Manjusha ; Swami's response:Q + A with Swami: Asuras?

[Guest guest]

And in life it is the constant struggle (?) to maintain a balance

within ourselves to find harmony and peace - however precarious.

 

The important lesson it holds for me is that since both devas and

asuras are necessary for creating the energy to churn the nectar of

life to reach the goal - this knowledge enables me to become a

detached observer on the path to becoming a Hamsa (as you have put it

so well).

 

It is so much easier to understand things - but so much more difficult

to put them in practice.

 

, bmarley343 wrote:

>

> i believe it was swamiji who also related it to breath

>

> the So Ham

>

> inhalation and exhalation is the churning of the devas and asuras.

>

> to churn the nectar through pranayama - expansion of prana

>

> the crown chakra is the top of mount meru.

>

> churning the nectar, becoming the Hamsa

>

>

>

>

> gauri_108 <gauri_108

>

> Sat, 14 Feb 2009 3:31 pm

> [www.ShreeMaa.org] Manjusha ; Swami's response:Re: Q + A with

> Swami: Asuras?

Namaste Dan,

>

> the first mantra is my altime favorite and the other two are close

> seconds.....great minds think alike!

>

> And every time Swamiji mentions the story of churning the Milk Ocean,

> it makes me very happy.....Devs and Ashuras on opposite sides ina

> tug-of-war to get the soma...

>

> Jaaaaaaaaaaai Maa!

>

> , bmarley343@ wrote:

> >

> >

> > reminds me of 3 mantras in particular

> >

> > this mantra is right after the achman in the first 10 or so pages of

> > every book

> >

> > 1.

> > Om apavitrah pavitro va sarvavastham gato-pi va

> > ya smaret pundarikaksham sa bahyabhyantarah sucih

> >

> > OM the impure and the pure reside within all objects.

> > who remembers the lotus-eyed Consciousness is conveyed to radiant

> > beauty

> >

> > and from the prana pratistha suktam...

> >

> > 2.

> > Kalakala Hi Devanam Danavanam Kalakalah

> > Samgrhya Nirmito Yasmat Kalasastena Kathyate

> >

> > All the gods are fragments of the cosmic whole,

> > also all the asuras are fragments of the cosmic whole.

> > thus we make a house to contain all these energies.

> >

> > 3.

> > Deva danava samvade mathyamane mahodadhau

> > utpanni-si tada bumbha vidhrto visnuna svayam

> >

> > The Gods and asuras speaking together are the great givers of

> churning

> > to the mind.

> > Rise to the top of this pot to separate them from what is actually

> > Vishnu Himself!

> >

> >

> > which reminds me of the story of the churning of the milk ocean. the

> > devas and asuras worked together to churn it.

> >

> > namaste all

> > dan

> >

> >

> >

> > misra_manjusha <misra_manjusha@>

> >

> > Fri, 13 Feb 2009 4:29 am

> > [www.ShreeMaa.org] Manjusha ; Swami's response:Re: Q + A

> with

> > Swami: Asuras?

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> >

> > Namaste Vish,

> >

> > The second part of Swamiji's answer is the one that's been intriguing

> > me actually! I think he's brought the real issue I had in mind, to

> the

> > forefront.

> > If objects change their perspectives depending on how you look at

> them,

> > does it mean that it does not really matter how you look at things

> > (because that might depend on which society you live in or where you

> > come from) because it doesn't change the reality.

> > Is our spirituality geared towards 'seeing' the entire object without

> > being biased by any particular perspective? (I remember a certain

> story

> > about an elephant and blind men)

> > Would that mean Dev and Asuras are two sides of the same coin?

> >

> > Thanks Vish for engaging the discussion.

> > Jai Maa and Jai Swamiji!!!!

> >

> > Manjushri

> >

> > , " inspectionconnection108 "

> > <inspectionconnection108@> wrote:

> > >

> > > Namaste Manjusha: here are Swami's answers to your questions below

> > >

> > > SWAMI said:

> > > " Everything in manifested existence has both.

> > >

> > > Also there is a way of looking at things, so that something that

> > > appears as negative to one individual could appear as positive to

> > > another. "

> > > _______________

> > >

> > >

> > > Is there any geographical/historical connotation? Or do we all have

> > > both the shining and dark forces within us?

> > >

> > > Jai Maa & Jai Swamiji

> > > Manjushri

> > >

> >

>

[Guest guest]

Dear Manjushri,

 

Perhaps it is less confusing to see the the deva/asura dichotomy in a

psychological sense as Hope and Fear. These truly are two sides of

the same coin because intrinsic to hope is a fear that one will not

achieve one's aims, and in fear there is always the hope of things

turning out right. The ocean of our mind is truly churned by hopes

and fears and the evanescent drama of our life in this world with its

joys and sorrows arises in dependence on them.

 

I don't think that you can say that it doesn't matter what one

perceives simply because there is an element of relativity to our

interaction with our objects of experience. I think that perhaps

Svamiji is saying is that for flies, excrement might be an excellent

and delightful food... but we would come to woe if we in our human

form tried to subsist on such a diet.

 

An important application of this is that we should never be too

zealous in our proclamations of Truth, excluding the paths and

proclivities of others. This does not mean that we dispense with the

Absolute. However, we must realize that all *paths* to wisdom have

more to do with our dis-ease and confusion than with the goal itself.

From the point of view of Reality, all " practice " is a kind of vanity,

but one that is absolutely necessary for those of us that are confused

to engage wholeheartedly and one-pointedly in.

 

With love,

 

Kalidas

 

On Fri, Feb 13, 2009 at 4:29 AM, misra_manjusha

<misra_manjusha wrote:

> Namaste Vish,

>

> The second part of Swamiji's answer is the one that's been intriguing me

> actually! I think he's brought the real issue I had in mind, to the

> forefront.

> If objects change their perspectives depending on how you look at them, does

> it mean that it does not really matter how you look at things (because that

> might depend on which society you live in or where you come from) because it

> doesn't change the reality.

> Is our spirituality geared towards 'seeing' the entire object without being

> biased by any particular perspective? (I remember a certain story about an

> elephant and blind men)

> Would that mean Dev and Asuras are two sides of the same coin?

>

> Thanks Vish for engaging the discussion.

> Jai Maa and Jai Swamiji!!!!

>

> Manjushri

>

> , " inspectionconnection108 "

> <inspectionconnection108 wrote:

>>

>> Namaste Manjusha: here are Swami's answers to your questions below

>>

>> SWAMI said:

>> " Everything in manifested existence has both.

>>

>> Also there is a way of looking at things, so that something that

>> appears as negative to one individual could appear as positive to

>> another. "

>> _______________

>>

>>

>> Is there any geographical/historical connotation? Or do we all have

>> both the shining and dark forces within us?

>>

>> Jai Maa & Jai Swamiji

>> Manjushri

>>

>

>

[Guest guest]

also i like to look at the dichotomy of deva and asura as divya to

shine. our ability to look inside and see our inner shining. and asura

as our desire to look out into the world. the play of looking within

and looking outside. the more we look outside we see duality. the more

we look within we see unity. to the extent that we look outside to

reaffirm what we find inside i would say that this is how the devas and

asuras work together to churn the milk ocean . the amrita is that eyes

open or closed i am firmly established in oneness with god. OM. JAI

SWAMIJI JAI MA!!!

 

dan

 

 

 

Thubten Namgyal <anandabhairav

 

Wed, 25 Feb 2009 11:40 am

Re: [www.ShreeMaa.org] Manjusha ; Swami's response:Re: Q + A

with Swami: Asuras?

 

 

 

 

 

 

Dear Manjushri,

 

Perhaps it is less confusing to see the the deva/asura dichotomy in a

psychological sense as Hope and Fear. These truly are two sides of

the same coin because intrinsic to hope is a fear that one will not

achieve one's aims, and in fear there is always the hope of things

turning out right. The ocean of our mind is truly churned by hopes

and fears and the evanescent drama of our life in this world with its

joys and sorrows arises in dependence on them.

 

I don't think that you can say that it doesn't matter what one

perceives simply because there is an element of relativity to our

interaction with our objects of experience. I think that perhaps

Svamiji is saying is that for flies, excrement might be an excellent

and delightful food... but we would come to woe if we in our human

form tried to subsist on such a diet.

 

An important application of this is that we should never be too

zealous in our proclamations of Truth, excluding the paths and

proclivities of others. This does not mean that we dispense with the

Absolute. However, we must realize that all *paths* to wisdom have

more to do with our dis-ease and confusion than with the goal itself.

From the point of view of Reality, all " practice " is a kind of vanity,

but one that is absolutely necessary for those of us that are confused

to engage wholeheartedly and one-pointedly in.

 

With love,

 

Kalidas

 

On Fri, Feb 13, 2009 at 4:29 AM, misra_manjusha

<misra_manjusha wrote:

> Namaste Vish,

>

> The second part of Swamiji's answer is the one that's been intriguing

me

> actually! I think he's brought the real issue I had in mind, to the

> forefront.

> If objects change their perspectives depending on how you look at

them, does

> it mean that it does not really matter how you look at things

(because that

> might depend on which society you live in or where you come from)

because it

> doesn't change the reality.

> Is our spirituality geared towards 'seeing' the entire object without

being

> biased by any particular perspective? (I remember a certain story

about an

> elephant and blind men)

> Would that mean Dev and Asuras are two sides of the same coin?

>

> Thanks Vish for engaging the discussion.

> Jai Maa and Jai Swamiji!!!!

>

> Manjushri

>

> , " inspectionconnection108 "

> <inspectionconnection108 wrote:

>>

>> Namaste Manjusha: here are Swami's answers to your questions below

>>

>> SWAMI said:

>> " Everything in manifested existence has both.

>>

>> Also there is a way of looking at things, so that something that

>> appears as negative to one individual could appear as positive to

>> another. "

>> _______________

>>

>>

>> Is there any geographical/historical connotation? Or do we all have

>> both the shining and dark forces within us?

>>

>> Jai Maa & Jai Swamiji

>> Manjushri

>>

>

>