Subha/Paapa and Soumya/Kroora (On Seeing Deities from the 12th..)

[Guest guest]

Dear Shri Narasimhaji,

 

Namashkar,

 

Please suggest me best fit gemstones for me.Please help me in knowing which

Subha and Paapa for my chart.

 

 

 

My Birth Name:-Surendra Biradar DOB:-05th July 1977 Birth time:-20:20pm Birth

Place:-Miraj, Maharashtra, India

 

Thanking you and with best regards,

 

Mr.Sunilkumar Biradar

Assistant Resident Engineer

Improvement of Roads & Access Surrounding Metro Stations (R659/11)

PARSONS De Leuw Cather Overseas Ltd

Dubai,UAE

 

 

 

 

 

 

vedic astrology , " Narasimha P.V.R. Rao " <pvr wrote:

>

> Namaste Karu,

>

> Well, Parasara clearly said:

>

> tatraarkashanibhUputraaH kShINenduraahuketavaH.

> krUraaH sheShagrahaaH saumyaaH krUraH krUrayuto budhaH..

>

> Meaning: Sun, Saturn, Mars, waning Moon, Rahu and Ketu are kroora (harsh)

planets and the rest are soumya (gentle). When with kroora planets, Mercury is

also kroora.

>

> The soumya planets are the so-called natural benefics and kroora planets are

the so-called natural malefics.

>

> Parasara defined shubha and paapa specifically based on the houses owned from

lagna. Subha clearly means functional benefic and paapa clearly means functional

malefic.

>

> There seems to be a lot of confusion today regarding subha/paapa and

soumya/kroora planets. But this is fundamental issue and Parasara's teachings

are crystal clear.

>

> Best regards,

> Narasimha

>

> Do a Short Homam Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/homam

> Do Pitri Tarpanas Yourself: http://www.VedicAstrologer.org/tarpana

> Spirituality:

> Free Jyotish lessons (MP3): http://vedicastro.home.comcast.net

> Free Jyotish software (Windows): http://www.VedicAstrologer.org

> Sri Jagannath Centre (SJC) website: http://www.SriJagannath.org

>

>

> sohamsa , " Karu Heenkenda " <heen@> wrote:

> >

> > Hare Rama Krishna

> > Dear Narasimha,

> > There is only one Kroora graha. It is Sun who protect dharma without

emotions. Others are not Kroora, but Papa because their tamasic nature. Sun is

Satvik and not a Papi unless weak.

> > Functional nature of planets is another thing.

> > Best Wishes

> > Karu

> >

> > sohamsa , Narasimha PVR Rao <pvr@> wrote:

> >

> > Dear Sundeep,

> >

> > Great question!

> >

> > Even if Rahu and Ketu are together, their influence on the 12th house may be

different. One may dominate. So Rahu and Ketu can still give different results.

> >

> > > So, no one can ever attain enlightenment, since if

> > > Ketu is there, so must Rahu..

> >

> > The verse you refer to says:

> >

> > kArakAMshAd.h vyaye ketau shubhakheTayutexite |

> > tadA tu jAyate muktiH sAyujyapadamApnuyAt.h || 65||

> >

> > Literal translation is: " If Ketu is in the 12th house from AK's amsa,

conjoined or aspected by a subha planet, then liberation occurs and one joins

god's lotus feet. "

> >

> > The words used in this verse and the next one are " subha " and " paapa " .

> >

> > When Parasara defined these terms, he defined soumya (gentle) and kroora

(harsh) grahas withOUT reference to ascendant and he defined subha

(auspicious/benefic) and paapa (inauspicious/malefic) grahas with reference to

ascendant. These terms are translated as natural benefic/malefic and functional

benefic/malefic in English. Because both pairs of phrases are similar, people

mix them up.

> >

> > Jupiter is soumya, but he need not be subha. That depends on lagna (or other

reference used). Saturn is kroora, but he need not be paapa. That depends on

lagna.

> >

> > Parasara used the terms soumya and kroora in some combinations and subha and

asubha/paapa in some. Please note that they are not interchangable!

Unfortunately, translators of Parasara weren't always consistent in their

translation, but I don't think a maharshi would mix up the two pairs of words

and use the wrong word. Take it as a functional benefic when he says subha and

take it as a functional malefic when he says paapa.

> >

> > Soumya means one who is gentle and kroora means one who is harsh. Subha

means one who does good and asubha/paapa means one who does bad. A harsh person

can do you good and a gentle person can harm you.

> >

> > Rahu is a kroora graha, but he can certainly be a subha graha in a chart!

> >

> > I will leave it to you to figure out from which reference the functionality

(beneficence or maleficence) of a planet joining or aspecting Ketu in 12th

should be judged - lagna or AK, in rasi or vimsamsa etc.

> >

> > Best regards,

> > Narasimha

> >

> > sohamsa , " vedicastrostudent " <vedicastrostudent@>

wrote:

> > >

> > > Dear Narasimhaji,

> > > While what you say sounds compelling, you know that Rahu and Ketu are

always together in D-20. Did Parasara have verses that gave distinct results for

Rahu and for Ketu in 12th from AK? Why would he do so if he knew for certain

that they'll always be together? Please explain in detail. At least in one

translation I have:

> > >

> > > " If Ketu is in the 12th from Karak & #257; & #324; & #347;, receiving a Drishti

from a malefic, or is there yuti with a malefic, one will not attain full

enlightenment. "

> > >

> > > Clearly, he is talking about worship and spiritual practices here. So he

must be talking about D-20 according to your rules of inference. So, no one can

ever attain enlightenment, since if Ketu is there, so must Rahu..

> > >

> > > Regards,

> > >

> > > Sundeep

> > > >

> > > > In the chapter called " kaarakaamsa phala " in BPHS, Parasara mentioned

the deities worshipped based on the planets in the 12th from kaarakaamsha. For

example, Sun in 12th from AK shows a worshipper of Shiva and Moon in 12th from

AK shows a worshipper of Gouri.

> > > >

> > > > The term " kaarakaamsa " means " AK's amsa " . Amsa only means division.

Which amsa or division is Parasara referring to?

> > > >

> > > > Though people jumped to the conclusion that amsa means navaamsa by

default, there is one more important thing to consider here. At the onset

itself, Parasara clarified which amsas (divisions) are used for which purposes.

He clearly said " upaasanaayaaH viGYaanaM saadhyaM viMshati bhaagake " , meaning

" the knowledge of one's worship and spiritual practices is possible in D-20 " .

> > > >

> > > > If, having said that at the onset, he defines which deities are

worshipped based on the 12th house from AK in an " amsa " , can the amsa in

question be anything other than D-20?! After all, he clearly said one's

upaasanaa is seen from D-20. So the principles laid out later by Parasara for

upaasanaa *must* be referring to D-20 by " amsa " and *not* D-9 as people normally

take.

> > > >

>

>

>