Guest guest Posted November 16, 2007 Report Share Posted November 16, 2007 Jai Maa Kaalii and Namaste Erin, I thank you for the response! Even though my entry was worded in hurry, it was hoped people who had perceptions to share would discuss them. You are correct Im referring to Ahamkara as well as Mahishasura. I don't want to make assumptions for my friend, but I know he is very familiar with yogic terminology and very well understands how the term is applied. He suggested I read something he channeled about the Ego years ago from beings he calls the Manu or Emmanuel, who he feels authored the Rg Veda. It says that one should never surrender to the illusion of seperation, but rather surrender to the truth behind it. He claims that to see the Ego/Ahamkara/Mahishasura as seperate from Pranava and as something impure/imperfect/lowly, is to gaze through the illusory dualistic lense of seperation. For him it is the illusionary seperation and dualism between the Ego and the Divine that is the issue, not the Ego itself. This may be a case of a subtle ego trick of justifying its imbalance. The Chandi helps to remember Maa everywhere and everywhen, not increase seperation from Her. Though I feel there is some truth to the Ahamkara being a tool of that Omniscient Shakthi, when it wakes up and get's past " MeMeMe " to realise " MAMAMA. " I appreciate your recounting of Swami's reflections on Tamas, how it is a necessary aspect of creation, but taken to an excess results in devolution. Expanding the ego beyond individual limits into the universal seems to be the key, growing up past the teenage stage into fully fledged awakening. I do remember though the potential for Ego inflation as one progresses in knowledge and vidya. However it is true Vidya it should be Veda(wise), and that Light of Wisdom must protect us from those inflation tricks so that we can walk the razors edge without shedding a drop of blood and falling from exalted grace of jnana. With Gratitude and Love, Jai Maa and Jai Swami!!! Shantihi! -Eric \\ --- Erin Sundari Johansen Hurwitt <erin.johansen wrote: > Jai Maa! and namaste Eric, > > You didn't ask for my opinion, but I find this > interesting, so I humbly and > with love offer my thoughts. I assume that when you > talk about " ego " you're > talking about " ahamkara. " If that is the case, It > seems to me that your > friend has mistaken ego (as in, Western > [pop-]psychology with all its bad > connotations) for ego (as in, ahamkara, literally > the " I-maker " of Hindu > philosophy). > > I am reminded of what Swamiji said about Tamas in > his Kali Puja classes - > that Tamas isn't a bad thing, in fact it's necessary > for these bodies that > are our vehicles on this planet. It's just when we > get too much of it or use > it improperly or without discernment/awareness that > there are problems. > > Ahamkara is useful! It allows us to exist in this > physical world to do what > we need to do for spiritual progression. But it also > takes over, makes us > forget that Maa exists, or that we are connected > intimately to all of > creation, makes us forget that we are actually one > with everything; the tool > that helps us exist in the world also makes us stuck > in the world. It is > jnana (knowledge) and vidya (wisdom) that help > expand ahamkara and teach it > to grow up, and realize that Everything Is Not All > About Me. That everything > is all about MAA! Mahadevi! Great Mother! Or however > it is useful for me see > God/dess, right? But ahamkara likes being right, so > it fights divine wisdom > like a hyperactive teenager. > > I think your friend is right in some way; sure, > ahamkara is Maa just as > everything is Maa, it's a tool Maa has given us - > but the flaw in his logic > is that it also is responsible for keeping us > separate from Maa, because it > is like that hyperactive teenager, really a sweet > thing at heart, but trying > to be grown up and wise without really not > understanding how everything is > connected. It's a trick of ahamkara to equate > oneself with ahamkara, with > the individual personality. But to say that it (or > anything else) is > separate from Maa may also be another trick of > ahamkara! > > Anyway, my thought is, if one can use wisdom and > discernment to expand > one's " ego " (that is, the " I-maker " ) to include > everything and find oneness > with the Ultimate, so that it is not " I " and " you " > but " MAA " then it becomes > a tool rather than a hindrance. So I don't think > either you or your friend > is " right " or " wrong, " necessarily. > > Just my two cents, to take or leave. > > And regardless, I have faith that Swamiji and/or > Shree Maa (well, there's me > thinking of them as separate! how foolish of me!) > will have a short, > sweet and powerful response to your question. > > shanti, > sundari > > > > > On Nov 12, 2007 7:38 AM, Eric Cassils > <Quanchula1 wrote: > > > Namaste Vishweshwar, > > > > Your remark about the the ego is interesting, and > I > > resonate with it, however, when I spoke to one of > my > > friends who I believe does not understand the > pitfalls > > of ego, and mentioned Sri Maa's remark that " Ego > is > > the enemy of wisdom. Ego can make you fall' to try > to > > help him negate some of the impulsive drives he > was he > > experiencing, he just responded by saying " Embrace > the > > Ego as God already " and that he is no " hindu > > purusha/prakriti dualist' as if to say that > viewing > > the ego as seperate from God is just a perverse > form > > of inane dualism. Ego must have been created by > God, > > but just because God creates something, does that > make > > God's creation equal with God? I replied to my > friend > > that I would not embrace the ego as God already, > as > > that is simply not my experience of the ego, and I > > much prefered to receive the grace of Maa that > slices > > and dices away at persona imbalances such as > inflated > > pride, ignorace and pomposity. What do Swami and > Maa > > have to say about this idea that ego is God > already? > > Much Love, Jai Maa! Jai Svami, > > Eric > > --- inspectionconnection108 > > <inspectionconnection108 > <inspectionconnection108%40>> > > wrote: > > > > > Namaste Wendy: Thanks for posting from your > heart. > > > I truly > > > understand how difficult it can be to be away > from > > > Maa. That said, > > > you refused to surrender to the ego and made the > > > effort to stay tuned > > > to Her in your heart. Sure we know She is always > > > there, but we do > > > forget. But She never forgets, She never goes > away, > > > She is amazing. > > > She is our Guru. She brings the Light to dispel > the > > > darkness. > > > > > > Jai Maa Jai Swami > > > > > > vishweshwar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, > > " way131 " > > > <wendy131 wrote: > > > > > > > > Namaste Vish, > > > > I am so glad to see the webcam working again. > Not > > > having the link of > > > > the webcam has proven to be a very interesting > > > stretch of time for > > > > me -- kind of like my personal Kali Yuga! One > > > thing I saw, close up > > > > and personal, was the working of my ego and my > > > attachments. I hate to > > > > say it, but I will admit that sometimes I felt > > > frustrated by > > > > not 'seeing' life at the Mandir. I knew there > were > > > activities going > > > > on, but I couldn't see it, I couldn't hear it, > and > > > I felt " left out. " > > > > > > > > One way (there were others as well) I picked > > > myself up and shut down > > > > my ego was to return to Shree Maa's > Autobiography. > > > Reading and > > > > rereading that book always seems to have a > magical > > > effect on me – it > > > > helps me feel closer to beloved Shree Maa and > > > serves as another > > > > reminder that She is always with me. > > > > So, I guess my studies here have helped me > (yes, > > > this is quite an > > > > undersatement!). Previously, it would be easy > for > > > me to just get lost > > > > in the daily drama of life and 'forget' about > my > > > spiritual practices, > > > > but not this time. > === message truncated === ______________________________\ ____ Be a better pen pal. Text or chat with friends inside Mail. See how. http://overview.mail./ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest guest Posted November 17, 2007 Report Share Posted November 17, 2007 Peace to you both, Eric and Erin! What a great coversation! I have to admit that my understanding of Hindu language is woefully inadequate, but I am conceptually following the dialogue enough to ask the following questions(s): What is higher than the ahamkara (I AM)? Or is the ahamkara just " I " ? Is the ahamkara simply the ultimate awareness? Ego is the awareness of the ability to make a choice and " see " the separation? Because truly, when one ultimately becomes aware and realized in his/her oneness with God/dess, then there really is no choice, because then, reality becomes an illusory drama and the path is actually very simple and very clear. One can embrace the actual realization and love it as a very good thing and be profoundly grateful. One can also embrace that one can " step down " so to speak and make choices (this being my understanding of the mahishasura - or I AM Now Choosing). That's what we are here as spiritual beings playing a human game are to do. So, would one who has not re-membered or realized their spiritual oneness with All There Is actually be in possession of ahamkara (or do we have it and it is perhaps just simply lying dormant until activiation), the person remaining unaware, or lacking discernment or being uable to make a choice from the highest perspective? I bow to your tireless search for the Truth. Thank you both for causing those wheels to spin... much love to all! sal. , Eric Cassils <Quanchula1 wrote: > > Jai Maa Kaalii and Namaste Erin, > > I thank you for the response! Even though my entry > was worded in hurry, it was hoped people who had > perceptions to share would discuss them. You are > correct Im referring to Ahamkara as well as > Mahishasura. > > I don't want to make assumptions for my friend, but I > know he is very familiar with yogic terminology and > very well understands how the term is applied. He > suggested I read something he channeled about the Ego > years ago from beings he calls the Manu or Emmanuel, > who he feels authored the Rg Veda. It says that one > should never surrender to the illusion of seperation, > but rather surrender to the truth behind it. He claims > that to see the Ego/Ahamkara/Mahishasura as seperate > from Pranava and as something impure/imperfect/lowly, > is to gaze through the illusory dualistic lense of > seperation. For him it is the illusionary seperation > and dualism between the Ego and the Divine that is the > issue, not the Ego itself. This may be a case of a > subtle ego trick of justifying its imbalance. The > Chandi helps to remember Maa everywhere and everywhen, > not increase seperation from Her. Though I feel there > is some truth to the Ahamkara being a tool of that > Omniscient Shakthi, when it wakes up and get's past > " MeMeMe " to realise " MAMAMA. " > > I appreciate your recounting of Swami's reflections on > Tamas, how it is a necessary aspect of creation, but > taken to an excess results in devolution. > Expanding the ego beyond individual limits into the > universal seems to be the key, growing up past the > teenage stage into fully fledged awakening. I do > remember though the potential for Ego inflation as one > progresses in knowledge and vidya. However it is true > Vidya it should be Veda(wise), and that Light of > Wisdom must protect us from those inflation tricks so > that we can walk the razors edge without shedding a > drop of blood and falling from exalted grace of jnana. > > With Gratitude and Love, Jai Maa and Jai Swami!!! > Shantihi! > -Eric > \\ > --- Erin Sundari Johansen Hurwitt > <erin.johansen wrote: > > > Jai Maa! and namaste Eric, > > > > You didn't ask for my opinion, but I find this > > interesting, so I humbly and > > with love offer my thoughts. I assume that when you > > talk about " ego " you're > > talking about " ahamkara. " If that is the case, It > > seems to me that your > > friend has mistaken ego (as in, Western > > [pop-]psychology with all its bad > > connotations) for ego (as in, ahamkara, literally > > the " I-maker " of Hindu > > philosophy). > > > > I am reminded of what Swamiji said about Tamas in > > his Kali Puja classes - > > that Tamas isn't a bad thing, in fact it's necessary > > for these bodies that > > are our vehicles on this planet. It's just when we > > get too much of it or use > > it improperly or without discernment/awareness that > > there are problems. > > > > Ahamkara is useful! It allows us to exist in this > > physical world to do what > > we need to do for spiritual progression. But it also > > takes over, makes us > > forget that Maa exists, or that we are connected > > intimately to all of > > creation, makes us forget that we are actually one > > with everything; the tool > > that helps us exist in the world also makes us stuck > > in the world. It is > > jnana (knowledge) and vidya (wisdom) that help > > expand ahamkara and teach it > > to grow up, and realize that Everything Is Not All > > About Me. That everything > > is all about MAA! Mahadevi! Great Mother! Or however > > it is useful for me see > > God/dess, right? But ahamkara likes being right, so > > it fights divine wisdom > > like a hyperactive teenager. > > > > I think your friend is right in some way; sure, > > ahamkara is Maa just as > > everything is Maa, it's a tool Maa has given us - > > but the flaw in his logic > > is that it also is responsible for keeping us > > separate from Maa, because it > > is like that hyperactive teenager, really a sweet > > thing at heart, but trying > > to be grown up and wise without really not > > understanding how everything is > > connected. It's a trick of ahamkara to equate > > oneself with ahamkara, with > > the individual personality. But to say that it (or > > anything else) is > > separate from Maa may also be another trick of > > ahamkara! > > > > Anyway, my thought is, if one can use wisdom and > > discernment to expand > > one's " ego " (that is, the " I-maker " ) to include > > everything and find oneness > > with the Ultimate, so that it is not " I " and " you " > > but " MAA " then it becomes > > a tool rather than a hindrance. So I don't think > > either you or your friend > > is " right " or " wrong, " necessarily. > > > > Just my two cents, to take or leave. > > > > And regardless, I have faith that Swamiji and/or > > Shree Maa (well, there's me > > thinking of them as separate! how foolish of me!) > > will have a short, > > sweet and powerful response to your question. > > > > shanti, > > sundari > > > > > > > > > > On Nov 12, 2007 7:38 AM, Eric Cassils > > <Quanchula1 wrote: > > > > > Namaste Vishweshwar, > > > > > > Your remark about the the ego is interesting, and > > I > > > resonate with it, however, when I spoke to one of > > my > > > friends who I believe does not understand the > > pitfalls > > > of ego, and mentioned Sri Maa's remark that " Ego > > is > > > the enemy of wisdom. Ego can make you fall' to try > > to > > > help him negate some of the impulsive drives he > > was he > > > experiencing, he just responded by saying " Embrace > > the > > > Ego as God already " and that he is no " hindu > > > purusha/prakriti dualist' as if to say that > > viewing > > > the ego as seperate from God is just a perverse > > form > > > of inane dualism. Ego must have been created by > > God, > > > but just because God creates something, does that > > make > > > God's creation equal with God? I replied to my > > friend > > > that I would not embrace the ego as God already, > > as > > > that is simply not my experience of the ego, and I > > > much prefered to receive the grace of Maa that > > slices > > > and dices away at persona imbalances such as > > inflated > > > pride, ignorace and pomposity. What do Swami and > > Maa > > > have to say about this idea that ego is God > > already? > > > Much Love, Jai Maa! Jai Svami, > > > Eric > > > --- inspectionconnection108 > > > <inspectionconnection108 > > <inspectionconnection108%40>> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Namaste Wendy: Thanks for posting from your > > heart. > > > > I truly > > > > understand how difficult it can be to be away > > from > > > > Maa. That said, > > > > you refused to surrender to the ego and made the > > > > effort to stay tuned > > > > to Her in your heart. Sure we know She is always > > > > there, but we do > > > > forget. But She never forgets, She never goes > > away, > > > > She is amazing. > > > > She is our Guru. She brings the Light to dispel > > the > > > > darkness. > > > > > > > > Jai Maa Jai Swami > > > > > > > > vishweshwar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > <%40>, > > > " way131 " > > > > <wendy131@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Namaste Vish, > > > > > I am so glad to see the webcam working again. > > Not > > > > having the link of > > > > > the webcam has proven to be a very interesting > > > > stretch of time for > > > > > me -- kind of like my personal Kali Yuga! One > > > > thing I saw, close up > > > > > and personal, was the working of my ego and my > > > > attachments. I hate to > > > > > say it, but I will admit that sometimes I felt > > > > frustrated by > > > > > not 'seeing' life at the Mandir. I knew there > > were > > > > activities going > > > > > on, but I couldn't see it, I couldn't hear it, > > and > > > > I felt " left out. " > > > > > > > > > > One way (there were others as well) I picked > > > > myself up and shut down > > > > > my ego was to return to Shree Maa's > > Autobiography. > > > > Reading and > > > > > rereading that book always seems to have a > > magical > > > > effect on me – it > > > > > helps me feel closer to beloved Shree Maa and > > > > serves as another > > > > > reminder that She is always with me. > > > > > So, I guess my studies here have helped me > > (yes, > > > > this is quite an > > > > > undersatement!). Previously, it would be easy > > for > > > > me to just get lost > > > > > in the daily drama of life and 'forget' about > > my > > > > spiritual practices, > > > > > but not this time. > > > === message truncated === > > > > ____________________ ______________ > Be a better pen pal. > Text or chat with friends inside Mail. See how. http://overview.mail./ > Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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