Guest guest Posted August 31, 2007 Report Share Posted August 31, 2007 Om Gurave Namah Dear Promila, Please send the birth chart details of Jiddu Krishnamurti so that everybody can follow. Warm regards, Tijana sohamsa , Promila Chitkara <promilac wrote: > > Jiddu Krishnamurti's chart is very interesting: > Both Saturn ® and Sun are exalted and are opposite each other on 4/10 axis. > Sun, the AK is exalted in rasi chart in 10th house. Since he was an evolved soul. We don't need to look its D-9 position as much. Am I correct? > An exalted atmakaraka, who is a natural significator of atma taught the world to observe the " I " . Interesting enough that he discouraged talks on reincarnation, intuition, meditation, astrology etc. He discouraged adopting a mechanical approach towards religion and spirituality. His idea of meditation is really beautiful! That said, he wanted the world to go deeper to understand the need why we discuss and depend on these stuff. This is a result of saturn/sun opposition. > From AL, saturn/sun are at 6/12 axis, and ketu/rahu are at 4/10 axis. > Pisces rises in D-9, a spiritual sign. Luminaries are on 4/10 axis-- complementing each other. So the mind and the atma were well aligned. The saturn and jupiter are together. Saturn being stronger, so he rejected all dogmas and systems. > In D-60, the moon is in the ninth house shows his skills in past lives: unmatched understanding of the mind. The moon is also in a quadrant from the AK. So the soul really wanted to rip apart human psyche to find the truth in next life. Have I got it right? > In D-60, The AK is with Ketu, the mokshakaraka, and its exalted dispositor is in the twelfth house--this is 6/12 axis. > Just my thoughts. I've just begun to understand astrology, so can't see beyond the above points. > > Promila > > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent > sohamsa > Friday, August 31, 2007 4:12:27 AM > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and v_reality) > > > Dear Sharat, > I cant share the chart of the person that I mentioned. However, > among famous people the ones with Sun AK that I remember are: > 1) Swami Vivekananda (Sun in Sag, 1st house) > 2) Jiddu Krishnamurti (Sun exalted in 4th house) May 12, 1895, > 0:23am, 78E30, 13N33, +5:14GMT. Extremely insightful writings on the > nature/contents of the mind. > 3) Gautam Buddha (I saw the chart somewhere and it was exalted Sun > AK, but I cant verify it anymore, perhaps someone else can suggest > the time) > I know that there was this one Guru on this group - Partha - he was > Sun AK too and wrote many insightful posts about the nature of self, > but he doesnt seem to be posting anymore. I am pretty sure that > Bharatji (if you dont mind my identifying you) is Sun AK too, and > you can see for yourself that he writes in the same vein as well. > > Hope this helps, > > Sundeep > > sohamsa@ .com, " Sharat " <gidoc@> wrote: > > > > |Namah Shivaya| > > Dear Sundeep, > > Sun AK thus 'struggles' as it can always see ' himself' clearly > while for others the drive is on other aspects of life, you quote > mirror as an apt example. > > It will help to study how Sun AK do their karmas and how it > effects their spirituality. > > Any example charts? > > Best > > Sharat > > > > - > > vedicastrostudent > > sohamsa@ .com > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 7:40 PM > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > v_reality) > > > > > > Dear Promila, > > First, thanks to all of you (Sharat, Tijanaji, Promila, Nitish) > for > > responding. > > > > But Promila, how dare you stop when you've made such a wonderful > > point :-) See, Tijanaji's point that ego is simply a situation > where > > we take more than we give is fraught with problems. It is simply > a > > statement made from Guru to Shishya with a lot of unsaid context > > around it and that context is only understood by Guru and > Shishya. > > You cannot use this definition when trying to fathom the depths > of > > the many good works on psychology and spirituality. See, what is > it > > that we are " giving " and " taking " and is that what all the > > books/scriptures mean when they talk about ego? By this > definition, > > Bill Gates and Warren Buffet can be said to have the smallest > egos > > in the world, because they both have decided to give virtually > ALL > > their material belongings (worth about $50 billion each) to > charity. > > I know you are all shaking your heads saying, " but that is not > what > > was meant " . So, you didnt mean it materially right? So what way > was > > it meant? Psychologically? But then what is it that you > are " giving " > > and " taking " ? And if you play around a little more and test it > out, > > Promila's wonderful example will throw you in another fix - > because > > as she rightly observes it is not only the " great me " > moods/types > > that are egotistical, but also the " poor me " moods/types. > The " poor > > me " types are generally self-flagellating types who work very > hard > > for others (family, spouse, children etc) and on the > surface " give " > > a lot. In both cases, the focus on " me " is exaggerated. I prefer > > Carl Jung's definition of ego, and notice that it is what is > meant > > in most deep contexts. Ego is simply the center of > consciousness. > > The psyche not only has the Ego but the unconscious also. Within > the > > unconscious is a deeper center called the Self, which is perhaps > the > > indicator of the Atma. An egotistical person, whether the " poor > me " > > type or the " great me " type has greater concentration of mental > > energy on the ego, and less in the Self (the Self is always > > perceived as divinity). Every AK's goal is to " reduce the ego " > i.e. > > reduce the concentration of mental energy in the ego, and > increase > > it in the Self (the divine center). That is why, to me, Sun is > the > > natural AK. When one says that everyone must " serve " , no matter > how > > it manifests *physically* , psychologically they are reducing the > > concentration of energy in the ego and increasing it in the > Self. > > Different chara AKs are different only in the method they adopt > to > > cause a reduction in ego of the native. Venus AKs have > relationship > > experiences that put the mirror in front of the ego and make it > give > > up its energy to the Self, Rahu AKs have rahu like experiences I > > guess that put the mirror in front of the ego. With Sun AK, I > have > > found the mirror is direct. > > > > I only post because I continue to dispute the implication that > Sun > > AKs have larger egos. They are no different from others, but > their > > experiences quickly bring direct and harsh focus on themselves > > rather than through other aspects of their interactions with the > > world. The chara karakatwa of Sun is not an indicator of larger > ego, > > only of the directness of the experiences that will lead to a > > reduction in it. > > > > Sundeep > > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@> > > wrote: > > > > > > Ego is not only the feeling of " I'm great " , but it is also > > the " Poor me " attitude. Both great and poor me demand attention. > > I'll stop at that as it's a forum to discuss to jyotish (you > rightly > > said). > > > > > > I've Taurus ascendent . Saturn is in the third house (Cancer) > > along with Sun. Darkness and light are together. D-9 ascendent > is > > Capricon and Saturn is in the 7th house (Cancer). So Saturn is > > Virgottama. IT's also my Ishtadevta. Now tell me what's in your > > mind > > > > > > > > > > > > tijanadamjanovic <nix_nixen@> > > > sohamsa@ .com > > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 8:40:08 PM > > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > > v_reality) > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah > > > Dear Sundeep and Promila, > > > It`s inevitable to enter the sphere of philosophy in subjects > like > > > this, but we should try stick to Jyotish principles. That is > how i > > > understood Nitish`s and mine discussion. Not in a moment i > thought > > i > > > can actually define ahamkar, or even ego, and am sure it wasn`t > > > Nitish` ambition either. > > > Actually i follow a single definition of ego taught by my Guru- > ego > > is > > > nothing but a situation where we are taking more than we are > > giving. > > > If one likes to think, one can find a lot in this simple > statement > > and > > > it`s the most practical advice also. > > > Promila, where is Saturn in your rasi and navamsa chart? > > > Warm regards, > > > Tijana > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara > <promilac@ .> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Sundeep, > > > > > > > > You post was beautiful! > > > > > > > > I don't know how technically accurate it is, but at the > > > psychological level you have made good points. I've Rahu as my > AK, > > but > > > I've major ego despite a weak Sun! Maybe it comes from Mars in > the > > D-1 > > > and D-9 ascendents. However, since Ketu is placed in D-1 > ascendent > > > (taurus) with Mars, it urges me to do a lot of self-analysis > and > > > self-obervation. Not even a single hour passes in my life > without > > > analyzing my thoughts and actions...I don't know if I make > sense > > here. > > > > > > > > > > > > P. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...> > > > > sohamsa@ .com > > > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 1:26:13 AM > > > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish > and > > v_reality) > > > > > > > > Dear Tijanaji and Nitish, > > > > > > > > I have been reading your exchange with interest in the hope > of > > > > learning something new, but I find myself disagreeing subtly > in > > the > > > > essence of what you say. In fact, deep down in the exchange > I > > find > > > > this statement made by " v_reality " which makes a lot of > sense to > > me: > > > > " Can this also be understood at a different level as the > > effacement > > > > of 'self' in a spiritual sense? " . > > > > > > > > Here is my take - I have none of the scriptural knowledge > you > > both > > > > have, only I have seen several Sun AK people: I dont think > it is > > > > fair to say that Sun AK people are egotistic. See, English > also > > has > > > > a lot of words which have subtly different meanings, and the > > right > > > > one has to be used. An egotistic person is one who has a > > exaggerated > > > > sense of self-importance. Almost everyone in this world has > that > > > > (and you are fooling yourself if you deny it), it is plain > wrong > > to > > > > observe a person have Sun AK and simultaneously observe that > he > > also > > > > has an exaggerated sense of self importance and say " yes, > that > > is > > > > what the Sun AK does to him " . I can cite hundreds of people > I > > know > > > > who are very self important and DONT have Sun AK, and not > only > > that > > > > may not even have a strong Sun in their chart. > > > > > > > > I personally think the only statement that can be observed > > > > repeatedly with Sun AK people is that they are egocentric > i.e. > > their > > > > view of the world is based on the individual rather than the > > > > society. They may or may not be egotistical (i.e. > egocentricity > > does > > > > not imply self importance) - the AK simply makes them go > through > > > > experiences in life such that their core self is tested. How > > they > > > > respond to it depends probably on lots of other astrological > > > > factors. The only statement I can safely make, based on pure > > > > experience, is that Sun AK people are guided to divinity > through > > > > experiences of the self, consequently their view is > egocentric. > > > > > > > > I know one Sun AK woman (dont know if I can share her data) > who > > was > > > > molested (by her own professor) and denied a higher degree > that > > she > > > > worked hard for, then get married and then divorced, then > have > > her > > > > mom die of cancer in a rather painful way, then have her > brother > > get > > > > divorced in a messy lawsuit (and then leave her too), then > (she) > > get > > > > married again and her husband develop terminal cancer very > soon > > > > afterward. Net result: she cant seem to find a strong and > > consistent > > > > support outside of herself - she has become self reliant and > > only > > > > finds consistent happiness in meditation/reiki. She is > probably > > > > egotistical in some degree too, but not in any outstanding > way > > at > > > > all, and probably much less than all the people around her.. > > > > > > > > Consequently, I really dispute the fact that Sun AK people > must > > > > learn to " reduce their ego " . That is simply a general lesson > for > > all > > > > of mankind. Sun AK people's AK will guide them towards > divinity > > > > through experiences that make them focus on themselves and > > search > > > > for the truth: now that's the statement I find much more to > the > > > > point. > > > > > > > > Comments? > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > Sundeep > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, nix nixen <nix_nixen@ ..> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah > > > > > Dear Nitish, > > > > > Only from one simple statement of yours " It is not always > > > > possible for me... " i read that your AK must be nothing less > > than > > > > Sun. Am i right? If yes, then i think i`m on the right way > of > > > > finding answers on my queries. > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > > Tijana > > > > > > > > > > yeeahoo_99 <nitish.arya@ ...> wrote: > > > > > Dear Tijana, > > > > > Raja Yoga is the yoga of soul with paramatma - > deep/shallow, > > > > > material/spiritual - all kind of things have a basis only > in > > > > > paramatma. Thus, even Raja-bhanga yoga has a basis i.e. > > separation > > > > of > > > > > soul from paramatma (which is illusory only though) and > hence > > > > > material/spiritual loss depending on the kind of karma > > involved. > > > > > > > > > > As the lord of a sign, a planet rules a 12th part of the > > > > > consciousness, relatively . Thus, in part, it becomes its > > > > > responsibility to guide the affairs of that sign/house > towards > > > > > fulfillment. You may explore it further. > > > > > > > > > > It is not always possible for me to answer to your > specific > > > > queries. > > > > > Hopefully, in time, you will discover the truth of your > > queries. > > > > > > > > > > best regards, > > > > > nitish > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, " tijanadamjanovic " > > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah > > > > > > Dear Nitish, > > > > > > Yes, all must serve. The questions raised in these > > discussions > > > > on Atma > > > > > > karakas were on the specific way of serving. > > > > > > If we say that Sun AK must learn principles of artha > shastra > > to > > > > serve, > > > > > > the same stands for Ma and Ju AK? How to differentiate? > I > > assume > > > > you > > > > > > are taking karakatvas of the houses into account also > (2nd, > > 6th, > > > > 10th)? > > > > > > The Sun/Raja gets service on the throne, but regarding > > > > spirituality > > > > > > and Atma this is related to real Raja yoga whose deepest > > meaning > > > > is > > > > > > inseparable from 10th house of indriyas (refer > > Vivekananda) . > > > > Only in > > > > > > that sense we can talk of Janaka or the perfect King. > What > > artha > > > > > > shastra principles you had in mind? > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > > > Tijana > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, " yeeahoo_99 " > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om TAT SAT || > > > > > > > Dear Tijana, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > > mentioning Gita in this context. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Context that was intended is Gita Chapter 3,sloka 22. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All must work if the lord of the cosmos has chosen to > > work. > > > > Thus, > > > > > > > there is nothing specific that only SUN AK has > to " serve " , > > all > > > > AKs > > > > > > > " serve " . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, are you implying that Sun AK gives a person > akin to > > > > Janaka?! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, Sun AK gives a person akin to Janaka - > jivanmukta - > > > > provided > > > > > > > enough effort has been put in. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you determing dharma based on this? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No, Sun AK need not be 9th lord. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra > as > > an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > The attitude of service is seen from 6th house. Leo > being > > a > > > > dharma > > > > > > > trikona sign fulfills its purpose of service through > 10th > > > > house of > > > > > > > Artha, which is 6th from it. So a Sun AK should learn > > > > principles of > > > > > > > artha shastra to serve. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All souls have to " Serve " only as there is nothing > else to > > be > > > > done > > > > > > > in the three worlds because Krishna has already > achieved > > > > everything > > > > > > > that is there to achieve in the three worlds(refer > Gita). > > > > Those who > > > > > > > do not serve, are reborn to learn to serve, whatever > be > > their > > > > AK. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus > > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself). > > > > > > > > But do you think it`s a coincidence that His Master > had > > > > exalted > > > > > > > Saturn in 9th > > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is not re-born after exhausting his karma/desires. > > Thus, > > > > > > > vivekananda (Rahu PiK) came here to exhaust his > remaining > > > > karma/ > > > > > > > desires with Ramakrishna (Rahu AK). There is no more > > substance > > > > to > > > > > > > this than a past-life karmic relationship of the two > which > > > > continued > > > > > > > in this birth also. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > NITISH > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, " tijana " <nix_nixen@> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah > > > > > > > > Dear Nitish, > > > > > > > > Your elaboration would be even more brilliant if you > had > > > > just answer > > > > > > > > my question. > > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > mentioning > > > > > > > > Gita in this context. But, are you implying that Sun > AK > > > > gives a > > > > > > > > person akin to Janaka?! Are you determing dharma > based > > on > > > > this? Will > > > > > > > > you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra as an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus > > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself). > > > > But do > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > think it`s a coincidence that His Master had exalted > > Saturn > > > > in 9th > > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these? > > > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > > > > > Tijana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, " yeeahoo_99 " > > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || > > > > > > > > > Dear Tijana, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What is the thing that Raja will hardly ever do? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read up Gita, arthashastra and ancient texts that > show > > > > what > > > > > > > all a > > > > > > > > > Raja has to do to ensure that his subjects are > > protected > > > > and > > > > > > > progress > > > > > > > > > on the upward evolutionary path. Look at krishna, > > Janaka > > > > and > > > > > > > > > ChandraGupta Maurya and you will understand > whatever > > > > that " hardly > > > > > > > > > ever do " equates to. > > > > > > > > > Otherwise, going by your statement, AK wouldn't do > > > > anything > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > the king of the horoscope and the rest of the > karakas > > (BK, > > > > PiK, > > > > > > > Puk, > > > > > > > > > GK) i.e. his subjects will follow the suit! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, the mantra is " Shiva jnane Jiva Seva " > > (serving > > > > every > > > > > > > > > being as the full manifestation of God) that > > Narendranath > > > > > > > received > > > > > > > > > from his Master Ramakrishna who had Sun in > Aquarius. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Being Sun AK, Vivekananda had developed peculiar > > sharpness > > > > of > > > > > > > > > perception and assimilation that empowered him > with > > > > unusual power > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > pick up 'the gems' from the talks of his Master. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Sun in Sagittarius, he could, as compared to > > others, > > > > > > > easily > > > > > > > > > 'see' the deep meaning in the words of Sri > > Ramakrishna, > > > > even > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > the Master told them in simple language (Aq Sun), > and > > > > never as > > > > > > > > > preaching. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With its dispositor Jupiter in Libra, gradually > Swami > > > > > > > Vivekananda > > > > > > > > > started assimilating tips and hints on practical > > Vedanta > > > > that > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > benefit individual and collective life in the > society. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > " ...For spiritual persons Sun as AK should be in > > > > Jupiter`s > > > > > > > signs > > > > > > > > > > (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s very hard > task... " > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Putting up statements like you have done is not > wise. > > Sri > > > > > > > Yukteswar > > > > > > > > > Giri, has Sun AK placed in Aries and had attained > > highest > > > > level > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > spirituality. Even if Sun AK is placed in Libra, > it > > could > > > > be the > > > > > > > most > > > > > > > > > spiritual person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AK shows the spiritual power of a sign over the > rest > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > signs/ > > > > > > > > > planets in the chart and this spiritual power > > manifests > > > > through > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > dispositor of AK and its sign placement. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > NITISH > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, " tijana " > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah > > > > > > > > > > Dear Su, > > > > > > > > > > Sun is the Self. Its qualities are those of Raja > > (karaka > > > > for > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > first house, lord of the 5th, dig bala in 10th). > > What is > > > > the > > > > > > > thing > > > > > > > > > > that Raja will hardly ever do? The lesson that > has > > to be > > > > learnt > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK is serving, in the highest sence it > > gives " Shiva > > > > jnane > > > > > > > Shiva > > > > > > > > > > seva " (service of man as God)-the divine lesson > > given to > > > > us by > > > > > > > > > Swami > > > > > > > > > > Vivekananda (Sun AK). For spiritual persons Sun > as > > AK > > > > should be > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > Jupiter`s signs (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s > > very > > > > hard task. > > > > > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > > > > > > > Tijana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, " v reality " > > <reality_v@> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bojan-ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for your reply. Much appreciated. > > > > > > > > > > > If I may ask another query re Sun AK. The > lesson > > to be > > > > > > > learnt > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK, > > > > > > > > > > > is the reduction of ego. Can this also be > > understood > > > > at a > > > > > > > > > > different level > > > > > > > > > > > as the effacement of 'self' in a spiritual > sense? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > Su > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan Vidakovic <janbovid@> > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com > > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK > > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 08:33:22 -0700 (PDT) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >HARE RAMA KRISHNA > > > > > > > > > > > >Dear Su > > > > > > > > > > > >I would add that with Gu AK person have to be > > very > > > > humble to > > > > > > > all > > > > > > > > > > spiritual > > > > > > > > > > > >techers and natives, like priests, gurus, > > teachers. > > > > With Ma > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > person must > > > > > > > > > > > >practise Ahumsa (nonviolence) , with Ch the > > native is > > > > always > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > caring, > > > > > > > > > > > >and gives emotions but the problem is that > they > > never > > > > get > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > > >themselves from other people. The person must > > learn > > > > lessons > > > > > > > also > > > > > > > > > > from the > > > > > > > > > > > >people represented with AK. Ch / mother, Sy / > > father > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > everything those > > > > > > > > > > > >grahas represent. > > > > > > > > > > > >Take few examples of people you know and see > it > > in > > > > praxix. > > > > > > > Best > > > > > > > > > > wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan > > > > > > > > > > > >Hari Om Tat Sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > hraum namah adityaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Su, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Person should use a lot of glass and > sing/hum > > > > melodies. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > Rafal Gendarz > > > > > > > > > > > > Sri Jagannath Center Guru > > > > > > > > > > > > email: rafal@ > > > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > v reality napisaÅ,(a): Dear Rafalji/Members > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is an interesting discussion. Could we > > discuss > > > > other > > > > > > > AKs > > > > > > > > > > too. I read > > > > > > > > > > > > in an article that natives with Moon as AK > need > > to > > > > learn > > > > > > > to be > > > > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > > > >caring > > > > > > > > > > > > and loving to others. But I know of a chart > > where > > > > the > > > > > > > native > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > >by > > > > > > > > > > > > nature very caring, loving and concerned > about > > > > others > > > > > > > since > > > > > > > > > > young. So > > > > > > > > > > > >what > > > > > > > > > > > > is the lesson to be learnt? > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > Su > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> > > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com > > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com > > > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK > > > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 10:24:14 +0200 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *hraum namah adityaya* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Dear LN Kumar, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >With Ju AK person should learn to respect > > others > > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > >tradition, > > > > > > > > > > > > >should be ready to learn from others. When > Ju > > is in > > > > > > > kendra to > > > > > > > > > > AK or is > > > > > > > > > > > >AK > > > > > > > > > > > > >himself then native thinks that he knows > > everything > > > > and > > > > > > > now > > > > > > > > > He > > > > > > > > > > can share > > > > > > > > > > > > >His knowledge with everybody. Good teachers > of > > > > course > > > > > > > comes > > > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > > > >AK-Jupiter- Natives, as this graha will be > > > > naturally in > > > > > > > > > > Karakamsa. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >With MA AK person should learn to catalyze > > energies > > > > > > > through > > > > > > > > > > ZEN, TAI-CHI > > > > > > > > > > > >or > > > > > > > > > > > > >other techniques, while with JU AK person > > should > > > > learn to > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > more humble > > > > > > > > > > > > >regarding knowledge. Of course person can > be > > > > focused on > > > > > > > > > Jupiter- > > > > > > > > > > karakas > > > > > > > > > > > > >like kids, spirituality, law, luck etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Mahadasa of AK brings lesson to us so its > not > > so > > > > easy > > > > > > > > > > materially but > > > > > > > > > > > > >inspiring spiritually, so if Surya is in > good > > > > placement > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > then it > > > > > > > > > > > >can > > > > > > > > > > > > >be not so bad as person is spiritual. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz > > > > > > > > > > > > >Sri Jagannath Center Guru > > > > > > > > > > > > >email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com > > > > > > > > > > > > >Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >narender kumar napisa?(a): > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>Dear Gurujans, > > > > > > > > > > > > >>Kindly throw some light on Jupiter as > > > > > > > > > > > > >>Atmakaraka and having Jupiter as mahadasha. > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>Respectful Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > >>LN Kumar > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>__________ __ _________ _________ > _________ > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > > _________ _ > > > > > > > > > > > > >>Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the > > > > Internet in > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > pocket: > > > > > > > > > > > >mail, > > > > > > > > > > > > >>news, photos & more. > > > > > > > > > > > > >>http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC > > > > > > > > > > > > >><http://mobile. / go?refer= > 1GNXIC> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ > > _________ > > > > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > _ > > > > > > > > > > > > Advertisement: It's simple! 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Check out > Autos > > > new Car Finder tool. > > > > http://autos. / carfinder/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ > > ____________ ___ > > > Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the Internet in your > > pocket: mail, news, photos & more. > > > http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________________ ______________ > Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Answers - Check it out. > http://answers./dir/?link=list & sid=396545469 > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 31, 2007 Report Share Posted August 31, 2007 Sundeep had already sent the details. See the second last mail in this thread. Jiddu Krishnamurti May 12, 1895, 0:23am, 78E30, 13N33, +5:14GMT. tijanadamjanovic <nix_nixensohamsa Sent: Friday, August 31, 2007 4:47:40 PM Jiddu Krishnamurti Om Gurave NamahDear Promila,Please send the birth chart details of Jiddu Krishnamurti so that everybody can follow.Warm regards,Tijanasohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@.. .> wrote:>> Jiddu Krishnamurti' s chart is very interesting:> Both Saturn ® and Sun are exalted and are opposite each other on 4/10 axis.> Sun, the AK is exalted in rasi chart in 10th house. Since he was an evolved soul. We don't need to look its D-9 position as much. Am I correct? > An exalted atmakaraka, who is a natural significator of atma taught the world to observe the "I". Interesting enough that he discouraged talks on reincarnation, intuition, meditation, astrology etc. He discouraged adopting a mechanical approach towards religion and spirituality. His idea of meditation is really beautiful! That said, he wanted the world to go deeper to understand the need why we discuss and depend on these stuff. This is a result of saturn/sun opposition.> From AL, saturn/sun are at 6/12 axis, and ketu/rahu are at 4/10 axis.> Pisces rises in D-9, a spiritual sign. Luminaries are on 4/10 axis--complementing each other. So the mind and the atma were well aligned. The saturn and jupiter are together. Saturn being stronger, so he rejected all dogmas and systems.> In D-60, the moon is in the ninth house shows his skills in past lives: unmatched understanding of the mind. The moon is also in a quadrant from the AK. So the soul really wanted to rip apart human psyche to find the truth in next life. Have I got it right?> In D-60, The AK is with Ketu, the mokshakaraka, and its exalted dispositor is in the twelfth house--this is 6/12 axis. > Just my thoughts. I've just begun to understand astrology, so can't see beyond the above points. > > Promila> > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...>> sohamsa@ .com> Friday, August 31, 2007 4:12:27 AM> Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and v_reality)> > > Dear Sharat,> I cant share the chart of the person that I mentioned. However, > among famous people the ones with Sun AK that I remember are:> 1) Swami Vivekananda (Sun in Sag, 1st house)> 2) Jiddu Krishnamurti (Sun exalted in 4th house) May 12, 1895, > 0:23am, 78E30, 13N33, +5:14GMT. Extremely insightful writings on the > nature/contents of the mind.> 3) Gautam Buddha (I saw the chart somewhere and it was exalted Sun > AK, but I cant verify it anymore, perhaps someone else can suggest > the time)> I know that there was this one Guru on this group - Partha - he was > Sun AK too and wrote many insightful posts about the nature of self, > but he doesnt seem to be posting anymore. I am pretty sure that > Bharatji (if you dont mind my identifying you) is Sun AK too, and > you can see for yourself that he writes in the same vein as well. > > Hope this helps,> > Sundeep> > sohamsa@ .com, " Sharat" <gidoc@> wrote:> >> > |Namah Shivaya|> > Dear Sundeep,> > Sun AK thus 'struggles' as it can always see ' himself' clearly > while for others the drive is on other aspects of life, you quote > mirror as an apt example.> > It will help to study how Sun AK do their karmas and how it > effects their spirituality.> > Any example charts?> > Best> > Sharat> > > > - > > vedicastrostudent > > sohamsa@ .com > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 7:40 PM> > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > v_reality)> > > > > > Dear Promila,> > First, thanks to all of you (Sharat, Tijanaji, Promila, Nitish) > for > > responding.> > > > But Promila, how dare you stop when you've made such a wonderful > > point :-) See, Tijanaji's point that ego is simply a situation > where > > we take more than we give is fraught with problems. It is simply > a > > statement made from Guru to Shishya with a lot of unsaid context > > around it and that context is only understood by Guru and > Shishya. > > You cannot use this definition when trying to fathom the depths > of > > the many good works on psychology and spirituality. See, what is > it > > that we are "giving" and "taking" and is that what all the > > books/scriptures mean when they talk about ego? By this > definition, > > Bill Gates and Warren Buffet can be said to have the smallest > egos > > in the world, because they both have decided to give virtually > ALL > > their material belongings (worth about $50 billion each) to > charity. > > I know you are all shaking your heads saying, "but that is not > what > > was meant". So, you didnt mean it materially right? So what way > was > > it meant? Psychologically? But then what is it that you > are "giving" > > and "taking"? And if you play around a little more and test it > out, > > Promila's wonderful example will throw you in another fix - > because > > as she rightly observes it is not only the "great me" > moods/types > > that are egotistical, but also the "poor me" moods/types. > The "poor > > me" types are generally self-flagellating types who work very > hard > > for others (family, spouse, children etc) and on the > surface "give" > > a lot. In both cases, the focus on "me" is exaggerated. I prefer > > Carl Jung's definition of ego, and notice that it is what is > meant > > in most deep contexts. Ego is simply the center of > consciousness. > > The psyche not only has the Ego but the unconscious also. Within > the > > unconscious is a deeper center called the Self, which is perhaps > the > > indicator of the Atma. An egotistical person, whether the "poor > me" > > type or the "great me" type has greater concentration of mental > > energy on the ego, and less in the Self (the Self is always > > perceived as divinity). Every AK's goal is to "reduce the ego" > i.e. > > reduce the concentration of mental energy in the ego, and > increase > > it in the Self (the divine center). That is why, to me, Sun is > the > > natural AK. When one says that everyone must "serve", no matter > how > > it manifests *physically* , psychologically they are reducing the > > concentration of energy in the ego and increasing it in the > Self. > > Different chara AKs are different only in the method they adopt > to > > cause a reduction in ego of the native. Venus AKs have > relationship > > experiences that put the mirror in front of the ego and make it > give > > up its energy to the Self, Rahu AKs have rahu like experiences I > > guess that put the mirror in front of the ego. With Sun AK, I > have > > found the mirror is direct.> > > > I only post because I continue to dispute the implication that > Sun > > AKs have larger egos. They are no different from others, but > their > > experiences quickly bring direct and harsh focus on themselves > > rather than through other aspects of their interactions with the > > world. The chara karakatwa of Sun is not an indicator of larger > ego, > > only of the directness of the experiences that will lead to a > > reduction in it.> > > > Sundeep> > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@> > > wrote:> > >> > > Ego is not only the feeling of "I'm great", but it is also > > the "Poor me" attitude. Both great and poor me demand attention. > > I'll stop at that as it's a forum to discuss to jyotish (you > rightly > > said).> > > > > > I've Taurus ascendent . Saturn is in the third house (Cancer) > > along with Sun. Darkness and light are together. D-9 ascendent > is > > Capricon and Saturn is in the 7th house (Cancer). So Saturn is > > Virgottama. IT's also my Ishtadevta. Now tell me what's in your > > mind > > > > > > > > > > > > tijanadamjanovic <nix_nixen@>> > > sohamsa@ .com> > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 8:40:08 PM> > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > > v_reality)> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > Dear Sundeep and Promila,> > > It`s inevitable to enter the sphere of philosophy in subjects > like> > > this, but we should try stick to Jyotish principles. That is > how i> > > understood Nitish`s and mine discussion. Not in a moment i > thought > > i> > > can actually define ahamkar, or even ego, and am sure it wasn`t> > > Nitish` ambition either. > > > Actually i follow a single definition of ego taught by my Guru-> ego > > is> > > nothing but a situation where we are taking more than we are > > giving.> > > If one likes to think, one can find a lot in this simple > statement > > and> > > it`s the most practical advice also.> > > Promila, where is Saturn in your rasi and navamsa chart?> > > Warm regards,> > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara > <promilac@ .> > > wrote:> > > >> > > > Sundeep,> > > > > > > > You post was beautiful!> > > > > > > > I don't know how technically accurate it is, but at the> > > psychological level you have made good points. I've Rahu as my > AK, > > but> > > I've major ego despite a weak Sun! Maybe it comes from Mars in > the > > D-1> > > and D-9 ascendents. However, since Ketu is placed in D-1 > ascendent> > > (taurus) with Mars, it urges me to do a lot of self-analysis > and> > > self-obervation. Not even a single hour passes in my life > without> > > analyzing my thoughts and actions...I don't know if I make > sense > > here.> > > > > > > > > > > > P.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...>> > > > sohamsa@ .com> > > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 1:26:13 AM> > > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish > and > > v_reality)> > > > > > > > Dear Tijanaji and Nitish,> > > > > > > > I have been reading your exchange with interest in the hope > of > > > > learning something new, but I find myself disagreeing subtly > in > > the > > > > essence of what you say. In fact, deep down in the exchange > I > > find > > > > this statement made by "v_reality" which makes a lot of > sense to > > me:> > > > "Can this also be understood at a different level as the > > effacement > > > > of 'self' in a spiritual sense?".> > > > > > > > Here is my take - I have none of the scriptural knowledge > you > > both > > > > have, only I have seen several Sun AK people: I dont think > it is > > > > fair to say that Sun AK people are egotistic. See, English > also > > has > > > > a lot of words which have subtly different meanings, and the > > right > > > > one has to be used. An egotistic person is one who has a > > exaggerated > > > > sense of self-importance. Almost everyone in this world has > that > > > > (and you are fooling yourself if you deny it), it is plain > wrong > > to > > > > observe a person have Sun AK and simultaneously observe that > he > > also > > > > has an exaggerated sense of self importance and say "yes, > that > > is > > > > what the Sun AK does to him". I can cite hundreds of people > I > > know > > > > who are very self important and DONT have Sun AK, and not > only > > that > > > > may not even have a strong Sun in their chart.> > > > > > > > I personally think the only statement that can be observed > > > > repeatedly with Sun AK people is that they are egocentric > i.e. > > their > > > > view of the world is based on the individual rather than the > > > > society. They may or may not be egotistical (i.e. > egocentricity > > does > > > > not imply self importance) - the AK simply makes them go > through > > > > experiences in life such that their core self is tested. How > > they > > > > respond to it depends probably on lots of other astrological > > > > factors. The only statement I can safely make, based on pure > > > > experience, is that Sun AK people are guided to divinity > through > > > > experiences of the self, consequently their view is > egocentric.> > > > > > > > I know one Sun AK woman (dont know if I can share her data) > who > > was > > > > molested (by her own professor) and denied a higher degree > that > > she > > > > worked hard for, then get married and then divorced, then > have > > her > > > > mom die of cancer in a rather painful way, then have her > brother > > get > > > > divorced in a messy lawsuit (and then leave her too), then > (she) > > get > > > > married again and her husband develop terminal cancer very > soon > > > > afterward. Net result: she cant seem to find a strong and > > consistent > > > > support outside of herself - she has become self reliant and > > only > > > > finds consistent happiness in meditation/reiki. She is > probably > > > > egotistical in some degree too, but not in any outstanding > way > > at > > > > all, and probably much less than all the people around her..> > > > > > > > Consequently, I really dispute the fact that Sun AK people > must > > > > learn to "reduce their ego". That is simply a general lesson > for > > all > > > > of mankind. Sun AK people's AK will guide them towards > divinity > > > > through experiences that make them focus on themselves and > > search > > > > for the truth: now that's the statement I find much more to > the > > > > point.> > > > > > > > Comments?> > > > > > > > Thanks,> > > > > > > > Sundeep> > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, nix nixen <nix_nixen@ ..> > wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > Only from one simple statement of yours "It is not always > > > > possible for me..." i read that your AK must be nothing less > > than > > > > Sun. Am i right? If yes, then i think i`m on the right way > of > > > > finding answers on my queries.> > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > yeeahoo_99 <nitish.arya@ ...> wrote:> > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > Raja Yoga is the yoga of soul with paramatma - > deep/shallow,> > > > > material/spiritual - all kind of things have a basis only > in> > > > > paramatma. Thus, even Raja-bhanga yoga has a basis i.e. > > separation > > > > of> > > > > soul from paramatma (which is illusory only though) and > hence> > > > > material/spiritual loss depending on the kind of karma > > involved.> > > > > > > > > > As the lord of a sign, a planet rules a 12th part of the> > > > > consciousness, relatively . Thus, in part, it becomes its> > > > > responsibility to guide the affairs of that sign/house > towards> > > > > fulfillment. You may explore it further.> > > > > > > > > > It is not always possible for me to answer to your > specific > > > > queries.> > > > > Hopefully, in time, you will discover the truth of your > > queries.> > > > > > > > > > best regards,> > > > > nitish> > > > > > > > > > --- In sohamsa@ .com, "tijanadamjanovic" > > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > > Yes, all must serve. The questions raised in these > > discussions > > > > on Atma> > > > > > karakas were on the specific way of serving. > > > > > > If we say that Sun AK must learn principles of artha > shastra > > to > > > > serve,> > > > > > the same stands for Ma and Ju AK? How to differentiate? > I > > assume > > > > you> > > > > > are taking karakatvas of the houses into account also > (2nd, > > 6th, > > > > 10th)?> > > > > > The Sun/Raja gets service on the throne, but regarding > > > > spirituality> > > > > > and Atma this is related to real Raja yoga whose deepest > > meaning > > > > is> > > > > > inseparable from 10th house of indriyas (refer > > Vivekananda) . > > > > Only in> > > > > > that sense we can talk of Janaka or the perfect King. > What > > artha> > > > > > shastra principles you had in mind?> > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "yeeahoo_99" > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > > > wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > || Om TAT SAT ||> > > > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > > mentioning Gita in this context.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Context that was intended is Gita Chapter 3,sloka 22.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > All must work if the lord of the cosmos has chosen to > > work. > > > > Thus, > > > > > > > there is nothing specific that only SUN AK has > to "serve", > > all > > > > AKs > > > > > > > "serve".> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, are you implying that Sun AK gives a person > akin to > > > > Janaka?! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, Sun AK gives a person akin to Janaka - > jivanmukta - > > > > provided > > > > > > > enough effort has been put in.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you determing dharma based on this? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No, Sun AK need not be 9th lord.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra > as > > an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > The attitude of service is seen from 6th house. Leo > being > > a > > > > dharma > > > > > > > trikona sign fulfills its purpose of service through > 10th > > > > house of > > > > > > > Artha, which is 6th from it. So a Sun AK should learn > > > > principles of > > > > > > > artha shastra to serve.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All souls have to "Serve" only as there is nothing > else to > > be > > > > done > > > > > > > in the three worlds because Krishna has already > achieved > > > > everything > > > > > > > that is there to achieve in the three worlds(refer > Gita). > > > > Those who > > > > > > > do not serve, are reborn to learn to serve, whatever > be > > their > > > > AK.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus> > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself).> > > > > > > > But do you think it`s a coincidence that His Master > had > > > > exalted > > > > > > > Saturn in 9th> > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is not re-born after exhausting his karma/desires. > > Thus, > > > > > > > vivekananda (Rahu PiK) came here to exhaust his > remaining > > > > karma/> > > > > > > desires with Ramakrishna (Rahu AK). There is no more > > substance > > > > to > > > > > > > this than a past-life karmic relationship of the two > which > > > > continued > > > > > > > in this birth also.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards,> > > > > > > NITISH> > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijana" <nix_nixen@> > > wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > > > > Your elaboration would be even more brilliant if you > had > > > > just answer> > > > > > > > my question.> > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > mentioning> > > > > > > > Gita in this context. But, are you implying that Sun > AK > > > > gives a> > > > > > > > person akin to Janaka?! Are you determing dharma > based > > on > > > > this? Will> > > > > > > > you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra as an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus> > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself). > > > > But do > > > > > > > you> > > > > > > > think it`s a coincidence that His Master had exalted > > Saturn > > > > in 9th> > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these? > > > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "yeeahoo_99" > > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat ||> > > > > > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What is the thing that Raja will hardly ever do?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read up Gita, arthashastra and ancient texts that > show > > > > what > > > > > > > all a > > > > > > > > > Raja has to do to ensure that his subjects are > > protected > > > > and > > > > > > > progress > > > > > > > > > on the upward evolutionary path. Look at krishna, > > Janaka > > > > and > > > > > > > > > ChandraGupta Maurya and you will understand > whatever > > > > that "hardly > > > > > > > > > ever do" equates to.> > > > > > > > > Otherwise, going by your statement, AK wouldn't do > > > > anything > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > the king of the horoscope and the rest of the > karakas > > (BK, > > > > PiK, > > > > > > > Puk, > > > > > > > > > GK) i.e. his subjects will follow the suit!> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, the mantra is "Shiva jnane Jiva Seva" > > (serving > > > > every > > > > > > > > > being as the full manifestation of God) that > > Narendranath > > > > > > > received > > > > > > > > > from his Master Ramakrishna who had Sun in > Aquarius.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Being Sun AK, Vivekananda had developed peculiar > > sharpness > > > > of > > > > > > > > > perception and assimilation that empowered him > with > > > > unusual power > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > pick up 'the gems' from the talks of his Master.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Sun in Sagittarius, he could, as compared to > > others, > > > > > > > easily > > > > > > > > > 'see' the deep meaning in the words of Sri > > Ramakrishna, > > > > even > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > the Master told them in simple language (Aq Sun), > and > > > > never as > > > > > > > > > preaching.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With its dispositor Jupiter in Libra, gradually > Swami > > > > > > > Vivekananda > > > > > > > > > started assimilating tips and hints on practical > > Vedanta > > > > that > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > benefit individual and collective life in the > society.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "...For spiritual persons Sun as AK should be in > > > > Jupiter`s > > > > > > > signs > > > > > > > > > > (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s very hard > task..."> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Putting up statements like you have done is not > wise. > > Sri > > > > > > > Yukteswar > > > > > > > > > Giri, has Sun AK placed in Aries and had attained > > highest > > > > level > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > spirituality. Even if Sun AK is placed in Libra, > it > > could > > > > be the > > > > > > > most > > > > > > > > > spiritual person.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AK shows the spiritual power of a sign over the > rest > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > signs/> > > > > > > > > planets in the chart and this spiritual power > > manifests > > > > through > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > dispositor of AK and its sign placement.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards,> > > > > > > > > NITISH> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijana" > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > > > > > Dear Su,> > > > > > > > > > Sun is the Self. Its qualities are those of Raja > > (karaka > > > > for > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > first house, lord of the 5th, dig bala in 10th). > > What is > > > > the > > > > > > > thing > > > > > > > > > > that Raja will hardly ever do? The lesson that > has > > to be > > > > learnt > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK is serving, in the highest sence it > > gives "Shiva > > > > jnane > > > > > > > Shiva > > > > > > > > > > seva" (service of man as God)-the divine lesson > > given to > > > > us by > > > > > > > > > Swami > > > > > > > > > > Vivekananda (Sun AK). For spiritual persons Sun > as > > AK > > > > should be > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > Jupiter`s signs (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s > > very > > > > hard task.> > > > > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "v reality" > > <reality_v@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bojan-ji> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for your reply. Much appreciated.> > > > > > > > > > > If I may ask another query re Sun AK. The > lesson > > to be > > > > > > > learnt > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK, > > > > > > > > > > > is the reduction of ego. Can this also be > > understood > > > > at a > > > > > > > > > > different level > > > > > > > > > > > as the effacement of 'self' in a spiritual > sense?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks> > > > > > > > > > > Su> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan Vidakovic <janbovid@>> > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK> > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 08:33:22 -0700 (PDT)> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >HARE RAMA KRISHNA> > > > > > > > > > > >Dear Su> > > > > > > > > > > >I would add that with Gu AK person have to be > > very > > > > humble to > > > > > > > all > > > > > > > > > > spiritual > > > > > > > > > > > >techers and natives, like priests, gurus, > > teachers. > > > > With Ma > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > person must > > > > > > > > > > > >practise Ahumsa (nonviolence) , with Ch the > > native is > > > > always > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > caring, > > > > > > > > > > > >and gives emotions but the problem is that > they > > never > > > > get > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > > >themselves from other people. The person must > > learn > > > > lessons > > > > > > > also > > > > > > > > > > from the > > > > > > > > > > > >people represented with AK. Ch / mother, Sy / > > father > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > everything those > > > > > > > > > > > >grahas represent.> > > > > > > > > > > >Take few examples of people you know and see > it > > in > > > > praxix. > > > > > > > Best > > > > > > > > > > wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan> > > > > > > > > > > >Hari Om Tat Sat> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ > wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > hraum namah adityaya> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Su,> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Person should use a lot of glass and > sing/hum > > > > melodies.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > Rafal Gendarz> > > > > > > > > > > > Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > > > > > > > > > > > email: rafal@> > > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > v reality napisaÅ,(a): Dear Rafalji/Members> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > This is an interesting discussion. Could we > > discuss > > > > other > > > > > > > AKs > > > > > > > > > > too. I read> > > > > > > > > > > > in an article that natives with Moon as AK > need > > to > > > > learn > > > > > > > to be > > > > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > > > >caring> > > > > > > > > > > > and loving to others. But I know of a chart > > where > > > > the > > > > > > > native > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > >by> > > > > > > > > > > > nature very caring, loving and concerned > about > > > > others > > > > > > > since > > > > > > > > > > young. So > > > > > > > > > > > >what> > > > > > > > > > > > is the lesson to be learnt?> > > > > > > > > > > > thanks> > > > > > > > > > > > Su> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl>> > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK> > > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 10:24:14 +0200> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > *hraum namah adityaya*> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Dear LN Kumar,> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >With Ju AK person should learn to respect > > others > > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > >tradition,> > > > > > > > > > > > >should be ready to learn from others. When > Ju > > is in > > > > > > > kendra to > > > > > > > > > > AK or is > > > > > > > > > > > >AK> > > > > > > > > > > > >himself then native thinks that he knows > > everything > > > > and > > > > > > > now > > > > > > > > > He > > > > > > > > > > can share> > > > > > > > > > > > >His knowledge with everybody. Good teachers > of > > > > course > > > > > > > comes > > > > > > > > > from> > > > > > > > > > > > >AK-Jupiter- Natives, as this graha will be > > > > naturally in > > > > > > > > > > Karakamsa.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >With MA AK person should learn to catalyze > > energies > > > > > > > through > > > > > > > > > > ZEN, TAI-CHI > > > > > > > > > > > >or> > > > > > > > > > > > >other techniques, while with JU AK person > > should > > > > learn to > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > more humble> > > > > > > > > > > > >regarding knowledge. Of course person can > be > > > > focused on > > > > > > > > > Jupiter-> > > > > > > > > > karakas> > > > > > > > > > > > >like kids, spirituality, law, luck etc.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Mahadasa of AK brings lesson to us so its > not > > so > > > > easy > > > > > > > > > > materially but> > > > > > > > > > > > >inspiring spiritually, so if Surya is in > good > > > > placement > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > then it > > > > > > > > > > > >can> > > > > > > > > > > > >be not so bad as person is spiritual.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz> > > > > > > > > > > > >Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > > > > > > > > > > > >email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com> > > > > > > > > > > > >Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >narender kumar napisa?(a):> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Dear Gurujans,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Kindly throw some light on Jupiter as> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Atmakaraka and having Jupiter as mahadasha.> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Respectful Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>LN Kumar> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>__________ __ _________ _________ > _________ > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > > _________ _> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the > > > > Internet in > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > pocket: > > > > > > > > > > > >mail,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>news, photos & more.> > > > > > > > > > > > >>http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC> > > > > > > > > > > > >><http://mobile. / go?refer= > 1GNXIC>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ > > _________ > > > > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > _> > > > > > > > > > > > Advertisement: It's simple! 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Find > what > > you > > > > want at > > > > > > > > > > www.eBay.com. au > > > > > > > > > > > http://a.ninemsn. com.au/> > > > > > > > > b.aspx?URL=http% 3A%2F%2Frover% 2Eebay%2Ecom%> > > > > > > > > > 2Frover%2F1% 2F705%2D10129% 2D5668%2D323% 2F4%2F%> > 3Fid%> > > > > > > > > > 3D6 & _t=763807330 & _r=email_ taglines_ EBAY & _m=EXT> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ---> > > > > Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the Internet in > your > > > > pocket: mail, news, photos & more.> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ > _> > > > Choose the right car based on your needs. Check out > Autos> > > new Car Finder tool.> > > > http://autos. / carfinder/> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _> > ____________ ___> > > Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the Internet in your > > pocket: mail, news, photos & more. > > > http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC> > >> >> > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _____________ __> Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Answers - Check it out.> http://answers. / dir/?link= list & sid= 396545469> Luggage? GPS? Comic books? Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 31, 2007 Report Share Posted August 31, 2007 Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Promila, > From AL, saturn/sun are at 6/12 axis, and ketu/rahu are at 4/10 axisArudha Lagna is Aries with exalted Surya giving a person that emphasises 'being' and 'now'. Saturn exalted but retrograde in the 7th from AL shows the obstruction he faced in life with orthodox religion and rigid belief systems. > Sun, the AK is exalted in rasi chart in 10th house. Since he was an evolved soul. We don't need to look its D-9 position as much. Am I correct? I think you are using Cancer Lagna, when actually his Lagna is Makara. Also, seeing the Navamsa position is very important.Respectfully,Michaltijanadamjanovic <nix_nixensohamsa Sent: Friday, August 31, 2007 11:17:40 PM Jiddu Krishnamurti Om Gurave Namah Dear Promila, Please send the birth chart details of Jiddu Krishnamurti so that everybody can follow. Warm regards, Tijana sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@.. .> wrote: > > Jiddu Krishnamurti' s chart is very interesting: > Both Saturn ® and Sun are exalted and are opposite each other on 4/10 axis. > Sun, the AK is exalted in rasi chart in 10th house. Since he was an evolved soul. We don't need to look its D-9 position as much. Am I correct? > An exalted atmakaraka, who is a natural significator of atma taught the world to observe the "I". Interesting enough that he discouraged talks on reincarnation, intuition, meditation, astrology etc. He discouraged adopting a mechanical approach towards religion and spirituality. His idea of meditation is really beautiful! That said, he wanted the world to go deeper to understand the need why we discuss and depend on these stuff. This is a result of saturn/sun opposition. > From AL, saturn/sun are at 6/12 axis, and ketu/rahu are at 4/10 axis. > Pisces rises in D-9, a spiritual sign. Luminaries are on 4/10 axis-- complementing each other. So the mind and the atma were well aligned. The saturn and jupiter are together. Saturn being stronger, so he rejected all dogmas and systems. > In D-60, the moon is in the ninth house shows his skills in past lives: unmatched understanding of the mind. The moon is also in a quadrant from the AK. So the soul really wanted to rip apart human psyche to find the truth in next life. Have I got it right? > In D-60, The AK is with Ketu, the mokshakaraka, and its exalted dispositor is in the twelfth house--this is 6/12 axis. > Just my thoughts. I've just begun to understand astrology, so can't see beyond the above points. > > Promila > > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...> > sohamsa@ .com > Friday, August 31, 2007 4:12:27 AM > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and v_reality) > > > Dear Sharat, > I cant share the chart of the person that I mentioned. However, > among famous people the ones with Sun AK that I remember are: > 1) Swami Vivekananda (Sun in Sag, 1st house) > 2) Jiddu Krishnamurti (Sun exalted in 4th house) May 12, 1895, > 0:23am, 78E30, 13N33, +5:14GMT. Extremely insightful writings on the > nature/contents of the mind. > 3) Gautam Buddha (I saw the chart somewhere and it was exalted Sun > AK, but I cant verify it anymore, perhaps someone else can suggest > the time) > I know that there was this one Guru on this group - Partha - he was > Sun AK too and wrote many insightful posts about the nature of self, > but he doesnt seem to be posting anymore. I am pretty sure that > Bharatji (if you dont mind my identifying you) is Sun AK too, and > you can see for yourself that he writes in the same vein as well. > > Hope this helps, > > Sundeep > > sohamsa@ .com, " Sharat" <gidoc@> wrote: > > > > |Namah Shivaya| > > Dear Sundeep, > > Sun AK thus 'struggles' as it can always see ' himself' clearly > while for others the drive is on other aspects of life, you quote > mirror as an apt example. > > It will help to study how Sun AK do their karmas and how it > effects their spirituality. > > Any example charts? > > Best > > Sharat > > > > - > > vedicastrostudent > > sohamsa@ .com > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 7:40 PM > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > v_reality) > > > > > > Dear Promila, > > First, thanks to all of you (Sharat, Tijanaji, Promila, Nitish) > for > > responding. > > > > But Promila, how dare you stop when you've made such a wonderful > > point :-) See, Tijanaji's point that ego is simply a situation > where > > we take more than we give is fraught with problems. It is simply > a > > statement made from Guru to Shishya with a lot of unsaid context > > around it and that context is only understood by Guru and > Shishya. > > You cannot use this definition when trying to fathom the depths > of > > the many good works on psychology and spirituality. See, what is > it > > that we are "giving" and "taking" and is that what all the > > books/scriptures mean when they talk about ego? By this > definition, > > Bill Gates and Warren Buffet can be said to have the smallest > egos > > in the world, because they both have decided to give virtually > ALL > > their material belongings (worth about $50 billion each) to > charity. > > I know you are all shaking your heads saying, "but that is not > what > > was meant". So, you didnt mean it materially right? So what way > was > > it meant? Psychologically? But then what is it that you > are "giving" > > and "taking"? And if you play around a little more and test it > out, > > Promila's wonderful example will throw you in another fix - > because > > as she rightly observes it is not only the "great me" > moods/types > > that are egotistical, but also the "poor me" moods/types. > The "poor > > me" types are generally self-flagellating types who work very > hard > > for others (family, spouse, children etc) and on the > surface "give" > > a lot. In both cases, the focus on "me" is exaggerated. I prefer > > Carl Jung's definition of ego, and notice that it is what is > meant > > in most deep contexts. Ego is simply the center of > consciousness. > > The psyche not only has the Ego but the unconscious also. Within > the > > unconscious is a deeper center called the Self, which is perhaps > the > > indicator of the Atma. An egotistical person, whether the "poor > me" > > type or the "great me" type has greater concentration of mental > > energy on the ego, and less in the Self (the Self is always > > perceived as divinity). Every AK's goal is to "reduce the ego" > i.e. > > reduce the concentration of mental energy in the ego, and > increase > > it in the Self (the divine center). That is why, to me, Sun is > the > > natural AK. When one says that everyone must "serve", no matter > how > > it manifests *physically* , psychologically they are reducing the > > concentration of energy in the ego and increasing it in the > Self. > > Different chara AKs are different only in the method they adopt > to > > cause a reduction in ego of the native. Venus AKs have > relationship > > experiences that put the mirror in front of the ego and make it > give > > up its energy to the Self, Rahu AKs have rahu like experiences I > > guess that put the mirror in front of the ego. With Sun AK, I > have > > found the mirror is direct. > > > > I only post because I continue to dispute the implication that > Sun > > AKs have larger egos. They are no different from others, but > their > > experiences quickly bring direct and harsh focus on themselves > > rather than through other aspects of their interactions with the > > world. The chara karakatwa of Sun is not an indicator of larger > ego, > > only of the directness of the experiences that will lead to a > > reduction in it. > > > > Sundeep > > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@> > > wrote: > > > > > > Ego is not only the feeling of "I'm great", but it is also > > the "Poor me" attitude. Both great and poor me demand attention. > > I'll stop at that as it's a forum to discuss to jyotish (you > rightly > > said). > > > > > > I've Taurus ascendent . Saturn is in the third house (Cancer) > > along with Sun. Darkness and light are together. D-9 ascendent > is > > Capricon and Saturn is in the 7th house (Cancer). So Saturn is > > Virgottama. IT's also my Ishtadevta. Now tell me what's in your > > mind > > > > > > > > > > > > tijanadamjanovic <nix_nixen@> > > > sohamsa@ .com > > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 8:40:08 PM > > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > > v_reality) > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah > > > Dear Sundeep and Promila, > > > It`s inevitable to enter the sphere of philosophy in subjects > like > > > this, but we should try stick to Jyotish principles. That is > how i > > > understood Nitish`s and mine discussion. Not in a moment i > thought > > i > > > can actually define ahamkar, or even ego, and am sure it wasn`t > > > Nitish` ambition either. > > > Actually i follow a single definition of ego taught by my Guru- > ego > > is > > > nothing but a situation where we are taking more than we are > > giving. > > > If one likes to think, one can find a lot in this simple > statement > > and > > > it`s the most practical advice also. > > > Promila, where is Saturn in your rasi and navamsa chart? > > > Warm regards, > > > Tijana > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara > <promilac@ .> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > Sundeep, > > > > > > > > You post was beautiful! > > > > > > > > I don't know how technically accurate it is, but at the > > > psychological level you have made good points. I've Rahu as my > AK, > > but > > > I've major ego despite a weak Sun! Maybe it comes from Mars in > the > > D-1 > > > and D-9 ascendents. However, since Ketu is placed in D-1 > ascendent > > > (taurus) with Mars, it urges me to do a lot of self-analysis > and > > > self-obervation. Not even a single hour passes in my life > without > > > analyzing my thoughts and actions...I don't know if I make > sense > > here. > > > > > > > > > > > > P. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...> > > > > sohamsa@ .com > > > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 1:26:13 AM > > > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish > and > > v_reality) > > > > > > > > Dear Tijanaji and Nitish, > > > > > > > > I have been reading your exchange with interest in the hope > of > > > > learning something new, but I find myself disagreeing subtly > in > > the > > > > essence of what you say. In fact, deep down in the exchange > I > > find > > > > this statement made by "v_reality" which makes a lot of > sense to > > me: > > > > "Can this also be understood at a different level as the > > effacement > > > > of 'self' in a spiritual sense?". > > > > > > > > Here is my take - I have none of the scriptural knowledge > you > > both > > > > have, only I have seen several Sun AK people: I dont think > it is > > > > fair to say that Sun AK people are egotistic. See, English > also > > has > > > > a lot of words which have subtly different meanings, and the > > right > > > > one has to be used. An egotistic person is one who has a > > exaggerated > > > > sense of self-importance. Almost everyone in this world has > that > > > > (and you are fooling yourself if you deny it), it is plain > wrong > > to > > > > observe a person have Sun AK and simultaneously observe that > he > > also > > > > has an exaggerated sense of self importance and say "yes, > that > > is > > > > what the Sun AK does to him". I can cite hundreds of people > I > > know > > > > who are very self important and DONT have Sun AK, and not > only > > that > > > > may not even have a strong Sun in their chart. > > > > > > > > I personally think the only statement that can be observed > > > > repeatedly with Sun AK people is that they are egocentric > i.e. > > their > > > > view of the world is based on the individual rather than the > > > > society. They may or may not be egotistical (i.e. > egocentricity > > does > > > > not imply self importance) - the AK simply makes them go > through > > > > experiences in life such that their core self is tested. How > > they > > > > respond to it depends probably on lots of other astrological > > > > factors. The only statement I can safely make, based on pure > > > > experience, is that Sun AK people are guided to divinity > through > > > > experiences of the self, consequently their view is > egocentric. > > > > > > > > I know one Sun AK woman (dont know if I can share her data) > who > > was > > > > molested (by her own professor) and denied a higher degree > that > > she > > > > worked hard for, then get married and then divorced, then > have > > her > > > > mom die of cancer in a rather painful way, then have her > brother > > get > > > > divorced in a messy lawsuit (and then leave her too), then > (she) > > get > > > > married again and her husband develop terminal cancer very > soon > > > > afterward. Net result: she cant seem to find a strong and > > consistent > > > > support outside of herself - she has become self reliant and > > only > > > > finds consistent happiness in meditation/reiki. She is > probably > > > > egotistical in some degree too, but not in any outstanding > way > > at > > > > all, and probably much less than all the people around her.. > > > > > > > > Consequently, I really dispute the fact that Sun AK people > must > > > > learn to "reduce their ego". That is simply a general lesson > for > > all > > > > of mankind. Sun AK people's AK will guide them towards > divinity > > > > through experiences that make them focus on themselves and > > search > > > > for the truth: now that's the statement I find much more to > the > > > > point. > > > > > > > > Comments? > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > Sundeep > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, nix nixen <nix_nixen@ ..> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah > > > > > Dear Nitish, > > > > > Only from one simple statement of yours "It is not always > > > > possible for me..." i read that your AK must be nothing less > > than > > > > Sun. Am i right? If yes, then i think i`m on the right way > of > > > > finding answers on my queries. > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > > Tijana > > > > > > > > > > yeeahoo_99 <nitish.arya@ ...> wrote: > > > > > Dear Tijana, > > > > > Raja Yoga is the yoga of soul with paramatma - > deep/shallow, > > > > > material/spiritual - all kind of things have a basis only > in > > > > > paramatma. Thus, even Raja-bhanga yoga has a basis i.e. > > separation > > > > of > > > > > soul from paramatma (which is illusory only though) and > hence > > > > > material/spiritual loss depending on the kind of karma > > involved. > > > > > > > > > > As the lord of a sign, a planet rules a 12th part of the > > > > > consciousness, relatively . Thus, in part, it becomes its > > > > > responsibility to guide the affairs of that sign/house > towards > > > > > fulfillment. You may explore it further. > > > > > > > > > > It is not always possible for me to answer to your > specific > > > > queries. > > > > > Hopefully, in time, you will discover the truth of your > > queries. > > > > > > > > > > best regards, > > > > > nitish > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijanadamjanovic" > > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah > > > > > > Dear Nitish, > > > > > > Yes, all must serve. The questions raised in these > > discussions > > > > on Atma > > > > > > karakas were on the specific way of serving. > > > > > > If we say that Sun AK must learn principles of artha > shastra > > to > > > > serve, > > > > > > the same stands for Ma and Ju AK? How to differentiate? > I > > assume > > > > you > > > > > > are taking karakatvas of the houses into account also > (2nd, > > 6th, > > > > 10th)? > > > > > > The Sun/Raja gets service on the throne, but regarding > > > > spirituality > > > > > > and Atma this is related to real Raja yoga whose deepest > > meaning > > > > is > > > > > > inseparable from 10th house of indriyas (refer > > Vivekananda) . > > > > Only in > > > > > > that sense we can talk of Janaka or the perfect King. > What > > artha > > > > > > shastra principles you had in mind? > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > > > Tijana > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "yeeahoo_99" > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om TAT SAT || > > > > > > > Dear Tijana, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > > mentioning Gita in this context. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Context that was intended is Gita Chapter 3,sloka 22. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All must work if the lord of the cosmos has chosen to > > work. > > > > Thus, > > > > > > > there is nothing specific that only SUN AK has > to "serve", > > all > > > > AKs > > > > > > > "serve". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, are you implying that Sun AK gives a person > akin to > > > > Janaka?! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, Sun AK gives a person akin to Janaka - > jivanmukta - > > > > provided > > > > > > > enough effort has been put in. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you determing dharma based on this? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No, Sun AK need not be 9th lord. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra > as > > an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > The attitude of service is seen from 6th house. Leo > being > > a > > > > dharma > > > > > > > trikona sign fulfills its purpose of service through > 10th > > > > house of > > > > > > > Artha, which is 6th from it. So a Sun AK should learn > > > > principles of > > > > > > > artha shastra to serve. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All souls have to "Serve" only as there is nothing > else to > > be > > > > done > > > > > > > in the three worlds because Krishna has already > achieved > > > > everything > > > > > > > that is there to achieve in the three worlds(refer > Gita). > > > > Those who > > > > > > > do not serve, are reborn to learn to serve, whatever > be > > their > > > > AK. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus > > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself). > > > > > > > > But do you think it`s a coincidence that His Master > had > > > > exalted > > > > > > > Saturn in 9th > > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is not re-born after exhausting his karma/desires. > > Thus, > > > > > > > vivekananda (Rahu PiK) came here to exhaust his > remaining > > > > karma/ > > > > > > > desires with Ramakrishna (Rahu AK). There is no more > > substance > > > > to > > > > > > > this than a past-life karmic relationship of the two > which > > > > continued > > > > > > > in this birth also. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > NITISH > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijana" <nix_nixen@> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah > > > > > > > > Dear Nitish, > > > > > > > > Your elaboration would be even more brilliant if you > had > > > > just answer > > > > > > > > my question. > > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > mentioning > > > > > > > > Gita in this context. But, are you implying that Sun > AK > > > > gives a > > > > > > > > person akin to Janaka?! Are you determing dharma > based > > on > > > > this? Will > > > > > > > > you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra as an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus > > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself). > > > > But do > > > > > > > you > > > > > > > > think it`s a coincidence that His Master had exalted > > Saturn > > > > in 9th > > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these? > > > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > > > > > Tijana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "yeeahoo_99" > > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat || > > > > > > > > > Dear Tijana, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What is the thing that Raja will hardly ever do? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read up Gita, arthashastra and ancient texts that > show > > > > what > > > > > > > all a > > > > > > > > > Raja has to do to ensure that his subjects are > > protected > > > > and > > > > > > > progress > > > > > > > > > on the upward evolutionary path. Look at krishna, > > Janaka > > > > and > > > > > > > > > ChandraGupta Maurya and you will understand > whatever > > > > that "hardly > > > > > > > > > ever do" equates to. > > > > > > > > > Otherwise, going by your statement, AK wouldn't do > > > > anything > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > the king of the horoscope and the rest of the > karakas > > (BK, > > > > PiK, > > > > > > > Puk, > > > > > > > > > GK) i.e. his subjects will follow the suit! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, the mantra is "Shiva jnane Jiva Seva" > > (serving > > > > every > > > > > > > > > being as the full manifestation of God) that > > Narendranath > > > > > > > received > > > > > > > > > from his Master Ramakrishna who had Sun in > Aquarius. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Being Sun AK, Vivekananda had developed peculiar > > sharpness > > > > of > > > > > > > > > perception and assimilation that empowered him > with > > > > unusual power > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > pick up 'the gems' from the talks of his Master. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Sun in Sagittarius, he could, as compared to > > others, > > > > > > > easily > > > > > > > > > 'see' the deep meaning in the words of Sri > > Ramakrishna, > > > > even > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > the Master told them in simple language (Aq Sun), > and > > > > never as > > > > > > > > > preaching. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With its dispositor Jupiter in Libra, gradually > Swami > > > > > > > Vivekananda > > > > > > > > > started assimilating tips and hints on practical > > Vedanta > > > > that > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > benefit individual and collective life in the > society. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "...For spiritual persons Sun as AK should be in > > > > Jupiter`s > > > > > > > signs > > > > > > > > > > (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s very hard > task..." > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Putting up statements like you have done is not > wise. > > Sri > > > > > > > Yukteswar > > > > > > > > > Giri, has Sun AK placed in Aries and had attained > > highest > > > > level > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > spirituality. Even if Sun AK is placed in Libra, > it > > could > > > > be the > > > > > > > most > > > > > > > > > spiritual person. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AK shows the spiritual power of a sign over the > rest > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > signs/ > > > > > > > > > planets in the chart and this spiritual power > > manifests > > > > through > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > dispositor of AK and its sign placement. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards, > > > > > > > > > NITISH > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijana" > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah > > > > > > > > > > Dear Su, > > > > > > > > > > Sun is the Self. Its qualities are those of Raja > > (karaka > > > > for > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > first house, lord of the 5th, dig bala in 10th). > > What is > > > > the > > > > > > > thing > > > > > > > > > > that Raja will hardly ever do? The lesson that > has > > to be > > > > learnt > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK is serving, in the highest sence it > > gives "Shiva > > > > jnane > > > > > > > Shiva > > > > > > > > > > seva" (service of man as God)-the divine lesson > > given to > > > > us by > > > > > > > > > Swami > > > > > > > > > > Vivekananda (Sun AK). For spiritual persons Sun > as > > AK > > > > should be > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > Jupiter`s signs (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s > > very > > > > hard task. > > > > > > > > > > Warm regards, > > > > > > > > > > Tijana > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "v reality" > > <reality_v@> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bojan-ji > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for your reply. Much appreciated. > > > > > > > > > > > If I may ask another query re Sun AK. The > lesson > > to be > > > > > > > learnt > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK, > > > > > > > > > > > is the reduction of ego. Can this also be > > understood > > > > at a > > > > > > > > > > different level > > > > > > > > > > > as the effacement of 'self' in a spiritual > sense? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > Su > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan Vidakovic <janbovid@> > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com > > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK > > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 08:33:22 -0700 (PDT) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >HARE RAMA KRISHNA > > > > > > > > > > > >Dear Su > > > > > > > > > > > >I would add that with Gu AK person have to be > > very > > > > humble to > > > > > > > all > > > > > > > > > > spiritual > > > > > > > > > > > >techers and natives, like priests, gurus, > > teachers. > > > > With Ma > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > person must > > > > > > > > > > > >practise Ahumsa (nonviolence) , with Ch the > > native is > > > > always > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > caring, > > > > > > > > > > > >and gives emotions but the problem is that > they > > never > > > > get > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > > >themselves from other people. The person must > > learn > > > > lessons > > > > > > > also > > > > > > > > > > from the > > > > > > > > > > > >people represented with AK. Ch / mother, Sy / > > father > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > everything those > > > > > > > > > > > >grahas represent. > > > > > > > > > > > >Take few examples of people you know and see > it > > in > > > > praxix. > > > > > > > Best > > > > > > > > > > wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan > > > > > > > > > > > >Hari Om Tat Sat > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > hraum namah adityaya > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Su, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Person should use a lot of glass and > sing/hum > > > > melodies. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > Rafal Gendarz > > > > > > > > > > > > Sri Jagannath Center Guru > > > > > > > > > > > > email: rafal@ > > > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > v reality napisaÅ,(a): Dear Rafalji/Members > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is an interesting discussion. Could we > > discuss > > > > other > > > > > > > AKs > > > > > > > > > > too. I read > > > > > > > > > > > > in an article that natives with Moon as AK > need > > to > > > > learn > > > > > > > to be > > > > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > > > >caring > > > > > > > > > > > > and loving to others. But I know of a chart > > where > > > > the > > > > > > > native > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > >by > > > > > > > > > > > > nature very caring, loving and concerned > about > > > > others > > > > > > > since > > > > > > > > > > young. So > > > > > > > > > > > >what > > > > > > > > > > > > is the lesson to be learnt? > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks > > > > > > > > > > > > Su > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl> > > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com > > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com > > > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK > > > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 10:24:14 +0200 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > *hraum namah adityaya* > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Dear LN Kumar, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >With Ju AK person should learn to respect > > others > > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > >tradition, > > > > > > > > > > > > >should be ready to learn from others. When > Ju > > is in > > > > > > > kendra to > > > > > > > > > > AK or is > > > > > > > > > > > >AK > > > > > > > > > > > > >himself then native thinks that he knows > > everything > > > > and > > > > > > > now > > > > > > > > > He > > > > > > > > > > can share > > > > > > > > > > > > >His knowledge with everybody. Good teachers > of > > > > course > > > > > > > comes > > > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > > > > >AK-Jupiter- Natives, as this graha will be > > > > naturally in > > > > > > > > > > Karakamsa. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >With MA AK person should learn to catalyze > > energies > > > > > > > through > > > > > > > > > > ZEN, TAI-CHI > > > > > > > > > > > >or > > > > > > > > > > > > >other techniques, while with JU AK person > > should > > > > learn to > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > more humble > > > > > > > > > > > > >regarding knowledge. Of course person can > be > > > > focused on > > > > > > > > > Jupiter- > > > > > > > > > > karakas > > > > > > > > > > > > >like kids, spirituality, law, luck etc. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Mahadasa of AK brings lesson to us so its > not > > so > > > > easy > > > > > > > > > > materially but > > > > > > > > > > > > >inspiring spiritually, so if Surya is in > good > > > > placement > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > then it > > > > > > > > > > > >can > > > > > > > > > > > > >be not so bad as person is spiritual. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz > > > > > > > > > > > > >Sri Jagannath Center Guru > > > > > > > > > > > > >email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com > > > > > > > > > > > > >Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >narender kumar napisa?(a): > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>Dear Gurujans, > > > > > > > > > > > > >>Kindly throw some light on Jupiter as > > > > > > > > > > > > >>Atmakaraka and having Jupiter as mahadasha. > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>Respectful Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > >>LN Kumar > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >>__________ __ _________ _________ > _________ > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > > _________ _ > > > > > > > > > > > > >>Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the > > > > Internet in > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > pocket: > > > > > > > > > > > >mail, > > > > > > > > > > > > >>news, photos & more. > > > > > > > > > > > > >>http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC > > > > > > > > > > > > >><http://mobile. / go?refer= > 1GNXIC> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ > > _________ > > > > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > _ > > > > > > > > > > > > Advertisement: It's simple! Sell your car > for > > just > > > > $30 at > > > > > > > > > > CarPoint.com. > > > > > > > > > > > >au > > > > > > > > > > > > http://a.ninemsn. com.au/b. aspx?URL= http% > 3A% > > 2F% > > > > > > > 2Fsecure% > > > > > > > > > > > >2Dau%2Eimrworldw ide%2Ecom% 2Fcgi%2Dbin% 2Fa% > > 2Fci% > > > > 5F450304% > > > > > > > > > 2Fet% > > > > > > > > > > 5F2% > > > > > > > > > > > >2Fcg%5F801459% 2Fpi%5F1004813% 2Fai%5F859641 & > > > > _t=762955845 & > > > > > > > > > > _r=tig_AUG07 & > > > > > > > > > > > >_m=EXT > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Best wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > SJC Guru Bojan Vidakovic > > > > > > > > > > > > for articles and consultations visit > > > > > > > > > > > >http://www.jataveda s.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >----------- --------- --------- ---- > > > > > > > > > > > >Choose the right car based on your needs. > Check > > out > > > > > > > > > > > > > Autos > > > > > > > > > > new Car > > > > > > > > > > > >Finder tool. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ > > _________ _ > > > > > > > > > > > Advertisement: Make shopping exciting. Find > what > > you > > > > want at > > > > > > > > > > www.eBay.com. au > > > > > > > > > > > http://a.ninemsn. com.au/ > > > > > > > > > b.aspx?URL=http% 3A%2F%2Frover% 2Eebay%2Ecom% > > > > > > > > > > 2Frover%2F1% 2F705%2D10129% 2D5668%2D323% 2F4%2F% > > 3Fid% > > > > > > > > > > 3D6 & _t=763807330 & _r=email_ taglines_ EBAY & _m=EXT > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- --- > > > > > Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the Internet in > your > > > > pocket: mail, news, photos & more. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ > _ > > > > Choose the right car based on your needs. Check out > Autos > > > new Car Finder tool. > > > > http://autos. / carfinder/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ > > ____________ ___ > > > Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the Internet in your > > pocket: mail, news, photos & more. > > > http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _ ____________ __ > Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Answers - Check it out. > http://answers. / dir/?link= list & sid= 396545469 > Choose the right car based on your needs. Check out Autos new Car Finder tool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2007 Report Share Posted September 1, 2007 Hare Rama Krsna ||Hi Michael, Thanks for your input. His lagna is cancer. I rechecked. To verify we can do a search on google. Will get back on this point soon, in the meantime if you find some more references of capricorn lagna, please let me know. I really like the following point you made. Arudha Lagna is Aries with exalted Surya giving a person that emphasises 'being' and 'now'. Saturn exalted but retrograde in the 7th from AL shows the obstruction he faced in life with orthodox religion and rigid belief systems. However, I read long ago that if a planet is retrograde, that is, if it starts going in the opposite direction (from fwd to backwards), its signification also take a turn, that is, they are just the opposite of its natural signification. So if Saturn is retro, instead of making one a tranditionalist or conformist, it will actually take the native away from these. IF my understanding is correct, then Saturn contributed to the major event of his life when he disowned the "Order of Star of the East" and said truth is a pathless land and systems, sects, and religions only take you away from it. I would be grateful, if you also give your views on other points that I made, and please also add more analysis. It'll facilitate good learning. God Bless! Promila Michal Dziwulski <nearmichalsohamsa Sent: Saturday, September 1, 2007 1:55:23 AMRe: Jiddu Krishnamurti Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Promila,> From AL, saturn/sun are at 6/12 axis, and ketu/rahu are at 4/10 axisArudha Lagna is Aries with exalted Surya giving a person that emphasises 'being' and 'now'. Saturn exalted but retrograde in the 7th from AL shows the obstruction he faced in life with orthodox religion and rigid belief systems.> Sun, the AK is exalted in rasi chart in 10th house. Since he was an evolved soul. We don't need to look its D-9 position as much. Am I correct? I think you are using Cancer Lagna, when actually his Lagna is Makara. Also, seeing the Navamsa position is very important.Respectfully,Michal tijanadamjanovic <nix_nixen >sohamsa@ .comFriday, August 31, 2007 11:17:40 PM Jiddu Krishnamurti Om Gurave NamahDear Promila,Please send the birth chart details of Jiddu Krishnamurti so that everybody can follow.Warm regards,Tijanasohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@.. .> wrote:>> Jiddu Krishnamurti' s chart is very interesting:> Both Saturn ® and Sun are exalted and are opposite each other on 4/10 axis.> Sun, the AK is exalted in rasi chart in 10th house. Since he was an evolved soul. We don't need to look its D-9 position as much. Am I correct? > An exalted atmakaraka, who is a natural significator of atma taught the world to observe the "I". Interesting enough that he discouraged talks on reincarnation, intuition, meditation, astrology etc. He discouraged adopting a mechanical approach towards religion and spirituality. His idea of meditation is really beautiful! That said, he wanted the world to go deeper to understand the need why we discuss and depend on these stuff. This is a result of saturn/sun opposition.> From AL, saturn/sun are at 6/12 axis, and ketu/rahu are at 4/10 axis.> Pisces rises in D-9, a spiritual sign. Luminaries are on 4/10 axis--complementing each other. So the mind and the atma were well aligned. The saturn and jupiter are together. Saturn being stronger, so he rejected all dogmas and systems.> In D-60, the moon is in the ninth house shows his skills in past lives: unmatched understanding of the mind. The moon is also in a quadrant from the AK. So the soul really wanted to rip apart human psyche to find the truth in next life. Have I got it right?> In D-60, The AK is with Ketu, the mokshakaraka, and its exalted dispositor is in the twelfth house--this is 6/12 axis. > Just my thoughts. I've just begun to understand astrology, so can't see beyond the above points. > > Promila> > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...>> sohamsa@ .com> Friday, August 31, 2007 4:12:27 AM> Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and v_reality)> > > Dear Sharat,> I cant share the chart of the person that I mentioned. However, > among famous people the ones with Sun AK that I remember are:> 1) Swami Vivekananda (Sun in Sag, 1st house)> 2) Jiddu Krishnamurti (Sun exalted in 4th house) May 12, 1895, > 0:23am, 78E30, 13N33, +5:14GMT. Extremely insightful writings on the > nature/contents of the mind.> 3) Gautam Buddha (I saw the chart somewhere and it was exalted Sun > AK, but I cant verify it anymore, perhaps someone else can suggest > the time)> I know that there was this one Guru on this group - Partha - he was > Sun AK too and wrote many insightful posts about the nature of self, > but he doesnt seem to be posting anymore. I am pretty sure that > Bharatji (if you dont mind my identifying you) is Sun AK too, and > you can see for yourself that he writes in the same vein as well. > > Hope this helps,> > Sundeep> > sohamsa@ .com, " Sharat" <gidoc@> wrote:> >> > |Namah Shivaya|> > Dear Sundeep,> > Sun AK thus 'struggles' as it can always see ' himself' clearly > while for others the drive is on other aspects of life, you quote > mirror as an apt example.> > It will help to study how Sun AK do their karmas and how it > effects their spirituality.> > Any example charts?> > Best> > Sharat> > > > - > > vedicastrostudent > > sohamsa@ .com > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 7:40 PM> > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > v_reality)> > > > > > Dear Promila,> > First, thanks to all of you (Sharat, Tijanaji, Promila, Nitish) > for > > responding.> > > > But Promila, how dare you stop when you've made such a wonderful > > point :-) See, Tijanaji's point that ego is simply a situation > where > > we take more than we give is fraught with problems. It is simply > a > > statement made from Guru to Shishya with a lot of unsaid context > > around it and that context is only understood by Guru and > Shishya. > > You cannot use this definition when trying to fathom the depths > of > > the many good works on psychology and spirituality. See, what is > it > > that we are "giving" and "taking" and is that what all the > > books/scriptures mean when they talk about ego? By this > definition, > > Bill Gates and Warren Buffet can be said to have the smallest > egos > > in the world, because they both have decided to give virtually > ALL > > their material belongings (worth about $50 billion each) to > charity. > > I know you are all shaking your heads saying, "but that is not > what > > was meant". So, you didnt mean it materially right? So what way > was > > it meant? Psychologically? But then what is it that you > are "giving" > > and "taking"? And if you play around a little more and test it > out, > > Promila's wonderful example will throw you in another fix - > because > > as she rightly observes it is not only the "great me" > moods/types > > that are egotistical, but also the "poor me" moods/types. > The "poor > > me" types are generally self-flagellating types who work very > hard > > for others (family, spouse, children etc) and on the > surface "give" > > a lot. In both cases, the focus on "me" is exaggerated. I prefer > > Carl Jung's definition of ego, and notice that it is what is > meant > > in most deep contexts. Ego is simply the center of > consciousness. > > The psyche not only has the Ego but the unconscious also. Within > the > > unconscious is a deeper center called the Self, which is perhaps > the > > indicator of the Atma. An egotistical person, whether the "poor > me" > > type or the "great me" type has greater concentration of mental > > energy on the ego, and less in the Self (the Self is always > > perceived as divinity). Every AK's goal is to "reduce the ego" > i.e. > > reduce the concentration of mental energy in the ego, and > increase > > it in the Self (the divine center). That is why, to me, Sun is > the > > natural AK. When one says that everyone must "serve", no matter > how > > it manifests *physically* , psychologically they are reducing the > > concentration of energy in the ego and increasing it in the > Self. > > Different chara AKs are different only in the method they adopt > to > > cause a reduction in ego of the native. Venus AKs have > relationship > > experiences that put the mirror in front of the ego and make it > give > > up its energy to the Self, Rahu AKs have rahu like experiences I > > guess that put the mirror in front of the ego. With Sun AK, I > have > > found the mirror is direct.> > > > I only post because I continue to dispute the implication that > Sun > > AKs have larger egos. They are no different from others, but > their > > experiences quickly bring direct and harsh focus on themselves > > rather than through other aspects of their interactions with the > > world. The chara karakatwa of Sun is not an indicator of larger > ego, > > only of the directness of the experiences that will lead to a > > reduction in it.> > > > Sundeep> > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@> > > wrote:> > >> > > Ego is not only the feeling of "I'm great", but it is also > > the "Poor me" attitude. Both great and poor me demand attention. > > I'll stop at that as it's a forum to discuss to jyotish (you > rightly > > said).> > > > > > I've Taurus ascendent . Saturn is in the third house (Cancer) > > along with Sun. Darkness and light are together. D-9 ascendent > is > > Capricon and Saturn is in the 7th house (Cancer). So Saturn is > > Virgottama. IT's also my Ishtadevta. Now tell me what's in your > > mind > > > > > > > > > > > > tijanadamjanovic <nix_nixen@>> > > sohamsa@ .com> > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 8:40:08 PM> > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > > v_reality)> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > Dear Sundeep and Promila,> > > It`s inevitable to enter the sphere of philosophy in subjects > like> > > this, but we should try stick to Jyotish principles. That is > how i> > > understood Nitish`s and mine discussion. Not in a moment i > thought > > i> > > can actually define ahamkar, or even ego, and am sure it wasn`t> > > Nitish` ambition either. > > > Actually i follow a single definition of ego taught by my Guru-> ego > > is> > > nothing but a situation where we are taking more than we are > > giving.> > > If one likes to think, one can find a lot in this simple > statement > > and> > > it`s the most practical advice also.> > > Promila, where is Saturn in your rasi and navamsa chart?> > > Warm regards,> > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara > <promilac@ .> > > wrote:> > > >> > > > Sundeep,> > > > > > > > You post was beautiful!> > > > > > > > I don't know how technically accurate it is, but at the> > > psychological level you have made good points. I've Rahu as my > AK, > > but> > > I've major ego despite a weak Sun! Maybe it comes from Mars in > the > > D-1> > > and D-9 ascendents. However, since Ketu is placed in D-1 > ascendent> > > (taurus) with Mars, it urges me to do a lot of self-analysis > and> > > self-obervation. Not even a single hour passes in my life > without> > > analyzing my thoughts and actions...I don't know if I make > sense > > here.> > > > > > > > > > > > P.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...>> > > > sohamsa@ .com> > > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 1:26:13 AM> > > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish > and > > v_reality)> > > > > > > > Dear Tijanaji and Nitish,> > > > > > > > I have been reading your exchange with interest in the hope > of > > > > learning something new, but I find myself disagreeing subtly > in > > the > > > > essence of what you say. In fact, deep down in the exchange > I > > find > > > > this statement made by "v_reality" which makes a lot of > sense to > > me:> > > > "Can this also be understood at a different level as the > > effacement > > > > of 'self' in a spiritual sense?".> > > > > > > > Here is my take - I have none of the scriptural knowledge > you > > both > > > > have, only I have seen several Sun AK people: I dont think > it is > > > > fair to say that Sun AK people are egotistic. See, English > also > > has > > > > a lot of words which have subtly different meanings, and the > > right > > > > one has to be used. An egotistic person is one who has a > > exaggerated > > > > sense of self-importance. Almost everyone in this world has > that > > > > (and you are fooling yourself if you deny it), it is plain > wrong > > to > > > > observe a person have Sun AK and simultaneously observe that > he > > also > > > > has an exaggerated sense of self importance and say "yes, > that > > is > > > > what the Sun AK does to him". I can cite hundreds of people > I > > know > > > > who are very self important and DONT have Sun AK, and not > only > > that > > > > may not even have a strong Sun in their chart.> > > > > > > > I personally think the only statement that can be observed > > > > repeatedly with Sun AK people is that they are egocentric > i.e. > > their > > > > view of the world is based on the individual rather than the > > > > society. They may or may not be egotistical (i.e. > egocentricity > > does > > > > not imply self importance) - the AK simply makes them go > through > > > > experiences in life such that their core self is tested. How > > they > > > > respond to it depends probably on lots of other astrological > > > > factors. The only statement I can safely make, based on pure > > > > experience, is that Sun AK people are guided to divinity > through > > > > experiences of the self, consequently their view is > egocentric.> > > > > > > > I know one Sun AK woman (dont know if I can share her data) > who > > was > > > > molested (by her own professor) and denied a higher degree > that > > she > > > > worked hard for, then get married and then divorced, then > have > > her > > > > mom die of cancer in a rather painful way, then have her > brother > > get > > > > divorced in a messy lawsuit (and then leave her too), then > (she) > > get > > > > married again and her husband develop terminal cancer very > soon > > > > afterward. Net result: she cant seem to find a strong and > > consistent > > > > support outside of herself - she has become self reliant and > > only > > > > finds consistent happiness in meditation/reiki. She is > probably > > > > egotistical in some degree too, but not in any outstanding > way > > at > > > > all, and probably much less than all the people around her..> > > > > > > > Consequently, I really dispute the fact that Sun AK people > must > > > > learn to "reduce their ego". That is simply a general lesson > for > > all > > > > of mankind. Sun AK people's AK will guide them towards > divinity > > > > through experiences that make them focus on themselves and > > search > > > > for the truth: now that's the statement I find much more to > the > > > > point.> > > > > > > > Comments?> > > > > > > > Thanks,> > > > > > > > Sundeep> > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, nix nixen <nix_nixen@ ..> > wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > Only from one simple statement of yours "It is not always > > > > possible for me..." i read that your AK must be nothing less > > than > > > > Sun. Am i right? If yes, then i think i`m on the right way > of > > > > finding answers on my queries.> > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > yeeahoo_99 <nitish.arya@ ...> wrote:> > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > Raja Yoga is the yoga of soul with paramatma - > deep/shallow,> > > > > material/spiritual - all kind of things have a basis only > in> > > > > paramatma. Thus, even Raja-bhanga yoga has a basis i.e. > > separation > > > > of> > > > > soul from paramatma (which is illusory only though) and > hence> > > > > material/spiritual loss depending on the kind of karma > > involved.> > > > > > > > > > As the lord of a sign, a planet rules a 12th part of the> > > > > consciousness, relatively . Thus, in part, it becomes its> > > > > responsibility to guide the affairs of that sign/house > towards> > > > > fulfillment. You may explore it further.> > > > > > > > > > It is not always possible for me to answer to your > specific > > > > queries.> > > > > Hopefully, in time, you will discover the truth of your > > queries.> > > > > > > > > > best regards,> > > > > nitish> > > > > > > > > > --- In sohamsa@ .com, "tijanadamjanovic" > > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > > Yes, all must serve. The questions raised in these > > discussions > > > > on Atma> > > > > > karakas were on the specific way of serving. > > > > > > If we say that Sun AK must learn principles of artha > shastra > > to > > > > serve,> > > > > > the same stands for Ma and Ju AK? How to differentiate? > I > > assume > > > > you> > > > > > are taking karakatvas of the houses into account also > (2nd, > > 6th, > > > > 10th)?> > > > > > The Sun/Raja gets service on the throne, but regarding > > > > spirituality> > > > > > and Atma this is related to real Raja yoga whose deepest > > meaning > > > > is> > > > > > inseparable from 10th house of indriyas (refer > > Vivekananda) . > > > > Only in> > > > > > that sense we can talk of Janaka or the perfect King. > What > > artha> > > > > > shastra principles you had in mind?> > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "yeeahoo_99" > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > > > wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > || Om TAT SAT ||> > > > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > > mentioning Gita in this context.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Context that was intended is Gita Chapter 3,sloka 22.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > All must work if the lord of the cosmos has chosen to > > work. > > > > Thus, > > > > > > > there is nothing specific that only SUN AK has > to "serve", > > all > > > > AKs > > > > > > > "serve".> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, are you implying that Sun AK gives a person > akin to > > > > Janaka?! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, Sun AK gives a person akin to Janaka - > jivanmukta - > > > > provided > > > > > > > enough effort has been put in.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you determing dharma based on this? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No, Sun AK need not be 9th lord.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra > as > > an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > The attitude of service is seen from 6th house. Leo > being > > a > > > > dharma > > > > > > > trikona sign fulfills its purpose of service through > 10th > > > > house of > > > > > > > Artha, which is 6th from it. So a Sun AK should learn > > > > principles of > > > > > > > artha shastra to serve.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All souls have to "Serve" only as there is nothing > else to > > be > > > > done > > > > > > > in the three worlds because Krishna has already > achieved > > > > everything > > > > > > > that is there to achieve in the three worlds(refer > Gita). > > > > Those who > > > > > > > do not serve, are reborn to learn to serve, whatever > be > > their > > > > AK.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus> > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself).> > > > > > > > But do you think it`s a coincidence that His Master > had > > > > exalted > > > > > > > Saturn in 9th> > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is not re-born after exhausting his karma/desires. > > Thus, > > > > > > > vivekananda (Rahu PiK) came here to exhaust his > remaining > > > > karma/> > > > > > > desires with Ramakrishna (Rahu AK). There is no more > > substance > > > > to > > > > > > > this than a past-life karmic relationship of the two > which > > > > continued > > > > > > > in this birth also.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards,> > > > > > > NITISH> > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijana" <nix_nixen@> > > wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > > > > Your elaboration would be even more brilliant if you > had > > > > just answer> > > > > > > > my question.> > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > mentioning> > > > > > > > Gita in this context. But, are you implying that Sun > AK > > > > gives a> > > > > > > > person akin to Janaka?! Are you determing dharma > based > > on > > > > this? Will> > > > > > > > you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra as an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus> > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself). > > > > But do > > > > > > > you> > > > > > > > think it`s a coincidence that His Master had exalted > > Saturn > > > > in 9th> > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these? > > > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "yeeahoo_99" > > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat ||> > > > > > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What is the thing that Raja will hardly ever do?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read up Gita, arthashastra and ancient texts that > show > > > > what > > > > > > > all a > > > > > > > > > Raja has to do to ensure that his subjects are > > protected > > > > and > > > > > > > progress > > > > > > > > > on the upward evolutionary path. Look at krishna, > > Janaka > > > > and > > > > > > > > > ChandraGupta Maurya and you will understand > whatever > > > > that "hardly > > > > > > > > > ever do" equates to.> > > > > > > > > Otherwise, going by your statement, AK wouldn't do > > > > anything > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > the king of the horoscope and the rest of the > karakas > > (BK, > > > > PiK, > > > > > > > Puk, > > > > > > > > > GK) i.e. his subjects will follow the suit!> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, the mantra is "Shiva jnane Jiva Seva" > > (serving > > > > every > > > > > > > > > being as the full manifestation of God) that > > Narendranath > > > > > > > received > > > > > > > > > from his Master Ramakrishna who had Sun in > Aquarius.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Being Sun AK, Vivekananda had developed peculiar > > sharpness > > > > of > > > > > > > > > perception and assimilation that empowered him > with > > > > unusual power > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > pick up 'the gems' from the talks of his Master.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Sun in Sagittarius, he could, as compared to > > others, > > > > > > > easily > > > > > > > > > 'see' the deep meaning in the words of Sri > > Ramakrishna, > > > > even > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > the Master told them in simple language (Aq Sun), > and > > > > never as > > > > > > > > > preaching.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With its dispositor Jupiter in Libra, gradually > Swami > > > > > > > Vivekananda > > > > > > > > > started assimilating tips and hints on practical > > Vedanta > > > > that > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > benefit individual and collective life in the > society.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "...For spiritual persons Sun as AK should be in > > > > Jupiter`s > > > > > > > signs > > > > > > > > > > (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s very hard > task..."> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Putting up statements like you have done is not > wise. > > Sri > > > > > > > Yukteswar > > > > > > > > > Giri, has Sun AK placed in Aries and had attained > > highest > > > > level > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > spirituality. Even if Sun AK is placed in Libra, > it > > could > > > > be the > > > > > > > most > > > > > > > > > spiritual person.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AK shows the spiritual power of a sign over the > rest > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > signs/> > > > > > > > > planets in the chart and this spiritual power > > manifests > > > > through > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > dispositor of AK and its sign placement.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards,> > > > > > > > > NITISH> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijana" > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > > > > > Dear Su,> > > > > > > > > > Sun is the Self. Its qualities are those of Raja > > (karaka > > > > for > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > first house, lord of the 5th, dig bala in 10th). > > What is > > > > the > > > > > > > thing > > > > > > > > > > that Raja will hardly ever do? The lesson that > has > > to be > > > > learnt > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK is serving, in the highest sence it > > gives "Shiva > > > > jnane > > > > > > > Shiva > > > > > > > > > > seva" (service of man as God)-the divine lesson > > given to > > > > us by > > > > > > > > > Swami > > > > > > > > > > Vivekananda (Sun AK). For spiritual persons Sun > as > > AK > > > > should be > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > Jupiter`s signs (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s > > very > > > > hard task.> > > > > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "v reality" > > <reality_v@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bojan-ji> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for your reply. Much appreciated.> > > > > > > > > > > If I may ask another query re Sun AK. The > lesson > > to be > > > > > > > learnt > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK, > > > > > > > > > > > is the reduction of ego. Can this also be > > understood > > > > at a > > > > > > > > > > different level > > > > > > > > > > > as the effacement of 'self' in a spiritual > sense?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks> > > > > > > > > > > Su> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan Vidakovic <janbovid@>> > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK> > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 08:33:22 -0700 (PDT)> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >HARE RAMA KRISHNA> > > > > > > > > > > >Dear Su> > > > > > > > > > > >I would add that with Gu AK person have to be > > very > > > > humble to > > > > > > > all > > > > > > > > > > spiritual > > > > > > > > > > > >techers and natives, like priests, gurus, > > teachers. > > > > With Ma > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > person must > > > > > > > > > > > >practise Ahumsa (nonviolence) , with Ch the > > native is > > > > always > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > caring, > > > > > > > > > > > >and gives emotions but the problem is that > they > > never > > > > get > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > > >themselves from other people. The person must > > learn > > > > lessons > > > > > > > also > > > > > > > > > > from the > > > > > > > > > > > >people represented with AK. Ch / mother, Sy / > > father > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > everything those > > > > > > > > > > > >grahas represent.> > > > > > > > > > > >Take few examples of people you know and see > it > > in > > > > praxix. > > > > > > > Best > > > > > > > > > > wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan> > > > > > > > > > > >Hari Om Tat Sat> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ > wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > hraum namah adityaya> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Su,> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Person should use a lot of glass and > sing/hum > > > > melodies.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > Rafal Gendarz> > > > > > > > > > > > Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > > > > > > > > > > > email: rafal@> > > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > v reality napisaÅ,(a): Dear Rafalji/Members> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > This is an interesting discussion. Could we > > discuss > > > > other > > > > > > > AKs > > > > > > > > > > too. I read> > > > > > > > > > > > in an article that natives with Moon as AK > need > > to > > > > learn > > > > > > > to be > > > > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > > > >caring> > > > > > > > > > > > and loving to others. But I know of a chart > > where > > > > the > > > > > > > native > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > >by> > > > > > > > > > > > nature very caring, loving and concerned > about > > > > others > > > > > > > since > > > > > > > > > > young. So > > > > > > > > > > > >what> > > > > > > > > > > > is the lesson to be learnt?> > > > > > > > > > > > thanks> > > > > > > > > > > > Su> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl>> > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK> > > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 10:24:14 +0200> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > *hraum namah adityaya*> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Dear LN Kumar,> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >With Ju AK person should learn to respect > > others > > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > >tradition,> > > > > > > > > > > > >should be ready to learn from others. When > Ju > > is in > > > > > > > kendra to > > > > > > > > > > AK or is > > > > > > > > > > > >AK> > > > > > > > > > > > >himself then native thinks that he knows > > everything > > > > and > > > > > > > now > > > > > > > > > He > > > > > > > > > > can share> > > > > > > > > > > > >His knowledge with everybody. Good teachers > of > > > > course > > > > > > > comes > > > > > > > > > from> > > > > > > > > > > > >AK-Jupiter- Natives, as this graha will be > > > > naturally in > > > > > > > > > > Karakamsa.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >With MA AK person should learn to catalyze > > energies > > > > > > > through > > > > > > > > > > ZEN, TAI-CHI > > > > > > > > > > > >or> > > > > > > > > > > > >other techniques, while with JU AK person > > should > > > > learn to > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > more humble> > > > > > > > > > > > >regarding knowledge. Of course person can > be > > > > focused on > > > > > > > > > Jupiter-> > > > > > > > > > karakas> > > > > > > > > > > > >like kids, spirituality, law, luck etc.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Mahadasa of AK brings lesson to us so its > not > > so > > > > easy > > > > > > > > > > materially but> > > > > > > > > > > > >inspiring spiritually, so if Surya is in > good > > > > placement > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > then it > > > > > > > > > > > >can> > > > > > > > > > > > >be not so bad as person is spiritual.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz> > > > > > > > > > > > >Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > > > > > > > > > > > >email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com> > > > > > > > > > > > >Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >narender kumar napisa?(a):> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Dear Gurujans,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Kindly throw some light on Jupiter as> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Atmakaraka and having Jupiter as mahadasha.> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Respectful Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>LN Kumar> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>__________ __ _________ _________ > _________ > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > > _________ _> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the > > > > Internet in > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > pocket: > > > > > > > > > > > >mail,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>news, photos & more.> > > > > > > > > > > > >>http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC> > > > > > > > > > > > >><http://mobile. / go?refer= > 1GNXIC>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ > > _________ > > > > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > _> > > > > > > > > > > > Advertisement: It's simple! 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Guest guest Posted September 1, 2007 Report Share Posted September 1, 2007 Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Promila,Here are the details given earlier in this thread:2) Jiddu Krishnamurti (Sun exalted in 4th house) May 12, 1895, > 0:23am, 78E30, 13N33I don't know what you 'rechecked', but Capricorn is the Lagna.Respectfully,MichalPromila Chitkara <promilacsohamsa Sent: Saturday, September 1, 2007 9:04:06 PMRe: Jiddu Krishnamurti Hare Rama Krsna ||Hi Michael, Thanks for your input. His lagna is cancer. I rechecked. To verify we can do a search on google. Will get back on this point soon, in the meantime if you find some more references of capricorn lagna, please let me know. I really like the following point you made. Arudha Lagna is Aries with exalted Surya giving a person that emphasises 'being' and 'now'. Saturn exalted but retrograde in the 7th from AL shows the obstruction he faced in life with orthodox religion and rigid belief systems. However, I read long ago that if a planet is retrograde, that is, if it starts going in the opposite direction (from fwd to backwards), its signification also take a turn, that is, they are just the opposite of its natural signification. So if Saturn is retro, instead of making one a tranditionalist or conformist, it will actually take the native away from these. IF my understanding is correct, then Saturn contributed to the major event of his life when he disowned the "Order of Star of the East" and said truth is a pathless land and systems, sects, and religions only take you away from it. I would be grateful, if you also give your views on other points that I made, and please also add more analysis. It'll facilitate good learning. God Bless! Promila Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal >sohamsa@ .comSaturday, September 1, 2007 1:55:23 AMRe: Jiddu Krishnamurti Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Promila,> From AL, saturn/sun are at 6/12 axis, and ketu/rahu are at 4/10 axisArudha Lagna is Aries with exalted Surya giving a person that emphasises 'being' and 'now'. Saturn exalted but retrograde in the 7th from AL shows the obstruction he faced in life with orthodox religion and rigid belief systems.> Sun, the AK is exalted in rasi chart in 10th house. Since he was an evolved soul. We don't need to look its D-9 position as much. Am I correct? I think you are using Cancer Lagna, when actually his Lagna is Makara. Also, seeing the Navamsa position is very important.Respectfully,Michal tijanadamjanovic <nix_nixen >sohamsa@ .comFriday, August 31, 2007 11:17:40 PM Jiddu Krishnamurti Om Gurave NamahDear Promila,Please send the birth chart details of Jiddu Krishnamurti so that everybody can follow.Warm regards,Tijanasohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@.. .> wrote:>> Jiddu Krishnamurti' s chart is very interesting:> Both Saturn ® and Sun are exalted and are opposite each other on 4/10 axis.> Sun, the AK is exalted in rasi chart in 10th house. Since he was an evolved soul. We don't need to look its D-9 position as much. Am I correct? > An exalted atmakaraka, who is a natural significator of atma taught the world to observe the "I". Interesting enough that he discouraged talks on reincarnation, intuition, meditation, astrology etc. He discouraged adopting a mechanical approach towards religion and spirituality. His idea of meditation is really beautiful! That said, he wanted the world to go deeper to understand the need why we discuss and depend on these stuff. This is a result of saturn/sun opposition.> From AL, saturn/sun are at 6/12 axis, and ketu/rahu are at 4/10 axis.> Pisces rises in D-9, a spiritual sign. Luminaries are on 4/10 axis--complementing each other. So the mind and the atma were well aligned. The saturn and jupiter are together. Saturn being stronger, so he rejected all dogmas and systems.> In D-60, the moon is in the ninth house shows his skills in past lives: unmatched understanding of the mind. The moon is also in a quadrant from the AK. So the soul really wanted to rip apart human psyche to find the truth in next life. Have I got it right?> In D-60, The AK is with Ketu, the mokshakaraka, and its exalted dispositor is in the twelfth house--this is 6/12 axis. > Just my thoughts. I've just begun to understand astrology, so can't see beyond the above points. > > Promila> > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...>> sohamsa@ .com> Friday, August 31, 2007 4:12:27 AM> Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and v_reality)> > > Dear Sharat,> I cant share the chart of the person that I mentioned. However, > among famous people the ones with Sun AK that I remember are:> 1) Swami Vivekananda (Sun in Sag, 1st house)> 2) Jiddu Krishnamurti (Sun exalted in 4th house) May 12, 1895, > 0:23am, 78E30, 13N33, +5:14GMT. Extremely insightful writings on the > nature/contents of the mind.> 3) Gautam Buddha (I saw the chart somewhere and it was exalted Sun > AK, but I cant verify it anymore, perhaps someone else can suggest > the time)> I know that there was this one Guru on this group - Partha - he was > Sun AK too and wrote many insightful posts about the nature of self, > but he doesnt seem to be posting anymore. I am pretty sure that > Bharatji (if you dont mind my identifying you) is Sun AK too, and > you can see for yourself that he writes in the same vein as well. > > Hope this helps,> > Sundeep> > sohamsa@ .com, " Sharat" <gidoc@> wrote:> >> > |Namah Shivaya|> > Dear Sundeep,> > Sun AK thus 'struggles' as it can always see ' himself' clearly > while for others the drive is on other aspects of life, you quote > mirror as an apt example.> > It will help to study how Sun AK do their karmas and how it > effects their spirituality.> > Any example charts?> > Best> > Sharat> > > > - > > vedicastrostudent > > sohamsa@ .com > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 7:40 PM> > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > v_reality)> > > > > > Dear Promila,> > First, thanks to all of you (Sharat, Tijanaji, Promila, Nitish) > for > > responding.> > > > But Promila, how dare you stop when you've made such a wonderful > > point :-) See, Tijanaji's point that ego is simply a situation > where > > we take more than we give is fraught with problems. It is simply > a > > statement made from Guru to Shishya with a lot of unsaid context > > around it and that context is only understood by Guru and > Shishya. > > You cannot use this definition when trying to fathom the depths > of > > the many good works on psychology and spirituality. See, what is > it > > that we are "giving" and "taking" and is that what all the > > books/scriptures mean when they talk about ego? By this > definition, > > Bill Gates and Warren Buffet can be said to have the smallest > egos > > in the world, because they both have decided to give virtually > ALL > > their material belongings (worth about $50 billion each) to > charity. > > I know you are all shaking your heads saying, "but that is not > what > > was meant". So, you didnt mean it materially right? So what way > was > > it meant? Psychologically? But then what is it that you > are "giving" > > and "taking"? And if you play around a little more and test it > out, > > Promila's wonderful example will throw you in another fix - > because > > as she rightly observes it is not only the "great me" > moods/types > > that are egotistical, but also the "poor me" moods/types. > The "poor > > me" types are generally self-flagellating types who work very > hard > > for others (family, spouse, children etc) and on the > surface "give" > > a lot. In both cases, the focus on "me" is exaggerated. I prefer > > Carl Jung's definition of ego, and notice that it is what is > meant > > in most deep contexts. Ego is simply the center of > consciousness. > > The psyche not only has the Ego but the unconscious also. Within > the > > unconscious is a deeper center called the Self, which is perhaps > the > > indicator of the Atma. An egotistical person, whether the "poor > me" > > type or the "great me" type has greater concentration of mental > > energy on the ego, and less in the Self (the Self is always > > perceived as divinity). Every AK's goal is to "reduce the ego" > i.e. > > reduce the concentration of mental energy in the ego, and > increase > > it in the Self (the divine center). That is why, to me, Sun is > the > > natural AK. When one says that everyone must "serve", no matter > how > > it manifests *physically* , psychologically they are reducing the > > concentration of energy in the ego and increasing it in the > Self. > > Different chara AKs are different only in the method they adopt > to > > cause a reduction in ego of the native. Venus AKs have > relationship > > experiences that put the mirror in front of the ego and make it > give > > up its energy to the Self, Rahu AKs have rahu like experiences I > > guess that put the mirror in front of the ego. With Sun AK, I > have > > found the mirror is direct.> > > > I only post because I continue to dispute the implication that > Sun > > AKs have larger egos. They are no different from others, but > their > > experiences quickly bring direct and harsh focus on themselves > > rather than through other aspects of their interactions with the > > world. The chara karakatwa of Sun is not an indicator of larger > ego, > > only of the directness of the experiences that will lead to a > > reduction in it.> > > > Sundeep> > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@> > > wrote:> > >> > > Ego is not only the feeling of "I'm great", but it is also > > the "Poor me" attitude. Both great and poor me demand attention. > > I'll stop at that as it's a forum to discuss to jyotish (you > rightly > > said).> > > > > > I've Taurus ascendent . Saturn is in the third house (Cancer) > > along with Sun. Darkness and light are together. D-9 ascendent > is > > Capricon and Saturn is in the 7th house (Cancer). So Saturn is > > Virgottama. IT's also my Ishtadevta. Now tell me what's in your > > mind > > > > > > > > > > > > tijanadamjanovic <nix_nixen@>> > > sohamsa@ .com> > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 8:40:08 PM> > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > > v_reality)> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > Dear Sundeep and Promila,> > > It`s inevitable to enter the sphere of philosophy in subjects > like> > > this, but we should try stick to Jyotish principles. That is > how i> > > understood Nitish`s and mine discussion. Not in a moment i > thought > > i> > > can actually define ahamkar, or even ego, and am sure it wasn`t> > > Nitish` ambition either. > > > Actually i follow a single definition of ego taught by my Guru-> ego > > is> > > nothing but a situation where we are taking more than we are > > giving.> > > If one likes to think, one can find a lot in this simple > statement > > and> > > it`s the most practical advice also.> > > Promila, where is Saturn in your rasi and navamsa chart?> > > Warm regards,> > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara > <promilac@ .> > > wrote:> > > >> > > > Sundeep,> > > > > > > > You post was beautiful!> > > > > > > > I don't know how technically accurate it is, but at the> > > psychological level you have made good points. I've Rahu as my > AK, > > but> > > I've major ego despite a weak Sun! Maybe it comes from Mars in > the > > D-1> > > and D-9 ascendents. However, since Ketu is placed in D-1 > ascendent> > > (taurus) with Mars, it urges me to do a lot of self-analysis > and> > > self-obervation. Not even a single hour passes in my life > without> > > analyzing my thoughts and actions...I don't know if I make > sense > > here.> > > > > > > > > > > > P.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...>> > > > sohamsa@ .com> > > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 1:26:13 AM> > > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish > and > > v_reality)> > > > > > > > Dear Tijanaji and Nitish,> > > > > > > > I have been reading your exchange with interest in the hope > of > > > > learning something new, but I find myself disagreeing subtly > in > > the > > > > essence of what you say. In fact, deep down in the exchange > I > > find > > > > this statement made by "v_reality" which makes a lot of > sense to > > me:> > > > "Can this also be understood at a different level as the > > effacement > > > > of 'self' in a spiritual sense?".> > > > > > > > Here is my take - I have none of the scriptural knowledge > you > > both > > > > have, only I have seen several Sun AK people: I dont think > it is > > > > fair to say that Sun AK people are egotistic. See, English > also > > has > > > > a lot of words which have subtly different meanings, and the > > right > > > > one has to be used. An egotistic person is one who has a > > exaggerated > > > > sense of self-importance. Almost everyone in this world has > that > > > > (and you are fooling yourself if you deny it), it is plain > wrong > > to > > > > observe a person have Sun AK and simultaneously observe that > he > > also > > > > has an exaggerated sense of self importance and say "yes, > that > > is > > > > what the Sun AK does to him". I can cite hundreds of people > I > > know > > > > who are very self important and DONT have Sun AK, and not > only > > that > > > > may not even have a strong Sun in their chart.> > > > > > > > I personally think the only statement that can be observed > > > > repeatedly with Sun AK people is that they are egocentric > i.e. > > their > > > > view of the world is based on the individual rather than the > > > > society. They may or may not be egotistical (i.e. > egocentricity > > does > > > > not imply self importance) - the AK simply makes them go > through > > > > experiences in life such that their core self is tested. How > > they > > > > respond to it depends probably on lots of other astrological > > > > factors. The only statement I can safely make, based on pure > > > > experience, is that Sun AK people are guided to divinity > through > > > > experiences of the self, consequently their view is > egocentric.> > > > > > > > I know one Sun AK woman (dont know if I can share her data) > who > > was > > > > molested (by her own professor) and denied a higher degree > that > > she > > > > worked hard for, then get married and then divorced, then > have > > her > > > > mom die of cancer in a rather painful way, then have her > brother > > get > > > > divorced in a messy lawsuit (and then leave her too), then > (she) > > get > > > > married again and her husband develop terminal cancer very > soon > > > > afterward. Net result: she cant seem to find a strong and > > consistent > > > > support outside of herself - she has become self reliant and > > only > > > > finds consistent happiness in meditation/reiki. She is > probably > > > > egotistical in some degree too, but not in any outstanding > way > > at > > > > all, and probably much less than all the people around her..> > > > > > > > Consequently, I really dispute the fact that Sun AK people > must > > > > learn to "reduce their ego". That is simply a general lesson > for > > all > > > > of mankind. Sun AK people's AK will guide them towards > divinity > > > > through experiences that make them focus on themselves and > > search > > > > for the truth: now that's the statement I find much more to > the > > > > point.> > > > > > > > Comments?> > > > > > > > Thanks,> > > > > > > > Sundeep> > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, nix nixen <nix_nixen@ ..> > wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > Only from one simple statement of yours "It is not always > > > > possible for me..." i read that your AK must be nothing less > > than > > > > Sun. Am i right? If yes, then i think i`m on the right way > of > > > > finding answers on my queries.> > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > yeeahoo_99 <nitish.arya@ ...> wrote:> > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > Raja Yoga is the yoga of soul with paramatma - > deep/shallow,> > > > > material/spiritual - all kind of things have a basis only > in> > > > > paramatma. Thus, even Raja-bhanga yoga has a basis i.e. > > separation > > > > of> > > > > soul from paramatma (which is illusory only though) and > hence> > > > > material/spiritual loss depending on the kind of karma > > involved.> > > > > > > > > > As the lord of a sign, a planet rules a 12th part of the> > > > > consciousness, relatively . Thus, in part, it becomes its> > > > > responsibility to guide the affairs of that sign/house > towards> > > > > fulfillment. You may explore it further.> > > > > > > > > > It is not always possible for me to answer to your > specific > > > > queries.> > > > > Hopefully, in time, you will discover the truth of your > > queries.> > > > > > > > > > best regards,> > > > > nitish> > > > > > > > > > --- In sohamsa@ .com, "tijanadamjanovic" > > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > > Yes, all must serve. The questions raised in these > > discussions > > > > on Atma> > > > > > karakas were on the specific way of serving. > > > > > > If we say that Sun AK must learn principles of artha > shastra > > to > > > > serve,> > > > > > the same stands for Ma and Ju AK? How to differentiate? > I > > assume > > > > you> > > > > > are taking karakatvas of the houses into account also > (2nd, > > 6th, > > > > 10th)?> > > > > > The Sun/Raja gets service on the throne, but regarding > > > > spirituality> > > > > > and Atma this is related to real Raja yoga whose deepest > > meaning > > > > is> > > > > > inseparable from 10th house of indriyas (refer > > Vivekananda) . > > > > Only in> > > > > > that sense we can talk of Janaka or the perfect King. > What > > artha> > > > > > shastra principles you had in mind?> > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "yeeahoo_99" > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > > > wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > || Om TAT SAT ||> > > > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > > mentioning Gita in this context.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Context that was intended is Gita Chapter 3,sloka 22.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > All must work if the lord of the cosmos has chosen to > > work. > > > > Thus, > > > > > > > there is nothing specific that only SUN AK has > to "serve", > > all > > > > AKs > > > > > > > "serve".> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, are you implying that Sun AK gives a person > akin to > > > > Janaka?! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, Sun AK gives a person akin to Janaka - > jivanmukta - > > > > provided > > > > > > > enough effort has been put in.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you determing dharma based on this? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No, Sun AK need not be 9th lord.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra > as > > an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > The attitude of service is seen from 6th house. Leo > being > > a > > > > dharma > > > > > > > trikona sign fulfills its purpose of service through > 10th > > > > house of > > > > > > > Artha, which is 6th from it. So a Sun AK should learn > > > > principles of > > > > > > > artha shastra to serve.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All souls have to "Serve" only as there is nothing > else to > > be > > > > done > > > > > > > in the three worlds because Krishna has already > achieved > > > > everything > > > > > > > that is there to achieve in the three worlds(refer > Gita). > > > > Those who > > > > > > > do not serve, are reborn to learn to serve, whatever > be > > their > > > > AK.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus> > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself).> > > > > > > > But do you think it`s a coincidence that His Master > had > > > > exalted > > > > > > > Saturn in 9th> > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is not re-born after exhausting his karma/desires. > > Thus, > > > > > > > vivekananda (Rahu PiK) came here to exhaust his > remaining > > > > karma/> > > > > > > desires with Ramakrishna (Rahu AK). There is no more > > substance > > > > to > > > > > > > this than a past-life karmic relationship of the two > which > > > > continued > > > > > > > in this birth also.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards,> > > > > > > NITISH> > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijana" <nix_nixen@> > > wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > > > > Your elaboration would be even more brilliant if you > had > > > > just answer> > > > > > > > my question.> > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > mentioning> > > > > > > > Gita in this context. But, are you implying that Sun > AK > > > > gives a> > > > > > > > person akin to Janaka?! Are you determing dharma > based > > on > > > > this? Will> > > > > > > > you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra as an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus> > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself). > > > > But do > > > > > > > you> > > > > > > > think it`s a coincidence that His Master had exalted > > Saturn > > > > in 9th> > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these? > > > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "yeeahoo_99" > > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat ||> > > > > > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What is the thing that Raja will hardly ever do?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read up Gita, arthashastra and ancient texts that > show > > > > what > > > > > > > all a > > > > > > > > > Raja has to do to ensure that his subjects are > > protected > > > > and > > > > > > > progress > > > > > > > > > on the upward evolutionary path. Look at krishna, > > Janaka > > > > and > > > > > > > > > ChandraGupta Maurya and you will understand > whatever > > > > that "hardly > > > > > > > > > ever do" equates to.> > > > > > > > > Otherwise, going by your statement, AK wouldn't do > > > > anything > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > the king of the horoscope and the rest of the > karakas > > (BK, > > > > PiK, > > > > > > > Puk, > > > > > > > > > GK) i.e. his subjects will follow the suit!> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, the mantra is "Shiva jnane Jiva Seva" > > (serving > > > > every > > > > > > > > > being as the full manifestation of God) that > > Narendranath > > > > > > > received > > > > > > > > > from his Master Ramakrishna who had Sun in > Aquarius.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Being Sun AK, Vivekananda had developed peculiar > > sharpness > > > > of > > > > > > > > > perception and assimilation that empowered him > with > > > > unusual power > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > pick up 'the gems' from the talks of his Master.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Sun in Sagittarius, he could, as compared to > > others, > > > > > > > easily > > > > > > > > > 'see' the deep meaning in the words of Sri > > Ramakrishna, > > > > even > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > the Master told them in simple language (Aq Sun), > and > > > > never as > > > > > > > > > preaching.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With its dispositor Jupiter in Libra, gradually > Swami > > > > > > > Vivekananda > > > > > > > > > started assimilating tips and hints on practical > > Vedanta > > > > that > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > benefit individual and collective life in the > society.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "...For spiritual persons Sun as AK should be in > > > > Jupiter`s > > > > > > > signs > > > > > > > > > > (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s very hard > task..."> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Putting up statements like you have done is not > wise. > > Sri > > > > > > > Yukteswar > > > > > > > > > Giri, has Sun AK placed in Aries and had attained > > highest > > > > level > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > spirituality. Even if Sun AK is placed in Libra, > it > > could > > > > be the > > > > > > > most > > > > > > > > > spiritual person.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AK shows the spiritual power of a sign over the > rest > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > signs/> > > > > > > > > planets in the chart and this spiritual power > > manifests > > > > through > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > dispositor of AK and its sign placement.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards,> > > > > > > > > NITISH> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijana" > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > > > > > Dear Su,> > > > > > > > > > Sun is the Self. Its qualities are those of Raja > > (karaka > > > > for > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > first house, lord of the 5th, dig bala in 10th). > > What is > > > > the > > > > > > > thing > > > > > > > > > > that Raja will hardly ever do? The lesson that > has > > to be > > > > learnt > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK is serving, in the highest sence it > > gives "Shiva > > > > jnane > > > > > > > Shiva > > > > > > > > > > seva" (service of man as God)-the divine lesson > > given to > > > > us by > > > > > > > > > Swami > > > > > > > > > > Vivekananda (Sun AK). For spiritual persons Sun > as > > AK > > > > should be > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > Jupiter`s signs (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s > > very > > > > hard task.> > > > > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "v reality" > > <reality_v@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bojan-ji> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for your reply. Much appreciated.> > > > > > > > > > > If I may ask another query re Sun AK. The > lesson > > to be > > > > > > > learnt > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK, > > > > > > > > > > > is the reduction of ego. Can this also be > > understood > > > > at a > > > > > > > > > > different level > > > > > > > > > > > as the effacement of 'self' in a spiritual > sense?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks> > > > > > > > > > > Su> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan Vidakovic <janbovid@>> > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK> > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 08:33:22 -0700 (PDT)> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >HARE RAMA KRISHNA> > > > > > > > > > > >Dear Su> > > > > > > > > > > >I would add that with Gu AK person have to be > > very > > > > humble to > > > > > > > all > > > > > > > > > > spiritual > > > > > > > > > > > >techers and natives, like priests, gurus, > > teachers. > > > > With Ma > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > person must > > > > > > > > > > > >practise Ahumsa (nonviolence) , with Ch the > > native is > > > > always > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > caring, > > > > > > > > > > > >and gives emotions but the problem is that > they > > never > > > > get > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > > >themselves from other people. The person must > > learn > > > > lessons > > > > > > > also > > > > > > > > > > from the > > > > > > > > > > > >people represented with AK. Ch / mother, Sy / > > father > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > everything those > > > > > > > > > > > >grahas represent.> > > > > > > > > > > >Take few examples of people you know and see > it > > in > > > > praxix. > > > > > > > Best > > > > > > > > > > wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan> > > > > > > > > > > >Hari Om Tat Sat> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ > wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > hraum namah adityaya> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Su,> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Person should use a lot of glass and > sing/hum > > > > melodies.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > Rafal Gendarz> > > > > > > > > > > > Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > > > > > > > > > > > email: rafal@> > > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > v reality napisaÅ,(a): Dear Rafalji/Members> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > This is an interesting discussion. Could we > > discuss > > > > other > > > > > > > AKs > > > > > > > > > > too. I read> > > > > > > > > > > > in an article that natives with Moon as AK > need > > to > > > > learn > > > > > > > to be > > > > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > > > >caring> > > > > > > > > > > > and loving to others. But I know of a chart > > where > > > > the > > > > > > > native > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > >by> > > > > > > > > > > > nature very caring, loving and concerned > about > > > > others > > > > > > > since > > > > > > > > > > young. So > > > > > > > > > > > >what> > > > > > > > > > > > is the lesson to be learnt?> > > > > > > > > > > > thanks> > > > > > > > > > > > Su> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl>> > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK> > > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 10:24:14 +0200> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > *hraum namah adityaya*> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Dear LN Kumar,> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >With Ju AK person should learn to respect > > others > > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > >tradition,> > > > > > > > > > > > >should be ready to learn from others. When > Ju > > is in > > > > > > > kendra to > > > > > > > > > > AK or is > > > > > > > > > > > >AK> > > > > > > > > > > > >himself then native thinks that he knows > > everything > > > > and > > > > > > > now > > > > > > > > > He > > > > > > > > > > can share> > > > > > > > > > > > >His knowledge with everybody. Good teachers > of > > > > course > > > > > > > comes > > > > > > > > > from> > > > > > > > > > > > >AK-Jupiter- Natives, as this graha will be > > > > naturally in > > > > > > > > > > Karakamsa.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >With MA AK person should learn to catalyze > > energies > > > > > > > through > > > > > > > > > > ZEN, TAI-CHI > > > > > > > > > > > >or> > > > > > > > > > > > >other techniques, while with JU AK person > > should > > > > learn to > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > more humble> > > > > > > > > > > > >regarding knowledge. Of course person can > be > > > > focused on > > > > > > > > > Jupiter-> > > > > > > > > > karakas> > > > > > > > > > > > >like kids, spirituality, law, luck etc.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Mahadasa of AK brings lesson to us so its > not > > so > > > > easy > > > > > > > > > > materially but> > > > > > > > > > > > >inspiring spiritually, so if Surya is in > good > > > > placement > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > then it > > > > > > > > > > > >can> > > > > > > > > > > > >be not so bad as person is spiritual.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz> > > > > > > > > > > > >Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > > > > > > > > > > > >email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com> > > > > > > > > > > > >Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >narender kumar napisa?(a):> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Dear Gurujans,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Kindly throw some light on Jupiter as> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Atmakaraka and having Jupiter as mahadasha.> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Respectful Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>LN Kumar> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>__________ __ _________ _________ > _________ > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > > _________ _> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the > > > > Internet in > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > pocket: > > > > > > > > > > > >mail,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>news, photos & more.> > > > > > > > > > > > >>http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC> > > > > > > > > > > > >><http://mobile. / go?refer= > 1GNXIC>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ > > _________ > > > > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > _> > > > > > > > > > > > Advertisement: It's simple! Sell your car > for > > just > > > > $30 at > > > > > > > > > > CarPoint.com. > > > > > > > > > > > >au> > > > > > > > > > > > http://a.ninemsn. com.au/b. aspx?URL= http%> 3A%> > 2F% > > > > > > > 2Fsecure% > > > > > > > > > > > >2Dau%2Eimrworldw ide%2Ecom% 2Fcgi%2Dbin% 2Fa%> > 2Fci% > > > > 5F450304% > > > > > > > > > 2Fet%> > > > > > > > > > 5F2% > > > > > > > > > > > >2Fcg%5F801459% 2Fpi%5F1004813% 2Fai%5F859641 & > > > > _t=762955845 & > > > > > > > > > > _r=tig_AUG07 & > > > > > > > > > > > >_m=EXT> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >Best wishes,> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > SJC Guru Bojan Vidakovic> > > > > > > > > > > > for articles and consultations visit> > > > > > > > > > > >http://www.jataveda s.com> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >----------- --------- --------- ----> > > > > > > > > > > >Choose the right car based on your needs. > Check > > out > > > > > > > > > > > > > Autos > > > > > > > > > > new Car > > > > > > > > > > > >Finder tool.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ > > _________ _> > > > > > > > > > > Advertisement: Make shopping exciting. 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Check out > Autos> > > new Car Finder tool.> > > > http://autos. / carfinder/> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _> > ____________ ___> > > Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the Internet in your > > pocket: mail, news, photos & more. > > > http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC> > >> >> > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _____________ __> Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Answers - Check it out.> http://answers. / dir/?link= list & sid= 396545469> Choose the right car based on your needs. Check out Autos new Car Finder tool. Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Travel. Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with FareChase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2007 Report Share Posted September 1, 2007 Dear Michal, I'm sorry I got it all wrong. I don't know how I managed to get is upside down I also misspelled your name in my last post, apologies. Promila Michal Dziwulski <nearmichalsohamsa Sent: Saturday, September 1, 2007 2:56:25 PMRe: Jiddu Krishnamurti Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Promila,Here are the details given earlier in this thread:2) Jiddu Krishnamurti (Sun exalted in 4th house) May 12, 1895, > 0:23am, 78E30, 13N33I don't know what you 'rechecked', but Capricorn is the Lagna.Respectfully,Michal Promila Chitkara <promilac >sohamsa@ .comSaturday, September 1, 2007 9:04:06 PMRe: Jiddu Krishnamurti Hare Rama Krsna ||Hi Michael, Thanks for your input. His lagna is cancer. I rechecked. To verify we can do a search on google. Will get back on this point soon, in the meantime if you find some more references of capricorn lagna, please let me know. I really like the following point you made. Arudha Lagna is Aries with exalted Surya giving a person that emphasises 'being' and 'now'. Saturn exalted but retrograde in the 7th from AL shows the obstruction he faced in life with orthodox religion and rigid belief systems. However, I read long ago that if a planet is retrograde, that is, if it starts going in the opposite direction (from fwd to backwards), its signification also take a turn, that is, they are just the opposite of its natural signification. So if Saturn is retro, instead of making one a tranditionalist or conformist, it will actually take the native away from these. IF my understanding is correct, then Saturn contributed to the major event of his life when he disowned the "Order of Star of the East" and said truth is a pathless land and systems, sects, and religions only take you away from it. I would be grateful, if you also give your views on other points that I made, and please also add more analysis. It'll facilitate good learning. God Bless! Promila Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal >sohamsa@ .comSaturday, September 1, 2007 1:55:23 AMRe: Jiddu Krishnamurti Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Promila,> From AL, saturn/sun are at 6/12 axis, and ketu/rahu are at 4/10 axisArudha Lagna is Aries with exalted Surya giving a person that emphasises 'being' and 'now'. Saturn exalted but retrograde in the 7th from AL shows the obstruction he faced in life with orthodox religion and rigid belief systems.> Sun, the AK is exalted in rasi chart in 10th house. Since he was an evolved soul. We don't need to look its D-9 position as much. Am I correct? I think you are using Cancer Lagna, when actually his Lagna is Makara. Also, seeing the Navamsa position is very important.Respectfully,Michal tijanadamjanovic <nix_nixen >sohamsa@ .comFriday, August 31, 2007 11:17:40 PM Jiddu Krishnamurti Om Gurave NamahDear Promila,Please send the birth chart details of Jiddu Krishnamurti so that everybody can follow.Warm regards,Tijanasohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@.. .> wrote:>> Jiddu Krishnamurti' s chart is very interesting:> Both Saturn ® and Sun are exalted and are opposite each other on 4/10 axis.> Sun, the AK is exalted in rasi chart in 10th house. Since he was an evolved soul. We don't need to look its D-9 position as much. Am I correct? > An exalted atmakaraka, who is a natural significator of atma taught the world to observe the "I". Interesting enough that he discouraged talks on reincarnation, intuition, meditation, astrology etc. He discouraged adopting a mechanical approach towards religion and spirituality. His idea of meditation is really beautiful! That said, he wanted the world to go deeper to understand the need why we discuss and depend on these stuff. This is a result of saturn/sun opposition.> From AL, saturn/sun are at 6/12 axis, and ketu/rahu are at 4/10 axis.> Pisces rises in D-9, a spiritual sign. Luminaries are on 4/10 axis--complementing each other. So the mind and the atma were well aligned. The saturn and jupiter are together. Saturn being stronger, so he rejected all dogmas and systems.> In D-60, the moon is in the ninth house shows his skills in past lives: unmatched understanding of the mind. The moon is also in a quadrant from the AK. So the soul really wanted to rip apart human psyche to find the truth in next life. Have I got it right?> In D-60, The AK is with Ketu, the mokshakaraka, and its exalted dispositor is in the twelfth house--this is 6/12 axis. > Just my thoughts. I've just begun to understand astrology, so can't see beyond the above points. > > Promila> > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...>> sohamsa@ .com> Friday, August 31, 2007 4:12:27 AM> Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and v_reality)> > > Dear Sharat,> I cant share the chart of the person that I mentioned. However, > among famous people the ones with Sun AK that I remember are:> 1) Swami Vivekananda (Sun in Sag, 1st house)> 2) Jiddu Krishnamurti (Sun exalted in 4th house) May 12, 1895, > 0:23am, 78E30, 13N33, +5:14GMT. Extremely insightful writings on the > nature/contents of the mind.> 3) Gautam Buddha (I saw the chart somewhere and it was exalted Sun > AK, but I cant verify it anymore, perhaps someone else can suggest > the time)> I know that there was this one Guru on this group - Partha - he was > Sun AK too and wrote many insightful posts about the nature of self, > but he doesnt seem to be posting anymore. I am pretty sure that > Bharatji (if you dont mind my identifying you) is Sun AK too, and > you can see for yourself that he writes in the same vein as well. > > Hope this helps,> > Sundeep> > sohamsa@ .com, " Sharat" <gidoc@> wrote:> >> > |Namah Shivaya|> > Dear Sundeep,> > Sun AK thus 'struggles' as it can always see ' himself' clearly > while for others the drive is on other aspects of life, you quote > mirror as an apt example.> > It will help to study how Sun AK do their karmas and how it > effects their spirituality.> > Any example charts?> > Best> > Sharat> > > > - > > vedicastrostudent > > sohamsa@ .com > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 7:40 PM> > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > v_reality)> > > > > > Dear Promila,> > First, thanks to all of you (Sharat, Tijanaji, Promila, Nitish) > for > > responding.> > > > But Promila, how dare you stop when you've made such a wonderful > > point :-) See, Tijanaji's point that ego is simply a situation > where > > we take more than we give is fraught with problems. It is simply > a > > statement made from Guru to Shishya with a lot of unsaid context > > around it and that context is only understood by Guru and > Shishya. > > You cannot use this definition when trying to fathom the depths > of > > the many good works on psychology and spirituality. See, what is > it > > that we are "giving" and "taking" and is that what all the > > books/scriptures mean when they talk about ego? By this > definition, > > Bill Gates and Warren Buffet can be said to have the smallest > egos > > in the world, because they both have decided to give virtually > ALL > > their material belongings (worth about $50 billion each) to > charity. > > I know you are all shaking your heads saying, "but that is not > what > > was meant". So, you didnt mean it materially right? So what way > was > > it meant? Psychologically? But then what is it that you > are "giving" > > and "taking"? And if you play around a little more and test it > out, > > Promila's wonderful example will throw you in another fix - > because > > as she rightly observes it is not only the "great me" > moods/types > > that are egotistical, but also the "poor me" moods/types. > The "poor > > me" types are generally self-flagellating types who work very > hard > > for others (family, spouse, children etc) and on the > surface "give" > > a lot. In both cases, the focus on "me" is exaggerated. I prefer > > Carl Jung's definition of ego, and notice that it is what is > meant > > in most deep contexts. Ego is simply the center of > consciousness. > > The psyche not only has the Ego but the unconscious also. Within > the > > unconscious is a deeper center called the Self, which is perhaps > the > > indicator of the Atma. An egotistical person, whether the "poor > me" > > type or the "great me" type has greater concentration of mental > > energy on the ego, and less in the Self (the Self is always > > perceived as divinity). Every AK's goal is to "reduce the ego" > i.e. > > reduce the concentration of mental energy in the ego, and > increase > > it in the Self (the divine center). That is why, to me, Sun is > the > > natural AK. When one says that everyone must "serve", no matter > how > > it manifests *physically* , psychologically they are reducing the > > concentration of energy in the ego and increasing it in the > Self. > > Different chara AKs are different only in the method they adopt > to > > cause a reduction in ego of the native. Venus AKs have > relationship > > experiences that put the mirror in front of the ego and make it > give > > up its energy to the Self, Rahu AKs have rahu like experiences I > > guess that put the mirror in front of the ego. With Sun AK, I > have > > found the mirror is direct.> > > > I only post because I continue to dispute the implication that > Sun > > AKs have larger egos. They are no different from others, but > their > > experiences quickly bring direct and harsh focus on themselves > > rather than through other aspects of their interactions with the > > world. The chara karakatwa of Sun is not an indicator of larger > ego, > > only of the directness of the experiences that will lead to a > > reduction in it.> > > > Sundeep> > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@> > > wrote:> > >> > > Ego is not only the feeling of "I'm great", but it is also > > the "Poor me" attitude. Both great and poor me demand attention. > > I'll stop at that as it's a forum to discuss to jyotish (you > rightly > > said).> > > > > > I've Taurus ascendent . Saturn is in the third house (Cancer) > > along with Sun. Darkness and light are together. D-9 ascendent > is > > Capricon and Saturn is in the 7th house (Cancer). So Saturn is > > Virgottama. IT's also my Ishtadevta. Now tell me what's in your > > mind > > > > > > > > > > > > tijanadamjanovic <nix_nixen@>> > > sohamsa@ .com> > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 8:40:08 PM> > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > > v_reality)> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > Dear Sundeep and Promila,> > > It`s inevitable to enter the sphere of philosophy in subjects > like> > > this, but we should try stick to Jyotish principles. That is > how i> > > understood Nitish`s and mine discussion. Not in a moment i > thought > > i> > > can actually define ahamkar, or even ego, and am sure it wasn`t> > > Nitish` ambition either. > > > Actually i follow a single definition of ego taught by my Guru-> ego > > is> > > nothing but a situation where we are taking more than we are > > giving.> > > If one likes to think, one can find a lot in this simple > statement > > and> > > it`s the most practical advice also.> > > Promila, where is Saturn in your rasi and navamsa chart?> > > Warm regards,> > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara > <promilac@ .> > > wrote:> > > >> > > > Sundeep,> > > > > > > > You post was beautiful!> > > > > > > > I don't know how technically accurate it is, but at the> > > psychological level you have made good points. I've Rahu as my > AK, > > but> > > I've major ego despite a weak Sun! Maybe it comes from Mars in > the > > D-1> > > and D-9 ascendents. However, since Ketu is placed in D-1 > ascendent> > > (taurus) with Mars, it urges me to do a lot of self-analysis > and> > > self-obervation. Not even a single hour passes in my life > without> > > analyzing my thoughts and actions...I don't know if I make > sense > > here.> > > > > > > > > > > > P.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...>> > > > sohamsa@ .com> > > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 1:26:13 AM> > > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish > and > > v_reality)> > > > > > > > Dear Tijanaji and Nitish,> > > > > > > > I have been reading your exchange with interest in the hope > of > > > > learning something new, but I find myself disagreeing subtly > in > > the > > > > essence of what you say. In fact, deep down in the exchange > I > > find > > > > this statement made by "v_reality" which makes a lot of > sense to > > me:> > > > "Can this also be understood at a different level as the > > effacement > > > > of 'self' in a spiritual sense?".> > > > > > > > Here is my take - I have none of the scriptural knowledge > you > > both > > > > have, only I have seen several Sun AK people: I dont think > it is > > > > fair to say that Sun AK people are egotistic. See, English > also > > has > > > > a lot of words which have subtly different meanings, and the > > right > > > > one has to be used. An egotistic person is one who has a > > exaggerated > > > > sense of self-importance. Almost everyone in this world has > that > > > > (and you are fooling yourself if you deny it), it is plain > wrong > > to > > > > observe a person have Sun AK and simultaneously observe that > he > > also > > > > has an exaggerated sense of self importance and say "yes, > that > > is > > > > what the Sun AK does to him". I can cite hundreds of people > I > > know > > > > who are very self important and DONT have Sun AK, and not > only > > that > > > > may not even have a strong Sun in their chart.> > > > > > > > I personally think the only statement that can be observed > > > > repeatedly with Sun AK people is that they are egocentric > i.e. > > their > > > > view of the world is based on the individual rather than the > > > > society. They may or may not be egotistical (i.e. > egocentricity > > does > > > > not imply self importance) - the AK simply makes them go > through > > > > experiences in life such that their core self is tested. How > > they > > > > respond to it depends probably on lots of other astrological > > > > factors. The only statement I can safely make, based on pure > > > > experience, is that Sun AK people are guided to divinity > through > > > > experiences of the self, consequently their view is > egocentric.> > > > > > > > I know one Sun AK woman (dont know if I can share her data) > who > > was > > > > molested (by her own professor) and denied a higher degree > that > > she > > > > worked hard for, then get married and then divorced, then > have > > her > > > > mom die of cancer in a rather painful way, then have her > brother > > get > > > > divorced in a messy lawsuit (and then leave her too), then > (she) > > get > > > > married again and her husband develop terminal cancer very > soon > > > > afterward. Net result: she cant seem to find a strong and > > consistent > > > > support outside of herself - she has become self reliant and > > only > > > > finds consistent happiness in meditation/reiki. She is > probably > > > > egotistical in some degree too, but not in any outstanding > way > > at > > > > all, and probably much less than all the people around her..> > > > > > > > Consequently, I really dispute the fact that Sun AK people > must > > > > learn to "reduce their ego". That is simply a general lesson > for > > all > > > > of mankind. Sun AK people's AK will guide them towards > divinity > > > > through experiences that make them focus on themselves and > > search > > > > for the truth: now that's the statement I find much more to > the > > > > point.> > > > > > > > Comments?> > > > > > > > Thanks,> > > > > > > > Sundeep> > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, nix nixen <nix_nixen@ ..> > wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > Only from one simple statement of yours "It is not always > > > > possible for me..." i read that your AK must be nothing less > > than > > > > Sun. Am i right? If yes, then i think i`m on the right way > of > > > > finding answers on my queries.> > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > yeeahoo_99 <nitish.arya@ ...> wrote:> > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > Raja Yoga is the yoga of soul with paramatma - > deep/shallow,> > > > > material/spiritual - all kind of things have a basis only > in> > > > > paramatma. Thus, even Raja-bhanga yoga has a basis i.e. > > separation > > > > of> > > > > soul from paramatma (which is illusory only though) and > hence> > > > > material/spiritual loss depending on the kind of karma > > involved.> > > > > > > > > > As the lord of a sign, a planet rules a 12th part of the> > > > > consciousness, relatively . Thus, in part, it becomes its> > > > > responsibility to guide the affairs of that sign/house > towards> > > > > fulfillment. You may explore it further.> > > > > > > > > > It is not always possible for me to answer to your > specific > > > > queries.> > > > > Hopefully, in time, you will discover the truth of your > > queries.> > > > > > > > > > best regards,> > > > > nitish> > > > > > > > > > --- In sohamsa@ .com, "tijanadamjanovic" > > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > > Yes, all must serve. The questions raised in these > > discussions > > > > on Atma> > > > > > karakas were on the specific way of serving. > > > > > > If we say that Sun AK must learn principles of artha > shastra > > to > > > > serve,> > > > > > the same stands for Ma and Ju AK? How to differentiate? > I > > assume > > > > you> > > > > > are taking karakatvas of the houses into account also > (2nd, > > 6th, > > > > 10th)?> > > > > > The Sun/Raja gets service on the throne, but regarding > > > > spirituality> > > > > > and Atma this is related to real Raja yoga whose deepest > > meaning > > > > is> > > > > > inseparable from 10th house of indriyas (refer > > Vivekananda) . > > > > Only in> > > > > > that sense we can talk of Janaka or the perfect King. > What > > artha> > > > > > shastra principles you had in mind?> > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "yeeahoo_99" > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > > > wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > || Om TAT SAT ||> > > > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > > mentioning Gita in this context.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Context that was intended is Gita Chapter 3,sloka 22.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > All must work if the lord of the cosmos has chosen to > > work. > > > > Thus, > > > > > > > there is nothing specific that only SUN AK has > to "serve", > > all > > > > AKs > > > > > > > "serve".> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, are you implying that Sun AK gives a person > akin to > > > > Janaka?! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, Sun AK gives a person akin to Janaka - > jivanmukta - > > > > provided > > > > > > > enough effort has been put in.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you determing dharma based on this? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No, Sun AK need not be 9th lord.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra > as > > an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > The attitude of service is seen from 6th house. Leo > being > > a > > > > dharma > > > > > > > trikona sign fulfills its purpose of service through > 10th > > > > house of > > > > > > > Artha, which is 6th from it. So a Sun AK should learn > > > > principles of > > > > > > > artha shastra to serve.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All souls have to "Serve" only as there is nothing > else to > > be > > > > done > > > > > > > in the three worlds because Krishna has already > achieved > > > > everything > > > > > > > that is there to achieve in the three worlds(refer > Gita). > > > > Those who > > > > > > > do not serve, are reborn to learn to serve, whatever > be > > their > > > > AK.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus> > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself).> > > > > > > > But do you think it`s a coincidence that His Master > had > > > > exalted > > > > > > > Saturn in 9th> > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is not re-born after exhausting his karma/desires. > > Thus, > > > > > > > vivekananda (Rahu PiK) came here to exhaust his > remaining > > > > karma/> > > > > > > desires with Ramakrishna (Rahu AK). There is no more > > substance > > > > to > > > > > > > this than a past-life karmic relationship of the two > which > > > > continued > > > > > > > in this birth also.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards,> > > > > > > NITISH> > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijana" <nix_nixen@> > > wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > > > > Your elaboration would be even more brilliant if you > had > > > > just answer> > > > > > > > my question.> > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > mentioning> > > > > > > > Gita in this context. But, are you implying that Sun > AK > > > > gives a> > > > > > > > person akin to Janaka?! Are you determing dharma > based > > on > > > > this? Will> > > > > > > > you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra as an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus> > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself). > > > > But do > > > > > > > you> > > > > > > > think it`s a coincidence that His Master had exalted > > Saturn > > > > in 9th> > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these? > > > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "yeeahoo_99" > > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat ||> > > > > > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What is the thing that Raja will hardly ever do?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read up Gita, arthashastra and ancient texts that > show > > > > what > > > > > > > all a > > > > > > > > > Raja has to do to ensure that his subjects are > > protected > > > > and > > > > > > > progress > > > > > > > > > on the upward evolutionary path. Look at krishna, > > Janaka > > > > and > > > > > > > > > ChandraGupta Maurya and you will understand > whatever > > > > that "hardly > > > > > > > > > ever do" equates to.> > > > > > > > > Otherwise, going by your statement, AK wouldn't do > > > > anything > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > the king of the horoscope and the rest of the > karakas > > (BK, > > > > PiK, > > > > > > > Puk, > > > > > > > > > GK) i.e. his subjects will follow the suit!> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, the mantra is "Shiva jnane Jiva Seva" > > (serving > > > > every > > > > > > > > > being as the full manifestation of God) that > > Narendranath > > > > > > > received > > > > > > > > > from his Master Ramakrishna who had Sun in > Aquarius.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Being Sun AK, Vivekananda had developed peculiar > > sharpness > > > > of > > > > > > > > > perception and assimilation that empowered him > with > > > > unusual power > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > pick up 'the gems' from the talks of his Master.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Sun in Sagittarius, he could, as compared to > > others, > > > > > > > easily > > > > > > > > > 'see' the deep meaning in the words of Sri > > Ramakrishna, > > > > even > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > the Master told them in simple language (Aq Sun), > and > > > > never as > > > > > > > > > preaching.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With its dispositor Jupiter in Libra, gradually > Swami > > > > > > > Vivekananda > > > > > > > > > started assimilating tips and hints on practical > > Vedanta > > > > that > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > benefit individual and collective life in the > society.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "...For spiritual persons Sun as AK should be in > > > > Jupiter`s > > > > > > > signs > > > > > > > > > > (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s very hard > task..."> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Putting up statements like you have done is not > wise. > > Sri > > > > > > > Yukteswar > > > > > > > > > Giri, has Sun AK placed in Aries and had attained > > highest > > > > level > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > spirituality. Even if Sun AK is placed in Libra, > it > > could > > > > be the > > > > > > > most > > > > > > > > > spiritual person.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AK shows the spiritual power of a sign over the > rest > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > signs/> > > > > > > > > planets in the chart and this spiritual power > > manifests > > > > through > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > dispositor of AK and its sign placement.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards,> > > > > > > > > NITISH> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijana" > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > > > > > Dear Su,> > > > > > > > > > Sun is the Self. Its qualities are those of Raja > > (karaka > > > > for > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > first house, lord of the 5th, dig bala in 10th). > > What is > > > > the > > > > > > > thing > > > > > > > > > > that Raja will hardly ever do? The lesson that > has > > to be > > > > learnt > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK is serving, in the highest sence it > > gives "Shiva > > > > jnane > > > > > > > Shiva > > > > > > > > > > seva" (service of man as God)-the divine lesson > > given to > > > > us by > > > > > > > > > Swami > > > > > > > > > > Vivekananda (Sun AK). For spiritual persons Sun > as > > AK > > > > should be > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > Jupiter`s signs (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s > > very > > > > hard task.> > > > > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "v reality" > > <reality_v@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bojan-ji> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for your reply. Much appreciated.> > > > > > > > > > > If I may ask another query re Sun AK. The > lesson > > to be > > > > > > > learnt > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK, > > > > > > > > > > > is the reduction of ego. Can this also be > > understood > > > > at a > > > > > > > > > > different level > > > > > > > > > > > as the effacement of 'self' in a spiritual > sense?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks> > > > > > > > > > > Su> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan Vidakovic <janbovid@>> > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK> > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 08:33:22 -0700 (PDT)> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >HARE RAMA KRISHNA> > > > > > > > > > > >Dear Su> > > > > > > > > > > >I would add that with Gu AK person have to be > > very > > > > humble to > > > > > > > all > > > > > > > > > > spiritual > > > > > > > > > > > >techers and natives, like priests, gurus, > > teachers. > > > > With Ma > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > person must > > > > > > > > > > > >practise Ahumsa (nonviolence) , with Ch the > > native is > > > > always > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > caring, > > > > > > > > > > > >and gives emotions but the problem is that > they > > never > > > > get > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > > >themselves from other people. The person must > > learn > > > > lessons > > > > > > > also > > > > > > > > > > from the > > > > > > > > > > > >people represented with AK. Ch / mother, Sy / > > father > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > everything those > > > > > > > > > > > >grahas represent.> > > > > > > > > > > >Take few examples of people you know and see > it > > in > > > > praxix. > > > > > > > Best > > > > > > > > > > wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan> > > > > > > > > > > >Hari Om Tat Sat> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ > wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > hraum namah adityaya> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Su,> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Person should use a lot of glass and > sing/hum > > > > melodies.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > Rafal Gendarz> > > > > > > > > > > > Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > > > > > > > > > > > email: rafal@> > > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > v reality napisaÅ,(a): Dear Rafalji/Members> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > This is an interesting discussion. Could we > > discuss > > > > other > > > > > > > AKs > > > > > > > > > > too. I read> > > > > > > > > > > > in an article that natives with Moon as AK > need > > to > > > > learn > > > > > > > to be > > > > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > > > >caring> > > > > > > > > > > > and loving to others. But I know of a chart > > where > > > > the > > > > > > > native > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > >by> > > > > > > > > > > > nature very caring, loving and concerned > about > > > > others > > > > > > > since > > > > > > > > > > young. So > > > > > > > > > > > >what> > > > > > > > > > > > is the lesson to be learnt?> > > > > > > > > > > > thanks> > > > > > > > > > > > Su> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl>> > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK> > > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 10:24:14 +0200> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > *hraum namah adityaya*> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Dear LN Kumar,> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >With Ju AK person should learn to respect > > others > > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > >tradition,> > > > > > > > > > > > >should be ready to learn from others. When > Ju > > is in > > > > > > > kendra to > > > > > > > > > > AK or is > > > > > > > > > > > >AK> > > > > > > > > > > > >himself then native thinks that he knows > > everything > > > > and > > > > > > > now > > > > > > > > > He > > > > > > > > > > can share> > > > > > > > > > > > >His knowledge with everybody. Good teachers > of > > > > course > > > > > > > comes > > > > > > > > > from> > > > > > > > > > > > >AK-Jupiter- Natives, as this graha will be > > > > naturally in > > > > > > > > > > Karakamsa.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >With MA AK person should learn to catalyze > > energies > > > > > > > through > > > > > > > > > > ZEN, TAI-CHI > > > > > > > > > > > >or> > > > > > > > > > > > >other techniques, while with JU AK person > > should > > > > learn to > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > more humble> > > > > > > > > > > > >regarding knowledge. Of course person can > be > > > > focused on > > > > > > > > > Jupiter-> > > > > > > > > > karakas> > > > > > > > > > > > >like kids, spirituality, law, luck etc.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Mahadasa of AK brings lesson to us so its > not > > so > > > > easy > > > > > > > > > > materially but> > > > > > > > > > > > >inspiring spiritually, so if Surya is in > good > > > > placement > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > then it > > > > > > > > > > > >can> > > > > > > > > > > > >be not so bad as person is spiritual.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz> > > > > > > > > > > > >Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > > > > > > > > > > > >email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com> > > > > > > > > > > > >Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >narender kumar napisa?(a):> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Dear Gurujans,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Kindly throw some light on Jupiter as> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Atmakaraka and having Jupiter as mahadasha.> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Respectful Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>LN Kumar> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>__________ __ _________ _________ > _________ > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > > _________ _> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the > > > > Internet in > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > pocket: > > > > > > > > > > > >mail,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>news, photos & more.> > > > > > > > > > > > >>http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC> > > > > > > > > > > > >><http://mobile. / go?refer= > 1GNXIC>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ > > _________ > > > > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > _> > > > > > > > > > > > Advertisement: It's simple! Sell your car > for > > just > > > > $30 at > > > > > > > > > > CarPoint.com. > > > > > > > > > > > >au> > > > > > > > > > > > http://a.ninemsn. com.au/b. aspx?URL= http%> 3A%> > 2F% > > > > > > > 2Fsecure% > > > > > > > > > > > >2Dau%2Eimrworldw ide%2Ecom% 2Fcgi%2Dbin% 2Fa%> > 2Fci% > > > > 5F450304% > > > > > > > > > 2Fet%> > > > > > > > > > 5F2% > > > > > > > > > > > >2Fcg%5F801459% 2Fpi%5F1004813% 2Fai%5F859641 & > > > > _t=762955845 & > > > > > > > > > > _r=tig_AUG07 & > > > > > > > > > > > >_m=EXT> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >Best wishes,> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > SJC Guru Bojan Vidakovic> > > > > > > > > > > > for articles and consultations visit> > > > > > > > > > > >http://www.jataveda s.com> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >----------- --------- --------- ----> > > > > > > > > > > >Choose the right car based on your needs. > Check > > out > > > > > > > > > > > > > Autos > > > > > > > > > > new Car > > > > > > > > > > > >Finder tool.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ > > _________ _> > > > > > > > > > > Advertisement: Make shopping exciting. Find > what > > you > > > > want at > > > > > > > > > > www.eBay.com. au > > > > > > > > > > > http://a.ninemsn. com.au/> > > > > > > > > b.aspx?URL=http% 3A%2F%2Frover% 2Eebay%2Ecom%> > > > > > > > > > 2Frover%2F1% 2F705%2D10129% 2D5668%2D323% 2F4%2F%> > 3Fid%> > > > > > > > > > 3D6 & _t=763807330 & _r=email_ taglines_ EBAY & _m=EXT> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------ --------- --------- ---> > > > > Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the Internet in > your > > > > pocket: mail, news, photos & more.> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ > _> > > > Choose the right car based on your needs. Check out > Autos> > > new Car Finder tool.> > > > http://autos. / carfinder/> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _> > ____________ ___> > > Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the Internet in your > > pocket: mail, news, photos & more. > > > http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC> > >> >> > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _____________ __> Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Answers - Check it out.> http://answers. / dir/?link= list & sid= 396545469> Choose the right car based on your needs. Check out Autos new Car Finder tool. Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Travel. Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with FareChase. Fussy? Opinionated? Impossible to please? Perfect. Join 's user panel and lay it on us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2007 Report Share Posted September 1, 2007 Dear Michal, I just found the following excerpts from Sanjay Prabhakaran's blog. This is Sanjay Rath ji's analysis: http://sanjayprabhakaran.blogspot.com/2005/12/atmakaraka-in-alarudha-lagna.html 2. Jiddu Krishnamuti has the Sun atmakaraka in arudha lagna in Aries. This is the most royal sign and the Sun relates to father. There is a dictum which states that the Sun in the 1st or 7th house in Aries/Libra - native is abandoned by parents. This is true both for Bhagavan Sri Rama and Jiddu Krishnamurti who had Sun in AL in Aries and Saturn in 7th house. Krishnamurti lost his mother in 1905 and was finally adopted by Helena Blavatsky in 1910. Then there was a legal dispute over parental custody between Blavatsky and Jiddu Narasimah (Krishnamurti's biological father). It finally ended when Krishnamurti finall appeared at the Privy council and chose Blavatsky instead of his father. [at this stage the arudha lagna dominated over the atmakaraka as Krishnamurti was only 18 years old]. However, the atmakaraka started rising after his 28 years of age as it is in Aries - this was triggered by two events (1) death of father [sun] in 1924 and (2) death of brother [Mars] in 1925. Look at the Sun in Aries as AK. Then in 1929 on the opening day of the annual Star Camp at Ommen, Holland, Krishnamurti dissolved the Order before 3000 members. This was the complete and total rejection of the arudha. He questioned the fundamental basis of the guru-shisya parampara and said that the spiritual path was a path to freedom while the guru-shisya parampara of spiritual lineages in India were a kind of bondage. Remember AK Sun in AL is aspected by Saturn. Light! Promila Michal Dziwulski <nearmichalsohamsa Sent: Saturday, September 1, 2007 2:56:25 PMRe: Jiddu Krishnamurti Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Promila,Here are the details given earlier in this thread:2) Jiddu Krishnamurti (Sun exalted in 4th house) May 12, 1895, > 0:23am, 78E30, 13N33I don't know what you 'rechecked', but Capricorn is the Lagna.Respectfully,Michal Promila Chitkara <promilac >sohamsa@ .comSaturday, September 1, 2007 9:04:06 PMRe: Jiddu Krishnamurti Hare Rama Krsna ||Hi Michael, Thanks for your input. His lagna is cancer. I rechecked. To verify we can do a search on google. Will get back on this point soon, in the meantime if you find some more references of capricorn lagna, please let me know. I really like the following point you made. Arudha Lagna is Aries with exalted Surya giving a person that emphasises 'being' and 'now'. Saturn exalted but retrograde in the 7th from AL shows the obstruction he faced in life with orthodox religion and rigid belief systems. However, I read long ago that if a planet is retrograde, that is, if it starts going in the opposite direction (from fwd to backwards), its signification also take a turn, that is, they are just the opposite of its natural signification. So if Saturn is retro, instead of making one a tranditionalist or conformist, it will actually take the native away from these. IF my understanding is correct, then Saturn contributed to the major event of his life when he disowned the "Order of Star of the East" and said truth is a pathless land and systems, sects, and religions only take you away from it. I would be grateful, if you also give your views on other points that I made, and please also add more analysis. It'll facilitate good learning. God Bless! Promila Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal >sohamsa@ .comSaturday, September 1, 2007 1:55:23 AMRe: Jiddu Krishnamurti Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Promila,> From AL, saturn/sun are at 6/12 axis, and ketu/rahu are at 4/10 axisArudha Lagna is Aries with exalted Surya giving a person that emphasises 'being' and 'now'. Saturn exalted but retrograde in the 7th from AL shows the obstruction he faced in life with orthodox religion and rigid belief systems.> Sun, the AK is exalted in rasi chart in 10th house. Since he was an evolved soul. We don't need to look its D-9 position as much. Am I correct? I think you are using Cancer Lagna, when actually his Lagna is Makara. Also, seeing the Navamsa position is very important.Respectfully,Michal tijanadamjanovic <nix_nixen >sohamsa@ .comFriday, August 31, 2007 11:17:40 PM Jiddu Krishnamurti Om Gurave NamahDear Promila,Please send the birth chart details of Jiddu Krishnamurti so that everybody can follow.Warm regards,Tijanasohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@.. .> wrote:>> Jiddu Krishnamurti' s chart is very interesting:> Both Saturn ® and Sun are exalted and are opposite each other on 4/10 axis.> Sun, the AK is exalted in rasi chart in 10th house. Since he was an evolved soul. We don't need to look its D-9 position as much. Am I correct? > An exalted atmakaraka, who is a natural significator of atma taught the world to observe the "I". Interesting enough that he discouraged talks on reincarnation, intuition, meditation, astrology etc. He discouraged adopting a mechanical approach towards religion and spirituality. His idea of meditation is really beautiful! That said, he wanted the world to go deeper to understand the need why we discuss and depend on these stuff. This is a result of saturn/sun opposition.> From AL, saturn/sun are at 6/12 axis, and ketu/rahu are at 4/10 axis.> Pisces rises in D-9, a spiritual sign. Luminaries are on 4/10 axis--complementing each other. So the mind and the atma were well aligned. The saturn and jupiter are together. Saturn being stronger, so he rejected all dogmas and systems.> In D-60, the moon is in the ninth house shows his skills in past lives: unmatched understanding of the mind. The moon is also in a quadrant from the AK. So the soul really wanted to rip apart human psyche to find the truth in next life. Have I got it right?> In D-60, The AK is with Ketu, the mokshakaraka, and its exalted dispositor is in the twelfth house--this is 6/12 axis. > Just my thoughts. I've just begun to understand astrology, so can't see beyond the above points. > > Promila> > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...>> sohamsa@ .com> Friday, August 31, 2007 4:12:27 AM> Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and v_reality)> > > Dear Sharat,> I cant share the chart of the person that I mentioned. However, > among famous people the ones with Sun AK that I remember are:> 1) Swami Vivekananda (Sun in Sag, 1st house)> 2) Jiddu Krishnamurti (Sun exalted in 4th house) May 12, 1895, > 0:23am, 78E30, 13N33, +5:14GMT. Extremely insightful writings on the > nature/contents of the mind.> 3) Gautam Buddha (I saw the chart somewhere and it was exalted Sun > AK, but I cant verify it anymore, perhaps someone else can suggest > the time)> I know that there was this one Guru on this group - Partha - he was > Sun AK too and wrote many insightful posts about the nature of self, > but he doesnt seem to be posting anymore. I am pretty sure that > Bharatji (if you dont mind my identifying you) is Sun AK too, and > you can see for yourself that he writes in the same vein as well. > > Hope this helps,> > Sundeep> > sohamsa@ .com, " Sharat" <gidoc@> wrote:> >> > |Namah Shivaya|> > Dear Sundeep,> > Sun AK thus 'struggles' as it can always see ' himself' clearly > while for others the drive is on other aspects of life, you quote > mirror as an apt example.> > It will help to study how Sun AK do their karmas and how it > effects their spirituality.> > Any example charts?> > Best> > Sharat> > > > - > > vedicastrostudent > > sohamsa@ .com > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 7:40 PM> > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > v_reality)> > > > > > Dear Promila,> > First, thanks to all of you (Sharat, Tijanaji, Promila, Nitish) > for > > responding.> > > > But Promila, how dare you stop when you've made such a wonderful > > point :-) See, Tijanaji's point that ego is simply a situation > where > > we take more than we give is fraught with problems. It is simply > a > > statement made from Guru to Shishya with a lot of unsaid context > > around it and that context is only understood by Guru and > Shishya. > > You cannot use this definition when trying to fathom the depths > of > > the many good works on psychology and spirituality. See, what is > it > > that we are "giving" and "taking" and is that what all the > > books/scriptures mean when they talk about ego? By this > definition, > > Bill Gates and Warren Buffet can be said to have the smallest > egos > > in the world, because they both have decided to give virtually > ALL > > their material belongings (worth about $50 billion each) to > charity. > > I know you are all shaking your heads saying, "but that is not > what > > was meant". So, you didnt mean it materially right? So what way > was > > it meant? Psychologically? But then what is it that you > are "giving" > > and "taking"? And if you play around a little more and test it > out, > > Promila's wonderful example will throw you in another fix - > because > > as she rightly observes it is not only the "great me" > moods/types > > that are egotistical, but also the "poor me" moods/types. > The "poor > > me" types are generally self-flagellating types who work very > hard > > for others (family, spouse, children etc) and on the > surface "give" > > a lot. In both cases, the focus on "me" is exaggerated. I prefer > > Carl Jung's definition of ego, and notice that it is what is > meant > > in most deep contexts. Ego is simply the center of > consciousness. > > The psyche not only has the Ego but the unconscious also. Within > the > > unconscious is a deeper center called the Self, which is perhaps > the > > indicator of the Atma. An egotistical person, whether the "poor > me" > > type or the "great me" type has greater concentration of mental > > energy on the ego, and less in the Self (the Self is always > > perceived as divinity). Every AK's goal is to "reduce the ego" > i.e. > > reduce the concentration of mental energy in the ego, and > increase > > it in the Self (the divine center). That is why, to me, Sun is > the > > natural AK. When one says that everyone must "serve", no matter > how > > it manifests *physically* , psychologically they are reducing the > > concentration of energy in the ego and increasing it in the > Self. > > Different chara AKs are different only in the method they adopt > to > > cause a reduction in ego of the native. Venus AKs have > relationship > > experiences that put the mirror in front of the ego and make it > give > > up its energy to the Self, Rahu AKs have rahu like experiences I > > guess that put the mirror in front of the ego. With Sun AK, I > have > > found the mirror is direct.> > > > I only post because I continue to dispute the implication that > Sun > > AKs have larger egos. They are no different from others, but > their > > experiences quickly bring direct and harsh focus on themselves > > rather than through other aspects of their interactions with the > > world. The chara karakatwa of Sun is not an indicator of larger > ego, > > only of the directness of the experiences that will lead to a > > reduction in it.> > > > Sundeep> > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@> > > wrote:> > >> > > Ego is not only the feeling of "I'm great", but it is also > > the "Poor me" attitude. Both great and poor me demand attention. > > I'll stop at that as it's a forum to discuss to jyotish (you > rightly > > said).> > > > > > I've Taurus ascendent . Saturn is in the third house (Cancer) > > along with Sun. Darkness and light are together. D-9 ascendent > is > > Capricon and Saturn is in the 7th house (Cancer). So Saturn is > > Virgottama. IT's also my Ishtadevta. Now tell me what's in your > > mind > > > > > > > > > > > > tijanadamjanovic <nix_nixen@>> > > sohamsa@ .com> > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 8:40:08 PM> > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > > v_reality)> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > Dear Sundeep and Promila,> > > It`s inevitable to enter the sphere of philosophy in subjects > like> > > this, but we should try stick to Jyotish principles. That is > how i> > > understood Nitish`s and mine discussion. Not in a moment i > thought > > i> > > can actually define ahamkar, or even ego, and am sure it wasn`t> > > Nitish` ambition either. > > > Actually i follow a single definition of ego taught by my Guru-> ego > > is> > > nothing but a situation where we are taking more than we are > > giving.> > > If one likes to think, one can find a lot in this simple > statement > > and> > > it`s the most practical advice also.> > > Promila, where is Saturn in your rasi and navamsa chart?> > > Warm regards,> > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara > <promilac@ .> > > wrote:> > > >> > > > Sundeep,> > > > > > > > You post was beautiful!> > > > > > > > I don't know how technically accurate it is, but at the> > > psychological level you have made good points. I've Rahu as my > AK, > > but> > > I've major ego despite a weak Sun! Maybe it comes from Mars in > the > > D-1> > > and D-9 ascendents. However, since Ketu is placed in D-1 > ascendent> > > (taurus) with Mars, it urges me to do a lot of self-analysis > and> > > self-obervation. Not even a single hour passes in my life > without> > > analyzing my thoughts and actions...I don't know if I make > sense > > here.> > > > > > > > > > > > P.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...>> > > > sohamsa@ .com> > > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 1:26:13 AM> > > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish > and > > v_reality)> > > > > > > > Dear Tijanaji and Nitish,> > > > > > > > I have been reading your exchange with interest in the hope > of > > > > learning something new, but I find myself disagreeing subtly > in > > the > > > > essence of what you say. In fact, deep down in the exchange > I > > find > > > > this statement made by "v_reality" which makes a lot of > sense to > > me:> > > > "Can this also be understood at a different level as the > > effacement > > > > of 'self' in a spiritual sense?".> > > > > > > > Here is my take - I have none of the scriptural knowledge > you > > both > > > > have, only I have seen several Sun AK people: I dont think > it is > > > > fair to say that Sun AK people are egotistic. See, English > also > > has > > > > a lot of words which have subtly different meanings, and the > > right > > > > one has to be used. An egotistic person is one who has a > > exaggerated > > > > sense of self-importance. Almost everyone in this world has > that > > > > (and you are fooling yourself if you deny it), it is plain > wrong > > to > > > > observe a person have Sun AK and simultaneously observe that > he > > also > > > > has an exaggerated sense of self importance and say "yes, > that > > is > > > > what the Sun AK does to him". I can cite hundreds of people > I > > know > > > > who are very self important and DONT have Sun AK, and not > only > > that > > > > may not even have a strong Sun in their chart.> > > > > > > > I personally think the only statement that can be observed > > > > repeatedly with Sun AK people is that they are egocentric > i.e. > > their > > > > view of the world is based on the individual rather than the > > > > society. They may or may not be egotistical (i.e. > egocentricity > > does > > > > not imply self importance) - the AK simply makes them go > through > > > > experiences in life such that their core self is tested. How > > they > > > > respond to it depends probably on lots of other astrological > > > > factors. The only statement I can safely make, based on pure > > > > experience, is that Sun AK people are guided to divinity > through > > > > experiences of the self, consequently their view is > egocentric.> > > > > > > > I know one Sun AK woman (dont know if I can share her data) > who > > was > > > > molested (by her own professor) and denied a higher degree > that > > she > > > > worked hard for, then get married and then divorced, then > have > > her > > > > mom die of cancer in a rather painful way, then have her > brother > > get > > > > divorced in a messy lawsuit (and then leave her too), then > (she) > > get > > > > married again and her husband develop terminal cancer very > soon > > > > afterward. Net result: she cant seem to find a strong and > > consistent > > > > support outside of herself - she has become self reliant and > > only > > > > finds consistent happiness in meditation/reiki. She is > probably > > > > egotistical in some degree too, but not in any outstanding > way > > at > > > > all, and probably much less than all the people around her..> > > > > > > > Consequently, I really dispute the fact that Sun AK people > must > > > > learn to "reduce their ego". That is simply a general lesson > for > > all > > > > of mankind. Sun AK people's AK will guide them towards > divinity > > > > through experiences that make them focus on themselves and > > search > > > > for the truth: now that's the statement I find much more to > the > > > > point.> > > > > > > > Comments?> > > > > > > > Thanks,> > > > > > > > Sundeep> > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, nix nixen <nix_nixen@ ..> > wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > Only from one simple statement of yours "It is not always > > > > possible for me..." i read that your AK must be nothing less > > than > > > > Sun. Am i right? If yes, then i think i`m on the right way > of > > > > finding answers on my queries.> > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > yeeahoo_99 <nitish.arya@ ...> wrote:> > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > Raja Yoga is the yoga of soul with paramatma - > deep/shallow,> > > > > material/spiritual - all kind of things have a basis only > in> > > > > paramatma. Thus, even Raja-bhanga yoga has a basis i.e. > > separation > > > > of> > > > > soul from paramatma (which is illusory only though) and > hence> > > > > material/spiritual loss depending on the kind of karma > > involved.> > > > > > > > > > As the lord of a sign, a planet rules a 12th part of the> > > > > consciousness, relatively . Thus, in part, it becomes its> > > > > responsibility to guide the affairs of that sign/house > towards> > > > > fulfillment. You may explore it further.> > > > > > > > > > It is not always possible for me to answer to your > specific > > > > queries.> > > > > Hopefully, in time, you will discover the truth of your > > queries.> > > > > > > > > > best regards,> > > > > nitish> > > > > > > > > > --- In sohamsa@ .com, "tijanadamjanovic" > > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > > Yes, all must serve. The questions raised in these > > discussions > > > > on Atma> > > > > > karakas were on the specific way of serving. > > > > > > If we say that Sun AK must learn principles of artha > shastra > > to > > > > serve,> > > > > > the same stands for Ma and Ju AK? How to differentiate? > I > > assume > > > > you> > > > > > are taking karakatvas of the houses into account also > (2nd, > > 6th, > > > > 10th)?> > > > > > The Sun/Raja gets service on the throne, but regarding > > > > spirituality> > > > > > and Atma this is related to real Raja yoga whose deepest > > meaning > > > > is> > > > > > inseparable from 10th house of indriyas (refer > > Vivekananda) . > > > > Only in> > > > > > that sense we can talk of Janaka or the perfect King. > What > > artha> > > > > > shastra principles you had in mind?> > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "yeeahoo_99" > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > > > wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > || Om TAT SAT ||> > > > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > > mentioning Gita in this context.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Context that was intended is Gita Chapter 3,sloka 22.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > All must work if the lord of the cosmos has chosen to > > work. > > > > Thus, > > > > > > > there is nothing specific that only SUN AK has > to "serve", > > all > > > > AKs > > > > > > > "serve".> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, are you implying that Sun AK gives a person > akin to > > > > Janaka?! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, Sun AK gives a person akin to Janaka - > jivanmukta - > > > > provided > > > > > > > enough effort has been put in.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you determing dharma based on this? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No, Sun AK need not be 9th lord.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra > as > > an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > The attitude of service is seen from 6th house. Leo > being > > a > > > > dharma > > > > > > > trikona sign fulfills its purpose of service through > 10th > > > > house of > > > > > > > Artha, which is 6th from it. So a Sun AK should learn > > > > principles of > > > > > > > artha shastra to serve.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All souls have to "Serve" only as there is nothing > else to > > be > > > > done > > > > > > > in the three worlds because Krishna has already > achieved > > > > everything > > > > > > > that is there to achieve in the three worlds(refer > Gita). > > > > Those who > > > > > > > do not serve, are reborn to learn to serve, whatever > be > > their > > > > AK.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus> > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself).> > > > > > > > But do you think it`s a coincidence that His Master > had > > > > exalted > > > > > > > Saturn in 9th> > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is not re-born after exhausting his karma/desires. > > Thus, > > > > > > > vivekananda (Rahu PiK) came here to exhaust his > remaining > > > > karma/> > > > > > > desires with Ramakrishna (Rahu AK). There is no more > > substance > > > > to > > > > > > > this than a past-life karmic relationship of the two > which > > > > continued > > > > > > > in this birth also.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards,> > > > > > > NITISH> > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijana" <nix_nixen@> > > wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > > > > Your elaboration would be even more brilliant if you > had > > > > just answer> > > > > > > > my question.> > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > mentioning> > > > > > > > Gita in this context. But, are you implying that Sun > AK > > > > gives a> > > > > > > > person akin to Janaka?! Are you determing dharma > based > > on > > > > this? Will> > > > > > > > you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra as an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus> > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself). > > > > But do > > > > > > > you> > > > > > > > think it`s a coincidence that His Master had exalted > > Saturn > > > > in 9th> > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these? > > > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "yeeahoo_99" > > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat ||> > > > > > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What is the thing that Raja will hardly ever do?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read up Gita, arthashastra and ancient texts that > show > > > > what > > > > > > > all a > > > > > > > > > Raja has to do to ensure that his subjects are > > protected > > > > and > > > > > > > progress > > > > > > > > > on the upward evolutionary path. Look at krishna, > > Janaka > > > > and > > > > > > > > > ChandraGupta Maurya and you will understand > whatever > > > > that "hardly > > > > > > > > > ever do" equates to.> > > > > > > > > Otherwise, going by your statement, AK wouldn't do > > > > anything > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > the king of the horoscope and the rest of the > karakas > > (BK, > > > > PiK, > > > > > > > Puk, > > > > > > > > > GK) i.e. his subjects will follow the suit!> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, the mantra is "Shiva jnane Jiva Seva" > > (serving > > > > every > > > > > > > > > being as the full manifestation of God) that > > Narendranath > > > > > > > received > > > > > > > > > from his Master Ramakrishna who had Sun in > Aquarius.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Being Sun AK, Vivekananda had developed peculiar > > sharpness > > > > of > > > > > > > > > perception and assimilation that empowered him > with > > > > unusual power > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > pick up 'the gems' from the talks of his Master.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Sun in Sagittarius, he could, as compared to > > others, > > > > > > > easily > > > > > > > > > 'see' the deep meaning in the words of Sri > > Ramakrishna, > > > > even > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > the Master told them in simple language (Aq Sun), > and > > > > never as > > > > > > > > > preaching.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With its dispositor Jupiter in Libra, gradually > Swami > > > > > > > Vivekananda > > > > > > > > > started assimilating tips and hints on practical > > Vedanta > > > > that > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > benefit individual and collective life in the > society.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "...For spiritual persons Sun as AK should be in > > > > Jupiter`s > > > > > > > signs > > > > > > > > > > (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s very hard > task..."> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Putting up statements like you have done is not > wise. > > Sri > > > > > > > Yukteswar > > > > > > > > > Giri, has Sun AK placed in Aries and had attained > > highest > > > > level > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > spirituality. Even if Sun AK is placed in Libra, > it > > could > > > > be the > > > > > > > most > > > > > > > > > spiritual person.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AK shows the spiritual power of a sign over the > rest > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > signs/> > > > > > > > > planets in the chart and this spiritual power > > manifests > > > > through > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > dispositor of AK and its sign placement.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards,> > > > > > > > > NITISH> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijana" > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > > > > > Dear Su,> > > > > > > > > > Sun is the Self. Its qualities are those of Raja > > (karaka > > > > for > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > first house, lord of the 5th, dig bala in 10th). > > What is > > > > the > > > > > > > thing > > > > > > > > > > that Raja will hardly ever do? The lesson that > has > > to be > > > > learnt > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK is serving, in the highest sence it > > gives "Shiva > > > > jnane > > > > > > > Shiva > > > > > > > > > > seva" (service of man as God)-the divine lesson > > given to > > > > us by > > > > > > > > > Swami > > > > > > > > > > Vivekananda (Sun AK). For spiritual persons Sun > as > > AK > > > > should be > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > Jupiter`s signs (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s > > very > > > > hard task.> > > > > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "v reality" > > <reality_v@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bojan-ji> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for your reply. Much appreciated.> > > > > > > > > > > If I may ask another query re Sun AK. The > lesson > > to be > > > > > > > learnt > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK, > > > > > > > > > > > is the reduction of ego. Can this also be > > understood > > > > at a > > > > > > > > > > different level > > > > > > > > > > > as the effacement of 'self' in a spiritual > sense?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks> > > > > > > > > > > Su> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan Vidakovic <janbovid@>> > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK> > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 08:33:22 -0700 (PDT)> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >HARE RAMA KRISHNA> > > > > > > > > > > >Dear Su> > > > > > > > > > > >I would add that with Gu AK person have to be > > very > > > > humble to > > > > > > > all > > > > > > > > > > spiritual > > > > > > > > > > > >techers and natives, like priests, gurus, > > teachers. > > > > With Ma > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > person must > > > > > > > > > > > >practise Ahumsa (nonviolence) , with Ch the > > native is > > > > always > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > caring, > > > > > > > > > > > >and gives emotions but the problem is that > they > > never > > > > get > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > > >themselves from other people. The person must > > learn > > > > lessons > > > > > > > also > > > > > > > > > > from the > > > > > > > > > > > >people represented with AK. Ch / mother, Sy / > > father > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > everything those > > > > > > > > > > > >grahas represent.> > > > > > > > > > > >Take few examples of people you know and see > it > > in > > > > praxix. > > > > > > > Best > > > > > > > > > > wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan> > > > > > > > > > > >Hari Om Tat Sat> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ > wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > hraum namah adityaya> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Su,> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Person should use a lot of glass and > sing/hum > > > > melodies.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > Rafal Gendarz> > > > > > > > > > > > Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > > > > > > > > > > > email: rafal@> > > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > v reality napisaÅ,(a): Dear Rafalji/Members> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > This is an interesting discussion. Could we > > discuss > > > > other > > > > > > > AKs > > > > > > > > > > too. I read> > > > > > > > > > > > in an article that natives with Moon as AK > need > > to > > > > learn > > > > > > > to be > > > > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > > > >caring> > > > > > > > > > > > and loving to others. But I know of a chart > > where > > > > the > > > > > > > native > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > >by> > > > > > > > > > > > nature very caring, loving and concerned > about > > > > others > > > > > > > since > > > > > > > > > > young. So > > > > > > > > > > > >what> > > > > > > > > > > > is the lesson to be learnt?> > > > > > > > > > > > thanks> > > > > > > > > > > > Su> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl>> > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK> > > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 10:24:14 +0200> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > *hraum namah adityaya*> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Dear LN Kumar,> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >With Ju AK person should learn to respect > > others > > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > >tradition,> > > > > > > > > > > > >should be ready to learn from others. When > Ju > > is in > > > > > > > kendra to > > > > > > > > > > AK or is > > > > > > > > > > > >AK> > > > > > > > > > > > >himself then native thinks that he knows > > everything > > > > and > > > > > > > now > > > > > > > > > He > > > > > > > > > > can share> > > > > > > > > > > > >His knowledge with everybody. Good teachers > of > > > > course > > > > > > > comes > > > > > > > > > from> > > > > > > > > > > > >AK-Jupiter- Natives, as this graha will be > > > > naturally in > > > > > > > > > > Karakamsa.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >With MA AK person should learn to catalyze > > energies > > > > > > > through > > > > > > > > > > ZEN, TAI-CHI > > > > > > > > > > > >or> > > > > > > > > > > > >other techniques, while with JU AK person > > should > > > > learn to > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > more humble> > > > > > > > > > > > >regarding knowledge. Of course person can > be > > > > focused on > > > > > > > > > Jupiter-> > > > > > > > > > karakas> > > > > > > > > > > > >like kids, spirituality, law, luck etc.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Mahadasa of AK brings lesson to us so its > not > > so > > > > easy > > > > > > > > > > materially but> > > > > > > > > > > > >inspiring spiritually, so if Surya is in > good > > > > placement > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > then it > > > > > > > > > > > >can> > > > > > > > > > > > >be not so bad as person is spiritual.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz> > > > > > > > > > > > >Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > > > > > > > > > > > >email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com> > > > > > > > > > > > >Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >narender kumar napisa?(a):> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Dear Gurujans,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Kindly throw some light on Jupiter as> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Atmakaraka and having Jupiter as mahadasha.> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Respectful Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>LN Kumar> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>__________ __ _________ _________ > _________ > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > > _________ _> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the > > > > Internet in > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > pocket: > > > > > > > > > > > >mail,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>news, photos & more.> > > > > > > > > > > > >>http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC> > > > > > > > > > > > >><http://mobile. / go?refer= > 1GNXIC>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ > > _________ > > > > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > _> > > > > > > > > > > > Advertisement: It's simple! Sell your car > for > > just > > > > $30 at > > > > > > > > > > CarPoint.com. > > > > > > > > > > > >au> > > > > > > > > > > > http://a.ninemsn. com.au/b. aspx?URL= http%> 3A%> > 2F% > > > > > > > 2Fsecure% > > > > > > > > > > > >2Dau%2Eimrworldw ide%2Ecom% 2Fcgi%2Dbin% 2Fa%> > 2Fci% > > > > 5F450304% > > > > > > > > > 2Fet%> > > > > > > > > > 5F2% > > > > > > > > > > > >2Fcg%5F801459% 2Fpi%5F1004813% 2Fai%5F859641 & > > > > _t=762955845 & > > > > > > > > > > _r=tig_AUG07 & > > > > > > > > > > > >_m=EXT> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >Best wishes,> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > SJC Guru Bojan Vidakovic> > > > > > > > > > > > for articles and consultations visit> > > > > > > > > > > >http://www.jataveda s.com> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >----------- --------- --------- ----> > > > > > > > > > > >Choose the right car based on your needs. > Check > > out > > > > > > > > > > > > > Autos > > > > > > > > > > new Car > > > > > > > > > > > >Finder tool.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ > > _________ _> > > > > > > > > > > Advertisement: Make shopping exciting. 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Check out > Autos> > > new Car Finder tool.> > > > http://autos. / carfinder/> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _> > ____________ ___> > > Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the Internet in your > > pocket: mail, news, photos & more. > > > http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC> > >> >> > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _____________ __> Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Answers - Check it out.> http://answers. / dir/?link= list & sid= 396545469> Choose the right car based on your needs. Check out Autos new Car Finder tool. Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Travel. Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with FareChase. Luggage? GPS? Comic books? Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted September 1, 2007 Report Share Posted September 1, 2007 Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Promila,I am familiar with this article. I also have Sun AK in Aries AL and my Father dissapeared and was not heard from since when I was just a child. My chart is attatched.7th May 1981, 3:15am, Warsaw, PolandRespectfully,MichalPromila Chitkara <promilacsohamsa Sent: Sunday, September 2, 2007 1:02:13 AMRe: Jiddu Krishnamurti Dear Michal, I just found the following excerpts from Sanjay Prabhakaran' s blog. This is Sanjay Rath ji's analysis: http://sanjayprabha karan.blogspot. com/2005/ 12/atmakaraka- in-alarudha- lagna.html 2. Jiddu Krishnamuti has the Sun atmakaraka in arudha lagna in Aries. This is the most royal sign and the Sun relates to father. There is a dictum which states that the Sun in the 1st or 7th house in Aries/Libra - native is abandoned by parents. This is true both for Bhagavan Sri Rama and Jiddu Krishnamurti who had Sun in AL in Aries and Saturn in 7th house. Krishnamurti lost his mother in 1905 and was finally adopted by Helena Blavatsky in 1910. Then there was a legal dispute over parental custody between Blavatsky and Jiddu Narasimah (Krishnamurti' s biological father). It finally ended when Krishnamurti finall appeared at the Privy council and chose Blavatsky instead of his father. [at this stage the arudha lagna dominated over the atmakaraka as Krishnamurti was only 18 years old]. However, the atmakaraka started rising after his 28 years of age as it is in Aries - this was triggered by two events (1) death of father [sun] in 1924 and (2) death of brother [Mars] in 1925. Look at the Sun in Aries as AK. Then in 1929 on the opening day of the annual Star Camp at Ommen, Holland, Krishnamurti dissolved the Order before 3000 members. This was the complete and total rejection of the arudha. He questioned the fundamental basis of the guru-shisya parampara and said that the spiritual path was a path to freedom while the guru-shisya parampara of spiritual lineages in India were a kind of bondage. Remember AK Sun in AL is aspected by Saturn. Light! Promila Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal >sohamsa@ .comSaturday, September 1, 2007 2:56:25 PMRe: Jiddu Krishnamurti Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Promila,Here are the details given earlier in this thread:2) Jiddu Krishnamurti (Sun exalted in 4th house) May 12, 1895, > 0:23am, 78E30, 13N33I don't know what you 'rechecked', but Capricorn is the Lagna.Respectfully,Michal Promila Chitkara <promilac >sohamsa@ .comSaturday, September 1, 2007 9:04:06 PMRe: Jiddu Krishnamurti Hare Rama Krsna ||Hi Michael, Thanks for your input. His lagna is cancer. I rechecked. To verify we can do a search on google. Will get back on this point soon, in the meantime if you find some more references of capricorn lagna, please let me know. I really like the following point you made. Arudha Lagna is Aries with exalted Surya giving a person that emphasises 'being' and 'now'. Saturn exalted but retrograde in the 7th from AL shows the obstruction he faced in life with orthodox religion and rigid belief systems. However, I read long ago that if a planet is retrograde, that is, if it starts going in the opposite direction (from fwd to backwards), its signification also take a turn, that is, they are just the opposite of its natural signification. So if Saturn is retro, instead of making one a tranditionalist or conformist, it will actually take the native away from these. IF my understanding is correct, then Saturn contributed to the major event of his life when he disowned the "Order of Star of the East" and said truth is a pathless land and systems, sects, and religions only take you away from it. I would be grateful, if you also give your views on other points that I made, and please also add more analysis. It'll facilitate good learning. God Bless! Promila Michal Dziwulski <nearmichal >sohamsa@ .comSaturday, September 1, 2007 1:55:23 AMRe: Jiddu Krishnamurti Hare Rama Krsna ||Dear Promila,> From AL, saturn/sun are at 6/12 axis, and ketu/rahu are at 4/10 axisArudha Lagna is Aries with exalted Surya giving a person that emphasises 'being' and 'now'. Saturn exalted but retrograde in the 7th from AL shows the obstruction he faced in life with orthodox religion and rigid belief systems.> Sun, the AK is exalted in rasi chart in 10th house. Since he was an evolved soul. We don't need to look its D-9 position as much. Am I correct? I think you are using Cancer Lagna, when actually his Lagna is Makara. Also, seeing the Navamsa position is very important.Respectfully,Michal tijanadamjanovic <nix_nixen >sohamsa@ .comFriday, August 31, 2007 11:17:40 PM Jiddu Krishnamurti Om Gurave NamahDear Promila,Please send the birth chart details of Jiddu Krishnamurti so that everybody can follow.Warm regards,Tijanasohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@.. .> wrote:>> Jiddu Krishnamurti' s chart is very interesting:> Both Saturn ® and Sun are exalted and are opposite each other on 4/10 axis.> Sun, the AK is exalted in rasi chart in 10th house. Since he was an evolved soul. We don't need to look its D-9 position as much. Am I correct? > An exalted atmakaraka, who is a natural significator of atma taught the world to observe the "I". Interesting enough that he discouraged talks on reincarnation, intuition, meditation, astrology etc. He discouraged adopting a mechanical approach towards religion and spirituality. His idea of meditation is really beautiful! That said, he wanted the world to go deeper to understand the need why we discuss and depend on these stuff. This is a result of saturn/sun opposition.> From AL, saturn/sun are at 6/12 axis, and ketu/rahu are at 4/10 axis.> Pisces rises in D-9, a spiritual sign. Luminaries are on 4/10 axis--complementing each other. So the mind and the atma were well aligned. The saturn and jupiter are together. Saturn being stronger, so he rejected all dogmas and systems.> In D-60, the moon is in the ninth house shows his skills in past lives: unmatched understanding of the mind. The moon is also in a quadrant from the AK. So the soul really wanted to rip apart human psyche to find the truth in next life. Have I got it right?> In D-60, The AK is with Ketu, the mokshakaraka, and its exalted dispositor is in the twelfth house--this is 6/12 axis. > Just my thoughts. I've just begun to understand astrology, so can't see beyond the above points. > > Promila> > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...>> sohamsa@ .com> Friday, August 31, 2007 4:12:27 AM> Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and v_reality)> > > Dear Sharat,> I cant share the chart of the person that I mentioned. However, > among famous people the ones with Sun AK that I remember are:> 1) Swami Vivekananda (Sun in Sag, 1st house)> 2) Jiddu Krishnamurti (Sun exalted in 4th house) May 12, 1895, > 0:23am, 78E30, 13N33, +5:14GMT. Extremely insightful writings on the > nature/contents of the mind.> 3) Gautam Buddha (I saw the chart somewhere and it was exalted Sun > AK, but I cant verify it anymore, perhaps someone else can suggest > the time)> I know that there was this one Guru on this group - Partha - he was > Sun AK too and wrote many insightful posts about the nature of self, > but he doesnt seem to be posting anymore. I am pretty sure that > Bharatji (if you dont mind my identifying you) is Sun AK too, and > you can see for yourself that he writes in the same vein as well. > > Hope this helps,> > Sundeep> > sohamsa@ .com, " Sharat" <gidoc@> wrote:> >> > |Namah Shivaya|> > Dear Sundeep,> > Sun AK thus 'struggles' as it can always see ' himself' clearly > while for others the drive is on other aspects of life, you quote > mirror as an apt example.> > It will help to study how Sun AK do their karmas and how it > effects their spirituality.> > Any example charts?> > Best> > Sharat> > > > - > > vedicastrostudent > > sohamsa@ .com > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 7:40 PM> > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > v_reality)> > > > > > Dear Promila,> > First, thanks to all of you (Sharat, Tijanaji, Promila, Nitish) > for > > responding.> > > > But Promila, how dare you stop when you've made such a wonderful > > point :-) See, Tijanaji's point that ego is simply a situation > where > > we take more than we give is fraught with problems. It is simply > a > > statement made from Guru to Shishya with a lot of unsaid context > > around it and that context is only understood by Guru and > Shishya. > > You cannot use this definition when trying to fathom the depths > of > > the many good works on psychology and spirituality. See, what is > it > > that we are "giving" and "taking" and is that what all the > > books/scriptures mean when they talk about ego? By this > definition, > > Bill Gates and Warren Buffet can be said to have the smallest > egos > > in the world, because they both have decided to give virtually > ALL > > their material belongings (worth about $50 billion each) to > charity. > > I know you are all shaking your heads saying, "but that is not > what > > was meant". So, you didnt mean it materially right? So what way > was > > it meant? Psychologically? But then what is it that you > are "giving" > > and "taking"? And if you play around a little more and test it > out, > > Promila's wonderful example will throw you in another fix - > because > > as she rightly observes it is not only the "great me" > moods/types > > that are egotistical, but also the "poor me" moods/types. > The "poor > > me" types are generally self-flagellating types who work very > hard > > for others (family, spouse, children etc) and on the > surface "give" > > a lot. In both cases, the focus on "me" is exaggerated. I prefer > > Carl Jung's definition of ego, and notice that it is what is > meant > > in most deep contexts. Ego is simply the center of > consciousness. > > The psyche not only has the Ego but the unconscious also. Within > the > > unconscious is a deeper center called the Self, which is perhaps > the > > indicator of the Atma. An egotistical person, whether the "poor > me" > > type or the "great me" type has greater concentration of mental > > energy on the ego, and less in the Self (the Self is always > > perceived as divinity). Every AK's goal is to "reduce the ego" > i.e. > > reduce the concentration of mental energy in the ego, and > increase > > it in the Self (the divine center). That is why, to me, Sun is > the > > natural AK. When one says that everyone must "serve", no matter > how > > it manifests *physically* , psychologically they are reducing the > > concentration of energy in the ego and increasing it in the > Self. > > Different chara AKs are different only in the method they adopt > to > > cause a reduction in ego of the native. Venus AKs have > relationship > > experiences that put the mirror in front of the ego and make it > give > > up its energy to the Self, Rahu AKs have rahu like experiences I > > guess that put the mirror in front of the ego. With Sun AK, I > have > > found the mirror is direct.> > > > I only post because I continue to dispute the implication that > Sun > > AKs have larger egos. They are no different from others, but > their > > experiences quickly bring direct and harsh focus on themselves > > rather than through other aspects of their interactions with the > > world. The chara karakatwa of Sun is not an indicator of larger > ego, > > only of the directness of the experiences that will lead to a > > reduction in it.> > > > Sundeep> > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara <promilac@> > > wrote:> > >> > > Ego is not only the feeling of "I'm great", but it is also > > the "Poor me" attitude. Both great and poor me demand attention. > > I'll stop at that as it's a forum to discuss to jyotish (you > rightly > > said).> > > > > > I've Taurus ascendent . Saturn is in the third house (Cancer) > > along with Sun. Darkness and light are together. D-9 ascendent > is > > Capricon and Saturn is in the 7th house (Cancer). So Saturn is > > Virgottama. IT's also my Ishtadevta. Now tell me what's in your > > mind > > > > > > > > > > > > tijanadamjanovic <nix_nixen@>> > > sohamsa@ .com> > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 8:40:08 PM> > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish and > > v_reality)> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > Dear Sundeep and Promila,> > > It`s inevitable to enter the sphere of philosophy in subjects > like> > > this, but we should try stick to Jyotish principles. That is > how i> > > understood Nitish`s and mine discussion. Not in a moment i > thought > > i> > > can actually define ahamkar, or even ego, and am sure it wasn`t> > > Nitish` ambition either. > > > Actually i follow a single definition of ego taught by my Guru-> ego > > is> > > nothing but a situation where we are taking more than we are > > giving.> > > If one likes to think, one can find a lot in this simple > statement > > and> > > it`s the most practical advice also.> > > Promila, where is Saturn in your rasi and navamsa chart?> > > Warm regards,> > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, Promila Chitkara > <promilac@ .> > > wrote:> > > >> > > > Sundeep,> > > > > > > > You post was beautiful!> > > > > > > > I don't know how technically accurate it is, but at the> > > psychological level you have made good points. I've Rahu as my > AK, > > but> > > I've major ego despite a weak Sun! Maybe it comes from Mars in > the > > D-1> > > and D-9 ascendents. However, since Ketu is placed in D-1 > ascendent> > > (taurus) with Mars, it urges me to do a lot of self-analysis > and> > > self-obervation. Not even a single hour passes in my life > without> > > analyzing my thoughts and actions...I don't know if I make > sense > > here.> > > > > > > > > > > > P.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > vedicastrostudent <vedicastrostudent@ ...>> > > > sohamsa@ .com> > > > Thursday, August 30, 2007 1:26:13 AM> > > > Re: Jupiter as AK (to Tijanaji, Nitish > and > > v_reality)> > > > > > > > Dear Tijanaji and Nitish,> > > > > > > > I have been reading your exchange with interest in the hope > of > > > > learning something new, but I find myself disagreeing subtly > in > > the > > > > essence of what you say. In fact, deep down in the exchange > I > > find > > > > this statement made by "v_reality" which makes a lot of > sense to > > me:> > > > "Can this also be understood at a different level as the > > effacement > > > > of 'self' in a spiritual sense?".> > > > > > > > Here is my take - I have none of the scriptural knowledge > you > > both > > > > have, only I have seen several Sun AK people: I dont think > it is > > > > fair to say that Sun AK people are egotistic. See, English > also > > has > > > > a lot of words which have subtly different meanings, and the > > right > > > > one has to be used. An egotistic person is one who has a > > exaggerated > > > > sense of self-importance. Almost everyone in this world has > that > > > > (and you are fooling yourself if you deny it), it is plain > wrong > > to > > > > observe a person have Sun AK and simultaneously observe that > he > > also > > > > has an exaggerated sense of self importance and say "yes, > that > > is > > > > what the Sun AK does to him". I can cite hundreds of people > I > > know > > > > who are very self important and DONT have Sun AK, and not > only > > that > > > > may not even have a strong Sun in their chart.> > > > > > > > I personally think the only statement that can be observed > > > > repeatedly with Sun AK people is that they are egocentric > i.e. > > their > > > > view of the world is based on the individual rather than the > > > > society. They may or may not be egotistical (i.e. > egocentricity > > does > > > > not imply self importance) - the AK simply makes them go > through > > > > experiences in life such that their core self is tested. How > > they > > > > respond to it depends probably on lots of other astrological > > > > factors. The only statement I can safely make, based on pure > > > > experience, is that Sun AK people are guided to divinity > through > > > > experiences of the self, consequently their view is > egocentric.> > > > > > > > I know one Sun AK woman (dont know if I can share her data) > who > > was > > > > molested (by her own professor) and denied a higher degree > that > > she > > > > worked hard for, then get married and then divorced, then > have > > her > > > > mom die of cancer in a rather painful way, then have her > brother > > get > > > > divorced in a messy lawsuit (and then leave her too), then > (she) > > get > > > > married again and her husband develop terminal cancer very > soon > > > > afterward. Net result: she cant seem to find a strong and > > consistent > > > > support outside of herself - she has become self reliant and > > only > > > > finds consistent happiness in meditation/reiki. She is > probably > > > > egotistical in some degree too, but not in any outstanding > way > > at > > > > all, and probably much less than all the people around her..> > > > > > > > Consequently, I really dispute the fact that Sun AK people > must > > > > learn to "reduce their ego". That is simply a general lesson > for > > all > > > > of mankind. Sun AK people's AK will guide them towards > divinity > > > > through experiences that make them focus on themselves and > > search > > > > for the truth: now that's the statement I find much more to > the > > > > point.> > > > > > > > Comments?> > > > > > > > Thanks,> > > > > > > > Sundeep> > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, nix nixen <nix_nixen@ ..> > wrote:> > > > >> > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > Only from one simple statement of yours "It is not always > > > > possible for me..." i read that your AK must be nothing less > > than > > > > Sun. Am i right? If yes, then i think i`m on the right way > of > > > > finding answers on my queries.> > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > yeeahoo_99 <nitish.arya@ ...> wrote:> > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > Raja Yoga is the yoga of soul with paramatma - > deep/shallow,> > > > > material/spiritual - all kind of things have a basis only > in> > > > > paramatma. Thus, even Raja-bhanga yoga has a basis i.e. > > separation > > > > of> > > > > soul from paramatma (which is illusory only though) and > hence> > > > > material/spiritual loss depending on the kind of karma > > involved.> > > > > > > > > > As the lord of a sign, a planet rules a 12th part of the> > > > > consciousness, relatively . Thus, in part, it becomes its> > > > > responsibility to guide the affairs of that sign/house > towards> > > > > fulfillment. You may explore it further.> > > > > > > > > > It is not always possible for me to answer to your > specific > > > > queries.> > > > > Hopefully, in time, you will discover the truth of your > > queries.> > > > > > > > > > best regards,> > > > > nitish> > > > > > > > > > --- In sohamsa@ .com, "tijanadamjanovic" > > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > >> > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > > Yes, all must serve. The questions raised in these > > discussions > > > > on Atma> > > > > > karakas were on the specific way of serving. > > > > > > If we say that Sun AK must learn principles of artha > shastra > > to > > > > serve,> > > > > > the same stands for Ma and Ju AK? How to differentiate? > I > > assume > > > > you> > > > > > are taking karakatvas of the houses into account also > (2nd, > > 6th, > > > > 10th)?> > > > > > The Sun/Raja gets service on the throne, but regarding > > > > spirituality> > > > > > and Atma this is related to real Raja yoga whose deepest > > meaning > > > > is> > > > > > inseparable from 10th house of indriyas (refer > > Vivekananda) . > > > > Only in> > > > > > that sense we can talk of Janaka or the perfect King. > What > > artha> > > > > > shastra principles you had in mind?> > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "yeeahoo_99" > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > > > wrote:> > > > > > >> > > > > > > || Om TAT SAT ||> > > > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > > mentioning Gita in this context.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Context that was intended is Gita Chapter 3,sloka 22.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > All must work if the lord of the cosmos has chosen to > > work. > > > > Thus, > > > > > > > there is nothing specific that only SUN AK has > to "serve", > > all > > > > AKs > > > > > > > "serve".> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > But, are you implying that Sun AK gives a person > akin to > > > > Janaka?! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes, Sun AK gives a person akin to Janaka - > jivanmukta - > > > > provided > > > > > > > enough effort has been put in.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Are you determing dharma based on this? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No, Sun AK need not be 9th lord.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Will you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra > as > > an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > The attitude of service is seen from 6th house. Leo > being > > a > > > > dharma > > > > > > > trikona sign fulfills its purpose of service through > 10th > > > > house of > > > > > > > Artha, which is 6th from it. So a Sun AK should learn > > > > principles of > > > > > > > artha shastra to serve.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > All souls have to "Serve" only as there is nothing > else to > > be > > > > done > > > > > > > in the three worlds because Krishna has already > achieved > > > > everything > > > > > > > that is there to achieve in the three worlds(refer > Gita). > > > > Those who > > > > > > > do not serve, are reborn to learn to serve, whatever > be > > their > > > > AK.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus> > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself).> > > > > > > > But do you think it`s a coincidence that His Master > had > > > > exalted > > > > > > > Saturn in 9th> > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > One is not re-born after exhausting his karma/desires. > > Thus, > > > > > > > vivekananda (Rahu PiK) came here to exhaust his > remaining > > > > karma/> > > > > > > desires with Ramakrishna (Rahu AK). There is no more > > substance > > > > to > > > > > > > this than a past-life karmic relationship of the two > which > > > > continued > > > > > > > in this birth also.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards,> > > > > > > NITISH> > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijana" <nix_nixen@> > > wrote:> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > > > Dear Nitish,> > > > > > > > Your elaboration would be even more brilliant if you > had > > > > just answer> > > > > > > > my question.> > > > > > > > To fulfill ones own dharma is what you probably had > in > > mind > > > > > > > mentioning> > > > > > > > Gita in this context. But, are you implying that Sun > AK > > > > gives a> > > > > > > > person akin to Janaka?! Are you determing dharma > based > > on > > > > this? Will> > > > > > > > you advise Sun AK people to take Dhartharastra as an > > > > example! > > > > > > > > So, again, what Raja will hardly ever do is serving. > > > > > > > > Swami Vivekananda` s Dharm bhava lord was Sun AK in > > lagna in > > > > Dhanus> > > > > > > > (extraordinary combination for unselfish giving by > > itself). > > > > But do > > > > > > > you> > > > > > > > think it`s a coincidence that His Master had exalted > > Saturn > > > > in 9th> > > > > > > > bhava and Rahu AK? What do you think, why even Swami > > needed > > > > these? > > > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "yeeahoo_99" > > <nitish.arya@ > > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > || Om Tat Sat ||> > > > > > > > > Dear Tijana,> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What is the thing that Raja will hardly ever do?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Read up Gita, arthashastra and ancient texts that > show > > > > what > > > > > > > all a > > > > > > > > > Raja has to do to ensure that his subjects are > > protected > > > > and > > > > > > > progress > > > > > > > > > on the upward evolutionary path. Look at krishna, > > Janaka > > > > and > > > > > > > > > ChandraGupta Maurya and you will understand > whatever > > > > that "hardly > > > > > > > > > ever do" equates to.> > > > > > > > > Otherwise, going by your statement, AK wouldn't do > > > > anything > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > the king of the horoscope and the rest of the > karakas > > (BK, > > > > PiK, > > > > > > > Puk, > > > > > > > > > GK) i.e. his subjects will follow the suit!> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually, the mantra is "Shiva jnane Jiva Seva" > > (serving > > > > every > > > > > > > > > being as the full manifestation of God) that > > Narendranath > > > > > > > received > > > > > > > > > from his Master Ramakrishna who had Sun in > Aquarius.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Being Sun AK, Vivekananda had developed peculiar > > sharpness > > > > of > > > > > > > > > perception and assimilation that empowered him > with > > > > unusual power > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > > > pick up 'the gems' from the talks of his Master.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Sun in Sagittarius, he could, as compared to > > others, > > > > > > > easily > > > > > > > > > 'see' the deep meaning in the words of Sri > > Ramakrishna, > > > > even > > > > > > > though > > > > > > > > > the Master told them in simple language (Aq Sun), > and > > > > never as > > > > > > > > > preaching.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With its dispositor Jupiter in Libra, gradually > Swami > > > > > > > Vivekananda > > > > > > > > > started assimilating tips and hints on practical > > Vedanta > > > > that > > > > > > > could > > > > > > > > > benefit individual and collective life in the > society.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "...For spiritual persons Sun as AK should be in > > > > Jupiter`s > > > > > > > signs > > > > > > > > > > (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s very hard > task..."> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Putting up statements like you have done is not > wise. > > Sri > > > > > > > Yukteswar > > > > > > > > > Giri, has Sun AK placed in Aries and had attained > > highest > > > > level > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > spirituality. Even if Sun AK is placed in Libra, > it > > could > > > > be the > > > > > > > most > > > > > > > > > spiritual person.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > AK shows the spiritual power of a sign over the > rest > > of > > > > the > > > > > > > signs/> > > > > > > > > planets in the chart and this spiritual power > > manifests > > > > through > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > dispositor of AK and its sign placement.> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > regards,> > > > > > > > > NITISH> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "tijana" > <nix_nixen@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Om Gurave Namah> > > > > > > > > > Dear Su,> > > > > > > > > > Sun is the Self. Its qualities are those of Raja > > (karaka > > > > for > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > first house, lord of the 5th, dig bala in 10th). > > What is > > > > the > > > > > > > thing > > > > > > > > > > that Raja will hardly ever do? The lesson that > has > > to be > > > > learnt > > > > > > > by > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK is serving, in the highest sence it > > gives "Shiva > > > > jnane > > > > > > > Shiva > > > > > > > > > > seva" (service of man as God)-the divine lesson > > given to > > > > us by > > > > > > > > > Swami > > > > > > > > > > Vivekananda (Sun AK). For spiritual persons Sun > as > > AK > > > > should be > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > Jupiter`s signs (Shiva jnane...), otherwise it`s > > very > > > > hard task.> > > > > > > > > > Warm regards,> > > > > > > > > > Tijana> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa@ .com, "v reality" > > <reality_v@> > > > > wrote:> > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Dear Bojan-ji> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thank you for your reply. Much appreciated.> > > > > > > > > > > If I may ask another query re Sun AK. The > lesson > > to be > > > > > > > learnt > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > Sun AK, > > > > > > > > > > > is the reduction of ego. Can this also be > > understood > > > > at a > > > > > > > > > > different level > > > > > > > > > > > as the effacement of 'self' in a spiritual > sense?> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > thanks> > > > > > > > > > > Su> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan Vidakovic <janbovid@>> > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK> > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 08:33:22 -0700 (PDT)> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >HARE RAMA KRISHNA> > > > > > > > > > > >Dear Su> > > > > > > > > > > >I would add that with Gu AK person have to be > > very > > > > humble to > > > > > > > all > > > > > > > > > > spiritual > > > > > > > > > > > >techers and natives, like priests, gurus, > > teachers. > > > > With Ma > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > person must > > > > > > > > > > > >practise Ahumsa (nonviolence) , with Ch the > > native is > > > > always > > > > > > > very > > > > > > > > > > caring, > > > > > > > > > > > >and gives emotions but the problem is that > they > > never > > > > get > > > > > > > enough > > > > > > > > > > for > > > > > > > > > > > >themselves from other people. The person must > > learn > > > > lessons > > > > > > > also > > > > > > > > > > from the > > > > > > > > > > > >people represented with AK. Ch / mother, Sy / > > father > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > everything those > > > > > > > > > > > >grahas represent.> > > > > > > > > > > >Take few examples of people you know and see > it > > in > > > > praxix. > > > > > > > Best > > > > > > > > > > wishes, > > > > > > > > > > > >Bojan> > > > > > > > > > > >Hari Om Tat Sat> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ > wrote:> > > > > > > > > > > > hraum namah adityaya> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Su,> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Person should use a lot of glass and > sing/hum > > > > melodies.> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > Rafal Gendarz> > > > > > > > > > > > Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > > > > > > > > > > > email: rafal@> > > > > > > > > > > > Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > v reality napisaÅ,(a): Dear Rafalji/Members> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > This is an interesting discussion. Could we > > discuss > > > > other > > > > > > > AKs > > > > > > > > > > too. I read> > > > > > > > > > > > in an article that natives with Moon as AK > need > > to > > > > learn > > > > > > > to be > > > > > > > > > > more > > > > > > > > > > > >caring> > > > > > > > > > > > and loving to others. But I know of a chart > > where > > > > the > > > > > > > native > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > already > > > > > > > > > > > >by> > > > > > > > > > > > nature very caring, loving and concerned > about > > > > others > > > > > > > since > > > > > > > > > > young. So > > > > > > > > > > > >what> > > > > > > > > > > > is the lesson to be learnt?> > > > > > > > > > > > thanks> > > > > > > > > > > > Su> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz <starsuponme@ wp.pl>> > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > > >sohamsa@ .com> > > > > > > > > > > > >Re: Jupiter as AK> > > > > > > > > > > > >Wed, 22 Aug 2007 10:24:14 +0200> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > *hraum namah adityaya*> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Dear LN Kumar,> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >With Ju AK person should learn to respect > > others > > > > > > > knowledge > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > > >tradition,> > > > > > > > > > > > >should be ready to learn from others. When > Ju > > is in > > > > > > > kendra to > > > > > > > > > > AK or is > > > > > > > > > > > >AK> > > > > > > > > > > > >himself then native thinks that he knows > > everything > > > > and > > > > > > > now > > > > > > > > > He > > > > > > > > > > can share> > > > > > > > > > > > >His knowledge with everybody. Good teachers > of > > > > course > > > > > > > comes > > > > > > > > > from> > > > > > > > > > > > >AK-Jupiter- Natives, as this graha will be > > > > naturally in > > > > > > > > > > Karakamsa.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >With MA AK person should learn to catalyze > > energies > > > > > > > through > > > > > > > > > > ZEN, TAI-CHI > > > > > > > > > > > >or> > > > > > > > > > > > >other techniques, while with JU AK person > > should > > > > learn to > > > > > > > be > > > > > > > > > > more humble> > > > > > > > > > > > >regarding knowledge. Of course person can > be > > > > focused on > > > > > > > > > Jupiter-> > > > > > > > > > karakas> > > > > > > > > > > > >like kids, spirituality, law, luck etc.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Mahadasa of AK brings lesson to us so its > not > > so > > > > easy > > > > > > > > > > materially but> > > > > > > > > > > > >inspiring spiritually, so if Surya is in > good > > > > placement > > > > > > > from > > > > > > > > > AK > > > > > > > > > > then it > > > > > > > > > > > >can> > > > > > > > > > > > >be not so bad as person is spiritual.> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > >Rafal Gendarz> > > > > > > > > > > > >Sri Jagannath Center Guru> > > > > > > > > > > > >email: rafal (AT) rohinaa (DOT) com> > > > > > > > > > > > >Jyotish pages: www.rohinaa. com> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > >narender kumar napisa?(a):> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Dear Gurujans,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Kindly throw some light on Jupiter as> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Atmakaraka and having Jupiter as mahadasha.> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Respectful Regards,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>LN Kumar> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>__________ __ _________ _________ > _________ > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > > _________ _> > > > > > > > > > > > >>Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the > > > > Internet in > > > > > > > your > > > > > > > > > > pocket: > > > > > > > > > > > >mail,> > > > > > > > > > > > >>news, photos & more.> > > > > > > > > > > > >>http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC> > > > > > > > > > > > >><http://mobile. / go?refer= > 1GNXIC>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > > >>> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ > > _________ > > > > > > > _________ > > > > > > > > > _> > > > > > > > > > > > Advertisement: It's simple! 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Check out > Autos> > > new Car Finder tool.> > > > http://autos. / carfinder/> > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _> > ____________ ___> > > Take the Internet to Go: Go puts the Internet in your > > pocket: mail, news, photos & more. > > > http://mobile. / go?refer= 1GNXIC> > >> >> > > > > > > ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _________ _____________ __> Be a better Globetrotter. Get better travel answers from someone who knows. Answers - Check it out.> http://answers. / dir/?link= list & sid= 396545469> Choose the right car based on your needs. Check out Autos new Car Finder tool. Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Travel. Looking for a deal? Find great prices on flights and hotels with FareChase. Luggage? GPS? Comic books? Check out fitting gifts for grads at Search. Need a vacation? Get great deals to amazing places on Travel. 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