Sanjay Rath Vs Narsimha on Mantra Shastra

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Read following and following, Sanjay Rath is no where in Mantra Sadhana, only bookish knolwdge and Narsimha who also has very limited basic exposure to sacred flames of mantras, but see the degree of arguments, No body immersed in sadhana but runs towards book stores or safrom clad well settled guruji's to find their own versions of this divine shastra.

regards,Lalit.

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Dear Sanjay,> Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping thatI do have a definition of gandanta, which is Parasara's definition in BPHS.Since some of you are extrapolating it based on the fire embodied in UL andwater embodied in tithis, the onus is on you to outline and justify yourdefinition. I got into this thread because statements were made that fasting onparticular weekdays or tithis in a chart can cause "insult to Vishnu", "seriousdoshas" and "danger to spouse", based on these far-fetched extrapolations ofgandanta.> Which is perfectly in line with everything I have learnt.Well, you once taught that houses represent Sun/Shiva/truth and arudhasrepresent Moon/Gouri/perception. That was meaningful. Now, you associated UL, anarudha, with Sun and fire and 12th, a house, with Gouri and water. I questionwhether the new theory on fasting is really in line with everything you havelearnt (and taught).BTW, I specifically asked for a clarification on whether this was based on yourown thinking or from classics/parampara (see quoted mail below for the fullcontext). Like so many times with similar questions I asked privately andrecently publicly, you did not respond.* * *> Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus> and has no relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by> Parasara and others to be done on specific days are irrlevant and> not of much consequence.First of all, Parasara did *not* prescribe fasting on specific weekdays ortithis based on any arudhas or houses in a chart.For doshas in birth chart or to get relief from planetary afflictions or to getthe blessings of planets, he suggested various *homas* (fire rituals) anddescribed how to perform them. His section on remedial measures is full ofvarious homas. I am not dismissing those remedies taught by Parasara himself andI am in fact slowly preparing manuals on them so that anybody can do them bythemselves.Parasara did *not* specify the weekday or tithi for most of these homas (e.g.planetary homas). Only for homas for specific birth doshas (e.g. Amavasya doshaor Moola dosha), he fixed the tithi or nakshatra based on the dosha and thedeity. But the days are not based on any house or arudha in the chart.Thus, the principles I am questioning are *not* from Parasara.Second, I said what I said in a *context*. People are mentioning complicatedprinciples that are not found in classics or works of rishis and scaring peoplethat performing austerities such as fasting on certain days cause "danger tospouse" or "serious doshas" or "insult to Vishnu", based on horoscope. I findthese principles illogical and based on hasty thinking. There may be a littledifference between doing an austerity on different days, but my point is that itis smaller compared to the difference between doing and not doing at all andthat doing it on a "wrong day" does not cause danger as being suggested.Third, our shastras primarily talk about worshipping various deities on variousdays, based on the energy of the *deity*. For worshipping a certain deity,certain tithi or weekday or nakshatra is better than others. This is based onthe deity and irrespective of the person worshipping. Let me give an analogy. Ifa rich man comes out with more money to give to beggars on a specific day, abeggar is better off going and begging on that day. Schedule and mood of thegiver is more important.Choosing the day of a remedy based on the deity is more important and thevariations based on individual horoscope are less important. I am not sayingthere are no horoscopic variations. But they are smaller and, more importantly,I question if they are actually well-understood by astrologers today to apply*reliably*. I question over-emphasizing and over-selling unreliable principlesof questionable origin and scaring people on that basis.* * *> Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless> and the Rishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for> the same devata, like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman> when any one mantra would suffice. OR it is like saying that we can> take paracetamol and pray that cancer is cured. I think I may have to> write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate the teachings of the vedic> seers.I did not say it is "useless". Instead, I suggest that our ability to use it islimited and we should take our limitations into consideration.The universe has many lokas (planes of consciousness), many beings and manyobjects. There are infinite karmic interactions possible between them.Accordingly, there are infinite possible mantras. When one is able to perfectlycontrol the mind and *fill it* with a mantra (i.e. no thoughts but the mantrareverberating in the mind constantly), then one experiences the mantra. Thisperfect absorption of self-awareness in the mantra then causes internal changesby the flow of energy internally in specific ways (specific to the mantra) andthat causes corresponding external changes in the universe and correspondingkarmic interactions between various objects.However, this variety of mantras, experiences and results is irrelevant to onewho does not have such perfect control over the mind to absorb the mind fully ina mantra. It is relevant only to a seer whose self-awareness is quite evolvedand hence control over mind impeccable. Such seers are extremely extremely raretoday. Most people are unable to experience any mantra and mantras do not workfor them as they are supposed to.* * *Just repeating a combination of sounds does not guarantee anything. Some peoplemay think that certain results come when they repeat a mantra certain number oftimes. That is an incorrect notion. A mantra may work for one person quickly andanother may spend the whole life chanting it and nothing may happen. Absorptionof the entire mind into a mantra is needed for a mantra to really work and it ismuch more difficult than one may think.* * *A highly learned scholar in the court of a king may be able to command the kingand get whatever he wants from king. An incapable one is better off begging theking, rather than trying to command (and failing for sure).Similarly, most people are better off begging god for what they want rather thantrying to use the right mantra to command what they want. A beggar does not needa huge vocabulary or great scholarship or knowledge. Feeling of humility andhelplessness, surrender, patience and persistence are what help a beggarsucceed. A beggar needs the right attitude rather than knowledge. In this ageand time, best bet for most people is to learn to be a good beggar at god'sdoor.What people today need for material and spiritual progress through remedialmeasures is a better attitude in begging god rather than a better choice oftools such as mantras and other specifics such as weekday, tithi etc to commanda specific result from god.It is worth noting that so many great spiritual teachers who came in the lastcentury or two did not emphasize picking the right mantra based on horoscopeetc. Instead, they emphasized having the correct attitude - surrender,submission, devotion, patience, persistence, discipline, humility etc. *That* isa lot more important and useful than trying to be oversmart with the choice ofmantra, day etc and impress god.* * *One more thing. We have many mantras given by rishis, but the guidelines fromrishis like Parasara on how to pick a mantra based on the horoscope are verylimited. Astrologers today do not operate solely based on them. They use allkinds of other rules coming from various traditions. They are not free fromcorruption and imperfection. Most scriptures associate various mantras withvarious results, irrespective of horoscope. For example, irrespective of who isthe 6th lord and 8th lord and lord of A6 and A8, Rina Vimochaka Angaraka mantrais good for debt control. And so on. Linking of horoscope is overplayed bytoday's astrologers, way beyond the scope of Parasara's guidelines.If one has a sadguru, I recommend following the word of sadguru rather than thatof an astrology theoretician.If not, there is no foolproof way to know the right path. Pick any path (givenby an astrologer or one that you feel attracted to) instead of wasting time andthen keep working on your attitude. The latter is the key. As I said earlier,learn to be a humble beggar at god's door. Choice of Mantra is secondary andattitude is primary. If you succeed in being a really humble beggar, you stand abetter chance of success than great scholars.Any prasiddha mantra (e.g. ashtakshari, panchakshari, dwadasakshari, navakshari,vishnu sahasranaam, rudram, hare krishna maha mantra, chandipath, ganapatiatharva seersham, mrityunjaya mantra etc) can help one make progress if onedevelops the right attitude. Without the right attitude, even an impeaccablypicked mantra will do nothing.* * *I hope this sufficiently clarifies my stand. I discuss these matters related tospiritual sadhana more on the . Some writings are sampledat http://www.vedicastrologer.org/homam/writings.htm.Best regards,NarasimhaDo a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/homamDo Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/tarpanaSpirituality: Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.netFree Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.orgSri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.orgom paramesthi gurave namahDear Narasimha,Since you do not have any real definition of Gandanta, I am dropping that andcontinue with my belief of the junction between Agni and Jala rasi as the caseof gandanta and the loka junctions. Which is perfectly in line with everything Ihave learnt.Two statements you have made contradict standard texts on Jyotish and MantraShastra. Please correct me if I am not understanding you well out here -1. Statement 1: *fasting on any day or any tithi* is good so long as thesankalpa has been made for the devata you intend to pray to. Results maybe a bitdelayed but will be there.2. Statement 2: *reciting any prayer* will give the desired effects for anyailment we wish to remedyIs this what you intended to say or did I get this wrong?Statement 1 is an arrogance that the entire Jyotisha shastra is bogus and hasno relevance as the remedial measures prescribed by Parasara and others to bedone on specific days are irrlevant and not of much consequence. This soundslike another astrologer I had known some time back whose statements like thiscoerced me to write Vedic Remedies in Astrology so that people are not misledbut such pretexts to knowledge.Statement 2 is an arrogance that the entire mantra shastra is useless and theRishi’s were wasting time in giving so many mantras for the same devata,like say thousands of mantras for Vishnu or Hanuman when any one mantra wouldsuffice. OR it is like saying that we can take paracetamol and pray that canceris cured. I think I may have to write a book on Mantra Shastra to validate theteachings of the vedic seers.I think there is something wrong in the way you are saying what you want tosay. Please rethink and correct your statements for the sake of good record inthis list.With Warm RegardsSanjay Rathhttp://srath.com http://sohamsa.com http://.org15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi, 110060, India