Guest guest Posted March 31, 2004 Report Share Posted March 31, 2004 ||Om Brihaspataye Namah|| Dear Sanjay, Pranaams. I read your paper on Atmakaraka. It is good but I object to your blanket chararacterization of Mars as atmakaraka. Here is what you wrote in the paper: "MARS as the AK indicates that the native should refrain from all forms of violence and stick to the path of ahimsa. Mars is the strength of the Kälapurusha and gives the ability for wielding weapons and person desires to win battles and proves its strength. Such people are great fighters and will gradually realize the futility of war mongering. They like martial arts and would prefer learning karate, kung fu and other forms of self defense. In a more spiritual individual this can mean learning hatha yoga and other physical exercises to remain strong and ever youthful. So long as these are practiced as a spiritual discipline like the monks of the Shaolin temple, it is very good; else the karma can lead one to regret many mistakes caused by acts of violence. The ultimate lesson in spirituality is that the ätma is indestructible and hence does not need any form of physical protection. Violence is a manifestation of ones hatred towards other creatures and beings. Thus, the truth lies in ahimsa or non-violence. Such natives should practice Zen and other forms of meditation and some physical exercises like Tai Chi to canalize their excess energies." Among all the planets as AK, you have devoted the most words to Mars as AK! I dont know why; is it because of Mars in 7th? The reason I am objecting is because of my personal experience. I too have Mars as AK and my experiences so far do not fit even one word in your description. Not to say that you are wrong as probably it is your experience that makes you describe thus. No doubt I have a temper, same as my father but this temper was confined mostly to my family and very rarely manifested itself in physical violence. I also never learnt anything about karate or other martial arts or through out my life, nor engaged in violent fights. Nor do I feel an excess of energies or the need to channelize them properly. In fact, I am more on the lazy side and inclined to curl up with a nice book for company. Mars as Atmakaraka also means that I should be somewhat of an extrovert but instead, through most of my childhood, I was a loner so as to speak, although with the usual quota of friends. So I am confused and I ask whether it is okay to make such a blanket characterization of the AK without seeing other modifying influences? Another reason I object is because Mars is exalted in my rasi chart (debilitated in navamsa though) and therefore what you describe should be more than applicable but it is not! regards Hari Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 2, 2004 Report Share Posted April 2, 2004 sadgurudevaaye namah dear hari may i also say a few words. for past days, this topic has become my favourite. first we need to think "why" ( as sanjay ji also says) behind this theory. are there only 8 types of atmakaraka? what does atmakarka mean tangibly? & why ista is considerd from 12 from ak? i've a lot to say, but first could u attach ur chart? regards prashantHari M <onlyhari wrote: ||Om Brihaspataye Namah|| Dear Sanjay, Pranaams. I read your paper on Atmakaraka. It is good but I object to your blanket chararacterization of Mars as atmakaraka. Here is what you wrote in the paper: "MARS as the AK indicates that the native should refrain from all forms of violence and stick to the path of ahimsa. Mars is the strength of the Kälapurusha and gives the ability for wielding weapons and person desires to win battles and proves its strength. Such people are great fighters and will gradually realize the futility of war mongering. They like martial arts and would prefer learning karate, kung fu and other forms of self defense. In a more spiritual individual this can mean learning hatha yoga and other physical exercises to remain strong and ever youthful. So long as these are practiced as a spiritual discipline like the monks of the Shaolin temple, it is very good; else the karma can lead one to regret many mistakes caused by acts of violence. The ultimate lesson in spirituality is that the ätma is indestructible and hence does not need any form of physical protection. Violence is a manifestation of ones hatred towards other creatures and beings. Thus, the truth lies in ahimsa or non-violence. Such natives should practice Zen and other forms of meditation and some physical exercises like Tai Chi to canalize their excess energies." Among all the planets as AK, you have devoted the most words to Mars as AK! I dont know why; is it because of Mars in 7th? The reason I am objecting is because of my personal experience. I too have Mars as AK and my experiences so far do not fit even one word in your description. Not to say that you are wrong as probably it is your experience that makes you describe thus. No doubt I have a temper, same as my father but this temper was confined mostly to my family and very rarely manifested itself in physical violence. I also never learnt anything about karate or other martial arts or through out my life, nor engaged in violent fights. Nor do I feel an excess of energies or the need to channelize them properly. In fact, I am more on the lazy side and inclined to curl up with a nice book for company. Mars as Atmakaraka also means that I should be somewhat of an extrovert but instead, through most of my childhood, I was a loner so as to speak, although with the usual quota of friends. So I am confused and I ask whether it is okay to make such a blanket characterization of the AK without seeing other modifying influences? Another reason I object is because Mars is exalted in my rasi chart (debilitated in navamsa though) and therefore what you describe should be more than applicable but it is not! regards Hari Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time. |Om Tat Sat|http://www.varahamihira Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 2, 2004 Report Share Posted April 2, 2004 ||Om Brihaspataye Namah|| Dear Prashant, My comments below: sadgurudevaaye namah dear hari may i also say a few words. for past days, this topic has become my favourite. first we need to think "why" ( as sanjay ji also says) behind this theory. are there only 8 types of atmakaraka? what does atmakarka mean tangibly? & [Hari] 8 different types of atmakaraka? Probably you mean the 8 different grahas (excluding Ketu who is the mokshakaraka) which can take on the role of atmakaraka? Why the number 8? why not 6 or 9? The Bhagavad Geeta says "Behold the (dwadasa)adityas, the (asta)vasus, the ekadasa (rudras), the (two) Aswins and also the Maruts. Behold many wonders never seen before, O Bharata" Now here Bhagwan Krishna hints at the most important of the devas created by him for this universe. It is evident that the primary variables for creation/destruction of any thing in this Universe are as enumerated above. Of these, the astavasus are the 8 variables necessary for creation of anything living/nonliving. Add to this Ra/Ke as the nodes of the Moon and we get 10 variables totally. Now lagna and Ketu are excluded and thus we have 8 charakarakas for living things. hmmm....probably you know this already so maybe i havent got ur point. why ista is considerd from 12 from ak? [Hari] the soul is trying to find a way to reach God somehow and and 12th to karakamsa represents what the soul can give in order to attain the path to moksha but to whom? to the planet if there is any in the 12th house. And that is why Parasara lists out the deities for each of the planets at the very beginning itself so that the ista can be identified. i've a lot to say, but first could u attach ur chart? [Hari] Sure. 28/09/1971, 11.01 AM, Madras (Theyegaraja Nagar), India. JHD attached also. regards Hari Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 3, 2004 Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 sadgurudevaaye namah dear hari ji, Hari M <onlyhari wrote: ||Om Brihaspataye Namah|| Dear Prashant, My comments below: sadgurudevaaye namah dear hari may i also say a few words. for past days, this topic has become my favourite. first we need to think "why" ( as sanjay ji also says) behind this theory. are there only 8 types of atmakaraka? what does atmakarka mean tangibly? & [Hari] 8 different types of atmakaraka? Probably you mean the 8 different grahas (excluding Ketu who is the mokshakaraka) which can take on the role of atmakaraka? Why the number 8? why not 6 or 9? The Bhagavad Geeta says "Behold the (dwadasa)adityas, the (asta)vasus, the ekadasa (rudras), the (two) Aswins and also the Maruts. Behold many wonders never seen before, O Bharata" Now here Bhagwan Krishna hints at the most important of the devas created by him for this universe. It is evident that the primary variables for creation/destruction of any thing in this Universe are as enumerated above. Of these, the astavasus are the 8 variables necessary for creation of anything living/nonliving. Add to this Ra/Ke as the nodes of the Moon and we get 10 variables totally. Now lagna and Ketu are excluded and thus we have 8 charakarakas for living things. hmmm....probably you know this already so maybe i havent got ur point. my point is when a particular planet becomes atmakarka , it signifies something. now , should we confine ourselves to 8 kind of significations only just because there are only 8possibilities? are there only 8 goals in the world ? someone may lack somewhere else also or not? what does this ak mean? atmakarka signifies not just our soul , but also rinanubandhan related to it. (soul is supposed to be pure , a amsa of parmatma. so ofcourse the planet represent the sukshms/karana sarira) for eg. moon as ak shows the soul is full of feminine energies, & should tread on the path of self -realisation through love.but suppose if moon is in virgo in navamsa, it will mean the person has to focus on purity. similarly, moon -ak native is least expecetd to achieve through meditataion, but what if moon is in scorpio in navamsa. will it not do meditaion ( & it may signify left path too!) this moon in scorpio may take him to osho ashram( sambhog se samdhi tak-from sex to samadhi) or may be khajuraho. see the difference!! if ur mars is in cancer in navamsa. where is the anger? there is no fire, all steam.. it makes u touchy! it makes you too very sensitive...sometimes u dont respond , but react ... u know better abt ur emotional side. the inetersting thing is it is in 7th house. bhavas are more important than rasis in navamsa. jaimini says when ak is in 7th , the native is very straightforward! now, what will happen when hot steam is blown out straight on someone' face? you just cant ignore cancer sign & 7th bhava. one must see other significations also in a hollistic way. every horoscope is unique & one cant generalise the rinaubandha & path it has to follow. why ista is considerd from 12 from ak? [Hari] the soul is trying to find a way to reach God somehow and and 12th to karakamsa represents what the soul can give in order to attain the path to moksha but to whom? to the planet if there is any in the 12th house. And that is why Parasara lists out the deities for each of the planets at the very beginning itself so that the ista can be identified. 12 house also represents loss, thats the most basic signification of 12th house. until & unless this planet 12 th lord(or if there is aplanet there) from ak comes to atmakaraka to cut its cords of rinanubandha, how will the karmic balance be settled? without that how can the person get moksha? as sri gurugranth sahib says .. hari (The Lord) cuts down and weeds out the corruption of the cycle of birth and death. ||1|| janam maran bikaar ankur har kaat chhaaday kho-ay. ||1|| that's why we worship the lord signified by 12th lord from karakmsa. even if there is a planet in 12 th, that will help in incurring loss of our karmic debts. as far as the deities told by parasara are concerned, there is only a handful of people in this world who know abt those deities. this does not mean that others will never get moksha. this is cynical. that's the reason i refrain from "prescibing" deities to be worshipped for atmakaraka. more important is the path.....the path or the deity comes itself...sometime the soul knows better , sometimes the deity! good to have more planets in 12. more the planets, faster the decay of our karmas!! regards prashant [Hari] Sure. 28/09/1971, 11.01 AM, Madras (Theyegaraja Nagar), India. JHD attached also. regards Hari Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today |Om Tat Sat|http://www.varahamihira > ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=hari.jhd Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 3, 2004 Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 ||Om Brihaspataye Namah|| Dear Prashant, This is what I was afraid of. After all, if the blanket description of a certain planet as the atmakaraka is not true in an individuals case, then we try to see the house & sign placement of the atmakaraka in the navamsa in order to find an explanation for why the description doesnt fit! No doubt, what you say is all true but that is like trying to explain what does not fit the goose will fit the duck! Rasi chart is the overwhelming indication and if Mars as my AK is exalted in the rasi chart, dont you expect that the blanket description will fit in my case? Or have I missed out on some funda that says navamsa is the more important chart for deciphering the role of atmakaraka? If that is true, why not Shastiamsa which is supposed to show the precise reasons for the atma to take rebirth? The atmakaraka has been given the role of karaka for the 1st and 8th house, per Sanjays teachings and therefore indicates that during the Vimsottari Dasa period, it will cause the nija dosa (resultant sins of previous births) will be exhausted during this time. Yesterday I came across a beautiful quote thanks to my friend. Swami Haridass said "Be happy during your periods of suffering as it is the bad karma which is exhausted and be sad during your periods of happiness as it is the good karma which is being exhausted!" Yes, what you say is true. I have a clean heart and am quite frank. Some people have told me that I tend to be a bit blunt at times but luckily, this outspokenness has not landed me in fights or cheesing off other people. Maybe I am lucky in the respect of when to be frank or when to be silent! My experience of blowing hot steam in the face of others is usually that the face is a mirror and when steam is blown on the mirror, the steam condenses on the mirror thus preventing a true appreciation of the situation . As for atmakaraka in 7th sign of cancer, sigh, unfortunately Venus is not that well placed but being one of the 2 istadevatas, I hope it wont be all that bad. regards Hari prashant narang <prashantnarang wrote: sadgurudevaaye namah dear hari ji, Hari M <onlyhari wrote: ||Om Brihaspataye Namah|| Dear Prashant, My comments below: sadgurudevaaye namah dear hari may i also say a few words. for past days, this topic has become my favourite. first we need to think "why" ( as sanjay ji also says) behind this theory. are there only 8 types of atmakaraka? what does atmakarka mean tangibly? & [Hari] 8 different types of atmakaraka? Probably you mean the 8 different grahas (excluding Ketu who is the mokshakaraka) which can take on the role of atmakaraka? Why the number 8? why not 6 or 9? The Bhagavad Geeta says "Behold the (dwadasa)adityas, the (asta)vasus, the ekadasa (rudras), the (two) Aswins and also the Maruts. Behold many wonders never seen before, O Bharata" Now here Bhagwan Krishna hints at the most important of the devas created by him for this universe. It is evident that the primary variables for creation/destruction of any thing in this Universe are as enumerated above. Of these, the astavasus are the 8 variables necessary for creation of anything living/nonliving. Add to this Ra/Ke as the nodes of the Moon and we get 10 variables totally. Now lagna and Ketu are excluded and thus we have 8 charakarakas for living things. hmmm....probably you know this already so maybe i havent got ur point. my point is when a particular planet becomes atmakarka , it signifies something. now , should we confine ourselves to 8 kind of significations only just because there are only 8possibilities? are there only 8 goals in the world ? someone may lack somewhere else also or not? what does this ak mean? atmakarka signifies not just our soul , but also rinanubandhan related to it. (soul is supposed to be pure , a amsa of parmatma. so ofcourse the planet represent the sukshms/karana sarira) for eg. moon as ak shows the soul is full of feminine energies, & should tread on the path of self -realisation through love.but suppose if moon is in virgo in navamsa, it will mean the person has to focus on purity. similarly, moon -ak native is least expecetd to achieve through meditataion, but what if moon is in scorpio in navamsa. will it not do meditaion ( & it may signify left path too!) this moon in scorpio may take him to osho ashram( sambhog se samdhi tak-from sex to samadhi) or may be khajuraho. see the difference!! if ur mars is in cancer in navamsa. where is the anger? there is no fire, all steam.. it makes u touchy! it makes you too very sensitive...sometimes u dont respond , but react ... u know better abt ur emotional side. the inetersting thing is it is in 7th house. bhavas are more important than rasis in navamsa. jaimini says when ak is in 7th , the native is very straightforward! now, what will happen when hot steam is blown out straight on someone' face? you just cant ignore cancer sign & 7th bhava. one must see other significations also in a hollistic way. every horoscope is unique & one cant generalise the rinaubandha & path it has to follow. why ista is considerd from 12 from ak? [Hari] the soul is trying to find a way to reach God somehow and and 12th to karakamsa represents what the soul can give in order to attain the path to moksha but to whom? to the planet if there is any in the 12th house. And that is why Parasara lists out the deities for each of the planets at the very beginning itself so that the ista can be identified. 12 house also represents loss, thats the most basic signification of 12th house. until & unless this planet 12 th lord(or if there is aplanet there) from ak comes to atmakaraka to cut its cords of rinanubandha, how will the karmic balance be settled? without that how can the person get moksha? as sri gurugranth sahib says .. hari (The Lord) cuts down and weeds out the corruption of the cycle of birth and death. ||1|| janam maran bikaar ankur har kaat chhaaday kho-ay. ||1|| that's why we worship the lord signified by 12th lord from karakmsa. even if there is a planet in 12 th, that will help in incurring loss of our karmic debts. as far as the deities told by parasara are concerned, there is only a handful of people in this world who know abt those deities. this does not mean that others will never get moksha. this is cynical. that's the reason i refrain from "prescibing" deities to be worshipped for atmakaraka. more important is the path.....the path or the deity comes itself...sometime the soul knows better , sometimes the deity! good to have more planets in 12. more the planets, faster the decay of our karmas!! regards prashant [Hari] Sure. 28/09/1971, 11.01 AM, Madras (Theyegaraja Nagar), India. JHD attached also. regards Hari Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today |Om Tat Sat|http://www.varahamihira > ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=hari.jhd Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today |Om Tat Sat|http://www.varahamihira Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 3, 2004 Report Share Posted April 3, 2004 sadgurudevaaye namah dear hari ji not so good to feel that my words seemed to be a justification for someone's words. i did not read sanjay ji's article before he posted it to the group last week. (indeed a great work!!) but my belief that ak in navmsa should be checked with its bhava & rasi placement is much older than this. infact my previous discussions are proof that i've always advocated that ak should b seen in totality.Hari M <onlyhari wrote: ||Om Brihaspataye Namah|| Dear Prashant, This is what I was afraid of. After all, if the blanket description of a certain planet as the atmakaraka is not true in an individuals case, then we try to see the house & sign placement of the atmakaraka in the navamsa in order to find an explanation for why the description doesnt fit! No doubt, what you say is all true but that is like trying to explain what does not fit the goose will fit the duck! tell me if rasi placement of ak was to get such importance , then why karakamsa should be seen in navamsa, not in rasi chart? now u explain why rasi chart is not used as/for karakamsa ! Rasi chart is the overwhelming indication and if Mars as my AK is exalted in the rasi chart, dont you expect that the blanket description will fit in my case? Or have I missed out on some funda that says navamsa is the more important chart for deciphering the role of atmakaraka? If that is true, why not Shastiamsa which is supposed to show the precise reasons for the atma to take rebirth? yes, u have missed out that funda which says navmsa is more important! shashtiamsa-the word is not so easy to interpret as it seems. again i repeat that ak precisely shows ur past desires, ur unsettled karmic accounts(good or bad), whereas d-60 is for past life & much more which is still hidden... The atmakaraka has been given the role of karaka for the 1st and 8th house, per Sanjays teachings and therefore indicates that during the Vimsottari Dasa period, it will cause the nija dosa (resultant sins of previous births) will be exhausted during this time. Yesterday I came across a beautiful quote thanks to my friend. Swami Haridass said "Be happy during your periods of suffering as it is the bad karma which is exhausted and be sad during your periods of happiness as it is the good karma which is being exhausted!" karaka for houses? i cant comment on this right now before i find it convincing. yes, one thing more, ak is not synonomous with suffering. i totally disagree with this . it totally depends on the involvement of ak in various charts. if ak is involved in good yogas, it will ceratinly reap the previous karmic fruits. why not? doesnt it give silver spoon in the mouth right from birth if in navamsa lagna? Yes, what you say is true. I have a clean heart and am quite frank. Some people have told me that I tend to be a bit blunt at times but luckily, this outspokenness has not landed me in fights or cheesing off other people. Maybe I am lucky in the respect of when to be frank or when to be silent! My experience of blowing hot steam in the face of others is usually that the face is a mirror and when steam is blown on the mirror, the steam condenses on the mirror thus preventing a true appreciation of the situation . this was just a behavioural aspect. this placement of ak has also to do with ur relation with parents , wife & ur religious beliefs. i wonder if nothing is happened on religious front in past 2 years. do take care of ur parents. btw, i still wonder how can u even think of ignoring cancer sign otherwise. for scorpio, it is badhak as well as pushkar navamsa. it makes u religious /spiritual. As for atmakaraka in 7th sign of cancer, sigh, unfortunately Venus is not that well placed but being one of the 2 istadevatas, I hope it wont be all that bad. regards Hari for ur information, i myself had written an article "mysteries of navamsa" , in which i had elaborated on role of atmakaraka in context to one's life goal, it will soon be put on my website. regards prashantprashant narang <prashantnarang wrote: sadgurudevaaye namah dear hari ji, Hari M <onlyhari wrote: ||Om Brihaspataye Namah|| Dear Prashant, My comments below: sadgurudevaaye namah dear hari may i also say a few words. for past days, this topic has become my favourite. first we need to think "why" ( as sanjay ji also says) behind this theory. are there only 8 types of atmakaraka? what does atmakarka mean tangibly? & [Hari] 8 different types of atmakaraka? Probably you mean the 8 different grahas (excluding Ketu who is the mokshakaraka) which can take on the role of atmakaraka? Why the number 8? why not 6 or 9? The Bhagavad Geeta says "Behold the (dwadasa)adityas, the (asta)vasus, the ekadasa (rudras), the (two) Aswins and also the Maruts. Behold many wonders never seen before, O Bharata" Now here Bhagwan Krishna hints at the most important of the devas created by him for this universe. It is evident that the primary variables for creation/destruction of any thing in this Universe are as enumerated above. Of these, the astavasus are the 8 variables necessary for creation of anything living/nonliving. Add to this Ra/Ke as the nodes of the Moon and we get 10 variables totally. Now lagna and Ketu are excluded and thus we have 8 charakarakas for living things. hmmm....probably you know this already so maybe i havent got ur point. my point is when a particular planet becomes atmakarka , it signifies something. now , should we confine ourselves to 8 kind of significations only just because there are only 8possibilities? are there only 8 goals in the world ? someone may lack somewhere else also or not? what does this ak mean? atmakarka signifies not just our soul , but also rinanubandhan related to it. (soul is supposed to be pure , a amsa of parmatma. so ofcourse the planet represent the sukshms/karana sarira) for eg. moon as ak shows the soul is full of feminine energies, & should tread on the path of self -realisation through love.but suppose if moon is in virgo in navamsa, it will mean the person has to focus on purity. similarly, moon -ak native is least expecetd to achieve through meditataion, but what if moon is in scorpio in navamsa. will it not do meditaion ( & it may signify left path too!) this moon in scorpio may take him to osho ashram( sambhog se samdhi tak-from sex to samadhi) or may be khajuraho. see the difference!! if ur mars is in cancer in navamsa. where is the anger? there is no fire, all steam.. it makes u touchy! it makes you too very sensitive...sometimes u dont respond , but react ... u know better abt ur emotional side. the inetersting thing is it is in 7th house. bhavas are more important than rasis in navamsa. jaimini says when ak is in 7th , the native is very straightforward! now, what will happen when hot steam is blown out straight on someone' face? you just cant ignore cancer sign & 7th bhava. one must see other significations also in a hollistic way. every horoscope is unique & one cant generalise the rinaubandha & path it has to follow. why ista is considerd from 12 from ak? [Hari] the soul is trying to find a way to reach God somehow and and 12th to karakamsa represents what the soul can give in order to attain the path to moksha but to whom? to the planet if there is any in the 12th house. And that is why Parasara lists out the deities for each of the planets at the very beginning itself so that the ista can be identified. 12 house also represents loss, thats the most basic signification of 12th house. until & unless this planet 12 th lord(or if there is aplanet there) from ak comes to atmakaraka to cut its cords of rinanubandha, how will the karmic balance be settled? without that how can the person get moksha? as sri gurugranth sahib says .. hari (The Lord) cuts down and weeds out the corruption of the cycle of birth and death. ||1|| janam maran bikaar ankur har kaat chhaaday kho-ay. ||1|| that's why we worship the lord signified by 12th lord from karakmsa. even if there is a planet in 12 th, that will help in incurring loss of our karmic debts. as far as the deities told by parasara are concerned, there is only a handful of people in this world who know abt those deities. this does not mean that others will never get moksha. this is cynical. that's the reason i refrain from "prescibing" deities to be worshipped for atmakaraka. more important is the path.....the path or the deity comes itself...sometime the soul knows better , sometimes the deity! good to have more planets in 12. more the planets, faster the decay of our karmas!! regards prashant [Hari] Sure. 28/09/1971, 11.01 AM, Madras (Theyegaraja Nagar), India. JHD attached also. regards Hari Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today |Om Tat Sat|http://www.varahamihira > ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=hari.jhd Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today |Om Tat Sat|http://www.varahamihira Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today |Om Tat Sat|http://www.varahamihira Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 4, 2004 Report Share Posted April 4, 2004 ||Om Brihaspataye Namah|| Dear Prashant, not so good to feel that my words seemed to be a justification for someone's words. [Hari] No, not at all. I am not using your words to criticize another persons opinion, if that is what you are saying. tell me if rasi placement of ak was to get such importance , then why karakamsa should be seen in navamsa, not in rasi chart? now u explain why rasi chart is not used as/for karakamsa ! [Hari] Suppose a person has X planet as atmakaraka. How will this show up in the physical nature of the person? The atmakaraka placement in the rasi chart can give a clue as to the persons way of thinking and desires driving the person. Karakamsa is mostly seen for finer attributes such as the istadevata, talents/abilities of the atma etc. karaka for houses? i cant comment on this right now before i find it convincing. [Hari] Then what is the point of developing the charakaraka scheme at all. Dont we want to use it to see for which houses, this karaka is applicable? This is basic. How will a planet by itself bring all the baggage of the past karma to the present life? Unless there is a house connection, we cannot explain it satisfactorily. For example, why have we arranged the charakarakas in this particular order and not some other order. yes, one thing more, ak is not synonomous with suffering. i totally disagree with this . it totally depends on the involvement of ak in various charts. if ak is involved in good yogas, it will ceratinly reap the previous karmic fruits. why not? doesnt it give silver spoon in the mouth right from birth if in navamsa lagna? btw, i still wonder how can u even think of ignoring cancer sign otherwise. for scorpio, it is badhak as well as pushkar navamsa. it makes u religious /spiritual. [Hari] I didnt ignore all the cancer placement; what I was questioning is how a blanket description can be applied. for ur information, i myself had written an article "mysteries of navamsa" , in which i had elaborated on role of atmakaraka in context to one's life goal, it will soon be put on my website. [Hari] That will be interesting; may I know your website address so that I can look forward to reading your article. best regards Hari Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 6, 2004 Report Share Posted April 6, 2004 Hare Rama Krsna Yes, AK is more important in Navamsa and house and sign placement change everything. Mars uccha in rasi and neecha in Navamsa is uccha banga, it may try to give good effects but the bhagya does not support it. The AK in navamsa is very important to see the soul’s goal of life. A neecha KK will give negative effects in the month the Sun transits the navamsa sign. Namah Sivaya prashant narang [prashantnarang] Saturday, April 03, 2004 4:42 PM varahamihira Re: |Sri Varaha| Mars as atmakaraka sadgurudevaaye namah dear hari ji not so good to feel that my words seemed to be a justification for someone's words. i did not read sanjay ji's article before he posted it to the group last week. (indeed a great work!!) but my belief that ak in navmsa should be checked with its bhava & rasi placement is much older than this. infact my previous discussions are proof that i've always advocated that ak should b seen in totality. Hari M <onlyhari wrote: ||Om Brihaspataye Namah|| Dear Prashant, This is what I was afraid of. After all, if the blanket description of a certain planet as the atmakaraka is not true in an individuals case, then we try to see the house & sign placement of the atmakaraka in the navamsa in order to find an explanation for why the description doesnt fit! No doubt, what you say is all true but that is like trying to explain what does not fit the goose will fit the duck! tell me if rasi placement of ak was to get such importance , then why karakamsa should be seen in navamsa, not in rasi chart? now u explain why rasi chart is not used as/for karakamsa ! Rasi chart is the overwhelming indication and if Mars as my AK is exalted in the rasi chart, dont you expect that the blanket description will fit in my case? Or have I missed out on some funda that says navamsa is the more important chart for deciphering the role of atmakaraka? If that is true, why not Shastiamsa which is supposed to show the precise reasons for the atma to take rebirth? yes, u have missed out that funda which says navmsa is more important! shashtiamsa-the word is not so easy to interpret as it seems. again i repeat that ak precisely shows ur past desires, ur unsettled karmic accounts(good or bad), whereas d-60 is for past life & much more which is still hidden... The atmakaraka has been given the role of karaka for the 1st and 8th house, per Sanjays teachings and therefore indicates that during the Vimsottari Dasa period, it will cause the nija dosa (resultant sins of previous births) will be exhausted during this time. Yesterday I came across a beautiful quote thanks to my friend. Swami Haridass said " Be happy during your periods of suffering as it is the bad karma which is exhausted and be sad during your periods of happiness as it is the good karma which is being exhausted! " karaka for houses? i cant comment on this right now before i find it convincing. yes, one thing more, ak is not synonomous with suffering. i totally disagree with this . it totally depends on the involvement of ak in various charts. if ak is involved in good yogas, it will ceratinly reap the previous karmic fruits. why not? doesnt it give silver spoon in the mouth right from birth if in navamsa lagna? Yes, what you say is true. I have a clean heart and am quite frank. Some people have told me that I tend to be a bit blunt at times but luckily, this outspokenness has not landed me in fights or cheesing off other people. Maybe I am lucky in the respect of when to be frank or when to be silent! My experience of blowing hot steam in the face of others is usually that the face is a mirror and when steam is blown on the mirror, the steam condenses on the mirror thus preventing a true appreciation of the situation . this was just a behavioural aspect. this placement of ak has also to do with ur relation with parents , wife & ur religious beliefs. i wonder if nothing is happened on religious front in past 2 years. do take care of ur parents. btw, i still wonder how can u even think of ignoring cancer sign otherwise. for scorpio, it is badhak as well as pushkar navamsa. it makes u religious /spiritual. As for atmakaraka in 7th sign of cancer, sigh, unfortunately Venus is not that well placed but being one of the 2 istadevatas, I hope it wont be all that bad. regards Hari for ur information, i myself had written an article " mysteries of navamsa " , in which i had elaborated on role of atmakaraka in context to one's life goal, it will soon be put on my website. regards prashant prashant narang <prashantnarang wrote: sadgurudevaaye namah dear hari ji, Hari M <onlyhari wrote: ||Om Brihaspataye Namah|| Dear Prashant, My comments below: sadgurudevaaye namah dear hari may i also say a few words. for past days, this topic has become my favourite. first we need to think " why " ( as sanjay ji also says) behind this theory. are there only 8 types of atmakaraka? what does atmakarka mean tangibly? & [Hari] 8 different types of atmakaraka? Probably you mean the 8 different grahas (excluding Ketu who is the mokshakaraka) which can take on the role of atmakaraka? Why the number 8? why not 6 or 9? The Bhagavad Geeta says " Behold the (dwadasa)adityas, the (asta)vasus, the ekadasa (rudras), the (two) Aswins and also the Maruts. Behold many wonders never seen before, O Bharata " Now here Bhagwan Krishna hints at the most important of the devas created by him for this universe. It is evident that the primary variables for creation/destruction of any thing in this Universe are as enumerated above. Of these, the astavasus are the 8 variables necessary for creation of anything living/nonliving. Add to this Ra/Ke as the nodes of the Moon and we get 10 variables totally. Now lagna and Ketu are excluded and thus we have 8 charakarakas for living things. hmmm....probably you know this already so maybe i havent got ur point. my point is when a particular planet becomes atmakarka , it signifies something. now , should we confine ourselves to 8 kind of significations only just because there are only 8possibilities? are there only 8 goals in the world ? someone may lack somewhere else also or not? what does this ak mean? atmakarka signifies not just our soul , but also rinanubandhan related to it. (soul is supposed to be pure , a amsa of parmatma. so ofcourse the planet represent the sukshms/karana sarira) for eg. moon as ak shows the soul is full of feminine energies, & should tread on the path of self -realisation through love.but suppose if moon is in virgo in navamsa, it will mean the person has to focus on purity. similarly, moon -ak native is least expecetd to achieve through meditataion, but what if moon is in scorpio in navamsa. will it not do meditaion ( & it may signify left path too!) this moon in scorpio may take him to osho ashram( sambhog se samdhi tak-from sex to samadhi) or may be khajuraho. see the difference!! if ur mars is in cancer in navamsa. where is the anger? there is no fire, all steam.. it makes u touchy! it makes you too very sensitive...sometimes u dont respond , but react ... u know better abt ur emotional side. the inetersting thing is it is in 7th house. bhavas are more important than rasis in navamsa. jaimini says when ak is in 7th , the native is very straightforward! now, what will happen when hot steam is blown out straight on someone' face? you just cant ignore cancer sign & 7th bhava. one must see other significations also in a hollistic way. every horoscope is unique & one cant generalise the rinaubandha & path it has to follow. why ista is considerd from 12 from ak? [Hari] the soul is trying to find a way to reach God somehow and and 12th to karakamsa represents what the soul can give in order to attain the path to moksha but to whom? to the planet if there is any in the 12th house. And that is why Parasara lists out the deities for each of the planets at the very beginning itself so that the ista can be identified. 12 house also represents loss, thats the most basic signification of 12th house. until & unless this planet 12 th lord(or if there is aplanet there) from ak comes to atmakaraka to cut its cords of rinanubandha, how will the karmic balance be settled? without that how can the person get moksha? as sri gurugranth sahib says .. hari (The Lord) cuts down and weeds out the corruption of the cycle of birth and death. ||1|| janam maran bikaar ankur har kaat chhaaday kho-ay. ||1|| that's why we worship the lord signified by 12th lord from karakmsa. even if there is a planet in 12 th, that will help in incurring loss of our karmic debts. as far as the deities told by parasara are concerned, there is only a handful of people in this world who know abt those deities. this does not mean that others will never get moksha. this is cynical. that's the reason i refrain from " prescibing " deities to be worshipped for atmakaraka. more important is the path.....the path or the deity comes itself...sometime the soul knows better , sometimes the deity! good to have more planets in 12. more the planets, faster the decay of our karmas!! regards prashant [Hari] Sure. 28/09/1971, 11.01 AM, Madras (Theyegaraja Nagar), India. JHD attached also. regards Hari Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today |Om Tat Sat| http://www.varahamihira > ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=hari.jhd Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today |Om Tat Sat| http://www.varahamihira Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today |Om Tat Sat| http://www.varahamihira Small Business $15K Web Design Giveaway - Enter today |Om Tat Sat| http://www.varahamihira Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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