Kundalini and the Maya Response...

[Guest guest]

Sat Nam Yogis:

I don't want to rain on anyone's parade BUT I checked out Maya

references to Kundalini with a leading Maya expert in the US. He is a

friend of mine and reads the language of Maya iconography. He had this

to say:

 

" Hunbatz Men is notorious for making stuff up that appeals to New

Agers just to make a buck (if you've never seen Incidents of Travel at

Chichen Itza I'd highly recommend it). He claims things are part of

the Maya tradition, but when challenged by someone that actually knows

about the Maya, he says they are " family " traditions passed down by

his father and grandfather that are somehow lost to every other Maya,

living or dead. I've never heard or read anything about " chacla " nor

about the " 7 powers " nor about K'ULTHANLILNI and I have spent a lot of

time in Maya-land. The leading expert on Classic Maya priesthood is

Marc Zender (his dissertation focused on it) and the leading experts

on modern Maya priests and their traditions are Allen Christensen and

Bruce Love, none of which has ever mentioned anything remotely similar

to what Hunbatz Men suggests.

 

The bible for body symbolism in Mesoamerica is Lopez-Austin's " The

Human Body and Ideology: Concept of the Ancient Nahuas " and specific

to the Maya area we have Karl Taube's recent book with Houston and

Stuart called " Memory of Bones: Body, Being and Experience Among the

Classic Maya. " I really recommend it for anyone interested in the Maya.

 

While it is a nice to try to trace connections cross-culturally

concerning Kundalini technology I think it is really important to try

to use valid sources, or else we run the risk of being marginalized by

those we are trying to reach. Such marginalization will allow the

powerful technology of Kundalini to be dismissed as trival and

" un-scientific. " All of us know what powerful results we have from the

practice. I feel that for myself I want the stories I tell about the

technology to be validated by as many valid sources as possible.

Remember TRUTH is our NAME.

 

This is why I have been concerned to try to understand the

relationship between Sikhism and Kundalini Yoga- that is where/when

the tradition of Yoga blended with Sikhism. Though I have posted my

questions on this group I have not gotten any satisfatory answers. I

do not doubt the power of the teachings, but as a scholar and as a

Kundalini teacher I want to be able to understand these connections so

I don't misrepresent the teachings and so I can honor the teachers

that have passed on these wonderful teachings.

Please see my post on kundalini and belief for more infomation.

Sat Nam,

justine

[Guest guest]

Dear Justine, Sat Nam -

Blessings to you. But here is also a Kundalini " line in the sand " --

when you project negatively about anyone, a person you know or a

spiritual figure whom you don't know, and you don't create a space or

way for that person in a neutral mind to respond in a graceful manner,

It's slander. Moreover, whenever one slanders, the only parade you

can be raining on is your own.

 

Here is a factual connection (in so far as the framework of THIS

website is concerned, ie., the Teachings of Kundalini Yoga as taught

by Yogi Bhajan) between the teachings of Kundalini Yoga and the

traditional Mayan teachings - please turn to the " Files " section of

this Forum (you have to go online to the site to do this, in

case you're usually only using your email browser), and immerse

yourself in what Yogiji himself had to say about the ancient Maya, in

August 1987. I transcribed this lecture in 1987 because it was one of

the most important lectures I'd ever heard him give, out of many

(many) hundreds of his lectures. I was not a newcomer. In Buddhist

terms, THIS lecture by Yogi Bhajan " was a Turning of the Wheel of

Dharma. " That's something that Buddhas do.

 

It started a quest for me. A real quest. A path I allowed to

transform my life completely, and it did. The more I followed this

path, the more clear and meaningful the connections between Kundalini

Yoga, Khalsa, the teachings of Guru Nanak, and the ancient Mayan

legacy that still breathes and powerfully recollects itself on this

Hemisphere, the more it ALL connected. And out of that quest that my

own teacher incited and stimulated, after sifting through all the new

age and academic " maya " about the Maya, I met a Mayan who resonated

perfectly with the teachings of my teacher, and my Gurus. And that

was Hunbatz Men, with whom I studied actively for 2 1/2 years, and

remain in deep resonance and profound respect toward. HE has never

spoken like the fool your friend you quoted, alleges. And everything

I've received from him has been the Guru's Prashaad.

 

Your post is inappropriate in making disrespectful allegation against

someone of high spiritual stature whom I happen to know and revere

personally. Therefore, I'm stepping forward to say " Lucy, you got

some splainin " or sincere apologizing to do, for the sake of

maintaining your own grace and self respect. And THIS is a sine qua

non of the teachings of Yogi Bhajan.

 

Neither will I participate in a circle or gathering, physical or

online, that allows a free pass for slander. So this where the rubber

will hit the road. And I would like to see it made good. Sorry if

it's not easy, but you are the grandmaster of your own parade and you

publicly declared it. I would encourage you to un-declare it.

 

I'd be happy to engage you and your scholarly friend in a real,

stand up, out front debate (if you like debate, I was a champion but I

don't like it nearly as much as dialogue, but I can meet either way)

to establish what you believe to be true about the ancient Maya. If

you don't agree with Hunbatz Men, fine. No problem. Who should care?

But leave the slanderous attacks off this site, please. If you have

an important truth to bring forward, please to that.

 

for many Blessings,

Krishna Singh

 

 

 

Yogi Bhajan, What Coming Age Owes to Mayan Culture.pdf

 

Kundalini-Yoga , " charanpreet7 "

<justinelemos wrote:

>

> Sat Nam Yogis:

> I don't want to rain on anyone's parade BUT I checked out Maya

> references to Kundalini with a leading Maya expert in the US. He is a

> friend of mine and reads the language of Maya iconography. He had this

> to say:

>

> " Hunbatz Men is notorious for making stuff up that appeals to New

> Agers just to make a buck (if you've never seen Incidents of Travel at

> Chichen Itza I'd highly recommend it). He claims things are part of

> the Maya tradition, but when challenged by someone that actually knows

> about the Maya, he says they are " family " traditions passed down by

> his father and grandfather that are somehow lost to every other Maya,

> living or dead. I've never heard or read anything about " chacla " nor

> about the " 7 powers " nor about K'ULTHANLILNI and I have spent a lot of

> time in Maya-land. The leading expert on Classic Maya priesthood is

> Marc Zender (his dissertation focused on it) and the leading experts

> on modern Maya priests and their traditions are Allen Christensen and

> Bruce Love, none of which has ever mentioned anything remotely similar

> to what Hunbatz Men suggests.

>

> The bible for body symbolism in Mesoamerica is Lopez-Austin's " The

> Human Body and Ideology: Concept of the Ancient Nahuas " and specific

> to the Maya area we have Karl Taube's recent book with Houston and

> Stuart called " Memory of Bones: Body, Being and Experience Among the

> Classic Maya. " I really recommend it for anyone interested in the Maya.

>

> While it is a nice to try to trace connections cross-culturally

> concerning Kundalini technology I think it is really important to try

> to use valid sources, or else we run the risk of being marginalized by

> those we are trying to reach. Such marginalization will allow the

> powerful technology of Kundalini to be dismissed as trival and

> " un-scientific. " All of us know what powerful results we have from the

> practice. I feel that for myself I want the stories I tell about the

> technology to be validated by as many valid sources as possible.

> Remember TRUTH is our NAME.

>

> This is why I have been concerned to try to understand the

> relationship between Sikhism and Kundalini Yoga- that is where/when

> the tradition of Yoga blended with Sikhism. Though I have posted my

> questions on this group I have not gotten any satisfatory answers. I

> do not doubt the power of the teachings, but as a scholar and as a

> Kundalini teacher I want to be able to understand these connections so

> I don't misrepresent the teachings and so I can honor the teachers

> that have passed on these wonderful teachings.

> Please see my post on kundalini and belief for more infomation.

> Sat Nam,

> justine

>

[Guest guest]

Sat Nam,

 

In the interests of love and sister/brotherhood can we agree to allow

people to disagree. I don't see where anyone was disrespectful. I too

wondered about the validity of the Mayan teachings connection to

Kundalini Yoga. In the email I read there didn't seem to be any

disrespect and only a sincere desire to be as clear and supportive of

kundalini yoga as possible.

Peace

EOKS

[Guest guest]

Sat Nam,

 

I am sorry to keep this up but this made me angry.

 

Krishan Singh says that Justina sent slanderous negative energy.

 

and that " Your post is inappropriate in making disrespectful

allegation against someone of high spiritual stature "

 

Sounds like a bishop in the catholic church decrying heresy!

 

What's with this. Can't we ask questions? I didn't see any slander

and the only one who responded agressively is Krisna Singh and

perhaps Me.

 

Ok I'm over it but does anyone 'get' this? It's wrong to blast people

for asking questions with the intention of being knowledgable.

Especially another Kundalini Yoga Teacher and I don't think

questioning anyone of 'spiritual status' is ever wrong. This is

soudning like a cult.

 

 

 

 

 

Kundalini-Yoga , " Krishna Singh Khalsa "

<Krishna wrote:

>

> Dear Justine, Sat Nam -

> Blessings to you. But here is also a Kundalini " line in the sand " -

-

> when you project negatively about anyone, a person you know or a

> spiritual figure whom you don't know, and you don't create a space

or

> way for that person in a neutral mind to respond in a graceful

manner,

> It's slander. Moreover, whenever one slanders, the only parade you

> can be raining on is your own.

>

> Here is a factual connection (in so far as the framework of THIS

> website is concerned, ie., the Teachings of Kundalini Yoga as taught

> by Yogi Bhajan) between the teachings of Kundalini Yoga and the

> traditional Mayan teachings - please turn to the " Files " section of

> this Forum (you have to go online to the site to do this, in

> case you're usually only using your email browser), and immerse

> yourself in what Yogiji himself had to say about the ancient Maya,

in

> August 1987. I transcribed this lecture in 1987 because it was one

of

> the most important lectures I'd ever heard him give, out of many

> (many) hundreds of his lectures. I was not a newcomer. In Buddhist

> terms, THIS lecture by Yogi Bhajan " was a Turning of the Wheel of

> Dharma. " That's something that Buddhas do.

>

> It started a quest for me. A real quest. A path I allowed to

> transform my life completely, and it did. The more I followed this

> path, the more clear and meaningful the connections between

Kundalini

> Yoga, Khalsa, the teachings of Guru Nanak, and the ancient Mayan

> legacy that still breathes and powerfully recollects itself on this

> Hemisphere, the more it ALL connected. And out of that quest that

my

> own teacher incited and stimulated, after sifting through all the

new

> age and academic " maya " about the Maya, I met a Mayan who resonated

> perfectly with the teachings of my teacher, and my Gurus. And that

> was Hunbatz Men, with whom I studied actively for 2 1/2 years, and

> remain in deep resonance and profound respect toward. HE has never

> spoken like the fool your friend you quoted, alleges. And

everything

> I've received from him has been the Guru's Prashaad.

>

> Your post is inappropriate in making disrespectful allegation

against

> someone of high spiritual stature whom I happen to know and revere

> personally. Therefore, I'm stepping forward to say " Lucy, you got

> some splainin " or sincere apologizing to do, for the sake of

> maintaining your own grace and self respect. And THIS is a sine qua

> non of the teachings of Yogi Bhajan.

>

> Neither will I participate in a circle or gathering, physical or

> online, that allows a free pass for slander. So this where the

rubber

> will hit the road. And I would like to see it made good. Sorry if

> it's not easy, but you are the grandmaster of your own parade and

you

> publicly declared it. I would encourage you to un-declare it.

>

> I'd be happy to engage you and your scholarly friend in a real,

> stand up, out front debate (if you like debate, I was a champion

but I

> don't like it nearly as much as dialogue, but I can meet either way)

> to establish what you believe to be true about the ancient Maya. If

> you don't agree with Hunbatz Men, fine. No problem. Who should

care?

> But leave the slanderous attacks off this site, please. If you

have

> an important truth to bring forward, please to that.

>

> for many Blessings,

> Krishna Singh

>

>

>

> Yogi Bhajan, What Coming Age Owes to Mayan Culture.pdf

>

> Kundalini-Yoga , " charanpreet7 "

> <justinelemos@> wrote:

> >

> > Sat Nam Yogis:

> > I don't want to rain on anyone's parade BUT I checked out Maya

> > references to Kundalini with a leading Maya expert in the US. He

is a

> > friend of mine and reads the language of Maya iconography. He had

this

> > to say:

> >

> > " Hunbatz Men is notorious for making stuff up that appeals to New

> > Agers just to make a buck (if you've never seen Incidents of

Travel at

> > Chichen Itza I'd highly recommend it). He claims things are part

of

> > the Maya tradition, but when challenged by someone that actually

knows

> > about the Maya, he says they are " family " traditions passed down

by

> > his father and grandfather that are somehow lost to every other

Maya,

> > living or dead. I've never heard or read anything about " chacla "

nor

> > about the " 7 powers " nor about K'ULTHANLILNI and I have spent a

lot of

> > time in Maya-land. The leading expert on Classic Maya priesthood

is

> > Marc Zender (his dissertation focused on it) and the leading

experts

> > on modern Maya priests and their traditions are Allen Christensen

and

> > Bruce Love, none of which has ever mentioned anything remotely

similar

> > to what Hunbatz Men suggests.

> >

> > The bible for body symbolism in Mesoamerica is Lopez-Austin's " The

> > Human Body and Ideology: Concept of the Ancient Nahuas " and

specific

> > to the Maya area we have Karl Taube's recent book with Houston and

> > Stuart called " Memory of Bones: Body, Being and Experience Among

the

> > Classic Maya. " I really recommend it for anyone interested in the

Maya.

> >

> > While it is a nice to try to trace connections cross-culturally

> > concerning Kundalini technology I think it is really important to

try

> > to use valid sources, or else we run the risk of being

marginalized by

> > those we are trying to reach. Such marginalization will allow the

> > powerful technology of Kundalini to be dismissed as trival and

> > " un-scientific. " All of us know what powerful results we have

from the

> > practice. I feel that for myself I want the stories I tell about

the

> > technology to be validated by as many valid sources as possible.

> > Remember TRUTH is our NAME.

> >

> > This is why I have been concerned to try to understand the

> > relationship between Sikhism and Kundalini Yoga- that is

where/when

> > the tradition of Yoga blended with Sikhism. Though I have posted

my

> > questions on this group I have not gotten any satisfatory

answers. I

> > do not doubt the power of the teachings, but as a scholar and as a

> > Kundalini teacher I want to be able to understand these

connections so

> > I don't misrepresent the teachings and so I can honor the teachers

> > that have passed on these wonderful teachings.

> > Please see my post on kundalini and belief for more infomation.

> > Sat Nam,

> > justine

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Sat Nam and Greetings, Why have individuals jumped on this post and attacked Justine instead of addressing all of the specifics in the post? At least three source references are mentioned and there is lots of opportunity for discussion. I thought she presented her concerns as respectfully as possible, but the response seems to be " Woe to the unbeliever" as if she said something 'bad' and the accusation is that she is slandering, gossiping. The accusations sound like religion, so familiar and discouraging. I'm on this path with you because I have hope and faith in us to actually do things differently. I would love to see the high-mindedness and respect for other's beliefs (and concerns) that this spiritual-seeking group aspires to. I know open-mindedness and deep respect are not easy to live up to when one's own self righteous beliefs are threatened, but I do believe we agreed

to the challenge and can uplift each other by actually manifesting ideals that we claim are real for us. I thank Justine for her post, and for her desire to seek the truth wherever it might lead, even at risk of being disillusioned. Sat Nam, Ravi Kaur Wishing you green grass and clear waters...peace.

[Guest guest]

Sat Nam,

 

Your response was much nicer than mine. Thankyou for being an example

of peaceful communication.

 

Peace