Guest guest Posted December 5, 2008 Report Share Posted December 5, 2008 thank you, dear thor. David Hawthorne SAMVA [sAMVA ] On Behalf Of Cosmologer Friday, December 05, 2008 1:10 AM samva Sharp decline in the oil price Dear friends, The stock market volatility has continued as predicted based on the SAMVA USA chart. Of special interest in the recent developments is the sudden collapse of the oil price. It is now forceast to drop to $25 per barrel - after exceeding $150 only a few months ago. Its lowest level in recent years was in 1998, when the oil prices temporarily plunged to $10 per barrel. U.S. Stocks Drop, Led by GM; Exxon Falls on $25 Oil Forecast Dec. 4 (Bloomberg) -- U.S. stocks fell for the first time in three days, pushed down by concern General Motors Corp. may file for bankruptcy and a plunge in energy shares following Merrill Lynch & Co.¢s prediction that oil will hit $25 a barrel. http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087 & sid=a1yPHYy6sHHg & refer=home The present development in the price of oil is taking place when transit Saturn has moved into old age in Leo while being under the close aspect of transit Jupiter in old age in Sagittarius. This aspect has taken place earlier in the year when both planets were in full strength. In recent days, transit Sun, the dispositor of Saturn, has in Scorpio come under the afflicting aspect of transit Ketu in Cancer. Likely, this has fed into the sharp decline. In the SAMVA USA chart, these planets are both functional malefics. Moreover, in the chart, natal Saturn afflicts transit Saturn. The oil price is quoted in US dollars and the USA is a large user of oil. We also know that the international financial crisis, which began in the USA, has spread and reduced the dynamism of economic growth in other parts of the world, including the deman for oil. Hence, it may have merit in explaining the development, or at least be consistent with it. It will be interesting to see what happens to the oil price after - transit Jupiter moves into Capricorn next week and its aspect to transit Saturn separates around December 21, 2008 - transit Saturn goes retrograde in Leo and regains strength while moving out of the aspect of natal Saturn in March 2009. Best wishes, Thor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 5, 2008 Report Share Posted December 5, 2008 Dear David, You are most welcome. Best wishes, Thor David Hawthorne <davidSAMVA Sent: Friday, December 5, 2008 3:48:10 PMRE: Sharp decline in the oil price thank you, dear thor. David Hawthorne SAMVA [sAMVA ] On Behalf Of CosmologerFriday, December 05, 2008 1:10 AMsamva Subject: Sharp decline in the oil price Dear friends, The stock market volatility has continued as predicted based on the SAMVA USA chart. Of special interest in the recent developments is the sudden collapse of the oil price. It is now forceast to drop to $25 per barrel - after exceeding $150 only a few months ago. Its lowest level in recent years was in 1998, when the oil prices temporarily plunged to $10 per barrel. U.S. Stocks Drop, Led by GM; Exxon Falls on $25 Oil Forecast Dec. 4 (Bloomberg) -- U.S. stocks fell for the first time in three days, pushed down by concern General Motors Corp. may file for bankruptcy and a plunge in energy shares following Merrill Lynch & Co.¢s prediction that oil will hit $25 a barrel. http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087 & sid=a1yPHYy6sHHg & refer=home The present development in the price of oil is taking place when transit Saturn has moved into old age in Leo while being under the close aspect of transit Jupiter in old age in Sagittarius. This aspect has taken place earlier in the year when both planets were in full strength. In recent days, transit Sun, the dispositor of Saturn, has in Scorpio come under the afflicting aspect of transit Ketu in Cancer. Likely, this has fed into the sharp decline. In the SAMVA USA chart, these planets are both functional malefics. Moreover, in the chart, natal Saturn afflicts transit Saturn. The oil price is quoted in US dollars and the USA is a large user of oil. We also know that the international financial crisis, which began in the USA, has spread and reduced the dynamism of economic growth in other parts of the world, including the deman for oil. Hence, it may have merit in explaining the development, or at least be consistent with it. It will be interesting to see what happens to the oil price after - transit Jupiter moves into Capricorn next week and its aspect to transit Saturn separates around December 21, 2008 - transit Saturn goes retrograde in Leo and regains strength while moving out of the aspect of natal Saturn in March 2009. Best wishes, Thor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 6, 2008 Report Share Posted December 6, 2008 Dear Thor, You are exactly right, It seems around 12 Dec Tr sun shall be conjunt natal saturn and moving forward Tr sun shall be in old age under affliction from natal saturn, I hope during this time the Crude oil could bottom out and You have rightly pointed that after 21 dec when aspect of Jup to tr sat moves out of orbit, It seems after 21 dec we could see a little uptrend in crude oil prices. Thus crude oil prices in coming days shall be entirely dependent on the transist strength of sun.You are right on pointing that the real strength in crude oil prices shall be only after march 2009 as per US chart.Moreover OPEC is also meeting on 17 Dec 2008 to decide on cutting output of crude oil as falling crude oil prices could hit economy of oil producing countries which are entirely dependent on revenues from crude oil for sustaining their economies.Best Regards Ajay.--- On Thu, 12/4/08, Cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Cosmologer <cosmologer Sharp decline in the oil pricesamva Date: Thursday, December 4, 2008, 11:09 PM Dear friends, The stock market volatility has continued as predicted based on the SAMVA USA chart. Of special interest in the recent developments is the sudden collapse of the oil price. It is now forceast to drop to $25 per barrel - after exceeding $150 only a few months ago. Its lowest level in recent years was in 1998, when the oil prices temporarily plunged to $10 per barrel. U.S. Stocks Drop, Led by GM; Exxon Falls on $25 Oil Forecast Dec. 4 (Bloomberg) -- U.S. stocks fell for the first time in three days, pushed down by concern General Motors Corp. may file for bankruptcy and a plunge in energy shares following Merrill Lynch & Co.¢s prediction that oil will hit $25 a barrel. http://www.bloomber g.com/apps/ news?pid= 20601087 & sid=a1yPHYy6sHHg & refer=home The present development in the price of oil is taking place when transit Saturn has moved into old age in Leo while being under the close aspect of transit Jupiter in old age in Sagittarius. This aspect has taken place earlier in the year when both planets were in full strength. In recent days, transit Sun, the dispositor of Saturn, has in Scorpio come under the afflicting aspect of transit Ketu in Cancer. Likely, this has fed into the sharp decline. In the SAMVA USA chart, these planets are both functional malefics. Moreover, in the chart, natal Saturn afflicts transit Saturn. The oil price is quoted in US dollars and the USA is a large user of oil. We also know that the international financial crisis, which began in the USA, has spread and reduced the dynamism of economic growth in other parts of the world, including the deman for oil. Hence, it may have merit in explaining the development, or at least be consistent with it. It will be interesting to see what happens to the oil price after - transit Jupiter moves into Capricorn next week and its aspect to transit Saturn separates around December 21, 2008 - transit Saturn goes retrograde in Leo and regains strength while moving out of the aspect of natal Saturn in March 2009. Best wishes, Thor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 6, 2008 Report Share Posted December 6, 2008 Dear Ajay, It is difficult to predict the spot price movement with any degree of precision. As we have seen, large movements in the oil price are dependent on imbalances between supply and demand for oil globally. It was the surging economic activity, rising living standards in China, India and elsewhere that generated the income to create excess demand globally, with the result that the oil price surged. In the early 2000s, the oil producing countries were not able or willing to react by increasing output significantly. So demand grew but not supply, this resulted in the oil price being bid up. Now, with the global economy contracting, this is seen in a reduced demand for oil. At the same time, oil producers appear to be considering cutbacks in the supply of oil to prevent a collapse in the oil price. In other words, the oil price is dependent on global demand for oil and this is determined by the purchasing power of people to buy cars and petrol. Saturn rules working people and their jobs. It also rules all things mined from the ground, including oil. We also know that Saturn's indications may be supported more when in the royal sign of Leo. This may explain the extraordinary price in recent years. To this we could add that the supply of oil may be linked to Mars, which rules industrial production. Ketu may also be involved as it possibly rules combustible substances like petrol. So, the condition of these planets may be important to understand the overall development, both on the demand and supply side and the imbalances that occur resulting in major shifts in the price. To guide the research of those interested to study this further we can begin by noting that from April 1998 when Saturn was debilitated in Aries and afflicted by Rahu in Leo, the oil price collapsed to its lowest level. This was because the oil price had been relatively low in prior years, and then the Asian crisis broke out in 1997 followed by the crisis in Russia in 1998 which also created financial tremors in the West. This may have affected the demand or also supply decisions. When the aspect lifted in 1999, the oil price recovered noticeably. We also know that when Saturn was in Leo from August 2007 and unafflicted its price soared, peaking at new highs in the summer of 2008. Annual charts of the oil price (Jan-Sept. only) may be seen here: http://futures.tradingcharts.com/hist_BC.html Best wishes, Thor ajay sehg <ajaysehgSAMVA Sent: Saturday, December 6, 2008 5:21:12 AMRe: Sharp decline in the oil price Dear Thor, You are exactly right, It seems around 12 Dec Tr sun shall be conjunt natal saturn and moving forward Tr sun shall be in old age under affliction from natal saturn, I hope during this time the Crude oil could bottom out and You have rightly pointed that after 21 dec when aspect of Jup to tr sat moves out of orbit, It seems after 21 dec we could see a little uptrend in crude oil prices. Thus crude oil prices in coming days shall be entirely dependent on the transist strength of sun.You are right on pointing that the real strength in crude oil prices shall be only after march 2009 as per US chart.Moreover OPEC is also meeting on 17 Dec 2008 to decide on cutting output of crude oil as falling crude oil prices could hit economy of oil producing countries which are entirely dependent on revenues from crude oil for sustaining their economies.Best Regards Ajay.--- On Thu, 12/4/08, Cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Cosmologer <cosmologer Sharp decline in the oil pricesamva Date: Thursday, December 4, 2008, 11:09 PM Dear friends, The stock market volatility has continued as predicted based on the SAMVA USA chart. Of special interest in the recent developments is the sudden collapse of the oil price. It is now forceast to drop to $25 per barrel - after exceeding $150 only a few months ago. Its lowest level in recent years was in 1998, when the oil prices temporarily plunged to $10 per barrel. U.S. Stocks Drop, Led by GM; Exxon Falls on $25 Oil Forecast Dec. 4 (Bloomberg) -- U.S. stocks fell for the first time in three days, pushed down by concern General Motors Corp. may file for bankruptcy and a plunge in energy shares following Merrill Lynch & Co.¢s prediction that oil will hit $25 a barrel. http://www.bloomber g.com/apps/ news?pid= 20601087 & sid=a1yPHYy6sHHg & refer=home The present development in the price of oil is taking place when transit Saturn has moved into old age in Leo while being under the close aspect of transit Jupiter in old age in Sagittarius. This aspect has taken place earlier in the year when both planets were in full strength. In recent days, transit Sun, the dispositor of Saturn, has in Scorpio come under the afflicting aspect of transit Ketu in Cancer. Likely, this has fed into the sharp decline. In the SAMVA USA chart, these planets are both functional malefics. Moreover, in the chart, natal Saturn afflicts transit Saturn. The oil price is quoted in US dollars and the USA is a large user of oil. We also know that the international financial crisis, which began in the USA, has spread and reduced the dynamism of economic growth in other parts of the world, including the deman for oil. Hence, it may have merit in explaining the development, or at least be consistent with it. It will be interesting to see what happens to the oil price after - transit Jupiter moves into Capricorn next week and its aspect to transit Saturn separates around December 21, 2008 - transit Saturn goes retrograde in Leo and regains strength while moving out of the aspect of natal Saturn in March 2009. Best wishes, Thor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 6, 2008 Report Share Posted December 6, 2008 Dear Ajay and list members, One further insight. I checked the oil price in the 1970s and 1980s, including when Saturn was previously in Leo - from September1977 to December 1979. At that time, the oil price also rose considerably. While the oil price continued rising into 1980 and stayed at a high level into 1981, it began to decline afterwards. To this we could add that US consumer price inflation (CPI) was rising fast in those years. This means that the real increase in the oil price there was perhaps less in 1980 than in 1977-1977. This would imply that the price of oil began to come down, in both nominal and real terms after Saturn moved into Virgo. Monthly data: http://www.economagic.com/em-cgi/data.exe/var/west-texas-crude-long Annual data: http://www.inflationdata.com/inflation/Inflation_Rate/Historical_Oil_Prices_Table.asp In other words, we have empirical support for the hypothesis that the condition of Saturn in transit is important in explaining the (real) price of oil. Best wishes, Thor Cosmologer <cosmologerSAMVA Sent: Saturday, December 6, 2008 8:53:22 AMRe: Sharp decline in the oil price Dear Ajay, It is difficult to predict the spot price movement with any degree of precision. As we have seen, large movements in the oil price are dependent on imbalances between supply and demand for oil globally. It was the surging economic activity, rising living standards in China, India and elsewhere that generated the income to create excess demand globally, with the result that the oil price surged. In the early 2000s, the oil producing countries were not able or willing to react by increasing output significantly. So demand grew but not supply, this resulted in the oil price being bid up. Now, with the global economy contracting, this is seen in a reduced demand for oil. At the same time, oil producers appear to be considering cutbacks in the supply of oil to prevent a collapse in the oil price. In other words, the oil price is dependent on global demand for oil and this is determined by the purchasing power of people to buy cars and petrol. Saturn rules working people and their jobs. It also rules all things mined from the ground, including oil. We also know that Saturn's indications may be supported more when in the royal sign of Leo. This may explain the extraordinary price in recent years. To this we could add that the supply of oil may be linked to Mars, which rules industrial production. Ketu may also be involved as it possibly rules combustible substances like petrol. So, the condition of these planets may be important to understand the overall development, both on the demand and supply side and the imbalances that occur resulting in major shifts in the price. To guide the research of those interested to study this further we can begin by noting that from April 1998 when Saturn was debilitated in Aries and afflicted by Rahu in Leo, the oil price collapsed to its lowest level. This was because the oil price had been relatively low in prior years, and then the Asian crisis broke out in 1997 followed by the crisis in Russia in 1998 which also created financial tremors in the West. This may have affected the demand or also supply decisions. When the aspect lifted in 1999, the oil price recovered noticeably. We also know that when Saturn was in Leo from August 2007 and unafflicted its price soared, peaking at new highs in the summer of 2008. Annual charts of the oil price (Jan-Sept. only) may be seen here: http://futures.tradingcharts.com/hist_BC.html Best wishes, Thor ajay sehg <ajaysehgSAMVA Sent: Saturday, December 6, 2008 5:21:12 AMRe: Sharp decline in the oil price Dear Thor, You are exactly right, It seems around 12 Dec Tr sun shall be conjunt natal saturn and moving forward Tr sun shall be in old age under affliction from natal saturn, I hope during this time the Crude oil could bottom out and You have rightly pointed that after 21 dec when aspect of Jup to tr sat moves out of orbit, It seems after 21 dec we could see a little uptrend in crude oil prices. Thus crude oil prices in coming days shall be entirely dependent on the transist strength of sun.You are right on pointing that the real strength in crude oil prices shall be only after march 2009 as per US chart.Moreover OPEC is also meeting on 17 Dec 2008 to decide on cutting output of crude oil as falling crude oil prices could hit economy of oil producing countries which are entirely dependent on revenues from crude oil for sustaining their economies.Best Regards Ajay.--- On Thu, 12/4/08, Cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: Cosmologer <cosmologer Sharp decline in the oil pricesamva Date: Thursday, December 4, 2008, 11:09 PM Dear friends, The stock market volatility has continued as predicted based on the SAMVA USA chart. Of special interest in the recent developments is the sudden collapse of the oil price. It is now forceast to drop to $25 per barrel - after exceeding $150 only a few months ago. Its lowest level in recent years was in 1998, when the oil prices temporarily plunged to $10 per barrel. U.S. Stocks Drop, Led by GM; Exxon Falls on $25 Oil Forecast Dec. 4 (Bloomberg) -- U.S. stocks fell for the first time in three days, pushed down by concern General Motors Corp. may file for bankruptcy and a plunge in energy shares following Merrill Lynch & Co.¢s prediction that oil will hit $25 a barrel. http://www.bloomber g.com/apps/ news?pid= 20601087 & sid=a1yPHYy6sHHg & refer=home The present development in the price of oil is taking place when transit Saturn has moved into old age in Leo while being under the close aspect of transit Jupiter in old age in Sagittarius. This aspect has taken place earlier in the year when both planets were in full strength. In recent days, transit Sun, the dispositor of Saturn, has in Scorpio come under the afflicting aspect of transit Ketu in Cancer. Likely, this has fed into the sharp decline. In the SAMVA USA chart, these planets are both functional malefics. Moreover, in the chart, natal Saturn afflicts transit Saturn. The oil price is quoted in US dollars and the USA is a large user of oil. We also know that the international financial crisis, which began in the USA, has spread and reduced the dynamism of economic growth in other parts of the world, including the deman for oil. Hence, it may have merit in explaining the development, or at least be consistent with it. It will be interesting to see what happens to the oil price after - transit Jupiter moves into Capricorn next week and its aspect to transit Saturn separates around December 21, 2008 - transit Saturn goes retrograde in Leo and regains strength while moving out of the aspect of natal Saturn in March 2009. Best wishes, Thor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 6, 2008 Report Share Posted December 6, 2008 Dear Thor, You are absolutely right saying that it is difficult to predict the spot price movements with any degree of precision. Spot prices depend on many aspects and miltifactorial combinations. The only thing I’d like to add is about Ketu and Rahu. The influence of these nodes is very much important. Some Indian astrologers, for instance, are able accurately predict oil futures fluctuations on the basis of Rahu/Ketu only. Ketu clarifies the situation with the accumulated planetary energy and its influences on all aspects of our life. Ketu is a fire energy in fuel tanks and oil-processing plants. Rahu is the planetary system of distribution (tankers, pipelines etc.). If we simply look at the triad Saturn-Rahu-Ketu we can at the first onset understand general oil trends… Kind regards, Ananta SAMVA , Cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: > > Dear Ajay, > > It is difficult to predict the spot price movement with any degree of precision. As we have seen, large movements in the oil price are dependent on imbalances between supply and demand for oil�globally. It was the surging economic activity, rising living standards�in China, India and elsewhere that generated the income to create�excess demand globally, with the result that the oil price surged. In the early 2000s, the oil producing countries were not able or willing to react by increasing output significantly. So demand grew but not supply, this resulted in the oil price being bid up.�Now, with the global economy contracting, this is seen in a reduced�demand for oil. At the same time, oil producers appear to be�considering cutbacks in the supply of oil to prevent a collapse in the oil price. In other words, the oil price is dependent on global demand for oil and this is�determined by�the purchasing power of people to buy cars and petrol. Saturn > rules working people and their jobs. It also rules all�things mined from the ground, including oil.�We also know that Saturn's indications may be�supported more when in the royal sign of Leo.�This may explain the extraordinary price in recent years.�To this we could add that the supply of oil may be linked to Mars, which rules industrial production.�Ketu may�also�be involved as it�possibly�rules combustible�substances like petrol. So, the condition of these planets may be important to understand the overall development, both on the demand and supply side and the imbalances that occur resulting in major shifts in the price. > > To guide the research of those interested to study this further we can begin by noting that�from April�1998�when Saturn was debilitated in Aries and afflicted by Rahu in Leo, the oil price collapsed to its lowest level. This was because the oil price had been relatively low in prior years, and then the Asian crisis broke out in�1997 followed by the crisis in Russia in�1998 which also created financial tremors in the West. This may have affected the demand or also supply decisions. When the aspect lifted in 1999, the oil price recovered noticeably.�We also know that when Saturn was in Leo from August 2007�and unafflicted its price soared, peaking at new highs in the summer of 2008. > > Annual charts of the oil price�(Jan-Sept. only) may be seen here: > http://futures.tradingcharts.com/hist_BC.html > > Best wishes, > > Thor > > > > > ________________________________ > ajay sehg <ajaysehg > SAMVA > Saturday, December 6, 2008 5:21:12 AM > Re: Sharp decline in the oil price > > > > > Dear Thor, > > You are exactly right, It seems around 12 Dec Tr sun shall be conjunt natal saturn and moving forward Tr sun shall be in old age under affliction from natal saturn, I hope during this time the Crude oil could bottom out and You have rightly pointed that after 21 dec when aspect of Jup to tr sat moves out of orbit, It seems after 21 dec we could see a little uptrend in crude oil prices. > > Thus crude oil prices in coming days shall be entirely dependent on the transist strength of sun. > > You�are right on pointing that the real strength in crude oil prices shall be only after march 2009 as per US chart. > > Moreover OPEC is also meeting on 17 Dec 2008 to decide on cutting output of crude oil as falling crude oil prices could hit economy of oil producing countries which are entirely dependent on revenues�from crude oil for sustaining their economies. > > Best Regards > ���� Ajay. > > > --- On Thu, 12/4/08, Cosmologer <cosmologer wrote: > > Cosmologer <cosmologer > Sharp decline in the oil price > samva > Thursday, December 4, 2008, 11:09 PM > > > Dear friends, > � > The stock market volatility has continued as predicted based on the SAMVA USA chart. Of special interest in the recent developments is the sudden collapse of the oil price. It is now forceast to drop to $25 per barrel�- after exceeding $150 only a few months ago. Its lowest level in recent years was in 1998, when the�oil prices temporarily�plunged to $10 per barrel. > � > U.S. Stocks Drop, Led by GM; Exxon Falls on $25 Oil Forecast > Dec. 4 (Bloomberg) -- U.S. stocks fell for the first time in three days, pushed down by concern General Motors Corp. may file for bankruptcy and a plunge in energy shares following Merrill Lynch & Co.�s prediction that oil will hit $25 a barrel. > http://www.bloomber g.com/apps/ news?pid= 20601087 & sid=a1yPHYy6sHHg & refer=home > > The present development in the price of oil is taking place when transit Saturn has moved into old age in Leo while being under the close aspect of transit Jupiter in old age in Sagittarius. This aspect has taken place earlier in the year when both planets were in full strength. In recent days, transit Sun, the dispositor of Saturn, has in Scorpio�come under the afflicting aspect of transit Ketu in Cancer. Likely, this has fed into the sharp decline. > � > In the SAMVA USA chart, these planets are both functional malefics. Moreover, in the chart, natal Saturn afflicts transit Saturn. The oil price is quoted in US dollars and the USA is�a large user of oil. We also know that the international financial crisis, which�began in the USA,�has spread and reduced�the dynamism of economic growth in other parts of the world, including the deman for oil. Hence, it may have merit in explaining the development, or at least be consistent with it. > > It will be interesting to see what happens to the oil price after > -�transit Jupiter moves into Capricorn�next week�and�its aspect to transit Saturn separates around December 21, 2008 > - transit�Saturn�goes retrograde in Leo�and regains strength while�moving out of the aspect of natal Saturn in March 2009. > > Best wishes, > > Thor� > > > � > > � > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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