Guest guest Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 I totally agree with this view. Let us throw away the differences and behave as Vaishnavit.SEVEL KRISHNAN18 Thiruvengadam Street ExtensionsEast Raja AnnamalaipuramChennai 600028Landline 24617660mobile 99400 95670 CC: vsrangacharFrom: vsrangacharDate: Fri, 2 Jan 2009 21:48:33 +0530Re: Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali)Dear Swamins Whatever said and done the FIGHT between the two sects shows a very state of affairs of the IYENGARS in the eyes of the others & the world. The recent one regarding the MELKOTE temple is shining example to the level the fight is going. Even in those days the fight reached the privy council (british highest court). In my opinion in this period of the survival of the very base of HINDUIsm in India - we should be ASHAMED OF FIGHTING LIKE THIS. wHAT WE ARE LEAVING TO THE POSTERITY IS hatred, hatred AND HATRED ONLY INSTEAD OF THE PERINIAL PHILOSOPHIES AND Divya prabhandams. It is high time we ALL realise and rise to the level from where WE can all make a GLORIOUS religion - Hinduism. Adiyen,dasanvsr V.S. Rangachar--- On Fri, 2/1/09, आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 > wrote:आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 > Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali)naranann (AT) (DOT) in, "Ponnappan" <Oppiliappan >, , "divya desam" , "Swami" , "Ramanuja and desika " <RamanujaandDesika >Friday, 2 January, 2009, 5:07 PM---------- Forwarded message ----------आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 11:50 AMFwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali )naranann (AT) (DOT) . in---------- Forwarded message ----------आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:53 AMFwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali )vishnurdn (AT) (DOT) co.in, kidambi seshadri <krseshadri84@ gmail.com>, "sailesh..... .... joined in srm" <saileshrjn (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, Veeraraghavan <radharaghu (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, Balakrishnan ramanuaj Dasan <alwarbalan2008@ gmail.com>---------- Forwarded message ----------आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:50 AMTotal Mails.....(vadakali )vishnurdn (AT) (DOT) co.in, Veeraraghavan <radharaghu (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, "sailesh..... .... joined in srm" <saileshrjn (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, kidambi seshadri <krseshadri84@ gmail.com>---------- Forwarded message ----------swamidesikadasan <swamidesikadasan@ gmail.com>Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 8:24 PMRe:sailesh rajan <saileshrjn (AT) gmail (DOT) com>,Adisesh Iyengar<adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Dear all, There are many proofs that Swami desikan and also Manavala Mamuni are Vadakalai. The first one is the thirumeni at Sri Thiruvahindipuram of Swami desikan is Adorning Vadakalai thiruman.Which was made by Swami desikan himself. Next thatacharirars( periya Tirumalai Nambi),uncle of Sri Bashyakarar are Vadakalai. If u visit Sreeperambuthur the Archa Thirumeni of Sri bashyakarar adorns Vadakalai thiruman. secondly when the Tridandi jyer covered the Vimanam of Sribashyakarar and half of perumal sannidhi they didn't allow media and even Srivaishnavs to take photograph. The vimanam in Sriperambuthur contains Vdakalaithiruman. Once Sriprambuthur was a Vadakalai shrine but was converted to Tekalai around 150 years ago,when the new Embar mutt was started. The temple in Sripreambuthur was taken care by the Sriperambuthur Tirumalia EEchambadi. Thus Vdakalayars built a new Desikan Sannidhi in Sriperambuthur near the Purshkarini. In Sriperambuthur the Chinna Jyer covered the Vimana of Perumal 1/3rd only..... This is so because there are Vadakalai there. Nextly we can talk about Sri Manavala Mamuni and other Tenkaayars. Tenkalayars say that they don't have the caste feelings . They perform Samasrayanam and also include Bagawatargal in Srivaishnava Ghosti. Its wrong, in the Bashyam of Sri periyavachan Pillai(said as Tenkalai) to Amalanadipiran, Sri Vachan pillai clearly states that Thirupannar is a Panchamar and even thought he said Amalan the cast can't be excluded. Thus in Periyavachan Pillai Vyakyanam it is clearly said that they see the differences in Cast but say that all people who perform Samasrayanam are equal. But when u see the Bashyam of Sri Swami Vedanta Desikan, Swami mentions that Thirupannar is a Avadoothi and not a ordinary man.Few tenkalayars say that Swami desikan was consider Pillailokachariar and Periyavachan Pillai as his Acharayn. These information are totally Fake. If they were acharyans then swami desikan would have mention them in his Granthas like Adikara Sangraham and many. Swami desikan had the ideology of Bashyakara and thus he didn't agree with the ideas of Pillailokachariar. Swami desikan had good relationship with All the acharyars at this time. Few fanatics say that Swami had composed stotras on Periyavachan Pillai , if composed can they name it? Only 28 stotras are composed by swami desikan. To say many Tenkalayars( now considering) like Dodachary and Prativaid bayankaram anna had composed many granthas on Swami desikan. Prativadi title was offered to Anna by Nayanachariar( son of Swami desikan) and he had his Samasrayanam done under Swami Nayanachariar . Later he became a sishya of Manavala Mamuni. Dodyachariar who was earlier as Sishyan of Manavala Mamui was influenced by Swai deiskan ideology wrote VedantadesikaPrakas hika. Till now there are Vamsikas of Doddachariar in Nagapattnam. Prativadi anna composed SaptatRatnamalika. Redarding Thayar......There are lot of contravesy between the two Kalayars regarding the matter of Sri. The vadakali sect say that thayar too is Paramatma as lord is. But this Paksham was not accepted by Tenkalayars. On this contraversy Swami desikan had written in his Chattusloki Bashyam regarding the Piratti. All tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan pillai and also Nampillai, Nanjyer, Parasara Bhattar in their EEdu and other Srisookthis tell that thayar is Paramatham. This difference was created after the Grandson of Koil Annan. Then, Tenkalayars condisder Perumal Keupa as Nirhetu Krupa but Vadakalayas say that its Hetu krupa . Hert means reasoned. Thus acoording to the TK point of view , when Perumal is Nirhetukrupi, Why cant he shower his Krupa on all Jeevatmas and make them all Srivaishnavs and give moksham? If thayar is not given importance in Tenkalai Sampraday then, They must nor adorn Srichoorna, Then must not be called as Srivaishnavas. As Tenkalaayars don't Sanskrit ,they take wrong meanings of Sri Desikan Granthas and others.Regarding SaranagathiTenkalayars say that Prapati is the only way which leads moksha and the other ways like Gnana,karma and Bakthi willn't lead to Moksham. But we say that all the 4 ways lead to Moksham but Prapatti is a very easy form to Moksha. To Tenkalai Fanatics: If bakthi,Gnana and Karma yogams will not lead to Moksham then how did Prahaladhan, Bishmar and many rishis went to Moksham.Regarding Thiruman The old and Prachina Thiruman is the U or Vadakalai Thiruman. Pancharatra Agama states that "Arabhya Nasika Mulam: nasika mulam arabhya: nasadikesa payantam anasamularabhya" which means that the Urdhva Pundram must start between the two eyebrows and end at the Kesham(hair) . It is clear that the Tenkalai thiruman is a new form because the Tenkalayars adorn different thirumans at different places. Ex: Y thiruman at face and Tamil PAA similar to U thiruman in the body. So the tenkalai thiruman was derived frm the Vadakali (already mentioned that Bashyakarar was Vadakali).IF there were two thirumans at the Time of Swami desikan than, swmai would have mentioned inhis grantha named Saccaritra raksha. Few tenkalayars say that there are thirumans(tenkalai) in many Stambams and Moolavars in Karnataka. In those around 1600-1700 many temples were rennovated,in karnataka,due to Mughal Invasion. During the rennovation the Moolavars and utsavars were replaced with Thiruman. Actually to say in Silpa Sastram or in any Puranama there are no reference to any thiruman. But the Tenkalayars say that Tenkalai thiruman was the first. There are many evidences of Vadakalai thiruman in many countirs like Egypt,Greece. The photos of these places are available at the website of Stephan Knapp. There are many Vadakali Thirumans in Kanchipuram, Srirangam, Tirumalai, and amny Divyadesam but they were destroyed by the Tenkalayars. At present there are few Thiruman in Tirupati and Kanchipuram. The Ramanujar at Tirumalai was a Vadakalai sannidhi the name itsef Signifies that it belongs to Vadakalai (bashyakarar) but was undertake by Tenkalayars.Regarding Thaniyan There are two Thaniyans for Swami desikan in Sanskrit and one Tamil Thaniyan composed by Sri Pillailokachary( tenkalai head)The thaniyans are "Sreeman Venkatanatharyaha Kavitharkika Kesari Vedanthacharya Varyome Sannidhattam Sadahrudhim " & "Ramanuja Dayapatram Gnana Vairagya BushanamSreemath Venkatanatharyaham Vande Vedanta Desikam"These two thaniyans were composed by Sri Nayanachariar( swami's Son) and Brahmatantrar swami. Manavalamamunigal has a sanskrit Thaniyan "Sreesailesha Dayapatram Deepatyadi Gunarnavam Yetinda Pravanam Vandhe Ramyaja Mataram Munim"This thaniyan was composed by sri narayan Jyer one of the sishyas of Manavala Mamunigal and it was mentioned in VARAVARAMUNI SHATAKAM by Yerumbiappa. But the present Tenkalayars say that the Thaniyan was supposed to be recited by Lord Ranganatha Itself. There are many stories like, When Sriranganathan came as a small boy and recited Thaniyan for Manavala Mamuni, the bagawats in Ghosti asked for Thirunal Pattu to by said by the boy. Then this itself signifies that there was Thirunal Pathhu for some other Acharayar, that is none other than Swami Deiskan.Another Avatara OF RamanuajarThere are many stories like Manavala Mamuni was the avatara of Ramanuajar. This is one of the lies told by tenkalayars. It is said that Sri BAshyakarar didn't warite and spread the essence of Divya PRabandham . Thus he took another avatara as Manavala Mamuni. There are also other stories like Sriman Narayanana granted 200 years of life span for Adiseshan and asked him to take avatar as Ramanujar and as Ramanmujar lived for only 120 years he took another avatara as Manavala Mamuni(swami survived for 73years only). The 120+73=193. Then what about 7 years? Then did Adiseshan took another avatara for 7 years? Then Vadakalayars can clearly say that Swmai desikan was the amasam of Sri Bashyakarar . Swmai desiakn had authored many Granthas liek Munivahanaboham, Madurakavi Hridayam,Dravidopan ishad Saram,etc., on Divya Prabandham in Sanskrit and Tamil. Swami Bashyakarara lived as a Sanyasi most of his life. Thus Swami desikan was born as a Amsam of Sri Bashyakarara to explain how a Srivaishnavan must lead a life as Grihastan. Swami desikan had written Vyakyanams for Thiruvoimozhi in Sanskrit. Swami desikan wrote 73,000 padi but it was lost due to carelessness. And swami desikan had written Many Rakshai's for Pancharatra Agama,Srivaishanva Sampraday and many. So swami Desikan is the Amsam of Sri Bashyakarar.About Manavala Mamuni Manavala Mamunigal had his Sribashya Kalakshebam done under the Grandson of Kidambi Appular(a Vadakalate) and aslo he took his Preksha Mantram or Sanyasam under the 1st Azhagiyasingar of Sri Ahobila Mutt(a Vadakala MUtt). Many say that the Ahobila Mutt itself was a Tenkalai Mutt . There are no PRooves for their Paksham. And also The 6th Azhagiyasingar of Ahobila Mutt had written many comentires on Swami Desikan Granthas especially Sankalpa Suryodhayam. Tenkalayars mainly consider Ahobila MUtt as tenkalai because if Ahobila mutt is Vadakalai then Manavalamamuni will be Vadakalai. 1st Azhagiyasingar was born on 1378 and Manavalamamuni on 1370. There may be a age difference but 1st Azhagiyasingar got Sanyashasram from Narasimhan at a young age of 20. Thus frm him got sanyashram Manavalamamuni. The Chinna Jyer of Andhara recently appointed a new Jyer called Ahobila Jyer to suppress the Ahobila Mutt activities. The Chinna Jyer of andhara has been giving Sanyashasam like SSLC ceritificate to all. His mutt which was started by his Grandpa was a new mutt which was established in late 1950's.FEw tenkalayars say that Manavalamamuni didn't take Sanyasam as Manavala Mamuni took Sanyasam from Satakopa jyer and not Adivan Satakopa Jyer. In our Srivaishnava Sampraday Ahobila Mutt is the only Muttt which bears the name Van Satakopan or Satakopan for its Peetadipathi . After giving Sanyashasramam to Manavala Mamuni Satakopa Jyer or Adivan Satakopa Jyer was titled the name Adi van by Nammalwar itself and Nammalwar gave his Hamsa Mudrai to 1st Azhagiyasingar. Even today in Alwar Thirunagari Alwar Brahmotsavam Ahobila Mutt obtains 1st three Days Mariyadhai.Anyone who wants to have the Darshan of Hamsa Mudrai of Nammalwar can see them in Ahobila Mutt Aradhan Mundapam.In the year 1730-1759 Swami desikan Thaniyans in many places were replace by the above thaniyan of Manavala Mamuni. EX: Even thousg the temple of meloke is Tenkalai(converted) the sattumurai vazhi thirunamam is recited for Swami desikan only. This was by the Order of Narasimha Udayar of Mysore that they shuldn't replace the thaniyan of Swami desikan with Manaval Mamuni.Even today though the temple of Melkote and Thirunarayanapuram are Tenkalai Parakala Mutt Swami obtains first MAridhai and aslo the Thaniyan and Vazhi Thirunamam of Swmai desikan is recited daily. As per the Kalvettu of Srirangam Swami Desikan's thaniyan was recited in the Temple and houses of Srirangam as swami Desikan restarted the Adhyayana Utsavam. Few Tenkalayars say that why there are two Thaniyans for Swmai desikan? There must be only one Taniyan. Then the answer is AnantanPillai of Tirumalai also had two Thanyians . To say even Manavalamamuni had two Thaniyas but the earlier was rejected and a new starting with Srisailesa Daapatram was accepted. Is this what Manavala Mamuni or ther Tenkalai Acharayr wants? When we consider Tirumala Parakala Mutt was the Darmadatta Mutt but after the advent of Chinna Jyer Mutt in Tirumala all the powers were Trasferred to Tenkalai,which is mentioned in Tirumalai Vozhagu. The Desikan Thaniyan and Vazhithirunamam were recited in Tirumala till 1910's but was stopped by the Tenkalai Mutt. In Tirupati Swami desikan had Thiruvadi Thozhudal of Govindarajan but the tenkalayars who were jelous stoped this Utsava toooo...... There are many Simhasanadipatis like Kandadai,Tirumalai Nallan Chakravarthi, Tirumalai EEchambadi,Tholapac hariar,Tholappar ,Thatachariar, Anantalvan, Illayavillai, Kidambi,Assuri, Veeravilli, etc..., in Vadakali. The Acharyars like Periyanambi, Parasarabattar and others in Sriranga were compelled and converted to Tenkalai. Actually the 74 Simhasanadipadis doesn't have Manavalamamuni but today Acharyars like Parasara Bhattar , Periya Nambi,Tirumalai Anantanpillai, and otheres were compelled to accept Manavalamamuni as acharyan.The thaniyans and also Vazhithirunamam of Manavala Mamuni was a copy of Swami Desikan's.In the vazhi thirunamam of Manavala Mamuni it is said that MANAVALAMAMUNIYE INNUM ORU NOOTRANDU IRUM. What does this mean when ever a man had completed 100 years it is correct to say that innum oru nootrandu irum. But Manavala Mamuni lived only for 73 years.So it is clear that the Tenkalayars must say MANAVALAMAMUNIYE INNUM ORU YEZHUBATHI IRANDU ORU ANDU IRUM . So its clear that Tenkalayars coppied the Vazhithirunamam of Swami Desikan. Then in the Tirumala Oriental Collage all the Granthas of Poorvachariars were collected at that time they found that in the Srisookthies of Manavala MAmuni it is found that another Thaniyans by Appilar was used ex:Yetiraja Saptati. So frm this it is clear that the Tenkalayars had created a new Srivaishnava Sect an copied the matter frm Vadakali Sampradyam.In Upadesaratnamala too Swami Manavalamamuni followed the method of swami desikan's Prabandhasaram and to say the Pasurams are similar to Prabandhasaram and Adhikara Sangraham.We are not Manavala Mamuni Dooshkas but we are condemn him iam tell the facts abt our Sampraday ans not to hurt anybody..... ... Regarding Prabandham . Here onwards i want to tell that Swami Manavalamanuni followed both the footpaths of Swami desikan and Pillai Lokachariar. Tenkalai fanatics say that alwars themself had composed 4000 Divya Prabandham and Ramanuja Nootrandadi is not included in it because Swami desikan in his Prabandha Saram had included Ramanuja Nootrandadi in 4000 Divya PRabandham. IS this the ACHARYA BAKTHI SHOWN BY TENKALAYARS TO SRI RAMANUJAR? Actually 4000 DP composed by alwars contain 3892 pasurams and this was rounded to 4000 and was called Naalaiyira Divya Prabandham PRE Bashyakarar period.. After composing the Iramanuja Nootrandadi Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar handed over this Prabandham to Bashyakarar. But bashyakarar was angry because it was composed on him. Bashyakara sishyas pleaded him and finally Bashyakarar said that this Prabandham must be recited after the 4000 Divya Prabandham(beacuse it contains information about Bashyakarar Acharyars) . Thus Ramanuja Nootandadi Was added to 4000 DP . More over the sum 3892+108=4000 was also Suitable to say Naaliyira Divya Prabandham. Thus Sri Swami Desikan included in his Prabandha Saaram included Ramanuja Notrandadi as a part of Divya Prabandham (in Iyerpa, last 1000) . But Swami Desikan Dweshi's didn't agree this Paksham as the Prabandham was composed by Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar ,then he too is a Alwar. The answer for this question is "Even thought the Prabandham was composed by Amudanar , it was in Praise of Sri Bashyakarar. " This was mentioned not only by Swami desikan but also by Sri manavala Mamunni in his Upadesa Ratnamala. Manavala Mamuni had composed Upadesa Ratnamala by following Swami desikan Prabandham like Adikara Sangraham,Prabandha Saram. Pasurams like "Poigai muni boodathar Peyalwar.... ........" were used in Upadesaratnamala. Swami Manavalamamuni had mentioned the birth month of each alwar but finally he mentions MaduraKavigal, Andal and Bashyakarar. Then according to Nakshatram MadurakaviAlwar must come after Ramanjar , but is not in that order. So, Manavala Mamuni had composed the Pasuram like the the "matha Pitha Yuvatayas" of Parasara Bhattar in which Parasara Bhatter describes all alwars as angam of Nammalwar,so he mentions Nammalwar lastly. Similarly Manava Mamuni had mentioned Bashyakarar at last and then he starts Nathamuni(Pasuram 37-38 in Upadesa Ratnamalai). This itself Signifies that Manavala Mamuni had also accepted the same order as sri Desikan did.. Even Tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan Pilli folowed the order of Adding RAMANUJA NOOTRANDADI to 4000 DIVYA PRABANDHAM.Thus the present Tenkalayars had altered Divya Prabandham so that they can have many divisions mentioned like Ashtadasa Bedahah....18 Differences. . There are differences even in Perialwar Thirumozhi. Vadakalayars consider Perialwar thirumozhi which consists even Thirupallandu in it . But the Tenkalayars had divided Perialwar Thirumozhi into two divisions , Thirupallanu and Perialawar Thirumozhi. As per Tenkalai Sampradaya ONNAM PATHU of PErialwar Thirumozhi have 90 Pasurams only as thirupallandu was seperated from it. Actually Pathu means 10*10 i.e, a total of 100 Pasurams in One pathu. But the 1st pathu according to Tenkalayars contain 90 Pasurams only.Thus the Tenkalayars even divided the Divya Prabandham as they wish. Above, i had mentioned few facts and prooves that Ahobila Mutt was,is and will be Vadakalai. Here Iam adding few more facts. Recently The Chinna Jyer of Andhra had given a Sanyasam Degree to a new IAS officer and named him as Ahobila Ramanuja jyer. This is because they want a Tenklai Ahobila Mutt. Then we Vadakalayars must ask for A Vadakalai Periya Jyer Mutt in Tirupati as 31st and 32nd Jyer in Periya Jyer Mutt were Vadakalai.Why cant the previous Jyer choose a Tenkalai Jyer as as successer? R there no Tenkalayars sutiable to that post except Vadakalayars? SO we Vadakalayars too must ask for a Vadakali Periya Jyer Mutt.Even So the Chinna Jyer of Andhra must stop doing these Tenkalai Pracharam and must develop Ramanuja Sampraday.Being a Srivaishnava Sanyasi how can he rennovate Siva temples and other Demi Gods temples? Is this waht mention in Ramanja Sampradaya or Tenkalai Sampraday? As said by Manavala Mamuni one must selest a acharyan who has high Gnanam and Anustanam thus a sihsyan will get a good guidance.But most of the Tenkalai Acharayars nowadasays doesn't have Anustanam . Only few are folowinf the words of Manavala MAmuni(said as Tenkalai acharayar) . Many Tenklayars have the opinion that Vadakalayars don't give much importance to Divya Prabandham and they neglect it. ITs totally false. Swami deiskan Had written many Granthas on Prandham like Munivahana Boham,Prabanda Saram,73,000 padi on DP(which was lost) , Dravidopanishad, etcc., Swami Deiskan consider Vedam and Divya Prabandham as two eyes . Without an eye we cant see Perumal. As Vedic religion we must for Vedam and Divya Prabandham is for our Atma Ujeevanam. But most Tenkalayars neglect Vedam . Sri BAshyakarar during his last days told 5 main sentences. 1st sentence is that "Learn Sri BAshyam and Preach it to others" 2nd is to Learn "Bagawat Vishyam and preach it to others"... And the other sentenses continues... .But swami Desikan followed the 1st sentece of Sri BAshyakara and lead his life. But the Tenkalayars don;t know this and asay that Swami DEsikan had neglected Divya Prabandham. Since that give To Sri Bashyam and Vedas.... Prabandham is for Atma Ujeevanam... .....Thus Vadakalai Sampradaya is oldest and Tenkalai was a division from Vadakali. Regarding Chinna Jyer of Andhra The Tridandi Jyer had converted many sishyas of Swayamacharayars and various Mutt into his sishyas. We srivaishnavas must save those who had converted or had their samasrayanam done under him. If a Acharayan is not qualified , then the Sishyan can chabge his acharayan which is mentioned in Pillailokacharirar Ashtadasa Rahasyam. So we srivaishnavas must save people from the clutches of a A Vaishnavan. He must stop Tenakali Prachara and work for Ramanuaja Darshanam.He had converted sishyas of Many Vadakali Acharyas in Andhra like Vasudevachari, etc...,Acording to Our Dhram Shastra no one must cross the ocean. Whenever they do this they are not allowed to enter the temples.But the Tridandi had gone to countires like Australia,America, etc..., Is this what said in Dharam Sastra?There are few sishyas of This Chinna Jyer saying that he is another avatara of Ramaujar. Then did Ramaujar Worshiped or went to demi god temples? 4 times Sastnaga Namaskaram Different SampradhAyins prostrate beforethe Lord once , twice or four times .In Vadakalai SampradhAyam , it is done four times .One can use Yukti Vaadhams and point out thefour NamaskaraNams are for the four directions or for the four hands of the Lord holding the disc ,the conch , the abhaya Mudhra and the Lotus or Gadhai. One can also view it as salutations to the Four vyUhams etc. There is however more doctrinal reasons based on AchAryA's teachings . Let us look at them now : Both Swamy AlavanthAr in His StOtra Ratna slOkam and Swamy Desikan elsewhere has given the reasons for the 4 NamaskArams as Svaroopa Sodhanams . When we are visiting a Temple of Sriman NarayaNan , one prostrates ( ShAshtAnga NamaskArams) before the Bali Peetam and then enter the temple .The First NamaskAram is to remind ourselves ofthe Lord's Paratvam ( Superiority as ParadEvathai) . The second NamaskAram is to comfort ourselves with His Soulabhya guNam ( ease of access inspite of His Paratvam) of the Lord . The Third namaskAram is to remind ourselves of His Praapyatvam ( Being the ultimate goal , PradhAna PurushArtham ) . The Fourth NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of His SaraNyatvam or His staying as the SarvalOka SaraNyan and Sarva Rakshakan . When one does the 4 NamaskArams this way , one's ego is pushed aside and one approaches the Lord's sannidhi with the right attitude and Jn~Anam . We prostrate 4 times before AchAryan ,Parents and elder Persons . One can explain this with the Veda PramANam of AchArya DevO Bhava et al . The alternate four reaons for NamaskAram in PerumAL Sannidhi based on Swamy AlavanthAr's stOtra Ratna slOkam and PeriyaVaacchAn PiLLai's commentary is summed up in my 2005 posting in Sriranga Sri archives (Volume I) and Oppiliappan archives ( Part II ) : http://www.ibiblio. org/sripedia/ / archives/apr05/msg00071. html and http://www..ibiblio. org/oppiliappan/ archives/ apr05/msg00015. html The two folded palms in the AshtAnga NamaskAram have their own significance , The right palm of the devotee is said to represent the lotus feet of the Lord and the left palm , the head of the devotee. Desikan Dooshakargal Prativadi Bayankaram ANnan in his Saptati Ratnamalika quotes that"गà¥à¤°à¥‚व वधी हमà¥à¤¸à¤® à¤à¥à¤¦à¤¾à¤šà¤¾à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ सिषà¥à¤¯ जना बकती हीना येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ शà¥à¤¯à¥à¤¹à¥ :|येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ विषà¥à¤£à¥ कारà¥à¤¨à¥à¤¯ ढूरà¥à¤¹à¤¾: कà¥à¤¤à¥‹ मà¥à¤•à¥à¤¤à¤¿ वारà¥à¤¤à¤¾ हि तादà¥à¤° विधानाम || "which means when anybody talks bad about Swami desikan, then he will be disliked by Yetindra(Bashyakara r) and this leads to Vishnu KArunya Dhoorahah(loss of Vishnu Karunyam) and Lord will not grant Moksha for them. These slokas were written by sri Prativadi Bayankaram Annan(now Tenkalai Achayan) . So Tenkalayars must know this slokas and must not talk bad about swmai deiskan and his Granthas.Courtesy: PrabandhaSara VaibhavamGet perfect Email ID for your Resume. Get before others grab. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 The segregation of thengalai and vadagalai came only later and during Ramanuja's time all vaishnavas were the same. After the time of Desika and Manavalamamuni the followers of Dsesika who gave more importance to sanskrit granthas were called vadagalai while the followers of Manavalamamuni who held Tamil prabhandhas as supreme came to be called thengalai.This is according to my knowledge and if anyone can give evidence otherwise I stand corrected. Moreover Ramanuja did not have discrimination even between brahmins and nonbrahmins and both vadagalai and thengalai profess to be the followers of him.In the world vedanta has come to mean only advaita especially due to the cosmopolitanm outlook the great teaschers like Ramakrishna, Sivananda, Ramana and so many others. Vishishtadvaita is unknown to the world at large because of the attitude of vaishnavites to keep the teachings of vaishnvite saints and acharyas secret. After all hRamanuja shouted the ashtakshara from the temple tower. There are people who disapproved my taking Sribhashya as the topic for my thesis. Luckily I had a genuine devotee who is also an orthodox vaishnava as my guru, who is now 94. Ramanuja took as his disciple those whom had the only qualification of being a devotee and calling ourselves as his followers should we restrict ourselves within the fold of vaishnavism itself seggregating into vadagalai and thenkalai?. There is no basic distinction between thenkalai and vadakalai except the mode of worship and the attitude towards sarnagathi which again depends on one's individual relationship to the Lord irrespective of which sect he belongs to.A vadakalai vaishnavite may follow the path of markatanyaya of vadakalai , that is, the way of a young one of a monkey which holds to its mother by its own efforts, instead of the maarjaalanyaya of the thenkalai, that is, the way of the kitten which is carried by its mother in her mouth without any effort on its part, and vice versa.I t all depends on one's capability and thr degree of devotion which may vary from person to person no matter whether he belongs to vadagalai or thenkalai. i would like to extend it further and say that all devotees belong to one class, the class of bhaagavathas and to be treated equally. The differences are only in the modes of worship which is purely a matter of convenience and convention.It is said in the Mahabharatha that the Lord requires no more than a pot filled with water, the washing of His feet with love and words spoken to Him with love,'anyatpoornaadhapaam kumbhaat anyatpadhaavasechanaat anyatkusalsamprasnaat na chechchathi janaardhanah.' As long as you have His mark on your mind it does not matter how you mark your forehead. External paraphernalia is to create the attitude of bhakthi so that the Lord will make your heart His abode. Once He has come in the these outward marks are like the kolam we put on our doorstep to denote auspiciousness. True vaishnava is one who has ahimsa,satya, TOLERANCE, bhoothadaya etc. One of the five yajnas namely, Brahmayajna, devayajna, manushya yajna, pitryajnaand bhootha yajna, is manushya yajna , service to mankind treating all as same, and in Bhagavata the Lord says that if you do not respect and treat all human beings equally there is no use doing puja to Him and He actually gets angry with your worship. So no dogmas or bigotry is allowed for a vaishnava as laid out clearly in the favourite song of Gandhiji , ' vaishnavajan tho the ne kahiye,' by Narsi Mehtha. My main idea in starting my groups and the postings on the internet and in creating webpages and blocks is to break the barriers of religeous restrictions and to make my learning of the vaishnavite literature, thiough meagre, to all, let them be non-vaishnavites or non-proficient in sanskrit so that the treasures of vaishnavism , the teachings of Ramanuaja, Desika and the azvars will be known to all as they were intended to be universal. To the best of my ability I try to give what I have learnt in simple language and I consider this as bhagavtkainkarya. One of the five yajnas, Brahma yajna is the study of scriptures and to explain them to others. Several vaishnavite scholars are also doing this as we can see in the groups and websites on vaishnavism and I am glad that I am able to add a little like the squirrel. After all God is one by whatever name you call Him and He is common to all. The religious disciplines and beliefs are only our guidelines like the road maps. Once you reach the destination the road by which you travel does not matter anymore. saroja Ramanujam Dr. Saroja Ramanujam, M.A., Ph.D, Siromani in sanskrit. www.freewebs.com/asrama3 --- On Mon, 1/5/09, Krishnan Sevel Venkataraman <krishnan1940 wrote: Krishnan Sevel Venkataraman <krishnan1940RE: Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali) Cc: vsrangacharDate: Monday, January 5, 2009, 10:23 AM I totally agree with this view. Let us throw away the differences and behave as Vaishnavit. SEVEL KRISHNAN 18 Thiruvengadam Street Extensions East Raja Annamalaipuram Chennai 600028 Landline 24617660 mobile 99400 95670 CC: vsrangachar@ gmail.comvsrangachar@ Fri, 2 Jan 2009 21:48:33 +0530Re: Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali ) Dear Swamins Whatever said and done the FIGHT between the two sects shows a very state of affairs of the IYENGARS in the eyes of the others & the world. The recent one regarding the MELKOTE temple is shining example to the level the fight is going. Even in those days the fight reached the privy council (british highest court). In my opinion in this period of the survival of the very base of HINDUIsm in India - we should be ASHAMED OF FIGHTING LIKE THIS. wHAT WE ARE LEAVING TO THE POSTERITY IS hatred, hatred AND HATRED ONLY INSTEAD OF THE PERINIAL PHILOSOPHIES AND Divya prabhandams. It is high time we ALL realise and rise to the level from where WE can all make a GLORIOUS religion - Hinduism. Adiyen, dasan vsr V.S. Rangachar--- On Fri, 2/1/09, आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote: आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali )naranann (AT) (DOT) in, "Ponnappan" <Oppiliappan>, , "divya desam" <>, "Swami" <>, "Ramanuja and desika " <RamanujaandDesika>Friday, 2 January, 2009, 5:07 PM ---------- Forwarded message ----------आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 11:50 AMFwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali )naranann (AT) (DOT) . in ---------- Forwarded message ----------आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:53 AMFwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali )vishnurdn (AT) (DOT) co.in, kidambi seshadri <krseshadri84@ gmail.com>, "sailesh.... . .... joined in srm" <saileshrjn (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, Veeraraghavan <radharaghu (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, Balakrishnan ramanuaj Dasan <alwarbalan2008@ gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ----------आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:50 AMTotal Mails.....(vadakali )vishnurdn (AT) (DOT) co.in, Veeraraghavan <radharaghu (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, "sailesh.... . .... joined in srm" <saileshrjn (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, kidambi seshadri <krseshadri84@ gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ----------swamidesikadasan <swamidesikadasan@ gmail.com>Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 8:24 PMRe:sailesh rajan <saileshrjn (AT) gmail (DOT) com>,Adisesh Iyengar<adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Dear all, There are many proofs that Swami desikan and also Manavala Mamuni are Vadakalai. The first one is the thirumeni at Sri Thiruvahindipuram of Swami desikan is Adorning Vadakalai thiruman.Which was made by Swami desikan himself. Next thatacharirars( periya Tirumalai Nambi),uncle of Sri Bashyakarar are Vadakalai. If u visit Sreeperambuthur the Archa Thirumeni of Sri bashyakarar adorns Vadakalai thiruman. secondly when the Tridandi jyer covered the Vimanam of Sribashyakarar and half of perumal sannidhi they didn't allow media and even Srivaishnavs to take photograph. The vimanam in Sriperambuthur contains Vdakalaithiruman. Once Sriprambuthur was a Vadakalai shrine but was converted to Tekalai around 150 years ago,when the new Embar mutt was started. The temple in Sripreambuthur was taken care by the Sriperambuthur Tirumalia EEchambadi. Thus Vdakalayars built a new Desikan Sannidhi in Sriperambuthur near the Purshkarini. In Sriperambuthur the Chinna Jyer covered the Vimana of Perumal 1/3rd only..... This is so because there are Vadakalai there. Nextly we can talk about Sri Manavala Mamuni and other Tenkaayars. Tenkalayars say that they don't have the caste feelings . They perform Samasrayanam and also include Bagawatargal in Srivaishnava Ghosti. Its wrong, in the Bashyam of Sri periyavachan Pillai(said as Tenkalai) to Amalanadipiran, Sri Vachan pillai clearly states that Thirupannar is a Panchamar and even thought he said Amalan the cast can't be excluded. Thus in Periyavachan Pillai Vyakyanam it is clearly said that they see the differences in Cast but say that all people who perform Samasrayanam are equal. But when u see the Bashyam of Sri Swami Vedanta Desikan, Swami mentions that Thirupannar is a Avadoothi and not a ordinary man.Few tenkalayars say that Swami desikan was consider Pillailokachariar and Periyavachan Pillai as his Acharayn. These information are totally Fake. If they were acharyans then swami desikan would have mention them in his Granthas like Adikara Sangraham and many. Swami desikan had the ideology of Bashyakara and thus he didn't agree with the ideas of Pillailokachariar. Swami desikan had good relationship with All the acharyars at this time. Few fanatics say that Swami had composed stotras on Periyavachan Pillai , if composed can they name it? Only 28 stotras are composed by swami desikan. To say many Tenkalayars( now considering) like Dodachary and Prativaid bayankaram anna had composed many granthas on Swami desikan. Prativadi title was offered to Anna by Nayanachariar( son of Swami desikan) and he had his Samasrayanam done under Swami Nayanachariar . Later he became a sishya of Manavala Mamuni. Dodyachariar who was earlier as Sishyan of Manavala Mamui was influenced by Swai deiskan ideology wrote VedantadesikaPrakas hika. Till now there are Vamsikas of Doddachariar in Nagapattnam. Prativadi anna composed SaptatRatnamalika. Redarding Thayar......There are lot of contravesy between the two Kalayars regarding the matter of Sri. The vadakali sect say that thayar too is Paramatma as lord is. But this Paksham was not accepted by Tenkalayars. On this contraversy Swami desikan had written in his Chattusloki Bashyam regarding the Piratti. All tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan pillai and also Nampillai, Nanjyer, Parasara Bhattar in their EEdu and other Srisookthis tell that thayar is Paramatham. This difference was created after the Grandson of Koil Annan. Then, Tenkalayars condisder Perumal Keupa as Nirhetu Krupa but Vadakalayas say that its Hetu krupa . Hert means reasoned. Thus acoording to the TK point of view , when Perumal is Nirhetukrupi, Why cant he shower his Krupa on all Jeevatmas and make them all Srivaishnavs and give moksham? If thayar is not given importance in Tenkalai Sampraday then, They must nor adorn Srichoorna, Then must not be called as Srivaishnavas. As Tenkalaayars don't Sanskrit ,they take wrong meanings of Sri Desikan Granthas and others.Regarding SaranagathiTenkalayars say that Prapati is the only way which leads moksha and the other ways like Gnana,karma and Bakthi willn't lead to Moksham. But we say that all the 4 ways lead to Moksham but Prapatti is a very easy form to Moksha. To Tenkalai Fanatics: If bakthi,Gnana and Karma yogams will not lead to Moksham then how did Prahaladhan, Bishmar and many rishis went to Moksham.Regarding Thiruman The old and Prachina Thiruman is the U or Vadakalai Thiruman. Pancharatra Agama states that "Arabhya Nasika Mulam: nasika mulam arabhya: nasadikesa payantam anasamularabhya" which means that the Urdhva Pundram must start between the two eyebrows and end at the Kesham(hair) . It is clear that the Tenkalai thiruman is a new form because the Tenkalayars adorn different thirumans at different places. Ex: Y thiruman at face and Tamil PAA similar to U thiruman in the body. So the tenkalai thiruman was derived frm the Vadakali (already mentioned that Bashyakarar was Vadakali).IF there were two thirumans at the Time of Swami desikan than, swmai would have mentioned inhis grantha named Saccaritra raksha. Few tenkalayars say that there are thirumans(tenkalai) in many Stambams and Moolavars in Karnataka. In those around 1600-1700 many temples were rennovated,in karnataka,due to Mughal Invasion. During the rennovation the Moolavars and utsavars were replaced with Thiruman. Actually to say in Silpa Sastram or in any Puranama there are no reference to any thiruman. But the Tenkalayars say that Tenkalai thiruman was the first. There are many evidences of Vadakalai thiruman in many countirs like Egypt,Greece. The photos of these places are available at the website of Stephan Knapp. There are many Vadakali Thirumans in Kanchipuram, Srirangam, Tirumalai, and amny Divyadesam but they were destroyed by the Tenkalayars. At present there are few Thiruman in Tirupati and Kanchipuram. The Ramanujar at Tirumalai was a Vadakalai sannidhi the name itsef Signifies that it belongs to Vadakalai (bashyakarar) but was undertake by Tenkalayars.Regarding Thaniyan There are two Thaniyans for Swami desikan in Sanskrit and one Tamil Thaniyan composed by Sri Pillailokachary( tenkalai head)The thaniyans are "Sreeman Venkatanatharyaha Kavitharkika Kesari Vedanthacharya Varyome Sannidhattam Sadahrudhim " & "Ramanuja Dayapatram Gnana Vairagya BushanamSreemath Venkatanatharyaham Vande Vedanta Desikam" These two thaniyans were composed by Sri Nayanachariar( swami's Son) and Brahmatantrar swami. Manavalamamunigal has a sanskrit Thaniyan "Sreesailesha Dayapatram Deepatyadi Gunarnavam Yetinda Pravanam Vandhe Ramyaja Mataram Munim" This thaniyan was composed by sri narayan Jyer one of the sishyas of Manavala Mamunigal and it was mentioned in VARAVARAMUNI SHATAKAM by Yerumbiappa. But the present Tenkalayars say that the Thaniyan was supposed to be recited by Lord Ranganatha Itself. There are many stories like, When Sriranganathan came as a small boy and recited Thaniyan for Manavala Mamuni, the bagawats in Ghosti asked for Thirunal Pattu to by said by the boy. Then this itself signifies that there was Thirunal Pathhu for some other Acharayar, that is none other than Swami Deiskan.Another Avatara OF RamanuajarThere are many stories like Manavala Mamuni was the avatara of Ramanuajar. This is one of the lies told by tenkalayars. It is said that Sri BAshyakarar didn't warite and spread the essence of Divya PRabandham . Thus he took another avatara as Manavala Mamuni. There are also other stories like Sriman Narayanana granted 200 years of life span for Adiseshan and asked him to take avatar as Ramanujar and as Ramanmujar lived for only 120 years he took another avatara as Manavala Mamuni(swami survived for 73years only). The 120+73=193. Then what about 7 years? Then did Adiseshan took another avatara for 7 years? Then Vadakalayars can clearly say that Swmai desikan was the amasam of Sri Bashyakarar . Swmai desiakn had authored many Granthas liek Munivahanaboham, Madurakavi Hridayam,Dravidopan ishad Saram,etc., on Divya Prabandham in Sanskrit and Tamil. Swami Bashyakarara lived as a Sanyasi most of his life. Thus Swami desikan was born as a Amsam of Sri Bashyakarara to explain how a Srivaishnavan must lead a life as Grihastan. Swami desikan had written Vyakyanams for Thiruvoimozhi in Sanskrit. Swami desikan wrote 73,000 padi but it was lost due to carelessness. And swami desikan had written Many Rakshai's for Pancharatra Agama,Srivaishanva Sampraday and many. So swami Desikan is the Amsam of Sri Bashyakarar. About Manavala Mamuni Manavala Mamunigal had his Sribashya Kalakshebam done under the Grandson of Kidambi Appular(a Vadakalate) and aslo he took his Preksha Mantram or Sanyasam under the 1st Azhagiyasingar of Sri Ahobila Mutt(a Vadakala MUtt). Many say that the Ahobila Mutt itself was a Tenkalai Mutt . There are no PRooves for their Paksham. And also The 6th Azhagiyasingar of Ahobila Mutt had written many comentires on Swami Desikan Granthas especially Sankalpa Suryodhayam. Tenkalayars mainly consider Ahobila MUtt as tenkalai because if Ahobila mutt is Vadakalai then Manavalamamuni will be Vadakalai. 1st Azhagiyasingar was born on 1378 and Manavalamamuni on 1370. There may be a age difference but 1st Azhagiyasingar got Sanyashasram from Narasimhan at a young age of 20. Thus frm him got sanyashram Manavalamamuni. The Chinna Jyer of Andhara recently appointed a new Jyer called Ahobila Jyer to suppress the Ahobila Mutt activities. The Chinna Jyer of andhara has been giving Sanyashasam like SSLC ceritificate to all. His mutt which was started by his Grandpa was a new mutt which was established in late 1950's.FEw tenkalayars say that Manavalamamuni didn't take Sanyasam as Manavala Mamuni took Sanyasam from Satakopa jyer and not Adivan Satakopa Jyer. In our Srivaishnava Sampraday Ahobila Mutt is the only Muttt which bears the name Van Satakopan or Satakopan for its Peetadipathi . After giving Sanyashasramam to Manavala Mamuni Satakopa Jyer or Adivan Satakopa Jyer was titled the name Adi van by Nammalwar itself and Nammalwar gave his Hamsa Mudrai to 1st Azhagiyasingar. Even today in Alwar Thirunagari Alwar Brahmotsavam Ahobila Mutt obtains 1st three Days Mariyadhai.Anyone who wants to have the Darshan of Hamsa Mudrai of Nammalwar can see them in Ahobila Mutt Aradhan Mundapam.In the year 1730-1759 Swami desikan Thaniyans in many places were replace by the above thaniyan of Manavala Mamuni. EX: Even thousg the temple of meloke is Tenkalai(converted) the sattumurai vazhi thirunamam is recited for Swami desikan only. This was by the Order of Narasimha Udayar of Mysore that they shuldn't replace the thaniyan of Swami desikan with Manaval Mamuni.Even today though the temple of Melkote and Thirunarayanapuram are Tenkalai Parakala Mutt Swami obtains first MAridhai and aslo the Thaniyan and Vazhi Thirunamam of Swmai desikan is recited daily. As per the Kalvettu of Srirangam Swami Desikan's thaniyan was recited in the Temple and houses of Srirangam as swami Desikan restarted the Adhyayana Utsavam. Few Tenkalayars say that why there are two Thaniyans for Swmai desikan? There must be only one Taniyan. Then the answer is AnantanPillai of Tirumalai also had two Thanyians . To say even Manavalamamuni had two Thaniyas but the earlier was rejected and a new starting with Srisailesa Daapatram was accepted. Is this what Manavala Mamuni or ther Tenkalai Acharayr wants? When we consider Tirumala Parakala Mutt was the Darmadatta Mutt but after the advent of Chinna Jyer Mutt in Tirumala all the powers were Trasferred to Tenkalai,which is mentioned in Tirumalai Vozhagu. The Desikan Thaniyan and Vazhithirunamam were recited in Tirumala till 1910's but was stopped by the Tenkalai Mutt. In Tirupati Swami desikan had Thiruvadi Thozhudal of Govindarajan but the tenkalayars who were jelous stoped this Utsava toooo...... There are many Simhasanadipatis like Kandadai,Tirumalai Nallan Chakravarthi, Tirumalai EEchambadi,Tholapac hariar,Tholappar ,Thatachariar, Anantalvan, Illayavillai, Kidambi,Assuri, Veeravilli, etc..., in Vadakali. The Acharyars like Periyanambi, Parasarabattar and others in Sriranga were compelled and converted to Tenkalai. Actually the 74 Simhasanadipadis doesn't have Manavalamamuni but today Acharyars like Parasara Bhattar , Periya Nambi,Tirumalai Anantanpillai, and otheres were compelled to accept Manavalamamuni as acharyan.The thaniyans and also Vazhithirunamam of Manavala Mamuni was a copy of Swami Desikan's.In the vazhi thirunamam of Manavala Mamuni it is said that MANAVALAMAMUNIYE INNUM ORU NOOTRANDU IRUM. What does this mean when ever a man had completed 100 years it is correct to say that innum oru nootrandu irum. But Manavala Mamuni lived only for 73 years.So it is clear that the Tenkalayars must say MANAVALAMAMUNIYE INNUM ORU YEZHUBATHI IRANDU ORU ANDU IRUM . So its clear that Tenkalayars coppied the Vazhithirunamam of Swami Desikan. Then in the Tirumala Oriental Collage all the Granthas of Poorvachariars were collected at that time they found that in the Srisookthies of Manavala MAmuni it is found that another Thaniyans by Appilar was used ex:Yetiraja Saptati. So frm this it is clear that the Tenkalayars had created a new Srivaishnava Sect an copied the matter frm Vadakali Sampradyam.In Upadesaratnamala too Swami Manavalamamuni followed the method of swami desikan's Prabandhasaram and to say the Pasurams are similar to Prabandhasaram and Adhikara Sangraham. We are not Manavala Mamuni Dooshkas but we are condemn him iam tell the facts abt our Sampraday ans not to hurt anybody..... ... Regarding Prabandham . Here onwards i want to tell that Swami Manavalamanuni followed both the footpaths of Swami desikan and Pillai Lokachariar. Tenkalai fanatics say that alwars themself had composed 4000 Divya Prabandham and Ramanuja Nootrandadi is not included in it because Swami desikan in his Prabandha Saram had included Ramanuja Nootrandadi in 4000 Divya PRabandham. IS this the ACHARYA BAKTHI SHOWN BY TENKALAYARS TO SRI RAMANUJAR? Actually 4000 DP composed by alwars contain 3892 pasurams and this was rounded to 4000 and was called Naalaiyira Divya Prabandham PRE Bashyakarar period.. After composing the Iramanuja Nootrandadi Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar handed over this Prabandham to Bashyakarar. But bashyakarar was angry because it was composed on him. Bashyakara sishyas pleaded him and finally Bashyakarar said that this Prabandham must be recited after the 4000 Divya Prabandham(beacuse it contains information about Bashyakarar Acharyars) . Thus Ramanuja Nootandadi Was added to 4000 DP . More over the sum 3892+108=4000 was also Suitable to say Naaliyira Divya Prabandham. Thus Sri Swami Desikan included in his Prabandha Saaram included Ramanuja Notrandadi as a part of Divya Prabandham (in Iyerpa, last 1000) . But Swami Desikan Dweshi's didn't agree this Paksham as the Prabandham was composed by Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar ,then he too is a Alwar. The answer for this question is "Even thought the Prabandham was composed by Amudanar , it was in Praise of Sri Bashyakarar. " This was mentioned not only by Swami desikan but also by Sri manavala Mamunni in his Upadesa Ratnamala. Manavala Mamuni had composed Upadesa Ratnamala by following Swami desikan Prabandham like Adikara Sangraham,Prabandha Saram. Pasurams like "Poigai muni boodathar Peyalwar.... ........" were used in Upadesaratnamala. Swami Manavalamamuni had mentioned the birth month of each alwar but finally he mentions MaduraKavigal, Andal and Bashyakarar. Then according to Nakshatram MadurakaviAlwar must come after Ramanjar , but is not in that order. So, Manavala Mamuni had composed the Pasuram like the the "matha Pitha Yuvatayas" of Parasara Bhattar in which Parasara Bhatter describes all alwars as angam of Nammalwar,so he mentions Nammalwar lastly. Similarly Manava Mamuni had mentioned Bashyakarar at last and then he starts Nathamuni(Pasuram 37-38 in Upadesa Ratnamalai). This itself Signifies that Manavala Mamuni had also accepted the same order as sri Desikan did.. Even Tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan Pilli folowed the order of Adding RAMANUJA NOOTRANDADI to 4000 DIVYA PRABANDHAM.Thus the present Tenkalayars had altered Divya Prabandham so that they can have many divisions mentioned like Ashtadasa Bedahah....18 Differences. . There are differences even in Perialwar Thirumozhi. Vadakalayars consider Perialwar thirumozhi which consists even Thirupallandu in it . But the Tenkalayars had divided Perialwar Thirumozhi into two divisions , Thirupallanu and Perialawar Thirumozhi. As per Tenkalai Sampradaya ONNAM PATHU of PErialwar Thirumozhi have 90 Pasurams only as thirupallandu was seperated from it. Actually Pathu means 10*10 i.e, a total of 100 Pasurams in One pathu. But the 1st pathu according to Tenkalayars contain 90 Pasurams only.Thus the Tenkalayars even divided the Divya Prabandham as they wish. Above, i had mentioned few facts and prooves that Ahobila Mutt was,is and will be Vadakalai. Here Iam adding few more facts. Recently The Chinna Jyer of Andhra had given a Sanyasam Degree to a new IAS officer and named him as Ahobila Ramanuja jyer. This is because they want a Tenklai Ahobila Mutt. Then we Vadakalayars must ask for A Vadakalai Periya Jyer Mutt in Tirupati as 31st and 32nd Jyer in Periya Jyer Mutt were Vadakalai.Why cant the previous Jyer choose a Tenkalai Jyer as as successer? R there no Tenkalayars sutiable to that post except Vadakalayars? SO we Vadakalayars too must ask for a Vadakali Periya Jyer Mutt.Even So the Chinna Jyer of Andhra must stop doing these Tenkalai Pracharam and must develop Ramanuja Sampraday.Being a Srivaishnava Sanyasi how can he rennovate Siva temples and other Demi Gods temples? Is this waht mention in Ramanja Sampradaya or Tenkalai Sampraday? As said by Manavala Mamuni one must selest a acharyan who has high Gnanam and Anustanam thus a sihsyan will get a good guidance.But most of the Tenkalai Acharayars nowadasays doesn't have Anustanam . Only few are folowinf the words of Manavala MAmuni(said as Tenkalai acharayar) . Many Tenklayars have the opinion that Vadakalayars don't give much importance to Divya Prabandham and they neglect it. ITs totally false. Swami deiskan Had written many Granthas on Prandham like Munivahana Boham,Prabanda Saram,73,000 padi on DP(which was lost) , Dravidopanishad, etcc., Swami Deiskan consider Vedam and Divya Prabandham as two eyes . Without an eye we cant see Perumal. As Vedic religion we must for Vedam and Divya Prabandham is for our Atma Ujeevanam. But most Tenkalayars neglect Vedam . Sri BAshyakarar during his last days told 5 main sentences. 1st sentence is that "Learn Sri BAshyam and Preach it to others" 2nd is to Learn "Bagawat Vishyam and preach it to others"... And the other sentenses continues... .But swami Desikan followed the 1st sentece of Sri BAshyakara and lead his life. But the Tenkalayars don;t know this and asay that Swami DEsikan had neglected Divya Prabandham. Since that give To Sri Bashyam and Vedas.... Prabandham is for Atma Ujeevanam... .....Thus Vadakalai Sampradaya is oldest and Tenkalai was a division from Vadakali. Regarding Chinna Jyer of Andhra The Tridandi Jyer had converted many sishyas of Swayamacharayars and various Mutt into his sishyas. We srivaishnavas must save those who had converted or had their samasrayanam done under him. If a Acharayan is not qualified , then the Sishyan can chabge his acharayan which is mentioned in Pillailokacharirar Ashtadasa Rahasyam. So we srivaishnavas must save people from the clutches of a A Vaishnavan. He must stop Tenakali Prachara and work for Ramanuaja Darshanam.He had converted sishyas of Many Vadakali Acharyas in Andhra like Vasudevachari, etc...,Acording to Our Dhram Shastra no one must cross the ocean. Whenever they do this they are not allowed to enter the temples.But the Tridandi had gone to countires like Australia,America, etc..., Is this what said in Dharam Sastra?There are few sishyas of This Chinna Jyer saying that he is another avatara of Ramaujar. Then did Ramaujar Worshiped or went to demi god temples? 4 times Sastnaga Namaskaram Different SampradhAyins prostrate beforethe Lord once , twice or four times .In Vadakalai SampradhAyam , it is done four times .One can use Yukti Vaadhams and point out thefour NamaskaraNams are for the four directions or for the four hands of the Lord holding the disc ,the conch , the abhaya Mudhra and the Lotus or Gadhai. One can also view it as salutations to the Four vyUhams etc. There is however more doctrinal reasons based on AchAryA's teachings . Let us look at them now : Both Swamy AlavanthAr in His StOtra Ratna slOkam and Swamy Desikan elsewhere has given the reasons for the 4 NamaskArams as Svaroopa Sodhanams . When we are visiting a Temple of Sriman NarayaNan , one prostrates ( ShAshtAnga NamaskArams) before the Bali Peetam and then enter the temple .The First NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of the Lord's Paratvam ( Superiority as ParadEvathai) . The second NamaskAram is to comfort ourselves with His Soulabhya guNam ( ease of access inspite of His Paratvam) of the Lord . The Third namaskAram is to remind ourselves of His Praapyatvam ( Being the ultimate goal , PradhAna PurushArtham ) . The Fourth NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of His SaraNyatvam or His staying as the SarvalOka SaraNyan and Sarva Rakshakan . When one does the 4 NamaskArams this way , one's ego is pushed aside and one approaches the Lord's sannidhi with the right attitude and Jn~Anam . We prostrate 4 times before AchAryan ,Parents and elder Persons . One can explain this with the Veda PramANam of AchArya DevO Bhava et al . The alternate four reaons for NamaskAram in PerumAL Sannidhi based on Swamy AlavanthAr's stOtra Ratna slOkam and PeriyaVaacchAn PiLLai's commentary is summed up in my 2005 posting in Sriranga Sri archives (Volume I) and Oppiliappan archives ( Part II ) : http://www.ibiblio. org/sripedia/ / archives/apr05/msg00071. html and http://www.. ibiblio. org/oppiliappan/ archives/ apr05/msg00015. html The two folded palms in the AshtAnga NamaskAram have their own significance , The right palm of the devotee is said to represent the lotus feet of the Lord and the left palm , the head of the devotee. Desikan Dooshakargal Prativadi Bayankaram ANnan in his Saptati Ratnamalika quotes that "गà¥à¤°à¥‚व वधी हमà¥à¤¸à¤® à¤à¥à¤¦à¤¾à¤šà¤¾à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ सिषà¥à¤¯ जना बकती हीना येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ शà¥à¤¯à¥à¤¹à¥ :|येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ विषà¥à¤£à¥ कारà¥à¤¨à¥à¤¯ ढूरà¥à¤¹à¤¾: कà¥à¤¤à¥‹ मà¥à¤•à¥à¤¤à¤¿ वारà¥à¤¤à¤¾ हि तादà¥à¤° विधानाम || " which means when anybody talks bad about Swami desikan, then he will be disliked by Yetindra(Bashyakara r) and this leads to Vishnu KArunya Dhoorahah(loss of Vishnu Karunyam) and Lord will not grant Moksha for them. These slokas were written by sri Prativadi Bayankaram Annan(now Tenkalai Achayan) . So Tenkalayars must know this slokas and must not talk bad about swmai deiskan and his Granthas.Courtesy: PrabandhaSara Vaibhavam Get perfect Email ID for your Resume. Get before others grab. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 Dear Sriman Sevel Krishnan, Please note that caste has nothing to do with one being a Vaishnavite. Krishna himself was not a Brahmin, so also was Rama. Many Alwars were not Brahmins. In the Bhagavadgita, Lord did not make any caste requirement for moksham (Please see the last 4 verses of Chapter 9  as well as Charama Shlokam). It is inevitable, every one has to work. Caste is a matter of one's inborn professional aptitude. It is not dependent, but often influenced by one's parents and upbringing. dAsan KST Krishnan Sevel Venkataraman <krishnan1940 Cc: naranann; oppiliappan ; ; ; ramanujaanddesika Sun, 4 Jan 2009 11:51 pm RE: Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali) Dear Swamin  adiyen Sevel Krishnan would like to make the following suggestions:  Let us be proud at the outset that we are born as Brahmins and that too as Vaishnavit.  I do not know far it is true- I am told that to born as a vaishnavit, you sho uld have born as a brahmin in your last birth and because of your good deeds, you have born now as a Vaishnavit.  If the above is accepted, why should we worry about whether we belongs to thenkalai or vadakalai cult. Our Narayanan is the supreme deity and those who believe in it, should not even think of any differences among these two cults. If my observation is wrong, please enlighten me further. Our younger generation are not aware of these differences and by discussing trhese differences, we are taking a big risk in their belief in Vaishavism SEVEL KRISHNAN 18 Thiruvengadam Street Extensions East Raja Annamalaipuram Chennai 600028 Landline 24617660 mobile 99400 95670 CC: naranann; Oppiliappan ; ; ; RamanujaandDesika sridharyaamunan Sat, 3 Jan 2009 10:04:39 +0400 Re: Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali) Dear swamin Adiyean Sridhar There are no thenkalai fanatics. Lot of thankalayars worship Swami desikan also. Can you please hear some upanyasams of SRI U.VE. VELLUKUDI KRISHNAN SWAMI. Adiyean Ramanuja dasan sridhar On 1/2/09, आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 > wrote: > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 > > Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 11:50 AM > Fwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali) > naranann (AT) (DOT) in > > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 > > Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:53 AM > Fwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali) > vishnurdn (AT) (DOT) co.in, kidambi seshadri <krseshadri84 >, > "sailesh......... joined in srm" <saileshrjn >, Veeraraghavan < > radharaghu >, Balakrishnan ramanuaj Dasan <alwarbalan2008 >> > > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 > > Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:50 AM > Total Mails.....(vadakali) > vishnurdn (AT) (DOT) co.in, Veeraraghavan <radharaghu >, > "sailesh......... joined in srm" <saileshrjn >, kidambi seshadri < > krseshadri84 > > > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > *swamidesikadasan* <swamidesikadasan > > Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 8:24 PM > Re: > sailesh rajan <saileshrjn >,Adisesh Iyengar<adisesh92 >> > > > Dear all, > > There are many proofs that Swami desikan and also Manavala > Mamuni are Vadakalai. The first one is the thirumeni at Sri > Thiruvahindipuram of Swami desikan is Adorning Vadakalai thiruman.Which was > made by Swami desikan himself. > > Next thatacharirars(periya Tirumalai Nambi),uncle of Sri Bashyakarar are > Vadakalai. If u visit Sreeperambuthur the Archa Thirumeni of Sri bashyakarar > adorns Vadakalai thiruman. secondly when the Tridandi jyer covered the > Vimanam of Sribashyakarar and half of perumal sannidhi they didn't allow > media and even Srivaishnavs to take photograph. The vimanam in > Sriperambuthur contains Vdakalaithiruman. Once Sriprambuthur was a Vadakalai > shrine but was converted to Tekalai around 150 years ago,when the new Embar > mutt was started. The temple in Sripreambuthur was taken care by the > Sriperambuthur Tirumalia EEchambadi. Thus Vdakalayars built a new Desikan > Sannidhi in Sriperambuthur near the Purshkarini.In Sriperambuthur the Chinna > Jyer covered the Vimana of Perumal 1/3rd only..... This is so because there > are Vadakalai there. > > Nextly we can talk about Sri Manavala Mamuni and other Tenkaayars. > Tenkalayars say that they don't have the caste feelings . They perform > Samasrayanam and also include Bagawatargal in Srivaishnava Ghosti. Its > wrong, in the Bashyam of Sri periyavachan Pillai(said as Tenkalai) to > Amalanadipiran, Sri Vachan pillai clearly states that Thirupannar is a > Panchamar and even thought he said Amalan the cast can't be excluded. Thus > in Periyavachan Pillai V yakyanam it is clearly said that they see the > differences in Cast but say that all people who perform Samasrayanam are > equal. But when u see the Bashyam of Sri Swami Vedanta Desikan, Swami > mentions that Thirupannar is a Avadoothi and not a ordinary man.Few > tenkalayars say that Swami desikan was consider Pillailokachariar and > Periyavachan Pillai as his Acharayn. These information are totally Fake. If > they were acharyans then swami desikan would have mention them in his > Granthas like Adikara Sangraham and many. Swami desikan had the ideology of > Bashyakara and thus he didn't agree with the ideas of Pillailokachariar. > Swami desikan had good relationship with All the acharyars at this time. Few > fanatics say that Swami had composed stotras on Periyavachan Pillai , if > composed can they name it? Only 28 stotras are composed by swami desikan. To > say many Tenkalayars(now considering) like Dodachary and Prativaid > bayankaram anna had composed many granthas on Swami desikan. Prativadi title > was offered to Anna by Nayanachariar(son of Swami desikan) and he had his > Samasrayanam done under Swami Nayanachariar . Later he became a sishya of > Manavala Mamuni. Dodyachariar who was earlier as Sishyan of Manavala Mamui > was influenced by Swai deiskan ideology wrote VedantadesikaPrakashika. Till > now there are Vamsikas of Doddachariar in Nagapattnam. Prativadi anna > composed SaptatRatnamalika. > > *Redarding Thayar...... > > *There are lot of contravesy between the two Kalayars regarding the matter > of Sri. The vadakali sect say that thayar too is Paramatma as lord is. But > this Paksham was not accepted by Tenkalayars.On this contraversy Swami > desikan had written in his Chattusloki Bashyam regarding the Piratti. All > tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan pillai and also Nampillai, Nanjyer, > Parasara Bhattar in their EEdu and other Srisookthis tell that thayar is > Paramatham. This difference was created after the Grandson of Koil Annan. > Then, Tenkalayars condisder Perumal Keupa as *Nirhetu Krupa* but Vadakalayas > say that its Hetu krupa . Hert means reasoned. Thus acoording to the TK > point of view , when Perumal is Nirhetukrupi, Why cant he shower his Krupa > on all Jeevatmas and make them all Srivaishnavs and give moksham? If thayar > is not given importance in Tenkalai Sampraday then, They must nor adorn > Srichoorna, Then must not be called as Srivaishnavas.As Tenkalaayars don't > Sanskrit ,they take wrong meanings of Sri Desikan Granthas and others. > > *Regarding Saranagathi* > > Tenkalayars say that Prapati is the only way which leads moksha and the > other ways like Gnana,karma and Bakthi willn't lead to Moksham. But we say > that all the 4 ways lead to Moksham but Prapatti is a very easy form to > Moksha. To Tenkalai Fanatics: If bakthi,Gnana and Karma yogams will not lead > to Moksham then how did Prahaladhan,Bishmar and many ri shis went to Moksham. > > *Regarding Thiruman* > > The old and Prachina Thiruman is the U or Vadakalai Thiruman. Pancharatra > Agama states that "Arabhya Nasika Mulam: nasika mulam arabhya: nasadikesa > payantam anasamularabhya" which means that the Urdhva Pundram must start > between the two eyebrows and end at the Kesham(hair). *It is clear that the > Tenkalai thiruman is a new form because the Tenkalayars adorn different > thirumans at different places. Ex: Y thiruman at face and Tamil PAA similar > to U thiruman in the body. *So the tenkalai thiruman was derived frm the > Vadakali (already mentioned that Bashyakarar was Vadakali).IF there were two > thirumans at the Time of Swami desikan than, swmai would have mentioned > inhis grantha named Saccaritra raksha. Few tenkalayars say that there are > thirumans(tenkalai) in many Stambams and Moolavars in Karnataka. In those > around 1600-1700 many temples were rennovated,in karnataka,due to Mughal > Invasion. During the rennovation the Moolavars and utsavars were replaced > with Thiruman. Actually to say in Silpa Sastram or in any Puranama there are > no reference to any thiruman. But the Tenkalayars say that Tenkalai thiruman > was the first. There are many evidences of Vadakalai thiruman in many > countirs like Egypt,Greece. The photos of these places are available at the > website of Stephan Knapp. There are many Vadakali Thirumans in > Kanchipuram,Srirangam,Tirumalai,and amny Divyadesam b ut they were destroyed > by the Tenkalayars. At present there are few Thiruman in Tirupati and > Kanchipuram. The Ramanujar at Tirumalai was a Vadakalai sannidhi the name > itsef Signifies that it belongs to Vadakalai (bashyakarar) but was undertake > by Tenkalayars. > > *Regarding Thaniyan* > > There are two Thaniyans for Swami desikan in Sanskrit and one Tamil Thaniyan > composed by Sri Pillailokachary(tenkalai head) > > The thaniyans are *"Sreeman Venkatanatharyaha Kavitharkika Kesari * > *Vedanthacharya Varyome Sannidhattam Sadahrudhim " > * & * > "Ramanuja Dayapatram Gnana Vairagya Bushanam > Sreemath Venkatanatharyaham Vande Vedanta Desikam"* > These two thaniyans were composed by Sri Nayanachariar(swami's Son) and > Brahmatantrar swami. > > Manavalamamunigal has a sanskrit Thaniyan > > *"Sreesailesha Dayapatram Deepatyadi Gunarnavam > Yetinda Pravanam Vandhe Ramyaja Mataram Munim"* > This thaniyan was composed by sri narayan Jyer one of the sishyas of > Manavala Mamunigal and it was mentioned in VARAVARAMUNI SHATAKAM by > Yerumbiappa. But the present Tenkalayars say that the Thaniyan was supposed > to be recited by Lord Ranganatha Itself. There are many stories like, When > Sriranganathan came as a small boy and recited Thaniyan for Manavala Mamuni, > the bagawats in Ghosti asked for Thirunal Pattu to by said by the boy. Then > this itself signifies that there was Thirunal Pathhu for some other > Acharayar, that is none othe r than Swami Deiskan. > * > Another Avatara OF Ramanuajar* > > There are many stories like Manavala Mamuni was the avatara of Ramanuajar. > This is one of the lies told by tenkalayars. It is said that Sri BAshyakarar > didn't warite and spread the essence of Divya PRabandham . Thus he took > another avatara as Manavala Mamuni. There are also other stories like Sriman > Narayanana granted 200 years of life span for Adiseshan and asked him to > take avatar as Ramanujar and as Ramanmujar lived for only 120 years he took > another avatara as Manavala Mamuni(swami survived for 73years only). The > 120+73=193. Then what about 7 years? Then did Adiseshan took another avatara > for 7 years? > > Then Vadakalayars can clearly say that Swmai desikan was the amasam of Sri > Bashyakarar . Swmai desiakn had authored many Granthas liek Munivahanaboham, > Madurakavi Hridayam,Dravidopanishad Saram,etc., on Divya Prabandham in > Sanskrit and Tamil. Swami Bashyakarara lived as a Sanyasi most of his life. > Thus Swami desikan was born as a Amsam of Sri Bashyakarara to explain how a > Srivaishnavan must lead a life as Grihastan. Swami desikan had written > Vyakyanams for Thiruvoimozhi in Sanskrit. Swami desikan wrote 73,000 padi > but it was lost due to carelessness. And swami desikan had written Many > Rakshai's for Pancharatra Agama,Srivaishanva Sampraday and many. So swami > Desikan is the Amsam of Sri Bashyakarar. > > *About Manavala Mam uni* > > Manavala Mamunigal had his Sribashya Kalakshebam done under the Grandson of > Kidambi Appular(a Vadakalate) and aslo he took his Preksha Mantram or > Sanyasam under the 1st Azhagiyasingar of Sri Ahobila Mutt(a Vadakala MUtt). > Many say that the Ahobila Mutt itself was a Tenkalai Mutt . There are no > PRooves for their Paksham. And also The 6th Azhagiyasingar of Ahobila Mutt > had written many comentires on Swami Desikan Granthas especially Sankalpa > Suryodhayam. Tenkalayars mainly consider Ahobila MUtt as tenkalai because if > Ahobila mutt is Vadakalai then Manavalamamuni will be Vadakalai. 1st > Azhagiyasingar was born on 1378 and Manavalamamuni on 1370. There may be a > age difference but 1st Azhagiyasingar got Sanyashasram from Narasimhan at a > young age of 20. Thus frm him got sanyashram Manavalamamuni.The Chinna Jyer > of Andhara recently appointed a new Jyer called Ahobila Jyer to suppress the > Ahobila Mutt activities. The Chinna Jyer of andhara has been giving > Sanyashasam like SSLC ceritificate to all. His mutt which was started by his > Grandpa was a new mutt which was established in late 1950's.FEw tenkalayars > say that Manavalamamuni didn't take Sanyasam as Manavala Mamuni took > Sanyasam from Satakopa jyer and not Adivan Satakopa Jyer. In our > Srivaishnava Sampraday Ahobila Mutt is the only Muttt which bears the name > Van Satakopan or Satakopan for its Peetadipathi . After giving > Sanyashasramam to Manavala Mamuni Sa takopa Jyer or Adivan Satakopa Jyer was > titled the name Adi van by Nammalwar itself and Nammalwar gave his Hamsa > Mudrai to 1st Azhagiyasingar. Even today in Alwar Thirunagari Alwar > Brahmotsavam Ahobila Mutt obtains 1st three Days Mariyadhai.Anyone who wants > to have the Darshan of Hamsa Mudrai of Nammalwar can see them in Ahobila > Mutt Aradhan Mundapam. > > > In the year 1730-1759 Swami desikan Thaniyans in many places were replace by > the above thaniyan of Manavala Mamuni. EX: Even thousg the temple of meloke > is Tenkalai(converted) the sattumurai vazhi thirunamam is recited for Swami > desikan only. This was by the Order of Narasimha Udayar of Mysore that they > shuldn't replace the thaniyan of Swami desikan with Manaval Mamuni.Even > today though the temple of Melkote and Thirunarayanapuram are Tenkalai > Parakala Mutt Swami obtains first MAridhai and aslo the Thaniyan and Vazhi > Thirunamam of Swmai desikan is recited daily. As per the Kalvettu of > Srirangam Swami Desikan's thaniyan was recited in the Temple and houses of > Srirangam as swami Desikan restarted the Adhyayana Utsavam. Few Tenkalayars > say that why there are two Thaniyans for Swmai desikan? There must be only > one Taniyan. Then the answer is AnantanPillai of Tirumalai also had two > Thanyians . To say even Manavalamamuni had two Thaniyas but the earlier was > rejected and a new starting with Srisailesa Daapatram was accepted. Is this > what Manavala Mamuni or ther Tenkalai Acharayr wants? > > When we consider Tirumala Parakala Mutt was the Darmadatta Mutt but after > the advent of Chinna Jyer Mutt in Tirumala all the powers were Trasferred to > Tenkalai,which is mentioned in Tirumalai Vozhagu. The Desikan Thaniyan and > Vazhithirunamam were recited in Tirumala till 1910's but was stopped by the > Tenkalai Mutt. In Tirupati Swami desikan had Thiruvadi Thozhudal of > Govindarajan but the tenkalayars who were jelous stoped this Utsava > toooo...... > > There are many Simhasanadipatis like Kandadai,Tirumalai Nallan > Chakravarthi,Tirumalai > EEchambadi,Tholapachariar,Tholappar,Thatachariar,Anantalvan,Illayavillai,Kidambi,Assuri,Veeravilli,etc..., > in Vadakali. The Acharyars like Periyanambi,Parasarabattar and others in > Sriranga were compelled and converted to Tenkalai. Actually the 74 > Simhasanadipadis doesn't have Manavalamamuni but today Acharyars like > Parasara Bhattar , Periya Nambi,Tirumalai Anantanpillai,and otheres were > compelled to accept Manavalamamuni as acharyan. > > The thaniyans and also Vazhithirunamam of Manavala Mamuni was a copy of > Swami Desikan's. > > In the vazhi thirunamam of Manavala Mamuni it is said that *MANAVALAMAMUNIYE > INNUM ORU NOOTRANDU IRUM.* What does this mean when ever a man had completed > 100 years it is correct to say that innum oru nootrandu irum. But Manavala > Mamuni lived only for 73 years.So it is clear that the Tenkalayars must say > *MAN AVALAMAMUNIYE INNUM ORU YEZHUBATHI IRANDU ORU ANDU IRUM* . So its clear > that Tenkalayars coppied the Vazhithirunamam of Swami Desikan. > > Then in the Tirumala Oriental Collage all the Granthas of Poorvachariars > were collected at that time they found that in the Srisookthies of Manavala > MAmuni it is found that another Thaniyans by Appilar was used ex:Yetiraja > Saptati. So frm this it is clear that the Tenkalayars had created a new > Srivaishnava Sect an copied the matter frm Vadakali Sampradyam. > > In Upadesaratnamala too Swami Manavalamamuni followed the method of swami > desikan's Prabandhasaram and to say the Pasurams are similar to > Prabandhasaram and Adhikara Sangraham. > > > > We are not Manavala Mamuni Dooshkas but we are condemn him iam tell the > facts abt our Sampraday ans not to hurt anybody........ > > *Regarding Prabandham* > > . Here onwards i want to tell that Swami Manavalamanuni followed > both the footpaths of Swami desikan and Pillai Lokachariar. Tenkalai > fanatics say that alwars themself had composed 4000 Divya Prabandham and > Ramanuja Nootrandadi is not included in it because Swami desikan in his > Prabandha Saram had included Ramanuja Nootrandadi in 4000 Divya PRabandham. > I*S this the ACHARYA BAKTHI SHOWN BY TENKALAYARS TO SRI RAMANUJAR?* Actually > 4000 DP composed by alwars contain 3892 pasurams and this was rounded to > 4000 and was called Naalaiyira Divya Prabandham PRE Bashyakarar per iod. > After composing the Iramanuja Nootrandadi Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar handed > over this Prabandham to Bashyakarar. But bashyakarar was angry because it > was composed on him. Bashyakara sishyas pleaded him and finally Bashyakarar > said that this Prabandham must be recited after the 4000 Divya > Prabandham(beacuse it contains information about Bashyakarar Acharyars) . > Thus Ramanuja Nootandadi Was added to 4000 DP . More over the sum > 3892+108=4000 was also Suitable to say Naaliyira Divya Prabandham. Thus Sri > Swami Desikan included in his Prabandha Saaram included Ramanuja Notrandadi > as a part of Divya Prabandham (in Iyerpa, last 1000) . But Swami Desikan > Dweshi's didn't agree this Paksham as the Prabandham was composed by > Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar ,then he too is a Alwar. The answer for this > question is "Even thought the Prabandham was composed by Amudanar , it was > in Praise of Sri Bashyakarar. " This was mentioned not only by Swami desikan > but also by Sri manavala Mamunni in his Upadesa Ratnamala. Manavala Mamuni > had composed Upadesa Ratnamala by following Swami desikan Prabandham like > Adikara Sangraham,Prabandha Saram. Pasurams like "Poigai muni boodathar > Peyalwar..........." were used in Upadesaratnamala. Swami Manavalamamuni had > mentioned the birth month of each alwar but finally he mentions > MaduraKavigal,Andal and Bashyakarar. Then according to Nakshatram > MadurakaviAlwar must come after Ramanjar , but is not in that order .. So, > Manavala Mamuni had composed the Pasuram like the the "matha Pitha > Yuvatayas" of Parasara Bhattar in which Parasara Bhatter describes all > alwars as angam of Nammalwar,so he mentions Nammalwar lastly. Similarly > Manava Mamuni had mentioned Bashyakarar at last and then he starts > Nathamuni(Pasuram 37-38 in Upadesa Ratnamalai). This itself Signifies that > Manavala Mamuni had also accepted the same order as sri Desikan did.. Even > Tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan Pilli folowed the order of Adding > RAMANUJA NOOTRANDADI to 4000 DIVYA PRABANDHAM. > > > > Thus the present Tenkalayars had altered Divya Prabandham so that they can > have many divisions mentioned like Ashtadasa Bedahah....18 Differences.. > > There are differences even in Perialwar Thirumozhi. Vadakalayars consider > Perialwar thirumozhi which consists even Thirupallandu in it . But the > Tenkalayars had divided Perialwar Thirumozhi into two divisions , > Thirupallanu and Perialawar Thirumozhi. As per Tenkalai Sampradaya ONNAM > PATHU of PErialwar Thirumozhi have 90 Pasurams only as thirupallandu was > seperated from it. Actually Pathu means 10*10 i.e, a total of 100 Pasurams > in One pathu. But the 1st pathu according to Tenkalayars contain 90 Pasurams > only. > > Thus the Tenkalayars even divided the Divya Prabandham as they wish. > > Above, i had mentioned few facts and prooves that Ahobila Mutt was,is and > will be Vadakalai. Here Iam adding few more facts .. Recently The Chinna Jyer > of Andhra had given a Sanyasam Degree to a new IAS officer and named him as > Ahobila Ramanuja jyer. This is because they want a Tenklai Ahobila Mutt. > Then we* Vadakalayars must ask for A Vadakalai Periya Jyer Mutt in Tirupati > as 31st and 32nd Jyer in Periya Jyer Mutt were Vadakalai*.Why cant the > previous Jyer choose a Tenkalai Jyer as as successer? R there no Tenkalayars > sutiable to that post except Vadakalayars? SO we Vadakalayars too must ask > for a Vadakali Periya Jyer Mutt.Even So the Chinna Jyer of Andhra must stop > doing these Tenkalai Pracharam and must develop Ramanuja Sampraday.Being a > Srivaishnava Sanyasi how can he rennovate Siva temples and other Demi Gods > temples? Is this waht mention in Ramanja Sampradaya or Tenkalai Sampraday? > As said by Manavala Mamuni one must selest a acharyan who has high Gnanam > and Anustanam thus a sihsyan will get a good guidance.But most of the > Tenkalai Acharayars nowadasays doesn't have Anustanam . Only few are > folowinf the words of Manavala MAmuni(said as Tenkalai acharayar) . > > > Many Tenklayars have the opinion that Vadakalayars don't give much > importance to Divya Prabandham and they neglect it. ITs totally false. Swami > deiskan Had written many Granthas on Prandham like Munivahana Boham,Prabanda > Saram,73,000 padi on DP(which was lost) , Dravidopanishad,etcc., Swami > Deiskan consider Vedam and Divya Prabandham as two eyes . Without=2 0an eye we > cant see Perumal. As Vedic religion we must for Vedam and Divya Prabandham > is for our Atma Ujeevanam. But most Tenkalayars neglect Vedam . Sri > BAshyakarar during his last days told 5 main sentences. 1st sentence is that > "Learn Sri BAshyam and Preach it to others" 2nd is to Learn "Bagawat Vishyam > and preach it to others"... And the other sentenses continues.... > > But swami Desikan followed the 1st sentece of Sri BAshyakara and lead his > life. But the Tenkalayars don;t know this and asay that Swami DEsikan had > neglected Divya Prabandham. Since that give To Sri Bashyam and Vedas.... > Prabandham is for Atma Ujeevanam........ > > > Thus Vadakalai Sampradaya is oldest and Tenkalai was a division from > Vadakali. > > > *Regarding Chinna Jyer of Andhra* > > The Tridandi Jyer had > converted many sishyas of Swayamacharayars and various Mutt into his > sishyas. We srivaishnavas must save those who had converted or had their > samasrayanam done under him. If a Acharayan is not qualified , then the > Sishyan can chabge his acharayan which is mentioned in Pillailokacharirar > Ashtadasa Rahasyam. So we srivaishnavas must save people from the clutches > of a A Vaishnavan. He must stop Tenakali Prachara and work for Ramanuaja > Darshanam.He had converted sishyas of Many Vadakali Acharyas in Andhra like > Vasudevachari,etc..., > > Acording to Our Dhram Shastra no one must cross the ocean .. Whenever they do > this they are not allowed to enter the temples.But the Tridandi had gone to > countires like Australia,America,etc..., Is this what said in Dharam Sastra? > > There are few sishyas of This Chinna Jyer saying that he is another avatara > of Ramaujar. Then did Ramaujar Worshiped or went to demi god temples? > > > * > 4 times Sastnaga Namaskaram* > > Different SampradhAyins prostrate beforethe Lord once , twice or four times > .In Vadakalai SampradhAyam , it is done four > times .One can use Yukti Vaadhams and point out thefour NamaskaraNams are > for the four directions or for the four hands of the Lord holding the disc > ,the conch , the abhaya Mudhra and the Lotus or Gadhai. One can also view it > as salutations to the Four vyUhams etc. There is however more doctrinal > reasons based on AchAryA's teachings . Let us look at them now : > > Both Swamy AlavanthAr in His StOtra Ratna slOkam and Swamy Desikan elsewhere > has given the reasons for the 4 NamaskArams as Svaroopa Sodhanams . When we > are visiting a Temple of Sriman NarayaNan , one prostrates ( ShAshtAnga > NamaskArams) before the Bali Peetam and then enter the temple .The First > NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of > the Lord's Paratvam ( Superiority as ParadEvathai). The second NamaskAram is > to comfort ourselves > with His Soulabhya guNam ( ease of access inspite of His Paratvam) of the > Lord . >0A> The Third namaskAram is to remind ourselves of His Praapyatvam ( Being the > ultimate goal , PradhAna PurushArtham ) . > > The Fourth NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of His SaraNyatvam or His > staying as the SarvalOka SaraNyan and Sarva Rakshakan . > > When one does the 4 NamaskArams this way , one's ego is pushed aside and one > approaches the Lord's sannidhi with the right attitude and Jn~Anam . > > We prostrate 4 times before AchAryan ,Parents and elder Persons . One can > explain this with the Veda PramANam of AchArya DevO Bhava et al . > > The alternate four reaons for NamaskAram in PerumAL Sannidhi based on Swamy > AlavanthAr's stOtra Ratna slOkam and PeriyaVaacchAn PiLLai's commentary is > summed up in my 2005 posting in Sriranga Sri archives (Volume I) and > Oppiliappan archives ( Part II ) : > > http://www.ibiblio.org/sripedia//archi<http://www.ibiblio.org/sripedia//archives/apr05/msg00071.html> > ves/apr05/msg00071.html > > and > > http://www.ibiblio.org/oppiliappan/archives/apr05/msg00015.html > > The two folded palms in the AshtAnga NamaskAram have their own significance > , The right palm of the devotee is said to represent the lotus feet of the > Lord and the left palm , the head of the devotee. > > > > *Desikan Dooshakargal > * > Prativadi Bayankaram ANnan in his > Saptati Ratnamalika quotes that > *"गà¥à¤°à¥‚व वधी हमà¥à¤¸à¤® à¤à¥à¤¦à¤¾à¤šà¤¾à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ सिषà¥à¤¯ > जना बकती हीना येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ शà¥à¤¯à¥à¤¹à¥ :| > येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ विषà¥à¤£à¥ कारà¥à¤¨à¥à¤¯ ढूरà¥à¤¹à¤¾: > कà¥à¤¤à¥‹ मà¥à¤•à¥à¤¤à¤¿ वारà¥à¤¤à¤¾ हि तादà¥à¤° विधानाम || " > *which means when anybody talks bad about Swami desikan, then he will be > disliked by Yetindra(Bashyakarar) and this leads to Vishnu KArunya > Dhoorahah(loss of Vishnu Karunyam) and Lord will not grant Moksha for them. > > These slokas were written by sri Prativadi Bayankaram Annan(now Tenkalai > Achayan) . So Tenkalayars must know this slokas and must not talk bad about > swmai deiskan20and his Granthas. Courtesy: PrabandhaSara Vaibhavam > -- To Succeed in Life, You need two things: IGNORANCE and CONFIDENCE Get a free MP3 every day with the Spinner.com Toolbar. Get it Now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009  Dear Sri Venkatraman : Thank you for your mail . As an editor of Oppiliappan , Sarnagathi , Malolan and few other groups , I make it a point to reject mailings to my groups relating to outbursts based on Kalai dhvEsham . There are inded differences in the doctrines of two kalais . There is no neeed however to engage in battles to prove who is right or wrong . This is just a waste of time . One can fruitfully send one's time following AchArya and AzhwAr Sri Sookthis and staying close to one's own AchArya Paramparai and KulAchArams . Let us focus on serving our AchAryans , BhagavathAs and the dhivya dampathis and leave the rest out . There is so much to learn and so little time to get closer to even a small portion of the Bhagavad anubhavam housed in the SrI Sookthis of AzhwArs and AchAryans . NamO Sriman NaarAyaNAya , V.Sadagopan ---- Original Message ----- Krishnan Sevel Venkataraman Cc: naranann ; oppiliappan ; ; ; ramanujaanddesika Sunday, January 04, 2009 11:51 PM RE: Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali) Dear Swamin adiyen Sevel Krishnan would like to make the following suggestions: Let us be proud at the outset that we are born as Brahmins and that too as Vaishnavit. I do not know far it is true- I am told that to born as a vaishnavit, you should have born as a brahmin in your last birth and because of your good deeds, you have born now as a Vaishnavit. If the above is accepted, why should we worry about whether we belongs to thenkalai or vadakalai cult. Our Narayanan is the supreme deity and those who believe in it, should not even think of any differences among these two cults.If my observation is wrong, please enlighten me further. Our younger generation are not aware of these differences and by discussing trhese differences, we are taking a big risk in their belief in Vaishavism SEVEL KRISHNAN 18 Thiruvengadam Street Extensions East Raja Annamalaipuram Chennai 600028 Landline 24617660 mobile 99400 95670 CC: naranann; Oppiliappan ; ; ; RamanujaandDesika From: sridharyaamunanDate: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 10:04:39 +0400Re: Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali) Dear swaminAdiyean SridharThere are no thenkalai fanatics. Lot of thankalayars worship Swamidesikan also. Can you please hear some upanyasams of SRI U.VE.VELLUKUDI KRISHNAN SWAMI.AdiyeanRamanuja dasansridharOn 1/2/09, आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 > wrote:> ---------- Forwarded message ----------> आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 >> Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 11:50 AM> Fwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali)> naranann (AT) (DOT) in>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------> आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 >> Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:53 AM> Fwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali)> vishnurdn (AT) (DOT) co.in, kidambi seshadri <krseshadri84 >,> "sailesh......... joined in srm" <saileshrjn >, Veeraraghavan <> radharaghu >, Balakrishnan ramanuaj Dasan <alwarbalan2008 >>>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------> आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 >> Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:50 AM> Total Mails.....(vadakali)> vishnurdn (AT) (DOT) co.in, Veeraraghavan <radharaghu >,> "sailesh......... joined in srm" <saileshrjn >, kidambi seshadri <> krseshadri84 >>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------> *swamidesikadasan* <swamidesikadasan >> Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 8:24 PM> Re:> sailesh rajan <saileshrjn >,Adisesh Iyengar<adisesh92 >>>>> Dear all,>> There are many proofs that Swami desikan and also Manavala> Mamuni are Vadakalai. The first one is the thirumeni at Sri> Thiruvahindipuram of Swami desikan is Adorning Vadakalai thiruman.Which was> made by Swami desikan himself.>> Next thatacharirars(periya Tirumalai Nambi),uncle of Sri Bashyakarar are> Vadakalai. If u visit Sreeperambuthur the Archa Thirumeni of Sri bashyakarar> adorns Vadakalai thiruman. secondly when the Tridandi jyer covered the> Vimanam of Sribashyakarar and half of perumal sannidhi they didn't allow> media and even Srivaishnavs to take photograph. The vimanam in> Sriperambuthur contains Vdakalaithiruman. Once Sriprambuthur was a Vadakalai> shrine but was converted to Tekalai around 150 years ago,when the new Embar> mutt was started. The temple in Sripreambuthur was taken care by the> Sriperambuthur Tirumalia EEchambadi. Thus Vdakalayars built a new Desikan> Sannidhi in Sriperambuthur near the Purshkarini.In Sriperambuthur the Chinna> Jyer covered the Vimana of Perumal 1/3rd only..... This is so because there> are Vadakalai there.>> Nextly we can talk about Sri Manavala Mamuni and other Tenkaayars.> Tenkalayars say that they don't have the caste feelings . They perform> Samasrayanam and also include Bagawatargal in Srivaishnava Ghosti. Its> wrong, in the Bashyam of Sri periyavachan Pillai(said as Tenkalai) to> Amalanadipiran, Sri Vachan pillai clearly states that Thirupannar is a> Panchamar and even thought he said Amalan the cast can't be excluded. Thus> in Periyavachan Pillai Vyakyanam it is clearly said that they see the> differences in Cast but say that all people who perform Samasrayanam are> equal. But when u see the Bashyam of Sri Swami Vedanta Desikan, Swami> mentions that Thirupannar is a Avadoothi and not a ordinary man.Few> tenkalayars say that Swami desikan was consider Pillailokachariar and> Periyavachan Pillai as his Acharayn. These information are totally Fake. If> they were acharyans then swami desikan would have mention them in his> Granthas like Adikara Sangraham and many. Swami desikan had the ideology of> Bashyakara and thus he didn't agree with the ideas of Pillailokachariar.> Swami desikan had good relationship with All the acharyars at this time. Few> fanatics say that Swami had composed stotras on Periyavachan Pillai , if> composed can they name it? Only 28 stotras are composed by swami desikan. To> say many Tenkalayars(now considering) like Dodachary and Prativaid> bayankaram anna had composed many granthas on Swami desikan. Prativadi title> was offered to Anna by Nayanachariar(son of Swami desikan) and he had his> Samasrayanam done under Swami Nayanachariar . Later he became a sishya of> Manavala Mamuni. Dodyachariar who was earlier as Sishyan of Manavala Mamui> was influenced by Swai deiskan ideology wrote VedantadesikaPrakashika. Till> now there are Vamsikas of Doddachariar in Nagapattnam. Prativadi anna> composed SaptatRatnamalika.>> *Redarding Thayar......>> *There are lot of contravesy between the two Kalayars regarding the matter> of Sri. The vadakali sect say that thayar too is Paramatma as lord is. But> this Paksham was not accepted by Tenkalayars.On this contraversy Swami> desikan had written in his Chattusloki Bashyam regarding the Piratti. All> tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan pillai and also Nampillai, Nanjyer,> Parasara Bhattar in their EEdu and other Srisookthis tell that thayar is> Paramatham. This difference was created after the Grandson of Koil Annan.> Then, Tenkalayars condisder Perumal Keupa as *Nirhetu Krupa* but Vadakalayas> say that its Hetu krupa . Hert means reasoned. Thus acoording to the TK> point of view , when Perumal is Nirhetukrupi, Why cant he shower his Krupa> on all Jeevatmas and make them all Srivaishnavs and give moksham? If thayar> is not given importance in Tenkalai Sampraday then, They must nor adorn> Srichoorna, Then must not be called as Srivaishnavas.As Tenkalaayars don't> Sanskrit ,they take wrong meanings of Sri Desikan Granthas and others.>> *Regarding Saranagathi*>> Tenkalayars say that Prapati is the only way which leads moksha and the> other ways like Gnana,karma and Bakthi willn't lead to Moksham. But we say> that all the 4 ways lead to Moksham but Prapatti is a very easy form to> Moksha. To Tenkalai Fanatics: If bakthi,Gnana and Karma yogams will not lead> to Moksham then how did Prahaladhan,Bishmar and many rishis went to Moksham.>> *Regarding Thiruman*>> The old and Prachina Thiruman is the U or Vadakalai Thiruman. Pancharatra> Agama states that "Arabhya Nasika Mulam: nasika mulam arabhya: nasadikesa> payantam anasamularabhya" which means that the Urdhva Pundram must start> between the two eyebrows and end at the Kesham(hair). *It is clear that the> Tenkalai thiruman is a new form because the Tenkalayars adorn different> thirumans at different places. Ex: Y thiruman at face and Tamil PAA similar> to U thiruman in the body. *So the tenkalai thiruman was derived frm the> Vadakali (already mentioned that Bashyakarar was Vadakali).IF there were two> thirumans at the Time of Swami desikan than, swmai would have mentioned> inhis grantha named Saccaritra raksha. Few tenkalayars say that there are> thirumans(tenkalai) in many Stambams and Moolavars in Karnataka. In those> around 1600-1700 many temples were rennovated,in karnataka,due to Mughal> Invasion. During the rennovation the Moolavars and utsavars were replaced> with Thiruman. Actually to say in Silpa Sastram or in any Puranama there are> no reference to any thiruman. But the Tenkalayars say that Tenkalai thiruman> was the first. There are many evidences of Vadakalai thiruman in many> countirs like Egypt,Greece. The photos of these places are available at the> website of Stephan Knapp. There are many Vadakali Thirumans in> Kanchipuram,Srirangam,Tirumalai,and amny Divyadesam but they were destroyed> by the Tenkalayars. At present there are few Thiruman in Tirupati and> Kanchipuram. The Ramanujar at Tirumalai was a Vadakalai sannidhi the name> itsef Signifies that it belongs to Vadakalai (bashyakarar) but was undertake> by Tenkalayars.>> *Regarding Thaniyan*>> There are two Thaniyans for Swami desikan in Sanskrit and one Tamil Thaniyan> composed by Sri Pillailokachary(tenkalai head)>> The thaniyans are *"Sreeman Venkatanatharyaha Kavitharkika Kesari *> *Vedanthacharya Varyome Sannidhattam Sadahrudhim "> * & *> "Ramanuja Dayapatram Gnana Vairagya Bushanam> Sreemath Venkatanatharyaham Vande Vedanta Desikam"*> These two thaniyans were composed by Sri Nayanachariar(swami's Son) and> Brahmatantrar swami.>> Manavalamamunigal has a sanskrit Thaniyan>> *"Sreesailesha Dayapatram Deepatyadi Gunarnavam> Yetinda Pravanam Vandhe Ramyaja Mataram Munim"*> This thaniyan was composed by sri narayan Jyer one of the sishyas of> Manavala Mamunigal and it was mentioned in VARAVARAMUNI SHATAKAM by> Yerumbiappa. But the present Tenkalayars say that the Thaniyan was supposed> to be recited by Lord Ranganatha Itself. There are many stories like, When> Sriranganathan came as a small boy and recited Thaniyan for Manavala Mamuni,> the bagawats in Ghosti asked for Thirunal Pattu to by said by the boy. Then> this itself signifies that there was Thirunal Pathhu for some other> Acharayar, that is none other than Swami Deiskan.> *> Another Avatara OF Ramanuajar*>> There are many stories like Manavala Mamuni was the avatara of Ramanuajar.> This is one of the lies told by tenkalayars. It is said that Sri BAshyakarar> didn't warite and spread the essence of Divya PRabandham . Thus he took> another avatara as Manavala Mamuni. There are also other stories like Sriman> Narayanana granted 200 years of life span for Adiseshan and asked him to> take avatar as Ramanujar and as Ramanmujar lived for only 120 years he took> another avatara as Manavala Mamuni(swami survived for 73years only). The> 120+73=193. Then what about 7 years? Then did Adiseshan took another avatara> for 7 years?>> Then Vadakalayars can clearly say that Swmai desikan was the amasam of Sri> Bashyakarar . Swmai desiakn had authored many Granthas liek Munivahanaboham,> Madurakavi Hridayam,Dravidopanishad Saram,etc., on Divya Prabandham in> Sanskrit and Tamil. Swami Bashyakarara lived as a Sanyasi most of his life.> Thus Swami desikan was born as a Amsam of Sri Bashyakarara to explain how a> Srivaishnavan must lead a life as Grihastan. Swami desikan had written> Vyakyanams for Thiruvoimozhi in Sanskrit. Swami desikan wrote 73,000 padi> but it was lost due to carelessness. And swami desikan had written Many> Rakshai's for Pancharatra Agama,Srivaishanva Sampraday and many. So swami> Desikan is the Amsam of Sri Bashyakarar.>> *About Manavala Mamuni*>> Manavala Mamunigal had his Sribashya Kalakshebam done under the Grandson of> Kidambi Appular(a Vadakalate) and aslo he took his Preksha Mantram or> Sanyasam under the 1st Azhagiyasingar of Sri Ahobila Mutt(a Vadakala MUtt).> Many say that the Ahobila Mutt itself was a Tenkalai Mutt . There are no> PRooves for their Paksham. And also The 6th Azhagiyasingar of Ahobila Mutt> had written many comentires on Swami Desikan Granthas especially Sankalpa> Suryodhayam. Tenkalayars mainly consider Ahobila MUtt as tenkalai because if> Ahobila mutt is Vadakalai then Manavalamamuni will be Vadakalai. 1st> Azhagiyasingar was born on 1378 and Manavalamamuni on 1370. There may be a> age difference but 1st Azhagiyasingar got Sanyashasram from Narasimhan at a> young age of 20. Thus frm him got sanyashram Manavalamamuni.The Chinna Jyer> of Andhara recently appointed a new Jyer called Ahobila Jyer to suppress the> Ahobila Mutt activities. The Chinna Jyer of andhara has been giving> Sanyashasam like SSLC ceritificate to all. His mutt which was started by his> Grandpa was a new mutt which was established in late 1950's.FEw tenkalayars> say that Manavalamamuni didn't take Sanyasam as Manavala Mamuni took> Sanyasam from Satakopa jyer and not Adivan Satakopa Jyer. In our> Srivaishnava Sampraday Ahobila Mutt is the only Muttt which bears the name> Van Satakopan or Satakopan for its Peetadipathi . After giving> Sanyashasramam to Manavala Mamuni Satakopa Jyer or Adivan Satakopa Jyer was> titled the name Adi van by Nammalwar itself and Nammalwar gave his Hamsa> Mudrai to 1st Azhagiyasingar. Even today in Alwar Thirunagari Alwar> Brahmotsavam Ahobila Mutt obtains 1st three Days Mariyadhai.Anyone who wants> to have the Darshan of Hamsa Mudrai of Nammalwar can see them in Ahobila> Mutt Aradhan Mundapam.>>> In the year 1730-1759 Swami desikan Thaniyans in many places were replace by> the above thaniyan of Manavala Mamuni. EX: Even thousg the temple of meloke> is Tenkalai(converted) the sattumurai vazhi thirunamam is recited for Swami> desikan only. This was by the Order of Narasimha Udayar of Mysore that they> shuldn't replace the thaniyan of Swami desikan with Manaval Mamuni.Even> today though the temple of Melkote and Thirunarayanapuram are Tenkalai> Parakala Mutt Swami obtains first MAridhai and aslo the Thaniyan and Vazhi> Thirunamam of Swmai desikan is recited daily. As per the Kalvettu of> Srirangam Swami Desikan's thaniyan was recited in the Temple and houses of> Srirangam as swami Desikan restarted the Adhyayana Utsavam. Few Tenkalayars> say that why there are two Thaniyans for Swmai desikan? There must be only> one Taniyan. Then the answer is AnantanPillai of Tirumalai also had two> Thanyians . To say even Manavalamamuni had two Thaniyas but the earlier was> rejected and a new starting with Srisailesa Daapatram was accepted. Is this> what Manavala Mamuni or ther Tenkalai Acharayr wants?>> When we consider Tirumala Parakala Mutt was the Darmadatta Mutt but after> the advent of Chinna Jyer Mutt in Tirumala all the powers were Trasferred to> Tenkalai,which is mentioned in Tirumalai Vozhagu. The Desikan Thaniyan and> Vazhithirunamam were recited in Tirumala till 1910's but was stopped by the> Tenkalai Mutt. In Tirupati Swami desikan had Thiruvadi Thozhudal of> Govindarajan but the tenkalayars who were jelous stoped this Utsava> toooo......>> There are many Simhasanadipatis like Kandadai,Tirumalai Nallan> Chakravarthi,Tirumalai> EEchambadi,Tholapachariar,Tholappar,Thatachariar,Anantalvan,Illayavillai,Kidambi,Assuri,Veeravilli,etc...,> in Vadakali. The Acharyars like Periyanambi,Parasarabattar and others in> Sriranga were compelled and converted to Tenkalai. Actually the 74> Simhasanadipadis doesn't have Manavalamamuni but today Acharyars like> Parasara Bhattar , Periya Nambi,Tirumalai Anantanpillai,and otheres were> compelled to accept Manavalamamuni as acharyan.>> The thaniyans and also Vazhithirunamam of Manavala Mamuni was a copy of> Swami Desikan's.>> In the vazhi thirunamam of Manavala Mamuni it is said that *MANAVALAMAMUNIYE> INNUM ORU NOOTRANDU IRUM.* What does this mean when ever a man had completed> 100 years it is correct to say that innum oru nootrandu irum. But Manavala> Mamuni lived only for 73 years.So it is clear that the Tenkalayars must say> *MANAVALAMAMUNIYE INNUM ORU YEZHUBATHI IRANDU ORU ANDU IRUM* . So its clear> that Tenkalayars coppied the Vazhithirunamam of Swami Desikan.>> Then in the Tirumala Oriental Collage all the Granthas of Poorvachariars> were collected at that time they found that in the Srisookthies of Manavala> MAmuni it is found that another Thaniyans by Appilar was used ex:Yetiraja> Saptati. So frm this it is clear that the Tenkalayars had created a new> Srivaishnava Sect an copied the matter frm Vadakali Sampradyam.>> In Upadesaratnamala too Swami Manavalamamuni followed the method of swami> desikan's Prabandhasaram and to say the Pasurams are similar to> Prabandhasaram and Adhikara Sangraham.>>>> We are not Manavala Mamuni Dooshkas but we are condemn him iam tell the> facts abt our Sampraday ans not to hurt anybody........>> *Regarding Prabandham*>> . Here onwards i want to tell that Swami Manavalamanuni followed> both the footpaths of Swami desikan and Pillai Lokachariar. Tenkalai> fanatics say that alwars themself had composed 4000 Divya Prabandham and> Ramanuja Nootrandadi is not included in it because Swami desikan in his> Prabandha Saram had included Ramanuja Nootrandadi in 4000 Divya PRabandham.> I*S this the ACHARYA BAKTHI SHOWN BY TENKALAYARS TO SRI RAMANUJAR?* Actually> 4000 DP composed by alwars contain 3892 pasurams and this was rounded to> 4000 and was called Naalaiyira Divya Prabandham PRE Bashyakarar period.> After composing the Iramanuja Nootrandadi Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar handed> over this Prabandham to Bashyakarar. But bashyakarar was angry because it> was composed on him. Bashyakara sishyas pleaded him and finally Bashyakarar> said that this Prabandham must be recited after the 4000 Divya> Prabandham(beacuse it contains information about Bashyakarar Acharyars) .> Thus Ramanuja Nootandadi Was added to 4000 DP . More over the sum> 3892+108=4000 was also Suitable to say Naaliyira Divya Prabandham. Thus Sri> Swami Desikan included in his Prabandha Saaram included Ramanuja Notrandadi> as a part of Divya Prabandham (in Iyerpa, last 1000) . But Swami Desikan> Dweshi's didn't agree this Paksham as the Prabandham was composed by> Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar ,then he too is a Alwar. The answer for this> question is "Even thought the Prabandham was composed by Amudanar , it was> in Praise of Sri Bashyakarar. " This was mentioned not only by Swami desikan> but also by Sri manavala Mamunni in his Upadesa Ratnamala. Manavala Mamuni> had composed Upadesa Ratnamala by following Swami desikan Prabandham like> Adikara Sangraham,Prabandha Saram. Pasurams like "Poigai muni boodathar> Peyalwar..........." were used in Upadesaratnamala. Swami Manavalamamuni had> mentioned the birth month of each alwar but finally he mentions> MaduraKavigal,Andal and Bashyakarar. Then according to Nakshatram> MadurakaviAlwar must come after Ramanjar , but is not in that order. So,> Manavala Mamuni had composed the Pasuram like the the "matha Pitha> Yuvatayas" of Parasara Bhattar in which Parasara Bhatter describes all> alwars as angam of Nammalwar,so he mentions Nammalwar lastly. Similarly> Manava Mamuni had mentioned Bashyakarar at last and then he starts> Nathamuni(Pasuram 37-38 in Upadesa Ratnamalai). This itself Signifies that> Manavala Mamuni had also accepted the same order as sri Desikan did.. Even> Tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan Pilli folowed the order of Adding> RAMANUJA NOOTRANDADI to 4000 DIVYA PRABANDHAM.>>>> Thus the present Tenkalayars had altered Divya Prabandham so that they can> have many divisions mentioned like Ashtadasa Bedahah....18 Differences..>> There are differences even in Perialwar Thirumozhi. Vadakalayars consider> Perialwar thirumozhi which consists even Thirupallandu in it . But the> Tenkalayars had divided Perialwar Thirumozhi into two divisions ,> Thirupallanu and Perialawar Thirumozhi. As per Tenkalai Sampradaya ONNAM> PATHU of PErialwar Thirumozhi have 90 Pasurams only as thirupallandu was> seperated from it. Actually Pathu means 10*10 i.e, a total of 100 Pasurams> in One pathu. But the 1st pathu according to Tenkalayars contain 90 Pasurams> only.>> Thus the Tenkalayars even divided the Divya Prabandham as they wish.>> Above, i had mentioned few facts and prooves that Ahobila Mutt was,is and> will be Vadakalai. Here Iam adding few more facts. Recently The Chinna Jyer> of Andhra had given a Sanyasam Degree to a new IAS officer and named him as> Ahobila Ramanuja jyer. This is because they want a Tenklai Ahobila Mutt.> Then we* Vadakalayars must ask for A Vadakalai Periya Jyer Mutt in Tirupati> as 31st and 32nd Jyer in Periya Jyer Mutt were Vadakalai*.Why cant the> previous Jyer choose a Tenkalai Jyer as as successer? R there no Tenkalayars> sutiable to that post except Vadakalayars? SO we Vadakalayars too must ask> for a Vadakali Periya Jyer Mutt.Even So the Chinna Jyer of Andhra must stop> doing these Tenkalai Pracharam and must develop Ramanuja Sampraday.Being a> Srivaishnava Sanyasi how can he rennovate Siva temples and other Demi Gods> temples? Is this waht mention in Ramanja Sampradaya or Tenkalai Sampraday?> As said by Manavala Mamuni one must selest a acharyan who has high Gnanam> and Anustanam thus a sihsyan will get a good guidance.But most of the> Tenkalai Acharayars nowadasays doesn't have Anustanam . Only few are> folowinf the words of Manavala MAmuni(said as Tenkalai acharayar) .>>> Many Tenklayars have the opinion that Vadakalayars don't give much> importance to Divya Prabandham and they neglect it. ITs totally false. Swami> deiskan Had written many Granthas on Prandham like Munivahana Boham,Prabanda> Saram,73,000 padi on DP(which was lost) , Dravidopanishad,etcc., Swami> Deiskan consider Vedam and Divya Prabandham as two eyes . Without an eye we> cant see Perumal. As Vedic religion we must for Vedam and Divya Prabandham> is for our Atma Ujeevanam. But most Tenkalayars neglect Vedam . Sri> BAshyakarar during his last days told 5 main sentences. 1st sentence is that> "Learn Sri BAshyam and Preach it to others" 2nd is to Learn "Bagawat Vishyam> and preach it to others"... And the other sentenses continues....>> But swami Desikan followed the 1st sentece of Sri BAshyakara and lead his> life. But the Tenkalayars don;t know this and asay that Swami DEsikan had> neglected Divya Prabandham. Since that give To Sri Bashyam and Vedas....> Prabandham is for Atma Ujeevanam........>>> Thus Vadakalai Sampradaya is oldest and Tenkalai was a division from> Vadakali.>>> *Regarding Chinna Jyer of Andhra*>> The Tridandi Jyer had> converted many sishyas of Swayamacharayars and various Mutt into his> sishyas. We srivaishnavas must save those who had converted or had their> samasrayanam done under him. If a Acharayan is not qualified , then the> Sishyan can chabge his acharayan which is mentioned in Pillailokacharirar> Ashtadasa Rahasyam. So we srivaishnavas must save people from the clutches> of a A Vaishnavan. He must stop Tenakali Prachara and work for Ramanuaja> Darshanam.He had converted sishyas of Many Vadakali Acharyas in Andhra like> Vasudevachari,etc...,>> Acording to Our Dhram Shastra no one must cross the ocean. Whenever they do> this they are not allowed to enter the temples.But the Tridandi had gone to> countires like Australia,America,etc..., Is this what said in Dharam Sastra?>> There are few sishyas of This Chinna Jyer saying that he is another avatara> of Ramaujar. Then did Ramaujar Worshiped or went to demi god temples?>>> *> 4 times Sastnaga Namaskaram*>> Different SampradhAyins prostrate beforethe Lord once , twice or four times> .In Vadakalai SampradhAyam , it is done four> times .One can use Yukti Vaadhams and point out thefour NamaskaraNams are> for the four directions or for the four hands of the Lord holding the disc> ,the conch , the abhaya Mudhra and the Lotus or Gadhai. One can also view it> as salutations to the Four vyUhams etc. There is however more doctrinal> reasons based on AchAryA's teachings . Let us look at them now :>> Both Swamy AlavanthAr in His StOtra Ratna slOkam and Swamy Desikan elsewhere> has given the reasons for the 4 NamaskArams as Svaroopa Sodhanams . When we> are visiting a Temple of Sriman NarayaNan , one prostrates ( ShAshtAnga> NamaskArams) before the Bali Peetam and then enter the temple .The First> NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of> the Lord's Paratvam ( Superiority as ParadEvathai). The second NamaskAram is> to comfort ourselves> with His Soulabhya guNam ( ease of access inspite of His Paratvam) of the> Lord .>> The Third namaskAram is to remind ourselves of His Praapyatvam ( Being the> ultimate goal , PradhAna PurushArtham ) .>> The Fourth NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of His SaraNyatvam or His> staying as the SarvalOka SaraNyan and Sarva Rakshakan .>> When one does the 4 NamaskArams this way , one's ego is pushed aside and one> approaches the Lord's sannidhi with the right attitude and Jn~Anam .>> We prostrate 4 times before AchAryan ,Parents and elder Persons . One can> explain this with the Veda PramANam of AchArya DevO Bhava et al .>> The alternate four reaons for NamaskAram in PerumAL Sannidhi based on Swamy> AlavanthAr's stOtra Ratna slOkam and PeriyaVaacchAn PiLLai's commentary is> summed up in my 2005 posting in Sriranga Sri archives (Volume I) and> Oppiliappan archives ( Part II ) :>> http://www.ibiblio.org/sripedia//archi<http://www.ibiblio.org/sripedia//archives/apr05/msg00071.html>> ves/apr05/msg00071.html>> and>> http://www.ibiblio.org/oppiliappan/archives/apr05/msg00015.html>> The two folded palms in the AshtAnga NamaskAram have their own significance> , The right palm of the devotee is said to represent the lotus feet of the> Lord and the left palm , the head of the devotee.>>>> *Desikan Dooshakargal> *> Prativadi Bayankaram ANnan in his> Saptati Ratnamalika quotes that> *"गà¥à¤°à¥‚व वधी हमà¥à¤¸à¤® à¤à¥à¤¦à¤¾à¤šà¤¾à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ सिषà¥à¤¯> जना बकती हीना येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ शà¥à¤¯à¥à¤¹à¥ :|> येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ विषà¥à¤£à¥ कारà¥à¤¨à¥à¤¯ ढूरà¥à¤¹à¤¾:> कà¥à¤¤à¥‹ मà¥à¤•à¥à¤¤à¤¿ वारà¥à¤¤à¤¾ हि तादà¥à¤° विधानाम || "> *which means when anybody talks bad about Swami desikan, then he will be> disliked by Yetindra(Bashyakarar) and this leads to Vishnu KArunya> Dhoorahah(loss of Vishnu Karunyam) and Lord will not grant Moksha for them.>> These slokas were written by sri Prativadi Bayankaram Annan(now Tenkalai> Achayan) . So Tenkalayars must know this slokas and must not talk bad about> swmai deiskan and his Granthas.>>>>>>> Courtesy: PrabandhaSara Vaibhavam>-- To Succeed in Life, You need two things:IGNORANCE and CONFIDENCE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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