What to do if upasana is broken?

[Guest guest]

Namah Tripurasundari

 

I have failed in maintaining the continuity of my upasana. So what

should I do? Shall i start it again from the beginning or just

continue from where it was broken?

[Guest guest]

It depends on a lot of things. How was your upasana's continuity

disturbed? Are we talking about a phone call interrupting you in the

middle of japa? Or is it a bigger " falling off the wagon " thing,

where you haven't done any upasana at all for months or years?

 

In general, I am a proponent of starting over. In the case of the

telphone interrupting japa I'd go back to the beginning (IF time

wasn't an issue; I think it's always better to do something than

nothing -- but if circumstances allow, why not start over?).

 

If the case of having fallen out of the habit of upasana, I'd also

start over again, nice and slow. And then -- as with a hatha yoga

practice that's been long interrupted -- just listen to your mind and

body.

 

Chances are, if you've done a lot of upasana in the past, it will

come back very quickly, and you'll be back where you left off in no

time. Whereas if you try and jump in directly where you left off,

there's going to be a heavy sense of disconnect and discontinuity.

Better to spend a little time gently bring yourself back up to speed.

 

~ aim mAtangyai namaH ~

 

, " Haridev.S.V "

<haridevcusat wrote:

>

> Namah Tripurasundari

>

> I have failed in maintaining the continuity of my upasana. So what

> should I do? Shall i start it again from the beginning or just

> continue from where it was broken?

>

[Guest guest]

Not a drop of sadhana is ever wasted. Even if the goal was not previously

attained. Pretty simple to start over for some prayoga, or continue some

shanti sadhana with no ill results. In the Vajrayana we have ways to atone

for commitment breaks. At any rate, the methods are the same as for the

sadhanas themselves - practice, charity, yamas, niyamas, etc....in some ways

there is nothing called 'continuity' at all whatsoever, but just some notion

of continuance. But on the other hand, the notion of continuance of sadhana

all the time is the very definition of tantra. Best to ask the person who

gave you the sadhana, or if nobody gave it to you then you are your own

expert. The most important thing is to 'just do it!'

[Guest guest]

Wouldnt it be better to consult your Guru in this matter?

 

I think if purushcharana breaks then you break niyama of sadhana and in most

mantra based sadhana that completely voids the whole practice and one must

restart it all over again. It depends how liberal you are with your " upasana " .

 

I have a meru that took ages to do prana pratishta to so basically rain, hail or

shine some milk goes on it with mantras to Devi as a basic minimum. In the event

where puja is missed I do a three kumbha based abhisheka to Meru, and other

items of worship that I have. Fortunately this has never happened.

 

In cases where a purushcharana is broken then homa is done to the respective

deity and for Lalita it normally means doing homa to her anga devatas as well.

It is also recommended by a lot of scriptures that in the event a sankalpa for a

purushcharana is broken that austerities and charity work be taken such as

kumari puja and the anusthan be restarted.

 

Gurus are at liberty to simplify these scriptural demands and veto a lot of the

hard work that is required when purushcharana is missed. If one knowing of

scripture consults the Master in hopes of getting a simpler form of redemption

then they are performing a morally corrupt deed, so it would be prudent to

consult a Guru where possible before asking someone else.

 

 

Devi Bhakta <devi_bhakta

 

Saturday, 24 March, 2007 12:52:08 AM

Re: What to do if upasana is broken?

 

It depends on a lot of things. How was your upasana's continuity disturbed? Are

we talking about a phone call interrupting you in the middle of japa? Or is it a

bigger " falling off the wagon " thing, where you haven't done any upasana at all

for months or years?

 

In general, I am a proponent of starting over. In the case of the telphone

interrupting japa I'd go back to the beginning (IF time wasn't an issue; I think

it's always better to do something than nothing -- but if circumstances allow,

why not start over?).

 

If the case of having fallen out of the habit of upasana, I'd also start over

again, nice and slow. And then -- as with a hatha yoga practice that's been long

interrupted -- just listen to your mind and body.

 

Chances are, if you've done a lot of upasana in the past, it will come back very

quickly, and you'll be back where you left off in no time. Whereas if you try

and jump in directly where you left off, there's going to be a heavy sense of

disconnect and discontinuity. Better to spend a little time gently bring

yourself back up to speed.

 

 

 

~ aim mAtangyai namaH ~

 

, " Haridev.S.V "

 

<haridevcusat@ ... wrote:

 

Namah Tripurasundari

 

I have failed in maintaining the continuity of my upasana. So what should I do?

Shall i start it again from the beginning or just continue from where it was

broken?

[Guest guest]

It is the best advice of course; but is it not safe to assume that if

Haridev had a Guru to ask, would not not be asking us?

 

Perhaps I am wrong to say so, but one of the more frequent complaints

I've received from various members here is that the " ask your Guru "

response is unhelpful to the vast majority of people who do not have one.

 

Please know that this is not a criticism of your excellent and learned

reply, Kartik; just a general observation for whatever it may be worth.

 

DB

 

 

, kartik gaurav <omkaaraya

wrote:

>

> Wouldnt it be better to consult your Guru in this matter?

>

> I think if purushcharana breaks then you break niyama of sadhana and

in most mantra based sadhana that completely voids the whole practice

and one must restart it all over again. It depends how liberal you are

with your " upasana " .

>

> I have a meru that took ages to do prana pratishta to so basically

rain, hail or shine some milk goes on it with mantras to Devi as a

basic minimum. In the event where puja is missed I do a three kumbha

based abhisheka to Meru, and other items of worship that I have.

Fortunately this has never happened.

>

> In cases where a purushcharana is broken then homa is done to the

respective deity and for Lalita it normally means doing homa to her

anga devatas as well. It is also recommended by a lot of scriptures

that in the event a sankalpa for a purushcharana is broken that

austerities and charity work be taken such as kumari puja and the

anusthan be restarted.

>

> Gurus are at liberty to simplify these scriptural demands and veto a

lot of the hard work that is required when purushcharana is missed. If

one knowing of scripture consults the Master in hopes of getting a

simpler form of redemption then they are performing a morally corrupt

deed, so it would be prudent to consult a Guru where possible before

asking someone else.

>

>

> Devi Bhakta <devi_bhakta

>

> Saturday, 24 March, 2007 12:52:08 AM

> Re: What to do if upasana is broken?

>

> It depends on a lot of things. How was your upasana's continuity

disturbed? Are we talking about a phone call interrupting you in the

middle of japa? Or is it a bigger " falling off the wagon " thing, where

you haven't done any upasana at all for months or years?

>

> In general, I am a proponent of starting over. In the case of the

telphone interrupting japa I'd go back to the beginning (IF time

wasn't an issue; I think it's always better to do something than

nothing -- but if circumstances allow, why not start over?).

>

> If the case of having fallen out of the habit of upasana, I'd also

start over again, nice and slow. And then -- as with a hatha yoga

practice that's been long interrupted -- just listen to your mind and

body.

>

> Chances are, if you've done a lot of upasana in the past, it will

come back very quickly, and you'll be back where you left off in no

time. Whereas if you try and jump in directly where you left off,

there's going to be a heavy sense of disconnect and discontinuity.

Better to spend a little time gently bring yourself back up to speed.

>

>

>

> ~ aim mAtangyai namaH ~

>

> , " Haridev.S.V "

>

> <haridevcusat@ ... wrote:

>

> Namah Tripurasundari

>

> I have failed in maintaining the continuity of my upasana. So what

should I do? Shall i start it again from the beginning or just

continue from where it was broken?

>

[Guest guest]

Namaste DB,

 

I dont assume, at least not in this topic. Making assumptions in sadhana for me

is the equivalent of walking a fine line over the hell fire which is one's

ignorance.

 

Scripture has tremendously harsh and for some, impossible measures for the

instances where one breaks their oath/sankalpa in carrying out a particular

anusthan. Only a Guru has the supreme authority to veto such demands that

conventional scripture makes and allow the shishya a much more easier route to

self redemption. A lot of people tend to forget that the vidya one uses is

sentient and living; it is the very fabric that connects us to the personage of

the divine- its nature can change rapidly on account of our karmas and that is

why the shastra deshikas have implemented such rigid and specific protocol in

addressing most issues which arise in or due to sadhana.

 

A Guru or a Natha of one's parampara is considered as being augmented with the

discernment that is required to discriminate between aspects of shastra which

have been written to insight fear and prevent the occurrence of certain acts and

those which are the true solutions to one's problems in sadhana.

 

I am sure none have been eaten alive by Yoginis, who have done the Bala vidya

without diksha- but I am certain it might take them a longer period than if they

had proper shakti patha, diksha and upadesha from a living tradition; unless of

course they have some due prarabdha or Devi anugraha which are both rare in the

absence of diksha and such.

 

Without knowing the details of the type of upAsana, or having the pleasure of

knowing Sri Haridev personally, it would be blatantly ignorant of me to assume

anything- yet alone give the suggestion of restarting the sadhana. Some sadhanas

cause catastrophic results if they are restarted without due rites to propitiate

any malefic effects one might have generated in the initial practice. The

sadhana of Tara comes to mind where the devotee has to go neck deep in a natural

source of water, and recite a thousand times the gayatri of Tara before dawn.

 

I understand that there are people who do sadhana without proper diksha/upadesha

and I find this to be very disturbing and strange. There are no scripture that I

have come across which accept Guru and or parampara as being ancillary

components, if anything, they are more important than the mantras themselves.

 

 

 

 

Devi Bhakta <devi_bhakta

 

Saturday, 24 March, 2007 4:48:53 PM

Re: What to do if upasana is broken?

[Guest guest]

Regarding Ask your Guru:

 

When people see specific questions, there is no sure answer without

knowing what the questioner is really doing.

 

I can quote only a Cardinal rule of guidance. Here it is:

 

This for those who " wing-it " without a Guru. No one can do a sadhana

lasting for more than 15 minutes or so. To do more than that it

requires extraordinary spiritual prowess, in the form of initiation

from Guru, followed by long practices of observing, chanting etc.

 

All ways start at zero, that is, you are nothing. No ego. " Oh I'm

special, I can do more " is a fallacy. Do not give into it.

 

If you have an urge to do long sadhana, stop and think. No " good " God

will ask for long sadhana. Like a mother, " My child is happy. (S)he

will come to me, when (s)he wants to. " That is it, no other

interpretation.

 

Make sure there are no electrical equipment above and below you or the

deity (where it is placed), no toilet or water drains above or below

(you/deity). Sit on a simple cloth (cotton works fine), facing east.

The long ends of the cloth facing east-west, you facing east. Morning

or evening, do the same. Do not ever change. If some uninitiated retard

told you to use dharbAsana or something like that, do not do it. If you

are using it, stop using it. Only Gods can sit on DharbAsana and we are

not there yet.

 

After visiting cemetary etc, always take a shower, wear fresh clothes.

Clense properly (at least, wash face, hands, feet, gargle 3 times)

after using the toilet. Take a shower in warm water (bearable

temperature) before doing a sadhana. Being a shaktha, wear kumkum

between the brows.

 

If you do not have a Guru, make yourself one. Before starting your

sadhana, pray to Adi sankara or Sringeri/ Kanchi Gurus or Ammachi or

Lolla, whomever you feel comfy with. If a photo of Guru is available,

place it at the entrance of your home, prefrably facing the entrance,

adorned with kumkum. Pray with " Guru brahmah, gurur vishnuh...... " ask

them to guide, teach you how to do the correct sadhana. Ask them or

rather beg them to correct any mistakes in your sadhana. Once finished

praying, submit your sadhana at the feet of your Guru and beg him/her

to correct the mistakes (rituals, pronunciation etc) and submit it to

HER. Do NOT ever submit it directly to whatever appears before you or

to your ishta devatha. Only Guru knows how to submit it to HER as He is

HER.

 

After doing all this, suddenly, you feel that you should not do even

the sadhana you are doing, take it as Guru's Order and stick to simple

slokas (No LSN, LT, SL - as they are mahamantras in their own might).

Or if you feel like chanting the above stotras, go to a temple and

chant. The nasties are banned from (consecreted) temples because of

specific rituals. Due to the power of LSN, LT and SL, all the good and

bad will arrive. But, as always, bad will be the first to arrive as

both exist in homes. If you do not have the ability to discern between

good and the bad or the " itches and seeing dead ppl " syndrome is too

much to bear, go to a temple to do the stotra chanting or even sadhana.

 

If you feel empty and not spiritually charged while chating in the

temple (as you felt while doing it at home), continue doing it, until

you feel the same as you do in your home. If you feel charged while

chanting at home and not so much at temple (even after several days),

then there is an issue at home. Stick to slokas (no mantra stotras) at

home until a way/means is found to resolve it. Guru (as above) will

help there.

 

End of Guru advise for the uninitiated. If still suffering from itches

and seeing dead people, take two asprins and call your Guru in the

morning.

 

G

 

 

 

, " Devi Bhakta " <devi_bhakta

wrote:

>

> It is the best advice of course; but is it not safe to assume that if

> Haridev had a Guru to ask, would not not be asking us?

>

> Perhaps I am wrong to say so, but one of the more frequent complaints

> I've received from various members here is that the " ask your Guru "

> response is unhelpful to the vast majority of people who do not have

one.

>

> Please know that this is not a criticism of your excellent and learned

> reply, Kartik; just a general observation for whatever it may be

worth.

>

> DB

[Guest guest]

Dear G,

 

thank you so much for your guidance- you put everything very nicely and and a

matter of fact way which was very refreshing. Once again thanks.

By the way what is ST, LN?

 

 

 

ganpra <ganpra wrote: Regarding

Ask your Guru:

 

When people see specific questions, there is no sure answer without

knowing what the questioner is really doing.

 

I can quote only a Cardinal rule of guidance. Here it is:

[Guest guest]

LT = Lalita Trisathi

LSN = Lalita Sahasranama

SL = Soundarya Lahari

 

, h p <random_cerebral

wrote:

>

> Dear G,

>

> thank you so much for your guidance- you put everything very nicely

and and a matter of fact way which was very refreshing. Once again

thanks.

> By the way what is ST, LN?

>

>

>

> ganpra <ganpra wrote:

Regarding Ask your Guru:

>

> When people see specific questions, there is no sure answer

without

> knowing what the questioner is really doing.

>

> I can quote only a Cardinal rule of guidance. Here it is:

>

[Guest guest]

I know LSN, LT, SL are considered to be Mahamantras, but this is the

first time I've heard of any warnings about merely chanting them. In

many of the homes I know these are chanted regularly [ sometimes only

on Tues and Fri.]. There are also many ladies groups who get together

and chant them regularly and do it in rotation in different houses

with apparently no bad effects or " itches " or " corpses " troubling them!

In fact Vedanta Bharati, headquartered in Mysore has been trying to

popularise the chanting of SL etc. and to this end they had arranged a

mass chanting program in Jan. this year in Bangalore, where different

groups [ I think the number was around 65,000+ women] congregated at

Palace Grounds and chanted the SL. I am also part of one such group,

but since I was out of town could'nt particiapte in that particular

program.

So far none of the ladies I know have reported any ill effects from

chanting these mantras.I myself have been chanting the LSN since I was

a kid and did'nt even undertand what it was all about, but did it all

the same because my Amma insisted and said it was good for me.Now I'm

understanding it in greater depth.

It has only blessed me, never sent any negative energies, no dead

bodies.Itches yes..from mosquito bites and insects.. then they are

also Mahamaya/Devi

 

 

 

, " ganpra " <ganpra wrote:

>

> Regarding Ask your Guru:

>

> When people see specific questions, there is no sure answer without

> knowing what the questioner is really doing.

>

> I can quote only a Cardinal rule of guidance. Here it is:

>

>

[Guest guest]

That advise is for people who chant Sri Vidya mantras w/o initiation

from a Guru, who in case of odd occurances might choose only to chant

LSN, LT or SL. I never stated that it is wrong to chant LSN, LT or SL

or it is harmful to chant them w/o any initiation.

 

The whole posting, broken in smaller paragraphs (for the ease of

reading and understanding, as this one as well) is a continous advise

dwelling on various aspects. Please do not take only one part and

interpret differently, as it might/will not make any sense to those who

do NOT experience such things.

 

As the first few sentences stated, it is not easy to prescribe or

proscribe certain sadhana based on the questions one ask on this group.

Unless someone who can " see " meets or connects with the person, no

specific solution can be given.

 

It is a catch all method, to evaluate and discern the occurances which

have been posted here, when there are issues at the place of chanting,

owing either to the person or the place or mantra sadhana.

 

Thanks for bringing up the point for clarification.

 

G

 

, " tclived " <tclived wrote:

>

> I know LSN, LT, SL are considered to be Mahamantras, but this is the

> first time I've heard of any warnings about merely chanting them. In

> many of the homes

[Guest guest]

Hi everyone,

 

About chanting of LSN, SL, LT etc., the traditional view point is that one must

receive it from a guru even for reciting it without proper nyasa. These

compositions are part of mantrashaastra and can be used in prayogas for kaamya

purposes. Simply acquiring it from a book and reciting especially if one wants

any of his desires fulfilled will be futile.

 

Of course in this time and age, it is rather difficult to expect anyone to

adhere strictly to these rules - all the same the rules are there. No competent

authority is vested with powers to waive these unless it is one's own Guru who

is an accomplished master.

 

Reciting it everyday just like reciting Vishnu Sahasranaamam may lead us in the

right path, it per se may not bring any spiritual advancement.

 

Compare a person who has done years of practice under a guru in Karnatic music

singing a song and one who sings songs by listening to songs being played

repeatedly (but without proper tutelage).

 

About mass recitation, it is like moving in a sea of people. Madi (Tamil word

for Suchi) is not violated when one moves in and through a sea of humanity. This

is a part of sadachara rule.

 

I contribute my ignorance to the discussiion.

 

JR

 

ganpra <ganpra wrote: That

advise is for people who chant Sri Vidya mantras w/o initiation

from a Guru, who in case of odd occurances might choose only to chant

LSN, LT or SL. I never stated that it is wrong to chant LSN, LT or SL

or it is harmful to chant them w/o any initiation.

 

The whole posting, broken in smaller paragraphs (for the ease of

reading and understanding, as this one as well) is a continous advise

dwelling on various aspects. Please do not take only one part and

interpret differently, as it might/will not make any sense to those who

do NOT experience such things.

 

As the first few sentences stated, it is not easy to prescribe or

proscribe certain sadhana based on the questions one ask on this group.

Unless someone who can " see " meets or connects with the person, no

specific solution can be given.

 

It is a catch all method, to evaluate and discern the occurances which

have been posted here, when there are issues at the place of chanting,

owing either to the person or the place or mantra sadhana.

 

Thanks for bringing up the point for clarification.

 

G

 

, " tclived " <tclived wrote:

>

> I know LSN, LT, SL are considered to be Mahamantras, but this is the

> first time I've heard of any warnings about merely chanting them. In

> many of the homes

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Expecting? Get great news right away with email Auto-Check.

Try the Mail Beta.

 

 

[Guest guest]

Namah Tripurasundari

I meant an upasana for six months and i missed it for 2 consecutive days

 

, " Devi Bhakta " <devi_bhakta

wrote:

>

> It depends on a lot of things. How was your upasana's continuity

> disturbed? Are we talking about a phone call interrupting you in the

> middle of japa? Or is it a bigger " falling off the wagon " thing,

> where you haven't done any upasana at all for months or years?

>

[Guest guest]

Hail Mother Goddess

 

Hello Karthik

 

Sure that no one can accomplish without a Guru, (or else he should be

an incarnate).Even Lord Krishna formally had a guru, following the

parampara.

I have never got diksha from a guru. I consider Amritanandamayi Devi

as my Guru. She Herself had no guru to guide her , she was born in

the lowest of circumstances from where one could find it difficult to

progress spiritually. No one assisted Her sadhana, everyone opposed

Her spiritual ways.She was uninitiated in any mantra and hence she

used to chant 'amma amma '. Yet She accomplished and She once said

to Her disciples...'if I could reach goal from those circumstances,

why cant you people?'...

I have read Her life in books and saw how weary Her circumstances

were. She was just showing us an example in devotion. Incarnations

dont need Gurus at all.

 

But She herself adviced that 'no one will ever reach the goal in

spirituality without an accomplished Guru. There may be one or two

who may do it without Guru, but they are only a controversy to the

common rule.'

 

Sarada Devi's teachings say that without diksha a upasak will be

impure and unsteady. today he will be attracted to one mantra,

tomorrow another and before succeeding that he will choose another

and so on.

 

I want to know whether it incur any sin to chant mantras without

diksha. What should uninitiated devotees do ? Should they chant

anything?or keep away from the deities .

how to achieve Guru's grace

 

 

 

, kartik gaurav <omkaaraya

wrote:

>

> Namaste DB,

>

> I dont assume, at least not in this topic. Making assumptions in

sadhana for me is the equivalent of walking a fine line over the hell

fire which is one's ignorance.

>

> Scripture has tremendously harsh and for some, impossible measures

for the instances where one breaks their oath/sankalpa in carrying

out a particular anusthan. Only a Guru has the supreme authority to

veto such demands that conventional scripture makes and allow the

shishya a much more easier route to self redemption. A lot of people

tend to forget that the vidya one uses is sentient and living; it is

the very fabric that connects us to the personage of the divine- its

nature can change rapidly on account of our karmas and that is why

the shastra deshikas have implemented such rigid and specific

protocol in addressing most issues which arise in or due to sadhana.

>

> A Guru or a Natha of one's parampara is considered as being

augmented with the discernment that is required to discriminate

between aspects of shastra which have been written to insight fear

and prevent the occurrence of certain acts and those which are the

true solutions to one's problems in sadhana.

>

> I am sure none have been eaten alive by Yoginis, who have done the

Bala vidya without diksha- but I am certain it might take them a

longer period than if they had proper shakti patha, diksha and

upadesha from a living tradition; unless of course they have some due

prarabdha or Devi anugraha which are both rare in the absence of

diksha and such.

>

> Without knowing the details of the type of upAsana, or having the

pleasure of knowing Sri Haridev personally, it would be blatantly

ignorant of me to assume anything- yet alone give the suggestion of

restarting the sadhana. Some sadhanas cause catastrophic results if

they are restarted without due rites to propitiate any malefic

effects one might have generated in the initial practice. The sadhana

of Tara comes to mind where the devotee has to go neck deep in a

natural source of water, and recite a thousand times the gayatri of

Tara before dawn.

>

> I understand that there are people who do sadhana without proper

diksha/upadesha and I find this to be very disturbing and strange.

There are no scripture that I have come across which accept Guru and

or parampara as being ancillary components, if anything, they are

more important than the mantras themselves.

>

>

>

[Guest guest]

Namah Tripurasundari

 

Hello Devotees,

 

The following statement I read from Ganpra's message. I dont know

whether everyone accept it or not.

 

" ........ No one can do a sadhana lasting for more than 15 minutes or

so. To do more than that it requires extraordinary spiritual prowess,

in the form of initiation from Guru, followed by long practices of

observing, chanting etc.... "

 

 

But I feel elevated after reading the above statement since I used to

sit continuously for 5 or 6 hours in my college days for chanting Her

praises. Fellow students used to abuse, but it was my weakness. They

tell I was wasting time. I thought- the time others spend to drink,

smoke, roam , sleep etc, i am using it to chant.After reading here that

uninitiated people should not chant anything, i now feel i was wasting

time, acquiring sin.

[Guest guest]

Namaste Harideva Ji,

 

I've put this post so that the most relevant information comes to you first-

These are my opinions and I am not projecting any of these as being facts or

anyone else save myself. Hope this helps:

 

 

I've heard that the mantra as mentioned in the Tripura Tapini upanishad

works really well without any diksha. I've heard this from a very

reliable source and am of the opinion that it is true. I've also heard the same

about navarna but:

 

 

 

Ask yourself the question, in the end what difference does it make if

you recite a vidya of a maha vidya or just do their nAmasmarana? Dont

you have the conviction that She listens? If She does then why go

through the pain of doing something the hard way. Without proper

guidance people can injure themselves when performing tantric rites and

using tantric mantras. If a mantra can cause marana, mohana, stambhana

and ucchatana on another then what makes you think it wont backfire on

you?

 

S

ure tantric/bijokta mantras can be empowering and they sound cool but

after doing a few lakhs of their japa that thrill just becomes a fad.

There is a bottle neck with all Vidyas, most of them die out at the

rudra granthi when one masters the anahata Nada- you no longer use

vaikhari to propel yourself from here into true nivritti. In fact just

before you master this you get ability for pashyanti and such. You also

master a few stages of nidra [refer to mandukya upanishad]= all this is

possible with her name as well. Even shAbar mantras can take you this

far forget bijokta mantras, so basically the idea here is start off

with nAmasmarana. I know someone who didnt rely on tantric mantras, was a

devotee of Tara and reached unmani avastha, what does that tell you?

This person told me that bijokta mantra is just a part of much broader spectrum

of ways one can use to attain Devi. He felt that She didnt want him to jump into

the tantric stuff and so led him into the hatha tradition. He is still a shakta

at heart and a strong devotee for saptashati.

 

 

All bija mantras do is just provide you with siddhis, mukti can be sought even

by name as well. They also accelerate the normal process that one initiates with

nAmasmarana but the cost is that you have to do quite a number of rituals

inorder to activate them.

 

Parampara Tarpana, Yantra Purushcharana, Nyasa, Prayathara, Japa with Dhyana,

doing Utkilana, Shodhana, Dipika and for some mantras Sanjivani Viddhi and

finally ending it with Bali and Bali devata tarpana. This stuff is ridiculously

long and complicated for one who does not have diksha, it would also be mind

blowing becuase following the wrotten tantras make it much harder [some

exaggerate on the rituals and requirements].

 

I am not being a hypocrite here- I have more faith in her name than I do in

bijas because I grew up reciting her name and it was much later that I got

diksha in bijokta mantras.With bija mantras it is not the mantra themselves that

I have the strong conviction in but the Guru- I cannot understand how you can

master [become pati] of a mantra unless it is given to you by one who is already

nAtha of the mantra. At the end of the day bijokta mantras have the goal of

being mastered, namasmarana does not necessarily have this goal.

 

 

I have no experiences and very little knowledge of who Amritanandamayi Maa is. I

tend to confuse Anandamayi Ma and Amritanandamayi Ma all the time, so you can

clearly tell that I have very little understanding about her person, teachings

and have had absolutely no interaction with her or anyone that clearly follows

her teachings.

 

This is not due to ahamkara or anything, just that I never had an opportunity to

meet her or other more popular religious figures- I hate crowds lol; I would

imagine she attracts hundreds.

 

Anyways back to the more important issue of Mantras-

 

I think you will find differences of opinions about mantras, and diksha within

people of the same parampara who even have the same Guru (personal experience)

yet alone in the much larger and diversified society. What I can tell you is

that mantras tend to be very complicated and I would like to share some of that

theory with you:

 

Firstly the Sanskrit alphabets are classified has representing one of the five

major classes of tattvas and this type of categorization is called bhuta chakra.

There are a variety of other methods of classifications i.e. which alphabets

deal with which nakshatra, this goes on and on until you reach the kurma chakra.

 

Scholars and advanced practitioners use this information and gage it with your

astrological chart, your personality and also your past experiences with

sadhana. They then determine whether the mantra has any specific doshas which

might apply on you and give you its remedy. In most instances this means editing

the original mantra with are samputa until you have done the minimum

purushcharana. Diksha from a Natha vetos this dosha. To learn more about doshas

either due to astrological effects or just the actual formulation of the mantra

consult Sharada Tilaka Tantra or I think the kAlA kitAb.

 

So one of the more practical reasons for getting diksha and upadesha is so that

sadhana becomes a little easy for you, why burden yourself with trouble when it

is not necessary? You dont really win brownie points with the Devata for this.

 

There are at least 27 more theories like this I know about mantras which would

support the fact why one should get diksha prior to starting a mantra. I agree

whole heartedly with what Sharada Maa had said and what you so gracefully had

cited; it confirms some of my personal observations of others.

 

Some rulings suggest that there are certain mantras which do not require proper

diksha because it has been proven that they have absolutely no dosha.

PanchAkshari is free from all doshas if the pranava bija is put in front of it.

Almost all Sri vidya mantras either have kilana or shApa so it wouldnt be a

smart idea to pick them up unless you know how to undo the locks and curses put

on em.

 

Bala Sundari's triAksharI has at least 6 commonly known curses/locks and three

that are mentioned during the diksha rites. Some sources suggest more but I hold

that there is only 9.

 

 

Mantras and the philosophy of mantras tends to be very pedantic and a bit too

technical for simple minded people like myself. I can tell you that I was born

in a Family which didnt have a living Devi tradition, we had a living Shiva

tradition so I got Shiva mantras in the early part of my childhood. I was warned

about bija mantras and because I didnt have Guru Diksha in devi mantras, I didnt

do worship to Devi with mantras that had bijas. I simply recited portions of the

Shaptashati and made my own few simple and broken prayers.

 

I sincerely wish you all the best and whatever happened to just saying Jaya

Bhavani!!! its so much more fun!

 

 

 

Haridev.S.V <haridevcusat

 

Tuesday, 27 March, 2007 3:56:49 PM

Re: What to do if upasana is broken?

[Guest guest]

Perhaps Sri Ganpra meant that short spell during Sadhana where when one becomes

absolutely unaware of everything else and individual identity does not exist.To

quote Adi Sankara " Mano Buddhih Chittaney Ahankara Naahum, Sivo Hum, Sivo Hum

" . Prolonged Sadhana is a preparation for this moment of feeling oneness with

God. Deep spiritualism cannot be contained with in the bounds of a system. It is

breaking away from the system that leads one to the path of self realisation and

God. But somewhere in the process there is a critical encounter with a person

or an incident that brings a transformation. This is more by accident than

design. Ultimately each one is his own judge. There is a story about

Valmiki.When he could not even say Rama, he was asked to reverse it and say Mara

repeatedly and thus do Rama Nama Japa. Mantra alone is not every thing. But if

one can, it is better to learn and recite correctly since there is a musical

quality which makes the Sadhana more

enjoyable.

 

" Haridev.S.V " <haridevcusat wrote: Namah Tripurasundari

 

Hello Devotees,

 

The following statement I read from Ganpra's message. I dont know

whether everyone accept it or not.

 

" ........ No one can do a sadhana lasting for more than 15 minutes or

so. To do more than that it requires extraordinary spiritual prowess,

in the form of initiation from Guru, followed by long practices of

observing, chanting etc.... "

 

But I feel elevated after reading the above statement since I used to

sit continuously for 5 or 6 hours in my college days for chanting Her

praises. Fellow students used to abuse, but it was my weakness. They

tell I was wasting time. I thought- the time others spend to drink,

smoke, roam , sleep etc, i am using it to chant.After reading here that

uninitiated people should not chant anything, i now feel i was wasting

time, acquiring sin.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here’s a new way to find what you're looking for - Answers

 

 

[Guest guest]

Why not look at it this way.........Devi wanted you to chant her name so she

made you.................how she chooses to teach people is her own mystery and

Gurus and initiations exist at many levels............including subtle........if

you chanted for 5-6 hrs.........that is the work of grace.

 

Tarini

 

" Haridev.S.V " <haridevcusat wrote:

Namah Tripurasundari

 

Hello Devotees,

 

The following statement I read from Ganpra's message. I dont know

whether everyone accept it or not.

 

" ........ No one can do a sadhana lasting for more than 15 minutes or

so. To do more than that it requires extraordinary spiritual prowess,

in the form of initiation from Guru, followed by long practices of

observing, chanting etc.... "

 

But I feel elevated after reading the above statement since I used to

sit continuously for 5 or 6 hours in my college days for chanting Her

praises. Fellow students used to abuse, but it was my weakness. They

tell I was wasting time. I thought- the time others spend to drink,

smoke, roam , sleep etc, i am using it to chant.After reading here that

uninitiated people should not chant anything, i now feel i was wasting

time, acquiring sin.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here’s a new way to find what you're looking for - Answers

 

 

[Guest guest]

Thanks Sri. Sitam_Subba, for interpreting it correctly.

 

Sadhana must be voluntary, but not become an obsession.

 

Sadhana is like other things one does during the day, wake up,

morning duties, go to work, eat, come home, relax, eat and sleep. In

between these, sadhana fits somewhere.

 

Even two veda pandits I know confirmed it. One who was around 80 yrs

of age said, " Oh, doing a sadhana (puja, japa, pArAynam) for more

than a short period of time is for mahapurusha. " And he was one such,

practicing veda and prohitham since childhood. Another, an Anjenaya

upasaka said, " Yes, I do puja for all the deities I have in my home.

That takes major part of the morning. But, after that it is not

possible to do any more. " Another seer used a funny analogy (in

relation to external influences). Sadhana is like keeping food on

table for the family. A loving wife who understands how hard you work

to obtain that food, will not ask for more and more. But, if you have

a mistress (aka gold digger), she will never be satisfied with what

you give and ask for more and more. It is not love any more, but it

is an obsession.

 

That is why, it is better to discern and learn. That is where the

Guru comes into the picture. Either a mAnaseega Guru or someone in

person. When dealing with beings of a spiritual plane beyond one's

own, it is better to ask for help from those who has been there. A

little help helps one go further and farther in a short period of

time.

 

, venkat bhasksr

<sitam_subba wrote:

>

> Perhaps Sri Ganpra meant that short spell during Sadhana where

when one becomes absolutely unaware of everything else and individual

identity does not exist.To quote Adi Sankara " Mano Buddhih Chittaney

Ahankara Naahum, Sivo Hum, Sivo Hum " . Prolonged Sadhana is a

preparation for this moment of feeling oneness with God. Deep

spiritualism cannot be contained with in the bounds of a system. It

is breaking away from the system that leads one to the path of self

realisation and God. But somewhere in the process there is a

critical encounter with a person or an incident that brings a

transformation. This is more by accident than design. Ultimately each

one is his own judge. There is a story about Valmiki.When he could

not even say Rama, he was asked to reverse it and say Mara repeatedly

and thus do Rama Nama Japa. Mantra alone is not every thing. But if

one can, it is better to learn and recite correctly since there is a

musical quality which makes the Sadhana more

> enjoyable.

>

[Guest guest]

Nah, it was BS, but who cares really. Hyperbole it's called. I went to MIU,

we sat in the domes for hours each day. I do believe my 'rounding' schedule

back then when I meditated formally was something like 5 hours a day.

 

Stop that acquiring sin thing. Nonsense. There are splits. Myself, I believe

that being alive is all the initiation one needs to do any spiritual

practice on Earth with impunity. But then, after I say that, I also don't

practice much of anything for which I haven't had initiation. Nonetheless,

if I want to practice something, I do so, because as said, better to ask for

forgiveness then beg for permission and victory to the opportunist.

 

At any rate, myself I believe that one small life isn't really long enough

for original thoughts, meaning we all are pretty much doing the same thing

that we did last time around. Maybe not materially and conventionally, but

essentially. Therefore, one who is destined to seek initiation someday may

well be chanting these things earlier in prelude. You have to start

somewhere.

 

 

 

 

 

But I feel elevated after reading the above statement since I used to

sit continuously for 5 or 6 hours in my college days for chanting Her

praises. Fellow students used to abuse, but it was my weakness. They

tell I was wasting time. I thought- the time others spend to drink,

smoke, roam , sleep etc, i am using it to chant.After reading here that

uninitiated people should not chant anything, i now feel i was wasting

time, acquiring sin.