Guest guest Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Dear Anyone who wishes to answer, Were there 2 Tulasi's? 1) Vrinda was born to Kalanemi and then bacame wife of Jalandhar and later transformed into Tulasi, or, 2) Tulasi was born to Dharmadhwaja and became wife of Shankhachuda? Never mind, the end of the story was the same, the guy(s) got killed by Shiva with "help" from Vishnu and Tulasi became VishnupriyA after Vishnu felt bad due to misleading her. For academic interest, Jalandhar was born out of Shiva's locks, while Shankhachuda was born from Dambha who in previous birth was Sudama (according to the Puranas, of course). mysticalsense. The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong.Carl Jung. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH Dear Mysticalsense , Thanks for your explanation.Now the question is that can we use Tulasi to worship Lord Shiva ? I have seen normally in South India,in all temples Lord Shiva is being worshipped by offering Bilva Leaves. Your comments please, With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana, Ramadas Rao. On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 6:08 PM, mysticalsense <sensemystical wrote: Dear Anyone who wishes to answer, Were there 2 Tulasi's? 1) Vrinda was born to Kalanemi and then bacame wife of Jalandhar and later transformed into Tulasi, or, 2) Tulasi was born to Dharmadhwaja and became wife of Shankhachuda? Never mind, the end of the story was the same, the guy(s) got killed by Shiva with " help " from Vishnu and Tulasi became VishnupriyA after Vishnu felt bad due to misleading her. For academic interest, Jalandhar was born out of Shiva's locks, while Shankhachuda was born from Dambha who in previous birth was Sudama (according to the Puranas, of course). mysticalsense. The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong.Carl Jung. -- Ramadas Rao Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Namaste! Every text has a particular context and time. It is meant for a certain kind of audience at a certain time. This time would be mostly at a certain time in the evolution of the soul. It also depends on ones Guru parampara. These texts are not meant to be picked up and read like books because it will cause confusion without the guidance of a Guru. Why is it so ? Because these are certain indications to the one within. The seeds sown by the Guru sprout and the plant grows into a tree under certain conditions- which include ideas and practices as deemed appropriate. Certain practices are also meant for people with certain attitudes and ways of looking at the divine. To start with the assumption that all people are the same leads to difficulty. The attitudes are also transmitted.. Now does all this help in tell you about Tulsi and Champaka ? May be it does, may be it does, may be it does not. Gum Gurubhyo Namaha, Jaya Devi Durge Shyam ----- Start Original Message ----- Mon, 21 Dec 2009 15:08:13 -0000 " mysticalsense " <sensemystical sohamsa Tulasi: Either or Both? > > Dear Anyone who wishes to answer, Were there 2 Tulasi's? 1) Vrinda was born to Kalanemi and then bacame wife of Jalandhar and later transformed into Tulasi, or, 2) Tulasi was born to Dharmadhwaja and became wife of Shankhachuda? Never mind, the end of the story was the same, the guy(s) got killed by Shiva with " help " from Vishnu and Tulasi became VishnupriyA after Vishnu felt bad due to misleading her. For academic interest, Jalandhar was born out of Shiva's locks, while Shankhachuda was born from Dambha who in previous birth was Sudama (according to the Puranas, of course). mysticalsense. The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong.Carl Jung. ----- End Original Message ----- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 23, 2009 Report Share Posted December 23, 2009 Dear Ramdas, Chapter 22 of Vidyeshvara Samhita of Shiva Purana describes Bilva Mahatmaya (apart from that of Shiva Naivedya). It becomes clear from there that not only is offering of bilva leaves beneficial, but there are other ways to derive various benefits from Bilva, and these are specified in that Chapter. Just to give a couple of examples: lighting lamp at base of bilva tree, offering water to bilva tree, etc. Regarding whether Tulasi should be offered or not, i guess this was just what was being deliberated here: sohamsa/message/20635 You can share your inputs and conclusions re. the same. mysticalsense. The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong.Carl Jung. sohamsa , Ramdas Hosabettu <kashyapagotraja wrote:>> OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH> Dear Mysticalsense ,> Thanks for your explanation.Now the question is that can we use Tulasi to> worship Lord Shiva ? I have seen normally in South India,in all temples Lord> Shiva is being worshipped by offering Bilva Leaves.> Your comments please,> With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana,> Ramadas Rao.> > > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 6:08 PM, mysticalsense sensemysticalwrote:> > >> >> > Dear Anyone who wishes to answer,> >> > Were there 2 Tulasi's?> >> > 1) Vrinda was born to Kalanemi and then bacame wife of Jalandhar and later> > transformed into Tulasi, or,> >> > 2) Tulasi was born to Dharmadhwaja and became wife of Shankhachuda?> >> > Never mind, the end of the story was the same, the guy(s) got killed by> > Shiva with "help" from Vishnu and Tulasi became VishnupriyA after Vishnu> > felt bad due to misleading her.> >> > For academic interest, Jalandhar was born out of Shiva's locks, while> > Shankhachuda was born from Dambha who in previous birth was Sudama> > (according to the Puranas, of course).> >> > mysticalsense.> >> > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between> > right and wrong.Carl Jung.> >> >> >> > > >> > > > -- > Ramadas Rao> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 24, 2009 Report Share Posted December 24, 2009 om gurave namah Dear MS What can people do in the rest of the world where Bilva does not grow? I have been thinking about why these plants for sometime...maybe someone who is good with Ayurveda can explain there beneficience and find their equivalence in other countries. In the Maharsihi movement there was one such great Ayurveda doc who could go to any place, look at the plants and tel their medicinal value. We need someone like that to help us go further in this. Bilva, Rudraksha - Shiva Chandan - Gouri, all devata like chandan Rakta chandan - surya Tulasi - Vishnu Haldi - Ganesha .....and so on. The understanding becomes better when we know what they really do and then alone can we appreciate their utility and these correlations Best Wishes Sanjay Rath 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi 110060, India; +91 (011) 4504 8762 Readings: www.srath.com; Courses: www.sohamsa.com; Books: www.sagittariuspublications.com; Community: www..org sohamsa [sohamsa ] On Behalf Of mysticalsense 23 December 2009 12:52 PM sohamsa Re: Tulasi: Either or Both? Dear Ramdas, Chapter 22 of Vidyeshvara Samhita of Shiva Purana describes Bilva Mahatmaya (apart from that of Shiva Naivedya). It becomes clear from there that not only is offering of bilva leaves beneficial, but there are other ways to derive various benefits from Bilva, and these are specified in that Chapter. Just to give a couple of examples: lighting lamp at base of bilva tree, offering water to bilva tree, etc. Regarding whether Tulasi should be offered or not, i guess this was just what was being deliberated here: sohamsa/message/20635 You can share your inputs and conclusions re. the same. mysticalsense. The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong.Carl Jung. sohamsa , Ramdas Hosabettu <kashyapagotraja wrote: > > OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH > Dear Mysticalsense , > Thanks for your explanation.Now the question is that can we use Tulasi to > worship Lord Shiva ? I have seen normally in South India,in all temples Lord > Shiva is being worshipped by offering Bilva Leaves. > Your comments please, > With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana, > Ramadas Rao. > > > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 6:08 PM, mysticalsense sensemysticalwrote: > > > > > > > Dear Anyone who wishes to answer, > > > > Were there 2 Tulasi's? > > > > 1) Vrinda was born to Kalanemi and then bacame wife of Jalandhar and later > > transformed into Tulasi, or, > > > > 2) Tulasi was born to Dharmadhwaja and became wife of Shankhachuda? > > > > Never mind, the end of the story was the same, the guy(s) got killed by > > Shiva with " help " from Vishnu and Tulasi became VishnupriyA after Vishnu > > felt bad due to misleading her. > > > > For academic interest, Jalandhar was born out of Shiva's locks, while > > Shankhachuda was born from Dambha who in previous birth was Sudama > > (according to the Puranas, of course). > > > > mysticalsense. > > > > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between > > right and wrong.Carl Jung. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Ramadas Rao > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 24, 2009 Report Share Posted December 24, 2009 OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAHDear MS,Thanks for your excellent explanation.But my question is of practical.I visited a lot of Shiva temples and I have never seen anywhere offering of Tulasi to Lord Shiva.Even our family Purohit also told me that Tulasi will be offered only to Lord Vishnu and his Avataras and Bilvapatra to Lord Shiva.The problem is I stay in Kuwait and I have a lot of Tulasi plants and my Ishta Devatha is Lord Krishna which itself indicates Tulasi is being grown in my house so nicely.My wife always used to tell me see how Tulasi plants are growing and they are like well dressed Bride !!!. The reason is that here I have visited a lot of my friends house and they say that Tulasi plants are dying in their house or they are in a ppor condition even if they put some special fertiliser as advised by me.I invited them to see my house and showed Tulasi plants and they got surprised !!! My next question is that along with Lord Krishna's silver idol,I have Lord Shiva's photograph and many times it comes in my mind to offer Tulasi leaves to Lord Shiva but I could not.Until now nobody gave me clear picture of this information.Now what I wanted is that if any Shiva temple Purohit is there in our list here, he can give the clear picture about offering of Tulasi leaves to Lord Shiva. With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana,Ramadas Rao. On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 10:21 AM, mysticalsense <sensemystical wrote: Dear Ramdas, Chapter 22 of Vidyeshvara Samhita of Shiva Purana describes Bilva Mahatmaya (apart from that of Shiva Naivedya). It becomes clear from there that not only is offering of bilva leaves beneficial, but there are other ways to derive various benefits from Bilva, and these are specified in that Chapter. Just to give a couple of examples: lighting lamp at base of bilva tree, offering water to bilva tree, etc. Regarding whether Tulasi should be offered or not, i guess this was just what was being deliberated here: sohamsa/message/20635 You can share your inputs and conclusions re. the same. mysticalsense. The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong.Carl Jung. sohamsa , Ramdas Hosabettu <kashyapagotraja wrote:>> OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH> Dear Mysticalsense , > Thanks for your explanation.Now the question is that can we use Tulasi to> worship Lord Shiva ? I have seen normally in South India,in all temples Lord> Shiva is being worshipped by offering Bilva Leaves. > Your comments please,> With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana,> Ramadas Rao.> > > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 6:08 PM, mysticalsense sensemysticalwrote:> > > > >> > Dear Anyone who wishes to answer,> >> > Were there 2 Tulasi's?> >> > 1) Vrinda was born to Kalanemi and then bacame wife of Jalandhar and later> > transformed into Tulasi, or, > >> > 2) Tulasi was born to Dharmadhwaja and became wife of Shankhachuda?> >> > Never mind, the end of the story was the same, the guy(s) got killed by> > Shiva with " help " from Vishnu and Tulasi became VishnupriyA after Vishnu > > felt bad due to misleading her.> >> > For academic interest, Jalandhar was born out of Shiva's locks, while> > Shankhachuda was born from Dambha who in previous birth was Sudama > > (according to the Puranas, of course).> >> > mysticalsense.> >> > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between> > right and wrong.Carl Jung. > >> >> >> > > >> > > > -- > Ramadas Rao> -- Ramadas Rao Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2009 Report Share Posted December 25, 2009 || Jaya Jagannatha || Namaskar Gurujis, Then I was small and heard a story about the logic behind the Maha SHIVA Raatri story . ( Maha Shiva Ratri means a full night worship, breaking night sleep, of God SHIVA ). Once upon a time, a tiger was chasing a hunter who went for hunting. The hunter was running and climbed on a Bilva Tree. The tiger didn't go out and waiting under the Bilva tree. Night came but tiger didn't move out. To break the night sleep , the hunter started to pluck one by one leaves and drop till the morning . Then tiger left the bilva leave. Under the Bilva tree , there was a Shiva Lingam which was not known to the hunter. Most Biva leaves fell on Shiva Lingam and the hunter got Moksham. Guruji Ram Das Raoji might know this story well but gorgot ? siva sarasalai. sohamsa , Ramdas Hosabettu <kashyapagotraja wrote: > > OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH > Dear MS, > Thanks for your excellent explanation.But my question is of practical.I > visited a lot of Shiva temples and I have never seen anywhere offering of > Tulasi to Lord Shiva.Even our family Purohit also told me that Tulasi will > be offered only to Lord Vishnu and his Avataras and Bilvapatra to Lord > Shiva.The problem is I stay in Kuwait and I have a lot of Tulasi plants and > my Ishta Devatha is Lord Krishna which itself indicates Tulasi is being > grown in my house so nicely.My wife always used to tell me see how Tulasi > plants are growing and they are like well dressed Bride !!!. The reason is > that here I have visited a lot of my friends house and they say that Tulasi > plants are dying in their house or they are in a ppor condition even if they > put some special fertiliser as advised by me.I invited them to see my house > and showed Tulasi plants and they got surprised !!! > My next question is that along with Lord Krishna's silver idol,I have Lord > Shiva's photograph and many times it comes in my mind to offer Tulasi leaves > to Lord Shiva but I could not.Until now nobody gave me clear picture of this > information.Now what I wanted is that if any Shiva temple Purohit is there > in our list here, he can give the clear picture about offering of Tulasi > leaves to Lord Shiva. > With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana, > Ramadas Rao. > > On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 10:21 AM, mysticalsense <sensemysticalwrote: > > > > > > > Dear Ramdas, > > > > Chapter 22 of Vidyeshvara Samhita of Shiva Purana describes Bilva Mahatmaya > > (apart from that of Shiva Naivedya). It becomes clear from there that not > > only is offering of bilva leaves beneficial, but there are other ways to > > derive various benefits from Bilva, and these are specified in that Chapter. > > > > > > Just to give a couple of examples: lighting lamp at base of bilva tree, > > offering water to bilva tree, etc. > > > > Regarding whether Tulasi should be offered or not, i guess this was just > > what was being deliberated here: > > > > sohamsa/message/20635 > > > > You can share your inputs and conclusions re. the same. > > > > mysticalsense. > > > > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between > > right and wrong.Carl Jung. > > > > > > > > sohamsa , Ramdas Hosabettu <kashyapagotraja@> > > wrote: > > > > > > OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH > > > Dear Mysticalsense , > > > Thanks for your explanation.Now the question is that can we use Tulasi to > > > worship Lord Shiva ? I have seen normally in South India,in all temples > > Lord > > > Shiva is being worshipped by offering Bilva Leaves. > > > Your comments please, > > > With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana, > > > Ramadas Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 6:08 PM, mysticalsense sensemystical: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Anyone who wishes to answer, > > > > > > > > Were there 2 Tulasi's? > > > > > > > > 1) Vrinda was born to Kalanemi and then bacame wife of Jalandhar and > > later > > > > transformed into Tulasi, or, > > > > > > > > 2) Tulasi was born to Dharmadhwaja and became wife of Shankhachuda? > > > > > > > > Never mind, the end of the story was the same, the guy(s) got killed by > > > > Shiva with " help " from Vishnu and Tulasi became VishnupriyA after > > Vishnu > > > > felt bad due to misleading her. > > > > > > > > For academic interest, Jalandhar was born out of Shiva's locks, while > > > > Shankhachuda was born from Dambha who in previous birth was Sudama > > > > (according to the Puranas, of course). > > > > > > > > mysticalsense. > > > > > > > > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not > > between > > > > right and wrong.Carl Jung. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Ramadas Rao > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Ramadas Rao > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2009 Report Share Posted December 25, 2009 OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAHDear Shiva Ji,I think nobody understood why I am writing .My question is not about Bilva offering to Lord Shiva which I know.My question is offering of Tulasi leaves to Lord Shiva.Why it is not offered in most of the Shiva temples I have visited even as one MS has quoted from Shiva Purana that Tulasi is very auspicious for Lord Shiva ? In June 2010, when I come for vacation to my native place,I have to confirm with this from the Priests of Shri Anantheshvara and Shri Chandramouleshvara temples in Udipi. With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana,Ramadas Rao. On Fri, Dec 25, 2009 at 7:46 AM, siva <sarasalai_siva wrote: || Jaya Jagannatha || Namaskar Gurujis, Then I was small and heard a story about the logic behind the Maha SHIVA Raatri story . ( Maha Shiva Ratri means a full night worship, breaking night sleep, of God SHIVA ). Once upon a time, a tiger was chasing a hunter who went for hunting. The hunter was running and climbed on a Bilva Tree. The tiger didn't go out and waiting under the Bilva tree. Night came but tiger didn't move out. To break the night sleep , the hunter started to pluck one by one leaves and drop till the morning . Then tiger left the bilva leave. Under the Bilva tree , there was a Shiva Lingam which was not known to the hunter. Most Biva leaves fell on Shiva Lingam and the hunter got Moksham. Guruji Ram Das Raoji might know this story well but gorgot ? siva sarasalai. sohamsa , Ramdas Hosabettu <kashyapagotraja wrote: > > OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH > Dear MS, > Thanks for your excellent explanation.But my question is of practical.I > visited a lot of Shiva temples and I have never seen anywhere offering of > Tulasi to Lord Shiva.Even our family Purohit also told me that Tulasi will > be offered only to Lord Vishnu and his Avataras and Bilvapatra to Lord > Shiva.The problem is I stay in Kuwait and I have a lot of Tulasi plants and > my Ishta Devatha is Lord Krishna which itself indicates Tulasi is being > grown in my house so nicely.My wife always used to tell me see how Tulasi > plants are growing and they are like well dressed Bride !!!. The reason is > that here I have visited a lot of my friends house and they say that Tulasi > plants are dying in their house or they are in a ppor condition even if they > put some special fertiliser as advised by me.I invited them to see my house > and showed Tulasi plants and they got surprised !!! > My next question is that along with Lord Krishna's silver idol,I have Lord > Shiva's photograph and many times it comes in my mind to offer Tulasi leaves > to Lord Shiva but I could not.Until now nobody gave me clear picture of this > information.Now what I wanted is that if any Shiva temple Purohit is there > in our list here, he can give the clear picture about offering of Tulasi > leaves to Lord Shiva. > With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana, > Ramadas Rao. > > On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 10:21 AM, mysticalsense <sensemysticalwrote: > > > > > > > Dear Ramdas, > > > > Chapter 22 of Vidyeshvara Samhita of Shiva Purana describes Bilva Mahatmaya > > (apart from that of Shiva Naivedya). It becomes clear from there that not > > only is offering of bilva leaves beneficial, but there are other ways to > > derive various benefits from Bilva, and these are specified in that Chapter. > > > > > > Just to give a couple of examples: lighting lamp at base of bilva tree, > > offering water to bilva tree, etc. > > > > Regarding whether Tulasi should be offered or not, i guess this was just > > what was being deliberated here: > > > > sohamsa/message/20635 > > > > You can share your inputs and conclusions re. the same. > > > > mysticalsense. > > > > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between > > right and wrong.Carl Jung. > > > > > > > > sohamsa , Ramdas Hosabettu <kashyapagotraja@> > > wrote: > > > > > > OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH > > > Dear Mysticalsense , > > > Thanks for your explanation.Now the question is that can we use Tulasi to > > > worship Lord Shiva ? I have seen normally in South India,in all temples > > Lord > > > Shiva is being worshipped by offering Bilva Leaves. > > > Your comments please, > > > With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana, > > > Ramadas Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 6:08 PM, mysticalsense sensemystical: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Anyone who wishes to answer, > > > > > > > > Were there 2 Tulasi's? > > > > > > > > 1) Vrinda was born to Kalanemi and then bacame wife of Jalandhar and > > later > > > > transformed into Tulasi, or, > > > > > > > > 2) Tulasi was born to Dharmadhwaja and became wife of Shankhachuda? > > > > > > > > Never mind, the end of the story was the same, the guy(s) got killed by > > > > Shiva with " help " from Vishnu and Tulasi became VishnupriyA after > > Vishnu > > > > felt bad due to misleading her. > > > > > > > > For academic interest, Jalandhar was born out of Shiva's locks, while > > > > Shankhachuda was born from Dambha who in previous birth was Sudama > > > > (according to the Puranas, of course). > > > > > > > > mysticalsense. > > > > > > > > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not > > between > > > > right and wrong.Carl Jung. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Ramadas Rao > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Ramadas Rao > -- Ramadas Rao Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2009 Report Share Posted December 25, 2009 om gurave namah Dear Ramdas ji Be rest assured, they will give you the same answer - eka-bilvam shivaarpanam If we have to offer, offer the best Best Wishes Sanjay Rath 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi 110060, India; +91 (011) 4504 8762 Readings: www.srath.com; Courses: www.sohamsa.com; Books: www.sagittariuspublications.com; Community: www..org sohamsa [sohamsa ] On Behalf Of Ramdas Hosabettu 25 December 2009 11:38 AM sohamsa Re: Re: Tulasi: Either or Both? OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH Dear Shiva Ji, I think nobody understood why I am writing .My question is not about Bilva offering to Lord Shiva which I know.My question is offering of Tulasi leaves to Lord Shiva.Why it is not offered in most of the Shiva temples I have visited even as one MS has quoted from Shiva Purana that Tulasi is very auspicious for Lord Shiva ? In June 2010, when I come for vacation to my native place,I have to confirm with this from the Priests of Shri Anantheshvara and Shri Chandramouleshvara temples in Udipi. With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana, Ramadas Rao. On Fri, Dec 25, 2009 at 7:46 AM, siva <sarasalai_siva wrote: || Jaya Jagannatha || Namaskar Gurujis, Then I was small and heard a story about the logic behind the Maha SHIVA Raatri story . ( Maha Shiva Ratri means a full night worship, breaking night sleep, of God SHIVA ). Once upon a time, a tiger was chasing a hunter who went for hunting. The hunter was running and climbed on a Bilva Tree. The tiger didn't go out and waiting under the Bilva tree. Night came but tiger didn't move out. To break the night sleep , the hunter started to pluck one by one leaves and drop till the morning . Then tiger left the bilva leave. Under the Bilva tree , there was a Shiva Lingam which was not known to the hunter. Most Biva leaves fell on Shiva Lingam and the hunter got Moksham. Guruji Ram Das Raoji might know this story well but gorgot ? siva sarasalai. sohamsa , Ramdas Hosabettu <kashyapagotraja wrote: > > OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH > Dear MS, > Thanks for your excellent explanation.But my question is of practical.I > visited a lot of Shiva temples and I have never seen anywhere offering of > Tulasi to Lord Shiva.Even our family Purohit also told me that Tulasi will > be offered only to Lord Vishnu and his Avataras and Bilvapatra to Lord > Shiva.The problem is I stay in Kuwait and I have a lot of Tulasi plants and > my Ishta Devatha is Lord Krishna which itself indicates Tulasi is being > grown in my house so nicely.My wife always used to tell me see how Tulasi > plants are growing and they are like well dressed Bride !!!. The reason is > that here I have visited a lot of my friends house and they say that Tulasi > plants are dying in their house or they are in a ppor condition even if they > put some special fertiliser as advised by me.I invited them to see my house > and showed Tulasi plants and they got surprised !!! > My next question is that along with Lord Krishna's silver idol,I have Lord > Shiva's photograph and many times it comes in my mind to offer Tulasi leaves > to Lord Shiva but I could not.Until now nobody gave me clear picture of this > information.Now what I wanted is that if any Shiva temple Purohit is there > in our list here, he can give the clear picture about offering of Tulasi > leaves to Lord Shiva. > With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana, > Ramadas Rao. > > On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 10:21 AM, mysticalsense <sensemysticalwrote: > > > > > > > Dear Ramdas, > > > > Chapter 22 of Vidyeshvara Samhita of Shiva Purana describes Bilva Mahatmaya > > (apart from that of Shiva Naivedya). It becomes clear from there that not > > only is offering of bilva leaves beneficial, but there are other ways to > > derive various benefits from Bilva, and these are specified in that Chapter. > > > > > > Just to give a couple of examples: lighting lamp at base of bilva tree, > > offering water to bilva tree, etc. > > > > Regarding whether Tulasi should be offered or not, i guess this was just > > what was being deliberated here: > > > > sohamsa/message/20635 > > > > You can share your inputs and conclusions re. the same. > > > > mysticalsense. > > > > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between > > right and wrong.Carl Jung. > > > > > > > > sohamsa , Ramdas Hosabettu <kashyapagotraja@> > > wrote: > > > > > > OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH > > > Dear Mysticalsense , > > > Thanks for your explanation.Now the question is that can we use Tulasi to > > > worship Lord Shiva ? I have seen normally in South India,in all temples > > Lord > > > Shiva is being worshipped by offering Bilva Leaves. > > > Your comments please, > > > With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana, > > > Ramadas Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 6:08 PM, mysticalsense sensemystical: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Anyone who wishes to answer, > > > > > > > > Were there 2 Tulasi's? > > > > > > > > 1) Vrinda was born to Kalanemi and then bacame wife of Jalandhar and > > later > > > > transformed into Tulasi, or, > > > > > > > > 2) Tulasi was born to Dharmadhwaja and became wife of Shankhachuda? > > > > > > > > Never mind, the end of the story was the same, the guy(s) got killed by > > > > Shiva with " help " from Vishnu and Tulasi became VishnupriyA after > > Vishnu > > > > felt bad due to misleading her. > > > > > > > > For academic interest, Jalandhar was born out of Shiva's locks, while > > > > Shankhachuda was born from Dambha who in previous birth was Sudama > > > > (according to the Puranas, of course). > > > > > > > > mysticalsense. > > > > > > > > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not > > between > > > > right and wrong.Carl Jung. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Ramadas Rao > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Ramadas Rao > -- Ramadas Rao Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 25, 2009 Report Share Posted December 25, 2009 Respected sir, I don't know the technical reason as to why Tulasi is not offered to Shiva, but I know that we shouldn't...!! Actually sometimes ago, I used to offer Tulasi to Shiv Linga, but later I came to know that I shouldn't, so I stopped that. Now while I didn't face any problems because of that, I know of people who had problems due to that only..like a friend of mine had kept shiva linga at the Tulasi Pindi and used to pour water over it...needless to say, his " general time and growth " suffered! Also it wouldn't be out of place to mention that once a year, on Mahashivaratri, Tulasi is offered to Baba Vaidyanath in Jharkhand, and if my memory doesn't fail me, Bel Patra to Vishnu ji.. It is a practice being followed since God knows when, but it is right for that place at that time... Though it is slightly off the topic, but let me add few more words...the same deity may change his/her bhava from place to place..so even as there are generalities as mentioned in scriptures, there are local/specific differences..to alter that is possible only for people like Adi Shankaracharya..Now the reasons behind this phenomenon can be many and unexplainable...Our own bhavas over a period of time(like bhavas of Bhaktas or of very evolved souls) somehow affects the bhava of deity too... So I think if I have to offer something to Shiva ji, I'll offer Bel Patra..But suppose You r really in love with Him and have been worshipping Him with Tulasi all your life, if I happen to come to your house, I'll make it a point that I offer some Tulasi to Shiv Ji :-) Sincerely, Kunal Nath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 26, 2009 Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAHDear Sanjay Ji,Understood clearly. With Shri Hari vayu Guru Naama Smaran,Ramadas Rao. On Fri, Dec 25, 2009 at 7:39 PM, Sanjay Rath <sanjayrath wrote: om gurave namah Dear Ramdas ji Be rest assured, they will give you the same answer - eka-bilvam shivaarpanam If we have to offer, offer the best Best Wishes Sanjay Rath 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi 110060, India; +91 (011) 4504 8762 Readings: www.srath.com; Courses: www.sohamsa.com; Books: www.sagittariuspublications.com; Community: www..org sohamsa [sohamsa ] On Behalf Of Ramdas Hosabettu 25 December 2009 11:38 AM sohamsa Re: Re: Tulasi: Either or Both? OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH Dear Shiva Ji, I think nobody understood why I am writing .My question is not about Bilva offering to Lord Shiva which I know.My question is offering of Tulasi leaves to Lord Shiva.Why it is not offered in most of the Shiva temples I have visited even as one MS has quoted from Shiva Purana that Tulasi is very auspicious for Lord Shiva ? In June 2010, when I come for vacation to my native place,I have to confirm with this from the Priests of Shri Anantheshvara and Shri Chandramouleshvara temples in Udipi. With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana, Ramadas Rao. On Fri, Dec 25, 2009 at 7:46 AM, siva <sarasalai_siva wrote: || Jaya Jagannatha || Namaskar Gurujis, Then I was small and heard a story about the logic behind the Maha SHIVA Raatri story . ( Maha Shiva Ratri means a full night worship, breaking night sleep, of God SHIVA ). Once upon a time, a tiger was chasing a hunter who went for hunting. The hunter was running and climbed on a Bilva Tree. The tiger didn't go out and waiting under the Bilva tree. Night came but tiger didn't move out. To break the night sleep , the hunter started to pluck one by one leaves and drop till the morning . Then tiger left the bilva leave. Under the Bilva tree , there was a Shiva Lingam which was not known to the hunter. Most Biva leaves fell on Shiva Lingam and the hunter got Moksham. Guruji Ram Das Raoji might know this story well but gorgot ? siva sarasalai. sohamsa , Ramdas Hosabettu <kashyapagotraja wrote: > > OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH > Dear MS, > Thanks for your excellent explanation.But my question is of practical.I > visited a lot of Shiva temples and I have never seen anywhere offering of > Tulasi to Lord Shiva.Even our family Purohit also told me that Tulasi will > be offered only to Lord Vishnu and his Avataras and Bilvapatra to Lord > Shiva.The problem is I stay in Kuwait and I have a lot of Tulasi plants and > my Ishta Devatha is Lord Krishna which itself indicates Tulasi is being > grown in my house so nicely.My wife always used to tell me see how Tulasi > plants are growing and they are like well dressed Bride !!!. The reason is > that here I have visited a lot of my friends house and they say that Tulasi > plants are dying in their house or they are in a ppor condition even if they > put some special fertiliser as advised by me.I invited them to see my house > and showed Tulasi plants and they got surprised !!! > My next question is that along with Lord Krishna's silver idol,I have Lord > Shiva's photograph and many times it comes in my mind to offer Tulasi leaves > to Lord Shiva but I could not.Until now nobody gave me clear picture of this > information.Now what I wanted is that if any Shiva temple Purohit is there > in our list here, he can give the clear picture about offering of Tulasi > leaves to Lord Shiva. > With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana, > Ramadas Rao. > > On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 10:21 AM, mysticalsense <sensemysticalwrote: > > > > > > > Dear Ramdas, > > > > Chapter 22 of Vidyeshvara Samhita of Shiva Purana describes Bilva Mahatmaya > > (apart from that of Shiva Naivedya). It becomes clear from there that not > > only is offering of bilva leaves beneficial, but there are other ways to > > derive various benefits from Bilva, and these are specified in that Chapter. > > > > > > Just to give a couple of examples: lighting lamp at base of bilva tree, > > offering water to bilva tree, etc. > > > > Regarding whether Tulasi should be offered or not, i guess this was just > > what was being deliberated here: > > > > sohamsa/message/20635 > > > > You can share your inputs and conclusions re. the same. > > > > mysticalsense. > > > > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between > > right and wrong.Carl Jung. > > > > > > > > sohamsa , Ramdas Hosabettu <kashyapagotraja@> > > wrote: > > > > > > OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH > > > Dear Mysticalsense , > > > Thanks for your explanation.Now the question is that can we use Tulasi to > > > worship Lord Shiva ? I have seen normally in South India,in all temples > > Lord > > > Shiva is being worshipped by offering Bilva Leaves. > > > Your comments please, > > > With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana, > > > Ramadas Rao. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 6:08 PM, mysticalsense sensemystical: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Dear Anyone who wishes to answer, > > > > > > > > Were there 2 Tulasi's? > > > > > > > > 1) Vrinda was born to Kalanemi and then bacame wife of Jalandhar and > > later > > > > transformed into Tulasi, or, > > > > > > > > 2) Tulasi was born to Dharmadhwaja and became wife of Shankhachuda? > > > > > > > > Never mind, the end of the story was the same, the guy(s) got killed by > > > > Shiva with " help " from Vishnu and Tulasi became VishnupriyA after > > Vishnu > > > > felt bad due to misleading her. > > > > > > > > For academic interest, Jalandhar was born out of Shiva's locks, while > > > > Shankhachuda was born from Dambha who in previous birth was Sudama > > > > (according to the Puranas, of course). > > > > > > > > mysticalsense. > > > > > > > > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not > > between > > > > right and wrong.Carl Jung. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Ramadas Rao > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > Ramadas Rao > -- Ramadas Rao -- Ramadas Rao Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 26, 2009 Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 om gurave namah Dear Kunal Nath That is 100% correct. Only on Shiva ratri is tulasi offered to Shiva and Bilva offered to Vishnu. This is taught after the battle between Brahma and Vishnu in the Vidyesvara samhita of Shiva purana. For Shivaratri is the day when the Atma linga (pillar of light) was witnessed as the manifestation of Shiva by them. It was on this day that Shiva granted the boon of equivalence to Vishnu and forgiveness to Brahma for his sins. Therefore those who have lied and sinned in the year go to Shiva with the Ketaki flower (only offered on this day) and while offering it, they CONFESS their sin. This confession with Ketaki as witness leads to forgiveness and change. This is pracised in all Orissa temples even today. Best Wishes Sanjay Rath 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi 110060, India; +91 (011) 4504 8762 Readings: www.srath.com; Courses: www.sohamsa.com; Books: www.sagittariuspublications.com; Community: www..org sohamsa [sohamsa ] On Behalf Of utkarsh_vaggbhav 26 December 2009 03:06 AM sohamsa Re: Tulasi: Either or Both? Respected sir, I don't know the technical reason as to why Tulasi is not offered to Shiva, but I know that we shouldn't...!! Actually sometimes ago, I used to offer Tulasi to Shiv Linga, but later I came to know that I shouldn't, so I stopped that. Now while I didn't face any problems because of that, I know of people who had problems due to that only..like a friend of mine had kept shiva linga at the Tulasi Pindi and used to pour water over it...needless to say, his " general time and growth " suffered! Also it wouldn't be out of place to mention that once a year, on Mahashivaratri, Tulasi is offered to Baba Vaidyanath in Jharkhand, and if my memory doesn't fail me, Bel Patra to Vishnu ji.. It is a practice being followed since God knows when, but it is right for that place at that time... Though it is slightly off the topic, but let me add few more words...the same deity may change his/her bhava from place to place..so even as there are generalities as mentioned in scriptures, there are local/specific differences..to alter that is possible only for people like Adi Shankaracharya..Now the reasons behind this phenomenon can be many and unexplainable...Our own bhavas over a period of time(like bhavas of Bhaktas or of very evolved souls) somehow affects the bhava of deity too... So I think if I have to offer something to Shiva ji, I'll offer Bel Patra..But suppose You r really in love with Him and have been worshipping Him with Tulasi all your life, if I happen to come to your house, I'll make it a point that I offer some Tulasi to Shiv Ji :-) Sincerely, Kunal Nath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted December 26, 2009 Report Share Posted December 26, 2009 Respected Guruji, When I look at my spiritual Guru, I see Compassion personified...When I look at you, I find an ocean of Gyan! Over time, it has become one of my deepest desires & ambition of my life, that as soon as I get my career settled, I come to your shores and receive some of your nectar! Meanwhile, I'm contented by your drops of wisdom like this! Your sincerely, Kunal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 Dear SR, You are right that these offerings have medicinal values. The Hindu system is actually a Way of Life, not just a mumbo jumbo of rituals. We are well aware that Adi Shankaracharya brought forward the philosophy (or whatever one may call it) that worshipping of Panchadevatas can take care of everything (in a person's life). We may derive futher correspondence between these panchadevatas and panchatattvas and perhaps other pancha-aspects. Use of plants/herbs (like ones you have listed below) may be a way to incorporate some basic herbs/plants that have remedial or preventive (wrt illness) or health promoting values in the puja articles. Offering of panchatattva may carry a different meaning in spiritual context. Most Indian families would know about health benefits of Haldi and Tulasi. You may concur that application of shveta chandan on forehead is pacifying (may relieve anxtiety etc). Rudraksha-water is known to remedy blood pressure. Bilva parts, especially fruit, are already being used for it's medicinal value by Ayurveda. In this way the rishis (or, our ancient knowledgeable ancestors) guided us to grow and preserve these plants, so that we may benefit from them with the health and longevity point of veiw. Going further, the banyan tree became associated with Shiva, while Neem was associated with Krishna and so on and so forth.... Rakta Chandana is aready being used in Ayurvedic medicines. It is another story that Rakta Chandana is also offered to Ganesha. Would be good to collate the taste, vata/pitta/kapha remedying effect etc of these (5 i.e. bilva etc) and see how it works with astrological aspect (wrt health issues), and how various tilakas may be useful...including kesara, kumkum etc. depending on Lagna planets. For latter, may be tilaka of same planet is beneficial in some cases, but opposite or some other be beneficial for other people. eg. if Sun in lagna is producing too much heat in the head, making one irritable, then rakta chandana may not be that beneficial, then which one would be beneficial will have to be seen...or may be find why rakta chandana is offered to Ganesha and not just to Surya. For assimilating correspondences of these plants (that you have mentioned below) in other parts of the world, it would definitely require much expertise. May be remedies could be found in homeopathy too (you know it developed in Germany)...every place, geographically, has it's own remedial storehouse from Nature. May be one could find correspondence in mud-bath, sun-bath etc. or whatever Naturopathy remedies are prevelant at that place. We dont know (yet). We may extend our prayers to the nidhaye sarva vidyaanaam, bheshaje bhava-roginaam. mysticalsense. The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong. Carl Jung. sohamsa , "Sanjay Rath" <sanjayrath wrote:>> > > > > om gurave namah> > Dear MS> > What can people do in the rest of the world where Bilva does not grow? I have been thinking about why these plants for sometime...maybe someone who is good with Ayurveda can explain there beneficience and find their equivalence in other countries. In the Maharsihi movement there was one such great Ayurveda doc who could go to any place, look at the plants and tel their medicinal value. We need someone like that to help us go further in this.> > Bilva, Rudraksha - Shiva> > Chandan - Gouri, all devata like chandan> > Rakta chandan - surya> > Tulasi - Vishnu> > Haldi - Ganesha> > ....and so on. The understanding becomes better when we know what they really do and then alone can we appreciate their utility and these correlations> > Best Wishes> > Sanjay Rath> > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi 110060, India; +91 (011) 4504 8762> > Readings: www.srath.com; Courses: www.sohamsa.com; Books: www.sagittariuspublications.com; Community: www..org> > > > sohamsa [sohamsa ] On Behalf Of mysticalsense> 23 December 2009 12:52 PM > sohamsa > Re: Tulasi: Either or Both?> > > > > > Dear Ramdas,> > Chapter 22 of Vidyeshvara Samhita of Shiva Purana describes Bilva Mahatmaya (apart from that of Shiva Naivedya). It becomes clear from there that not only is offering of bilva leaves beneficial, but there are other ways to derive various benefits from Bilva, and these are specified in that Chapter. > > Just to give a couple of examples: lighting lamp at base of bilva tree, offering water to bilva tree, etc.> > Regarding whether Tulasi should be offered or not, i guess this was just what was being deliberated here:> > sohamsa/message/20635> > You can share your inputs and conclusions re. the same.> > mysticalsense.> > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong.Carl Jung.> > > > sohamsa , Ramdas Hosabettu kashyapagotraja@ wrote:> >> > OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH> > Dear Mysticalsense ,> > Thanks for your explanation.Now the question is that can we use Tulasi to> > worship Lord Shiva ? I have seen normally in South India,in all temples Lord> > Shiva is being worshipped by offering Bilva Leaves.> > Your comments please,> > With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana,> > Ramadas Rao.> > > > > > > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 6:08 PM, mysticalsense sensemystical:> > > > >> > >> > > Dear Anyone who wishes to answer,> > >> > > Were there 2 Tulasi's?> > >> > > 1) Vrinda was born to Kalanemi and then bacame wife of Jalandhar and later> > > transformed into Tulasi, or,> > >> > > 2) Tulasi was born to Dharmadhwaja and became wife of Shankhachuda?> > >> > > Never mind, the end of the story was the same, the guy(s) got killed by> > > Shiva with "help" from Vishnu and Tulasi became VishnupriyA after Vishnu> > > felt bad due to misleading her.> > >> > > For academic interest, Jalandhar was born out of Shiva's locks, while> > > Shankhachuda was born from Dambha who in previous birth was Sudama> > > (according to the Puranas, of course).> > >> > > mysticalsense.> > >> > > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between> > > right and wrong.Carl Jung.> > >> > >> > >> > > > > >> > > > > > > > -- > > Ramadas Rao> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 This also makes me think: eko hi rudro na dvitiiyaaya tasthur.... mysticalsense. The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong. Carl Jung. > On Fri, Dec 25, 2009 at 7:39 PM, Sanjay Rath sanjayrath wrote:> > >> >> >> >> >> >> > om gurave namah> >> > Dear Ramdas ji> >> > Be rest assured, they will give you the same answer -> >> > eka-bilvam shivaarpanam> >> > If we have to offer, offer the best> >> > Best Wishes> >> > Sanjay Rath> >> > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi 110060, India; +91 (011) 4504 8762> >> > Readings: www.srath.com; Courses: www.sohamsa.com; Books:> > www.sagittariuspublications.com; Community: www..org> >> >> >> > ** sohamsa [sohamsa ] *On> > Behalf Of *Ramdas Hosabettu> > *Sent:* 25 December 2009 11:38 AM> > *To:* sohamsa > > *Subject:* Re: Re: Tulasi: Either or Both?> >> >> >> >> >> > OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH> >> > Dear Shiva Ji,> >> > I think nobody understood why I am writing .My question is not about Bilva> > offering to Lord Shiva which I know.My question is offering of Tulasi leaves> > to Lord Shiva.Why it is not offered in most of the Shiva temples I have> > visited even as one MS has quoted from Shiva Purana that Tulasi is very> > auspicious for Lord Shiva ?> >> > In June 2010, when I come for vacation to my native place,I have to confirm> > with this from the Priests of Shri Anantheshvara and Shri Chandramouleshvara> > temples in Udipi.> >> > With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana,> >> > Ramadas Rao.> >> > On Fri, Dec 25, 2009 at 7:46 AM, siva sarasalai_siva wrote:> >> >> >> > || Jaya Jagannatha ||> >> > Namaskar Gurujis,> >> > Then I was small and heard a story about the logic behind the Maha SHIVA> > Raatri story . ( Maha Shiva Ratri means a full night worship, breaking night> > sleep, of God SHIVA ).> >> > Once upon a time, a tiger was chasing a hunter who went for hunting.> > The hunter was running and climbed on a Bilva Tree. The tiger didn't go out> > and waiting under the Bilva tree. Night came but tiger didn't move out. To> > break the night sleep , the hunter started to pluck one by one leaves and> > drop till the morning . Then tiger left the bilva leave. Under the Bilva> > tree , there was a Shiva Lingam which was not known to the hunter.> >> > Most Biva leaves fell on Shiva Lingam and the hunter got Moksham.> >> > Guruji Ram Das Raoji might know this story well but gorgot ?> >> > siva sarasalai.> >> >> >> > sohamsa <sohamsa%40>, Ramdas> > Hosabettu kashyapagotraja@ wrote:> > >> > > OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH> >> > > Dear MS,> > > Thanks for your excellent explanation.But my question is of practical.I> > > visited a lot of Shiva temples and I have never seen anywhere offering of> > > Tulasi to Lord Shiva.Even our family Purohit also told me that Tulasi> > will> > > be offered only to Lord Vishnu and his Avataras and Bilvapatra to Lord> > > Shiva.The problem is I stay in Kuwait and I have a lot of Tulasi plants> > and> > > my Ishta Devatha is Lord Krishna which itself indicates Tulasi is being> > > grown in my house so nicely.My wife always used to tell me see how Tulasi> > > plants are growing and they are like well dressed Bride !!!. The reason> > is> > > that here I have visited a lot of my friends house and they say that> > Tulasi> > > plants are dying in their house or they are in a ppor condition even if> > they> > > put some special fertiliser as advised by me.I invited them to see my> > house> > > and showed Tulasi plants and they got surprised !!!> > > My next question is that along with Lord Krishna's silver idol,I have> > Lord> > > Shiva's photograph and many times it comes in my mind to offer Tulasi> > leaves> > > to Lord Shiva but I could not.Until now nobody gave me clear picture of> > this> > > information.Now what I wanted is that if any Shiva temple Purohit is> > there> > > in our list here, he can give the clear picture about offering of Tulasi> > > leaves to Lord Shiva.> > > With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana,> > > Ramadas Rao.> > >> >> > > On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 10:21 AM, mysticalsense <sensemystical@> > ...>wrote:> >> >> > >> > > >> > > >> > > > Dear Ramdas,> > > >> > > > Chapter 22 of Vidyeshvara Samhita of Shiva Purana describes Bilva> > Mahatmaya> > > > (apart from that of Shiva Naivedya). It becomes clear from there that> > not> > > > only is offering of bilva leaves beneficial, but there are other ways> > to> > > > derive various benefits from Bilva, and these are specified in that> > Chapter.> > > >> > > >> > > > Just to give a couple of examples: lighting lamp at base of bilva tree,> > > > offering water to bilva tree, etc.> > > >> > > > Regarding whether Tulasi should be offered or not, i guess this was> > just> > > > what was being deliberated here:> > > >> > > > sohamsa/message/20635> > > >> > > > You can share your inputs and conclusions re. the same.> > > >> > > > mysticalsense.> > > >> > > > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not> > between> > > > right and wrong.Carl Jung.> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > sohamsa <sohamsa%40>, Ramdas> > Hosabettu <kashyapagotraja@>> > > > wrote:> > > > >> > > > > OM SHRI LAKSHMI NARASIMHAAYA NAMAH> > > > > Dear Mysticalsense ,> > > > > Thanks for your explanation.Now the question is that can we use> > Tulasi to> > > > > worship Lord Shiva ? I have seen normally in South India,in all> > temples> > > > Lord> > > > > Shiva is being worshipped by offering Bilva Leaves.> > > > > Your comments please,> > > > > With Shri Hari Vayu Guru Naama Smarana,> > > > > Ramadas Rao.> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> >> > > > > On Mon, Dec 21, 2009 at 6:08 PM, mysticalsense sensemystical@:> >> >> > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > Dear Anyone who wishes to answer,> > > > > >> > > > > > Were there 2 Tulasi's?> > > > > >> > > > > > 1) Vrinda was born to Kalanemi and then bacame wife of Jalandhar> > and> > > > later> > > > > > transformed into Tulasi, or,> > > > > >> > > > > > 2) Tulasi was born to Dharmadhwaja and became wife of Shankhachuda?> > > > > >> > > > > > Never mind, the end of the story was the same, the guy(s) got> > killed by> > > > > > Shiva with "help" from Vishnu and Tulasi became VishnupriyA after> > > > Vishnu> > > > > > felt bad due to misleading her.> > > > > >> > > > > > For academic interest, Jalandhar was born out of Shiva's locks,> > while> > > > > > Shankhachuda was born from Dambha who in previous birth was Sudama> > > > > > (according to the Puranas, of course).> > > > > >> > > > > > mysticalsense.> > > > > >> > > > > > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not> > > > between> > > > > > right and wrong.Carl Jung.> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> > > > > --> > > > > Ramadas Rao> > > > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> > > --> > > Ramadas Rao> > >> >> >> >> >> > --> > Ramadas Rao> >> > > >> > > > -- > Ramadas Rao> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 4, 2010 Report Share Posted January 4, 2010 Dear SR, It can also be inferred that since the Atman in us is the Shiva and the rest of what we are made of is Shakti/Girija (ref: AdiShankaracharya's kriti: Atmaa tvaM girijaa matiH sahachrAhA; and Shiva Purana); then we should neither be consuming tulasi nor wearing it, as in essence we just end up offering it to Shiva+Shakti, since consuming it will put it into the Shakti part and wearing it will be around the body that houses the Atman that is the Spark of Shiva. oh ho but who is sustaining this body and the universe...Vishnu? so where is Vishnu if everything is Shiva+Shakti....and so on and so forth, then someone learned with Vishnu Purana will say, it is Vishnu that manifests as everything...so the 2 parties keep fighting about who is superior and what should be offered to whom. Coming back to Shiva Purana, why would Shiva Purana be talking about offering Tulasi to Shiva in general or under special circumstances? e.g. ShivaPurana: Rudra Samhita: Chapter 14: talks of offering Tulasi to Shiva ( Shloka 28 ), among benefits of offering other articles like bilva, bandhuka, nirgundi etc. this chapter 14 explicit in saying that ketaki and champaka are prohibited (and reasons to same are given in other parts of Shiva Purana). Please can you point the reference from Shiva Purana or elsewhere which says that "Only on Shiva ratri is tulasi offered to Shiva and Bilva offered to Vishnu." or is that an inference (or a tradition being followed)? mysticalsense. The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong. Carl Jung. sohamsa , "Sanjay Rath" <sanjayrath wrote:>> > > > > om gurave namah> > Dear Kunal Nath> > That is 100% correct. Only on Shiva ratri is tulasi offered to Shiva and Bilva offered to Vishnu. This is taught after the battle between Brahma and Vishnu in the Vidyesvara samhita of Shiva purana. For Shivaratri is the day when the Atma linga (pillar of light) was witnessed as the manifestation of Shiva by them. It was on this day that Shiva granted the boon of equivalence to Vishnu and forgiveness to Brahma for his sins. Therefore those who have lied and sinned in the year go to Shiva with the Ketaki flower (only offered on this day) and while offering it, they CONFESS their sin. This confession with Ketaki as witness leads to forgiveness and change. This is pracised in all Orissa temples even today.> > Best Wishes> > Sanjay Rath> > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi 110060, India; +91 (011) 4504 8762> > Readings: www.srath.com; Courses: www.sohamsa.com; Books: www.sagittariuspublications.com; Community: www..org> > > > sohamsa [sohamsa ] On Behalf Of utkarsh_vaggbhav> 26 December 2009 03:06 AM > sohamsa > Re: Tulasi: Either or Both?> > > > > > Respected sir,> > I don't know the technical reason as to why Tulasi is not offered to Shiva, but I know that we shouldn't...!! Actually sometimes ago, I used to offer Tulasi to Shiv Linga, but later I came to know that I shouldn't, so I stopped that. Now while I didn't face any problems because of that, I know of people who had problems due to that only..like a friend of mine had kept shiva linga at the Tulasi Pindi and used to pour water over it...needless to say, his "general time and growth" suffered!> > Also it wouldn't be out of place to mention that once a year, on Mahashivaratri, Tulasi is offered to Baba Vaidyanath in Jharkhand, and if my memory doesn't fail me, Bel Patra to Vishnu ji.. It is a practice being followed since God knows when, but it is right for that place at that time...> > Though it is slightly off the topic, but let me add few more words...the same deity may change his/her bhava from place to place..so even as there are generalities as mentioned in scriptures, there are local/specific differences..to alter that is possible only for people like Adi Shankaracharya..Now the reasons behind this phenomenon can be many and unexplainable...Our own bhavas over a period of time(like bhavas of Bhaktas or of very evolved souls) somehow affects the bhava of deity too...> > So I think if I have to offer something to Shiva ji, I'll offer Bel Patra..But suppose You r really in love with Him and have been worshipping Him with Tulasi all your life, if I happen to come to your house, I'll make it a point that I offer some Tulasi to Shiv Ji :-)> > Sincerely,> Kunal Nath.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Respected Acharyas Isn't tradition as good as or sometimes at par with scriptural injunctions !?! The reality we live in is a product of our belief system , our perception guides our vision and shapes our reality! Here my reality is like a genetic code and carries with me when I change bodies in newer births! Take for example, the caste system, its effect can be seen even after death...the example of Brahma Rakshas(Brahma Pishachas or simply Brahmas) is evident of it! A great confusion arises because of using the name " Shiva " in a very wide sense! When a simple layman, uneducated of sutleties of Hindu philosophy goes to a Shiv mandir, and worships Shiv linga, what is in his mind? Is he worshipping the Nirguna Brahma called Shiva, or is he worshipping Mahesha, Shankar, one of the trinities, or an aspect like Rudra(as he had recently got done a Rudrabhisheka by a local pundit)? May be he doesn't have the qualification to distinguish, but then Who shall receive his puja and bless him? All the Mahavidyas have seperate " Shivas " ! The " Shiva " of Kamala is " Sadashiva Vishnu " . The " Shiva " of " Kali " is " Mahakal Shiva " . To distinguish, we may say that here the 1st " Shiva " meant " Param Shiva " ...But I'm a lay person and I don't understand all that, the moment I see a Shiv Linga, I say Shiv Shankar and offer Bilva, and my wish is fulfilled! There is a Shiv temple near my place, forbidden for general public to worship as people become mad by worshipping it! Locals call him " Bauraha(Insane) Mahadeva " . There He is in " Aghoreshwar " form, and his worship includes objects like rotten Urhul flowers. Only very very high Aghoris can worship there! So generally it remains closed! I wonder if inferences and logical concusions help in these matters! In essence, all is Shiva, even animals, birds, spirits... If I worship a spirit under some Babool tree, a Brahma Pishacha under Paras Peepal, or some yakshini under an Ashoka tree, surely " Shiva " won't be receiving my offerings, even though all thse are " Shiva " in essence! All I can do is try to explain philosophically that we wanted to see Shiva as a Yakshini, and so our state of reality was shaped accordingly! But then, what about their state of reality?! I know of a person who used to offer tarpans to his ancestors, at a certain place, and after more than 10 years, he came to know that it was being received by a certain ghost, who was no doubt very greatful to him! Your sincerely, Kunal Nath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2010 Report Share Posted January 5, 2010 Hello Sir, This is an interesting discussion. In a small village near Puri, where I was born, people regularly offer Champaka to Shiva linga. Many people offer multiple of 108 Champakas when their wishes are fulfilled. I am not sure about other places in India, but this practice is also seen in several other parts of Odisha. I cannot exactly remember where (I think it was in Pune) but once a pandit has asked me to offer Tulasi on Shiva linga during a rudrabhiseka. Thanks and regards, Sudhir sohamsa , " mysticalsense " <sensemystical wrote: > > > Dear SR, > > It can also be inferred that since the Atman in us is the Shiva and > the rest of what we are made of is Shakti/Girija (ref: > AdiShankaracharya's kriti: Atmaa tvaM girijaa matiH sahachrAhA; and > Shiva Purana); then we should neither be consuming tulasi nor wearing > it, as in essence we just end up offering it to Shiva+Shakti, since > consuming it will put it into the Shakti part and wearing it will be > around the body that houses the Atman that is the Spark of Shiva. > > oh ho but who is sustaining this body and the universe...Vishnu? so > where is Vishnu if everything is Shiva+Shakti....and so on and so forth, > then someone learned with Vishnu Purana will say, it is Vishnu that > manifests as everything...so the 2 parties keep fighting about who is > superior and what should be offered to whom. > > Coming back to Shiva Purana, why would Shiva Purana be talking about > offering Tulasi to Shiva in general or under special circumstances? > > e.g. ShivaPurana: Rudra Samhita: Chapter 14: talks of offering Tulasi to > Shiva ( Shloka 28 ), among benefits of offering other articles like > bilva, bandhuka, nirgundi etc. this chapter 14 explicit in saying that > ketaki and champaka are prohibited (and reasons to same are given in > other parts of Shiva Purana). Please can you point the reference from > Shiva Purana or elsewhere which says that " Only on Shiva ratri is tulasi > offered to Shiva and Bilva offered to Vishnu. " or is that an inference > (or a tradition being followed)? > > mysticalsense. > > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not > between right and wrong. Carl Jung. > > > > > > sohamsa , " Sanjay Rath " <sanjayrath@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > om gurave namah > > > > Dear Kunal Nath > > > > That is 100% correct. Only on Shiva ratri is tulasi offered to Shiva > and Bilva offered to Vishnu. This is taught after the battle between > Brahma and Vishnu in the Vidyesvara samhita of Shiva purana. For > Shivaratri is the day when the Atma linga (pillar of light) was > witnessed as the manifestation of Shiva by them. It was on this day that > Shiva granted the boon of equivalence to Vishnu and forgiveness to > Brahma for his sins. Therefore those who have lied and sinned in the > year go to Shiva with the Ketaki flower (only offered on this day) and > while offering it, they CONFESS their sin. This confession with Ketaki > as witness leads to forgiveness and change. This is pracised in all > Orissa temples even today. > > > > Best Wishes > > > > Sanjay Rath > > > > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi 110060, India; +91 (011) 4504 > 8762 > > > > Readings: www.srath.com; Courses: www.sohamsa.com; Books: > www.sagittariuspublications.com; Community: www..org > > > > > > > > sohamsa [sohamsa ] On > Behalf Of utkarsh_vaggbhav > > 26 December 2009 03:06 AM > > sohamsa > > Re: Tulasi: Either or Both? > > > > > > > > > > > > Respected sir, > > > > I don't know the technical reason as to why Tulasi is not offered to > Shiva, but I know that we shouldn't...!! Actually sometimes ago, I used > to offer Tulasi to Shiv Linga, but later I came to know that I > shouldn't, so I stopped that. Now while I didn't face any problems > because of that, I know of people who had problems due to that > only..like a friend of mine had kept shiva linga at the Tulasi Pindi and > used to pour water over it...needless to say, his " general time and > growth " suffered! > > > > Also it wouldn't be out of place to mention that once a year, on > Mahashivaratri, Tulasi is offered to Baba Vaidyanath in Jharkhand, and > if my memory doesn't fail me, Bel Patra to Vishnu ji.. It is a practice > being followed since God knows when, but it is right for that place at > that time... > > > > Though it is slightly off the topic, but let me add few more > words...the same deity may change his/her bhava from place to place..so > even as there are generalities as mentioned in scriptures, there are > local/specific differences..to alter that is possible only for people > like Adi Shankaracharya..Now the reasons behind this phenomenon can be > many and unexplainable...Our own bhavas over a period of time(like > bhavas of Bhaktas or of very evolved souls) somehow affects the bhava of > deity too... > > > > So I think if I have to offer something to Shiva ji, I'll offer Bel > Patra..But suppose You r really in love with Him and have been > worshipping Him with Tulasi all your life, if I happen to come to your > house, I'll make it a point that I offer some Tulasi to Shiv Ji :-) > > > > Sincerely, > > Kunal Nath. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 om gurave namah Dear Kunal ji Let me indulge ... A simple explanation for such a complex issue is not possible nor would it be wise to say 'to each his own'. Ignorance is surely not bliss in spiritual matters. You have given some nice examples to bring out the point that it aybe impossible to infer the level of the worship but then that is what tradition is all about. It gives us the possibility of lerning the scriptures and understanding them in their higher levels. when the understanding arises and as we grow older and pass through the stages where desire for small things no longer satisfies. Then the same little boy whowould go to the shiva linga for asking for good marks in exam will gow up and feel ashamed that he could ever ask for such a petty thing like better exam scores. But then his mind tells him, look Shiva is holy father of all, he understands. you were small. now pray for higher things then he goes a level higher and asks for well being of his family...and like this another 25 years or so passes and he becomes wiser by the day and desires change. Kids have grown and he goes to Shiva linga and realises he was so stupid to ask for the well being of the children - they are not really his, they are Shiva's cildren and he is only a guardian. now he must rise higher and ask for well being of his country, his people, his dharma...and all that. He lives beyond 75 and then he ralises that the nation is only a line drawn on a piece of paper called map. there is a whole world in animals and plansts who have shared life with him. The pipal tree in his courtyard is the only living thing that has stayed with him. wife is dead, siblings are dead or too weak to see him. children have their lives to live and now grandchildren also have their children to marry and settle. He has done his time and then he goes to the Shiva linga and wonders - I must be the most stupid fellow on earth. I have wasted a whole life asking for something which in fact is Lord Shiva's responsibility. He is the old father of all and he has been doing his dharma all through. So why was I being so narrow and selfish and asking only for my wife and children and nation. what about othr nations? What about the good old pipal tree under which I sit everyday who has been my only true companion for 75 years. Let me now pray for all in the world, the globe and my pipal tree ... And that night he sees Lord Shiva in a dream telling him that he has lived a good life and is now grow a little older. If a day of the devas = 1 year in human life, then then his deva age is just 75 days (although he feels like 75 years in human life). In deva calendar he is just beginning to take some baby steps.... If after this people still have the time to do all those things for personal gratification, then they are just babies in the eyes of Shiva. and babies can always seek forgiveness when they grow out of their baby mistakes and fancies. Now think of tradition. If the present day traditions started at the time of Sri Krishna, then they are about 3000 days old (in eyes of devas, not shiva or brahma or vishnu)...in simple words, the traditions restarte at the time of the Kali Yuga by the grace of Krishna are just 9 years old (3000/360 approx). Which means it is time for them to have sacred thread. therefore all these traditions are seeing a sudden spurt of religious study, inquiry and all that. But in comparision to the scriptres themselves, they are small kids for the scriptures are as old as Brahma. that is why they are Brahma vidya. Best Wishes Sanjay Rath 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi 110060, India; +91 (011) 4504 8762 Readings: www.srath.com; Courses: www.sohamsa.com; Books: www.sagittariuspublications.com; Community: www..org sohamsa [sohamsa ] On Behalf Of Utkarsh 05 January 2010 09:11 AM sohamsa Re: Tulasi: Either or Both? Respected Acharyas Isn't tradition as good as or sometimes at par with scriptural injunctions !?! The reality we live in is a product of our belief system , our perception guides our vision and shapes our reality! Here my reality is like a genetic code and carries with me when I change bodies in newer births! Take for example, the caste system, its effect can be seen even after death...the example of Brahma Rakshas(Brahma Pishachas or simply Brahmas) is evident of it! A great confusion arises because of using the name " Shiva " in a very wide sense! When a simple layman, uneducated of sutleties of Hindu philosophy goes to a Shiv mandir, and worships Shiv linga, what is in his mind? Is he worshipping the Nirguna Brahma called Shiva, or is he worshipping Mahesha, Shankar, one of the trinities, or an aspect like Rudra(as he had recently got done a Rudrabhisheka by a local pundit)? May be he doesn't have the qualification to distinguish, but then Who shall receive his puja and bless him? All the Mahavidyas have seperate " Shivas " ! The " Shiva " of Kamala is " Sadashiva Vishnu " . The " Shiva " of " Kali " is " Mahakal Shiva " . To distinguish, we may say that here the 1st " Shiva " meant " Param Shiva " ...But I'm a lay person and I don't understand all that, the moment I see a Shiv Linga, I say Shiv Shankar and offer Bilva, and my wish is fulfilled! There is a Shiv temple near my place, forbidden for general public to worship as people become mad by worshipping it! Locals call him " Bauraha(Insane) Mahadeva " . There He is in " Aghoreshwar " form, and his worship includes objects like rotten Urhul flowers. Only very very high Aghoris can worship there! So generally it remains closed! I wonder if inferences and logical concusions help in these matters! In essence, all is Shiva, even animals, birds, spirits... If I worship a spirit under some Babool tree, a Brahma Pishacha under Paras Peepal, or some yakshini under an Ashoka tree, surely " Shiva " won't be receiving my offerings, even though all thse are " Shiva " in essence! All I can do is try to explain philosophically that we wanted to see Shiva as a Yakshini, and so our state of reality was shaped accordingly! But then, what about their state of reality?! I know of a person who used to offer tarpans to his ancestors, at a certain place, and after more than 10 years, he came to know that it was being received by a certain ghost, who was no doubt very greatful to him! Your sincerely, Kunal Nath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Respected Guruji,Pranam!That is really profound, and that is how you always are! True, Scriptures are actually compilations of eternal truths! I used the word "scripture" little loosely. At one level, Scriptures contain the ideal of "Shivoham", while at the other end, they teache us to offer Bilva etc. I don't know if this end comes in the category of "Scripture". And it is at this end that the role of traditions is vital. Of course, when the swimmer has learned to swim in a pool, he gets a drive to go to a river, and if he is destined, he crosses the English Channel. Before he realises, in the process of worshipping Shiva, he has himself become Shiva. And all this this while, Scriptures were there as friendly guides and the repository of rules as well as the ultimate Truth itself!You indicated towards the relation between Bhakti and Gyan Yoga, each leading to the other and raising the individual higher & higher. All spiritual aspirants are combinations of Bhakti, Gyan & Karma Yogas, in varying proportions, depending upon the evolution of the soul. If I take my own example, I really hate to grow up, but She compells me, and one day I come to know that she is Vishnu granthi vibhedhini, she is rudra granthi vibhedini, and lo behold, she is Shivshaktyaikyaroopini! Oh it is so overwhelming! She is growing at such an alarming rate, I feel unfit to offer her flowers as I used to! And so I'm compelled to grow up!Though it is a different thread, I steal this opportunity to request you to pay heed to my prayers in the thread "Anticipating Guruji (Pandit Sanjay Rath ji)'s grace!" Your sincerely,Kunal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 7, 2010 Report Share Posted January 7, 2010 Thank you, Guruji!It's nice to see the emphasis on Shiva as the All-Father, knowing, guiding, forgiving and the emphasis on checking tradition against scripture so that we are not merely wandering about in a tradition of partial knowledge.Steve Sanjay Rath <sanjayrathsohamsa Sent: Wed, January 6, 2010 11:50:06 AMRE: Re: Tulasi: Either or Both? om gurave namah Dear Kunal ji Let me indulge ... A simple explanation for such a complex issue is not possible nor would it be wise to say 'to each his own'. Ignorance is surely not bliss in spiritual matters. You have given some nice examples to bring out the point that it aybe impossible to infer the level of the worship but then that is what tradition is all about. It gives us the possibility of lerning the scriptures and understanding them in their higher levels. when the understanding arises and as we grow older and pass through the stages where desire for small things no longer satisfies. Then the same little boy whowould go to the shiva linga for asking for good marks in exam will gow up and feel ashamed that he could ever ask for such a petty thing like better exam scores. But then his mind tells him, look Shiva is holy father of all, he understands. you were small. now pray for higher things then he goes a level higher and asks for well being of his family...and like this another 25 years or so passes and he becomes wiser by the day and desires change. Kids have grown and he goes to Shiva linga and realises he was so stupid to ask for the well being of the children - they are not really his, they are Shiva's cildren and he is only a guardian. now he must rise higher and ask for well being of his country, his people, his dharma...and all that. He lives beyond 75 and then he ralises that the nation is only a line drawn on a piece of paper called map. there is a whole world in animals and plansts who have shared life with him. The pipal tree in his courtyard is the only living thing that has stayed with him. wife is dead, siblings are dead or too weak to see him. children have their lives to live and now grandchildren also have their children to marry and settle. He has done his time and then he goes to the Shiva linga and wonders - I must be the most stupid fellow on earth. I have wasted a whole life asking for something which in fact is Lord Shiva's responsibility. He is the old father of all and he has been doing his dharma all through. So why was I being so narrow and selfish and asking only for my wife and children and nation. what about othr nations? What about the good old pipal tree under which I sit everyday who has been my only true companion for 75 years. Let me now pray for all in the world, the globe and my pipal tree ... And that night he sees Lord Shiva in a dream telling him that he has lived a good life and is now grow a little older. If a day of the devas = 1 year in human life, then then his deva age is just 75 days (although he feels like 75 years in human life). In deva calendar he is just beginning to take some baby steps.... If after this people still have the time to do all those things for personal gratification, then they are just babies in the eyes of Shiva. and babies can always seek forgiveness when they grow out of their baby mistakes and fancies. Now think of tradition. If the present day traditions started at the time of Sri Krishna, then they are about 3000 days old (in eyes of devas, not shiva or brahma or vishnu)...in simple words, the traditions restarte at the time of the Kali Yuga by the grace of Krishna are just 9 years old (3000/360 approx). Which means it is time for them to have sacred thread. therefore all these traditions are seeing a sudden spurt of religious study, inquiry and all that. But in comparision to the scriptres themselves, they are small kids for the scriptures are as old as Brahma. that is why they are Brahma vidya. Best Wishes Sanjay Rath 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi 110060, India; +91 (011) 4504 8762 Readings: www.srath.com; Courses: www.sohamsa. com; Books: www.sagittariuspubl ications. com; Community: www.. org sohamsa@ .com [sohamsa] On Behalf Of Utkarsh 05 January 2010 09:11 AM sohamsa@ .com Re: Tulasi: Either or Both? Respected Acharyas Isn't tradition as good as or sometimes at par with scriptural injunctions !?! The reality we live in is a product of our belief system , our perception guides our vision and shapes our reality! Here my reality is like a genetic code and carries with me when I change bodies in newer births! Take for example, the caste system, its effect can be seen even after death...the example of Brahma Rakshas(Brahma Pishachas or simply Brahmas) is evident of it! A great confusion arises because of using the name "Shiva" in a very wide sense! When a simple layman, uneducated of sutleties of Hindu philosophy goes to a Shiv mandir, and worships Shiv linga, what is in his mind? Is he worshipping the Nirguna Brahma called Shiva, or is he worshipping Mahesha, Shankar, one of the trinities, or an aspect like Rudra(as he had recently got done a Rudrabhisheka by a local pundit)? May be he doesn't have the qualification to distinguish, but then Who shall receive his puja and bless him? All the Mahavidyas have seperate "Shivas"! The "Shiva" of Kamala is "Sadashiva Vishnu". The "Shiva" of "Kali" is "Mahakal Shiva". To distinguish, we may say that here the 1st "Shiva" meant "Param Shiva" ...But I'm a lay person and I don't understand all that, the moment I see a Shiv Linga, I say Shiv Shankar and offer Bilva, and my wish is fulfilled! There is a Shiv temple near my place, forbidden for general public to worship as people become mad by worshipping it! Locals call him "Bauraha(Insane) Mahadeva". There He is in "Aghoreshwar" form, and his worship includes objects like rotten Urhul flowers. Only very very high Aghoris can worship there! So generally it remains closed! I wonder if inferences and logical concusions help in these matters! In essence, all is Shiva, even animals, birds, spirits... If I worship a spirit under some Babool tree, a Brahma Pishacha under Paras Peepal, or some yakshini under an Ashoka tree, surely "Shiva" won't be receiving my offerings, even though all thse are "Shiva" in essence! All I can do is try to explain philosophically that we wanted to see Shiva as a Yakshini, and so our state of reality was shaped accordingly! But then, what about their state of reality?! I know of a person who used to offer tarpans to his ancestors, at a certain place, and after more than 10 years, he came to know that it was being received by a certain ghost, who was no doubt very greatful to him! Your sincerely, Kunal Nath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2010 Report Share Posted January 25, 2010 Very Wise. mysticalsnese The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong. Carl Jung. sohamsa , "Sanjay Rath" <sanjayrath wrote:>> > > > > om gurave namah> > Dear Kunal ji> > Let me indulge ...> > A simple explanation for such a complex issue is not possible nor would it be wise to say 'to each his own'. Ignorance is surely not bliss in spiritual matters. You have given some nice examples to bring out the point that it aybe impossible to infer the level of the worship but then that is what tradition is all about. It gives us the possibility of lerning the scriptures and understanding them in their higher levels. when the understanding arises and as we grow older and pass through the stages where desire for small things no longer satisfies. Then the same little boy whowould go to the shiva linga for asking for good marks in exam will gow up and feel ashamed that he could ever ask for such a petty thing like better exam scores. But then his mind tells him, look Shiva is holy father of all, he understands. you were small. now pray for higher things> > then he goes a level higher and asks for well being of his family...and like this another 25 years or so passes and he becomes wiser by the day and desires change. Kids have grown and he goes to Shiva linga and realises he was so stupid to ask for the well being of the children - they are not really his, they are Shiva's cildren and he is only a guardian. now he must rise higher and ask for well being of his country, his people, his dharma...and all that. He lives beyond 75 and then he ralises that the nation is only a line drawn on a piece of paper called map. there is a whole world in animals and plansts who have shared life with him. The pipal tree in his courtyard is the only living thing that has stayed with him. wife is dead, siblings are dead or too weak to see him. children have their lives to live and now grandchildren also have their children to marry and settle. He has done his time and then he goes to the Shiva linga and wonders - I must be the most stupid fellow on earth. I have wasted a whole life asking for something which in fact is Lord Shiva's responsibility. He is the old father of all and he has been doing his dharma all through. So why was I being so narrow and selfish and asking only for my wife and children and nation. what about othr nations? What about the good old pipal tree under which I sit everyday who has been my only true companion for 75 years. Let me now pray for all in the world, the globe and my pipal tree ... > > And that night he sees Lord Shiva in a dream telling him that he has lived a good life and is now grow a little older.> > If a day of the devas = 1 year in human life, then then his deva age is just 75 days (although he feels like 75 years in human life). In deva calendar he is just beginning to take some baby steps....> > If after this people still have the time to do all those things for personal gratification, then they are just babies in the eyes of Shiva. and babies can always seek forgiveness when they grow out of their baby mistakes and fancies.> > > > Now think of tradition. If the present day traditions started at the time of Sri Krishna, then they are about 3000 days old (in eyes of devas, not shiva or brahma or vishnu)...in simple words, the traditions restarte at the time of the Kali Yuga by the grace of Krishna are just 9 years old (3000/360 approx). Which means it is time for them to have sacred thread. therefore all these traditions are seeing a sudden spurt of religious study, inquiry and all that. But in comparision to the scriptres themselves, they are small kids for the scriptures are as old as Brahma. that is why they are Brahma vidya.> > > > Best Wishes> > Sanjay Rath> > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi 110060, India; +91 (011) 4504 8762> > Readings: www.srath.com; Courses: www.sohamsa.com; Books: www.sagittariuspublications.com; Community: www..org> > > > sohamsa [sohamsa ] On Behalf Of Utkarsh> 05 January 2010 09:11 AM > sohamsa > Re: Tulasi: Either or Both?> > > > > > Respected Acharyas> > Isn't tradition as good as or sometimes at par with scriptural injunctions !?! The reality we live in is a product of our belief system , our perception guides our vision and shapes our reality! Here my reality is like a genetic code and carries with me when I change bodies in newer births! Take for example, the caste system, its effect can be seen even after death...the example of Brahma Rakshas(Brahma Pishachas or simply Brahmas) is evident of it!> > A great confusion arises because of using the name "Shiva" in a very wide sense! When a simple layman, uneducated of sutleties of Hindu philosophy goes to a Shiv mandir, and worships Shiv linga, what is in his mind? Is he worshipping the Nirguna Brahma called Shiva, or is he worshipping Mahesha, Shankar, one of the trinities, or an aspect like Rudra(as he had recently got done a Rudrabhisheka by a local pundit)? May be he doesn't have the qualification to distinguish, but then Who shall receive his puja and bless him? > > All the Mahavidyas have seperate "Shivas"! The "Shiva" of Kamala is "Sadashiva Vishnu". The "Shiva" of "Kali" is "Mahakal Shiva". To distinguish, we may say that here the 1st "Shiva" meant "Param Shiva" ...But I'm a lay person and I don't understand all that, the moment I see a Shiv Linga, I say Shiv Shankar and offer Bilva, and my wish is fulfilled!> > There is a Shiv temple near my place, forbidden for general public to worship as people become mad by worshipping it! Locals call him "Bauraha(Insane) Mahadeva". There He is in "Aghoreshwar" form, and his worship includes objects like rotten Urhul flowers. Only very very high Aghoris can worship there! So generally it remains closed!> > I wonder if inferences and logical concusions help in these matters! In essence, all is Shiva, even animals, birds, spirits... If I worship a spirit under some Babool tree, a Brahma Pishacha under Paras Peepal, or some yakshini under an Ashoka tree, surely "Shiva" won't be receiving my offerings, even though all thse are "Shiva" in essence!> All I can do is try to explain philosophically that we wanted to see Shiva as a Yakshini, and so our state of reality was shaped accordingly! But then, what about their state of reality?! I know of a person who used to offer tarpans to his ancestors, at a certain place, and after more than 10 years, he came to know that it was being received by a certain ghost, who was no doubt very greatful to him!> > Your sincerely,> Kunal Nath.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2010 Report Share Posted January 25, 2010 Dear Sudhir, Are we really in a position to offer something to the 'One' Who actually has given us Life? In true sense, we can only Ask. or should we actually ask - doesnt He/She already know what we need? Do 'We' really exist? Or is it only 'That' which exists as manifold? One Mind, many Views. mysticalsense. The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong. Carl Jung. sohamsa , "sudhir_panda_bbsr" <sudhir_panda_bbsr wrote:>> Hello Sir,> > This is an interesting discussion. In a small village near Puri, where I was born, people regularly offer Champaka to Shiva linga. Many people offer multiple of 108 Champakas when their wishes are fulfilled. I am not sure about other places in India, but this practice is also seen in several other parts of Odisha. > > I cannot exactly remember where (I think it was in Pune) but once a pandit has asked me to offer Tulasi on Shiva linga during a rudrabhiseka. > > Thanks and regards,> Sudhir> > > sohamsa , "mysticalsense" sensemystical@ wrote:> >> > > > Dear SR,> > > > It can also be inferred that since the Atman in us is the Shiva and> > the rest of what we are made of is Shakti/Girija (ref:> > AdiShankaracharya's kriti: Atmaa tvaM girijaa matiH sahachrAhA; and> > Shiva Purana); then we should neither be consuming tulasi nor wearing> > it, as in essence we just end up offering it to Shiva+Shakti, since> > consuming it will put it into the Shakti part and wearing it will be> > around the body that houses the Atman that is the Spark of Shiva.> > > > oh ho but who is sustaining this body and the universe...Vishnu? so> > where is Vishnu if everything is Shiva+Shakti....and so on and so forth,> > then someone learned with Vishnu Purana will say, it is Vishnu that> > manifests as everything...so the 2 parties keep fighting about who is> > superior and what should be offered to whom.> > > > Coming back to Shiva Purana, why would Shiva Purana be talking about> > offering Tulasi to Shiva in general or under special circumstances?> > > > e.g. ShivaPurana: Rudra Samhita: Chapter 14: talks of offering Tulasi to> > Shiva ( Shloka 28 ), among benefits of offering other articles like> > bilva, bandhuka, nirgundi etc. this chapter 14 explicit in saying that> > ketaki and champaka are prohibited (and reasons to same are given in> > other parts of Shiva Purana). Please can you point the reference from> > Shiva Purana or elsewhere which says that "Only on Shiva ratri is tulasi> > offered to Shiva and Bilva offered to Vishnu." or is that an inference> > (or a tradition being followed)?> > > > mysticalsense.> > > > The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not> > between right and wrong. Carl Jung.> > > > > > > > > > > > sohamsa , "Sanjay Rath" <sanjayrath@> wrote:> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > om gurave namah> > >> > > Dear Kunal Nath> > >> > > That is 100% correct. Only on Shiva ratri is tulasi offered to Shiva> > and Bilva offered to Vishnu. This is taught after the battle between> > Brahma and Vishnu in the Vidyesvara samhita of Shiva purana. For> > Shivaratri is the day when the Atma linga (pillar of light) was> > witnessed as the manifestation of Shiva by them. It was on this day that> > Shiva granted the boon of equivalence to Vishnu and forgiveness to> > Brahma for his sins. Therefore those who have lied and sinned in the> > year go to Shiva with the Ketaki flower (only offered on this day) and> > while offering it, they CONFESS their sin. This confession with Ketaki> > as witness leads to forgiveness and change. This is pracised in all> > Orissa temples even today.> > >> > > Best Wishes> > >> > > Sanjay Rath> > >> > > 15B Gangaram Hospital Road, New Delhi 110060, India; +91 (011) 4504> > 8762> > >> > > Readings: www.srath.com; Courses: www.sohamsa.com; Books:> > www.sagittariuspublications.com; Community: www..org> > >> > >> > >> > > sohamsa [sohamsa ] On> > Behalf Of utkarsh_vaggbhav> > > 26 December 2009 03:06 AM> > > sohamsa > > > Re: Tulasi: Either or Both?> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > Respected sir,> > >> > > I don't know the technical reason as to why Tulasi is not offered to> > Shiva, but I know that we shouldn't...!! Actually sometimes ago, I used> > to offer Tulasi to Shiv Linga, but later I came to know that I> > shouldn't, so I stopped that. Now while I didn't face any problems> > because of that, I know of people who had problems due to that> > only..like a friend of mine had kept shiva linga at the Tulasi Pindi and> > used to pour water over it...needless to say, his "general time and> > growth" suffered!> > >> > > Also it wouldn't be out of place to mention that once a year, on> > Mahashivaratri, Tulasi is offered to Baba Vaidyanath in Jharkhand, and> > if my memory doesn't fail me, Bel Patra to Vishnu ji.. It is a practice> > being followed since God knows when, but it is right for that place at> > that time...> > >> > > Though it is slightly off the topic, but let me add few more> > words...the same deity may change his/her bhava from place to place..so> > even as there are generalities as mentioned in scriptures, there are> > local/specific differences..to alter that is possible only for people> > like Adi Shankaracharya..Now the reasons behind this phenomenon can be> > many and unexplainable...Our own bhavas over a period of time(like> > bhavas of Bhaktas or of very evolved souls) somehow affects the bhava of> > deity too...> > >> > > So I think if I have to offer something to Shiva ji, I'll offer Bel> > Patra..But suppose You r really in love with Him and have been> > worshipping Him with Tulasi all your life, if I happen to come to your> > house, I'll make it a point that I offer some Tulasi to Shiv Ji :-)> > >> > > Sincerely,> > > Kunal Nath.> > >> >> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2010 Report Share Posted January 25, 2010 Respected Guru ji,Sadar Pranam!Will not the very conception of "Mind" result in duality and hence many frames of refrence and even multiple views with a common frame? If that is true, a mind praying Kali for an afflicted Saturn will get results accordingly while a mind praying Kali for some power will get different results. And on a very different level, one Ramakrishna will pray Kali and become Paramhansa achieving "No Mind" !Perhaps all three are right in their respective frames... Views will always exist as long as Mind exists... Shishyawat,Kunal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 25, 2010 Report Share Posted January 25, 2010 Dear Kunal, While Guruji answers, another 'view' comes to the Mind: Mind produces all kinds of thoughts and thoughts arrange to form views and concepts. Some may be more evolved than others and hence there are the people at different stages of evolution having various viewpoints and concepts (about Spirituality, God etc.) trying to grasp "That" which is "beyond Everything" - including thought, views, concepts and Mind....and perhaps "No Mind" too, isn't "That" 'Neither' and 'Both' at the same time. Paradoxical is the duality between "Mind" and "No Mind" . Where (in us) does the concept of "No Mind" arise? Can it be 'understood by the Mind'? mysticalsense. The pendulum of the mind alternates between sense and nonsense, not between right and wrong. Carl Jung. sohamsa , "Utkarsh" <utkarsh_vaggbhav wrote:>> Respected Guru ji,> Sadar Pranam!> > Will not the very conception of "Mind" result in duality and hence many> frames of refrence and even multiple views with a common frame? If that> is true, a mind praying Kali for an afflicted Saturn will get results> accordingly while a mind praying Kali for some power will get different> results. And on a very different level, one Ramakrishna will pray Kali> and become Paramhansa achieving "No Mind" !> Perhaps all three are right in their respective frames... Views will > always exist as long as Mind exists...> > Shishyawat,> Kunal.> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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