Is the economic and political influence of the USA waning?

[Guest guest]

Dear friends,

 

There are now concerns in the USA that the economic and political influence of the country in the world is at risk.

 

 

==============

 

US clout down, risks up by 2025 -intel outlook

Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:17pm EST - by Randall Mikkelsen

WASHINGTON, Nov 20 (Reuters) - U.S. economic and political clout will decline over the next two decades and the world will be more dangerous, with food and water scarce and advanced weapons plentiful, U.S. spy agencies projected on Thursday.The National Intelligence Council analysis "Global Trends 2025" also said the current financial crisis on Wall Street is just the first phase of a global economic reordering. The U.S. dollar's role as the world's major currency would weaken to become a "first among equals," the report said. The outlook is intended to inform U.S. President-elect Barack Obama of factors that will influence global events. It is based on a year-long global survey of experts and trends by U.S. intelligence analysts. "The next 20 years of transition to a new system are fraught with risks," said the report, which was more pessimistic about U.S. influence and the potential for conflict than the last outlook for 2020.

http://www.reuters.com/article/usDollarRpt/idUSN2041155720081120

==============

 

As we know from the SAMVA USA chart (Perpetual Union), the international influence of the USA is associated with the placement of a strong 2nd lord SUN on the most effective point of the 7th house. Adding to the influence, is the presence of 3rd lord MERCURY in the 7th house. The Sun explains the status and wealth as well as the authority of the USA as it is strongly placed in the chart. These factors find expression in the 7th house of foreign affairs. Mercury's placement explains the many initiatives the US takes in the foreign policy field. There are other influences, but let us now concentrate on the concerns raised above.

 

In the SAMVA USA chart, 8th lord SATURN aspects the Sun, adding some degree of obstacles and endings to the affairs of the Sun. Whenever, the energy of Saturn becomes prominent in the chart through transit or period, we could expect the problems to increase associated with this natal influence. Certainly, as has been brought out in recent messages, transit Saturn is now being hammered by both transit and natal functional malefic planets in the chart.

 

During the upcoming Saturn sub-period from February 17, 2009, the energy of Saturn would also be expected to be more strongly felt. The economy and other indications of Saturn will come to the forefront and be a source of problems. There may also be major difficulties for the USA in global affairs in mid 2010, during the Saturn sub-period, when the transit afflictions in the chart, involving also transit Saturn, will be pronounced.

 

That said, the long term pessimism regarding the international power and influence of the USA in the world is likely overstated given that a very powerful Sun major period begins in 2016.

 

Best wishes,

 

Thor

[Guest guest]

Hello, Thor,

 

That looks correct and interesting, but what about the transit of Jupiter

through Capricorn? Actually, a threat war seems probable…

 

Kind regards,

 

Ananta

 

 

 

SAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer wrote:

>

> Dear friends,

> �

> There are now concerns in the USA that the economic and political

influence of the country in the world is at risk.

>

> ==============

> US clout down, risks up by 2025 -intel outlook

> Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:17pm EST� - by Randall Mikkelsen

> WASHINGTON, Nov 20 (Reuters) - U.S. economic and political clout will

decline over the next two decades and the world will be more dangerous,

with food and water scarce and advanced weapons plentiful, U.S. spy

agencies projected on Thursday.The National Intelligence Council analysis

" Global Trends 2025 " also said the current financial crisis on Wall Street

is just the first phase of a global economic reordering. The U.S. dollar's

role as the world's major currency would weaken to become a " first among

equals, " the report said. The outlook is intended to inform U.S.

President-elect Barack Obama of factors that will influence global events.

It is based on a year-long global survey of experts and trends by U.S.

intelligence analysts.� " The next 20 years of transition to a new system

are fraught with risks, " said the report, which was more pessimistic about

U.S. influence and the potential for conflict than the last outlook for

2020.

> http://www.reuters.com/article/usDollarRpt/idUSN2041155720081120

> ==============

> �

> As we know from the SAMVA USA chart (Perpetual Union), the international

influence of the USA is associated with the placement of a strong 2nd lord

SUN on the most effective point of the 7th house. Adding to the influence,

is the presence of 3rd lord MERCURY in the 7th house. The Sun explains the

status and wealth as well as the authority of the USA as it is strongly

placed in the chart. These factors find expression in the 7th house of

foreign affairs. Mercury's placement�explains the many initiatives the US

takes in the�foreign policy field.

> There are other influences, but let us now concentrate on the concerns

raised above.

> �

> In the SAMVA USA chart, 8th lord SATURN aspects the Sun, adding some

degree of obstacles and endings to the affairs of the Sun. Whenever, the

energy of Saturn becomes prominent in the chart through transit or period,

we could expect the problems to increase associated with this natal

influence. Certainly, as has been brought�out in

recent�messages,�transit Saturn is now being hammered by both transit and

natal functional malefic planets in the chart.

> �

> During the upcoming Saturn sub-period from February 17, 2009, the

energy of Saturn would also be expected to�be more strongly�felt. The

economy and other indications of Saturn will come to the forefront and be

a source of problems. There may also be major difficulties for the USA in

global affairs in mid 2010, during the Saturn sub-period,�when the

transit afflictions in the chart, involving also transit Saturn,�will be

pronounced.

> �

> That said, the long term pessimism regarding the international�power

and influence of the USA in the world�is likely overstated given that�a

very powerful Sun major period begins in 2016.

> �

> Best wishes,

> �

> Thor

>

[Guest guest]

Hello Ananta,

 

What we can surmise from the transit of Jupiter, 6th lord of conflict, through Capricorn, its sign of debilitation, and the 7th house of foreign affairs, is that the USA will be more vulnerable than before if it were to engage in conflict. Its other indications, including financial stability will also be vulnerable while Jupiter is transit afflicted in Capricorn, such as at the beginning of the year when it becomes conjunct the nodal axis, while Rahu is stationary at 15° Capricorn. In other words, it would not be helpful to the USA to engage in conflict in 2009. In 2010, when Jupiter transits through Aquarius and the 8th house, during the sub-period of the 8th lord Saturn, the indications of Jupiter would continue under strain and be vulnerable. Even in the summer of 2010, after Jupiter enters Pisces and the 9th house there could be serious problems. Transit Jupiter will then be

mutually afflicting with sub-period lord Saturn in early Virgo and 3rd house, while both transiting malefics are transit afflicting natal Jupiter in early Scorpio of the SAMVA USA chart. During the summer of 2010, transit Ketu will also be stationary in Gemini and 12th house in exact aspect to natal Ketu and transit stationary Rahu in Sagittarius and 6th house will exactly afflict natal Rahu in the 10th house. Given so many malefic afflictions in the chart, that would likely be a very difficult time for the US on a wide range of fronts. We could expect improvement after the end of the Saturn period - following three consequtive periods of functional malefics in the chart - Rahu (2003-06), Jupiter (2006-09) and Saturn (2009-12).

 

Best wishes,

 

Thor

 

 

 

anantavijnyana <non-dualSAMVA Sent: Saturday, November 22, 2008 12:41:03 PM Re: Is the economic and political influence of the USA waning?Hello, Thor,That looks correct and interesting, but what about the transit of Jupiter through Capricorn? Actually, a threat war seems probable…Kind regards,AnantaSAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer wrote:>> Dear friends, > �> There are now concerns in the USA that the economic and political influence of the country in the world is at risk.> >

==============> US clout down, risks up by 2025 -intel outlook> Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:17pm EST� - by Randall Mikkelsen> WASHINGTON, Nov 20 (Reuters) - U.S. economic and political clout will decline over the next two decades and the world will be more dangerous, with food and water scarce and advanced weapons plentiful, U.S. spy agencies projected on Thursday.The National Intelligence Council analysis "Global Trends 2025" also said the current financial crisis on Wall Street is just the first phase of a global economic reordering. The U.S. dollar's role as the world's major currency would weaken to become a "first among equals," the report said. The outlook is intended to inform U.S. President-elect Barack Obama of factors that will influence global events. It is based on a year-long global survey of experts and trends by U.S. intelligence analysts.�"The next 20 years of transition to a

new system are fraught with risks," said the report, which was more pessimistic about U.S. influence and the potential for conflict than the last outlook for 2020.> http://www.reuters.com/article/usDollarRpt/idUSN2041155720081120> ==============> �> As we know from the SAMVA USA chart (Perpetual Union), the international influence of the USA is associated with the placement of a strong 2nd lord SUN on the most effective point of the 7th house. Adding to the influence, is the presence of 3rd lord MERCURY in the 7th house. The Sun explains the status and wealth as well as the authority of the USA as it is strongly placed in the chart. These factors find expression in the 7th house of foreign affairs. Mercury's placement�explains the many initiatives the US takes in the�foreign

policy field. > There are other influences, but let us now concentrate on the concerns raised above. > �> In the SAMVA USA chart, 8th lord SATURN aspects the Sun, adding some degree of obstacles and endings to the affairs of the Sun. Whenever, the energy of Saturn becomes prominent in the chart through transit or period, we could expect the problems to increase associated with this natal influence. Certainly, as has been brought�out in recent�messages,�transit Saturn is now being hammered by both transit and natal functional malefic planets in the chart. > �> During the upcoming Saturn sub-period from February 17, 2009, the energy of Saturn would also be expected to�be more strongly�felt. The economy and other indications of Saturn will come to the forefront and be a source of problems. There may also be major difficulties for the USA in

global affairs in mid 2010, during the Saturn sub-period,�when the transit afflictions in the chart, involving also transit Saturn,�will be pronounced. > �> That said, the long term pessimism regarding the international�power and influence of the USA in the world�is likely overstated given that�a very powerful Sun major period begins in 2016.> �> Best wishes,> �> Thor>---

[Guest guest]

Hello Thor,

 

Thank you for your reply and reading. I do fully agree with you when

you write in terms of US vulnerability and weakness. Indeed, these

indications tell their own tale. But all these factors do not exclude

hasty steps towards new military adventures. The Saturn Antardasha

starts on 04.02.2009. At that spring time Jupiter (the lord of H6)

will be in Capricorn (7H) near the nodal axis together with transit

Mars. Many karmic predispositions associated with martial spirit will

become active. The country will presumably try to solve their own

problems freeload. At the same time, an alternative scenario is also

possible: the emanating military impulse may reverse its motion

demolishing the national unity and integrity. In this connection it is

also interesting to look at the Narayana Dasha of the SAMVA USA chart.

The Mahadasha of Libra (4H) will start on 02.02.2009. This fourth

house rules the political stability and internal harmony. We may

anticipate that Ketu in the 4H will try to bring about some violent

actions (perhaps inter-ethnic etc.).

 

Kind regards and best wishes,

 

Ananta

 

 

 

 

SAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer wrote:

>

> Hello Ananta,

>

> What we can surmise from the transit�of Jupiter,�6th lord of

conflict, through�Capricorn, its sign of debilitation, and the 7th

house of foreign affairs, is that the USA will be more vulnerable than

before if it were�to engage in conflict. Its other indications,

including financial stability will also be vulnerable while�Jupiter is

transit afflicted in Capricorn, such as at the beginning of the year

when it becomes conjunct the nodal axis, while Rahu is�stationary at

15� Capricorn. In other words, it would not be helpful to the USA to

engage in conflict in 2009. In 2010, when Jupiter�transits through

Aquarius and�the 8th house, during the sub-period�of the 8th

lord�Saturn,�the indications of Jupiter would continue under strain

and be vulnerable. Even�in the summer of 2010, after�Jupiter enters

Pisces and the 9th house there could be serious problems. Transit

Jupiter will then�be mutually afflicting with sub-period lord Saturn

in early

> Virgo and 3rd house, while both�transiting malefics are

transit�afflicting natal Jupiter in early Scorpio of the SAMVA USA

chart. During the summer of 2010,�transit Ketu will also be stationary

in Gemini and 12th house in exact�aspect to natal Ketu�and transit

stationary�Rahu in Sagittarius and 6th house will exactly�afflict

natal Rahu in the 10th house. Given so many malefic afflictions in the

chart, that would likely be a very difficult time for the US on a wide

range of fronts.�We�could�expect improvement after the end of the

Saturn period - following three consequtive periods of functional

malefics�in the chart�- Rahu (2003-06), Jupiter (2006-09) and Saturn

(2009-12).�

>

> Best wishes,

>

> Thor

>

>

>

> ________________________________

> anantavijnyana <non-dual

> SAMVA

> Saturday, November 22, 2008 12:41:03 PM

> Re: Is the economic and political influence of the

USA waning?

>

> Hello, Thor,

>

> That looks correct and interesting, but what about the transit of

Jupiter

> through Capricorn? Actually, a threat war seems probable…

>

> Kind regards,

>

> Ananta

>

>

>

> SAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear friends,

> > �

> > There are now concerns in the USA that the economic and political

> influence of the country in the world is at risk.

> >

> > ==============

> > US clout down, risks up by 2025 -intel outlook

> > Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:17pm EST� - by Randall Mikkelsen

> > WASHINGTON, Nov 20 (Reuters) - U.S. economic and political clout

will

> decline over the next two decades and the world will be more

dangerous,

> with food and water scarce and advanced weapons plentiful, U.S. spy

> agencies projected on Thursday.The National Intelligence Council

analysis

> " Global Trends 2025 " also said the current financial crisis on Wall

Street

> is just the first phase of a global economic reordering. The U.S.

dollar's

> role as the world's major currency would weaken to become a " first

among

> equals, " the report said. The outlook is intended to inform U.S.

> President-elect Barack Obama of factors that will influence global

events.

> It is based on a year-long global survey of experts and trends by

U.S.

> intelligence analysts.� " The next 20 years of transition to a new

system

> are fraught with risks, " said the report, which was more pessimistic

about

> U.S. influence and the potential for conflict than the last outlook

for

> 2020.

> > http://www.reuters.com/article/usDollarRpt/idUSN2041155720081120

> > ==============

> > �

> > As we know from the SAMVA USA chart (Perpetual Union), the

international

> influence of the USA is associated with the placement of a strong

2nd lord

> SUN on the most effective point of the 7th house. Adding to the

influence,

> is the presence of 3rd lord MERCURY in the 7th house. The Sun

explains the

> status and wealth as well as the authority of the USA as it is

strongly

> placed in the chart. These factors find expression in the 7th house

of

> foreign affairs. Mercury's placement�explains the many initiatives

the US

> takes in the�foreign policy field.

> > There are other influences, but let us now concentrate on the

concerns

> raised above.

> > �

> > In the SAMVA USA chart, 8th lord SATURN aspects the Sun, adding

some

> degree of obstacles and endings to the affairs of the Sun. Whenever,

the

> energy of Saturn becomes prominent in the chart through transit or

period,

> we could expect the problems to increase associated with this natal

> influence. Certainly, as has been brought�out in

> recent�messages,�transit Saturn is now being hammered by both

transit and

> natal functional malefic planets in the chart.

> > �

> > During the upcoming Saturn sub-period from February 17, 2009, the

> energy of Saturn would also be expected to�be more strongly�felt.

The

> economy and other indications of Saturn will come to the forefront

and be

> a source of problems. There may also be major difficulties for the

USA in

> global affairs in mid 2010, during the Saturn sub-period,�when the

> transit afflictions in the chart, involving also transit

Saturn,�will be

> pronounced.

> > �

> > That said, the long term pessimism regarding the

international�power

> and influence of the USA in the world�is likely overstated given

that�a

> very powerful Sun major period begins in 2016.

> > �

> > Best wishes,

> > �

> > Thor

> >

>

>

>

> ---

>

>

[Guest guest]

Hello Ananta,

 

In looking at the history of US military involvement, let me note that the transit of Jupiter through the sign of Capricorn is not prominently featured in major conflicts, with the exception of the Korean War of 1950 and the Cuban Missile Crisis in 1962. At both times, the US had its hands full - or was put on the defenisve.

 

In 1950, US General MacArthur underestimated the threat of the Chinese entry into the war, which took place, putting the US on the defensive on the Korean Peninsula and prolongued the war.

 

During the Cuban Missile Crisis which developed from May through October 1962, the Soviets put the US Kennedy administration on the defensive over the Jupiter missiles the previous US Eisenhover administration had installed in Turkey in 1959 by taking steps to install missiles in Cuba. The risk of a thermonuclear exchange has never been greater in the post-war era. Soviet Premier Kruisheve is said to have underestimated the resolve of President Kennedy in that war of nerves - even if the latter backed down and quietly ordered the dismantling of the missiles in Turkey in 1963.

 

In 2009 we may see some action by the Russian government over the Missile Shield the US Bush administration has installed in states bordering Russia. The Obama administration, which has now been elected into power on a peace platform, may be ill at ease demonstrating its resolve to back up the actions of the prior administration with force.

 

That said, the real danger for war is in the summer of 2010

 

With best wishes,

 

Thor

 

PS as a rule, so as to avoid confusion, this forum is dedicated to the study of the Systems' Approach.

 

 

 

anantavijnyana <non-dualSAMVA Sent: Sunday, November 23, 2008 9:46:08 AM Re: Is the economic and political influence of the USA waning?Hello Thor,Thank you for your reply and reading. I do fully agree with you when you write in terms of US vulnerability and weakness. Indeed, these indications tell their own tale. But all these factors do not exclude hasty steps towards new military adventures. The Saturn Antardasha starts on 04.02.2009. At that spring time Jupiter (the lord of H6) will be in Capricorn (7H) near the nodal axis together with transit Mars. Many karmic predispositions associated with martial spirit will become active. The country will presumably

try to solve their own problems freeload. At the same time, an alternative scenario is also possible: the emanating military impulse may reverse its motion demolishing the national unity and integrity. In this connection it is also interesting to look at the Narayana Dasha of the SAMVA USA chart. The Mahadasha of Libra (4H) will start on 02.02.2009. This fourth house rules the political stability and internal harmony. We may anticipate that Ketu in the 4H will try to bring about some violent actions (perhaps inter-ethnic etc.). Kind regards and best wishes,Ananta SAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer wrote:>> Hello Ananta,> > What we can surmise from the transit�of Jupiter,�6th lord of conflict, through�Capricorn,

its sign of debilitation, and the 7th house of foreign affairs, is that the USA will be more vulnerable than before if it were�to engage in conflict. Its other indications, including financial stability will also be vulnerable while�Jupiter is transit afflicted in Capricorn, such as at the beginning of the year when it becomes conjunct the nodal axis, while Rahu is�stationary at 15� Capricorn. In other words, it would not be helpful to the USA to engage in conflict in 2009. In 2010, when Jupiter�transits through Aquarius and�the 8th house, during the sub-period�of the 8th lord�Saturn,�the indications of Jupiter would continue under strain and be vulnerable. Even�in the summer of 2010, after�Jupiter enters Pisces and the 9th house there could be serious problems. Transit Jupiter will then�be mutually afflicting with sub-period lord Saturn in

early> Virgo and 3rd house, while both�transiting malefics are transit�afflicting natal Jupiter in early Scorpio of the SAMVA USA chart. During the summer of 2010,�transit Ketu will also be stationary in Gemini and 12th house in exact�aspect to natal Ketu�and transit stationary�Rahu in Sagittarius and 6th house will exactly�afflict natal Rahu in the 10th house. Given so many malefic afflictions in the chart, that would likely be a very difficult time for the US on a wide range of fronts.�We�could�expect improvement after the end of the Saturn period - following three consequtive periods of functional malefics�in the chart�- Rahu (2003-06), Jupiter (2006-09) and Saturn (2009-12).�> > Best wishes,> > Thor> > > > ________________________________> anantavijnyana

<non-dual> SAMVA > Saturday, November 22, 2008 12:41:03 PM> Re: Is the economic and political influence of the USA waning?> > Hello, Thor,> > That looks correct and interesting, but what about the transit of Jupiter > through Capricorn? Actually, a threat war seems probable…> > Kind regards,> > Ananta> > > > SAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote:> >> > Dear friends, > > �> > There are now concerns in the USA that the economic and political > influence of the country in the world is at risk.> > > >

==============> > US clout down, risks up by 2025 -intel outlook> > Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:17pm EST� - by Randall Mikkelsen> > WASHINGTON, Nov 20 (Reuters) - U.S. economic and political clout will > decline over the next two decades and the world will be more dangerous, > with food and water scarce and advanced weapons plentiful, U.S. spy > agencies projected on Thursday.The National Intelligence Council analysis > "Global Trends 2025" also said the current financial crisis on Wall Street > is just the first phase of a global economic reordering. The U.S. dollar's > role as the world's major currency would weaken to become a "first among > equals," the report said. The outlook is intended to inform U.S. > President-elect Barack Obama of factors that will influence global events. > It is based on a year-long global survey of experts

and trends by U.S. > intelligence analysts.�"The next 20 years of transition to a new system > are fraught with risks," said the report, which was more pessimistic about > U.S. influence and the potential for conflict than the last outlook for > 2020.> > http://www.reuters.com/article/usDollarRpt/idUSN2041155720081120> > ==============> > �> > As we know from the SAMVA USA chart (Perpetual Union), the international > influence of the USA is associated with the placement of a strong 2nd lord > SUN on the most effective point of the 7th house. Adding to the influence, > is the presence of 3rd lord MERCURY in the 7th house. The Sun explains the > status and wealth as well as the authority of the USA as it is strongly >

placed in the chart. These factors find expression in the 7th house of > foreign affairs. Mercury's placement�explains the many initiatives the US > takes in the�foreign policy field. > > There are other influences, but let us now concentrate on the concerns > raised above. > > �> > In the SAMVA USA chart, 8th lord SATURN aspects the Sun, adding some > degree of obstacles and endings to the affairs of the Sun. Whenever, the > energy of Saturn becomes prominent in the chart through transit or period, > we could expect the problems to increase associated with this natal > influence. Certainly, as has been brought�out in > recent�messages,�transit Saturn is now being hammered by both transit and > natal functional malefic planets in the chart. > > �> > During the upcoming Saturn

sub-period from February 17, 2009, the > energy of Saturn would also be expected to�be more strongly�felt. The > economy and other indications of Saturn will come to the forefront and be > a source of problems. There may also be major difficulties for the USA in > global affairs in mid 2010, during the Saturn sub-period,�when the > transit afflictions in the chart, involving also transit Saturn,�will be > pronounced. > > �> > That said, the long term pessimism regarding the international�power > and influence of the USA in the world�is likely overstated given that�a > very powerful Sun major period begins in 2016.> > �> > Best wishes,> > �> > Thor> >> > > > ---> >

Links>---

[Guest guest]

Dear Thor,

 

The time is a spiral not a straight line so many aspects of the next

(Jupiter) transiting through Capricorn will be unprecedented. The

country has accumulated a lot of negative karma since the sixties. We

should also bear in mind that now the events seem go faster, more

intense than before. The time/energy spiral, being under contraction,

produce hotter temperatures, more intense events etc.

 

You mentioned the Korean War in 1950, but at that time the transits

were not so destructive. The karmic nodal axis was not in the 1H/7H

position…

 

When it comes to 2010 I do agree that the danger of war is also very

high. Besides, my calculations show that in 2010 we will probably see

the collapse of US dollar (this process will be initiated in 2009)…

 

Kind regards,

 

Ananta

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

SAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer wrote:

>

> Hello Ananta,

> �

> In looking at the history of US military involvement, let me note

that the transit of Jupiter through the sign of Capricorn is

not�prominently featured in�major conflicts, with the exception of

the Korean War of 1950 and the Cuban Missile Crisis in 1962. At both

times, the US had its hands full - or�was put on the defenisve.

> �

> In 1950, US General MacArthur underestimated the threat of the

Chinese entry into the war, which took place, putting the US on the

defensive on the Korean Peninsula and prolongued the war.

> �

> During the Cuban Missile Crisis which developed from May through

October 1962, the Soviets put the US Kennedy administration�on

the�defensive over the Jupiter missiles the previous US Eisenhover

administration had installed in Turkey in 1959 by taking steps to

install missiles in Cuba. The risk of a thermonuclear exchange has

never been greater in the post-war era. Soviet Premier Kruisheve is

said to have underestimated the resolve of President Kennedy in that

war of nerves - even if the latter backed down and quietly ordered

the dismantling of�the missiles in Turkey in 1963.

> �

> In 2009 we may see some action by the Russian government over the

Missile Shield the US Bush administration has installed in states

bordering Russia. The Obama administration, which has now

been�elected into power on a peace platform,�may be ill at ease

demonstrating its resolve to back up the actions of the prior

administration�with force.

> �

> That said, the real danger for war is in the summer of 2010

> �

> With best wishes,

>

> Thor

>

> PS as a rule, so as�to avoid�confusion, this forum is dedicated to

the study of the Systems' Approach.

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________

> anantavijnyana <non-dual

> SAMVA

> Sunday, November 23, 2008 9:46:08 AM

> Re: Is the economic and political influence of the

USA waning?

>

> Hello Thor,

>

> Thank you for your reply and reading. I do fully agree with you

when

> you write in terms of US vulnerability and weakness. Indeed, these

> indications tell their own tale. But all these factors do not

exclude

> hasty steps towards new military adventures. The Saturn Antardasha

> starts on 04.02.2009. At that spring time Jupiter (the lord of H6)

> will be in Capricorn (7H) near the nodal axis together with transit

> Mars. Many karmic predispositions associated with martial spirit

will

> become active. The country will presumably try to solve their own

> problems freeload. At the same time, an alternative scenario is

also

> possible: the emanating military impulse may reverse its motion

> demolishing the national unity and integrity. In this connection it

is

> also interesting to look at the Narayana Dasha of the SAMVA USA

chart.

> The Mahadasha of Libra (4H) will start on 02.02.2009. This fourth

> house rules the political stability and internal harmony. We may

> anticipate that Ketu in the 4H will try to bring about some violent

> actions (perhaps inter-ethnic etc.).�

>

> Kind regards and best wishes,

>

> Ananta� �

>

>

>

>

> SAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote:

> >

> > Hello Ananta,

> >

> > What we can surmise from the transit�of Jupiter,�6th lord of

> conflict, through�Capricorn, its sign of debilitation, and the 7th

> house of foreign affairs, is that the USA will be more vulnerable

than

> before if it were�to engage in conflict. Its other indications,

> including financial stability will also be vulnerable while�Jupiter

is

> transit afflicted in Capricorn, such as at the beginning of the

year

> when it becomes conjunct the nodal axis, while Rahu is�stationary

at

> 15� Capricorn. In other words, it would not be helpful to the USA

to

> engage in conflict in 2009. In 2010, when Jupiter�transits through

> Aquarius and�the 8th house, during the sub-period�of the 8th

> lord�Saturn,�the indications of Jupiter would continue under

strain

> and be vulnerable. Even�in the summer of 2010, after�Jupiter

enters

> Pisces and the 9th house there could be serious problems. Transit

> Jupiter will then�be mutually afflicting with sub-period lord

Saturn

> in early

> >� Virgo and 3rd house, while both�transiting malefics are

> transit�afflicting natal Jupiter in early Scorpio of the SAMVA USA

> chart. During the summer of 2010,�transit Ketu will also be

stationary

> in Gemini and 12th house in exact�aspect to natal Ketu�and transit

> stationary�Rahu in Sagittarius and 6th house will exactly�afflict

> natal Rahu in the 10th house. Given so many malefic afflictions in

the

> chart, that would likely be a very difficult time for the US on a

wide

> range of fronts.�We�could�expect improvement after the end of the

> Saturn period - following three consequtive periods of functional

> malefics�in the chart�- Rahu (2003-06), Jupiter (2006-09) and

Saturn

> (2009-12).�

> >

> > Best wishes,

> >

> > Thor

> >

> >

> >

> > ________________________________

> > anantavijnyana <non-dual@>

> > SAMVA

> > Saturday, November 22, 2008 12:41:03 PM

> > Re: Is the economic and political influence of

the

> USA waning?

> >

> > Hello, Thor,

> >

> > That looks correct and interesting, but what about the transit of

> Jupiter

> > through Capricorn? Actually, a threat war seems probable…

> >

> > Kind regards,

> >

> > Ananta

> >

> >

> >

> > SAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear friends,

> > > �

> > > There are now concerns in the USA that the economic and

political

> > influence of the country in the world is at risk.

> > >

> > > ==============

> > > US clout down, risks up by 2025 -intel outlook

> > > Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:17pm EST� - by Randall Mikkelsen

> > > WASHINGTON, Nov 20 (Reuters) - U.S. economic and political

clout

> will

> > decline over the next two decades and the world will be more

> dangerous,

> > with food and water scarce and advanced weapons plentiful, U.S.

spy

> > agencies projected on Thursday.The National Intelligence Council

> analysis

> > " Global Trends 2025 " also said the current financial crisis on

Wall

> Street

> > is just the first phase of a global economic reordering. The U.S.

> dollar's

> > role as the world's major currency would weaken to become a

" first

> among

> > equals, " the report said. The outlook is intended to inform U.S.

> > President-elect Barack Obama of factors that will influence

global

> events.

> > It is based on a year-long global survey of experts and trends by

> U.S.

> > intelligence analysts.� " The next 20 years of transition to a new

> system

> > are fraught with risks, " said the report, which was more

pessimistic

> about

> > U.S. influence and the potential for conflict than the last

outlook

> for

> > 2020.

> > > http://www.reuters.com/article/usDollarRpt/idUSN2041155720081120

> > > ==============

> > > �

> > > As we know from the SAMVA USA chart (Perpetual Union), the

> international

> > influence of the USA is associated with the placement of a strong

> 2nd lord

> > SUN on the most effective point of the 7th house. Adding to the

> influence,

> > is the presence of 3rd lord MERCURY in the 7th house. The Sun

> explains the

> > status and wealth as well as the authority of the USA as it is

> strongly

> > placed in the chart. These factors find expression in the 7th

house

> of

> > foreign affairs. Mercury's placement�explains the many

initiatives

> the US

> > takes in the�foreign policy field.

> > > There are other influences, but let us now concentrate on the

> concerns

> > raised above.

> > > �

> > > In the SAMVA USA chart, 8th lord SATURN aspects the Sun, adding

> some

> > degree of obstacles and endings to the affairs of the Sun.

Whenever,

> the

> > energy of Saturn becomes prominent in the chart through transit

or

> period,

> > we could expect the problems to increase associated with this

natal

> > influence. Certainly, as has been brought�out in

> > recent�messages,�transit Saturn is now being hammered by both

> transit and

> > natal functional malefic planets in the chart.

> > > �

> > > During the upcoming Saturn sub-period from February 17, 2009,

the

> > energy of Saturn would also be expected to�be more

strongly�felt.

> The

> > economy and other indications of Saturn will come to the

forefront

> and be

> > a source of problems. There may also be major difficulties for

the

> USA in

> > global affairs in mid 2010, during the Saturn sub-period,�when

the

> > transit afflictions in the chart, involving also transit

> Saturn,�will be

> > pronounced.

> > > �

> > > That said, the long term pessimism regarding the

> international�power

> > and influence of the USA in the world�is likely overstated given

> that�a

> > very powerful Sun major period begins in 2016.

> > > �

> > > Best wishes,

> > > �

> > > Thor

> > >

> >

> >

> >

> > ---

> >

> >

[Guest guest]

Dear Ananta,

 

what is your jyotisha forecast consideration for US dollar collapse ? armands

 

 

 

On 11/23/08, anantavijnyana <non-dual wrote:

 

 

 

 

 

Dear Thor,The time is a spiral not a straight line so many aspects of the next (Jupiter) transiting through Capricorn will be unprecedented. The country has accumulated a lot of negative karma since the sixties. We

should also bear in mind that now the events seem go faster, more intense than before. The time/energy spiral, being under contraction, produce hotter temperatures, more intense events etc.You mentioned the Korean War in 1950, but at that time the transits

were not so destructive. The karmic nodal axis was not in the 1H/7H position…When it comes to 2010 I do agree that the danger of war is also very high. Besides, my calculations show that in 2010 we will probably see

the collapse of US dollar (this process will be initiated in 2009)… Kind regards,AnantaSAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer wrote:

>> Hello Ananta,> �> In looking at the history of US military involvement, let me note that the transit of Jupiter through the sign of Capricorn is not�prominently featured in�major conflicts, with the exception of

the Korean War of 1950 and the Cuban Missile Crisis in 1962. At both times, the US had its hands full - or�was put on the defenisve. > �> In 1950, US General MacArthur underestimated the threat of the

Chinese entry into the war, which took place, putting the US on the defensive on the Korean Peninsula and prolongued the war. > �> During the Cuban Missile Crisis which developed from May through

October 1962, the Soviets put the US Kennedy administration�on the�defensive over the Jupiter missiles the previous US Eisenhover administration had installed in Turkey in 1959 by taking steps to

install missiles in Cuba. The risk of a thermonuclear exchange has never been greater in the post-war era. Soviet Premier Kruisheve is said to have underestimated the resolve of President Kennedy in that war of nerves - even if the latter backed down and quietly ordered

the dismantling of�the missiles in Turkey in 1963.> �> In 2009 we may see some action by the Russian government over the Missile Shield the US Bush administration has installed in states

bordering Russia. The Obama administration, which has now been�elected into power on a peace platform,�may be ill at ease demonstrating its resolve to back up the actions of the prior

administration�with force.> �> That said, the real danger for war is in the summer of 2010> �> With best wishes,> > Thor> > PS as a rule, so as�to avoid�confusion, this forum is dedicated to

the study of the Systems' Approach.> > > > > ________________________________> anantavijnyana <non-dual > SAMVA > Sunday, November 23, 2008 9:46:08 AM

> Re: Is the economic and political influence of the USA waning?> > Hello Thor,> > Thank you for your reply and reading. I do fully agree with you when > you write in terms of US vulnerability and weakness. Indeed, these

> indications tell their own tale. But all these factors do not exclude > hasty steps towards new military adventures. The Saturn Antardasha > starts on 04.02.2009. At that spring time Jupiter (the lord of H6)

> will be in Capricorn (7H) near the nodal axis together with transit > Mars. Many karmic predispositions associated with martial spirit will > become active. The country will presumably try to solve their own

> problems freeload. At the same time, an alternative scenario is also > possible: the emanating military impulse may reverse its motion > demolishing the national unity and integrity. In this connection it

is > also interesting to look at the Narayana Dasha of the SAMVA USA chart. > The Mahadasha of Libra (4H) will start on 02.02.2009. This fourth > house rules the political stability and internal harmony. We may

> anticipate that Ketu in the 4H will try to bring about some violent > actions (perhaps inter-ethnic etc.).� > > Kind regards and best wishes,> > Ananta� �

> > > > > SAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote:

> >> > Hello Ananta,> > > > What we can surmise from the transit�of Jupiter,�6th lord of > conflict, through�Capricorn, its sign of debilitation, and the 7th > house of foreign affairs, is that the USA will be more vulnerable

than > before if it were�to engage in conflict. Its other indications, > including financial stability will also be vulnerable while�Jupiter is > transit afflicted in Capricorn, such as at the beginning of the

year > when it becomes conjunct the nodal axis, while Rahu is�stationary at > 15� Capricorn. In other words, it would not be helpful to the USA to > engage in conflict in 2009. In 2010, when Jupiter�transits through

> Aquarius and�the 8th house, during the sub-period�of the 8th > lord�Saturn,�the indications of Jupiter would continue under strain > and be vulnerable. Even�in the summer of 2010, after�Jupiter

enters > Pisces and the 9th house there could be serious problems. Transit > Jupiter will then�be mutually afflicting with sub-period lord Saturn > in early> >� Virgo and 3rd house, while both�transiting malefics are

> transit�afflicting natal Jupiter in early Scorpio of the SAMVA USA > chart. During the summer of 2010,�transit Ketu will also be stationary > in Gemini and 12th house in exact�aspect to natal Ketu�and transit

> stationary�Rahu in Sagittarius and 6th house will exactly�afflict > natal Rahu in the 10th house. Given so many malefic afflictions in the > chart, that would likely be a very difficult time for the US on a

wide > range of fronts.�We�could�expect improvement after the end of the > Saturn period - following three consequtive periods of functional > malefics�in the chart�- Rahu (2003-06), Jupiter (2006-09) and

Saturn > (2009-12).�> > > > Best wishes,> > > > Thor> > > > > > > > ________________________________> > anantavijnyana <non-dual@>

> > SAMVA > > Saturday, November 22, 2008 12:41:03 PM> > Re: Is the economic and political influence of

the > USA waning?> > > > Hello, Thor,> > > > That looks correct and interesting, but what about the transit of > Jupiter > > through Capricorn? Actually, a threat war seems probable…

> > > > Kind regards,> > > > Ananta> > > > > > > > SAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote:

> > >> > > Dear friends, > > > �> > > There are now concerns in the USA that the economic and political > > influence of the country in the world is at risk.

> > > > > > ==============> > > US clout down, risks up by 2025 -intel outlook> > > Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:17pm EST� - by Randall Mikkelsen> > > WASHINGTON, Nov 20 (Reuters) - U.S. economic and political

clout > will > > decline over the next two decades and the world will be more > dangerous, > > with food and water scarce and advanced weapons plentiful, U.S. spy > > agencies projected on Thursday.The National Intelligence Council

> analysis > > " Global Trends 2025 " also said the current financial crisis on Wall > Street > > is just the first phase of a global economic reordering. The U.S. > dollar's

> > role as the world's major currency would weaken to become a " first > among > > equals, " the report said. The outlook is intended to inform U.S. > > President-elect Barack Obama of factors that will influence

global > events. > > It is based on a year-long global survey of experts and trends by > U.S. > > intelligence analysts.� " The next 20 years of transition to a new > system

> > are fraught with risks, " said the report, which was more pessimistic > about > > U.S. influence and the potential for conflict than the last outlook > for > > 2020.

> > > http://www.reuters.com/article/usDollarRpt/idUSN2041155720081120

> > > ==============> > > �> > > As we know from the SAMVA USA chart (Perpetual Union), the > international > > influence of the USA is associated with the placement of a strong

> 2nd lord > > SUN on the most effective point of the 7th house. Adding to the > influence, > > is the presence of 3rd lord MERCURY in the 7th house. The Sun > explains the > > status and wealth as well as the authority of the USA as it is

> strongly > > placed in the chart. These factors find expression in the 7th house > of > > foreign affairs. Mercury's placement�explains the many initiatives > the US

> > takes in the�foreign policy field. > > > There are other influences, but let us now concentrate on the > concerns > > raised above. > > > �> > > In the SAMVA USA chart, 8th lord SATURN aspects the Sun, adding

> some > > degree of obstacles and endings to the affairs of the Sun. Whenever, > the > > energy of Saturn becomes prominent in the chart through transit or > period, > > we could expect the problems to increase associated with this

natal > > influence. Certainly, as has been brought�out in > > recent�messages,�transit Saturn is now being hammered by both > transit and > > natal functional malefic planets in the chart.

> > > �> > > During the upcoming Saturn sub-period from February 17, 2009, the > > energy of Saturn would also be expected to�be more strongly�felt. > The > > economy and other indications of Saturn will come to the

forefront > and be > > a source of problems. There may also be major difficulties for the > USA in > > global affairs in mid 2010, during the Saturn sub-period,�when the > > transit afflictions in the chart, involving also transit

> Saturn,�will be > > pronounced. > > > �> > > That said, the long term pessimism regarding the > international�power > > and influence of the USA in the world�is likely overstated given

> that�a > > very powerful Sun major period begins in 2016.> > > �> > > Best wishes,> > > �> > > Thor> > >> > > >

> > > > ---> > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Ananta,

 

Indeed, transit Jupiter entered Capricorn on 1 March 1949 and stayed there until 31 March 1950. The US was therefore not at war during such a transit as my cursory review of the annual transits suggested.

 

What the data shows is that the USA entered war when transit Jupiter had entered Aquarius and the 8th house. This is more in line with the astrological dynamics of previous US military engagements. Let's look at some interesting facts of the Korean War:

 

The US entered into major hostilities in the Korean war, which lasted from June 25, 1950 until the armistice was signed on July 27, 1953. Jupiter-Mars period was operating.

 

China unexpectedly assembled its troops by order of Mao Zedong on 8 October 1950 and made contact with US troops on November 1, 1950. At that time, transit Jupiter was at 4° Aquarius/H8 while transit Rahu was at 4° Pisces/H9 afflicting natal Jupiter at 4° Scorpio/H5, while transit 8th lord SATURN at 5° Virgo was conjunct transit KETU at 4° Virgo. Transit Saturn was also afflicting natal Jupiter.

 

By the time the Jupiter-Rahu period began, on 19 November 1950, the events were turning dramatically against the USA:

 

"In late November, the Chinese struck in the west, along the Chongchon River, and completely overran several South Korean divisions and successfully landed a heavy blow to the flank of the remaining UN forces. The ensuing defeat of the U.S. Eighth Army resulted in the longest retreat of any American military unit in history."

 

The foregoing shows that the SAMVA USA chart explains the events extremely well. More importantly, there is scant if any evidence to back up the claims that

 

a) the US is likely to enter war while transit Jupiter is in Capricorn or

b) the nodes need to be in the 1st or 7th houses at such times.

 

Indeed, as my earlier message showed, if there is an empirical regularity to be seen, it is this: war is more likely when the nodes transit the 6th and 12th houses - or as was the case in the War of 1812, in Aquarius/H8.

 

Best wishes,

 

Thor

 

 

 

 

 

anantavijnyana <non-dualSAMVA Sent: Sunday, November 23, 2008 12:11:12 PM Re: Is the economic and political influence of the USA waning?Dear Thor,The time is a spiral not a straight line so many aspects of the next (Jupiter) transiting through Capricorn will be unprecedented. The country has accumulated a lot of negative karma since the sixties. We should also bear in mind that now the events seem go faster, more intense than before. The time/energy spiral, being under contraction, produce hotter temperatures, more intense events etc.You mentioned the Korean War in 1950, but at that time the transits were not so destructive. The karmic nodal axis was not

in the 1H/7H position…When it comes to 2010 I do agree that the danger of war is also very high. Besides, my calculations show that in 2010 we will probably see the collapse of US dollar (this process will be initiated in 2009)… Kind regards,AnantaSAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer wrote:>> Hello Ananta,> �> In looking at the history of US military involvement, let me note that the transit of Jupiter through the sign of Capricorn is not�prominently featured in�major conflicts, with the exception of the Korean War of 1950 and the Cuban Missile Crisis in 1962. At both times, the US had its hands full - or�was put on the defenisve. > �> In 1950, US General MacArthur underestimated

the threat of the Chinese entry into the war, which took place, putting the US on the defensive on the Korean Peninsula and prolongued the war. > �> During the Cuban Missile Crisis which developed from May through October 1962, the Soviets put the US Kennedy administration�on the�defensive over the Jupiter missiles the previous US Eisenhover administration had installed in Turkey in 1959 by taking steps to install missiles in Cuba. The risk of a thermonuclear exchange has never been greater in the post-war era. Soviet Premier Kruisheve is said to have underestimated the resolve of President Kennedy in that war of nerves - even if the latter backed down and quietly ordered the dismantling of�the missiles in Turkey in 1963.> �> In 2009 we may see some action by the Russian government over the Missile Shield the US Bush administration has installed in states

bordering Russia. The Obama administration, which has now been�elected into power on a peace platform,�may be ill at ease demonstrating its resolve to back up the actions of the prior administration�with force.> �> That said, the real danger for war is in the summer of 2010> �> With best wishes,> > Thor> > PS as a rule, so as�to avoid�confusion, this forum is dedicated to the study of the Systems' Approach.> > > > > ________________________________> anantavijnyana <non-dual> SAMVA > Sunday, November 23, 2008 9:46:08 AM> Re: Is the economic and political influence of the USA waning?> > Hello Thor,> > Thank you for

your reply and reading. I do fully agree with you when > you write in terms of US vulnerability and weakness. Indeed, these > indications tell their own tale. But all these factors do not exclude > hasty steps towards new military adventures. The Saturn Antardasha > starts on 04.02.2009. At that spring time Jupiter (the lord of H6) > will be in Capricorn (7H) near the nodal axis together with transit > Mars. Many karmic predispositions associated with martial spirit will > become active. The country will presumably try to solve their own > problems freeload. At the same time, an alternative scenario is also > possible: the emanating military impulse may reverse its motion > demolishing the national unity and integrity. In this connection it is > also interesting to look at the Narayana Dasha of the SAMVA USA chart. > The Mahadasha of Libra (4H)

will start on 02.02.2009. This fourth > house rules the political stability and internal harmony. We may > anticipate that Ketu in the 4H will try to bring about some violent > actions (perhaps inter-ethnic etc.).� > > Kind regards and best wishes,> > Ananta� � > > > > > SAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote:> >> > Hello Ananta,> > > > What we can surmise from the transit�of Jupiter,�6th lord of > conflict, through�Capricorn, its sign of debilitation, and the 7th > house of foreign affairs, is that the USA will be more vulnerable than > before if it were�to engage in conflict. Its other indications, > including financial stability will also be vulnerable

while�Jupiter is > transit afflicted in Capricorn, such as at the beginning of the year > when it becomes conjunct the nodal axis, while Rahu is�stationary at > 15� Capricorn. In other words, it would not be helpful to the USA to > engage in conflict in 2009. In 2010, when Jupiter�transits through > Aquarius and�the 8th house, during the sub-period�of the 8th > lord�Saturn,�the indications of Jupiter would continue under strain > and be vulnerable. Even�in the summer of 2010, after�Jupiter enters > Pisces and the 9th house there could be serious problems. Transit > Jupiter will then�be mutually afflicting with sub-period lord Saturn > in early> >� Virgo and 3rd house, while both�transiting malefics are > transit�afflicting natal Jupiter in early Scorpio of the SAMVA USA

> chart. During the summer of 2010,�transit Ketu will also be stationary > in Gemini and 12th house in exact�aspect to natal Ketu�and transit > stationary�Rahu in Sagittarius and 6th house will exactly�afflict > natal Rahu in the 10th house. Given so many malefic afflictions in the > chart, that would likely be a very difficult time for the US on a wide > range of fronts.�We�could�expect improvement after the end of the > Saturn period - following three consequtive periods of functional > malefics�in the chart�- Rahu (2003-06), Jupiter (2006-09) and Saturn > (2009-12).�> > > > Best wishes,> > > > Thor> > > > > > > > ________________________________> > anantavijnyana <non-dual@>> > SAMVA > > Saturday, November 22, 2008 12:41:03 PM> > Re: Is the economic and political influence of the > USA waning?> > > > Hello, Thor,> > > > That looks correct and interesting, but what about the transit of > Jupiter > > through Capricorn? Actually, a threat war seems probable…> > > > Kind regards,> > > > Ananta> > > > > > > > SAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer@> wrote:> > >> > > Dear friends, > > > �> > > There are now concerns in the USA that the economic and political > > influence of

the country in the world is at risk.> > > > > > ==============> > > US clout down, risks up by 2025 -intel outlook> > > Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:17pm EST� - by Randall Mikkelsen> > > WASHINGTON, Nov 20 (Reuters) - U.S. economic and political clout > will > > decline over the next two decades and the world will be more > dangerous, > > with food and water scarce and advanced weapons plentiful, U.S. spy > > agencies projected on Thursday.The National Intelligence Council > analysis > > "Global Trends 2025" also said the current financial crisis on Wall > Street > > is just the first phase of a global economic reordering. The U.S. > dollar's > > role as the world's major currency would weaken to become a "first > among > > equals," the report said. The outlook is

intended to inform U.S. > > President-elect Barack Obama of factors that will influence global > events. > > It is based on a year-long global survey of experts and trends by > U.S. > > intelligence analysts.�"The next 20 years of transition to a new > system > > are fraught with risks," said the report, which was more pessimistic > about > > U.S. influence and the potential for conflict than the last outlook > for > > 2020.> > > http://www.reuters.com/article/usDollarRpt/idUSN2041155720081120> > > ==============> > > �> > > As we know from the SAMVA USA chart (Perpetual Union), the > international > > influence of the USA is associated with the placement of a strong > 2nd

lord > > SUN on the most effective point of the 7th house. Adding to the > influence, > > is the presence of 3rd lord MERCURY in the 7th house. The Sun > explains the > > status and wealth as well as the authority of the USA as it is > strongly > > placed in the chart. These factors find expression in the 7th house > of > > foreign affairs. Mercury's placement�explains the many initiatives > the US > > takes in the�foreign policy field. > > > There are other influences, but let us now concentrate on the > concerns > > raised above. > > > �> > > In the SAMVA USA chart, 8th lord SATURN aspects the Sun, adding > some > > degree of obstacles and endings to the affairs of the Sun. Whenever, > the > > energy of Saturn becomes prominent in the chart

through transit or > period, > > we could expect the problems to increase associated with this natal > > influence. Certainly, as has been brought�out in > > recent�messages,�transit Saturn is now being hammered by both > transit and > > natal functional malefic planets in the chart. > > > �> > > During the upcoming Saturn sub-period from February 17, 2009, the > > energy of Saturn would also be expected to�be more strongly�felt. > The > > economy and other indications of Saturn will come to the forefront > and be > > a source of problems. There may also be major difficulties for the > USA in > > global affairs in mid 2010, during the Saturn sub-period,�when the > > transit afflictions in the chart, involving also transit >

Saturn,�will be > > pronounced. > > > �> > > That said, the long term pessimism regarding the > international�power > > and influence of the USA in the world�is likely overstated given > that�a > > very powerful Sun major period begins in 2016.> > > �> > > Best wishes,> > > �> > > Thor> > >> > > > > > > > ---> > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Armands,

 

I’m sorry but I wouldn’t like to be engaged in further detailed

considerations as to this matter because my conclusion is not fully based

on the System Approach (SA). Actually I always try to combine different

astrological systems to improve the reliability of any predictions. At the

same time, we can also see many alarming factors within limits of the SA.

Just look at the Vimshottari dashas and transits. I think, that Thor will

explore it more professionally then me…

 

Kind regards,

 

Ananta

 

 

SAMVA , " Armands Birins " <abirins wrote:

>

> Dear Ananta,

>

> what is your jyotisha forecast consideration for US dollar collapse ?

>

> armands

>

>

>

> On 11/23/08, anantavijnyana <non-dual wrote:

> >

> > Dear Thor,

> >

> > The time is a spiral not a straight line so many aspects of the next

> > (Jupiter) transiting through Capricorn will be unprecedented. The

> > country has accumulated a lot of negative karma since the sixties. We

> > should also bear in mind that now the events seem go faster, more

> > intense than before. The time/energy spiral, being under contraction,

> > produce hotter temperatures, more intense events etc.

> >

> > You mentioned the Korean War in 1950, but at that time the transits

> > were not so destructive. The karmic nodal axis was not in the 1H/7H

> > position…

> >

> > When it comes to 2010 I do agree that the danger of war is also very

> > high. Besides, my calculations show that in 2010 we will probably see

> > the collapse of US dollar (this process will be initiated in 2009)…

> >

> > Kind regards,

> >

> > Ananta

> >

> > SAMVA <SAMVA%40>, Cosmologer

> > <cosmologer@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Hello Ananta,

> > > �

> > > In looking at the history of US military involvement, let me note

> > that the transit of Jupiter through the sign of Capricorn is

> > not�prominently featured in�major conflicts, with the exception of

> > the Korean War of 1950 and the Cuban Missile Crisis in 1962. At both

> > times, the US had its hands full - or�was put on the defenisve.

> > > �

> > > In 1950, US General MacArthur underestimated the threat of the

> > Chinese entry into the war, which took place, putting the US on the

> > defensive on the Korean Peninsula and prolongued the war.

> > > �

> > > During the Cuban Missile Crisis which developed from May through

> > October 1962, the Soviets put the US Kennedy administration�on

> > the�defensive over the Jupiter missiles the previous US Eisenhover

> > administration had installed in Turkey in 1959 by taking steps to

> > install missiles in Cuba. The risk of a thermonuclear exchange has

> > never been greater in the post-war era. Soviet Premier Kruisheve is

> > said to have underestimated the resolve of President Kennedy in that

> > war of nerves - even if the latter backed down and quietly ordered

> > the dismantling of�the missiles in Turkey in 1963.

> > > �

> > > In 2009 we may see some action by the Russian government over the

> > Missile Shield the US Bush administration has installed in states

> > bordering Russia. The Obama administration, which has now

> > been�elected into power on a peace platform,�may be ill at ease

> > demonstrating its resolve to back up the actions of the prior

> > administration�with force.

> > > �

> > > That said, the real danger for war is in the summer of 2010

> > > �

> > > With best wishes,

> > >

> > > Thor

> > >

> > > PS as a rule, so as�to avoid�confusion, this forum is dedicated to

> > the study of the Systems' Approach.

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > ________________________________

> > > anantavijnyana <non-dual@>

> > > SAMVA <SAMVA%40>

> > > Sunday, November 23, 2008 9:46:08 AM

> > > Re: Is the economic and political influence of the

> > USA waning?

> > >

> > > Hello Thor,

> > >

> > > Thank you for your reply and reading. I do fully agree with you

> > when

> > > you write in terms of US vulnerability and weakness. Indeed, these

> > > indications tell their own tale. But all these factors do not

> > exclude

> > > hasty steps towards new military adventures. The Saturn Antardasha

> > > starts on 04.02.2009. At that spring time Jupiter (the lord of H6)

> > > will be in Capricorn (7H) near the nodal axis together with transit

> > > Mars. Many karmic predispositions associated with martial spirit

> > will

> > > become active. The country will presumably try to solve their own

> > > problems freeload. At the same time, an alternative scenario is

> > also

> > > possible: the emanating military impulse may reverse its motion

> > > demolishing the national unity and integrity. In this connection it

> > is

> > > also interesting to look at the Narayana Dasha of the SAMVA USA

> > chart.

> > > The Mahadasha of Libra (4H) will start on 02.02.2009. This fourth

> > > house rules the political stability and internal harmony. We may

> > > anticipate that Ketu in the 4H will try to bring about some violent

> > > actions (perhaps inter-ethnic etc.).�

> > >

> > > Kind regards and best wishes,

> > >

> > > Ananta� �

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > >

> > > SAMVA <SAMVA%40>, Cosmologer

> > <cosmologer@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Hello Ananta,

> > > >

> > > > What we can surmise from the transit�of Jupiter,�6th lord of

> > > conflict, through�Capricorn, its sign of debilitation, and the 7th

> > > house of foreign affairs, is that the USA will be more vulnerable

> > than

> > > before if it were�to engage in conflict. Its other indications,

> > > including financial stability will also be vulnerable while�Jupiter

> > is

> > > transit afflicted in Capricorn, such as at the beginning of the

> > year

> > > when it becomes conjunct the nodal axis, while Rahu is�stationary

> > at

> > > 15� Capricorn. In other words, it would not be helpful to the USA

> > to

> > > engage in conflict in 2009. In 2010, when Jupiter�transits through

> > > Aquarius and�the 8th house, during the sub-period�of the 8th

> > > lord�Saturn,�the indications of Jupiter would continue under

> > strain

> > > and be vulnerable. Even�in the summer of 2010, after�Jupiter

> > enters

> > > Pisces and the 9th house there could be serious problems. Transit

> > > Jupiter will then�be mutually afflicting with sub-period lord

> > Saturn

> > > in early

> > > >� Virgo and 3rd house, while both�transiting malefics are

> > > transit�afflicting natal Jupiter in early Scorpio of the SAMVA USA

> > > chart. During the summer of 2010,�transit Ketu will also be

> > stationary

> > > in Gemini and 12th house in exact�aspect to natal Ketu�and transit

> > > stationary�Rahu in Sagittarius and 6th house will exactly�afflict

> > > natal Rahu in the 10th house. Given so many malefic afflictions in

> > the

> > > chart, that would likely be a very difficult time for the US on a

> > wide

> > > range of fronts.�We�could�expect improvement after the end of the

> > > Saturn period - following three consequtive periods of functional

> > > malefics�in the chart�- Rahu (2003-06), Jupiter (2006-09) and

> > Saturn

> > > (2009-12).�

> > > >

> > > > Best wishes,

> > > >

> > > > Thor

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ________________________________

> > > > anantavijnyana <non-dual@>

> > > > SAMVA <SAMVA%40>

> > > > Saturday, November 22, 2008 12:41:03 PM

> > > > Re: Is the economic and political influence of

> > the

> > > USA waning?

> > > >

> > > > Hello, Thor,

> > > >

> > > > That looks correct and interesting, but what about the transit of

> > > Jupiter

> > > > through Capricorn? Actually, a threat war seems probable…

> > > >

> > > > Kind regards,

> > > >

> > > > Ananta

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > SAMVA <SAMVA%40>, Cosmologer

> > <cosmologer@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Dear friends,

> > > > > �

> > > > > There are now concerns in the USA that the economic and

> > political

> > > > influence of the country in the world is at risk.

> > > > >

> > > > > ==============

> > > > > US clout down, risks up by 2025 -intel outlook

> > > > > Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:17pm EST� - by Randall Mikkelsen

> > > > > WASHINGTON, Nov 20 (Reuters) - U.S. economic and political

> > clout

> > > will

> > > > decline over the next two decades and the world will be more

> > > dangerous,

> > > > with food and water scarce and advanced weapons plentiful, U.S.

> > spy

> > > > agencies projected on Thursday.The National Intelligence Council

> > > analysis

> > > > " Global Trends 2025 " also said the current financial crisis on

> > Wall

> > > Street

> > > > is just the first phase of a global economic reordering. The U.S.

> > > dollar's

> > > > role as the world's major currency would weaken to become a

> > " first

> > > among

> > > > equals, " the report said. The outlook is intended to inform U.S.

> > > > President-elect Barack Obama of factors that will influence

> > global

> > > events.

> > > > It is based on a year-long global survey of experts and trends by

> > > U.S.

> > > > intelligence analysts.� " The next 20 years of transition to a new

> > > system

> > > > are fraught with risks, " said the report, which was more

> > pessimistic

> > > about

> > > > U.S. influence and the potential for conflict than the last

> > outlook

> > > for

> > > > 2020.

> > > > > http://www.reuters.com/article/usDollarRpt/idUSN2041155720081120

> > > > > ==============

> > > > > �

> > > > > As we know from the SAMVA USA chart (Perpetual Union), the

> > > international

> > > > influence of the USA is associated with the placement of a strong

> > > 2nd lord

> > > > SUN on the most effective point of the 7th house. Adding to the

> > > influence,

> > > > is the presence of 3rd lord MERCURY in the 7th house. The Sun

> > > explains the

> > > > status and wealth as well as the authority of the USA as it is

> > > strongly

> > > > placed in the chart. These factors find expression in the 7th

> > house

> > > of

> > > > foreign affairs. Mercury's placement�explains the many

> > initiatives

> > > the US

> > > > takes in the�foreign policy field.

> > > > > There are other influences, but let us now concentrate on the

> > > concerns

> > > > raised above.

> > > > > �

> > > > > In the SAMVA USA chart, 8th lord SATURN aspects the Sun, adding

> > > some

> > > > degree of obstacles and endings to the affairs of the Sun.

> > Whenever,

> > > the

> > > > energy of Saturn becomes prominent in the chart through transit

> > or

> > > period,

> > > > we could expect the problems to increase associated with this

> > natal

> > > > influence. Certainly, as has been brought�out in

> > > > recent�messages,�transit Saturn is now being hammered by both

> > > transit and

> > > > natal functional malefic planets in the chart.

> > > > > �

> > > > > During the upcoming Saturn sub-period from February 17, 2009,

> > the

> > > > energy of Saturn would also be expected to�be more

> > strongly�felt.

> > > The

> > > > economy and other indications of Saturn will come to the

> > forefront

> > > and be

> > > > a source of problems. There may also be major difficulties for

> > the

> > > USA in

> > > > global affairs in mid 2010, during the Saturn sub-period,�when

> > the

> > > > transit afflictions in the chart, involving also transit

> > > Saturn,�will be

> > > > pronounced.

> > > > > �

> > > > > That said, the long term pessimism regarding the

> > > international�power

> > > > and influence of the USA in the world�is likely overstated given

> > > that�a

> > > > very powerful Sun major period begins in 2016.

> > > > > �

> > > > > Best wishes,

> > > > > �

> > > > > Thor

> > > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ---

> > > >

> > > >

[Guest guest]

Dear Ananta,

 

Feel free to discuss your predictions off-line with interested list members if

not based on SA.

 

Regarding your suggestion, let me note that it is difficult for me to explain

your predictions.

 

Best wishes,

 

Thor.

 

SAMVA , " anantavijnyana " <non-dual wrote:

>

> Dear Armands,

>

> I’m sorry but I wouldn’t like to be engaged in further detailed

> considerations as to this matter because my conclusion is not fully based

> on the System Approach (SA). Actually I always try to combine different

> astrological systems to improve the reliability of any predictions. At the

> same time, we can also see many alarming factors within limits of the SA.

> Just look at the Vimshottari dashas and transits. I think, that Thor will

> explore it more professionally then me…

>

> Kind regards,

>

> Ananta

>

>

> SAMVA , " Armands Birins " <abirins@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Ananta,

> >

> > what is your jyotisha forecast consideration for US dollar collapse ?

> >

> > armands

> >

> >

> >

> > On 11/23/08, anantavijnyana <non-dual@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Thor,

> > >

> > > The time is a spiral not a straight line so many aspects of the next

> > > (Jupiter) transiting through Capricorn will be unprecedented. The

> > > country has accumulated a lot of negative karma since the sixties. We

> > > should also bear in mind that now the events seem go faster, more

> > > intense than before. The time/energy spiral, being under contraction,

> > > produce hotter temperatures, more intense events etc.

> > >

> > > You mentioned the Korean War in 1950, but at that time the transits

> > > were not so destructive. The karmic nodal axis was not in the 1H/7H

> > > position…

> > >

> > > When it comes to 2010 I do agree that the danger of war is also very

> > > high. Besides, my calculations show that in 2010 we will probably see

> > > the collapse of US dollar (this process will be initiated in 2009)…

> > >

> > > Kind regards,

> > >

> > > Ananta

> > >

> > > SAMVA <SAMVA%40>, Cosmologer

> > > <cosmologer@> wrote:

> > > >

> > > > Hello Ananta,

> > > > �

> > > > In looking at the history of US military involvement, let me note

> > > that the transit of Jupiter through the sign of Capricorn is

> > > not�prominently featured in�major conflicts, with the exception of

> > > the Korean War of 1950 and the Cuban Missile Crisis in 1962. At both

> > > times, the US had its hands full - or�was put on the defenisve.

> > > > �

> > > > In 1950, US General MacArthur underestimated the threat of the

> > > Chinese entry into the war, which took place, putting the US on the

> > > defensive on the Korean Peninsula and prolongued the war.

> > > > �

> > > > During the Cuban Missile Crisis which developed from May through

> > > October 1962, the Soviets put the US Kennedy administration�on

> > > the�defensive over the Jupiter missiles the previous US Eisenhover

> > > administration had installed in Turkey in 1959 by taking steps to

> > > install missiles in Cuba. The risk of a thermonuclear exchange has

> > > never been greater in the post-war era. Soviet Premier Kruisheve is

> > > said to have underestimated the resolve of President Kennedy in that

> > > war of nerves - even if the latter backed down and quietly ordered

> > > the dismantling of�the missiles in Turkey in 1963.

> > > > �

> > > > In 2009 we may see some action by the Russian government over the

> > > Missile Shield the US Bush administration has installed in states

> > > bordering Russia. The Obama administration, which has now

> > > been�elected into power on a peace platform,�may be ill at ease

> > > demonstrating its resolve to back up the actions of the prior

> > > administration�with force.

> > > > �

> > > > That said, the real danger for war is in the summer of 2010

> > > > �

> > > > With best wishes,

> > > >

> > > > Thor

> > > >

> > > > PS as a rule, so as�to avoid�confusion, this forum is dedicated to

> > > the study of the Systems' Approach.

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > ________________________________

> > > > anantavijnyana <non-dual@>

> > > > SAMVA <SAMVA%40>

> > > > Sunday, November 23, 2008 9:46:08 AM

> > > > Re: Is the economic and political influence of the

> > > USA waning?

> > > >

> > > > Hello Thor,

> > > >

> > > > Thank you for your reply and reading. I do fully agree with you

> > > when

> > > > you write in terms of US vulnerability and weakness. Indeed, these

> > > > indications tell their own tale. But all these factors do not

> > > exclude

> > > > hasty steps towards new military adventures. The Saturn Antardasha

> > > > starts on 04.02.2009. At that spring time Jupiter (the lord of H6)

> > > > will be in Capricorn (7H) near the nodal axis together with transit

> > > > Mars. Many karmic predispositions associated with martial spirit

> > > will

> > > > become active. The country will presumably try to solve their own

> > > > problems freeload. At the same time, an alternative scenario is

> > > also

> > > > possible: the emanating military impulse may reverse its motion

> > > > demolishing the national unity and integrity. In this connection it

> > > is

> > > > also interesting to look at the Narayana Dasha of the SAMVA USA

> > > chart.

> > > > The Mahadasha of Libra (4H) will start on 02.02.2009. This fourth

> > > > house rules the political stability and internal harmony. We may

> > > > anticipate that Ketu in the 4H will try to bring about some violent

> > > > actions (perhaps inter-ethnic etc.).�

> > > >

> > > > Kind regards and best wishes,

> > > >

> > > > Ananta� �

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > >

> > > > SAMVA <SAMVA%40>, Cosmologer

> > > <cosmologer@> wrote:

> > > > >

> > > > > Hello Ananta,

> > > > >

> > > > > What we can surmise from the transit�of Jupiter,�6th lord of

> > > > conflict, through�Capricorn, its sign of debilitation, and the 7th

> > > > house of foreign affairs, is that the USA will be more vulnerable

> > > than

> > > > before if it were�to engage in conflict. Its other indications,

> > > > including financial stability will also be vulnerable while�Jupiter

> > > is

> > > > transit afflicted in Capricorn, such as at the beginning of the

> > > year

> > > > when it becomes conjunct the nodal axis, while Rahu is�stationary

> > > at

> > > > 15� Capricorn. In other words, it would not be helpful to the USA

> > > to

> > > > engage in conflict in 2009. In 2010, when Jupiter�transits through

> > > > Aquarius and�the 8th house, during the sub-period�of the 8th

> > > > lord�Saturn,�the indications of Jupiter would continue under

> > > strain

> > > > and be vulnerable. Even�in the summer of 2010, after�Jupiter

> > > enters

> > > > Pisces and the 9th house there could be serious problems. Transit

> > > > Jupiter will then�be mutually afflicting with sub-period lord

> > > Saturn

> > > > in early

> > > > >� Virgo and 3rd house, while both�transiting malefics are

> > > > transit�afflicting natal Jupiter in early Scorpio of the SAMVA USA

> > > > chart. During the summer of 2010,�transit Ketu will also be

> > > stationary

> > > > in Gemini and 12th house in exact�aspect to natal Ketu�and transit

> > > > stationary�Rahu in Sagittarius and 6th house will exactly�afflict

> > > > natal Rahu in the 10th house. Given so many malefic afflictions in

> > > the

> > > > chart, that would likely be a very difficult time for the US on a

> > > wide

> > > > range of fronts.�We�could�expect improvement after the end of the

> > > > Saturn period - following three consequtive periods of functional

> > > > malefics�in the chart�- Rahu (2003-06), Jupiter (2006-09) and

> > > Saturn

> > > > (2009-12).�

> > > > >

> > > > > Best wishes,

> > > > >

> > > > > Thor

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ________________________________

> > > > > anantavijnyana <non-dual@>

> > > > > SAMVA <SAMVA%40>

> > > > > Saturday, November 22, 2008 12:41:03 PM

> > > > > Re: Is the economic and political influence of

> > > the

> > > > USA waning?

> > > > >

> > > > > Hello, Thor,

> > > > >

> > > > > That looks correct and interesting, but what about the transit of

> > > > Jupiter

> > > > > through Capricorn? Actually, a threat war seems probable…

> > > > >

> > > > > Kind regards,

> > > > >

> > > > > Ananta

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > SAMVA <SAMVA%40>, Cosmologer

> > > <cosmologer@> wrote:

> > > > > >

> > > > > > Dear friends,

> > > > > > �

> > > > > > There are now concerns in the USA that the economic and

> > > political

> > > > > influence of the country in the world is at risk.

> > > > > >

> > > > > > ==============

> > > > > > US clout down, risks up by 2025 -intel outlook

> > > > > > Thu Nov 20, 2008 6:17pm EST� - by Randall Mikkelsen

> > > > > > WASHINGTON, Nov 20 (Reuters) - U.S. economic and political

> > > clout

> > > > will

> > > > > decline over the next two decades and the world will be more

> > > > dangerous,

> > > > > with food and water scarce and advanced weapons plentiful, U.S.

> > > spy

> > > > > agencies projected on Thursday.The National Intelligence Council

> > > > analysis

> > > > > " Global Trends 2025 " also said the current financial crisis on

> > > Wall

> > > > Street

> > > > > is just the first phase of a global economic reordering. The U.S.

> > > > dollar's

> > > > > role as the world's major currency would weaken to become a

> > > " first

> > > > among

> > > > > equals, " the report said. The outlook is intended to inform U.S.

> > > > > President-elect Barack Obama of factors that will influence

> > > global

> > > > events.

> > > > > It is based on a year-long global survey of experts and trends by

> > > > U.S.

> > > > > intelligence analysts.� " The next 20 years of transition to a new

> > > > system

> > > > > are fraught with risks, " said the report, which was more

> > > pessimistic

> > > > about

> > > > > U.S. influence and the potential for conflict than the last

> > > outlook

> > > > for

> > > > > 2020.

> > > > > > http://www.reuters.com/article/usDollarRpt/idUSN2041155720081120

> > > > > > ==============

> > > > > > �

> > > > > > As we know from the SAMVA USA chart (Perpetual Union), the

> > > > international

> > > > > influence of the USA is associated with the placement of a strong

> > > > 2nd lord

> > > > > SUN on the most effective point of the 7th house. Adding to the

> > > > influence,

> > > > > is the presence of 3rd lord MERCURY in the 7th house. The Sun

> > > > explains the

> > > > > status and wealth as well as the authority of the USA as it is

> > > > strongly

> > > > > placed in the chart. These factors find expression in the 7th

> > > house

> > > > of

> > > > > foreign affairs. Mercury's placement�explains the many

> > > initiatives

> > > > the US

> > > > > takes in the�foreign policy field.

> > > > > > There are other influences, but let us now concentrate on the

> > > > concerns

> > > > > raised above.

> > > > > > �

> > > > > > In the SAMVA USA chart, 8th lord SATURN aspects the Sun, adding

> > > > some

> > > > > degree of obstacles and endings to the affairs of the Sun.

> > > Whenever,

> > > > the

> > > > > energy of Saturn becomes prominent in the chart through transit

> > > or

> > > > period,

> > > > > we could expect the problems to increase associated with this

> > > natal

> > > > > influence. Certainly, as has been brought�out in

> > > > > recent�messages,�transit Saturn is now being hammered by both

> > > > transit and

> > > > > natal functional malefic planets in the chart.

> > > > > > �

> > > > > > During the upcoming Saturn sub-period from February 17, 2009,

> > > the

> > > > > energy of Saturn would also be expected to�be more

> > > strongly�felt.

> > > > The

> > > > > economy and other indications of Saturn will come to the

> > > forefront

> > > > and be

> > > > > a source of problems. There may also be major difficulties for

> > > the

> > > > USA in

> > > > > global affairs in mid 2010, during the Saturn sub-period,�when

> > > the

> > > > > transit afflictions in the chart, involving also transit

> > > > Saturn,�will be

> > > > > pronounced.

> > > > > > �

> > > > > > That said, the long term pessimism regarding the

> > > > international�power

> > > > > and influence of the USA in the world�is likely overstated given

> > > > that�a

> > > > > very powerful Sun major period begins in 2016.

> > > > > > �

> > > > > > Best wishes,

> > > > > > �

> > > > > > Thor

> > > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > >

> > > > > ---

> > > > >

> > > > >