Guest guest Posted January 4, 2009 Report Share Posted January 4, 2009 To The Moderator what is the objective of the group?? I urge you not to entertain this type of perverted postings they go against the spirit of the group and exhange of communication among members such biased mails are to be avoided nyayavadi PS The person posted has not even spelt the word 'vadagalai" in the subject heading correctly --- On Fri, 2/1/09, आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 wrote: आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali)naranann, "Ponnappan" <Oppiliappan >, , "divya desam" , "Swami" , "Ramanuja and desika " <RamanujaandDesika >Friday, 2 January, 2009, 5:07 PM ---------- Forwarded message ----------आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 11:50 AMFwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali )naranann (AT) (DOT) . in ---------- Forwarded message ----------आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:53 AMFwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali )vishnurdn (AT) (DOT) co.in, kidambi seshadri <krseshadri84@ gmail.com>, "sailesh..... .... joined in srm" <saileshrjn (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, Veeraraghavan <radharaghu (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, Balakrishnan ramanuaj Dasan <alwarbalan2008@ gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ----------आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:50 AMTotal Mails.....(vadakali )vishnurdn (AT) (DOT) co.in, Veeraraghavan <radharaghu (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, "sailesh..... .... joined in srm" <saileshrjn (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, kidambi seshadri <krseshadri84@ gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ----------swamidesikadasan <swamidesikadasan@ gmail.com>Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 8:24 PMRe:sailesh rajan <saileshrjn (AT) gmail (DOT) com>,Adisesh Iyengar<adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>Dear all, There are many proofs that Swami desikan and also Manavala Mamuni are Vadakalai. The first one is the thirumeni at Sri Thiruvahindipuram of Swami desikan is Adorning Vadakalai thiruman.Which was made by Swami desikan himself. Next thatacharirars( periya Tirumalai Nambi),uncle of Sri Bashyakarar are Vadakalai. If u visit Sreeperambuthur the Archa Thirumeni of Sri bashyakarar adorns Vadakalai thiruman. secondly when the Tridandi jyer covered the Vimanam of Sribashyakarar and half of perumal sannidhi they didn't allow media and even Srivaishnavs to take photograph. The vimanam in Sriperambuthur contains Vdakalaithiruman. Once Sriprambuthur was a Vadakalai shrine but was converted to Tekalai around 150 years ago,when the new Embar mutt was started. The temple in Sripreambuthur was taken care by the Sriperambuthur Tirumalia EEchambadi. Thus Vdakalayars built a new Desikan Sannidhi in Sriperambuthur near the Purshkarini. In Sriperambuthur the Chinna Jyer covered the Vimana of Perumal 1/3rd only..... This is so because there are Vadakalai there. Nextly we can talk about Sri Manavala Mamuni and other Tenkaayars. Tenkalayars say that they don't have the caste feelings . They perform Samasrayanam and also include Bagawatargal in Srivaishnava Ghosti. Its wrong, in the Bashyam of Sri periyavachan Pillai(said as Tenkalai) to Amalanadipiran, Sri Vachan pillai clearly states that Thirupannar is a Panchamar and even thought he said Amalan the cast can't be excluded. Thus in Periyavachan Pillai Vyakyanam it is clearly said that they see the differences in Cast but say that all people who perform Samasrayanam are equal. But when u see the Bashyam of Sri Swami Vedanta Desikan, Swami mentions that Thirupannar is a Avadoothi and not a ordinary man.Few tenkalayars say that Swami desikan was consider Pillailokachariar and Periyavachan Pillai as his Acharayn. These information are totally Fake. If they were acharyans then swami desikan would have mention them in his Granthas like Adikara Sangraham and many. Swami desikan had the ideology of Bashyakara and thus he didn't agree with the ideas of Pillailokachariar. Swami desikan had good relationship with All the acharyars at this time. Few fanatics say that Swami had composed stotras on Periyavachan Pillai , if composed can they name it? Only 28 stotras are composed by swami desikan. To say many Tenkalayars( now considering) like Dodachary and Prativaid bayankaram anna had composed many granthas on Swami desikan. Prativadi title was offered to Anna by Nayanachariar( son of Swami desikan) and he had his Samasrayanam done under Swami Nayanachariar . Later he became a sishya of Manavala Mamuni. Dodyachariar who was earlier as Sishyan of Manavala Mamui was influenced by Swai deiskan ideology wrote VedantadesikaPrakas hika. Till now there are Vamsikas of Doddachariar in Nagapattnam. Prativadi anna composed SaptatRatnamalika. Redarding Thayar......There are lot of contravesy between the two Kalayars regarding the matter of Sri. The vadakali sect say that thayar too is Paramatma as lord is. But this Paksham was not accepted by Tenkalayars. On this contraversy Swami desikan had written in his Chattusloki Bashyam regarding the Piratti. All tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan pillai and also Nampillai, Nanjyer, Parasara Bhattar in their EEdu and other Srisookthis tell that thayar is Paramatham. This difference was created after the Grandson of Koil Annan. Then, Tenkalayars condisder Perumal Keupa as Nirhetu Krupa but Vadakalayas say that its Hetu krupa . Hert means reasoned. Thus acoording to the TK point of view , when Perumal is Nirhetukrupi, Why cant he shower his Krupa on all Jeevatmas and make them all Srivaishnavs and give moksham? If thayar is not given importance in Tenkalai Sampraday then, They must nor adorn Srichoorna, Then must not be called as Srivaishnavas. As Tenkalaayars don't Sanskrit ,they take wrong meanings of Sri Desikan Granthas and others.Regarding SaranagathiTenkalayars say that Prapati is the only way which leads moksha and the other ways like Gnana,karma and Bakthi willn't lead to Moksham. But we say that all the 4 ways lead to Moksham but Prapatti is a very easy form to Moksha. To Tenkalai Fanatics: If bakthi,Gnana and Karma yogams will not lead to Moksham then how did Prahaladhan, Bishmar and many rishis went to Moksham.Regarding Thiruman The old and Prachina Thiruman is the U or Vadakalai Thiruman. Pancharatra Agama states that "Arabhya Nasika Mulam: nasika mulam arabhya: nasadikesa payantam anasamularabhya" which means that the Urdhva Pundram must start between the two eyebrows and end at the Kesham(hair) . It is clear that the Tenkalai thiruman is a new form because the Tenkalayars adorn different thirumans at different places. Ex: Y thiruman at face and Tamil PAA similar to U thiruman in the body. So the tenkalai thiruman was derived frm the Vadakali (already mentioned that Bashyakarar was Vadakali).IF there were two thirumans at the Time of Swami desikan than, swmai would have mentioned inhis grantha named Saccaritra raksha. Few tenkalayars say that there are thirumans(tenkalai) in many Stambams and Moolavars in Karnataka. In those around 1600-1700 many temples were rennovated,in karnataka,due to Mughal Invasion. During the rennovation the Moolavars and utsavars were replaced with Thiruman. Actually to say in Silpa Sastram or in any Puranama there are no reference to any thiruman. But the Tenkalayars say that Tenkalai thiruman was the first. There are many evidences of Vadakalai thiruman in many countirs like Egypt,Greece. The photos of these places are available at the website of Stephan Knapp. There are many Vadakali Thirumans in Kanchipuram, Srirangam, Tirumalai, and amny Divyadesam but they were destroyed by the Tenkalayars. At present there are few Thiruman in Tirupati and Kanchipuram. The Ramanujar at Tirumalai was a Vadakalai sannidhi the name itsef Signifies that it belongs to Vadakalai (bashyakarar) but was undertake by Tenkalayars.Regarding Thaniyan There are two Thaniyans for Swami desikan in Sanskrit and one Tamil Thaniyan composed by Sri Pillailokachary( tenkalai head)The thaniyans are "Sreeman Venkatanatharyaha Kavitharkika Kesari Vedanthacharya Varyome Sannidhattam Sadahrudhim " & "Ramanuja Dayapatram Gnana Vairagya BushanamSreemath Venkatanatharyaham Vande Vedanta Desikam" These two thaniyans were composed by Sri Nayanachariar( swami's Son) and Brahmatantrar swami. Manavalamamunigal has a sanskrit Thaniyan "Sreesailesha Dayapatram Deepatyadi Gunarnavam Yetinda Pravanam Vandhe Ramyaja Mataram Munim" This thaniyan was composed by sri narayan Jyer one of the sishyas of Manavala Mamunigal and it was mentioned in VARAVARAMUNI SHATAKAM by Yerumbiappa. But the present Tenkalayars say that the Thaniyan was supposed to be recited by Lord Ranganatha Itself. There are many stories like, When Sriranganathan came as a small boy and recited Thaniyan for Manavala Mamuni, the bagawats in Ghosti asked for Thirunal Pattu to by said by the boy. Then this itself signifies that there was Thirunal Pathhu for some other Acharayar, that is none other than Swami Deiskan.Another Avatara OF RamanuajarThere are many stories like Manavala Mamuni was the avatara of Ramanuajar. This is one of the lies told by tenkalayars. It is said that Sri BAshyakarar didn't warite and spread the essence of Divya PRabandham . Thus he took another avatara as Manavala Mamuni. There are also other stories like Sriman Narayanana granted 200 years of life span for Adiseshan and asked him to take avatar as Ramanujar and as Ramanmujar lived for only 120 years he took another avatara as Manavala Mamuni(swami survived for 73years only). The 120+73=193. Then what about 7 years? Then did Adiseshan took another avatara for 7 years? Then Vadakalayars can clearly say that Swmai desikan was the amasam of Sri Bashyakarar . Swmai desiakn had authored many Granthas liek Munivahanaboham, Madurakavi Hridayam,Dravidopan ishad Saram,etc., on Divya Prabandham in Sanskrit and Tamil. Swami Bashyakarara lived as a Sanyasi most of his life. Thus Swami desikan was born as a Amsam of Sri Bashyakarara to explain how a Srivaishnavan must lead a life as Grihastan. Swami desikan had written Vyakyanams for Thiruvoimozhi in Sanskrit. Swami desikan wrote 73,000 padi but it was lost due to carelessness. And swami desikan had written Many Rakshai's for Pancharatra Agama,Srivaishanva Sampraday and many. So swami Desikan is the Amsam of Sri Bashyakarar. About Manavala Mamuni Manavala Mamunigal had his Sribashya Kalakshebam done under the Grandson of Kidambi Appular(a Vadakalate) and aslo he took his Preksha Mantram or Sanyasam under the 1st Azhagiyasingar of Sri Ahobila Mutt(a Vadakala MUtt). Many say that the Ahobila Mutt itself was a Tenkalai Mutt . There are no PRooves for their Paksham. And also The 6th Azhagiyasingar of Ahobila Mutt had written many comentires on Swami Desikan Granthas especially Sankalpa Suryodhayam. Tenkalayars mainly consider Ahobila MUtt as tenkalai because if Ahobila mutt is Vadakalai then Manavalamamuni will be Vadakalai. 1st Azhagiyasingar was born on 1378 and Manavalamamuni on 1370. There may be a age difference but 1st Azhagiyasingar got Sanyashasram from Narasimhan at a young age of 20. Thus frm him got sanyashram Manavalamamuni. The Chinna Jyer of Andhara recently appointed a new Jyer called Ahobila Jyer to suppress the Ahobila Mutt activities. The Chinna Jyer of andhara has been giving Sanyashasam like SSLC ceritificate to all. His mutt which was started by his Grandpa was a new mutt which was established in late 1950's.FEw tenkalayars say that Manavalamamuni didn't take Sanyasam as Manavala Mamuni took Sanyasam from Satakopa jyer and not Adivan Satakopa Jyer. In our Srivaishnava Sampraday Ahobila Mutt is the only Muttt which bears the name Van Satakopan or Satakopan for its Peetadipathi . After giving Sanyashasramam to Manavala Mamuni Satakopa Jyer or Adivan Satakopa Jyer was titled the name Adi van by Nammalwar itself and Nammalwar gave his Hamsa Mudrai to 1st Azhagiyasingar. Even today in Alwar Thirunagari Alwar Brahmotsavam Ahobila Mutt obtains 1st three Days Mariyadhai.Anyone who wants to have the Darshan of Hamsa Mudrai of Nammalwar can see them in Ahobila Mutt Aradhan Mundapam.In the year 1730-1759 Swami desikan Thaniyans in many places were replace by the above thaniyan of Manavala Mamuni. EX: Even thousg the temple of meloke is Tenkalai(converted) the sattumurai vazhi thirunamam is recited for Swami desikan only. This was by the Order of Narasimha Udayar of Mysore that they shuldn't replace the thaniyan of Swami desikan with Manaval Mamuni.Even today though the temple of Melkote and Thirunarayanapuram are Tenkalai Parakala Mutt Swami obtains first MAridhai and aslo the Thaniyan and Vazhi Thirunamam of Swmai desikan is recited daily. As per the Kalvettu of Srirangam Swami Desikan's thaniyan was recited in the Temple and houses of Srirangam as swami Desikan restarted the Adhyayana Utsavam. Few Tenkalayars say that why there are two Thaniyans for Swmai desikan? There must be only one Taniyan. Then the answer is AnantanPillai of Tirumalai also had two Thanyians . To say even Manavalamamuni had two Thaniyas but the earlier was rejected and a new starting with Srisailesa Daapatram was accepted. Is this what Manavala Mamuni or ther Tenkalai Acharayr wants? When we consider Tirumala Parakala Mutt was the Darmadatta Mutt but after the advent of Chinna Jyer Mutt in Tirumala all the powers were Trasferred to Tenkalai,which is mentioned in Tirumalai Vozhagu. The Desikan Thaniyan and Vazhithirunamam were recited in Tirumala till 1910's but was stopped by the Tenkalai Mutt. In Tirupati Swami desikan had Thiruvadi Thozhudal of Govindarajan but the tenkalayars who were jelous stoped this Utsava toooo...... There are many Simhasanadipatis like Kandadai,Tirumalai Nallan Chakravarthi, Tirumalai EEchambadi,Tholapac hariar,Tholappar ,Thatachariar, Anantalvan, Illayavillai, Kidambi,Assuri, Veeravilli, etc..., in Vadakali. The Acharyars like Periyanambi, Parasarabattar and others in Sriranga were compelled and converted to Tenkalai. Actually the 74 Simhasanadipadis doesn't have Manavalamamuni but today Acharyars like Parasara Bhattar , Periya Nambi,Tirumalai Anantanpillai, and otheres were compelled to accept Manavalamamuni as acharyan.The thaniyans and also Vazhithirunamam of Manavala Mamuni was a copy of Swami Desikan's.In the vazhi thirunamam of Manavala Mamuni it is said that MANAVALAMAMUNIYE INNUM ORU NOOTRANDU IRUM. What does this mean when ever a man had completed 100 years it is correct to say that innum oru nootrandu irum. But Manavala Mamuni lived only for 73 years.So it is clear that the Tenkalayars must say MANAVALAMAMUNIYE INNUM ORU YEZHUBATHI IRANDU ORU ANDU IRUM . So its clear that Tenkalayars coppied the Vazhithirunamam of Swami Desikan. Then in the Tirumala Oriental Collage all the Granthas of Poorvachariars were collected at that time they found that in the Srisookthies of Manavala MAmuni it is found that another Thaniyans by Appilar was used ex:Yetiraja Saptati. So frm this it is clear that the Tenkalayars had created a new Srivaishnava Sect an copied the matter frm Vadakali Sampradyam.In Upadesaratnamala too Swami Manavalamamuni followed the method of swami desikan's Prabandhasaram and to say the Pasurams are similar to Prabandhasaram and Adhikara Sangraham. We are not Manavala Mamuni Dooshkas but we are condemn him iam tell the facts abt our Sampraday ans not to hurt anybody..... ... Regarding Prabandham . Here onwards i want to tell that Swami Manavalamanuni followed both the footpaths of Swami desikan and Pillai Lokachariar. Tenkalai fanatics say that alwars themself had composed 4000 Divya Prabandham and Ramanuja Nootrandadi is not included in it because Swami desikan in his Prabandha Saram had included Ramanuja Nootrandadi in 4000 Divya PRabandham. IS this the ACHARYA BAKTHI SHOWN BY TENKALAYARS TO SRI RAMANUJAR? Actually 4000 DP composed by alwars contain 3892 pasurams and this was rounded to 4000 and was called Naalaiyira Divya Prabandham PRE Bashyakarar period.. After composing the Iramanuja Nootrandadi Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar handed over this Prabandham to Bashyakarar. But bashyakarar was angry because it was composed on him. Bashyakara sishyas pleaded him and finally Bashyakarar said that this Prabandham must be recited after the 4000 Divya Prabandham(beacuse it contains information about Bashyakarar Acharyars) . Thus Ramanuja Nootandadi Was added to 4000 DP . More over the sum 3892+108=4000 was also Suitable to say Naaliyira Divya Prabandham. Thus Sri Swami Desikan included in his Prabandha Saaram included Ramanuja Notrandadi as a part of Divya Prabandham (in Iyerpa, last 1000) . But Swami Desikan Dweshi's didn't agree this Paksham as the Prabandham was composed by Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar ,then he too is a Alwar. The answer for this question is "Even thought the Prabandham was composed by Amudanar , it was in Praise of Sri Bashyakarar. " This was mentioned not only by Swami desikan but also by Sri manavala Mamunni in his Upadesa Ratnamala. Manavala Mamuni had composed Upadesa Ratnamala by following Swami desikan Prabandham like Adikara Sangraham,Prabandha Saram. Pasurams like "Poigai muni boodathar Peyalwar.... ........" were used in Upadesaratnamala. Swami Manavalamamuni had mentioned the birth month of each alwar but finally he mentions MaduraKavigal, Andal and Bashyakarar. Then according to Nakshatram MadurakaviAlwar must come after Ramanjar , but is not in that order. So, Manavala Mamuni had composed the Pasuram like the the "matha Pitha Yuvatayas" of Parasara Bhattar in which Parasara Bhatter describes all alwars as angam of Nammalwar,so he mentions Nammalwar lastly. Similarly Manava Mamuni had mentioned Bashyakarar at last and then he starts Nathamuni(Pasuram 37-38 in Upadesa Ratnamalai). This itself Signifies that Manavala Mamuni had also accepted the same order as sri Desikan did.. Even Tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan Pilli folowed the order of Adding RAMANUJA NOOTRANDADI to 4000 DIVYA PRABANDHAM.Thus the present Tenkalayars had altered Divya Prabandham so that they can have many divisions mentioned like Ashtadasa Bedahah....18 Differences. . There are differences even in Perialwar Thirumozhi. Vadakalayars consider Perialwar thirumozhi which consists even Thirupallandu in it . But the Tenkalayars had divided Perialwar Thirumozhi into two divisions , Thirupallanu and Perialawar Thirumozhi. As per Tenkalai Sampradaya ONNAM PATHU of PErialwar Thirumozhi have 90 Pasurams only as thirupallandu was seperated from it. Actually Pathu means 10*10 i.e, a total of 100 Pasurams in One pathu. But the 1st pathu according to Tenkalayars contain 90 Pasurams only.Thus the Tenkalayars even divided the Divya Prabandham as they wish. Above, i had mentioned few facts and prooves that Ahobila Mutt was,is and will be Vadakalai. Here Iam adding few more facts. Recently The Chinna Jyer of Andhra had given a Sanyasam Degree to a new IAS officer and named him as Ahobila Ramanuja jyer. This is because they want a Tenklai Ahobila Mutt. Then we Vadakalayars must ask for A Vadakalai Periya Jyer Mutt in Tirupati as 31st and 32nd Jyer in Periya Jyer Mutt were Vadakalai.Why cant the previous Jyer choose a Tenkalai Jyer as as successer? R there no Tenkalayars sutiable to that post except Vadakalayars? SO we Vadakalayars too must ask for a Vadakali Periya Jyer Mutt.Even So the Chinna Jyer of Andhra must stop doing these Tenkalai Pracharam and must develop Ramanuja Sampraday.Being a Srivaishnava Sanyasi how can he rennovate Siva temples and other Demi Gods temples? Is this waht mention in Ramanja Sampradaya or Tenkalai Sampraday? As said by Manavala Mamuni one must selest a acharyan who has high Gnanam and Anustanam thus a sihsyan will get a good guidance.But most of the Tenkalai Acharayars nowadasays doesn't have Anustanam . Only few are folowinf the words of Manavala MAmuni(said as Tenkalai acharayar) . Many Tenklayars have the opinion that Vadakalayars don't give much importance to Divya Prabandham and they neglect it. ITs totally false. Swami deiskan Had written many Granthas on Prandham like Munivahana Boham,Prabanda Saram,73,000 padi on DP(which was lost) , Dravidopanishad, etcc., Swami Deiskan consider Vedam and Divya Prabandham as two eyes . Without an eye we cant see Perumal. As Vedic religion we must for Vedam and Divya Prabandham is for our Atma Ujeevanam. But most Tenkalayars neglect Vedam . Sri BAshyakarar during his last days told 5 main sentences. 1st sentence is that "Learn Sri BAshyam and Preach it to others" 2nd is to Learn "Bagawat Vishyam and preach it to others"... And the other sentenses continues... .But swami Desikan followed the 1st sentece of Sri BAshyakara and lead his life. But the Tenkalayars don;t know this and asay that Swami DEsikan had neglected Divya Prabandham. Since that give To Sri Bashyam and Vedas.... Prabandham is for Atma Ujeevanam... .....Thus Vadakalai Sampradaya is oldest and Tenkalai was a division from Vadakali. Regarding Chinna Jyer of Andhra The Tridandi Jyer had converted many sishyas of Swayamacharayars and various Mutt into his sishyas. We srivaishnavas must save those who had converted or had their samasrayanam done under him. If a Acharayan is not qualified , then the Sishyan can chabge his acharayan which is mentioned in Pillailokacharirar Ashtadasa Rahasyam. So we srivaishnavas must save people from the clutches of a A Vaishnavan. He must stop Tenakali Prachara and work for Ramanuaja Darshanam.He had converted sishyas of Many Vadakali Acharyas in Andhra like Vasudevachari, etc...,Acording to Our Dhram Shastra no one must cross the ocean. Whenever they do this they are not allowed to enter the temples.But the Tridandi had gone to countires like Australia,America, etc..., Is this what said in Dharam Sastra?There are few sishyas of This Chinna Jyer saying that he is another avatara of Ramaujar. Then did Ramaujar Worshiped or went to demi god temples? 4 times Sastnaga Namaskaram Different SampradhAyins prostrate beforethe Lord once , twice or four times .In Vadakalai SampradhAyam , it is done four times .One can use Yukti Vaadhams and point out thefour NamaskaraNams are for the four directions or for the four hands of the Lord holding the disc ,the conch , the abhaya Mudhra and the Lotus or Gadhai. One can also view it as salutations to the Four vyUhams etc. There is however more doctrinal reasons based on AchAryA's teachings . Let us look at them now : Both Swamy AlavanthAr in His StOtra Ratna slOkam and Swamy Desikan elsewhere has given the reasons for the 4 NamaskArams as Svaroopa Sodhanams . When we are visiting a Temple of Sriman NarayaNan , one prostrates ( ShAshtAnga NamaskArams) before the Bali Peetam and then enter the temple .The First NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of the Lord's Paratvam ( Superiority as ParadEvathai) . The second NamaskAram is to comfort ourselves with His Soulabhya guNam ( ease of access inspite of His Paratvam) of the Lord . The Third namaskAram is to remind ourselves of His Praapyatvam ( Being the ultimate goal , PradhAna PurushArtham ) . The Fourth NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of His SaraNyatvam or His staying as the SarvalOka SaraNyan and Sarva Rakshakan . When one does the 4 NamaskArams this way , one's ego is pushed aside and one approaches the Lord's sannidhi with the right attitude and Jn~Anam . We prostrate 4 times before AchAryan ,Parents and elder Persons . One can explain this with the Veda PramANam of AchArya DevO Bhava et al . The alternate four reaons for NamaskAram in PerumAL Sannidhi based on Swamy AlavanthAr's stOtra Ratna slOkam and PeriyaVaacchAn PiLLai's commentary is summed up in my 2005 posting in Sriranga Sri archives (Volume I) and Oppiliappan archives ( Part II ) : http://www.ibiblio. org/sripedia/ / archives/apr05/msg00071. html and http://www..ibiblio. org/oppiliappan/ archives/ apr05/msg00015. html The two folded palms in the AshtAnga NamaskAram have their own significance , The right palm of the devotee is said to represent the lotus feet of the Lord and the left palm , the head of the devotee. Desikan Dooshakargal Prativadi Bayankaram ANnan in his Saptati Ratnamalika quotes that "गà¥à¤°à¥‚व वधी हमà¥à¤¸à¤® à¤à¥à¤¦à¤¾à¤šà¤¾à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ सिषà¥à¤¯ जना बकती हीना येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ शà¥à¤¯à¥à¤¹à¥ :|येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ विषà¥à¤£à¥ कारà¥à¤¨à¥à¤¯ ढूरà¥à¤¹à¤¾: कà¥à¤¤à¥‹ मà¥à¤•à¥à¤¤à¤¿ वारà¥à¤¤à¤¾ हि तादà¥à¤° विधानाम || " which means when anybody talks bad about Swami desikan, then he will be disliked by Yetindra(Bashyakara r) and this leads to Vishnu KArunya Dhoorahah(loss of Vishnu Karunyam) and Lord will not grant Moksha for them. These slokas were written by sri Prativadi Bayankaram Annan(now Tenkalai Achayan) . So Tenkalayars must know this slokas and must not talk bad about swmai deiskan and his Granthas.Courtesy: PrabandhaSara Vaibhavam Check out the all-new Messenger 9.0! Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009  Dear Sri Venkatraman : Thank you for your mail . As an editor of Oppiliappan , Sarnagathi , Malolan and few other groups , I make it a point to reject mailings to my groups relating to outbursts based on Kalai dhvEsham . There are inded differences in the doctrines of two kalais . There is no neeed however to engage in battles to prove who is right or wrong . This is just a waste of time . One can fruitfully send one's time following AchArya and AzhwAr Sri Sookthis and staying close to one's own AchArya Paramparai and KulAchArams . Let us focus on serving our AchAryans , BhagavathAs and the dhivya dampathis and leave the rest out . There is so much to learn and so little time to get closer to even a small portion of the Bhagavad anubhavam housed in the SrI Sookthis of AzhwArs and AchAryans . NamO Sriman NaarAyaNAya , V.Sadagopan ---- Original Message ----- Krishnan Sevel Venkataraman Cc: naranann ; oppiliappan ; ; ; ramanujaanddesika Sunday, January 04, 2009 11:51 PM RE: Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali) Dear Swamin adiyen Sevel Krishnan would like to make the following suggestions: Let us be proud at the outset that we are born as Brahmins and that too as Vaishnavit. I do not know far it is true- I am told that to born as a vaishnavit, you should have born as a brahmin in your last birth and because of your good deeds, you have born now as a Vaishnavit. If the above is accepted, why should we worry about whether we belongs to thenkalai or vadakalai cult. Our Narayanan is the supreme deity and those who believe in it, should not even think of any differences among these two cults.If my observation is wrong, please enlighten me further. Our younger generation are not aware of these differences and by discussing trhese differences, we are taking a big risk in their belief in Vaishavism SEVEL KRISHNAN 18 Thiruvengadam Street Extensions East Raja Annamalaipuram Chennai 600028 Landline 24617660 mobile 99400 95670 CC: naranann; Oppiliappan ; ; ; RamanujaandDesika From: sridharyaamunanDate: Sat, 3 Jan 2009 10:04:39 +0400Re: Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali) Dear swaminAdiyean SridharThere are no thenkalai fanatics. Lot of thankalayars worship Swamidesikan also. Can you please hear some upanyasams of SRI U.VE.VELLUKUDI KRISHNAN SWAMI.AdiyeanRamanuja dasansridharOn 1/2/09, आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 > wrote:> ---------- Forwarded message ----------> आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 >> Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 11:50 AM> Fwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali)> naranann (AT) (DOT) in>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------> आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 >> Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:53 AM> Fwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali)> vishnurdn (AT) (DOT) co.in, kidambi seshadri <krseshadri84 >,> "sailesh......... joined in srm" <saileshrjn >, Veeraraghavan <> radharaghu >, Balakrishnan ramanuaj Dasan <alwarbalan2008 >>>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------> आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 >> Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:50 AM> Total Mails.....(vadakali)> vishnurdn (AT) (DOT) co.in, Veeraraghavan <radharaghu >,> "sailesh......... joined in srm" <saileshrjn >, kidambi seshadri <> krseshadri84 >>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------> *swamidesikadasan* <swamidesikadasan >> Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 8:24 PM> Re:> sailesh rajan <saileshrjn >,Adisesh Iyengar<adisesh92 >>>>> Dear all,>> There are many proofs that Swami desikan and also Manavala> Mamuni are Vadakalai. The first one is the thirumeni at Sri> Thiruvahindipuram of Swami desikan is Adorning Vadakalai thiruman.Which was> made by Swami desikan himself.>> Next thatacharirars(periya Tirumalai Nambi),uncle of Sri Bashyakarar are> Vadakalai. If u visit Sreeperambuthur the Archa Thirumeni of Sri bashyakarar> adorns Vadakalai thiruman. secondly when the Tridandi jyer covered the> Vimanam of Sribashyakarar and half of perumal sannidhi they didn't allow> media and even Srivaishnavs to take photograph. The vimanam in> Sriperambuthur contains Vdakalaithiruman. Once Sriprambuthur was a Vadakalai> shrine but was converted to Tekalai around 150 years ago,when the new Embar> mutt was started. The temple in Sripreambuthur was taken care by the> Sriperambuthur Tirumalia EEchambadi. Thus Vdakalayars built a new Desikan> Sannidhi in Sriperambuthur near the Purshkarini.In Sriperambuthur the Chinna> Jyer covered the Vimana of Perumal 1/3rd only..... This is so because there> are Vadakalai there.>> Nextly we can talk about Sri Manavala Mamuni and other Tenkaayars.> Tenkalayars say that they don't have the caste feelings . They perform> Samasrayanam and also include Bagawatargal in Srivaishnava Ghosti. Its> wrong, in the Bashyam of Sri periyavachan Pillai(said as Tenkalai) to> Amalanadipiran, Sri Vachan pillai clearly states that Thirupannar is a> Panchamar and even thought he said Amalan the cast can't be excluded. Thus> in Periyavachan Pillai Vyakyanam it is clearly said that they see the> differences in Cast but say that all people who perform Samasrayanam are> equal. But when u see the Bashyam of Sri Swami Vedanta Desikan, Swami> mentions that Thirupannar is a Avadoothi and not a ordinary man.Few> tenkalayars say that Swami desikan was consider Pillailokachariar and> Periyavachan Pillai as his Acharayn. These information are totally Fake. If> they were acharyans then swami desikan would have mention them in his> Granthas like Adikara Sangraham and many. Swami desikan had the ideology of> Bashyakara and thus he didn't agree with the ideas of Pillailokachariar.> Swami desikan had good relationship with All the acharyars at this time. Few> fanatics say that Swami had composed stotras on Periyavachan Pillai , if> composed can they name it? Only 28 stotras are composed by swami desikan. To> say many Tenkalayars(now considering) like Dodachary and Prativaid> bayankaram anna had composed many granthas on Swami desikan. Prativadi title> was offered to Anna by Nayanachariar(son of Swami desikan) and he had his> Samasrayanam done under Swami Nayanachariar . Later he became a sishya of> Manavala Mamuni. Dodyachariar who was earlier as Sishyan of Manavala Mamui> was influenced by Swai deiskan ideology wrote VedantadesikaPrakashika. Till> now there are Vamsikas of Doddachariar in Nagapattnam. Prativadi anna> composed SaptatRatnamalika.>> *Redarding Thayar......>> *There are lot of contravesy between the two Kalayars regarding the matter> of Sri. The vadakali sect say that thayar too is Paramatma as lord is. But> this Paksham was not accepted by Tenkalayars.On this contraversy Swami> desikan had written in his Chattusloki Bashyam regarding the Piratti. All> tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan pillai and also Nampillai, Nanjyer,> Parasara Bhattar in their EEdu and other Srisookthis tell that thayar is> Paramatham. This difference was created after the Grandson of Koil Annan.> Then, Tenkalayars condisder Perumal Keupa as *Nirhetu Krupa* but Vadakalayas> say that its Hetu krupa . Hert means reasoned. Thus acoording to the TK> point of view , when Perumal is Nirhetukrupi, Why cant he shower his Krupa> on all Jeevatmas and make them all Srivaishnavs and give moksham? If thayar> is not given importance in Tenkalai Sampraday then, They must nor adorn> Srichoorna, Then must not be called as Srivaishnavas.As Tenkalaayars don't> Sanskrit ,they take wrong meanings of Sri Desikan Granthas and others.>> *Regarding Saranagathi*>> Tenkalayars say that Prapati is the only way which leads moksha and the> other ways like Gnana,karma and Bakthi willn't lead to Moksham. But we say> that all the 4 ways lead to Moksham but Prapatti is a very easy form to> Moksha. To Tenkalai Fanatics: If bakthi,Gnana and Karma yogams will not lead> to Moksham then how did Prahaladhan,Bishmar and many rishis went to Moksham.>> *Regarding Thiruman*>> The old and Prachina Thiruman is the U or Vadakalai Thiruman. Pancharatra> Agama states that "Arabhya Nasika Mulam: nasika mulam arabhya: nasadikesa> payantam anasamularabhya" which means that the Urdhva Pundram must start> between the two eyebrows and end at the Kesham(hair). *It is clear that the> Tenkalai thiruman is a new form because the Tenkalayars adorn different> thirumans at different places. Ex: Y thiruman at face and Tamil PAA similar> to U thiruman in the body. *So the tenkalai thiruman was derived frm the> Vadakali (already mentioned that Bashyakarar was Vadakali).IF there were two> thirumans at the Time of Swami desikan than, swmai would have mentioned> inhis grantha named Saccaritra raksha. Few tenkalayars say that there are> thirumans(tenkalai) in many Stambams and Moolavars in Karnataka. In those> around 1600-1700 many temples were rennovated,in karnataka,due to Mughal> Invasion. During the rennovation the Moolavars and utsavars were replaced> with Thiruman. Actually to say in Silpa Sastram or in any Puranama there are> no reference to any thiruman. But the Tenkalayars say that Tenkalai thiruman> was the first. There are many evidences of Vadakalai thiruman in many> countirs like Egypt,Greece. The photos of these places are available at the> website of Stephan Knapp. There are many Vadakali Thirumans in> Kanchipuram,Srirangam,Tirumalai,and amny Divyadesam but they were destroyed> by the Tenkalayars. At present there are few Thiruman in Tirupati and> Kanchipuram. The Ramanujar at Tirumalai was a Vadakalai sannidhi the name> itsef Signifies that it belongs to Vadakalai (bashyakarar) but was undertake> by Tenkalayars.>> *Regarding Thaniyan*>> There are two Thaniyans for Swami desikan in Sanskrit and one Tamil Thaniyan> composed by Sri Pillailokachary(tenkalai head)>> The thaniyans are *"Sreeman Venkatanatharyaha Kavitharkika Kesari *> *Vedanthacharya Varyome Sannidhattam Sadahrudhim "> * & *> "Ramanuja Dayapatram Gnana Vairagya Bushanam> Sreemath Venkatanatharyaham Vande Vedanta Desikam"*> These two thaniyans were composed by Sri Nayanachariar(swami's Son) and> Brahmatantrar swami.>> Manavalamamunigal has a sanskrit Thaniyan>> *"Sreesailesha Dayapatram Deepatyadi Gunarnavam> Yetinda Pravanam Vandhe Ramyaja Mataram Munim"*> This thaniyan was composed by sri narayan Jyer one of the sishyas of> Manavala Mamunigal and it was mentioned in VARAVARAMUNI SHATAKAM by> Yerumbiappa. But the present Tenkalayars say that the Thaniyan was supposed> to be recited by Lord Ranganatha Itself. There are many stories like, When> Sriranganathan came as a small boy and recited Thaniyan for Manavala Mamuni,> the bagawats in Ghosti asked for Thirunal Pattu to by said by the boy. Then> this itself signifies that there was Thirunal Pathhu for some other> Acharayar, that is none other than Swami Deiskan.> *> Another Avatara OF Ramanuajar*>> There are many stories like Manavala Mamuni was the avatara of Ramanuajar.> This is one of the lies told by tenkalayars. It is said that Sri BAshyakarar> didn't warite and spread the essence of Divya PRabandham . Thus he took> another avatara as Manavala Mamuni. There are also other stories like Sriman> Narayanana granted 200 years of life span for Adiseshan and asked him to> take avatar as Ramanujar and as Ramanmujar lived for only 120 years he took> another avatara as Manavala Mamuni(swami survived for 73years only). The> 120+73=193. Then what about 7 years? Then did Adiseshan took another avatara> for 7 years?>> Then Vadakalayars can clearly say that Swmai desikan was the amasam of Sri> Bashyakarar . Swmai desiakn had authored many Granthas liek Munivahanaboham,> Madurakavi Hridayam,Dravidopanishad Saram,etc., on Divya Prabandham in> Sanskrit and Tamil. Swami Bashyakarara lived as a Sanyasi most of his life.> Thus Swami desikan was born as a Amsam of Sri Bashyakarara to explain how a> Srivaishnavan must lead a life as Grihastan. Swami desikan had written> Vyakyanams for Thiruvoimozhi in Sanskrit. Swami desikan wrote 73,000 padi> but it was lost due to carelessness. And swami desikan had written Many> Rakshai's for Pancharatra Agama,Srivaishanva Sampraday and many. So swami> Desikan is the Amsam of Sri Bashyakarar.>> *About Manavala Mamuni*>> Manavala Mamunigal had his Sribashya Kalakshebam done under the Grandson of> Kidambi Appular(a Vadakalate) and aslo he took his Preksha Mantram or> Sanyasam under the 1st Azhagiyasingar of Sri Ahobila Mutt(a Vadakala MUtt).> Many say that the Ahobila Mutt itself was a Tenkalai Mutt . There are no> PRooves for their Paksham. And also The 6th Azhagiyasingar of Ahobila Mutt> had written many comentires on Swami Desikan Granthas especially Sankalpa> Suryodhayam. Tenkalayars mainly consider Ahobila MUtt as tenkalai because if> Ahobila mutt is Vadakalai then Manavalamamuni will be Vadakalai. 1st> Azhagiyasingar was born on 1378 and Manavalamamuni on 1370. There may be a> age difference but 1st Azhagiyasingar got Sanyashasram from Narasimhan at a> young age of 20. Thus frm him got sanyashram Manavalamamuni.The Chinna Jyer> of Andhara recently appointed a new Jyer called Ahobila Jyer to suppress the> Ahobila Mutt activities. The Chinna Jyer of andhara has been giving> Sanyashasam like SSLC ceritificate to all. His mutt which was started by his> Grandpa was a new mutt which was established in late 1950's.FEw tenkalayars> say that Manavalamamuni didn't take Sanyasam as Manavala Mamuni took> Sanyasam from Satakopa jyer and not Adivan Satakopa Jyer. In our> Srivaishnava Sampraday Ahobila Mutt is the only Muttt which bears the name> Van Satakopan or Satakopan for its Peetadipathi . After giving> Sanyashasramam to Manavala Mamuni Satakopa Jyer or Adivan Satakopa Jyer was> titled the name Adi van by Nammalwar itself and Nammalwar gave his Hamsa> Mudrai to 1st Azhagiyasingar. Even today in Alwar Thirunagari Alwar> Brahmotsavam Ahobila Mutt obtains 1st three Days Mariyadhai.Anyone who wants> to have the Darshan of Hamsa Mudrai of Nammalwar can see them in Ahobila> Mutt Aradhan Mundapam.>>> In the year 1730-1759 Swami desikan Thaniyans in many places were replace by> the above thaniyan of Manavala Mamuni. EX: Even thousg the temple of meloke> is Tenkalai(converted) the sattumurai vazhi thirunamam is recited for Swami> desikan only. This was by the Order of Narasimha Udayar of Mysore that they> shuldn't replace the thaniyan of Swami desikan with Manaval Mamuni.Even> today though the temple of Melkote and Thirunarayanapuram are Tenkalai> Parakala Mutt Swami obtains first MAridhai and aslo the Thaniyan and Vazhi> Thirunamam of Swmai desikan is recited daily. As per the Kalvettu of> Srirangam Swami Desikan's thaniyan was recited in the Temple and houses of> Srirangam as swami Desikan restarted the Adhyayana Utsavam. Few Tenkalayars> say that why there are two Thaniyans for Swmai desikan? There must be only> one Taniyan. Then the answer is AnantanPillai of Tirumalai also had two> Thanyians . To say even Manavalamamuni had two Thaniyas but the earlier was> rejected and a new starting with Srisailesa Daapatram was accepted. Is this> what Manavala Mamuni or ther Tenkalai Acharayr wants?>> When we consider Tirumala Parakala Mutt was the Darmadatta Mutt but after> the advent of Chinna Jyer Mutt in Tirumala all the powers were Trasferred to> Tenkalai,which is mentioned in Tirumalai Vozhagu. The Desikan Thaniyan and> Vazhithirunamam were recited in Tirumala till 1910's but was stopped by the> Tenkalai Mutt. In Tirupati Swami desikan had Thiruvadi Thozhudal of> Govindarajan but the tenkalayars who were jelous stoped this Utsava> toooo......>> There are many Simhasanadipatis like Kandadai,Tirumalai Nallan> Chakravarthi,Tirumalai> EEchambadi,Tholapachariar,Tholappar,Thatachariar,Anantalvan,Illayavillai,Kidambi,Assuri,Veeravilli,etc...,> in Vadakali. The Acharyars like Periyanambi,Parasarabattar and others in> Sriranga were compelled and converted to Tenkalai. Actually the 74> Simhasanadipadis doesn't have Manavalamamuni but today Acharyars like> Parasara Bhattar , Periya Nambi,Tirumalai Anantanpillai,and otheres were> compelled to accept Manavalamamuni as acharyan.>> The thaniyans and also Vazhithirunamam of Manavala Mamuni was a copy of> Swami Desikan's.>> In the vazhi thirunamam of Manavala Mamuni it is said that *MANAVALAMAMUNIYE> INNUM ORU NOOTRANDU IRUM.* What does this mean when ever a man had completed> 100 years it is correct to say that innum oru nootrandu irum. But Manavala> Mamuni lived only for 73 years.So it is clear that the Tenkalayars must say> *MANAVALAMAMUNIYE INNUM ORU YEZHUBATHI IRANDU ORU ANDU IRUM* . So its clear> that Tenkalayars coppied the Vazhithirunamam of Swami Desikan.>> Then in the Tirumala Oriental Collage all the Granthas of Poorvachariars> were collected at that time they found that in the Srisookthies of Manavala> MAmuni it is found that another Thaniyans by Appilar was used ex:Yetiraja> Saptati. So frm this it is clear that the Tenkalayars had created a new> Srivaishnava Sect an copied the matter frm Vadakali Sampradyam.>> In Upadesaratnamala too Swami Manavalamamuni followed the method of swami> desikan's Prabandhasaram and to say the Pasurams are similar to> Prabandhasaram and Adhikara Sangraham.>>>> We are not Manavala Mamuni Dooshkas but we are condemn him iam tell the> facts abt our Sampraday ans not to hurt anybody........>> *Regarding Prabandham*>> . Here onwards i want to tell that Swami Manavalamanuni followed> both the footpaths of Swami desikan and Pillai Lokachariar. Tenkalai> fanatics say that alwars themself had composed 4000 Divya Prabandham and> Ramanuja Nootrandadi is not included in it because Swami desikan in his> Prabandha Saram had included Ramanuja Nootrandadi in 4000 Divya PRabandham.> I*S this the ACHARYA BAKTHI SHOWN BY TENKALAYARS TO SRI RAMANUJAR?* Actually> 4000 DP composed by alwars contain 3892 pasurams and this was rounded to> 4000 and was called Naalaiyira Divya Prabandham PRE Bashyakarar period.> After composing the Iramanuja Nootrandadi Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar handed> over this Prabandham to Bashyakarar. But bashyakarar was angry because it> was composed on him. Bashyakara sishyas pleaded him and finally Bashyakarar> said that this Prabandham must be recited after the 4000 Divya> Prabandham(beacuse it contains information about Bashyakarar Acharyars) .> Thus Ramanuja Nootandadi Was added to 4000 DP . More over the sum> 3892+108=4000 was also Suitable to say Naaliyira Divya Prabandham. Thus Sri> Swami Desikan included in his Prabandha Saaram included Ramanuja Notrandadi> as a part of Divya Prabandham (in Iyerpa, last 1000) . But Swami Desikan> Dweshi's didn't agree this Paksham as the Prabandham was composed by> Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar ,then he too is a Alwar. The answer for this> question is "Even thought the Prabandham was composed by Amudanar , it was> in Praise of Sri Bashyakarar. " This was mentioned not only by Swami desikan> but also by Sri manavala Mamunni in his Upadesa Ratnamala. Manavala Mamuni> had composed Upadesa Ratnamala by following Swami desikan Prabandham like> Adikara Sangraham,Prabandha Saram. Pasurams like "Poigai muni boodathar> Peyalwar..........." were used in Upadesaratnamala. Swami Manavalamamuni had> mentioned the birth month of each alwar but finally he mentions> MaduraKavigal,Andal and Bashyakarar. Then according to Nakshatram> MadurakaviAlwar must come after Ramanjar , but is not in that order. So,> Manavala Mamuni had composed the Pasuram like the the "matha Pitha> Yuvatayas" of Parasara Bhattar in which Parasara Bhatter describes all> alwars as angam of Nammalwar,so he mentions Nammalwar lastly. Similarly> Manava Mamuni had mentioned Bashyakarar at last and then he starts> Nathamuni(Pasuram 37-38 in Upadesa Ratnamalai). This itself Signifies that> Manavala Mamuni had also accepted the same order as sri Desikan did.. Even> Tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan Pilli folowed the order of Adding> RAMANUJA NOOTRANDADI to 4000 DIVYA PRABANDHAM.>>>> Thus the present Tenkalayars had altered Divya Prabandham so that they can> have many divisions mentioned like Ashtadasa Bedahah....18 Differences..>> There are differences even in Perialwar Thirumozhi. Vadakalayars consider> Perialwar thirumozhi which consists even Thirupallandu in it . But the> Tenkalayars had divided Perialwar Thirumozhi into two divisions ,> Thirupallanu and Perialawar Thirumozhi. As per Tenkalai Sampradaya ONNAM> PATHU of PErialwar Thirumozhi have 90 Pasurams only as thirupallandu was> seperated from it. Actually Pathu means 10*10 i.e, a total of 100 Pasurams> in One pathu. But the 1st pathu according to Tenkalayars contain 90 Pasurams> only.>> Thus the Tenkalayars even divided the Divya Prabandham as they wish.>> Above, i had mentioned few facts and prooves that Ahobila Mutt was,is and> will be Vadakalai. Here Iam adding few more facts. Recently The Chinna Jyer> of Andhra had given a Sanyasam Degree to a new IAS officer and named him as> Ahobila Ramanuja jyer. This is because they want a Tenklai Ahobila Mutt.> Then we* Vadakalayars must ask for A Vadakalai Periya Jyer Mutt in Tirupati> as 31st and 32nd Jyer in Periya Jyer Mutt were Vadakalai*.Why cant the> previous Jyer choose a Tenkalai Jyer as as successer? R there no Tenkalayars> sutiable to that post except Vadakalayars? SO we Vadakalayars too must ask> for a Vadakali Periya Jyer Mutt.Even So the Chinna Jyer of Andhra must stop> doing these Tenkalai Pracharam and must develop Ramanuja Sampraday.Being a> Srivaishnava Sanyasi how can he rennovate Siva temples and other Demi Gods> temples? Is this waht mention in Ramanja Sampradaya or Tenkalai Sampraday?> As said by Manavala Mamuni one must selest a acharyan who has high Gnanam> and Anustanam thus a sihsyan will get a good guidance.But most of the> Tenkalai Acharayars nowadasays doesn't have Anustanam . Only few are> folowinf the words of Manavala MAmuni(said as Tenkalai acharayar) .>>> Many Tenklayars have the opinion that Vadakalayars don't give much> importance to Divya Prabandham and they neglect it. ITs totally false. Swami> deiskan Had written many Granthas on Prandham like Munivahana Boham,Prabanda> Saram,73,000 padi on DP(which was lost) , Dravidopanishad,etcc., Swami> Deiskan consider Vedam and Divya Prabandham as two eyes . Without an eye we> cant see Perumal. As Vedic religion we must for Vedam and Divya Prabandham> is for our Atma Ujeevanam. But most Tenkalayars neglect Vedam . Sri> BAshyakarar during his last days told 5 main sentences. 1st sentence is that> "Learn Sri BAshyam and Preach it to others" 2nd is to Learn "Bagawat Vishyam> and preach it to others"... And the other sentenses continues....>> But swami Desikan followed the 1st sentece of Sri BAshyakara and lead his> life. But the Tenkalayars don;t know this and asay that Swami DEsikan had> neglected Divya Prabandham. Since that give To Sri Bashyam and Vedas....> Prabandham is for Atma Ujeevanam........>>> Thus Vadakalai Sampradaya is oldest and Tenkalai was a division from> Vadakali.>>> *Regarding Chinna Jyer of Andhra*>> The Tridandi Jyer had> converted many sishyas of Swayamacharayars and various Mutt into his> sishyas. We srivaishnavas must save those who had converted or had their> samasrayanam done under him. If a Acharayan is not qualified , then the> Sishyan can chabge his acharayan which is mentioned in Pillailokacharirar> Ashtadasa Rahasyam. So we srivaishnavas must save people from the clutches> of a A Vaishnavan. He must stop Tenakali Prachara and work for Ramanuaja> Darshanam.He had converted sishyas of Many Vadakali Acharyas in Andhra like> Vasudevachari,etc...,>> Acording to Our Dhram Shastra no one must cross the ocean. Whenever they do> this they are not allowed to enter the temples.But the Tridandi had gone to> countires like Australia,America,etc..., Is this what said in Dharam Sastra?>> There are few sishyas of This Chinna Jyer saying that he is another avatara> of Ramaujar. Then did Ramaujar Worshiped or went to demi god temples?>>> *> 4 times Sastnaga Namaskaram*>> Different SampradhAyins prostrate beforethe Lord once , twice or four times> .In Vadakalai SampradhAyam , it is done four> times .One can use Yukti Vaadhams and point out thefour NamaskaraNams are> for the four directions or for the four hands of the Lord holding the disc> ,the conch , the abhaya Mudhra and the Lotus or Gadhai. One can also view it> as salutations to the Four vyUhams etc. There is however more doctrinal> reasons based on AchAryA's teachings . Let us look at them now :>> Both Swamy AlavanthAr in His StOtra Ratna slOkam and Swamy Desikan elsewhere> has given the reasons for the 4 NamaskArams as Svaroopa Sodhanams . When we> are visiting a Temple of Sriman NarayaNan , one prostrates ( ShAshtAnga> NamaskArams) before the Bali Peetam and then enter the temple .The First> NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of> the Lord's Paratvam ( Superiority as ParadEvathai). The second NamaskAram is> to comfort ourselves> with His Soulabhya guNam ( ease of access inspite of His Paratvam) of the> Lord .>> The Third namaskAram is to remind ourselves of His Praapyatvam ( Being the> ultimate goal , PradhAna PurushArtham ) .>> The Fourth NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of His SaraNyatvam or His> staying as the SarvalOka SaraNyan and Sarva Rakshakan .>> When one does the 4 NamaskArams this way , one's ego is pushed aside and one> approaches the Lord's sannidhi with the right attitude and Jn~Anam .>> We prostrate 4 times before AchAryan ,Parents and elder Persons . One can> explain this with the Veda PramANam of AchArya DevO Bhava et al .>> The alternate four reaons for NamaskAram in PerumAL Sannidhi based on Swamy> AlavanthAr's stOtra Ratna slOkam and PeriyaVaacchAn PiLLai's commentary is> summed up in my 2005 posting in Sriranga Sri archives (Volume I) and> Oppiliappan archives ( Part II ) :>> http://www.ibiblio.org/sripedia//archi<http://www.ibiblio.org/sripedia//archives/apr05/msg00071.html>> ves/apr05/msg00071.html>> and>> http://www.ibiblio.org/oppiliappan/archives/apr05/msg00015.html>> The two folded palms in the AshtAnga NamaskAram have their own significance> , The right palm of the devotee is said to represent the lotus feet of the> Lord and the left palm , the head of the devotee.>>>> *Desikan Dooshakargal> *> Prativadi Bayankaram ANnan in his> Saptati Ratnamalika quotes that> *"गà¥à¤°à¥‚व वधी हमà¥à¤¸à¤® à¤à¥à¤¦à¤¾à¤šà¤¾à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ सिषà¥à¤¯> जना बकती हीना येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ शà¥à¤¯à¥à¤¹à¥ :|> येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ विषà¥à¤£à¥ कारà¥à¤¨à¥à¤¯ ढूरà¥à¤¹à¤¾:> कà¥à¤¤à¥‹ मà¥à¤•à¥à¤¤à¤¿ वारà¥à¤¤à¤¾ हि तादà¥à¤° विधानाम || "> *which means when anybody talks bad about Swami desikan, then he will be> disliked by Yetindra(Bashyakarar) and this leads to Vishnu KArunya> Dhoorahah(loss of Vishnu Karunyam) and Lord will not grant Moksha for them.>> These slokas were written by sri Prativadi Bayankaram Annan(now Tenkalai> Achayan) . So Tenkalayars must know this slokas and must not talk bad about> swmai deiskan and his Granthas.>>>>>>> Courtesy: PrabandhaSara Vaibhavam>-- To Succeed in Life, You need two things:IGNORANCE and CONFIDENCE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 5, 2009 Report Share Posted January 5, 2009 Only few % of Iyengars know our Sampadaya and None talks about Manavala Mamuni............... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 Sorry to all. In my earliar mail by mistake I have not typed a word 'not'. The correct sentence is given here. We should not see that whether Mamunigal or Desigan is Vadakalai or Thenkali. We must follow their advice VP SRINIVASAN On 1/5/09, srinivasan kanna <kanna1957 wrote: If we fight like this which is great Vadakalai or Thenkalai, very soon we can expect East kalai and West Kalai. And our honourable, respected great Chief Minister Sriman U.Ve. Karunanidhi swamigal will introduce Dravida kalai and instruct all Vaishnava's to follow strictly that. This the story of two cats fought for Roti and monkey cheated them. Forgot the Kalai difference. We will do lot kainkaryams. More people are still under poverty line. We must do something. We must develop education in our country. We should see that whether Mamunigal or Desigan is Vadakalai or Thenkali. We must follow their advice. They have not told us to fight. Please give good information through this mail. If the fight continues, defenitly this mail groups will be stopped by concerned authorities. I am Thenkalai. But Sriman U.Ve. Gopala Desikan swamy of Uppliappan Koil have become very close to me in friendship. He appriciated my ideas. Has he ignored me as Thenkalai? So, pl forgot the differences and fogot that mail also. Vichanthangal Prathivathi Bayangaram Srinivasan On 1/2/09, आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 wrote: ---------- Forwarded message ----------आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 11:50 AMFwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali)naranann ---------- Forwarded message ----------आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:53 AMFwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali)vishnurdn, kidambi seshadri <krseshadri84, " sailesh......... joined in srm " <saileshrjn, Veeraraghavan <radharaghu, Balakrishnan ramanuaj Dasan <alwarbalan2008 ---------- Forwarded message ----------आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:50 AMTotal Mails.....(vadakali)vishnurdn, Veeraraghavan <radharaghu, " sailesh......... joined in srm " <saileshrjn, kidambi seshadri <krseshadri84 ---------- Forwarded message ----------swamidesikadasan <swamidesikadasan Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 8:24 PMRe:sailesh rajan <saileshrjn,Adisesh Iyengar<adisesh92 Dear all, There are many proofs that Swami desikan and also Manavala Mamuni are Vadakalai. The first one is the thirumeni at Sri Thiruvahindipuram of Swami desikan is Adorning Vadakalai thiruman.Which was made by Swami desikan himself. Next thatacharirars(periya Tirumalai Nambi),uncle of Sri Bashyakarar are Vadakalai. If u visit Sreeperambuthur the Archa Thirumeni of Sri bashyakarar adorns Vadakalai thiruman. secondly when the Tridandi jyer covered the Vimanam of Sribashyakarar and half of perumal sannidhi they didn't allow media and even Srivaishnavs to take photograph. The vimanam in Sriperambuthur contains Vdakalaithiruman. Once Sriprambuthur was a Vadakalai shrine but was converted to Tekalai around 150 years ago,when the new Embar mutt was started. The temple in Sripreambuthur was taken care by the Sriperambuthur Tirumalia EEchambadi. Thus Vdakalayars built a new Desikan Sannidhi in Sriperambuthur near the Purshkarini.In Sriperambuthur the Chinna Jyer covered the Vimana of Perumal 1/3rd only..... This is so because there are Vadakalai there. Nextly we can talk about Sri Manavala Mamuni and other Tenkaayars. Tenkalayars say that they don't have the caste feelings . They perform Samasrayanam and also include Bagawatargal in Srivaishnava Ghosti. Its wrong, in the Bashyam of Sri periyavachan Pillai(said as Tenkalai) to Amalanadipiran, Sri Vachan pillai clearly states that Thirupannar is a Panchamar and even thought he said Amalan the cast can't be excluded. Thus in Periyavachan Pillai Vyakyanam it is clearly said that they see the differences in Cast but say that all people who perform Samasrayanam are equal. But when u see the Bashyam of Sri Swami Vedanta Desikan, Swami mentions that Thirupannar is a Avadoothi and not a ordinary man.Few tenkalayars say that Swami desikan was consider Pillailokachariar and Periyavachan Pillai as his Acharayn. These information are totally Fake. If they were acharyans then swami desikan would have mention them in his Granthas like Adikara Sangraham and many. Swami desikan had the ideology of Bashyakara and thus he didn't agree with the ideas of Pillailokachariar. Swami desikan had good relationship with All the acharyars at this time. Few fanatics say that Swami had composed stotras on Periyavachan Pillai , if composed can they name it? Only 28 stotras are composed by swami desikan. To say many Tenkalayars(now considering) like Dodachary and Prativaid bayankaram anna had composed many granthas on Swami desikan. Prativadi title was offered to Anna by Nayanachariar(son of Swami desikan) and he had his Samasrayanam done under Swami Nayanachariar . Later he became a sishya of Manavala Mamuni. Dodyachariar who was earlier as Sishyan of Manavala Mamui was influenced by Swai deiskan ideology wrote VedantadesikaPrakashika. Till now there are Vamsikas of Doddachariar in Nagapattnam. Prativadi anna composed SaptatRatnamalika. Redarding Thayar......There are lot of contravesy between the two Kalayars regarding the matter of Sri. The vadakali sect say that thayar too is Paramatma as lord is. But this Paksham was not accepted by Tenkalayars.On this contraversy Swami desikan had written in his Chattusloki Bashyam regarding the Piratti. All tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan pillai and also Nampillai, Nanjyer, Parasara Bhattar in their EEdu and other Srisookthis tell that thayar is Paramatham. This difference was created after the Grandson of Koil Annan. Then, Tenkalayars condisder Perumal Keupa as Nirhetu Krupa but Vadakalayas say that its Hetu krupa . Hert means reasoned. Thus acoording to the TK point of view , when Perumal is Nirhetukrupi, Why cant he shower his Krupa on all Jeevatmas and make them all Srivaishnavs and give moksham? If thayar is not given importance in Tenkalai Sampraday then, They must nor adorn Srichoorna, Then must not be called as Srivaishnavas.As Tenkalaayars don't Sanskrit ,they take wrong meanings of Sri Desikan Granthas and others. Regarding SaranagathiTenkalayars say that Prapati is the only way which leads moksha and the other ways like Gnana,karma and Bakthi willn't lead to Moksham. But we say that all the 4 ways lead to Moksham but Prapatti is a very easy form to Moksha. To Tenkalai Fanatics: If bakthi,Gnana and Karma yogams will not lead to Moksham then how did Prahaladhan,Bishmar and many rishis went to Moksham. Regarding Thiruman The old and Prachina Thiruman is the U or Vadakalai Thiruman. Pancharatra Agama states that " Arabhya Nasika Mulam: nasika mulam arabhya: nasadikesa payantam anasamularabhya " which means that the Urdhva Pundram must start between the two eyebrows and end at the Kesham(hair). It is clear that the Tenkalai thiruman is a new form because the Tenkalayars adorn different thirumans at different places. Ex: Y thiruman at face and Tamil PAA similar to U thiruman in the body. So the tenkalai thiruman was derived frm the Vadakali (already mentioned that Bashyakarar was Vadakali).IF there were two thirumans at the Time of Swami desikan than, swmai would have mentioned inhis grantha named Saccaritra raksha. Few tenkalayars say that there are thirumans(tenkalai) in many Stambams and Moolavars in Karnataka. In those around 1600-1700 many temples were rennovated,in karnataka,due to Mughal Invasion. During the rennovation the Moolavars and utsavars were replaced with Thiruman. Actually to say in Silpa Sastram or in any Puranama there are no reference to any thiruman. But the Tenkalayars say that Tenkalai thiruman was the first. There are many evidences of Vadakalai thiruman in many countirs like Egypt,Greece. The photos of these places are available at the website of Stephan Knapp. There are many Vadakali Thirumans in Kanchipuram,Srirangam,Tirumalai,and amny Divyadesam but they were destroyed by the Tenkalayars. At present there are few Thiruman in Tirupati and Kanchipuram. The Ramanujar at Tirumalai was a Vadakalai sannidhi the name itsef Signifies that it belongs to Vadakalai (bashyakarar) but was undertake by Tenkalayars. Regarding Thaniyan There are two Thaniyans for Swami desikan in Sanskrit and one Tamil Thaniyan composed by Sri Pillailokachary(tenkalai head)The thaniyans are " Sreeman Venkatanatharyaha Kavitharkika Kesari Vedanthacharya Varyome Sannidhattam Sadahrudhim " & " Ramanuja Dayapatram Gnana Vairagya BushanamSreemath Venkatanatharyaham Vande Vedanta Desikam " These two thaniyans were composed by Sri Nayanachariar(swami's Son) and Brahmatantrar swami. Manavalamamunigal has a sanskrit Thaniyan " Sreesailesha Dayapatram Deepatyadi Gunarnavam Yetinda Pravanam Vandhe Ramyaja Mataram Munim " This thaniyan was composed by sri narayan Jyer one of the sishyas of Manavala Mamunigal and it was mentioned in VARAVARAMUNI SHATAKAM by Yerumbiappa. But the present Tenkalayars say that the Thaniyan was supposed to be recited by Lord Ranganatha Itself. There are many stories like, When Sriranganathan came as a small boy and recited Thaniyan for Manavala Mamuni, the bagawats in Ghosti asked for Thirunal Pattu to by said by the boy. Then this itself signifies that there was Thirunal Pathhu for some other Acharayar, that is none other than Swami Deiskan. Another Avatara OF RamanuajarThere are many stories like Manavala Mamuni was the avatara of Ramanuajar. This is one of the lies told by tenkalayars. It is said that Sri BAshyakarar didn't warite and spread the essence of Divya PRabandham . Thus he took another avatara as Manavala Mamuni. There are also other stories like Sriman Narayanana granted 200 years of life span for Adiseshan and asked him to take avatar as Ramanujar and as Ramanmujar lived for only 120 years he took another avatara as Manavala Mamuni(swami survived for 73years only). The 120+73=193. Then what about 7 years? Then did Adiseshan took another avatara for 7 years? Then Vadakalayars can clearly say that Swmai desikan was the amasam of Sri Bashyakarar . Swmai desiakn had authored many Granthas liek Munivahanaboham, Madurakavi Hridayam,Dravidopanishad Saram,etc., on Divya Prabandham in Sanskrit and Tamil. Swami Bashyakarara lived as a Sanyasi most of his life. Thus Swami desikan was born as a Amsam of Sri Bashyakarara to explain how a Srivaishnavan must lead a life as Grihastan. Swami desikan had written Vyakyanams for Thiruvoimozhi in Sanskrit. Swami desikan wrote 73,000 padi but it was lost due to carelessness. And swami desikan had written Many Rakshai's for Pancharatra Agama,Srivaishanva Sampraday and many. So swami Desikan is the Amsam of Sri Bashyakarar. About Manavala Mamuni Manavala Mamunigal had his Sribashya Kalakshebam done under the Grandson of Kidambi Appular(a Vadakalate) and aslo he took his Preksha Mantram or Sanyasam under the 1st Azhagiyasingar of Sri Ahobila Mutt(a Vadakala MUtt). Many say that the Ahobila Mutt itself was a Tenkalai Mutt . There are no PRooves for their Paksham. And also The 6th Azhagiyasingar of Ahobila Mutt had written many comentires on Swami Desikan Granthas especially Sankalpa Suryodhayam. Tenkalayars mainly consider Ahobila MUtt as tenkalai because if Ahobila mutt is Vadakalai then Manavalamamuni will be Vadakalai. 1st Azhagiyasingar was born on 1378 and Manavalamamuni on 1370. There may be a age difference but 1st Azhagiyasingar got Sanyashasram from Narasimhan at a young age of 20. Thus frm him got sanyashram Manavalamamuni.The Chinna Jyer of Andhara recently appointed a new Jyer called Ahobila Jyer to suppress the Ahobila Mutt activities. The Chinna Jyer of andhara has been giving Sanyashasam like SSLC ceritificate to all. His mutt which was started by his Grandpa was a new mutt which was established in late 1950's.FEw tenkalayars say that Manavalamamuni didn't take Sanyasam as Manavala Mamuni took Sanyasam from Satakopa jyer and not Adivan Satakopa Jyer. In our Srivaishnava Sampraday Ahobila Mutt is the only Muttt which bears the name Van Satakopan or Satakopan for its Peetadipathi . After giving Sanyashasramam to Manavala Mamuni Satakopa Jyer or Adivan Satakopa Jyer was titled the name Adi van by Nammalwar itself and Nammalwar gave his Hamsa Mudrai to 1st Azhagiyasingar. Even today in Alwar Thirunagari Alwar Brahmotsavam Ahobila Mutt obtains 1st three Days Mariyadhai.Anyone who wants to have the Darshan of Hamsa Mudrai of Nammalwar can see them in Ahobila Mutt Aradhan Mundapam. In the year 1730-1759 Swami desikan Thaniyans in many places were replace by the above thaniyan of Manavala Mamuni. EX: Even thousg the temple of meloke is Tenkalai(converted) the sattumurai vazhi thirunamam is recited for Swami desikan only. This was by the Order of Narasimha Udayar of Mysore that they shuldn't replace the thaniyan of Swami desikan with Manaval Mamuni.Even today though the temple of Melkote and Thirunarayanapuram are Tenkalai Parakala Mutt Swami obtains first MAridhai and aslo the Thaniyan and Vazhi Thirunamam of Swmai desikan is recited daily. As per the Kalvettu of Srirangam Swami Desikan's thaniyan was recited in the Temple and houses of Srirangam as swami Desikan restarted the Adhyayana Utsavam. Few Tenkalayars say that why there are two Thaniyans for Swmai desikan? There must be only one Taniyan. Then the answer is AnantanPillai of Tirumalai also had two Thanyians . To say even Manavalamamuni had two Thaniyas but the earlier was rejected and a new starting with Srisailesa Daapatram was accepted. Is this what Manavala Mamuni or ther Tenkalai Acharayr wants? When we consider Tirumala Parakala Mutt was the Darmadatta Mutt but after the advent of Chinna Jyer Mutt in Tirumala all the powers were Trasferred to Tenkalai,which is mentioned in Tirumalai Vozhagu. The Desikan Thaniyan and Vazhithirunamam were recited in Tirumala till 1910's but was stopped by the Tenkalai Mutt. In Tirupati Swami desikan had Thiruvadi Thozhudal of Govindarajan but the tenkalayars who were jelous stoped this Utsava toooo...... There are many Simhasanadipatis like Kandadai,Tirumalai Nallan Chakravarthi,Tirumalai EEchambadi,Tholapachariar,Tholappar,Thatachariar,Anantalvan,Illayavillai,Kidambi,Assuri,Veeravilli,etc..., in Vadakali. The Acharyars like Periyanambi,Parasarabattar and others in Sriranga were compelled and converted to Tenkalai. Actually the 74 Simhasanadipadis doesn't have Manavalamamuni but today Acharyars like Parasara Bhattar , Periya Nambi,Tirumalai Anantanpillai,and otheres were compelled to accept Manavalamamuni as acharyan. The thaniyans and also Vazhithirunamam of Manavala Mamuni was a copy of Swami Desikan's.In the vazhi thirunamam of Manavala Mamuni it is said that MANAVALAMAMUNIYE INNUM ORU NOOTRANDU IRUM. What does this mean when ever a man had completed 100 years it is correct to say that innum oru nootrandu irum. But Manavala Mamuni lived only for 73 years.So it is clear that the Tenkalayars must say MANAVALAMAMUNIYE INNUM ORU YEZHUBATHI IRANDU ORU ANDU IRUM . So its clear that Tenkalayars coppied the Vazhithirunamam of Swami Desikan. Then in the Tirumala Oriental Collage all the Granthas of Poorvachariars were collected at that time they found that in the Srisookthies of Manavala MAmuni it is found that another Thaniyans by Appilar was used ex:Yetiraja Saptati. So frm this it is clear that the Tenkalayars had created a new Srivaishnava Sect an copied the matter frm Vadakali Sampradyam. In Upadesaratnamala too Swami Manavalamamuni followed the method of swami desikan's Prabandhasaram and to say the Pasurams are similar to Prabandhasaram and Adhikara Sangraham. We are not Manavala Mamuni Dooshkas but we are condemn him iam tell the facts abt our Sampraday ans not to hurt anybody........ Regarding Prabandham . Here onwards i want to tell that Swami Manavalamanuni followed both the footpaths of Swami desikan and Pillai Lokachariar. Tenkalai fanatics say that alwars themself had composed 4000 Divya Prabandham and Ramanuja Nootrandadi is not included in it because Swami desikan in his Prabandha Saram had included Ramanuja Nootrandadi in 4000 Divya PRabandham. IS this the ACHARYA BAKTHI SHOWN BY TENKALAYARS TO SRI RAMANUJAR? Actually 4000 DP composed by alwars contain 3892 pasurams and this was rounded to 4000 and was called Naalaiyira Divya Prabandham PRE Bashyakarar period. After composing the Iramanuja Nootrandadi Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar handed over this Prabandham to Bashyakarar. But bashyakarar was angry because it was composed on him. Bashyakara sishyas pleaded him and finally Bashyakarar said that this Prabandham must be recited after the 4000 Divya Prabandham(beacuse it contains information about Bashyakarar Acharyars) . Thus Ramanuja Nootandadi Was added to 4000 DP . More over the sum 3892+108=4000 was also Suitable to say Naaliyira Divya Prabandham. Thus Sri Swami Desikan included in his Prabandha Saaram included Ramanuja Notrandadi as a part of Divya Prabandham (in Iyerpa, last 1000) . But Swami Desikan Dweshi's didn't agree this Paksham as the Prabandham was composed by Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar ,then he too is a Alwar. The answer for this question is " Even thought the Prabandham was composed by Amudanar , it was in Praise of Sri Bashyakarar. " This was mentioned not only by Swami desikan but also by Sri manavala Mamunni in his Upadesa Ratnamala. Manavala Mamuni had composed Upadesa Ratnamala by following Swami desikan Prabandham like Adikara Sangraham,Prabandha Saram. Pasurams like " Poigai muni boodathar Peyalwar........... " were used in Upadesaratnamala. Swami Manavalamamuni had mentioned the birth month of each alwar but finally he mentions MaduraKavigal,Andal and Bashyakarar. Then according to Nakshatram MadurakaviAlwar must come after Ramanjar , but is not in that order. So, Manavala Mamuni had composed the Pasuram like the the " matha Pitha Yuvatayas " of Parasara Bhattar in which Parasara Bhatter describes all alwars as angam of Nammalwar,so he mentions Nammalwar lastly. Similarly Manava Mamuni had mentioned Bashyakarar at last and then he starts Nathamuni(Pasuram 37-38 in Upadesa Ratnamalai). This itself Signifies that Manavala Mamuni had also accepted the same order as sri Desikan did.. Even Tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan Pilli folowed the order of Adding RAMANUJA NOOTRANDADI to 4000 DIVYA PRABANDHAM. Thus the present Tenkalayars had altered Divya Prabandham so that they can have many divisions mentioned like Ashtadasa Bedahah....18 Differences.. There are differences even in Perialwar Thirumozhi. Vadakalayars consider Perialwar thirumozhi which consists even Thirupallandu in it . But the Tenkalayars had divided Perialwar Thirumozhi into two divisions , Thirupallanu and Perialawar Thirumozhi. As per Tenkalai Sampradaya ONNAM PATHU of PErialwar Thirumozhi have 90 Pasurams only as thirupallandu was seperated from it. Actually Pathu means 10*10 i.e, a total of 100 Pasurams in One pathu. But the 1st pathu according to Tenkalayars contain 90 Pasurams only. Thus the Tenkalayars even divided the Divya Prabandham as they wish. Above, i had mentioned few facts and prooves that Ahobila Mutt was,is and will be Vadakalai. Here Iam adding few more facts. Recently The Chinna Jyer of Andhra had given a Sanyasam Degree to a new IAS officer and named him as Ahobila Ramanuja jyer. This is because they want a Tenklai Ahobila Mutt. Then we Vadakalayars must ask for A Vadakalai Periya Jyer Mutt in Tirupati as 31st and 32nd Jyer in Periya Jyer Mutt were Vadakalai.Why cant the previous Jyer choose a Tenkalai Jyer as as successer? R there no Tenkalayars sutiable to that post except Vadakalayars? SO we Vadakalayars too must ask for a Vadakali Periya Jyer Mutt.Even So the Chinna Jyer of Andhra must stop doing these Tenkalai Pracharam and must develop Ramanuja Sampraday.Being a Srivaishnava Sanyasi how can he rennovate Siva temples and other Demi Gods temples? Is this waht mention in Ramanja Sampradaya or Tenkalai Sampraday? As said by Manavala Mamuni one must selest a acharyan who has high Gnanam and Anustanam thus a sihsyan will get a good guidance.But most of the Tenkalai Acharayars nowadasays doesn't have Anustanam . Only few are folowinf the words of Manavala MAmuni(said as Tenkalai acharayar) . Many Tenklayars have the opinion that Vadakalayars don't give much importance to Divya Prabandham and they neglect it. ITs totally false. Swami deiskan Had written many Granthas on Prandham like Munivahana Boham,Prabanda Saram,73,000 padi on DP(which was lost) , Dravidopanishad,etcc., Swami Deiskan consider Vedam and Divya Prabandham as two eyes . Without an eye we cant see Perumal. As Vedic religion we must for Vedam and Divya Prabandham is for our Atma Ujeevanam. But most Tenkalayars neglect Vedam . Sri BAshyakarar during his last days told 5 main sentences. 1st sentence is that " Learn Sri BAshyam and Preach it to others " 2nd is to Learn " Bagawat Vishyam and preach it to others " ... And the other sentenses continues.... But swami Desikan followed the 1st sentece of Sri BAshyakara and lead his life. But the Tenkalayars don;t know this and asay that Swami DEsikan had neglected Divya Prabandham. Since that give To Sri Bashyam and Vedas.... Prabandham is for Atma Ujeevanam........ Thus Vadakalai Sampradaya is oldest and Tenkalai was a division from Vadakali. Regarding Chinna Jyer of Andhra The Tridandi Jyer had converted many sishyas of Swayamacharayars and various Mutt into his sishyas. We srivaishnavas must save those who had converted or had their samasrayanam done under him. If a Acharayan is not qualified , then the Sishyan can chabge his acharayan which is mentioned in Pillailokacharirar Ashtadasa Rahasyam. So we srivaishnavas must save people from the clutches of a A Vaishnavan. He must stop Tenakali Prachara and work for Ramanuaja Darshanam.He had converted sishyas of Many Vadakali Acharyas in Andhra like Vasudevachari,etc..., Acording to Our Dhram Shastra no one must cross the ocean. Whenever they do this they are not allowed to enter the temples.But the Tridandi had gone to countires like Australia,America,etc..., Is this what said in Dharam Sastra? There are few sishyas of This Chinna Jyer saying that he is another avatara of Ramaujar. Then did Ramaujar Worshiped or went to demi god temples? 4 times Sastnaga Namaskaram Different SampradhAyins prostrate beforethe Lord once , twice or four times .In Vadakalai SampradhAyam , it is done four times .One can use Yukti Vaadhams and point out thefour NamaskaraNams are for the four directions or for the four hands of the Lord holding the disc ,the conch , the abhaya Mudhra and the Lotus or Gadhai. One can also view it as salutations to the Four vyUhams etc. There is however more doctrinal reasons based on AchAryA's teachings . Let us look at them now : Both Swamy AlavanthAr in His StOtra Ratna slOkam and Swamy Desikan elsewhere has given the reasons for the 4 NamaskArams as Svaroopa Sodhanams . When we are visiting a Temple of Sriman NarayaNan , one prostrates ( ShAshtAnga NamaskArams) before the Bali Peetam and then enter the temple .The First NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of the Lord's Paratvam ( Superiority as ParadEvathai). The second NamaskAram is to comfort ourselves with His Soulabhya guNam ( ease of access inspite of His Paratvam) of the Lord . The Third namaskAram is to remind ourselves of His Praapyatvam ( Being the ultimate goal , PradhAna PurushArtham ) . The Fourth NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of His SaraNyatvam or His staying as the SarvalOka SaraNyan and Sarva Rakshakan . When one does the 4 NamaskArams this way , one's ego is pushed aside and one approaches the Lord's sannidhi with the right attitude and Jn~Anam . We prostrate 4 times before AchAryan ,Parents and elder Persons . One can explain this with the Veda PramANam of AchArya DevO Bhava et al . The alternate four reaons for NamaskAram in PerumAL Sannidhi based on Swamy AlavanthAr's stOtra Ratna slOkam and PeriyaVaacchAn PiLLai's commentary is summed up in my 2005 posting in Sriranga Sri archives (Volume I) and Oppiliappan archives ( Part II ) : http://www.ibiblio.org/sripedia//archives/apr05/msg00071.html and http://www.ibiblio.org/oppiliappan/archives/apr05/msg00015.html The two folded palms in the AshtAnga NamaskAram have their own significance , The right palm of the devotee is said to represent the lotus feet of the Lord and the left palm , the head of the devotee. Desikan Dooshakargal Prativadi Bayankaram ANnan in his Saptati Ratnamalika quotes that " गà¥à¤°à¥‚व वधी हमà¥à¤¸à¤® à¤à¥à¤¦à¤¾à¤šà¤¾à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ सिषà¥à¤¯ जना बकती हीना येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ शà¥à¤¯à¥à¤¹à¥ :|येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ विषà¥à¤£à¥ कारà¥à¤¨à¥à¤¯ ढूरà¥à¤¹à¤¾: कà¥à¤¤à¥‹ मà¥à¤•à¥à¤¤à¤¿ वारà¥à¤¤à¤¾ हि तादà¥à¤° विधानाम || " which means when anybody talks bad about Swami desikan, then he will be disliked by Yetindra(Bashyakarar) and this leads to Vishnu KArunya Dhoorahah(loss of Vishnu Karunyam) and Lord will not grant Moksha for them. These slokas were written by sri Prativadi Bayankaram Annan(now Tenkalai Achayan) . So Tenkalayars must know this slokas and must not talk bad about swmai deiskan and his Granthas. Courtesy: PrabandhaSara Vaibhavam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 To the Moderator Why are u permitting this type of perverted emails to be posted in your group again after the spate of emails in the last two days advising to stop such emails?? If you do not have any bias then you should post this message also for the benefit of every member nyayavadi62 --- On Mon, 5/1/09, आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 wrote: आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali)naranannCc: krseshadri84, vishnurdn, saileshrjn, swamidesikadasan, sridharyaamunan, Date: Monday, 5 January, 2009, 2:16 PM Only few % of Iyengars know our Sampadaya and None talks about Manavala Mamuni...... ......... Add more friends to your messenger and enjoy! Invite them now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 SRI : || Hare Krishna. Dear & Respectful Bhagavthas. Adiyen PanAmams. As has been preached and practiced by our Noble and Great Azhwars, Acharyas , BhagavathAs and Bhaktas of Sriman Narayana, let our heads be decorated by the dust from The Feet Of Those who are followers of The Doctrine of Swami Ramanuja - thus ourselves being termed as Sri Ramanuja Dasas. In The Unique work of Thodaradippodi Azhwar - " ThirumAlai " - he makes an emphatic dictum in verse 43 : amaravOrangamArum vEdamOr nAngumOdhi * thamargaLil thalaivarAya sAdhi andhaNargaLEnum * numargaLai pazhipparagil nodippadhOr aLavil * AngE avargaLthAm pulaiyar pOlum arangamAnagaruLAnE. "Even if some people have mastered The VedAs & Upanishads, even if they are chaste brahmins, if they speak ill of your BhaktAs, Oh Lord Sri RanganAthA, they are verily Pulayars, ( said to be the very low caste people ) " . By what is said by Thodaradipodi Azhwar , we disqualify ourselves to be brahmins, when we talk ill of people who worship The Supreme Lord Sriman Narayana, more so The followers of Swami Ramanuja. In today's world , many of us cannot even qualify to be termed as brahmins, except few blessed ones, as we have contravened many eligibility criteia ( or more truly, constrained to cross the lines drawn by Dharma sAstrAs ) for qualifying to be brahmins . To speak ill of some sect or other , who are followers of Sath SampradAyam, Sri Ramanuja Darsanam, the path laid by Swami Ramanuja, based on some differences that may be the there, is a great sin. More important is the fact that by dividing ourselves, we become the root cause of our own destruction. Vaishnava is one who cannot think, say or do anything that will hurt others. That being the case, to use strong and unpleasant words against any Ramanuja Dasas is not right and it may need , if at all there is any, doing prayaschitha.We should follow strictly the quality of " advEsham " with sincere efforts. Let us not waste this Great Birth as Sri Ramanuja Dasas, who uphold Sriman Narayana as The Supreme Lord, in matters which will definitely be not pleasant to Our Lord. Our life span is not sufficient even for larning the fundamental steps of our Sath SampradAyam. That is why we resort to SaraNgathi, expressing our total inability to practice any other means of salvation. Let us also try to extend our helping hand to serve the needy poor, elders and bring our youth into the groove of sathsampradAyam which will be pleasing to Our Lord. May Swami Ramanuja, Swami Desikan, Swami ManavAla MAmuni and other stlwarts of our SampradAyam Bless us to concentrate on worthy things in life, instead of losing the very little time we have for " LIVING"-- see verse 3 of "ThirumAlai " - ( vEdam nool prAyam nooru...... ) . The present AchAryAs and learned leaders & scholars of Sri Vaishnavism have a Great Task to see that all The VaishnavAs are brought together under one umbrella by constant and consistant endeavours, as Lord Sri Krishna brought all yadavAs under Govardhana Giri . Adiyen Sri Ramanuja Dasan, Kombur Vankeepuram Madhavan. Please Help The Needy as it is Service To God.--- On Mon, 1/5/09, Dr.V.Sadagopan <yennappan wrote: Dr.V.Sadagopan <yennappan Re: Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali) Cc: naranann, oppiliappan , Date: Monday, January 5, 2009, 6:37 PM  Dear Sri Venkatraman : Thank you for your mail . As an editor of Oppiliappan , Sarnagathi , Malolan and few other groups , I make it a point to reject mailings to my groups relating to outbursts based on Kalai dhvEsham . There are inded differences in the doctrines of two kalais . There is no neeed however to engage in battles to prove who is right or wrong . This is just a waste of time . One can fruitfully send one's time following AchArya and AzhwAr Sri Sookthis and staying close to one's own AchArya Paramparai and KulAchArams . Let us focus on serving our AchAryans , BhagavathAs and the dhivya dampathis and leave the rest out . There is so much to learn and so little time to get closer to even a small portion of the Bhagavad anubhavam housed in the SrI Sookthis of AzhwArs and AchAryans . NamO Sriman NaarAyaNAya , V.Sadagopan ---- Original Message ----- Krishnan Sevel Venkataraman Cc: naranann (AT) (DOT) in ; oppiliappan ; ; ; ramanujaanddesika Sunday, January 04, 2009 11:51 PM RE: Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali ) Dear Swamin adiyen Sevel Krishnan would like to make the following suggestions: Let us be proud at the outset that we are born as Brahmins and that too as Vaishnavit. I do not know far it is true- I am told that to born as a vaishnavit, you should have born as a brahmin in your last birth and because of your good deeds, you have born now as a Vaishnavit. If the above is accepted, why should we worry about whether we belongs to thenkalai or vadakalai cult. Our Narayanan is the supreme deity and those who believe in it, should not even think of any differences among these two cults.If my observation is wrong, please enlighten me further. Our younger generation are not aware of these differences and by discussing trhese differences, we are taking a big risk in their belief in Vaishavism SEVEL KRISHNAN 18 Thiruvengadam Street Extensions East Raja Annamalaipuram Chennai 600028 Landline 24617660 mobile 99400 95670 CC: naranann (AT) (DOT) in; Oppiliappan; ; ; RamanujaandDesikasridharyaamunan@ gmail.comSat, 3 Jan 2009 10:04:39 +0400Re: Re: Total Mails.....(vadakali ) Dear swaminAdiyean SridharThere are no thenkalai fanatics. Lot of thankalayars worship Swamidesikan also. Can you please hear some upanyasams of SRI U.VE.VELLUKUDI KRISHNAN SWAMI.AdiyeanRamanuja dasansridharOn 1/2/09, आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com> wrote:> ---------- Forwarded message ----------> आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>> Fri, Jan 2, 2009 at 11:50 AM> Fwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali )> naranann (AT) (DOT) in>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------> आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>> Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:53 AM> Fwd: Total Mails.....(vadakali )> vishnurdn (AT) (DOT) co.in, kidambi seshadri <krseshadri84@ gmail.com>,> "sailesh.... ..... joined in srm" <saileshrjn (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, Veeraraghavan <> radharaghu (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, Balakrishnan ramanuaj Dasan <alwarbalan2008@ gmail.com>>>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------> आदिशेष à¤à¤¯à¥‡à¤‚गार <adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>> Thu, Jan 1, 2009 at 9:50 AM> Total Mails.....(vadakali )> vishnurdn (AT) (DOT) co.in, Veeraraghavan <radharaghu (AT) gmail (DOT) com>,> "sailesh.... ..... joined in srm" <saileshrjn (AT) gmail (DOT) com>, kidambi seshadri <> krseshadri84@ gmail.com>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------> *swamidesikadasan* <swamidesikadasan@ gmail.com>> Sat, Dec 27, 2008 at 8:24 PM> Re:> sailesh rajan <saileshrjn (AT) gmail (DOT) com>,Adisesh Iyengar<adisesh92 (AT) gmail (DOT) com>>>>> Dear all,>> There are many proofs that Swami desikan and also Manavala> Mamuni are Vadakalai. The first one is the thirumeni at Sri> Thiruvahindipuram of Swami desikan is Adorning Vadakalai thiruman.Which was> made by Swami desikan himself.>> Next thatacharirars( periya Tirumalai Nambi),uncle of Sri Bashyakarar are> Vadakalai. If u visit Sreeperambuthur the Archa Thirumeni of Sri bashyakarar> adorns Vadakalai thiruman. secondly when the Tridandi jyer covered the> Vimanam of Sribashyakarar and half of perumal sannidhi they didn't allow> media and even Srivaishnavs to take photograph. The vimanam in> Sriperambuthur contains Vdakalaithiruman. Once Sriprambuthur was a Vadakalai> shrine but was converted to Tekalai around 150 years ago,when the new Embar> mutt was started. The temple in Sripreambuthur was taken care by the> Sriperambuthur Tirumalia EEchambadi. Thus Vdakalayars built a new Desikan> Sannidhi in Sriperambuthur near the Purshkarini. In Sriperambuthur the Chinna> Jyer covered the Vimana of Perumal 1/3rd only..... This is so because there> are Vadakalai there.>> Nextly we can talk about Sri Manavala Mamuni and other Tenkaayars.> Tenkalayars say that they don't have the caste feelings . They perform> Samasrayanam and also include Bagawatargal in Srivaishnava Ghosti. Its> wrong, in the Bashyam of Sri periyavachan Pillai(said as Tenkalai) to> Amalanadipiran, Sri Vachan pillai clearly states that Thirupannar is a> Panchamar and even thought he said Amalan the cast can't be excluded. Thus> in Periyavachan Pillai Vyakyanam it is clearly said that they see the> differences in Cast but say that all people who perform Samasrayanam are> equal. But when u see the Bashyam of Sri Swami Vedanta Desikan, Swami> mentions that Thirupannar is a Avadoothi and not a ordinary man.Few> tenkalayars say that Swami desikan was consider Pillailokachariar and> Periyavachan Pillai as his Acharayn. These information are totally Fake. If> they were acharyans then swami desikan would have mention them in his> Granthas like Adikara Sangraham and many. Swami desikan had the ideology of> Bashyakara and thus he didn't agree with the ideas of Pillailokachariar.> Swami desikan had good relationship with All the acharyars at this time. Few> fanatics say that Swami had composed stotras on Periyavachan Pillai , if> composed can they name it? Only 28 stotras are composed by swami desikan. To> say many Tenkalayars( now considering) like Dodachary and Prativaid> bayankaram anna had composed many granthas on Swami desikan. Prativadi title> was offered to Anna by Nayanachariar( son of Swami desikan) and he had his> Samasrayanam done under Swami Nayanachariar . Later he became a sishya of> Manavala Mamuni. Dodyachariar who was earlier as Sishyan of Manavala Mamui> was influenced by Swai deiskan ideology wrote VedantadesikaPrakas hika. Till> now there are Vamsikas of Doddachariar in Nagapattnam. Prativadi anna> composed SaptatRatnamalika.>> *Redarding Thayar......>> *There are lot of contravesy between the two Kalayars regarding the matter> of Sri. The vadakali sect say that thayar too is Paramatma as lord is. But> this Paksham was not accepted by Tenkalayars. On this contraversy Swami> desikan had written in his Chattusloki Bashyam regarding the Piratti. All> tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan pillai and also Nampillai, Nanjyer,> Parasara Bhattar in their EEdu and other Srisookthis tell that thayar is> Paramatham. This difference was created after the Grandson of Koil Annan.> Then, Tenkalayars condisder Perumal Keupa as *Nirhetu Krupa* but Vadakalayas> say that its Hetu krupa . Hert means reasoned. Thus acoording to the TK> point of view , when Perumal is Nirhetukrupi, Why cant he shower his Krupa> on all Jeevatmas and make them all Srivaishnavs and give moksham? If thayar> is not given importance in Tenkalai Sampraday then, They must nor adorn> Srichoorna, Then must not be called as Srivaishnavas. As Tenkalaayars don't> Sanskrit ,they take wrong meanings of Sri Desikan Granthas and others.>> *Regarding Saranagathi*>> Tenkalayars say that Prapati is the only way which leads moksha and the> other ways like Gnana,karma and Bakthi willn't lead to Moksham. But we say> that all the 4 ways lead to Moksham but Prapatti is a very easy form to> Moksha. To Tenkalai Fanatics: If bakthi,Gnana and Karma yogams will not lead> to Moksham then how did Prahaladhan, Bishmar and many rishis went to Moksham.>> *Regarding Thiruman*>> The old and Prachina Thiruman is the U or Vadakalai Thiruman. Pancharatra> Agama states that "Arabhya Nasika Mulam: nasika mulam arabhya: nasadikesa> payantam anasamularabhya" which means that the Urdhva Pundram must start> between the two eyebrows and end at the Kesham(hair) . *It is clear that the> Tenkalai thiruman is a new form because the Tenkalayars adorn different> thirumans at different places. Ex: Y thiruman at face and Tamil PAA similar> to U thiruman in the body. *So the tenkalai thiruman was derived frm the> Vadakali (already mentioned that Bashyakarar was Vadakali).IF there were two> thirumans at the Time of Swami desikan than, swmai would have mentioned> inhis grantha named Saccaritra raksha. Few tenkalayars say that there are> thirumans(tenkalai) in many Stambams and Moolavars in Karnataka. In those> around 1600-1700 many temples were rennovated,in karnataka,due to Mughal> Invasion. During the rennovation the Moolavars and utsavars were replaced> with Thiruman. Actually to say in Silpa Sastram or in any Puranama there are> no reference to any thiruman. But the Tenkalayars say that Tenkalai thiruman> was the first. There are many evidences of Vadakalai thiruman in many> countirs like Egypt,Greece. The photos of these places are available at the> website of Stephan Knapp. There are many Vadakali Thirumans in> Kanchipuram, Srirangam, Tirumalai, and amny Divyadesam but they were destroyed> by the Tenkalayars. At present there are few Thiruman in Tirupati and> Kanchipuram. The Ramanujar at Tirumalai was a Vadakalai sannidhi the name> itsef Signifies that it belongs to Vadakalai (bashyakarar) but was undertake> by Tenkalayars.>> *Regarding Thaniyan*>> There are two Thaniyans for Swami desikan in Sanskrit and one Tamil Thaniyan> composed by Sri Pillailokachary( tenkalai head)>> The thaniyans are *"Sreeman Venkatanatharyaha Kavitharkika Kesari *> *Vedanthacharya Varyome Sannidhattam Sadahrudhim "> * & *> "Ramanuja Dayapatram Gnana Vairagya Bushanam> Sreemath Venkatanatharyaham Vande Vedanta Desikam"*> These two thaniyans were composed by Sri Nayanachariar( swami's Son) and> Brahmatantrar swami.>> Manavalamamunigal has a sanskrit Thaniyan>> *"Sreesailesha Dayapatram Deepatyadi Gunarnavam> Yetinda Pravanam Vandhe Ramyaja Mataram Munim"*> This thaniyan was composed by sri narayan Jyer one of the sishyas of> Manavala Mamunigal and it was mentioned in VARAVARAMUNI SHATAKAM by> Yerumbiappa. But the present Tenkalayars say that the Thaniyan was supposed> to be recited by Lord Ranganatha Itself. There are many stories like, When> Sriranganathan came as a small boy and recited Thaniyan for Manavala Mamuni,> the bagawats in Ghosti asked for Thirunal Pattu to by said by the boy. Then> this itself signifies that there was Thirunal Pathhu for some other> Acharayar, that is none other than Swami Deiskan.> *> Another Avatara OF Ramanuajar*>> There are many stories like Manavala Mamuni was the avatara of Ramanuajar.> This is one of the lies told by tenkalayars. It is said that Sri BAshyakarar> didn't warite and spread the essence of Divya PRabandham . Thus he took> another avatara as Manavala Mamuni. There are also other stories like Sriman> Narayanana granted 200 years of life span for Adiseshan and asked him to> take avatar as Ramanujar and as Ramanmujar lived for only 120 years he took> another avatara as Manavala Mamuni(swami survived for 73years only). The> 120+73=193. Then what about 7 years? Then did Adiseshan took another avatara> for 7 years?>> Then Vadakalayars can clearly say that Swmai desikan was the amasam of Sri> Bashyakarar . Swmai desiakn had authored many Granthas liek Munivahanaboham,> Madurakavi Hridayam,Dravidopan ishad Saram,etc., on Divya Prabandham in> Sanskrit and Tamil. Swami Bashyakarara lived as a Sanyasi most of his life.> Thus Swami desikan was born as a Amsam of Sri Bashyakarara to explain how a> Srivaishnavan must lead a life as Grihastan. Swami desikan had written> Vyakyanams for Thiruvoimozhi in Sanskrit. Swami desikan wrote 73,000 padi> but it was lost due to carelessness. And swami desikan had written Many> Rakshai's for Pancharatra Agama,Srivaishanva Sampraday and many. So swami> Desikan is the Amsam of Sri Bashyakarar.>> *About Manavala Mamuni*>> Manavala Mamunigal had his Sribashya Kalakshebam done under the Grandson of> Kidambi Appular(a Vadakalate) and aslo he took his Preksha Mantram or> Sanyasam under the 1st Azhagiyasingar of Sri Ahobila Mutt(a Vadakala MUtt).> Many say that the Ahobila Mutt itself was a Tenkalai Mutt . There are no> PRooves for their Paksham. And also The 6th Azhagiyasingar of Ahobila Mutt> had written many comentires on Swami Desikan Granthas especially Sankalpa> Suryodhayam. Tenkalayars mainly consider Ahobila MUtt as tenkalai because if> Ahobila mutt is Vadakalai then Manavalamamuni will be Vadakalai. 1st> Azhagiyasingar was born on 1378 and Manavalamamuni on 1370. There may be a> age difference but 1st Azhagiyasingar got Sanyashasram from Narasimhan at a> young age of 20. Thus frm him got sanyashram Manavalamamuni. The Chinna Jyer> of Andhara recently appointed a new Jyer called Ahobila Jyer to suppress the> Ahobila Mutt activities. The Chinna Jyer of andhara has been giving> Sanyashasam like SSLC ceritificate to all. His mutt which was started by his> Grandpa was a new mutt which was established in late 1950's.FEw tenkalayars> say that Manavalamamuni didn't take Sanyasam as Manavala Mamuni took> Sanyasam from Satakopa jyer and not Adivan Satakopa Jyer. In our> Srivaishnava Sampraday Ahobila Mutt is the only Muttt which bears the name> Van Satakopan or Satakopan for its Peetadipathi . After giving> Sanyashasramam to Manavala Mamuni Satakopa Jyer or Adivan Satakopa Jyer was> titled the name Adi van by Nammalwar itself and Nammalwar gave his Hamsa> Mudrai to 1st Azhagiyasingar. Even today in Alwar Thirunagari Alwar> Brahmotsavam Ahobila Mutt obtains 1st three Days Mariyadhai.Anyone who wants> to have the Darshan of Hamsa Mudrai of Nammalwar can see them in Ahobila> Mutt Aradhan Mundapam.>>> In the year 1730-1759 Swami desikan Thaniyans in many places were replace by> the above thaniyan of Manavala Mamuni. EX: Even thousg the temple of meloke> is Tenkalai(converted) the sattumurai vazhi thirunamam is recited for Swami> desikan only. This was by the Order of Narasimha Udayar of Mysore that they> shuldn't replace the thaniyan of Swami desikan with Manaval Mamuni.Even> today though the temple of Melkote and Thirunarayanapuram are Tenkalai> Parakala Mutt Swami obtains first MAridhai and aslo the Thaniyan and Vazhi> Thirunamam of Swmai desikan is recited daily. As per the Kalvettu of> Srirangam Swami Desikan's thaniyan was recited in the Temple and houses of> Srirangam as swami Desikan restarted the Adhyayana Utsavam. Few Tenkalayars> say that why there are two Thaniyans for Swmai desikan? There must be only> one Taniyan. Then the answer is AnantanPillai of Tirumalai also had two> Thanyians . To say even Manavalamamuni had two Thaniyas but the earlier was> rejected and a new starting with Srisailesa Daapatram was accepted. Is this> what Manavala Mamuni or ther Tenkalai Acharayr wants?>> When we consider Tirumala Parakala Mutt was the Darmadatta Mutt but after> the advent of Chinna Jyer Mutt in Tirumala all the powers were Trasferred to> Tenkalai,which is mentioned in Tirumalai Vozhagu. The Desikan Thaniyan and> Vazhithirunamam were recited in Tirumala till 1910's but was stopped by the> Tenkalai Mutt. In Tirupati Swami desikan had Thiruvadi Thozhudal of> Govindarajan but the tenkalayars who were jelous stoped this Utsava> toooo......>> There are many Simhasanadipatis like Kandadai,Tirumalai Nallan> Chakravarthi, Tirumalai> EEchambadi,Tholapac hariar,Tholappar ,Thatachariar, Anantalvan, Illayavillai, Kidambi,Assuri, Veeravilli, etc...,> in Vadakali. The Acharyars like Periyanambi, Parasarabattar and others in> Sriranga were compelled and converted to Tenkalai. Actually the 74> Simhasanadipadis doesn't have Manavalamamuni but today Acharyars like> Parasara Bhattar , Periya Nambi,Tirumalai Anantanpillai, and otheres were> compelled to accept Manavalamamuni as acharyan.>> The thaniyans and also Vazhithirunamam of Manavala Mamuni was a copy of> Swami Desikan's.>> In the vazhi thirunamam of Manavala Mamuni it is said that *MANAVALAMAMUNIYE> INNUM ORU NOOTRANDU IRUM.* What does this mean when ever a man had completed> 100 years it is correct to say that innum oru nootrandu irum. But Manavala> Mamuni lived only for 73 years.So it is clear that the Tenkalayars must say> *MANAVALAMAMUNIYE INNUM ORU YEZHUBATHI IRANDU ORU ANDU IRUM* . So its clear> that Tenkalayars coppied the Vazhithirunamam of Swami Desikan.>> Then in the Tirumala Oriental Collage all the Granthas of Poorvachariars> were collected at that time they found that in the Srisookthies of Manavala> MAmuni it is found that another Thaniyans by Appilar was used ex:Yetiraja> Saptati. So frm this it is clear that the Tenkalayars had created a new> Srivaishnava Sect an copied the matter frm Vadakali Sampradyam.>> In Upadesaratnamala too Swami Manavalamamuni followed the method of swami> desikan's Prabandhasaram and to say the Pasurams are similar to> Prabandhasaram and Adhikara Sangraham.>>>> We are not Manavala Mamuni Dooshkas but we are condemn him iam tell the> facts abt our Sampraday ans not to hurt anybody..... ...>> *Regarding Prabandham*>> . Here onwards i want to tell that Swami Manavalamanuni followed> both the footpaths of Swami desikan and Pillai Lokachariar. Tenkalai> fanatics say that alwars themself had composed 4000 Divya Prabandham and> Ramanuja Nootrandadi is not included in it because Swami desikan in his> Prabandha Saram had included Ramanuja Nootrandadi in 4000 Divya PRabandham.> I*S this the ACHARYA BAKTHI SHOWN BY TENKALAYARS TO SRI RAMANUJAR?* Actually> 4000 DP composed by alwars contain 3892 pasurams and this was rounded to> 4000 and was called Naalaiyira Divya Prabandham PRE Bashyakarar period.> After composing the Iramanuja Nootrandadi Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar handed> over this Prabandham to Bashyakarar. But bashyakarar was angry because it> was composed on him. Bashyakara sishyas pleaded him and finally Bashyakarar> said that this Prabandham must be recited after the 4000 Divya> Prabandham(beacuse it contains information about Bashyakarar Acharyars) .> Thus Ramanuja Nootandadi Was added to 4000 DP . More over the sum> 3892+108=4000 was also Suitable to say Naaliyira Divya Prabandham. Thus Sri> Swami Desikan included in his Prabandha Saaram included Ramanuja Notrandadi> as a part of Divya Prabandham (in Iyerpa, last 1000) . But Swami Desikan> Dweshi's didn't agree this Paksham as the Prabandham was composed by> Thiruvarangathu Amudhanar ,then he too is a Alwar. The answer for this> question is "Even thought the Prabandham was composed by Amudanar , it was> in Praise of Sri Bashyakarar. " This was mentioned not only by Swami desikan> but also by Sri manavala Mamunni in his Upadesa Ratnamala. Manavala Mamuni> had composed Upadesa Ratnamala by following Swami desikan Prabandham like> Adikara Sangraham,Prabandha Saram. Pasurams like "Poigai muni boodathar> Peyalwar.... ......." were used in Upadesaratnamala. Swami Manavalamamuni had> mentioned the birth month of each alwar but finally he mentions> MaduraKavigal, Andal and Bashyakarar. Then according to Nakshatram> MadurakaviAlwar must come after Ramanjar , but is not in that order. So,> Manavala Mamuni had composed the Pasuram like the the "matha Pitha> Yuvatayas" of Parasara Bhattar in which Parasara Bhatter describes all> alwars as angam of Nammalwar,so he mentions Nammalwar lastly. Similarly> Manava Mamuni had mentioned Bashyakarar at last and then he starts> Nathamuni(Pasuram 37-38 in Upadesa Ratnamalai). This itself Signifies that> Manavala Mamuni had also accepted the same order as sri Desikan did.. Even> Tenkalai Acharyars like Periyavachan Pilli folowed the order of Adding> RAMANUJA NOOTRANDADI to 4000 DIVYA PRABANDHAM.>>>> Thus the present Tenkalayars had altered Divya Prabandham so that they can> have many divisions mentioned like Ashtadasa Bedahah....18 Differences. .>> There are differences even in Perialwar Thirumozhi. Vadakalayars consider> Perialwar thirumozhi which consists even Thirupallandu in it . But the> Tenkalayars had divided Perialwar Thirumozhi into two divisions ,> Thirupallanu and Perialawar Thirumozhi. As per Tenkalai Sampradaya ONNAM> PATHU of PErialwar Thirumozhi have 90 Pasurams only as thirupallandu was> seperated from it. Actually Pathu means 10*10 i.e, a total of 100 Pasurams> in One pathu. But the 1st pathu according to Tenkalayars contain 90 Pasurams> only.>> Thus the Tenkalayars even divided the Divya Prabandham as they wish.>> Above, i had mentioned few facts and prooves that Ahobila Mutt was,is and> will be Vadakalai. Here Iam adding few more facts. Recently The Chinna Jyer> of Andhra had given a Sanyasam Degree to a new IAS officer and named him as> Ahobila Ramanuja jyer. This is because they want a Tenklai Ahobila Mutt.> Then we* Vadakalayars must ask for A Vadakalai Periya Jyer Mutt in Tirupati> as 31st and 32nd Jyer in Periya Jyer Mutt were Vadakalai*.Why cant the> previous Jyer choose a Tenkalai Jyer as as successer? R there no Tenkalayars> sutiable to that post except Vadakalayars? SO we Vadakalayars too must ask> for a Vadakali Periya Jyer Mutt.Even So the Chinna Jyer of Andhra must stop> doing these Tenkalai Pracharam and must develop Ramanuja Sampraday.Being a> Srivaishnava Sanyasi how can he rennovate Siva temples and other Demi Gods> temples? Is this waht mention in Ramanja Sampradaya or Tenkalai Sampraday?> As said by Manavala Mamuni one must selest a acharyan who has high Gnanam> and Anustanam thus a sihsyan will get a good guidance.But most of the> Tenkalai Acharayars nowadasays doesn't have Anustanam . Only few are> folowinf the words of Manavala MAmuni(said as Tenkalai acharayar) .>>> Many Tenklayars have the opinion that Vadakalayars don't give much> importance to Divya Prabandham and they neglect it. ITs totally false. Swami> deiskan Had written many Granthas on Prandham like Munivahana Boham,Prabanda> Saram,73,000 padi on DP(which was lost) , Dravidopanishad, etcc., Swami> Deiskan consider Vedam and Divya Prabandham as two eyes . Without an eye we> cant see Perumal. As Vedic religion we must for Vedam and Divya Prabandham> is for our Atma Ujeevanam. But most Tenkalayars neglect Vedam . Sri> BAshyakarar during his last days told 5 main sentences. 1st sentence is that> "Learn Sri BAshyam and Preach it to others" 2nd is to Learn "Bagawat Vishyam> and preach it to others"... And the other sentenses continues... .>> But swami Desikan followed the 1st sentece of Sri BAshyakara and lead his> life. But the Tenkalayars don;t know this and asay that Swami DEsikan had> neglected Divya Prabandham. Since that give To Sri Bashyam and Vedas....> Prabandham is for Atma Ujeevanam... .....>>> Thus Vadakalai Sampradaya is oldest and Tenkalai was a division from> Vadakali.>>> *Regarding Chinna Jyer of Andhra*>> The Tridandi Jyer had> converted many sishyas of Swayamacharayars and various Mutt into his> sishyas. We srivaishnavas must save those who had converted or had their> samasrayanam done under him. If a Acharayan is not qualified , then the> Sishyan can chabge his acharayan which is mentioned in Pillailokacharirar> Ashtadasa Rahasyam. So we srivaishnavas must save people from the clutches> of a A Vaishnavan. He must stop Tenakali Prachara and work for Ramanuaja> Darshanam.He had converted sishyas of Many Vadakali Acharyas in Andhra like> Vasudevachari, etc...,>> Acording to Our Dhram Shastra no one must cross the ocean. Whenever they do> this they are not allowed to enter the temples.But the Tridandi had gone to> countires like Australia,America, etc..., Is this what said in Dharam Sastra?>> There are few sishyas of This Chinna Jyer saying that he is another avatara> of Ramaujar. Then did Ramaujar Worshiped or went to demi god temples?>>> *> 4 times Sastnaga Namaskaram*>> Different SampradhAyins prostrate beforethe Lord once , twice or four times> .In Vadakalai SampradhAyam , it is done four> times .One can use Yukti Vaadhams and point out thefour NamaskaraNams are> for the four directions or for the four hands of the Lord holding the disc> ,the conch , the abhaya Mudhra and the Lotus or Gadhai. One can also view it> as salutations to the Four vyUhams etc. There is however more doctrinal> reasons based on AchAryA's teachings . Let us look at them now :>> Both Swamy AlavanthAr in His StOtra Ratna slOkam and Swamy Desikan elsewhere> has given the reasons for the 4 NamaskArams as Svaroopa Sodhanams . When we> are visiting a Temple of Sriman NarayaNan , one prostrates ( ShAshtAnga> NamaskArams) before the Bali Peetam and then enter the temple .The First> NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of> the Lord's Paratvam ( Superiority as ParadEvathai) . The second NamaskAram is> to comfort ourselves> with His Soulabhya guNam ( ease of access inspite of His Paratvam) of the> Lord .>> The Third namaskAram is to remind ourselves of His Praapyatvam ( Being the> ultimate goal , PradhAna PurushArtham ) .>> The Fourth NamaskAram is to remind ourselves of His SaraNyatvam or His> staying as the SarvalOka SaraNyan and Sarva Rakshakan .>> When one does the 4 NamaskArams this way , one's ego is pushed aside and one> approaches the Lord's sannidhi with the right attitude and Jn~Anam .>> We prostrate 4 times before AchAryan ,Parents and elder Persons . One can> explain this with the Veda PramANam of AchArya DevO Bhava et al .>> The alternate four reaons for NamaskAram in PerumAL Sannidhi based on Swamy> AlavanthAr's stOtra Ratna slOkam and PeriyaVaacchAn PiLLai's commentary is> summed up in my 2005 posting in Sriranga Sri archives (Volume I) and> Oppiliappan archives ( Part II ) :>> http://www.ibiblio. org/sripedia/ / archi<http://www.ibiblio. org/sripedia/ / archives/ apr05/msg00071. html>> ves/apr05/msg00071. html>> and>> http://www.ibiblio. org/oppiliappan/ archives/ apr05/msg00015. html>> The two folded palms in the AshtAnga NamaskAram have their own significance> , The right palm of the devotee is said to represent the lotus feet of the> Lord and the left palm , the head of the devotee.>>>> *Desikan Dooshakargal> *> Prativadi Bayankaram ANnan in his> Saptati Ratnamalika quotes that> *"गà¥à¤°à¥‚व वधी हमà¥à¤¸à¤® à¤à¥à¤¦à¤¾à¤šà¤¾à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ सिषà¥à¤¯> जना बकती हीना येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ शà¥à¤¯à¥à¤¹à¥ :|> येतिनà¥à¤¦à¥à¤°à¤ªà¥à¤°à¤¿à¤¯à¤¾ विषà¥à¤£à¥ कारà¥à¤¨à¥à¤¯ ढूरà¥à¤¹à¤¾:> कà¥à¤¤à¥‹ मà¥à¤•à¥à¤¤à¤¿ वारà¥à¤¤à¤¾ हि तादà¥à¤° विधानाम || "> *which means when anybody talks bad about Swami desikan, then he will be> disliked by Yetindra(Bashyakara r) and this leads to Vishnu KArunya> Dhoorahah(loss of Vishnu Karunyam) and Lord will not grant Moksha for them.>> These slokas were written by sri Prativadi Bayankaram Annan(now Tenkalai> Achayan) . So Tenkalayars must know this slokas and must not talk bad about> swmai deiskan and his Granthas.>>>>>>> Courtesy: PrabandhaSara Vaibhavam>-- To Succeed in Life, You need two things:IGNORANCE and CONFIDENCE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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