Guest guest Posted July 5, 2008 Report Share Posted July 5, 2008 Hari Aum, Dear bandhu, Your post kindled a conversation with my learned friend and I would like to share his inputs with all respected group members. This information was in the form of a chat transcript so I have done little editing. Pranam " Now, these KAVACHA, ARGALA and KILAKA have to be chanted all three at a time " . There seems to be no scriptural basis for this statement. Devi Kavacham is believed to be a part of varAha purANa [brahmANDa according to some] which does not advocate the exclusive use of Kavacham only with Argala and Kilakam. Someone reading the Kavacha as a part of VarAha purANa can study it without referring to argaLa or kilakam. The ineffectiveness of one of the three without the other two does not seem to have a scriptural or traditional basis. As for Kilaka stotra, there is a lot that needs to be examined. " So, when UTKILANA is PERFORMED with the MANTRA, the NAIL or PIVOT is removed and the BOLT or ARGALA drops off. When the BOLT AND PIVOT is opened, at one shot the entire KAVACHA or ARMOUR is loosened and it drops off from the Body.This KAVACHA is the KANCHUKA of JIVA which is a limitation for the JIVA. So, with the UTKILANA mantra and with the mantra " RUPAM DEHI …… " of ARGALA, the NUT AND BOLT are removed. As soon as ARGALA AND KILAKA are removed, the KAVACHA OF JIVATVA drops off and he is in his SWA-SWARUPA STHITHI " According to this analogy, kIlana is removed first, then the argala and then the kavacha drops. In that case, we would need to recite the three in the same order. But we recite kavacha, argaLA, followed by kIlaka. Nothing wrong with this analogy, but I am trying to decipher its relevance in practice. Also, it is always appreciable to incorporate the hoary ideals of vedAnta into our practices but in a manner that is logical and in line with the shAstra pramANa. If, a combination of kavacha, argaLA and kIlaka alone could result in anAvaraNa or pashutva nivrtti, these three would not have been a~Ngas of the main practice, which is saptasatI. If the goal of saptasatI japarUpopAsti is agreed as cognition of the self, then these three, which can grant the same result, cannot be termed as a~NgAs as the a~NgA~Ngi nyAya falls off the hook. It should be noted however, that the a~Nga status for kavacha, argaLA and kIlaka has pramANa in kAtyAyanI tantra: a~NgahIno yathA devi sarvakarmasu na kshamaH a~NgaShaTkavihInA tu tathA saptasatI stutiH | tasmAdetatpaThitvaiva japetsaptashatIM parAm anyathA shApamApnoti hAni~nchaiva pade pade || As for argaLA, the significance is explained clearly in kAtyAyanI tantra and its commentary: siddhipratibandhakam pApamargaLAsadR^ishatvAdargaLA | tannAshaka stotrasyApi lakShaNayA argaLeti saMj~nA || Argala is typically a wooden bolt used to fasten the door or the lid of a container. Sins, owing to their nature of causing hindrance to mantra siddhi, are comparable to argala because they prohibit the upAsaka from opening the siddhi dvAra. As this stava destroys such sins and hence the obstacles to mantra siddhi [mantra is saptasatI in this case], by lakShana of its application, the stotra also comes to be called argaLA. The pramANa for this is katyAyanI tantra. Similar approach to kIlakam is seen in the same tantra. As for kIlakam, if one examines the text, which we call popularly call a stotra, there really is no stuti of devatA per se but instead prashamsA of the process of niShkIlana. Whether this procedure is something that is hinted within what we call kIlaka stuti or the text itself does this kIlana, is something we need to carefully examine. To get into that direction, we would need to examine the relation between navAraNa mantra and saptasatI, which I probably discussed earlier somewhere. When viewed together, one is pradhAna or the principle and the other is secondary or apradhAna. This pradhAna upasarjana relation is the key here. The first case is where navAkSharI assumes prAdhAnya and saptashatI becomes its a~Nga. In this case, the upAsaka receives navArNa dIkShA from Sadguru, performs purashcharyA and recites saptashatI as it's a~Nga. The other pakSha is where the upAsaka is initiated into saptashatI mAlA mantra as described in DAmarAdi tantras and recites navAkSharI as its a~Nga. With this background, one should examine the verses from the kIlaka chapter: sarvametadvijAnIyAnmantrANAmabhikIlakam | so.api kShemamavApnoti satataM japa [jApya]tatparaH || siddhantyucChATanAdIni vastUni sakalAnyapi | etena stuvatAM devI stotramAtreNa siddhyati || Based on this, it can be understood that by reciting " this " stotra alone, all siddhis are obtained. What is " this " stotra that we are talking about? Is it the text that we call kIlaka stava that can alone grant all siddhis? A simple examination of the content of the text is sufficient to educate us in this regard and dispel this misconception. As we discussed earlier, there is a category of upAsakas who recite navAkSharI alone with a customary importance given to saptashatI. Even such an upAsaka [so.api], who is immersed in constant repetition of the navAraNa, by understanding the process of niShkIlana, attains kShema [this word here is indicative of su-siddhi]. Now what about those, who are devoted solely to the recitation of the mAlA mantra [i.e. the second pakSha discussed above]? Such an upAsaka, without the need for other means, attains sarvasiddhi, by achieving niShkIlana of the mantra. The first pakSha can be interpreted to refer to other mantras as well but it makes more sense to consider navArNa alone for various reasons. So, for prathama pakSha, niShkIlana of the iShTa mantra is achieved by reciting saptashatI stava. For the second pakSha, the vidhi for niShkIlana of the mAlA mantra itself, can be picked from tantrAntara or from the verse: kR^iShNAyAM vA chatirdashyAM aShTamyAM vA samAhitaH | dadAti pratigR^ihNAti nAnyathaiShA prasIdati | itthaM rUpeNa kIlena mahAdevena kIlitam || The procedure, hinted above, is explained in greater detail elsewhere: sarvatra chaNDIpAThasya prAchuryeNa mahItale | brahmakANdaH karmakANdaH tantrakANDashcha sarvadA || abhUtpratihato.anena shighrasiddhipradAyinA | tathA teShAM cha sArthakyaM kartuM kamena bhUtale || dAnapratigrahatvena mantro.ayaM kIlito mayA | dAnapratigrahAkhyaM yatkIlakaM samudAhR^itam || There are charyA and mantra bhAgas for achieving this niShkilana which are to be learnt directly from a competent deshika. " For Kamya Prayogas, the Seedless Fruits (for eg. seedless grapes, kis-mis etc.) are not offered. The prayoga would not yield result as there is no seed in the fruit. Seed indicates 'Karma Phala Bija'. My gurunatha prohibited us from using " SEEDLESS FRUITS " as naivedya in Kamya Prayogas " . There does not seem to be any shAstra pramANa for this prescription. The use of sabIja phalas is prescribed for deities like mahAgaNapati irrespective of whether the worship is nitya, naimittika or kAmya. If there is a pramANa, then we can examine the relevance of this statement, or else, it can be assumed as a specific instruction given by a specific Guru to a specific disciple, and hence of relevance only in that context. Hare kR^iShNa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 5, 2008 Report Share Posted July 5, 2008 Hari Aum, In my previous mail, I took the liberty to change one word to niShkilan, and my friend asked me to use the word utkIlan instead. Apologies to him and all for the mistake. pranam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2008 Report Share Posted July 7, 2008 Respected Mishra, My prostration to your learned friend and it seems I know him by his style of writing. Whoever he may be, I have a great respect for him and he is on par with my gurunatha. So, I would not deny his observations and humbly accept his remarks. This is not to hurt anybody's sentiments nor to refute anybody's opinions. These are some of the facts. As I have already mentioned in my earlier mails, these Purva-Angas and Uttarangas were incorporations of later stage to make Sapthasathi a Mantra Swarupa as Shad-Angas are required for a Mantra. How exactly was the swarupa of Sapthasathi, we do not know. Whether it is `Sapthasathi' or `Navasathi " is a debatable issue. Marichi Kalpa says that the Tantrika Devi Sukta contains " Sahasrakshara Vidya " and hence to be suffixed with Sapthasathi. Vaidika Vak Sukta and Ratri Sukta are added as angas which is from Rig Veda. Who made this connection of Rg Veda and Sapthasathi we do not know. Ancient tantrics while compiling the works have incorporated the Angas into Sapthasathi as it was being misused by upasakas. Tantrics just to maintain a low profile would coin the term " siva-parvati samvada " . This can be seen in the phala sruti of Vishnu Sahasranama " sri rama rama rameti rame………….ramanama varaanane " . Parvati questions whether there is any short cut to Vishnu Sahasranama. Shiva initiates her into this mantra. This is though provoking. So, this shiva-parvati samvada is a work of some low profiled person. Further, there is also a Rudra-Shapa to Vishnu Sahasranama. Who dares to put curse on Vishnu, Chandi etc. When asked, Shri Chandavolu Shastry told that these were the works of Tantrics so as to protect the Shastra from undeserved hands. Vamakeswara Tantra mentions about the " Sapthasathi " as " Navasathi " . Moreover, the original sapthasathi which the Tantra claims to be the primitive one has " rahasya traya " as the 13th chapter. So, " Nava " has got certain esoteric sense with Sapthasathi because of " Navakshari " , " Navashati " , " Navakoshta Chandi Yantra " and " Navaraatri " . Though there is no Shastra Pramana for this, the Kalyanananda Bharati of Virupaksha Pita and Shri Gopanandanatha have compiled " Chandi Navashati " . Moreover, the order of Kavacha, Argala and Kilaka are differently mentioned in Chidambara Samhita which it claims to be the uttama paddathi. Kavacha, Argala and Kilaka are also chanted independently (not as anga) without Sapthasathi. The pradhnopasarga lakshana is to show that when importance is given to Navakshari then Sapthsathi becomes the secondary and vice-versa. That does not mean that the secondary one is inferior. Though, this lakshana is a part of Kilaka apart from dana-pratigraha kriya yoga, there is also exclusively a " Utkilana Mantra " which has to be learnt from gurunatha. Brahmasri Tadepalli Raghavanarayana Sastry used to do the parayana of Chandi without Purva-Angas and Uttara-Angas. He used to do the samputikara of Chandi Navakshari and just used to do the Sapthsathi, per se. No Kavacha, Argala, Kilaka, Ratri Sukta, Devi Sukta, Rahasya Traya etc. When I asked him, he said nothing is required when Navakshari is used as Samputikarana. Those were the later incorporations. MOREOVER, IF ONE GOES BY SHASTRA PRAMANA, THE CHANDI NAVAKSHARI IS NOT PREFIXED WITH PRANAVA BUT STILL SOME OF THE UPASAKAS AND SOME ADVANCED UPASAKAS FROM SRINGERI PITA LIKE SHRI NARENDRA KAPRE, SHRI VENKATESH DAMBLE MAHARAJ, SHRI DONGRE MAHARAJ DO THE NAVAKSHARI WITH PRANAVA. TADEPALLI RAGHAVANANARAYANA SASTRY USED TO DO PRANAVA- RAHITA NAVAKSHARI WHEREAS BRAHMASRI ANANTHARAMA SHASTRY GHANEKAR (MY PARAMAGURU) USED TO DO PRANAVA-SAHITA NAVAKSHARI. Again, shastra is quoted that when Shakta Pranava like AIM, HRIM etc. are added, OM is not required. " hreeshcha te lakshmischa patnou " says the purusha sukta. So, OM is Brahma-vachaka and HRIM is Sakti- vachaka which is called Saktha Pranava. So, if we go by Shastra Pramana, can we deny these stalwarts and brush aside their upasana to be wrong. Certainly Not. Several mutts viz., Pushpagiri, Hariharapura, Hampi, Sampekatte, Yogananda Mutts are doing the Navakshari Japa with Pranava only. Nevertheless, Shri Chandrasekhara Bharati objected to this pranava-sahita Navakshari. Devi Atharvashirshopanishad does not say about Pranava-Sahita Navakshari. Moreover, if Pranava is added, it becomes Chandi Dashakshari which is against the shastra pramana. But still people are doing it. And as regards the Naivedya, though there is no shastra pramana for these, certain facts and observations are made by the subtle intellect of advanced upasakas. They are able to judge with their upasana bala and sukshma buddhi. Certain naivedyas are mandatory for certain kamya prayogas. Infact, there are several reservations regarding the offering of flowers also. Jasmine has certain subtle vibrations, rose has certain vibrations, Chrysenthmum has something and Sunflower has got some vibrations. Even, the naivedya made of Black Gram has for specific purpose. Pulihora, sweet pongal, curd rice is used for certain specific purpose depending upon the tantra prayoga. SO, I THINK ONE SHOULD HUMBLY BOW BEFORE ONE'S GURUPARAMPARA AND FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS OF ONE'S LINEAGE. With regards, Sriram , " shri.tripura " <shri.tripura wrote: > > Hari Aum, Dear bandhu, > > Your post kindled a conversation with my learned friend and I would > like to share his inputs with all respected group members. This > information was in the form of a chat transcript so I have done little > editing. Pranam > > > > " Now, these KAVACHA, ARGALA and KILAKA have to be chanted all three > at a time " . > > > > There seems to be no scriptural basis for this statement. Devi > Kavacham is believed to be a part of varAha purANa [brahmANDa > according to some] which does not advocate the exclusive use of > Kavacham only with Argala and Kilakam. Someone reading the Kavacha as > a part of VarAha purANa can study it without referring to argaLa or > kilakam. The ineffectiveness of one of the three without the other two > does not seem to have a scriptural or traditional basis. As for Kilaka > stotra, there is a lot that needs to be examined. > > > > > " So, when UTKILANA is PERFORMED with the MANTRA, the NAIL or PIVOT is > removed > and the BOLT or ARGALA drops off. When the BOLT AND PIVOT is opened, > at one > shot the entire KAVACHA or ARMOUR is loosened and it drops off from > the Body.This KAVACHA is the KANCHUKA of JIVA which is a limitation > for the JIVA. So, with the UTKILANA mantra and with the mantra " RUPAM > DEHI …… " of ARGALA, > the NUT AND BOLT are removed. As soon as ARGALA AND KILAKA are > removed, the > KAVACHA OF JIVATVA drops off and he is in his SWA-SWARUPA STHITHI " > > > > According to this analogy, kIlana is removed first, then the argala > and then the kavacha drops. In that case, we would need to recite the > three in the same order. But we recite kavacha, argaLA, followed by > kIlaka. Nothing wrong with this analogy, but I am trying to decipher > its relevance in practice. > > Also, it is always appreciable to incorporate the hoary ideals of > vedAnta into our practices but in a manner that is logical and in line > with the shAstra pramANa. If, a combination of kavacha, argaLA and > kIlaka alone could result in anAvaraNa or pashutva nivrtti, these > three would not have been a~Ngas of the main practice, which is > saptasatI. If the goal of saptasatI japarUpopAsti is agreed as > cognition of the self, then these three, which can grant the same > result, cannot be termed as a~NgAs as the a~NgA~Ngi nyAya falls off > the hook. It should be noted however, that the a~Nga status for > kavacha, argaLA and kIlaka has pramANa in kAtyAyanI tantra: > > a~NgahIno yathA devi sarvakarmasu na kshamaH > a~NgaShaTkavihInA tu tathA saptasatI stutiH | > tasmAdetatpaThitvaiva japetsaptashatIM parAm > anyathA shApamApnoti hAni~nchaiva pade pade || > > As for argaLA, the significance is explained clearly in kAtyAyanI > tantra and its commentary: > > siddhipratibandhakam pApamargaLAsadR^ishatvAdargaLA | tannAshaka > stotrasyApi lakShaNayA argaLeti saMj~nA || > > Argala is typically a wooden bolt used to fasten the door or the lid > of a container. Sins, owing to their nature of causing hindrance to > mantra siddhi, are comparable to argala because they prohibit the > upAsaka from opening the siddhi dvAra. As this stava destroys such > sins and hence the obstacles to mantra siddhi [mantra is saptasatI in > this case], by lakShana of its application, the stotra also comes to > be called argaLA. The pramANa for this is katyAyanI tantra. Similar > approach to kIlakam is seen in the same tantra. > > As for kIlakam, if one examines the text, which we call popularly call > a stotra, there really is no stuti of devatA per se but instead > prashamsA of the process of niShkIlana. Whether this procedure is > something that is hinted within what we call kIlaka stuti or the text > itself does this kIlana, is something we need to carefully examine. To > get into that direction, we would need to examine the relation between > navAraNa mantra and saptasatI, which I probably discussed earlier > somewhere. When viewed together, one is pradhAna or the principle and > the other is secondary or apradhAna. This pradhAna upasarjana relation > is the key here. The first case is where navAkSharI assumes prAdhAnya > and saptashatI becomes its a~Nga. In this case, the upAsaka receives > navArNa dIkShA from Sadguru, performs purashcharyA and recites > saptashatI as it's a~Nga. The other pakSha is where the upAsaka is > initiated into saptashatI mAlA mantra as described in DAmarAdi tantras > and recites navAkSharI as its a~Nga. With this background, one should > examine the verses from the kIlaka chapter: > > sarvametadvijAnIyAnmantrANAmabhikIlakam | > so.api kShemamavApnoti satataM japa [jApya]tatparaH || > siddhantyucChATanAdIni vastUni sakalAnyapi | > etena stuvatAM devI stotramAtreNa siddhyati || > > Based on this, it can be understood that by reciting " this " stotra > alone, all siddhis are obtained. What is " this " stotra that we are > talking about? Is it the text that we call kIlaka stava that can alone > grant all siddhis? A simple examination of the content of the text is > sufficient to educate us in this regard and dispel this misconception. > As we discussed earlier, there is a category of upAsakas who recite > navAkSharI alone with a customary importance given to saptashatI. Even > such an upAsaka [so.api], who is immersed in constant repetition of > the navAraNa, by understanding the process of niShkIlana, attains > kShema [this word here is indicative of su-siddhi]. Now what about > those, who are devoted solely to the recitation of the mAlA mantra > [i.e. the second pakSha discussed above]? Such an upAsaka, without the > need for other means, attains sarvasiddhi, by achieving niShkIlana of > the mantra. The first pakSha can be interpreted to refer to other > mantras as well but it makes more sense to consider navArNa alone for > various reasons. So, for prathama pakSha, niShkIlana of the iShTa > mantra is achieved by reciting saptashatI stava. For the second > pakSha, the vidhi for niShkIlana of the mAlA mantra itself, can be > picked from tantrAntara or from the verse: > > kR^iShNAyAM vA chatirdashyAM aShTamyAM vA samAhitaH | > dadAti pratigR^ihNAti nAnyathaiShA prasIdati | > itthaM rUpeNa kIlena mahAdevena kIlitam || > > The procedure, hinted above, is explained in greater detail elsewhere: > > sarvatra chaNDIpAThasya prAchuryeNa mahItale | > brahmakANdaH karmakANdaH tantrakANDashcha sarvadA || > abhUtpratihato.anena shighrasiddhipradAyinA | > tathA teShAM cha sArthakyaM kartuM kamena bhUtale || > dAnapratigrahatvena mantro.ayaM kIlito mayA | > dAnapratigrahAkhyaM yatkIlakaM samudAhR^itam || > > There are charyA and mantra bhAgas for achieving this niShkilana which > are to be learnt directly from a competent deshika. > > > > > > " For Kamya Prayogas, the Seedless Fruits (for eg. seedless grapes, kis-mis > etc.) are not offered. The prayoga would not yield result as there is > no seed > in the fruit. Seed indicates 'Karma Phala Bija'. My gurunatha > prohibited us > from using " SEEDLESS FRUITS " as naivedya in Kamya Prayogas " . > > > > There does not seem to be any shAstra pramANa for this prescription. > The use of sabIja phalas is prescribed for deities like mahAgaNapati > irrespective of whether the worship is nitya, naimittika or kAmya. If > there is a pramANa, then we can examine the relevance of this > statement, or else, it can be assumed as a specific instruction given > by a specific Guru to a specific disciple, and hence of relevance only > in that context. Hare kR^iShNa > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted July 7, 2008 Report Share Posted July 7, 2008 Shri Gurubhyo namah Shri Mahaganapathaye namah Friends: It is wonderful to see points of view expressed without any negative references to individuals. It is nice to see authority being placed behind one's words. This is the kind of vAgvivAdam that one needs in this forum. Thanks and Regards. KR. Shree Maatre namaH - sriram Monday, July 07, 2008 4:08 AM Re: The secret of Kavacha, Argala and Kilaka of Chandi Sapthasathi Respected Mishra, My prostration to your learned friend and it seems I know him by his style of writing. Whoever he may be, I have a great respect for him and he is on par with my gurunatha. So, I would not deny his observations and humbly accept his remarks. This is not to hurt anybody's sentiments nor to refute anybody's opinions. These are some of the facts. As I have already mentioned in my earlier mails, these Purva-Angas and Uttarangas were incorporations of later stage to make Sapthasathi a Mantra Swarupa as Shad-Angas are required for a Mantra. How exactly was the swarupa of Sapthasathi, we do not know. Whether it is `Sapthasathi' or `Navasathi " is a debatable issue. Marichi Kalpa says that the Tantrika Devi Sukta contains " Sahasrakshara Vidya " and hence to be suffixed with Sapthasathi. Vaidika Vak Sukta and Ratri Sukta are added as angas which is from Rig Veda. Who made this connection of Rg Veda and Sapthasathi we do not know. Ancient tantrics while compiling the works have incorporated the Angas into Sapthasathi as it was being misused by upasakas. Tantrics just to maintain a low profile would coin the term " siva-parvati samvada " . This can be seen in the phala sruti of Vishnu Sahasranama " sri rama rama rameti rame.....ramanama varaanane " . Parvati questions whether there is any short cut to Vishnu Sahasranama. Shiva initiates her into this mantra. This is though provoking. So, this shiva-parvati samvada is a work of some low profiled person. Further, there is also a Rudra-Shapa to Vishnu Sahasranama. Who dares to put curse on Vishnu, Chandi etc. When asked, Shri Chandavolu Shastry told that these were the works of Tantrics so as to protect the Shastra from undeserved hands. Vamakeswara Tantra mentions about the " Sapthasathi " as " Navasathi " . Moreover, the original sapthasathi which the Tantra claims to be the primitive one has " rahasya traya " as the 13th chapter. So, " Nava " has got certain esoteric sense with Sapthasathi because of " Navakshari " , " Navashati " , " Navakoshta Chandi Yantra " and " Navaraatri " . Though there is no Shastra Pramana for this, the Kalyanananda Bharati of Virupaksha Pita and Shri Gopanandanatha have compiled " Chandi Navashati " . Moreover, the order of Kavacha, Argala and Kilaka are differently mentioned in Chidambara Samhita which it claims to be the uttama paddathi. Kavacha, Argala and Kilaka are also chanted independently (not as anga) without Sapthasathi. The pradhnopasarga lakshana is to show that when importance is given to Navakshari then Sapthsathi becomes the secondary and vice-versa. That does not mean that the secondary one is inferior. Though, this lakshana is a part of Kilaka apart from dana-pratigraha kriya yoga, there is also exclusively a " Utkilana Mantra " which has to be learnt from gurunatha. Brahmasri Tadepalli Raghavanarayana Sastry used to do the parayana of Chandi without Purva-Angas and Uttara-Angas. He used to do the samputikara of Chandi Navakshari and just used to do the Sapthsathi, per se. No Kavacha, Argala, Kilaka, Ratri Sukta, Devi Sukta, Rahasya Traya etc. When I asked him, he said nothing is required when Navakshari is used as Samputikarana. Those were the later incorporations. MOREOVER, IF ONE GOES BY SHASTRA PRAMANA, THE CHANDI NAVAKSHARI IS NOT PREFIXED WITH PRANAVA BUT STILL SOME OF THE UPASAKAS AND SOME ADVANCED UPASAKAS FROM SRINGERI PITA LIKE SHRI NARENDRA KAPRE, SHRI VENKATESH DAMBLE MAHARAJ, SHRI DONGRE MAHARAJ DO THE NAVAKSHARI WITH PRANAVA. TADEPALLI RAGHAVANANARAYANA SASTRY USED TO DO PRANAVA- RAHITA NAVAKSHARI WHEREAS BRAHMASRI ANANTHARAMA SHASTRY GHANEKAR (MY PARAMAGURU) USED TO DO PRANAVA-SAHITA NAVAKSHARI. Again, shastra is quoted that when Shakta Pranava like AIM, HRIM etc. are added, OM is not required. " hreeshcha te lakshmischa patnou " says the purusha sukta. So, OM is Brahma-vachaka and HRIM is Sakti- vachaka which is called Saktha Pranava. So, if we go by Shastra Pramana, can we deny these stalwarts and brush aside their upasana to be wrong. Certainly Not. Several mutts viz., Pushpagiri, Hariharapura, Hampi, Sampekatte, Yogananda Mutts are doing the Navakshari Japa with Pranava only. Nevertheless, Shri Chandrasekhara Bharati objected to this pranava-sahita Navakshari. Devi Atharvashirshopanishad does not say about Pranava-Sahita Navakshari. Moreover, if Pranava is added, it becomes Chandi Dashakshari which is against the shastra pramana. But still people are doing it. And as regards the Naivedya, though there is no shastra pramana for these, certain facts and observations are made by the subtle intellect of advanced upasakas. They are able to judge with their upasana bala and sukshma buddhi. Certain naivedyas are mandatory for certain kamya prayogas. Infact, there are several reservations regarding the offering of flowers also. Jasmine has certain subtle vibrations, rose has certain vibrations, Chrysenthmum has something and Sunflower has got some vibrations. Even, the naivedya made of Black Gram has for specific purpose. Pulihora, sweet pongal, curd rice is used for certain specific purpose depending upon the tantra prayoga. SO, I THINK ONE SHOULD HUMBLY BOW BEFORE ONE'S GURUPARAMPARA AND FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS OF ONE'S LINEAGE. With regards, Sriram , " shri.tripura " <shri.tripura wrote: > > Hari Aum, Dear bandhu, > > Your post kindled a conversation with my learned friend and I would > like to share his inputs with all respected group members. This > information was in the form of a chat transcript so I have done little > editing. Pranam > > > > " Now, these KAVACHA, ARGALA and KILAKA have to be chanted all three > at a time " . > > > > There seems to be no scriptural basis for this statement. Devi > Kavacham is believed to be a part of varAha purANa [brahmANDa > according to some] which does not advocate the exclusive use of > Kavacham only with Argala and Kilakam. Someone reading the Kavacha as > a part of VarAha purANa can study it without referring to argaLa or > kilakam. The ineffectiveness of one of the three without the other two > does not seem to have a scriptural or traditional basis. As for Kilaka > stotra, there is a lot that needs to be examined. > > > > > " So, when UTKILANA is PERFORMED with the MANTRA, the NAIL or PIVOT is > removed > and the BOLT or ARGALA drops off. When the BOLT AND PIVOT is opened, > at one > shot the entire KAVACHA or ARMOUR is loosened and it drops off from > the Body.This KAVACHA is the KANCHUKA of JIVA which is a limitation > for the JIVA. So, with the UTKILANA mantra and with the mantra " RUPAM > DEHI .. " of ARGALA, > the NUT AND BOLT are removed. As soon as ARGALA AND KILAKA are > removed, the > KAVACHA OF JIVATVA drops off and he is in his SWA-SWARUPA STHITHI " > > > > According to this analogy, kIlana is removed first, then the argala > and then the kavacha drops. In that case, we would need to recite the > three in the same order. But we recite kavacha, argaLA, followed by > kIlaka. Nothing wrong with this analogy, but I am trying to decipher > its relevance in practice. > > Also, it is always appreciable to incorporate the hoary ideals of > vedAnta into our practices but in a manner that is logical and in line > with the shAstra pramANa. If, a combination of kavacha, argaLA and > kIlaka alone could result in anAvaraNa or pashutva nivrtti, these > three would not have been a~Ngas of the main practice, which is > saptasatI. If the goal of saptasatI japarUpopAsti is agreed as > cognition of the self, then these three, which can grant the same > result, cannot be termed as a~NgAs as the a~NgA~Ngi nyAya falls off > the hook. It should be noted however, that the a~Nga status for > kavacha, argaLA and kIlaka has pramANa in kAtyAyanI tantra: > > a~NgahIno yathA devi sarvakarmasu na kshamaH > a~NgaShaTkavihInA tu tathA saptasatI stutiH | > tasmAdetatpaThitvaiva japetsaptashatIM parAm > anyathA shApamApnoti hAni~nchaiva pade pade || > > As for argaLA, the significance is explained clearly in kAtyAyanI > tantra and its commentary: > > siddhipratibandhakam pApamargaLAsadR^ishatvAdargaLA | tannAshaka > stotrasyApi lakShaNayA argaLeti saMj~nA || > > Argala is typically a wooden bolt used to fasten the door or the lid > of a container. Sins, owing to their nature of causing hindrance to > mantra siddhi, are comparable to argala because they prohibit the > upAsaka from opening the siddhi dvAra. As this stava destroys such > sins and hence the obstacles to mantra siddhi [mantra is saptasatI in > this case], by lakShana of its application, the stotra also comes to > be called argaLA. The pramANa for this is katyAyanI tantra. Similar > approach to kIlakam is seen in the same tantra. > > As for kIlakam, if one examines the text, which we call popularly call > a stotra, there really is no stuti of devatA per se but instead > prashamsA of the process of niShkIlana. Whether this procedure is > something that is hinted within what we call kIlaka stuti or the text > itself does this kIlana, is something we need to carefully examine. To > get into that direction, we would need to examine the relation between > navAraNa mantra and saptasatI, which I probably discussed earlier > somewhere. When viewed together, one is pradhAna or the principle and > the other is secondary or apradhAna. This pradhAna upasarjana relation > is the key here. The first case is where navAkSharI assumes prAdhAnya > and saptashatI becomes its a~Nga. In this case, the upAsaka receives > navArNa dIkShA from Sadguru, performs purashcharyA and recites > saptashatI as it's a~Nga. The other pakSha is where the upAsaka is > initiated into saptashatI mAlA mantra as described in DAmarAdi tantras > and recites navAkSharI as its a~Nga. With this background, one should > examine the verses from the kIlaka chapter: > > sarvametadvijAnIyAnmantrANAmabhikIlakam | > so.api kShemamavApnoti satataM japa [jApya]tatparaH || > siddhantyucChATanAdIni vastUni sakalAnyapi | > etena stuvatAM devI stotramAtreNa siddhyati || > > Based on this, it can be understood that by reciting " this " stotra > alone, all siddhis are obtained. What is " this " stotra that we are > talking about? Is it the text that we call kIlaka stava that can alone > grant all siddhis? A simple examination of the content of the text is > sufficient to educate us in this regard and dispel this misconception. > As we discussed earlier, there is a category of upAsakas who recite > navAkSharI alone with a customary importance given to saptashatI. Even > such an upAsaka [so.api], who is immersed in constant repetition of > the navAraNa, by understanding the process of niShkIlana, attains > kShema [this word here is indicative of su-siddhi]. Now what about > those, who are devoted solely to the recitation of the mAlA mantra > [i.e. the second pakSha discussed above]? Such an upAsaka, without the > need for other means, attains sarvasiddhi, by achieving niShkIlana of > the mantra. The first pakSha can be interpreted to refer to other > mantras as well but it makes more sense to consider navArNa alone for > various reasons. So, for prathama pakSha, niShkIlana of the iShTa > mantra is achieved by reciting saptashatI stava. For the second > pakSha, the vidhi for niShkIlana of the mAlA mantra itself, can be > picked from tantrAntara or from the verse: > > kR^iShNAyAM vA chatirdashyAM aShTamyAM vA samAhitaH | > dadAti pratigR^ihNAti nAnyathaiShA prasIdati | > itthaM rUpeNa kIlena mahAdevena kIlitam || > > The procedure, hinted above, is explained in greater detail elsewhere: > > sarvatra chaNDIpAThasya prAchuryeNa mahItale | > brahmakANdaH karmakANdaH tantrakANDashcha sarvadA || > abhUtpratihato.anena shighrasiddhipradAyinA | > tathA teShAM cha sArthakyaM kartuM kamena bhUtale || > dAnapratigrahatvena mantro.ayaM kIlito mayA | > dAnapratigrahAkhyaM yatkIlakaM samudAhR^itam || > > There are charyA and mantra bhAgas for achieving this niShkilana which > are to be learnt directly from a competent deshika. > > > > > > " For Kamya Prayogas, the Seedless Fruits (for eg. seedless grapes, kis-mis > etc.) are not offered. The prayoga would not yield result as there is > no seed > in the fruit. Seed indicates 'Karma Phala Bija'. My gurunatha > prohibited us > from using " SEEDLESS FRUITS " as naivedya in Kamya Prayogas " . > > > > There does not seem to be any shAstra pramANa for this prescription. > The use of sabIja phalas is prescribed for deities like mahAgaNapati > irrespective of whether the worship is nitya, naimittika or kAmya. If > there is a pramANa, then we can examine the relevance of this > statement, or else, it can be assumed as a specific instruction given > by a specific Guru to a specific disciple, and hence of relevance only > in that context. Hare kR^iShNa > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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