question on biographical detail of Tondar-adi-podi AzhwAr

[Guest guest]

Could someone knowledgeable please help me with this question:

 

Tondaradipodi AzhwAr's 2 works " tirupalliezhucchi " and " tirumAlai " -- were they

composed before or after his encounter with Devadevi, the " femme fatale " with

whom, according to traditional biography (per the " AchArya-guru-parampara "

accounts), he had a brief, fateful but life-transforming relationship?

 

Warm Regards,

Sudarshan

 

 

 

 

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[Guest guest]

SrIman Sudarsan :

 

It is good to hear from you .

 

As you indicated , the encounter with

Deva DEvi is referred to by some accounts

and is rejected by others .

 

Granting that such an incident took place

in this Naishtika BrahmachAri AzhwAr's life

steeped in bhakthi for Lord RanganAtha ,

we have to remember that he was engaged in

Nandavana Kaimkaryam , when this incident

is said to have happened .

 

He was engaged in carrying Morning garlands to

Lord Ranganatha and awakening the Lord of the Universe .

It is fair to imagine that the Ranganatha Pativratai AzhwAr

sang ThiruppaLLiyezucchi for SuprabhAtham and woke up

His Lord and offered His MaalA Kaimkaryam .ThiruppaLLiyezucchi

recital in front of the Lord's sannidhi must therefore have been

nithyAnusandhAnam for the AzhwAr

and we are beneficiaries of that nithyAnusandhAnam

even today at Srirangam with the auspicious sound

of VeeNA Naadham .

 

This Sevai might have been interrupted during His time of

infatuation with Deva Devi , if we concede that such an

event took place . Barring factual references , one has to

make use of ykthi vAdham here .

 

ThoNDaradipodi AzhwAr was such a VairAgyasAli

and a Naishtika BrahmachAri at that , it is very hard

for AzhwAr abhimAnis to include this colorful inccident

in His life . This incident however has educational value

about the power of Kaamam and the dhivya dampathy's

intervention to set things straight .

 

In summary , I lean towards the view that these

two Prabhandhams arose from the AzhwAr

before this incident , if it ever took place .

 

NamO SrI RanganAthAya ,

V.Sadagopan

 

 

-

" sudarshan madabushi " <mksudarshan2002

<tiruvenkatam >; <oppiliappan >;

 

Wednesday, July 30, 2008 8:25 AM

question on biographical detail of Tondar-adi-podi

AzhwAr

 

 

>

> Could someone knowledgeable please help me with this question:

>

> Tondaradipodi AzhwAr's 2 works " tirupalliezhucchi " and " tirumAlai " -- were

> they composed before or after his encounter with Devadevi, the " femme

> fatale " with whom, according to traditional biography (per the

> " AchArya-guru-parampara " accounts), he had a brief, fateful but

> life-transforming relationship?

>

> Warm Regards,

> Sudarshan

>

>

>

>

> Connect with friends all over the world. Get India Messenger

> at http://in.messenger./?wm=n/

>

> ---

>

> Oppiliappan Koil Varadachari Sadagopan

> http://www.sadagopan.org

[Guest guest]

Respectful Swamin, adiyEn went through your explanation about the event in the life SrI ThoNaDaraDipoDi AzhvAr. adiyEn studied his vaibhavam given in the Divya Prabhandam published by SrI Puthur Krishnaswami Iyengar SwAmi. According to his version the AzhvAr fell into the trap of DevadEvi when he was young and totally inolved in the observance of brahmacharyam and service of SrI arangan. Later, after he got out of the involment by the grace of the Lord and SrI ThAyAr, he devoted more to the Lord's service, when he acquired the name of 'ToNDaraDip PoDi'. Later, he composed the two prabhandams, first, ThirumAlai followed by ThirupaLLiyezhucchi. The ThirumAlai reveals his renouncement of the worldly life. Hence, it appears that the said incident must have happenned in his early life.

Regards,

dAsan

anbil SrInivAsan

--- On Wed, 30/7/08, Dr.V.Sadagopan <yennappan wrote:

Dr.V.Sadagopan <yennappanRe: question on biographical detail of Tondar-adi-podi AzhwArOppiliappan , tiruvenkatam , Cc: "Murali Battar Rangaraja" <muralibattarWednesday, 30 July, 2008, 6:22 PM

 

 

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[Guest guest]

Swami, Both were composed by Thondaradipodi Azhwar after his encounter with DevaDevi. Please refer THIRUMALAI-----THIRD PASURAM THIRD LINE in which "pethai paalakan athu aakum"---athu refers to youth which he does not want anymore because of his suffering. adiyen Ramanuja dasan Srinivasan sudarshan madabushi <mksudarshan2002 wrote: Could someone knowledgeable please help me with this question:Tondaradipodi AzhwAr's 2 works "tirupalliezhucchi" and "tirumAlai" -- were they composed before or after his encounter with Devadevi, the "femme fatale" with whom, according to traditional biography (per the "AchArya-guru-parampara" accounts), he had a brief, fateful but life-transforming relationship? Warm Regards,SudarshanConnect with friends all over the world. Get India Messenger at http://in.messenger./?wm=n/

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[Guest guest]

Dear Bhagavatas,

 

In the 16th paasuram of Thiru Maalai, Sri Tondaradippodi Azhwar says:

 

soodhanAi kalvanAki thoortharodu isaidha kaalam

maadharaar kazhaL kaN ennum valaiyuL pattu azhundhuvEnai

podharE enru solli pundhiyil pukundhu than pAl

Adharam perugha vaitha azhagan oor arangam anrE

 

According to this paasuram, Azhwar says that he was trapped in the lure

of feminine attraction, and the Lord of Sri Rangam intercepted him, entered

into his mind (pundhiyil pukundhu ) and told him (i.e Azhwar) not to go astray(podharE enru solli ). Further, the Lord granted the Azhwar devotion towards Him (than pAl

Adharam perugha vaitha).

 

This seems to suggest that the Deva Devi episode occurred prior to Azhwar's outpouring (adiyen wouldn't prefer to use the word composition) of ThirumAlai, if indeed the Deva Devi episode did take place in the first place.

 

However, this pAsuram itself does not confirm if the episode did take place. It might be

Azhwar's characteristic humility. Azhwar might have been talking on our behalf !

 

namO nArAyana

dAsan

Sriman V.

--- On Thu, 7/31/08, srini vasan <gsreeni_vasan wrote:

srini vasan <gsreeni_vasanRe: question on biographical detail of Tondar-adi-podi AzhwArOppiliappan Date: Thursday, July 31, 2008, 9:02 AM

 

 

 

Swami,

 

Both were composed by Thondaradipodi Azhwar after his encounter with

DevaDevi. Please refer THIRUMALAI-- ---THIRD PASURAM THIRD LINE

in which "pethai paalakan athu aakum"---athu refers to youth

 

which he does not want anymore because of his suffering.

 

adiyen Ramanuja dasan

Srinivasan

 

sudarshan madabushi <mksudarshan2002@ .co. in> wrote:

 

 

Could someone knowledgeable please help me with this question:Tondaradipodi AzhwAr's 2 works "tirupalliezhucchi" and "tirumAlai" -- were they composed before or after his encounter with Devadevi, the "femme fatale" with whom, according to traditional biography (per the "AchArya-guru- parampara" accounts), he had a brief, fateful but life-transforming relationship? Warm Regards,SudarshanConnect with friends all over the world. Get India Messenger at http://in.messenger ./ ?wm=n/

 

 

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[Guest guest]

SrI:

 

Dear Sri Venkatesan :

 

AzhwArs and AchAryAs have a well established record of

NaicchAnusandhAnam , where they condemn themselves

for trespasses that they are least likely to committ .

Thirumangai Mannan's Paasurams are replete with such

statements . Swamy AlavanthAr's StOtra Ratnam has

number of self-codemnatory verses arising from a sense

of NirvEdham .

 

AzhwArs and AchAryAs engage in such outpourings for

our benefit .

 

Coming to ThoNDaradippodi AzhwAr's vyAmOham with Deva Devi

is a colorful and credible incident , where the Srirangam Dhivya

Dampathis were engaged in a sport to test AzhwAr's MahA

ViswAsam . The legend has it that Lord RanganAtha orchestrated it ,

had one of His Sannidhi Golden Vattil ( from His Soma Sundaram)

delivered in person to Deva Devi's house to please Deva Devi

to reunite with the discarded AzhwAr . Our Guru Paramparai

descriptions are not very consistent on such matters .

 

With all these points in mind , a devotee is left to oneself

to either accept this incident in the life of the great AzhwAr

or to have some doubts about it . Our reverence for

the AzhwAr and Lord Ranganatha however

does not change even by an iota .

 

NamO SrI RanganAthAya ,

V.Sadagopan

 

-

Sriman Venkatesan

Oppiliappan

Thursday, July 31, 2008 8:19 AM

Re: question on biographical detail of Tondar-adi-podi AzhwAr

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dear Bhagavatas,

 

In the 16th paasuram of Thiru Maalai, Sri Tondaradippodi Azhwar says:

 

soodhanAi kalvanAki thoortharodu isaidha kaalam

maadharaar kazhaL kaN ennum valaiyuL pattu azhundhuvEnai

podharE enru solli pundhiyil pukundhu than pAl

Adharam perugha vaitha azhagan oor arangam anrE

 

According to this paasuram, Azhwar says that he was trapped in the lure

of feminine attraction, and the Lord of Sri Rangam intercepted him, entered

into his mind (pundhiyil pukundhu ) and told him (i.e Azhwar) not to go astray(podharE enru solli ). Further, the Lord granted the Azhwar devotion towards Him (than pAl

Adharam perugha vaitha).

 

This seems to suggest that the Deva Devi episode occurred prior to Azhwar's outpouring (adiyen wouldn't prefer to use the word composition) of ThirumAlai, if indeed the Deva Devi episode did take place in the first place.

 

However, this pAsuram itself does not confirm if the episode did take place. It might be

Azhwar's characteristic humility. Azhwar might have been talking on our behalf !

 

namO nArAyana

dAsan

Sriman V.

--- On Thu, 7/31/08, srini vasan <gsreeni_vasan wrote:

srini vasan <gsreeni_vasanRe: question on biographical detail of Tondar-adi-podi AzhwArOppiliappan Date: Thursday, July 31, 2008, 9:02 AM

 

 

 

Swami,

 

Both were composed by Thondaradipodi Azhwar after his encounter with

DevaDevi. Please refer THIRUMALAI-- ---THIRD PASURAM THIRD LINE

in which "pethai paalakan athu aakum"---athu refers to youth

 

which he does not want anymore because of his suffering.

 

adiyen Ramanuja dasan

Srinivasan

 

sudarshan madabushi <mksudarshan2002@ .co. in> wrote:

 

 

Could someone knowledgeable please help me with this question:Tondaradipodi AzhwAr's 2 works "tirupalliezhucchi" and "tirumAlai" -- were they composed before or after his encounter with Devadevi, the "femme fatale" with whom, according to traditional biography (per the "AchArya-guru- parampara" accounts), he had a brief, fateful but life-transforming relationship? Warm Regards,SudarshanConnect with friends all over the world. Get India Messenger at http://in.messenger ./ ?wm=n/

 

 

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