Guest guest Posted July 29, 2009 Report Share Posted July 29, 2009 Anyone have comments on this huge issue? I am pro change/reform and going forward even with challenges and mistakes in the bill might be better than staying mired in what we have now. Opinions? Cardie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Cardie, Yogis, being conscious, may want to use their stimulated frontal lobes, the center of judgement, on actions of those that dain to put themselves above our otherwise natural equality. Politicians have a monopoly on violence, and can do to us whatever they will, subject to the willingness of other coequal branches of govt - or the disparaged states - to stop them (a rare occurrence). Once the People give a Power to Big Brother, that power never is relinquished, and, it tends to grow in scope. Just as has happened in other countries which prohibit mutual consent in doctor-patient relationships, the US prospective socialist health system will find costs hard to control, thus leading to rationing of care based on global priorities. You, thus, no longer will own your body. Second, and more specific to the natural care preferred by yogis, all government programs cater to their most powerful constituents, who, in the case of health care, are the big pharmaceutical companies, big hospital systems, and major medical associations. They don't like competition from natural supplement and therapy companies now, and they surely will leave us hanging out to dry when it comes time to ratchet down the budget to make the socialist system work. What government can do for you, eventually it can do TO you! Remember that. Finally, it's not like anti-socialists don't have their own reform ideas. Having worked in Congress during Hillary's first attempt to takeover 1/7th of the economy, I can tell you that there are excellent ideas out there. But because they disempower Big Business and Big Government, they have no chance of getting a fair hearing. Even without tax advantages, however, some of these ideas are already revolutionizing the system. Medical savings accounts, for example, are the fastest rising product for coverage. If states can be convinced to ignore the special interests, and repeal all the benefit mandates and prohibitions on purchasing out of state insurance, a Health Savings Account holder can combine the account with real cheap insurance, which does what insurance is supposed to do: cover only unforeseen, catastrophic expenses. Having third party insurers - whether government or private - cover low level health expenses is the main driver of costs. Replace that recipe for disaster with the superior dynamic of patients forcing doctors and hospitals to disclose their prices, and then we actually, for the first time really, can create a vibrant market in health services (hospitals are the true barrier to price disclosure). Some doctors also aren't waiting for the govt to ruin the system even more than it already has: they are offering concierge offerings with monthly charges and unlimited care. Other doctors are cash only, with very affordable prices. To ensure a wide variety of natural nutrients and therapies are available for health account holders, we need to repeal the FDA, USDA and FTC, which, with Big Pharma and Big Agriculture backing, annually lobby Congress and those agencies to grow existing regulations to the point that small mom-and-pop naturopaths - and highly skilled healers - find it impossible to offer their therapies without risking midnight raids of the FDA gestapo police (see http://www.infowars.com/fda-running-extortion-racket-natural-supplement-companie\ s-threatened-with-arrest-if-they-dont-pay-up/). This is no laughing matter, and if you support the Big Business-Big Governement cabal after reading that, well... If insurance were removed from the first 3 thousand dollars of care, then insurers could be more creative to get business, including covering more pre-existing conditions. If not, most states already have started Risk Pools to cover sick people. And as a backup, hospitals get reimbursed from the govt for uncompensated care to the poor in emergency rooms. Medicaid in the states already covers most poor people (how to reform Medicaid is another story). Tax treatment should be neutral between employer-based and individual coverage: the location of benefits at the workplace, after all, is a tragic result of World War Two price controls. In politics, include the sages to drive your thinking. Taoist founder Lao-Tsu equated government with a band of robbers, saying " the more laws that are passed, the poorer the people become " , and " to bring peace and prosperity, get rid of the sage (ruler) and the rule " . Plato did the same in the Republic, when discussing being attacked by a " man, a gang or a government " (his colleague Pythagoras was the first Western philosopher to unite East and West with the start of an ashram). In the Vedas are written " opposition to tyranny is just " , and " liberty is the first ideal " . There's more classical liberal thinking in all societies, throughout history. Let's honor the sages, not the powermongers. Yogi Bhajan said kundalini yoga protects us from being controlled. Why would a yogi offer any support to further aggrandizement, consolidation, and centralization of Power, for an elite cabal of politicians and their Big business backers? Sat nam, Amar Atma Kundalini-Yoga , " Cardie " <cardiek wrote: > > Anyone have comments on this huge issue? I am pro change/reform and going forward even with challenges and mistakes in the bill might be better than staying mired in what we have now. Opinions? > Cardie > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 30, 2009 Report Share Posted July 30, 2009 Yes, our health-care system could be worse, much worse. Do anything just to get it done? I think not. A friend whose read part of the bill sent me this today: This is a breakdown of some of the worst aspects of the first 500 pages of the bill. Contact your Representatives and let them know how you feel about this infringement on our freedom. We, as a country, cannot afford another 1000 page bill to go through congress without being read. Another 500 pages to go. I have under-lined a few of the items that are down right unconstitutional. • Page 22: Mandates audits of all employers that self-insure! • Page 29: Admission: your health care will be rationed! • Page 30: A government committee will decide what treatments and benefits you get (and, unlike an insurer, there will be no appeals process) • Page 42: The " Health Choices Commissioner " will decide health benefits for you. You will have no choice. None. • Page 50: All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free healthcare services. • Page 58: Every person will be issued a National ID Healthcard. • Page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer. • Page 65: Taxpayers will subsidize all union retiree and community organizer health plans (read: SEIU, UAW and ACORN) • Page 72: All private healthcare plans must conform to government rules to participate in a Healthcare Exchange. • Page 84: All private healthcare plans must participate in the Healthcare Exchange (i.e., total government control of private plans) • Page 91: Government mandates linguistic infrastructure for services; translation: illegal aliens • Page 95: The Government will pay ACORN and Americorps to sign up individuals for Government-run Health Care plan. • Page 102: Those eligible for Medicaid will be automatically enrolled: you have no choice in the matter. • Page 124: No company can sue the government for price-fixing. No " judicial review " is permitted against the government monopoly. Put simply, private insurers will be crushed. • Page 127: The AMA sold doctors out: the government will set wages. • Page 145: An employer MUST auto-enroll employees into the government-run public plan. No alternatives. • Page 126: Employers MUST pay healthcare bills for part-time employees AND their families. • Page 149: Any employer with a payroll of $400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays an 8% tax on payroll • Page 150: Any employer with a payroll of $250K-400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays a 2 to 6% tax on payroll • Page 167: Any individual who doesn't' have acceptable healthcare (according to the government) will be taxed 2.5% of income. • Page 170: Any NON-RESIDENT alien is exempt from individual taxes (Americans will pay for them). • Page 195: Officers and employees of Government Healthcare Bureaucracy will have access to ALL American financial and personal records. • Page 203: " The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax. " Yes, it really says that. • Page 239: Bill will reduce physician services for Medicaid. Seniors and the poor most affected. " • Page 241: Doctors: no matter what specialty you have, you'll all be paid the same (thanks, AMA!) • Page 253: Government sets value of doctors' time, their professional judgment, etc. • Page 265: Government mandates and controls productivity for private healthcare industries. • Page 268: Government regulates rental and purchase of power-driven wheelchairs. • Page 272: Cancer patients: welcome to the wonderful world of rationing! • Page 280: Hospitals will be penalized for what the government deems preventable re-admissions. • Page 298: Doctors: if you treat a patient during an initial admission that results in a readmission, you will be penalized by the government. • Page 317: Doctors: you are now prohibited for owning and investing in healthcare companies! • Page 318: Prohibition on hospital expansion. Hospitals cannot expand without government approval. • Page 321: Hospital expansion hinges on " community " input: in other words, yet another payoff for ACORN. • Page 335: Government mandates establishment of outcome-based measures: i.e., rationing. • Page 341: Government has authority to disqualify Medicare Advantage Plans, HMOs, etc. • Page 354: Government will restrict enrollment of SPECIAL NEEDS individuals. • Page 379: More bureaucracy: Telehealth Advisory Committee (healthcare by phone). • Page 425: More bureaucracy: Advance Care Planning Consult: Senior Citizens, assisted suicide, euthanasia? • Page 425: Government will instruct and consult regarding living wills, durable powers of attorney, etc. Mandatory. Appears to lock in estate taxes ahead of time. • Page 425: Government provides approved list of end-of-life resources, guiding you in death. • Page 427: Government mandates program that orders end-of-life treatment; government dictates how your life ends. • Page 429: Advance Care Planning Consult will be used to dictate treatment as patient's health deteriorates. This can include an ORDER for end-of-life plans. An ORDER from the GOVERNMENT. • Page 430: Government will decide what level of treatments you may have at end-of-life. • Page 469: Community-based Home Medical Services: more payoffs for ACORN. • Page 472: Payments to Community-based organizations: more payoffs for ACORN. • Page 489: Government will cover marriage and family therapy. Government intervenes in your marriage. • Page 494: Government will cover mental health services: defining, creating and rationing those services. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 31, 2009 Report Share Posted July 31, 2009 Even without passage of Congress' effort to completely takeover the already over-regulated health system, yesterday the House passed a bill to put small food and supplement producers in even more jeopardy than they already are due to existing FDA/USDA/FTC rules. This is important to share in a yogi because supplements, wholesome food and natural therapies are critical to our lifestyle, and to the salvation of the planet. Here's the story and how your grassroots calls can stop this before the Senate cabal sends this to el Presidente for his signature into law: http://www.rense.com/general86/insane.htm Shocking, the list of bill problems in that link, huh? I share this as an example of what happens when you trust Big Brother to " fix " " problems " . What started as an " admirable " effort to protect our food, has resulted, as all legislation does, as a new sop to the Big Businesses that contribute money to the politicians who sit on the committees overseeing the agencies in question (FDA, USDA and FTC). Big Pharma, Big Agra and Big Medica don't like competition from natural foods, nutrients and therapies. This dynamic happens in all markets, not just those dealing with food, drugs and health services. In no market are small entrepreneurs left without harrassment from the agencies controlled by their larger incumbent competitors. Acquiescing to demogoguery about problems and solutions only plays into the hands of the wolves. Resist the temptation to buy into this salvation by rules mentality. Meditate. Be free. Sat nam, Amar Atma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 31, 2009 Report Share Posted July 31, 2009 Sat Nam, I couldn't disagree more with the two posters opposing reform. Our health care system is terribly inequitable and inefficient, and desperately needs reform. I do not feel that a yogic approach is to leave poor members of society out in the cold to die. There is so much fear mongering in this debate that uses the tired rhetoric of the Cold War to scare people away from constructive reform that would cover the uninsured, making all of us healthier by reducing public health risks. Here's a useful perspective on the value of publicly provided services: http://blog.healthcareforamericanow.org/2009/07/30/you-like-your-public-firefigh\ ting-option-right/ Ultimately a single payer system is best, as most Europeans and Canadians will agree, but until we get there, I do believe that incremental changes are critically important. Even if the Congressional compromise is only able to accomplish insurance reform, it's a step in the right direction, that would begin to retrieve power from the insurance lobby and return it to regular people. Right now, giant corporations motivated purely by profit are making decisions. I believe health care is a human right, and I do not trust corporations to make decisions that are in my best interest, or the interests of poor people. It was shocking to me to read the poster's disagreement with a feature like providing translation for non-English speakers. How is this a yogic perspective? I urge all people of conscious to evaluate the proposals for yourself, and to listen to some of the proposals that will alleviate the suffering of the most vulnerable in our society. Care for all benefits us all. Here are a few resources to make your own decision, and please call your Congressional represntatives. http://www.healthcareforamericanow.org/, http://www.codebluenow.org/press-center/suggested-reading/Quick%20facts%20Factsh\ eet%201%2017%2008.pdf , http://www.democracynow.org/2009/7/16/former_insurance_exec_wendell_porter , http://www.ppionline.org/documents/Fixing_Health_Care_092205.pdf , Love & Light, Kartar Kaur Kundalini-Yoga , " ramneetfl " <ramneetfl wrote: > > Yes, our health-care system could be worse, much worse. Do anything just to get it done? I think not. A friend whose read part of the bill sent me this today: > > This is a breakdown of some of the worst aspects of the first 500 pages of the bill. Contact your Representatives and let them know how you feel about this infringement on our freedom. We, as a country, cannot afford another 1000 page bill to go through congress without being read. Another 500 pages to go. I have under-lined a few of the items that are down right unconstitutional. > > > • Page 22: Mandates audits of all employers that self-insure! > • Page 29: Admission: your health care will be rationed! > • Page 30: A government committee will decide what treatments and benefits you get (and, unlike an insurer, there will be no appeals process) > • Page 42: The " Health Choices Commissioner " will decide health benefits for you. You will have no choice. None. > • Page 50: All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free healthcare services. > • Page 58: Every person will be issued a National ID Healthcard. > • Page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer. > • Page 65: Taxpayers will subsidize all union retiree and community organizer health plans (read: SEIU, UAW and ACORN) > • Page 72: All private healthcare plans must conform to government rules to participate in a Healthcare Exchange. > • Page 84: All private healthcare plans must participate in the Healthcare Exchange (i.e., total government control of private plans) > • Page 91: Government mandates linguistic infrastructure for services; translation: illegal aliens > • Page 95: The Government will pay ACORN and Americorps to sign up individuals for Government-run Health Care plan. > • Page 102: Those eligible for Medicaid will be automatically enrolled: you have no choice in the matter. > • Page 124: No company can sue the government for price-fixing. No " judicial review " is permitted against the government monopoly. Put simply, private insurers will be crushed. > • Page 127: The AMA sold doctors out: the government will set wages. > • Page 145: An employer MUST auto-enroll employees into the government-run public plan. No alternatives. > • Page 126: Employers MUST pay healthcare bills for part-time employees AND their families. > • Page 149: Any employer with a payroll of $400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays an 8% tax on payroll > • Page 150: Any employer with a payroll of $250K-400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays a 2 to 6% tax on payroll > • Page 167: Any individual who doesn't' have acceptable healthcare (according to the government) will be taxed 2.5% of income. > • Page 170: Any NON-RESIDENT alien is exempt from individual taxes (Americans will pay for them). > • Page 195: Officers and employees of Government Healthcare Bureaucracy will have access to ALL American financial and personal records. > • Page 203: " The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax. " Yes, it really says that. > • Page 239: Bill will reduce physician services for Medicaid. Seniors and the poor most affected. " > • Page 241: Doctors: no matter what specialty you have, you'll all be paid the same (thanks, AMA!) > • Page 253: Government sets value of doctors' time, their professional judgment, etc. > • Page 265: Government mandates and controls productivity for private healthcare industries. > • Page 268: Government regulates rental and purchase of power-driven wheelchairs. > • Page 272: Cancer patients: welcome to the wonderful world of rationing! > • Page 280: Hospitals will be penalized for what the government deems preventable re-admissions. > • Page 298: Doctors: if you treat a patient during an initial admission that results in a readmission, you will be penalized by the government. > • Page 317: Doctors: you are now prohibited for owning and investing in healthcare companies! > • Page 318: Prohibition on hospital expansion. Hospitals cannot expand without government approval. > • Page 321: Hospital expansion hinges on " community " input: in other words, yet another payoff for ACORN. > • Page 335: Government mandates establishment of outcome-based measures: i.e., rationing. > • Page 341: Government has authority to disqualify Medicare Advantage Plans, HMOs, etc. > • Page 354: Government will restrict enrollment of SPECIAL NEEDS individuals. > • Page 379: More bureaucracy: Telehealth Advisory Committee (healthcare by phone). > • Page 425: More bureaucracy: Advance Care Planning Consult: Senior Citizens, assisted suicide, euthanasia? > • Page 425: Government will instruct and consult regarding living wills, durable powers of attorney, etc. Mandatory. Appears to lock in estate taxes ahead of time. > • Page 425: Government provides approved list of end-of-life resources, guiding you in death. > • Page 427: Government mandates program that orders end-of-life treatment; government dictates how your life ends. > • Page 429: Advance Care Planning Consult will be used to dictate treatment as patient's health deteriorates. This can include an ORDER for end-of-life plans. An ORDER from the GOVERNMENT. > • Page 430: Government will decide what level of treatments you may have at end-of-life. > • Page 469: Community-based Home Medical Services: more payoffs for ACORN. > • Page 472: Payments to Community-based organizations: more payoffs for ACORN. > • Page 489: Government will cover marriage and family therapy. Government intervenes in your marriage. > • Page 494: Government will cover mental health services: defining, creating and rationing those services. > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 2, 2009 Report Share Posted August 2, 2009 Dear KMay, I'm afraid you jumped the gun, since my post didn't oppose reform; rather, it promoted reform that, unlike your idea, would get all third party insurers - whether private or public - out of the low level expenses of the doctor-patient relationship. And I went on how this would work over several paragraphs. When reading opponents in politics, it's important to reread arguments enough times to actually understand what they're saying, how they would achieve goals, and then offer an alternative that would reach those goals, or other goals that you find more important. If your goal is simply to empower govt, then you made a good argument how to reach that goal. My goal is not to empower business, or insurance, or any special interests. I want all special groups out of the doctors' office when he or she is focusing on my life or death issues. Indeed, my method would hurt insurers, by taking away 90% of business from them (only 10% of patients annually use more than $3,000 worth of health services). Yesterday the House sent to the Senate a bill to further threaten small farmers and supplement makers. Larger health reform bills ignore the doctor-patient empowering plans that get all special interests out of the doctors' office. There's more to this debate than the typically superficial coverage of the mainstream, elite-apologist Media. Let's broaden our horizons to read alternative media, dig deeper to sharply identify our goals in this and all debates, and watch for which solutions are demonized by the corporate media - and there will usually be the solution and the truth. Sat nam, Amar Atma Kundalini-Yoga , " kmay4747 " <kmay_araiza wrote: > > Sat Nam, > I couldn't disagree more with the two posters opposing reform. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 2, 2009 Report Share Posted August 2, 2009 Sat Nam I tend to agree with the opinion that beginning the incremental change can be the start of something good for the majority. The idea of health care for major profit is fundamentally wrong - insurance companies are leading this fear based opposition - they pay off the senators and congresspeople to then pass it off as rhetoric. 47% of people living in my Congressional District do not have health care. Supporting or just being involved with the change is a catalyst and the dialog is gaining strength, only to improve the bill. Thank you all for your comments and I look forward to reading more. Cardie Kundalini-Yoga , " kmay4747 " <kmay_araiza wrote: > > Sat Nam, > I couldn't disagree more with the two posters opposing reform. Our health care system is terribly inequitable and inefficient, and desperately needs reform. I do not feel that a yogic approach is to leave poor members of society out in the cold to die. There is so much fear mongering in this debate that uses the tired rhetoric of the Cold War to scare people away from constructive reform that would cover the uninsured, making all of us healthier by reducing public health risks. Here's a useful perspective on the value of publicly provided services: http://blog.healthcareforamericanow.org/2009/07/30/you-like-your-public-firefigh\ ting-option-right/ > > Ultimately a single payer system is best, as most Europeans and Canadians will agree, but until we get there, I do believe that incremental changes are critically important. Even if the Congressional compromise is only able to accomplish insurance reform, it's a step in the right direction, that would begin to retrieve power from the insurance lobby and return it to regular people. Right now, giant corporations motivated purely by profit are making decisions. I believe health care is a human right, and I do not trust corporations to make decisions that are in my best interest, or the interests of poor people. It was shocking to me to read the poster's disagreement with a feature like providing translation for non-English speakers. How is this a yogic perspective? I urge all people of conscious to evaluate the proposals for yourself, and to listen to some of the proposals that will alleviate the suffering of the most vulnerable in our society. Care for all benefits us all. Here are a few resources to make your own decision, and please call your Congressional represntatives. http://www.healthcareforamericanow.org/, http://www.codebluenow.org/press-center/suggested-reading/Quick%20facts%20Factsh\ eet%201%2017%2008.pdf , http://www.democracynow.org/2009/7/16/former_insurance_exec_wendell_porter , http://www.ppionline.org/documents/Fixing_Health_Care_092205.pdf , > > Love & Light, Kartar Kaur > > Kundalini-Yoga , " ramneetfl " <ramneetfl@> wrote: > > > > Yes, our health-care system could be worse, much worse. Do anything just to get it done? I think not. A friend whose read part of the bill sent me this today: > > > > This is a breakdown of some of the worst aspects of the first 500 pages of the bill. Contact your Representatives and let them know how you feel about this infringement on our freedom. We, as a country, cannot afford another 1000 page bill to go through congress without being read. Another 500 pages to go. I have under-lined a few of the items that are down right unconstitutional. > > > > > > • Page 22: Mandates audits of all employers that self-insure! > > • Page 29: Admission: your health care will be rationed! > > • Page 30: A government committee will decide what treatments and benefits you get (and, unlike an insurer, there will be no appeals process) > > • Page 42: The " Health Choices Commissioner " will decide health benefits for you. You will have no choice. None. > > • Page 50: All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free healthcare services. > > • Page 58: Every person will be issued a National ID Healthcard. > > • Page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer. > > • Page 65: Taxpayers will subsidize all union retiree and community organizer health plans (read: SEIU, UAW and ACORN) > > • Page 72: All private healthcare plans must conform to government rules to participate in a Healthcare Exchange. > > • Page 84: All private healthcare plans must participate in the Healthcare Exchange (i.e., total government control of private plans) > > • Page 91: Government mandates linguistic infrastructure for services; translation: illegal aliens > > • Page 95: The Government will pay ACORN and Americorps to sign up individuals for Government-run Health Care plan. > > • Page 102: Those eligible for Medicaid will be automatically enrolled: you have no choice in the matter. > > • Page 124: No company can sue the government for price-fixing. No " judicial review " is permitted against the government monopoly. Put simply, private insurers will be crushed. > > • Page 127: The AMA sold doctors out: the government will set wages. > > • Page 145: An employer MUST auto-enroll employees into the government-run public plan. No alternatives. > > • Page 126: Employers MUST pay healthcare bills for part-time employees AND their families. > > • Page 149: Any employer with a payroll of $400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays an 8% tax on payroll > > • Page 150: Any employer with a payroll of $250K-400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays a 2 to 6% tax on payroll > > • Page 167: Any individual who doesn't' have acceptable healthcare (according to the government) will be taxed 2.5% of income. > > • Page 170: Any NON-RESIDENT alien is exempt from individual taxes (Americans will pay for them). > > • Page 195: Officers and employees of Government Healthcare Bureaucracy will have access to ALL American financial and personal records. > > • Page 203: " The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax. " Yes, it really says that. > > • Page 239: Bill will reduce physician services for Medicaid. Seniors and the poor most affected. " > > • Page 241: Doctors: no matter what specialty you have, you'll all be paid the same (thanks, AMA!) > > • Page 253: Government sets value of doctors' time, their professional judgment, etc. > > • Page 265: Government mandates and controls productivity for private healthcare industries. > > • Page 268: Government regulates rental and purchase of power-driven wheelchairs. > > • Page 272: Cancer patients: welcome to the wonderful world of rationing! > > • Page 280: Hospitals will be penalized for what the government deems preventable re-admissions. > > • Page 298: Doctors: if you treat a patient during an initial admission that results in a readmission, you will be penalized by the government. > > • Page 317: Doctors: you are now prohibited for owning and investing in healthcare companies! > > • Page 318: Prohibition on hospital expansion. Hospitals cannot expand without government approval. > > • Page 321: Hospital expansion hinges on " community " input: in other words, yet another payoff for ACORN. > > • Page 335: Government mandates establishment of outcome-based measures: i.e., rationing. > > • Page 341: Government has authority to disqualify Medicare Advantage Plans, HMOs, etc. > > • Page 354: Government will restrict enrollment of SPECIAL NEEDS individuals. > > • Page 379: More bureaucracy: Telehealth Advisory Committee (healthcare by phone). > > • Page 425: More bureaucracy: Advance Care Planning Consult: Senior Citizens, assisted suicide, euthanasia? > > • Page 425: Government will instruct and consult regarding living wills, durable powers of attorney, etc. Mandatory. Appears to lock in estate taxes ahead of time. > > • Page 425: Government provides approved list of end-of-life resources, guiding you in death. > > • Page 427: Government mandates program that orders end-of-life treatment; government dictates how your life ends. > > • Page 429: Advance Care Planning Consult will be used to dictate treatment as patient's health deteriorates. This can include an ORDER for end-of-life plans. An ORDER from the GOVERNMENT. > > • Page 430: Government will decide what level of treatments you may have at end-of-life. > > • Page 469: Community-based Home Medical Services: more payoffs for ACORN. > > • Page 472: Payments to Community-based organizations: more payoffs for ACORN. > > • Page 489: Government will cover marriage and family therapy. Government intervenes in your marriage. > > • Page 494: Government will cover mental health services: defining, creating and rationing those services. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 2, 2009 Report Share Posted August 2, 2009 Hello,Well being that I am Canadian, there are people that complain about our health care system as well and I mostly think they are misinformed. I don't know much about the health care system but I did see Michael Moore's movie on it a few years ago (I normally don't care for his work but found this to be more balanced). I do think it would be quite a challenge for America to overhaul their system because it also requires a shift in values. Our system is not 100% but neither is private care. I think though, I would prefer a socialized medicine since it is popular in Europe as well. Socialism isn't the death of individualism, which is the fear that private care seems to spread. PaulaOn 8/2/09, Cardie <cardiek wrote: Sat Nam I tend to agree with the opinion that beginning the incremental change can be the start of something good for the majority. The idea of health care for major profit is fundamentally wrong - insurance companies are leading this fear based opposition - they pay off the senators and congresspeople to then pass it off as rhetoric. 47% of people living in my Congressional District do not have health care. Supporting or just being involved with the change is a catalyst and the dialog is gaining strength, only to improve the bill. Thank you all for your comments and I look forward to reading more. Cardie Kundalini-Yoga , " kmay4747 " <kmay_araiza wrote: > > Sat Nam, > I couldn't disagree more with the two posters opposing reform. Our health care system is terribly inequitable and inefficient, and desperately needs reform. I do not feel that a yogic approach is to leave poor members of society out in the cold to die. There is so much fear mongering in this debate that uses the tired rhetoric of the Cold War to scare people away from constructive reform that would cover the uninsured, making all of us healthier by reducing public health risks. Here's a useful perspective on the value of publicly provided services: http://blog.healthcareforamericanow.org/2009/07/30/you-like-your-public-firefighting-option-right/ > > Ultimately a single payer system is best, as most Europeans and Canadians will agree, but until we get there, I do believe that incremental changes are critically important. Even if the Congressional compromise is only able to accomplish insurance reform, it's a step in the right direction, that would begin to retrieve power from the insurance lobby and return it to regular people. Right now, giant corporations motivated purely by profit are making decisions. I believe health care is a human right, and I do not trust corporations to make decisions that are in my best interest, or the interests of poor people. It was shocking to me to read the poster's disagreement with a feature like providing translation for non-English speakers. How is this a yogic perspective? I urge all people of conscious to evaluate the proposals for yourself, and to listen to some of the proposals that will alleviate the suffering of the most vulnerable in our society. Care for all benefits us all. Here are a few resources to make your own decision, and please call your Congressional represntatives. http://www.healthcareforamericanow.org/, http://www.codebluenow.org/press-center/suggested-reading/Quick%20facts%20Factsheet%201%2017%2008.pdf , http://www.democracynow.org/2009/7/16/former_insurance_exec_wendell_porter , http://www.ppionline.org/documents/Fixing_Health_Care_092205.pdf , > > Love & Light, Kartar Kaur > > Kundalini-Yoga , " ramneetfl " <ramneetfl@> wrote: > > > > Yes, our health-care system could be worse, much worse. Do anything just to get it done? I think not. A friend whose read part of the bill sent me this today: > > > > This is a breakdown of some of the worst aspects of the first 500 pages of the bill. Contact your Representatives and let them know how you feel about this infringement on our freedom. We, as a country, cannot afford another 1000 page bill to go through congress without being read. Another 500 pages to go. I have under-lined a few of the items that are down right unconstitutional. > > > > > > • Page 22: Mandates audits of all employers that self-insure! > > • Page 29: Admission: your health care will be rationed! > > • Page 30: A government committee will decide what treatments and benefits you get (and, unlike an insurer, there will be no appeals process) > > • Page 42: The " Health Choices Commissioner " will decide health benefits for you. You will have no choice. None. > > • Page 50: All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free healthcare services. > > • Page 58: Every person will be issued a National ID Healthcard. > > • Page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer. > > • Page 65: Taxpayers will subsidize all union retiree and community organizer health plans (read: SEIU, UAW and ACORN) > > • Page 72: All private healthcare plans must conform to government rules to participate in a Healthcare Exchange. > > • Page 84: All private healthcare plans must participate in the Healthcare Exchange (i.e., total government control of private plans) > > • Page 91: Government mandates linguistic infrastructure for services; translation: illegal aliens > > • Page 95: The Government will pay ACORN and Americorps to sign up individuals for Government-run Health Care plan. > > • Page 102: Those eligible for Medicaid will be automatically enrolled: you have no choice in the matter. > > • Page 124: No company can sue the government for price-fixing. No " judicial review " is permitted against the government monopoly. Put simply, private insurers will be crushed. > > • Page 127: The AMA sold doctors out: the government will set wages. > > • Page 145: An employer MUST auto-enroll employees into the government-run public plan. No alternatives. > > • Page 126: Employers MUST pay healthcare bills for part-time employees AND their families. > > • Page 149: Any employer with a payroll of $400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays an 8% tax on payroll > > • Page 150: Any employer with a payroll of $250K-400K or more, who does not offer the public option, pays a 2 to 6% tax on payroll > > • Page 167: Any individual who doesn't' have acceptable healthcare (according to the government) will be taxed 2.5% of income. > > • Page 170: Any NON-RESIDENT alien is exempt from individual taxes (Americans will pay for them). > > • Page 195: Officers and employees of Government Healthcare Bureaucracy will have access to ALL American financial and personal records. > > • Page 203: " The tax imposed under this section shall not be treated as tax. " Yes, it really says that. > > • Page 239: Bill will reduce physician services for Medicaid. Seniors and the poor most affected. " > > • Page 241: Doctors: no matter what specialty you have, you'll all be paid the same (thanks, AMA!) > > • Page 253: Government sets value of doctors' time, their professional judgment, etc. > > • Page 265: Government mandates and controls productivity for private healthcare industries. > > • Page 268: Government regulates rental and purchase of power-driven wheelchairs. > > • Page 272: Cancer patients: welcome to the wonderful world of rationing! > > • Page 280: Hospitals will be penalized for what the government deems preventable re-admissions. > > • Page 298: Doctors: if you treat a patient during an initial admission that results in a readmission, you will be penalized by the government. > > • Page 317: Doctors: you are now prohibited for owning and investing in healthcare companies! > > • Page 318: Prohibition on hospital expansion. Hospitals cannot expand without government approval. > > • Page 321: Hospital expansion hinges on " community " input: in other words, yet another payoff for ACORN. > > • Page 335: Government mandates establishment of outcome-based measures: i.e., rationing. > > • Page 341: Government has authority to disqualify Medicare Advantage Plans, HMOs, etc. > > • Page 354: Government will restrict enrollment of SPECIAL NEEDS individuals. > > • Page 379: More bureaucracy: Telehealth Advisory Committee (healthcare by phone). > > • Page 425: More bureaucracy: Advance Care Planning Consult: Senior Citizens, assisted suicide, euthanasia? > > • Page 425: Government will instruct and consult regarding living wills, durable powers of attorney, etc. Mandatory. Appears to lock in estate taxes ahead of time. > > • Page 425: Government provides approved list of end-of-life resources, guiding you in death. > > • Page 427: Government mandates program that orders end-of-life treatment; government dictates how your life ends. > > • Page 429: Advance Care Planning Consult will be used to dictate treatment as patient's health deteriorates. This can include an ORDER for end-of-life plans. An ORDER from the GOVERNMENT. > > • Page 430: Government will decide what level of treatments you may have at end-of-life. > > • Page 469: Community-based Home Medical Services: more payoffs for ACORN. > > • Page 472: Payments to Community-based organizations: more payoffs for ACORN. > > • Page 489: Government will cover marriage and family therapy. Government intervenes in your marriage. > > • Page 494: Government will cover mental health services: defining, creating and rationing those services. > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 3, 2009 Report Share Posted August 3, 2009 I can certainly empathize that medicare and medicaid folks get cheap coverage while the rest of us pay the big bucks, covered or not. However, I'm with Amar Atma totally on this. If government sucks all of the oxygen out of our economy, there won't be much left for us to choose how to best use our resources and live our lives (no money left for yoga lessons! Gotta support someone else's obesity, for example) Consider that Cuba has not recovered in fifty years and won't for the next fifty as long as their government controls and is hostile to personal power. Maybe the feds should consider fixing what they already control (medicare and medicaid) incrementally. (Those programs are just about out of money and unsustainable, and the government wants more?) Then, If they could get their fraud and coverage of expensive procedures figured out, they could extend the coverage until the programs merged. How about an honest discussion for a change- like how much should the gov't spend, and how should it be spent? Should we really have such a huge transfer of wealth from young to old when financial stress is a top cause for divorce and so harmful for children? So much easier to just take over 17% of the economy than try for some sanity and efficiency. Especially when the trial attorneys are the largest contributors to the democratic party, and a large part of the problem with rising costs. And retirees vote big time! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted August 4, 2009 Report Share Posted August 4, 2009 > " I can certainly empathize that medicare and medicaid folks get cheap coverage while the rest of us pay the big bucks, covered or not. > > However, I'm with Amar Atma totally on this. If government sucks all of the oxygen out of our economy, there won't be much left for us to choose how to best use our resources and live our lives (no money left for yoga lessons! Gotta support someone else's obesity, for example) " I am a yoga student and teacher, a college educated woman with two children who works, volunteers in her community, offers free classes, grows much of her own food, pays taxes on the money my husband and I do make and in no way can even begin to afford medical coverage for my children let alone my husband and myself. I have to say that I find the above quoted post ill-informed, intolerant and so very sad. Not all " medicare and medicaid folks " are lazy or stupid or " obese. " My husband, children and I eat organic, home grown foods, exercise our bodies, minds and spirits on a daily basis and do not fill our hearts with begrudging attitudes towards those in the world that some consider less worthy than ourselves of care and compassion. If you are really, truly upset about all of the money spent on the elderly and those in poverty, than I hope that you are indeed willing to let old mom and pops (and any other family member or friend in need) bunk up with you when their medical bills become too high for them to sustain their mortgage payments, prescriptions and 24 hour nursing care. I agree that the system is broken. But let's not turn on one another with accusatory and ignorant statements about the quality of person who is forced, yes forced, to be part of this system. I wish that my husband and I were in the position to shell out the " big bucks " for our own medical coverage... at least for our children. But, we simply do not make enough money to do so. It costs, minimally, over $600 a month for a family our size, plus ridiculously large co-pays on visits and prescriptions, and a HUGE deductable. I do not know if you have kids, but I think that if you do you would want to at least know that they could get a bone set if it were broken, or antibiotics if they were seriously ill with a bacterial infection. Luckily we are a very healthy crew and do not often have the need for these services, but I am so very thankful that they are available if the need arises. I am all for reform, and I am not necessarily keen on the idea of a totally socialized system. Yes, the lawyers, big pharma, corruption and greed have gravely damaged our ability to even begin to fix this big mess... I do not have answers. What I do have is the desire to be sure that ALL people are cared for... whether *I* think they are *deserving* or not. Oh, I know that there are plenty of people who leach on the rest of society, giving nothing. But, I am willing to care for and have compassion for those people as well. Isn't that what our common yogic path teaches us? Non-judgement, compassion, love... are these not qualities, ideals and practices that should be brought even into our thoughts on political reform and health care? As in all things, shouldn't we move from the heart, from the spirit on this? Shouldn't our discussion and solutions be conjured from a place of peace and love as opposed to frustration and resentment towards our fellow souls? With Love, Nichole Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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