worthwhile research, we > > could > > > > > > look at > > > > > > > it in the 4th bhava. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu does not become lord of the Bhavas, but in Vimshottari > > > > dashas > > > > > > he > > > > > > > does give results like that of Mars who in the instant case > > > > > > happens to > > > > > > > be Maraka, being 2nd and 7th lord. Since it also gives > > results > > > > of > > > > > > > Saturn, depending on transits, it can also give > > education , or > > > > > > progeny > > > > > > > depending on the person's age. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks. I would like to know how you read the graduation > > slab, > > > > > > which is > > > > > > > > neither higher education nor early education. Please > > tell. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu giving Mars-like results is understandable but to my > > > > mind, > > > > > > not to > > > > > > > > the extent of replicating the lordship. Besides, it is > > not > > > > Aries > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > Scorpio assigned secondarily to Ketu that we can deduce > > that, > > > > is > > > > > > it? The > > > > > > > > reading on mother and domicile front may stick. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe we can examine the 2nd and 7th lordship result of > > Ketu > > > > as > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > kuja-tulya phala after a look at the overall chart. I > > will > > > > post > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > chart soon. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I could also indicate harm to mother or giving up > > > > motherland. > > > > > > It could > > > > > > > > > also indicate problems in graduation slab of education > > and > > > > > > even giving > > > > > > > > > up education at that time. Ketu would also give > > results of > > > > > > Saturn in > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > dasha and being like Mars the 2nd and 7th lord could > > > > indicate > > > > > > problems > > > > > > > > > on marital front. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrasekharji, > > > > > > > > > > What if Saturn and Ketu are in 4th hse? You have > > alluded > > > > to > > > > > > Kapata > > > > > > > > Yoga > > > > > > > > > > under Sat+Moon in 4th. Saturn+Ketu ipso facto > > constitutes > > > > > > saintly > > > > > > > > > > disposition if I correctly remember your observation > > at > > > > this > > > > > > forum. > > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > > sign in this case is Makara. > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > > com>, > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn- Moon in 4th could indicate an old large > > house > > > > and > > > > > > also the > > > > > > > > > > > possibility of a tendency of not speaking truth, > > > > > > necessarily. It > > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > > > also indicate a long lived mother. Saturn or Moon > > not > > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > > the th > > > > > > > > > > > or 9th I do not think this could mean fanaticism. > > It is > > > > > > more the > > > > > > > > > > > Sun+mars combination that could sometimes indicate > > this > > > > > > tendency > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > showing off his religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupitor's presence has confused me too but Sat + > > Moon > > > > in > > > > > > 4'th > > > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > > > and Jup affliction by Saturn's aspect on it, as > > well > > > > as > > > > > > Mars > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > > > on lagna gave me thoughts to put the chart in the > > > > group > > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > > > serious > > > > > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will Sat + Moon combo in 4'th house make a person > > > > > > fanatic and > > > > > > > > > > > > barberic ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ s.com > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > > com> > > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > > > > com>, > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Check your source. With Aquarius and Jupiter > > in the > > > > > > Lagna his > > > > > > > > > > > > history > > > > > > > > > > > > > does not suit the chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Group and Elders, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Shahjahanama, author Mulla Abdul Hamid > > Lahori > > > > has > > > > > > given > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > > > > > unorganised astro contents, they tell u > > planetary > > > > > > position > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > time of various events. Presenting Shahjahan > > and > > > > his > > > > > > bad son > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aurangjeb's available horoscopic details to > > have > > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > > > study of their horoscopes, focusing on - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. massive killing and oppression of > > siblings. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. enimical behavior with their fathers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. barbaric nature (more in case of > > Aurangjeb) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. exploitation of women ( keeping hundreds > > of > > > > women > > > > > > in the > > > > > > > > > > fort) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. Aurangjeb's hate for music and dance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. religious fanatism > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A ---> Aurangjeb > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dob : 03/11/1618 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tob : 20:05 (Acquarius Lagna, pls. check the > > > > time, m > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > sure) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pob : somewhere in Gujrat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The details i have are as follows - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius - Jup > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H : Sat + Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6h : Ketu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 9H : Sun + Merc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Ven > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12: Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) And Shahjahan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh my god, i forgot to note down his birth > > > > details, > > > > > > any way > > > > > > > > > > > > reproducing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > his horoscope > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H: Sat + Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8H: Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10H : Ju > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Sun + Ketu+Merc+Venus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > He did a revolt against Father in > > Rahu/Moon/Mars > > > > but > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > Sani/Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > All > > > > > > > > > > > > > > his sons were killed by Aurangjeb (another > > Son). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will give more details tomorrow. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > > > > > http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.> > > <http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 17, 2008 Report Share Posted June 17, 2008 Nmaste Litsol and others, Come on dont get confused .Just see 4th bhava in sidhamsa ( d-24). 4th bhava in rasi just shows various general things like -mother, vehicle, heart,education ....So be specific for specific varga ,other wise u will get messed up things all.I had previously done this mistake ,but guru Rafal tought me that things from different vargas . So just see vargas.This formula works wonderfully. 5th bhava is the intelligence not degree ,diploma knowledge.Its like common sense ( chaturta). thanks, dheeraj Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar <sharma.chandrashekhar wrote: > > Dear Lalit, > > It appears that you have made up your mind that 4th can not be > education. Did you ask Vighnesh if he began CA before or after his > graduation? May be Vighnesh himself would like to comment. > > 4th lord going to the 8th does not make it strong and like it or not > Mercury is karaka for education and is in Papakartari. Jupiter is not > the karaka for education, it is karaka for knowledge, progeny, Guru, > money and work. > > Take care, > Chandrashekhar > > litsol wrote: > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > I m sorry to say that logic and eplanation given by you does seem > > appropriate,First let's scale the effect of good and bad aspects, > > > > Will u say : *Aspect of exalted Ju + Aspect of exalted Merc < Aspect > > of Mars ?* > > > > In vighnesh Ji's chart, 4'th receives aspect of exalted Guru from the > > 8'th, and again receives aspect of exalted Mercury. > > > > Mercury and Jupitor both are the karaka for study and Knowledge, Both > > are exalted, Now come Mars, Why only Mars's aspect w'd impact and the > > impact is so bad that he could not clear his CA despite multiple > > efforts, CA is only a graduation level education. > > > > Same is case of RK Daa, It's important to note that his lagna lord > > Merc is exalted in 4'th but he never got good rank, Mercury's > > exaltation happens in his own sign, so, there is no case of > > dispositor's bad effect, in his academic education, he met failures > > and broken the line of study, however, he is learned more than most of > > the people we see around us, he has real knowledge and has an autority > > in his profession. > > > > *Take my brother's chart.* > > > > Lagna is Aquarious, 4'th and 9'th lord Venus is placed in 5'th house > > whereas Moon is placed in 9'th,So, as per the dictum that 4'th denotes > > education, he should do good in graduation, should have a good > > academic record, but on the contrary, he had a gap of 2 yrs after his > > 12'th, he never scored good except for his class 10'th, He dis his > > Graduation with 54.7% of marx only. > > > > If u take 2nd house for study, His 2nd lord Ju is placed in 7'th in a > > frind rashi, So, why he was only an average student throughout his > > school time as well got good marx only in class 10'th. > > > > *My idea is -* > > > > His 5'th house receives Saturn's aspect thus chart does not have very > > good potential for study and he was running in saturn's dasa during > > his study, along with this, 5'th lord is placed in 6'th along with > > Rahu. Thus chart dosnt have promise for good ecucation. > > > > regards, > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing >, Chandrashekhar > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > I thought so. Anyway, Buddhi or Buddhi prabandhan can not be equated to > > > formal education, neither can Dhi. So the references tat you quote do > > > not seem to say that education is to be seen from the 5th. But if you > > > feel that you should take it as the house of formal education you are > > > free to do so. Only the sages do not seem to agree. > > > > > > I do not have chart of RK da to comment about his 4th bhava. But in > > case > > > of Vighnesh the 4th lord occupies the 8th bhava in both rasi and > > > Navamsha and Mercury is in Papakartari. So the 4th bhava is not as > > > strong as it should be. besides aspects of Jupiter and Mercury it also > > > receives the aspect of Mars and Jupiter the 4th lord itself is in > > aspect > > > of Saturn. However by not doing good education do you mean he had > > > obstacles in education or that he did not pursue post graduation (which > > > should be seen from the 5th as indicated by me) ? > > > > > > Take care, > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > Like any science, astrology too evolved over the period and we see > > > > one concept after another for same thing till the establishment and > > > > maturity point. > > > > > > > > I have quoted shlokas from Bhava Kautuhalam, Shambu Hora, Phalit > > > > Martand. > > > > > > > > I m sorry for referring to two personal incidens but In RK Daa's > > > > chart, in the 4'th house, there is Mercury exalted, still he could > > > > not get any good achievment in academic education, in another group > > > > member, Vighnesh Ji's chart same Merc is exalted in 10'th thus > > > > aspecting 4'th prominantly still he could not do good in academic > > > > education. > > > > > > > > It's upto astrologer if they want to find right causes or not, even > > > > with wrong aproach and wrong concept sometimes one may get > > > > satisfactory justification but not always. > > > > > > > > If 4'th denotes education, I w'd have done very good in my Grad. > > > > > > > > It's vital to understand the potential and pattern of life through > > > > the chart. If 5'th is weak, there is no good potential, and during a > > > > bad dasha and transit, one can get obstacles and failures. This has > > > > no exception at all. > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>>, Chandrashekhar > > > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > I agree with RK da. Please give reference to the classic text from > > > > which > > > > > you give the shlokas. If one really wants o go to the classical > > > > > definitions verbatim, then only the 2nd is called Vidya bhava. > > > > Bhrigu > > > > > does refer to this being opinion of the learned and says that in > > > > his > > > > > opinion 4th is the house of academic education. Fifth he allots to > > > > > higher learning and wisdom, intelligence spiritual practices and > > > > so on. > > > > > Mantreshwar in Phaladeepika also indicates the 4th for education. > > > > So > > > > > many classics do mention the 4th being related to education. > > > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Daa, Sri Chandrashekhar Ji, Nalini Ji and Group, > > > > > > > > > > > > I m surprised to see following is written by RK Daa, A conclusion > > > > > > which has no clear endorsement in a classics - > > > > > > > > > > > > A.) 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded, with strength > > > > > > from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability to devise > > > > > > plans > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) The core vidya sthana is 4th house - Almost similar opinion > > > > is > > > > > > given by Sri Chandrashekhar Ji. > > > > > > > > > > > > I examined both the statements, Sorry, both needs serious review, > > > > > > however, It's true that confusion between 4'th with and 9'th with > > > > > > 10'th for some common significations is quite normal, Great BV > > > > Raman > > > > > > also could not reach any visible distinction, the answer lies in > > > > > > tradition, since cnturies such a tradition has been continued in > > > > > > several pockets of india, however, our classics are quite clear > > > > on > > > > > > primary and secondary kind of significations of the bhavas. > > > > > > > > > > > > To remove the doubt of members and to put an end to this > > > > confusion, > > > > > > which sometimes forces astrologer to stretch the basics to reach > > > > a > > > > > > justification, i m giving some shlokas of classics. > > > > > > > > > > > > 4'th is unaminously called " Turya Sthaana " , " Mitra Alaya " > > > > or " Sukha > > > > > > Sthaana " , The shloka is - > > > > > > > > > > > > Turyasthan Sanstham Phalam tat Vakscha-Sthaanam Purushanam > > > > Niruktam > > > > > > (Principles or Ethics expressed) ! > > > > > > Amba (Mother) BandhuKchhoni Mitralayanam (Public Support by > > > > friends > > > > > > and relatives) Sarva Annanam (Food Grain, Yield of effort) GramYug > > > > > > Vahananaam (Land, Village, Vehicles). > > > > > > > > > > > > 5'th is unaminously called place for " Mati Prabandhaha " , " Budhi > > > > > > Prabandha " or Management of Mind and Intellect. > > > > > > > > > > > > The shloka goes - > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Mati Prabandhaha Sutabhe Nijodaram (One's own Children), > > > > > > Vinaye(Modesty, Politeness)- Garbha-Sthiti, Mantra Sadhanam > > > > > > Modesty !! > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. Santan Garbha Sthitineeti Sanstha, Mantradi Siddhi Vinayash > > > > Vidya > > > > > > (Learning/Education), Buddhi Prabandhaha Sutabhe Vichintyam Etat > > > > annu > > > > > > JatakGyaha !! > > > > > > > > > > > > Now, where is the confusion, I think that was there because the > > > > 4'th > > > > > > denotes how u keep what u acquire, the immovables, so, the > > > > knowledge > > > > > > that you retain after studying a subject, is to be seen from the > > > > 4'th > > > > > > not the education, study or ur's learning itself. > > > > > > > > > > > > I w'd request RK Daa to review the 4'th house and education in > > > > his > > > > > > own case, Why this placement has not given you a bright academic > > > > > > education. > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's not misundersatand the primary and seconday significations. > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>> > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>>, " arkaydash " > > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Nalini, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your 4th house is aspected by its lord. Strengthened. It is > > > > > > aspected by > > > > > > > Mercury, not by any other planet. Stenghtened and imbued with > > > > Mc, > > > > > > right? > > > > > > > Capable of quick learning. Mc in water sign. Intuitive. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My understaning is that 4th speaks of how learned one is. If > > > > it is > > > > > > in > > > > > > > the care of its benefic lord and is by and large unsullied by > > > > > > malefic > > > > > > > impact, learning is assured. If the care is with Mc, have no > > > > doubt. > > > > > > Mc > > > > > > > as 4th lord ensures that the real wealth is his or her > > > > learning; > > > > > > other > > > > > > > tangible assets will gravitate in the goodness of time via > > > > Mercury's > > > > > > > prasaada (grants). As lagna lord in debility, Mc spells > > > > periods of > > > > > > > concern; when there is a bad run of dasa etc, health may not > > > > remain > > > > > > > unassailed. Your fluctuating academic performances have to be > > > > seen > > > > > > in > > > > > > > the context of the then operating dasa and transit. Transit of > > > > the > > > > > > Big > > > > > > > Two. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Third house has to do with dexeterity, manual. The act of > > > > writing & > > > > > > > communication & retention (dhruti) thus also patience. Benefics > > > > > > there: a > > > > > > > person writes a good hand. His patience does not run out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The core vidya sthana is 4th house. With a strong, unalloyed > > > > 4th > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > one cannot command vidya. Neither 5th, nor 9th can compensate. > > > > 5th > > > > > > is > > > > > > > intelligence in the sense of discernement. 9th is the ability > > > > to > > > > > > process > > > > > > > ideas, abstaract systems. 5th can make for shrewdness even, > > > > when > > > > > > loaded > > > > > > > with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives > > > > > > ability to > > > > > > > devise plans. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, 9th. Some other time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>> > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>>, nalini swamy > > > > > > > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Chandrasekhar ji, RK da,Lalit ji and others, > > > > > > > > Namaskar. > > > > > > > > When it comes to handwriting, a native's chart where Guru is > > > > in > > > > > > > makara, lagna with exalted Sukra and neecha Budha yuti in > > > > Meena. > > > > > > > > The native is left-handed when writing, eating with > > > > implements > > > > > > like > > > > > > > spoon, fork etc. Right-handed when it comes to using bare > > > > hands. The > > > > > > > handwriting is terrible too. Is it due to neecha 3rd lord? The > > > > 3rd > > > > > > house > > > > > > > here is not aspected by a malefic; Native dislikes writing, > > > > even > > > > > > > academic. Native has not done very well academically despite > > > > being > > > > > > very > > > > > > > intelligent as he does no like even to write the answers in > > > > full but > > > > > > > just enough to get him through. > > > > > > > > Now coming to academic excellence and grades, in my chart > > > > my 4th > > > > > > > bhava, Kanya, has Rahu. The LL and 4th lord are in Meena, deb, > > > > with > > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > > and enemy Chandra. In Navamnsha, Budha and Ketu occupy Karka, > > > > again > > > > > > to > > > > > > > do with Chandra in the 4th, and the lagna is Rishaba( yuti > > > > dwiguru). > > > > > > > > I have done extremely well in school, average in > > > > Intermediate and > > > > > > very > > > > > > > well in Graduation. Again average in Post-grad. I am now doing > > > > a > > > > > > > Bachelors and a post grad all over again... I am so > > > > facscinated by > > > > > > the > > > > > > > fact that the grades dont follow the pattern I mentioned > > > > earlier. I > > > > > > > started off very,very well and nose-dived in the 2nd year. A > > > > lot to > > > > > > do > > > > > > > with Gochara I suppose. > > > > > > > > I also do well in abstract concepts and writing, not very > > > > good in > > > > > > > science when it comes to grades. Even in Jyotish, I am helped > > > > more > > > > > > with > > > > > > > intuitive stuff rather than mere astro concepts which is also > > > > why I > > > > > > > hesitate to discuss charts (: > > > > > > > > Love to have your inputs, > > > > > > > > Nalini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar sharma.chandrashekhar@ > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>> > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>> > > > > > > > > Friday, 13 June, 2008 5:50:13 AM > > > > > > > > Re: [Vedic Astrologyandhealing] Re: ShahJahan and > > > > > > AurangJeb - > > > > > > > AstroAnalysis (Related Q to Chandrashekarji) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a difference between handwriting and Likhita vidya. > > > > It is > > > > > > > only in these days that even 3 year old are taught to write > > > > that > > > > > > too two > > > > > > > languages. Earlier till one attained 1st standard most of the > > > > > > teaching > > > > > > > was by making one memorize tables, shlokas and so on. With > > > > time the > > > > > > > definition of what is Maukhik, Likhita, learnt for getting > > > > Gyaan > > > > > > and so > > > > > > > on changes. I remember the times when those who had done > > > > > > Matriculation > > > > > > > were considered highly educated. These days it is not uncommon > > > > to > > > > > > see > > > > > > > even rickshaw-wallas being graduates or even post graduates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In your case did you notice that your 4th bhava is in > > > > Papakartari > > > > > > and > > > > > > > its lord Mercury is afflicted by Ketu occupying the rasi of its > > > > > > enemy > > > > > > > Moon and that of Jupiter in Navamsha? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Think about this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > Sri Chandrashekhar Ji and Our RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I find it's important to mention that lekhan (writing) is > > > > more > > > > > > > > related to 3'rd house not the 4'th, I have seen dozens of the > > > > > > cases > > > > > > > > when 3rd is occupied by a malific (my own case) and if > > > > aspected > > > > > > by a > > > > > > > > malific (my 2 brother's case), one is not only poor in > > > > writing > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > stuff but his handwriting is also very very bad. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also exclusively 4'th can not be graduation, my 4'th house is > > > > > > > > occupied by Venus, aspected by Ju, I did very bad in my > > > > > > graduation, > > > > > > > > whereas in school and in my PG i did excellent. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5'th dominates in chart for the judgement of education. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ > > <aling@> s.com, > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I look to 2nd for education up to secondary level, 4th for > > > > > > > > graduation > > > > > > > > > and 5th for post graduation, 9th being the Doctoral or > > > > higher > > > > > > > > education. > > > > > > > > > Actually the 2nd is Maukhik (verbal) Vidya, 4th Likhita > > > > (written > > > > > > > > word) > > > > > > > > > vidya, 5th the Gyaan or acquired knowledge and 9th higher > > > > form > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > acquired knowledge. However we have to fit this in with the > > > > > > > > current > > > > > > > > > education pattern. May be if a person is doing Ph.D. only > > > > to get > > > > > > > > > University scales and not for any worthwhile research, we > > > > could > > > > > > > > look at > > > > > > > > > it in the 4th bhava. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu does not become lord of the Bhavas, but in Vimshottari > > > > > > dashas > > > > > > > > he > > > > > > > > > does give results like that of Mars who in the instant case > > > > > > > > happens to > > > > > > > > > be Maraka, being 2nd and 7th lord. Since it also gives > > > > results > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > Saturn, depending on transits, it can also give > > > > education , or > > > > > > > > progeny > > > > > > > > > depending on the person's age. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks. I would like to know how you read the graduation > > > > slab, > > > > > > > > which is > > > > > > > > > > neither higher education nor early education. Please > > > > tell. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu giving Mars-like results is understandable but to my > > > > > > mind, > > > > > > > > not to > > > > > > > > > > the extent of replicating the lordship. Besides, it is > > > > not > > > > > > Aries > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > Scorpio assigned secondarily to Ketu that we can deduce > > > > that, > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > it? The > > > > > > > > > > reading on mother and domicile front may stick. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe we can examine the 2nd and 7th lordship result of > > > > Ketu > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > kuja-tulya phala after a look at the overall chart. I > > > > will > > > > > > post > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > chart soon. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ > > <aling@> s.com > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com>, > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I could also indicate harm to mother or giving up > > > > > > motherland. > > > > > > > > It could > > > > > > > > > > > also indicate problems in graduation slab of education > > > > and > > > > > > > > even giving > > > > > > > > > > > up education at that time. Ketu would also give > > > > results of > > > > > > > > Saturn in > > > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > > dasha and being like Mars the 2nd and 7th lord could > > > > > > indicate > > > > > > > > problems > > > > > > > > > > > on marital front. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrasekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > > What if Saturn and Ketu are in 4th hse? You have > > > > alluded > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > Kapata > > > > > > > > > > Yoga > > > > > > > > > > > > under Sat+Moon in 4th. Saturn+Ketu ipso facto > > > > constitutes > > > > > > > > saintly > > > > > > > > > > > > disposition if I correctly remember your observation > > > > at > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > forum. > > > > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > > > > sign in this case is Makara. > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ > > <aling@> s.com > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > > > > com>, > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn- Moon in 4th could indicate an old large > > > > house > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > also the > > > > > > > > > > > > > possibility of a tendency of not speaking truth, > > > > > > > > necessarily. It > > > > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > > > > > also indicate a long lived mother. Saturn or Moon > > > > not > > > > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > > > > the th > > > > > > > > > > > > > or 9th I do not think this could mean fanaticism. > > > > It is > > > > > > > > more the > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun+mars combination that could sometimes indicate > > > > this > > > > > > > > tendency > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > > showing off his religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupitor's presence has confused me too but Sat + > > > > Moon > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > 4'th > > > > > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and Jup affliction by Saturn's aspect on it, as > > > > well > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > Mars > > > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > > > > > on lagna gave me thoughts to put the chart in the > > > > > > group > > > > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > > > > > serious > > > > > > > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will Sat + Moon combo in 4'th house make a person > > > > > > > > fanatic and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > barberic ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ > > <aling@> s.com > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. com> > > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > > > > com> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > > > > > > com>, > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Check your source. With Aquarius and Jupiter > > > > in the > > > > > > > > Lagna his > > > > > > > > > > > > > > history > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > does not suit the chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Group and Elders, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Shahjahanama, author Mulla Abdul Hamid > > > > Lahori > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > given > > > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > unorganised astro contents, they tell u > > > > planetary > > > > > > > > position > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > time of various events. Presenting Shahjahan > > > > and > > > > > > his > > > > > > > > bad son > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aurangjeb's available horoscopic details to > > > > have > > > > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > study of their horoscopes, focusing on - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. massive killing and oppression of > > > > siblings. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. enimical behavior with their fathers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. barbaric nature (more in case of > > > > Aurangjeb) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. exploitation of women ( keeping hundreds > > > > of > > > > > > women > > > > > > > > in the > > > > > > > > > > > > fort) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. Aurangjeb's hate for music and dance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. religious fanatism > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A ---> Aurangjeb > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dob : 03/11/1618 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tob : 20:05 (Acquarius Lagna, pls. check the > > > > > > time, m > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > sure) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pob : somewhere in Gujrat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The details i have are as follows - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius - Jup > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H : Sat + Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6h : Ketu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 9H : Sun + Merc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Ven > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12: Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) And Shahjahan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh my god, i forgot to note down his birth > > > > > > details, > > > > > > > > any way > > > > > > > > > > > > > > reproducing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > his horoscope > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H: Sat + Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8H: Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10H : Ju > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Sun + Ketu+Merc+Venus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > He did a revolt against Father in > > > > Rahu/Moon/Mars > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > Sani/Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > his sons were killed by Aurangjeb (another > > > > Son). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will give more details tomorrow. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > > > > > > > http://au.messenger. > > <http://au.messenger.> <http://au.messenger. > > <http://au.messenger.>> > > > > <http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.> > > <http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.>>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted June 18, 2008 Report Share Posted June 18, 2008 Dear Dheeraj, In Sanskrit " Dhi " means Talent, there is a slight difference between Talent and Intelligence, Intelligence may lead to cleverness if degree of selfishness and sense of insecurity is high in the given chart, this is what i tried to convey, What i say is 5'th gives the capacity to learn and 4'th shows how much u learn by ur's learning process. About Rafel, he is good guy in bad company, now he is adopting everything that he should avoid to become good in astrology. Only advocating that astrology is a divine science and behaving contrary to it, takes one to confusion, whatever may be the level of confidence one have, even confidence in that case only speeds up one's deviation, this happens when a judgement a required, pls. convey this Rafel, I appreciate his good learning and he might be a light of torch of indian cultural values in the western world but he has to remain very alert from doing the show of guruism. I m keenly studying verga charts and will tell u the concept behind forming them, how such tool's should be taken, an astrologer must understand. I m trying to put an end the mess like If Navamsha is good and lagna chart is bad, it's over all good or vice versa. I m developing a scientific and organised approach to judge lagna chart's consequences with that of it's several verga charts. But i have got only one Sutra as of now, my study is in the very beginning stage but i have got the concept. regards, Lalit. Vedic Astrologyandhealing , " DHEERAJ KHOSLA " <khosladheeraj wrote: > > Nmaste Litsol and others, > Come on dont get confused .Just see 4th > bhava in sidhamsa ( d-24). 4th bhava in rasi just shows various > general things like -mother, vehicle, heart,education ....So be > specific for specific varga ,other wise u will get messed up things > all.I had previously done this mistake ,but guru Rafal tought me that > things from different vargas . So just see vargas.This formula works > wonderfully. > > 5th bhava is the intelligence not > degree ,diploma knowledge.Its like common sense ( chaturta). > > thanks, > dheeraj > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing , Chandrashekhar > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > It appears that you have made up your mind that 4th can not be > > education. Did you ask Vighnesh if he began CA before or after his > > graduation? May be Vighnesh himself would like to comment. > > > > 4th lord going to the 8th does not make it strong and like it or > not > > Mercury is karaka for education and is in Papakartari. Jupiter is > not > > the karaka for education, it is karaka for knowledge, progeny, > Guru, > > money and work. > > > > Take care, > > Chandrashekhar > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > I m sorry to say that logic and eplanation given by you does seem > > > appropriate,First let's scale the effect of good and bad aspects, > > > > > > Will u say : *Aspect of exalted Ju + Aspect of exalted Merc < > Aspect > > > of Mars ?* > > > > > > In vighnesh Ji's chart, 4'th receives aspect of exalted Guru from > the > > > 8'th, and again receives aspect of exalted Mercury. > > > > > > Mercury and Jupitor both are the karaka for study and Knowledge, > Both > > > are exalted, Now come Mars, Why only Mars's aspect w'd impact and > the > > > impact is so bad that he could not clear his CA despite multiple > > > efforts, CA is only a graduation level education. > > > > > > Same is case of RK Daa, It's important to note that his lagna > lord > > > Merc is exalted in 4'th but he never got good rank, Mercury's > > > exaltation happens in his own sign, so, there is no case of > > > dispositor's bad effect, in his academic education, he met > failures > > > and broken the line of study, however, he is learned more than > most of > > > the people we see around us, he has real knowledge and has an > autority > > > in his profession. > > > > > > *Take my brother's chart.* > > > > > > Lagna is Aquarious, 4'th and 9'th lord Venus is placed in 5'th > house > > > whereas Moon is placed in 9'th,So, as per the dictum that 4'th > denotes > > > education, he should do good in graduation, should have a good > > > academic record, but on the contrary, he had a gap of 2 yrs after > his > > > 12'th, he never scored good except for his class 10'th, He dis > his > > > Graduation with 54.7% of marx only. > > > > > > If u take 2nd house for study, His 2nd lord Ju is placed in 7'th > in a > > > frind rashi, So, why he was only an average student throughout > his > > > school time as well got good marx only in class 10'th. > > > > > > *My idea is -* > > > > > > His 5'th house receives Saturn's aspect thus chart does not have > very > > > good potential for study and he was running in saturn's dasa > during > > > his study, along with this, 5'th lord is placed in 6'th along > with > > > Rahu. Thus chart dosnt have promise for good ecucation. > > > > > > regards, > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing >, Chandrashekhar > > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > I thought so. Anyway, Buddhi or Buddhi prabandhan can not be > equated to > > > > formal education, neither can Dhi. So the references tat you > quote do > > > > not seem to say that education is to be seen from the 5th. But > if you > > > > feel that you should take it as the house of formal education > you are > > > > free to do so. Only the sages do not seem to agree. > > > > > > > > I do not have chart of RK da to comment about his 4th bhava. > But in > > > case > > > > of Vighnesh the 4th lord occupies the 8th bhava in both rasi and > > > > Navamsha and Mercury is in Papakartari. So the 4th bhava is not > as > > > > strong as it should be. besides aspects of Jupiter and Mercury > it also > > > > receives the aspect of Mars and Jupiter the 4th lord itself is > in > > > aspect > > > > of Saturn. However by not doing good education do you mean he > had > > > > obstacles in education or that he did not pursue post > graduation (which > > > > should be seen from the 5th as indicated by me) ? > > > > > > > > Take care, > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > Like any science, astrology too evolved over the period and > we see > > > > > one concept after another for same thing till the > establishment and > > > > > maturity point. > > > > > > > > > > I have quoted shlokas from Bhava Kautuhalam, Shambu Hora, > Phalit > > > > > Martand. > > > > > > > > > > I m sorry for referring to two personal incidens but In RK > Daa's > > > > > chart, in the 4'th house, there is Mercury exalted, still he > could > > > > > not get any good achievment in academic education, in another > group > > > > > member, Vighnesh Ji's chart same Merc is exalted in 10'th thus > > > > > aspecting 4'th prominantly still he could not do good in > academic > > > > > education. > > > > > > > > > > It's upto astrologer if they want to find right causes or > not, even > > > > > with wrong aproach and wrong concept sometimes one may get > > > > > satisfactory justification but not always. > > > > > > > > > > If 4'th denotes education, I w'd have done very good in my > Grad. > > > > > > > > > > It's vital to understand the potential and pattern of life > through > > > > > the chart. If 5'th is weak, there is no good potential, and > during a > > > > > bad dasha and transit, one can get obstacles and failures. > This has > > > > > no exception at all. > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>>, > Chandrashekhar > > > > > <sharma.chandrashekhar@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > I agree with RK da. Please give reference to the classic > text from > > > > > which > > > > > > you give the shlokas. If one really wants o go to the > classical > > > > > > definitions verbatim, then only the 2nd is called Vidya > bhava. > > > > > Bhrigu > > > > > > does refer to this being opinion of the learned and says > that in > > > > > his > > > > > > opinion 4th is the house of academic education. Fifth he > allots to > > > > > > higher learning and wisdom, intelligence spiritual > practices and > > > > > so on. > > > > > > Mantreshwar in Phaladeepika also indicates the 4th for > education. > > > > > So > > > > > > many classics do mention the 4th being related to education. > > > > > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Daa, Sri Chandrashekhar Ji, Nalini Ji and Group, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I m surprised to see following is written by RK Daa, A > conclusion > > > > > > > which has no clear endorsement in a classics - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A.) 5th can make for shrewdness even, when loaded, with > strength > > > > > > > from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It gives ability > to devise > > > > > > > plans > > > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) The core vidya sthana is 4th house - Almost similar > opinion > > > > > is > > > > > > > given by Sri Chandrashekhar Ji. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I examined both the statements, Sorry, both needs serious > review, > > > > > > > however, It's true that confusion between 4'th with and > 9'th with > > > > > > > 10'th for some common significations is quite normal, > Great BV > > > > > Raman > > > > > > > also could not reach any visible distinction, the answer > lies in > > > > > > > tradition, since cnturies such a tradition has been > continued in > > > > > > > several pockets of india, however, our classics are quite > clear > > > > > on > > > > > > > primary and secondary kind of significations of the > bhavas. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To remove the doubt of members and to put an end to this > > > > > confusion, > > > > > > > which sometimes forces astrologer to stretch the basics > to reach > > > > > a > > > > > > > justification, i m giving some shlokas of classics. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4'th is unaminously called " Turya Sthaana " , " Mitra Alaya " > > > > > or " Sukha > > > > > > > Sthaana " , The shloka is - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Turyasthan Sanstham Phalam tat Vakscha-Sthaanam Purushanam > > > > > Niruktam > > > > > > > (Principles or Ethics expressed) ! > > > > > > > Amba (Mother) BandhuKchhoni Mitralayanam (Public Support > by > > > > > friends > > > > > > > and relatives) Sarva Annanam (Food Grain, Yield of effort) > GramYug > > > > > > > Vahananaam (Land, Village, Vehicles). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5'th is unaminously called place for " Mati > Prabandhaha " , " Budhi > > > > > > > Prabandha " or Management of Mind and Intellect. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The shloka goes - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. Mati Prabandhaha Sutabhe Nijodaram (One's own > Children), > > > > > > > Vinaye(Modesty, Politeness)- Garbha-Sthiti, Mantra > Sadhanam > > > > > > > Modesty !! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. Santan Garbha Sthitineeti Sanstha, Mantradi Siddhi > Vinayash > > > > > Vidya > > > > > > > (Learning/Education), Buddhi Prabandhaha Sutabhe > Vichintyam Etat > > > > > annu > > > > > > > JatakGyaha !! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Now, where is the confusion, I think that was there > because the > > > > > 4'th > > > > > > > denotes how u keep what u acquire, the immovables, so, the > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > that you retain after studying a subject, is to be seen > from the > > > > > 4'th > > > > > > > not the education, study or ur's learning itself. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I w'd request RK Daa to review the 4'th house and > education in > > > > > his > > > > > > > own case, Why this placement has not given you a bright > academic > > > > > > > education. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Let's not misundersatand the primary and seconday > significations. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>> > > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing% 40>>, " arkaydash " > > > > > > > <arkaydash@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Nalini, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Your 4th house is aspected by its lord. Strengthened. > It is > > > > > > > aspected by > > > > > > > > Mercury, not by any other planet. Stenghtened and > imbued with > > > > > Mc, > > > > > > > right? > > > > > > > > Capable of quick learning. Mc in water sign. Intuitive. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > My understaning is that 4th speaks of how learned one > is. If > > > > > it is > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > the care of its benefic lord and is by and large > unsullied by > > > > > > > malefic > > > > > > > > impact, learning is assured. If the care is with Mc, > have no > > > > > doubt. > > > > > > > Mc > > > > > > > > as 4th lord ensures that the real wealth is his or her > > > > > learning; > > > > > > > other > > > > > > > > tangible assets will gravitate in the goodness of time > via > > > > > Mercury's > > > > > > > > prasaada (grants). As lagna lord in debility, Mc spells > > > > > periods of > > > > > > > > concern; when there is a bad run of dasa etc, health > may not > > > > > remain > > > > > > > > unassailed. Your fluctuating academic performances have > to be > > > > > seen > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > the context of the then operating dasa and transit. > Transit of > > > > > the > > > > > > > Big > > > > > > > > Two. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Third house has to do with dexeterity, manual. The act > of > > > > > writing & > > > > > > > > communication & retention (dhruti) thus also patience. > Benefics > > > > > > > there: a > > > > > > > > person writes a good hand. His patience does not run > out. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The core vidya sthana is 4th house. With a strong, > unalloyed > > > > > 4th > > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > one cannot command vidya. Neither 5th, nor 9th can > compensate. > > > > > 5th > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > intelligence in the sense of discernement. 9th is the > ability > > > > > to > > > > > > > process > > > > > > > > ideas, abstaract systems. 5th can make for shrewdness > even, > > > > > when > > > > > > > loaded > > > > > > > > with strength from mixed kind (benefic and malefic). It > gives > > > > > > > ability to > > > > > > > > devise plans. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Well, 9th. Some other time. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>> > > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>>, nalini swamy > > > > > > > > <nalini2818@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected Chandrasekhar ji, RK da,Lalit ji and others, > > > > > > > > > Namaskar. > > > > > > > > > When it comes to handwriting, a native's chart where > Guru is > > > > > in > > > > > > > > makara, lagna with exalted Sukra and neecha Budha yuti > in > > > > > Meena. > > > > > > > > > The native is left-handed when writing, eating with > > > > > implements > > > > > > > like > > > > > > > > spoon, fork etc. Right-handed when it comes to using > bare > > > > > hands. The > > > > > > > > handwriting is terrible too. Is it due to neecha 3rd > lord? The > > > > > 3rd > > > > > > > house > > > > > > > > here is not aspected by a malefic; Native dislikes > writing, > > > > > even > > > > > > > > academic. Native has not done very well academically > despite > > > > > being > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > intelligent as he does no like even to write the > answers in > > > > > full but > > > > > > > > just enough to get him through. > > > > > > > > > Now coming to academic excellence and grades, in my > chart > > > > > my 4th > > > > > > > > bhava, Kanya, has Rahu. The LL and 4th lord are in > Meena, deb, > > > > > with > > > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > > > and enemy Chandra. In Navamnsha, Budha and Ketu occupy > Karka, > > > > > again > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > do with Chandra in the 4th, and the lagna is Rishaba( > yuti > > > > > dwiguru). > > > > > > > > > I have done extremely well in school, average in > > > > > Intermediate and > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > well in Graduation. Again average in Post-grad. I am > now doing > > > > > a > > > > > > > > Bachelors and a post grad all over again... I am so > > > > > facscinated by > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > fact that the grades dont follow the pattern I mentioned > > > > > earlier. I > > > > > > > > started off very,very well and nose-dived in the 2nd > year. A > > > > > lot to > > > > > > > do > > > > > > > > with Gochara I suppose. > > > > > > > > > I also do well in abstract concepts and writing, not > very > > > > > good in > > > > > > > > science when it comes to grades. Even in Jyotish, I am > helped > > > > > more > > > > > > > with > > > > > > > > intuitive stuff rather than mere astro concepts which > is also > > > > > why I > > > > > > > > hesitate to discuss charts (: > > > > > > > > > Love to have your inputs, > > > > > > > > > Nalini > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >  > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar sharma.chandrashekhar@ > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>> > > > > > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40 > > > <Vedic Astrologyandhealing%40>> > > > > > > > > > Friday, 13 June, 2008 5:50:13 AM > > > > > > > > > Re: [Vedic Astrologyandhealing] Re: ShahJahan > and > > > > > > > AurangJeb - > > > > > > > > AstroAnalysis (Related Q to Chandrashekarji) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > There is a difference between handwriting and Likhita > vidya. > > > > > It is > > > > > > > > only in these days that even 3 year old are taught to > write > > > > > that > > > > > > > too two > > > > > > > > languages. Earlier till one attained 1st standard most > of the > > > > > > > teaching > > > > > > > > was by making one memorize tables, shlokas and so on. > With > > > > > time the > > > > > > > > definition of what is Maukhik, Likhita, learnt for > getting > > > > > Gyaan > > > > > > > and so > > > > > > > > on changes. I remember the times when those who had done > > > > > > > Matriculation > > > > > > > > were considered highly educated. These days it is not > uncommon > > > > > to > > > > > > > see > > > > > > > > even rickshaw-wallas being graduates or even post > graduates. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In your case did you notice that your 4th bhava is in > > > > > Papakartari > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > its lord Mercury is afflicted by Ketu occupying the > rasi of its > > > > > > > enemy > > > > > > > > Moon and that of Jupiter in Navamsha? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Think about this. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > Sri Chandrashekhar Ji and Our RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I find it's important to mention that lekhan > (writing) is > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > related to 3'rd house not the 4'th, I have seen > dozens of the > > > > > > > cases > > > > > > > > > when 3rd is occupied by a malific (my own case) and if > > > > > aspected > > > > > > > by a > > > > > > > > > malific (my 2 brother's case), one is not only poor in > > > > > writing > > > > > > > good > > > > > > > > > stuff but his handwriting is also very very bad. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also exclusively 4'th can not be graduation, my 4'th > house is > > > > > > > > > occupied by Venus, aspected by Ju, I did very bad in > my > > > > > > > graduation, > > > > > > > > > whereas in school and in my PG i did excellent. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5'th dominates in chart for the judgement of > education. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ > > > <aling@> s.com, > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I look to 2nd for education up to secondary level, > 4th for > > > > > > > > > graduation > > > > > > > > > > and 5th for post graduation, 9th being the Doctoral > or > > > > > higher > > > > > > > > > education. > > > > > > > > > > Actually the 2nd is Maukhik (verbal) Vidya, 4th > Likhita > > > > > (written > > > > > > > > > word) > > > > > > > > > > vidya, 5th the Gyaan or acquired knowledge and 9th > higher > > > > > form > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > acquired knowledge. However we have to fit this in > with the > > > > > > > > > current > > > > > > > > > > education pattern. May be if a person is doing > Ph.D. only > > > > > to get > > > > > > > > > > University scales and not for any worthwhile > research, we > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > look at > > > > > > > > > > it in the 4th bhava. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu does not become lord of the Bhavas, but in > Vimshottari > > > > > > > dashas > > > > > > > > > he > > > > > > > > > > does give results like that of Mars who in the > instant case > > > > > > > > > happens to > > > > > > > > > > be Maraka, being 2nd and 7th lord. Since it also > gives > > > > > results > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > Saturn, depending on transits, it can also give > > > > > education , or > > > > > > > > > progeny > > > > > > > > > > depending on the person's age. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Chandrashekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks. I would like to know how you read the > graduation > > > > > slab, > > > > > > > > > which is > > > > > > > > > > > neither higher education nor early education. > Please > > > > > tell. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ketu giving Mars-like results is understandable > but to my > > > > > > > mind, > > > > > > > > > not to > > > > > > > > > > > the extent of replicating the lordship. Besides, > it is > > > > > not > > > > > > > Aries > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > Scorpio assigned secondarily to Ketu that we can > deduce > > > > > that, > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > it? The > > > > > > > > > > > reading on mother and domicile front may stick. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Maybe we can examine the 2nd and 7th lordship > result of > > > > > Ketu > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > > kuja-tulya phala after a look at the overall > chart. I > > > > > will > > > > > > > post > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > chart soon. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ > > > <aling@> s.com > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > com>, > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > <sharma.chandrashek har@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear RK Da, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I could also indicate harm to mother or giving > up > > > > > > > motherland. > > > > > > > > > It could > > > > > > > > > > > > also indicate problems in graduation slab of > education > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > even giving > > > > > > > > > > > > up education at that time. Ketu would also give > > > > > results of > > > > > > > > > Saturn in > > > > > > > > > > > its > > > > > > > > > > > > dasha and being like Mars the 2nd and 7th lord > could > > > > > > > indicate > > > > > > > > > problems > > > > > > > > > > > > on marital front. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > arkaydash wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrasekharji, > > > > > > > > > > > > > What if Saturn and Ketu are in 4th hse? You > have > > > > > alluded > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > Kapata > > > > > > > > > > > Yoga > > > > > > > > > > > > > under Sat+Moon in 4th. Saturn+Ketu ipso facto > > > > > constitutes > > > > > > > > > saintly > > > > > > > > > > > > > disposition if I correctly remember your > observation > > > > > at > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > forum. > > > > > > > > > > > The > > > > > > > > > > > > > sign in this case is Makara. > > > > > > > > > > > > > RK > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe aling@ > > > <aling@> s.com > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > com> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% > 40. > > > > > com>, > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Saturn- Moon in 4th could indicate an old > large > > > > > house > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > also the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > possibility of a tendency of not speaking > truth, > > > > > > > > > necessarily. It > > > > > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > > > > > > also indicate a long lived mother. Saturn > or Moon > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > aspecting > > > > > > > > > > > the th > > > > > > > > > > > > > > or 9th I do not think this could mean > fanaticism. > > > > > It is > > > > > > > > > more the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sun+mars combination that could sometimes > indicate > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > tendency > > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > showing off his religion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > take care, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Sir, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jupitor's presence has confused me too > but Sat + > > > > > Moon > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > 4'th > > > > > > > > > > > house, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > and Jup affliction by Saturn's aspect on > it, as > > > > > well > > > > > > > as > > > > > > > > > Mars > > > > > > > > > > > aspect > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > on lagna gave me thoughts to put the > chart in the > > > > > > > group > > > > > > > > > for a > > > > > > > > > > > > > serious > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > discussion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will Sat + Moon combo in 4'th house make > a person > > > > > > > > > fanatic and > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > barberic ? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Vedic Astrologyandhe > aling@ > > > <aling@> s.com > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% 40. > com> > > > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% > 40. > > > > > com> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <vedicastrol ogyandhealing% > 40. > > > > > > > com>, > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sharma.chandrashekh ar@ wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Lalit, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Check your source. With Aquarius and > Jupiter > > > > > in the > > > > > > > > > Lagna his > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > history > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > does not suit the chart. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chandrashekhar. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > litsol wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Group and Elders, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > In Shahjahanama, author Mulla Abdul > Hamid > > > > > Lahori > > > > > > > has > > > > > > > > > given > > > > > > > > > > > some > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > unorganised astro contents, they tell > u > > > > > planetary > > > > > > > > > position > > > > > > > > > > > at > > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > time of various events. Presenting > Shahjahan > > > > > and > > > > > > > his > > > > > > > > > bad son > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Aurangjeb's available horoscopic > details to > > > > > have > > > > > > > an > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > study of their horoscopes, focusing > on - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 1. massive killing and oppression of > > > > > siblings. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2. enimical behavior with their > fathers. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 3. barbaric nature (more in case of > > > > > Aurangjeb) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4. exploitation of women ( keeping > hundreds > > > > > of > > > > > > > women > > > > > > > > > in the > > > > > > > > > > > > > fort) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 5. Aurangjeb's hate for music and > dance > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6. religious fanatism > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > A ---> Aurangjeb > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dob : 03/11/1618 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Tob : 20:05 (Acquarius Lagna, pls. > check the > > > > > > > time, m > > > > > > > > > not > > > > > > > > > > > sure) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Pob : somewhere in Gujrat. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The details i have are as follows - > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius - Jup > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H : Sat + Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 6h : Ketu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 7H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 9H : Sun + Merc > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Ven > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 12: Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > B.) And Shahjahan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Oh my god, i forgot to note down his > birth > > > > > > > details, > > > > > > > > > any way > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > reproducing > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > his horoscope > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lagna : Aquarius > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 2H : Mars > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 4H: Sat + Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 8H: Moon > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 10H : Ju > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > 11H : Sun + Ketu+Merc+Venus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > He did a revolt against Father in > > > > > Rahu/Moon/Mars > > > > > > > but > > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sani/Rahu > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > his sons were killed by Aurangjeb > (another > > > > > Son). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will give more details tomorrow. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Lalit > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Send instant messages to your online friends > > > > > > > > http://au.messenger. > > > <http://au.messenger.> <http://au.messenger. > > > <http://au.messenger.>> > > > > > <http://au.messenger. > <http://au.messenger.> > > > <http://au.messenger. <http://au.messenger.>>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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