seethaa raama kalyaanam 3

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Post 3

Dear sri vaishNava perunthagaiyeer,

 

Thank you all for the lovely comments and points received. For those waiting to write their views, please do so. I hope the moderator swamin, in our respected sreeman sadagopan will bear with me for having initiated this topic [a good topic - in my opinion].

 

 

I will respond to the points furnished one by one a little later.

 

But my immediate request to sreeman K.P.Sarathy swamy is to furnish that oonjal song in full – and sri bhattar's points in detail. That way it will give all a new line of learning on sreemadh raamaayaNam.

 

 

Why I changed gears to thyaagaraaja krithi is, this krithi is one of the rare krithis [as stated earlier] and also very rich in its content and meaning and is fully connected with seethaa raama kalyaaNam. How and all details we will see as we progress.

As stated earlier in my articles on thyaagaraaja krithis, even the raagam selection by thyaagaraaja swamigaL is

so apt for the occasion, that the raagam itself, to some extent, give the clue to what incident it leads to in sreemadh raamayaNam.

 

Here, for krithi 'inthanuchu' the raagam is guNDakriyaa [or guNTakriyaa or kuNDakriyaa or kuNtakriyaa] – [i am not sure which one to adopt here] – because when I search in the music websites I get all above spellings. So let me go into the meaning of different words here like guNda, guNta or kuNda or kuNTa --

 

 

As per Monier Williams dictionary

 

GuNda – 'scirpus kysoor' – a kind of reed [page 358]

– reed means stalk or grass or straw or stem

 

This means - it is something like a type of grass, which is used as a seat covering for sitting on it and doing some 'kriyaa' – a yagnam like thing – like the 'dharbha aasanam'

 

Or a stalk offered in fire

 

[since I am not a botanical expert I cannot say what is 'scirpus kysoor'

–

can it be stems of 'naayuruvi' in tamil

–

of course cannot be used as a seat but put or placed in the fire as oblation.

Stalks of naayuruvi is used in homams now also – particularly for homams done during auspicious occasions – sudharsana homams, pavithra homams etc]

 

 

No 'gunTa' word is available.

No 'kuNTa' word is also available.

Another kunTha – the second Ta is available and that meaning is a mad man – so no need for us to use that word.

 

 

Then can it be kuNDa – if it is a root verb kuNda then

 

kuNDathE - verb – to burn [page 289 of Monier Williams]

kuNdayathi – verb – to protect

kundathi - verb – to mutilate

 

kuNDa – noun – a vessel for coal, a basin, pot or bowl – [as per rigveda], a clump of dharbha grass, a round hole in ground for receiving water or fire

 

 

kriyaa – dear readers you all know as – an action – doing – performing.

 

So even if it guNDa or kunDa it is ok for me – for all these meanings suit well. But generally used name of this raagam is guNdakriyaa.

 

 

raama's marriage was the occasion where raama was sitting and doing a 'hOma kriyaa' along with seethaa - as elaborately described. In other occasions when a homam or yagnam is performed by raama [like that vaasthu saanthi rites] – no such detailed description is available in vaalmeeki and thyaagaraaja has not done krithi on that. On that great grand pattaabhishEkam – as the name goes it is pouring of holy water from all holy water sources. So no big descriptions of homa kriyaa is available like this marriage time.

 

So the raagam selection is fully apt.

 

Perhaps somebody may raise an objection why you are referring Sanskrit dictionary instead of telugu for the correct name of this raagam and its meaning, for the krithi is in telugu, – to him I have to say most of the raagam names are in sanskrit ONLY.

 

On this particular point our respected moderator Sri Sadagopan swamin will also agree in toto with me -I suppose.

 

Let us continue in next post.

Dhasan

Vasudevan m.g.-- Vasudevan MG

[Guest guest]

SrI:

 

Dear Sriman Vasudevan :

 

It is an auspicious and delightful topic that you have started .

SethA PirAtti and Andal are avathArams of BhUmi Devi and

Andal ; latter has celebrated as You know Her Vedic Wedding with

Lord RanganathA in VaaraNamAyiram Paasurams ( covered in

the 54th e-Sundarasimham e-books) .

 

Look forward to many posts from yourself and the Members

on this auspicious topic !

V.Sadagopan

 

-

MG Vasudevan

oppiliappan ; tiruvenkatam

Thursday, November 29, 2007 6:20 AM

seethaa raama kalyaanam 3

 

Post 3

Dear sri vaishNava perunthagaiyeer,

 

Thank you all for the lovely comments and points received. For those waiting to write their views, please do so. I hope the moderator swamin, in our respected sreeman sadagopan will bear with me for having initiated this topic [a good topic - in my opinion].

 

[Guest guest]

Dear Sirs, forgive me for this e-mail. Seetha Devi is Maha Lakshmi herself, and so, how then she is avatharam of Bhumi Devi ?? Very sorry, for this question . adiyen"Dr. Sadagopan" <yennappan wrote: SrI: Dear Sriman Vasudevan : It is an auspicious and delightful

topic that you have started . SethA PirAtti and Andal are avathArams of BhUmi Devi and Andal ; latter has celebrated as You know Her Vedic Wedding with Lord RanganathA in VaaraNamAyiram Paasurams ( covered in the 54th e-Sundarasimham e-books) . Look forward to many posts from yourself and the Members on this auspicious topic ! V.Sadagopan - MG Vasudevan oppiliappan ; tiruvenkatam Thursday, November 29, 2007 6:20 AM seethaa raama kalyaanam 3 Post 3 Dear sri vaishNava perunthagaiyeer, Thank you all for the lovely comments and points received. For those waiting to write

their views, please do so. I hope the moderator swamin, in our respected sreeman sadagopan will bear with me for having initiated this topic [a good topic - in my opinion].

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Sir Is Bhumi Devi not an avataram of Sri Devi (Lakshmi) herself? Therefore Sita is an avataram of Bhumi Devi as she is from the Earth, and ultimately another form of Sri Devi. This is from my knowledge. Regards Rameshvenkat kanumalla <sridhardikshit wrote: Dear Sirs, forgive me for this e-mail. Seetha Devi is Maha Lakshmi herself, and so,

how then she is avatharam of Bhumi Devi ?? Very sorry, for this question . adiyen"Dr. Sadagopan" <yennappan (AT) computer (DOT) net> wrote: SrI: Dear Sriman Vasudevan : It is an auspicious and delightful topic that you have started . SethA PirAtti and Andal are avathArams of BhUmi Devi and Andal ; latter has celebrated as You know Her Vedic Wedding with Lord RanganathA in VaaraNamAyiram Paasurams ( covered in the 54th

e-Sundarasimham e-books) . Look forward to many posts from yourself and the Members on this auspicious topic ! V.Sadagopan - MG Vasudevan oppiliappan ; tiruvenkatam Thursday, November 29, 2007 6:20 AM

seethaa raama kalyaanam 3 Post 3 Dear sri vaishNava perunthagaiyeer, Thank you all for the lovely comments and points received. For those waiting to write their views, please do so. I hope the moderator swamin, in our respected sreeman sadagopan will bear with me for having initiated this topic [a good topic - in my opinion]. Get easy, one-click access to your favorites. Make your homepage.

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---- Original Message -----

 

venkat kanumalla

Oppiliappan

Cc: gopan sadagopan

Thursday, November 29, 2007 7:52 PM

Re: seethaa raama kalyaanam 3

 

Dear Sirs,

forgive me for this e-mail.

Seetha Devi is Maha Lakshmi herself, how then is she the avatharam of Bhumi Devi ??

Very sorry, for this question .

adiyenRESPONSE:

 

Dear SrI Venkat : These confusions arise from our attempts

to reconcile PurANams , IthihAsams ( UpabrahmaNams)

with Sruthi and Aagamam .

 

Let me assemble some thoughts on Mahaa Lakshmi ,

BhUmi DEvi , SithA Piratti and other divine consorts

of the Lord :

 

The theological and ontological relationships of Goddess

Sri and othe Devis of the Lord need some comments in

this context of potential confusion .

 

For Swami Desika SampradhAyam , Mahaa Lakshmi

is on a par with Her Lord , VishNu & enjoys equal status

with Him and is a Vibhu ( commented in detail in SrI Sthuthi

and also in his commentaries on SrI Sthavam

by Swami Desikan ) .

 

PaancharAthra Agamam ( Lakshmi Tantram) points

out that Sri Devi is different from BhU Devi and

NeeLA DEvi saluted in BhU Sooktham and

NeeLaa Sooktam ; Purusha Sooktham and

Hari Vamsa ( appendix of Mahaa BhArathA )

again point out that BhU DEvi is distinct from

SrI DEvi .

 

The questions arising are :

 

1) Are both of them consorts of the Lord ?

2) What is the ontological status of Bhu devi

with respect to Sri DEvi ?

 

PurANa , ithihAsa , Sruthi pramANams assert

that both are VishNu Pathnis . Swamy Desikan has

composed seperate sthOthrams for them as well

as for GodhA Piratti to indcate that they are distinct

consorts of the Lord .

 

From the ontological point of view , BhU Devi and

NeeLaa DEvi are regarded as two ASPECTS ( AMSAAS)

OF VISHNU SAKTHI , WHICH ACCORDING TO PaancharAthra

Aagamam is the VERY GODDESS LAKSHMI .

 

BhU Devi is the aspect of Kshamaa /tolerance of

Lakshmi and is worshipped with latter as Ubhaya

NaacchiyAr without affecting the unitary character of

Mahaa Lakshmi as the inseperable consort ( anapAyini)

of the Lord enjoying the same status as Her Lord

( yEka Seshithva Yogam , as the means and the goal) .

VishvaksEna samhithai points out that BhU and NeeLA

DEvis are not Vibhus like Mahaa Lakshmi and yet both

are dear to Sriman narayaNa and are His consorts .

 

Ashta Lakshmis are also considered secondary manifestations

of Mahaa lakshmi presiding over 8 sources of wealth .

 

SithA Piraati and AndaL were ayOnijais ( not born out of

human womb) but were discovered by Janakar and PeriyAzhwAr

at the end of their furrows( SithA ) when they were ploughing

the land . According to Srimad RamAyaNam , SithA came out of

the Earth ( Bhu Devi) and returned to Her Mother Earth at

the end of Her avathAra Kaaryam . BhU devi is also the Mother of

NarakAsura in our PurANams (Srimadh BhAgavatham) and

SathyabhAma is considered an amsam of BhU DEvi . RukmiNi

is Mahaa Lakshmi in KrishNAvathAram .

 

In summary , BhU devi and SrI Devi are both the dear wives

of the Lord . One is reminded of the IsAvAsyOpanishad

passage ( PoorNasya PoorNamAdhaya poorNamEvAvaSishyathE)

and Upanishad BhAshyakArar's commentary passage :

" svaroopathO dharmathO vaa anyaTAthvam gacchath

bhOgya - bhOkthru roopam vasthu jjatham " . The PoorNathvam

of Mahaa Lakshmi and BhOgya roopam of NeeLA DEvi can be

understood from here . One can visualize a similar ontological

status for BhUmi DEvi as an amsam of Mahaa Lakshmi ,

while both are the dear consorts of Lord VishNu .

 

Mahaa Lakshmi has three different roles in a VishNu Temple ;

She has Her own Sannidhi( TanikkOil NaacchiyAr as Sri RanganAyaki)

or stays on the side of the Lord as one of the Ubhaya NaacchiyAr or

stays on His chest as Vakshasthala Lakshmi .

 

As TanikkOil NaachiyAr without Her Lord and is known

as AdhikAra archai . We pray to Her First before we go

in to offer worship to Her Lord .

 

As BhOga Archai , She is by the side of Her Lord

as Jaanaki at MadhurAnthakam , BhUmi Devi at

Oppiliappan Sannidhi , VanjuLavalli at NaacchiyAr

Koil or at most of the Sannidhis as one of the Ubhaya

NaaccimAr .

 

As LayArcha Moorthy , She stays on the chest of the Lord to

plead for Her children , who anger Her Lord thru their satha kOti

aparAdhams .

 

Swamy ParAsara Bhattar identified Sri RanganAyaki with

SithA PirAtti and took Her side ( Vide : GuNa Rathna Kosa

SlOkams : Sundarasimham e-book 38 :

http://www.sundarasimham.org ; The finer points about Lakshmi

Tathtvam are housed in Swamy Desikan's commentary on

ChathusslOki and KurEsar's SrI Sthavam .These are also

archived in SundaraSimham.org e-books reelased last year .

 

SrI RanaganAyakai NamO Nama:

 

Daasan , Oppiliappan Koil Varadachari Sadagopan

 

 

 

 

consoidered