Guest guest Posted April 23, 2007 Report Share Posted April 23, 2007 Namaste Y'All, I apologize for the delay in yesterday's post. continues to have problems (I'm sure you must've noticed). Well todays recitation saw the demise of Nishumba (Self-deprication) and, finally, the last of the forces of separation, Shumba (Self-Conceit). How do you feel? Do you feel, perhaps, just a bit more balanced, a little more free of yourself? I continue to be surprised at how fast the recitations are going. Not that I'm blazing through them, but I sit down and begin the pranams and before I know it I've reached the end. [Thankfully no cramps today - I was a bit concerned...] One of the things that strikes me about this section is the relationship between Nishumba and Shumba (they are very close), the fact that Shumba is the last to go, and that when Nishumba is pierced in the heart, " Emerging from the heart pierced by the pike, came a spirit of great strength and valor, crying 'Stop.'. " There's significance here, I can almost smell it. How, I wonder, does it all relate to the development and experience of the individual sadhaka? What do you think? Tomorrow we begin praising the Goddess and learning about Her aspects - filling-up our hearts and minds with Her alone. " The sacred fires burned brilliantly in PEACE, and Peaceful became the fearful sounds which had filled all the directions. " " Om " Tomorrow (Day Seven): Chapters 11, 12, and 13 (with the kushandika [devata pranam] first, of course) And don't forget to ask for a boon in Chapter 13, after verse 15 (It is reported that Mother always suggests we ask for pure devotion) Happy chanting! Jai Maa! Chris Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 23, 2007 Report Share Posted April 23, 2007 Jai Maa, Chris! Thank you for keeping up the energy around this sankalpa with your daily posts. It is a joy to read them. I've been struck by several things during this sankalpa. How quickly it's going, how I've settled into it after a few days and my legs no longer fall asleep (it's funny - a new practice always makes my legs fall asleep - it's only when I relax and let my spine float and trust the practice that I stop putting so much pressure on my legs/knees and everything flows). Also, I'm struck anew by how very violent the Chandi is. Really violent! It seems to me gratuitously so. I don't watch television (I'm a grad student so don't have time/money for TV), so I think maybe I've regained my sensitivity to violence. I'm always saddened at the violence in the Chandi, but also feel that this violence is part of the human experience, so to shun or ignore it would be willful blindness. Rather than relishing Maa's victories completely, I feel great sympathy in my deepest heart - sympathy that the Great Battle of our thoughts and desires so often has to come to this kind of violent struggle. What would happen if the asuras simply surrendered, and willingly became part of Maa, as opposed to having to be chewed up and slaughtered by Her? And I think about where I struggle in life, how Maa's teeth chew me up when I'm being resistant to my true Self, or to the surrender She demands. I also wonder how we transcend the violence and the language of the Chandi to achieve lasting peace beyond it. Discipline - that is what my Mother tells me. This exact thing. Sadhana. Compassionate detachment. Anyway, these are the questions and thoughts that hum and shake through me each day. I am a priestess of Kali, so how can I do anything ultimately, but surrender? Jai Chandika Devi! shanti saa'ham -sundari On 4/23/07, Chris Kirner <chriskirner1956 wrote: Namaste Y'All,I apologize for the delay in yesterday's post. continues to haveproblems (I'm sure you must've noticed).Well todays recitation saw the demise of Nishumba (Self-deprication) and, finally, the last of the forces of separation, Shumba(Self-Conceit). How do you feel? Do you feel, perhaps, just a bit morebalanced, a little more free of yourself?I continue to be surprised at how fast the recitations are going. Not that I'm blazing through them, but I sit down and begin the pranamsand before I know it I've reached the end. [Thankfully no cramps today- I was a bit concerned...]One of the things that strikes me about this section is the relationship between Nishumba and Shumba (they are very close), thefact that Shumba is the last to go, and that when Nishumba is piercedin the heart, " Emerging from the heart pierced by the pike, came a spirit of great strength and valor, crying 'Stop.'. " There'ssignificance here, I can almost smell it. How, I wonder, does it allrelate to the development and experience of the individual sadhaka? What do you think?Tomorrow we begin praising the Goddess and learning about Her aspects- filling-up our hearts and minds with Her alone. " The sacred fires burned brilliantly in PEACE, and Peaceful became the fearful sounds which had filled all the directions. " " Om " Tomorrow (Day Seven): Chapters 11, 12, and 13 (with the kushandika[devata pranam] first, of course)And don't forget to ask for a boon in Chapter 13, after verse 15 (It is reported that Mother always suggests we ask for pure devotion)Happy chanting!Jai Maa!Chris -- ------- erinwww.erinjohansen.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 24, 2007 Report Share Posted April 24, 2007 Hi Sundari, so good to hear form you! You are not the first person to feel uncomfortable with the graphic nature of the battles in the Chandi. I think everyone feels that way at first. I think there's a real process of psychological separation that goes on. This is a scripture, and we come to it wanting to accept on its terms, so it takes us time to learn just " how real is real " , or how " literal " we need to be to understand it properly. As you no doubt noticed in my post for day four, my favorite part is one of the most graphic in the Chandi. I have come to relish the violence of that part because to me it represents the actual intensity of my separation from my own divinity, and the corresponding intensity required to purify all the junk that creates that separation. [Also, I like it because that is how I think Kali comes to us - in noise, confusion, and overwhelming power] Here's a post from Morningsong from a couple of years ago that addresses your very questions - with Swamiji's answer! 407--Q & A WITH SWAMIJI-- Chandi and Non-violence Question from Morningsong: This question has been nagging at me ever since I started reading the Chandi so I hope I am able to articulate what I'm curious about. As a yogini and devotee of God I'm committed to living a life of non-violence. I make every effort to keep my thoughts, words, and actions in alignment with this commitment and, other than a certain amount of self-judgment, I feel that I mostly am walking my talk although it certainly is an ongoing practice. Then comes my dilemma... I love reading the Chandi, I love reading how beautiful and great the Goddess is, and I love the songs and prayers. But I have to say that I really struggle with the battle scenes. I understand that She must fight to defeat all those terrible thoughts, and I'm very grateful that She does, but I find it difficult to read these parts of the Chandi. Swamiji, do you have any suggestions regarding how I can better reconcile this challenge? How can I approach these passages in such a way that I am not feeling at odds within my heart and perhaps even further my practice of non-violence? Swamiji's response: When the body is infected with disease, don't we attack the germs with antibiotics? That does not make us violent individuals. When our minds are infected with spiritual obstacles, we must use whatever means to become free, even if it means destroying the obstructions. That in no way defines us as violent individuals. In fact, it is quite the opposite: because we are fighting the battle within ourselves, we are peaceful with regard to the rest of creation. Jai Maa! Chris , Sundari <erin.johansen wrote: > > Jai Maa, Chris! Thank you for keeping up the energy around this sankalpa > with your daily posts. It is a joy to read them. > > I've been struck by several things during this sankalpa. How quickly it's > going, how I've settled into it after a few days and my legs no longer fall > asleep (it's funny - a new practice always makes my legs fall asleep - it's > only when I relax and let my spine float and trust the practice that I stop > putting so much pressure on my legs/knees and everything flows). > > Also, I'm struck anew by how very violent the Chandi is. Really violent! It > seems to me gratuitously so. I don't watch television (I'm a grad student so > don't have time/money for TV), so I think maybe I've regained my sensitivity > to violence. I'm always saddened at the violence in the Chandi, but also > feel that this violence is part of the human experience, so to shun or > ignore it would be willful blindness. Rather than relishing Maa's victories > completely, I feel great sympathy in my deepest heart - sympathy that the > Great Battle of our thoughts and desires so often has to come to this kind > of violent struggle. What would happen if the asuras simply surrendered, and > willingly became part of Maa, as opposed to having to be chewed up and > slaughtered by Her? And I think about where I struggle in life, how Maa's > teeth chew me up when I'm being resistant to my true Self, or to the > surrender She demands. > > I also wonder how we transcend the violence and the language of the Chandi > to achieve lasting peace beyond it. Discipline - that is what my Mother > tells me. This exact thing. Sadhana. Compassionate detachment. > > Anyway, these are the questions and thoughts that hum and shake through me > each day. I am a priestess of Kali, so how can I do anything ultimately, but > surrender? > > Jai Chandika Devi! > > shanti saa'ham > -sundari > > > > On 4/23/07, Chris Kirner <chriskirner1956 wrote: > > > > Namaste Y'All, > > > > I apologize for the delay in yesterday's post. continues to have > > problems (I'm sure you must've noticed). > > > > Well todays recitation saw the demise of Nishumba (Self-deprication) > > and, finally, the last of the forces of separation, Shumba > > (Self-Conceit). How do you feel? Do you feel, perhaps, just a bit more > > balanced, a little more free of yourself? > > > > I continue to be surprised at how fast the recitations are going. Not > > that I'm blazing through them, but I sit down and begin the pranams > > and before I know it I've reached the end. [Thankfully no cramps today > > - I was a bit concerned...] > > > > One of the things that strikes me about this section is the > > relationship between Nishumba and Shumba (they are very close), the > > fact that Shumba is the last to go, and that when Nishumba is pierced > > in the heart, " Emerging from the heart pierced by the pike, came a > > spirit of great strength and valor, crying 'Stop.'. " There's > > significance here, I can almost smell it. How, I wonder, does it all > > relate to the development and experience of the individual sadhaka? > > What do you think? > > > > Tomorrow we begin praising the Goddess and learning about Her aspects > > - filling-up our hearts and minds with Her alone. > > > > " The sacred fires burned brilliantly in PEACE, and Peaceful became the > > fearful sounds which had filled all the directions. " > > > > " Om " > > > > Tomorrow (Day Seven): Chapters 11, 12, and 13 (with the kushandika > > [devata pranam] first, of course) > > > > And don't forget to ask for a boon in Chapter 13, after verse 15 (It > > is reported that Mother always suggests we ask for pure devotion) > > > > Happy chanting! > > > > Jai Maa! > > Chris > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > --\ ----- > erin > www.erinjohansen.com > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 25, 2007 Report Share Posted April 25, 2007 Hi Chris Thank you for finding and posting Morningsong's question, along with Swamiji's response. The clarity of Morningsong's question spoke directly to the point of the battles in the Chandi Path and the practice of ahimsa. This sankalpa was my first time reading this scripture from start to finish. I read it in both Sanskrit and English, and to be honest, was a bit taken aback by the graphic description of the battles. Sam and I were doing the sankalpa together (I was chanting/reading aloud, while he sat and listened) and I was tempted to soften the text a bit for him. I didn't do that, trusting that the energy of the text was speaking to a deeper place in both of us, and that it was my ego feeling the need to censor. Ha, the very thing that was at the root of the entire battle to begin with was acting up in me and I had to do my own personal battle at the same time! Swamiji's answer, as always, is clear and satisfying. Isn't is amazing how when he speaks, everything becomes clear and simple? Jai Maa! Jai Swamiji! wendy , " Chris Kirner " <chriskirner1956 wrote: > > Hi Sundari, so good to hear form you! You are not the first person to > feel uncomfortable with the graphic nature of the battles in the > Chandi. I think everyone feels that way at first. > > I think there's a real process of psychological separation that goes > on. This is a scripture, and we come to it wanting to accept on its > terms, so it takes us time to learn just " how real is real " , or how > " literal " we need to be to understand it properly. As you no doubt > noticed in my post for day four, my favorite part is one of the most > graphic in the Chandi. I have come to relish the violence of that part > because to me it represents the actual intensity of my separation from > my own divinity, and the corresponding intensity required to purify > all the junk that creates that separation. [Also, I like it because > that is how I think Kali comes to us - in noise, confusion, and > overwhelming power] > > Here's a post from Morningsong from a couple of years ago that > addresses your very questions - with Swamiji's answer! > > 407--Q & A WITH SWAMIJI-- Chandi and Non-violence > > Question from Morningsong: > This question has been nagging at me ever since I started reading the > Chandi so I hope I am able to articulate what I'm curious about. As a > yogini and devotee of God I'm committed to living a life of > non-violence. I make every effort to keep my thoughts, words, and > actions in alignment with this commitment and, other than a certain > amount of self-judgment, I feel that I mostly am walking my talk > although it certainly is an ongoing practice. > > Then comes my dilemma... I love reading the Chandi, I love reading how > beautiful and great the Goddess is, and I love the songs and prayers. > But I have to say that I really struggle with the battle scenes. I > understand that She must fight to defeat all those terrible thoughts, > and I'm very grateful that She does, but I find it difficult to read > these parts of the Chandi. Swamiji, do you have any suggestions > regarding how I can better reconcile this challenge? How can I > approach these passages in such a way that I am not feeling at odds > within my heart and perhaps even further my practice of non- violence? > > Swamiji's response: > When the body is infected with disease, don't we attack the germs with > antibiotics? That does not make us violent individuals. When our minds > are infected with spiritual obstacles, we must use whatever means to > become free, even if it means destroying the obstructions. That in no > way defines us as violent individuals. In fact, it is quite the > opposite: because we are fighting the battle within ourselves, we are > peaceful with regard to the rest of creation. > > > Jai Maa! > Chris > > > > > , Sundari <erin.johansen@> wrote: > > > > Jai Maa, Chris! Thank you for keeping up the energy around this sankalpa > > with your daily posts. It is a joy to read them. > > > > I've been struck by several things during this sankalpa. How quickly > it's > > going, how I've settled into it after a few days and my legs no > longer fall > > asleep (it's funny - a new practice always makes my legs fall asleep > - it's > > only when I relax and let my spine float and trust the practice that > I stop > > putting so much pressure on my legs/knees and everything flows). > > > > Also, I'm struck anew by how very violent the Chandi is. Really > violent! It > > seems to me gratuitously so. I don't watch television (I'm a grad > student so > > don't have time/money for TV), so I think maybe I've regained my > sensitivity > > to violence. I'm always saddened at the violence in the Chandi, but also > > feel that this violence is part of the human experience, so to shun or > > ignore it would be willful blindness. Rather than relishing Maa's > victories > > completely, I feel great sympathy in my deepest heart - sympathy > that the > > Great Battle of our thoughts and desires so often has to come to > this kind > > of violent struggle. What would happen if the asuras simply > surrendered, and > > willingly became part of Maa, as opposed to having to be chewed up and > > slaughtered by Her? And I think about where I struggle in life, how > Maa's > > teeth chew me up when I'm being resistant to my true Self, or to the > > surrender She demands. > > > > I also wonder how we transcend the violence and the language of the > Chandi > > to achieve lasting peace beyond it. Discipline - that is what my Mother > > tells me. This exact thing. Sadhana. Compassionate detachment. > > > > Anyway, these are the questions and thoughts that hum and shake > through me > > each day. I am a priestess of Kali, so how can I do anything > ultimately, but > > surrender? > > > > Jai Chandika Devi! > > > > shanti saa'ham > > -sundari > > > > > > > > On 4/23/07, Chris Kirner <chriskirner1956@> wrote: > > > > > > Namaste Y'All, > > > > > > I apologize for the delay in yesterday's post. continues to have > > > problems (I'm sure you must've noticed). > > > > > > Well todays recitation saw the demise of Nishumba (Self- deprication) > > > and, finally, the last of the forces of separation, Shumba > > > (Self-Conceit). How do you feel? Do you feel, perhaps, just a bit more > > > balanced, a little more free of yourself? > > > > > > I continue to be surprised at how fast the recitations are going. Not > > > that I'm blazing through them, but I sit down and begin the pranams > > > and before I know it I've reached the end. [Thankfully no cramps today > > > - I was a bit concerned...] > > > > > > One of the things that strikes me about this section is the > > > relationship between Nishumba and Shumba (they are very close), the > > > fact that Shumba is the last to go, and that when Nishumba is pierced > > > in the heart, " Emerging from the heart pierced by the pike, came a > > > spirit of great strength and valor, crying 'Stop.'. " There's > > > significance here, I can almost smell it. How, I wonder, does it all > > > relate to the development and experience of the individual sadhaka? > > > What do you think? > > > > > > Tomorrow we begin praising the Goddess and learning about Her aspects > > > - filling-up our hearts and minds with Her alone. > > > > > > " The sacred fires burned brilliantly in PEACE, and Peaceful became the > > > fearful sounds which had filled all the directions. " > > > > > > " Om " > > > > > > Tomorrow (Day Seven): Chapters 11, 12, and 13 (with the kushandika > > > [devata pranam] first, of course) > > > > > > And don't forget to ask for a boon in Chapter 13, after verse 15 (It > > > is reported that Mother always suggests we ask for pure devotion) > > > > > > Happy chanting! > > > > > > Jai Maa! > > > Chris > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > -- ----------------- > > erin@ > > www.erinjohansen.com > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted April 26, 2007 Report Share Posted April 26, 2007 I'm so glad it was a special experience for you - for me too! Jai Maa! Chris , " way131 " <wendy131 wrote: > > Hi Chris > Thank you for finding and posting Morningsong's question, along with > Swamiji's response. The clarity of Morningsong's question spoke > directly to the point of the battles in the Chandi Path and the > practice of ahimsa. > > This sankalpa was my first time reading this scripture from start to > finish. I read it in both Sanskrit and English, and to be honest, was > a bit taken aback by the graphic description of the battles. Sam and > I were doing the sankalpa together (I was chanting/reading aloud, > while he sat and listened) and I was tempted to soften the text a bit > for him. I didn't do that, trusting that the energy of the text was > speaking to a deeper place in both of us, and that it was my ego > feeling the need to censor. Ha, the very thing that was at the root > of the entire battle to begin with was acting up in me and I had to > do my own personal battle at the same time! > > Swamiji's answer, as always, is clear and satisfying. > Isn't is amazing how when he speaks, everything becomes clear and > simple? > Jai Maa! Jai Swamiji! > wendy > > , " Chris Kirner " > <chriskirner1956@> wrote: > > > > Hi Sundari, so good to hear form you! You are not the first person > to > > feel uncomfortable with the graphic nature of the battles in the > > Chandi. I think everyone feels that way at first. > > > > I think there's a real process of psychological separation that goes > > on. This is a scripture, and we come to it wanting to accept on its > > terms, so it takes us time to learn just " how real is real " , or how > > " literal " we need to be to understand it properly. As you no doubt > > noticed in my post for day four, my favorite part is one of the most > > graphic in the Chandi. I have come to relish the violence of that > part > > because to me it represents the actual intensity of my separation > from > > my own divinity, and the corresponding intensity required to purify > > all the junk that creates that separation. [Also, I like it because > > that is how I think Kali comes to us - in noise, confusion, and > > overwhelming power] > > > > Here's a post from Morningsong from a couple of years ago that > > addresses your very questions - with Swamiji's answer! > > > > 407--Q & A WITH SWAMIJI-- Chandi and Non-violence > > > > Question from Morningsong: > > This question has been nagging at me ever since I started reading > the > > Chandi so I hope I am able to articulate what I'm curious about. > As a > > yogini and devotee of God I'm committed to living a life of > > non-violence. I make every effort to keep my thoughts, words, and > > actions in alignment with this commitment and, other than a certain > > amount of self-judgment, I feel that I mostly am walking my talk > > although it certainly is an ongoing practice. > > > > Then comes my dilemma... I love reading the Chandi, I love reading > how > > beautiful and great the Goddess is, and I love the songs and > prayers. > > But I have to say that I really struggle with the battle scenes. I > > understand that She must fight to defeat all those terrible > thoughts, > > and I'm very grateful that She does, but I find it difficult to read > > these parts of the Chandi. Swamiji, do you have any suggestions > > regarding how I can better reconcile this challenge? How can I > > approach these passages in such a way that I am not feeling at odds > > within my heart and perhaps even further my practice of non- > violence? > > > > Swamiji's response: > > When the body is infected with disease, don't we attack the germs > with > > antibiotics? That does not make us violent individuals. When our > minds > > are infected with spiritual obstacles, we must use whatever means to > > become free, even if it means destroying the obstructions. That in > no > > way defines us as violent individuals. In fact, it is quite the > > opposite: because we are fighting the battle within ourselves, we > are > > peaceful with regard to the rest of creation. > > > > > > Jai Maa! > > Chris > > > > > > > > > > , Sundari <erin.johansen@> wrote: > > > > > > Jai Maa, Chris! Thank you for keeping up the energy around this > sankalpa > > > with your daily posts. It is a joy to read them. > > > > > > I've been struck by several things during this sankalpa. How > quickly > > it's > > > going, how I've settled into it after a few days and my legs no > > longer fall > > > asleep (it's funny - a new practice always makes my legs fall > asleep > > - it's > > > only when I relax and let my spine float and trust the practice > that > > I stop > > > putting so much pressure on my legs/knees and everything flows). > > > > > > Also, I'm struck anew by how very violent the Chandi is. Really > > violent! It > > > seems to me gratuitously so. I don't watch television (I'm a grad > > student so > > > don't have time/money for TV), so I think maybe I've regained my > > sensitivity > > > to violence. I'm always saddened at the violence in the Chandi, > but also > > > feel that this violence is part of the human experience, so to > shun or > > > ignore it would be willful blindness. Rather than relishing Maa's > > victories > > > completely, I feel great sympathy in my deepest heart - sympathy > > that the > > > Great Battle of our thoughts and desires so often has to come to > > this kind > > > of violent struggle. What would happen if the asuras simply > > surrendered, and > > > willingly became part of Maa, as opposed to having to be chewed > up and > > > slaughtered by Her? And I think about where I struggle in life, > how > > Maa's > > > teeth chew me up when I'm being resistant to my true Self, or to > the > > > surrender She demands. > > > > > > I also wonder how we transcend the violence and the language of > the > > Chandi > > > to achieve lasting peace beyond it. Discipline - that is what my > Mother > > > tells me. This exact thing. Sadhana. Compassionate detachment. > > > > > > Anyway, these are the questions and thoughts that hum and shake > > through me > > > each day. I am a priestess of Kali, so how can I do anything > > ultimately, but > > > surrender? > > > > > > Jai Chandika Devi! > > > > > > shanti saa'ham > > > -sundari > > > > > > > > > > > > On 4/23/07, Chris Kirner <chriskirner1956@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Namaste Y'All, > > > > > > > > I apologize for the delay in yesterday's post. continues > to have > > > > problems (I'm sure you must've noticed). > > > > > > > > Well todays recitation saw the demise of Nishumba (Self- > deprication) > > > > and, finally, the last of the forces of separation, Shumba > > > > (Self-Conceit). How do you feel? Do you feel, perhaps, just a > bit more > > > > balanced, a little more free of yourself? > > > > > > > > I continue to be surprised at how fast the recitations are > going. Not > > > > that I'm blazing through them, but I sit down and begin the > pranams > > > > and before I know it I've reached the end. [Thankfully no > cramps today > > > > - I was a bit concerned...] > > > > > > > > One of the things that strikes me about this section is the > > > > relationship between Nishumba and Shumba (they are very close), > the > > > > fact that Shumba is the last to go, and that when Nishumba is > pierced > > > > in the heart, " Emerging from the heart pierced by the pike, > came a > > > > spirit of great strength and valor, crying 'Stop.'. " There's > > > > significance here, I can almost smell it. How, I wonder, does > it all > > > > relate to the development and experience of the individual > sadhaka? > > > > What do you think? > > > > > > > > Tomorrow we begin praising the Goddess and learning about Her > aspects > > > > - filling-up our hearts and minds with Her alone. > > > > > > > > " The sacred fires burned brilliantly in PEACE, and Peaceful > became the > > > > fearful sounds which had filled all the directions. " > > > > > > > > " Om " > > > > > > > > Tomorrow (Day Seven): Chapters 11, 12, and 13 (with the > kushandika > > > > [devata pranam] first, of course) > > > > > > > > And don't forget to ask for a boon in Chapter 13, after verse > 15 (It > > > > is reported that Mother always suggests we ask for pure > devotion) > > > > > > > > Happy chanting! > > > > > > > > Jai Maa! > > > > Chris > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > > -- > ----------------- > > > erin@ > > > www.erinjohansen.com > > > > > > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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